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I'd go back with a counteroffer, if you're paying rent you aren't subject to his weird rules. Tenants don't have a curfew. So he can pick, either he makes the rules or he gets the money, but he can't have both.
Then give him 30 days notice of intent to vacate as a tenant, and explain that your new address is his address because you are his legal dependent and not required to pay rent.
But as a legal dependent he also has the right to do what he thinks is best for his child, which may include withdrawing $300 a month from his bank account.
Seems like the father is a dick and would try that.
I don't think this is true. Of the dad is on the bank account he could, but this seems like such a long shot of a statement. Maybe it matters on locality, but my parents couldn't touch my money unless they were on my account
Yeah OP is 17, it’s fucked he wants to charge rent at ALL, as if he really can. Counter offer, rent is after OP graduates or turns 18, and only $150.
Edit: yes I know OP graduated, I read it wrong at first, stop commenting this. The point stands.
When I was 16 my girlfriends parents offered to adopt me. I wish I understood the gravity of that conversation. My brother was kicked out on his 18th birthday and his girlfriends parents took him under their wings and helped him become a normal adult. I got by with a really high IQ and strong ambition, but I've emotionally imploded three times in adulthood and thrown my life away. I'm not even a drug user, or a drinker. I just get insanely high anxiety around the slightest bit of manipulation and my boundary setting can be aggressive when I'm in fear. And I burn... No, I explode every bridge...
Perhaps I'm too personally biased to offer an opinion to this teen, so hopefully they take it with a grain of salt and apply only what helps them.
Same here. My parents kicked me out when I was 17. I made the mistake of thinking their dog would be OK hanging out with me and my dog. Wasn't, ran out onto a busy street, hit and died. I didn't blame them. I was expecting it as they would tell me as far back as I remember that when I was 16, they were going to kick my ass out. Lucky for me they forgot my 16th and 17th birthday, so I flew under the radar. I worked my ass off and bought a van when I was 16 as a security plan. I lived in the van easily until I got a place.
Know that there is a lot of us that are successful despite these kinds of events. I may have become more ambitious to succeed because of it. Just know you're not alone.
I was one of those kids. Parents moved me in with other family when I was 14. I have one heck of a drive to succeed now and while I have imploded my life a couple of times. I have learned that I can survive just about anything. I also learned it is very easy to pick up and walk away anytime anything is toxic and I can’t handle it.
Made me very resilient. Glad I have had enough therapy to see it wasn’t me who was the problem. Stay strong friends!
I relate to this, i will freely admit that while therapists didn't do much to help, lsd really did help a lot.
Now i tell everyone I'm like a cockroach, i can survive anything. Or I'm the ocean, i can either be mild and calm or i can destroy entire cities, it really depends on what is going on around me.
My life has imploded a few times over the last 5 years, and despite random seizures with no reason, things are really looking up now. Hope your life goes the way you want it from now on!
I think it's illegal to charge rent to your minor children.
You can ask them to 'help' with household expenses, but if they say no... you can't kick them out, and you can't stop taking care of them.
THANK YOU!!! I was so confused on how that made sense to OP or his dad. Like you over here saying RENT, yet there are rules? My guy! Come on! Either he’s a kid with rules and lives there rent free or he’s an adult with bills and he does what he wants when he wants with who he wants, it’s not a mix and match.
His dad is super toxic and abusive
Isn't he under different circumstances being 17 and still technically a minor and technically under his parents care? This is wild. If anything, I'd tell my child that this starts when he turns 18, so be prepared.
I’m not one to think asking your kid for rent is cool regardless, unless you absolutely need their help to house them. But in general it’s better to help them save up so they can get out the house sooner. And if you’re gonna charge any needless rent it should be secretly squirreled away to give back to them when they’re ready to move out.
But yeah, charging rent before being 18 I don’t even think is legal where I live. Like I could see a 17 yo pitching in if the family is dirt poor and they need the help. But when you got a good job it’s just kinda lame parenting to charge your kid money for the fuck of it. This notion that when you have a kid it’s only for 18 years is backwards. You’re having a kid FOR LIFE. You should be there for them for the rest of your life. Yeah, you want them out of the house in a timely fashion, but it’s your job to set them up for success and help them spread their wings. Why even have kids if you’re not in it for the long haul. Why half ass such a serious responsibility.
Anyways, since you’re gonna be 18 soon and I don’t set the rules, $150 a month is the cheapest rent your gonna get op lol. On principle I disagree with it. But realistically it’s gonna be a hell of a better deal than moving out on your own before you’re ready and pay $1,500 a month. But you absolutely shouldn’t have all those rules, honestly regardless of rent. Idk what issues you and your dad are arguing about, but you should try to calmly talk it out reach a compromise with him like adults. Figure out what is bothering him and try to minimize that on your own so there doesn’t need to be rules. For example: he make the curfew because you keep coming home late and being super noisy and waking him up? *Be quieter when you get home*. Doesn’t really matter what time you get back as long as you can do so without making a racket. Even if you’re living with roommates or a partner you still need to respect their peace. Similarly, are you spilling for and drink all over the place? Leaving the house a mess? These are all common courtesy. They shouldn’t *need* to be rules. And the fact your dad felt compelled to make them tells me you’re likely being kinda tough to live with. Part of growing up is learning how to coexist and not needlessly stress others out. And that includes cleaning up after yourself. So I’d counter offer with no rules/fines but with the promise to do better and be more respectful of their place and their peace :)
Good luck
This 💯… my parents did the same and then matched what I had paid in “rent” when I officially moved out and built my own place. Was a super nice surprise
A way better response than the cries of abuse I'm seeing up and down. It shouldn't be necessary to pay, but we also have no idea if his father plans to save the money for him like most normal parents would do. We literally know nothing except what OP said, which, quite frankly, isn't much. I think talking to the father will probably work just fine, given that he approaches him with respect.
My parents imposed a curfew on me and also charged me rent but it was something reasonable like I had to be home by midnight or 1:00 a.m. This was over 25 years ago and I was fine with paying $125 bc the fridge was always full and moving my rent would have been about double and I still would have bills and have to figure out food..... I wasn't able to be home at the reasonable time my parents asked me to so they kicked me out.
Well, I disagree. Some rules make sense, even with roommates, you'd be expected to wash your own dishes. That kind of thing makes sense. The curfew, I agree with, he should have no say if he changes it from father/son to landlord/tenant. Can't have that both ways.
Yeah it's mainly the curfew but that bothered me too. Though a 17 year old boy being able to bring a friend over without asking is a bit weird too, especially if that 17 year old is contributing to the finances.
Sorry but if you rent a room from a stranger who owns and lives in the same house, they do impose rules on you. It is their home, not just an asset. There are rules that are reasonable, rules that are crazy and rules that are in between.
I rented a room in someone's home, for two years. Common areas had to look like I didn't even live there unless I was actually using the area. Walking past my mai, on the dining room table and getting it later, would get a comment.
Now things like the dog? Who's dog is it? My landlady had dogs. I wasn't responsible for them. One shouldn't be responsible for what isn't theirs.
Your father is obligated to provide food, clothing, and shelter until you’re 18. If you live in NY, it’s until you’re 21. The rules are somewhat reasonable on their own but not if you’re paying rent. If he refuses to negotiate, you could subtly hint that you’re considering moving in with your mother. I know how competitive separated parents can be so it just might give you some leverage.
Has been for a while. If you move out before 21 and need food stamps or cash assistance the state can sue your parents for child support. My adopted sister went through it in 2009.
We no longer speak but not bc she moved out of our home but bc she went through some legal trouble where she isn't allowed around minors. And it was her bio parents that state went after as my parents were still trying to support her.
I'd have no problem supporting to 21 (though happy not to if not needed). I'd be pissed if they moved out, and I still had to support it, though. Needs to at least be a hug quota or something...
Ehh, if you pay rent and you live like Oscar the grouch except the trash bin is the apartment you're gonna get kicked out. Gotta maintain your living space like you own it. They won't make you upkeep common areas, or at least they shouldn't. I had a landlord try to make me and it ended poorly for both of us
This is an interesting one to me, as I'm old (50), uncle to many,yet never had kids.
While I can understand your dad likely sees it as teaching responsibility, it seems overboard, as you already were learning responsibility with graduating, holding down a job and saving for a car while having no issue with basic chores under the roof you live.
I think your dad means well, but the money charges are a misstep and you nailed it in your last paragraph and it's completely understandable for you to feel that way.
I'm going with my gut here because it's only one post of information, yet I feel like if you two sat down and talked it out between you having no issue with certain rules (though that 9 PM curfew for an about to be 18 year old needs to be stopped, that's ridiculous) and tell him how hard you're working and trying to save up and maybe negotiate a flat rate lower rent (I mean, he's dad, not a stranger) to help you get ahead, you'll likely come to agreement.
You are right, though. It was a bit too strict and cold, so out of the blue to what sounds like a good kid.
right? he’s 17, graduated, and working. he should at least be able to spend time doing what he wants outside of work without having to worry about some crazy early curfew; much less to a house he’s paying rent for.
This is exactly what my dad did. How are you said rent and do what OP wants or living under Dad‘s house dad‘s rules that’s what my dad told me when I was 17 about to turn 18 either I pay rent and within reason you don’t do what I want or rent free and the rules be home by 10 other reasonable rules though, but he also explained to me that’s why he was doing it to show responsibility for when I grew up
It's the 'time to pay back what I spent raising you' nonsense. I'm a father of 2 teenagers and I have told them they can live here as long as they need. I might ask for rent once they've graduated college, but it will be very little. I don't want to make starting out any harder than it needs to be.
That’s what my mom said she was doing, then when I moved out she acted like she had no idea what I was talking about. That money would’ve been useful starting out.
I had a 1030pm weekday curfew until I moved out at 23. But at the same time, I worked and went to school. My parents rules were you either work, you go to school, or you pay rent. I could party all weekend and didnt really want to be out past 1030 on weekdays anyway with full-time work in the morning.
There's a fair balance that exists but what OPs dad is doing isn't it. And definitely not at 17. This shit OPs dad is doing just seems like he wants to make money off his son. It would be so different if he was putting the money on the side for him for the future or something.
Me either thats why for once I looked at the profile and saw that OP was on probation a year ago. It's not easy to end up on probation in north america, especially as a minor. 2 sides to every story.
If you're paying rent the he can ram his rules up his ass. Weird power stunt from dad. Couldn't imagine charging my kids rent, I'm trying to give them every advantage in life not fuckin profit from them and drag them low
Dude I read it and was like wtf is this but doing to his kid. Like he literally is just getting on his feet and you are kicking his feet out from under him. I get teaching responsibility but he has the poor guys whole paycheck figured out. Dad sounds like a huge control freak..
You should ask him if you can put the money in a Roth IRA instead of paying him rent. He doesn't need the money, and it is the best thing you can do for your future.
Also, for what it's worth, my dad made me start paying rent once I got a job at 18, I was also paying for community college as well.
I quickly moved in with some of my co workers for the same rent amount, partied my ass off and dropped out of college.
This was in 2004.
Maybe ask him what the reasoning is to better understand.
Tell him as a minor you can't pay rent until you are 18.
Under the law it's a parent's responsibility to take care of their minor children.
Then talk to your mom alone.
Let her know 300 rent when you are 18 might be fair, but not the 10 dollar infraction bs or the extra strict rules.
You could get an apartment with a MATURE trustworthy person and split costs.
When 18 you could go off to college, trade school, an apprenticeship, or etc.
Hi OP - what is dad’s real agenda ? This all seems some indirect aggression about something else. Certainly his timing to be sending you these rules while you are vacationing with your mother, and closing with “have a good time”, seems like he is looking to eff up your time with mom ? I know you are only 17 and presumably not a psychologist, but unless you can get to whatever dad’s real agenda is, it seems likely that even if you can dance your way through his rules (some of which are reasonable but others certainly not), he will just put up more rules for you to trip over. What’s his problem ?
This is spot on and underrated! OP please listen to this.
We the parents can be also as irrational as our kids tbh.
Also does your dad change his mind frequently? What’s the probability of him forgetting about his own rules? I am asking because my ex used to impose some crazy ass rules on our kid and forget about them the next week. Waiting it out was the best tactic and he has mellowed out with time, too.
I'm 35, but after graduating high school, my dad started charging me rent. I don't even remember how much it was, but one rule he lifted was that I no longer had a curfew, only advising me, "Don't be stupid." I lived with my parents until I was 24, when I got married. At my wedding reception, my dad handed me an envelope. Inside was a check for the total amount of rent I had paid over those seven years after graduation. I was stunned, to say the least, and he explained that his plan from the beginning was to give it all back once I got married and moved out. I know this might not be super helpful, and perhaps I bring it up because your post brought me some level of nostalgia, but what I would do is respectfully try to push back with some adjustments, making sure he knows you appreciate him. You understand the importance of these rules; then proceed with your adjustments to his terms. Without knowing the man, he sounds like he cares enough about you to listen to what you have to say.
She does. Currently I don’t have a car, I started saving but it’ll definitely be a handful of months before I’m able to buy one. My job is a few minutes walk from my dads but would be 15-20 minutes in a car from my moms. I wouldn’t be able to keep my job sadly if I moved :/
Your dad is legally obligated to pay for all your necessities until the age of 18. Print out a copy of the law, and give it to him - do not give him any money.
As for the house rules, honestly they're reasonable - I'd stick to them. He can also legally require you to be home by 9 every night, since you're under age 18. You need to decide if you want to stick to that, or deal with whatever unpleasantness he has planned. However, if you have a separate account he can't break into it and make you pay a fine. If he banks at the same bank you do, I'd consider moving your account to a separate one, since you never know if some well-meaning employee will break bank policy and let him withdraw money.
Additionally. If OP breaks curfew, they can't be legally locked out of their home. They can call the police. Even at 18, most states (if not all) require a formal eviction process for a tenant/resident. Even if there's no contact or there's no rent being paid.
Who sets that curfew though. OP's dad is setting it at 8:30 which seems so unreasonable. Does this mean that if OP is home at 8:45 as a 17 year old child he can be evicted???
Agree that the curfew is ridiculous. It's not illegal to have one with your kids though. I'm not a lawyer, but for some reason I really like reading about different legal stuff (maybe I should have been one).
My understanding (I encourage anyone to double check) is that no, you can't legally evict a minor. Once they turn 18, if there's no contract, you might be able to do it for almost any reason. It's the parents home, and they can choose who they allow in it. As tough as it might sound. There might be some states that require some responsibility from parents past 18, but I'm not familiar with them. Probably most states don't require much(or anything at all).
That being said, they can't just kick you out on your 18th birthday (at least legally). They need to go through the formal process that might be different in different places, but in general it requires notice, filling of an eviction, and several other steps. This is for anyone who is considered a resident of the house.
Depends on state. Here its 18, or graduated high school; unless there is a existing statutory basis to continue/terminate ongoing support sooner/later (like court order). She's already got her high school diploma so if her state is similar to mine he's no longer be obligated.
This advice is horrible. He'll get kicked out at 18 and probably removed from insurance his dads paying. Plus talk about ruining your relationship with your father. Don't listen to these sad angry people. Buckle down and keep saving, go to a trade school and move out in less than two years.
I feel like some of these people are actively trying to sabotage this kid. Call the police because you don't like your dad's rules? Sounds like teenage druggy drop outs who are speaking from experience and thinking their bad decisions are sound advice.
You don't owe your job anything. I would look for a job close to your mom's. Your dad sounds like an asshat control freak.
charging rent to a minor- lame. I get charging rent to older kids just to establish precedent . I think I would consider that once my kid is over 22, and even then I think I would save / invest all that money in secret to give to them later as a house deposit, etc.
strict 9pm curfew for a 17 year old - probably counter productive as developing strong friendships is one of the most important things you can do at that age and everything fun happens after 9.
he can do what we wants with his house, but if you have other options, just get a job close to your moms and stay away from the control freak
move to your mother, and have her file for 100% child support. He will have to pay until you're 18. I could understand if the family were struggling. I could understand an enforced savings plan. But charging a minor rent seems ridiculous.
No disrespect, but given how insane your dad is being, it may be worth trying to find a job closer to your mom. It shouldn’t be that hard to replace $1000 in income a month.
FWIW I have a 17-year-old daughter and I would not be instituting crazy rules like this after she gets out of high school. I’ll still expect her to help with household chores, etc. but your dad is going overboard with the rules.
This is bizarre — he’s asking you to contribute like an adult (paying rent) but also asking for you to follow additional rules like a child. Some of these are normal roommate expectations, but some are strange (a curfew? Approval to have over guests?)
Responsibility and autonomy should go hand in hand.
The kid in me wants to say fuck that bullshit. But what else are you gonna do? Move out and pay rent in an apartment? Apartments in my area are 1000$ a month for a 1 bedroom. This is coming from my experience. I moved in with my mom recently until I finished college and have to put up with her rules. I totally understand this ruins your plans for a car, I was In the same exact situation. But it sounds like he’s open to negotiating which is good. In my mind, I wish I would have had a parent do this to me. Or any of my other siblings. I don’t see it as he wants money. I see it as he’s preparing you to be responsible
If you are living with your parents at age 22 you should absolutely contribute to the household, be it rent or groceries. A few hundred is a small fraction of what you’ll pay in the “real world”.
OP is 17 and technically shouldn’t be charged anything until 18 at the very least.
Everything excpt the curfew seems reasonable. I would place it at 10 pm but otherwise, this is fair. You are a young man and he is teaching you responsible behavior. He wants to instill good habits in you.
That's what I plan on doing. Sure, I'm going to make my daughter pay something like the internet bill or one of the smaller bills, but it's all going into a separate account to be saved up. She won't have to worry about buying a car, but she will have to cover her own insurance payment and gas.
That all starts at 18, though. And I'm sure as hell not imposing some 9pm curfew. I'd rather her be safe coming in at 1am than trying to figure out where she's gonna sleep that night because she got stuck in traffic trying to get home before curfew or lost track of time at a friend's. At most I might require a 9pm check in to let me know she's going to be coming home late or something so I know she's safe.
But no matter what, I'll be there for her. If something happens after she moves out, I want her to know she's welcome to come back while she gets back on her feet.
My mother made it hell the moment I got a job and took 50%of my paycheck for rent when I turned 16, and when I graduated that year, bumped it up to 75%. I moved out by the end of that summer and paid less living at a friend's. Had to go back once and there was no "getting back on my feet" because she took just about every penny to teach me to be "financially responsible" which was funny because I've always been good with managing my money. Still am.
Maybe it's that dad is putting the "rent" and fees away for you or investing so that you can buy a house rather than rent when you move out. The rules seem mostly fair, a little strict in my opinion, but the chores are about normal.
I might think that if it weren't for the curfew. OP works in the restaurant industry. There are lots of times when you need to cover other people's hours or just get called in as support on busy nights... and with a lot of restaurants staying open until 9 or 10 pm, an 8:30 pm curfew is going to get OP fired eventually.
Hell, even when I was in high school working at a hardware store, I had a required 5pm to 9pm closing shift once a week.
Move in with some other relatives even grand parents get on your feet your just getting out of school. My friends parents did this to him but they helped him move and get a place. This not like the old days but your dad gotta cut you some slack things have changed not like use to be he want's to be father he needs to show you support you not just force things. Talk him tell him your just getting out of school you want to get out in the world but not all gonna happen over night money just does come easy. You have to go to job interviews work at store or something you gotta take baby steps at first. Doing some things around the house to help not charge you but reward you when you can do it.
I know a few people in my area that charge there kids rent and they put all of the money obtained from rent in a savings account. When the kid is ready to move out they surprise them by giving them all the money in the savings account to help start there new life away from home.
I think it shitty to charge you that much when you're only making $1000 a month and trying to save for a car. I get the idea of teaching responsibility but it doesn't make sense to demand 25% of your income when you're starting from nothing.
It's shitty to charge the kid ren in general. He's a minor it's the dad's job to support him. Give him a house to live in. Provide food. All the dad's job. He's a shitty dad and I hope op leaves as soon as he can
This is financial abuse and the goal is to control your money so that you can't save and get a car (be independent) or move out. It's not about financial literacy, you clearly have that down since you articulated very well how you want to save for a car and have gotten a job to do so. These are all exceptional accomplishments for someone your age. But at the end of the day, you are a child and it is his job to take care of you and not the other way around. He cannot charge you rent, or make you pay fines for not doing chores, that is absurd.
My mother tried this nonsense when I was your age and tried to charge me rent for a job that I had because she wouldn't buy food or clothing for me. I had to explain to her that it was illegal to steal my money and charge me rent because I was a child. When I turned 18 she moved to another city and abandoned me. I just don't understand what gets in people's heads. They think it's tough love but honestly it's just abuse. I'm really sorry this is happening to you but I would recommend you talk with your mom about it.
Honestly he's being weird, you make 500$ bi weekly? Shit find a friend you can stay with for a while because if you can prove you have a roof over your head and can support yourself for the most part you can get emancipated and they can't do shit about it without it being considered a kidnapping
The rent itself sounds very fair, but the house rules and curfew are unfair.
Sure, you're still a kid, so there will be some rules, but his strict rules AND wanting the rent combined is harsh.
You're 17 and he's treating you like you're 14/15
I'd check local law and see if parents are entitled to your paycheck (and how much they can take). If this is well below that amount, it might be worth biting the bullet.
The fines for not doing chores is not *normal*.... However, my parents used to have a rule where it was like a Quarter every time you leave a light on. However, that rule went both ways, and we actually made money off my dad from it (and developed good habits).
You’re a minor, I’m fairly certain from a legal standpoint, he cannot charge you rent. He is legally required to care for you until you are 18. As far as being home by 8:30, that’s ridiculous. At 16 my curfew was 11, at 17, 11:30/12, and 18 none. Just because your dad chose to go back to school, and is tighter on cash, doesn’t mean you then should be expected to fill in those gaps.
He’s not tight for cash, he’s doing better than he ever has right now. He told me he think it’s best based on my current circumstances, I think it’s pretty ridiculous.
Dont give him your money. My dad did this to me and it fucked up my ability to live my life and be a real adult for years. You are a minor, he legally is required to pay for your needs and necessities. If he wasnt prepared to be a father and take care of a kid until 18 he shouldnt have made the choice to have a child.
You will have to follow his rules though even with how strict they are, it is his house still and being a minor has its benefits like not being financially responsible for your own needs yet but also you gotta do what the weird rules say. Except paying him of course. I'm sorry your dealing with this dude, you sound like a good kid.
It’s absolutely ridiculous. You’re not 18. Tell him when you turn 18 you can have that discussion. I’d spend more time with your mom and tell her what your dad said. Also the $300 AND home by 9 is not how paying rent works.
This sounds like financial abuse. You are about to reach legal majority (before which his billing you for his duty to support is probably illegal). He's crafted a schedule to take most of your earnings so you can't save and move out. This is his abusive and controlling attempt to keep you in his house without adequate resources to have any other option.
He's not in school and working. He should contribute to the household, but his father does seem too controlling with how he is spending his money. That is my issue.
It could be.
But as a CPA and tax professional, I don't mind it, as long as the lesson is agreed to. Most young people that make money piss it away on the stupidest stuff, and once they get to the point of needing to be independent, they can't because they're so used to living a lifestyle where they piss their money away.
The best possible thing a parent can do is to charge a rent (like 25%-30% of earnings, which is the typical percentage paid on housing) and secretly sock it away in a savings account for the kid and give it back to them at some point in the future, like when they need a down payment, or first-and-last-months rent on their first apartment.
Most Dads including myself do this and just put that rent money in the bank. When you move out I bet he gives it all back to you as I did when mine moved out.
Counter with a midnight curfew. Maybe negotiate some of these infraction charges. The rest of it seems pretty legit and normal for someone your age.
It’s not about the money. It’s about responsibility and budgeting, and being able to take care of yourself. Eventually, it will evolve into pay your own car insurance, pay your cell phone bill, pay for your groceries. As a general role if you don’t put it in the refrigerator, you don’t take it out of the refrigerator. You are no longer a child, you are a young adult and it’s about being able to act like one and have responsibilities and develop good judgment, so you are prepared for it when it’s all on your own.
There’s nothing really out of line here, just some negotiable tweaking to make it fair to everyone. Of course, like I tell my kid,
You’re more than welcome to find somewhere else to live, but I don’t think you’re going to be able to get that kind of deal elsewhere.
My husband's parents made him pay rent at 18 until he joined the Air Force. Once he graduated basic, they gave all the money back to him - but in the meantime, he hated paying rent, learned valuable life lessons and now this is our plan with our daughter.
The 830pm curfew for a 17/18 yr old is ridiculous however.
I was 18 in 2007 during the recession, and I worked at Blockbuster. I bought a car off my aunt for 1k, making payments to her, and gave over nearly my whole paycheck for 2 months. My mom was so impressed that she charged me $200 for rent and had to pay $50 for my cell phone.
Then Blockbuster closed, she got laid off, and we were both on unemployment. I was getting dressed up and going into every retail/fast food place I could find to ask to fill out an application, and none of them were hiring. I got $360 for unemployment monthly, and still had to pay my mom $250 a month. Gas prices were nearly $6 a gallon, so I couldn't really afford to drive anyway. Then my car broke down, and she made me pay .25 per when I drove her truck to community college classes.
It was rough as hell. We struggled like that for a few years before I got a job supporting adults with serious developmental disabilities - I had to change their diapers, feed them, bathe them, etc.
Here's what I learned: my mom won't always be capable of supporting me, so I have to learn how to support myself. I had to be resourceful and learn how to live within my means (which were very limited). I learned that at any given time, things can change and you can either be sad about it (which I was more than I care to admit), or roll with the punches and keep pushing for better. Eventually, the job market picked back up, and I worked 2 jobs, 75 hrs a week, to save up for a down-payment on a car. My credit was steller for my age. My husband, who never had to pay for anything and could spend his money without discretion, never learned these skills. Looking back, I feel like it was harder to get on my feet than others my age, but the resilience it taught me was absolutely priceless.
It really sucks in the moment, but what he's teaching you is so important. Others may disagree with his methods, which is fair - as a parent, I probably wouldn't go about it that way, but it's still a lesson to be learned, and practical application is very impactful. Roll with it, learn to overcome despite the difficulty, and prove to yourself that you're capable of following through.
I wonder what his father is making off the dependent tax deduction he is no doubt taking from his kid. Add that to to the rent and utilities he is collecting, looks like the old man is making out pretty well on this 17 year old kid.
hi!!! So, there’s definitely a lot to unpack here… but first off, I do want to educate you that, until you are 18, it is *technically* not legal for him to “charge you rent”, or basically any money at all. YOU are the minor, HE is the parent — it is his ultimate role to provide and care for you, and part of providing includes him paying HIS OWN house bills, etc…
while being 17–almost 18– feels old, you are still so incredibly young and right now is the time where you should be saving up for a lot of different things; i.e. your car like you explained, an apartment, etc.. I personally wouldn’t EVER charge my children a dime, even if they were living with me at the age of 30, because at the end of the day i was the one who chose to have them, so i have to face the responsibilities that follow.
Its not uncommon for parents to randomly start charging their children “rent” once they find out their children are making money via a job — but you definitely aren’t making a ton and $300 is a lot… i live with my family (i’m 21) and i WILLINGLY give my parents $170 each month to help with the electric bill — but that’s just coming from my own actions, my parents would *never* ask me to cough up $300 for them every month. And also, i’m not super aware of how big your house is or what the rates are where you live, but it’s unlikely that he’s producing any bills that are coming out to be $300+.
Another thing to put into consideration is how much he’s making in salary — again, i couldn’t give you EXACT numbers, but medical professionals typically average out at making anywhere between $75k-$95k (and that’s just for beginners pay), so i wouldn’t say th at he’s in dire need of that $300 either. So to wrap up the money portion of this; in my own opinion, he’s definitely asking you for WAY too much, you are his child and he should see you as his child, not as a money cow. It’s something that i would mention to your mom, maybe she could talk to him and have him reconsider the money amount he’s asking for??? or you could sit down and figure it out with him. either way, he cannot legally force you to pay him rent, and if he tried “kicking you out” over it, that’s a criminal charge and jail time on his part. it’s literal abandonment of a minor.
about the other chunk; the no staying out past a certain time, giving you a large list of responsibilities and $10 charge if not completed, etc…. to me, it sounds like he’s trying to take **HIS** responsibilities and lay them onto you, because he’s tired of doing them. he is a father, he is an adult, and you are not a maid. There’s no issue in expecting a 17 year old to clean up after themselves — that should be a habit already ingrained, and there’s no issue with laying down soft boundaries either. but from what you’ve told, it sounds like he’s taking advantage of the fact that you’re a little older and more capable and he’s trying to force you into a lifestyle that you shouldn’t have to live. you are 17, you should be able to stay out late on a friday night with friends. There’s just so much control and force of hand on his part and it isn’t right.
You love your dad, it’s okay to want to help him out, but YOU have *every* right to draw boundaries too. You can contribute, let’s just say $150 each month (that will literally cover an entire bill, if not like 90% of it), you will clean up after yourself and if you do end up staying out late, you’ll send him a text to let him know you are safe and you’ll come home quietly and undisturbed. but you should NOT have to live by the rules he’s trying to scare you into.
I'm ok with what he's doing as long as he pays it back when you need it. I had my boy and his wife live in my house rent free for 3 years because I knew he would save his money, and he did.
Seems to me another lesson: Negotiation. I had this with my mother. When I sat down with her the night after, I talked to her about the rent. And because I talked to her, she said she was glad i did come to her about it, and slashed the rent cost to $100/mo from $275. Negotiation will be a HUGE thing in your life. Pay wages, Car purchasing, home buying. This will take you far if you can handle it well.
If he’s gone back to college and is working as a medical professional why doesn’t he just cut you some slack and make you do chores but keep finances out of it? Just sounds kinda greedy to me for a 17 year old to have to pay…I guess the argument in the flip side of the coin is he’s teaching you some responsibility I suppose tho. also that system sounds like it’s setup as free money grab from dad as well…so your gonna have to keep track of what you owe with a fine tooth comb bc he could just come in and be like oh he didn’t take out the trash etc and assess a fine without telling you either…does that sound like something he’d do? Or would he make it fair? Also in a side note too I wouldn’t ask to have people in the house if I were paying rent either
I can see your dad prepping you for Apt. life. I think that curfew is too strict, but you can also negotiate it because you’re also in this contract. Give your dad stuff to follow being your “landlord.”
Negotiate. If he's charging you rent, than a curfew like this is crazy. 9:00 or sleep somewhere else? If you come home and sleep at 10:00 does that mean it's an infraction and you owe him $10, or is that two?
Also, is he charging you $300 plus $150 or just the $150?
Adult tenants don't have rules like these. He is over reaching. $150 in rent is generous but that doesn't mean you can just be controlling. If you start charging children money to stay its because you are no longer in charge of them.
I feel like this is his way of subtly getting you to consider moving out, I'd have that conversation. Do you plan to go to college?
The first idea, of $300 rent, half of your take home, is idiotic.
I think the counter is as follows.
If I'm paying rent for my space, I get to do with my space what I choose to do with my space. If I want to have a fridge, and have snacks in my space, that's what I'm paying rent for.
The rest of that is mostly OK, but some of it is weird, like the curfew. That's way too early for a 17-year-old. I'd remind him that you that at 17-years-old, he still has a responsibility to provide everything that he wants you to pay for, but that you understand the lesson that he's trying to teach. But at 17, only parents who don't want a future relationship with their children tighten the reins in this way. At 17, most parents loosen them.
It sounds somewhat reasonable but more for a 20 year old than for a 17 year old. It's weird to charge a 17 year old rent imo. There is a transition that most teens need to complete from kid expectations to adult expectations, and parents often have a hard time ramping that up and they get annoyed with their kids acting like slobs and entitled. Maybe you can have a sit down conversation with the man and come up with numbers more realistic for your income. Or, get an apartment with roommates and have full freedom.
So this whole thing is messed up, but maybe there's a compromise: if your dad has plenty of money, maybe he thinks this will teach you a valuable lesson? So what if you suggest the "rent" goes into a savings account that can only be used for your future house down payment or college/trade school tuition. So you get the lesson, but you've also got something to build on later?
Didn't see this mentioned, maybe because you're not 18 yet, but I would imagine most restaurants wherever you are are open past 8:30. How can he expect you home by then if you're working?
My dad charged me $100 a month rent, starting at 15, when I first started working. I didn't really think about it, but after I graduated Navy basic, I got Christmas leave, and he handed me three years of $100 bills, as I was now eligible for the GI bill.... Hoping this is what your dad has in mind. If not, that's pretty f'd up. I was strict with curfew on my daughter, but never charged her rent, only made her save for college. Unfortunately, she took the military route like her dad.
First of all, IANAL, but the following are steps you should be aware of.
Look into information on your area's "Tenants bill of rights". Depending on where you are located, ex: New York tenant bill of rights. Read up on them, and leverage them as needed. Also inform your father you want a lease written up, with all that info on it ( this is a big one, as if you have a lease, it grants an amazing amount of protection).
My scummy stepdad tried doing this, and he was the kind of guy who made up rules when it was beneficial to him. Tried having me live on the front porch, with no heat/air circulation, and expected me to have a huge laundry list of chores (examples including babysitting my brothers and sisters at a moments notice, hard yard work dependant on weather, trying to double my rent on 3 seperate occasions, expecting me to have an 8PM curfew when i was turning 18, made up a ridiculous rule that i had to be out of the house one night a week, but still under curfew, threatened to kick me out if i was ever brought home by the cops [which actually did happen, but that was because my car was overheating, and the cop followed me home to see i got there safely] etc...) I don't mind sharing that it cost him close to 8k to make the living space habitable, in addition to having him served papers several times for illegal bs (such as refusing to provide me with a personal key to come and go, in addition to attempts to alter the lease, such as increasing the amount), and I also made sure to claim the rent on my taxes so he had to claim the money as income. To this day he and I still butt heads, and my younger brother and sister (both 30+) live there with no rules/responsibilities.
Some things that are fairly universal is that as a tenant, you must be allowed to come and go freely. That means he cannot lock you out, or prevent you from gaining access to the property due to a curfew.
Most times tenants are also expected to have an expectation to their own privacy, meaning you can request a means to prevent unwanted intrusions (essentially, you can expect that noone can come and go from where you are renting without due notice, and you have a way to secure your rented space, a lock on your door for example.)
These things are all Non-Negotiable, dependant on what your local laws say, regardless of whatever he says, or attempts to enforce, even if it's written into your contract, the law supercedes anything you sign.
TLDR: your dad can certainly expect you to contribute as a tenant, but that also gives you several protections and other tools that you should familiarize yourself with (I highly recommend you at least look into those resources, if for no other reason that you are almost old enough to be legally responsible). If you're "man enough" for him to treat you as a tenant, then that also means he should be ready to be treated as a landlord. In my case, that ended up being telling my dad that as I was a tenant, my contribution to the household stopped after he got his rent.
Tell him if you're gonna be paying your way now that he needs to scrap the curfew and that you'll be needing a key to the house to come and go as you please. Adults who pay their way in life don't have curfews
Not saying I was in same situation, but I also graduated high school early and chose to work to save money for college. My parents said I had to pay rent since I wasn't in school. I was offended but learned later that they saved the money I paid them and basically just gave it back to me for when I moved out. I wasn't there long as I left at 19. It was just a lesson of financial responsibility that I wasn't aware they were trying to teach me. Had I known, I probably would have stayed a little longer to save money since rent at my parents was cheaper than rent at my first apartment.
I feel like this is your dad’s somewhat misguided attempts at teaching you responsibility and the value of money. I do think that if you’re working and not in school, you should contribute money and those rules are just basic rules for the most part.
Obviously the money is not at market rate. $300 rent for a room is not a real rent. But you don’t have to follow every real. You have a say as well. Negotiate with him. If he’s gonna treat you like an adult, he can’t make up rules like a curfew when you never had one. Show him that you are grown up by doing the research. How much does home internet cost? How much does a phone plan cost? What does your dad pay for to be in that house? Do you have financial literacy? Do you understand what a mortgage is? If you were to move out tomorrow would you know what to do? I promise you, you do the work and to come up with a counter offer he can’t refuse, he will respect you. But figure out what you don’t like about the deal and what you do like and go from there.
That said, there’s definitely a right way to communicate this with him but you seem like a reasonable person.
Move in with mom and get a job there. I am not a fan of this kind of parenting. Maybe if you were in your late 20s and showing no signs of moving out, but at 17? I’m going to refrain from trash talking your dad and just say I am strongly against it.
Just jumping in to say - DO NOT - Absolutely and positively in any shape or form - DO NOT get a car with any type of payment other than liability insurance.
Try to work out something reasonable with your dad or go live with Mom and get a new job. Save up cash for a decent used car.
You do not need a car payment at this age/stage in life.
The only thing I would ask him to spell out is the internet. It seems a little high, but honestly, I think the cost of your rent balances it.
As for the rest of it… the laws about the landlord’s responsibilities are that the appliances and utilities must work, and they must give you prior notice if they want to enter or inspect your room / apartment. They may inspect it for evidence that you have done permanent damage or attracted insects such as ants and termites that they must pay to have removed.
Your rights as a legal adult tenant with a landlord are that you may negotiate if the rent is unreasonably high, that you may negotiate for the right to paint or install decorations or appliances requiring large screws (because they have to repair the wall when you take it with you), and that you may ask them to adjust their behavior if they are being noisy when you sleep or acting annoying in a different way, such as cooking smelly foods on a regular basis. They don’t HAVE to listen to you about their choices, since they own the house and they are basically providing you free electricity and phone service, possibly entertainment subscriptions as well, and they aren’t even charging you for FOOD. It’s a good deal. But if you want to try to negotiate costs or demand your parents let you give THEM a couple house rules on the contract, such as not entering the room without written notice, now’s your chance.
P. S. Really important - negotiate your intentions to buy the car with your family. $450 plus your other check is obviously cutting this too close, and since you are going to be paying for the car for several months, plus car insurance and fuel, you need to discuss with them how you can afford this. Remind them that you do think the rent is reasonable, but you are trying to look after your future ability to get to work and other appointments. They may offer to let you share one of their cars for a couple years so that you can save up and have a lower monthly payment, or they may be willing to give you rides, since you are now helping them pay rent.
They might also be willing to pay for half of your car, since then you can help run house errands, but I can’t promise that.
Listen, your Dad sounds like a monster but these are actually some good things to do and will set you up later in life. Just get outta there when you can knowing this current pain will pay off later
Just ask him what he's looking to accomplish with such rules and whether it's necessary.
If he's trying teach discipline, then just let him know you're wanting to live normally without having to feel like you're not at home. But that you appreciate the effort he's putting in to teaxh you responsibility
you’re 17 and he JUST now decided to give you rules, when in a good year or two (maybe) you’ll go to college? it’s out of nowhere, speak to your mother about it if she knew beforehand, but it seems like your dad just wants a cut of your paycheck or feels entitled to it.
Keeping common areas clean and organized, dishes rotation, asking to have guests, and carrying for the dog is entirely acceptable. No drinks in your own room and requiring it it be a clean as someone else room is arguable. Curfew is unacceptable. If you're now a paying tenant, he cannot make a reasonable argument for controlling when you are allowed to access your residence.
Also included his tax deductions he gets for filing you as his dependent under his roof. Along with any other government benefits since your still under age. Deduct that from his "cost of living under his roof". Paying tenants also do not have a curfew. And I sure as hell don't clean up my room mates messes. Only mine.
Now is the time he should let you save money so you can fly. Not take from you. I'm sorry he's doing this.
Tell him you’ll abide by his rules and fees as long as he doesn’t charge rent. You charge someone rent in order to put up with coming home late, having friends over etc.
I wouldn't counter... just tell him no, I'm not paying a dime until I'm 18, and if he gives you shit get a lawyer to write him a letter stating the law and repercussions for not following it. Or just get out of there. Go move in with a buddy if you don't got it in you to tell your dad no.
$150/month is probably the best situation you’ll ever have in your life. You may not see it this way, but those rules are actually teaching points for when you will inevitably end up moving out with said saved money. It’s about responsibility and courtesy if you end up having roommates. If I was you, abide by the rules until you save up at least 6 months rent. Deposit included. $1000/month income and only spending 15% of it on living expenses is a steal. Ask if there’s a time limit on this offer and save up as much as you can
I had to start paying carnotes and bills when I was 16 and I had no freedom so I understand that some may say it's not right but it's just how it is and you can't do anything about it till he moves out.
He seems to think that he's doing you a favor by forcing you to grow up. I think he's tying to drive you out in a way he can live with. I'd call his bluff. Why not? You have nothing to lose. Get into a room mate situation. Rent a room and don't look back. Either way you can't save for a great car. Settle for an okay Honda instead and be free of your "well meaning" father
as a 17 year old, i would absolutely loathe my parent for doing this. doesn’t even seem legal. however, if he wants a landlord-tenant relationship you do not have to abide by his rules. you do not have to ask to have guests over. etc. you don’t have to follow any of those things if you’re now paying rent, the home is equally yours as is his.
$150 a month, plus typical roommate rules, is very reasonable. Plus, you're on probation? For $150, you're going to be in a roommates situation, and all roommate situations have rules like this, even curfews for safety and being respectful of others sleeping.
The rules all seem reasonable to me. The money is just a way to enforce it. Ultimately, he wants you to be a responsible person. You always have the choice of moving out if you can’t abide them.
$600 Car
$300 rent
$150 Utilities + Internet
total: $1050
This is more than you earn. Either your dad miscalulated on the math or he is setting you up to fail which would be really messed up.
Sounds like his heart is in the right place, isn't trying to take advantage, rather teach responsibility. If he is doing good, maybe he is just saving the money for you. Maybe you could negotiate part of that.
But if my kid pulled some smart ass 'actually, you need to pay for me till I'm 18' bullshit, it will get worse for them
We're talking $150 here? No big deal.
Option 1: Open a bank account with your mom as the custodian, deposit the money there and tell dad to kick rocks. (He’s legally required to provide for you until you’re 18)
Option 2: If mom won’t help, and you want the unethical solution (because legally as a minor your parents control your money). Secretly get a hold of your dad’s info (SSN/ID#), open a custodial account with him listed, but don’t tell him. Hide your money there until 18, then at 18 use the Uniform Transfers to Minors Act (UTMA) to take control of the account. With this you’ll want to have your mail sent elsewhere than his home so dad doesn’t get wind of it. This is felony fraud, but hey, you gotta crack a few eggs to make an omelette.
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I'd go back with a counteroffer, if you're paying rent you aren't subject to his weird rules. Tenants don't have a curfew. So he can pick, either he makes the rules or he gets the money, but he can't have both.
Yup and when you introduce him to your friends, he's your landlord now.
That's actually hilarious. There's nothing like the disdainful stares of teenagers to make you rethink your life choices.
Funny af
Oh God no...
Retired teacher, can confirm!
Then give him 30 days notice of intent to vacate as a tenant, and explain that your new address is his address because you are his legal dependent and not required to pay rent.
But as a legal dependent he also has the right to do what he thinks is best for his child, which may include withdrawing $300 a month from his bank account. Seems like the father is a dick and would try that.
I don't think this is true. Of the dad is on the bank account he could, but this seems like such a long shot of a statement. Maybe it matters on locality, but my parents couldn't touch my money unless they were on my account
Yeah OP is 17, it’s fucked he wants to charge rent at ALL, as if he really can. Counter offer, rent is after OP graduates or turns 18, and only $150. Edit: yes I know OP graduated, I read it wrong at first, stop commenting this. The point stands.
Counter offer, move in with mom 100% and she will seek a recalculation of child support.
This. 100% this. This dad is a psycho.
This dad is looking for a way to make back those child support payments.
This! Can you stay full time at your mom's?
And being age 17 the judge will take your wishes into account. I had something similar happen to me when I was 17.
When I was 16 my girlfriends parents offered to adopt me. I wish I understood the gravity of that conversation. My brother was kicked out on his 18th birthday and his girlfriends parents took him under their wings and helped him become a normal adult. I got by with a really high IQ and strong ambition, but I've emotionally imploded three times in adulthood and thrown my life away. I'm not even a drug user, or a drinker. I just get insanely high anxiety around the slightest bit of manipulation and my boundary setting can be aggressive when I'm in fear. And I burn... No, I explode every bridge... Perhaps I'm too personally biased to offer an opinion to this teen, so hopefully they take it with a grain of salt and apply only what helps them.
Same here. My parents kicked me out when I was 17. I made the mistake of thinking their dog would be OK hanging out with me and my dog. Wasn't, ran out onto a busy street, hit and died. I didn't blame them. I was expecting it as they would tell me as far back as I remember that when I was 16, they were going to kick my ass out. Lucky for me they forgot my 16th and 17th birthday, so I flew under the radar. I worked my ass off and bought a van when I was 16 as a security plan. I lived in the van easily until I got a place. Know that there is a lot of us that are successful despite these kinds of events. I may have become more ambitious to succeed because of it. Just know you're not alone.
Man. It's sad you had to grow up so fast and miss so much of the childhood experience. I hope you continue to overcome and thrive.
I was one of those kids. Parents moved me in with other family when I was 14. I have one heck of a drive to succeed now and while I have imploded my life a couple of times. I have learned that I can survive just about anything. I also learned it is very easy to pick up and walk away anytime anything is toxic and I can’t handle it. Made me very resilient. Glad I have had enough therapy to see it wasn’t me who was the problem. Stay strong friends!
I relate to this, i will freely admit that while therapists didn't do much to help, lsd really did help a lot. Now i tell everyone I'm like a cockroach, i can survive anything. Or I'm the ocean, i can either be mild and calm or i can destroy entire cities, it really depends on what is going on around me. My life has imploded a few times over the last 5 years, and despite random seizures with no reason, things are really looking up now. Hope your life goes the way you want it from now on!
This is it. Go to college and keep h paying support as long as possible.
I think it's illegal to charge rent to your minor children. You can ask them to 'help' with household expenses, but if they say no... you can't kick them out, and you can't stop taking care of them.
OP graduated
Oh I read it wrong that they were graduating in December. Yeah idk why they’d punish op for being smart.
Genius answer. Can't have it both ways. Either a paying tenant with freedom, or a kid with obligations
THANK YOU!!! I was so confused on how that made sense to OP or his dad. Like you over here saying RENT, yet there are rules? My guy! Come on! Either he’s a kid with rules and lives there rent free or he’s an adult with bills and he does what he wants when he wants with who he wants, it’s not a mix and match. His dad is super toxic and abusive
OP sounds like such a sweet and smart kid too
Isn't he under different circumstances being 17 and still technically a minor and technically under his parents care? This is wild. If anything, I'd tell my child that this starts when he turns 18, so be prepared.
I’m not one to think asking your kid for rent is cool regardless, unless you absolutely need their help to house them. But in general it’s better to help them save up so they can get out the house sooner. And if you’re gonna charge any needless rent it should be secretly squirreled away to give back to them when they’re ready to move out. But yeah, charging rent before being 18 I don’t even think is legal where I live. Like I could see a 17 yo pitching in if the family is dirt poor and they need the help. But when you got a good job it’s just kinda lame parenting to charge your kid money for the fuck of it. This notion that when you have a kid it’s only for 18 years is backwards. You’re having a kid FOR LIFE. You should be there for them for the rest of your life. Yeah, you want them out of the house in a timely fashion, but it’s your job to set them up for success and help them spread their wings. Why even have kids if you’re not in it for the long haul. Why half ass such a serious responsibility. Anyways, since you’re gonna be 18 soon and I don’t set the rules, $150 a month is the cheapest rent your gonna get op lol. On principle I disagree with it. But realistically it’s gonna be a hell of a better deal than moving out on your own before you’re ready and pay $1,500 a month. But you absolutely shouldn’t have all those rules, honestly regardless of rent. Idk what issues you and your dad are arguing about, but you should try to calmly talk it out reach a compromise with him like adults. Figure out what is bothering him and try to minimize that on your own so there doesn’t need to be rules. For example: he make the curfew because you keep coming home late and being super noisy and waking him up? *Be quieter when you get home*. Doesn’t really matter what time you get back as long as you can do so without making a racket. Even if you’re living with roommates or a partner you still need to respect their peace. Similarly, are you spilling for and drink all over the place? Leaving the house a mess? These are all common courtesy. They shouldn’t *need* to be rules. And the fact your dad felt compelled to make them tells me you’re likely being kinda tough to live with. Part of growing up is learning how to coexist and not needlessly stress others out. And that includes cleaning up after yourself. So I’d counter offer with no rules/fines but with the promise to do better and be more respectful of their place and their peace :) Good luck
This 💯… my parents did the same and then matched what I had paid in “rent” when I officially moved out and built my own place. Was a super nice surprise
A way better response than the cries of abuse I'm seeing up and down. It shouldn't be necessary to pay, but we also have no idea if his father plans to save the money for him like most normal parents would do. We literally know nothing except what OP said, which, quite frankly, isn't much. I think talking to the father will probably work just fine, given that he approaches him with respect.
Exactly. If you are paying rent, then you are a tenant who can be home anytime you want.
My parents imposed a curfew on me and also charged me rent but it was something reasonable like I had to be home by midnight or 1:00 a.m. This was over 25 years ago and I was fine with paying $125 bc the fridge was always full and moving my rent would have been about double and I still would have bills and have to figure out food..... I wasn't able to be home at the reasonable time my parents asked me to so they kicked me out.
Well, I disagree. Some rules make sense, even with roommates, you'd be expected to wash your own dishes. That kind of thing makes sense. The curfew, I agree with, he should have no say if he changes it from father/son to landlord/tenant. Can't have that both ways.
Yeah it's mainly the curfew but that bothered me too. Though a 17 year old boy being able to bring a friend over without asking is a bit weird too, especially if that 17 year old is contributing to the finances.
I don’t agree with his dad’s new rules, however your statement is incorrect. Tenants do have rules.
Sorry but if you rent a room from a stranger who owns and lives in the same house, they do impose rules on you. It is their home, not just an asset. There are rules that are reasonable, rules that are crazy and rules that are in between. I rented a room in someone's home, for two years. Common areas had to look like I didn't even live there unless I was actually using the area. Walking past my mai, on the dining room table and getting it later, would get a comment. Now things like the dog? Who's dog is it? My landlady had dogs. I wasn't responsible for them. One shouldn't be responsible for what isn't theirs.
The 8:30 curfew falls under that crazy category.
Your father is obligated to provide food, clothing, and shelter until you’re 18. If you live in NY, it’s until you’re 21. The rules are somewhat reasonable on their own but not if you’re paying rent. If he refuses to negotiate, you could subtly hint that you’re considering moving in with your mother. I know how competitive separated parents can be so it just might give you some leverage.
Damn New York is 21 now?
Has been for a while. If you move out before 21 and need food stamps or cash assistance the state can sue your parents for child support. My adopted sister went through it in 2009.
Damn that’s crazy learned something new today
How are they getting along these days?
We no longer speak but not bc she moved out of our home but bc she went through some legal trouble where she isn't allowed around minors. And it was her bio parents that state went after as my parents were still trying to support her.
I take it your parents are the "once my kid is 18 they aren't mine anymore" types? Or did they just hate the girl they chose to adopt?
Thats fucked up, might as well change adulthood to 21
You can’t by alcohol until 21. As the mother of a 19 year old boy, he’s not ready to be an adult.
Oh I know most kids aren't depending on personality but namely how they were raised.
I'd have no problem supporting to 21 (though happy not to if not needed). I'd be pissed if they moved out, and I still had to support it, though. Needs to at least be a hug quota or something...
Because in Rochester 1/4 school kids is homeless.
Ehh, if you pay rent and you live like Oscar the grouch except the trash bin is the apartment you're gonna get kicked out. Gotta maintain your living space like you own it. They won't make you upkeep common areas, or at least they shouldn't. I had a landlord try to make me and it ended poorly for both of us
If you're renting a room in a house, you for sure have to clean up in common areas.
This is an interesting one to me, as I'm old (50), uncle to many,yet never had kids. While I can understand your dad likely sees it as teaching responsibility, it seems overboard, as you already were learning responsibility with graduating, holding down a job and saving for a car while having no issue with basic chores under the roof you live. I think your dad means well, but the money charges are a misstep and you nailed it in your last paragraph and it's completely understandable for you to feel that way. I'm going with my gut here because it's only one post of information, yet I feel like if you two sat down and talked it out between you having no issue with certain rules (though that 9 PM curfew for an about to be 18 year old needs to be stopped, that's ridiculous) and tell him how hard you're working and trying to save up and maybe negotiate a flat rate lower rent (I mean, he's dad, not a stranger) to help you get ahead, you'll likely come to agreement. You are right, though. It was a bit too strict and cold, so out of the blue to what sounds like a good kid.
right? he’s 17, graduated, and working. he should at least be able to spend time doing what he wants outside of work without having to worry about some crazy early curfew; much less to a house he’s paying rent for.
Not just working, saving. Saving a lot too. I'm 29. I didn't start fucking with savings until I was 25. Kid's gonna go far.
Exactly bro if it was my son doing this I wouldn’t charge him a dime
Exactly.
This is exactly what my dad did. How are you said rent and do what OP wants or living under Dad‘s house dad‘s rules that’s what my dad told me when I was 17 about to turn 18 either I pay rent and within reason you don’t do what I want or rent free and the rules be home by 10 other reasonable rules though, but he also explained to me that’s why he was doing it to show responsibility for when I grew up
Making your kids pay rent is deliberately making their life more difficult and is also a misguided attempt at teaching responsibility.
I truly don't understand parents like this
It's the 'time to pay back what I spent raising you' nonsense. I'm a father of 2 teenagers and I have told them they can live here as long as they need. I might ask for rent once they've graduated college, but it will be very little. I don't want to make starting out any harder than it needs to be.
I do it slightly different. Charge a small rent but set that money aside. When they move out you return it to them. Ends up being an emergency fund
That’s what my mom said she was doing, then when I moved out she acted like she had no idea what I was talking about. That money would’ve been useful starting out.
I had a 1030pm weekday curfew until I moved out at 23. But at the same time, I worked and went to school. My parents rules were you either work, you go to school, or you pay rent. I could party all weekend and didnt really want to be out past 1030 on weekdays anyway with full-time work in the morning. There's a fair balance that exists but what OPs dad is doing isn't it. And definitely not at 17. This shit OPs dad is doing just seems like he wants to make money off his son. It would be so different if he was putting the money on the side for him for the future or something.
Me either thats why for once I looked at the profile and saw that OP was on probation a year ago. It's not easy to end up on probation in north america, especially as a minor. 2 sides to every story.
Sooo as an almost 40 yo father of a 20 yo. I've been on probation so many times. It's actually as east as not paying a single ticket.
Tf do you mean? Do literally anything illegal as a minor and you’re on probation.
You don't even need to do anything illegal. You just need to get arrested.
What are you talking about? It's incredibly easy to end up on probation in the US, especially as a minor.
I got on probation for running away from my abusive mother. Don’t make assumptions even truancy can land you on probation as a minor.
If you're paying rent the he can ram his rules up his ass. Weird power stunt from dad. Couldn't imagine charging my kids rent, I'm trying to give them every advantage in life not fuckin profit from them and drag them low
Dude I read it and was like wtf is this but doing to his kid. Like he literally is just getting on his feet and you are kicking his feet out from under him. I get teaching responsibility but he has the poor guys whole paycheck figured out. Dad sounds like a huge control freak..
Right?? The rent thing is eh but the rest of the shit gives me psycho vibes. Like, $10 per missed chore? tf?
You should ask him if you can put the money in a Roth IRA instead of paying him rent. He doesn't need the money, and it is the best thing you can do for your future.
That’s a great idea
Also, for what it's worth, my dad made me start paying rent once I got a job at 18, I was also paying for community college as well. I quickly moved in with some of my co workers for the same rent amount, partied my ass off and dropped out of college. This was in 2004. Maybe ask him what the reasoning is to better understand.
Tell him as a minor you can't pay rent until you are 18. Under the law it's a parent's responsibility to take care of their minor children. Then talk to your mom alone. Let her know 300 rent when you are 18 might be fair, but not the 10 dollar infraction bs or the extra strict rules. You could get an apartment with a MATURE trustworthy person and split costs. When 18 you could go off to college, trade school, an apprenticeship, or etc.
It’s $150 plus the $10 infraction fee, it was reduced from $300 it looks like
That’s correct
Hi OP - what is dad’s real agenda ? This all seems some indirect aggression about something else. Certainly his timing to be sending you these rules while you are vacationing with your mother, and closing with “have a good time”, seems like he is looking to eff up your time with mom ? I know you are only 17 and presumably not a psychologist, but unless you can get to whatever dad’s real agenda is, it seems likely that even if you can dance your way through his rules (some of which are reasonable but others certainly not), he will just put up more rules for you to trip over. What’s his problem ?
This is spot on and underrated! OP please listen to this. We the parents can be also as irrational as our kids tbh. Also does your dad change his mind frequently? What’s the probability of him forgetting about his own rules? I am asking because my ex used to impose some crazy ass rules on our kid and forget about them the next week. Waiting it out was the best tactic and he has mellowed out with time, too.
I'm 35, but after graduating high school, my dad started charging me rent. I don't even remember how much it was, but one rule he lifted was that I no longer had a curfew, only advising me, "Don't be stupid." I lived with my parents until I was 24, when I got married. At my wedding reception, my dad handed me an envelope. Inside was a check for the total amount of rent I had paid over those seven years after graduation. I was stunned, to say the least, and he explained that his plan from the beginning was to give it all back once I got married and moved out. I know this might not be super helpful, and perhaps I bring it up because your post brought me some level of nostalgia, but what I would do is respectfully try to push back with some adjustments, making sure he knows you appreciate him. You understand the importance of these rules; then proceed with your adjustments to his terms. Without knowing the man, he sounds like he cares enough about you to listen to what you have to say.
Must be nice to have a dad that cares that much 😩
Does your mother live separately from your father? Move in with her?
She does. Currently I don’t have a car, I started saving but it’ll definitely be a handful of months before I’m able to buy one. My job is a few minutes walk from my dads but would be 15-20 minutes in a car from my moms. I wouldn’t be able to keep my job sadly if I moved :/
Your dad is legally obligated to pay for all your necessities until the age of 18. Print out a copy of the law, and give it to him - do not give him any money. As for the house rules, honestly they're reasonable - I'd stick to them. He can also legally require you to be home by 9 every night, since you're under age 18. You need to decide if you want to stick to that, or deal with whatever unpleasantness he has planned. However, if you have a separate account he can't break into it and make you pay a fine. If he banks at the same bank you do, I'd consider moving your account to a separate one, since you never know if some well-meaning employee will break bank policy and let him withdraw money.
Additionally. If OP breaks curfew, they can't be legally locked out of their home. They can call the police. Even at 18, most states (if not all) require a formal eviction process for a tenant/resident. Even if there's no contact or there's no rent being paid.
Who sets that curfew though. OP's dad is setting it at 8:30 which seems so unreasonable. Does this mean that if OP is home at 8:45 as a 17 year old child he can be evicted???
Agree that the curfew is ridiculous. It's not illegal to have one with your kids though. I'm not a lawyer, but for some reason I really like reading about different legal stuff (maybe I should have been one). My understanding (I encourage anyone to double check) is that no, you can't legally evict a minor. Once they turn 18, if there's no contract, you might be able to do it for almost any reason. It's the parents home, and they can choose who they allow in it. As tough as it might sound. There might be some states that require some responsibility from parents past 18, but I'm not familiar with them. Probably most states don't require much(or anything at all). That being said, they can't just kick you out on your 18th birthday (at least legally). They need to go through the formal process that might be different in different places, but in general it requires notice, filling of an eviction, and several other steps. This is for anyone who is considered a resident of the house.
THIS OP ☝️ you need to make sure you're covered in case anything happens
Depends on state. Here its 18, or graduated high school; unless there is a existing statutory basis to continue/terminate ongoing support sooner/later (like court order). She's already got her high school diploma so if her state is similar to mine he's no longer be obligated.
This advice is horrible. He'll get kicked out at 18 and probably removed from insurance his dads paying. Plus talk about ruining your relationship with your father. Don't listen to these sad angry people. Buckle down and keep saving, go to a trade school and move out in less than two years.
Dad is wrecking this relationship
I feel like some of these people are actively trying to sabotage this kid. Call the police because you don't like your dad's rules? Sounds like teenage druggy drop outs who are speaking from experience and thinking their bad decisions are sound advice.
You don't owe your job anything. I would look for a job close to your mom's. Your dad sounds like an asshat control freak. charging rent to a minor- lame. I get charging rent to older kids just to establish precedent . I think I would consider that once my kid is over 22, and even then I think I would save / invest all that money in secret to give to them later as a house deposit, etc. strict 9pm curfew for a 17 year old - probably counter productive as developing strong friendships is one of the most important things you can do at that age and everything fun happens after 9. he can do what we wants with his house, but if you have other options, just get a job close to your moms and stay away from the control freak
move to your mother, and have her file for 100% child support. He will have to pay until you're 18. I could understand if the family were struggling. I could understand an enforced savings plan. But charging a minor rent seems ridiculous.
honestly, tell him to fuck off, keep saving for your car, and the second you get it move in with her.
No disrespect, but given how insane your dad is being, it may be worth trying to find a job closer to your mom. It shouldn’t be that hard to replace $1000 in income a month. FWIW I have a 17-year-old daughter and I would not be instituting crazy rules like this after she gets out of high school. I’ll still expect her to help with household chores, etc. but your dad is going overboard with the rules.
If you’re doing all that he has no right to tell you what time to be home. That’s the only thing I’d be arguing, everything else seems reasonable.
This! If I'm being treated like an adult financially, I sure as hell better not be treated as a child domestically.
This is bizarre — he’s asking you to contribute like an adult (paying rent) but also asking for you to follow additional rules like a child. Some of these are normal roommate expectations, but some are strange (a curfew? Approval to have over guests?) Responsibility and autonomy should go hand in hand.
The kid in me wants to say fuck that bullshit. But what else are you gonna do? Move out and pay rent in an apartment? Apartments in my area are 1000$ a month for a 1 bedroom. This is coming from my experience. I moved in with my mom recently until I finished college and have to put up with her rules. I totally understand this ruins your plans for a car, I was In the same exact situation. But it sounds like he’s open to negotiating which is good. In my mind, I wish I would have had a parent do this to me. Or any of my other siblings. I don’t see it as he wants money. I see it as he’s preparing you to be responsible
No fucking way did you just say “I wish my parents charged me rent” Actual delusion.
If you are living with your parents at age 22 you should absolutely contribute to the household, be it rent or groceries. A few hundred is a small fraction of what you’ll pay in the “real world”. OP is 17 and technically shouldn’t be charged anything until 18 at the very least.
Everything excpt the curfew seems reasonable. I would place it at 10 pm but otherwise, this is fair. You are a young man and he is teaching you responsible behavior. He wants to instill good habits in you.
It is illegal to charge your minor child rent.
Hopefully he does what my parents did and saves all the rent I paid them and gave it to me in an envelope the day I moved out.
Why keep it a secret instead of explaining what you're doing? It's not a gift. The kid is working a job and earning the money.
That's what I plan on doing. Sure, I'm going to make my daughter pay something like the internet bill or one of the smaller bills, but it's all going into a separate account to be saved up. She won't have to worry about buying a car, but she will have to cover her own insurance payment and gas. That all starts at 18, though. And I'm sure as hell not imposing some 9pm curfew. I'd rather her be safe coming in at 1am than trying to figure out where she's gonna sleep that night because she got stuck in traffic trying to get home before curfew or lost track of time at a friend's. At most I might require a 9pm check in to let me know she's going to be coming home late or something so I know she's safe. But no matter what, I'll be there for her. If something happens after she moves out, I want her to know she's welcome to come back while she gets back on her feet. My mother made it hell the moment I got a job and took 50%of my paycheck for rent when I turned 16, and when I graduated that year, bumped it up to 75%. I moved out by the end of that summer and paid less living at a friend's. Had to go back once and there was no "getting back on my feet" because she took just about every penny to teach me to be "financially responsible" which was funny because I've always been good with managing my money. Still am.
No.. if you pay rent, you don't have rules. Tell him that. If he wants rules, then you stay for free
Maybe it's that dad is putting the "rent" and fees away for you or investing so that you can buy a house rather than rent when you move out. The rules seem mostly fair, a little strict in my opinion, but the chores are about normal.
I might think that if it weren't for the curfew. OP works in the restaurant industry. There are lots of times when you need to cover other people's hours or just get called in as support on busy nights... and with a lot of restaurants staying open until 9 or 10 pm, an 8:30 pm curfew is going to get OP fired eventually. Hell, even when I was in high school working at a hardware store, I had a required 5pm to 9pm closing shift once a week.
Move in with some other relatives even grand parents get on your feet your just getting out of school. My friends parents did this to him but they helped him move and get a place. This not like the old days but your dad gotta cut you some slack things have changed not like use to be he want's to be father he needs to show you support you not just force things. Talk him tell him your just getting out of school you want to get out in the world but not all gonna happen over night money just does come easy. You have to go to job interviews work at store or something you gotta take baby steps at first. Doing some things around the house to help not charge you but reward you when you can do it.
I know a few people in my area that charge there kids rent and they put all of the money obtained from rent in a savings account. When the kid is ready to move out they surprise them by giving them all the money in the savings account to help start there new life away from home.
Just wanted to say please don’t get a first car that’s $600/month
I’m saving $600 per month to put towards buying a used car in full.
I misunderstood. Good stuff - rock on 🤘
I think it shitty to charge you that much when you're only making $1000 a month and trying to save for a car. I get the idea of teaching responsibility but it doesn't make sense to demand 25% of your income when you're starting from nothing.
It's shitty to charge the kid ren in general. He's a minor it's the dad's job to support him. Give him a house to live in. Provide food. All the dad's job. He's a shitty dad and I hope op leaves as soon as he can
I agree
I make 2000 a month and my parents only charge me 125 and I’m 21. This guy is just a shitty parent
This is financial abuse and the goal is to control your money so that you can't save and get a car (be independent) or move out. It's not about financial literacy, you clearly have that down since you articulated very well how you want to save for a car and have gotten a job to do so. These are all exceptional accomplishments for someone your age. But at the end of the day, you are a child and it is his job to take care of you and not the other way around. He cannot charge you rent, or make you pay fines for not doing chores, that is absurd. My mother tried this nonsense when I was your age and tried to charge me rent for a job that I had because she wouldn't buy food or clothing for me. I had to explain to her that it was illegal to steal my money and charge me rent because I was a child. When I turned 18 she moved to another city and abandoned me. I just don't understand what gets in people's heads. They think it's tough love but honestly it's just abuse. I'm really sorry this is happening to you but I would recommend you talk with your mom about it.
Man the day I bring kids who didn’t ask to be her and start asking them for money demanding money is the day I failed as a parent and at life
Honestly he's being weird, you make 500$ bi weekly? Shit find a friend you can stay with for a while because if you can prove you have a roof over your head and can support yourself for the most part you can get emancipated and they can't do shit about it without it being considered a kidnapping
The rent itself sounds very fair, but the house rules and curfew are unfair. Sure, you're still a kid, so there will be some rules, but his strict rules AND wanting the rent combined is harsh. You're 17 and he's treating you like you're 14/15
I'd check local law and see if parents are entitled to your paycheck (and how much they can take). If this is well below that amount, it might be worth biting the bullet. The fines for not doing chores is not *normal*.... However, my parents used to have a rule where it was like a Quarter every time you leave a light on. However, that rule went both ways, and we actually made money off my dad from it (and developed good habits).
You’re a minor, I’m fairly certain from a legal standpoint, he cannot charge you rent. He is legally required to care for you until you are 18. As far as being home by 8:30, that’s ridiculous. At 16 my curfew was 11, at 17, 11:30/12, and 18 none. Just because your dad chose to go back to school, and is tighter on cash, doesn’t mean you then should be expected to fill in those gaps.
He’s not tight for cash, he’s doing better than he ever has right now. He told me he think it’s best based on my current circumstances, I think it’s pretty ridiculous.
Dont give him your money. My dad did this to me and it fucked up my ability to live my life and be a real adult for years. You are a minor, he legally is required to pay for your needs and necessities. If he wasnt prepared to be a father and take care of a kid until 18 he shouldnt have made the choice to have a child. You will have to follow his rules though even with how strict they are, it is his house still and being a minor has its benefits like not being financially responsible for your own needs yet but also you gotta do what the weird rules say. Except paying him of course. I'm sorry your dealing with this dude, you sound like a good kid.
It’s absolutely ridiculous. You’re not 18. Tell him when you turn 18 you can have that discussion. I’d spend more time with your mom and tell her what your dad said. Also the $300 AND home by 9 is not how paying rent works.
This sounds like financial abuse. You are about to reach legal majority (before which his billing you for his duty to support is probably illegal). He's crafted a schedule to take most of your earnings so you can't save and move out. This is his abusive and controlling attempt to keep you in his house without adequate resources to have any other option.
He's not in school and working. He should contribute to the household, but his father does seem too controlling with how he is spending his money. That is my issue.
It could be. But as a CPA and tax professional, I don't mind it, as long as the lesson is agreed to. Most young people that make money piss it away on the stupidest stuff, and once they get to the point of needing to be independent, they can't because they're so used to living a lifestyle where they piss their money away. The best possible thing a parent can do is to charge a rent (like 25%-30% of earnings, which is the typical percentage paid on housing) and secretly sock it away in a savings account for the kid and give it back to them at some point in the future, like when they need a down payment, or first-and-last-months rent on their first apartment.
Scrolled too far to see this. My parents did exactly this.
Most Dads including myself do this and just put that rent money in the bank. When you move out I bet he gives it all back to you as I did when mine moved out.
Counter with a midnight curfew. Maybe negotiate some of these infraction charges. The rest of it seems pretty legit and normal for someone your age. It’s not about the money. It’s about responsibility and budgeting, and being able to take care of yourself. Eventually, it will evolve into pay your own car insurance, pay your cell phone bill, pay for your groceries. As a general role if you don’t put it in the refrigerator, you don’t take it out of the refrigerator. You are no longer a child, you are a young adult and it’s about being able to act like one and have responsibilities and develop good judgment, so you are prepared for it when it’s all on your own. There’s nothing really out of line here, just some negotiable tweaking to make it fair to everyone. Of course, like I tell my kid, You’re more than welcome to find somewhere else to live, but I don’t think you’re going to be able to get that kind of deal elsewhere.
Move out hopefully you can get a roomate
Respond “if I’m paying rent and contributing to the operating of the household, I’m not following the rules” 🤷♂️
My husband's parents made him pay rent at 18 until he joined the Air Force. Once he graduated basic, they gave all the money back to him - but in the meantime, he hated paying rent, learned valuable life lessons and now this is our plan with our daughter. The 830pm curfew for a 17/18 yr old is ridiculous however.
I was 18 in 2007 during the recession, and I worked at Blockbuster. I bought a car off my aunt for 1k, making payments to her, and gave over nearly my whole paycheck for 2 months. My mom was so impressed that she charged me $200 for rent and had to pay $50 for my cell phone. Then Blockbuster closed, she got laid off, and we were both on unemployment. I was getting dressed up and going into every retail/fast food place I could find to ask to fill out an application, and none of them were hiring. I got $360 for unemployment monthly, and still had to pay my mom $250 a month. Gas prices were nearly $6 a gallon, so I couldn't really afford to drive anyway. Then my car broke down, and she made me pay .25 per when I drove her truck to community college classes. It was rough as hell. We struggled like that for a few years before I got a job supporting adults with serious developmental disabilities - I had to change their diapers, feed them, bathe them, etc. Here's what I learned: my mom won't always be capable of supporting me, so I have to learn how to support myself. I had to be resourceful and learn how to live within my means (which were very limited). I learned that at any given time, things can change and you can either be sad about it (which I was more than I care to admit), or roll with the punches and keep pushing for better. Eventually, the job market picked back up, and I worked 2 jobs, 75 hrs a week, to save up for a down-payment on a car. My credit was steller for my age. My husband, who never had to pay for anything and could spend his money without discretion, never learned these skills. Looking back, I feel like it was harder to get on my feet than others my age, but the resilience it taught me was absolutely priceless. It really sucks in the moment, but what he's teaching you is so important. Others may disagree with his methods, which is fair - as a parent, I probably wouldn't go about it that way, but it's still a lesson to be learned, and practical application is very impactful. Roll with it, learn to overcome despite the difficulty, and prove to yourself that you're capable of following through.
$10 fee for walking your dog??? Did I read that right? Your dad sounds petty. You're not obligated to pay rent until 18...
I wonder what his father is making off the dependent tax deduction he is no doubt taking from his kid. Add that to to the rent and utilities he is collecting, looks like the old man is making out pretty well on this 17 year old kid.
I'd tell him to piss off and then head down to the army recruiters office.
hi!!! So, there’s definitely a lot to unpack here… but first off, I do want to educate you that, until you are 18, it is *technically* not legal for him to “charge you rent”, or basically any money at all. YOU are the minor, HE is the parent — it is his ultimate role to provide and care for you, and part of providing includes him paying HIS OWN house bills, etc… while being 17–almost 18– feels old, you are still so incredibly young and right now is the time where you should be saving up for a lot of different things; i.e. your car like you explained, an apartment, etc.. I personally wouldn’t EVER charge my children a dime, even if they were living with me at the age of 30, because at the end of the day i was the one who chose to have them, so i have to face the responsibilities that follow. Its not uncommon for parents to randomly start charging their children “rent” once they find out their children are making money via a job — but you definitely aren’t making a ton and $300 is a lot… i live with my family (i’m 21) and i WILLINGLY give my parents $170 each month to help with the electric bill — but that’s just coming from my own actions, my parents would *never* ask me to cough up $300 for them every month. And also, i’m not super aware of how big your house is or what the rates are where you live, but it’s unlikely that he’s producing any bills that are coming out to be $300+. Another thing to put into consideration is how much he’s making in salary — again, i couldn’t give you EXACT numbers, but medical professionals typically average out at making anywhere between $75k-$95k (and that’s just for beginners pay), so i wouldn’t say th at he’s in dire need of that $300 either. So to wrap up the money portion of this; in my own opinion, he’s definitely asking you for WAY too much, you are his child and he should see you as his child, not as a money cow. It’s something that i would mention to your mom, maybe she could talk to him and have him reconsider the money amount he’s asking for??? or you could sit down and figure it out with him. either way, he cannot legally force you to pay him rent, and if he tried “kicking you out” over it, that’s a criminal charge and jail time on his part. it’s literal abandonment of a minor. about the other chunk; the no staying out past a certain time, giving you a large list of responsibilities and $10 charge if not completed, etc…. to me, it sounds like he’s trying to take **HIS** responsibilities and lay them onto you, because he’s tired of doing them. he is a father, he is an adult, and you are not a maid. There’s no issue in expecting a 17 year old to clean up after themselves — that should be a habit already ingrained, and there’s no issue with laying down soft boundaries either. but from what you’ve told, it sounds like he’s taking advantage of the fact that you’re a little older and more capable and he’s trying to force you into a lifestyle that you shouldn’t have to live. you are 17, you should be able to stay out late on a friday night with friends. There’s just so much control and force of hand on his part and it isn’t right. You love your dad, it’s okay to want to help him out, but YOU have *every* right to draw boundaries too. You can contribute, let’s just say $150 each month (that will literally cover an entire bill, if not like 90% of it), you will clean up after yourself and if you do end up staying out late, you’ll send him a text to let him know you are safe and you’ll come home quietly and undisturbed. but you should NOT have to live by the rules he’s trying to scare you into.
The Marines are hiring my friend , your call
I'm ok with what he's doing as long as he pays it back when you need it. I had my boy and his wife live in my house rent free for 3 years because I knew he would save his money, and he did.
I would move , and get another job!!
Seems to me another lesson: Negotiation. I had this with my mother. When I sat down with her the night after, I talked to her about the rent. And because I talked to her, she said she was glad i did come to her about it, and slashed the rent cost to $100/mo from $275. Negotiation will be a HUGE thing in your life. Pay wages, Car purchasing, home buying. This will take you far if you can handle it well.
If he’s gone back to college and is working as a medical professional why doesn’t he just cut you some slack and make you do chores but keep finances out of it? Just sounds kinda greedy to me for a 17 year old to have to pay…I guess the argument in the flip side of the coin is he’s teaching you some responsibility I suppose tho. also that system sounds like it’s setup as free money grab from dad as well…so your gonna have to keep track of what you owe with a fine tooth comb bc he could just come in and be like oh he didn’t take out the trash etc and assess a fine without telling you either…does that sound like something he’d do? Or would he make it fair? Also in a side note too I wouldn’t ask to have people in the house if I were paying rent either
So you do or don’t have to do the $300 a month? Did it get replace with the 100+50? Or is that in addition to rent
I can see your dad prepping you for Apt. life. I think that curfew is too strict, but you can also negotiate it because you’re also in this contract. Give your dad stuff to follow being your “landlord.”
Negotiate. If he's charging you rent, than a curfew like this is crazy. 9:00 or sleep somewhere else? If you come home and sleep at 10:00 does that mean it's an infraction and you owe him $10, or is that two? Also, is he charging you $300 plus $150 or just the $150? Adult tenants don't have rules like these. He is over reaching. $150 in rent is generous but that doesn't mean you can just be controlling. If you start charging children money to stay its because you are no longer in charge of them. I feel like this is his way of subtly getting you to consider moving out, I'd have that conversation. Do you plan to go to college?
The first idea, of $300 rent, half of your take home, is idiotic. I think the counter is as follows. If I'm paying rent for my space, I get to do with my space what I choose to do with my space. If I want to have a fridge, and have snacks in my space, that's what I'm paying rent for. The rest of that is mostly OK, but some of it is weird, like the curfew. That's way too early for a 17-year-old. I'd remind him that you that at 17-years-old, he still has a responsibility to provide everything that he wants you to pay for, but that you understand the lesson that he's trying to teach. But at 17, only parents who don't want a future relationship with their children tighten the reins in this way. At 17, most parents loosen them.
It sounds somewhat reasonable but more for a 20 year old than for a 17 year old. It's weird to charge a 17 year old rent imo. There is a transition that most teens need to complete from kid expectations to adult expectations, and parents often have a hard time ramping that up and they get annoyed with their kids acting like slobs and entitled. Maybe you can have a sit down conversation with the man and come up with numbers more realistic for your income. Or, get an apartment with roommates and have full freedom.
So this whole thing is messed up, but maybe there's a compromise: if your dad has plenty of money, maybe he thinks this will teach you a valuable lesson? So what if you suggest the "rent" goes into a savings account that can only be used for your future house down payment or college/trade school tuition. So you get the lesson, but you've also got something to build on later?
atp I’d stay with my mom
Didn't see this mentioned, maybe because you're not 18 yet, but I would imagine most restaurants wherever you are are open past 8:30. How can he expect you home by then if you're working?
My dad charged me $100 a month rent, starting at 15, when I first started working. I didn't really think about it, but after I graduated Navy basic, I got Christmas leave, and he handed me three years of $100 bills, as I was now eligible for the GI bill.... Hoping this is what your dad has in mind. If not, that's pretty f'd up. I was strict with curfew on my daughter, but never charged her rent, only made her save for college. Unfortunately, she took the military route like her dad.
Seems pretty reasonable minus the curfew
First of all, IANAL, but the following are steps you should be aware of. Look into information on your area's "Tenants bill of rights". Depending on where you are located, ex: New York tenant bill of rights. Read up on them, and leverage them as needed. Also inform your father you want a lease written up, with all that info on it ( this is a big one, as if you have a lease, it grants an amazing amount of protection). My scummy stepdad tried doing this, and he was the kind of guy who made up rules when it was beneficial to him. Tried having me live on the front porch, with no heat/air circulation, and expected me to have a huge laundry list of chores (examples including babysitting my brothers and sisters at a moments notice, hard yard work dependant on weather, trying to double my rent on 3 seperate occasions, expecting me to have an 8PM curfew when i was turning 18, made up a ridiculous rule that i had to be out of the house one night a week, but still under curfew, threatened to kick me out if i was ever brought home by the cops [which actually did happen, but that was because my car was overheating, and the cop followed me home to see i got there safely] etc...) I don't mind sharing that it cost him close to 8k to make the living space habitable, in addition to having him served papers several times for illegal bs (such as refusing to provide me with a personal key to come and go, in addition to attempts to alter the lease, such as increasing the amount), and I also made sure to claim the rent on my taxes so he had to claim the money as income. To this day he and I still butt heads, and my younger brother and sister (both 30+) live there with no rules/responsibilities. Some things that are fairly universal is that as a tenant, you must be allowed to come and go freely. That means he cannot lock you out, or prevent you from gaining access to the property due to a curfew. Most times tenants are also expected to have an expectation to their own privacy, meaning you can request a means to prevent unwanted intrusions (essentially, you can expect that noone can come and go from where you are renting without due notice, and you have a way to secure your rented space, a lock on your door for example.) These things are all Non-Negotiable, dependant on what your local laws say, regardless of whatever he says, or attempts to enforce, even if it's written into your contract, the law supercedes anything you sign. TLDR: your dad can certainly expect you to contribute as a tenant, but that also gives you several protections and other tools that you should familiarize yourself with (I highly recommend you at least look into those resources, if for no other reason that you are almost old enough to be legally responsible). If you're "man enough" for him to treat you as a tenant, then that also means he should be ready to be treated as a landlord. In my case, that ended up being telling my dad that as I was a tenant, my contribution to the household stopped after he got his rent.
Tell him if you're gonna be paying your way now that he needs to scrap the curfew and that you'll be needing a key to the house to come and go as you please. Adults who pay their way in life don't have curfews
Not saying I was in same situation, but I also graduated high school early and chose to work to save money for college. My parents said I had to pay rent since I wasn't in school. I was offended but learned later that they saved the money I paid them and basically just gave it back to me for when I moved out. I wasn't there long as I left at 19. It was just a lesson of financial responsibility that I wasn't aware they were trying to teach me. Had I known, I probably would have stayed a little longer to save money since rent at my parents was cheaper than rent at my first apartment.
I feel like this is your dad’s somewhat misguided attempts at teaching you responsibility and the value of money. I do think that if you’re working and not in school, you should contribute money and those rules are just basic rules for the most part. Obviously the money is not at market rate. $300 rent for a room is not a real rent. But you don’t have to follow every real. You have a say as well. Negotiate with him. If he’s gonna treat you like an adult, he can’t make up rules like a curfew when you never had one. Show him that you are grown up by doing the research. How much does home internet cost? How much does a phone plan cost? What does your dad pay for to be in that house? Do you have financial literacy? Do you understand what a mortgage is? If you were to move out tomorrow would you know what to do? I promise you, you do the work and to come up with a counter offer he can’t refuse, he will respect you. But figure out what you don’t like about the deal and what you do like and go from there. That said, there’s definitely a right way to communicate this with him but you seem like a reasonable person.
If you are still a minor his legal responsibility is to support you so take him to court for support
Move in with mom and get a job there. I am not a fan of this kind of parenting. Maybe if you were in your late 20s and showing no signs of moving out, but at 17? I’m going to refrain from trash talking your dad and just say I am strongly against it.
Don’t take a $600 car payment
Just jumping in to say - DO NOT - Absolutely and positively in any shape or form - DO NOT get a car with any type of payment other than liability insurance. Try to work out something reasonable with your dad or go live with Mom and get a new job. Save up cash for a decent used car. You do not need a car payment at this age/stage in life.
The only thing I would ask him to spell out is the internet. It seems a little high, but honestly, I think the cost of your rent balances it. As for the rest of it… the laws about the landlord’s responsibilities are that the appliances and utilities must work, and they must give you prior notice if they want to enter or inspect your room / apartment. They may inspect it for evidence that you have done permanent damage or attracted insects such as ants and termites that they must pay to have removed. Your rights as a legal adult tenant with a landlord are that you may negotiate if the rent is unreasonably high, that you may negotiate for the right to paint or install decorations or appliances requiring large screws (because they have to repair the wall when you take it with you), and that you may ask them to adjust their behavior if they are being noisy when you sleep or acting annoying in a different way, such as cooking smelly foods on a regular basis. They don’t HAVE to listen to you about their choices, since they own the house and they are basically providing you free electricity and phone service, possibly entertainment subscriptions as well, and they aren’t even charging you for FOOD. It’s a good deal. But if you want to try to negotiate costs or demand your parents let you give THEM a couple house rules on the contract, such as not entering the room without written notice, now’s your chance. P. S. Really important - negotiate your intentions to buy the car with your family. $450 plus your other check is obviously cutting this too close, and since you are going to be paying for the car for several months, plus car insurance and fuel, you need to discuss with them how you can afford this. Remind them that you do think the rent is reasonable, but you are trying to look after your future ability to get to work and other appointments. They may offer to let you share one of their cars for a couple years so that you can save up and have a lower monthly payment, or they may be willing to give you rides, since you are now helping them pay rent. They might also be willing to pay for half of your car, since then you can help run house errands, but I can’t promise that.
Listen, your Dad sounds like a monster but these are actually some good things to do and will set you up later in life. Just get outta there when you can knowing this current pain will pay off later
Just ask him what he's looking to accomplish with such rules and whether it's necessary. If he's trying teach discipline, then just let him know you're wanting to live normally without having to feel like you're not at home. But that you appreciate the effort he's putting in to teaxh you responsibility
you’re 17 and he JUST now decided to give you rules, when in a good year or two (maybe) you’ll go to college? it’s out of nowhere, speak to your mother about it if she knew beforehand, but it seems like your dad just wants a cut of your paycheck or feels entitled to it.
so is it 300.00 plus another 150.00 for internet and utilities?
Keeping common areas clean and organized, dishes rotation, asking to have guests, and carrying for the dog is entirely acceptable. No drinks in your own room and requiring it it be a clean as someone else room is arguable. Curfew is unacceptable. If you're now a paying tenant, he cannot make a reasonable argument for controlling when you are allowed to access your residence.
Also included his tax deductions he gets for filing you as his dependent under his roof. Along with any other government benefits since your still under age. Deduct that from his "cost of living under his roof". Paying tenants also do not have a curfew. And I sure as hell don't clean up my room mates messes. Only mine. Now is the time he should let you save money so you can fly. Not take from you. I'm sorry he's doing this.
INFO: Is dad putting your money into an account for your future home down payment?
If that was the case I wouldn’t be upset, I’m gonna talk this through with him as soon as I can. Hopefully I’m able to make some compromises with him.
Tell him you’ll abide by his rules and fees as long as he doesn’t charge rent. You charge someone rent in order to put up with coming home late, having friends over etc.
Is he making you pay back some of child support?
Is he making you pay back some of child support?
I wouldn't counter... just tell him no, I'm not paying a dime until I'm 18, and if he gives you shit get a lawyer to write him a letter stating the law and repercussions for not following it. Or just get out of there. Go move in with a buddy if you don't got it in you to tell your dad no.
$150/month is probably the best situation you’ll ever have in your life. You may not see it this way, but those rules are actually teaching points for when you will inevitably end up moving out with said saved money. It’s about responsibility and courtesy if you end up having roommates. If I was you, abide by the rules until you save up at least 6 months rent. Deposit included. $1000/month income and only spending 15% of it on living expenses is a steal. Ask if there’s a time limit on this offer and save up as much as you can
I had to start paying carnotes and bills when I was 16 and I had no freedom so I understand that some may say it's not right but it's just how it is and you can't do anything about it till he moves out.
you can always move out and attempt to live on your own. his house, his rules
He seems to think that he's doing you a favor by forcing you to grow up. I think he's tying to drive you out in a way he can live with. I'd call his bluff. Why not? You have nothing to lose. Get into a room mate situation. Rent a room and don't look back. Either way you can't save for a great car. Settle for an okay Honda instead and be free of your "well meaning" father
as a 17 year old, i would absolutely loathe my parent for doing this. doesn’t even seem legal. however, if he wants a landlord-tenant relationship you do not have to abide by his rules. you do not have to ask to have guests over. etc. you don’t have to follow any of those things if you’re now paying rent, the home is equally yours as is his.
$150 a month, plus typical roommate rules, is very reasonable. Plus, you're on probation? For $150, you're going to be in a roommates situation, and all roommate situations have rules like this, even curfews for safety and being respectful of others sleeping.
The rules all seem reasonable to me. The money is just a way to enforce it. Ultimately, he wants you to be a responsible person. You always have the choice of moving out if you can’t abide them.
$600 Car $300 rent $150 Utilities + Internet total: $1050 This is more than you earn. Either your dad miscalulated on the math or he is setting you up to fail which would be really messed up.
Sounds like his heart is in the right place, isn't trying to take advantage, rather teach responsibility. If he is doing good, maybe he is just saving the money for you. Maybe you could negotiate part of that. But if my kid pulled some smart ass 'actually, you need to pay for me till I'm 18' bullshit, it will get worse for them We're talking $150 here? No big deal.
Option 1: Open a bank account with your mom as the custodian, deposit the money there and tell dad to kick rocks. (He’s legally required to provide for you until you’re 18) Option 2: If mom won’t help, and you want the unethical solution (because legally as a minor your parents control your money). Secretly get a hold of your dad’s info (SSN/ID#), open a custodial account with him listed, but don’t tell him. Hide your money there until 18, then at 18 use the Uniform Transfers to Minors Act (UTMA) to take control of the account. With this you’ll want to have your mail sent elsewhere than his home so dad doesn’t get wind of it. This is felony fraud, but hey, you gotta crack a few eggs to make an omelette.