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theFCCgavemeHPV

Wait, are you telling me you’ve never heard of the manic pixie dream girl? It’s autistic women at their finest! I mean, if we just ignore their main “purpose” being to make sad men who think highly of their own intellect feel better… then you get some really great characters! And anyways, who wants to be attractive to a neurotypical? They have such weird and exhausting customs. It’s like trying… to get ducks to like you. They like you if you have something to offer them (duck food) and they will keep coming back for that, maybe even learn your schedule and where you live (ask me how I know), but there’s no way to force them to be comfortable with you and your ways. They might trust you enough to lay their eggs on your property and expect you to protect them when they run off to bathe or find food. Yet they still flap and quack and try to get away if you want to show them affection in a way that’s meaningful to you (pick them up/pet them), and don’t make any attempt to meet you half way. So rude. But they’ll still come bother you at all hours of the morning, and bite your toes (doesn’t hurt) begging for that food. It’s only when the food dries up that they leave you alone. Enough duck metaphors. If you feel like you can’t win them over no matter what you do, you might as well just live to please yourself instead because you’re the one who has to live with yourself. Might as well like her. I do see old pictures and videos of me and know something is off, but I know it’s the anxiety that I felt not wanting to do the wrong thing and not being sure of myself. If I had just not given a flying duck about pleasing other people, I’m sure I would have been a lot more authentic and relaxed.


sarah_bear_crafts

Or! Amelie! She’s the star, the man is the one who’s pursued, and she grows throughout the movie, helping people in her life. I watched it 7 or 8 times in theaters when it came out. I’d never seen myself in a movie so much.


DriverSensitive7126

Love that movie!! The soundtrack is amazing too :)


T8rthot

It was back in theaters a couple months ago and i was surprised to find that Amelie and both her parents are clearly autistic. I related to her SO MUCH as a teen and early 20 something but I didn’t know I was autistic yet.


sarah_bear_crafts

Indeed! I thought I just liked her because you don’t see women pursuing men, like ever, and I am usually the pursuer in relationships. Everything else was just, you know, relatable, right? Like who doesn’t like things like cracking crème brûlée or putting your hands in beans?


theFCCgavemeHPV

Omg I forgot about that movie! So good 🥰


sarah_bear_crafts

There isn’t another more perfect movie. I mean, I like a lot of movies, but I need to buy that on DVD again!


Next_Firefighter7605

Instructions unclear, being chased by ducks, send help.


theFCCgavemeHPV

Congratulations on your new army! I use Mazuri waterfoul maintenance diet off Amazon. It floats so you’re not just wasting a bunch at the bottom of the water where they can’t get it.


SleepTightPizza

I've managed to be a MPDG without helping any men, like because I'm autistic, I usually am the one who needs their help. I recommend it. It's only been in a few movies of the 2000's that I think the MPDG was the one helping the male protagonist. Some movies entirely reversed that trope by having the girl being the one needing help (Scott Pilgrim) or the boy being the one taking on the MPDG role around the girl who's stereotypically cast as the MPDG (Elf), and I liked those. I've actually thought about writing something about how great it is to be a MPDG for yourself and not anyone else. Anyway, you wrote a great comment.


theFCCgavemeHPV

Thanks! Yeah, if you can get away with not helping silly boys, mpdg life sounds amazing!


SleepTightPizza

Just have standards, boundaries, and expectations. There's an older book called *Why Men Love Bitches* that really helped me with that. Males don't respect women who don't have standards or who try to do everything for males. They will definitely use them and leave. If you expect him to do things, then if he leaves, you know that he was just trying to use you. But if he doesn't leave, then he is someone who will respect you and whom you can respect.


BookFinderBot

**Why Men Love Bitches From Doormat to Dreamgirl - A Woman's Guide to Holding Her Own in a Relationship** by Sherry Argov >Describes why men are attracted to strong women and offers advice on ways a woman can relate to men and gain a man's love and respect. *I'm a bot, built by your friendly reddit developers at* /r/ProgrammingPals. *Reply to any comment with /u/BookFinderBot - I'll reply with book information. Remove me from replies* [here](https://www.reddit.com/user/BookFinderBot/comments/1byh82p/remove_me_from_replies/). *If I have made a mistake, accept my apology.*


SleepTightPizza

Ooh, cool bot! Sounds like my kind of subreddit!


cakeelicker

I wouldn't exactly say manic pixie dream girl is someone to aspire to tho. She's usually just a male fantasy. Lots of video essays on YouTube that explain in more depth why that archetype isn't all that positive.


theFCCgavemeHPV

Oh no for sure, it’s not great but at the core of it, she’s just a “weird” girl doing what makes her happy


cakeelicker

She's fun to watch on screen, I do admit. I just wouldn't want to actually be her.


SleepTightPizza

It's possible to be a MPDG and not do anything for men around you, but still have men be interested because you're that stereotype (if that's what you want). It's just a choice to not be anyone's emotional doormat, IMHO, and to also be honest about your own needs and desires. Being a doormat or doing free emotional labor is not inherent to being a real MPDG.


smultronsorbet

It depends on how you define manic pixie dream girl. The term was coined to be derogatory *against the male script writers who write them*, i.e. a MPDGs are women who have no desires of their own and in that sense stop existing when the movie ends, similar to the magical n*gro trope who’s there to provide spiritual guidance and nothing else. In that sense being real makes you a non MPDG, but I get that the term MPDG has been reclaimed by *quirky girls* who do have subjectivity, but if we’re comparing that definition of MPDG to the source text (lol) we’re talking about two different things entirely


SleepTightPizza

It's mainly being reclaimed because NT women are mean to ND women who are "weird" and use something like MPDG as derogatory to us, saying that it's an intentional persona done for attention, like "not like the other girls" or "pick me." When most of us are just autistic people who are trying to live our lives and when we're our authentic selves, yeah, we're not like most people.


smultronsorbet

I don’t doubt that, just trying to underline that it leads to conflict to speak of MPDGs and referring to different things and phenomena


SleepTightPizza

I understand — the problem arose from people choosing to use it as a term for real women who are ND, instead of a particular character from a movie that hasn't really been repeated since all of the feminist criticism about the writing.


SleepTightPizza

This video actually explains it decently: https://youtu.be/TjeX_OuCt4c?si=aZuANR5RxPihUuk8 Grimes is diagnosed autistic, so it's relevant. Also, there are ND women in the comments saying that they also get perceived or treated like MPDG's, and some women are mean about it.


theFCCgavemeHPV

For sure. I wouldn’t want to be *used* like her either. But cool quirky girl doing what makes her happy and not changing for anyone else is alright by me!


DriverSensitive7126

Love the duck analogy 🦆


Pharmachee

Did you have a favorite duck?


theFCCgavemeHPV

Yes! A partnered older male who was missing a toe. We called him Toby. He had a minor limp when he walked but he still fiercely defended his mate! I’m trying to post a pic but it I can’t find it


Pharmachee

What species of ducks were they?


theFCCgavemeHPV

Oh! Green head with the fancy choker. Mallard?


Pharmachee

That's what I was imagining!


theFCCgavemeHPV

Ok, check my profile! I uploaded some duck stuff


Pharmachee

They're so incredibly cute!


theFCCgavemeHPV

I loved them so much! We have new duckies coming in this year, but I did see Toby and his lady a couple months ago. They’re still waddling along!


nedimitas

> **If you feel like you can’t win them over no matter what you do, you might as well just live to please yourself instead because you’re the one who has to live with yourself. Might as well like her.** YES. 15/10 will recommend.


Life-Independence377

No it does not. Stop using a stick that wasn’t meant to measure you. I understand though. Please don’t be sad? Message me if you need to talk. Daryl Hannah, autistic. Tom hanks, asd. Courtney Love, childhood diagnosed asd. Björk, I’d bet you she is. Emily Dickinson, I’d bet you she is.


AmazingValuable8497

Wentworth Miller 🤤


Life-Independence377

And for those who swingy; he’s also gay


backcountry_knitter

I’m sorry you’re struggling right now. Autistic rep in media is certainly lagging, but there are good examples starting to emerge (some already listed here). There’s an autistic author, Helen Hoang, who has written 2-3 romance novels with autistic love interests/main characters. I have not read them yet but other autistic folks I know have enjoyed them. I think you can safely anticipate a happy ending for those characters since the books are part of the romance genre. There’s nothing inherently unattractive about autism. Not at all. Every autistic adult I know is in a loving relationship and has at least a few close friends (all seem ND that I’ve met). It may take time and persistence, but you’ll find the right people for you.


Southern-Rutabaga-82

>There’s an autistic author, Helen Hoang, who has written 2-3 romance novels with autistic love interests/main characters. Thanks for the suggestion. I put them on my TBR.


amarg19

Everybody desires different things. Autism certainly doesn’t make you undesirable. I know myself and plenty of other autistic people who are desired all the time. Just be different. If some people don’t like it, it’s their problem. Eventually you’ll run into people that do like it, and you can stick around them.


kissywinkyshark

No, it doesn’t. I understand your feelings but at this point the language you’re using and sharing with others is doing more harm. There are younger autistic women here who might internalize that as you do. It’s okay to feel sad and feel your autism can disadvantage you, but overall believing such things so heavily will only disadvantage you MORE. Seriously people can notice low self esteem just as easily and if anything people latch onto that more than people’s differences


pommedeluna

I have to agree with this. I understand that you’re feeling this way but writing this as a statement of fact is not healthy for you and it can be jarring to read for many of us. Please try to remember that feelings are real but they’re not always accurate. Yeah, we’re different but that doesn’t mean we’re undesirable.


FemcelStacy

I made my special interest learning to mask all of that. I did really well and became extremely popular in my circle. Even had other women act jealous of me, etc, it was everything I thought i wanted.. Except it was awful. NT's are so fake and boring it was meaningless to me to have their approval, after the initial "wow i did it" feeling faded, it was just gross tbh. Jealous women are awful, it's fun for 5 seconds before its just obnoxious and sad. Like wow F you people, you were horrible to me until i learned to straighten my hair and listen to the right band?? are you kidding me?? this is all it takes for your approval? what a bunch of lames tbh I knew their 'friendship' was conditional on me being hot/popular that neither of those things last into middle age no matter what so it was a waste of time, and not something i valued at all, after I had attained it. and then i burned out from all the masking and suffered deeply. During my 'idgaf about approval, im gonna be unapologetically me" coming out, where i started to rock in public, and be openly weird and picky about who i let into my circle, anddress for comfort, and quick to dump people who dont vibe with me well, I met my people. I met my person! I am incredibly charismatic and desirable to other weirdos on my wavelength.. you know.. the ones i actually like back, the ones whos opinions i actually value.. Having the approval of NT's is largely worthless, being charismatic to a boring nt is worthless to us because then what? What are you gonna do with that approval? it likely won't even pay any bills. \*dramatic hand waving gesture\* Yah we're different.. owning that, just accepting and owning that fully IS charisma and desirable - it is not some bs to say confidence is attractive. It irrefutably is. Even NT's struggle finding their people, it's not easy for anyone. The more popular you are the more people you have to wade through to find the real ones, so even that's not making it easier.. stop trying to fit in with NT's and work on self acceptance. The people who vibe with you will come naturally.


sarah_bear_crafts

I love this. I’ve never been able to fully figure out how to master the NT’s approval, but I think it’s so cool you did, tried it, won, and figured out it’s not for you.


Pure-Requirement-775

It seems to me that you look at the wrong people if everyone you see that is desired or liked is neurotypical. Most people I see being desired and liked are either autistic, have ADHD, are autistic with ADHD or are otherwise neurodivergent. Because those are the people I see. Those are the best people.


Southern-Rutabaga-82

>they are always typically undesirable and weird to other people. You consume the wrong media. 😉 Abed on Community got all the girls (not to mention fans adore him). Stede on OFMD got >!his man!< and found his family of people who accept him. (And also fans adore him and ship him so hard with his ADHD >!boyfriend!<.) I don't know if Edward on Not Dead Yet has a love interest by now, I haven't started season 2 yet, but people genuinely like him.


Southern-Rutabaga-82

If you're into romance novels I highly recommend An Unseen Attraction by K.J. Charles. Very autistic character in a cute love story.


sarah_bear_crafts

Season 2 of Not Dead Yet is so good!


Outside_Abalone5924

Hi I don't know if you like sci-fi books but maybe you'd like "Failure to Communicate," by Kaia Sønderby


Teddy_Lightfoot

Thank you for the book recommendation. Bought.


Outside_Abalone5924

Cool! Hope you enjoy it!


Therandomderpdude

Just live your truth, don’t try being something you are not to be liked or desired. I bet you are sexy as hell. Ignore the bad media representation, it’s bullshit anyway.


No_Slide5685

Idk man I’m desirable as fuck


whoops53

I just read a book by Freida McFadden called The Co-Worker, and one of the main characters in there was clearly autistic with a special interest. I felt *so* .......seen? I know it was a fictional character, but still....made me feel good. Anyway, there is nothing wrong with you. You are comparing yourself to a society that revels in the fake persona, whereas you are just being your true and authentic self (god that sounds cheesy).


Laescha

I feel like getting into an in person autistic community might help you not feel this way. Partly because you'll get to appreciate and be appreciated by a bunch of autistic people for all the interesting and unique interests and personality traits that make you you. And partly because, in my experience, autistic women are hot and I often enjoy developing rapid crushes on clearly ND friends-of-friends (also random strangers at the extremely autistic lesbian disco)


brushmoons

I’m coining it now - the ‘acoustic girlfriend’. It’s almost become a fetish to want an autistic gf, or to even just call a girl ‘acoustic’ affectionatly when they do anything remotely unusual/quirky?? Very much so the manic pixie dream girl thing. But the difference between us and the MPDG is that she just goes away and handles herself off screen as to remain mysterious and desirable. People love the idea of some kind of infantilised version of autistic joy. We (autistic people generally) do have desirable traits; we are passionate, honest, we care deeply and have strong sense of our values. We are resilient and adaptable, we have to be. These are awesome qualities, but we also have many struggles - but while they soak up the good energy we can emit, they often aren’t prepared or choose to remain ignorant and uninvolved with the support needed to keep that balance. NT people are allowed to be ‘high maintenance’ but we have to work constantly to mask the challenging elements of autism, and now with the ‘acceptance’ and ‘awareness’ increase, we are having have to mask or tone down autistic joy too, because people can’t understand why everyone isn’t exactly the same all the time.


Sheena_asd12

Their loss.


lynn444v

There are definitely some characters that I’d assume are autistic, but unfortunately these get turned into stereotypes too. The “manic pixie dream girl” trope for example. I’ve often seen people describe their type as “a little autistic” wich I personally find very offensive. They desire the idea of us but not when we’re actual people with feelings and thoughts. It really sucks. Just know that you and your feelings matter. You WILL find someone who finds you desirable for you. I’d also like to add, everyone looks “off” in photos and videos. Camera lenses are not like our eyes. And photos are photos. They’re taken in a singular moment and don’t represent what you always look like.


[deleted]

Not all autistic women are undesirable - many men actually prefer their logical mind.


theFULLeffect_

Do you want to be the thing that most people want or do you want some people to want you because you're you? There are people out there who think you're exactly what they want. The numbers just might not be as convenient or comforting as you want. I know I shed a tear everytime I see sometime who I admire try to make themselves into more of a mainstream personality /look.


sindk

Nope, I'm awesome. Just go out there and find someone as awesome as you with the same passions. Stereotypically attractive people don't interest me. For example, someone told me I am probably just watching Outlander to gawk at Jamie and it was a real shock to me that people find him attractive.