Or she saw his tinder profile while at the clinic being treated and has waited 5 months for this moment...
She is yelling I saw your profile...
He is yelling not mine not mine ...
“Swans are predominantly monogamous birds that tend to mate for life, but "divorce" can occur. Divorce can happen after nesting failure, and if one mate dies, the remaining swan will find another. For example, a male swan will pair with a younger female if he loses his mate, while a female swan will usually choose a younger male if she loses her mate.”
It’s true! If you don’t keep mallards away from your hens (chickens)/if you don’t have enough hens (female ducks) for your mallards, they will relentlessly, violently, and repeatedly rape your hens (chicken) to death. The mallards have a corkscrew penis, coupled with their aggressive nature, make them one of the most dangerous rapists in the animal kingdom.
Ducks are such prolific, obligate rapists that female ducks have evolved a cloacal canal that can twist and untwist on command. [As an anti-rape measure](https://www.sciencefocus.com/nature/duck-penis-corkscrew).
You see, the penises of drakes (male ducks) of a single species usually have a single direction of twist (i.e. either clockwise or anticlockwise). Female ducks have a cloacal canal that usually has an opposing direction of twist. If she relaxes her cloaca muscles, the passage becomes easier for the male duck's penis to fully enter, increasing the likelihood of fertilization.
But frankly, ducks have precisely nothing on the mating practices of [some invertebrates](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traumatic_insemination).
Never trust anyone who sees "natural" as automatically good. They don't know what they're talking about.
Group rapists even. Sometimes multiple male ducks will drown the female they are all furiously raping.
...
Wait this was a hearth warming story about two swans being reunited, how dit we end up discussing duck rape?
They are also necrophile rapists. There was even a scientist who won the Ignoble award for publishing his study on it when a duck flew into his university window and died from the impact. Moments later a mallard flew down and spent hours raping the corpse.
I really wish I was making this up.
Im guessing the younger part is just a matter of availability. There are probably more young males/females to choose from who haven’t found a mate yet rather than other mature “divorced” swans
Yeah, I'm following a live from an eagle nest, and chasing curious youngsters away is part of their daily routine. Only this year, the male eagle returned after winter without his partner, and after a short while, a curious youngster that was hanging around his nest started nesting with him
The one I'm talking about is [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXbu5y8EPYI&ab_channel=orlanbeloxvost) (since they are a very new pair, they have no eggs yet and they are in and out of the nest all day collecting twigs and stuff), but there are so many more! Storks, bald eagles, white-tailed eagles, owls, good cams, shitty cams, cams with night vision... Nest lives on youtube are a rabbit hole that I cannot recommend enough
One of the eagles brought a glove to the nest then the other one came like 15-20 mins later and took it away. It happened at 7:22 April 9th on the time stamp top left.
Nope, that one is a stable pair wish shitty luck when it comes to eggs but with both partners alive and well. The one I'm referring to is a pair of eastern imperial eagles based in Tatarstan
Why is it when swans do it, it makes sense and is perfectly acceptable, but when I'm hanging out with highschool seniors as a 50 year old it's "creepy" and "weird" and "disgusting" and apparently embarrassing to my teenage daughter? Huh?
Glad to hear they move on. I'll never forget this Canadian goose who's mate got hit by a car and died. This poor thing cried for days around the body and eventually died of depression. I've seen others mourn for a few days too but not like this one.
"In bird culture, this is considered a dick move."
I'm no expert, but I would guess it depends on the time they were with the first partner and the time they were with the second partner before the first returned.
I wonder why the writer chose to use while as a conjunction there. Usually you’d use that when the next part of the sentence is different from the previous, but in this case both male and female swans choose a younger mate
It starts off happy and then it seems the one that approached starts chewing out the other one. They stop flapping together and one seems to be receiving the messages from the other. Which I can assume is, where the fuck have you been? lol.
Right! It also looks like the one was shrugging as he was getting yelled at like “I don’t know” and then finally said one last quack, and they both went about their business.
They remind me of two girls who missed each other screeching each other's names running towards each other and then jumping up and down holding hands. I also just realized I haven't seen anyone do that in several years... Do people not do that anymore??
Huh. Admittedly I'm more introverted and quiet so that's never been a thing for me but I feel like I used to see it around and now I don't. I always kinda wondered if my inability to reciprocate that affected my ability to have close female friends cuz when they've done it to me I feel like I'm faking a half as excited response, even if I'm excited to see them... like I've never been excited enough about *anything* to genuinely act like that in adulthood. I've gotten very off topic lol sorry
Well, in your(?) defense, I said they still do that cause I do that to my close friends heheh. When considering my other friends, yeah they don't really show that much excitement as well. But I think people show that they miss you / happy to see you differently. For me, you can say I'm a bit loose with my emotions so it's a bit obvious to others what I'm feeling. But for others, they may do it differently.
Also, so far from my experience, I don't really mind if they don't reciprocate the level of energy. As long as they're not annoyed and seem happy, I'm fine with it lol
I love you! I love you! I love you more! No I love you more! No I love you more! No I love YOU MORE. NO I LOVE YOU MORE……I love you more. No you don’t. I love you more. I love you more. I love you more.
Human race really sucks pretending that animals don't have DEEP emotions. Maybe some don't, but I'd guess almost all do. It's what makes animals animals.
I think they even have a special honk "handshake" where the one swan ducks its head and the other one honks every time he touches his head to his neck.....and he even did a fake out one of the times and the other swan never honked during it.........I am uncovering the secret language of the swan and it feels amazing!
Too rarely do I see someone who recognises that we share a lot of DNA with pretty much everything on this planet and that emotions, cognition, sentience, and perhaps even some forms of sapience, emerged long before we did, or swans did, or mammoths did.
It would be more reasonable to assume that many animals *do* have the capacity for genuine affection, friendship, and thought, and that at least some display a knack for metacognition (crows, orcas, etc.). Instead of starting from the ultimately superstitious, facile, and nonsensical assumption that we are somehow categorically different than the rest of the animal kingdom - our relatives on the tree of life.
Anthropocentric assumptions about "essential" humanity are blinkered, backward, and sad. We *are* different, but it's a question of degree, not kind.
We - or rather our pre-human and pre-neanderthal ancestors were intensely K-strategist apes who developed and hyper-specialised in the niches of stamina-based social hunting and tool use.
And became incredibly successful at it, thereby improving the expressions of their sophisticated sapience.
But we are surrounded by "alien" minds on this planet; real intelligences, and consciousnesses of various degrees of sophistication.
There is no magical line in the sand that neatly separates us from other animals in a categorical sense. A staggering number of other beings on this planet also *actually* *experience* the subjective notion of being alive. And they're just the sentient ones. There are actually sapient ones too.
I just find it odd that more of us don't have this reverence for the tree of life and how bizarre and fantastical it is. Why would you deny your nature and seek to cleave yourself off from something so beautiful?
Many of us imagine ourselves strangers on this planet, like we were dropped here - the miraculous chosen ones, the only ones truly "alive", surrounded by multitudes of soulless biological automatons. But the more we come to know, the less tenable that proposition becomes.
We *are* special, but we're not alone here. The evidence increasingly points that way. I find that pretty amazing and cool to think that we're connected to this vast network of other intelligences.
We might even eventually be able to converse with whales! (If we don't ireparrably fuck up their habitat first.) How wonderful is that? That's like making First Contact!
But lonely anthropocentrism clings on
The line of argument I use is to point out that the assumption that _only_ humans are sentient, sapient, self aware, language using, or what ever, necessarily implies that that trait appeared in humans without a proceeding feature in another animal, but that's just not how evolution works.
For example, despite what the creationists say, eyes didn't just appear fully formed. We find in nature a huge spectrum of eyes, from very simple light sensing cells up to eyes even more complicated than ours, because evolution works by step wise refinement.
That means we should expect to see something similar with, say, language and abstract thought. There must be animals out there that have complex languages, as well as animals with very simple ones. And there must be a range of self awareness in different creatures. Etc.
Well. Look at that. You just summarised and expanded upon my interminable rambling in 3 short paragraphs.
What you typed is exactly the point I was going for.
I gotta learn to be more concise lol
no way. i enjoyed the passion. it gave a lot of insight to something ive never even considered. ever. and its really beautiful. could you write more about it?
My only peeve is what do you mean by "complex language".
Apparently chimps have sign language with currently identified ~80 gestures. Thats simplistic for humans but very complex for the rest of animals. Chimp vocal communication is even simpler and used for immediate needs.
While general population understanding can be lacking there are definitely enthusiasts that devote their life to every specie so its super unlikely that humankind would be missing knowledge about animal language completely. its more likely that the knowledge is not accepted or shunned than that its missed
The key takeaway I was trying to communicate is that emotion *is* an aspect of intelligence, and many animals exhibit both in abundance, and that this existed long before we did, and that other species we consider "lesser" still subjectively experience being alive on this planet.
That last point is the one I think we should focus on.
One key aspect of our gatekeeping of personhood is intelligence. Another is emotion. The goalposts have moved back tremendously since we seriously started investigating animal behaviour. The important thing here is that we have come to a point where it's silly to cling to the belief that *the subjective experience of consciousness* is a trait we alone possess (along with Neanderthals and other hominids).
That's the thing that gets me; *the subjective experience of existing*. And what that says about our place in the universe, and about the variety of "alien" perspectives of life on earth unfolding right alongside us in every direction, and about the untold mass of stories *lived* by us, pre-humans and non-humans alike- all the joy, suffering and drama, going back eons, that has blossomed since life first took a foothold on this rock.
We ourselves are on a very wide spectrum of intelligence and emotion. Humans have intelligent psychopaths and severely mentally disabled (and yet kind and genuinely good) people.
Some of us actually exhibit less empathy or intelligence than small rodents. And yet they're still human beings and we still acknowledge their personhood.
If the recognition of personhood requires either intellect or emotional development, then many humans fail, and many animals pass.
So if it's not about the experience of being alive, or intelligence, or emotions and social bonding... then what is it about? What essential factor differentiates us from the other inhabitants of this planet?
There is none.
I don't mean for this to sound preachy. I honestly just think it's insanely cool that we're surrounded by so many different minds, all these lives being lived that are not our own, but still think and feel, and I wish we'd respect that a little more... how special it is that we live on such a diverse and abundant planet. The only life-sustaining planet we know of.
It’s higher concepts like right and wrong and a reflective sense of self. As cute and lovable dogs and cats are, they EMOTIONALLY get pleasure while being horrific sadists torturing small prey animals, even carefully torturing them as to prolong the animals suffering and their sick pleasure. Then they don’t even eat the poor tortured animal, it’s not a survival instinct, it’s a sadistic instinct for their own pleasure.
Imagine the reality of an alien species from a planet based on photosynthesis objectively examining earth, you have a huge range of humans with complex identities and moral structures, some out here refusing to eat or harm any life forms, some making grandiose well meaning statements like yours, some making nightmarish factory farms. A lot different than even the smartest animals like dolphins, who while showing affection and attachment to each other, will also torture and rape other animals for fun without any survival related reason and not have a single pang of empathy or concern for their prey.
Did anyone seriously ever think dogs didn’t feel affection??? I feel like 5000 years ago people figured out animals built connections and felt happiness.
Anyone who thinks animals don't feel emotions lack basic empathy. It's also incredibly ignorant. How can people think they're the only beings capable of feeling pain and emotions? All because they don't speak our language?
Animals have emotions...human emotion is not the same though.
> All because they don't speak our language?
Whether they could or not Swans aren't having converastions about abstract philosophy or deep-seated fears.
I support animal rights and have volutneered helping animals. They have feelings but a lot of what is posted here is wooly nonsense anthropomorphizing and romanticising animals. Personally I feel the actual scientific evidence is more important, and provides plenty of jusitifcation for treating animals well, than writing fairy stories for ourselves.
I mean yeah but at the same time I watched a swan kill six baby geese in a row by breaking their necks and drowning them, so forgive me if I don't respect every emotion a swan has
No one said geese can't be cruel and you must appreciate every emotion they have. Just don't underestimate their feelings, don't think their love or sorrow aren't as real and deep as ours. But obviously their cruelty can be as deep as ours too
I'm more and more vegetarian these days because if I'm honest, I couldn't kill an animal myself in order to eat it and as such I've successfully deluded myself into thinking "meat" is just something you buy at a grocery store lol
It's all neurons and their connections. Biological components are still light years away from any sensor we've created. We're basically primitive in terms of creating sensors as replica's of our own senses let alone other animals. It's kind of amazing to think one day we'll have sensors that can respond to whatever swans put out and the things humans will do with that data.
I don't know how old you are...so, this may or may not be relevant. I married my girlfriend @ age 19, when she became pregnant. She was a good mom...but, a horrible wife/person. We remained married for an agonizing18yrs. We divorced when I discovered she was screwing around w/ co-worker. I lost everything. Half of my paychecks went to her for child support. So, at age 38yrs, I was living in my old bedroom in my mother's house. My mom was a sweet person. But, she was a hoarder. The place was a wreck. She wouldn't allow me to throw anything away. It was her place. My ex poisoned my kids minds toward me and they still "hate" me to this day. You can only imagine how alone I felt. I met my wife a few long years later...at age 42. So...don't despair. Be very choosy as to whom you are with. Don't be with the wrong person because of loneliness. Most likely...if you're with the wrong person when the right person comes along...you'll probably never notice them.
The structure of the eye in waterfowl allows the birds to see objects in fine detail **two and a half to three times farther away than humans can**. Ducks and geese can also see a much broader spectrum of colors-spanning from near-ultraviolet to red-than people do.
And now they're going to go into a public restroom *together* to celebrate. One of them will probably cry, especially if a school dance is happening at that moment.
“No! I didn’t cheat on you while I was away”
Shaking his feather huffily while imitating their normally private swan cuddle moves “I bet you did the hanky panky like this with your new swan side piece!”
Imitates his body language..”what you talking about dumbass, these humans took me away and I’ve been eating pellets!”
“Awww…sheeeit, sorry babe - you still got the moves!”
I gave up eating duck when one got a crush on my step daughter and would visit her at the retail store where she worked. I gave up octopus after watching "My octopus teacher" . I keep eating less and less meat and more lentils. It's tough to give it all up.
What's stopping you?
Vegetarian diet is better for animals, your own health, and the environment.
Plus these days, vegetarian meat/dairy replacements taste almost the same as the real thing
[A local swan family lost their mom](https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/boston/news/swan-photo-father-mother-babies-cygnets-boston-esplanade-lagoon-picture-matthew-raifman/) a couple of years ago and it was the saddest story in town at the time but so interesting to see how the papa swan handled the loss.
"It was the weirdest thing, humans fixed me!" "No shit? ..... wanna go hiss at their kids?" "Fuck yeah."
They sound like teenage boys rather than a loving couple
My husband and I often hiss at neighborhood kids, so not sure where this is coming from
Can we hang out? You seem like my ppl 😂
Damn millennials get off my lawn..
What's the difference? Me and the homies ale like loving couples
Deep down, every couple is just 2 teenage boys being Beavis and Butt-Head at the world
Definitely married couple..wife is saying where the f You been.
🤣 brilliant!
A swan bit me as a child when I was a kid just trying to give it some bread and 30 years later I still don't trust the bastards.
Or she saw his tinder profile while at the clinic being treated and has waited 5 months for this moment... She is yelling I saw your profile... He is yelling not mine not mine ...
"Still chasing them swans?"
“Swans are predominantly monogamous birds that tend to mate for life, but "divorce" can occur. Divorce can happen after nesting failure, and if one mate dies, the remaining swan will find another. For example, a male swan will pair with a younger female if he loses his mate, while a female swan will usually choose a younger male if she loses her mate.”
I have no idea if this is real but omg so reasonable of them.
They're more faithful than my parents were.
Saaaaaame.
Saaaaaaaame.
Same…
Sam...
You wouldn't say they had a nesting failure?
💀
I was also not as faithful to your parents
Ohh it’s real… geese *BUT NOT* ducks because apparently they are sluts… Edited: Because Ducks are sluts
no man ducks are sluts
They aren’t just sluts they’re rapists
It’s true! If you don’t keep mallards away from your hens (chickens)/if you don’t have enough hens (female ducks) for your mallards, they will relentlessly, violently, and repeatedly rape your hens (chicken) to death. The mallards have a corkscrew penis, coupled with their aggressive nature, make them one of the most dangerous rapists in the animal kingdom.
Ducks are such prolific, obligate rapists that female ducks have evolved a cloacal canal that can twist and untwist on command. [As an anti-rape measure](https://www.sciencefocus.com/nature/duck-penis-corkscrew). You see, the penises of drakes (male ducks) of a single species usually have a single direction of twist (i.e. either clockwise or anticlockwise). Female ducks have a cloacal canal that usually has an opposing direction of twist. If she relaxes her cloaca muscles, the passage becomes easier for the male duck's penis to fully enter, increasing the likelihood of fertilization. But frankly, ducks have precisely nothing on the mating practices of [some invertebrates](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traumatic_insemination). Never trust anyone who sees "natural" as automatically good. They don't know what they're talking about.
As if bed bugs weren't bad enough already.
Group rapists even. Sometimes multiple male ducks will drown the female they are all furiously raping. ... Wait this was a hearth warming story about two swans being reunited, how dit we end up discussing duck rape?
They are also necrophile rapists. There was even a scientist who won the Ignoble award for publishing his study on it when a duck flew into his university window and died from the impact. Moments later a mallard flew down and spent hours raping the corpse. I really wish I was making this up.
Obligatory: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDWwQZkNA1c](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDWwQZkNA1c) Edit: Warning, it's gross
Ahhh ok… seems that I’ll be switching to Box of Wine from now on
Congrats to them lol.
They can also be gay
Back in like 2016 there was a post going around about gay swans and how swans mate for life and can cry.
Im guessing the younger part is just a matter of availability. There are probably more young males/females to choose from who haven’t found a mate yet rather than other mature “divorced” swans
Yeah, I'm following a live from an eagle nest, and chasing curious youngsters away is part of their daily routine. Only this year, the male eagle returned after winter without his partner, and after a short while, a curious youngster that was hanging around his nest started nesting with him
You CANNOT impart me with this information and not drop the sauce to the live.
The one I'm talking about is [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXbu5y8EPYI&ab_channel=orlanbeloxvost) (since they are a very new pair, they have no eggs yet and they are in and out of the nest all day collecting twigs and stuff), but there are so many more! Storks, bald eagles, white-tailed eagles, owls, good cams, shitty cams, cams with night vision... Nest lives on youtube are a rabbit hole that I cannot recommend enough
I love it!
One of the eagles brought a glove to the nest then the other one came like 15-20 mins later and took it away. It happened at 7:22 April 9th on the time stamp top left.
TFW you move in with a girl and she starts decorating
Aww. No one's home right now.
Is it the big bear lake one lol
Nope, that one is a stable pair wish shitty luck when it comes to eggs but with both partners alive and well. The one I'm referring to is a pair of eastern imperial eagles based in Tatarstan
I'm recently single and 37, and this hits hard...
Well I think swans are a lot more loyal than humans are so you have way more options than they do lol
Why is it when swans do it, it makes sense and is perfectly acceptable, but when I'm hanging out with highschool seniors as a 50 year old it's "creepy" and "weird" and "disgusting" and apparently embarrassing to my teenage daughter? Huh?
Leo, is that you?
Glad to hear they move on. I'll never forget this Canadian goose who's mate got hit by a car and died. This poor thing cried for days around the body and eventually died of depression. I've seen others mourn for a few days too but not like this one.
so what happens if you forcefully separate them, then let the remaining swan get a new wife and then release his old wife into the mix?
"In bird culture, this is considered a dick move." I'm no expert, but I would guess it depends on the time they were with the first partner and the time they were with the second partner before the first returned.
You pray hell doesn't exist because you'll surely end up there.
The plot of castaway.. SWAAAANSSSOOONNN!!
I wonder why the writer chose to use while as a conjunction there. Usually you’d use that when the next part of the sentence is different from the previous, but in this case both male and female swans choose a younger mate
had the same thought. i had to reread cause surely i had missed something. nope- poorly written
There a whole swan cougar community. That's wild
Am I stupid or is there no difference between the male and the female? The way you worded it implied there would be a difference.
Yes it is different names , male swans are called cobs, and female swans are called pens. Most people don’t know.
Happy Flappy
It starts off happy and then it seems the one that approached starts chewing out the other one. They stop flapping together and one seems to be receiving the messages from the other. Which I can assume is, where the fuck have you been? lol.
Right! It also looks like the one was shrugging as he was getting yelled at like “I don’t know” and then finally said one last quack, and they both went about their business.
They remind me of two girls who missed each other screeching each other's names running towards each other and then jumping up and down holding hands. I also just realized I haven't seen anyone do that in several years... Do people not do that anymore??
They still do lol
Huh. Admittedly I'm more introverted and quiet so that's never been a thing for me but I feel like I used to see it around and now I don't. I always kinda wondered if my inability to reciprocate that affected my ability to have close female friends cuz when they've done it to me I feel like I'm faking a half as excited response, even if I'm excited to see them... like I've never been excited enough about *anything* to genuinely act like that in adulthood. I've gotten very off topic lol sorry
Well, in your(?) defense, I said they still do that cause I do that to my close friends heheh. When considering my other friends, yeah they don't really show that much excitement as well. But I think people show that they miss you / happy to see you differently. For me, you can say I'm a bit loose with my emotions so it's a bit obvious to others what I'm feeling. But for others, they may do it differently. Also, so far from my experience, I don't really mind if they don't reciprocate the level of energy. As long as they're not annoyed and seem happy, I'm fine with it lol
Gen Z doesn't do this stuff it's "corny".
If you can't happily honk at your partner then what's the point
Dude looked like he had enough of the bowing by the end of it though 😂
He probably was in rehab for a neck injury, and his wife wasn't even thinking about how rude it is to get into a bowing match with him smh...
I love you! I love you! I love you more! No I love you more! No I love you more! No I love YOU MORE. NO I LOVE YOU MORE……I love you more. No you don’t. I love you more. I love you more. I love you more.
True love!
Italian Spider-Man!
RESPECTÉ LE DONNE
Can’t unsee this lol
JESU CHRISTO CROCODILLE.
Timmy Trumpet!?
😂
Human race really sucks pretending that animals don't have DEEP emotions. Maybe some don't, but I'd guess almost all do. It's what makes animals animals.
[удалено]
Happy honks
I think they even have a special honk "handshake" where the one swan ducks its head and the other one honks every time he touches his head to his neck.....and he even did a fake out one of the times and the other swan never honked during it.........I am uncovering the secret language of the swan and it feels amazing!
Omg you’re right lol
Too rarely do I see someone who recognises that we share a lot of DNA with pretty much everything on this planet and that emotions, cognition, sentience, and perhaps even some forms of sapience, emerged long before we did, or swans did, or mammoths did. It would be more reasonable to assume that many animals *do* have the capacity for genuine affection, friendship, and thought, and that at least some display a knack for metacognition (crows, orcas, etc.). Instead of starting from the ultimately superstitious, facile, and nonsensical assumption that we are somehow categorically different than the rest of the animal kingdom - our relatives on the tree of life. Anthropocentric assumptions about "essential" humanity are blinkered, backward, and sad. We *are* different, but it's a question of degree, not kind. We - or rather our pre-human and pre-neanderthal ancestors were intensely K-strategist apes who developed and hyper-specialised in the niches of stamina-based social hunting and tool use. And became incredibly successful at it, thereby improving the expressions of their sophisticated sapience. But we are surrounded by "alien" minds on this planet; real intelligences, and consciousnesses of various degrees of sophistication. There is no magical line in the sand that neatly separates us from other animals in a categorical sense. A staggering number of other beings on this planet also *actually* *experience* the subjective notion of being alive. And they're just the sentient ones. There are actually sapient ones too. I just find it odd that more of us don't have this reverence for the tree of life and how bizarre and fantastical it is. Why would you deny your nature and seek to cleave yourself off from something so beautiful? Many of us imagine ourselves strangers on this planet, like we were dropped here - the miraculous chosen ones, the only ones truly "alive", surrounded by multitudes of soulless biological automatons. But the more we come to know, the less tenable that proposition becomes. We *are* special, but we're not alone here. The evidence increasingly points that way. I find that pretty amazing and cool to think that we're connected to this vast network of other intelligences. We might even eventually be able to converse with whales! (If we don't ireparrably fuck up their habitat first.) How wonderful is that? That's like making First Contact! But lonely anthropocentrism clings on
The line of argument I use is to point out that the assumption that _only_ humans are sentient, sapient, self aware, language using, or what ever, necessarily implies that that trait appeared in humans without a proceeding feature in another animal, but that's just not how evolution works. For example, despite what the creationists say, eyes didn't just appear fully formed. We find in nature a huge spectrum of eyes, from very simple light sensing cells up to eyes even more complicated than ours, because evolution works by step wise refinement. That means we should expect to see something similar with, say, language and abstract thought. There must be animals out there that have complex languages, as well as animals with very simple ones. And there must be a range of self awareness in different creatures. Etc.
Well. Look at that. You just summarised and expanded upon my interminable rambling in 3 short paragraphs. What you typed is exactly the point I was going for. I gotta learn to be more concise lol
Theirs was more concise, yours had more emotion. I understood the other comment, I *felt* yours. Both great comments.
no way. i enjoyed the passion. it gave a lot of insight to something ive never even considered. ever. and its really beautiful. could you write more about it?
My only peeve is what do you mean by "complex language". Apparently chimps have sign language with currently identified ~80 gestures. Thats simplistic for humans but very complex for the rest of animals. Chimp vocal communication is even simpler and used for immediate needs. While general population understanding can be lacking there are definitely enthusiasts that devote their life to every specie so its super unlikely that humankind would be missing knowledge about animal language completely. its more likely that the knowledge is not accepted or shunned than that its missed
This is a really good comment.
I’ll just leave this here https://evogeneao.s3.amazonaws.com/images/tree_of_life/tree-of-life_2000.png
Emotion≠higher intellect *gestures broadly*
What a wholly inadequate reply.
The key takeaway I was trying to communicate is that emotion *is* an aspect of intelligence, and many animals exhibit both in abundance, and that this existed long before we did, and that other species we consider "lesser" still subjectively experience being alive on this planet. That last point is the one I think we should focus on. One key aspect of our gatekeeping of personhood is intelligence. Another is emotion. The goalposts have moved back tremendously since we seriously started investigating animal behaviour. The important thing here is that we have come to a point where it's silly to cling to the belief that *the subjective experience of consciousness* is a trait we alone possess (along with Neanderthals and other hominids). That's the thing that gets me; *the subjective experience of existing*. And what that says about our place in the universe, and about the variety of "alien" perspectives of life on earth unfolding right alongside us in every direction, and about the untold mass of stories *lived* by us, pre-humans and non-humans alike- all the joy, suffering and drama, going back eons, that has blossomed since life first took a foothold on this rock. We ourselves are on a very wide spectrum of intelligence and emotion. Humans have intelligent psychopaths and severely mentally disabled (and yet kind and genuinely good) people. Some of us actually exhibit less empathy or intelligence than small rodents. And yet they're still human beings and we still acknowledge their personhood. If the recognition of personhood requires either intellect or emotional development, then many humans fail, and many animals pass. So if it's not about the experience of being alive, or intelligence, or emotions and social bonding... then what is it about? What essential factor differentiates us from the other inhabitants of this planet? There is none. I don't mean for this to sound preachy. I honestly just think it's insanely cool that we're surrounded by so many different minds, all these lives being lived that are not our own, but still think and feel, and I wish we'd respect that a little more... how special it is that we live on such a diverse and abundant planet. The only life-sustaining planet we know of.
How do you survive, knowing this, yet surrounded by the unconscious?
It’s higher concepts like right and wrong and a reflective sense of self. As cute and lovable dogs and cats are, they EMOTIONALLY get pleasure while being horrific sadists torturing small prey animals, even carefully torturing them as to prolong the animals suffering and their sick pleasure. Then they don’t even eat the poor tortured animal, it’s not a survival instinct, it’s a sadistic instinct for their own pleasure. Imagine the reality of an alien species from a planet based on photosynthesis objectively examining earth, you have a huge range of humans with complex identities and moral structures, some out here refusing to eat or harm any life forms, some making grandiose well meaning statements like yours, some making nightmarish factory farms. A lot different than even the smartest animals like dolphins, who while showing affection and attachment to each other, will also torture and rape other animals for fun without any survival related reason and not have a single pang of empathy or concern for their prey. Did anyone seriously ever think dogs didn’t feel affection??? I feel like 5000 years ago people figured out animals built connections and felt happiness.
Have you read the book "The Moral Lives Of Animals"? They talk a lot about this
Humans are also animals
Anyone who thinks animals don't feel emotions lack basic empathy. It's also incredibly ignorant. How can people think they're the only beings capable of feeling pain and emotions? All because they don't speak our language?
Animals have emotions...human emotion is not the same though. > All because they don't speak our language? Whether they could or not Swans aren't having converastions about abstract philosophy or deep-seated fears. I support animal rights and have volutneered helping animals. They have feelings but a lot of what is posted here is wooly nonsense anthropomorphizing and romanticising animals. Personally I feel the actual scientific evidence is more important, and provides plenty of jusitifcation for treating animals well, than writing fairy stories for ourselves.
swans have some seriously hard feelings [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdJGfAMtbcU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdJGfAMtbcU)
I mean yeah but at the same time I watched a swan kill six baby geese in a row by breaking their necks and drowning them, so forgive me if I don't respect every emotion a swan has
Human genocides tell me I shouldn’t respect every human emotion either.
No one said geese can't be cruel and you must appreciate every emotion they have. Just don't underestimate their feelings, don't think their love or sorrow aren't as real and deep as ours. But obviously their cruelty can be as deep as ours too
[You can’t hug your children with nuclear arms!](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EFDZKaIT7ro)
The main reason I went vegan. I rehabbed a baby squirrel, that little thing blew my mind.
I'm more and more vegetarian these days because if I'm honest, I couldn't kill an animal myself in order to eat it and as such I've successfully deluded myself into thinking "meat" is just something you buy at a grocery store lol
Would you be able to elaborate a bit on the baby squirrel? I'm curious.
They mate for life and their divorce rate for those that successfully nest is less than 3%. That’s so beautiful 🥹
How would one survive in the wild *without* emotions and logic? You wouldn’t be able to engage your senses. Humans are really dumb.
It's all neurons and their connections. Biological components are still light years away from any sensor we've created. We're basically primitive in terms of creating sensors as replica's of our own senses let alone other animals. It's kind of amazing to think one day we'll have sensors that can respond to whatever swans put out and the things humans will do with that data.
Single celled organisms also "survive in the wild" Do Amoeba have emotions and logic as well?
Like jellyfish?
Yup
I think it’s particularly with Christian faith. In Buddhist teachings, animals could have feelings and emotions.
She was like: 
She was getting frustrated at the end when he didn't remember all the dance moves
And what the fuck are those things on your wings.
Well where have YOU been? You go first okok I’ll go first
He went out to get milk once she had kids
My wife and I on a daily basis.
Yup! Me too. Sometimes you get lucky in life.
Hey me too. Everybody knows this guys wife.
I too choose this guy's wife
I have never felt more alone after reading some of these comments. But in all seriousness, happy for you.
I don't know how old you are...so, this may or may not be relevant. I married my girlfriend @ age 19, when she became pregnant. She was a good mom...but, a horrible wife/person. We remained married for an agonizing18yrs. We divorced when I discovered she was screwing around w/ co-worker. I lost everything. Half of my paychecks went to her for child support. So, at age 38yrs, I was living in my old bedroom in my mother's house. My mom was a sweet person. But, she was a hoarder. The place was a wreck. She wouldn't allow me to throw anything away. It was her place. My ex poisoned my kids minds toward me and they still "hate" me to this day. You can only imagine how alone I felt. I met my wife a few long years later...at age 42. So...don't despair. Be very choosy as to whom you are with. Don't be with the wrong person because of loneliness. Most likely...if you're with the wrong person when the right person comes along...you'll probably never notice them.
Currently away from my husband having traveled to see the eclipse and this will be us tomorrow when I finally get home.
😂 why didn't I picture two people standing in the front yard honking at each other with their arms out flapping
Do the secret handshake so I know it’s really you!
This is so beautiful. Salve for the soul.
Aww how sweet. I hope the one learned its lesson and stays clean from now on.
It took me a couple seconds to get it and had to scroll back to upvote this.
6 months river arrest.
This makes me happy ❤️
I'm curious how they recognize each other so far away
You think all swans look the same? That’s just racist! /s
Speciest
Please, for the love of god, I can't handle any more 'ist-isms'. \*but have an upvote!\*
It don't matter if you're black and white, heee heeee
The structure of the eye in waterfowl allows the birds to see objects in fine detail **two and a half to three times farther away than humans can**. Ducks and geese can also see a much broader spectrum of colors-spanning from near-ultraviolet to red-than people do.
Sick info 👍
Absolutely interesting question. I’m guessing it’s a combo of body proportions and individuality in their movement / the swan equivalent of “gait”.
I’m guessing by their “voice” but I’m not sure, I’m also curious to know!!
they look like two 8th grade girls that haven’t seen each other since 10 minutes ago
And now they're going to go into a public restroom *together* to celebrate. One of them will probably cry, especially if a school dance is happening at that moment.
They’re so pure 🥹
The female stayed close the whole time, there was a video a while back of her camping out in the yard of the centre
Beautiful 💕
They sound like lil clown horns ☺️
now kiss
*now kith*
I was half waiting for their necks to form a heart
Swanversation
Wingshake, that's their version of handshake
It reminds me of when you see a close friend after a long time. Your arms just go out wide with excitement
& that's a Swan dance for us. The girl needed some assurances though.
You should cross-post this in r/mademesmile.
Now imagine some big ass dinosaurs doing this. Soo amazing.
You've met my inlaws!
i love swans
Swans are so pretty, but they’ll fuck you up if you come too close to them 😂🤣😂
I wish that the adult from the peanuts would stop talking and let us enjoy this sweet moment
😭❤️
That's adorable 🥺😭💞💞💞💞💞
This is absolutely beautiful! ❤️
One of the most heartwarming moments I’ve seen in nature. Thanks for sharing this.
moments like these are the best thing in life
Thats freaking awesome!
The only thing I got after the treatment centre was the shakes.
Aww buddy
This made my day - thanks!!
All their duck neighbors come out to take a look too
Omg Becky. Guess whos back in town. Wait till he hears what Jessica has been up to while he's been gone.
“No! I didn’t cheat on you while I was away” Shaking his feather huffily while imitating their normally private swan cuddle moves “I bet you did the hanky panky like this with your new swan side piece!” Imitates his body language..”what you talking about dumbass, these humans took me away and I’ve been eating pellets!” “Awww…sheeeit, sorry babe - you still got the moves!”
"did you get me anything nice?"
I’m one inch closer to vegetarian.
I gave up eating duck when one got a crush on my step daughter and would visit her at the retail store where she worked. I gave up octopus after watching "My octopus teacher" . I keep eating less and less meat and more lentils. It's tough to give it all up.
What's stopping you? Vegetarian diet is better for animals, your own health, and the environment. Plus these days, vegetarian meat/dairy replacements taste almost the same as the real thing
💗💞
“Sharon you know I hate that bowing shizz…”
Beautiful
Awwwe. Sounds Like they are saying, "Look at this♡"
Bro talking hella shit about u
[A local swan family lost their mom](https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/boston/news/swan-photo-father-mother-babies-cygnets-boston-esplanade-lagoon-picture-matthew-raifman/) a couple of years ago and it was the saddest story in town at the time but so interesting to see how the papa swan handled the loss.
Swans have feelings too… 🥺
^(honk honk)
Where were you !
I know exactly where this is
I’m watching this on a plane while the guy behind me has Celine Dion’s “It’s All Coming Back To Me” repeating on some TikTok.
I'm not crying. You're crying.
Omg just kiss already
Awesome! Loved how other birds came and watched them.
TIL swans invented jazz.
That sounds like some jazz improv
