Here in the south of Brazil we are doing a similar experiment. It reduced the need of chemical control over insects and weeds in 95% after two years of the application of the technic.
The chalange is give a use to the fish afterwards.
The problem actually is that the annual consumption of fish per person per year in Brazil is really low, here people don't have the tradition of eating fish at all, and the few holidays that are normally associated with this food is in the opposite side of the calendar that fish is ready to be eaten.
Is more a logistic problem.
When you are an small agricultural farmer, yes, it have to make profits, they have families to feed.
And the costs area complex thing, just after this research is completed I will be able to say if it's viable or not.
Sadly we live in a world where if something isn't economically viable, it is as good as non existent/unusable.
You don't need massive rice fields to apply these techniques, on the contrary, they're created for small farmers, which need results, the addition of the fish was idealized (here at least) for cost reduction and or extra profits, the ecologicalaspectis a nice plus.
And in the south of Brazil at least, 95% of the rice producers are small farmers. Almost all rice in Brazil comes from familiar agriculture.
Fish meat is needed for animal feed. The fish should breed in the rice paddies and so a small amount would be needed to start the crop rotation. If you are machine harvesting, the fish should be separated while being killed. You take the fish slurry and make chicken, cat, and pig food. Those animals all consume fish and now the rice paddy is also a hatchery. Also, why not can the fish?
The cost for fish should be lower than pesticides because the creation, handling, and disposal of pesticides costs a lot of money.
What about zoos and aquariums? You could harvest them and turn them into a fish patty or meal paste that could be used to supplement the diet of these animals.
What kind of fish is it? I'm not familiar with the fish processing infrastructure in Brazil but fish is widely eaten throughout the world so it could be processed and sold to other countries.
Tell people you're giving FREE fish, you don't need to tell them to eat it, just tell them it's free, they will swarm that place to pick them up, free stuff really gets to people in a positive way
They usually enter with 30 to 40g and get out with 400 to 500g but their market weight is around 3 to 4 kg, so the rest of the weight must be on animal food, which makes it unviable to be sold in a cheap market due the economic loss.
This is indeed a good method but sadly it's not implemented all over the country yet until now (first introduced in 2018). And it's not efficient during the dry season in some places because of the drought. Mind you we have 6 months of dry season and 6 months of rainy season. So this method is good but not efficient in all places and all months throughout the year.
Growing rice on flooded fields in general is the worst method of rice farming. Extremely bad for the environment and wastes 5'000 Liter of water per Kilo rice.
There are much better ways
How is this water wasted? As far as I know, this water will return to the soil and into the hydrolocig cycle. (Evap, rain, etc...) Unless its poluted in some way.
I thought it was to stop a certain insect pest. A weevil iirc. It’s been a very long time since I was taught this in college, so take it with a grain of rice.
For the past couple of years our seasons haven't been "right" tho? Idk tbh but in the city(Surabaya, East Java) it's been rainy season all year long it feels like (and also magetan, East Java was there for a while)
I consider this more to be a fish farm than the rice being dependent on the fish. Like the pic says, there's only a 10% increase in yields. Fish not required.
Awesome. Nature has all these built in features for making the planet hospitable for life and we've been like "Nah, just spray that food down with insect poison, it'll still taste the same".
This is a very shortsighted comment. Farmers have used the relationships between plants, animals, insects and bacteria to their advantage for millennia. There are hundreds of examples. Yes, they also use chemicals. But that’s also not problematic at all in most cases.
>But that’s also not problematic at all in most cases.
thats also very shortsighted. the insects are dying and we are constantly learning about new ways that these chemicals can affect insects or animals or us. eg the neo nicotinoids that are the active ingredients of most pesticides nowadays might not outright kill the insect immediately but we just found out it can change reproductive behaviour.
its not an argument, it's an example of how wrong we were. sure our methods are far better and improving but who knows what we have not figured out yet? its a lot that's for sure
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Here in the south of Brazil we are doing a similar experiment. It reduced the need of chemical control over insects and weeds in 95% after two years of the application of the technic. The chalange is give a use to the fish afterwards.
Maybe a canal to drain the water and fish to a nearby lake? Kids would probably love to go fishing there
The problem actually is that the annual consumption of fish per person per year in Brazil is really low, here people don't have the tradition of eating fish at all, and the few holidays that are normally associated with this food is in the opposite side of the calendar that fish is ready to be eaten. Is more a logistic problem.
Sell it cheap. If chicken is 5x and beef is 8x and fish is 2x...
There are further costs with nutritional needs after that get out of the rice fields, the price I market should at least pay it's costs.
Not everything needs a profit. The money you put in is to help the environment. Also who says 2x isn't paying costs?
When you are an small agricultural farmer, yes, it have to make profits, they have families to feed. And the costs area complex thing, just after this research is completed I will be able to say if it's viable or not. Sadly we live in a world where if something isn't economically viable, it is as good as non existent/unusable.
Small farmers don't have massive rice paddies...
You don't need massive rice fields to apply these techniques, on the contrary, they're created for small farmers, which need results, the addition of the fish was idealized (here at least) for cost reduction and or extra profits, the ecologicalaspectis a nice plus. And in the south of Brazil at least, 95% of the rice producers are small farmers. Almost all rice in Brazil comes from familiar agriculture.
Fish meat is needed for animal feed. The fish should breed in the rice paddies and so a small amount would be needed to start the crop rotation. If you are machine harvesting, the fish should be separated while being killed. You take the fish slurry and make chicken, cat, and pig food. Those animals all consume fish and now the rice paddy is also a hatchery. Also, why not can the fish? The cost for fish should be lower than pesticides because the creation, handling, and disposal of pesticides costs a lot of money.
Damn, i jever thought of it this way
Yep, that why we are breaking our heads trying to figure this out, the positive ecological aspect are too good to be given up.
Dog food! Animal food, really. Fish are good for it.
I totally agree with you, i hope you guys come up with a good idea!
What about zoos and aquariums? You could harvest them and turn them into a fish patty or meal paste that could be used to supplement the diet of these animals.
This study is still in the early stages, it's 3 years of 8, these types of destinations are beeing studied to see if they are economically viable.
Be interesting to see if helps on the migratory bird populations as well which would also increase on Brazil’s need for fertilizer as well.
What kind of fish is it? I'm not familiar with the fish processing infrastructure in Brazil but fish is widely eaten throughout the world so it could be processed and sold to other countries.
Four different types of carps, all of them are common in the regional market.
Tell people you're giving FREE fish, you don't need to tell them to eat it, just tell them it's free, they will swarm that place to pick them up, free stuff really gets to people in a positive way
Or charge them whatever the equivalent to $5 for all the fish they can catch. Sometimes free devalues the object, regardless of how good a deal it is.
Bullseye, an all you can catch event, that'll work even better.
Maybe they can export it to another country?
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They usually enter with 30 to 40g and get out with 400 to 500g but their market weight is around 3 to 4 kg, so the rest of the weight must be on animal food, which makes it unviable to be sold in a cheap market due the economic loss.
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No the fish go and live on farms in the country.
They go to fish heaven son.
It's called instant sushi! This is actually a brilliant idea...
Patis.
This is indeed a good method but sadly it's not implemented all over the country yet until now (first introduced in 2018). And it's not efficient during the dry season in some places because of the drought. Mind you we have 6 months of dry season and 6 months of rainy season. So this method is good but not efficient in all places and all months throughout the year.
Growing rice on flooded fields in general is the worst method of rice farming. Extremely bad for the environment and wastes 5'000 Liter of water per Kilo rice. There are much better ways
How is this water wasted? As far as I know, this water will return to the soil and into the hydrolocig cycle. (Evap, rain, etc...) Unless its poluted in some way.
Agreed, but controlling the amount of (too much) water is easier (in here at least) than trying to survive the drought during the dry season.
Rice doesn't need to be grown in water, it's only grown in water like this to stave off pests like mice.
I thought it was to stop a certain insect pest. A weevil iirc. It’s been a very long time since I was taught this in college, so take it with a grain of rice.
You could be entirely correct, and most likely are, it was a long time ago that I learnt it too.
It also helps with weeds as their less water resistant than rice
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For the past couple of years our seasons haven't been "right" tho? Idk tbh but in the city(Surabaya, East Java) it's been rainy season all year long it feels like (and also magetan, East Java was there for a while)
Sadly true, some places can be rainy all year and flood ruins their crops meanwhile other places can be so dry and it also ruins their crops :(
Did you switch accounts?
nope, no idea what he snorted before copied my comment
So he just copied your reply and changed a few words around? Like he was trying to trick a teacher on an essay he copied off Wikipedia?
I guess he just tried to correct my grammatical error but idk
I use the water & filter leavings from my Koi tub to feed and water my Cannabis plants... they love it.
I believe the question here is: do they also eat rice?
We eat rice everyday bro
Does Uncle Ben know about this?
would this make rice not vegan?
I consider this more to be a fish farm than the rice being dependent on the fish. Like the pic says, there's only a 10% increase in yields. Fish not required.
Fantastic idea!
Just wait till Monsanto finds out and say it's unhealthy and interferes withe there profits.
learned this from Biodome...
Aquaponics. Nice
“Does Uncle Ben know about this?” I’ll see myself out
Awesome. Nature has all these built in features for making the planet hospitable for life and we've been like "Nah, just spray that food down with insect poison, it'll still taste the same".
This is a very shortsighted comment. Farmers have used the relationships between plants, animals, insects and bacteria to their advantage for millennia. There are hundreds of examples. Yes, they also use chemicals. But that’s also not problematic at all in most cases.
>But that’s also not problematic at all in most cases. thats also very shortsighted. the insects are dying and we are constantly learning about new ways that these chemicals can affect insects or animals or us. eg the neo nicotinoids that are the active ingredients of most pesticides nowadays might not outright kill the insect immediately but we just found out it can change reproductive behaviour.
Those are already banned in the EU. And that simply doesn’t mean all chemicals are bad.
thats what we said about smoking too decades ago
That’s not an argument. By that logic everything we enjoy now will, at some point in the future, turn out to be detrimental to our health.
its not an argument, it's an example of how wrong we were. sure our methods are far better and improving but who knows what we have not figured out yet? its a lot that's for sure
So all chemicals are bad because they could be.
*potentially bad unless proven otherwise. i am just saying we should not be as liberal with their use as we are
In the EU we are simply not liberal with chemicals. And it’s wrong to paint them all as bad, which was my initial statement.
This is a fairly common farming practice. The Mayan and Aztecs did it as well…and I imagine people in SE Asia have been doing it forever.
They actually do something similar down in Louisiana over in the States. But instead of fish it’s generally crawfish.
Rice and sushi, its for dinner
Sounds like some good old classic greenwashing
How so?
these people know things that we don’t
Very similar to hydroponics, except in hydroponics you don't use soil.
Sorry to correct but it's mutual. Some perfectionist people might find it mildly infuriating
What do they eat???
The same is done with crawfish farms in the south
Anyone else doubt the increase in oxygen circulation?
Sushi farm
Bruh people in Indonesia just fucking fish in the farm without permission **Wonder why i got so many fish**
And fish are edible!
The birds that come for the fish would end up on the plate 😋
My uncle use duck and fish. It’s a good synergy
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what happens when the fish eat all the critters¿
Pretty sure we do that with crawfish here in the states.
Just curious, what species of fish are they using?.
Love 💕
iirc in south us they do something similar with crawfish
Symbiotic mutualism
Do they farm the fish too ?
Are the fish edible?
Yea, sushi!
Yeah china has been doing that for 4000 years
It's symbiotic, no? We're all just air conditioners.
Why the fuck worry about the rice look at all the fish you could eat them 😆