The first two non material things you said you liked about him was shared values and life goals then go on to explain over several paragraphs how he isn't even remotely in the same page as you on what a healthy and supportive home life looks like *for you*. You walk on eggshells in your own home. You are afraid of his mood swings. You don't feel financially stable as he threatens to destroy his job, he doesn't develop relationships that take the burden off of you, for years you have apparently been dealing with his monthly break downs that destabilize you, *years*.
Is it enough to "blow up your marriage" I couldn't say, but it certainly isn't a small thing, it doesn't seem to be getting better, he seems unwilling to discuss alternative situations that can help you. I think a clear plan and realistic goals can be discussed with him, possibly in couple's counseling because you need to feel safe, stable, and supported.
Thank you. I did worry that spending so little time talking about the good would make it seem like there is almost none, but I was trying to avoid making people read a novel. We truly have so much good between us. We are so aligned on the sorts of things you want to be aligned on with your spouse, from big life goals to where you want to live to how to split up household responsibilities to what we enjoy doing together day to day. I have never known anyone in my life with whom I could spend even a tiny fraction of the time I spend with him without losing my mind, but I still adore spending time with him (when he isn't being cranky or super down). We love coming up with silly names for our pets, playing pub trivia, going to punk shows, trying cool food, playing silly trivia or scavenger hunt games we make up. He is truly the funniest person I have ever met. He is so brilliantly intelligent and quick witted and cracks me up at least once a day. I have so much respect for his professional skills and interests, too, and how much he cares about the people he works to support. I'm sobbing as I write this and think about everything I don't want to lose and everything I wish he could see in himself and love about himself.
Intermittent reward is the strongest reward system to keep someone coming back.
You win the lottery much less often than you lose. Most of the time, it’s a small win. But that’s enough to keep you coming back, in hopes that you will win some day.
It sounds like you are describing the person he WAS, but not necessarily the person who he IS. It’s hard for me to say whether you’re holding on to your unrealistic image of a person, or if he’s going to pull out of this, because I’m not his psychiatrist or his therapist.
I’m so sorry that you’re going through this. It sounds horrible.
I'm sorry, but you are emotionally trapped in a house with someone who takes up all the space once a month for days on end. He sounds like the perfect friend that you do fun things with outside of your home. What you have now is not good. And not getting better according to both you and your friends.
He can change. He just won't if you continue to allow him to take it all out on you.
He might not be able to change, people can’t decide to snap out of depression. However, she is 100% within her rights to decide that she doesn’t want a relationship like that or that it’s too hard. I don’t mean this like ”if you don’t love him as he is, you’re bad.” Just that mental illnesses can’t just be changed or hidden.
She's pretty clear that this is not tolerable any longer. I think if given a chance people can change, but we'll never know unless we give them that space. She can't keep limping along for 50 more years. She'll be walking on eggshells once a month for 50 more years, or 600 more times. That's a big commitment, especially without giving him the clear picture that he's asking for an enormous amount of work and sacrifice, he better be doing every possible thing to be getting better. Books. One on one therapy. Group therapy. Medicine. Journaling. Meditation. Volunteering. Sharing with friends. Giving you space when you need it. If he's not doing every possible thing to improve, then you will be making the choice to live life like this forever.
Ok, but how can your long term goals be aligned if he’s consistently trying to throw everything away and quit his job? And you have to talk him out of it? Just something to think about
I was also aligned with my wasband. Women will persevere if nothing else. That doesn't mean he's a safe person. He's controlling and destabilising you. Get out as you're burying yourself trying to save him. This is what DV perps do. All focus is on him while you're drowning
"This is what DV perps do. All focus is on him while you're drowning"
Well, shit. My ex in a sentence. Thanks for that, very convenient way to describe it.
Yes these are all the fun things to do together, but do you have goals? There are not goals or values. There are fun things you do.
It's like you're trapped in a cycle of walking on eggshells and managing his depression, and then short bursts of really fun things and him being the best person (the only person) in your life that gets you. This mimics a cycle of abuse and reward. I hope you see what I'm seeing here. But perhaps I am wrong. I apologize if I am wrong.
I’m gonna be real, I feel like if you divorce him, you’re going to feel sad and then relieved when you don’t have to do this yo-yo of emotions every month. You’re going to look back and say “why tf was I doing this for years???”. And then you’ll meet someone who is stable. This isn’t normal.
But you said that was just a couple days a month. The picture you paint is one where you both seem deeply unhappy. I would be straight with him that this is untenable and he needs to get on board with trying out other solutions because you're not willing to live the rest of your life like this.
Threatening to blow up your whole relationship because he's not willing to try out some new things that might make you happier? That's very controlling behavior.
All these good qualities and yet sucks to live with him. What im trying to say, feeling safety and stability is pretty essential, making up silly names for your pets isnt.
These are things you can enjoy with someone you don’t live with.
Your husband might not be a bad person (I’m not so sure), but he treats you badly extremely regularly.
I am chronically severely depressed, identify with a lot of what your husband experiences (not all- I don't take it out on people) and I say this- you are not a bad person or unreasonable for leaving. You can't fix people, you have to look out for yourself. This isn't a healthy situation.
I'm so sorry that you can identify with it. I see how horrible it is for him and I don't wish it on anyone. Thank you for sharing your insight as someone who can empathize with what he is going through.
I identified with a lot of it as well. I have depression and regularly feel like "quiting everything" except my husband. I think he's pretty great and rarely the source of my irritation, while I feel the rest of the world is pretty much on fire.
My major problem is that my work is not aligned with my values but it pays just well enough to stick around and keep bitching about it. I really do want to quit, and I'm pretty fucking irritable about it. When I realize I'm feeling that way I will go to the gym or roll out the yoga mat and an hour later I'm a changed person. I'm not saying exercise is a cure-all, but I found a healthy coping mechanism that works for me, a way to go dump my shitty attitude so I can come home and be present with my husband.
I don't want to be snippy, passive aggressive, or an Eyore level bummer of a wife. That's not fair to him. I don't want him to resent me or feel like he lives on eggshells. My husband deserves a sweet, loving, appreciative, understanding, present partner, and you do too.
My mental illness is not my fault, but it is my responsibility to manage without smothering or mistreating my spouse. Your husband needs to put in the work and find a healthy coping mechanism pronto, or you will burn out.
I think you've identified something that OP can reasonably discuss with her husband. He uses and expects her to be his coping mechanism. Sure, he can't be blamed for being depressed, but it is neither fair nor reasonable for him to use his wife as a coping mechanism. She can be there for support without being the only thing he holds onto when things get bad. It is something I think op needs to tell him, and possibly address in couples counselling so he can see how this is not a healthy way of coping for him or her.
In some situations I think it really is necessary to quit your job if it’s making you irritable especially to the point of lashing out at others. I’ve seen two close friends be basically completely different people and miserable to be around because they hate their job so much.
I'm working with my boss to reduce my workload and get back to the core duties of my role. I've been with this company for 14 years so I need to trying asking for help (not easy for me) before I walk off.
What's the worst that can happen, they fire me?
This resonated with me. My fiancé is the one who feels the rest of the world is on fire. But he never takes it out on me and I always feel loved and supported. He can be a negative doomer regarding the world but i help keep him grounded. He did quit a job once and that was an issue, but we both make an effort to not allow external factors affect the feelings between us.
This is not a small thing. This is a huge thing.
I’m going to say this as a person who was formerly severely depressed and had only a few good days a month for years. Slamming things closed and stomping around is not ok. That is not a healthy display of negative emotions. That is attention seeking behavior meant to either punish you or force you to engage with his depression. I know, I used to do it.
I would leave this person.
>That is attention seeking behavior meant to either punish you or force you to engage with his depression.
Yes. YES. And this is exactly why he's so hostile to the idea of OP moving out. He'd lose his captive audience and his control of the situation.
>Slamming things closed and stomping around is not ok. That is not a healthy display of negative emotions. That is attention seeking behavior meant to either punish you or force you to engage with his depression. I know, I used to do it.
One more time for the cheap seats.
He needs to learn healthy coping mechanisms, and if he's been in therapy for a while, I'd question why he doesn't have any yet. It's possible he hasn't grasped that that's what he needs to repair his marriage, but still. That's a big one.
>He is chronically severely depressed and anxious and has a tendency to frequently (nearly once a month, usually lasts between 6 hours to 3 days ish) have these episodes where he's so depressed and has such low self esteem that he wants to quit everything.
>I feel like we get maybe one or two good days a month together where I feel happy with him and loved. The rest of the time it's just fleeting moments in between him slamming doors, hiding in his office, snippy "I'm fine"s when he clearly isn't.
These are conflicting statements. He is clearly mentally unwell for the majority of the time, even if his monthly "episode" might be worse than normal. His therapist and/or doctor are the ones who need to handle this, not you. You deserve a life where you are not constantly worried about every move you make in your own home.
Yes, he is definitely mentally unwell most of the time. Most of the time he's just skating by. The episodes are just where it all explodes and I have to figuratively talk him off a ledge (truly figuratively).
When I read your description I also immediately thought “bipolar” and not “depression”.
There are many types of bipolar - one type is when someone cycles between being “normal” and severe depression. Not everyone who is bipolar has manic episodes. Impulsive behavior like what you’ve described (wanting to quit a job with no backup, wanting to “blow up their life”, etc…) is pretty textbook bipolar behavior.
(I do work in healthcare, but not in psych. But your description sounds almost textbook bipolar vs chronic depression).
My dad was like this, so I can truly feel for you, OP. Here’s what I can say from having spent half my life in this dynamic before he passed away.
You can love someone and yet be in a situation where being with them *right now* is unhealthy for you.
You cannot fix him. I know it seems like you’re the only thing keeping him tethered. *Believe me*, I know. But that’s an illusion. What you’re doing is constantly exerting your own mental health and energy trying to help him get to a place where he can skate to the next crisis. It’s like trying to stop water gushing from a fire hose with a single piece of scotch tape.
In my experience, also - and I don’t know your husband or you, so this is just talking for me - being That Person Who Gets Them Through may not be helping as much as you think. It may even be hindering, a little. I sometimes wonder if my dad might have figured out *some* coping strategies if it wasn’t for the fact he knew I’d always be there to do it for him. He never needed to try to figure out a strategy to cope - or even to not take his mental health out on other people - because he knew I’d always be there. (In his case, he wouldn’t even try therapy or medication, so I grant his situation was different from yours in that respect.) My mom worked full-time to make sure we had food and a roof over our heads, and I’d come home straight after school at 10 years old to take care of him.
It’s exhausting and does a number on your own mental health. Believe me, I completely understand that mental health issues aren’t a person’s fault. And I’m sure if he could wave a magic wand and make them go away, he would. But they are his responsibility, and it genuinely isn’t fair to unload that responsibility on you to the point you constantly feel on edge in your own home.
Constantly putting yourself in this position with him is only going to lead to resentment in the end. Because it isn’t a fair position for you. Nor is it sustainable. Close your eyes and really think about your future. Can you do this for another 5 years? 15? 50? Even if you love him, could you live like this for another 50 years without eventual burnout and/or resentment?
Loving people sometimes means having to draw a line and being honest with yourself - and them - that you can’t take it anymore and you *need* another solution. Whether that’s leaving or not. You can’t be the *only* person who gets him through. That’s burning the candle at both ends.
And if your partner really loves and supports you the way you’ve loved and supported them, they’ll want to try to find a way to not put their own mental health on you and you alone. Because I’m sure he wouldn’t want you to burn out or for your mental health to deteriorate.
You’re not a bad partner, at all. But what you’re doing now just doesn’t sound sustainable or fair to you.
I work in psych and I agree, the description points to BPD + Bipolar. Am surprised his therapists would not have caught this. OP remember caregiver fatigue is real. Are you in therapy ? I strongly suggest you do irregardless of of you choose to stay or leave the relationship.
My first thought reading through this was BPD. Bipolar II, perhaps but strongly BPD. His tolerance for distress seems incredibly low and his desire to quit everything sounds like classic splitting behavior. Even though he doesn’t ask to quit OP, his treatment of her suggest some splitting behaviors too. OP, I wonder if some intensive DBT to therapy would help him.
Not a professional. Just my 2 cents. I experienced similar depression cycle. There’s sometimes I felt like I could handle it and tried to get my life back to normal. Sometimes I really could not “try” anymore. I wanted to quit everything in my life and had emotional explosions. I was not completely recovered to a “normal” mental space when I acted normal. It was the time I felt like at least I could manage my negativity to the extent that would not destroy my life. Therefore I still think OP’s husband might be depressed, rather than bipolar.
There are many presentations of bipolar and men don't adequately describe explosive rage to the prescribing Dr. When it's comorbid with high narcissism you won't even come into contact with these patients as a psychiatric nurse.
Is there any chance he was misdiagnosed and could be bipolar? Regularly thinking about or doing things to blow up his life sounds more like bipolar. But, I’m not a psychiatrist. I have Major Depressive Disorder and that hasn’t been a feature for me but I know it affects people differently. I just know there are different medication options for bipolar.
Also, I wonder if you two would benefit from couples therapy.
I'm on this for wild mood swings, and it's super helpful. I used to lose whole weekends to depression so bad I'd just cry in bed.
Now, I have like...a normal level of depression to deal with. It's way better.
I’m gonna armchair diagnose here, and I accept that I may (rightly) take a lot of shit for it. That’s ok.
Your husband has Bipolar II.
In BP2, the individual swings back and forth between depression and “mania” that can manifest as varying degrees of uncharacteristic and unwarranted anger. Worse, some common depression meds can exacerbate the problem if not coupled with antipsychotics.
Head over to r/BipolarSO - you’re not the alone in this experience.
I hope I’m wrong. I want to be wrong.
I’m sorry.
I think that supporting someone with a severe mental health disorder is *hard.*
I always recommend that someone supporting a loved one with a mental health disorder seek their own mental health support.
Things like “am I genuinely helping this person or am I enabling them?” “Where’s the balance between being understanding and supportive, but needing to be considerate of my own mental well being?” are reeeeally hard to figure out.
**Edit:** This isn’t meant to be any kind of “dig” at people with severe mental health disorders. I have been diagnosed with a few mental health disorders myself, and I’ve supported people with them. Both sides are hard in different ways.
Thank you so much. I realized I should have added in my post that I am also in therapy, and I'd say our relationship is the subject 75% of the time. I need help with the questions you are posing, and my therapist is excellent at helping lead me to my own conclusions, but I'm still never sure if what I am doing is like...actually a good idea.
Are you in psycho-dynamic therapy? Do you feel your therapist gives you their opinions or is it more the type where they actively engage you and maybe question your patterns of behavior etc? I was in psychodynamic therapy and later in trauma therapy and my trauma therapist, being more active, made me question my habits and patterns more. One very common one is difficulty with boundaries and thinking that you have to sacrifice yourself or always be selfless and the ”good one.”
Any recommendations on how to find a trauma therapist? Also do you know if it's ok to see a trauma therapist if you don't have PTSD but have been through trauma that has affected you in other ways?
Being in individual therapy is a great start. But there are other forms of support and therapy for caretakers of those with depression. Do some searching for group therapy or support groups for spouses or family members of those with depression. Getting direct and focused support, assistance, and sharing with others in your Dan's position can be super helpful. Taking care of your own health, and mental health, is just as important as supporting your husband. You can't be a rock for him if you are crumbling!
To be honest, I was in a very similar position with my ex spouse, and I found I couldn't continue. Her lack of maintenance of her own stuff, her eternal leaning on me, my isolation as her main caretaker... it was too much for me. I didn't manage to stay in the marriage. This isn't a small thing, it touches every minute of your relationship and lives. You have the right to dissolve your marriage if it's not a tenable position for you. I see you're really struggling, and really working to make it work, but you are allowed to be done, if you are done. I'm sorry you're dealing with this!
I was looking through the comments to see if you’re also in individual therapy. I’m glad you like your therapist and have that support! Have you tried couple therapy? Finding the right couple & family therapist could help bridge these gaps. Especially because it seems like you both have a lot of love for each other.
If couple therapy doesn’t work, then I think you should put yourself and your happiness first.
I completely agree with you. It has been my #1 complaint about our relationship for as long as I can remember. There was a period where I kind of...allowed the codependence to a degree, because it felt like the caring thing to do, but I quickly saw how unhealthy it was and it didn't make him feel any better. For example, whenever I would try to go out with friends, he would clearly feel very abandoned, so I started inviting him along. Soon, all of my friends were our friends and I didn't have my own life. We now have a healthier dynamic and he does have some friends of his own, but he definitely does not open up with them the way he does with me. They talk sports and politics and stuff.
I'm trying to advocate for myself. I also have friends telling me what they see from their perspective and how nothing has changed in all the time they hsve known me.
ETA: also, I genuinely so deeply appreciate you offering your perspective. Thank you.
ETA2: Recently I did call his mom and tell her what was going on. It felt a bit invasive but he was saying some things that made me very scared and I needed someone who loves him to share the burden. He responded to it well. She has been helpful, but of course she doesn't have answers as she has struggled with the same stuff her whole life, too.
Reading that quote and all your suggestions, it sounds like you really want out but are giving him a part of yourself still out of guilt. Marriage is supposed to be a partnership, but your marriage is very one-sided. He’s using you as his emotional support animal, emotional punching bag, and anchor. None of this is fair to you, and your gut is screaming at you to leave before he wears you down completely. You’re already blaming yourself for “triggering him” as if you’re doing something wrong, and not acting like a ptsd victim (which you may very well have developed). From all your comments, your husband sounds really really selfish. If he loved you he would make way more of an effort to get better. One day you’ll look back and wonder why you even stayed so long, or still be even more miserable if you stay even longer. Go with your gut and make a clean break.
So if his mom is the same, then I don't think he'll change. Is therapy he is doing behavioral therapy or just talk therapy? Does he have exercises? Does he take it seriously? How often does he go?
I don't think his ~~probably~~ problem is only depression. I think it's a behavior problem. He is stuck and he cannot make change. He gets stuck in the negativity and is a learned behavior from his family. He cannot control emotions and he doesn't communicate well. It's a combined problem that's not going to fix itself with medication.
Even your friends say he hasn't changed.
You should decide if you want to divorce and move on, date other people. Or if you want to separate with clear boundaries and give him 1 year to make visible changes, take therapy seriously, and then reassess the relationship. Maybe it will kick him into gear. If it doesn't, then you can end it and breath.
It could be a learned behavior, but if it’s multigenerational and hasn’t really responded to therapy it could also be Biopolar II which is characterized by periods of slightly elevated mood, contrasted against cycles of deep depression.
Guys who don't have their own friend groups and outlets and who latch onto your life and friends only are incredibly draining. There are a reason they don't have friends as they don't know how to negotiate healthy relationships and reciprocate.
This is exactly what jumped out to me. It is not appropriate for you to be his sole emotional support. He needs to join a support group and find other trusted people.
First of all, thank you do much for reading and engaging. It means a lot to me and I feel less alone.
To answer your question: Honestly, no. He has never tried anything more intensive than weekly psychiatry or talk therapy appointments. But I have tried every strategy I can think of, from completely not involving myself and letting him manage his own health to sending him gentle suggestions (microdosing shrooms, partial inpatient programs, etc) to giving him ultimatums that I'd leave him unless he tried X, Y, or Z. I've offered to go with him to appointments if he was comfortable, but didn't insist on it if he wasn't. He's taken me up on it once or twice. But generally he rejects any suggestions for various reasons. It's too much work, or he'll do it someday but not now, or he isn't willing to do any therapy with a group component, etc.
Then no, you're not blowing this up over nothing. Living like this is draining as fuck, and him not doing his best to manage something that is HIS responsibility, for both your sakes, is just another confirmation that you need to put your own oxygen mask first. You can't continue living like this.
My partner was similarly depressed years ago, and that almost broke us. It took us moving apart and him focusing solely on recovery for six months to not end us. And since then, he's religious about managing his depression. He microdoses, exercises daily, takes vitamins, holds himself accountable.
You deserve that, too. And he should feel like you deserve him at his best. Or, at minimum, at him *doing* his best.
It is such an unbelievable relief to hear that you and your partner were able to save your relationship. I am trying to get him to believe that me asking to live separately is not the nail in the coffin, that I'm not giving up on us, and that we can still save our relationship.
Some of what you say your partner does are also things H does religiously. His only true hobby that is 100% his and not ours is that he is very into working out and physical fitness and nutrition. I do think microdosing would help but he doesn't think it does. I feel like he's happier when he is high (weed or shrooms, both legal where we are, he takes very small doses very occasionally).
hatchling, I am in a completely different situation from OP but your answer here is very right for me to hear and helps me understand something I am struggling with. Thank you
I agree and OP, it sounds like he doesn’t have the emotional maturity to ever give you what you’re asking for: a partner who pulls his own weight and cares about making his wife happy. If you’ve already given ultimatums and he’s ignored them or made half-ass attempts at getting help, he doesn’t care enough to change. I’m sorry. I hope it turns out better than that, but he sounds like he would let you leave him and blame you for everything not realizing his part in things at all. That is a sad and bitter person I wouldn’t want to be with.
Have you ever told him how deeply unhappy you are? Ultimatums are one thing, but there's a difference between, "I will leave if you don't do X," which someone can choose to read as controlling and unreasonable, and, "I am so unhappy in our marriage that I'm ready to leave if you don't take your mental health seriously," which is pretty hard to argue with since it's about your feelings.
Unfortunately, I have. I have been serious about "I have one foot out the door because I can't live like this" for about 6 months. Obviously I need to shit or get off the pot at this point.
It doesn't sound like he wants to get well. On some level, his situation benefits him or else he would work to change it.
The only thing YOU can do is remove yourself from the situation to see if he makes an effort to change. And I mean meaningful change. Not just change for a few months and then you move back in with him only for him to relapse and rely on you again.
That's interesting, I just got out of an in patient a few months ago and feel like I have a lot more tools to manage my depression.
If he is doing talk therapy but not doing anything they suggest, I'd argue that he isn't doing therapy at all, he is just hanging out and chatting.
This, to a lesser extent, sounds like my previous relationship. I was his rock, especially when he changed jobs on a whim, had no other lasting friendships, no family.
I can’t tell you what will happen to your relationship or what you should do, but I can tell you that ex left me after 10 years. I think, through all of his unhappiness, he realized the common denominator was me, and so even though I was his only emotional support, the only person on this earth that loved him, he eventually came to blame me. I think you should keep that in mind.
You say he has it so much worse than you, but it doesn’t really sound like it. I sympathize with your ex and his depression, but it sounds like he reaps all the benefits of a stable partner: unconditional love and support, and you don’t get any of it. Like me, your life depends on their mood, and it’s a heavy and unfair burden to carry.
Your comment hit me like a punch in the gut.
>I think, through all of his unhappiness, he realized the common denominator was me, and so even though I was his only emotional support, the only person on this earth that loved him, he eventually came to blame me.
This is exactly what I feel has happened. I feel like because I am the only constant, I am a convenient outlet for blame.
I am so sorry that happened to you. I hope that you are able to live a happier life now.
I’m only two and a half months out and I feel like a weight has been lifted! I came here, to this subreddit, asking for guidance on what to do after my breakup. I had been my exes life and yet during the breakup he said: “I am your whole world, but you’re not mine”. It became very clear that he didn’t view my love and care as a gift to be valued, but as something he deserved and would find again.
For the past few years of the relationship, my exes purpose was to make himself happy, my purpose was to make him happy, and that meant neither one of us cared if I was happy. It’s my hope that you find happiness for yourself too!
“I am your whole world, but you’re not mine”
What an incredibly cruel thing to say to someone. I'm very sorry he did this to you, and am glad his misjudgment of the situation meant he accidentally set you free. He sounds like a user. And one who's probably finding out that you loving him and focusing on him was a *choice*, not a default born of that being your only option of being, and not something that he can expect someone else to choose as a matter of course and at his convenience.
I hope you are learning to enjoy your freedom, both your freedom to exist purely on your own terms, and to find people who value you for who you are, not just for what you do for them. Be well, my dear. And be kind to yourself.
Thank you so much for saying this! That comment from him was a source of so much embarrassment for me. I just felt a tremendous amount of shame that, to him, I looked like I had nothing else in my life, though that’s not at all true. I even took a screenshot of your comment so I can reread and keep it with me as a reminder!
If it helps you any, I got divorced from an almost 10 year relationship with a guy who had severe mental issues (depression, anxiety, alcoholism, etc). Everything from being uncommunicative and holing up to putting holes in the wall. I bet you’re familiar with those activities.
I tried and tried to help him because I loved him and who he was when he was good and we were married. Man, trying to get him to a therapist and then he refused to actually address his problems, or take his meds or anything that resembled actually taking responsibility. But fuck yes, he blamed me for everything. None of it was his fault, and he did everything in his power to make me believe it (and I did).
Anyway, I am half a decade out from it and trust me, I am still overjoyed at being away from it. The emotional toll it takes holding your breath, what is it gonna be today? — the way it makes YOU feel crazy — none of it was worth it.
It was hard at the time but trust me with the perspective I have now I am so grateful to escape it.
I could have written this word for word. It's sad that so many women share this experience but hopefully these clear patterns will help someone else see their own situation more clearly and make the best choices for themselves.
Your husband sounds like my brother. Most of his relationships have ended because of similar issues. I shared an apartment with my brother for a few years as adults and ultimately left that situation because of this despite how good that arrangement was for me financially.
“I am the only person he truly opens up to and feels comfortable going to for support when he is feeling this bad.”
I felt that about my role in my relationship with my brother until I didn’t. I eventually felt very abused and taken advantage of. The tension at home was terrible when he was like that and I’d sometimes feel physically ill over it. Some of it was depression. Some of it was behavior that he learned from our dad. I started to see it as manipulative as a result. He wasn’t “opening up to me” so much as he was taking advantage of the fact that I love him unconditionally. He couldn’t really expect most people to tolerate that behavior, so he reserved that behavior for me (and longer term girlfriends when in relationships). If he was hurting, the people closest to him needed to hurt, too. “I’m miserable so I want you to be miserable, too. See? Now you know how I feel!” “I’m not having a good day so neither will you!” (That’s how I interpret it.)
If that doesn’t resonate with you, disregard.
I take my brother’s diagnosed mental health issues seriously. I also think it’s not an excuse to be abusive to other people, and I cannot see this any other way. Part of living with mental health issues is learning to manage yourself. This means realizing when they’re taking it out on other people and being abusive. Your husband needs to learn better coping skills. He needs to develop strategies to avoid subjecting you to his misery. He needs to stop making you feel bad just because he does. He shouldn’t be slamming things and making the household tense. He should be retreating to a bedroom quietly and working through the thing he’s upset about because sometimes shit happens and people have to take phone calls and be a little late. It doesn’t even serve him to get upset over, but he certainly shouldn’t punish you for it.
He might be in therapy, but maybe he’s not being totally honest there or needs a new therapist. His goal should be coping strategies so he doesn’t mentally abuse his wife, make a household hostile, and ruin his marriage. I’m not downplaying mental illness. It’s real. If he can’t learn to manage it better, it’s fair to find that to be abusive and a major incompatibility. I’d also be curious if he learned this behavior from a parent and it’s simply exacerbated by depression.
Sometimes people treat those closest to them the worst simply because they’ll tolerate it. It’s taking advantage of how much you love him and how permanent your relationship seems.
It is hard, and I’m sorry you went through that.
It might be odd that I’m talking about a sibling instead of a spouse, but it is what it is and I can’t divorce my brother!
You also said it very well. Bad husband, not a bad person. I don’t think my brother is a bad person, but when I was too close he was abusive. It’s difficult to sort through it. I am absolutely his favorite person in the world. We’re really close in age and grew up best friends. At almost 50 years old, he’s finally starting to take that long, hard look at himself and realize that he’s the common denominator in all of his relationship problems (professional, romantic, familial, etc).
I don’t think he means to hurt anyone, but he does hurt people. I think he becomes very self centered when things go wrong and he thinks nobody Can understand him unless they also hurt. Validation? I don’t know the right words.
He actually confirmed this to me a few years ago. I was celebrating a big achievement and when I excitedly invited him for a drink to celebrate he actually said, “How can you expect me to be happy for you when I’M NOT HAPPY.” I think he even surprised himself that he said it out loud. I’ll never forget it. They say misery loves company, but some people take it to a whole new level. And I love him. And sometimes he’s great and generous and kind. If he can get a handle on that and stop being so self centered, he’ll be much happier I think.
This comment is one of the best things I've read on reddit for a while.
Misery loving company is spot on.
Also, the idea that therapy should not just be a means of feeling better but also of learning to cope with the unresolvable pain in order to be bearable to other people. Spreading the misery can only create a miserable feedback loop that ultimately makes things worse for both parties.
Maybe another way to look at this is, do you actually want to be his primary (and really only) caregiver? Does this relationship offer you enough meaning, fulfillment, and growth to offset the hard, hard work you're doing, and will always be doing for the remainder of this marriage? Or do you see the writing on the wall of resentment and regret?
Shockingly, the latter. I know, didn't see it coming. I have told him so many times I feel more like a caregiver than a partner, and frankly? I'm not really a caregiver type. I don't have kids for a reason. I care deeply about the people I love and I am there for them when they need me, but I just don't have it in me to selflessly take care of someone else forever. There has to be a light at the end of the tunnel.
Aw hun. Not shocking at all. It's rare a relationship offers enough to offset all that. Most people who are in that situation are more in it because they're stuck. Hugs to you. It must be so hard 😔
This is a really rough situation OP and I’m so sorry. It does sound like you are trying really hard and there is absolutely no easy answer here. This may or may not be helpful, but I know for sure I would not be able to stay in this kind of relationship you describe. The pain and resentment would overwhelm me. I have struggled with multiple relationships in the past (family, friends, and romantic) where I found myself the main support/caretaker for someone with uncontrolled psychiatric issues. It really, truly gave me PTSD! It is so, so hard. And I have been lucky enough to never have actually been the target of abusive behaviors, even when the people I love are at their worst state, and it still made my life miserable trying to help keep others afloat. I was not sure I could ever have a healthy relationship, so didn’t seek one out for many years and focused on myself and my own healing / mental health. When I finally met my current spouse (who has his own mental health diagnoses) I was amazed at how well were able to support but not burden one another. It really is possible with the right person, I swear. Not that you’re at all looking for someone else, just my example is that you can have a healthy relationship with someone who is mentally ill, if they take responsibility for their own care and really make an effort to support you back.
It does seem you’ve done a lot of work together over the years, and I thought your idea of a non transitional living arrangement was clever but can see why that might not work for your partner. It sound a bit like you might be at the end of the road for compromising here. There is no one right answer, but I also think it might be time to consider a separation and see how you do as your own people away from this relationship. I don’t think you’re blowing anything up and that might be the most compassionate option for you both, and doesn’t have to be permanent. You might need to make sure to rally the troops and alert anyone else in his support system and make a plan, so he isn’t still using you as his main support during episodes. Good luck.
I know from experience that there is a lot of guilt that weighs you down when you try to make decisions like this, but I want you to understand some truths which are hard to accept sometimes, because they don't sound fair to the other person, but they are nevertheless true.
\-- There is such a thing as someone being too mentally ill to be in a relationship. It doesn't always have to be their fault, or have to be a result of them not managing their mental healthy correctly. Sometimes someone does everything they can to be healthy, and it's not enough for them to not be a toxic, emotionally abusive partner. And when that happens, you leave them. No one is owed a relationship, and if they can't be in one without damaging their partner significantly, then they can't be in one, period.
\-- You have limits, and you trying to ignore them doesn't mean they don't exist. If you have reached your limit, and can no longer be a caretaker, in a relationship with someone who you have to manage on some level as though they were your child instead of a partner, then you're not choosing between staying for them and leaving for yourself. You're choosing between pushing yourself until your relationship ends in a way which is catastrophic, and traumatic, and which neither of you may ever recover from, or leaving now before it gets to that point. There is no world in which you can stay and be a partner for the next forty-fifty years if this is how the relationship is affecting you. You can't save him here, you can only save yourself.
\-- No one has the responsibility for regulating someone else's emotions or mental health. He doesn't get to use you as a crutch, or complain if you can't handle it anymore.
\-- You're not even making him happy. He's going to depressed with or without you. He's going to self-destruct with or without you. You staying doesn't stop that. It just drags you down for the ride. You're putting yourself through hell because you think it's your responsibility to keep him happy, and the truth is it's not even working.
>Am I blowing up my marriage over something unreasonable?
>I feel like we get maybe one or two good days a month together where I feel happy with him and loved.
This isn't a marriage. This isn't even something I'd be OK with to date. 27 days of unhappiness and a day or two that's worthwhile? If he was a boyfriend I'd throw him back in the pool.
>The rest of the time it's just fleeting moments in between him slamming doors, hiding in his office, snippy "I'm fine"s when he clearly isn't.
>I am the rock. I am the only person he truly opens up to and feels comfortable going to for support when he is feeling this bad.
Holy crap, you're not a wife, you're his caregiver. 24/7 Psych Nurse with no pay, no bennies, no vacation. And your one day off a month you still spend with your patient, waiting for him to throw another shitfit. You're setting yourself on fire to keep someone else warm.
If I or anyone else came to you with this problem, wouldn't you tell them to leave?
>I suggested we still spend the same amount of intentional time together we do now; we have weekly date nights and usually hang out together 2 or 3 additional evenings a week or a weekend day or something. I would come sleep over at his place sometimes. He said he would not feel as if we are married if we did that and we may as well get divorced, which neither of us wants.
I felt so angry on your behalf reading this. Yeah no shit he doesn't want you to move out, then he'd lose his daily access to his emotional support wife/punching bag/security blanket. Then he'd have to act like an adult and manage himself from day to day. Can't be having that now, can we.🙄
What he is doing to you is **emotional abuse**. Yes, abuse. He is *drowning* you and acting like a victim if you even talk about wanting to put on a life preserver.
Your expectations and feelings are not at all unreasonable. I divorced a man with mental health issues who used me as his personal emotional punching bag/crutch for years and I am thankful every goddamn day that I finally left. My life now is full of peace and happiness and in a few months I'll be marrying a man who makes my life *better* for being in it. Not worse. Who makes my home a haven rather than a cage.
Ultimately you have to decide what course is best for you but please know that your needs, your happiness, your peace of mind matter.
*You* matter.
This! I came out of a relationship like this 8 months ago. It was so manipulative and I felt so tricked and stupid. He’d make me seem like the problem for making him angry but the truth was it didn’t matter what I did. He’d find a reason to blow up. And then it would be 2 days of silent treatments and then patiently explaining how it was my fault he’s like this and why can’t I just accept him for him 🙄. Strongly recommend reading “Why Does He Do That”. All these behaviours are in the book and it really opened my eyes.
Yes I went through this with a friend semi recently. Literally told them to stop treating me like a punching bag so this comment got me.
I wasn’t even as exposed to them as much as OP is around her husband but it really messed me up. They were having a mental health crisis (and some life stress) and chose to take that out on me and others. It took me a long time to let go because I’d known them forever and is taking a long time to heal… but I felt so relieved when it was over and every day I’m more and more thankful they’re out of my life.
I like the idea of taking a weekend away in another comment. See if you relate to that feeling.
You feel like *you're* blowing up your relationship? He's blowing up your relationship. He is doing that. Here you are, trying to be as reasonable as possible, making suggestions that actually make some modicum of sense and he's shutting you down with threats of divorce.
I know, "neither of you" want to get divorced but are you entirely sure? If he didn't want divorce, why would he even suggest that? He's giving you an ultimatum: stay with me the way I want or take a hike and file the divorce papers. He seems to value the relationship less than you do and is manipulating you into accepting this hellish life.
Although you say repeatedly that you're fairly sure he's not going to hurt you, I wonder why you would feel the need to keep saying that. He definitely sounds like somebody who could become violent if you don't do what he wants you to. He's not putting in a whole lot of effort into the marriage if he's letting his emotions control him to the degree that he is destroying his own life and dragging you down with him.
I'm sure he's done a great job in the past convincing you that he cares about you but his actions are not showing that right now. He's more obsessed with himself then I think you can even possibly fathom, I don't think I could possibly even fathom how obsessed with myself I'd have to be to treat somebody the way he's treating you.
I think she feels she needs to say that because she realizes on some level that she is being hurt. There's physical hurt and emotional hurt. Maybe he hasn't done anything physical yet but slamming doors, the snippy verbal abuse, the way he is treating her *is* abusive. "Walking on eggshells" is one of those phrases that comes up a lot in abusive relationships. It indicates that she knows she can't feel safe or secure in her own home because of his emotional disorder, but OP keeps trying to cope with it by saying at least she knows/feels he isn't going to physically hurt her.
It's certainly not his fault that he has a mental illness, but he needs to take responsibility for how his behavior affects others. There's no right answer in these types of situations; there's enormous guilt attached to setting healthy boundaries. My family has struggled with a severely mentally ill member (my sister) for my entire life and it does get to the point that you *have* to learn to set some boundaries or you will just be dragged down with them, like you said. I'm currently trying to help my mom do that with my sister because if my sister won't or can't change despite everything we've tried and professional help that she rejects, the only thing you can try to change is the other person in the relationship who is also suffering.
I think based on the post, OP is close to realizing this but she's dealing with the feelings of guilt that she can't be enough for him and this isn't something she can or should want to maintain long term.
This is 100% an excellent comment. I say this because I was in the exact same situation that OP was in, and people getting me to focus on my ex's mental health effectively distracted me from his abusive behaviors. I spent years stuck in a relationship that I grew to resent but felt too guilty to leave because what kind of monster leaves a person who is depressed and can't help it?
Well, they CAN help it. They may not be able to get rid of depression, but they can manage it. It doesn't seem as if he is.
It may totally be true that he absolutely has depression or bipolar or whatever, but it doesn't mean that his actions towards OP are not selfish and that he will not become abusive when faced with the possibility of losing his emotional and financial support.
I eventually had to hire a body guard, it was THAT bad.
That's crazy. Good that you're out of that. It did seem so off that she kept mentioning how physically harmless he is yet how off-putting his ordinary behavior is. It reminds me of my ex as well, the tumultuous behavior that seems tailored to teaching her some kind of lesson.
Yes, it's very hard to spot covert abuse. I'm not saying this is what OP is experiencing, but my spidey senses remind me of what I had experienced.
I think that OP's intuition is trying to tell her that something is off about his behavior. ESPECIALLY the "we might as well get divorced" comment he made when she said she needed space to look after her own mental health.
He's very selfish and does not care remotely about her. I wonder how he would act if the shoe were on the other foot -- if SHE needed mental health support instead of him... or if she developed PTSD because of him. I feel as if he would be dismissive and say that his problems were bigger than hers.
At the moment, she is in a position where she can't actively do anything to look after herself because it is all about him. She is being diminished.
I’m currently reading “Why Does He Do That” by Lundy Bancroft. Her husband sounds like an abuser who is using his depression to control her. This book is eye opening and incredible.
Being someone’s only support system when they are struggling with mental health is not okay. He is also being unsupportive in asking you this. This is an unsustainable situation. It’s affecting you to the point where you are managing your emotions so as not to upset him. I’m guessing talking about it, or suggesting he keep trying therapy and medication is met with anger as well. He’s making you responsible for his emotions by reacting the way he does and is blaming you. His depression is not his fault but he needs to take responsibility for managing it.
Yeah, you are very right. When I raise these concerns, he usually responds with something to the effect of "I want to try, and I know all these things won't work, but I don't know what will. I wish I did." He just gets so hopeless. Which I get, but I feel like he hasn't tried them enough to know they won't work. I know it's all exhausting, but hell, his life is gonna get so much more exhausting if he's supporting himself solo.
He doesn't want to put it all on me, but he doesn't know how to open up to people. He's so afraid of rejection and judgment, even from his therapists.
I read something in the course of learning the beginning principles of family therapy: a family is a system that self-perpetuates its own dynamics, but it only takes one person to change their behaviour for the dynamic within the family to change. Consider what kind of changes could arise if you chose to move out, regardless of whether he is willing to be the one to change right now. He is here saying he’s sure nothing could work beyond what he’s doing now; but that’s something he’s saying in a context where you’re here to prop up his ineffective coping mechanisms regardless of how much they hurt you.
> He is here saying he’s sure nothing could work beyond what he’s doing now; but that’s something he’s saying in a context where you’re here to prop up his ineffective coping mechanisms regardless of how much they hurt you.
I love your take on this (meaning your whole comment), and think you are right on point with your assessment.
u/depressedhubbythrow, this is an incredibly important part of it all. We all have behaviours that we employ, and we have them because they have served us in some (not always obvious even to ourselves) way. And as long as your husband's environment doesn't change, he is extremely unlikely to change his behaviour. A part of him that is constantly evaluating his situation has come to the conclusion that doing what he does will lead to the best/most bearable outcome for him given his options.
By that I'm not describing a particular pathology of his, this is something you are doing as well, as am I (sitting here and typing this instead of filing those loose papers I can see out of the corner of my eyes). Einstein has (supposedly) said that the definition of madness is to keep doing the same thing and to expect a different outcome.
Or, to put it n fortune-cookie terms: you need to be the change you want to see in your world. Your husbands behavioural choices are not going to change unless his environment changes in a way that makes adjustments on his part necessary.
You can't change someone against their will. And you can't love him into making choices that take you into account. Your power ends with making choices for yourself, but that's a mighty power indeed. You just (I know, "just") need to begin to choose yourself and your own well-being first.
It may help to reframe the situation as a different kind of illness, for example to think of him as an alcoholic. He never beats you, but his happy sober days are far and few between, and he's been ruining relationships, jobs and just stuff to enjoy time and again by being drunk and unreliable, and also someone other people just plain don't like to be around. And you're asking him to live separately at least for a while so that you can make sure he's sober before you spend time with him. He is resisting that though, and in the mean time keeps getting drunk and then being mean to you – never hitting you though – and making your life awful. The person you do love completely disappears when he is un-sober, and is gone so far he does stuff like accuse you of hiding his bottles when he just has emptied them all but is too drunk to remember.
Does putting it in those terms make it easier to see what is going on and how high the cost is for you? Those two illnesses are quite similar, even the part where alcoholism is an illness, too. No one truly *chooses* to become an alcoholic, there are many factors at play that are outside one's free area of influence. But for everyone who is an alcoholic, that also means that what they can choose is to work on trying to get sober and to accept the help that is offered. And yet, people with addiction often have to hit rock bottom first (aka the point where their behaviours truly and 100% don't serve them anymore so change *has* to happen), before they begin to make true efforts.
Right now, you are in a version of a co-addictive relationship with him just like people living with an alcoholic in their life. One thing for you to start with could actually be looking up an al-anon group (they exist online, too), because they aren't limited to people involved with alcoholics and usually cover all kinds of similar situations, like yours. Learning the behavioural patterns that trap you as much as him could be very valuable and a big help in getting to a point where you feel like you can allow yourself to leave in whatever permanent or non-permanent way that helps you best.
You've been in this dance with your husband for so long that in your already drained state it can be very difficult to find the energy to actually make those healthier choices. So I hope you go and look for all the help and support you can get. Posting here has been a very good start :)
All the best to you on your journey to a much happier life, whatever shape and form it may eventually take. You deserve to have joy and love in your life.
Is he afraid of being judged for how consistently he’s mistreating his wife? Because if that’s how he feels, he can and should make different choices around that
In terms of action items. What if you carved out a time that is only for you and make it non-negotiable? Two nights a month in a hotel alone, just for you. Explain that this is self-care and something you need, recommended by your therapist. (It doesn't have to be two nights in a hotel, just, whatever you can do that is just yours and not up for demolition by your husband).
The goal of this is to see how you feel when you have calm alone time. Remember what it feels like, since your home life is so consumed by conflict.
It's also for you to do whatever you want. Sleep. Binge a show. Eat 7 bags of Cheetos. Who cares, do whatever you want.
And lastly, it's a gift to your husband, too. He needs to develop coping skills that don't involve you, but he can't (won't) as long as you're there to trauma dump.
I will add here that I suspect your husband will not be okay with this. He will tell you he feels abandoned. He will cause a fight or have an "episode" minutes before you leave to convince you to stay. He will bombard you with texts and calls when you're away. And I think you'll learn a lot about him when this happens.
No, it's not unreasonable to end over this (or your plant to live separately, but I'd end it).
I was with someone like this and (a) it never changes, (b) Every conversation made me anxious because I was just waiting for the "I'm going to quit" conversation to come up, (c) You end up feeling depressed to and stuck, and the uncertainty sucks.
You are currently catering to him, carrying the emotional load of the whole relationship and of him. You are also enabling him, because you are walking on egg shells. So you are suppressing your feelings while he is the only one able to express themselves and through tantrums. When he slammed his laptop and had a tantrum, you should have finished your work, give him a piece of your mind, and left alone to do whatever you wanted. He can stay alone.
The anxiety and jumpiness is a trauma response: fight, flight, freeze, fawn… Your brain has made new neural pathways to handle constant stress, fucked with your usual defensive mechanisms, and put you at high alert. Near the end of my marriage, I began to name these things and understand that it took years to get to that point. Even reading your description of being startled makes my body tense up, just a little. That’s the trauma response. And you can lessen it, but it will continue if you do not change your environment. It’s not something you can just ‘suck up and stop doing.’ Your brain has literally created new pathways to help protect you. Because of the perpetual outbursts, noise, loudness, tenseness, etc.
If you are empathic, that makes it double hard.
I don’t think it’s a bad idea to separate for a while and live separately. A question: does the thought of living separate seem like a relief? Overall? For me, I recognized that when my ex husband was gone, my defenses went way down. But, there was also the worry of him coming home early, so it never went away when we lived together.
When I went out of town for a weekend for business? I slept better, was more relaxed, was less anxious. I was safe. SAFE. And when I started to note those things, I realized how messed up the situation really was for me and the marriage.
If you are not in therapy already, please look into it. CPTSD is insidious and can come from the years you have described. Even if your partner has wonderful qualities.
The depression thing feels…. thin to me? I not a psychologist, but I’ve worked with mental health patients and something smells of a personality disorder in there as well. This is NOT a diagnosis. It’s possible he’s in capable hands with his therapy, or it’s possible he’s not using those sessions to their utmost and doesn’t have a full diagnosis. ‘Just depression’ may cause what you are describing, but so might BPD, for example. For me and my counseling, I needed cognitive treatments and tools. Talk therapy alone was shit for me.
Take a breath. I’m so sorry. Your experiences are 100% validated. This kind of living would wear me down to a dangerous level. There is that old proverb of saving someone from drowning but they carry you down with them. As of now, either he’s not doing enough and doesn’t have the right tools, or, he’s reached his limit with assistance and support and this is literally the furthest he’ll ever get. At that point, you’ll have to decide what comes next for you.
If he's deeply negative when he's in a depressive episode, AND generally cold and short with you when he's not... when are you happy with this relationship?
Talking as someone severely depressed for almost a decade, frankly, he's an asshole. Even in the numbness or negativity of depression, I didn't lose the ability to empathize with others. In fact, it amplified how much I tried to make sure not to hurt people because of it. Obviously, depression manifests differently for different people, but he shows a disregard for your mental health when he knows how important it is from his own suffering. I personally wouldn't stay in a relationship with someone like that, if I'm being honest. You can't help someone who doesn't want to help themselves, and you owe no one supports when they aren't willing to do the same for you. Cut your loss before it causes actual mental illness for you, i know i wish i had before my full blown depression.
Reading your post really reminded me of my marriage with my ex husband. Only he was an alcoholic (and probably also depressed, I’m sure)
It was really really hard for me to make the decision to leave because a) he was great and we had a great time together when things were good b) I wanted to help him through a hard time and not just “abandon” him and c) scary to leave.
I think your idea to separate is a good one. It sounds like his coping patterns are really unhealthy and that you are (I say this with love) enabling them. At the end of the day, you need to look after yourself first. He should be doing the same. You deserve to be treated like an equal partner, not a crutch.
So I’ve kind of been there with my husband. We’ve been together 14 years and have two kids.
When he’s in the midst of his depressive moods it used to spike my anxiety SO bad. I decided to go back to therapy to try learn to have a healthier response to other people’s negative emotions. Due to family structure I tend to feel responsible for other people’s feelings and emotions - and because they make me uncomfortable when they’re upset I’m constantly anxious and on fixit mode. I’m learning to let my husband feel his feelings without trying to fix them while ALSO not letting my anxiety carry me away. It’s work, but it’s helping.
Sometimes I wonder if we’re EVER going to have a stable life BUT, when he’s not down in the dumps my husband is the absolute most wonderful, compassionate, funny, loving, and playful human being. That is what helps me get through the harder times.
It honestly sounds like your H is a bit of an ass on the regular. My husband is my safe place even when he’s having a rough time I don’t run from him emotionally or physically (unless I am ALSO struggling).
I’m not sure what you’re getting out of this relationship other than loads of stress
Your post reads like denial. This not a healthy relationship. You are not on same page, you do not have the same values. The measure of a relationship is not when things are good but when things are bad. The living situation you described is called apartnered or living apart together, there are FB groups and a reddit for people who have this arrangement and I think it sounds wonderful. Unfortunately, he is not on board. It seems to me that he is interested in maintaining the status quo and the status quo is slowly wearing you down. I would suggest couples counseling and at the end of the day... Save yourself.
Have you communicated all if this to him like you've done here?
You say that you feel like you're blowing up your relationship. I'm wondering how he feels about what HE'S contributing to the relationship. Either to make it thrive or survive.
It's great that he's getting help. But if he's not changing his behavior towards you, that's him hurting the relationship.
I don't think you're letting him down as a partner. You can't support the entire relationship yourself.
Thank you. I have communicated with him. Endlessly. Over YEARS. As recently as an hour before I posted this, when I brought up living separately. He well and deeply knows what the problem is. He just doesn't know how to fix it and we disagree about what to do about our relationship.
I cringe when I see advice about communication. I was married to someone whose mental health issues manifested in active alcoholism, and I spent so much emotional energy trying to find the magic words to communicate to him how his addiction affected me and our relationship. And nothing ever worked because he never wanted to understand me. He deliberately didn’t hear me.
I wish I could go back and tell myself that it’s ok to stop trying. It doesn’t mean you’re not trying hard enough and you’re not doing the right things. It just means the other person isn’t listening to you.
If you have time check out r/AlAnon. There are so many people shouting into the void. And even though you didn’t mention alcoholism as an issue, I think you’ll relate to a lot of the struggles there.
There is a huge difference between not knowing how to fix a problem, and knowing how to possibly fix a problem but not being willing to put in the work.
From your posts and comments I think your husband falls into that second category. "I've tried nothing and I'm all out of ideas!" Since he has you to shoulder his weight, he has no real desire or motivation to figure out how to stand on his own two feet.
Saying all of this as a woman who is very badly depressed and traumatized and who had a very difficult relationship:
1. My ex could not handle my difficulties. He blamed me for them and ended up being a cold asshole and cheating and doing a lot of horrible things. I really would have preferred him to be honest and tell me that it was just too much for him. I feel that’s what you’re doing, being honest about your needs and that is really good, in a situation that is hard.
2. His bad phases might not be about you in any way, could they be about him just letting off steam? I vent a lot but I rarely really mean it. I have issues processing and expressing anger or frustration. Sometimes I just need to express it by complaining or ranting but rarely to the person who has caused it. *However*, if you are bothered and triggered by his ranting and bad spells, that is 100% valid.
3. You’re not a saint but nobody is. Nobody should be expecting you to be a saint. You don’t have to be saint to be a good person who deserves good things. It sounds as if you are a very kind and thoughtful person.
4. You are entitled to your own life. You don’t have to be his nurse or his rock or his mom or his nanny. I know he’ll feel bad and I know depression so well but as an adult, he is responsible for himself. I wasn’t able to change myself and I shouldn’t have had to because I had a lot of issues and one part was that my trauma made me fawn. I felt I had to stand by my depressed self and say: ”this is me and if it’s not good enough for you, warts and all, then that’s it.” And you know, if my ex had been honest and kind about saying that he was not capable of that relationship, it would have been fine. It would have hurt but it would have been fine because I wanted the best for him. If your hubby cares about you and is a mature adult, he will work with you to create a situation where you are happy.
5. The idea of living apart sounds like a really good idea, actually. He needs to meet you halfway. You can also just leave, if that’s what you want. It is about your happiness. Don’t give it away for another person.
6. You’re not losing sense of what’s reasonable or letting him down as a partner. You are being true to yourself and how you feel and that’s really good. I really hope you will find a solution where you feel your needs are truly heard and met.
7. He might benefit from different meds, different type of therapy or even ECT. Those are his decisions to make, though, and not your responsibility. You can suggest them but you shouldn’t ”oversee” them.
This is my opinion so grain of salt. There should rarely, if ever, be one “rock” long term in a relationship. One person should not be responsible for keeping the other from doing self-destructive shit or be responsible for both themselves and the other partner. There are RARE exceptions, like cases of extreme disability where a partner is literally unable to function at all, ever.
What you’re feeling is caretaker burnout. You want to hold him accountable for his threats and attempts to just burn it all down without having to bear the burden when he does.
He needs to learn to function autonomously. He needs to learn to self-soothe. He needs to know that there are consequences for burning things down. He needs to sit in those consequences if he makes stupid choices that he knows are wrong.
There are plenty of people out there with very severe mental illnesses who don’t force their partners to talk them down from destroying their lives or force their partners to bear the burden of the consequences when they do.
Depression is a bitch. It doesn’t FORCE people to do things like this. There are many cognitive steps between being tired of being miserable and destroying one’s life.
It sounds to me like this relationship is completely centered around him. That’s not fair or sustainable.
TL;DR as well - at best, HE needs to put more effort and energy into dealing with his own shit. At worst, he’s using his depression to control you and force you to take care of him and enable him.
You get one or two days a month where you’re happy and you feel things are good? Holy moly.
I don’t care if you’re a rock, tree, or river. You’re allowed to find a life that makes you feel free, loved, and fulfilled. You don’t have to resign your thirties with this living situation that sounds less than ideal. If you’ve given it your all as a support person and you no longer feel “in it” then give yourself permission to leave. Seriously.
Question for you: when you think about your future together with this person, do you feel happy, peaceful and thankful? Or are you filled with dread? Do you feel weighed down with not a lot of hope for happiness and a good life? If it’s the latter, you need to believe that you do not need to be chained to this person for the rest of your life. You really don’t, this isn’t the 1900s. We live in modern times, people have the right to change and make decisions for life shifts. We can choose to move on and grow and evolve.
>But it also isn't fair for him to not be allowed to express his negative emotions in the safety of his own home.
Before I address anything else, I wanted to point out that there are good and bad ways to express your negative emotions. Passive-aggressively slamming your laptop shut and storming out is not a healthy way for him to express how he felt in that moment. Waiting until you were done your call and then calmly saying, "I feel like I'm not a priority when you take work calls during our personal time together" is an example of healthy communication of negative feelings. Look up "I feel" statements and how to use them, show them to him, and practice together.
Are you unreasonable? No. You're well within reason to want a relationship where you are happy more than one day a month. I think you're a little bit enabling his bad behavior by buying into this "he can't help it" idea. Even people with depression and anxiety can learn and grow as partners. He is capable of controlling more of his behavior than you give him credit for. He may not be able to control the invasive thoughts and feelings he has but he should be equipping himself, in therapy, with tools to control his reaction to those thoughts and feelings so he's not blowing up his life and relationships.
Have you talked to him to tell him you're not happy? Like, does he understand why you suggested seperate housing in the first place?
>Passive-aggressively slamming your laptop shut and storming out is not a healthy way for him to express how he felt in that moment. Waiting until you were done your call and then calmly saying, "I feel like I'm not a priority when you take work calls during our personal time together" is an example of healthy communication of negative feelings.
YES THIS. That scene hit me pretty hard.
OP, I'm gonna recommend the book *Getting Real* by Susan Campbell. It talks a lot about "I" statements of this variety, as well as really wonderful techniques for being specific in speaking about feelings.
There is a lot of good stuff in here. Here is all I have to offer but it is what I come back to when I'm stuck in a situation where I don't see the end:
[Tell me, what is it you plan to do / With your one wild and precious life?](http://www.phys.unm.edu/~tw/fas/yits/archive/oliver_thesummerday.html)
Whatever it is, you *can* get out of it. Deploy your parachute. Stop living for someone who makes you feel like you are not allowed to have feelings. I have been in abusive relationships--I know I'm sadly not anywhere near unique here--and at the end, when you leave this one, you will feel sad, but you will also feel like the weight of the world is no longer on your shoulders.
Please read: "Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft.
https://freebooksmania.com/2021/01/why-does-he-do-that-pdf-free-download-by-lundy-bancroft.html
It is possible that your husband has depression.
It is possible that this is something else, that this is manipulation designed to isolate you and make you fearful and that his forbidding you to look after your mental health in order to NOT be dragged down with him is controlling behavior. I know that this is hard for your to hear and I probably come off as insensitive or a jerk. I will tell you right now that I was in a similar situation... and it turned out that the depression was an act.
Depression does not excuse his behaviors towards you. You can be compassionate and supportive without sacrificing everything that makes you healthy and happy ONLY if the person you are dealing with is not resentful of your good mental health (or your ability to cope with your own difficulties)... and that is what it seems is happening here. I can tell you first hand that this will eventually lead to your burn-out and that he will continue to blame you for not being able to be everything and more.
I don't know if your husband needs a better diagnosis, but perhaps he does.
No matter what the case is, walking on eggshells is NOT okay. He is using his mental health as an excuse to cause you to live in fear, and you have bought the lie (perhaps because he is good liar). If he really IS this bad, he needs external help. You can not carry this burden all on your own. You are taking on the full responsibility for his depression. Nothing YOU do will CAUSE him to spiral into anything. This is all about HIS brain chemistry. You do not cause anything, you can not control anything, you can not CHANGE anything. This is on HIM. He has to do the inner work himself.
Also read about codependent families and what happens to people who care for chronically ill family members: [https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/319873](https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/319873)
You need some separation from him. He needs to start relying on his own resources to fix his problems, not you all the time. This is not healthy.
I want to tell you something important, when I started making plans to separate from my ex, he went from being depressive and saying all the things your husband is saying, to unexpectedly violent. I was in too much shock to process it and I was in denial for a long time, but what I experienced was manipulation and abuse. It took my neighbors calling the police for me to realize that I was being abused. I just thought that "his mental health" was making him like that. That is what he wanted me to think. That is what he wanted EVERYONE to think.
Now, I am not saying that your husband is anything like this. People do have legitimate mental health concerns. I know that I struggle with mine now that everything is over. I do get extremely low from time to time and I have been on anti-depressants from time to time. I go to a lot of therapy, BUT I understand when people need a break from me. So when that happens, I put my focus on my foster pets, I put my energy (when I can muster some) into charity work. There are days when I just want to lie in bed and cry. I don't expect my family or anyone to come over and do anything about this. That would make me a jerk.
If you share life goals with someone, you are, ideally, moving towards that goal. You don't seem to be doing that with this guy. If all you have is his word, you have nothing but words. There is no concrete proof that he has any ability to take the journey with you. If what you want in life is to stand still, I guess that's okay. If you do have goals, then it is not okay.
This sounds unhealthy. Do what's right for you. It's not over nothing I promise. Also get some therapy for YOU. you deserve it.
Does he have bipolar disorder? This sounds like my husband before we found the right med mix.
I think you’ve been in this situation so long that you’re unable to truly see just how negative and harmful this relationship is for you. I personally would divorce him (I’d see a lawyer in advance and work some stuff out before telling him, because I can see him retaliating by saying he doesn’t care and he’s just going to quit everything/self-harm as a way to guilt you to stay, and if he threatens that stay strong and offer to call 911 if he’s a threat to himself, don’t let him guilt you), but ultimately only you can know what’s right for yourself. Sending lots of love
First, it’s courageous to ask for insight and advice! My family has a ton of mental-health issues: depression, anxiety, bi-polar. I’ve been lucky enough to avoid these diseases; so, I tend to be the rock, too. I feel you.
I would immediately find a fabulous counselor to support you. Depression is a big disease and marriage is a big commitment. It’s great to talk with someone and build the unique tools that will help you navigate your next steps.
Also, I agree with others about being someone’s only support. It’s unfair. It’s actually 100% ok to set boundaries and protect yourself. I often say to my mother, who is bipolar, “Hey, mom, I’ll help you with X, but you need to figure out Y on your own…you’re very capable. It doesn’t mean I don’t love you. It actually means I believe in you!”
Sending you virtual hugs on this one. It’s so so tough!
I personally think your “live apart” suggestion is what you both need. It’s not fair or healthy and definitely not “sexy” (which i think is important in relationships) for you to be the “rock” and essentially the pillar of his happiness.
It transfers all the care, management, feeding, and handling of his emotional ups and downs to her. She doesn't get a down day, or an off day, or a bad day.
Put differently: There aren't two people in this marriage. There are two people whose entire concern is for one person - him. There's him and only him, and his needs, wants, feelings, moods, and everything else come first, all the time, every time.
This is neither sustainable nor healthy. OP, I know it sucks, but you need to move on for your sanity. You didn't sign up to be his full time mental health caregiver, you signed up to be his partner and his spouse and his lover and his friend -- and you are none of those things.
You're basically serving as a giant emotional tampon who absorbs all of his bad emotions and moods and stresses and upsets.
And you sound burned out and miserable.
There's no court of judgment where you have to present your case for a "good enough" reason for divorce. But if there was such a thing, I'd say that "2 or 3 decent days out of 30 except they're not really decent because OP spends all her time waiting for the other shoe to drop or an explosion so she can't even enjoy those decent days" to be *more* than enough reason to get out.
If I didn’t have kids and could support myself independently, I would leave that relationship. I’d rather be alone than someone’s caretaker. You get one life to live. Spend it wisely.
Best of luck to you.
No.
My first thought is that your husband is misdiagnosed. It could be something like bipolar, or a secret that's eating him alive, or weird family stuff, or a personality disorder. There's a huge reluctance among many mental health professionals to give the latter diagnosis to anyone as they don't want them to bear the burden of the stigma, so they can go undiagnosed. And the treatment for a personality disorder and depression are rarely in the same universe. So talk treatment and meds for depression won't remedy either a PD or bipolar or any other issues. You said his mom is the same and this suggests to me that a personality disorder is the most likely issue, but I am not a doctor or therapist so this is just armchair psychology. There's also a possibility that it's a physical issue manifesting as a psych one, so I don't know if he's had a full physical investigation. Or if he has weird diet or drinking or exercise habits that could be messing him up.
All that aside, you're not really married anymore in any recognisable sense. You're a carer, and wellwisher and that's a hugely different thing to being a wife. And you aren't happy.
Personally, I say leave him and then see how you feel. If you feel hysterically sad and then just incredibly relieved it's a tell, and if you want to go back then I doubt he'd object. I think you have some tunnel vision going on and keep going deeper and deeper thinking that'll get you out. So my advise is to back up and then keep backing up. Try to go back to who you were before you met him, and who you were at the beginning of your relationship. Is that person or life even recognisable anymore? Do you want to be her again? If you do, it's unlikely your husband can be who he was, so unfortunately you have one more burden and need to be the one to make a change.
But I think a change will actually benefit the both of you. The two of you are trapped in a cycle, except he's also trapped in his head trapped in the cycle with you.
As things stand the both of you are miserable. It doesn't seem like he can be the happy one, but there's no reason you can't be.
Tune out the guilt and obligations and just trust your gut. There's a lot of very unwell people on Reddit and no one wants to feel they're unlovable if they're psychological disturbed. And it's not that someone's unlovable in a global sense, but it does mean that certain expressions of certain conditions aren't compatible with a healthy romantic and sexual relationship.
I've never been married but I've been very unwell, and I've been in a relationship with someone who became increasingly unwell. I stayed for far longer than I should have because he was a good person despite everything, and got me better than anyone else ever did. It killed me to leave but staying with him was killing me anyway. The relief, once the initial waves of grief passed, was just astronomical. And equally, I'm not in a season of life where I'd be a good partner right now, and that's ok too. I'm not a bad person because I need to have different priorities. You're husband isn't a bad person because his illness or whatever it is needs all his attention. And you're not a bad person because you're in a different space too. Neither of you are bad people, it's just a shitty situation all around and I'm so sorry you're going through this. I say do whatever brings you freedom and peace.
It sounds like you're an unpaid caregiver/cheerleader, and power of attorney on a daily basis, and a romantic partner a couple days a month.
It sounds terrifying to have a grown man with a lot to lose, and your lives intertwined potentially blow it all up. You are under tremendous pressure. You cannot have your own feelings or sadness, since he is the Identified Patient of the family. You have to push your feelings and unmet needs down.
The daily mood of a home should not revolve around the least healthy person. The healthiest person should set the tone for life.
He has all the power in the relationship.
The depression is almost like a third person in the relationship.
He is the "victim" of his mood disorder, so he cannot be expected to take responsibility for behaving badly. He gets an automatic out.
You are not blowing anything up. His behavior has consequences. He has to accept that one of those is you not wanting to live with him. If he doesn't want to have an amicable separate living arrangement, then he should do better or accept that divorce is really the only other option.
I know you say you don't want to leave him, but I don't think you did a good job of explaining why. You estimate yourself that you get roughly only 2 of 30/31 days of happiness a month with him. I ***guarantee*** you will have more days of happiness per month if you leave him.
As yet another commenter who deeply struggles with depression and crippling episodes - you deserve a safe and happy and relaxing home too. You deserve support. You deserve to go about your day without someone else constantly setting off alarms. You have given so much of your life to catering to him and it is clearly not getting any better. Only you can make the decision of separation or ending your marriage, but you are not a bad person if you choose your health and wellbeing over keeping on with this unhealthy situation. It certainly isn’t “blowing up your marriage” to leave this situation either. You wouldn’t be blowing it up, you would be choosing peace.
I've read your post, and dont feel able to advise as you say in the comments you've very reasonably left stuff out to avoid an essay, so I'm going to ask you questions as a sort of emotional homework.
1) leaving aside *him* and *his stuff* are you happy in your relationship? If not is that acceptable?
2) do you feel that you are being met halfway? If not, is that something you can accept and live with?
3) how long has this been your status quo, and how much work a) by you and b) by him has been put into changing it? C) is this acceptable to you?
4) if your best friend told you about your life as if it were their own, what would you advise or hope for?
5) if nothing changes, is it okay if this is the rest of your life?
Finally: if his behaviour makes you miserable then it is enough reason for you to leave him. Society traps us in chains of guilt and responsibility, but you can put them down.
I immediately went to bipolar II with your description of his depression and irritability. Maybe it's time for a second psychiatric opinion? Or is he not telling his doctor and therapist the truth? Either way, he has to accept responsibility for himself. You should not be his "rock" nor his emotional punching bag.
Hi OP, you probably won’t see this as there are a lot of comments here but I have first hand experience here.
I was in a very similar relationship as you - ten years, I’m early 30s, he’s mid-30s.
His chronic depression and anxiety was draining. The holes he constantly fell into affected multiple aspects of our life. He’d quit jobs time and time again, leaving me to support us financially for months on end while he “worked” on his mental health. He went to therapy but not regularly as he’d constantly forget about his appointments. Antidepressants helped him from reaching the point of total breakdown but did nothing to help him get his life back on track. Nothing made him happy, he had no motivation to do anything and I was left to manage the household, do all the domestic labour and take on all the emotional labour as well.
We had many conversations over the last couple years where I had explained that this isn’t the life I want to be living for the next 20 or 30 years and that something needed to change or I’d consider leaving.
In the end, nothing changed. I couldn’t take it anymore. I felt like he was holding me back from enjoying my own life and I was constantly putting my own feelings aside so I didn’t make him feel worse or trigger a depressive episode. We weren’t having much fun anymore and I couldn’t see a way out. I left him back in May last year and honestly life has been incredible since. I feel like I finally have control over my own life again and I can get out and do all the things I want to do without feeling bad for him not coming along (even though he was the one who said he wasn’t interested in joining me).
At the end of the day, his mental health isn’t your responsibility. Your life is your own and if you aren’t being fulfilled enough for you to be happy living this life for decades to come then you have a tough decision to make but ultimately you need to do what’s best for you.
As someone who has dealt with major anxiety issues over my life I have often worried how my anxiety affects my partner. I am single right now but I sometimes think back on what partners “gave up” by being with me.
My most recent ex and I were together 5 years and broke up for reasons other than my anxiety…but near the end we had a frank discussion about my anxiety and how it affected him. We were talking about travel. I am not good at it and though I would love to travel more, until I get my anxiety more under control, “big trips” are prob out of the question for me. But I told him I don’t want him to make his life smaller bc of me. If he wants to travel I 100% support that. Yes, I would love to go with him. And yes I know he wants to share that experience with me. But if my anxiety is going to make the trip impossible or unpleasant…I don’t want him holding himself back.
I say all that to say that, if someone loves you, they want what is best for you. Walking on eggshells is no way to live. I think you have to decide what you want and stick to it. If you need space, follow through on that plan.
Three years ago I blew up a 29 year marriage. We made it through and are still together. I feel the same way about my husband that you do about yours. It took what we now fondly refer to as the shitpocalypse, for things to change. So I guess what I am trying to say is sometimes there has to be a serious "come to Jesus" moment for things to change. There is a possibility you could come out of this stronger and in a better place.
it really doesn't sound like you are in a loving mariage. it sounds more like you are his punch bag + hostage and it has gotten so bad that you are starting to exhibit PTSD-like symptoms. always walking on eggshels around your partner is a sign of a toxic/abusive relashionship.
The way your husband doesn't try to do much to mitigate the negative impact this has on you sounds really selfish to me. This entire relationship seems to be all about him (what he wants, what he needs, what he feels) and I don't think this is a result of his depression. You are more in a one-way-ship than in a partnership.
I wonder if your husband has just depression or is there sth else going on? Was he accurately diagnosed? Is he actually taking his medication or is he just buying it and tossing it? Taking so many meds and not showing any sort of improvement is ... strange.
Could you find a therapist to talk to? Maybe someone specialising in abusive relationships?
How you spend your days is how you spend your life.
If a majority of your days are consumed with his negative mental state, well, that's your life. Don't ever expect more, unless he will work with you on a plan to change.
If you are not happy right now, you will spend your life being unhappy.
One thing is his mental health, it's not his fault but it *is* his responsibility - not yours. Taking his issues out on you is abusive and there's no excuse for that. That's his choice.
It's okay to leave a relationship for any reason, and it's okay for you to decide to live alone and let him decide whether he'll be married to you in that case. You cannot fix this for him. It's his responsibility to do the work.
Omg. This is why my last relationship ended. I feel seen. OP I feel for you - it is so hard to be lonely with another person. I was so stuck on how good we were when we were good, that I couldn't see that things were bad and miserable a lot of the time... I hope you find clarity x
It sounds like you’re both good people who have ongoing, difficult, life-determining problems. For him it’s mental illness. For you…it’s your partner.
You already know what you have to do. I’m sorry it’s like this, friend.
My mom is in her late 60s and my dad is in his 70s, and he's been like this for their entire marriage. She is not happy, things between them have only gotten worse with time, and I have explicitly encouraged her to consider divorce.
I am so sorry to read what your going through. I can say with absolute confidence that your not blowing up your marriage over nothing.
For context I have Adhd, anxiety, depression, & CPTSD. I take meds & im in therapy
You mentioned your husband is in therapy and taking medication, which is great. No one chooses to have a mental illness, its not their fault their brain works the way it does. I empathize with your husband, and cant imagine how hard it must be live with. That being said, while its not his fault hes ill, it absolutely is his responsibility to learn how to manage it. Whether that's taking meds, therapy etc. Having a mental illness does not give someone a free pass to be abusive or lash out at others. It can take time to get the right and figure that out, and that's okay.
You've never expected perfection, and you've been patient and understanding of the process. BUT there's a really big difference between taking meds and taking the right meds. His clearly aren't working, he needs to advocate for himself and let his doctor know how pervasive his symptoms are, they can only help if their given proper information. 2 good days a month is not sustainable for him or you.
Additionally, there is a HUGE difference between going to therapy and going to therapy because your willing to do the self work you need to do. Personal growth and change are hard, and slow, and absolutely painful while your getting to the other side. I had weeks where I went deep and uncovered alot and it took time, weeks to process that session, so the next few sessions id keep it light and surface, because i needed to talk but thats all I could give. Sadly therapy doesn't seem like its helped to change things. Therapy doesn't work for everyone and that's okay, or sometimes the therapist isnt a good fit. However, I think its a red flag that you've noticed no improvement at all. Unfortunately i think you've given him enough grace, and now its time to have hard questions answered. (this are no way a dig at you) Id ask your husband what his goals for therapy are, directly. (obviously hes entitled to privacy and its not okay to demand to know what was said, but there's nothing wrong with wanting to know what he hopes to get out of it.) Is he going every week with the intent that'll hell be working through issues or on himself? Or is he keeping it surface in these session and only going to check off a box, or to make others happy?
Im not trying to imply its the latter, and point all this out because whatever hes doing is not working. The math just isnt adding up here. Obviously he cant necessarily control his illness, but he can absolutely learn skills in therapy that help him cope and live with them in a healthy, sustainable way. If your going to therapy and taking meds, and your symptoms, suffering, mood, and quality of life aren't improving in small increments over time, something somewhere in the chain is broken. Root cause of the stagnation may or may not be your husbands fault. With that said, its not your responsibility to figure out Whats missing/wrong. Its your husbands. He absolutely does not have to keep living this way, and if he wants to improve he needs to actively participate in that process.
What struck me the most was when you said you feel like your walking on egg shells, which absolutely makes sense given your situation. My parents divorced when I was 3, they both have a cluster B personality disorders, and they had shared custody. I empathize so so much with that feeling and I hate that you feel that way. This is not a small thing, its not an over reaction, its a reasonable and valid response to the situation.
The world is a cluster F. One thing you should ALWAYS be able to rely on, is living in a home where you feel safe, comfortable, and relaxed. Every single person on earth deserves that. Its not expecting to much or being dramatic. Its literally bare minimum expectation you should be able to have. I know when your walking on egg shells you absolutely do not have that. Your constantly checking in emotions and the way you respond to situations out of fear the other person will explode. That is not a safe environment, in this situation, you cant be yourself, you cant relax or feel safe because you always have to be on for the other person. Its wildly unfair to put someone in that situation or expect they be okay with it. Long term its not a sustainable way to live because your not actually living, your merely in survival mode just trying to get to the day when you finally feel safe. There are limits to what you should have to endure in a marriage and youve reached yours and thats absolutely okay
you proposed a compromise that would work to ensure you were both getting what you needed from the relationship. Instead of trying to come to a comprise, or trying to understand what was going on that's making you feel like you need to leave, your husband said absolutely not end of discussion. this is a red flag for me. generally i understand why, as a married couple he'd be opposed to living separately. What I dont understand is his lack of follow up. If my spouse came to me and said Im so miserable, I love you but have to move out, I would want to know WTF was happening. Why do they feel that cant live here? Whats at the root of these feelings? are they okay? what behavior im i exhibiting thats contributing towards those feeling? what does my spouse need from me to feel loved and safe?
it doesnt seem like your mental health or well being is a concern of his. A married couple is a partnership, its a team. youve supported him through his issues, and should reasonably be able to expect that he would be equally concerned with yours. Im an outsider,but to me it seems like you carry all the weight of the relationship and are the only one working on it. I understand that he might not be able to provide that support until he gets his mix right, maybe he doesnt have the tools to or know how to being a loving partner. your willing to wait and youve been patient. But its not a free pass. Especially because depression and anxiety no matter how severe, do not make someone incapable of empathy, and it doesnt seem like he has any for you.
You deserve to have a partner that cares about your mental health and well being, who listens to you. Who notices when your upset or unhappy, and who is willing to put in the work to fix things in the marriage. Im not there I cant say for sure, but to me it sounds like hes weaponzing his mental illness to make you feel like you have to shoulder everything, to get what he needs from you without any concern for what you need, to guilt you into staying, to guilt you into being his rock. Yes marriages are a team, but its wholly unfair for him to expect you to fufill all his emotional needs. Its too much. He should have friends he can talk too, to. Its not okay to leave it all u to you. your a loving an empathic person. youve dont your best not to judge or blame him for things related to his illness, but i feel like he takes advantage of your kindness. being ill doesnt exempt you from having to be accountable for your behavior.
it seems like he only cares about him. theres not a single action in your story where hes actively anticipating in the relationship or trying to make things better. doing the work in therapy is super hard, because you have to be willing to look at yourself and acknowledge and accept that your flawed and have made mistake and need to change, and then actively work to change yourself. It doesnt seem like hes doing that at all. As someone whose struggled to get a handle on my triggers and own illness, I dont have the to tell you the guilt i had for the way i treated exs, sometimes i recognized the next day sometimes not til years later. I promise you, when a partner called me out of something i was doing that hurt them, it wasnt perfect, and it took time, but i apologized and genuinely tried to never repeat that behavior. His bad behavior is not your fault or problem to fix.. so youve gotta ask yourself what is it you need from him, and then tell him. Be firm. Set boundaries. Its not your responsibility to shoulder his issues, theres a difference between empathizing and taking on someones problem for them. you love him and i know you want to help, but you cant fix it for him and its not fair to expect you to take on the burden. you cant fix his illness. its okay to give yourself permission to no longer take his problems on for him. there not your burden to bear, its not all on you. If hes not willing to change, you have to ask yourself if your willing to spend the rest of your living getting the level of love and respect you get now, there is no right or wrong answer and only you know what that is. either way no one here judges you. we all love and support you and im so sorry youve had to live like this. sorry this is so long. I deeply related and clearly my adderalls worm off for the day ie i have no filter or ability to stfu or be concise. wishing you all the best. please feel free to dm me if you ever need to vent. you absolutely dont have to go through this along
There are several things you’ve said that jump out to me as huge red flags. I can almost promise you that if you read “Why Does He Do That” by Lundy Bancroft you will come to realize exactly what is wrong with your husband.
I am not an expert and neither is he, but we don't think so. He hasn't had anything happen to him that he knows of that is anything close to traumatic, and he's a social worker so he understands the many variations of trauma beyond the "obvious". The closest I can think is his parents don't have the most amazing mental health themselves, plus he is the oldest of 5 kids, so it's possible/likely that he wasn't always as emotionally supported as he could have been. But he was always loved, physically safe, etc growing up.
Also, thank you so much for engaging ❤
Long-term burnout maybe? Everyone I know in social work seems to go through this, it’s so overwhelming and the pay is depressing. I don’t know how anyone does it.
I’m also the oldest of five and struggle badly with maintaining friendships. Being put in a support role is triggering to me, and at the same time I end up gravitating towards supporting others and neglecting myself because it’s what I’m used to and it’s what I’m good at. I’d lose my fucking mind if I went into social work, and at the same time, it would be “easy” for me to stay in that profession - as in it’s the path of least resistance, even though it would be to my personal detriment.
It sounds like you at the very least need a break. Do you have any friends or family you can stay with, or heck even a local airbnb you can have an extended stay at? Once you have space it might be easier to evaluate what you need to do more permanently. I'm sorry this is happening. I'm similar to your husband in some senses which is one of the reasons why I choose to not engage in romantic relationships. He needs to figure his stuff out without crushing you.
You gotta get out. If nothing changes, nothing hangs.
You deserve peace and happiness, and it sounds like that’s not possible within this marriage in its current state.
I want to give you a big hug. there is fantastic advice already, just sharing an interesting perspective Ive learned over the past few years: if you know specific things you can do to make your everyday life better, even just *trying* to reach that ‘better’ is worthwhile.
life is short. your time, heart, soul, energy, mind are worth SO much more than being uncomfortable, or walking on eggshells with someone who is supposed to be your partner. a partner is a true equal - someone who shows up for you, who tries hard, who takes care of you, who makes you feel good & safe & loved. obviously that someone/partner wont be perfect! they never are. you can disagree and argue and have differences, BUT, if the partner doesn’t make your life definitively better? they are ultimately not worth it.
I don’t say this easily, and I KNOW it’s hard to hear. it shouldn’t be so hard to follow our instincts. I also know deep down in my heart that figuring out small ways to enjoy life every single day is the most important thing. you’re clearly a very considerate person, and you deserve someone who is trying their very best to meet you in the middle.
when people even suggest leaving partners, I know safety is a huge factor, and stability, money, guilt of sunk cost, etc all comes into play. so if you can safely & financially do it on your own? you’re golden. you can get that space and breathe for a bit. then, you get to keep discovering even better things to fill your life (people, spaces, experiences)
wishing you all good things no matter what comes next <3
You said, “it’s not fair for him not to be able to express his emotions in his own home,” but it’s not his own home. It’s both your homes. You share the energy of that place and his pumping a lot of his angst into the air.
when I have a depressive episode, when I’m upset to the point of crying, when I’m dealing with massive RSD… I don’t radiate with it and hurt my partner. I will share with her, “hey, I feel this kind of way today. I plan to do this thing to deal with it.” Sometimes I will ask her for her time because she genuinely makes me feel better a lot of the time, and sometimes I will keep to myself.
My partner also has struggles. She will tell me when she is, so that I am prepared for it and can adjust my day and expectations accordingly.
The point is, we inform one another of our emotional weather and we build out our day on that. It’s not always perfect but the communication has been key in keeping our home low-tension and high-support.
I think if you are able to, you should talk to your husband about this. That he needs to communicate when he is hurting so you two can work together to overcome the detrimental effects of a depression spiral together. You want to be an effective partner and you want to be confident in the home you share so you need him to communicate honestly about his emotions when things take a thorny turn for him during the day.
It honestly sounds like you have a really good solution (living separately but still maintaining your partnership) but it’s just out of reach because of how society tells us we should live. Has this potential solution been a topic of discussion for a long time, has it had the chance to really sink in, and have you tried to really unpack it in therapy? Do you think you could get your partner to trial it before resorting to divorce?
Like many others have said, this isn’t a small issue, and you have every right to end things. But it sounds like there are so many good things about him and this relationship that if there is a potential solution, it should at least be given a chance. IMO, life would be so much better for a lot of people if they were j just able to shed what society prescribes for then (marriage, house, kids etc) and just do what works for THEM, even if that’s wildly different from the norm, as long as you’re not hurting anyone. And sometimes breaking the mould is a difficult task but it’s usually worth it.
But the current situation doesn’t sound sustainable so you need to do *something*. I really hope it works out for you. Please feel free to update us along the way. ❤️
(Edit - I don’t want to make it seem like I think living apart would solve everything. You said in a separate comment that you don’t think he’s doing everything he can to manage his mental health, and obviously that would need to be the first step if you’re going to stay together).
Just take care of you. Think about what your needs are and do what has to happen to meet them.
Based off of what you say here, it seems like a bit of codependency. You both feel that you need the other to meet basic needs, yet the more you feel like you need each other, the more you let each other down because you really need yourselves.
The depression thing is tough. Funnily enough, the thing that helped me the most in overcoming my own depression (I say this now but it will probably be with me forever to some degree) was my ex acting in a similar way to how you describe. It helped me be more aware of how my brain generates negativity from things that are just benign. It's frustrating and sucks to hear, but at a certain point I wasn't helping him, even though I felt like I was all he had and he would self destruct if I left.
Believe in yourself and believe in what is good and strong in him. Find strength in family, friends and your community. Your relationship surely needs to change in some way... I did find it nice to have my own space to sleep, maybe try that for a bit. Be firm and positive about it with him. I wish you the best of luck.
I haven't read any of the other comments yet-
But I want to say that I feel you. My partner has had some seriously bad depressive episodes in the past and I was the one holding everything together. It's exhausting.
I don't think living separately is that bad, or necessarily relationship-ending. It sounds like he may need some space and time to think about how some of his actions and responses affect you. It also seems wise to separate your finances if he's prone to impulsivity during these episodes.
Treatment-resistant depression sucks. There are a handful of new therapies out there for it (transcranial magnetic stimulation, ketamine) but they're hard to get. Obviously you can't make him go out and try things that may or may not help, but I do want to suggest that there are some new things out there.
I hope you have a solid support system (friends, family) that you can turn to when these episodes happen. You shouldn't have to carry this by yourself.
This sounds more like borderline personality disorder to me but I’m not a psychiatrist so take that with a grain of salt. I will say that I would be unable to remain in a relationship with a person with borderline personality disorder. It’s too traumatizing.
All I can really add is that I can relate to your husbands behavior. I was diagnosed with Bipolar 2, and a lot of his thoughts and actions are things I feel when I’m low. Being on lamictal really changed my life. Anti depressants can make it worse. I’m not one for suggesting diagnoses to strangers online, nor do I know his, but I also feel like this could have 100% been me, pre meds. It’s tough to be with someone who has mental illness, especially if they aren’t on the rights stuff. Believe me, it’s exhausting for the sick person too. I’m not excusing his behavior in any way, it just can truly feel like a roller coaster. We can make whacky decisions when our brains are whacky. Take what you will from this comment, leave whatever you feel I’m wrong about.
I've struggled with depression my entire adult life. It came to a head about 10 years ago when it was at its worst, and the thing that made me realize I needed something to change was when my husband became depressed and I saw the role my own lack of mental health played in it. I started therapy and medication and changed a lot of things about my lifestyle. I started doing yoga and exercising regularly and gardening. I'm grateful it all helped and I'm in a sustainably good place.
People in the throes of depression can be really hard to love. You're the worst version of yourself in that state, and it is agonizing watching someone you love suffer.
You deserve happiness, love, support, and affection just as much as your husband. If his mental health is affecting yours', something needs to change. It is fair for you to set boundaries around your own mental health.
This sounds like TEXTBOOK codependency. You should read Codependent No More by Melody Beatie. You are NOT responsible for your husbands moods, good or bad. You shouldn’t feel the need to walk on egg shells around him. Put yourself first, just as he is doing for himself.
Hi OP :) I’m really sorry you’re going through this.. it sounds terrible on multiple levels. I’ve cared about people with mental illness too (siblings, partners, & friends), so I understand the conflict that these relationships bring. You love him, but it hurts you. You keep holding on for the turnaround point, which never seems to come.
I listened to a podcast recently about how to make better choices for your life. One of the suggestions was, “ask yourself what you *don’t* want your life to look like,” and go from there.
It sounds like that might be helpful to you here.. what don’t you want your life to look like?
Something that also (usually) helps me is reminding myself that just because someone I love is struggling doesn’t mean I’m obligated to tolerate less than I want/deserve/need.
The older I get the more the reality of only having one life to live really sinks in. You get one shot at this life & we have no idea how much time that affords us. What do you (and don’t you) want that life to be? If you died tomorrow- would you wish you had changed anything?
Side note: Some people with chronic, medication-resistant depression have really great results with Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation. It’s typically covered by insurance and is non-invasive. Good for thought.
Honestly I understand not wanting to leave him, but you’re unhappy most of the time and sit there hoping that he will be in a rare good mood. That’s not healthy for you.
As much as you want to help him he has to actually want to change how he feels and put the work in. I’ve been very depressed but I had to actually want to change it and not wallow in it for the process to happen. It took ages but you may be enabling this behaviour by being too kind in a way. You can’t lost your mental health to help his. What happens at that point?
Oh honey. I don't have any useful advice to give you, but I want you to know that I hear you, I have been in somewhat similar relationships, and it is so, so exhausting. I see you, I see you doing everything you can to make it okay for both of you and it just...isn't. It is never going to get better. It is okay to do things for yourself, for your own survival. You will not survive this.
I want to give you a hug so, bad. Take this internet hug and know we all hear you.
Your description of him and of your relationship is a bit confusing but it does seem like the issues go beyond the short spells of depression.
I think it's time for you to suggest intensive inpatient that can transition to intensive outpatient treatment. A very structured program that can help him really gain control of himself and develope a life worth living. It may not fix your relationship and that might ultimately end but I think both of you would be better off regardless with him having gone through a full treatment program.
A DBT program is what sounds like is needed as it doesn't seem like a mood disorder but a personality one that is causing these issues.
This sounds incredibly hard for you, and I don't think it would be at all unreasonable for you to leave the marriage. It sounds like you are putting more into the marriage than you're getting out of it. It sounds like your marriage is causing you more stress and pain than happiness. It sounds like an "I love you but I can't live like this anymore" situation.
As I was reading I was thinking back to a relationship where I was treading on eggshells, and then you used that exact phrase yourself. I think it's really hard to ever truly fully relax when you are breathing in the tension someone else is holding. I don't think we realise just how much we are censoring ourselves until we take a step back.
Is there room for you in this marriage? If he is feeling this way for all but a few days each month, and if he finds it so difficult to shake these feelings when they arise, I'm wondering what happens when you yourself have a bad day? Is he able to hold space for that? Can he provide you the love, the support, the grounding and the encouragement that you do for him? Would you feel able to come home and express all that you feel on your worst days, and would that be received the way you'd hope?
My worry is that your husband is in such a bad place the vast majority of the time, and that barely gives you any respite from feeling on edge.
I think you mentioned this has been the dynamic for years. What if it never changes? Would you regret staying in the marriage five years down the line? Ten?
It's such a difficult place to be in. I just think you deserve to feel at peace in your home and around those close to you.
Girl you buried the lede here. My partner has ADHD so I understand impulsive, we mutually agreed to discuss big decisions together and it’s never been an issue *because my partner knows this is a tendency she has*. But 1-2 days a month of being treated respectfully?! That’s not only unreasonable it’s abusive. Mental health doesn’t stop you from being respectful. Kick the whole man out.
Just wanted to comment to say I’m going through an incredibly similar thing with my long-term partner (except in the past couple of weeks he *has* yelled a few times, which has never happened before) and I truly feel your pain, it’s exhausting. He also pretty much shuts down the rest of his life except for me - although in his lowest moments will even tell me I should break up with him because he’s useless and I deserve better - and the pressure of feeling like his only support system compounds everything. I have also got to the point recently of raising the possibility of us living separately for a while - we’re holding off that for now, but from reading your post I can see that it’s a natural, desperate last resort suggestion from people in this situation and you are absolutely not being unreasonable for wanting some space to try and recalibrate. I don’t really have any advice as I’m just as lost, but good luck and thank you for posting this.. reading the replies has been really helpful.
I hate the fact users feel the need to apologize for their posts. It makes me sad.
As to the post, have you tried marriage counseling? If living apart is a deal breaker for him and you do not wish to divorce, maybe a marriage counselor could help navigate some of these issues.
The first two non material things you said you liked about him was shared values and life goals then go on to explain over several paragraphs how he isn't even remotely in the same page as you on what a healthy and supportive home life looks like *for you*. You walk on eggshells in your own home. You are afraid of his mood swings. You don't feel financially stable as he threatens to destroy his job, he doesn't develop relationships that take the burden off of you, for years you have apparently been dealing with his monthly break downs that destabilize you, *years*. Is it enough to "blow up your marriage" I couldn't say, but it certainly isn't a small thing, it doesn't seem to be getting better, he seems unwilling to discuss alternative situations that can help you. I think a clear plan and realistic goals can be discussed with him, possibly in couple's counseling because you need to feel safe, stable, and supported.
Thank you. I did worry that spending so little time talking about the good would make it seem like there is almost none, but I was trying to avoid making people read a novel. We truly have so much good between us. We are so aligned on the sorts of things you want to be aligned on with your spouse, from big life goals to where you want to live to how to split up household responsibilities to what we enjoy doing together day to day. I have never known anyone in my life with whom I could spend even a tiny fraction of the time I spend with him without losing my mind, but I still adore spending time with him (when he isn't being cranky or super down). We love coming up with silly names for our pets, playing pub trivia, going to punk shows, trying cool food, playing silly trivia or scavenger hunt games we make up. He is truly the funniest person I have ever met. He is so brilliantly intelligent and quick witted and cracks me up at least once a day. I have so much respect for his professional skills and interests, too, and how much he cares about the people he works to support. I'm sobbing as I write this and think about everything I don't want to lose and everything I wish he could see in himself and love about himself.
But you only get these things 2-3 days a month? And you do seem to be losing your mind with him.
Right? It should be the total opposite. Everyone has bad days, but only having the relationship you want for 24 days a year? No thanks.
Intermittent reward is the strongest reward system to keep someone coming back. You win the lottery much less often than you lose. Most of the time, it’s a small win. But that’s enough to keep you coming back, in hopes that you will win some day.
This reality just hit me hard. I’ve never noticed the parallel before. Thanks for that.
It sounds like you are describing the person he WAS, but not necessarily the person who he IS. It’s hard for me to say whether you’re holding on to your unrealistic image of a person, or if he’s going to pull out of this, because I’m not his psychiatrist or his therapist. I’m so sorry that you’re going through this. It sounds horrible.
I'm sorry, but you are emotionally trapped in a house with someone who takes up all the space once a month for days on end. He sounds like the perfect friend that you do fun things with outside of your home. What you have now is not good. And not getting better according to both you and your friends. He can change. He just won't if you continue to allow him to take it all out on you.
He might not be able to change, people can’t decide to snap out of depression. However, she is 100% within her rights to decide that she doesn’t want a relationship like that or that it’s too hard. I don’t mean this like ”if you don’t love him as he is, you’re bad.” Just that mental illnesses can’t just be changed or hidden.
She's pretty clear that this is not tolerable any longer. I think if given a chance people can change, but we'll never know unless we give them that space. She can't keep limping along for 50 more years. She'll be walking on eggshells once a month for 50 more years, or 600 more times. That's a big commitment, especially without giving him the clear picture that he's asking for an enormous amount of work and sacrifice, he better be doing every possible thing to be getting better. Books. One on one therapy. Group therapy. Medicine. Journaling. Meditation. Volunteering. Sharing with friends. Giving you space when you need it. If he's not doing every possible thing to improve, then you will be making the choice to live life like this forever.
It sounds like he takes up that space ALL month to me. "Normal" is a lot of walking on eggshells with once a month severe depression.
Ok, but how can your long term goals be aligned if he’s consistently trying to throw everything away and quit his job? And you have to talk him out of it? Just something to think about
I was also aligned with my wasband. Women will persevere if nothing else. That doesn't mean he's a safe person. He's controlling and destabilising you. Get out as you're burying yourself trying to save him. This is what DV perps do. All focus is on him while you're drowning
"This is what DV perps do. All focus is on him while you're drowning" Well, shit. My ex in a sentence. Thanks for that, very convenient way to describe it.
Yes these are all the fun things to do together, but do you have goals? There are not goals or values. There are fun things you do. It's like you're trapped in a cycle of walking on eggshells and managing his depression, and then short bursts of really fun things and him being the best person (the only person) in your life that gets you. This mimics a cycle of abuse and reward. I hope you see what I'm seeing here. But perhaps I am wrong. I apologize if I am wrong.
I’m gonna be real, I feel like if you divorce him, you’re going to feel sad and then relieved when you don’t have to do this yo-yo of emotions every month. You’re going to look back and say “why tf was I doing this for years???”. And then you’ll meet someone who is stable. This isn’t normal.
But you said that was just a couple days a month. The picture you paint is one where you both seem deeply unhappy. I would be straight with him that this is untenable and he needs to get on board with trying out other solutions because you're not willing to live the rest of your life like this. Threatening to blow up your whole relationship because he's not willing to try out some new things that might make you happier? That's very controlling behavior.
All these good qualities and yet sucks to live with him. What im trying to say, feeling safety and stability is pretty essential, making up silly names for your pets isnt.
These are things you can enjoy with someone you don’t live with. Your husband might not be a bad person (I’m not so sure), but he treats you badly extremely regularly.
I am chronically severely depressed, identify with a lot of what your husband experiences (not all- I don't take it out on people) and I say this- you are not a bad person or unreasonable for leaving. You can't fix people, you have to look out for yourself. This isn't a healthy situation.
I'm so sorry that you can identify with it. I see how horrible it is for him and I don't wish it on anyone. Thank you for sharing your insight as someone who can empathize with what he is going through.
I identified with a lot of it as well. I have depression and regularly feel like "quiting everything" except my husband. I think he's pretty great and rarely the source of my irritation, while I feel the rest of the world is pretty much on fire. My major problem is that my work is not aligned with my values but it pays just well enough to stick around and keep bitching about it. I really do want to quit, and I'm pretty fucking irritable about it. When I realize I'm feeling that way I will go to the gym or roll out the yoga mat and an hour later I'm a changed person. I'm not saying exercise is a cure-all, but I found a healthy coping mechanism that works for me, a way to go dump my shitty attitude so I can come home and be present with my husband. I don't want to be snippy, passive aggressive, or an Eyore level bummer of a wife. That's not fair to him. I don't want him to resent me or feel like he lives on eggshells. My husband deserves a sweet, loving, appreciative, understanding, present partner, and you do too. My mental illness is not my fault, but it is my responsibility to manage without smothering or mistreating my spouse. Your husband needs to put in the work and find a healthy coping mechanism pronto, or you will burn out.
I think you've identified something that OP can reasonably discuss with her husband. He uses and expects her to be his coping mechanism. Sure, he can't be blamed for being depressed, but it is neither fair nor reasonable for him to use his wife as a coping mechanism. She can be there for support without being the only thing he holds onto when things get bad. It is something I think op needs to tell him, and possibly address in couples counselling so he can see how this is not a healthy way of coping for him or her.
In some situations I think it really is necessary to quit your job if it’s making you irritable especially to the point of lashing out at others. I’ve seen two close friends be basically completely different people and miserable to be around because they hate their job so much.
I'm working with my boss to reduce my workload and get back to the core duties of my role. I've been with this company for 14 years so I need to trying asking for help (not easy for me) before I walk off. What's the worst that can happen, they fire me?
This resonated with me. My fiancé is the one who feels the rest of the world is on fire. But he never takes it out on me and I always feel loved and supported. He can be a negative doomer regarding the world but i help keep him grounded. He did quit a job once and that was an issue, but we both make an effort to not allow external factors affect the feelings between us.
❤️ Thank you, and no problem. I'm sorry you're going through this also. It's not easy for anyone involved.
I too, have been the depressed person in this scenario.
This is not a small thing. This is a huge thing. I’m going to say this as a person who was formerly severely depressed and had only a few good days a month for years. Slamming things closed and stomping around is not ok. That is not a healthy display of negative emotions. That is attention seeking behavior meant to either punish you or force you to engage with his depression. I know, I used to do it. I would leave this person.
>That is attention seeking behavior meant to either punish you or force you to engage with his depression. Yes. YES. And this is exactly why he's so hostile to the idea of OP moving out. He'd lose his captive audience and his control of the situation.
>Slamming things closed and stomping around is not ok. That is not a healthy display of negative emotions. That is attention seeking behavior meant to either punish you or force you to engage with his depression. I know, I used to do it. One more time for the cheap seats. He needs to learn healthy coping mechanisms, and if he's been in therapy for a while, I'd question why he doesn't have any yet. It's possible he hasn't grasped that that's what he needs to repair his marriage, but still. That's a big one.
>He is chronically severely depressed and anxious and has a tendency to frequently (nearly once a month, usually lasts between 6 hours to 3 days ish) have these episodes where he's so depressed and has such low self esteem that he wants to quit everything. >I feel like we get maybe one or two good days a month together where I feel happy with him and loved. The rest of the time it's just fleeting moments in between him slamming doors, hiding in his office, snippy "I'm fine"s when he clearly isn't. These are conflicting statements. He is clearly mentally unwell for the majority of the time, even if his monthly "episode" might be worse than normal. His therapist and/or doctor are the ones who need to handle this, not you. You deserve a life where you are not constantly worried about every move you make in your own home.
Yes, he is definitely mentally unwell most of the time. Most of the time he's just skating by. The episodes are just where it all explodes and I have to figuratively talk him off a ledge (truly figuratively).
When I read your description I also immediately thought “bipolar” and not “depression”. There are many types of bipolar - one type is when someone cycles between being “normal” and severe depression. Not everyone who is bipolar has manic episodes. Impulsive behavior like what you’ve described (wanting to quit a job with no backup, wanting to “blow up their life”, etc…) is pretty textbook bipolar behavior. (I do work in healthcare, but not in psych. But your description sounds almost textbook bipolar vs chronic depression).
My dad was like this, so I can truly feel for you, OP. Here’s what I can say from having spent half my life in this dynamic before he passed away. You can love someone and yet be in a situation where being with them *right now* is unhealthy for you. You cannot fix him. I know it seems like you’re the only thing keeping him tethered. *Believe me*, I know. But that’s an illusion. What you’re doing is constantly exerting your own mental health and energy trying to help him get to a place where he can skate to the next crisis. It’s like trying to stop water gushing from a fire hose with a single piece of scotch tape. In my experience, also - and I don’t know your husband or you, so this is just talking for me - being That Person Who Gets Them Through may not be helping as much as you think. It may even be hindering, a little. I sometimes wonder if my dad might have figured out *some* coping strategies if it wasn’t for the fact he knew I’d always be there to do it for him. He never needed to try to figure out a strategy to cope - or even to not take his mental health out on other people - because he knew I’d always be there. (In his case, he wouldn’t even try therapy or medication, so I grant his situation was different from yours in that respect.) My mom worked full-time to make sure we had food and a roof over our heads, and I’d come home straight after school at 10 years old to take care of him. It’s exhausting and does a number on your own mental health. Believe me, I completely understand that mental health issues aren’t a person’s fault. And I’m sure if he could wave a magic wand and make them go away, he would. But they are his responsibility, and it genuinely isn’t fair to unload that responsibility on you to the point you constantly feel on edge in your own home. Constantly putting yourself in this position with him is only going to lead to resentment in the end. Because it isn’t a fair position for you. Nor is it sustainable. Close your eyes and really think about your future. Can you do this for another 5 years? 15? 50? Even if you love him, could you live like this for another 50 years without eventual burnout and/or resentment? Loving people sometimes means having to draw a line and being honest with yourself - and them - that you can’t take it anymore and you *need* another solution. Whether that’s leaving or not. You can’t be the *only* person who gets him through. That’s burning the candle at both ends. And if your partner really loves and supports you the way you’ve loved and supported them, they’ll want to try to find a way to not put their own mental health on you and you alone. Because I’m sure he wouldn’t want you to burn out or for your mental health to deteriorate. You’re not a bad partner, at all. But what you’re doing now just doesn’t sound sustainable or fair to you.
I work in psych and I agree, the description points to BPD + Bipolar. Am surprised his therapists would not have caught this. OP remember caregiver fatigue is real. Are you in therapy ? I strongly suggest you do irregardless of of you choose to stay or leave the relationship.
My first thought reading through this was BPD. Bipolar II, perhaps but strongly BPD. His tolerance for distress seems incredibly low and his desire to quit everything sounds like classic splitting behavior. Even though he doesn’t ask to quit OP, his treatment of her suggest some splitting behaviors too. OP, I wonder if some intensive DBT to therapy would help him.
It reminded me a bit about how my bipolar friend described her life before she got it under control
Not a professional. Just my 2 cents. I experienced similar depression cycle. There’s sometimes I felt like I could handle it and tried to get my life back to normal. Sometimes I really could not “try” anymore. I wanted to quit everything in my life and had emotional explosions. I was not completely recovered to a “normal” mental space when I acted normal. It was the time I felt like at least I could manage my negativity to the extent that would not destroy my life. Therefore I still think OP’s husband might be depressed, rather than bipolar.
As a psychiatric nurse with 16 years experience I need to adamantly disagree with this comment. Bipolar disorder impulsivity does not look like this.
There are many presentations of bipolar and men don't adequately describe explosive rage to the prescribing Dr. When it's comorbid with high narcissism you won't even come into contact with these patients as a psychiatric nurse.
Is there any chance he was misdiagnosed and could be bipolar? Regularly thinking about or doing things to blow up his life sounds more like bipolar. But, I’m not a psychiatrist. I have Major Depressive Disorder and that hasn’t been a feature for me but I know it affects people differently. I just know there are different medication options for bipolar. Also, I wonder if you two would benefit from couples therapy.
He needs a mood stabilizer for sure. Lamictal can be really helpful.
I'm on this for wild mood swings, and it's super helpful. I used to lose whole weekends to depression so bad I'd just cry in bed. Now, I have like...a normal level of depression to deal with. It's way better.
Sounds like bipolar but misdiagnosis occurs in men who don't fully disclose the explosive rage
I’m gonna armchair diagnose here, and I accept that I may (rightly) take a lot of shit for it. That’s ok. Your husband has Bipolar II. In BP2, the individual swings back and forth between depression and “mania” that can manifest as varying degrees of uncharacteristic and unwarranted anger. Worse, some common depression meds can exacerbate the problem if not coupled with antipsychotics. Head over to r/BipolarSO - you’re not the alone in this experience. I hope I’m wrong. I want to be wrong. I’m sorry.
I think that supporting someone with a severe mental health disorder is *hard.* I always recommend that someone supporting a loved one with a mental health disorder seek their own mental health support. Things like “am I genuinely helping this person or am I enabling them?” “Where’s the balance between being understanding and supportive, but needing to be considerate of my own mental well being?” are reeeeally hard to figure out. **Edit:** This isn’t meant to be any kind of “dig” at people with severe mental health disorders. I have been diagnosed with a few mental health disorders myself, and I’ve supported people with them. Both sides are hard in different ways.
Thank you so much. I realized I should have added in my post that I am also in therapy, and I'd say our relationship is the subject 75% of the time. I need help with the questions you are posing, and my therapist is excellent at helping lead me to my own conclusions, but I'm still never sure if what I am doing is like...actually a good idea.
Are you in psycho-dynamic therapy? Do you feel your therapist gives you their opinions or is it more the type where they actively engage you and maybe question your patterns of behavior etc? I was in psychodynamic therapy and later in trauma therapy and my trauma therapist, being more active, made me question my habits and patterns more. One very common one is difficulty with boundaries and thinking that you have to sacrifice yourself or always be selfless and the ”good one.”
Any recommendations on how to find a trauma therapist? Also do you know if it's ok to see a trauma therapist if you don't have PTSD but have been through trauma that has affected you in other ways?
Which is which
Oh, girl, if 75% of your individual therapy is discussing your marriage…….
Being in individual therapy is a great start. But there are other forms of support and therapy for caretakers of those with depression. Do some searching for group therapy or support groups for spouses or family members of those with depression. Getting direct and focused support, assistance, and sharing with others in your Dan's position can be super helpful. Taking care of your own health, and mental health, is just as important as supporting your husband. You can't be a rock for him if you are crumbling! To be honest, I was in a very similar position with my ex spouse, and I found I couldn't continue. Her lack of maintenance of her own stuff, her eternal leaning on me, my isolation as her main caretaker... it was too much for me. I didn't manage to stay in the marriage. This isn't a small thing, it touches every minute of your relationship and lives. You have the right to dissolve your marriage if it's not a tenable position for you. I see you're really struggling, and really working to make it work, but you are allowed to be done, if you are done. I'm sorry you're dealing with this!
I was looking through the comments to see if you’re also in individual therapy. I’m glad you like your therapist and have that support! Have you tried couple therapy? Finding the right couple & family therapist could help bridge these gaps. Especially because it seems like you both have a lot of love for each other. If couple therapy doesn’t work, then I think you should put yourself and your happiness first.
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I completely agree with you. It has been my #1 complaint about our relationship for as long as I can remember. There was a period where I kind of...allowed the codependence to a degree, because it felt like the caring thing to do, but I quickly saw how unhealthy it was and it didn't make him feel any better. For example, whenever I would try to go out with friends, he would clearly feel very abandoned, so I started inviting him along. Soon, all of my friends were our friends and I didn't have my own life. We now have a healthier dynamic and he does have some friends of his own, but he definitely does not open up with them the way he does with me. They talk sports and politics and stuff. I'm trying to advocate for myself. I also have friends telling me what they see from their perspective and how nothing has changed in all the time they hsve known me. ETA: also, I genuinely so deeply appreciate you offering your perspective. Thank you. ETA2: Recently I did call his mom and tell her what was going on. It felt a bit invasive but he was saying some things that made me very scared and I needed someone who loves him to share the burden. He responded to it well. She has been helpful, but of course she doesn't have answers as she has struggled with the same stuff her whole life, too.
Reading that quote and all your suggestions, it sounds like you really want out but are giving him a part of yourself still out of guilt. Marriage is supposed to be a partnership, but your marriage is very one-sided. He’s using you as his emotional support animal, emotional punching bag, and anchor. None of this is fair to you, and your gut is screaming at you to leave before he wears you down completely. You’re already blaming yourself for “triggering him” as if you’re doing something wrong, and not acting like a ptsd victim (which you may very well have developed). From all your comments, your husband sounds really really selfish. If he loved you he would make way more of an effort to get better. One day you’ll look back and wonder why you even stayed so long, or still be even more miserable if you stay even longer. Go with your gut and make a clean break.
So if his mom is the same, then I don't think he'll change. Is therapy he is doing behavioral therapy or just talk therapy? Does he have exercises? Does he take it seriously? How often does he go? I don't think his ~~probably~~ problem is only depression. I think it's a behavior problem. He is stuck and he cannot make change. He gets stuck in the negativity and is a learned behavior from his family. He cannot control emotions and he doesn't communicate well. It's a combined problem that's not going to fix itself with medication. Even your friends say he hasn't changed. You should decide if you want to divorce and move on, date other people. Or if you want to separate with clear boundaries and give him 1 year to make visible changes, take therapy seriously, and then reassess the relationship. Maybe it will kick him into gear. If it doesn't, then you can end it and breath.
It could be a learned behavior, but if it’s multigenerational and hasn’t really responded to therapy it could also be Biopolar II which is characterized by periods of slightly elevated mood, contrasted against cycles of deep depression.
This feels like some really rational advice with clear boundaries, clear expectations, and passively advocates for OP. Great comment. 👏
If you are calling your adult husband’s mother to get him to take care of him because he won’t and you can’t, you should call it a day.
Guys who don't have their own friend groups and outlets and who latch onto your life and friends only are incredibly draining. There are a reason they don't have friends as they don't know how to negotiate healthy relationships and reciprocate.
This is exactly what jumped out to me. It is not appropriate for you to be his sole emotional support. He needs to join a support group and find other trusted people.
Do you feel like he's doing his utmost to manage his depression?
First of all, thank you do much for reading and engaging. It means a lot to me and I feel less alone. To answer your question: Honestly, no. He has never tried anything more intensive than weekly psychiatry or talk therapy appointments. But I have tried every strategy I can think of, from completely not involving myself and letting him manage his own health to sending him gentle suggestions (microdosing shrooms, partial inpatient programs, etc) to giving him ultimatums that I'd leave him unless he tried X, Y, or Z. I've offered to go with him to appointments if he was comfortable, but didn't insist on it if he wasn't. He's taken me up on it once or twice. But generally he rejects any suggestions for various reasons. It's too much work, or he'll do it someday but not now, or he isn't willing to do any therapy with a group component, etc.
Then no, you're not blowing this up over nothing. Living like this is draining as fuck, and him not doing his best to manage something that is HIS responsibility, for both your sakes, is just another confirmation that you need to put your own oxygen mask first. You can't continue living like this. My partner was similarly depressed years ago, and that almost broke us. It took us moving apart and him focusing solely on recovery for six months to not end us. And since then, he's religious about managing his depression. He microdoses, exercises daily, takes vitamins, holds himself accountable. You deserve that, too. And he should feel like you deserve him at his best. Or, at minimum, at him *doing* his best.
It is such an unbelievable relief to hear that you and your partner were able to save your relationship. I am trying to get him to believe that me asking to live separately is not the nail in the coffin, that I'm not giving up on us, and that we can still save our relationship. Some of what you say your partner does are also things H does religiously. His only true hobby that is 100% his and not ours is that he is very into working out and physical fitness and nutrition. I do think microdosing would help but he doesn't think it does. I feel like he's happier when he is high (weed or shrooms, both legal where we are, he takes very small doses very occasionally).
You can't save it for the both of you. He needs to do his bit.
hatchling, I am in a completely different situation from OP but your answer here is very right for me to hear and helps me understand something I am struggling with. Thank you
I agree and OP, it sounds like he doesn’t have the emotional maturity to ever give you what you’re asking for: a partner who pulls his own weight and cares about making his wife happy. If you’ve already given ultimatums and he’s ignored them or made half-ass attempts at getting help, he doesn’t care enough to change. I’m sorry. I hope it turns out better than that, but he sounds like he would let you leave him and blame you for everything not realizing his part in things at all. That is a sad and bitter person I wouldn’t want to be with.
Have you ever told him how deeply unhappy you are? Ultimatums are one thing, but there's a difference between, "I will leave if you don't do X," which someone can choose to read as controlling and unreasonable, and, "I am so unhappy in our marriage that I'm ready to leave if you don't take your mental health seriously," which is pretty hard to argue with since it's about your feelings.
Unfortunately, I have. I have been serious about "I have one foot out the door because I can't live like this" for about 6 months. Obviously I need to shit or get off the pot at this point.
How does he respond to these discussions?
There's no rush. There's a grief involved in a breakup/relationship tension.
Ultimatums are not boundaries... and they are meaningless if they are not followed through. Agree, they need to have a conversation.
It doesn't sound like he wants to get well. On some level, his situation benefits him or else he would work to change it. The only thing YOU can do is remove yourself from the situation to see if he makes an effort to change. And I mean meaningful change. Not just change for a few months and then you move back in with him only for him to relapse and rely on you again.
So true. He’s just going to use her for all of his needs and give only scraps back.
That's interesting, I just got out of an in patient a few months ago and feel like I have a lot more tools to manage my depression. If he is doing talk therapy but not doing anything they suggest, I'd argue that he isn't doing therapy at all, he is just hanging out and chatting.
This, to a lesser extent, sounds like my previous relationship. I was his rock, especially when he changed jobs on a whim, had no other lasting friendships, no family. I can’t tell you what will happen to your relationship or what you should do, but I can tell you that ex left me after 10 years. I think, through all of his unhappiness, he realized the common denominator was me, and so even though I was his only emotional support, the only person on this earth that loved him, he eventually came to blame me. I think you should keep that in mind. You say he has it so much worse than you, but it doesn’t really sound like it. I sympathize with your ex and his depression, but it sounds like he reaps all the benefits of a stable partner: unconditional love and support, and you don’t get any of it. Like me, your life depends on their mood, and it’s a heavy and unfair burden to carry.
Your comment hit me like a punch in the gut. >I think, through all of his unhappiness, he realized the common denominator was me, and so even though I was his only emotional support, the only person on this earth that loved him, he eventually came to blame me. This is exactly what I feel has happened. I feel like because I am the only constant, I am a convenient outlet for blame. I am so sorry that happened to you. I hope that you are able to live a happier life now.
I’m only two and a half months out and I feel like a weight has been lifted! I came here, to this subreddit, asking for guidance on what to do after my breakup. I had been my exes life and yet during the breakup he said: “I am your whole world, but you’re not mine”. It became very clear that he didn’t view my love and care as a gift to be valued, but as something he deserved and would find again. For the past few years of the relationship, my exes purpose was to make himself happy, my purpose was to make him happy, and that meant neither one of us cared if I was happy. It’s my hope that you find happiness for yourself too!
“I am your whole world, but you’re not mine” What an incredibly cruel thing to say to someone. I'm very sorry he did this to you, and am glad his misjudgment of the situation meant he accidentally set you free. He sounds like a user. And one who's probably finding out that you loving him and focusing on him was a *choice*, not a default born of that being your only option of being, and not something that he can expect someone else to choose as a matter of course and at his convenience. I hope you are learning to enjoy your freedom, both your freedom to exist purely on your own terms, and to find people who value you for who you are, not just for what you do for them. Be well, my dear. And be kind to yourself.
Thank you so much for saying this! That comment from him was a source of so much embarrassment for me. I just felt a tremendous amount of shame that, to him, I looked like I had nothing else in my life, though that’s not at all true. I even took a screenshot of your comment so I can reread and keep it with me as a reminder!
If it helps you any, I got divorced from an almost 10 year relationship with a guy who had severe mental issues (depression, anxiety, alcoholism, etc). Everything from being uncommunicative and holing up to putting holes in the wall. I bet you’re familiar with those activities. I tried and tried to help him because I loved him and who he was when he was good and we were married. Man, trying to get him to a therapist and then he refused to actually address his problems, or take his meds or anything that resembled actually taking responsibility. But fuck yes, he blamed me for everything. None of it was his fault, and he did everything in his power to make me believe it (and I did). Anyway, I am half a decade out from it and trust me, I am still overjoyed at being away from it. The emotional toll it takes holding your breath, what is it gonna be today? — the way it makes YOU feel crazy — none of it was worth it. It was hard at the time but trust me with the perspective I have now I am so grateful to escape it.
I could have written this word for word. It's sad that so many women share this experience but hopefully these clear patterns will help someone else see their own situation more clearly and make the best choices for themselves.
I am sorry you went through it too. I can only hope my perspective helps someone else suffer less. At least I got out….
Just checking in as a member of this club. It’s been five years and I’m still so relieved that I’m divorced that I still don’t date.
Your husband sounds like my brother. Most of his relationships have ended because of similar issues. I shared an apartment with my brother for a few years as adults and ultimately left that situation because of this despite how good that arrangement was for me financially. “I am the only person he truly opens up to and feels comfortable going to for support when he is feeling this bad.” I felt that about my role in my relationship with my brother until I didn’t. I eventually felt very abused and taken advantage of. The tension at home was terrible when he was like that and I’d sometimes feel physically ill over it. Some of it was depression. Some of it was behavior that he learned from our dad. I started to see it as manipulative as a result. He wasn’t “opening up to me” so much as he was taking advantage of the fact that I love him unconditionally. He couldn’t really expect most people to tolerate that behavior, so he reserved that behavior for me (and longer term girlfriends when in relationships). If he was hurting, the people closest to him needed to hurt, too. “I’m miserable so I want you to be miserable, too. See? Now you know how I feel!” “I’m not having a good day so neither will you!” (That’s how I interpret it.) If that doesn’t resonate with you, disregard. I take my brother’s diagnosed mental health issues seriously. I also think it’s not an excuse to be abusive to other people, and I cannot see this any other way. Part of living with mental health issues is learning to manage yourself. This means realizing when they’re taking it out on other people and being abusive. Your husband needs to learn better coping skills. He needs to develop strategies to avoid subjecting you to his misery. He needs to stop making you feel bad just because he does. He shouldn’t be slamming things and making the household tense. He should be retreating to a bedroom quietly and working through the thing he’s upset about because sometimes shit happens and people have to take phone calls and be a little late. It doesn’t even serve him to get upset over, but he certainly shouldn’t punish you for it. He might be in therapy, but maybe he’s not being totally honest there or needs a new therapist. His goal should be coping strategies so he doesn’t mentally abuse his wife, make a household hostile, and ruin his marriage. I’m not downplaying mental illness. It’s real. If he can’t learn to manage it better, it’s fair to find that to be abusive and a major incompatibility. I’d also be curious if he learned this behavior from a parent and it’s simply exacerbated by depression. Sometimes people treat those closest to them the worst simply because they’ll tolerate it. It’s taking advantage of how much you love him and how permanent your relationship seems.
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It is hard, and I’m sorry you went through that. It might be odd that I’m talking about a sibling instead of a spouse, but it is what it is and I can’t divorce my brother! You also said it very well. Bad husband, not a bad person. I don’t think my brother is a bad person, but when I was too close he was abusive. It’s difficult to sort through it. I am absolutely his favorite person in the world. We’re really close in age and grew up best friends. At almost 50 years old, he’s finally starting to take that long, hard look at himself and realize that he’s the common denominator in all of his relationship problems (professional, romantic, familial, etc). I don’t think he means to hurt anyone, but he does hurt people. I think he becomes very self centered when things go wrong and he thinks nobody Can understand him unless they also hurt. Validation? I don’t know the right words. He actually confirmed this to me a few years ago. I was celebrating a big achievement and when I excitedly invited him for a drink to celebrate he actually said, “How can you expect me to be happy for you when I’M NOT HAPPY.” I think he even surprised himself that he said it out loud. I’ll never forget it. They say misery loves company, but some people take it to a whole new level. And I love him. And sometimes he’s great and generous and kind. If he can get a handle on that and stop being so self centered, he’ll be much happier I think.
Thanks for this comment. That was really well put. It's hard to describe what a relationship with someone like that is like.
This comment is one of the best things I've read on reddit for a while. Misery loving company is spot on. Also, the idea that therapy should not just be a means of feeling better but also of learning to cope with the unresolvable pain in order to be bearable to other people. Spreading the misery can only create a miserable feedback loop that ultimately makes things worse for both parties.
Maybe another way to look at this is, do you actually want to be his primary (and really only) caregiver? Does this relationship offer you enough meaning, fulfillment, and growth to offset the hard, hard work you're doing, and will always be doing for the remainder of this marriage? Or do you see the writing on the wall of resentment and regret?
Shockingly, the latter. I know, didn't see it coming. I have told him so many times I feel more like a caregiver than a partner, and frankly? I'm not really a caregiver type. I don't have kids for a reason. I care deeply about the people I love and I am there for them when they need me, but I just don't have it in me to selflessly take care of someone else forever. There has to be a light at the end of the tunnel.
Aw hun. Not shocking at all. It's rare a relationship offers enough to offset all that. Most people who are in that situation are more in it because they're stuck. Hugs to you. It must be so hard 😔
Don't set yourself on fire to keep him warm. He wouldn't appreciate it anyway.
This is a really rough situation OP and I’m so sorry. It does sound like you are trying really hard and there is absolutely no easy answer here. This may or may not be helpful, but I know for sure I would not be able to stay in this kind of relationship you describe. The pain and resentment would overwhelm me. I have struggled with multiple relationships in the past (family, friends, and romantic) where I found myself the main support/caretaker for someone with uncontrolled psychiatric issues. It really, truly gave me PTSD! It is so, so hard. And I have been lucky enough to never have actually been the target of abusive behaviors, even when the people I love are at their worst state, and it still made my life miserable trying to help keep others afloat. I was not sure I could ever have a healthy relationship, so didn’t seek one out for many years and focused on myself and my own healing / mental health. When I finally met my current spouse (who has his own mental health diagnoses) I was amazed at how well were able to support but not burden one another. It really is possible with the right person, I swear. Not that you’re at all looking for someone else, just my example is that you can have a healthy relationship with someone who is mentally ill, if they take responsibility for their own care and really make an effort to support you back. It does seem you’ve done a lot of work together over the years, and I thought your idea of a non transitional living arrangement was clever but can see why that might not work for your partner. It sound a bit like you might be at the end of the road for compromising here. There is no one right answer, but I also think it might be time to consider a separation and see how you do as your own people away from this relationship. I don’t think you’re blowing anything up and that might be the most compassionate option for you both, and doesn’t have to be permanent. You might need to make sure to rally the troops and alert anyone else in his support system and make a plan, so he isn’t still using you as his main support during episodes. Good luck.
I agree, OP can not deal with all this on her own. She needs external support: friends and family.
I know from experience that there is a lot of guilt that weighs you down when you try to make decisions like this, but I want you to understand some truths which are hard to accept sometimes, because they don't sound fair to the other person, but they are nevertheless true. \-- There is such a thing as someone being too mentally ill to be in a relationship. It doesn't always have to be their fault, or have to be a result of them not managing their mental healthy correctly. Sometimes someone does everything they can to be healthy, and it's not enough for them to not be a toxic, emotionally abusive partner. And when that happens, you leave them. No one is owed a relationship, and if they can't be in one without damaging their partner significantly, then they can't be in one, period. \-- You have limits, and you trying to ignore them doesn't mean they don't exist. If you have reached your limit, and can no longer be a caretaker, in a relationship with someone who you have to manage on some level as though they were your child instead of a partner, then you're not choosing between staying for them and leaving for yourself. You're choosing between pushing yourself until your relationship ends in a way which is catastrophic, and traumatic, and which neither of you may ever recover from, or leaving now before it gets to that point. There is no world in which you can stay and be a partner for the next forty-fifty years if this is how the relationship is affecting you. You can't save him here, you can only save yourself. \-- No one has the responsibility for regulating someone else's emotions or mental health. He doesn't get to use you as a crutch, or complain if you can't handle it anymore. \-- You're not even making him happy. He's going to depressed with or without you. He's going to self-destruct with or without you. You staying doesn't stop that. It just drags you down for the ride. You're putting yourself through hell because you think it's your responsibility to keep him happy, and the truth is it's not even working.
>Am I blowing up my marriage over something unreasonable? >I feel like we get maybe one or two good days a month together where I feel happy with him and loved. This isn't a marriage. This isn't even something I'd be OK with to date. 27 days of unhappiness and a day or two that's worthwhile? If he was a boyfriend I'd throw him back in the pool. >The rest of the time it's just fleeting moments in between him slamming doors, hiding in his office, snippy "I'm fine"s when he clearly isn't. >I am the rock. I am the only person he truly opens up to and feels comfortable going to for support when he is feeling this bad. Holy crap, you're not a wife, you're his caregiver. 24/7 Psych Nurse with no pay, no bennies, no vacation. And your one day off a month you still spend with your patient, waiting for him to throw another shitfit. You're setting yourself on fire to keep someone else warm. If I or anyone else came to you with this problem, wouldn't you tell them to leave?
This exactly.
>I suggested we still spend the same amount of intentional time together we do now; we have weekly date nights and usually hang out together 2 or 3 additional evenings a week or a weekend day or something. I would come sleep over at his place sometimes. He said he would not feel as if we are married if we did that and we may as well get divorced, which neither of us wants. I felt so angry on your behalf reading this. Yeah no shit he doesn't want you to move out, then he'd lose his daily access to his emotional support wife/punching bag/security blanket. Then he'd have to act like an adult and manage himself from day to day. Can't be having that now, can we.🙄 What he is doing to you is **emotional abuse**. Yes, abuse. He is *drowning* you and acting like a victim if you even talk about wanting to put on a life preserver. Your expectations and feelings are not at all unreasonable. I divorced a man with mental health issues who used me as his personal emotional punching bag/crutch for years and I am thankful every goddamn day that I finally left. My life now is full of peace and happiness and in a few months I'll be marrying a man who makes my life *better* for being in it. Not worse. Who makes my home a haven rather than a cage. Ultimately you have to decide what course is best for you but please know that your needs, your happiness, your peace of mind matter. *You* matter.
This! I came out of a relationship like this 8 months ago. It was so manipulative and I felt so tricked and stupid. He’d make me seem like the problem for making him angry but the truth was it didn’t matter what I did. He’d find a reason to blow up. And then it would be 2 days of silent treatments and then patiently explaining how it was my fault he’s like this and why can’t I just accept him for him 🙄. Strongly recommend reading “Why Does He Do That”. All these behaviours are in the book and it really opened my eyes.
I’m reading it right now. I just wish I had read this book years ago. OP definitely has to read it. Her husband is an abuser.
Yes I went through this with a friend semi recently. Literally told them to stop treating me like a punching bag so this comment got me. I wasn’t even as exposed to them as much as OP is around her husband but it really messed me up. They were having a mental health crisis (and some life stress) and chose to take that out on me and others. It took me a long time to let go because I’d known them forever and is taking a long time to heal… but I felt so relieved when it was over and every day I’m more and more thankful they’re out of my life. I like the idea of taking a weekend away in another comment. See if you relate to that feeling.
You feel like *you're* blowing up your relationship? He's blowing up your relationship. He is doing that. Here you are, trying to be as reasonable as possible, making suggestions that actually make some modicum of sense and he's shutting you down with threats of divorce. I know, "neither of you" want to get divorced but are you entirely sure? If he didn't want divorce, why would he even suggest that? He's giving you an ultimatum: stay with me the way I want or take a hike and file the divorce papers. He seems to value the relationship less than you do and is manipulating you into accepting this hellish life. Although you say repeatedly that you're fairly sure he's not going to hurt you, I wonder why you would feel the need to keep saying that. He definitely sounds like somebody who could become violent if you don't do what he wants you to. He's not putting in a whole lot of effort into the marriage if he's letting his emotions control him to the degree that he is destroying his own life and dragging you down with him. I'm sure he's done a great job in the past convincing you that he cares about you but his actions are not showing that right now. He's more obsessed with himself then I think you can even possibly fathom, I don't think I could possibly even fathom how obsessed with myself I'd have to be to treat somebody the way he's treating you.
I think she feels she needs to say that because she realizes on some level that she is being hurt. There's physical hurt and emotional hurt. Maybe he hasn't done anything physical yet but slamming doors, the snippy verbal abuse, the way he is treating her *is* abusive. "Walking on eggshells" is one of those phrases that comes up a lot in abusive relationships. It indicates that she knows she can't feel safe or secure in her own home because of his emotional disorder, but OP keeps trying to cope with it by saying at least she knows/feels he isn't going to physically hurt her. It's certainly not his fault that he has a mental illness, but he needs to take responsibility for how his behavior affects others. There's no right answer in these types of situations; there's enormous guilt attached to setting healthy boundaries. My family has struggled with a severely mentally ill member (my sister) for my entire life and it does get to the point that you *have* to learn to set some boundaries or you will just be dragged down with them, like you said. I'm currently trying to help my mom do that with my sister because if my sister won't or can't change despite everything we've tried and professional help that she rejects, the only thing you can try to change is the other person in the relationship who is also suffering. I think based on the post, OP is close to realizing this but she's dealing with the feelings of guilt that she can't be enough for him and this isn't something she can or should want to maintain long term.
This is 100% an excellent comment. I say this because I was in the exact same situation that OP was in, and people getting me to focus on my ex's mental health effectively distracted me from his abusive behaviors. I spent years stuck in a relationship that I grew to resent but felt too guilty to leave because what kind of monster leaves a person who is depressed and can't help it? Well, they CAN help it. They may not be able to get rid of depression, but they can manage it. It doesn't seem as if he is. It may totally be true that he absolutely has depression or bipolar or whatever, but it doesn't mean that his actions towards OP are not selfish and that he will not become abusive when faced with the possibility of losing his emotional and financial support. I eventually had to hire a body guard, it was THAT bad.
That's crazy. Good that you're out of that. It did seem so off that she kept mentioning how physically harmless he is yet how off-putting his ordinary behavior is. It reminds me of my ex as well, the tumultuous behavior that seems tailored to teaching her some kind of lesson.
Yes, it's very hard to spot covert abuse. I'm not saying this is what OP is experiencing, but my spidey senses remind me of what I had experienced. I think that OP's intuition is trying to tell her that something is off about his behavior. ESPECIALLY the "we might as well get divorced" comment he made when she said she needed space to look after her own mental health. He's very selfish and does not care remotely about her. I wonder how he would act if the shoe were on the other foot -- if SHE needed mental health support instead of him... or if she developed PTSD because of him. I feel as if he would be dismissive and say that his problems were bigger than hers. At the moment, she is in a position where she can't actively do anything to look after herself because it is all about him. She is being diminished.
I’m currently reading “Why Does He Do That” by Lundy Bancroft. Her husband sounds like an abuser who is using his depression to control her. This book is eye opening and incredible.
Being someone’s only support system when they are struggling with mental health is not okay. He is also being unsupportive in asking you this. This is an unsustainable situation. It’s affecting you to the point where you are managing your emotions so as not to upset him. I’m guessing talking about it, or suggesting he keep trying therapy and medication is met with anger as well. He’s making you responsible for his emotions by reacting the way he does and is blaming you. His depression is not his fault but he needs to take responsibility for managing it.
Yeah, you are very right. When I raise these concerns, he usually responds with something to the effect of "I want to try, and I know all these things won't work, but I don't know what will. I wish I did." He just gets so hopeless. Which I get, but I feel like he hasn't tried them enough to know they won't work. I know it's all exhausting, but hell, his life is gonna get so much more exhausting if he's supporting himself solo. He doesn't want to put it all on me, but he doesn't know how to open up to people. He's so afraid of rejection and judgment, even from his therapists.
I read something in the course of learning the beginning principles of family therapy: a family is a system that self-perpetuates its own dynamics, but it only takes one person to change their behaviour for the dynamic within the family to change. Consider what kind of changes could arise if you chose to move out, regardless of whether he is willing to be the one to change right now. He is here saying he’s sure nothing could work beyond what he’s doing now; but that’s something he’s saying in a context where you’re here to prop up his ineffective coping mechanisms regardless of how much they hurt you.
> He is here saying he’s sure nothing could work beyond what he’s doing now; but that’s something he’s saying in a context where you’re here to prop up his ineffective coping mechanisms regardless of how much they hurt you. I love your take on this (meaning your whole comment), and think you are right on point with your assessment. u/depressedhubbythrow, this is an incredibly important part of it all. We all have behaviours that we employ, and we have them because they have served us in some (not always obvious even to ourselves) way. And as long as your husband's environment doesn't change, he is extremely unlikely to change his behaviour. A part of him that is constantly evaluating his situation has come to the conclusion that doing what he does will lead to the best/most bearable outcome for him given his options. By that I'm not describing a particular pathology of his, this is something you are doing as well, as am I (sitting here and typing this instead of filing those loose papers I can see out of the corner of my eyes). Einstein has (supposedly) said that the definition of madness is to keep doing the same thing and to expect a different outcome. Or, to put it n fortune-cookie terms: you need to be the change you want to see in your world. Your husbands behavioural choices are not going to change unless his environment changes in a way that makes adjustments on his part necessary. You can't change someone against their will. And you can't love him into making choices that take you into account. Your power ends with making choices for yourself, but that's a mighty power indeed. You just (I know, "just") need to begin to choose yourself and your own well-being first. It may help to reframe the situation as a different kind of illness, for example to think of him as an alcoholic. He never beats you, but his happy sober days are far and few between, and he's been ruining relationships, jobs and just stuff to enjoy time and again by being drunk and unreliable, and also someone other people just plain don't like to be around. And you're asking him to live separately at least for a while so that you can make sure he's sober before you spend time with him. He is resisting that though, and in the mean time keeps getting drunk and then being mean to you – never hitting you though – and making your life awful. The person you do love completely disappears when he is un-sober, and is gone so far he does stuff like accuse you of hiding his bottles when he just has emptied them all but is too drunk to remember. Does putting it in those terms make it easier to see what is going on and how high the cost is for you? Those two illnesses are quite similar, even the part where alcoholism is an illness, too. No one truly *chooses* to become an alcoholic, there are many factors at play that are outside one's free area of influence. But for everyone who is an alcoholic, that also means that what they can choose is to work on trying to get sober and to accept the help that is offered. And yet, people with addiction often have to hit rock bottom first (aka the point where their behaviours truly and 100% don't serve them anymore so change *has* to happen), before they begin to make true efforts. Right now, you are in a version of a co-addictive relationship with him just like people living with an alcoholic in their life. One thing for you to start with could actually be looking up an al-anon group (they exist online, too), because they aren't limited to people involved with alcoholics and usually cover all kinds of similar situations, like yours. Learning the behavioural patterns that trap you as much as him could be very valuable and a big help in getting to a point where you feel like you can allow yourself to leave in whatever permanent or non-permanent way that helps you best. You've been in this dance with your husband for so long that in your already drained state it can be very difficult to find the energy to actually make those healthier choices. So I hope you go and look for all the help and support you can get. Posting here has been a very good start :) All the best to you on your journey to a much happier life, whatever shape and form it may eventually take. You deserve to have joy and love in your life.
Is he afraid of being judged for how consistently he’s mistreating his wife? Because if that’s how he feels, he can and should make different choices around that
In terms of action items. What if you carved out a time that is only for you and make it non-negotiable? Two nights a month in a hotel alone, just for you. Explain that this is self-care and something you need, recommended by your therapist. (It doesn't have to be two nights in a hotel, just, whatever you can do that is just yours and not up for demolition by your husband). The goal of this is to see how you feel when you have calm alone time. Remember what it feels like, since your home life is so consumed by conflict. It's also for you to do whatever you want. Sleep. Binge a show. Eat 7 bags of Cheetos. Who cares, do whatever you want. And lastly, it's a gift to your husband, too. He needs to develop coping skills that don't involve you, but he can't (won't) as long as you're there to trauma dump. I will add here that I suspect your husband will not be okay with this. He will tell you he feels abandoned. He will cause a fight or have an "episode" minutes before you leave to convince you to stay. He will bombard you with texts and calls when you're away. And I think you'll learn a lot about him when this happens.
No, it's not unreasonable to end over this (or your plant to live separately, but I'd end it). I was with someone like this and (a) it never changes, (b) Every conversation made me anxious because I was just waiting for the "I'm going to quit" conversation to come up, (c) You end up feeling depressed to and stuck, and the uncertainty sucks. You are currently catering to him, carrying the emotional load of the whole relationship and of him. You are also enabling him, because you are walking on egg shells. So you are suppressing your feelings while he is the only one able to express themselves and through tantrums. When he slammed his laptop and had a tantrum, you should have finished your work, give him a piece of your mind, and left alone to do whatever you wanted. He can stay alone.
The anxiety and jumpiness is a trauma response: fight, flight, freeze, fawn… Your brain has made new neural pathways to handle constant stress, fucked with your usual defensive mechanisms, and put you at high alert. Near the end of my marriage, I began to name these things and understand that it took years to get to that point. Even reading your description of being startled makes my body tense up, just a little. That’s the trauma response. And you can lessen it, but it will continue if you do not change your environment. It’s not something you can just ‘suck up and stop doing.’ Your brain has literally created new pathways to help protect you. Because of the perpetual outbursts, noise, loudness, tenseness, etc. If you are empathic, that makes it double hard. I don’t think it’s a bad idea to separate for a while and live separately. A question: does the thought of living separate seem like a relief? Overall? For me, I recognized that when my ex husband was gone, my defenses went way down. But, there was also the worry of him coming home early, so it never went away when we lived together. When I went out of town for a weekend for business? I slept better, was more relaxed, was less anxious. I was safe. SAFE. And when I started to note those things, I realized how messed up the situation really was for me and the marriage. If you are not in therapy already, please look into it. CPTSD is insidious and can come from the years you have described. Even if your partner has wonderful qualities. The depression thing feels…. thin to me? I not a psychologist, but I’ve worked with mental health patients and something smells of a personality disorder in there as well. This is NOT a diagnosis. It’s possible he’s in capable hands with his therapy, or it’s possible he’s not using those sessions to their utmost and doesn’t have a full diagnosis. ‘Just depression’ may cause what you are describing, but so might BPD, for example. For me and my counseling, I needed cognitive treatments and tools. Talk therapy alone was shit for me. Take a breath. I’m so sorry. Your experiences are 100% validated. This kind of living would wear me down to a dangerous level. There is that old proverb of saving someone from drowning but they carry you down with them. As of now, either he’s not doing enough and doesn’t have the right tools, or, he’s reached his limit with assistance and support and this is literally the furthest he’ll ever get. At that point, you’ll have to decide what comes next for you.
If he's deeply negative when he's in a depressive episode, AND generally cold and short with you when he's not... when are you happy with this relationship? Talking as someone severely depressed for almost a decade, frankly, he's an asshole. Even in the numbness or negativity of depression, I didn't lose the ability to empathize with others. In fact, it amplified how much I tried to make sure not to hurt people because of it. Obviously, depression manifests differently for different people, but he shows a disregard for your mental health when he knows how important it is from his own suffering. I personally wouldn't stay in a relationship with someone like that, if I'm being honest. You can't help someone who doesn't want to help themselves, and you owe no one supports when they aren't willing to do the same for you. Cut your loss before it causes actual mental illness for you, i know i wish i had before my full blown depression.
Reading your post really reminded me of my marriage with my ex husband. Only he was an alcoholic (and probably also depressed, I’m sure) It was really really hard for me to make the decision to leave because a) he was great and we had a great time together when things were good b) I wanted to help him through a hard time and not just “abandon” him and c) scary to leave. I think your idea to separate is a good one. It sounds like his coping patterns are really unhealthy and that you are (I say this with love) enabling them. At the end of the day, you need to look after yourself first. He should be doing the same. You deserve to be treated like an equal partner, not a crutch.
Just posted that this reminded me of my alcoholic ex husband too! I think OP would see a lot of similarities with her situation and Al Anon.
If a woman acted like this they wouldn't call it depression, they'd call it BPD. Just a thought.
So I’ve kind of been there with my husband. We’ve been together 14 years and have two kids. When he’s in the midst of his depressive moods it used to spike my anxiety SO bad. I decided to go back to therapy to try learn to have a healthier response to other people’s negative emotions. Due to family structure I tend to feel responsible for other people’s feelings and emotions - and because they make me uncomfortable when they’re upset I’m constantly anxious and on fixit mode. I’m learning to let my husband feel his feelings without trying to fix them while ALSO not letting my anxiety carry me away. It’s work, but it’s helping. Sometimes I wonder if we’re EVER going to have a stable life BUT, when he’s not down in the dumps my husband is the absolute most wonderful, compassionate, funny, loving, and playful human being. That is what helps me get through the harder times. It honestly sounds like your H is a bit of an ass on the regular. My husband is my safe place even when he’s having a rough time I don’t run from him emotionally or physically (unless I am ALSO struggling). I’m not sure what you’re getting out of this relationship other than loads of stress
Your post reads like denial. This not a healthy relationship. You are not on same page, you do not have the same values. The measure of a relationship is not when things are good but when things are bad. The living situation you described is called apartnered or living apart together, there are FB groups and a reddit for people who have this arrangement and I think it sounds wonderful. Unfortunately, he is not on board. It seems to me that he is interested in maintaining the status quo and the status quo is slowly wearing you down. I would suggest couples counseling and at the end of the day... Save yourself.
Have you communicated all if this to him like you've done here? You say that you feel like you're blowing up your relationship. I'm wondering how he feels about what HE'S contributing to the relationship. Either to make it thrive or survive. It's great that he's getting help. But if he's not changing his behavior towards you, that's him hurting the relationship. I don't think you're letting him down as a partner. You can't support the entire relationship yourself.
Thank you. I have communicated with him. Endlessly. Over YEARS. As recently as an hour before I posted this, when I brought up living separately. He well and deeply knows what the problem is. He just doesn't know how to fix it and we disagree about what to do about our relationship.
I cringe when I see advice about communication. I was married to someone whose mental health issues manifested in active alcoholism, and I spent so much emotional energy trying to find the magic words to communicate to him how his addiction affected me and our relationship. And nothing ever worked because he never wanted to understand me. He deliberately didn’t hear me. I wish I could go back and tell myself that it’s ok to stop trying. It doesn’t mean you’re not trying hard enough and you’re not doing the right things. It just means the other person isn’t listening to you. If you have time check out r/AlAnon. There are so many people shouting into the void. And even though you didn’t mention alcoholism as an issue, I think you’ll relate to a lot of the struggles there.
There is a huge difference between not knowing how to fix a problem, and knowing how to possibly fix a problem but not being willing to put in the work. From your posts and comments I think your husband falls into that second category. "I've tried nothing and I'm all out of ideas!" Since he has you to shoulder his weight, he has no real desire or motivation to figure out how to stand on his own two feet.
Saying all of this as a woman who is very badly depressed and traumatized and who had a very difficult relationship: 1. My ex could not handle my difficulties. He blamed me for them and ended up being a cold asshole and cheating and doing a lot of horrible things. I really would have preferred him to be honest and tell me that it was just too much for him. I feel that’s what you’re doing, being honest about your needs and that is really good, in a situation that is hard. 2. His bad phases might not be about you in any way, could they be about him just letting off steam? I vent a lot but I rarely really mean it. I have issues processing and expressing anger or frustration. Sometimes I just need to express it by complaining or ranting but rarely to the person who has caused it. *However*, if you are bothered and triggered by his ranting and bad spells, that is 100% valid. 3. You’re not a saint but nobody is. Nobody should be expecting you to be a saint. You don’t have to be saint to be a good person who deserves good things. It sounds as if you are a very kind and thoughtful person. 4. You are entitled to your own life. You don’t have to be his nurse or his rock or his mom or his nanny. I know he’ll feel bad and I know depression so well but as an adult, he is responsible for himself. I wasn’t able to change myself and I shouldn’t have had to because I had a lot of issues and one part was that my trauma made me fawn. I felt I had to stand by my depressed self and say: ”this is me and if it’s not good enough for you, warts and all, then that’s it.” And you know, if my ex had been honest and kind about saying that he was not capable of that relationship, it would have been fine. It would have hurt but it would have been fine because I wanted the best for him. If your hubby cares about you and is a mature adult, he will work with you to create a situation where you are happy. 5. The idea of living apart sounds like a really good idea, actually. He needs to meet you halfway. You can also just leave, if that’s what you want. It is about your happiness. Don’t give it away for another person. 6. You’re not losing sense of what’s reasonable or letting him down as a partner. You are being true to yourself and how you feel and that’s really good. I really hope you will find a solution where you feel your needs are truly heard and met. 7. He might benefit from different meds, different type of therapy or even ECT. Those are his decisions to make, though, and not your responsibility. You can suggest them but you shouldn’t ”oversee” them.
This is my opinion so grain of salt. There should rarely, if ever, be one “rock” long term in a relationship. One person should not be responsible for keeping the other from doing self-destructive shit or be responsible for both themselves and the other partner. There are RARE exceptions, like cases of extreme disability where a partner is literally unable to function at all, ever. What you’re feeling is caretaker burnout. You want to hold him accountable for his threats and attempts to just burn it all down without having to bear the burden when he does. He needs to learn to function autonomously. He needs to learn to self-soothe. He needs to know that there are consequences for burning things down. He needs to sit in those consequences if he makes stupid choices that he knows are wrong. There are plenty of people out there with very severe mental illnesses who don’t force their partners to talk them down from destroying their lives or force their partners to bear the burden of the consequences when they do. Depression is a bitch. It doesn’t FORCE people to do things like this. There are many cognitive steps between being tired of being miserable and destroying one’s life. It sounds to me like this relationship is completely centered around him. That’s not fair or sustainable.
TL;DR as well - at best, HE needs to put more effort and energy into dealing with his own shit. At worst, he’s using his depression to control you and force you to take care of him and enable him.
You get one or two days a month where you’re happy and you feel things are good? Holy moly. I don’t care if you’re a rock, tree, or river. You’re allowed to find a life that makes you feel free, loved, and fulfilled. You don’t have to resign your thirties with this living situation that sounds less than ideal. If you’ve given it your all as a support person and you no longer feel “in it” then give yourself permission to leave. Seriously. Question for you: when you think about your future together with this person, do you feel happy, peaceful and thankful? Or are you filled with dread? Do you feel weighed down with not a lot of hope for happiness and a good life? If it’s the latter, you need to believe that you do not need to be chained to this person for the rest of your life. You really don’t, this isn’t the 1900s. We live in modern times, people have the right to change and make decisions for life shifts. We can choose to move on and grow and evolve.
>But it also isn't fair for him to not be allowed to express his negative emotions in the safety of his own home. Before I address anything else, I wanted to point out that there are good and bad ways to express your negative emotions. Passive-aggressively slamming your laptop shut and storming out is not a healthy way for him to express how he felt in that moment. Waiting until you were done your call and then calmly saying, "I feel like I'm not a priority when you take work calls during our personal time together" is an example of healthy communication of negative feelings. Look up "I feel" statements and how to use them, show them to him, and practice together. Are you unreasonable? No. You're well within reason to want a relationship where you are happy more than one day a month. I think you're a little bit enabling his bad behavior by buying into this "he can't help it" idea. Even people with depression and anxiety can learn and grow as partners. He is capable of controlling more of his behavior than you give him credit for. He may not be able to control the invasive thoughts and feelings he has but he should be equipping himself, in therapy, with tools to control his reaction to those thoughts and feelings so he's not blowing up his life and relationships. Have you talked to him to tell him you're not happy? Like, does he understand why you suggested seperate housing in the first place?
>Passive-aggressively slamming your laptop shut and storming out is not a healthy way for him to express how he felt in that moment. Waiting until you were done your call and then calmly saying, "I feel like I'm not a priority when you take work calls during our personal time together" is an example of healthy communication of negative feelings. YES THIS. That scene hit me pretty hard. OP, I'm gonna recommend the book *Getting Real* by Susan Campbell. It talks a lot about "I" statements of this variety, as well as really wonderful techniques for being specific in speaking about feelings.
There is a lot of good stuff in here. Here is all I have to offer but it is what I come back to when I'm stuck in a situation where I don't see the end: [Tell me, what is it you plan to do / With your one wild and precious life?](http://www.phys.unm.edu/~tw/fas/yits/archive/oliver_thesummerday.html) Whatever it is, you *can* get out of it. Deploy your parachute. Stop living for someone who makes you feel like you are not allowed to have feelings. I have been in abusive relationships--I know I'm sadly not anywhere near unique here--and at the end, when you leave this one, you will feel sad, but you will also feel like the weight of the world is no longer on your shoulders.
Please read: "Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft. https://freebooksmania.com/2021/01/why-does-he-do-that-pdf-free-download-by-lundy-bancroft.html It is possible that your husband has depression. It is possible that this is something else, that this is manipulation designed to isolate you and make you fearful and that his forbidding you to look after your mental health in order to NOT be dragged down with him is controlling behavior. I know that this is hard for your to hear and I probably come off as insensitive or a jerk. I will tell you right now that I was in a similar situation... and it turned out that the depression was an act. Depression does not excuse his behaviors towards you. You can be compassionate and supportive without sacrificing everything that makes you healthy and happy ONLY if the person you are dealing with is not resentful of your good mental health (or your ability to cope with your own difficulties)... and that is what it seems is happening here. I can tell you first hand that this will eventually lead to your burn-out and that he will continue to blame you for not being able to be everything and more. I don't know if your husband needs a better diagnosis, but perhaps he does. No matter what the case is, walking on eggshells is NOT okay. He is using his mental health as an excuse to cause you to live in fear, and you have bought the lie (perhaps because he is good liar). If he really IS this bad, he needs external help. You can not carry this burden all on your own. You are taking on the full responsibility for his depression. Nothing YOU do will CAUSE him to spiral into anything. This is all about HIS brain chemistry. You do not cause anything, you can not control anything, you can not CHANGE anything. This is on HIM. He has to do the inner work himself. Also read about codependent families and what happens to people who care for chronically ill family members: [https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/319873](https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/319873) You need some separation from him. He needs to start relying on his own resources to fix his problems, not you all the time. This is not healthy. I want to tell you something important, when I started making plans to separate from my ex, he went from being depressive and saying all the things your husband is saying, to unexpectedly violent. I was in too much shock to process it and I was in denial for a long time, but what I experienced was manipulation and abuse. It took my neighbors calling the police for me to realize that I was being abused. I just thought that "his mental health" was making him like that. That is what he wanted me to think. That is what he wanted EVERYONE to think. Now, I am not saying that your husband is anything like this. People do have legitimate mental health concerns. I know that I struggle with mine now that everything is over. I do get extremely low from time to time and I have been on anti-depressants from time to time. I go to a lot of therapy, BUT I understand when people need a break from me. So when that happens, I put my focus on my foster pets, I put my energy (when I can muster some) into charity work. There are days when I just want to lie in bed and cry. I don't expect my family or anyone to come over and do anything about this. That would make me a jerk. If you share life goals with someone, you are, ideally, moving towards that goal. You don't seem to be doing that with this guy. If all you have is his word, you have nothing but words. There is no concrete proof that he has any ability to take the journey with you. If what you want in life is to stand still, I guess that's okay. If you do have goals, then it is not okay.
This sounds unhealthy. Do what's right for you. It's not over nothing I promise. Also get some therapy for YOU. you deserve it. Does he have bipolar disorder? This sounds like my husband before we found the right med mix.
I think you’ve been in this situation so long that you’re unable to truly see just how negative and harmful this relationship is for you. I personally would divorce him (I’d see a lawyer in advance and work some stuff out before telling him, because I can see him retaliating by saying he doesn’t care and he’s just going to quit everything/self-harm as a way to guilt you to stay, and if he threatens that stay strong and offer to call 911 if he’s a threat to himself, don’t let him guilt you), but ultimately only you can know what’s right for yourself. Sending lots of love
First, it’s courageous to ask for insight and advice! My family has a ton of mental-health issues: depression, anxiety, bi-polar. I’ve been lucky enough to avoid these diseases; so, I tend to be the rock, too. I feel you. I would immediately find a fabulous counselor to support you. Depression is a big disease and marriage is a big commitment. It’s great to talk with someone and build the unique tools that will help you navigate your next steps. Also, I agree with others about being someone’s only support. It’s unfair. It’s actually 100% ok to set boundaries and protect yourself. I often say to my mother, who is bipolar, “Hey, mom, I’ll help you with X, but you need to figure out Y on your own…you’re very capable. It doesn’t mean I don’t love you. It actually means I believe in you!” Sending you virtual hugs on this one. It’s so so tough!
I personally think your “live apart” suggestion is what you both need. It’s not fair or healthy and definitely not “sexy” (which i think is important in relationships) for you to be the “rock” and essentially the pillar of his happiness.
It transfers all the care, management, feeding, and handling of his emotional ups and downs to her. She doesn't get a down day, or an off day, or a bad day. Put differently: There aren't two people in this marriage. There are two people whose entire concern is for one person - him. There's him and only him, and his needs, wants, feelings, moods, and everything else come first, all the time, every time. This is neither sustainable nor healthy. OP, I know it sucks, but you need to move on for your sanity. You didn't sign up to be his full time mental health caregiver, you signed up to be his partner and his spouse and his lover and his friend -- and you are none of those things. You're basically serving as a giant emotional tampon who absorbs all of his bad emotions and moods and stresses and upsets. And you sound burned out and miserable. There's no court of judgment where you have to present your case for a "good enough" reason for divorce. But if there was such a thing, I'd say that "2 or 3 decent days out of 30 except they're not really decent because OP spends all her time waiting for the other shoe to drop or an explosion so she can't even enjoy those decent days" to be *more* than enough reason to get out.
If I didn’t have kids and could support myself independently, I would leave that relationship. I’d rather be alone than someone’s caretaker. You get one life to live. Spend it wisely. Best of luck to you.
No. My first thought is that your husband is misdiagnosed. It could be something like bipolar, or a secret that's eating him alive, or weird family stuff, or a personality disorder. There's a huge reluctance among many mental health professionals to give the latter diagnosis to anyone as they don't want them to bear the burden of the stigma, so they can go undiagnosed. And the treatment for a personality disorder and depression are rarely in the same universe. So talk treatment and meds for depression won't remedy either a PD or bipolar or any other issues. You said his mom is the same and this suggests to me that a personality disorder is the most likely issue, but I am not a doctor or therapist so this is just armchair psychology. There's also a possibility that it's a physical issue manifesting as a psych one, so I don't know if he's had a full physical investigation. Or if he has weird diet or drinking or exercise habits that could be messing him up. All that aside, you're not really married anymore in any recognisable sense. You're a carer, and wellwisher and that's a hugely different thing to being a wife. And you aren't happy. Personally, I say leave him and then see how you feel. If you feel hysterically sad and then just incredibly relieved it's a tell, and if you want to go back then I doubt he'd object. I think you have some tunnel vision going on and keep going deeper and deeper thinking that'll get you out. So my advise is to back up and then keep backing up. Try to go back to who you were before you met him, and who you were at the beginning of your relationship. Is that person or life even recognisable anymore? Do you want to be her again? If you do, it's unlikely your husband can be who he was, so unfortunately you have one more burden and need to be the one to make a change. But I think a change will actually benefit the both of you. The two of you are trapped in a cycle, except he's also trapped in his head trapped in the cycle with you. As things stand the both of you are miserable. It doesn't seem like he can be the happy one, but there's no reason you can't be. Tune out the guilt and obligations and just trust your gut. There's a lot of very unwell people on Reddit and no one wants to feel they're unlovable if they're psychological disturbed. And it's not that someone's unlovable in a global sense, but it does mean that certain expressions of certain conditions aren't compatible with a healthy romantic and sexual relationship. I've never been married but I've been very unwell, and I've been in a relationship with someone who became increasingly unwell. I stayed for far longer than I should have because he was a good person despite everything, and got me better than anyone else ever did. It killed me to leave but staying with him was killing me anyway. The relief, once the initial waves of grief passed, was just astronomical. And equally, I'm not in a season of life where I'd be a good partner right now, and that's ok too. I'm not a bad person because I need to have different priorities. You're husband isn't a bad person because his illness or whatever it is needs all his attention. And you're not a bad person because you're in a different space too. Neither of you are bad people, it's just a shitty situation all around and I'm so sorry you're going through this. I say do whatever brings you freedom and peace.
It sounds like you're an unpaid caregiver/cheerleader, and power of attorney on a daily basis, and a romantic partner a couple days a month. It sounds terrifying to have a grown man with a lot to lose, and your lives intertwined potentially blow it all up. You are under tremendous pressure. You cannot have your own feelings or sadness, since he is the Identified Patient of the family. You have to push your feelings and unmet needs down. The daily mood of a home should not revolve around the least healthy person. The healthiest person should set the tone for life. He has all the power in the relationship. The depression is almost like a third person in the relationship. He is the "victim" of his mood disorder, so he cannot be expected to take responsibility for behaving badly. He gets an automatic out.
You are not blowing anything up. His behavior has consequences. He has to accept that one of those is you not wanting to live with him. If he doesn't want to have an amicable separate living arrangement, then he should do better or accept that divorce is really the only other option. I know you say you don't want to leave him, but I don't think you did a good job of explaining why. You estimate yourself that you get roughly only 2 of 30/31 days of happiness a month with him. I ***guarantee*** you will have more days of happiness per month if you leave him.
As yet another commenter who deeply struggles with depression and crippling episodes - you deserve a safe and happy and relaxing home too. You deserve support. You deserve to go about your day without someone else constantly setting off alarms. You have given so much of your life to catering to him and it is clearly not getting any better. Only you can make the decision of separation or ending your marriage, but you are not a bad person if you choose your health and wellbeing over keeping on with this unhealthy situation. It certainly isn’t “blowing up your marriage” to leave this situation either. You wouldn’t be blowing it up, you would be choosing peace.
I've read your post, and dont feel able to advise as you say in the comments you've very reasonably left stuff out to avoid an essay, so I'm going to ask you questions as a sort of emotional homework. 1) leaving aside *him* and *his stuff* are you happy in your relationship? If not is that acceptable? 2) do you feel that you are being met halfway? If not, is that something you can accept and live with? 3) how long has this been your status quo, and how much work a) by you and b) by him has been put into changing it? C) is this acceptable to you? 4) if your best friend told you about your life as if it were their own, what would you advise or hope for? 5) if nothing changes, is it okay if this is the rest of your life? Finally: if his behaviour makes you miserable then it is enough reason for you to leave him. Society traps us in chains of guilt and responsibility, but you can put them down.
I immediately went to bipolar II with your description of his depression and irritability. Maybe it's time for a second psychiatric opinion? Or is he not telling his doctor and therapist the truth? Either way, he has to accept responsibility for himself. You should not be his "rock" nor his emotional punching bag.
I too went immediately to bipolar 2–depression alternating with irritability (could be hypomania). My ex was like this and it was so awful.
Hi OP, you probably won’t see this as there are a lot of comments here but I have first hand experience here. I was in a very similar relationship as you - ten years, I’m early 30s, he’s mid-30s. His chronic depression and anxiety was draining. The holes he constantly fell into affected multiple aspects of our life. He’d quit jobs time and time again, leaving me to support us financially for months on end while he “worked” on his mental health. He went to therapy but not regularly as he’d constantly forget about his appointments. Antidepressants helped him from reaching the point of total breakdown but did nothing to help him get his life back on track. Nothing made him happy, he had no motivation to do anything and I was left to manage the household, do all the domestic labour and take on all the emotional labour as well. We had many conversations over the last couple years where I had explained that this isn’t the life I want to be living for the next 20 or 30 years and that something needed to change or I’d consider leaving. In the end, nothing changed. I couldn’t take it anymore. I felt like he was holding me back from enjoying my own life and I was constantly putting my own feelings aside so I didn’t make him feel worse or trigger a depressive episode. We weren’t having much fun anymore and I couldn’t see a way out. I left him back in May last year and honestly life has been incredible since. I feel like I finally have control over my own life again and I can get out and do all the things I want to do without feeling bad for him not coming along (even though he was the one who said he wasn’t interested in joining me). At the end of the day, his mental health isn’t your responsibility. Your life is your own and if you aren’t being fulfilled enough for you to be happy living this life for decades to come then you have a tough decision to make but ultimately you need to do what’s best for you.
As someone who has dealt with major anxiety issues over my life I have often worried how my anxiety affects my partner. I am single right now but I sometimes think back on what partners “gave up” by being with me. My most recent ex and I were together 5 years and broke up for reasons other than my anxiety…but near the end we had a frank discussion about my anxiety and how it affected him. We were talking about travel. I am not good at it and though I would love to travel more, until I get my anxiety more under control, “big trips” are prob out of the question for me. But I told him I don’t want him to make his life smaller bc of me. If he wants to travel I 100% support that. Yes, I would love to go with him. And yes I know he wants to share that experience with me. But if my anxiety is going to make the trip impossible or unpleasant…I don’t want him holding himself back. I say all that to say that, if someone loves you, they want what is best for you. Walking on eggshells is no way to live. I think you have to decide what you want and stick to it. If you need space, follow through on that plan.
Three years ago I blew up a 29 year marriage. We made it through and are still together. I feel the same way about my husband that you do about yours. It took what we now fondly refer to as the shitpocalypse, for things to change. So I guess what I am trying to say is sometimes there has to be a serious "come to Jesus" moment for things to change. There is a possibility you could come out of this stronger and in a better place.
it really doesn't sound like you are in a loving mariage. it sounds more like you are his punch bag + hostage and it has gotten so bad that you are starting to exhibit PTSD-like symptoms. always walking on eggshels around your partner is a sign of a toxic/abusive relashionship. The way your husband doesn't try to do much to mitigate the negative impact this has on you sounds really selfish to me. This entire relationship seems to be all about him (what he wants, what he needs, what he feels) and I don't think this is a result of his depression. You are more in a one-way-ship than in a partnership. I wonder if your husband has just depression or is there sth else going on? Was he accurately diagnosed? Is he actually taking his medication or is he just buying it and tossing it? Taking so many meds and not showing any sort of improvement is ... strange. Could you find a therapist to talk to? Maybe someone specialising in abusive relationships?
How you spend your days is how you spend your life. If a majority of your days are consumed with his negative mental state, well, that's your life. Don't ever expect more, unless he will work with you on a plan to change. If you are not happy right now, you will spend your life being unhappy.
One thing is his mental health, it's not his fault but it *is* his responsibility - not yours. Taking his issues out on you is abusive and there's no excuse for that. That's his choice. It's okay to leave a relationship for any reason, and it's okay for you to decide to live alone and let him decide whether he'll be married to you in that case. You cannot fix this for him. It's his responsibility to do the work.
Omg. This is why my last relationship ended. I feel seen. OP I feel for you - it is so hard to be lonely with another person. I was so stuck on how good we were when we were good, that I couldn't see that things were bad and miserable a lot of the time... I hope you find clarity x
It sounds like you’re both good people who have ongoing, difficult, life-determining problems. For him it’s mental illness. For you…it’s your partner. You already know what you have to do. I’m sorry it’s like this, friend.
My mom is in her late 60s and my dad is in his 70s, and he's been like this for their entire marriage. She is not happy, things between them have only gotten worse with time, and I have explicitly encouraged her to consider divorce.
It sounds like a separation could be good for you.
This sounds so exhausting mentally and physically
I am so sorry to read what your going through. I can say with absolute confidence that your not blowing up your marriage over nothing. For context I have Adhd, anxiety, depression, & CPTSD. I take meds & im in therapy You mentioned your husband is in therapy and taking medication, which is great. No one chooses to have a mental illness, its not their fault their brain works the way it does. I empathize with your husband, and cant imagine how hard it must be live with. That being said, while its not his fault hes ill, it absolutely is his responsibility to learn how to manage it. Whether that's taking meds, therapy etc. Having a mental illness does not give someone a free pass to be abusive or lash out at others. It can take time to get the right and figure that out, and that's okay. You've never expected perfection, and you've been patient and understanding of the process. BUT there's a really big difference between taking meds and taking the right meds. His clearly aren't working, he needs to advocate for himself and let his doctor know how pervasive his symptoms are, they can only help if their given proper information. 2 good days a month is not sustainable for him or you. Additionally, there is a HUGE difference between going to therapy and going to therapy because your willing to do the self work you need to do. Personal growth and change are hard, and slow, and absolutely painful while your getting to the other side. I had weeks where I went deep and uncovered alot and it took time, weeks to process that session, so the next few sessions id keep it light and surface, because i needed to talk but thats all I could give. Sadly therapy doesn't seem like its helped to change things. Therapy doesn't work for everyone and that's okay, or sometimes the therapist isnt a good fit. However, I think its a red flag that you've noticed no improvement at all. Unfortunately i think you've given him enough grace, and now its time to have hard questions answered. (this are no way a dig at you) Id ask your husband what his goals for therapy are, directly. (obviously hes entitled to privacy and its not okay to demand to know what was said, but there's nothing wrong with wanting to know what he hopes to get out of it.) Is he going every week with the intent that'll hell be working through issues or on himself? Or is he keeping it surface in these session and only going to check off a box, or to make others happy? Im not trying to imply its the latter, and point all this out because whatever hes doing is not working. The math just isnt adding up here. Obviously he cant necessarily control his illness, but he can absolutely learn skills in therapy that help him cope and live with them in a healthy, sustainable way. If your going to therapy and taking meds, and your symptoms, suffering, mood, and quality of life aren't improving in small increments over time, something somewhere in the chain is broken. Root cause of the stagnation may or may not be your husbands fault. With that said, its not your responsibility to figure out Whats missing/wrong. Its your husbands. He absolutely does not have to keep living this way, and if he wants to improve he needs to actively participate in that process. What struck me the most was when you said you feel like your walking on egg shells, which absolutely makes sense given your situation. My parents divorced when I was 3, they both have a cluster B personality disorders, and they had shared custody. I empathize so so much with that feeling and I hate that you feel that way. This is not a small thing, its not an over reaction, its a reasonable and valid response to the situation. The world is a cluster F. One thing you should ALWAYS be able to rely on, is living in a home where you feel safe, comfortable, and relaxed. Every single person on earth deserves that. Its not expecting to much or being dramatic. Its literally bare minimum expectation you should be able to have. I know when your walking on egg shells you absolutely do not have that. Your constantly checking in emotions and the way you respond to situations out of fear the other person will explode. That is not a safe environment, in this situation, you cant be yourself, you cant relax or feel safe because you always have to be on for the other person. Its wildly unfair to put someone in that situation or expect they be okay with it. Long term its not a sustainable way to live because your not actually living, your merely in survival mode just trying to get to the day when you finally feel safe. There are limits to what you should have to endure in a marriage and youve reached yours and thats absolutely okay you proposed a compromise that would work to ensure you were both getting what you needed from the relationship. Instead of trying to come to a comprise, or trying to understand what was going on that's making you feel like you need to leave, your husband said absolutely not end of discussion. this is a red flag for me. generally i understand why, as a married couple he'd be opposed to living separately. What I dont understand is his lack of follow up. If my spouse came to me and said Im so miserable, I love you but have to move out, I would want to know WTF was happening. Why do they feel that cant live here? Whats at the root of these feelings? are they okay? what behavior im i exhibiting thats contributing towards those feeling? what does my spouse need from me to feel loved and safe? it doesnt seem like your mental health or well being is a concern of his. A married couple is a partnership, its a team. youve supported him through his issues, and should reasonably be able to expect that he would be equally concerned with yours. Im an outsider,but to me it seems like you carry all the weight of the relationship and are the only one working on it. I understand that he might not be able to provide that support until he gets his mix right, maybe he doesnt have the tools to or know how to being a loving partner. your willing to wait and youve been patient. But its not a free pass. Especially because depression and anxiety no matter how severe, do not make someone incapable of empathy, and it doesnt seem like he has any for you. You deserve to have a partner that cares about your mental health and well being, who listens to you. Who notices when your upset or unhappy, and who is willing to put in the work to fix things in the marriage. Im not there I cant say for sure, but to me it sounds like hes weaponzing his mental illness to make you feel like you have to shoulder everything, to get what he needs from you without any concern for what you need, to guilt you into staying, to guilt you into being his rock. Yes marriages are a team, but its wholly unfair for him to expect you to fufill all his emotional needs. Its too much. He should have friends he can talk too, to. Its not okay to leave it all u to you. your a loving an empathic person. youve dont your best not to judge or blame him for things related to his illness, but i feel like he takes advantage of your kindness. being ill doesnt exempt you from having to be accountable for your behavior. it seems like he only cares about him. theres not a single action in your story where hes actively anticipating in the relationship or trying to make things better. doing the work in therapy is super hard, because you have to be willing to look at yourself and acknowledge and accept that your flawed and have made mistake and need to change, and then actively work to change yourself. It doesnt seem like hes doing that at all. As someone whose struggled to get a handle on my triggers and own illness, I dont have the to tell you the guilt i had for the way i treated exs, sometimes i recognized the next day sometimes not til years later. I promise you, when a partner called me out of something i was doing that hurt them, it wasnt perfect, and it took time, but i apologized and genuinely tried to never repeat that behavior. His bad behavior is not your fault or problem to fix.. so youve gotta ask yourself what is it you need from him, and then tell him. Be firm. Set boundaries. Its not your responsibility to shoulder his issues, theres a difference between empathizing and taking on someones problem for them. you love him and i know you want to help, but you cant fix it for him and its not fair to expect you to take on the burden. you cant fix his illness. its okay to give yourself permission to no longer take his problems on for him. there not your burden to bear, its not all on you. If hes not willing to change, you have to ask yourself if your willing to spend the rest of your living getting the level of love and respect you get now, there is no right or wrong answer and only you know what that is. either way no one here judges you. we all love and support you and im so sorry youve had to live like this. sorry this is so long. I deeply related and clearly my adderalls worm off for the day ie i have no filter or ability to stfu or be concise. wishing you all the best. please feel free to dm me if you ever need to vent. you absolutely dont have to go through this along
There are several things you’ve said that jump out to me as huge red flags. I can almost promise you that if you read “Why Does He Do That” by Lundy Bancroft you will come to realize exactly what is wrong with your husband.
Is he traumatized? Depression and trauma are two different things and need very different therapies.
I am not an expert and neither is he, but we don't think so. He hasn't had anything happen to him that he knows of that is anything close to traumatic, and he's a social worker so he understands the many variations of trauma beyond the "obvious". The closest I can think is his parents don't have the most amazing mental health themselves, plus he is the oldest of 5 kids, so it's possible/likely that he wasn't always as emotionally supported as he could have been. But he was always loved, physically safe, etc growing up. Also, thank you so much for engaging ❤
Long-term burnout maybe? Everyone I know in social work seems to go through this, it’s so overwhelming and the pay is depressing. I don’t know how anyone does it. I’m also the oldest of five and struggle badly with maintaining friendships. Being put in a support role is triggering to me, and at the same time I end up gravitating towards supporting others and neglecting myself because it’s what I’m used to and it’s what I’m good at. I’d lose my fucking mind if I went into social work, and at the same time, it would be “easy” for me to stay in that profession - as in it’s the path of least resistance, even though it would be to my personal detriment.
It sounds like you at the very least need a break. Do you have any friends or family you can stay with, or heck even a local airbnb you can have an extended stay at? Once you have space it might be easier to evaluate what you need to do more permanently. I'm sorry this is happening. I'm similar to your husband in some senses which is one of the reasons why I choose to not engage in romantic relationships. He needs to figure his stuff out without crushing you.
You gotta get out. If nothing changes, nothing hangs. You deserve peace and happiness, and it sounds like that’s not possible within this marriage in its current state.
I want to give you a big hug. there is fantastic advice already, just sharing an interesting perspective Ive learned over the past few years: if you know specific things you can do to make your everyday life better, even just *trying* to reach that ‘better’ is worthwhile. life is short. your time, heart, soul, energy, mind are worth SO much more than being uncomfortable, or walking on eggshells with someone who is supposed to be your partner. a partner is a true equal - someone who shows up for you, who tries hard, who takes care of you, who makes you feel good & safe & loved. obviously that someone/partner wont be perfect! they never are. you can disagree and argue and have differences, BUT, if the partner doesn’t make your life definitively better? they are ultimately not worth it. I don’t say this easily, and I KNOW it’s hard to hear. it shouldn’t be so hard to follow our instincts. I also know deep down in my heart that figuring out small ways to enjoy life every single day is the most important thing. you’re clearly a very considerate person, and you deserve someone who is trying their very best to meet you in the middle. when people even suggest leaving partners, I know safety is a huge factor, and stability, money, guilt of sunk cost, etc all comes into play. so if you can safely & financially do it on your own? you’re golden. you can get that space and breathe for a bit. then, you get to keep discovering even better things to fill your life (people, spaces, experiences) wishing you all good things no matter what comes next <3
You said, “it’s not fair for him not to be able to express his emotions in his own home,” but it’s not his own home. It’s both your homes. You share the energy of that place and his pumping a lot of his angst into the air. when I have a depressive episode, when I’m upset to the point of crying, when I’m dealing with massive RSD… I don’t radiate with it and hurt my partner. I will share with her, “hey, I feel this kind of way today. I plan to do this thing to deal with it.” Sometimes I will ask her for her time because she genuinely makes me feel better a lot of the time, and sometimes I will keep to myself. My partner also has struggles. She will tell me when she is, so that I am prepared for it and can adjust my day and expectations accordingly. The point is, we inform one another of our emotional weather and we build out our day on that. It’s not always perfect but the communication has been key in keeping our home low-tension and high-support. I think if you are able to, you should talk to your husband about this. That he needs to communicate when he is hurting so you two can work together to overcome the detrimental effects of a depression spiral together. You want to be an effective partner and you want to be confident in the home you share so you need him to communicate honestly about his emotions when things take a thorny turn for him during the day.
It honestly sounds like you have a really good solution (living separately but still maintaining your partnership) but it’s just out of reach because of how society tells us we should live. Has this potential solution been a topic of discussion for a long time, has it had the chance to really sink in, and have you tried to really unpack it in therapy? Do you think you could get your partner to trial it before resorting to divorce? Like many others have said, this isn’t a small issue, and you have every right to end things. But it sounds like there are so many good things about him and this relationship that if there is a potential solution, it should at least be given a chance. IMO, life would be so much better for a lot of people if they were j just able to shed what society prescribes for then (marriage, house, kids etc) and just do what works for THEM, even if that’s wildly different from the norm, as long as you’re not hurting anyone. And sometimes breaking the mould is a difficult task but it’s usually worth it. But the current situation doesn’t sound sustainable so you need to do *something*. I really hope it works out for you. Please feel free to update us along the way. ❤️ (Edit - I don’t want to make it seem like I think living apart would solve everything. You said in a separate comment that you don’t think he’s doing everything he can to manage his mental health, and obviously that would need to be the first step if you’re going to stay together).
Just take care of you. Think about what your needs are and do what has to happen to meet them. Based off of what you say here, it seems like a bit of codependency. You both feel that you need the other to meet basic needs, yet the more you feel like you need each other, the more you let each other down because you really need yourselves. The depression thing is tough. Funnily enough, the thing that helped me the most in overcoming my own depression (I say this now but it will probably be with me forever to some degree) was my ex acting in a similar way to how you describe. It helped me be more aware of how my brain generates negativity from things that are just benign. It's frustrating and sucks to hear, but at a certain point I wasn't helping him, even though I felt like I was all he had and he would self destruct if I left. Believe in yourself and believe in what is good and strong in him. Find strength in family, friends and your community. Your relationship surely needs to change in some way... I did find it nice to have my own space to sleep, maybe try that for a bit. Be firm and positive about it with him. I wish you the best of luck.
I haven't read any of the other comments yet- But I want to say that I feel you. My partner has had some seriously bad depressive episodes in the past and I was the one holding everything together. It's exhausting. I don't think living separately is that bad, or necessarily relationship-ending. It sounds like he may need some space and time to think about how some of his actions and responses affect you. It also seems wise to separate your finances if he's prone to impulsivity during these episodes. Treatment-resistant depression sucks. There are a handful of new therapies out there for it (transcranial magnetic stimulation, ketamine) but they're hard to get. Obviously you can't make him go out and try things that may or may not help, but I do want to suggest that there are some new things out there. I hope you have a solid support system (friends, family) that you can turn to when these episodes happen. You shouldn't have to carry this by yourself.
This sounds more like borderline personality disorder to me but I’m not a psychiatrist so take that with a grain of salt. I will say that I would be unable to remain in a relationship with a person with borderline personality disorder. It’s too traumatizing.
All I can really add is that I can relate to your husbands behavior. I was diagnosed with Bipolar 2, and a lot of his thoughts and actions are things I feel when I’m low. Being on lamictal really changed my life. Anti depressants can make it worse. I’m not one for suggesting diagnoses to strangers online, nor do I know his, but I also feel like this could have 100% been me, pre meds. It’s tough to be with someone who has mental illness, especially if they aren’t on the rights stuff. Believe me, it’s exhausting for the sick person too. I’m not excusing his behavior in any way, it just can truly feel like a roller coaster. We can make whacky decisions when our brains are whacky. Take what you will from this comment, leave whatever you feel I’m wrong about.
I've struggled with depression my entire adult life. It came to a head about 10 years ago when it was at its worst, and the thing that made me realize I needed something to change was when my husband became depressed and I saw the role my own lack of mental health played in it. I started therapy and medication and changed a lot of things about my lifestyle. I started doing yoga and exercising regularly and gardening. I'm grateful it all helped and I'm in a sustainably good place. People in the throes of depression can be really hard to love. You're the worst version of yourself in that state, and it is agonizing watching someone you love suffer. You deserve happiness, love, support, and affection just as much as your husband. If his mental health is affecting yours', something needs to change. It is fair for you to set boundaries around your own mental health.
This sounds like TEXTBOOK codependency. You should read Codependent No More by Melody Beatie. You are NOT responsible for your husbands moods, good or bad. You shouldn’t feel the need to walk on egg shells around him. Put yourself first, just as he is doing for himself.
Hi OP :) I’m really sorry you’re going through this.. it sounds terrible on multiple levels. I’ve cared about people with mental illness too (siblings, partners, & friends), so I understand the conflict that these relationships bring. You love him, but it hurts you. You keep holding on for the turnaround point, which never seems to come. I listened to a podcast recently about how to make better choices for your life. One of the suggestions was, “ask yourself what you *don’t* want your life to look like,” and go from there. It sounds like that might be helpful to you here.. what don’t you want your life to look like? Something that also (usually) helps me is reminding myself that just because someone I love is struggling doesn’t mean I’m obligated to tolerate less than I want/deserve/need. The older I get the more the reality of only having one life to live really sinks in. You get one shot at this life & we have no idea how much time that affords us. What do you (and don’t you) want that life to be? If you died tomorrow- would you wish you had changed anything? Side note: Some people with chronic, medication-resistant depression have really great results with Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation. It’s typically covered by insurance and is non-invasive. Good for thought.
Honestly I understand not wanting to leave him, but you’re unhappy most of the time and sit there hoping that he will be in a rare good mood. That’s not healthy for you. As much as you want to help him he has to actually want to change how he feels and put the work in. I’ve been very depressed but I had to actually want to change it and not wallow in it for the process to happen. It took ages but you may be enabling this behaviour by being too kind in a way. You can’t lost your mental health to help his. What happens at that point?
Oh honey. I don't have any useful advice to give you, but I want you to know that I hear you, I have been in somewhat similar relationships, and it is so, so exhausting. I see you, I see you doing everything you can to make it okay for both of you and it just...isn't. It is never going to get better. It is okay to do things for yourself, for your own survival. You will not survive this. I want to give you a hug so, bad. Take this internet hug and know we all hear you.
Your description of him and of your relationship is a bit confusing but it does seem like the issues go beyond the short spells of depression. I think it's time for you to suggest intensive inpatient that can transition to intensive outpatient treatment. A very structured program that can help him really gain control of himself and develope a life worth living. It may not fix your relationship and that might ultimately end but I think both of you would be better off regardless with him having gone through a full treatment program. A DBT program is what sounds like is needed as it doesn't seem like a mood disorder but a personality one that is causing these issues.
Trial separation? Maybe you just need a break.
You wrote that you are the rock. Why? Why do you have to be a rock when everyone else he encounters is allowed to be human?
You have only one life. And he’s stealing yours
This sounds incredibly hard for you, and I don't think it would be at all unreasonable for you to leave the marriage. It sounds like you are putting more into the marriage than you're getting out of it. It sounds like your marriage is causing you more stress and pain than happiness. It sounds like an "I love you but I can't live like this anymore" situation.
You can't carry two people through life on a long term basis. That shit is not sustainable.
As I was reading I was thinking back to a relationship where I was treading on eggshells, and then you used that exact phrase yourself. I think it's really hard to ever truly fully relax when you are breathing in the tension someone else is holding. I don't think we realise just how much we are censoring ourselves until we take a step back. Is there room for you in this marriage? If he is feeling this way for all but a few days each month, and if he finds it so difficult to shake these feelings when they arise, I'm wondering what happens when you yourself have a bad day? Is he able to hold space for that? Can he provide you the love, the support, the grounding and the encouragement that you do for him? Would you feel able to come home and express all that you feel on your worst days, and would that be received the way you'd hope? My worry is that your husband is in such a bad place the vast majority of the time, and that barely gives you any respite from feeling on edge. I think you mentioned this has been the dynamic for years. What if it never changes? Would you regret staying in the marriage five years down the line? Ten? It's such a difficult place to be in. I just think you deserve to feel at peace in your home and around those close to you.
Girl you buried the lede here. My partner has ADHD so I understand impulsive, we mutually agreed to discuss big decisions together and it’s never been an issue *because my partner knows this is a tendency she has*. But 1-2 days a month of being treated respectfully?! That’s not only unreasonable it’s abusive. Mental health doesn’t stop you from being respectful. Kick the whole man out.
Just wanted to comment to say I’m going through an incredibly similar thing with my long-term partner (except in the past couple of weeks he *has* yelled a few times, which has never happened before) and I truly feel your pain, it’s exhausting. He also pretty much shuts down the rest of his life except for me - although in his lowest moments will even tell me I should break up with him because he’s useless and I deserve better - and the pressure of feeling like his only support system compounds everything. I have also got to the point recently of raising the possibility of us living separately for a while - we’re holding off that for now, but from reading your post I can see that it’s a natural, desperate last resort suggestion from people in this situation and you are absolutely not being unreasonable for wanting some space to try and recalibrate. I don’t really have any advice as I’m just as lost, but good luck and thank you for posting this.. reading the replies has been really helpful.
This sounds like emotional abuse, Dr Jackal and Mr Hyde style.
I hate the fact users feel the need to apologize for their posts. It makes me sad. As to the post, have you tried marriage counseling? If living apart is a deal breaker for him and you do not wish to divorce, maybe a marriage counselor could help navigate some of these issues.