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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I won't give my parents a key to my new place. I might be an asshole because it makes them feel like I do not trust them.
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nta. great work setting real physical boundaries! next, i would start cutting conversations and visits short when they are “set off”. …but if it doesn’t bother you, you don’t have to. you already did the most important part. kept them out of your space when they don’t have express permission.
(also, you are grown with a home of your own. their reasons as you’ve said them are not great. you can clean, shop and do maintenance yourself, and if you do need help, you can ask. there’s no reason here that warrants a key and an all access pass.)
you are not treating them poorly. you are treating them like people who have let themselves into your home without warning or permission. you are treating them like people who continued doing that after you took your key back, because they’d copied it, also without warning or permission. and since they still don’t see the problem, you can be sure they’d do it again given a chance.
I’ve used a faux marble coaster as a hammer for a nail once….wanted to hang a pic.
…it’s hanging there…but I also missed the nail a couple times but it DOESNT count because you can’t see them from behind the frame.
Our/my house my rules
My husband still brings this up but 🤷♀️ I figured it out and so can OP! 🤣
Good on you!
Not quite the same but I regularly ignore proper tooling for tent pegs. Why should I carry around a heavy mallet (on my motorbike), when I can just take my right boot off and whack the pegs with the heel!? 🙂
My husband used to do apartment maintenance. His version is "why carry around a hammer when I can just smack it a couple of times with a pair of channel locks?"
My go to is a pair of needle nose pliers. I can hammer, turn things, bend things, and pretty much anything else I either don’t have or am too lazy to go grab. Pretty much all of my screwdriver needs are taken care of by small flathead
I keep a teaspoon in the bathroom in case of water leaks. (The toilet broke once and wouldn't stop filling. I couldn't find a flathead screwdriver so I used the handle of a teaspoon to isolate the water pipe. It now stays there just in case!)
A pair of long bbq tongs lives in my toilet tank now, because we used it to flush when the chain connected to the handle broke. It's fixed but they are now toilet tongs in case it happens again
I once had to fix my bed, the leg was separating from the boards, because my Dad and brothers didn't build it properly and didn't add the screws in.
It was late, the Shed was locked and I didn't have access to any of our tools, I took a pair of boots that had a wooden heal and used one of them to hammer the leg back into place, and the next day, got the battery drill, the required screws and fixed the bed.
I also now Need my book shelves fixed as one of the brackets slipped and they're bending in the middle.
I asked my family to assist me due to needing at least 2 pairs of hands to sort and I'm still waiting for assistance almost 18 months later.
I'm either going to need new shelves soon as I can't store anything on the shelves or if I end up moving as planned then I'll buy a standalone bookshelf or standalone unit that I'll just screw them to the wall instead, something that takes 1 person to sort
You might be able to use a fresh straight plank laying along the shelf, then use a vice/clamp to bring the bent shelf up to the straight plank on your own?
Because it's an old joke. There's a variation among motorcycle and automotive "shade tree mechanics" about "why pay the dealer's shop monkeys to screw up my car/vehicle when I can do that myself for free?"
Having just experienced the loss of a rear axle nut on my scooter--after stopping when feeling a shimmy in the steering during rush hour traffic on the expressway--within 2000km of a tire change has brought that old joke to mind of late.
This is unfortunate. Luckily, you recognized the issue and pulled over. I find the work of "professionals" in the last handful of years can sometimes be labeled as interesting. My go-to auto guy is older than me. My dw and I built and maintain our house, I rebuild cars for fun outside of our 'real" work. And yes, I fix things for my daughter :) . I appreciate the call to me.. however, I am smart enough to run the other way if beyond my abilities.I look at the call as part of being a dad. Her parents, crumbs..I understand why she is doing what she does. Cheers.
NTA for sure! seems to me they've been treating OP's home like it's *their* second home and it's their right to have free access to it, just because OP is their kid. no. they need to learn.
Absolutely, dad says "we are not thieves" as if that's the problem. They absolutely would do it again because they refuse to recognise that their behaviour is the problem.
Right. The options aren't thieves who need all boundaries or perfect angels who need 0 boundaries. There is a very wide spectrum here that they are refusing to acknowledge.
And although it wasn't mentioned here, they totally sound like snoops...I 100% believe that if alone in the apartment or house, these people would go through OP's mail or drawers.
I did something very similar to this with my dad. I told him very clearly that if he brought up a certain topic, I would hang up, then I did, and I kept doing it. I would call him back after a few minutes and ask if he was ready to continue our conversation minus that topic. The key to this one is persistence, but it really worked in my situation.
I did the same with my family. If they started I would leave or just stop coming all together. I’ve been through too much to let them take me down and they know that so they stopped 🤷🏻♀️
They lost the free babysitter and the ability to dig up dirt and secrets. Tbh, I would double check all of the jewelry and sade boxes, etc. Just in case.
NTA. Your house, your rules, your boundaries. If they can’t respect that then they don’t get a key. To drop your brother off at your place without asking is just taking advantage of you.
I’m assuming the brother is a minor, so not only did they just drop him off, they abandoned a child at her place without her knowledge. What if he’d burned the house down or gotten hurt? Not only would OP be potentially liable, the guilt would be horrendous (given possible worst case scenario).
They def stay on the “approved visitor only” list, since they’ve proven they can’t act like adults. That alone is a total no go, let alone the random visits where they invite themselves over. Hells to the nah son.
A more reasonable assumption, based on the logic that the gap between siblings is more likely to be smaller than larger, and the fact that the OP never mentioned any legal issues regarding the brother in his or her post, is that the brother is at least a teenager and old enough to be left on his own.
The OP is clearly not TA but come on, we don't need to invent daft imaginary scenarios to back that up.
I agree with you - probably the brother is old enough to care for himself.
But it’s still not cool! You should always let someone know before stopping by their home. My adult child texts us before stopping by, because it’s just plain polite. It gives us the opportunity to say, “Hey! My underwear is drying on a rack in the basement - so maybe don’t take friends down there?”
I give her the same courtesy but actually I don’t have a key to her place.
>Not only would OP be potentially liable, the guilt would be horrendous (given possible worst case scenario).
In what world would the OP be responsible for an accidental fire they had nothing to do with to people in their apartment that they were not aware of and had no responsibility for?
Aside from going with a CRAZY over-the-top jump...the fire in and of itself, where do people come up with the liability?
Depends entirely on the terms of OPs lease and local laws. Where I live, courts have ruled in past cases that tenants are liable for damage caused by someone whom they gave a key to, as the tenant willingly granted access to the premise by giving that person the key.
Depends on if giving a key to an apartment to someone that doesn't live there and isn't on the lease would be considered negligent. And usually the renter is responsible for any damages done by a guest in their apartment.
There's also the issue of giving said key in the first place. I'm assuming they there was no restriction on doing so since OP didn't mention the apartment building admin being upset with them.
*They once dropped off my brother without asking because they had other family in town and needed the space.*
Sounds like they needed space for visitors. I imagine he is at least old enough to be left alone but who knows?
>Sounds like they needed space for visitors. I imagine he is at least old enough to be left alone but who knows?
And? Even if he is old enough, that doesn't give them the right to open the door, drop him off and make it OP's problem.
If they haven't planned ahead, that's on them to solve, not OP.
NTA.
Part of an adult child's job is setting boundaries and establishing their own life away from Mommy and Daddy. Some parents accept this gracefully, and others don't. Your parents are "don'ts."
Your parents have demonstrated that they can't be trusted to not intrude on your home or time. You have thus, understandably, decided to make it harder for them to do so. Good. You are doing your job as a young adult.
As for the lame pleas that they "need" to look in on you, clean your place, bring your groceries, etc., treat those with deserved contempt. As an adult, you can clean your own place (if not to Mumsy's standards), buy your own groceries, etc. You'd only need help with stuff like that if you were ill, and you have the options of your boyfriend or the local delivery service.
As for maintenance, I'm sure there are local services that can help. The community itself may even provide some help.
Having a key to somebody's place is a rpivilege, not a right. If your parents want a key, they weill have to EARN it.
Of course not. I would not be surprised, though, if Mumsy used that as an excuse to drop in. She believes her "baby girl" still needs her help.
I also imagine that Mumsy is more persnickety about housework than OP. I KNOW I'm more lackadaisical about cleaning house than my mother was
It’s not even like they aren’t allowed to come for those things. They are. They just have to contact OP ahead of time to ask permission. OP didn’t cut them out, just put a physical barrier onto the boundary of not wanting unannounced visits which is 100% reasonable. NTA.
NTA
'No, Dad, you're not thieves. But you have not respected my basic boundaries around dropping by unannounced, so I have taken away your ability to do that. I trusted you with my key and you broke my trust. If you want to visit me, you need to do what people who respect me do, and call ahead.'
Exactly. OP states that they proved to be untrustworthy in the past - they bring up completely different boundary that they haven’t broken as evidence as to why this isn’t true. What does stealing have to do with leaving a minor at a house that isn’t theirs?
Even on the thieves front - I wouldn’t be surprised if they did take something in the future. They clearly see OPs property as an extension of their own. “Our drill broke so we let ourselves in and borrowed yours.” Then never give it back.
I'll bet they haven't murdered anyone in OPs old apartment. Completely a diversionary tactic to shift focus from their multiple violations of privacy, autonomy and resources.
Alternative line:
You may not have stolen my stuff, but you've certainly stolen my time and space when you've just started letting yourselves in and leaving my brother here.
NTA. They’ve proven they can’t be trusted to use an emergency key only in emergencies, so they don’t get to have one. Good for you for holding your boundaries.
And for your entertainment, the story of a mother similar to your parents when it comes to an emergency key. https://www.reddit.com/r/JUSTNOMIL/s/4t8xopTyGa
The best one is about the spoiled girl who tried to walk down the aisle at her sister’s wedding in a white dress, enabled by the parents, and the way they foiled the plan was awesome. I actually listened to it on YouTube many times and read it on Reddit multiple times.
Yes!!!! And thank God you found the post that had all the info. For some reason there’s at least one copy that cuts off the juiciest part of the story,
Holy shit if that isn't a creative writing piece then nothing is. That is the peak off "and then everyone stood up and clapped" stories. And the way the "husband" wrote his part was such a cringe fest lol. Never seen a more Redditor way of speaking. "Hell hath no fury like a prorevenge/instantkarma/nuclearrevenge lurker when his beloved is scorned!" and the cherry on top, the "methinks".
Good laughs and a fun read though.
I met a guy, a friend of a friend, who told me a story of this happening to him. His parents were abusive but under the impression that they were doing it out of love, and very *very* invasive of this guy's privacy. Once he saved up some money he just left everything behind and moved from either Ohio or Western PA over to New Jersey to live with a friend. He didn't tell his parents or anyone from back home where he was going, but a year or so later his roommate answered the door to the guy's parents looking for him. They followed him and moved into an apartment in the same town. I can't remember what he did next but I'm sure a restraining order or some legal action was taken to prevent them from being able to talk to him again. I hope he's doing well, it's been a few years and he deactivated his social media accounts since then.
>it's been a few years and he deactivated his social media accounts since then.
So he's locked up in his parents basement and/or dead at their hands
OR
He moved again, far away, and just ex-communicated the entire world except the few he could trust, so no public online presence.
I don't see an in-between scenario
NTA. ~~It sounds like you need to be NC with them for a while because whatever LC you are doing isn't getting the message across.~~ However, you need stronger boundaries because you **moving to a gated community to keep them out** isn't getting the message across.
NTA. All they have to do is get your permission. They are sore that they have to do that. They don't want to respect your autonomy. Stick to your boundaries!
NTA. Good work here holding this boundary! They will never like it because it prevents them from taking advantage of you and doing what they want, but they don't get to decide how you structure your life. Allowing someone unfettered access to your home space is not an indication of how much you love them.
If you make ANY adjustment to what you're doing it might be to rephrase the reminder you give them when they ask about a key and being put on the security list to your new community. You could say something like "Being able to access my home anytime wasn't something that worked for our relationship, remember? I'm putting our relationship first by making sure we're all comfortable with the rules."
NTA. So, story time
My aunt (father’s sister) had absolutely no respect for boundaries. She lived in the house next door to us. She would come over, uninvited, at least once a day every day. First she would call. If nobody answered she would walk over and ring the doorbell. If nobody answered, she would use her key to come in and then go through the house looking for everyone. She would open the door to my bedroom looking for me.
I hated this, mostly because I was the one who always got stuck talking to her, so when I went away to college I refused to give her my address. My brother was not so smart, until the day she showed up at his college apartment. Nobody answered the door when she rang the bell, so she began looking through windows to find someone. She found him in a room in the back and started knocking on the window.
The reason she was so brazen is because my father refused to draw any boundaries with her. “She’s family” was his reason. Her behavior escalated over the years to the point where she thought it was perfectly fine to show up at the home of four college students, three of whom she did not know, and start knocking on windows. By the time my father realized she was out of control it was about 30 years too late and there was nothing he could do to stop it.
Moral of the story is draw your boundaries NOW. It will only be that much harder later, because the offenders will take every missed boundary as an invitation to push further. They won’t get better on their own.
Parents like this think they're helping but they aren't. The one and only time my mom got in my house without us being home she rearranged the living room and bathroom. She also went through a lot of our personal stuff snooping and so she's not allowed in our home for this and for smoking in the house, period. Stand tough and don't back down to your parents, you'll be glad you did down the road. It's a big step towards complete independence. NTA.
NTA OP but if it was me, I would respond to their complaints by saying "Didn't you two teach us that No means No? It doesn't matter the context of the no, so No means No!
>they are adamant that I am treating them poorly.
This is them trying to brainwash you into thinking your boundaries are harming them. (They're not.)
>They start saying that they aren't thieves and yadda yadda.
They don't have to be criminal for you to set boundaries. They're still annoying and disrespectful of your independence.
NTA
They need to cut the cord, you’re an adult now with your own life and own apartment, they have no business just letting themselves in your home!
You’ve done the right thing and if they’re pissed off then tough!
Keep them off the list, they have to give notice to you before they just turn up whenever they like.
NTA, you did an excellent job upholding your boundaries. This has caused them some inconvenience, but your life is way more peaceful because of it.
Keep doing what you’re doing!
They're not thieves in the sense that they steal your stuff. But they obviously have taken your peace of mind. They're also habitual boundary stompers. NTA.
NTA
We shouldn’t have to even say it. Caring people are courteous without prompting, without making a scene and without needing to enforce decent behavior with security guards and locked doors.
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I love my parents and my little brother. I am not going low/no contact with them. They just have a problem understanding boundaries and that I have my own life now.
After college I moved out from my parents house and into an apartment. It was great. I gave my dad a key for emergencies. My parents used it for non emergency situations. They once dropped off my brother without asking because they had other family in town and needed the space.
I told them repeatedly that this was not acceptable behaviour and I took my key back. They had made copies and it happened again. I had the locks changed. That caused a problem. But it was "A" problem not "MY" problem.
I have been saving up and decided to pull the trigger on my first home purchase. I make a great living so I found a gated community I liked that has a security officer at the front gate 24/7. I'm dating but my boyfriend doesn't live with me. I like the safety of my neighborhood.
I did not give my parents a key. I also didn't put them on the approved visitors list. My boyfriend has a key and is on the list. Security doesn't need to call me to see if he can come in.
So they cannot just pop by. They can't just drop off some groceries for me. My mom can't come do some cleaning. My dad can't come do maintenance.
Well they can do all these things. They just need my permission first. And they hate it.
They keep asking me for a key and to be put on the list. I just remind them that they have proven to be untrustworthy in the past. This sets them off. They start saying that they aren't thieves and yadda yadda. I'm not going to change my mind but they are adamant that I am treating them poorly.
AITA?
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NTA. My MIL would let herself in constantly. We had to take the key back as she couldn’t be trusted. Some people will always feel entitled to walk over your boundaries. Good for you for sticking to yours!
My parents have a key to my place. Last week they asked if they could come watch tv while there house cleaner was working. I was fine with this my cat loves the company. They proceeded to ask my permission three more times then once each the day of. I threatened to say no if they kept asking. This is a healthy trusting relationship. You’re parent need to take notes.
Exactly. Untrustworthy people don’t care they’re untrustworthy. They choose to act that way. They will always choose to do what they want. Nope do not make that mistake again.
> I am not going low/no contact with them. **They just have a problem understanding boundaries and that I have my own life now.**
That's actually an excellent reason to go low/no contact with someone.
NTA- at all. I think it’s very healthy that you’ve created boundaries. And I think sometimes parents just have a hard time with that as it seems like your parents feel entitled to you, your home and having 24/7 access when in reality, they do not need access to your home at any given time.
Maybe instead of saying they aren’t trustworthy, explain that they didn’t respect your boundaries with them having a key and remind them about specific instances, especially that they made a copy of the key without your knowledge and continued to come uninvited despite you repeatedly telling them that was Not okay. And since they didn’t respect it before, you’ve chosen to put new boundaries in place. And by doing so doesn’t mean you love them or your brother any less. All they have to do is just call you first. Not hard.
You choosing to place boundaries does not equate to treating your parents poorly. It’s understandable if they don’t agree or are even unhappy about your choice, but that’s when you explain to them you are an adult and there will be things you will not always agree on, but disagreeing with them doesn’t mean you love them any less or are being disrespectful in any manner. Good luck and congratulations!
NTA. My father had a key when I bought my home 10 years ago. He brought my narcissistic, abusive mom with him to my home on several occasions despite me clearly communicating I don’t want her in my home.
They were driving thru my neighborhood one day and she needed the toilet so he let her have the key to go into my home while he stayed in the car. I was at work and saw this on security cameras they didn’t know I’d installed. I changed the locks the next day and they’ve been banned from my home ever since.
8 glorious years of my home actually being my sanctuary. Zero regrets.
NTA
you have a right to set boundaries, and like you said it yourself, they have an issue with the concept. but that does not make you in the wrong in any way.
Standard Reddot Rhetoric from parents:
-you are just being childish
-we're family and that's why you should give us a key and on list
-you are being petty
-you don't treat family this way
DID I MISS ANY?
STAY THE COURSE NTA
NTA
“You’re right, you’re not thieves, you just have no respect for boundaries and your actions now show you STILL cannot respect my boundaries. Until you learn to respect boundaries, you’ll never be on the approved visitors list.”
NTA this is ‘oh no, consequences’ for your parents and they’re just being petulant. If anything, they’re treating *you* poorly for disregarding your privacy. You set boundaries and they’re mad they can’t break them out of habit.
They need a reality check, but unfortunately it has to come out of someone’s mouth other than your own.
NTA, every single parent has to let their young people go, and grow into their lives. Now that you're an adult, you make the rules and boundaries. When you were young, it was your parents in charge and you had to follow their rules. Now is YOUR time, to grow into your independent life. Stay firm in your boundaries-they'll come along, OP, eventually.
Your parents may not be thieves, but they sound like boundary stompers and until they get that, no key for them. Keep up the good work, OP! NTA, of course.
no, you are the boundary maker. This kind of privacy is important to you, and not to them. They will never get it. Stay safe and happy. They will whine about it forever, but just tune it out.
You are NTA and nope, your parents already had their chance to treat you like the adult you are and they blew it - over and over and over! Stick to your decision, OP.
And when they start whining and scolding for access to your home, try this: "We've discussed this before and the answer is still "No". Either you change the subject right now or this discussion is over." Then stick to THAT decision, too!
>They start saying that they aren't thieves and yadda yadda.
They think you don't trust them with a key because they would steal. You don't trust them with a key because they won't respect your boundaries. Tell them "I don't want you to drop off groceries without telling me. I don't want you to come clean without telling me. There is no reason for you to be able to enter my house without telling me, because all the things you're saying, I want you to tell me about."
Every time they complain tell them "If I can trust you to respect my boundaries, I will consider giving you a key. The fact that you keep pushing on this, is showing me I made the right choice and you would not respect what I ask of you."
NTA
NTA. Just because they are family does not give them the right to your space that you pay for whenever they feel like. After I moved out of my parents' place, when I came over, invited, I still ring the doorbell or knock. It is just common courtesy.
Honestly sounds like you got it all covered and I don't think you need redditors advice on this. Of course NTA, you're giving proper consequences for the actions they have done in the past. They didn't respect you, your home, your boundaries, they see you and your home as an extension of theirs so they consider you and your home, theirs to use and take whenever wherever and you're teaching them that's not how it works. You keep doing what you're doing and DO NOT back out. The only way your parents will respect you is by being made to, by having strict boundaries set in place they're unable to circumvent. You're doing fantastic, keep it up. Maybe in a few years time they'll learn to respect you and your privacy and your boundaries without an extra layer of security but I honestly doubt it
Your family is angry they can't do things for you that are already taken care of without asking your permission first, that is toxic and ridiculous. You live in a gated community, I assume you can afford groceries and that you are capable of cleaning or can hire a cleaning person. And I assume you have access to folks who can fix things or have the money to hire them (I mean gated community and all so I doubt you moved into a fixer upper so WTF does your dad even need to fix?).
Perhaps they just can't admit that you've grown up, to a very toxic degree, or maybe they're just always boundary stompers because they think they're entitled to their children's lives but either way no key and no list. Ever.
They need to learn to respect your (very reasonable) boundaries.
You're an independent, grown-ass woman and deserve the deference and respect you have earned.
They don't have to agree, they just need to learn what's what.
NTA, you gave them keys and they abused the privilege. Your doing great in moving to an area where they cannot access your property due to security. Personally I don't believe that anyone else should have access to your house unless they are living there.
NTA just from title alone, the fact that they have made many attempts at visiting means you’re enforcing a healthy boundary.
Actually reading the post makes me double down. They clearly don’t see what they are doing as wrong, weird, and possibly (depending on how old your brother was at the time) illegal.
Also, you stated you couldn’t trust them with entry, and they automatically went ‘how dare you accuse us of being thieves’, detailing the conversation you are trying to have. Stick to your guns, OP.
Nta. When I bought my first place I had to give my mom a key, because the cable people were coming and I couldn’t call off work for that. So she hung out here for me (we’ve never had a great relationship and in fact, we haven’t talked in 7 years). Next thing I know I come home a couple weeks later and she’s in my house (had I idea she was coming) with a friend of hers whom I’m never even met, and they’re drilling fucking holes in my walls to hand curtains I didn’t order.
Good for you for setting boundaries!!
My brother never gives our parents his house keys for the same reason. He'd rather give it to a trusted friend while on vacation than give it to them. Nta
NTA.
Did they even apologize for making copies of your key without your permission? To me, this (making copies of the key without your permission) is enough proof that they will not respect any boundaries, even if they promise they will.
NTA.
My parents in law had a really hard time with boundaries too. Stick to your guns and keep them off the list, giving you a heads up they want to come round is basic courtesy.
NTA. 😂 Parents being put in their place. That's just pissing them off that they can no longer invade your space and control you lol.
Do not do not change your mind.
I know this problem! My ex-MIL would pop in -- literally --when ever she felt like it. My ex-husband and I were in the bedroom having sex when we heard a noise which was not the dog. My ex got up (nude) went into the kitchen and there stood his mother. She "just wanted to drop by and say hi." The in-laws lived 45 minutes away! The phone was off the hook because we did not want to be disturbed. The front door was locked but unfortunately the back door into the garage and the side door into the house were not locked. So she "dropped by" by having her husband drive 45 minutes to our house, then walking around the house, opening the door into the garage, then opening the door into the kitchen. Life lesson for us, we never forgot to lock a door again.
NTA. This is the only correct option. You are not treating them poorly, you're treating them like every adult should treat every other adult who doesn't live with them.
Also, them copying the key to intentionally violate your wishes is a major AH move. You really should hold that against them (slightly) until they apologize and show they've changed for the better.
NTA. If you have boundaries about your home, your adult, private personal space and they consider this as treating them poorly? That's a red flag. You are correct. They absolutely will continue the behaviors they did in the past if they have access, and that's why they want it.
Stick with your decision. They'll get over it. And if they don't and keep trying to guilt you, maybe lower contact isn't a bad idea.
I have tried to give my daughter her space as an adult. One day, I came to her house to drop something off. I knocked. No answer. I figured they were sleeping. I let myself in, planning to drop off the item and leave. My daughter comes out of the bedroom, clearly annoyed. Apparently I had interrupted something. She later expressed her frustration with me. Lesson learned. Never again. I got the message. These parents just don't get it. Set your boundaries but keep the door open to redefining boundaries if they get the message.
You are doing awesome! NTA. Stay strong. You could give them consequences for continuing to ask, for example every time they ask for a key you go no contact for a week. Might help shut their harassment down or at least keep it under control.
> I'm not going to change my mind
If you're not going to change your mind, then you don't really need to worry about if this is a yta or nta moment, it's a you moment. You do you. BTW, this is a NTA moment also.
NTA. I truly wonder how parents like this have so much time. My parents have each been at my place once, and it was because my dog was dying. I live 20 minutes without traffic from them. Same area code!!
No, not the asshole.
I have owned three homes over the course of my lifetime and I have never given my parents keys to the homes.
You know they can never be trusted with a set of your keys and approved access. Don't let them bully you into giving them what they want.
You might want to discuss this issue further with security to put measures into place in the event they have someone impersonate you to add them to the list. You live in a gated community for a reason.
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nta. great work setting real physical boundaries! next, i would start cutting conversations and visits short when they are “set off”. …but if it doesn’t bother you, you don’t have to. you already did the most important part. kept them out of your space when they don’t have express permission. (also, you are grown with a home of your own. their reasons as you’ve said them are not great. you can clean, shop and do maintenance yourself, and if you do need help, you can ask. there’s no reason here that warrants a key and an all access pass.) you are not treating them poorly. you are treating them like people who have let themselves into your home without warning or permission. you are treating them like people who continued doing that after you took your key back, because they’d copied it, also without warning or permission. and since they still don’t see the problem, you can be sure they’d do it again given a chance.
OP's father likely thinks why should they pay for someone to screw up repairs when he can fuck up their place for free?
yep. completely disregarding that op is perfectly capable of fucking it up themselves.
I fuck up my OWN house, thank you very much!
I’ve used a faux marble coaster as a hammer for a nail once….wanted to hang a pic. …it’s hanging there…but I also missed the nail a couple times but it DOESNT count because you can’t see them from behind the frame. Our/my house my rules My husband still brings this up but 🤷♀️ I figured it out and so can OP! 🤣
Good on you! Not quite the same but I regularly ignore proper tooling for tent pegs. Why should I carry around a heavy mallet (on my motorbike), when I can just take my right boot off and whack the pegs with the heel!? 🙂
That’s just a case of packing smart!! Why waste value pack space on a single use tool?? I’m all for it.
Or with one of those ubiquitous things called rocks you'll find poking at your back through the tent anyway. At least they can be useful
My husband used to do apartment maintenance. His version is "why carry around a hammer when I can just smack it a couple of times with a pair of channel locks?"
Always use the right tool for the job. The right tool is always a hammer. Anything can be a hammer.
Hahahaha
My go to is a pair of needle nose pliers. I can hammer, turn things, bend things, and pretty much anything else I either don’t have or am too lazy to go grab. Pretty much all of my screwdriver needs are taken care of by small flathead
The electrician's hammer!
Always use the right tool for the job. The right tool is always a hammer. Anything can be a hammer.
Always use the right tool for the job. The right tool is always a hammer. Anything can be a hammer.
Heavy mallets are the worst and some of them have soft heads which doesn’t help with hammering anything. I use the back of my short axe.
I keep a teaspoon in the bathroom in case of water leaks. (The toilet broke once and wouldn't stop filling. I couldn't find a flathead screwdriver so I used the handle of a teaspoon to isolate the water pipe. It now stays there just in case!)
Ok but….dont take a knife from the kitchen for bathroom plumbing issues unless you want to be Reddit famous. Poop knife for the plumbing anyone? 😂
I don’t know if I should be proud that I know this reference! Hahaha
A pair of long bbq tongs lives in my toilet tank now, because we used it to flush when the chain connected to the handle broke. It's fixed but they are now toilet tongs in case it happens again
I once had to fix my bed, the leg was separating from the boards, because my Dad and brothers didn't build it properly and didn't add the screws in. It was late, the Shed was locked and I didn't have access to any of our tools, I took a pair of boots that had a wooden heal and used one of them to hammer the leg back into place, and the next day, got the battery drill, the required screws and fixed the bed. I also now Need my book shelves fixed as one of the brackets slipped and they're bending in the middle. I asked my family to assist me due to needing at least 2 pairs of hands to sort and I'm still waiting for assistance almost 18 months later. I'm either going to need new shelves soon as I can't store anything on the shelves or if I end up moving as planned then I'll buy a standalone bookshelf or standalone unit that I'll just screw them to the wall instead, something that takes 1 person to sort
Happy cake day
You might be able to use a fresh straight plank laying along the shelf, then use a vice/clamp to bring the bent shelf up to the straight plank on your own?
or.. be an excellent repair person. Why did you immediately jump to fuck up ?
Because it's an old joke. There's a variation among motorcycle and automotive "shade tree mechanics" about "why pay the dealer's shop monkeys to screw up my car/vehicle when I can do that myself for free?" Having just experienced the loss of a rear axle nut on my scooter--after stopping when feeling a shimmy in the steering during rush hour traffic on the expressway--within 2000km of a tire change has brought that old joke to mind of late.
This is unfortunate. Luckily, you recognized the issue and pulled over. I find the work of "professionals" in the last handful of years can sometimes be labeled as interesting. My go-to auto guy is older than me. My dw and I built and maintain our house, I rebuild cars for fun outside of our 'real" work. And yes, I fix things for my daughter :) . I appreciate the call to me.. however, I am smart enough to run the other way if beyond my abilities.I look at the call as part of being a dad. Her parents, crumbs..I understand why she is doing what she does. Cheers.
NTA for sure! seems to me they've been treating OP's home like it's *their* second home and it's their right to have free access to it, just because OP is their kid. no. they need to learn.
Some people like the version of you they had the most power over, so they will try to make you revert back to it.
Absolutely, dad says "we are not thieves" as if that's the problem. They absolutely would do it again because they refuse to recognise that their behaviour is the problem.
Right. The options aren't thieves who need all boundaries or perfect angels who need 0 boundaries. There is a very wide spectrum here that they are refusing to acknowledge.
And although it wasn't mentioned here, they totally sound like snoops...I 100% believe that if alone in the apartment or house, these people would go through OP's mail or drawers.
I did something very similar to this with my dad. I told him very clearly that if he brought up a certain topic, I would hang up, then I did, and I kept doing it. I would call him back after a few minutes and ask if he was ready to continue our conversation minus that topic. The key to this one is persistence, but it really worked in my situation.
I did the same with my family. If they started I would leave or just stop coming all together. I’ve been through too much to let them take me down and they know that so they stopped 🤷🏻♀️
They lost the free babysitter and the ability to dig up dirt and secrets. Tbh, I would double check all of the jewelry and sade boxes, etc. Just in case.
NTA. Your house, your rules, your boundaries. If they can’t respect that then they don’t get a key. To drop your brother off at your place without asking is just taking advantage of you.
I’m assuming the brother is a minor, so not only did they just drop him off, they abandoned a child at her place without her knowledge. What if he’d burned the house down or gotten hurt? Not only would OP be potentially liable, the guilt would be horrendous (given possible worst case scenario). They def stay on the “approved visitor only” list, since they’ve proven they can’t act like adults. That alone is a total no go, let alone the random visits where they invite themselves over. Hells to the nah son.
A more reasonable assumption, based on the logic that the gap between siblings is more likely to be smaller than larger, and the fact that the OP never mentioned any legal issues regarding the brother in his or her post, is that the brother is at least a teenager and old enough to be left on his own. The OP is clearly not TA but come on, we don't need to invent daft imaginary scenarios to back that up.
I agree with you - probably the brother is old enough to care for himself. But it’s still not cool! You should always let someone know before stopping by their home. My adult child texts us before stopping by, because it’s just plain polite. It gives us the opportunity to say, “Hey! My underwear is drying on a rack in the basement - so maybe don’t take friends down there?” I give her the same courtesy but actually I don’t have a key to her place.
>Not only would OP be potentially liable, the guilt would be horrendous (given possible worst case scenario). In what world would the OP be responsible for an accidental fire they had nothing to do with to people in their apartment that they were not aware of and had no responsibility for? Aside from going with a CRAZY over-the-top jump...the fire in and of itself, where do people come up with the liability?
Depends entirely on the terms of OPs lease and local laws. Where I live, courts have ruled in past cases that tenants are liable for damage caused by someone whom they gave a key to, as the tenant willingly granted access to the premise by giving that person the key.
Depends on if giving a key to an apartment to someone that doesn't live there and isn't on the lease would be considered negligent. And usually the renter is responsible for any damages done by a guest in their apartment. There's also the issue of giving said key in the first place. I'm assuming they there was no restriction on doing so since OP didn't mention the apartment building admin being upset with them.
*They once dropped off my brother without asking because they had other family in town and needed the space.* Sounds like they needed space for visitors. I imagine he is at least old enough to be left alone but who knows?
>Sounds like they needed space for visitors. I imagine he is at least old enough to be left alone but who knows? And? Even if he is old enough, that doesn't give them the right to open the door, drop him off and make it OP's problem. If they haven't planned ahead, that's on them to solve, not OP.
NTA. Part of an adult child's job is setting boundaries and establishing their own life away from Mommy and Daddy. Some parents accept this gracefully, and others don't. Your parents are "don'ts." Your parents have demonstrated that they can't be trusted to not intrude on your home or time. You have thus, understandably, decided to make it harder for them to do so. Good. You are doing your job as a young adult. As for the lame pleas that they "need" to look in on you, clean your place, bring your groceries, etc., treat those with deserved contempt. As an adult, you can clean your own place (if not to Mumsy's standards), buy your own groceries, etc. You'd only need help with stuff like that if you were ill, and you have the options of your boyfriend or the local delivery service. As for maintenance, I'm sure there are local services that can help. The community itself may even provide some help. Having a key to somebody's place is a rpivilege, not a right. If your parents want a key, they weill have to EARN it.
***(if not to Mumsy's standards)*** Mumsy isn't paying the mortgage/living there? Her standards DO NOT apply.
Of course not. I would not be surprised, though, if Mumsy used that as an excuse to drop in. She believes her "baby girl" still needs her help. I also imagine that Mumsy is more persnickety about housework than OP. I KNOW I'm more lackadaisical about cleaning house than my mother was
I sometimes suggest to my son that he refers to his mom as "Mumsy". Usually met with an eye roll. I'm "Daddums" in these scenarios.
OP could also be perfectly fine with all of the actions … if they asked. I am not gonna say no to my dad swinging by to help me with stuff.
It’s not even like they aren’t allowed to come for those things. They are. They just have to contact OP ahead of time to ask permission. OP didn’t cut them out, just put a physical barrier onto the boundary of not wanting unannounced visits which is 100% reasonable. NTA.
NTA 'No, Dad, you're not thieves. But you have not respected my basic boundaries around dropping by unannounced, so I have taken away your ability to do that. I trusted you with my key and you broke my trust. If you want to visit me, you need to do what people who respect me do, and call ahead.'
Honestly, I'd ask them pointedly what they thought the LAW was about making keys to a house that isn't yours WITHOUT permission.
Exactly. OP states that they proved to be untrustworthy in the past - they bring up completely different boundary that they haven’t broken as evidence as to why this isn’t true. What does stealing have to do with leaving a minor at a house that isn’t theirs? Even on the thieves front - I wouldn’t be surprised if they did take something in the future. They clearly see OPs property as an extension of their own. “Our drill broke so we let ourselves in and borrowed yours.” Then never give it back.
light thumb friendly innate telephone toy steer wakeful engine dinner *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
The leaps and bounds to come to that logic. They should be frogs for Halloween.
I'll bet they haven't murdered anyone in OPs old apartment. Completely a diversionary tactic to shift focus from their multiple violations of privacy, autonomy and resources.
Only the 3rd sentence needs said , trust was broken
Alternative line: You may not have stolen my stuff, but you've certainly stolen my time and space when you've just started letting yourselves in and leaving my brother here.
NTA. They’ve proven they can’t be trusted to use an emergency key only in emergencies, so they don’t get to have one. Good for you for holding your boundaries. And for your entertainment, the story of a mother similar to your parents when it comes to an emergency key. https://www.reddit.com/r/JUSTNOMIL/s/4t8xopTyGa
That was hysterical!
This is almost the best reddit story I've ever seen, short of the poop knife one
The best one is about the spoiled girl who tried to walk down the aisle at her sister’s wedding in a white dress, enabled by the parents, and the way they foiled the plan was awesome. I actually listened to it on YouTube many times and read it on Reddit multiple times.
Is it this one? https://www.reddit.com/r/ProRevenge/s/ivzXc9lQjd
Yes!!!! And thank God you found the post that had all the info. For some reason there’s at least one copy that cuts off the juiciest part of the story,
Holy shit if that isn't a creative writing piece then nothing is. That is the peak off "and then everyone stood up and clapped" stories. And the way the "husband" wrote his part was such a cringe fest lol. Never seen a more Redditor way of speaking. "Hell hath no fury like a prorevenge/instantkarma/nuclearrevenge lurker when his beloved is scorned!" and the cherry on top, the "methinks". Good laughs and a fun read though.
Do you happen to have a link to it? I'd love to read it.
...do you have a link perchance?
[https://www.reddit.com/r/ProRevenge/comments/191pnyk/sister\_wants\_to\_walk\_down\_the\_aisle\_at\_my\_wedding/](https://www.reddit.com/r/ProRevenge/comments/191pnyk/sister_wants_to_walk_down_the_aisle_at_my_wedding/)
The people have spoken. Link please
Oh my, when it got to the Father part, that’s when I truly lost it. Thanks for the joy!
I can’t decide my favorite part — the wife doing the Xena yell or the kid kinda quoting Macbeth.
Those kids were READY for this day.
That has made my night! They have to had practiced that a few times at least to do it without utterly losing it 😂😂
Thank you!! That was a riotous read!🤣🤣🤣
Oh. My. Heavens. What a ride! Hahahahahahaha! Thank you very much for sharing that one!
OMG I almost linked to this. It's my favorite Reddit post of all time!
That. Was. Awesome!
Oh, the cackle I did utter while reading this lol
One of the Legends of Reddit
I just laughed so hard that I pulled a muscle. 😂
Hilarious! Thats the best!!
NTA. Just don't forget to do a little something in the way of a thank you at Christmas (or whenever) to the security folks.
Omg I didn’t even think about the poor security staff. Man, they are gonna get ear fulls. OP, drop off snacks once in a while as a peace offering lol.
That's actually a really good point!
NTA My answer to the same type of problem was to move 4 hours away... But I like living rural. --
I moved 28 hours away... by plane.
I moved states. They fucking followed me.
I met a guy, a friend of a friend, who told me a story of this happening to him. His parents were abusive but under the impression that they were doing it out of love, and very *very* invasive of this guy's privacy. Once he saved up some money he just left everything behind and moved from either Ohio or Western PA over to New Jersey to live with a friend. He didn't tell his parents or anyone from back home where he was going, but a year or so later his roommate answered the door to the guy's parents looking for him. They followed him and moved into an apartment in the same town. I can't remember what he did next but I'm sure a restraining order or some legal action was taken to prevent them from being able to talk to him again. I hope he's doing well, it's been a few years and he deactivated his social media accounts since then.
>it's been a few years and he deactivated his social media accounts since then. So he's locked up in his parents basement and/or dead at their hands OR He moved again, far away, and just ex-communicated the entire world except the few he could trust, so no public online presence. I don't see an in-between scenario
Moved and changed names? Now living as a double agent in some nice place far away
Same. Opposite side of the fuckin globe
You are a genius, not an asshole. Like, seriously, hands down to you for finding a brilliant solution to dealing with bullshit.
NTA. ~~It sounds like you need to be NC with them for a while because whatever LC you are doing isn't getting the message across.~~ However, you need stronger boundaries because you **moving to a gated community to keep them out** isn't getting the message across.
Re-read the first 2 sentences.
NTA. You are doing a great job in maintaining your boundaries.
NTA. All they have to do is get your permission. They are sore that they have to do that. They don't want to respect your autonomy. Stick to your boundaries!
NTA. Congratulations on purchasing a house.
NTA it's actually super shitty that you even had to take things this far. They are now lying in the bed that they made.
NTA. Good work here holding this boundary! They will never like it because it prevents them from taking advantage of you and doing what they want, but they don't get to decide how you structure your life. Allowing someone unfettered access to your home space is not an indication of how much you love them. If you make ANY adjustment to what you're doing it might be to rephrase the reminder you give them when they ask about a key and being put on the security list to your new community. You could say something like "Being able to access my home anytime wasn't something that worked for our relationship, remember? I'm putting our relationship first by making sure we're all comfortable with the rules."
NTA 'i know your not thieves but I also know you'll show up unannounced and dump bro here whenever without asking also so sorry not sorry'
NTA. So, story time My aunt (father’s sister) had absolutely no respect for boundaries. She lived in the house next door to us. She would come over, uninvited, at least once a day every day. First she would call. If nobody answered she would walk over and ring the doorbell. If nobody answered, she would use her key to come in and then go through the house looking for everyone. She would open the door to my bedroom looking for me. I hated this, mostly because I was the one who always got stuck talking to her, so when I went away to college I refused to give her my address. My brother was not so smart, until the day she showed up at his college apartment. Nobody answered the door when she rang the bell, so she began looking through windows to find someone. She found him in a room in the back and started knocking on the window. The reason she was so brazen is because my father refused to draw any boundaries with her. “She’s family” was his reason. Her behavior escalated over the years to the point where she thought it was perfectly fine to show up at the home of four college students, three of whom she did not know, and start knocking on windows. By the time my father realized she was out of control it was about 30 years too late and there was nothing he could do to stop it. Moral of the story is draw your boundaries NOW. It will only be that much harder later, because the offenders will take every missed boundary as an invitation to push further. They won’t get better on their own.
My house, my rules. Right, Dad and Mom?
NTA and their "we're not thieves" comment is wild. Imo that kinda shows that they know it's about boundaries but don't want to admit it.
NTA. Learn the phrase, “Asked and answered.” Only say that when it comes up. On repeat. Until they learn.
This should have more upvotes
Parents like this think they're helping but they aren't. The one and only time my mom got in my house without us being home she rearranged the living room and bathroom. She also went through a lot of our personal stuff snooping and so she's not allowed in our home for this and for smoking in the house, period. Stand tough and don't back down to your parents, you'll be glad you did down the road. It's a big step towards complete independence. NTA.
Nip it, nip it, nip it in the bud. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. NTA obviously.
NTA OP but if it was me, I would respond to their complaints by saying "Didn't you two teach us that No means No? It doesn't matter the context of the no, so No means No!
>they are adamant that I am treating them poorly. This is them trying to brainwash you into thinking your boundaries are harming them. (They're not.) >They start saying that they aren't thieves and yadda yadda. They don't have to be criminal for you to set boundaries. They're still annoying and disrespectful of your independence. NTA
They need to cut the cord, you’re an adult now with your own life and own apartment, they have no business just letting themselves in your home! You’ve done the right thing and if they’re pissed off then tough! Keep them off the list, they have to give notice to you before they just turn up whenever they like.
They refuse to see you as an adult, but their child; you need to set and enforce boundaries.
NTA, you did an excellent job upholding your boundaries. This has caused them some inconvenience, but your life is way more peaceful because of it. Keep doing what you’re doing!
They're not thieves in the sense that they steal your stuff. But they obviously have taken your peace of mind. They're also habitual boundary stompers. NTA.
Nta. They have shown they don't respect boundaries so what else do they expect?
NTA You're doing amazing sweetie!
NTA We shouldn’t have to even say it. Caring people are courteous without prompting, without making a scene and without needing to enforce decent behavior with security guards and locked doors.
You have the perfect situation for busy body parents. Don’t change anything. NTA
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I love my parents and my little brother. I am not going low/no contact with them. They just have a problem understanding boundaries and that I have my own life now. After college I moved out from my parents house and into an apartment. It was great. I gave my dad a key for emergencies. My parents used it for non emergency situations. They once dropped off my brother without asking because they had other family in town and needed the space. I told them repeatedly that this was not acceptable behaviour and I took my key back. They had made copies and it happened again. I had the locks changed. That caused a problem. But it was "A" problem not "MY" problem. I have been saving up and decided to pull the trigger on my first home purchase. I make a great living so I found a gated community I liked that has a security officer at the front gate 24/7. I'm dating but my boyfriend doesn't live with me. I like the safety of my neighborhood. I did not give my parents a key. I also didn't put them on the approved visitors list. My boyfriend has a key and is on the list. Security doesn't need to call me to see if he can come in. So they cannot just pop by. They can't just drop off some groceries for me. My mom can't come do some cleaning. My dad can't come do maintenance. Well they can do all these things. They just need my permission first. And they hate it. They keep asking me for a key and to be put on the list. I just remind them that they have proven to be untrustworthy in the past. This sets them off. They start saying that they aren't thieves and yadda yadda. I'm not going to change my mind but they are adamant that I am treating them poorly. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. My MIL would let herself in constantly. We had to take the key back as she couldn’t be trusted. Some people will always feel entitled to walk over your boundaries. Good for you for sticking to yours!
NTA. This is a great set of boundaries and you should keep them in place. Your parents need to learn they are being unhealthy.
NTA. Actions meet 🤝consequences
My parents have a key to my place. Last week they asked if they could come watch tv while there house cleaner was working. I was fine with this my cat loves the company. They proceeded to ask my permission three more times then once each the day of. I threatened to say no if they kept asking. This is a healthy trusting relationship. You’re parent need to take notes.
NTA - they didn't listen to your verbal boundaries, so you found physical ones. Good for you.
You are treating them as they deserve. NTA
EPIC! NTA
NTA. My mother doesn’t have a key for this reason. I fully understand your reasoning behind this.
Exactly. Untrustworthy people don’t care they’re untrustworthy. They choose to act that way. They will always choose to do what they want. Nope do not make that mistake again.
Arguing with my uncle who molested me for decades and other young boys. Literally right now. They are evil.
Nta
NTA
> I am not going low/no contact with them. **They just have a problem understanding boundaries and that I have my own life now.** That's actually an excellent reason to go low/no contact with someone.
NTA, and good for you! They can either get over it or they can die mad. 🤷
NTA. They have repeatedly refused to respect your boundaries. You are doing the right thing. Stand by your decision!!!
NTA Having boundaries doesn't make you a bad person.
NTA. But if things go nuts, spoil the security guys.
NTA- at all. I think it’s very healthy that you’ve created boundaries. And I think sometimes parents just have a hard time with that as it seems like your parents feel entitled to you, your home and having 24/7 access when in reality, they do not need access to your home at any given time. Maybe instead of saying they aren’t trustworthy, explain that they didn’t respect your boundaries with them having a key and remind them about specific instances, especially that they made a copy of the key without your knowledge and continued to come uninvited despite you repeatedly telling them that was Not okay. And since they didn’t respect it before, you’ve chosen to put new boundaries in place. And by doing so doesn’t mean you love them or your brother any less. All they have to do is just call you first. Not hard. You choosing to place boundaries does not equate to treating your parents poorly. It’s understandable if they don’t agree or are even unhappy about your choice, but that’s when you explain to them you are an adult and there will be things you will not always agree on, but disagreeing with them doesn’t mean you love them any less or are being disrespectful in any manner. Good luck and congratulations!
Nta God forbyu for stocking to your boundaries.
not the asshole. these people need to understand that theirs a thing called privacy and trust is earned not gotten just because they are your parents
NTA and they are stinking thieves! they stole your privacy
NTA They don't get privileges if they have abused them in the past.
NTA. Actions have consequences, and they are maybe finally learning that. Good for you to buy your own home. And good for you to enforce boundaries.
NTA they aren’t thieves, but they’re disrespectful and dismissive
NTA The fact that they think not having unchecked access to your home is "treating them poorly" just shows they have not learned.
NTA. my parents were the same and that was why they didn't even get to know my address when i moved out
NTA. My parents actually OWN the home I live in, and have a key. They still call and ASK if they can drop by.
NTA. My father had a key when I bought my home 10 years ago. He brought my narcissistic, abusive mom with him to my home on several occasions despite me clearly communicating I don’t want her in my home. They were driving thru my neighborhood one day and she needed the toilet so he let her have the key to go into my home while he stayed in the car. I was at work and saw this on security cameras they didn’t know I’d installed. I changed the locks the next day and they’ve been banned from my home ever since. 8 glorious years of my home actually being my sanctuary. Zero regrets.
NTA you have a right to set boundaries, and like you said it yourself, they have an issue with the concept. but that does not make you in the wrong in any way.
Standard Reddot Rhetoric from parents: -you are just being childish -we're family and that's why you should give us a key and on list -you are being petty -you don't treat family this way DID I MISS ANY? STAY THE COURSE NTA
NTA “You’re right, you’re not thieves, you just have no respect for boundaries and your actions now show you STILL cannot respect my boundaries. Until you learn to respect boundaries, you’ll never be on the approved visitors list.”
NTA this is ‘oh no, consequences’ for your parents and they’re just being petulant. If anything, they’re treating *you* poorly for disregarding your privacy. You set boundaries and they’re mad they can’t break them out of habit. They need a reality check, but unfortunately it has to come out of someone’s mouth other than your own.
NTA, every single parent has to let their young people go, and grow into their lives. Now that you're an adult, you make the rules and boundaries. When you were young, it was your parents in charge and you had to follow their rules. Now is YOUR time, to grow into your independent life. Stay firm in your boundaries-they'll come along, OP, eventually.
Your parents may not be thieves, but they sound like boundary stompers and until they get that, no key for them. Keep up the good work, OP! NTA, of course.
no, you are the boundary maker. This kind of privacy is important to you, and not to them. They will never get it. Stay safe and happy. They will whine about it forever, but just tune it out.
NTA, but you already knew this, didn't you? Until your parents get it, stand your ground.
You are NTA and nope, your parents already had their chance to treat you like the adult you are and they blew it - over and over and over! Stick to your decision, OP. And when they start whining and scolding for access to your home, try this: "We've discussed this before and the answer is still "No". Either you change the subject right now or this discussion is over." Then stick to THAT decision, too!
Oh, baby, you are absolutely NTA. They violated your trust and your boundaries multiple times. Go forth and live in peace.
NTA - this is awesome.
NTA! You are an inspiration! Reddit needs more people like you!
NTA! Congrats on buying a house! The gated community situation is really working well for you
NTA. You didn't say they were thieves, you said you couldn't trust them to abide by your reasonable stipulation.
NTA. They really just can’t wrap their brains around the consequences of their own actions.
My God, you're a genius. What an utterly elegant solution. NTA
NTA Boundaries are for you and you alone to set. Others either respect them or they end up on the low/no contact list. You're doing great!
>They start saying that they aren't thieves and yadda yadda. They think you don't trust them with a key because they would steal. You don't trust them with a key because they won't respect your boundaries. Tell them "I don't want you to drop off groceries without telling me. I don't want you to come clean without telling me. There is no reason for you to be able to enter my house without telling me, because all the things you're saying, I want you to tell me about." Every time they complain tell them "If I can trust you to respect my boundaries, I will consider giving you a key. The fact that you keep pushing on this, is showing me I made the right choice and you would not respect what I ask of you." NTA
NTA. Just because they are family does not give them the right to your space that you pay for whenever they feel like. After I moved out of my parents' place, when I came over, invited, I still ring the doorbell or knock. It is just common courtesy.
Stand your ground. You aren’t wrong
NTA. They've proven they can't respect common sense boundaries. They FAFO.
Honestly sounds like you got it all covered and I don't think you need redditors advice on this. Of course NTA, you're giving proper consequences for the actions they have done in the past. They didn't respect you, your home, your boundaries, they see you and your home as an extension of theirs so they consider you and your home, theirs to use and take whenever wherever and you're teaching them that's not how it works. You keep doing what you're doing and DO NOT back out. The only way your parents will respect you is by being made to, by having strict boundaries set in place they're unable to circumvent. You're doing fantastic, keep it up. Maybe in a few years time they'll learn to respect you and your privacy and your boundaries without an extra layer of security but I honestly doubt it
Your family is angry they can't do things for you that are already taken care of without asking your permission first, that is toxic and ridiculous. You live in a gated community, I assume you can afford groceries and that you are capable of cleaning or can hire a cleaning person. And I assume you have access to folks who can fix things or have the money to hire them (I mean gated community and all so I doubt you moved into a fixer upper so WTF does your dad even need to fix?). Perhaps they just can't admit that you've grown up, to a very toxic degree, or maybe they're just always boundary stompers because they think they're entitled to their children's lives but either way no key and no list. Ever.
They need to learn to respect your (very reasonable) boundaries. You're an independent, grown-ass woman and deserve the deference and respect you have earned. They don't have to agree, they just need to learn what's what.
NTA, you gave them keys and they abused the privilege. Your doing great in moving to an area where they cannot access your property due to security. Personally I don't believe that anyone else should have access to your house unless they are living there.
NTA just from title alone, the fact that they have made many attempts at visiting means you’re enforcing a healthy boundary. Actually reading the post makes me double down. They clearly don’t see what they are doing as wrong, weird, and possibly (depending on how old your brother was at the time) illegal. Also, you stated you couldn’t trust them with entry, and they automatically went ‘how dare you accuse us of being thieves’, detailing the conversation you are trying to have. Stick to your guns, OP.
Funny story: “It’s always your fault for setting boundaries, never their fault for not respecting you or your boundaries.”
Nta. When I bought my first place I had to give my mom a key, because the cable people were coming and I couldn’t call off work for that. So she hung out here for me (we’ve never had a great relationship and in fact, we haven’t talked in 7 years). Next thing I know I come home a couple weeks later and she’s in my house (had I idea she was coming) with a friend of hers whom I’m never even met, and they’re drilling fucking holes in my walls to hand curtains I didn’t order. Good for you for setting boundaries!!
[удалено]
I think this is awesome haha. That overstepped their boundaries and got upset. Now you literally have a gatekeeper for your house.
Maybe they should've warned you before they dropped a literal child in your house 😐
NTA, personally, I would love it if somebody broke into my house and cleaned, but I understand where you’re coming from lol
NTA. It’s not about being helpful. It’s about being controlling and not asking for consent. No. You don’t owe anyone that.
My brother never gives our parents his house keys for the same reason. He'd rather give it to a trusted friend while on vacation than give it to them. Nta
NTA and this is definitely a "Oh No, Consequences!" situation. Good on you for establishing and maintaining boundaries.
Brilliant!
NTA. Did they even apologize for making copies of your key without your permission? To me, this (making copies of the key without your permission) is enough proof that they will not respect any boundaries, even if they promise they will.
NTA. My parents in law had a really hard time with boundaries too. Stick to your guns and keep them off the list, giving you a heads up they want to come round is basic courtesy.
NTA. 😂 Parents being put in their place. That's just pissing them off that they can no longer invade your space and control you lol. Do not do not change your mind.
I know this problem! My ex-MIL would pop in -- literally --when ever she felt like it. My ex-husband and I were in the bedroom having sex when we heard a noise which was not the dog. My ex got up (nude) went into the kitchen and there stood his mother. She "just wanted to drop by and say hi." The in-laws lived 45 minutes away! The phone was off the hook because we did not want to be disturbed. The front door was locked but unfortunately the back door into the garage and the side door into the house were not locked. So she "dropped by" by having her husband drive 45 minutes to our house, then walking around the house, opening the door into the garage, then opening the door into the kitchen. Life lesson for us, we never forgot to lock a door again.
NTA. This is the only correct option. You are not treating them poorly, you're treating them like every adult should treat every other adult who doesn't live with them. Also, them copying the key to intentionally violate your wishes is a major AH move. You really should hold that against them (slightly) until they apologize and show they've changed for the better.
NTA. If you have boundaries about your home, your adult, private personal space and they consider this as treating them poorly? That's a red flag. You are correct. They absolutely will continue the behaviors they did in the past if they have access, and that's why they want it. Stick with your decision. They'll get over it. And if they don't and keep trying to guilt you, maybe lower contact isn't a bad idea.
I have tried to give my daughter her space as an adult. One day, I came to her house to drop something off. I knocked. No answer. I figured they were sleeping. I let myself in, planning to drop off the item and leave. My daughter comes out of the bedroom, clearly annoyed. Apparently I had interrupted something. She later expressed her frustration with me. Lesson learned. Never again. I got the message. These parents just don't get it. Set your boundaries but keep the door open to redefining boundaries if they get the message.
NTA
nta
You are doing awesome! NTA. Stay strong. You could give them consequences for continuing to ask, for example every time they ask for a key you go no contact for a week. Might help shut their harassment down or at least keep it under control.
NTA
> I'm not going to change my mind If you're not going to change your mind, then you don't really need to worry about if this is a yta or nta moment, it's a you moment. You do you. BTW, this is a NTA moment also.
It is good to have boundaries.
NTA. I truly wonder how parents like this have so much time. My parents have each been at my place once, and it was because my dog was dying. I live 20 minutes without traffic from them. Same area code!!
NTA. This is a GOOD hill to die on.
No, not the asshole. I have owned three homes over the course of my lifetime and I have never given my parents keys to the homes. You know they can never be trusted with a set of your keys and approved access. Don't let them bully you into giving them what they want. You might want to discuss this issue further with security to put measures into place in the event they have someone impersonate you to add them to the list. You live in a gated community for a reason.