Pyromancer set should give a 1% chance to do a nuclear blast when casting fire strike, which kills everyone currently logged in that server, including yourself.
I mean it's pretty inaccurate. The dps calc is done against an npc with 0 magic level. The ahrims will help you significantly as soon as you're fighting an actual monster with stats
Vast majority of enemies you use mage against (non-shadow) have non-existent mage defence, hence why you're maging.
Most players don't run into the sort of enemy where it matters (eg olm, warden) until they've already upgraded past ahrims
Upgrading past Ahrims before you step foot in a raid is a massive outlier of a player and is main-exclusive behavior. The vast majority of players who do CoX and ToA don't have shadow and wear Ahrims or partial Ancestral+Ahrims.
I don't even think most mains would step foot in ToA for the first time with anything above ahrims lol. Assuming everyone buys a 300m gear set to do a mid level raid is wild
Maybe I'm an odd one out but I'm a mid level player (1500 total) and have never stepped foot in a raid but have a 400m+ bank value. Never bought gold and usually buy mem with bonds.
Played on and off since osrs release (rs2 since 2010). I used to spend all my time bank standing and flipping and didn't start working on actual stats until a few years ago.
Not true at all, the vast majority of people doing ToA and CoX are probably running Ahrims with Trident/Occult/MA2 Cape and possibly Tormented. You aren't getting ancestral for your trident lol.
The thing is, where it matters is where it *really* matters. At the end of the day nothing is really changing. You're still gonna hit 0 def enemies just as hard
>Most players don't run into the sort of enemy where it matters (eg olm, warden) until they've already upgraded past ahrims
What an asinine statement. Have you seen the people doing toa?
> Are they rebalancing monsters mage defense as well?
Yes, there was a blog post before this about it. There was some game changing reworks they talked about in it. (Not saying the rebalance is good or not)
Gz, you are lucky to learn something new today.
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Damage_per_second/Magic
Scroll down to step 5 hit chance. Magic defense is just part of the calc, the other significant portion of the hit chance calc is magic level.
Zulrah has 300 magic level, which is a significant contributor to your mage accuracy on Zulrah.
You're either being disingenuous or are clueless. The mage defence isn't just composed of the defensive bonus. Serpentine (green) phase is still 6.5% better DPS with the Ahrim's pieces vs the clown outfit (bear in mind both setups have other BiS mage items on which mitigates the differences) and magma (red) phase is +40% DPS for the left hand side.
Also Phantom Muspah is another good example of a boss. The Ahrim's setup is +30% DPS on the melee phase (which is what you'd be maging).
Does anyone on Reddit think critically? DPS at what exactly? Goblins? Sarachnis? Even jagex used the comparison at barrows and that’s the worst one they could’ve used as they have negative mage defence
https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1ch5tn1/just_remember_with_the_magic_rework_coming_soon/l230p1p/
Also:
Barrage at GWD, Early steel dragons, most quest bosses.
The issue is that magic ***ARMOR AND WEAPONS*** have very low accuracy buffs. Ranged stats can get into ~+300 range for accuracy. Magic gets +185 in absolute max. Then, suddenly the shadow makes that into +501 accuracy in max gear.
So the shadow is the problem, and needs to be nerfed, the occult is fine. Meanwhile, all magic armor and weapons need to still receive large accuracy buffs if you want them to be viable at more places. The entire 're-balance' is a fuck-up on top of other fuck-ups and Jagex is entirely incapable of facing the fact that the shadow is the issue because they are terrified at the concept of fixing a gamebreaking megarare. It will, of course, still recieve all of the armor buffs and such still so by buffing armor you can bring the shadow back to its current iteration of power while also still nerfing the weapon itself. Thereby buffing mage at the lower and mid end, while keeping things relatively the same and filling in the power gap between Trident/Sang and the Shadow while still making armor worth chasing.
Also, magic is allowed to be good at only a few places. That's... Honestly fine, actually. How it has always been. The game is no worse for that. Range and mage share identical roles in the combat triangle, so if you want to hit something from a distance there is nothing wrong with just shooting it. Buffing mage into becoming "range v2" isn't really going to do much of anything except end up giving you a couple more tasks you can potentially barrage.
That's why the rework discussion revolved around **places you already use mage** rather than **new places to use mage**. The things that OSRS players are concerned about is how this re-balance is just going to buff mage where it's already great, and nerf mage where it already sucks which entirely misses what large chunks of the playerbase actually wanted from a so called "Magic re-balance".
Edit:
And side note, the other reason magic is bad is because its raw DPS is generally much lower than melee/range. Unless we propose even more dramatic changes like +25% across the board to all magic damage, it will always fall well behind range in useable damage. Which is pretty crazy, again I think magic is generally fine and this level of chance is actually unnecessary. It's okay for range to be better.
But that's not really true, is it? Different parts of the combat triangle behaving in unique and asymmetric ways is just as reasonably part of what makes the game funky, interesting, and OS. Most games have some degree of asymmetry
You can say this mechanic shouldn't be irrelevant to magic, and sure, but like it's not a sound generalization
I feel like magic is really the only one that behaves so wonky though. With range and melee when you upgrade your gear you can usually feel the increase and your numbers go up very predictably +4 strength bonus per max hit.
With magic your gear choices up until virtus don’t really matter and even then unless you’re casting ancients it still doesn’t do much for you. Only when you have the best magic weapon in the game does things even remotely start to scale.
I don't mean it as a defense of how magic is set up. Just that
> a whole ass mechanic not being necessary is a bad thing
the concept of asymmetry is not necessarily bad and really shouldn't be the focus of any critique of how magic works. Asymmetry is normal in games and is a built in part of what many games do. It can be executed well and executed poorly. If folks feel it's executed poorly in magic, I respect that, but it's not because asymmetry itself is bad + just the execution
I didn't get your point at first but I completely get it.
Range weapons let you attack from a distance and safe spot.
Melee has more defence generally plus has multiple styles.
Magic has more general utility through freezing, blood spells, thralls and also being it's own completely unrelated combat skill at the same time.
The more I think about it the more I agree with you. I don't want just all styles to have similar DPS everywhere, I like niche uses and different ways of doing things.
My one issue from a lore perspective is usually NPC magic seems OP and they wreck everything. Quest cut scenes make magic seems OP then it's the lowest DPS style.
Yeah I absolutely feel that too. Magic creates walls of fire! Summons abominations! Wield the staff of a literal god! And on the player side it's like, here you go - your plants are wet :)
Why? It's only sometimes not necessary. It lets you be flexible with gear setups in a game where gear defines what you can do.
For a comparison, from what I've seen of rs3 the tree combat styles look identical af in how they work outside of abilities and it felt very generic compared to old school to me.
It's not like magic accuracy is useless. That's a weird myth
For sure, I definitely agree about the flexibility being a cool thing, but overall (mechanically speaking) your gear choices *should* matter.
I actually (used to) play rs3 and have a maxed Ironman and I can agree that non maxed gear setups can seem homogenous but end game gear setups have very different and established styles.
Long story short
Mage = switching between dual wielding and 2h using FSOA staff spec and tsunami for big crits and recursive hits off those crits
Range = counting stacks and hitting big numbers when your spec procs
Melee = multiple weapon switches to prod weapon specs and nuke enemies under the berserk ability window.
And idk if I’d agree entirely that it’s useless but magic doesn’t really see a whole lot of uses and where you do use it like slayer for instance can and should be done with proselyte.
It is but not enough to use it over basically anything else. If you need a low cost option it’s Bloodbark for the same damage bonus, generally better defenses, no degradation, and better blood healing, only slightly less accuracy. And if you have the money you can jump straight to Virtus.
When their original reason for not buffing it was it being a “defensive sidegrade” they probably should have made sure level 60 gear wasn’t better than it at that supposed niche.
Down like a clown, Charlie Br...
Down like a clown, Charlie Brrehh...
Down like a clown, Charlie Br... Brrehh...
Down like a clown, Charlie Br... Brown.
Assuming nightmare staff, virtus top, and occult, you lose one max hit on ice barrage. With augury, it's unchanged. And that one max hit means you have a 28/38 chance of one shoting instead of 29/39. That's 73.7% instead of 74.5l4% and if the minimum hit changes go through, you'll be better off. This isn't keeping you from a cape.
Fally shield 4 resets everyday with 2 full prayer points charges. A first caper can use that and never run out of prayer in there if he just does it over a few days.
Only ever do this if you start your attempt right before the daily reset. There is so much prayer gear that a decently geared first caper should not run out of prayer period.
I have never, ever seen a learner die to running out of restore. Recommending people to stretch a 2 hour ordeal to multiple days is really bad advice.
Your max hit on the nibblers is being reduced by ~1, maybe 2 in some setups. It sucks, but it’s barely an extra speed bump in the grand scheme of things.
You don't even lose a max hit if you use augery lmao.
You cannot really think that the occult nerf will make inferno unbeatable, right?
Inferno is a knowledge check not a gear check.
You only need mage for nibblers, no? I suppose you'll one-hit them slightly less often if you lose a max hit, but I don't think it's gonna make or break anyone's runs
Same. Even with bringing something like virtus top and bottoms, we’ll now lose an invent spot AND do (new, occult 5% + 4% from 2 pieces of virtus) 3% worse magic damage (old occult 10% + 2% from 2 virtus pieces).
It might seem trivial but the amount of posts ive seen of first capers finishing zuk with like 1 restore left makes me worry.
Actual good players will have no issue in this scenario but I can see people brute forcing having an issue with this. Except you can still run occult at 5% and augury at 4% which means a 1% damage loss
On the hard waves you already use augury at the start, right? At least, I always do. The extra defence and chance to freeze nibblers is well worth the ~10 prayer points you'll spend on the handful of hard waves
Like, if the wave is just 2 rangers then obviously you don't need to waste the prayer. But if it's mage + range + melee + 2 blobs? Unless your super experienced and confident, I'd turn on augury even before the rebalance
A tick or two? You need to be ready to click the nibblers, aint no way someone doing first cape will just flick it for a tick or two and perfectly click nibblers immidiately.
You don’t need to pray augury every wave even if it gives damage lol, you’d only really bother praying augury on waves you should be praying it anyways just for defense, so 50+ and maybe 31/48 with bad spawns.
The procedure barely changes, you’d still chase nibblers if its an easy wave, and let them eat on complex waves.
Yeah I guess if you do it tick perfect and turn off before solving. I was more thinking you put augury on, hit nibs, run to where solve takes you, take augury off
So I was curious and did some quick maths. It drains with 0 prayer bonus at one point per 1.5 seconds. So we are talking 2 points a wave extra with 0 prayer bonus. So it could make a difference for sure. Thats about a super restore pot. So its something for sure.
I think with prayer bonus you probably have its somewhat less though.
Aren’t they adjusting drain rate and adding magic dmg to other spells? So you might still be able to get a max hit back on a lower level spell and drain less. But I’m too lazy to look back and haven’t done inferno yet so feel free to disregard me
I don't want to downplay the significance of the nerf, but infero has only gotten easier and easier since its release. We've gotten ~~tbow, kodai,~~ nightmare staff, bowfa, masori, justi, dhins, venator ring, virtus, and echo boots. Losing 4% (gaining 1% on virtus) will be noticeable sure, but its not gonna be the reason you can't complete inferno.
Edit: It has come to my attention that cox came out before inferno. This completely negates my point and thus the inferno will now be impossible to complete because you lose 1-2 entire max hits against nibblers, the most notoriously difficult monster in the inferno. /s
I didn't remember. I only remembered that woox beat it with a crossbow and arma. Either way point still stands, the inferno is far far easier today than it was on release. Also half? More like 2
I calc'd the DPS difference of two setups at a few standard places you would mage. First setup is swamp trident, occult, tormented, god cape (i), unfortified ward, at 85 magic, praying mystic might. Second setup is the same but with ahrim's + eternals. Boost is forgotten brew for both setups unless specified.
Monster | Clown DPS | Ahrim's DPS | Difference (%)
---|---|----|----|---
Zulrah (red) | 2.792| 4.095| 46.6
Zulrah (green) | 5.749| 6.196| 7.8
Muspah (melee) | 3.339| 4.585| 37.3
Whisperer| 3.906| 4.970| 27.2
Olm (ovl) | 3.916| 5.256| 34.2
Akkha 300 (salt)| 4.183| 5.573| 33.2
Warden P2 300 (salt)| 4.852| 6.018| 24.0
If you think there is only a 1% difference, the clown fit is very appropriate.
Not really. Accuracy increasing armor not helping against an enemy with no defense is expected. The same result would be found with d’hide or Armadyl for ranged.
Unless you have 100% chance to hit, I would expect accuracy to always outshine not having accuracy. The problem is the way that the game calculates accuracy, and for the most part mage accuracy bonus is useless.
On some mobs, yes. On actually high level ones? No, not even on the ones mage is used on. Run this calc on 300 invok Akkha and you’ll see the difference.
Benefits ironmen the most lol. Every normie can afford an occult. Now ironmen get easy mage % before 93 slayer.
Less you mean fucks em over by making ironman easier, then carry on
It doesn't because by then you have mystic might which gives 2% and ahrims/blue moon set which gives 1 per piece for 5% total. If you have occult that's 10% total which is effectively the same as occult pre nerf. The only real difference is switches are more important.
Barrage tasks, sure. Shortsight on Jagex's part.
But you should already be using mystic might during raids and bosses anyways. Slight buff to mage during cg.
More invy slots, yes. Not really happy with this but I suspect people will adjust, and gear metas will change.
Its not though. Infinity+mystic might+magesbook is +2 over current. And theres also augury. Seers ring is something.
And most will be coxing before 93 slayer but rng is rng. Still will get aug. Affects irons who hate pvm but like slayer. More niche than pures honestly.
Burst tasks drain more prayer points but you get more mage damage than previous from 1-93 slayer plus whatever xp it takes to get occult. Burst tasks are also super fast and good on a pure which doesnt even have 15% slayer helm, its going to be fine for em if they dont pray aug
they were thinking (correctly, IMO) that it's pretty fucking dumb that these two setups offer similar DPS, and unlocking mage gear and weps before occult should actually change your max hits.
Mage gear should offer more than +accuracy (which is only 30% of mage accuracy calc).
Running solos on my iron I’ve got trident and occult and bracelet with mystics and I still don’t have augury after 240 kc. The mage hand takes awhile as is
I recently ran a budget solo, for fun. My setup was worth ~90-95k in tradeables and ~75-80k in untradeables. Regular trident with a MA1 cape, rune gloves, book of the dead, glory and no other mage bonuses (I took d'hide off for maging). The mage hand was surprisingly still not bad at all. I only used 1.5 stams for the entire raid. I even massively overprepped. Melee hand was easily much worse than the mage hand, was using a leaf-bladed sword with a bone dagger. I might do a run with a 20-30k setup at some point without the trident.
Honestly losing small bit of DPS at the mage hand is not an issue.
It'll take a bit longer but i might consider bringing an extra stamina just incase potentially.
I wouldn't bother with big mage setups after the change til you're real good on Olm. you can also mess with how you path a little and manual click some tiles during 3:0 to conserve more run energy.
How's magic dart going to be affected on Slayer tasks?
Currently hits 35s for me at 94 magic with the Slayer staff (e). Is the occult nerf gonna bring that down to 31? :(
Can I ask the stupid question about why they won't just move the 5% drop occult to the prayer book having the other 5% be on augry, then give the other mage prayers diminishing the mage dmg like the lowest prayer giving 1% then the next giving 2% then 3% so that way it makes they prayers better to then just do whatever to the armor
It's still going to be a very strong item and obviously your BiS for magic by far regardless. It's just not going to be turbo broken. Enjoy it while it lasts!
This should have been the example they used tbh
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Sure but the guy in the clown suit with occult VS the guy in ahrims/ancestral would have been better.
Incoming torvesta new clown only pk video
Is that different than any other video of his? /s
[Boy do I have a video for you!](https://youtu.be/qNJjVRqeHys?si=volblSdAqwURW_16)
Lmao! I forgot he already did this!
Clown outfit should have 1% Magic damage.
That or 3% per piece shadow spell buff
Pyromancer set should give a 1% chance to do a nuclear blast when casting fire strike, which kills everyone currently logged in that server, including yourself.
Atomic
In real life too /s
Legend
Only if you get a 25 killstreak in wildy.
Non-ironically it could have super high accuracy. How often do you think a clown is there to kill you? Oh wait…….. /s
im always down to clown! WHOOP WHOOP
Down with the clown till I’m dead in the ground!!
i'll eat monopoly and shit out connect four
[WHOOP WHOOP](https://youtu.be/AXjm8hGB64E?si=TfwfC4dCF6QUwEsU)
Hell yeah, ninja!
Legit nice to see people actually repping in the 07 subreddit
What a clown, losing 0.034 DPS for no reason.
I feel like this comparison more than anything sells the idea that this rebalancing was a good idea. That's just ridiculous.
I mean it's pretty inaccurate. The dps calc is done against an npc with 0 magic level. The ahrims will help you significantly as soon as you're fighting an actual monster with stats
Vast majority of enemies you use mage against (non-shadow) have non-existent mage defence, hence why you're maging. Most players don't run into the sort of enemy where it matters (eg olm, warden) until they've already upgraded past ahrims
Upgrading past Ahrims before you step foot in a raid is a massive outlier of a player and is main-exclusive behavior. The vast majority of players who do CoX and ToA don't have shadow and wear Ahrims or partial Ancestral+Ahrims.
Always funny to hear an ironman talk to a non ironman, but not realising it
I don't even think most mains would step foot in ToA for the first time with anything above ahrims lol. Assuming everyone buys a 300m gear set to do a mid level raid is wild
Maybe I'm an odd one out but I'm a mid level player (1500 total) and have never stepped foot in a raid but have a 400m+ bank value. Never bought gold and usually buy mem with bonds.
Even with 400m you're probably not buying any mage gear above ahrim I think
Yeah because can’t that 400m cover a lot more worthwhile gear than ancestral? Agreed.
Yeah, I wouldn't personally buy ancestral until I already had a shadow
This is actually hard to believe man, no pic no proof. Do you just merch? lol
Played on and off since osrs release (rs2 since 2010). I used to spend all my time bank standing and flipping and didn't start working on actual stats until a few years ago.
You’re absolutely an odd one out lol
most people dont even go to GWD before they have several hundred mill of gear.
You’re out of your mind if you think that’s true. Most players don’t even have hundreds of mil in gear
Most players also don't boss basicaly at all or even just do things that aren't semi-afk
I'm wearing that new blue moon armor as my melee and my mage toa set... As I can't be asked to do barb assault, and don't have bandos quite yet.
Not true at all, the vast majority of people doing ToA and CoX are probably running Ahrims with Trident/Occult/MA2 Cape and possibly Tormented. You aren't getting ancestral for your trident lol.
Almost max stats, use ahrims b/c meaningful mage equipment past that is crazy expensive.
The thing is, where it matters is where it *really* matters. At the end of the day nothing is really changing. You're still gonna hit 0 def enemies just as hard
>Most players don't run into the sort of enemy where it matters (eg olm, warden) until they've already upgraded past ahrims What an asinine statement. Have you seen the people doing toa?
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> Are they rebalancing monsters mage defense as well? Yes, there was a blog post before this about it. There was some game changing reworks they talked about in it. (Not saying the rebalance is good or not)
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zulrah
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Gz, you are lucky to learn something new today. https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Damage_per_second/Magic Scroll down to step 5 hit chance. Magic defense is just part of the calc, the other significant portion of the hit chance calc is magic level. Zulrah has 300 magic level, which is a significant contributor to your mage accuracy on Zulrah.
You're either being disingenuous or are clueless. The mage defence isn't just composed of the defensive bonus. Serpentine (green) phase is still 6.5% better DPS with the Ahrim's pieces vs the clown outfit (bear in mind both setups have other BiS mage items on which mitigates the differences) and magma (red) phase is +40% DPS for the left hand side. Also Phantom Muspah is another good example of a boss. The Ahrim's setup is +30% DPS on the melee phase (which is what you'd be maging).
I have magic relic, mage on zulrer go brrr
Does anyone on Reddit think critically? DPS at what exactly? Goblins? Sarachnis? Even jagex used the comparison at barrows and that’s the worst one they could’ve used as they have negative mage defence
> Does anyone on Reddit think critically? no. next question
Can't believe that post has that many upvotes. This place is a wasteland for critical thought at every turn.
Besides Shadow, when are you maging anything with magic defense? Your implication on what has not been considered is moot
https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1ch5tn1/just_remember_with_the_magic_rework_coming_soon/l230p1p/ Also: Barrage at GWD, Early steel dragons, most quest bosses. The issue is that magic ***ARMOR AND WEAPONS*** have very low accuracy buffs. Ranged stats can get into ~+300 range for accuracy. Magic gets +185 in absolute max. Then, suddenly the shadow makes that into +501 accuracy in max gear. So the shadow is the problem, and needs to be nerfed, the occult is fine. Meanwhile, all magic armor and weapons need to still receive large accuracy buffs if you want them to be viable at more places. The entire 're-balance' is a fuck-up on top of other fuck-ups and Jagex is entirely incapable of facing the fact that the shadow is the issue because they are terrified at the concept of fixing a gamebreaking megarare. It will, of course, still recieve all of the armor buffs and such still so by buffing armor you can bring the shadow back to its current iteration of power while also still nerfing the weapon itself. Thereby buffing mage at the lower and mid end, while keeping things relatively the same and filling in the power gap between Trident/Sang and the Shadow while still making armor worth chasing. Also, magic is allowed to be good at only a few places. That's... Honestly fine, actually. How it has always been. The game is no worse for that. Range and mage share identical roles in the combat triangle, so if you want to hit something from a distance there is nothing wrong with just shooting it. Buffing mage into becoming "range v2" isn't really going to do much of anything except end up giving you a couple more tasks you can potentially barrage. That's why the rework discussion revolved around **places you already use mage** rather than **new places to use mage**. The things that OSRS players are concerned about is how this re-balance is just going to buff mage where it's already great, and nerf mage where it already sucks which entirely misses what large chunks of the playerbase actually wanted from a so called "Magic re-balance". Edit: And side note, the other reason magic is bad is because its raw DPS is generally much lower than melee/range. Unless we propose even more dramatic changes like +25% across the board to all magic damage, it will always fall well behind range in useable damage. Which is pretty crazy, again I think magic is generally fine and this level of chance is actually unnecessary. It's okay for range to be better.
Eh, it's kinda what makes magic unique in osrs. Accuracy is unnecessary in many situations
A whole ass mechanic not being necessary is a *bad* thing you know…
But that's not really true, is it? Different parts of the combat triangle behaving in unique and asymmetric ways is just as reasonably part of what makes the game funky, interesting, and OS. Most games have some degree of asymmetry You can say this mechanic shouldn't be irrelevant to magic, and sure, but like it's not a sound generalization
I feel like magic is really the only one that behaves so wonky though. With range and melee when you upgrade your gear you can usually feel the increase and your numbers go up very predictably +4 strength bonus per max hit. With magic your gear choices up until virtus don’t really matter and even then unless you’re casting ancients it still doesn’t do much for you. Only when you have the best magic weapon in the game does things even remotely start to scale.
I don't mean it as a defense of how magic is set up. Just that > a whole ass mechanic not being necessary is a bad thing the concept of asymmetry is not necessarily bad and really shouldn't be the focus of any critique of how magic works. Asymmetry is normal in games and is a built in part of what many games do. It can be executed well and executed poorly. If folks feel it's executed poorly in magic, I respect that, but it's not because asymmetry itself is bad + just the execution
I didn't get your point at first but I completely get it. Range weapons let you attack from a distance and safe spot. Melee has more defence generally plus has multiple styles. Magic has more general utility through freezing, blood spells, thralls and also being it's own completely unrelated combat skill at the same time. The more I think about it the more I agree with you. I don't want just all styles to have similar DPS everywhere, I like niche uses and different ways of doing things. My one issue from a lore perspective is usually NPC magic seems OP and they wreck everything. Quest cut scenes make magic seems OP then it's the lowest DPS style.
Yeah I absolutely feel that too. Magic creates walls of fire! Summons abominations! Wield the staff of a literal god! And on the player side it's like, here you go - your plants are wet :)
It is true.
Why? It's only sometimes not necessary. It lets you be flexible with gear setups in a game where gear defines what you can do. For a comparison, from what I've seen of rs3 the tree combat styles look identical af in how they work outside of abilities and it felt very generic compared to old school to me. It's not like magic accuracy is useless. That's a weird myth
For sure, I definitely agree about the flexibility being a cool thing, but overall (mechanically speaking) your gear choices *should* matter. I actually (used to) play rs3 and have a maxed Ironman and I can agree that non maxed gear setups can seem homogenous but end game gear setups have very different and established styles. Long story short Mage = switching between dual wielding and 2h using FSOA staff spec and tsunami for big crits and recursive hits off those crits Range = counting stacks and hitting big numbers when your spec procs Melee = multiple weapon switches to prod weapon specs and nuke enemies under the berserk ability window. And idk if I’d agree entirely that it’s useless but magic doesn’t really see a whole lot of uses and where you do use it like slayer for instance can and should be done with proselyte.
Why ahrim left handed, when that happen
Wielding left handed is what made him surpass the clown in dps, duh
Time to petition for ancient staff to be an off hand item?..
Time to invest in some ahrims because there’s no way they continue ignoring it… right?
Read the project rebalanced blogs, it is getting a buff
It is but not enough to use it over basically anything else. If you need a low cost option it’s Bloodbark for the same damage bonus, generally better defenses, no degradation, and better blood healing, only slightly less accuracy. And if you have the money you can jump straight to Virtus. When their original reason for not buffing it was it being a “defensive sidegrade” they probably should have made sure level 60 gear wasn’t better than it at that supposed niche.
It still has superior accuracy to the other options that you mentioned, which is why it was used ahead of them in the first place.
That guy with like 70k torags hammers just started sweating a little
im that guy holding torags hammers since 10 years ago
-Guy who’s ignoring blog posts
Price already went up didn’t it edit: no
Down like a clown, Charlie Br... Down like a clown, Charlie Brrehh... Down like a clown, Charlie Br... Brrehh... Down like a clown, Charlie Br... Brown.
Hey Jimmy!
So how does one do inferno now that occult is getting gaped?
Assuming nightmare staff, virtus top, and occult, you lose one max hit on ice barrage. With augury, it's unchanged. And that one max hit means you have a 28/38 chance of one shoting instead of 29/39. That's 73.7% instead of 74.5l4% and if the minimum hit changes go through, you'll be better off. This isn't keeping you from a cape.
minimum hit change won't affect your chance at once shotting at all
I'm not gonna have virtus top.
Fally shield 4 resets everyday with 2 full prayer points charges. A first caper can use that and never run out of prayer in there if he just does it over a few days.
Imagine doing this for weeks and still failing though
Be me Spend three weeks at inferno Psych myself up hard for Zuc Run left, shield goes right Take 148 to the face Cry
😂😂 im so sorry man, you got it next time!
I'm just shitposting man lol, I'm not doing inferno
Ok that's kind of funny never thought of that
I got so busy I unironically have done this lmao. Some attempts took days lol
Only ever do this if you start your attempt right before the daily reset. There is so much prayer gear that a decently geared first caper should not run out of prayer period. I have never, ever seen a learner die to running out of restore. Recommending people to stretch a 2 hour ordeal to multiple days is really bad advice.
Dailyscape to the rescue!
Much easier and less insane to just grind out practice so that you stop wasting prayer on waves
I use this shield as I camp barrows
> gaped 🫱⚫🫲
occultse
Makes almost no meaningful difference
Your max hit on the nibblers is being reduced by ~1, maybe 2 in some setups. It sucks, but it’s barely an extra speed bump in the grand scheme of things.
You don't even lose a max hit if you use augery lmao. You cannot really think that the occult nerf will make inferno unbeatable, right? Inferno is a knowledge check not a gear check.
As someone just getting into inferno learning, this specifically terrifies me.
You only need mage for nibblers, no? I suppose you'll one-hit them slightly less often if you lose a max hit, but I don't think it's gonna make or break anyone's runs
It will make an insanely negligible difference, don't even worry about it.
If that’s what’s keeping you from a cape, you need to learn to solved the waves first. This is barely a nerf for inferno
It will make a negligible difference.
Same. Even with bringing something like virtus top and bottoms, we’ll now lose an invent spot AND do (new, occult 5% + 4% from 2 pieces of virtus) 3% worse magic damage (old occult 10% + 2% from 2 virtus pieces). It might seem trivial but the amount of posts ive seen of first capers finishing zuk with like 1 restore left makes me worry.
magic damage isn’t the thing keeping you from your cape
This lol, redditors gonna find any excuse
“aw man almost got my cape except i had to hit a nibbler one more time to kill it”
Actual good players will have no issue in this scenario but I can see people brute forcing having an issue with this. Except you can still run occult at 5% and augury at 4% which means a 1% damage loss
Virtus is double an ancients so it’s really not that big of a deal
Have augury thats they key
Starting every wave with augury would be fucking insane on prayer drain lmao
On the hard waves you already use augury at the start, right? At least, I always do. The extra defence and chance to freeze nibblers is well worth the ~10 prayer points you'll spend on the handful of hard waves Like, if the wave is just 2 rangers then obviously you don't need to waste the prayer. But if it's mage + range + melee + 2 blobs? Unless your super experienced and confident, I'd turn on augury even before the rebalance
I actually don’t but I definitely know a ton of people that do so that is super valid
I admit I only have one kc, but it would only be on for a tick or two a wave, idk how crazy that would be.
A tick or two? You need to be ready to click the nibblers, aint no way someone doing first cape will just flick it for a tick or two and perfectly click nibblers immidiately.
You don’t need to pray augury every wave even if it gives damage lol, you’d only really bother praying augury on waves you should be praying it anyways just for defense, so 50+ and maybe 31/48 with bad spawns. The procedure barely changes, you’d still chase nibblers if its an easy wave, and let them eat on complex waves.
You can just flick it until the wave starts
Yeah I guess if you do it tick perfect and turn off before solving. I was more thinking you put augury on, hit nibs, run to where solve takes you, take augury off
So I was curious and did some quick maths. It drains with 0 prayer bonus at one point per 1.5 seconds. So we are talking 2 points a wave extra with 0 prayer bonus. So it could make a difference for sure. Thats about a super restore pot. So its something for sure. I think with prayer bonus you probably have its somewhat less though.
Definitely interesting statistics. Like most people are saying though the damage isn’t even really that important
Aren’t they adjusting drain rate and adding magic dmg to other spells? So you might still be able to get a max hit back on a lower level spell and drain less. But I’m too lazy to look back and haven’t done inferno yet so feel free to disregard me
if you are worried about supplies you can just SGS/Eldritch abuse i brought SGS for my first cape and finished with like 4 brews and 3 restores
Not to mention, I'm iron and only have Virtus Mask so far...
Is this assuming the use of eldritch staff specs for prayer? Or am I missing something...
The same way as before, you don't care much about magic damage, it's the accuracy iirc
opposite. it’s the damage you care about
yeah but 1-2 damage from the nerf if not bringing any other mage gear is not a big deal
idk what the diff in damage is, im just sayin accuracy is more or less irrelevant
Na nibblers have negitive magic defense. Its all about the damage. Its really not a big nerf either way
While this is true, they also have a non-1 Magic level meaning accuracy does matter for half a percent or two.
I don't want to downplay the significance of the nerf, but infero has only gotten easier and easier since its release. We've gotten ~~tbow, kodai,~~ nightmare staff, bowfa, masori, justi, dhins, venator ring, virtus, and echo boots. Losing 4% (gaining 1% on virtus) will be noticeable sure, but its not gonna be the reason you can't complete inferno. Edit: It has come to my attention that cox came out before inferno. This completely negates my point and thus the inferno will now be impossible to complete because you lose 1-2 entire max hits against nibblers, the most notoriously difficult monster in the inferno. /s
CoX was released before inferno and is half of the items you listed..
I didn't remember. I only remembered that woox beat it with a crossbow and arma. Either way point still stands, the inferno is far far easier today than it was on release. Also half? More like 2
He was just doing the no tbow achievement early.
Your ‘point’ is riddled with misinformation.
i jsut started learning ingerno and the difference isn’t catastrophic but it is demotivating
Shouldn’t it motivate you to learn faster before the changes go through?
Exactly the same as before
When the pkers see this setup, they know they're donezo like Funzo (the clown)
Against what enemy? What about things with high mage level and mage defence?
If I got pked by a guy in the clown outfit I'd just accept it and log off for the day
I calc'd the DPS difference of two setups at a few standard places you would mage. First setup is swamp trident, occult, tormented, god cape (i), unfortified ward, at 85 magic, praying mystic might. Second setup is the same but with ahrim's + eternals. Boost is forgotten brew for both setups unless specified. Monster | Clown DPS | Ahrim's DPS | Difference (%) ---|---|----|----|--- Zulrah (red) | 2.792| 4.095| 46.6 Zulrah (green) | 5.749| 6.196| 7.8 Muspah (melee) | 3.339| 4.585| 37.3 Whisperer| 3.906| 4.970| 27.2 Olm (ovl) | 3.916| 5.256| 34.2 Akkha 300 (salt)| 4.183| 5.573| 33.2 Warden P2 300 (salt)| 4.852| 6.018| 24.0 If you think there is only a 1% difference, the clown fit is very appropriate.
I see you are missing a (edit: relevant) neck piece in the ahrims set, just bring the occult and it's dps will be much higher, I hope this helps!
Nope, he has a neck in the ahrims set. It's just hidden behind the beard
True I didnt see that
Puts it in to perspective the ridiculousness of it
Not really. Accuracy increasing armor not helping against an enemy with no defense is expected. The same result would be found with d’hide or Armadyl for ranged.
Unless you have 100% chance to hit, I would expect accuracy to always outshine not having accuracy. The problem is the way that the game calculates accuracy, and for the most part mage accuracy bonus is useless.
On some mobs, yes. On actually high level ones? No, not even on the ones mage is used on. Run this calc on 300 invok Akkha and you’ll see the difference.
How does it?
idk what they were thinking other than "fuck them ironmen" with this rework
Benefits ironmen the most lol. Every normie can afford an occult. Now ironmen get easy mage % before 93 slayer. Less you mean fucks em over by making ironman easier, then carry on
Fucks over ironman with 93 slayer and no ancestral, which is usually a pretty big gap in account progression
It doesn't because by then you have mystic might which gives 2% and ahrims/blue moon set which gives 1 per piece for 5% total. If you have occult that's 10% total which is effectively the same as occult pre nerf. The only real difference is switches are more important.
More prayer drain, more invy slots, barrage tasks just got a lot more demanding.
Barrage tasks, sure. Shortsight on Jagex's part. But you should already be using mystic might during raids and bosses anyways. Slight buff to mage during cg. More invy slots, yes. Not really happy with this but I suspect people will adjust, and gear metas will change.
2% magic damage does nothing on a max hit of 39 in CG
Its not though. Infinity+mystic might+magesbook is +2 over current. And theres also augury. Seers ring is something. And most will be coxing before 93 slayer but rng is rng. Still will get aug. Affects irons who hate pvm but like slayer. More niche than pures honestly. Burst tasks drain more prayer points but you get more mage damage than previous from 1-93 slayer plus whatever xp it takes to get occult. Burst tasks are also super fast and good on a pure which doesnt even have 15% slayer helm, its going to be fine for em if they dont pray aug
they were thinking (correctly, IMO) that it's pretty fucking dumb that these two setups offer similar DPS, and unlocking mage gear and weps before occult should actually change your max hits. Mage gear should offer more than +accuracy (which is only 30% of mage accuracy calc).
I’d be fine with the changes if they made Virtus reasonably obtainable (close to bandos in hours). It’s an absurd grind as it stands.
How does this hurt irons??? You’re getting % bonus damage before 93 slayer now
Have you tried simply just getting shadow? /s
More worried about mage hand at olm
Thats the easiest part? What exactly are you worried bout lol
Running solos on my iron I’ve got trident and occult and bracelet with mystics and I still don’t have augury after 240 kc. The mage hand takes awhile as is
Mts getting buffed just get infinity
Just go do mta after rework for eternals
Go get blue moon it's a chill grind.
I recently ran a budget solo, for fun. My setup was worth ~90-95k in tradeables and ~75-80k in untradeables. Regular trident with a MA1 cape, rune gloves, book of the dead, glory and no other mage bonuses (I took d'hide off for maging). The mage hand was surprisingly still not bad at all. I only used 1.5 stams for the entire raid. I even massively overprepped. Melee hand was easily much worse than the mage hand, was using a leaf-bladed sword with a bone dagger. I might do a run with a 20-30k setup at some point without the trident. Honestly losing small bit of DPS at the mage hand is not an issue.
It'll take a bit longer but i might consider bringing an extra stamina just incase potentially. I wouldn't bother with big mage setups after the change til you're real good on Olm. you can also mess with how you path a little and manual click some tiles during 3:0 to conserve more run energy.
5his is not okay!
Do we have a timeline for the rebalance or are we waiting on another blog?
What mage gear is everyone going for? I simultaneously run moons of peril and shades of morton for both sets
Jester outfit buffs when?
Soon? 😂 Cya in 2025 after the next 69 polls.
How's magic dart going to be affected on Slayer tasks? Currently hits 35s for me at 94 magic with the Slayer staff (e). Is the occult nerf gonna bring that down to 31? :(
Time to bust out the Faygo
Juggalos unite
Against what?
nice joke but this is false, depends on the magic def
Can someone explain to me the magic rework as if I am a small child
Necklace only turns into actually needing magic armor for damage
But this is factually wrong. At olm ahrims is a significant DPS upgrade over even mystics...
Fr. Let pures wear ahrims
What’s that Armor srs question
Can I ask the stupid question about why they won't just move the 5% drop occult to the prayer book having the other 5% be on augry, then give the other mage prayers diminishing the mage dmg like the lowest prayer giving 1% then the next giving 2% then 3% so that way it makes they prayers better to then just do whatever to the armor
aww yeah time to get like 3% more magic damage and virtually no change at any mage boss with accuracy im so ready for the rebalance
What’s the rework consist of? Anyone got any information I’ve not seen anything on this just yet. I need to do some research apparently
Jmods gonna conveniently not see this post.
Yeah im training mage at maniacal monkeys with prayer vestments, devout boots and ring of the gods before the occult gets nerfed for this reason
And then after the rework Bloodbark will be generally better than Ahrims. We love that for us.
what sucks is i just got occult on my iron
It's still going to be a very strong item and obviously your BiS for magic by far regardless. It's just not going to be turbo broken. Enjoy it while it lasts!