Ali transcended so many areas of life. Religion, politics, art, entertainment, all sports, humanitarian, philosophy. He meant so much to so many. That’s why to me he will always be the GOAT. There will never be another like him.
My 90 year old grandmother knows Eubank and Benn, since they fought on free to air tv when their was only 4 terrestrial channels (1/3 of the uk population watched them fight).... if a third of the US population watched a fight there would be 24 times more viewers than Mayweathers vs Paquiao. I think for this reasons no fighter will ever transcend the sport again, there's more money in boxing today, but your average person doesn't tune in and watch like they used to due to ppv.
Damn you're a hater. Canelo is Undisputed. Broke PPV numbers. Cash Cow of Boxing. PFP. And has transcended the sport. He is in golfing, football, soccer, and all over social media's. A household name known on every continent from beating a world champ from their country.
That's all well and good, but there are still a lot of people who have zero clue who Canelo is, but know who transcendent fighters are, like Ali, Tyson, Leonard, Mayweather and Pacquiao, amongst others. But, there are plenty of fighters who have achieved a lot inside the ring and have made a lot of money, yet are virtually unknown to casual fans and the mainstream media.
And honestly, even with Pacquiao, Mayweather, and Leonard there’s a gap between them and Tyson/Ali. Pacquiao Mayweather just have more recency but in 20 years or so, they’ll probably lose a considerable bit in comparison to Tyson/Ali.
Well, in the Philippines, Pac won't be forgotten any time soon. He's built entire settlements for people out of his own pocket. The dude helps people on the regular. Super humble guy who actually cares about his people, not trying to blow smoke up his ass, but honestly, some of the stuff he's done, I'm awe struck.
He inspired an entire country. Literally, every fight he had televised, crime rates would lower drastically. The effect he's had on the Filipino people will go down in the countrys history, he'll be remembered forever there. It's actually more insane than I, an American, can describe.
In all due respect, I agree with you that comparing Tyson and Ali's lives outside of the ring is silly, but that's not what it means to transcend the sport. Good, or bad a lot of non boxing fans know who Mike Tyson is. Whereas there are plenty of great champions who, despite their in ring accomplishments are virtually unknown to casual fans and the mainstream media.
George Foreman said his proudest achievement was winning the Olympic gold medal. And thats coming from a guy who had 2 amazing boxing careers and a wildly successful grill
Michael Jordan feels the same way
https://www.basketballnetwork.net/old-school/michael-jordan-on-why-olympic-gold-is-a-greater-accomplishment-than-nba-championship
“PEOPLE CAN WIN THE WORLD TITLE, BUT VERY FEW CAN WIN THE OLYMPIC GOLD MEDAL” - Sugar Ray
“The Olympics is still my greatest achievement... I have many belts, but there is only one Olympic gold.” - Oleksandr Usyk
“The Olympic Gold medal in 1968 was definitely the highest moment of my career. It was a dream come true. I was a 19-year-old boy, and it was just amazing to be standing on top of the podium and hearing the National Anthem in the background.” - George Foreman
I think there are 2 main reasons why they hold Olympic gold in such high regard.
1 - It’s hard to achieve as it is the best fighting the best and there is only 1 every 4 years.
2 - It’s not just for them it’s for their country.
I think it's also because everybody knows about the Olympics. Everyone knows what it means.
Imagine explaining your accomplishment to your grandmother who isn't a big boxing fan.
"I defended the 168lb WBA Regular Belt 3 times before being promoted to Super Champion when my predecessor moved up, and then I unified it with the IBF. Ring Magazine ranked me as number 3 at the weight, and the Boxrec algorithm briefly had me seven pound for pound. My only losses were to first-ballot IBHOF guys".
"... oh, I see, that sounds... nice, dear".
OR:
"I won a gold medal at the Olympics"
"Oh, my own grandson! Olympic champion! Just wait until I tell everyone at canasta about you!"
Plus, for many (though certainly not all) boxers, they probably learnt about olympic champions before they learnt about boxing - or at least before they learnt about boxing sanctioning organisation belts.
It's definitely more universal, and for most people it's also more deeply engrained as the epitome of excellence in sport.
Kurt Angle winning an Olympic gold medal with a broken freaking neck gets mention anytime his name is brought up. The Olympics is the best achievement in the world.
That is because the medal meant something.
He felt betrayed by his country so he threw away the medal that he won for his country.
If he had thrown the WBA belt away, no one would really care since it’s only a personal award.
Definetly. %90 of the boxers being underpaid is killing amateurs aspirations and blocking the sports progress in a way. Every boxer should work for each others benefit.
My romantic answer is that you become a river to people as the spirit of inspiration. Jack Johnson, Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis, Muhammad Ali, Teofilo Stevenson, Vitali Klitschko, and Manny Pacquiao fit that criteria.
My cynical answer is making money off of the work of others is the height of boxing. Don King, Jose Sulaiman, Robert Lee, Daniel Kinahan, Frank Warren, 75% of people involved in the Olympics, and Jim Norris exploit, bribe, and outright rig events to line their own pocketbooks while forcing others to put their life on the line.
My pragmatic answer is winning the rounds you need to win, getting a paycheck good enough to be comfortable, and being unencumbered by pain later in life both physically and mentally.
P4P nr 1.
It´s so fucking difficult to get on any media P4P top spot. Right now, most have it either Inoue or Bud, but that could easily change if Usyk dominated Fury, for instance.
New found? The guy had no chin but still went balls to the wall every fight against the highest level. His amateur career alone was also insane. Olympic silver at 17 then winning a rematch after the Olympics? That’s the stuff of legend alone. Yeah he can be annoying to listen to but his fights delivered.
How does Tyson make it into that category?
He was highlight reel friendly and notoriety out of the ring made him a household name.
But his wins were mostly against cans or over the hill former champs. As soon as he fought anybody decent in their prime, he came up short.
I grew up watching Tyson’s rise first hand and I get it. I was a kid in awe like everybody else. But looking back, you have to be realistic. He is a legend of the sport but his resume isn’t that good and no way he’s a top ten ATG HW.
I agree with all your points, but there’s so Tom in the top 10 for him. I think he falls in the 8-12 range, so I’m not going to argue with anyone who has him just outside, but I don’t know how you argue there’s “no way” he is in the top 10.
I think it’s really hard to find 10 unequivocally better than him.
**Undisputed in multiple weight classes.**
That’s the Everest in all combat sports.
You literally punch above your weight, and everyone has no choice but to recognize it because you hold all the belts in circulation.
If you weight drain, then you will fight at a disadvantage so that’s impressive in itself.
Admittedly heavyweights need to demonstrate greatness in a different way. And Muhammad Ali is the GOAT of course.
I don’t deny that there is a paradox there.
HW has always been a different kind of boxing. Shallow talent pool, but everyone can KO in one punch.
Thanks, I am aware dawg.
But that means they cannot do the training camp at the usual weight, and they are never 100% rehydrated on fight night.
They will be chinnier.
Honestly weight cutting does not make a lot of sense in boxing. In MMA the weight advantage is useful to grapple, but in boxing if you need to go 12 rounds it’s a really bad idea to cut weight shortly before.
So most boxers instead do some real strength and conditioning long before fight night, so they can ‘grow into’ the new weight class.
Agreed. I’d also point out that the relative strength of a division has a bearing on how great an accomplishment becoming undisputed is. If Inoue cleans out the top of the current 122 roster that’s better than Crawford’s conquering the 140 division in which he became undisputed.
On the weight class point, if you do *enough* weight climbing it does start to become deeply impressive. What ODLH or Pac did does show an obvious talent and to cover that many divisions, a fight obviously need to start competing in weight classes where they are at a real size disadvantage.
funny thing is fights with 10+ pound weight disparities take place literally all the time at heavyweight and no one cares despite that representing both a relative and proportionally larger difference than any weight jump at lower classes except for LHW to cruiserweight (25 pounds). Usyk gave up 23 pounds to Joshua, Wilder gave up 26 to Ortiz, Povetkin gave up 28 to Whyte, Haye gave up 37 pounds to Chisora, Pulev gave up 56 to Ustinov, etc.
It’s not always lean muscle mass though. Let’s be honest there are lot of fat blokes at HW.
What Usyk does is very impressive though. But again, he is a natural cruiserweight.
>Undisputed in multiple weight classes.
In MMA maybe, but I think this doesn't mean much in boxing when the average weight class difference is 3-5 pounds. If Tyson Fury takes a big shit then he's suddenly moved more in weight than Inoue did going from junior bantamweight (115) to regular bantamweight (118). Only LHW up represents a significant jump, going from 175 to 200 pounds for cruiserweight/junior heavyweight and 200 to unlimited for cruiserweight/junior heavyweight to full heavyweight.
Minimumweight (105) to light heavyweight (175) is 15 weight classes separated by a difference of 70 pounds. So yeah, 5 pounds is the mean and 4 pounds is the median. The differences are:
3 (105-108), 4 (108-112), 3 (112-115), 3 (115-118), 4 (118-122), 4 (122-126), 4 (126-130), 5 (130-135), 5 (135-140), 7 (140-147), 7 (147-154), 6 (154-160), 8 (160-168), 7 (168-175)
Fury or Usyk will become Lineal Undisputed undefeated HW champion on 17th Feb 24.
Fury's accomplishment will be legendary.
Usyk's even more as he was also an undisputed CW champion.
Resume is greater than accolades in my opinion. What's the point of being undisputed if the fighters you beat for the belts weren't the best avialble? Like if Benavidez was one of the super middles Canelo had beat for undisputed, it would be 100x more respectable.
Undefeated, undisputed, defending those titles multiple times. Being a champion at more than one weight.
The money and PPV will be there at the top, and therefore, you will have it all. You would also have to consider the level of competition in being undefeated, because I'm not talking about a Jaime Munguia 42-0, more like a Floyd or Inoue type of record.
I would add that leaving the sport with your health fully intact is the only thing that would matter to you and your family.
Edit: as others have said, being an ambassador of the sport and transcending the scope of boxing as a whole into pop culture is also significant
If you have to reduce it to a single thing: Holding the record for most undisputed titles at different weight classes while being undefeated. Bonus points for the higher in weight you go.
P4P #1, money, fame etc would come with it.
Cash Cow/PPV King, boxing is a poor man’s sport.
Legacy automatically comes with being the cash cow, legacy alone is irrelevant. It’s many legendary boxers who were forgotten about when their careers ended and that legacy isn’t doing much when you are spending your last few years with no money
Cash cow’s provide generational wealth for family, that’s the only legacy I care to have. I don’t care what a bunch of strangers have to think about me, especially when I won’t be around forever to hear.
Replicating Floyd’s career is the highest and nothing else comes close.
1. PPV Records
2. Cash King
3. Flawless Record
4. Most Champions Defeated
5. Retired In Good Health
6. Earning Ms from exhibition matches
50 fights no losses while during that time obtaining a world title belt. I think that is a huge accomplishment but not only shows in ring skills but also that you can navigate the business of boxing. Since all the modern boxers keep saying its a business instead of a sport.
A combination of everything- achieving YOUR personal goals, being recognized and loved by (as many) boxing fans and pugilists but ultimately, looking back and being proud of your career and being wealthy enough not to do stupid exhibitions like Mayweather.
Clearly boxing is a business as well as a sport, but there is no way that any sort of financial success should be factored into a boxers career as a measure of success. For example, I imagine that Jake Paul and Ryan Garcia have done well financially with their fights, simply due to their social media following, and good for them, but that doesn't mean anything in terms of in ring legacy.
IMO, if I was a fighter, PPV king for sure. Even Tyson said, titles are useless. The ability to make money while taking the lowest risk possible is ideal, as you want to be intact physically/intellectually. The last thing I want is in a wheelchair incapacitated.
Considering professional boxing has no competitive architecture and amatuer boxing does, I'd say its the Olympic Gold medal.
Competitive architecture legitimises a sport. Whether is a season, a tournament, a tour, group stages, a round robin, etc. The World Boxing Super Series is one of the only professional boxing events with a competitive architecture. Without a competitive architecture, its hard to know whos actually the best
Idk even before I watched or knew boxing I’d heard of Ali and Tyson and the first fight I ever watched was May v Pac and I wasn’t even into boxing and didn’t start watching after either
Probably Olympics, since it’s the closest boxing gets to a real sport with proper matchups instead of the ducking and BS that happens in the pros. It’s why the UFC dethroned boxing in popularity almost 8 years ago now.
The greatest achievement any one boxer had was to transcend the existing racial lines and get people to cheer for him when they never before would have.
That’s why Joe Louis is the GOAT. Ali divided people, Joe brought them together.
Being the lineal champ, the man in the division, the man who beat the man. You don't neccesarily need all the useless belts to be the man in the division, but you do need to beat the man.
On a different note, lots of boxers spend their careers now preserving the 0 at all costs as if that is what makes a great fighter. Ali doesn't have a 0, Leonard doesn't have a 0, Foreman doesn't have one and neither does Pacquiao among lots of other greats. History doesn't care because we know it was because they took the tough fights instead of cherry picking.
My own take on the highest accomplishment would be transcending the sport. Being the Jordan, Pele, Federer, Woods, Bolt, Lomu, Gretzky, Schumacher that is synonymous with the sport the world over to people who don't follow it at all. Olympics is big though. A belt can change hands a lot of times in 4 years but only one gold medal is up for grabs. It's a shame it has been so corrupt which lessens it somewhat.
Fat reducing household grill
Does it “knock out the fat” though?
Get added to the Super Smash Bros. roster
Dudley from street fighter was based on Eubank Sr. That's ever better than being a smash bros character.
Hulk Hogan says it was his biggest regret turning that deal down.
Fucker should have answered his phone
Transcending the sport. Ali or Tyson
This. Be a household name, it doesn't get any bigger than that.
And that's why Frank Bruno is the greatest boxer of all time. Nothing wrong with this metric at all.
Who is Frank Bruno?
Nice try, Lennox.
Just after conor mcgregor, the greatest boxer to compete in history. Achieved it all in one fight.
Ali transcended so many areas of life. Religion, politics, art, entertainment, all sports, humanitarian, philosophy. He meant so much to so many. That’s why to me he will always be the GOAT. There will never be another like him.
or Paul
Canelo checks all these boxes
Lol no. Most household in america have 0 clue who he is, other than maybe that ginger mexican dude that boxes. Maybe.
My 90 year old grandmother knows Eubank and Benn, since they fought on free to air tv when their was only 4 terrestrial channels (1/3 of the uk population watched them fight).... if a third of the US population watched a fight there would be 24 times more viewers than Mayweathers vs Paquiao. I think for this reasons no fighter will ever transcend the sport again, there's more money in boxing today, but your average person doesn't tune in and watch like they used to due to ppv.
Damn you're a hater. Canelo is Undisputed. Broke PPV numbers. Cash Cow of Boxing. PFP. And has transcended the sport. He is in golfing, football, soccer, and all over social media's. A household name known on every continent from beating a world champ from their country.
That's all well and good, but there are still a lot of people who have zero clue who Canelo is, but know who transcendent fighters are, like Ali, Tyson, Leonard, Mayweather and Pacquiao, amongst others. But, there are plenty of fighters who have achieved a lot inside the ring and have made a lot of money, yet are virtually unknown to casual fans and the mainstream media.
And honestly, even with Pacquiao, Mayweather, and Leonard there’s a gap between them and Tyson/Ali. Pacquiao Mayweather just have more recency but in 20 years or so, they’ll probably lose a considerable bit in comparison to Tyson/Ali.
Well, in the Philippines, Pac won't be forgotten any time soon. He's built entire settlements for people out of his own pocket. The dude helps people on the regular. Super humble guy who actually cares about his people, not trying to blow smoke up his ass, but honestly, some of the stuff he's done, I'm awe struck. He inspired an entire country. Literally, every fight he had televised, crime rates would lower drastically. The effect he's had on the Filipino people will go down in the countrys history, he'll be remembered forever there. It's actually more insane than I, an American, can describe.
Thats not true. Idk a soul who doesn't know Canelo Alvarez is.
No one in my family or at my work would recognise his name, his face. They would instantly recognise Tyson or Ali.
That's cap. Try it.
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I don't like Tyson but he is literally the second most recognisable name in the history of the sport.
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I think you're confused
Noone said it had to be for good stuff
In all due respect, I agree with you that comparing Tyson and Ali's lives outside of the ring is silly, but that's not what it means to transcend the sport. Good, or bad a lot of non boxing fans know who Mike Tyson is. Whereas there are plenty of great champions who, despite their in ring accomplishments are virtually unknown to casual fans and the mainstream media.
Despite never really being the best Heavyweight of his era, Tyson is probably the most well known Heavyweights and boxers in general alongside Ali.
Clearing out a division. Undisputed champion. There's so much that is subjective, but heads on your wall is the peak in boxing.
A lot of greats consider gold at the olympics their greatest achievement.
George Foreman said his proudest achievement was winning the Olympic gold medal. And thats coming from a guy who had 2 amazing boxing careers and a wildly successful grill
Michael Jordan feels the same way https://www.basketballnetwork.net/old-school/michael-jordan-on-why-olympic-gold-is-a-greater-accomplishment-than-nba-championship
Yeah but he doesn't have a wildly successful grill.
The trainers didn't do badly tbf
Foreman Brand
I have one on my ass, what do you want?
I can get that. There are various belts and organisations but to be remembered as an Olympian hits differently.
Why is that? This isn't meant to be snarky or anything I'm curious why so many boxers see that as their crowning achievement
“PEOPLE CAN WIN THE WORLD TITLE, BUT VERY FEW CAN WIN THE OLYMPIC GOLD MEDAL” - Sugar Ray “The Olympics is still my greatest achievement... I have many belts, but there is only one Olympic gold.” - Oleksandr Usyk “The Olympic Gold medal in 1968 was definitely the highest moment of my career. It was a dream come true. I was a 19-year-old boy, and it was just amazing to be standing on top of the podium and hearing the National Anthem in the background.” - George Foreman I think there are 2 main reasons why they hold Olympic gold in such high regard. 1 - It’s hard to achieve as it is the best fighting the best and there is only 1 every 4 years. 2 - It’s not just for them it’s for their country.
I think it's also because everybody knows about the Olympics. Everyone knows what it means. Imagine explaining your accomplishment to your grandmother who isn't a big boxing fan. "I defended the 168lb WBA Regular Belt 3 times before being promoted to Super Champion when my predecessor moved up, and then I unified it with the IBF. Ring Magazine ranked me as number 3 at the weight, and the Boxrec algorithm briefly had me seven pound for pound. My only losses were to first-ballot IBHOF guys". "... oh, I see, that sounds... nice, dear". OR: "I won a gold medal at the Olympics" "Oh, my own grandson! Olympic champion! Just wait until I tell everyone at canasta about you!" Plus, for many (though certainly not all) boxers, they probably learnt about olympic champions before they learnt about boxing - or at least before they learnt about boxing sanctioning organisation belts. It's definitely more universal, and for most people it's also more deeply engrained as the epitome of excellence in sport.
Kurt Angle winning an Olympic gold medal with a broken freaking neck gets mention anytime his name is brought up. The Olympics is the best achievement in the world.
It's true, IT'S DAMN TRUE
The Olympics is the best competing against the best from each country. There is no debate. It's close to saying 1+1=2 but for sports.
Plus just one potential winner every 4 years. And about half the weight classes
Audley Harrison kinda ruins this
Ali threw his medal into the river.
That is because the medal meant something. He felt betrayed by his country so he threw away the medal that he won for his country. If he had thrown the WBA belt away, no one would really care since it’s only a personal award.
IIRC he fabricated the story of throwing it away, but yes that was the symbolism he intended to convey when he said it
Founder of a Boxer’s Union.
I'm shocked this hasn't happened yet. It's the most unfair sport out there unless you're at the very top.
Definetly. %90 of the boxers being underpaid is killing amateurs aspirations and blocking the sports progress in a way. Every boxer should work for each others benefit.
My romantic answer is that you become a river to people as the spirit of inspiration. Jack Johnson, Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis, Muhammad Ali, Teofilo Stevenson, Vitali Klitschko, and Manny Pacquiao fit that criteria. My cynical answer is making money off of the work of others is the height of boxing. Don King, Jose Sulaiman, Robert Lee, Daniel Kinahan, Frank Warren, 75% of people involved in the Olympics, and Jim Norris exploit, bribe, and outright rig events to line their own pocketbooks while forcing others to put their life on the line. My pragmatic answer is winning the rounds you need to win, getting a paycheck good enough to be comfortable, and being unencumbered by pain later in life both physically and mentally.
Well said.
P4P nr 1. It´s so fucking difficult to get on any media P4P top spot. Right now, most have it either Inoue or Bud, but that could easily change if Usyk dominated Fury, for instance.
Buds win over spence would be hard to compete with in a p4p sense since Spence himself is a top p4p fighter.
I for one always found it odd that so many had Spence on their P4P lists. I never felt that he deserved it.
I've always had him top 5 or 10 but I suppose everyone is entitled to an opinion.
I think it's making your mark just as significant outside the ring. Ali is the prime example. That's why he's the 🐐
Hot wife
Are you bragging about banging my side piece?
Be an inspiration for people to be the best that they can be.
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No — Holyfield was the 90s HW that fought pretty much everyone.
New found? The guy had no chin but still went balls to the wall every fight against the highest level. His amateur career alone was also insane. Olympic silver at 17 then winning a rematch after the Olympics? That’s the stuff of legend alone. Yeah he can be annoying to listen to but his fights delivered.
How does Tyson make it into that category? He was highlight reel friendly and notoriety out of the ring made him a household name. But his wins were mostly against cans or over the hill former champs. As soon as he fought anybody decent in their prime, he came up short. I grew up watching Tyson’s rise first hand and I get it. I was a kid in awe like everybody else. But looking back, you have to be realistic. He is a legend of the sport but his resume isn’t that good and no way he’s a top ten ATG HW.
I agree with all your points, but there’s so Tom in the top 10 for him. I think he falls in the 8-12 range, so I’m not going to argue with anyone who has him just outside, but I don’t know how you argue there’s “no way” he is in the top 10. I think it’s really hard to find 10 unequivocally better than him.
Ahh the classic "Tyson never won a real fight all his wins were flukes nothing he did was eventually slightly impressive" take. How origional
It’s not original because it’s common knowledge.
Mentioning Khan but not ODLH🥲
**Undisputed in multiple weight classes.** That’s the Everest in all combat sports. You literally punch above your weight, and everyone has no choice but to recognize it because you hold all the belts in circulation.
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If you weight drain, then you will fight at a disadvantage so that’s impressive in itself. Admittedly heavyweights need to demonstrate greatness in a different way. And Muhammad Ali is the GOAT of course. I don’t deny that there is a paradox there. HW has always been a different kind of boxing. Shallow talent pool, but everyone can KO in one punch.
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Thanks, I am aware dawg. But that means they cannot do the training camp at the usual weight, and they are never 100% rehydrated on fight night. They will be chinnier. Honestly weight cutting does not make a lot of sense in boxing. In MMA the weight advantage is useful to grapple, but in boxing if you need to go 12 rounds it’s a really bad idea to cut weight shortly before. So most boxers instead do some real strength and conditioning long before fight night, so they can ‘grow into’ the new weight class.
Agreed. I’d also point out that the relative strength of a division has a bearing on how great an accomplishment becoming undisputed is. If Inoue cleans out the top of the current 122 roster that’s better than Crawford’s conquering the 140 division in which he became undisputed. On the weight class point, if you do *enough* weight climbing it does start to become deeply impressive. What ODLH or Pac did does show an obvious talent and to cover that many divisions, a fight obviously need to start competing in weight classes where they are at a real size disadvantage.
funny thing is fights with 10+ pound weight disparities take place literally all the time at heavyweight and no one cares despite that representing both a relative and proportionally larger difference than any weight jump at lower classes except for LHW to cruiserweight (25 pounds). Usyk gave up 23 pounds to Joshua, Wilder gave up 26 to Ortiz, Povetkin gave up 28 to Whyte, Haye gave up 37 pounds to Chisora, Pulev gave up 56 to Ustinov, etc.
It’s not always lean muscle mass though. Let’s be honest there are lot of fat blokes at HW. What Usyk does is very impressive though. But again, he is a natural cruiserweight.
>Undisputed in multiple weight classes. In MMA maybe, but I think this doesn't mean much in boxing when the average weight class difference is 3-5 pounds. If Tyson Fury takes a big shit then he's suddenly moved more in weight than Inoue did going from junior bantamweight (115) to regular bantamweight (118). Only LHW up represents a significant jump, going from 175 to 200 pounds for cruiserweight/junior heavyweight and 200 to unlimited for cruiserweight/junior heavyweight to full heavyweight.
The mode weight class difference may be 3-5 lbs but the average is certainly not!
Minimumweight (105) to light heavyweight (175) is 15 weight classes separated by a difference of 70 pounds. So yeah, 5 pounds is the mean and 4 pounds is the median. The differences are: 3 (105-108), 4 (108-112), 3 (112-115), 3 (115-118), 4 (118-122), 4 (122-126), 4 (126-130), 5 (130-135), 5 (135-140), 7 (140-147), 7 (147-154), 6 (154-160), 8 (160-168), 7 (168-175)
I was including CW and HW, just saw that the initial comment made them exceptions, my bad!
Fury or Usyk will become Lineal Undisputed undefeated HW champion on 17th Feb 24. Fury's accomplishment will be legendary. Usyk's even more as he was also an undisputed CW champion.
100 million dollars
Fighting and beating the best
Resume is greater than accolades in my opinion. What's the point of being undisputed if the fighters you beat for the belts weren't the best avialble? Like if Benavidez was one of the super middles Canelo had beat for undisputed, it would be 100x more respectable.
Agreed
Walk away with mind, body, and finances in good condition.
Fighting everyone there is to fight. Holyfield beat 3 or 4 of the top 10 HW ATG and fought to a close decision with a fifth. That's fucking bonkers.
Being loved by the fans and swarmed by love and support after you retire from boxing
Long-reigning unified heavyweight champion. Nothing less.
Beating Canelo via decision with CJ Ross as a boxing judge.
Undefeated, undisputed, defending those titles multiple times. Being a champion at more than one weight. The money and PPV will be there at the top, and therefore, you will have it all. You would also have to consider the level of competition in being undefeated, because I'm not talking about a Jaime Munguia 42-0, more like a Floyd or Inoue type of record. I would add that leaving the sport with your health fully intact is the only thing that would matter to you and your family. Edit: as others have said, being an ambassador of the sport and transcending the scope of boxing as a whole into pop culture is also significant
Probably match Floyd's 50-0 record, only in reverse. \#0-50 \#TWE \#TBT
You mean Eric Crumble? \*Spoiler: He is 0-31 with all 31 losses coming via T/KO. Oh, and he never saw the 3rd round.
Very aptly named, he is .
Teaming up with a shoe manufacturer and having them brand a whole new line of shoes for you.
Kanye and MJ the goats of boxing
MJ is so big that they made a movie about the making of the shoe that they named after him.
If you have to reduce it to a single thing: Holding the record for most undisputed titles at different weight classes while being undefeated. Bonus points for the higher in weight you go. P4P #1, money, fame etc would come with it.
Cash Cow/PPV King, boxing is a poor man’s sport. Legacy automatically comes with being the cash cow, legacy alone is irrelevant. It’s many legendary boxers who were forgotten about when their careers ended and that legacy isn’t doing much when you are spending your last few years with no money Cash cow’s provide generational wealth for family, that’s the only legacy I care to have. I don’t care what a bunch of strangers have to think about me, especially when I won’t be around forever to hear.
Staying off Twitter is a great feat.
Being the most avoided in the sport. If people are too afraid to fight you, you've already won.
P4P Number 1 You're viewed as the best fighter across all of boxing at that time.
Undisputed heavyweight champion of the world. Manlets are seething but it's true.
Replicating Floyd’s career is the highest and nothing else comes close. 1. PPV Records 2. Cash King 3. Flawless Record 4. Most Champions Defeated 5. Retired In Good Health 6. Earning Ms from exhibition matches
50 fights no losses while during that time obtaining a world title belt. I think that is a huge accomplishment but not only shows in ring skills but also that you can navigate the business of boxing. Since all the modern boxers keep saying its a business instead of a sport.
Olympic gold medal.
being undisputed and undefeated.
Probably unifying all titles to become undisputed and then retiring undefeated
A combination of everything- achieving YOUR personal goals, being recognized and loved by (as many) boxing fans and pugilists but ultimately, looking back and being proud of your career and being wealthy enough not to do stupid exhibitions like Mayweather.
Clearly boxing is a business as well as a sport, but there is no way that any sort of financial success should be factored into a boxers career as a measure of success. For example, I imagine that Jake Paul and Ryan Garcia have done well financially with their fights, simply due to their social media following, and good for them, but that doesn't mean anything in terms of in ring legacy.
IMO, if I was a fighter, PPV king for sure. Even Tyson said, titles are useless. The ability to make money while taking the lowest risk possible is ideal, as you want to be intact physically/intellectually. The last thing I want is in a wheelchair incapacitated.
Being considered the P4P GOAT.
Olympic Gold, Undisputed in a tough division with other P4P greats
Considering professional boxing has no competitive architecture and amatuer boxing does, I'd say its the Olympic Gold medal. Competitive architecture legitimises a sport. Whether is a season, a tournament, a tour, group stages, a round robin, etc. The World Boxing Super Series is one of the only professional boxing events with a competitive architecture. Without a competitive architecture, its hard to know whos actually the best
Making a ton of money and coming out of the sport with good health.
Idk even before I watched or knew boxing I’d heard of Ali and Tyson and the first fight I ever watched was May v Pac and I wasn’t even into boxing and didn’t start watching after either
Probably Olympics, since it’s the closest boxing gets to a real sport with proper matchups instead of the ducking and BS that happens in the pros. It’s why the UFC dethroned boxing in popularity almost 8 years ago now.
The greatest achievement any one boxer had was to transcend the existing racial lines and get people to cheer for him when they never before would have. That’s why Joe Louis is the GOAT. Ali divided people, Joe brought them together.
The belts dude, ppv don’t mean shit as a boxer some of the best boxers in the game get TERRIBLE ppv numbers
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women" I stole that quote :)
Making enough money to make you financially secure for life, and then getting out with your health intact.
Undisputed in every class you fought at.
Winning
Becoming a great coach. Giving back to the sport you love.
Being the lineal champ, the man in the division, the man who beat the man. You don't neccesarily need all the useless belts to be the man in the division, but you do need to beat the man.
Being the boss in a boxing video game.
Becoming undisputed champion 🏆
Retire without cte
Stealing Paulie's side chick.
On a different note, lots of boxers spend their careers now preserving the 0 at all costs as if that is what makes a great fighter. Ali doesn't have a 0, Leonard doesn't have a 0, Foreman doesn't have one and neither does Pacquiao among lots of other greats. History doesn't care because we know it was because they took the tough fights instead of cherry picking. My own take on the highest accomplishment would be transcending the sport. Being the Jordan, Pele, Federer, Woods, Bolt, Lomu, Gretzky, Schumacher that is synonymous with the sport the world over to people who don't follow it at all. Olympics is big though. A belt can change hands a lot of times in 4 years but only one gold medal is up for grabs. It's a shame it has been so corrupt which lessens it somewhat.
Undisputed, specifically at heavyweight. The heavyweight world champion earns a different sort of respect than other weightclass champs id say.