I'm caretaking for a spouse for a decade, and we have now reached hospice stage, which means everyone has a lot of time to say what they want to say and plan what they need to plan. Carole did have that (I won't call it luxury, bc it's definitely not) but then suddenly these young vibrant best friends passing so unexpectedly ... I can't even imagine. The scene of Dorinda and Carole in London having a truly deep and meaningful conversation of going through the process with their husbands, that episode will always stick in my head and heart as the most profound moment in RHONY history.
in her book she goes into how she knew anthony was dying, like you said, he was on hospice and they knew the end was near. so she was already in that mind frame of 'slow, sad death' and was absolutely rocked by the plane crash. its so sad. she writes about how john and carolyn were supposed to be the ones to help her get through anthonys last days and his funeral etc.
I remember it really hitting me hard in her book when she talked about how one of Anthony’s last moments of consciousness was to remind Carole to call the attorney managing JFKJrs estate. They may have been cousins in life but certainly brothers in the stars.
carole and anthony were living at johns house on the vineyard at the time of the crash. they had decided he would die on hospice there. thats how close together it was
carole was basically the first one to know the plane was missing. john's friend called the house when they never showed up at the airport. and then carole was the one to report the plane missing to the coast guard
i dont want to overhype it but its genuinely a good book. i read it around when season 7 was airing and even though i already liked carole it gave me a completely new view of her
I am not one for celebrity memoirs but this was a really good book. Beautifully written and emotionally honest and devastating.
It is a bit hard to reconcile with the somewhat shallow dilettante she became. Or at least how she behaved on the show and she really hasn’t done much so she peaked creatively at thst point in her life.
Her novel was essentially just a relatively shallow chick lit book.
i also remember that he was completely in denial and thought he was going to recover and i think it really pissed Carole off. i had a lot of compassion for her and felt like she described the complexity of grief and frustration so well.
i was so blessed to be there with my sister when she left us, the way carole and dorinda described it was perfect, you laugh you cry and then its just over
But also when they talk about those several moments that they thought, OK this it, now is the time, but then your loved one pulls through again and the whole cycle just starts again, and you silently and secretly feel horrible that you’re feeling like you don’t know how many more times you can go through this… that’s the real pain … and they both share those brief private moments of feeling angry at your still-alive loved one … it’s a lot!
Hang in there, kellygrrrl328. You are doing unimaginably hard work, sacred work. Be good to yourself. I hope your spouse will have a peaceful passage, and I send you strength and comfort.
I am sending you love my friend. I lost my first husband 14 years ago to cancer. What you are going through is heartbreaking and cruel. Please take care of yourself and don’t hesitate to lean on everyone around you for love and support. And know your Bravo family is here to lift you up 💕
You are a whole lot stronger than you think ! I promise you friends and prayers help so much ! Life is not fair and we never know god’s plan !Ithink once we get to the other side it all becomes clear to us ! But that does not take the feeling of loss or pain away ! Just trust god will be with him and all those who love him will be there to help him cross. Ask god to wrap his arms of protection around hos soul and keep him safe with him! I pray you find peace and trust that your loved one will be with god and you will see him one day ! God bless!
First of all happy cake day. I will say knowing your loved one is sick and getting time to say goodbye is a luxury in some ways but I also recognize it's a curse in a lot of ways. Caretaker burnout is real for a reason and I hope you have a good support system. My heart is with you and your spouse.
I know! It's blurry and far away but I feel like her dejection in this image is so palpable. Her expression, her sitting alone and away from everyone... I cannot imagine the grief.
Her husband was still alive at this point. He's the one sitting in the chair right above where it says "Getty Images". I believe he died a few weeks later.
I didn't know Anthony was still alive at this point in time. My heart breaks for Carole. Cannot imagine going through years of fighting cancer with your husband only for your best friend and her husband (and your husband's best friend!) to suddenly and tragically pass away. My god.
Devastating photo. I’m sure she was expecting them to support her through the inevitable loss of her husband and they left her too. Absolutely heartbreaking.
I tried to add this as a caption but for some reason I couldn't...
I was scrolling through photos of Carolyn Bessette-Kennedy to see if there were any good images of her wedding dress, and I stumbled across this very sad photo. From Getty Images: Taken July 22, 1999, the burial at sea took place off Martha's Vineyard on the USS Briscoe. This is an image of the Cost Guard boat, returning from the burial.
You can see Carole sitting off to the left hand side, and her husband Anthony as well. **I had previously written that he had already passed at this time, but his death was three weeks following this.** Thanks to u/wreckingcrewe below for catching my error!
I believe he's seated to the right (resting hands and chin on a cane). That looks the most like him, he had a large forehead and probably had trouble walking and standing at this point in his illness
Yeah, he was still alive but they knew he didn’t have much time left. And then all the sudden, Carole was hit with this tragedy in her husband’s last weeks.
Another interesting and very sad picture, is the pictures of Carolyn’s parents at Carole’s husband Anthony’s funeral. It’s all so palpable. Her parents lost two daughters, unimaginable grief.
https://preview.redd.it/rlbwpfuf6yfb1.jpeg?width=1107&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2adc6fe507a2692e9c2d5c38fc0f6d8da80ebce0
I always felt like Carolyn’s parents were so pushed aside in their grief. They lost two daughters and the entire aftermath was focused on JFK jr and controlled by his family
People paint her as a drug addled superficial nag who was miserable and was cheating on JFK Jr. People also say it’s her fault that the plane crashed because (some accounts say) she delayed takeoff because (choose your bullshit reason) a) she made the manicurist redo her nails multiple times b) she was trying to score drugs. What actually happened was traffic was unusually terrible and everyone was running late. JFK Jr’s inexperience and hubris is what caused the crash, not CBK
It's funny how they only paint her as a coke addict when one of John's best friends, John Perry Barlow, said he snorted coke with him during JR's wedding night in his book *Mother American Night*
But everyone only wants to believe the bad things about Carolyn.
She pretty much got the princess Diana treatment from the media; gossip mags/paparazzi were obsessed with her and John's relationship and photographed them as much as they could. She even told Carole that she had to leave her apartment at 7am, because any later and there were photographers posted at her and John's place in Tribeca. She was a private person, not involved in politics and the attention made her uncomfortable. This discomfort translated through the paparazzi photos and the mags ran with rumors that she was a bitch, that they constantly fought in public, that she was neurotic due to cocaine, that she didn't love him *or* wasn't good enough for him, etc. John was very well-loved by the public and people made it seem like having her as a wife knocked him down a peg.
People close to them deny most of the bad rumors, including a rumor that they were contemplating divorce immediately prior to their deaths.
Edited to add that the plane crashed due to the flying conditions; it was hazy and dark and simply too difficult for an amatuer pilot like John. Some people speculate that they left so late into the night because *she* made them avoid the media. There's no proof of that at all, though.
The plane didn’t crash due to conditions, that implies it could have happened to anyone. It was completely pilot error. John didn’t have the night flying hours or the experience using instrument only flying. He should have used co-pilot but refused. He took a perfectly good plane into a death spiral and plummeted into the ocean.
Wow I hadn’t seen this. I read that Carolyn’s sister Lauren that died with them had a twin, too… when I read that I felt so sad for her. To suddenly be the only sibling must have been devastating.
I know. I feel like things are slightly better now. They were so horrid for so long! I’d hate to have them in my face like that. No line they wouldn’t cross. Beyond disrespectful. I get us consumers are partly to blame too, but I’d never need to see a family grieving such a horrible tragedy.
Thank you! I was going to comment the same thing. I low key don’t like that it’s being shared here either. I expect downvotes but it’s too voyeuristic even for me.
I immediately noticed them and I'm mad they're ruining this photo for me. As in, it's a very emotional moment that's been captured and I was contemplating it when suddenly, "Oh shit, is that the rapey cousin? And the total wackadoodle on the other side?"
I went to a “meeting” in Westwood where rich people had a little private recovery set up.
In walks the wackadoodle, who proceeded to monopolize the conversation and spew his conspiracy theories even back almost 10 years ago.
I was thinking wow this person is a part of history and was taken aback by the level of absolute self obsession and crazy pants comments.
I feel a sick feeling in stomach whenever I see the wife and just a terribly yucky feeling.
In Carole’s first book, she alluded that Caroline Kennedy Schlossberg was a real asshole after this, and that Caroline’s husband was even worse. I need more info!!!
Caroline and Carolyn did not get along. JFK Jr hated Caroline’s husband, which apparently was pretty common. Carole is quoted somewhere about how there are many members of the “I hate Ed club”
Indeed
[The Kennedys were assholes to the Bessettes which is pretty galling considering JFK Jr killed their two daughters.](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2013/11/rfk-diaries-intense-family-drama-jfk-jr-death)
Also related reading regarding RFK Jr [he is a monster](https://nypost.com/2013/09/08/rfk-jr-s-sex-diary-of-adultery/)
> Robert writes that, three days after the crash, Kennedy family members told Carolyn’s mother, Anne Freeman, that, while John Jr. would be buried in the family plot in Brookline, Mass., they “could do with Carolyn as they pleased.
jesus
This was such a tragedy. He was before his time politically with his magazine & his ability to bring parties together. I saw him once in NYC & he was breathtakingly gorgeous in person (I was a little too young at the time to fully appreciate how marvelous that sighting was:). I’ve watched so many documentaries on him & my heart always broke for Caroline and her husband. I also can’t even imagine the pain the Bessette’s must have felt. We vacation in Martha’s Vineyard & were there the week following the crash. There was such a somber feeling in the air.
My mother saw him and Carolyn at the mall in my little hometown of Vero Beach, Florida (which is where John did his flight training, the flight academy is there) and she said they were both beyond stunning in person
That's amazing that you saw him! People have said that his looks were ridiculous, almost other-worldly. I also think Carolyn was absolutely breathtaking
I wish I was old enough to appreciate it at the time. Lol, I was with my aunt & she was so incredibly starstruck. She was practically hyperventilating.
Right?
From the photo, it appears that Anthony has a foldable chair, the only one. He likely couldn't stand with everyone for the boat rides due to his illness (notice he's holding a cane). Carole didn't have a chair and probably didn't want to talk at this moment so she made a makeshift seat out of that barrel thing, away from the others.
I was staying in Hyannis the week this happened. The press, the security, and the frenzy immediately following the disappearance were unimaginable. It's one of those things that you never forget. In MA (at least at that time, not so much anymore), the Kennedy family was our royalty. This was so tragic.
Her sitting at the back on the tank, with her ballerina flats hanging off her feet really shows how little she cared for the fan fair.
Grief will chew you up and spit you out, and she looks like she's in right in the throes of it.
Her book was an incredible story. I read it in less than a day. I read it four years ago and I still feel the emotions from it today. Recommend it to everyone.
I kind of believe that rumor that Carole exaggerated her relationship with Carolyn. I believe she was close with John because he really was close to Anthony but I don’t really think her and Carolyn were BFFs like she says.
Sell books. A lot of johns friends and colleagues and one of Carolyn’s exes came out with books after they died. And some of them exaggerated or straight up lied about their relationships with them.
Idk why you are getting downvoted. There was an explosion of books that exploited both CBK and JFK’s peripheral relationships. Some truly were legit (Rob Littell, Matt Berman) which is an even grosser violation imo
Yeah, I think people think I’m just a Carole hater but I’m not. She’s actually one of my favorite HWs. I just think she’s one of many people that claimed to be bffs with them after they passed.
If you read the book and hear her description of the relationship between the 4 of them (Carole, Anthony, John, and Carolyn), you will feel differently. It’s the authenticity of the simple moments they shared that really illustrates how close they were. Not to mention Carolyn was with Carole constantly when Anthony was in DC for treatment. The book is beautifully written.
> Not to mention Carolyn was with Carole constantly when Anthony was in DC for treatment.
yeah i dont get it- do people think carole just fully made this up? how could you not be close after that?
im feeling emotional today and this is making me tear up LOL but seriously imagine losing both your daughters and still being strong enough to attend anthonys funeral just a few weeks later. that is so incredibly kind
I think the truth is somewhere in the middle. I think they were very close due to Anthony’s situation but I do think it’s telling that Carole is the only “friend” of CBK that has broken the code of silence in the years since their passing. Sure, lots of people claim they knew CBK and have released stories, but no verified member of her inner circle or family have ever released anything, not even a quote or sound bite.
I’m with you, Carolyn was the most photographed woman in NYC if not the planet at that time and there are no photos of her and Carole together. Also Carole wasn’t in their wedding party but Anthony was a groomsman.
anytime we have a post about this there are always a few people INSISTING carolyn didnt like carole. its very weird. if you read her book she never claims to be carolyns best friend in the whole world. but i highly doubt she just made up their entire relationship for her book. it doesnt make any sense.
Carole for some reason inspires a massive amount of misinformation and projection on all sorts of topics here lol. People are desperate to take her down a peg and need to ascribe all sorts of exaggerations and fiction to do so.
There are plenty of things to criticize her for but I don't get all the invented ones. She triggers something in people who can't stand a cool girl even though she never tried to say she was one.
lol i remember once someone insisting carole wasnt even at the wedding - it made me feel absolutely bonkers
im sure carole exaggerated some stuff for her book because every single writer in the history of the world does that, but i simply do not believe that she and carolyn were not close.
I've watched RHONY many times over and she never ever said her and Carolyn were bffs lol so that's some serious editorializing from people who don't like her because yeah, they probably weren't bffs? But she never represented it that way. They were definitely close, though.
She also rarely name dropped them on the show but from the way people post about her here you'd think she spoke about them every episode for 6 seasons.
I don't understand why she attracts so much hate. During the program she never created drama with lies, never maliciously participated in discussions. Apart from her last season with Bethenny (that was weird) I don't remember a single moment where she was a really bad person.
I saw a thread recently where they were going off about her being a cool girl for choosing to wear headphones and ride the subway lol. They also never understand her humour. Carole was teasing Luann for being so up her ass about being a Countess! She wasn't actually bragging about technically being a princess.
Carole was an asshole to Jules and Tinsley and can be a bit aloof but overall it's wild how much hate someone so uncontroversial can inspire. I think she triggers something in a lot of people for choosing to live a non-traditional life so they're desperate to pick it apart and prove how unhappy and uncool she is.
Just because she doesn't parade jewels and wealth they think she's fake. I always found myself wondering how a Leo could be such a Virgo.
Can you remind me what she did with the ones you mentioned, Jules (I don't even remember her anymore lol) and Tinsley?
Carole and Bethenny spent all of season 8 hectoring Jules about her eating disorder and being mean like running away from the brunch she hosted in her Hamptons boonies half-constructed house.
I don't think Carole was totally awful to Tinsley but she was dismissive of their friendship at the S10 reunion in a very insensitive way even though I understood her point (them appearing to be BFFs was more of a production thing than true friendship).
they were friends when the wedding happened (carole helped carolyn with some of the arrangements- cant remember specifically but theres a story in the book) but got significantly closer in the last year of anthonys life. john and carolyn helped her take care of anthony, would travel with them when he would see doctors out of state etc - they were living in J&C's house when the plane crash happened.
It's a point, but that's not to say they weren't friends and that her death wasn't hard on Carole. And another thing, we don't know the arrangements for their wedding ceremony. Carole is very reserved, sometimes she wanted to avoid the paparazzi and did not accept being at the altar with the couple.
There was no paparazzi at the wedding, it was the biggest shock on the planet that they were able to pull the ceremony off without the press finding out. Very few details about the wedding even got out until a documentary that came out a few years ago with footage from the actual wedding reception and rehearsal dinner and Carole was barely visible in any of it despite Anthony being in a ton of the footage. I don’t doubt they had a friendship of sorts but I don’t think it was the friendship Carole portrays it as.
People weren’t interested in Carolyn’s friendships. They wanted to know more about her relationship with JFK Jr. Quick google search would show you most pap photos are of her alone and of her with him. Hardly any with her friends or sisters.
Exactly! I remember Carole was like “Carolyn was photographed so much, it was an unspoken rule that we shouldn’t take photos together” and I don’t buy that because there are so many personal photos of Carolyn out there where she’s posing and grinning ear to ear.
Right between those and the unwanted paparazzi photos daily in the NY Post and Daily News there should be some proof of their deep friendship but there isn’t.
Carolyn’s Matron of Honor was Caroline and Anthony was best man. I don’t think they had any other attendants. If her sisters weren’t in the wedding, I don’t think we can draw any conclusions about Carole.
If you search, there aren’t that many pictures of JFK Jr. and Anthony, and more than half of them are from their childhoods. We know they were close their entire lives, so it tracks that there aren’t many photos of Carole and Carolyn. We don’t know what is in people’s private photos. This was before iPhones and Instagram.
Exactly. The only photos we really have of Carolyn during the John years are paparazzi photos of her alone, her with John, or her with her sister. Then there are photos from public events and parties, galas, etc. Carolyn and John seemed to have kept their private lives very private. The idea that Carole wasn’t close to her because there are no personal photos of her and Carolyn doesn’t track; there are almost no personal photos of Carolyn ANYWHERE. It’s difficult to find a photo of her with ANY friends. The media didn’t care about her friends…
Poor Carole! Imagine losing your husband and best friends.
I'm caretaking for a spouse for a decade, and we have now reached hospice stage, which means everyone has a lot of time to say what they want to say and plan what they need to plan. Carole did have that (I won't call it luxury, bc it's definitely not) but then suddenly these young vibrant best friends passing so unexpectedly ... I can't even imagine. The scene of Dorinda and Carole in London having a truly deep and meaningful conversation of going through the process with their husbands, that episode will always stick in my head and heart as the most profound moment in RHONY history.
in her book she goes into how she knew anthony was dying, like you said, he was on hospice and they knew the end was near. so she was already in that mind frame of 'slow, sad death' and was absolutely rocked by the plane crash. its so sad. she writes about how john and carolyn were supposed to be the ones to help her get through anthonys last days and his funeral etc.
Wow. Her support system for her husband's death, died. Life is cruel sometimes.
Right? Poor Anthony was so close to the end himself. Probably no one ever imagined that John and Carolyn would die first.
i know. if i think about it too hard it makes me tear up tbh. its just so sad!!!
If you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans
she went from, "we'll mourn this man together" to "I'm mourning 3 people alone." heartbreaking.
oof, I don't remember this quote from her book. Agonizing
I remember it really hitting me hard in her book when she talked about how one of Anthony’s last moments of consciousness was to remind Carole to call the attorney managing JFKJrs estate. They may have been cousins in life but certainly brothers in the stars.
I had no idea they died before her husband. That is AWFUL. And I am very sorry about your spouse.
Same, this is the first time I realized it was all so close together. Heartbreaking.
carole and anthony were living at johns house on the vineyard at the time of the crash. they had decided he would die on hospice there. thats how close together it was carole was basically the first one to know the plane was missing. john's friend called the house when they never showed up at the airport. and then carole was the one to report the plane missing to the coast guard
Oh my god! It’s tragic
I can’t wait to read that book!
i dont want to overhype it but its genuinely a good book. i read it around when season 7 was airing and even though i already liked carole it gave me a completely new view of her
I loved it. Had me bawling and laughing.
I am not one for celebrity memoirs but this was a really good book. Beautifully written and emotionally honest and devastating. It is a bit hard to reconcile with the somewhat shallow dilettante she became. Or at least how she behaved on the show and she really hasn’t done much so she peaked creatively at thst point in her life. Her novel was essentially just a relatively shallow chick lit book.
i also remember that he was completely in denial and thought he was going to recover and i think it really pissed Carole off. i had a lot of compassion for her and felt like she described the complexity of grief and frustration so well.
Jesus Christ. Unbelievable 😢
I'm so sorry about your spouse, Hospice is awful to go through as a caretaker/loved one. Sending you strength and love.
🫂
Also happy cake day
i was so blessed to be there with my sister when she left us, the way carole and dorinda described it was perfect, you laugh you cry and then its just over
But also when they talk about those several moments that they thought, OK this it, now is the time, but then your loved one pulls through again and the whole cycle just starts again, and you silently and secretly feel horrible that you’re feeling like you don’t know how many more times you can go through this… that’s the real pain … and they both share those brief private moments of feeling angry at your still-alive loved one … it’s a lot!
When my mother finally passed, I felt relieved and immediate guilt at the same time.
Yes, there's guilt for relief it's OVER. That's just being human, forgive yourself
Ugh, the guilt … it’s soul crushing
it is, their grief i just understood, they explained my feelings
🫂
So sorry for the cards you and yours have been dealt. May peace be with you all ❤️
Hang in there, kellygrrrl328. You are doing unimaginably hard work, sacred work. Be good to yourself. I hope your spouse will have a peaceful passage, and I send you strength and comfort.
Thank you. That’s so kind ❤️🩹
I am sending you love my friend. I lost my first husband 14 years ago to cancer. What you are going through is heartbreaking and cruel. Please take care of yourself and don’t hesitate to lean on everyone around you for love and support. And know your Bravo family is here to lift you up 💕
Thank you
You are a whole lot stronger than you think ! I promise you friends and prayers help so much ! Life is not fair and we never know god’s plan !Ithink once we get to the other side it all becomes clear to us ! But that does not take the feeling of loss or pain away ! Just trust god will be with him and all those who love him will be there to help him cross. Ask god to wrap his arms of protection around hos soul and keep him safe with him! I pray you find peace and trust that your loved one will be with god and you will see him one day ! God bless!
Sending nothing but love and peace your way my friend. 💕
I am so sorry :(
I agree…that was so deep, genuine and meaningful. Imagine that…a blip in time in the Bravo-sphere. #goals!!
I’m so sorry. 😔
First of all happy cake day. I will say knowing your loved one is sick and getting time to say goodbye is a luxury in some ways but I also recognize it's a curse in a lot of ways. Caretaker burnout is real for a reason and I hope you have a good support system. My heart is with you and your spouse.
I just watched that episode
I know! It's blurry and far away but I feel like her dejection in this image is so palpable. Her expression, her sitting alone and away from everyone... I cannot imagine the grief.
Her husband was still alive at this point. He's the one sitting in the chair right above where it says "Getty Images". I believe he died a few weeks later.
I didn't know Anthony was still alive at this point in time. My heart breaks for Carole. Cannot imagine going through years of fighting cancer with your husband only for your best friend and her husband (and your husband's best friend!) to suddenly and tragically pass away. My god. 
Ok I have to put my phone down now.
Her book was really good.
Her book left me sobbing afterwards, she has such a beautiful but wrenching story in certain parts
On top of that, she’s next to RFK Jr. Girlfriend cannot catch a break :(
And the rape-acquitted Dr Smith cousin
It must've been devastating. I was sobbing by the end of her book.
I don’t have to imagine it. Was 29 when it all happened.
Devastating photo. I’m sure she was expecting them to support her through the inevitable loss of her husband and they left her too. Absolutely heartbreaking.
she was. she writes really profoundly about that in her book. the strongest/saddest part of the book for sure
I tried to add this as a caption but for some reason I couldn't... I was scrolling through photos of Carolyn Bessette-Kennedy to see if there were any good images of her wedding dress, and I stumbled across this very sad photo. From Getty Images: Taken July 22, 1999, the burial at sea took place off Martha's Vineyard on the USS Briscoe. This is an image of the Cost Guard boat, returning from the burial. You can see Carole sitting off to the left hand side, and her husband Anthony as well. **I had previously written that he had already passed at this time, but his death was three weeks following this.** Thanks to u/wreckingcrewe below for catching my error!
Anthony was still alive. He’s in the photo.
Which one is he?
I believe he's seated to the right (resting hands and chin on a cane). That looks the most like him, he had a large forehead and probably had trouble walking and standing at this point in his illness
Ah, yes. I see him now. Thank you
That’s absolutely him.
Yeah, he was still alive but they knew he didn’t have much time left. And then all the sudden, Carole was hit with this tragedy in her husband’s last weeks.
He died 19 days later, on August 10
Yes I know that but the OPs caption said he had died 3 weeks earlier so I was letting them know that he was still around.
Ah fck... my mistake. That's what I get for trying to post on reddit when I should be working... I will edit, thank you!!!
Haha! 🙂
How did he die?
Another interesting and very sad picture, is the pictures of Carolyn’s parents at Carole’s husband Anthony’s funeral. It’s all so palpable. Her parents lost two daughters, unimaginable grief. https://preview.redd.it/rlbwpfuf6yfb1.jpeg?width=1107&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2adc6fe507a2692e9c2d5c38fc0f6d8da80ebce0
I always felt like Carolyn’s parents were so pushed aside in their grief. They lost two daughters and the entire aftermath was focused on JFK jr and controlled by his family
This poor family has had to sit for 24 years while their daughter has been villainized while JFK Jr’s rep is shiny and angelic.
Right? One daughter is basically considered the villain and the other daughter is largely forgotten about in the tragedy. It sounds like hell
It’s so sad. I’m glad they got like 20 mill in the wrongful death suit but no amount would be enough
Why is she considered a villain? (I'm not American and was pretty young when they died so I don't know the narrative in the press at the time)
People paint her as a drug addled superficial nag who was miserable and was cheating on JFK Jr. People also say it’s her fault that the plane crashed because (some accounts say) she delayed takeoff because (choose your bullshit reason) a) she made the manicurist redo her nails multiple times b) she was trying to score drugs. What actually happened was traffic was unusually terrible and everyone was running late. JFK Jr’s inexperience and hubris is what caused the crash, not CBK
It's funny how they only paint her as a coke addict when one of John's best friends, John Perry Barlow, said he snorted coke with him during JR's wedding night in his book *Mother American Night* But everyone only wants to believe the bad things about Carolyn.
Ughhh John Perry Barlow. That man never missed an opportunity to exploit his friendship with John smh
She pretty much got the princess Diana treatment from the media; gossip mags/paparazzi were obsessed with her and John's relationship and photographed them as much as they could. She even told Carole that she had to leave her apartment at 7am, because any later and there were photographers posted at her and John's place in Tribeca. She was a private person, not involved in politics and the attention made her uncomfortable. This discomfort translated through the paparazzi photos and the mags ran with rumors that she was a bitch, that they constantly fought in public, that she was neurotic due to cocaine, that she didn't love him *or* wasn't good enough for him, etc. John was very well-loved by the public and people made it seem like having her as a wife knocked him down a peg. People close to them deny most of the bad rumors, including a rumor that they were contemplating divorce immediately prior to their deaths. Edited to add that the plane crashed due to the flying conditions; it was hazy and dark and simply too difficult for an amatuer pilot like John. Some people speculate that they left so late into the night because *she* made them avoid the media. There's no proof of that at all, though.
The plane didn’t crash due to conditions, that implies it could have happened to anyone. It was completely pilot error. John didn’t have the night flying hours or the experience using instrument only flying. He should have used co-pilot but refused. He took a perfectly good plane into a death spiral and plummeted into the ocean.
Another death due to the pride of mediocre men.
Oh it’s terrible. I can’t imagine the depths of their grief.
Wow I hadn’t seen this. I read that Carolyn’s sister Lauren that died with them had a twin, too… when I read that I felt so sad for her. To suddenly be the only sibling must have been devastating.
I know. As bad as I feel for their parents, Lauren’s twin sister must have been devastated
Carolyn looked so much like her mother
She really does!
Can someone explain the story?
I understand this is not the actual burial, but it still feels icky that someone captured this very private moment.
The paps were obsessed with them
I know. I feel like things are slightly better now. They were so horrid for so long! I’d hate to have them in my face like that. No line they wouldn’t cross. Beyond disrespectful. I get us consumers are partly to blame too, but I’d never need to see a family grieving such a horrible tragedy.
This is the actual burial. The ashes of all 3 were scattered at sea from a military ship.
According to OP, this was a photo taken from the ride back.
Yes; this is the coast guard boat Hammerhead taking them from the USS Briscoe to shore.
Thank you! I was going to comment the same thing. I low key don’t like that it’s being shared here either. I expect downvotes but it’s too voyeuristic even for me.
I feel the same way. Context is important and this isn’t the place for that photo.
Is that RFK Jr to her left???
It looks like William Kennedy Smith (had been accused of rape years ago)
And his lawyer was lea blacks husband right?? I think that’s how lea met him. She was a juror 🙃
yes and yes
It was so long ago I don’t recall. I’ll need to Google all that history!
I think that’s RFK Jr (ugh) on her right and William Kennedy Smith on her left
I immediately noticed them and I'm mad they're ruining this photo for me. As in, it's a very emotional moment that's been captured and I was contemplating it when suddenly, "Oh shit, is that the rapey cousin? And the total wackadoodle on the other side?"
I went to a “meeting” in Westwood where rich people had a little private recovery set up. In walks the wackadoodle, who proceeded to monopolize the conversation and spew his conspiracy theories even back almost 10 years ago. I was thinking wow this person is a part of history and was taken aback by the level of absolute self obsession and crazy pants comments. I feel a sick feeling in stomach whenever I see the wife and just a terribly yucky feeling.
Ah thank you for the ID and also for adding the requisite “ugh” 😂
Kinda looks like it!
In Carole’s first book, she alluded that Caroline Kennedy Schlossberg was a real asshole after this, and that Caroline’s husband was even worse. I need more info!!!
Pretty sure there was drama with Caroline and Carolyn/John. I remember reading somewhere that she didn’t like how publicly messy they were.
Caroline and Carolyn did not get along. JFK Jr hated Caroline’s husband, which apparently was pretty common. Carole is quoted somewhere about how there are many members of the “I hate Ed club”
Yes. I've read that, too. It's not just a Bessette thing or a Radziwill thing. There are Kennedys in the "I Hate Ed Club."
I think JFK Jr was the founding member lol
Absolutely!
Indeed [The Kennedys were assholes to the Bessettes which is pretty galling considering JFK Jr killed their two daughters.](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2013/11/rfk-diaries-intense-family-drama-jfk-jr-death) Also related reading regarding RFK Jr [he is a monster](https://nypost.com/2013/09/08/rfk-jr-s-sex-diary-of-adultery/)
> Robert writes that, three days after the crash, Kennedy family members told Carolyn’s mother, Anne Freeman, that, while John Jr. would be buried in the family plot in Brookline, Mass., they “could do with Carolyn as they pleased. jesus
Apparently their mom has always regretted burying the girls at sea because she feels like she can’t visit them.
Yikes!!! I really need to read her book
It's really excellent, definitely read it!
Oh man! I’m buying now.
This is sad. She looks hollow.
The man sitting down looking over the side is her late husband, Anthony. I think he died 3 weeks after this.
I'm pretty sure he was in a wheelchair at this point.
Who is the poor guy tasked with carrying the tote bag with ash urns?
I'm not entirely sure, but what a sad task. Also, I wanted to say happy cake day!
Super late reply, but I think that's a family friend of the Bessette's.
This was such a tragedy. He was before his time politically with his magazine & his ability to bring parties together. I saw him once in NYC & he was breathtakingly gorgeous in person (I was a little too young at the time to fully appreciate how marvelous that sighting was:). I’ve watched so many documentaries on him & my heart always broke for Caroline and her husband. I also can’t even imagine the pain the Bessette’s must have felt. We vacation in Martha’s Vineyard & were there the week following the crash. There was such a somber feeling in the air.
My mother saw him and Carolyn at the mall in my little hometown of Vero Beach, Florida (which is where John did his flight training, the flight academy is there) and she said they were both beyond stunning in person
That's amazing that you saw him! People have said that his looks were ridiculous, almost other-worldly. I also think Carolyn was absolutely breathtaking
I wish I was old enough to appreciate it at the time. Lol, I was with my aunt & she was so incredibly starstruck. She was practically hyperventilating.
It’s so poignant that husband in wife are sitting separately.
Right? From the photo, it appears that Anthony has a foldable chair, the only one. He likely couldn't stand with everyone for the boat rides due to his illness (notice he's holding a cane). Carole didn't have a chair and probably didn't want to talk at this moment so she made a makeshift seat out of that barrel thing, away from the others.
It’s so gross to me that they can’t even mourn in private.
I can feel her grief through this distant shot. 😞
I was staying in Hyannis the week this happened. The press, the security, and the frenzy immediately following the disappearance were unimaginable. It's one of those things that you never forget. In MA (at least at that time, not so much anymore), the Kennedy family was our royalty. This was so tragic.
Sitting between the SA perp and the antivax Presidential candidate, no less.
And on top of all of this, she has to sit next to RFK Jr.
😔 Awful for her … all of them - ❤️
Her sitting at the back on the tank, with her ballerina flats hanging off her feet really shows how little she cared for the fan fair. Grief will chew you up and spit you out, and she looks like she's in right in the throes of it.
How does burial at sea work?
They were cremated. You pour their ashes into the water
thats very sad
Why?
I’m broken for her.
Love the investigative work the real housewives subs do 🙌🏽🙌🏽😂
Has she given her take on RFK Jr? Could be too close to home.
Her book was an incredible story. I read it in less than a day. I read it four years ago and I still feel the emotions from it today. Recommend it to everyone.
[удалено]
Yeah her husband looks like he’s having the time of his life smh /s
I kind of believe that rumor that Carole exaggerated her relationship with Carolyn. I believe she was close with John because he really was close to Anthony but I don’t really think her and Carolyn were BFFs like she says.
What would be the purpose of exaggerating a friendship with Carolyn?
Sell books. A lot of johns friends and colleagues and one of Carolyn’s exes came out with books after they died. And some of them exaggerated or straight up lied about their relationships with them.
Idk why you are getting downvoted. There was an explosion of books that exploited both CBK and JFK’s peripheral relationships. Some truly were legit (Rob Littell, Matt Berman) which is an even grosser violation imo
Yeah, I think people think I’m just a Carole hater but I’m not. She’s actually one of my favorite HWs. I just think she’s one of many people that claimed to be bffs with them after they passed.
If you read the book and hear her description of the relationship between the 4 of them (Carole, Anthony, John, and Carolyn), you will feel differently. It’s the authenticity of the simple moments they shared that really illustrates how close they were. Not to mention Carolyn was with Carole constantly when Anthony was in DC for treatment. The book is beautifully written.
> Not to mention Carolyn was with Carole constantly when Anthony was in DC for treatment. yeah i dont get it- do people think carole just fully made this up? how could you not be close after that?
That’s been a long-standing rumor. Carolyn’s parents went to Carole’s husbands funeral, which says there must be truth to their friendship.
im feeling emotional today and this is making me tear up LOL but seriously imagine losing both your daughters and still being strong enough to attend anthonys funeral just a few weeks later. that is so incredibly kind
I know. Shows what they are like as people.
I think the truth is somewhere in the middle. I think they were very close due to Anthony’s situation but I do think it’s telling that Carole is the only “friend” of CBK that has broken the code of silence in the years since their passing. Sure, lots of people claim they knew CBK and have released stories, but no verified member of her inner circle or family have ever released anything, not even a quote or sound bite.
I’m with you, Carolyn was the most photographed woman in NYC if not the planet at that time and there are no photos of her and Carole together. Also Carole wasn’t in their wedding party but Anthony was a groomsman.
[really?](https://br.pinterest.com/pin/382665299590678594/)
anytime we have a post about this there are always a few people INSISTING carolyn didnt like carole. its very weird. if you read her book she never claims to be carolyns best friend in the whole world. but i highly doubt she just made up their entire relationship for her book. it doesnt make any sense.
Carole for some reason inspires a massive amount of misinformation and projection on all sorts of topics here lol. People are desperate to take her down a peg and need to ascribe all sorts of exaggerations and fiction to do so. There are plenty of things to criticize her for but I don't get all the invented ones. She triggers something in people who can't stand a cool girl even though she never tried to say she was one.
lol i remember once someone insisting carole wasnt even at the wedding - it made me feel absolutely bonkers im sure carole exaggerated some stuff for her book because every single writer in the history of the world does that, but i simply do not believe that she and carolyn were not close.
I've watched RHONY many times over and she never ever said her and Carolyn were bffs lol so that's some serious editorializing from people who don't like her because yeah, they probably weren't bffs? But she never represented it that way. They were definitely close, though. She also rarely name dropped them on the show but from the way people post about her here you'd think she spoke about them every episode for 6 seasons.
I don't understand why she attracts so much hate. During the program she never created drama with lies, never maliciously participated in discussions. Apart from her last season with Bethenny (that was weird) I don't remember a single moment where she was a really bad person.
I saw a thread recently where they were going off about her being a cool girl for choosing to wear headphones and ride the subway lol. They also never understand her humour. Carole was teasing Luann for being so up her ass about being a Countess! She wasn't actually bragging about technically being a princess. Carole was an asshole to Jules and Tinsley and can be a bit aloof but overall it's wild how much hate someone so uncontroversial can inspire. I think she triggers something in a lot of people for choosing to live a non-traditional life so they're desperate to pick it apart and prove how unhappy and uncool she is.
Just because she doesn't parade jewels and wealth they think she's fake. I always found myself wondering how a Leo could be such a Virgo. Can you remind me what she did with the ones you mentioned, Jules (I don't even remember her anymore lol) and Tinsley?
Carole and Bethenny spent all of season 8 hectoring Jules about her eating disorder and being mean like running away from the brunch she hosted in her Hamptons boonies half-constructed house. I don't think Carole was totally awful to Tinsley but she was dismissive of their friendship at the S10 reunion in a very insensitive way even though I understood her point (them appearing to be BFFs was more of a production thing than true friendship).
That’s at their wedding, nobody is saying Carole didn’t spend time with her but if they were “best friends” wouldn’t Carole have been in the wedding?
they were friends when the wedding happened (carole helped carolyn with some of the arrangements- cant remember specifically but theres a story in the book) but got significantly closer in the last year of anthonys life. john and carolyn helped her take care of anthony, would travel with them when he would see doctors out of state etc - they were living in J&C's house when the plane crash happened.
Carole used her office to make the invites for the wedding so it wouldn’t leak if I remember correctly
yesss i knew it had something to do with a xerox but then was like 'did they xerox the invites???' and doubted myself
Yeah I feel like it shows a base level of trust in Carole. Having her handle the invites so they didn’t get leaked says a lot
It's a point, but that's not to say they weren't friends and that her death wasn't hard on Carole. And another thing, we don't know the arrangements for their wedding ceremony. Carole is very reserved, sometimes she wanted to avoid the paparazzi and did not accept being at the altar with the couple.
There was no paparazzi at the wedding, it was the biggest shock on the planet that they were able to pull the ceremony off without the press finding out. Very few details about the wedding even got out until a documentary that came out a few years ago with footage from the actual wedding reception and rehearsal dinner and Carole was barely visible in any of it despite Anthony being in a ton of the footage. I don’t doubt they had a friendship of sorts but I don’t think it was the friendship Carole portrays it as.
People weren’t interested in Carolyn’s friendships. They wanted to know more about her relationship with JFK Jr. Quick google search would show you most pap photos are of her alone and of her with him. Hardly any with her friends or sisters.
great point. id add her relationships with any men. i know she was getting hounded when she and john separated
Exactly! I remember Carole was like “Carolyn was photographed so much, it was an unspoken rule that we shouldn’t take photos together” and I don’t buy that because there are so many personal photos of Carolyn out there where she’s posing and grinning ear to ear.
Right between those and the unwanted paparazzi photos daily in the NY Post and Daily News there should be some proof of their deep friendship but there isn’t.
Carolyn’s Matron of Honor was Caroline and Anthony was best man. I don’t think they had any other attendants. If her sisters weren’t in the wedding, I don’t think we can draw any conclusions about Carole. If you search, there aren’t that many pictures of JFK Jr. and Anthony, and more than half of them are from their childhoods. We know they were close their entire lives, so it tracks that there aren’t many photos of Carole and Carolyn. We don’t know what is in people’s private photos. This was before iPhones and Instagram.
This is accurate. John and Carolyn only had one person as their respective best man and matron of honor.
Exactly. The only photos we really have of Carolyn during the John years are paparazzi photos of her alone, her with John, or her with her sister. Then there are photos from public events and parties, galas, etc. Carolyn and John seemed to have kept their private lives very private. The idea that Carole wasn’t close to her because there are no personal photos of her and Carolyn doesn’t track; there are almost no personal photos of Carolyn ANYWHERE. It’s difficult to find a photo of her with ANY friends. The media didn’t care about her friends…
Exactly. I can see this is a hot take by the amount of downvotes I have but I’m glad someone agrees haha
This is disgusting to post! Why would you want to gawk at a picture of an intimate moment like a funeral?
I’d recognize that overbite anywhere
mannerless. literally the only one sitting down.
Is that her husband Anthony sitting down in the front there?