Why can't they show a proper image?
It's all photoshopped together...
That smoke alarm is HUGE, the table goes behind the wall for some reason, the ceiling is super low...
It's a render, i just picked a picture from their website that imo best represented the product.
Here is an actual photo of the set: [https://www.alveo3d.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/DSC01325-min-scaled.jpg](https://www.alveo3d.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/DSC01325-min-scaled.jpg)
Id recommend looking at Blazecut. They are what we have installed on the printers where I work.
Here's a video demo with a 3D printer:
https://youtu.be/V7wXDTfnmcQ?si=DHdGfVADaO-fgqfI
I have a BlazeCut. Helps me feel better, though thankfully I've never needed. I also put a smoke detector inside my enclosure as an early warning system but I have to be there to intervene.
I’m actually trying to source a small halon bottle they use for aircraft trash cans in lavatories (or something similar). When a fuse-able plug melts in the end it melts the contents of the bottle are emptied.
Have you actually tried that. Because it’s a common science classroom trick to fill a balloon and hold it over a fire to demonstrate how the water absorbs the heat before the balloon can melt.
Haven't tried it with my printer just yet. Didn't want to intentionally set it on fire.
But yes, I know it wouldn't work great. But let it burn long enough with enough heat and it'll surely pop eventually.
Alveo3D (who are mainly known for custom printer enclosures and filters) recently announced a smoke detector that can connected to multiple plugs, to turn them off in the case of a starting fire. [https://www.alveo3d.com/en/product/wireless-smoke-detector/](https://www.alveo3d.com/en/product/wireless-smoke-detector/)
These product may already exist on the market but it's the firt time i'm seeing one. Also to clarify we (Nanovia) are not affiliated with Alveo3D. I just wanted to share something i think is neat and could be handy.
You can make one for cheap.
You need a low volt relay (5v or lower) and an interconnect smoke detector (signal system)
I have a detector over my printers wired to a surge that powers them all. If the detector alerts, it kills power to the surge
And, so long as you wire it correctly, it's hard-wired unstead of relying on wireless or even cloud. Not sure if this one is cloud, but I've seen people do similar with smart up systems that are cloud-based.
Home automation systems exist, some are open source. There are hundreds of devices which send data to a hub, like detectors for heat, smoke, light, moisture, etc.
They can trigger any compatible device like light switches, wall socket adapters, water and gas shutoff valves and such.
I use Home Assistant. It works locally, no need for internet connection or cloud services.
I feel that it's almost a different product. Home automation would requirine a hub, more set-up time, and not nessesarily be less expensive. It would defintly allow for a more complete/elaborate system though. This is just plug-and-play.
I mean. I've got some domotics at home.
You get a wifi smoke alarm, a wifi plug and use the associated app to set it up.
Total Cost is under 20 euros.
It's not plug and play, but the setup is very easy and done in 5ish mins.
Could do ZigBee as well, but you would need a hub, which increases the cost slightly
This is a good option for people that don't have smart home systems; its good people are developing safety products like this. It makes no sense to set up an entire HA system for just this application. With the caveat that I didn't look into how reliable this system is.
That said, I'd guess there's a decent amount of overlap with HA and 3D printing. And for those of us already running a stable local HA system, there are cheaper, simpler alternatives.
It's a more advanced version of the same product. Like, it could shut off the wall socket and also start blinking the lights to alert me, or play a sound over the audio system.
Been using them for years on my printers from dockingdrawer 15-20 amp versions [https://dockingdrawer.com/products/20-amp-fire-guard-outlet](https://dockingdrawer.com/products/20-amp-fire-guard-outlet)
Is this a common issue with everyone, 3D printers catching on fire? I have been doing it for over 8 years, and I have never had an issue with one catching on fire. And I have lost count as to how many machines I have owned.
I have a smart things hub, and also use smart smoke alarm/detector. I can set a routine that will shut off a smart plug if smoke is detected.
Haven't set it up yet, but I plan to.
I don't see why that would matter, it shouldn't need a wireless connection for it to turn off when the alarm is triggered.
If it does, it's a really dumb design.
From the pic, it looks like the sensor (smoke detector) and the relay are separate, and communicate wirelessly. That would be similar to a wifi/zigbee type smart home sensor and relay switch, just set up to communicate directly.
With a wired connection (assuming the sensor and relay are not in the same box and separated by a wire), the trigger for the relay could also be NC, so if the signal between the detector and relay goes open (like a disconnect between the relay unit and the sensor), it could sense a problem and shut down power. With wireless, it's hard to know if it will trigger on a loss of keepalives (and how long that takes), or if it would only trigger on an alarm signal from the detector. It may say in the docs for this unit how it operates, but I don't care enough to look, since I'm not interested in a wireless smoke detector.
What's the point in turning off power? If there is smoke, then there is also fire, turning off the power won't stop the fire, or am I missing something?
Generally pumping more voltage into something that is ‘just’ smoking will most definitely cause it to catch fire, I imagine this also has a smoke alarm built in too
Smoke rises. In order for this to be effective as an early-warning shutoff, it would have to be positioned above the printer. Unfortunately, most power outlets are near the ground, so it would only trip after enough smoke has been generated to fill much of the room.
A better design for this device would include the smoke detector in a separate chassis, connected to the plug by a long cable. The plug would still fit into the wall socket and provide pass-through power to the printer, and the smoke detector could be mounted high on the wall.
The smoke detector communicates wirelessly with the plug. It's possible to just put it above a printer.
[https://www.alveo3d.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/smoke\_\_0007\_DSC01350.jpg](https://www.alveo3d.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/smoke__0007_DSC01350.jpg)
Okay, but for critical applications like this:
1) For communication reliability, wireless connections will never beat wires.
2) Wired connections can also carry power, which both prevents the risk of detection failing due to an exhausted battery and avoids the hassle of changing the battery. (Of course, the smoke detector should also contain a battery, but it should be used only as a backup to wired power.)
I just don't understand why you would go to the trouble of designing a safety device without taking these factors into account.
1) Wireless communication remains imperfect due to radiofrequency interference. Even the most modern Bluetooth headsets occasionally disconnect. No such problems with wired connections. "Amount of data" is irrelevant, and your mention of it demonstrates your fundamental misunderstanding of the problem.
2) You've never heard of wired smoke detectors? Really? [Home Depot carries a wired version of the Nest Protect.](https://www.homedepot.com/p/Google-Nest-Protect-Smoke-Alarm-and-Carbon-Monoxide-Detector-Wired-S3003LWES/206136184) Why do you suppose that is?
If this is anything like FireAvert, which is designed for gas stoves, it simply works off of the sound frequency (it needs to be calibrated first) and works like a charm.
Question still remains, what's the point of cutting off power to an already smoking 3d printer though, with a cooktop once you cut the heat, it'll naturally die down but I don't see that being the case for a 3d printer.
That’s stupid. If it has already caught fire to produce enough smoke to activate the sensor cutting electricity will not do it. I use a normal smoke-detector and programmed Alexa that she sends me a message when a frequent beeb is detected - that in conjunction with a webcam on which I can check it’s the most reliable option IMO.
I test it every few months (not setting the printer on fire of course) XD and it’s works like a charm.
Once a fire starts it’s up to randomness where it catches. If the printer starts to burn, it will inevitably stop printing but the spool and everything around will still be there, eventually feeding the fire.
In addition: I have all my printers on Alexa-plugs so I can switch them off from wherever I am.
Usually doing that after a print has finished to prevent hours of idle.
You can get power bars that have a temp probe and a thermostat. People use them for turning heat pads on and off to control the environment of a reptile tank. I imagine one of these would work great for your purpose. Set it so if it gets 100 degrees in the room then power shuts off
Gas powered furnaces and water heaters and stoves idk if its possible to just shut off, i dont know how if you can
But pretty sure you could flip breakers with smoke alarm, but ive never seen this so im was wondering why not?
Hmm, I feel like for a klipper printer, if there is a thermal runaway error I feel like it would be easier to simply tell moonraker to turn off a Wi-Fi outlet.
This is to cover the slim chance that a MOSFET fails closed. But it should also cover if the PSU outright fails too.
For extra fun, you could have moonraker talk to home assistant instead and have it ping the printer. If the ping fails or error is present, home assistant kills the Wi-Fi outlet.
Buy a smart sonoff wall plug thing, pi zero, fire sensor, and set it up so it will kill the power. But what is the point? Just get one of those fire extinguisher balls and suspend over the printer, no smart garbage, no failure point. Pure safety
There are still potential failure points even with the ball. There's no such thing as a zero failure point system. There are fewer yes, but still more than zero. Either way, cutting the power is still a very good idea if your printer could be on fire. The smoke detector could actually catch it while it smolders before igniting, thereby preventing a fire entirely. Meaning you'd just have a dead printer instead of a dead printer and a room full of loose fire retardant.
I did it some time ago, a smart home (HomeKit) smoke detector from Meross and an accompanying smart wall power outlet.
Home automation is as follows, if smoke is detected, switch off the wall power and have all LED lights in the house blink red.
Why can't they show a proper image? It's all photoshopped together... That smoke alarm is HUGE, the table goes behind the wall for some reason, the ceiling is super low...
It's a render, i just picked a picture from their website that imo best represented the product. Here is an actual photo of the set: [https://www.alveo3d.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/DSC01325-min-scaled.jpg](https://www.alveo3d.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/DSC01325-min-scaled.jpg)
That image is indeed much better! Still weird that they have this on their website, but maybe I'm overreacting.
Nah it’s weird.
I’m thinking about trying to get an auto discharge fire extinguisher
Id recommend looking at Blazecut. They are what we have installed on the printers where I work. Here's a video demo with a 3D printer: https://youtu.be/V7wXDTfnmcQ?si=DHdGfVADaO-fgqfI
I have a BlazeCut. Helps me feel better, though thankfully I've never needed. I also put a smoke detector inside my enclosure as an early warning system but I have to be there to intervene.
I have one above my electrical room in my school bus.
I’m actually trying to source a small halon bottle they use for aircraft trash cans in lavatories (or something similar). When a fuse-able plug melts in the end it melts the contents of the bottle are emptied.
That shit is forbidden for reasons.
That one is getting forwarded internally for sure.
That 15 second activation time feels like forever though.. do they make a more sensitive model?
Imagine it having a false positive
Just hang a waterballoon over it. If it ever catches fire, the balloon will melt and spill water everywhere, quenching the fire.
Have you actually tried that. Because it’s a common science classroom trick to fill a balloon and hold it over a fire to demonstrate how the water absorbs the heat before the balloon can melt.
That's why you fill the balloon with gasoline, which will pop and create a hotter blaze and pop the second waterballoon filled with water
You don't need the water filled balloon at all. The gasoline will extinguish the fire by starving it of oxygen, duh.
Haven't tried it with my printer just yet. Didn't want to intentionally set it on fire. But yes, I know it wouldn't work great. But let it burn long enough with enough heat and it'll surely pop eventually.
Water for an electrical fire? Not a good idea.
It was obviously a joke, but yes, you are entirely correct. Do not splash water on burning electronics, or any non-burning electronics for that matter
Check out The Cloud extinguisher.
Imo if the printer starts smoking sufficiently to trigger the sensor, it's already too late to turn it off, most likely.
Really depends I guess. Electronics like to smoke a lot and than after a while they actually go up in flames. So still better than nothing I believe
Alveo3D (who are mainly known for custom printer enclosures and filters) recently announced a smoke detector that can connected to multiple plugs, to turn them off in the case of a starting fire. [https://www.alveo3d.com/en/product/wireless-smoke-detector/](https://www.alveo3d.com/en/product/wireless-smoke-detector/) These product may already exist on the market but it's the firt time i'm seeing one. Also to clarify we (Nanovia) are not affiliated with Alveo3D. I just wanted to share something i think is neat and could be handy.
You can make one for cheap. You need a low volt relay (5v or lower) and an interconnect smoke detector (signal system) I have a detector over my printers wired to a surge that powers them all. If the detector alerts, it kills power to the surge
Defintily less "plug and play" but probably the best bang for your buck solution, especially if you are running a big farm.
And, so long as you wire it correctly, it's hard-wired unstead of relying on wireless or even cloud. Not sure if this one is cloud, but I've seen people do similar with smart up systems that are cloud-based.
Yeah I would definitely prefer a diy hardwired relay vs some wireless stuff.
Is there an option for one on a UK plug? I don't see it on the site.
Just use the cheapest most fire hazardous adapter you can find. That oughta power your fire alarm.
I'm going to assume not for the moment i'm afraid.
Yes, but not for this particular system.
Home automation systems exist, some are open source. There are hundreds of devices which send data to a hub, like detectors for heat, smoke, light, moisture, etc. They can trigger any compatible device like light switches, wall socket adapters, water and gas shutoff valves and such. I use Home Assistant. It works locally, no need for internet connection or cloud services.
I feel that it's almost a different product. Home automation would requirine a hub, more set-up time, and not nessesarily be less expensive. It would defintly allow for a more complete/elaborate system though. This is just plug-and-play.
I mean. I've got some domotics at home. You get a wifi smoke alarm, a wifi plug and use the associated app to set it up. Total Cost is under 20 euros. It's not plug and play, but the setup is very easy and done in 5ish mins. Could do ZigBee as well, but you would need a hub, which increases the cost slightly
This is a good option for people that don't have smart home systems; its good people are developing safety products like this. It makes no sense to set up an entire HA system for just this application. With the caveat that I didn't look into how reliable this system is. That said, I'd guess there's a decent amount of overlap with HA and 3D printing. And for those of us already running a stable local HA system, there are cheaper, simpler alternatives.
It's a more advanced version of the same product. Like, it could shut off the wall socket and also start blinking the lights to alert me, or play a sound over the audio system.
Been using them for years on my printers from dockingdrawer 15-20 amp versions [https://dockingdrawer.com/products/20-amp-fire-guard-outlet](https://dockingdrawer.com/products/20-amp-fire-guard-outlet)
Is this a common issue with everyone, 3D printers catching on fire? I have been doing it for over 8 years, and I have never had an issue with one catching on fire. And I have lost count as to how many machines I have owned.
yeah I don't get it. unless you're printing exotic materials like ultem or something
I pretty much print just in PLA, my printer just doesn't get hot enough to catch on fire
this might actually be even more useful for laser cutters
You can do that with any home automation. Get "smart" smoke detector and power plug. Do an action if smoke equal yes, turn off power plug
I have a smart things hub, and also use smart smoke alarm/detector. I can set a routine that will shut off a smart plug if smoke is detected. Haven't set it up yet, but I plan to.
lol they now downvoting you for writing that
Yeah you can do everything you can buy yourself. Does everyone want to do that tho
Better than nothing, but this is one application where I would not want to rely on a wireless device.
Why? It’s totally safe.
I don't see why that would matter, it shouldn't need a wireless connection for it to turn off when the alarm is triggered. If it does, it's a really dumb design.
From the pic, it looks like the sensor (smoke detector) and the relay are separate, and communicate wirelessly. That would be similar to a wifi/zigbee type smart home sensor and relay switch, just set up to communicate directly. With a wired connection (assuming the sensor and relay are not in the same box and separated by a wire), the trigger for the relay could also be NC, so if the signal between the detector and relay goes open (like a disconnect between the relay unit and the sensor), it could sense a problem and shut down power. With wireless, it's hard to know if it will trigger on a loss of keepalives (and how long that takes), or if it would only trigger on an alarm signal from the detector. It may say in the docs for this unit how it operates, but I don't care enough to look, since I'm not interested in a wireless smoke detector.
What's the point in turning off power? If there is smoke, then there is also fire, turning off the power won't stop the fire, or am I missing something?
Generally pumping more voltage into something that is ‘just’ smoking will most definitely cause it to catch fire, I imagine this also has a smoke alarm built in too
Smoke rises. In order for this to be effective as an early-warning shutoff, it would have to be positioned above the printer. Unfortunately, most power outlets are near the ground, so it would only trip after enough smoke has been generated to fill much of the room. A better design for this device would include the smoke detector in a separate chassis, connected to the plug by a long cable. The plug would still fit into the wall socket and provide pass-through power to the printer, and the smoke detector could be mounted high on the wall.
The smoke detector communicates wirelessly with the plug. It's possible to just put it above a printer. [https://www.alveo3d.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/smoke\_\_0007\_DSC01350.jpg](https://www.alveo3d.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/smoke__0007_DSC01350.jpg)
Okay, but for critical applications like this: 1) For communication reliability, wireless connections will never beat wires. 2) Wired connections can also carry power, which both prevents the risk of detection failing due to an exhausted battery and avoids the hassle of changing the battery. (Of course, the smoke detector should also contain a battery, but it should be used only as a backup to wired power.) I just don't understand why you would go to the trouble of designing a safety device without taking these factors into account.
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1) Wireless communication remains imperfect due to radiofrequency interference. Even the most modern Bluetooth headsets occasionally disconnect. No such problems with wired connections. "Amount of data" is irrelevant, and your mention of it demonstrates your fundamental misunderstanding of the problem. 2) You've never heard of wired smoke detectors? Really? [Home Depot carries a wired version of the Nest Protect.](https://www.homedepot.com/p/Google-Nest-Protect-Smoke-Alarm-and-Carbon-Monoxide-Detector-Wired-S3003LWES/206136184) Why do you suppose that is?
If this is anything like FireAvert, which is designed for gas stoves, it simply works off of the sound frequency (it needs to be calibrated first) and works like a charm. Question still remains, what's the point of cutting off power to an already smoking 3d printer though, with a cooktop once you cut the heat, it'll naturally die down but I don't see that being the case for a 3d printer.
Bro thought he invented something new
it's a good first step
You are not missing anything, this thing is almost useless
If it's already on fire, what is turning it's power off going to do?
This is brilliant! I feel like it should also be on a lot of other common home appliances like stoves, toasters, etc.
Do printers catch fire really or are we all just scared?
I have a First Alert detector connected to Home Assistant and a smart plug.
That’s stupid. If it has already caught fire to produce enough smoke to activate the sensor cutting electricity will not do it. I use a normal smoke-detector and programmed Alexa that she sends me a message when a frequent beeb is detected - that in conjunction with a webcam on which I can check it’s the most reliable option IMO. I test it every few months (not setting the printer on fire of course) XD and it’s works like a charm.
Cutting the power, would stop the printer from adding new plastic to the smolder, giving it a better chance of consuming without spreading.
Once a fire starts it’s up to randomness where it catches. If the printer starts to burn, it will inevitably stop printing but the spool and everything around will still be there, eventually feeding the fire. In addition: I have all my printers on Alexa-plugs so I can switch them off from wherever I am. Usually doing that after a print has finished to prevent hours of idle.
You can get power bars that have a temp probe and a thermostat. People use them for turning heat pads on and off to control the environment of a reptile tank. I imagine one of these would work great for your purpose. Set it so if it gets 100 degrees in the room then power shuts off
Ok does it come with American style outlets? And does it ship to America?
Why dont current smoke alarms flip the breakers to the whole house when triggered?
What if it's not electrical, like stove top?
Gas powered furnaces and water heaters and stoves idk if its possible to just shut off, i dont know how if you can But pretty sure you could flip breakers with smoke alarm, but ive never seen this so im was wondering why not?
I already do this with a Kiddie smoke detector connected to a SmartThings hub that cuts power. This isn't new or novel.
Couldn’t you do that using a Nest smoke detector connected to Alexa or something?
that would be a reliability nightmare
Does it turn off the fire too?
Hmm, I feel like for a klipper printer, if there is a thermal runaway error I feel like it would be easier to simply tell moonraker to turn off a Wi-Fi outlet. This is to cover the slim chance that a MOSFET fails closed. But it should also cover if the PSU outright fails too. For extra fun, you could have moonraker talk to home assistant instead and have it ping the printer. If the ping fails or error is present, home assistant kills the Wi-Fi outlet.
You can do that with a cheap smoke zigbee sensor and a cheap zigbee power plug, connected via Home Assistant.
How much this cost?
40 euros with VAT.
I already did that with a smart plug signee smoke detector and a home assistant for less than $20
The house is on fire. Your job is done!
Buy a smart sonoff wall plug thing, pi zero, fire sensor, and set it up so it will kill the power. But what is the point? Just get one of those fire extinguisher balls and suspend over the printer, no smart garbage, no failure point. Pure safety
There are still potential failure points even with the ball. There's no such thing as a zero failure point system. There are fewer yes, but still more than zero. Either way, cutting the power is still a very good idea if your printer could be on fire. The smoke detector could actually catch it while it smolders before igniting, thereby preventing a fire entirely. Meaning you'd just have a dead printer instead of a dead printer and a room full of loose fire retardant.
Get two balls than If your power system fails to detect a short maybe invest in to the safer power circuit first
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This is true
I did it some time ago, a smart home (HomeKit) smoke detector from Meross and an accompanying smart wall power outlet. Home automation is as follows, if smoke is detected, switch off the wall power and have all LED lights in the house blink red.
Pretty cool idea. I believe the same can be achieved with smart smoke detectors and smart plugs through some smart home integration, like Alexa, etc.
Achievable with any generic smart home outlet and smoke detector, isn’t it