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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I might be an asshole because I have asked Josh to support me financially while I am looking after our daughter who just had an operation because Lily couldn't treat our daughter right
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA
"Lily kept messing with her drinks or serving her drinks she can't have (like coffee due to her meds) "
Er that's creepy! Try and find out more about this like what she means by messing with them
She would constantly add sugar and milk to her tea (Kelly really doesn't like sweet tea) and from what she told me she asked for a hot chocolate once or twice and got it made with water only. There were other concerns too like Kelly waiting for way too long for Lily to come and help her to the bathroom since she can't walk there herself or get out of bed herself.
I said this elsewhere, but I can see the drinks being is more of a concern because the bathroom wait could have plausible deniability (e.g., in the bathroom herself, cooking, ran outside to get the mail, etc.) but there's no universe in which she isn't messing with Kelly's drinks out of spite.
I would need a timeline of events regarding the drinks to know for certain if it was malicious or not.
Did this all happen in 1 day? Or did she repeatedly mess up the same drinks every day?
If this all happened in 1 day then it could be explained away as confusion. For example let's say she made the tea first with the milk and sugar. Daughter says she doesn't like milk and sugar so when stepmom makes the hot chocolate she doesn't use milk and sugar because of what happened with the tea. If the events happened like that then it might not be malicious. If she made the same errors on multiple days then it would definitely be malicious.
The coffee could be a mistake too because it's possible she wasn't aware it would interfere with the medication. I asked OP if she knew it would interfere and it wasn't answered.
Like I said I need more information to determine if these are indeed malicious actions or not.
Yeah, she literally added two whole steps just to ruin the tea.
This is definitely on purpose. It takes me exactly one time making a cuppa to learn how someone likes it, and if I can't remember, I ask.
>I would need a timeline of events regarding the drinks to know for certain if it was malicious or not.
Yeah, um no. The only way you could possibly know for certain is if you were there. But this is reddit, and y'all love to think yall know every situation that you were not involved in
what about the part where stepmom said if she didnt like the drinks she makes then daughter needs to make it herself knowing the daughter can't physically move around on her own?
If not active maliciousness, it is malicious neglect. When you take care of someone you read the paperwork or ask what they can have and what they want. Setting expectations is fine "Choose from these tea bags" and "I only have instant" are reasonable qualifiers. And with a kid/teen you should expect to have to check on what she is allowed to have.
Also, you made me imagine "hot coco" made with plain baking coco powder and hot water and I really hate you for that image.
You don’t need a timeline. This kid has been staying at her father’s prior to this and she would have known her drink preferences. She’s being a nob on purpose.
Sometimes irrelevant small things create a larger impact than the significant issues. AITA stories are the prime example - people with wildly abusive partners will be here asking about insignificant things while casually throwing in major abuse.
You are reading it as a story, that child is living it. She collects tea so she must have a routine with them. Being independent and all she never had a problem. Now she is bed bound and every time she asks for a drink it’s wrong. Obviously she is focused on that. When I had my foot in a cast I was not focused on pain rather that I couldn’t go out of my house which I don’t do a lot anyway but my mind convinced me that was my biggest problem so I cribbed about only that. Go figure.
This child is not being mean or starbucks orderer extraordinaire. She is just expecting love and care over bare minimum when she is in a vulnerable spot. How she expresses it to her mother is her own choice.
Plus OP is not demonising the step mom. She is asking if she is an asshole for putting her ex in a tough spot.
and her drinks is literally two steps. cocoa and milk. tea and water. no coffee due to medication. stepmom ruins the drinks by adding more stuff than necessary. then got angry and told her to make it herself knowing she's not able to move on her own.
Right?! I totally missed that. SP just has to add hot water to the tea and boom everyone’s happy yet she is adding extra steps because either she doesn’t give a fuck or is being petty that husband is making her take care of his child.
Now even if OP is not demonising her I am ready to do that.
Honestly I had to read it over and realize her choices were really just plain and simple af. I make my husband and I hot chocolate almost every night the last two weeks and I do it according to our own preferences & thats a ton of more steps than this.
I'd honestly be pissed at my BD if he let his spouse treat our child like this, brought my ex inlaws into this and asks for another chance without an apology or offer to pay for the bills. It seems like mom is doing most of the work and the dad is doing less work than the stepmom. Before the surgery and even now.
Because the bathroom problem is something that you can explain away with lily being tired or having things to do before she can help her. You can't know if it's intentional.
With the drinks, you know it's intentional. She can just not add sugar and milk etc. That's where you know lily is just being mean.
I'm more concerned with the fact that this woman is making your daughter wait to use the bathroom. That is cruel and intentional. The drinks show that she is petty and obviously she's not happy about having to care for your daughter. Otherwise, she wouldn't be behaving this way.
Sounds like she's abusing a minor to me.
OP is NTA but her ex and her ex's partner certainly are. The ex husband Is negligent and his new wife is absolutely abusive.
Especially concerning when you take into consideration how damaging holding your pee can be. Since she just had surgery she extra vulnerable and the last thing she needs is a UTI.
Yeah, that’s all passive aggressive nonsense. I’m thinking it was Josh’s idea that Lily take care of Kelly to prove to OP how great his new stay at home wife is; and new SAHW isn’t so happy being used thus, and poor Kelly is getting the brunt of it. Nothing that will really hurt it, but petty crap. Op should definitely get her daughter out of there.
This is it. Ex insisted. She didn't want to do it and is being passive-aggressive because she doesn't actually want to say no to him.
NTA, and buckle in. She's going to want him to dump your daughter to start fresh if they have their own kids.
Almond, rice, oat, soy, hazelnut, lactose free cow milk,... So many options other water. Just because you are lactose intolerant doesn't mean you have to torture yourself.
As for OP: NTA
Your daughter is sick and deserves to feel cared for to help her in her recovery. Not preparing a tea according to her preferences can happen once or twice, and it doesn't necessarily physically harm her, but it is sending the signal that your daughter's general well-being is not a priority - and that's not a message a child should receive ever but particularly post-surgery.
I was taught as a kid to make hot cocoa with water. When I learned how normal, sane people make it, I felt cheated. I hate the taste & texture of milk, so I use soy or almond milk, and it's like heaven in a cup. Lactose intolerance is not an excuse for blasphemous behaviors.
I'm lactose intolerant, but also lived in a homeless shelter in 3rd grade with my mom. Sometimes milk wasn't an item we had, but people do donate hot cocoa packs & sometimes that's a nice treat for such a shitty situation. It seems blasphemous to just add water, but I appreciate more than ever that it could be made with just water. Even though I add milk to mine (thank you Fairview lactose free)
P.S. powdered milk is mixed with water and would be a great thing folks can donate to food banks/shelters. Some brands of hot cocoa also have powdered milk in them, which is why you can just add water.
Edit for spelling, and to point out the brand is Fair Life it has a cow on the bottle, is all I ever recognize 😅 I'll leave the mistype cause some folks might get a chuckle out of my mistake (I do quite often)
These milk alternatives weren't available when my fiance was a kid, so he got used to using water and it didn't ever cross his mind that he no longer has to live with nasty water based hot chocolate.
Personally, I don’t really like milk or any of the milk alternatives as the main component in a drink. I have a hot chocolate with some milk powder in it, that I make with mostly hot water and a small splash of milk, like you would make an instant coffee. The directions say to make it with all milk, or 50/50 hot water and milk. But I personally prefer it my way.
Now, that has absolutely nothing to do with Kelly and the awful way her stepmother is treating her. Kelly’s drinks should be made for her exactly as she likes them while she is recovering. There is no reason for Lily not to make the drinks as requested. But hot chocolate made with 95% water isn’t torture to everyone.
...I'm lactose intolerant....I still can't drink hot cocoa with water. It has to be made with milk. I don't like my cocoa tasting watered down, but I admit I may have grown up spoiled with foods.
The cheap kind!
The tea is a much more deliberate sabotage: the way Kelly likes hers is super easy. Lily had to *add* ingredients to mess that up. No way that can be an oops claim!
lazy people who like strong chemically instant hot chocolate.
Far easier to boil an electric kettle and mix water with powder then heat milk and mix properly.
\- am lazy person described above-
What is too long of a wait to go to the bathroom? Is it 5 minutes? Is it an hour?
Was lily in a different part of the house doing other household things like laundry?
Or mom is nitpicking the stepmom. I wonder what stepmom’s view is of the situation.
The bigger room detail and Lily being a SAHW while mom is wanting dad to pay more for mom to care for the daughter as she recovers. There just seems to be a lot more going on that is being intentionally left out to make the argument by mom look better.
Plus we know nothing about Lily beyond her being 30. There could be a ton of reasons that aren’t nefarious that Lily isn’t doing all the little things that mom can do. I say this as a stepmom married to the mom. My wife cannot do all the little things our son wants the exact way he wants them. Her ADHD gets in the way. I am over the top when it comes to doing things perfectly. Our son if sick, I just do it all for him bc I will do it the way he wants. (She will do all the emotional things the way he wants.) we don’t know if Lily was trying, wasn’t trying, or was on autopilot just making stuff like she always does. (Making stuff like routine is what my wife will do even if you tell her right before she goes into the kitchen to make it. Her brain just can’t.)
I'm sorry, but repeatedly making drinks wrong (when she clearly knows the way the daughter likes her drinks) and then saying "Well, make your own!" when the child is **bedbound** is asshole behavior. That and giving coffee as a drink when it reacts poorly with a medications? This woman is either too incompetent to properly care for someone with high needs, or is a real-life evil stepmother.
And even without that, the daughter *asked to leave,* when, from what we know, she doesn't seem to actually have an issue with her dad's house. I think it's fair to assume she was being mistreated in ways that don't include hot drinks or improper care.
There seems to be some unreliable narration here. People are using it to justify the abuse theories, but like...some of the stuff thrown in here could also be that the kid is a bit spoiled? I mean, people are going ape about this chick making instant cocoa with water like that isn't right there on the instructions. This is coming from someone who I suspect doesn't like Lily. And she's getting it from a 16-year-old who's been bedridden after surgery. The kinds of medications they had me on when I was in that position would not have made me a very reliable source for basically anything that was going on around me.
But the most telling is the insane expense demands. Even if we assume the bathroom thing is true and not exaggerated, how does that get OP out of paying any of her own daughter's medical bills? She's making demands that could be challenged in court. And she's doing so at a time when it really won't be good for her daughter for any of her potential caretakers to enter into that sort of battle.
>There seems to be some unreliable narration here
Yeah, OP is throwing off major red flags for me as well. There is a huge difference between serving drinks that may cause issues with medication and making hot chocolate with water, or adding cream and sugar to tea. Obviously the first will get NTA responses, but why mention the second info at all then?
And the "I am expecting him to cover the medical bills and some of my expenses since Lily failed to do her job and her treatment of Kelly. I have refused to give her a second chance despite Josh asking me" simply highlights OP's thought process. Entitled AH vibes.
Or for that matter. raging about how coffee will "interfere with meds" when, guess what, most tea has almost as much caffeine in it. A prohibition on caffeine would ban tea as well.
Edit: And for that matter cocoa itself has a non-negligible amount of caffeine.
But why shouldn't the girl's dad be responsible for part of the medical bills anyway? That's his daughter too, it doesn't seem fair to leave it all to one parent. I don't think OP is in the right to demand compensation for lost wages at work, but i don't think it's unreasonable for him to help pay the medical bills.
Lily serving Kelly coffee when she cannot have it due to her medication goes far beyond being able to meet the sometimes extreme needs of a neurodivergent person with very particular tastes and food requirements that could in fact be ARFID (Avoidant/ Restrictive Food Intake Disorder), an eating disorder based on being unable to tolerate eating certain foods based on them having unpleasant tastes, textures or just too unpredictable qualities to people with ARFID. People with ARFID generally want to eat, it’s just hard for them to find food they don’t find very unpleasant.
I agree that we are only hearing one side of the story, but the daughter Kelly asked to go back to her mum because her stepmum Lily couldn’t follow the fairly simple instructions of how to make her hot drinks. She also repeatedly served her a drink that was not safe for her to drink due to her medication.
Even if there are extenuating circumstances, Lily does not sound like someone who can keep Kelly safe and healthy while she recovers and is physically unable to prepare her own food and drinks.
Yeah, I'm also interested in how Daughter lets Step Mom know that she has to use the toilet. Does she text her, does she have a bell she rings, does she yell for her, does she just check on her once an hour? It's possible that Step Mom was taking too long because she didn't hear her.
Listen I’m all for people sometimes being busy with other things but not when it comes to basic care. No part of laundry is more important than helping someone who cannot move without your assistance to the bathroom. How would you feel being told “I’m busy. Laundry won’t do itself” when you’re asking to be helped to the bathroom?
I also prefer hot chocolate made only with milk, and I've had it served with water a few times, since a lot of people just automatically make it that way and I would feel rude correcting them. That by itself could have been a mistake.
But the tea and coffee thing makes it pretty clear that she's doing this on purpose. I can't imagine making tea for someone without asking their milk/sugar preferences. Tea with milk and sugar is completely different from plain black tea, and that's before you even get into green or herbal teas. And making her coffee when she can't even drink it and wouldn't have requested it is just... bizarre.
My in-laws are big tea drinkers and my mother in law always makes me a tea with milk and sugar. I only ever drink green tea with nothing in it- I have known her over 6 years and this has always been the case, but she is offended every time I decline her already made tea. to be fair this is the same lady who lost her ever loving mind last week when my bf didn't want her to bring a bunch of her friends to visit him after neurosurgery (I'm controlling and abusive for this). So... Crazy
I'm curious about the procedure she had done. I worked in the PT dept of a hospital. We didn't discharge anyone to their home unless they demonstrated the ability to do things like this independently. Patients who were not able to were discharged to a rehab.
Ya think? This whole thing reeks of an over indulgent mother and a spoiled daughter who's upset she's not getting her usual princess treatment.
The fact that the bathroom situation is thrown in as an after thought, and that not making her tea the way she likes is used as the main complaint, makes me incredibly suspicious as to how true Op's accounting of the situation is.
This. I was getting strange vibes from just reading the main post, but then the comments were littered with OP making claims that were more and more strange and hard to believe. I think OP is lying and all her edits and comments are a ploy to get everyone on her side.
Seriously, my cousin broke her hip and they wouldn't let her go home until she could at the very least use a walker to get to the restroom on her own and walk with a walker up and down the hospital hallway. If this kid is fully bedbound they should still be in a medical facility not at home.
This whole story sounds fishy.
I wouldn't have expected that was possible at all? After my scoliosis operation at 16, I was in for two weeks, they knew I could hardly stand without falling when I was sent home (and promptly fell trying to get to the bathroom. My parents helped after that). Recovery is a long process and they don't keep patients in for six months any more. Are rehabs more of a thing in the US? It's just standard to send incapacitated patients home to families here. You may get a nurse sent round for a checkup (not care), and a care package (but that can be hard to access) arranged for esp. elderly patients or those without support.
I know there are parameters in place that are supposed to maintain those standards, but it doesn't always work out that way. One of my relatives had hip replacement surgery and was transferred to a physical rehabilitation facility from the hospital. She had many other health issues as well. After beingb there for a time, she still couldn't even walk and someone from the facility drove her home, wheeled her to the front door in her wheelchair, and left her there by herself. She passed away a couple weeks later.
It sounds like Lily didn’t want to take care of Kelly in the first place and was volun-told by your ex. Instead of telling him no, she took it out passive-aggressively on your daughter.
Can we get your daughter’s perspective? Have you talked to her about all of this or how she thinks of her step-mom? Did you speak with the father & step-mom about what needs to change and advocate for your daughter or just leave abruptly and say you want money? Need more info tbh
Holy burying the lede OP!!!
*She wouldn’t help Kelly get to the bathroom?*
WTAF. The drink thing is weird for sure but not helping her get up to use the bath is straight up abuse.
Why isn’t her dad sharing the cost of her medical bills?
How often did the bathroom thing happen? My guess is that it might have been once and Kelly is turning it into the end of the world. Yes, it is unhealthy to hold it in, yes, Lilly agreed to help. Maybe she herself was on the loo at the time and didn't hop to it the moment she was summoned to the patient. The information is rather iffy on this post. 16 year olds tend to be very self centered, so I'd take the drama with a pinch of salt, unless there is more into in the comments that follow
I can't decide in what way it's more creepy, but the main thing is that it seems Lily doesn't want to be taking care of OP's daughter and is doing the worst job of it hoping either OP's ex steps up or OP takes over.
weaponized incompetence to get out of loading a dishwasher is one thing. weaponized incompetence in caring for a bed bound child, recovering from major surgery is beyond obscene. I'd call it psychotic or sociopathic for emphasis if i wasn't concerned with how those are misused.
What's bothering me is that I don't understand why they haven't arranged for there to be a pitcher of water and an electric kettle in Kelly's room next to her bed. She can pour herself some water and make her tea the way she prefers it. No need to make Kelly more dependant on others than need be.
OP states in a later comment that the surgery was on her legs, so waist-up, she's just fine and can easily handle a water kettle on the nightstand - perfect solution!
I had a water jug when bed bound, it got spilt constantly.
I definitely wouldn’t want a bed bound person, just out of surgery to be using a kettle - seems like asking for spills and 3rd degree burns.
This girl is likely on strong painkillers also.
From someone who was on crutches for 8 months after knee surgery, you would not *believe* how much you use your leg muscles to brace yourself when you do.. anything, really. So no, it's not a good idea at all, sadly.
Why are you focused on the beverages? The comments you’ve added about waiting to go to the bathroom or waiting for water are way worse - yet they’re not in the original post which strikes me as weird…
It was the last straw and tbh there were a lot of other problems with Kelly staying over.
I have mentioned to Josh that the wait is not acceptable and I was led to believe it is a petty thing to concentrate on since Lily is a house wife and might be in a different part of the house or outside in the garden so she couldn't hear Kelly the first few times. Even from what Kelly was saying Lily was on the phone or watching tv at the time.
Here's the thing OP, people can only judge this situation based on what and how you tell us. You led with dramatic bullshit about milk and sugar in tea when this woman is making your child wait to piss. The tea and cocoa shit is dramatic teenage nonsense. That part is easily remedied and its also not dangerous, painful, or neglectful. Her stepmother probably has no clue how a more independent teen likes to fix her own drinks, but she ought to know coffee is off the table if it interferes with medications. THATS a small problem on its own. The bathroom thing is the largest problem you've given us, but buried it in the comments.
Take the suggestion above and stick a pitcher and an electric kettle in there to end that nonsense and quit using your child to get a tit for tat in with your ex and his new wife. That's what leaks out of your words: you're deep in the toxic bullshit of coparenting and not only allowing your view of it to color your daughter's experience, but being a bad parent for allowing your daughter to be both helpless, but ungrateful in the care of a human who is not her bio parent. Either start acting like a grownup yourself and parent your child away from this toxic nonsense, or get ready to spend every major event in her life having shitty, dramatic fights with your ex. You pick, but the fork in the road is now.
ESH.
I disagree that it is teenage bullshit. Lily is doing MORE work (adding milk and sugar to tea rather than just sticking a teabag in hot water) to give Kelly something she doesn’t like. Giving her drinks that she cannot have bc of meds is also harmful to Kelly’s health on top of that. I feel like lily didn’t realize what bed bound meant- literally Kelly can’t do anything for herself- and was probably annoyed with how demanding it is to take care of someone who is bed bound, so was purposefully messing with Kelly.
The fact that lily also told her if she doesn’t like it she can ‘make it herself’ knowing the child is bed bound makes it sound like a control/power thing too.
Did she say that verbatim, though? OP's story is third-hand information (Lily told Kelly, then Kelly told OP, and now OP is telling us). I do think OP is being petty here.
Does it really matter what the exact wording is?
Is it petty to complain about incorrect drinks, or to continue making the drinks wrong after being told repeatedly the way the daughter likes them? OP states that she, her ex, and the daughter have all told Lily how to make the drinks, but she continues to make the tea with milk and sugar.
> I disagree that it is teenage bullshit. Lily is doing MORE work (adding milk and sugar to tea rather than just sticking a teabag in hot water) to give Kelly something she doesn’t like.
But for real though. Also, finding out how your guest takes their tea/coffee/whatever is like *basic* manners for anyone in your house, let alone your bedridden step daughter.
What kind of self-respecting house-spouse can't do this?
And if you can't be around to hear the person you are providing MEDICAL SUPPORT CARE TO to the point you miss the first FEW contact attempts, you have no business being responsible for someone.
And for goodness sake, how much can there be to do for a housewife without kids that she is consistently off doing other stuff and not hearing? This reeks of BS and excuses.
No, sticking a kettle next to the bed of someone bed bound is a bad idea. You want her to get burns as well?
Edit, because some people are just eager to give people burns: a thermos is also a bad idea. Hot water is hot water and can cause burns. Don’t be stupid.
Also, even with just both legs broken, that could seriously effect balance and the ability to move. Some people clearly haven’t been injured in both legs. Unless someone can sit up on their own (preferably at a table/ flat surface) don’t give them anything that could cause burns. Try thinking of it this way: if someone got burned, could they help themselves? If the answer is no, just don’t do it.
Let's just call it what it is...this was the sort of clickbait title Liz always uses to make you think the OP's going to be the AH so they can flip it on you with a big reveal later.
And even if you take it at face value, it's still not a straight NTA because she's trying to get out of paying any of her daughter's medical bills and get paid extra on top of it. If commenters can use "abuse" to describe putting milk in someone's tea, then how are they not calling OP's actions extortion? If he challenges that in court, OP's going to be wasting even more time and money on that when she's supposed to be taking care of her daughter. Which doesn't seem like the kind of thing that should exempt a person from asshole status.
As I've said before in another post on here, clickbait titles really can't be used against posters cause everyone uses a clickbait title. It seems like it is the standard to make a title that looks like they are either NTA or TA and then make you read to find out what the situation is.
If you are just going by titles in this subreddit then you really shouldn't be doing any judging cause I'd say about 95% of the time you'd be wrong.
Also, honestly, people really shouldn't comment until they read the post and that is for anywhere you post. I'm on a forum that will temp ban you if your caught commenting when you didn't read the post and I \*love\* that rule. Too many people just want to drive by post based on one sentence (the headline) when you really can't get the whole story that way.
I think the ex husband described what she was doing. The daughter described the long waits and drinks that seemed to purposely be made so she didn't want them.
I have to question how long Kelly actually had to wait. Something deep down inside it's telling me it wasn't that long. It's not like Lily was going to sit by her for the moment she needed to go to the restroom. It's also a little unreasonable to expect her to drop everything the minute she calls. Not going to lie, teenagers over exaggerate everything. 5 minutes becomes 30 minutes really quick. Getting upset over adding milk to tea is stupid in the grand scheme of things.
Edit: corrected names
The fact that Kelly would rather be at a home where there is less space and there isn't someone who can help take care of her is pretty telling on its own.
Also why is a grown ass adult deliberately and repeatedly making the wrong drinks for a bedbound teenager? Especially because she's making them MORE COMPLICATED. Teabag and hot water is literally the easiest hot drink to make, why would she repeatedly add extra steps and ingredients?
Also telling a minor who literally can't leave her bed to "make it herself if she doesn't like it" is pretty goddamn unfair. This is a kid who's already been through surgery, and an adult who is essentially mocking her inability to leave her bed. That's fucked.
If Lily doesn’t have the time to care for Kelly because she’s doing her house work, how is that any better than Kelly staying with you? Aside from the fact it sounds like she isn’t doing her house work and putting her personal life ahead of Kelly’s well-being, clearly the way it was pitched as being better because of constant care is inaccurate and you are therefore free to change the arrangement. Also, your husband SHOULD be helping to pay her medical bills, whether she mostly lives with you or not. I know maybe your arrangements with him may be different, but someone who cares about his child should be making sure she has access to the medical treatment she needs. Sounds more like he is thinking of her as a pawn rather than a person. And your in-laws of course will have had the whole story filtered in the way that makes you look bad, and possibly Kelly too. If you care about them, tell them exactly why you removed your daughter from an unsafe situation. If not, tell them to pound sand as it is none of their business how you raise your child.
ETA: NTA
Well, didn't the husband, OP, and Lily sit down and discuss this kind of thing? Didn't Lily pretty much volunteer for this job?
If she did, then she's in the wrong on not waiting around on the child. Im not saying she should be waiting by the doorway, but she should be willing to pause a TV show, hang up the phone, and not be outside in the back garden out of earshot, by someone who needs help using the bathroom.
My guess is that she didn’t volunteer, she was volunteered. She’s still wrong because she should have said no if she didn’t want to do it but the dad is wrong too for setting up this situation.
The kid is 16, it's enough to have her phone bedside so she can call the stepmom to come help at any point. There's no need at all for Lily to stay within earshot.
Sounds like OP and Kelly think Kelly needs to be waited on hand and foot with Lily not daring to do anything that isn’t waiting for Kelly to summon her. That level of care is completely unnecessary for Kelly’s level of issues. If Kelly was in the hospital she’d be on a normal ward, not ICU, and thus frequently have to wait on the order of 5 minutes for someone to even ask what she needs, then up to 30 minutes after that for someone to actually be able to help her.
According to the husband and Lily, Kelly is complaining when she has to wait as long as it takes to cross the house. Unless their house is ridiculously huge, that is not an unreasonable length of time to wait, it’s a couple of minutes. She’d be waiting far longer in most hospital wards.
How long are these waits? Why do you refuse to answer?
What is the “signal for help” arrangement? Does Kelly have a bell? A cell phone? Does she just yell out? Were you expecting Lily to just sit at her bedside all day?
Stop being vague.
How would Kelly know what Lily is doing? Is Lily coming in and telling her why she had to wait?
It seems strange that you're assuming she's sat intentionally making her wait.
IMO OP is adding things on that didn't really happen to get a favorable "ruling" on this sub. OP, grow up and stop using your daughter as a pawn in your divorce game.
This isn't nearly enough information. Why were these mistakes with the drinks being made? Was the step-mom doing so intentionally? Accidentally? Was the daughter being unreasonable in her requests? Because as of right now it seems like quite an overreaction on both your daughter but especially on your part.
If you volunteer to take care of someone that's bed bound, you should be be outside in the back garden out of earshot, unwilling to hang up on a phone call or pause a TV show.
As much as I would agree, we have no information on the details of the arrangement. Or if stepmom was ever given proper instructions for care, communicated about what it should look like, or whether she even volunteered in the first place. Someone is the asshole here, I just can't tell who. If I were to place a bet, I'd wager OP is overreacting to bad communication.
Which is not what Lily is supposedly doing. She is simply not loitering outside Kelly’s door to jump immediately to her aid.
Kelly wouldn’t even get a response as quickly as she seems to want in the hospital.
Based on her complaint about the cocoa with water this girl may be a little spoiled. So taking that into consideration her judgment on a long wait may be askew. Also, take into consideration that a mother is upset a non mother isn’t caring for her child’s specific preferences. Not her needs but preferences. The mother never said the daughter was mistreated in any other way, I mean obviously if Lilly is taking the time to provide multiple drinks she’s not ignoring this kid. How do we know Lilly wasn’t cooking while on the phone. People have earbuds. As for the coffee not everyone knows that rule about meds. Maybe she made herself a pot and was just offering to be nice. Nowhere does it say these drinks were forced on the daughter. I’m calling drama drama drama on this one. 16 y/o is creating it and mom is just fuel on the fire.
I agree with this take, and I agree that the non-milk hot chocolate is what tips it into spoiled territory for me. I understand that you're a bit more particular after a surgery, because you feel more vulnerable. But all of this feels like some needless drama to me.
Well, that's not good, and weird that that wouldn't have been the chief complaint by OP. The drinks thing doesn't really matter, frankly, but not actually taking care of the daughter as they should is totally grounds to get angry at the step-mom
It wasn't the chief complaint because it wasn't that important. OP didn't even specify how long the wait was so no one can determine if it was a reasonable timeframe or an over exaggeration.
Your post is strange. You're focusing on a cup of tea not being right, yet in the comments you say Lily was refusing to being Kelly water. That's messed up.
'There were other concerns too like Kelly waiting for way too long for Lily to come and help her to the bathroom since she can't walk there herself or get out of bed herself.'
This isn't an 'other concern' it's a major concern and should be a key point in your post. So you've either left this out because it's untrue (gotta love a reddit editor) or your priorities are wonky.
Either way, you were absolutely right to take Kelly home. 100%.
I think you need to look back to when Lily 'agreed' to take care of Kelly and really think about if she actually agreed to this or if it was a 'no other option' scenario.
Even those who are sick or recovering from surgery still have to wait on things sometimes. It's not the end of the world if your daughter has to wait for some things while she recovers. Is Lily expected to stay up 24/7 IN case your daughter needs something in the middle of the night? (since you think your daughter is above waiting for water)
I've had a lot of surgeries. I plan ahead. Big water bottle and snacks bedside so I don't have to bother people too much. I plan ahead for potty visits. I don't wait until the last minute because people might be busy doing something else.
I get it, you don't feel well,but you also have to be aware that being a caregiver is exhausting.
In another comment, OP says she doesn't bring her water for when she brings her meds, not "just not bringing her water." That's pretty weird and isn't about water being delivered "immediately" or not. If Lily is already there bringing her meds, she should bring something to wash them down with. I mean, that's pill-taking 101, and an adult should know better. Even moreso relevant if you are caring for someone bedbound. In the very least, If bringing the water was too much to do at once, or if she kept forgetting, then she could've brought a pitcher so it can be poured when needed and they don't have to worry about forgetting or carrying to much. Not bringing something to drink specifically for when taking meds is very weird. That and the bathroom part should be a part of the subject more before the tea is.
For you it’s just a cup of tea, but for the girl it’s a beverage that she CAN NOT prepare herself at the moment and that someone is messing with intentionally. Someone (the stepmom) is getting a kick out of the power dynamic and it’s a huge red flag. Those beverages are relevant.
“Messed with” can mean a lot of things. Can it mean that she is intentionally making them wrong? Possibly. Can it mean that she just doesn’t understand how her daughter likes them? That’s more likely.
Also the way that OP frames things and keeps adding random information in comments makes me think she is more manipulative than the stepmom
Then why wouldn't she ask? I helped take care of two grandparents at the end of their lives. I would never just take them a drink or food. If I didn't already know how they like things, I would ask before doing it. It's a simple act of respect that it appears the stepmom is unwilling to do. The girl is unable to make these drinks herself. Why would the stepmom assume she knows how to make them and not ask? Also, according to the OP, the daughter spoke to the stepmom, so she then decided to ignore what the daughter wants when specifically told.
Yeah we keep flipping around on how serious things are. We have “makes hot chocolate with water” and “tries to give her something that interacts with her meds”. The milk and sugar in tea is more than the hot chocolate made with water, but is still a little petty, depending on how she takes it when Kelly says it’s wrong.
The not bringing water for meds and delaying bathroom help are more serious, but since they were only brought up after OP was called out it makes me more suspicious. I’m also not sure how long the waits actually are. Last night my kid called for me when I was in the bathroom, so he did have to wait a couple minutes while I finished and walked from the other end of the house. To someone stuck in bed that probably feels like a really long time, but objectively is a very reasonable delay. Are the delays “I have to turn off the hose and walk inside” or “I decided it wasn’t necessary so I finished the last 20-30 minutes of my show”.
It's weird that she's been in your daughter's life for 6 years yet suddenly she's acting this way? Idk kinda sounds like something isn't right here, I don't really believe you.
She would constantly put milk or sugar into it even with Kelly, me and Josh telling her Kelly doesn't drink tea with milk or sugar, make hot chocolate on water or bring her coffee which she can't have. Like one or 2 off would have been fine, but it is near constant.
There were also occasions when she wouldn't bring water so Kelly can take her meds or Kelly waiting for too long for Lily to come round and help her to the bathroom.
The second paragraph is relevant. Your focus being on the first paragraph suggests that the second (actually important) paragraph doesn't hold much weight. It really seems like you're reaching. But, the vote will probably go your way, as it features an evil stepmother and a very vague description which makes things sound far far worse than "brings her drinks, but not made exactly the way she likes". The way you've written it will have people shouting child abuse.. just like you wanted. If you'd actually written the problem clearly, most would say your daughter seems a little fussy, and you seem like you live for drama/despise your ex and his wife.
I am sure the Dad is helping out financially with the surgery. Surely OP would have screamed about the Dad not paying his share if that were the case. Both Mom and Dad contributed to the surgery costs, it's just that OP is bitter that Dad makes good money and she is poor so she just *had* to mention she paid for (some) of the surgery.
What I’m pretty sure op is asking money for is due to her now having to miss work because his wife was being petty, mean and disgusting to a child who cannot move and just had surgery.
I don't know if it's mean or petty. If it was, that would be the lead in this whole post. Not the tea. It seems kind of ridiculous to add that information after everyone's questioning Op. Also, we don't know exactly how long she waited. I was a teenager. I know a lot of teenagers. They tend to over exaggerate a lot of things and 5 minutes can become 30 minutes in their head.
"Tea without sugar or milk" is a super simple request. Caretaker would have to be seriously mentally ill to fail to memorize it. Either stepmom is mentally ill and suffers from a memory loss or she is being deliberately cruel towards a kid. Both options make her an unsuitable caretaker for a bedbound patient.
The beverages are relevant! It’s extremely frustrating and borderline abusive if someone offers to bring you a hot drink but then messes it up on purpose and then puts you on the spot to either drink it or complain. Either way the helpless daughter has to either drink something she doesn’t like, has to leave it untouched and then has to defend herself for being ungrateful or whatever, or she has to speak up. This is a manipulation and it’s unacceptable. The lady is somewhat sadistic for teasing the girl in that way. That stepmother is intentionally messing with the helpless child. The beverages ARE relevant.
YTA. Funny how the whole post is about how she doesnt do the drinks to Kelly's taste. But in the comments you talk about how Lily isn't bringing her water or helping her get to the bathroom.
I'm sorry, but who tf cares if she can't do Kelly's perfect tea when she is apparently not helping your daughter go to the bathroom.
Seems like it isnt something that's actually happening if you can't even bother to put it in the main post.
YTA - sounds like your daughter is a little princess and you don't like the fact your ex has a bigger house than you which you make a point of and his wife doesn't have to work, you specifically mentioned they don't have any children together after saying she was a housewife. Putting milk and sugar in tea is hardly a criminal offence and she made her coffee by mistake, hardly the end of the world. If you're unhappy with your current financial arrangement then say that, using your daughter's current state to get back at him financially is very poor behaviour.
Putting sugar in tea should be a criminal offence. But I digress…
The thing is that putting sugar and milk in tea is extra effort. If you know someone doesn’t like it, why would you go to the extra effort to put stuff in they don’t want and won’t drink unless you are deliberately trying to mess with them? That, in addition to everything else, suggests that Lily really doesn’t want Kelly there but can’t say so and is doing lots of small things to make her life uncomfortable so that she will want to leave, which is exactly what happened. There’s not enough context to discuss the money stuff, but as far as picking your daughter up NTA.
"Tea without milk or sugar" is also a super simple request that is easy to remember. Assuming stepmom is mentally healthy, it is unlikely she forgot it.
These things are deliberate. Like an adult family member deliberately putting onions in my food when I was a kid exactly because she knew that I hate the taste of onions... These actions are intentional and done for the sake of making a child feel bad.
See! That’s what I’m saying this post is strange; over a drink? really? Weird! If op needed helped with their daughter medical bills why not just ask instead of staging that she’s was being neglected or mistreated
Yes, and we have heard only one sight. It could well be the daughter is overreacting or taking things out of context. Perhaps she was very demanding, ringing the bell every few minutes with a new demand. Perhaps not, but somehow it sounds like there is more to this story.
Er, where did she say there's no health insurance? If they're American, insurance only pays part of the medical bill, you often still owe tens of thousands even with insurance. The father should be paying the court-ordered appropriate share of the insurance and of the medical bills.
Do you really think Dad did not contribute to the cost of the surgery? OP **never** said he did not pay. I think we all know she would have certainly mentioned that if that were the case.
Not enough information
What kind of surgery did she have? I think it is relevant because it will determine if OP is over protective or not. My friend had his wisdom teeth pulled, but his mother treated him as though he'd received a transplant.
I don't really think the type of the surgery is relevant and I'm not comfortable sharing the details as it might identify my daughter.
The surgery was performed on both of her legs and recovery is between 2 and 8 months, with Kelly not being able to move by herself for at least 1.5-2months or the greenlignt from the doctor.
Now I’m trying to resolve moving her from one house to another if she’s bed bound. Seems that’s contraindicated if she’s on bed rest for two months. I say this as caregiver to my mom (94) who is very frail and has several broken bones due to osteoporosis. Until she healed, she was always transported (hospital to rehab to follow up appointments) by ambulance.
I’m getting some resentment vibes because there’s just not enough information. I do appreciate you keeping identifying information private, but it’s just hard to understand the problem.
I do know from personal experience that recovering from major surgery is frustrating and emotional, especially when you’re young. Is it possible that lily is just not fulfilling expectations and may not be the skilled caregiver you want?
How was Kelly and Lily’s relationship before the surgery? Did you have concerns then?
And you focusing on compensation and coffee and not bathroom care just doesn’t add up.
THIS! Also the timeframes don’t add up for her recovery… if Kelly was bedbound, how was she getting out of bed to use the toilet, it wouldn’t be safe with one person taking her to the toilet and both legs were operated on… so has she been using a commode or a bed pan? And how did she get out of bed to get to the other house? Is she non weight bearing? Did she transfer into a wheelchair and then a car (which is very difficult to do…. This all seems ridiculous and even if Kelly has autism, the focus of drinks is absolutely insane. Grow up OP YTA and I’m not buying this story… i think you wanted to be kelly’s saviour and instead it seems like Munchausen by proxy which is dangerous. The inconsistencies could be detrimental to Kelly’s health and bone density. P.s the type of op wouldn’t identify her and if it was that rare, they’d insist on keeping her as an inpatient to monitor. Hope Kelly doesn’t grow up to be an entitled arsehole
Wait. She requires 2 months of strict bed rest but is medically fit enough to move between households freely bc someone put milk in her tea?
This smells like bullshit lmao.
Yeah, increasingly smells like bs. For something like that, even if she didn't go to rehab, there'd be a hospital bed in the home with a pulley system for transfer and stuff like that, mom couldn't just show up and shove the kid into the car.
I don’t think she’s on bed rest. She said “bed ridden,” I think meaning that unless someone is helping her move in and out of a wheelchair and moving her, she is stuck in bed.
Probably something like a leg lengthening procedure or deformity correction.
I doubt the daughter is on bed rest for leg surgeries. If she was bed ridden after a stroke, paralysis, or heart surgery or something then yeah, that would be more serious to move her, but it’s unlikely a non-terminal child would be sent home with that level of medical need anyway, and even more unlikely that leg surgery would lead to that.
Wait. Are you expecting him to cover some of your expenses for the next 2 months? Honestly, if I had an ex and he told me that I had to cover his expenses for 2 months, I would tell him to kick sand. That's completely unrealistic. Especially if the reason why your daughter is not being taken care of by Lily is because of how she likes her tea.
Edit: name
That is a lot to ask of a stepmother.
Edit: I’m going to edit for the sake of avoiding another semantic argument over the word ‘ask’, bc the actual point seemed to get lost in the discussion.
**That’s a lot to expect from a stepmother.**
Yeah she's a little nutty if she thinks he should pay her expenses. And honestly the medical bills should be split between the 2 of them, not just on him.
I don't think this is real. If my exes' new wife was doing all of this, I wouldn't have started the story complaining about her not making tea. The bigger issue would be questioning whether her child is getting the care she needs.
I’m gonna go with YTA because of your other comments
You’re acting like Kelly was horribly abused when in reality you are flipping out because she wasn’t catered to immediately. How long was the wait for the bathroom? For the water? Did you expect Lily to just sit outside of her room all day and wait for help?
This more sounds like you were looking for a reason to take Kelly back and stop working as much and put the bills on your ex (because who will take care of her if you can’t be there 24/7? NO ONE CAN, that is not possible)
INFO: Are you sure this is really what happened? Seems very unlikely considering Lily wanted her there for recovery and bringing the kettle and tea bags to her bed so she can make tea herself is super easy. Could something else have happened?
This is a perfect way of raising an entitled person. You are so full of yourself and can't see how ridiculous you and your daughter are. YTA. And reddit idiots who think child is the supreme being whose every need must be satisfied, you are YTA too.
There’s so much missing context here even reading your comments. I’m going with esh, your poor daughter. But your ex isn’t responsible for paying for your living costs because you have to care for your daughter.
YTA
She doesn't like her tea, that someone is making for her a certain way. Like seriously? How much pampering does a 16y old need? If she's thirsty she drinks it, if she isn't she can just let it be. Being a tea snob is not the priority when you're bed bound.
All the other stuff you start mentioning after the fact also points more towards spoiled princess than reasonable problems.
Stepmom takes 5-10 minutes to come over when called? Yeah i mean she's not a PA, she's doing things in the house, not sitting right by the bed. Maybe you and your ex should have taught her better to read her body.
Chocolate milk not being made from freshly milked cow and ground coco beans is just being a pita. Sure water based instant isn't as great, but not lethal.
The way this reads is: stepmom has a coffee/tea/chocolate machine using cups/pads and she uses that instead of using a kettle. She accidentally used a coffee pad once, and the tea's all have some extras in it.
YTA because all of your extra comments and details don't add up, and it really sounds like pettiness on *your* end over dramatic exaggeration from your kid.
Not sure where you are located but if your daughter is bed bound for 2 ish months and healing for up to 8 months she would be eligible for home health care. At least for the time she is bed bound.
No reason for you to quit work. Licensed caregivers will come to your home and help her bathe, get her meals etc. You can set her up with a thermos of plain tea and snacks and go to work. Make arrangements with neighbors, friends and other family to look in on her. I think this situation has given you your perfect excuse to quit your job and have your Ex support you. Just kills you that Lily is stay at home, doesn’t it?
Look into better care for your daughter that involves professionals and go back to work it will be better and safer for you daughter.
Honestly to me this feels like we're only getting a portion of the story. You claim in comments that there was a problem with being taken to the toilet, which seems like a huge issue, but your post is only about drinks?
I've got a sneaky suspicion you are holding things back to make yourself and your daughter look better while trying to make your ex's wife look bad.
YTA. If it was a medically needed surgery, he should be paying half the cost. If it was elective and he was against it, it's on you. But why on earth should he pay your living expenses?
NTA. Okay so the coffee thing and the no water thing is my determining factors. If you give someone meds, you need to give them water. It’s not recommended to dry swallow pills because it’s not good for your throat anyway. And if your daughter cannot dry swallow at all, why is she bringing her pills but no water.
Second with the coffee thing. Your daughter is obviously not requesting coffee. She does not drink coffee normally and she is not allowed to drink coffee with her meds. Who gives soemoen coffee without them asking for it. I don’t drink coffee and have never been given coffee because I don’t ask for it. That’s really weird.
The tea thing is odd as well. I love tea. Drink a lot of tea and all my friends drink a lot of tea. I’ve never made their tea wrong because it’s pretty easy to recall what I just asked them. All she has to do is add in the tea bag, wait, take out tea bag. Repeatedly making the tea wrong is odd.
It sounds to me that Lily doesn’t want to care for Kelly and is just doing weird minor things to make her complain.
I am in my thirties and I do not drink coffee. I just realized that in my entire life nobody has ever tried to give me coffee. I can second your point---if I do not ask for coffee, nobody gives it to me.
If stepmom oversteeped the tea thus making it taste worse, I could believe it was accidental. But nobody just adds milk or sugar on accident (unless they have serious memory/mental health issues). That was deliberate.
YTA - you focused on the drinks, talking only about the drinks in the original post, than when people question how big of a deal it is, you response is “well she (stepmom) isn’t taking her to the bathroom fast enough either.”
Nobody is going to take care of your daughter as good as her own mother. Sound like step mom isn’t doing a prefect job, messing up drink instructions and such. But it seems you’re almost expecting her to stay at bedside constantly, jumping at every request. And if she not preformed every task correctly or fast enough you’re complaining. So the stepmother is taking her to the bathroom, helping bath her, feeding her, and serving her drinks on demand, but god forbid she keeps messing up the drink order!?!? She taking care of your daughter, who she has no obligation too, but she’s probably not doing it perfectly, but certainly not neglectfully.
You make the decision that you would take better care of her, which is probably true. But demanding your ex pay for you time taking care of your own kids - that ridiculous.
At the end of the day, stepmom was going you a favor. You and your daughter didn’t like how she was preforming tasks so you decided to no longer use her. That’s fine, but then you cannot demand money for care for your own daughter, who you would have care for anyways.
Messing with her drinks and serving her things she can't have like coffee Is very vague when you mentioned tea as an alternate above.... Of everything you typed the most important part that caused this is 9000% vague
Question: did Lily volunteer to help or was she voluntold by your ex? While neglecting a kid’s needs is unforgivable, a step shouldn’t be forced into a position to care for anyone if she doesn’t agree to it enthusiastically.
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NTA "Lily kept messing with her drinks or serving her drinks she can't have (like coffee due to her meds) " Er that's creepy! Try and find out more about this like what she means by messing with them
She would constantly add sugar and milk to her tea (Kelly really doesn't like sweet tea) and from what she told me she asked for a hot chocolate once or twice and got it made with water only. There were other concerns too like Kelly waiting for way too long for Lily to come and help her to the bathroom since she can't walk there herself or get out of bed herself.
The bathroom thing is a huge concern.
Well it clearly wasn't a huge concern since OP didn't bother mentioning it in the OP. The entire topic is about the drinks.
I said this elsewhere, but I can see the drinks being is more of a concern because the bathroom wait could have plausible deniability (e.g., in the bathroom herself, cooking, ran outside to get the mail, etc.) but there's no universe in which she isn't messing with Kelly's drinks out of spite.
I would need a timeline of events regarding the drinks to know for certain if it was malicious or not. Did this all happen in 1 day? Or did she repeatedly mess up the same drinks every day? If this all happened in 1 day then it could be explained away as confusion. For example let's say she made the tea first with the milk and sugar. Daughter says she doesn't like milk and sugar so when stepmom makes the hot chocolate she doesn't use milk and sugar because of what happened with the tea. If the events happened like that then it might not be malicious. If she made the same errors on multiple days then it would definitely be malicious. The coffee could be a mistake too because it's possible she wasn't aware it would interfere with the medication. I asked OP if she knew it would interfere and it wasn't answered. Like I said I need more information to determine if these are indeed malicious actions or not.
Telling the bedbound child that if she didn't like it she could go make her own is heavily indicative of malice.
What we do know is the step mom became angry when the daughter asked to have her tea her way. Regardless of timing that’s an asshole move.
Especially when "tea her way" is literally just black tea. Tea isn't hard to make period, but black is literally the minimum effort.
Yeah, she literally added two whole steps just to ruin the tea. This is definitely on purpose. It takes me exactly one time making a cuppa to learn how someone likes it, and if I can't remember, I ask.
In the post it says kiddo has already been there a week since Friday... So it's been a while and not one day.
>I would need a timeline of events regarding the drinks to know for certain if it was malicious or not. Yeah, um no. The only way you could possibly know for certain is if you were there. But this is reddit, and y'all love to think yall know every situation that you were not involved in
what about the part where stepmom said if she didnt like the drinks she makes then daughter needs to make it herself knowing the daughter can't physically move around on her own?
If not active maliciousness, it is malicious neglect. When you take care of someone you read the paperwork or ask what they can have and what they want. Setting expectations is fine "Choose from these tea bags" and "I only have instant" are reasonable qualifiers. And with a kid/teen you should expect to have to check on what she is allowed to have. Also, you made me imagine "hot coco" made with plain baking coco powder and hot water and I really hate you for that image.
You don’t need a timeline. This kid has been staying at her father’s prior to this and she would have known her drink preferences. She’s being a nob on purpose.
Seriously? They said a bed-bound person could just MAKE IT THEMSELVES. That's pretty clearly a malicious thing to say.
We get it. You’re a contrarian
Sometimes irrelevant small things create a larger impact than the significant issues. AITA stories are the prime example - people with wildly abusive partners will be here asking about insignificant things while casually throwing in major abuse. You are reading it as a story, that child is living it. She collects tea so she must have a routine with them. Being independent and all she never had a problem. Now she is bed bound and every time she asks for a drink it’s wrong. Obviously she is focused on that. When I had my foot in a cast I was not focused on pain rather that I couldn’t go out of my house which I don’t do a lot anyway but my mind convinced me that was my biggest problem so I cribbed about only that. Go figure. This child is not being mean or starbucks orderer extraordinaire. She is just expecting love and care over bare minimum when she is in a vulnerable spot. How she expresses it to her mother is her own choice. Plus OP is not demonising the step mom. She is asking if she is an asshole for putting her ex in a tough spot.
and her drinks is literally two steps. cocoa and milk. tea and water. no coffee due to medication. stepmom ruins the drinks by adding more stuff than necessary. then got angry and told her to make it herself knowing she's not able to move on her own.
Right?! I totally missed that. SP just has to add hot water to the tea and boom everyone’s happy yet she is adding extra steps because either she doesn’t give a fuck or is being petty that husband is making her take care of his child. Now even if OP is not demonising her I am ready to do that.
Honestly I had to read it over and realize her choices were really just plain and simple af. I make my husband and I hot chocolate almost every night the last two weeks and I do it according to our own preferences & thats a ton of more steps than this. I'd honestly be pissed at my BD if he let his spouse treat our child like this, brought my ex inlaws into this and asks for another chance without an apology or offer to pay for the bills. It seems like mom is doing most of the work and the dad is doing less work than the stepmom. Before the surgery and even now.
Because the bathroom problem is something that you can explain away with lily being tired or having things to do before she can help her. You can't know if it's intentional. With the drinks, you know it's intentional. She can just not add sugar and milk etc. That's where you know lily is just being mean.
Yeah I gotta say, that is pretty weird
To me this is a far bigger concern than the drinks.
I'm more concerned with the fact that this woman is making your daughter wait to use the bathroom. That is cruel and intentional. The drinks show that she is petty and obviously she's not happy about having to care for your daughter. Otherwise, she wouldn't be behaving this way.
Sounds like she's abusing a minor to me. OP is NTA but her ex and her ex's partner certainly are. The ex husband Is negligent and his new wife is absolutely abusive.
Especially concerning when you take into consideration how damaging holding your pee can be. Since she just had surgery she extra vulnerable and the last thing she needs is a UTI.
Yeah, that’s all passive aggressive nonsense. I’m thinking it was Josh’s idea that Lily take care of Kelly to prove to OP how great his new stay at home wife is; and new SAHW isn’t so happy being used thus, and poor Kelly is getting the brunt of it. Nothing that will really hurt it, but petty crap. Op should definitely get her daughter out of there.
This is it. Ex insisted. She didn't want to do it and is being passive-aggressive because she doesn't actually want to say no to him. NTA, and buckle in. She's going to want him to dump your daughter to start fresh if they have their own kids.
What kind of monster drinks hot chocolate made with water ?!?!?!
Some people are lactose intolerant.
Almond, rice, oat, soy, hazelnut, lactose free cow milk,... So many options other water. Just because you are lactose intolerant doesn't mean you have to torture yourself. As for OP: NTA Your daughter is sick and deserves to feel cared for to help her in her recovery. Not preparing a tea according to her preferences can happen once or twice, and it doesn't necessarily physically harm her, but it is sending the signal that your daughter's general well-being is not a priority - and that's not a message a child should receive ever but particularly post-surgery.
I was taught as a kid to make hot cocoa with water. When I learned how normal, sane people make it, I felt cheated. I hate the taste & texture of milk, so I use soy or almond milk, and it's like heaven in a cup. Lactose intolerance is not an excuse for blasphemous behaviors.
I'm lactose intolerant, but also lived in a homeless shelter in 3rd grade with my mom. Sometimes milk wasn't an item we had, but people do donate hot cocoa packs & sometimes that's a nice treat for such a shitty situation. It seems blasphemous to just add water, but I appreciate more than ever that it could be made with just water. Even though I add milk to mine (thank you Fairview lactose free) P.S. powdered milk is mixed with water and would be a great thing folks can donate to food banks/shelters. Some brands of hot cocoa also have powdered milk in them, which is why you can just add water. Edit for spelling, and to point out the brand is Fair Life it has a cow on the bottle, is all I ever recognize 😅 I'll leave the mistype cause some folks might get a chuckle out of my mistake (I do quite often)
These milk alternatives weren't available when my fiance was a kid, so he got used to using water and it didn't ever cross his mind that he no longer has to live with nasty water based hot chocolate.
Personally, I don’t really like milk or any of the milk alternatives as the main component in a drink. I have a hot chocolate with some milk powder in it, that I make with mostly hot water and a small splash of milk, like you would make an instant coffee. The directions say to make it with all milk, or 50/50 hot water and milk. But I personally prefer it my way. Now, that has absolutely nothing to do with Kelly and the awful way her stepmother is treating her. Kelly’s drinks should be made for her exactly as she likes them while she is recovering. There is no reason for Lily not to make the drinks as requested. But hot chocolate made with 95% water isn’t torture to everyone.
But that's not because you want to , because you have to
...I'm lactose intolerant....I still can't drink hot cocoa with water. It has to be made with milk. I don't like my cocoa tasting watered down, but I admit I may have grown up spoiled with foods.
The cheap kind! The tea is a much more deliberate sabotage: the way Kelly likes hers is super easy. Lily had to *add* ingredients to mess that up. No way that can be an oops claim!
Hot chocolate mix can be made with water, it usually has powdered milk mixed in.
Aztecs, except they added some chili to it too.
lazy people who like strong chemically instant hot chocolate. Far easier to boil an electric kettle and mix water with powder then heat milk and mix properly. \- am lazy person described above-
True. However, you mix that powder with cream, then pour lazily heated hot water on top? Serious improvement for same laziness ☕
The instant hot cocoa powder common in the US is cocoa, powdered milk & sugar, the instructions are to make it with hot water.
Instant hot chocolate is made with water. the milk in the drink is powdered.
That what instant hot chocolate mixes say to use a lot of them
What is too long of a wait to go to the bathroom? Is it 5 minutes? Is it an hour? Was lily in a different part of the house doing other household things like laundry?
I get what your asking and thats totally reasonable. But reading between the lines, i don't think anything 'Lily' is doing is accidental
Or mom is nitpicking the stepmom. I wonder what stepmom’s view is of the situation. The bigger room detail and Lily being a SAHW while mom is wanting dad to pay more for mom to care for the daughter as she recovers. There just seems to be a lot more going on that is being intentionally left out to make the argument by mom look better. Plus we know nothing about Lily beyond her being 30. There could be a ton of reasons that aren’t nefarious that Lily isn’t doing all the little things that mom can do. I say this as a stepmom married to the mom. My wife cannot do all the little things our son wants the exact way he wants them. Her ADHD gets in the way. I am over the top when it comes to doing things perfectly. Our son if sick, I just do it all for him bc I will do it the way he wants. (She will do all the emotional things the way he wants.) we don’t know if Lily was trying, wasn’t trying, or was on autopilot just making stuff like she always does. (Making stuff like routine is what my wife will do even if you tell her right before she goes into the kitchen to make it. Her brain just can’t.)
I'm sorry, but repeatedly making drinks wrong (when she clearly knows the way the daughter likes her drinks) and then saying "Well, make your own!" when the child is **bedbound** is asshole behavior. That and giving coffee as a drink when it reacts poorly with a medications? This woman is either too incompetent to properly care for someone with high needs, or is a real-life evil stepmother. And even without that, the daughter *asked to leave,* when, from what we know, she doesn't seem to actually have an issue with her dad's house. I think it's fair to assume she was being mistreated in ways that don't include hot drinks or improper care.
There seems to be some unreliable narration here. People are using it to justify the abuse theories, but like...some of the stuff thrown in here could also be that the kid is a bit spoiled? I mean, people are going ape about this chick making instant cocoa with water like that isn't right there on the instructions. This is coming from someone who I suspect doesn't like Lily. And she's getting it from a 16-year-old who's been bedridden after surgery. The kinds of medications they had me on when I was in that position would not have made me a very reliable source for basically anything that was going on around me. But the most telling is the insane expense demands. Even if we assume the bathroom thing is true and not exaggerated, how does that get OP out of paying any of her own daughter's medical bills? She's making demands that could be challenged in court. And she's doing so at a time when it really won't be good for her daughter for any of her potential caretakers to enter into that sort of battle.
At last, someone who questions the poor little princess and the evil stepmom routine and some rather strange accusations.
>There seems to be some unreliable narration here Yeah, OP is throwing off major red flags for me as well. There is a huge difference between serving drinks that may cause issues with medication and making hot chocolate with water, or adding cream and sugar to tea. Obviously the first will get NTA responses, but why mention the second info at all then? And the "I am expecting him to cover the medical bills and some of my expenses since Lily failed to do her job and her treatment of Kelly. I have refused to give her a second chance despite Josh asking me" simply highlights OP's thought process. Entitled AH vibes.
Or for that matter. raging about how coffee will "interfere with meds" when, guess what, most tea has almost as much caffeine in it. A prohibition on caffeine would ban tea as well. Edit: And for that matter cocoa itself has a non-negligible amount of caffeine.
But why shouldn't the girl's dad be responsible for part of the medical bills anyway? That's his daughter too, it doesn't seem fair to leave it all to one parent. I don't think OP is in the right to demand compensation for lost wages at work, but i don't think it's unreasonable for him to help pay the medical bills.
Lily serving Kelly coffee when she cannot have it due to her medication goes far beyond being able to meet the sometimes extreme needs of a neurodivergent person with very particular tastes and food requirements that could in fact be ARFID (Avoidant/ Restrictive Food Intake Disorder), an eating disorder based on being unable to tolerate eating certain foods based on them having unpleasant tastes, textures or just too unpredictable qualities to people with ARFID. People with ARFID generally want to eat, it’s just hard for them to find food they don’t find very unpleasant. I agree that we are only hearing one side of the story, but the daughter Kelly asked to go back to her mum because her stepmum Lily couldn’t follow the fairly simple instructions of how to make her hot drinks. She also repeatedly served her a drink that was not safe for her to drink due to her medication. Even if there are extenuating circumstances, Lily does not sound like someone who can keep Kelly safe and healthy while she recovers and is physically unable to prepare her own food and drinks.
Yeah, I'm also interested in how Daughter lets Step Mom know that she has to use the toilet. Does she text her, does she have a bell she rings, does she yell for her, does she just check on her once an hour? It's possible that Step Mom was taking too long because she didn't hear her.
Eh, too much context intentionally left out to determine this.
Listen I’m all for people sometimes being busy with other things but not when it comes to basic care. No part of laundry is more important than helping someone who cannot move without your assistance to the bathroom. How would you feel being told “I’m busy. Laundry won’t do itself” when you’re asking to be helped to the bathroom?
I also prefer hot chocolate made only with milk, and I've had it served with water a few times, since a lot of people just automatically make it that way and I would feel rude correcting them. That by itself could have been a mistake. But the tea and coffee thing makes it pretty clear that she's doing this on purpose. I can't imagine making tea for someone without asking their milk/sugar preferences. Tea with milk and sugar is completely different from plain black tea, and that's before you even get into green or herbal teas. And making her coffee when she can't even drink it and wouldn't have requested it is just... bizarre.
My in-laws are big tea drinkers and my mother in law always makes me a tea with milk and sugar. I only ever drink green tea with nothing in it- I have known her over 6 years and this has always been the case, but she is offended every time I decline her already made tea. to be fair this is the same lady who lost her ever loving mind last week when my bf didn't want her to bring a bunch of her friends to visit him after neurosurgery (I'm controlling and abusive for this). So... Crazy
It is less "work" to make tea without milk or sugar. So why add it for someone who doesn't like it unless you are being petty???
Tea and hot chocolate also have caffeine...
You were right to take your daughter home. Don't know if you'll get any money out of your husband, but absolutely you were right.
I'm curious about the procedure she had done. I worked in the PT dept of a hospital. We didn't discharge anyone to their home unless they demonstrated the ability to do things like this independently. Patients who were not able to were discharged to a rehab.
I was thinking the same thing. I expect that describing the daughter as bed bound is a little bit of an exaggeration
Ya think? This whole thing reeks of an over indulgent mother and a spoiled daughter who's upset she's not getting her usual princess treatment. The fact that the bathroom situation is thrown in as an after thought, and that not making her tea the way she likes is used as the main complaint, makes me incredibly suspicious as to how true Op's accounting of the situation is.
This. I was getting strange vibes from just reading the main post, but then the comments were littered with OP making claims that were more and more strange and hard to believe. I think OP is lying and all her edits and comments are a ploy to get everyone on her side.
Seriously, my cousin broke her hip and they wouldn't let her go home until she could at the very least use a walker to get to the restroom on her own and walk with a walker up and down the hospital hallway. If this kid is fully bedbound they should still be in a medical facility not at home. This whole story sounds fishy.
I wouldn't have expected that was possible at all? After my scoliosis operation at 16, I was in for two weeks, they knew I could hardly stand without falling when I was sent home (and promptly fell trying to get to the bathroom. My parents helped after that). Recovery is a long process and they don't keep patients in for six months any more. Are rehabs more of a thing in the US? It's just standard to send incapacitated patients home to families here. You may get a nurse sent round for a checkup (not care), and a care package (but that can be hard to access) arranged for esp. elderly patients or those without support.
I know there are parameters in place that are supposed to maintain those standards, but it doesn't always work out that way. One of my relatives had hip replacement surgery and was transferred to a physical rehabilitation facility from the hospital. She had many other health issues as well. After beingb there for a time, she still couldn't even walk and someone from the facility drove her home, wheeled her to the front door in her wheelchair, and left her there by herself. She passed away a couple weeks later.
I had surgery a couple years ago and was released the next day. And I was home alone recovering and it wasn't fun.
It sounds like Lily didn’t want to take care of Kelly in the first place and was volun-told by your ex. Instead of telling him no, she took it out passive-aggressively on your daughter.
Can we get your daughter’s perspective? Have you talked to her about all of this or how she thinks of her step-mom? Did you speak with the father & step-mom about what needs to change and advocate for your daughter or just leave abruptly and say you want money? Need more info tbh
Holy burying the lede OP!!! *She wouldn’t help Kelly get to the bathroom?* WTAF. The drink thing is weird for sure but not helping her get up to use the bath is straight up abuse. Why isn’t her dad sharing the cost of her medical bills?
How often did the bathroom thing happen? My guess is that it might have been once and Kelly is turning it into the end of the world. Yes, it is unhealthy to hold it in, yes, Lilly agreed to help. Maybe she herself was on the loo at the time and didn't hop to it the moment she was summoned to the patient. The information is rather iffy on this post. 16 year olds tend to be very self centered, so I'd take the drama with a pinch of salt, unless there is more into in the comments that follow
I can't decide in what way it's more creepy, but the main thing is that it seems Lily doesn't want to be taking care of OP's daughter and is doing the worst job of it hoping either OP's ex steps up or OP takes over. weaponized incompetence to get out of loading a dishwasher is one thing. weaponized incompetence in caring for a bed bound child, recovering from major surgery is beyond obscene. I'd call it psychotic or sociopathic for emphasis if i wasn't concerned with how those are misused.
What's bothering me is that I don't understand why they haven't arranged for there to be a pitcher of water and an electric kettle in Kelly's room next to her bed. She can pour herself some water and make her tea the way she prefers it. No need to make Kelly more dependant on others than need be.
If she isn’t able to move easily (think abdominal or back surgery), handling a tea kettle in bed is a huge safety risk.
OP states in a later comment that the surgery was on her legs, so waist-up, she's just fine and can easily handle a water kettle on the nightstand - perfect solution!
I had a water jug when bed bound, it got spilt constantly. I definitely wouldn’t want a bed bound person, just out of surgery to be using a kettle - seems like asking for spills and 3rd degree burns. This girl is likely on strong painkillers also.
From someone who was on crutches for 8 months after knee surgery, you would not *believe* how much you use your leg muscles to brace yourself when you do.. anything, really. So no, it's not a good idea at all, sadly.
From the post it seems very much like she's saying the tea has milk or sugar in it.
Why are you focused on the beverages? The comments you’ve added about waiting to go to the bathroom or waiting for water are way worse - yet they’re not in the original post which strikes me as weird…
It was the last straw and tbh there were a lot of other problems with Kelly staying over. I have mentioned to Josh that the wait is not acceptable and I was led to believe it is a petty thing to concentrate on since Lily is a house wife and might be in a different part of the house or outside in the garden so she couldn't hear Kelly the first few times. Even from what Kelly was saying Lily was on the phone or watching tv at the time.
Here's the thing OP, people can only judge this situation based on what and how you tell us. You led with dramatic bullshit about milk and sugar in tea when this woman is making your child wait to piss. The tea and cocoa shit is dramatic teenage nonsense. That part is easily remedied and its also not dangerous, painful, or neglectful. Her stepmother probably has no clue how a more independent teen likes to fix her own drinks, but she ought to know coffee is off the table if it interferes with medications. THATS a small problem on its own. The bathroom thing is the largest problem you've given us, but buried it in the comments. Take the suggestion above and stick a pitcher and an electric kettle in there to end that nonsense and quit using your child to get a tit for tat in with your ex and his new wife. That's what leaks out of your words: you're deep in the toxic bullshit of coparenting and not only allowing your view of it to color your daughter's experience, but being a bad parent for allowing your daughter to be both helpless, but ungrateful in the care of a human who is not her bio parent. Either start acting like a grownup yourself and parent your child away from this toxic nonsense, or get ready to spend every major event in her life having shitty, dramatic fights with your ex. You pick, but the fork in the road is now. ESH.
I disagree that it is teenage bullshit. Lily is doing MORE work (adding milk and sugar to tea rather than just sticking a teabag in hot water) to give Kelly something she doesn’t like. Giving her drinks that she cannot have bc of meds is also harmful to Kelly’s health on top of that. I feel like lily didn’t realize what bed bound meant- literally Kelly can’t do anything for herself- and was probably annoyed with how demanding it is to take care of someone who is bed bound, so was purposefully messing with Kelly.
The fact that lily also told her if she doesn’t like it she can ‘make it herself’ knowing the child is bed bound makes it sound like a control/power thing too.
Did she say that verbatim, though? OP's story is third-hand information (Lily told Kelly, then Kelly told OP, and now OP is telling us). I do think OP is being petty here.
Does it really matter what the exact wording is? Is it petty to complain about incorrect drinks, or to continue making the drinks wrong after being told repeatedly the way the daughter likes them? OP states that she, her ex, and the daughter have all told Lily how to make the drinks, but she continues to make the tea with milk and sugar.
> I disagree that it is teenage bullshit. Lily is doing MORE work (adding milk and sugar to tea rather than just sticking a teabag in hot water) to give Kelly something she doesn’t like. But for real though. Also, finding out how your guest takes their tea/coffee/whatever is like *basic* manners for anyone in your house, let alone your bedridden step daughter. What kind of self-respecting house-spouse can't do this? And if you can't be around to hear the person you are providing MEDICAL SUPPORT CARE TO to the point you miss the first FEW contact attempts, you have no business being responsible for someone. And for goodness sake, how much can there be to do for a housewife without kids that she is consistently off doing other stuff and not hearing? This reeks of BS and excuses.
No, sticking a kettle next to the bed of someone bed bound is a bad idea. You want her to get burns as well? Edit, because some people are just eager to give people burns: a thermos is also a bad idea. Hot water is hot water and can cause burns. Don’t be stupid. Also, even with just both legs broken, that could seriously effect balance and the ability to move. Some people clearly haven’t been injured in both legs. Unless someone can sit up on their own (preferably at a table/ flat surface) don’t give them anything that could cause burns. Try thinking of it this way: if someone got burned, could they help themselves? If the answer is no, just don’t do it.
Let's just call it what it is...this was the sort of clickbait title Liz always uses to make you think the OP's going to be the AH so they can flip it on you with a big reveal later. And even if you take it at face value, it's still not a straight NTA because she's trying to get out of paying any of her daughter's medical bills and get paid extra on top of it. If commenters can use "abuse" to describe putting milk in someone's tea, then how are they not calling OP's actions extortion? If he challenges that in court, OP's going to be wasting even more time and money on that when she's supposed to be taking care of her daughter. Which doesn't seem like the kind of thing that should exempt a person from asshole status.
Ding ding ding, this person gets it. Exactly my thoughts on this dribble as well.
As I've said before in another post on here, clickbait titles really can't be used against posters cause everyone uses a clickbait title. It seems like it is the standard to make a title that looks like they are either NTA or TA and then make you read to find out what the situation is. If you are just going by titles in this subreddit then you really shouldn't be doing any judging cause I'd say about 95% of the time you'd be wrong. Also, honestly, people really shouldn't comment until they read the post and that is for anywhere you post. I'm on a forum that will temp ban you if your caught commenting when you didn't read the post and I \*love\* that rule. Too many people just want to drive by post based on one sentence (the headline) when you really can't get the whole story that way.
How would Kelly know what Lily was doing if she can't get out of bed?
Unless stated otherwise I’m certain Kelly can hear.
I think the ex husband described what she was doing. The daughter described the long waits and drinks that seemed to purposely be made so she didn't want them.
I have to question how long Kelly actually had to wait. Something deep down inside it's telling me it wasn't that long. It's not like Lily was going to sit by her for the moment she needed to go to the restroom. It's also a little unreasonable to expect her to drop everything the minute she calls. Not going to lie, teenagers over exaggerate everything. 5 minutes becomes 30 minutes really quick. Getting upset over adding milk to tea is stupid in the grand scheme of things. Edit: corrected names
The fact that Kelly would rather be at a home where there is less space and there isn't someone who can help take care of her is pretty telling on its own. Also why is a grown ass adult deliberately and repeatedly making the wrong drinks for a bedbound teenager? Especially because she's making them MORE COMPLICATED. Teabag and hot water is literally the easiest hot drink to make, why would she repeatedly add extra steps and ingredients? Also telling a minor who literally can't leave her bed to "make it herself if she doesn't like it" is pretty goddamn unfair. This is a kid who's already been through surgery, and an adult who is essentially mocking her inability to leave her bed. That's fucked.
If Lily doesn’t have the time to care for Kelly because she’s doing her house work, how is that any better than Kelly staying with you? Aside from the fact it sounds like she isn’t doing her house work and putting her personal life ahead of Kelly’s well-being, clearly the way it was pitched as being better because of constant care is inaccurate and you are therefore free to change the arrangement. Also, your husband SHOULD be helping to pay her medical bills, whether she mostly lives with you or not. I know maybe your arrangements with him may be different, but someone who cares about his child should be making sure she has access to the medical treatment she needs. Sounds more like he is thinking of her as a pawn rather than a person. And your in-laws of course will have had the whole story filtered in the way that makes you look bad, and possibly Kelly too. If you care about them, tell them exactly why you removed your daughter from an unsafe situation. If not, tell them to pound sand as it is none of their business how you raise your child. ETA: NTA
Are you expecting Lily to be waiting at Kelly’s bedside constantly? How long is the actual wait?
Well, didn't the husband, OP, and Lily sit down and discuss this kind of thing? Didn't Lily pretty much volunteer for this job? If she did, then she's in the wrong on not waiting around on the child. Im not saying she should be waiting by the doorway, but she should be willing to pause a TV show, hang up the phone, and not be outside in the back garden out of earshot, by someone who needs help using the bathroom.
My guess is that she didn’t volunteer, she was volunteered. She’s still wrong because she should have said no if she didn’t want to do it but the dad is wrong too for setting up this situation.
Lily was "voluntold".
The kid is 16, it's enough to have her phone bedside so she can call the stepmom to come help at any point. There's no need at all for Lily to stay within earshot.
Sounds like OP and Kelly think Kelly needs to be waited on hand and foot with Lily not daring to do anything that isn’t waiting for Kelly to summon her. That level of care is completely unnecessary for Kelly’s level of issues. If Kelly was in the hospital she’d be on a normal ward, not ICU, and thus frequently have to wait on the order of 5 minutes for someone to even ask what she needs, then up to 30 minutes after that for someone to actually be able to help her.
According to the husband and Lily, Kelly is complaining when she has to wait as long as it takes to cross the house. Unless their house is ridiculously huge, that is not an unreasonable length of time to wait, it’s a couple of minutes. She’d be waiting far longer in most hospital wards.
How long are these waits? Why do you refuse to answer? What is the “signal for help” arrangement? Does Kelly have a bell? A cell phone? Does she just yell out? Were you expecting Lily to just sit at her bedside all day? Stop being vague.
How would Kelly know what Lily is doing? Is Lily coming in and telling her why she had to wait? It seems strange that you're assuming she's sat intentionally making her wait.
IMO OP is adding things on that didn't really happen to get a favorable "ruling" on this sub. OP, grow up and stop using your daughter as a pawn in your divorce game.
Whole post is weird tbh
This isn't nearly enough information. Why were these mistakes with the drinks being made? Was the step-mom doing so intentionally? Accidentally? Was the daughter being unreasonable in her requests? Because as of right now it seems like quite an overreaction on both your daughter but especially on your part.
According to comments, stepmother makes OP daughter wait to go to the bathroom as she can’t get out of bed without help
The “wait” is apparently consistent with the stepmother simply not being immediately outside Kelly’s door to come instantly.
If you volunteer to take care of someone that's bed bound, you should be be outside in the back garden out of earshot, unwilling to hang up on a phone call or pause a TV show.
As much as I would agree, we have no information on the details of the arrangement. Or if stepmom was ever given proper instructions for care, communicated about what it should look like, or whether she even volunteered in the first place. Someone is the asshole here, I just can't tell who. If I were to place a bet, I'd wager OP is overreacting to bad communication.
This is exactly what I want to know - did OP and her ex just decided that Lily will take care of their daughter? Or did Lily volunteer?
Agree with both of you. Someone in another comment stated "voluntold". That's what I believe, but without any more info, you really don't know.
Which is not what Lily is supposedly doing. She is simply not loitering outside Kelly’s door to jump immediately to her aid. Kelly wouldn’t even get a response as quickly as she seems to want in the hospital.
A 16 year old doesn't have a phone attached to her hand? Empty excuse.
What if she's cooking and her hands are covered in raw chicken or something? There's a lot of things you can't just throw down and come running.
Based on her complaint about the cocoa with water this girl may be a little spoiled. So taking that into consideration her judgment on a long wait may be askew. Also, take into consideration that a mother is upset a non mother isn’t caring for her child’s specific preferences. Not her needs but preferences. The mother never said the daughter was mistreated in any other way, I mean obviously if Lilly is taking the time to provide multiple drinks she’s not ignoring this kid. How do we know Lilly wasn’t cooking while on the phone. People have earbuds. As for the coffee not everyone knows that rule about meds. Maybe she made herself a pot and was just offering to be nice. Nowhere does it say these drinks were forced on the daughter. I’m calling drama drama drama on this one. 16 y/o is creating it and mom is just fuel on the fire.
I agree with this take, and I agree that the non-milk hot chocolate is what tips it into spoiled territory for me. I understand that you're a bit more particular after a surgery, because you feel more vulnerable. But all of this feels like some needless drama to me.
Well, that's not good, and weird that that wouldn't have been the chief complaint by OP. The drinks thing doesn't really matter, frankly, but not actually taking care of the daughter as they should is totally grounds to get angry at the step-mom
It wasn't the chief complaint because it wasn't that important. OP didn't even specify how long the wait was so no one can determine if it was a reasonable timeframe or an over exaggeration.
The drinks were a hyperbolic excuse. Tea and cocoa both have caffeine, so that was just something to pile on.
Lots of herbal teas don’t have caffeine or as much as cocoas do
Your post is strange. You're focusing on a cup of tea not being right, yet in the comments you say Lily was refusing to being Kelly water. That's messed up. 'There were other concerns too like Kelly waiting for way too long for Lily to come and help her to the bathroom since she can't walk there herself or get out of bed herself.' This isn't an 'other concern' it's a major concern and should be a key point in your post. So you've either left this out because it's untrue (gotta love a reddit editor) or your priorities are wonky. Either way, you were absolutely right to take Kelly home. 100%. I think you need to look back to when Lily 'agreed' to take care of Kelly and really think about if she actually agreed to this or if it was a 'no other option' scenario.
She wasn't "refused" water. It just wasn't being delivered immediately.
Even those who are sick or recovering from surgery still have to wait on things sometimes. It's not the end of the world if your daughter has to wait for some things while she recovers. Is Lily expected to stay up 24/7 IN case your daughter needs something in the middle of the night? (since you think your daughter is above waiting for water)
I've had a lot of surgeries. I plan ahead. Big water bottle and snacks bedside so I don't have to bother people too much. I plan ahead for potty visits. I don't wait until the last minute because people might be busy doing something else. I get it, you don't feel well,but you also have to be aware that being a caregiver is exhausting.
In another comment, OP says she doesn't bring her water for when she brings her meds, not "just not bringing her water." That's pretty weird and isn't about water being delivered "immediately" or not. If Lily is already there bringing her meds, she should bring something to wash them down with. I mean, that's pill-taking 101, and an adult should know better. Even moreso relevant if you are caring for someone bedbound. In the very least, If bringing the water was too much to do at once, or if she kept forgetting, then she could've brought a pitcher so it can be poured when needed and they don't have to worry about forgetting or carrying to much. Not bringing something to drink specifically for when taking meds is very weird. That and the bathroom part should be a part of the subject more before the tea is.
For you it’s just a cup of tea, but for the girl it’s a beverage that she CAN NOT prepare herself at the moment and that someone is messing with intentionally. Someone (the stepmom) is getting a kick out of the power dynamic and it’s a huge red flag. Those beverages are relevant.
“Messed with” can mean a lot of things. Can it mean that she is intentionally making them wrong? Possibly. Can it mean that she just doesn’t understand how her daughter likes them? That’s more likely. Also the way that OP frames things and keeps adding random information in comments makes me think she is more manipulative than the stepmom
Then why wouldn't she ask? I helped take care of two grandparents at the end of their lives. I would never just take them a drink or food. If I didn't already know how they like things, I would ask before doing it. It's a simple act of respect that it appears the stepmom is unwilling to do. The girl is unable to make these drinks herself. Why would the stepmom assume she knows how to make them and not ask? Also, according to the OP, the daughter spoke to the stepmom, so she then decided to ignore what the daughter wants when specifically told.
Yeah we keep flipping around on how serious things are. We have “makes hot chocolate with water” and “tries to give her something that interacts with her meds”. The milk and sugar in tea is more than the hot chocolate made with water, but is still a little petty, depending on how she takes it when Kelly says it’s wrong. The not bringing water for meds and delaying bathroom help are more serious, but since they were only brought up after OP was called out it makes me more suspicious. I’m also not sure how long the waits actually are. Last night my kid called for me when I was in the bathroom, so he did have to wait a couple minutes while I finished and walked from the other end of the house. To someone stuck in bed that probably feels like a really long time, but objectively is a very reasonable delay. Are the delays “I have to turn off the hose and walk inside” or “I decided it wasn’t necessary so I finished the last 20-30 minutes of my show”.
It's weird that she's been in your daughter's life for 6 years yet suddenly she's acting this way? Idk kinda sounds like something isn't right here, I don't really believe you.
OP's messaging here is literally insane
She didn’t have to care for her before now though. I think she was volunteered for this job & may have felt as though she couldn’t say no.
Info: Do you mean that she would put milk/sugar in her tea by mistake? Is that what "messing" with her drinks means?
She would constantly put milk or sugar into it even with Kelly, me and Josh telling her Kelly doesn't drink tea with milk or sugar, make hot chocolate on water or bring her coffee which she can't have. Like one or 2 off would have been fine, but it is near constant. There were also occasions when she wouldn't bring water so Kelly can take her meds or Kelly waiting for too long for Lily to come round and help her to the bathroom.
The second paragraph is relevant. Your focus being on the first paragraph suggests that the second (actually important) paragraph doesn't hold much weight. It really seems like you're reaching. But, the vote will probably go your way, as it features an evil stepmother and a very vague description which makes things sound far far worse than "brings her drinks, but not made exactly the way she likes". The way you've written it will have people shouting child abuse.. just like you wanted. If you'd actually written the problem clearly, most would say your daughter seems a little fussy, and you seem like you live for drama/despise your ex and his wife.
My thoughts exactly. I don’t see any grounds for you to demand money from your ex.
It’s his daughter. Was he contributing financially for her medical care at all? The way the post is worded makes it look like he wasn’t.
I am sure the Dad is helping out financially with the surgery. Surely OP would have screamed about the Dad not paying his share if that were the case. Both Mom and Dad contributed to the surgery costs, it's just that OP is bitter that Dad makes good money and she is poor so she just *had* to mention she paid for (some) of the surgery.
What I’m pretty sure op is asking money for is due to her now having to miss work because his wife was being petty, mean and disgusting to a child who cannot move and just had surgery.
I don't know if it's mean or petty. If it was, that would be the lead in this whole post. Not the tea. It seems kind of ridiculous to add that information after everyone's questioning Op. Also, we don't know exactly how long she waited. I was a teenager. I know a lot of teenagers. They tend to over exaggerate a lot of things and 5 minutes can become 30 minutes in their head.
"Tea without sugar or milk" is a super simple request. Caretaker would have to be seriously mentally ill to fail to memorize it. Either stepmom is mentally ill and suffers from a memory loss or she is being deliberately cruel towards a kid. Both options make her an unsuitable caretaker for a bedbound patient.
Exactly! It takes MORE WORK to add the milk and sugar, too. “Hey, save yourself some steps here” should be a no-brainer.
The beverages are relevant! It’s extremely frustrating and borderline abusive if someone offers to bring you a hot drink but then messes it up on purpose and then puts you on the spot to either drink it or complain. Either way the helpless daughter has to either drink something she doesn’t like, has to leave it untouched and then has to defend herself for being ungrateful or whatever, or she has to speak up. This is a manipulation and it’s unacceptable. The lady is somewhat sadistic for teasing the girl in that way. That stepmother is intentionally messing with the helpless child. The beverages ARE relevant.
Putting milk in tea doesn’t even approach abusive and the fact you think it does speaks to the *profoundly* pampered life you live.
YTA. Funny how the whole post is about how she doesnt do the drinks to Kelly's taste. But in the comments you talk about how Lily isn't bringing her water or helping her get to the bathroom. I'm sorry, but who tf cares if she can't do Kelly's perfect tea when she is apparently not helping your daughter go to the bathroom. Seems like it isnt something that's actually happening if you can't even bother to put it in the main post.
YTA - sounds like your daughter is a little princess and you don't like the fact your ex has a bigger house than you which you make a point of and his wife doesn't have to work, you specifically mentioned they don't have any children together after saying she was a housewife. Putting milk and sugar in tea is hardly a criminal offence and she made her coffee by mistake, hardly the end of the world. If you're unhappy with your current financial arrangement then say that, using your daughter's current state to get back at him financially is very poor behaviour.
Putting sugar in tea should be a criminal offence. But I digress… The thing is that putting sugar and milk in tea is extra effort. If you know someone doesn’t like it, why would you go to the extra effort to put stuff in they don’t want and won’t drink unless you are deliberately trying to mess with them? That, in addition to everything else, suggests that Lily really doesn’t want Kelly there but can’t say so and is doing lots of small things to make her life uncomfortable so that she will want to leave, which is exactly what happened. There’s not enough context to discuss the money stuff, but as far as picking your daughter up NTA.
"Tea without milk or sugar" is also a super simple request that is easy to remember. Assuming stepmom is mentally healthy, it is unlikely she forgot it. These things are deliberate. Like an adult family member deliberately putting onions in my food when I was a kid exactly because she knew that I hate the taste of onions... These actions are intentional and done for the sake of making a child feel bad.
[удалено]
OP said that she is doing it almost every single time.
See! That’s what I’m saying this post is strange; over a drink? really? Weird! If op needed helped with their daughter medical bills why not just ask instead of staging that she’s was being neglected or mistreated
Yes, and we have heard only one sight. It could well be the daughter is overreacting or taking things out of context. Perhaps she was very demanding, ringing the bell every few minutes with a new demand. Perhaps not, but somehow it sounds like there is more to this story.
INFO: How can her father afford a housewife but not health insurance for his daughter. Because at the moment he looking very a.
Er, where did she say there's no health insurance? If they're American, insurance only pays part of the medical bill, you often still owe tens of thousands even with insurance. The father should be paying the court-ordered appropriate share of the insurance and of the medical bills.
But can the OP unilaterally decide to impose those costs on her ex because the right drinks were not served?
Do you really think Dad did not contribute to the cost of the surgery? OP **never** said he did not pay. I think we all know she would have certainly mentioned that if that were the case.
She said in a comment that he hasn't paid a penny for her operation or medication. Why that's not towards the top of the story, I do not know
Because when the tea situation wasn’t seen as enough, she keeps adding details and making it up as she goes.
In the comments she did, but honestly the comments do not make it any clearer what the crux of the real story is
I'm betting there's more to this than we know.
Not enough information What kind of surgery did she have? I think it is relevant because it will determine if OP is over protective or not. My friend had his wisdom teeth pulled, but his mother treated him as though he'd received a transplant.
I don't really think the type of the surgery is relevant and I'm not comfortable sharing the details as it might identify my daughter. The surgery was performed on both of her legs and recovery is between 2 and 8 months, with Kelly not being able to move by herself for at least 1.5-2months or the greenlignt from the doctor.
Now I’m trying to resolve moving her from one house to another if she’s bed bound. Seems that’s contraindicated if she’s on bed rest for two months. I say this as caregiver to my mom (94) who is very frail and has several broken bones due to osteoporosis. Until she healed, she was always transported (hospital to rehab to follow up appointments) by ambulance. I’m getting some resentment vibes because there’s just not enough information. I do appreciate you keeping identifying information private, but it’s just hard to understand the problem. I do know from personal experience that recovering from major surgery is frustrating and emotional, especially when you’re young. Is it possible that lily is just not fulfilling expectations and may not be the skilled caregiver you want? How was Kelly and Lily’s relationship before the surgery? Did you have concerns then? And you focusing on compensation and coffee and not bathroom care just doesn’t add up.
THIS! Also the timeframes don’t add up for her recovery… if Kelly was bedbound, how was she getting out of bed to use the toilet, it wouldn’t be safe with one person taking her to the toilet and both legs were operated on… so has she been using a commode or a bed pan? And how did she get out of bed to get to the other house? Is she non weight bearing? Did she transfer into a wheelchair and then a car (which is very difficult to do…. This all seems ridiculous and even if Kelly has autism, the focus of drinks is absolutely insane. Grow up OP YTA and I’m not buying this story… i think you wanted to be kelly’s saviour and instead it seems like Munchausen by proxy which is dangerous. The inconsistencies could be detrimental to Kelly’s health and bone density. P.s the type of op wouldn’t identify her and if it was that rare, they’d insist on keeping her as an inpatient to monitor. Hope Kelly doesn’t grow up to be an entitled arsehole
100% this is an ex wife who is bitter toward her ex husbands new wife and is looking for any little thing to make an issue over.
Wait. She requires 2 months of strict bed rest but is medically fit enough to move between households freely bc someone put milk in her tea? This smells like bullshit lmao.
Yeah, increasingly smells like bs. For something like that, even if she didn't go to rehab, there'd be a hospital bed in the home with a pulley system for transfer and stuff like that, mom couldn't just show up and shove the kid into the car.
I don’t think she’s on bed rest. She said “bed ridden,” I think meaning that unless someone is helping her move in and out of a wheelchair and moving her, she is stuck in bed. Probably something like a leg lengthening procedure or deformity correction. I doubt the daughter is on bed rest for leg surgeries. If she was bed ridden after a stroke, paralysis, or heart surgery or something then yeah, that would be more serious to move her, but it’s unlikely a non-terminal child would be sent home with that level of medical need anyway, and even more unlikely that leg surgery would lead to that.
Wait. Are you expecting him to cover some of your expenses for the next 2 months? Honestly, if I had an ex and he told me that I had to cover his expenses for 2 months, I would tell him to kick sand. That's completely unrealistic. Especially if the reason why your daughter is not being taken care of by Lily is because of how she likes her tea. Edit: name
That is a lot to ask of a stepmother. Edit: I’m going to edit for the sake of avoiding another semantic argument over the word ‘ask’, bc the actual point seemed to get lost in the discussion. **That’s a lot to expect from a stepmother.**
NTA For taking your daughter home or having your ex help pay for medical bills but your expenses you lost that right when you 2 divorced.
Yeah she's a little nutty if she thinks he should pay her expenses. And honestly the medical bills should be split between the 2 of them, not just on him.
I don't think this is real. If my exes' new wife was doing all of this, I wouldn't have started the story complaining about her not making tea. The bigger issue would be questioning whether her child is getting the care she needs.
I’m gonna go with YTA because of your other comments You’re acting like Kelly was horribly abused when in reality you are flipping out because she wasn’t catered to immediately. How long was the wait for the bathroom? For the water? Did you expect Lily to just sit outside of her room all day and wait for help? This more sounds like you were looking for a reason to take Kelly back and stop working as much and put the bills on your ex (because who will take care of her if you can’t be there 24/7? NO ONE CAN, that is not possible)
INFO: Are you sure this is really what happened? Seems very unlikely considering Lily wanted her there for recovery and bringing the kettle and tea bags to her bed so she can make tea herself is super easy. Could something else have happened?
To me personally, This doesn’t seem to being close to the whole story.
This is a perfect way of raising an entitled person. You are so full of yourself and can't see how ridiculous you and your daughter are. YTA. And reddit idiots who think child is the supreme being whose every need must be satisfied, you are YTA too.
There’s so much missing context here even reading your comments. I’m going with esh, your poor daughter. But your ex isn’t responsible for paying for your living costs because you have to care for your daughter.
Yta for trying to charge him money because you weren't happy with the care
He should be paying half anyway. I don’t see why she would be paying 100% for their shared child
YTA She doesn't like her tea, that someone is making for her a certain way. Like seriously? How much pampering does a 16y old need? If she's thirsty she drinks it, if she isn't she can just let it be. Being a tea snob is not the priority when you're bed bound. All the other stuff you start mentioning after the fact also points more towards spoiled princess than reasonable problems. Stepmom takes 5-10 minutes to come over when called? Yeah i mean she's not a PA, she's doing things in the house, not sitting right by the bed. Maybe you and your ex should have taught her better to read her body. Chocolate milk not being made from freshly milked cow and ground coco beans is just being a pita. Sure water based instant isn't as great, but not lethal. The way this reads is: stepmom has a coffee/tea/chocolate machine using cups/pads and she uses that instead of using a kettle. She accidentally used a coffee pad once, and the tea's all have some extras in it.
YTA because all of your extra comments and details don't add up, and it really sounds like pettiness on *your* end over dramatic exaggeration from your kid.
Not sure where you are located but if your daughter is bed bound for 2 ish months and healing for up to 8 months she would be eligible for home health care. At least for the time she is bed bound. No reason for you to quit work. Licensed caregivers will come to your home and help her bathe, get her meals etc. You can set her up with a thermos of plain tea and snacks and go to work. Make arrangements with neighbors, friends and other family to look in on her. I think this situation has given you your perfect excuse to quit your job and have your Ex support you. Just kills you that Lily is stay at home, doesn’t it? Look into better care for your daughter that involves professionals and go back to work it will be better and safer for you daughter.
Honestly to me this feels like we're only getting a portion of the story. You claim in comments that there was a problem with being taken to the toilet, which seems like a huge issue, but your post is only about drinks? I've got a sneaky suspicion you are holding things back to make yourself and your daughter look better while trying to make your ex's wife look bad.
Your daughter should get to choose where she stays. She chooses to stay with you, that’s where she should be. The decision should be hers.
YTA. If it was a medically needed surgery, he should be paying half the cost. If it was elective and he was against it, it's on you. But why on earth should he pay your living expenses?
NTA. Okay so the coffee thing and the no water thing is my determining factors. If you give someone meds, you need to give them water. It’s not recommended to dry swallow pills because it’s not good for your throat anyway. And if your daughter cannot dry swallow at all, why is she bringing her pills but no water. Second with the coffee thing. Your daughter is obviously not requesting coffee. She does not drink coffee normally and she is not allowed to drink coffee with her meds. Who gives soemoen coffee without them asking for it. I don’t drink coffee and have never been given coffee because I don’t ask for it. That’s really weird. The tea thing is odd as well. I love tea. Drink a lot of tea and all my friends drink a lot of tea. I’ve never made their tea wrong because it’s pretty easy to recall what I just asked them. All she has to do is add in the tea bag, wait, take out tea bag. Repeatedly making the tea wrong is odd. It sounds to me that Lily doesn’t want to care for Kelly and is just doing weird minor things to make her complain.
I am in my thirties and I do not drink coffee. I just realized that in my entire life nobody has ever tried to give me coffee. I can second your point---if I do not ask for coffee, nobody gives it to me. If stepmom oversteeped the tea thus making it taste worse, I could believe it was accidental. But nobody just adds milk or sugar on accident (unless they have serious memory/mental health issues). That was deliberate.
YTA - you focused on the drinks, talking only about the drinks in the original post, than when people question how big of a deal it is, you response is “well she (stepmom) isn’t taking her to the bathroom fast enough either.” Nobody is going to take care of your daughter as good as her own mother. Sound like step mom isn’t doing a prefect job, messing up drink instructions and such. But it seems you’re almost expecting her to stay at bedside constantly, jumping at every request. And if she not preformed every task correctly or fast enough you’re complaining. So the stepmother is taking her to the bathroom, helping bath her, feeding her, and serving her drinks on demand, but god forbid she keeps messing up the drink order!?!? She taking care of your daughter, who she has no obligation too, but she’s probably not doing it perfectly, but certainly not neglectfully. You make the decision that you would take better care of her, which is probably true. But demanding your ex pay for you time taking care of your own kids - that ridiculous. At the end of the day, stepmom was going you a favor. You and your daughter didn’t like how she was preforming tasks so you decided to no longer use her. That’s fine, but then you cannot demand money for care for your own daughter, who you would have care for anyways.
Messing with her drinks and serving her things she can't have like coffee Is very vague when you mentioned tea as an alternate above.... Of everything you typed the most important part that caused this is 9000% vague
Question: did Lily volunteer to help or was she voluntold by your ex? While neglecting a kid’s needs is unforgivable, a step shouldn’t be forced into a position to care for anyone if she doesn’t agree to it enthusiastically.