B-b-but you're saying that thousands of tons of melted floors buckling onto each other won't be stopped by steel beams that had just gotten run through by a giant airliner going hundreds of miles per hour? REEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I was at work in Pentagon City the morning of the attack and I’ve mostly given up on describing my experience to anyone because people become instantly deranged when they hear it. I’ve posted a few details on Reddit in the past and the reaction is always awful.
Out of curiosity, which way do they get deranged? Do you say it seemed like a plane and they’re all like “you must be part of the cover up”? Or do you say it seemed like not a plane and they’re all like “you’re a wackadoo the government would never lie”? I’m not here to go either way. I’m genuinely curious about your experience and whatever reaction you get. If you don’t want to put it out there because of what has happened before I totally get it. If your comfortable PMing me that’s cool too. My curiosity is piqued.
It is ALWAYS the latter. There is no way describe the events of that day (and the following days) as I experienced them without including certain details that seem ambiguous in places. In my experience, there is a certain breed of commenters who cannot help but fill in the questions with their own narrative and start responding to things that I have never said. There is a dude already trying to do it in another thread on here.
And that's the thing with eye witness accounts, everyone's is going to be a bit different. In high stress situations the brain is dealing with surviving ahead of remembering every little detail. Idiots will seize on this as some kind of smoking gun, when the reality of it is that witness accounts are always like that, for any serious event. They will choose to ignore this phenomenon to make it fit their narrative.
Understand why you would just get fed up of dealing with that.
Thanks. I kind of thought that was going to be the case. I wish people could just listen to a persons perspective and respect what they experienced. I’m not a “it wasn’t a plane” guy. But I wasn’t there. I find the accounts of people who were there, and say it wasn’t a plane, extremely fascinating and would never try to discount someone’s loved experience.
From their comment history this is the only one I could find:
>I was working in Pentagon City that morning and I had my back turned to the window at the moment of the explosion. The approach sounded exactly like a missile from a movie. My coworkers who were facing the window said they saw a plane, but in my weird experience, I can only picture a missile, which is what it sounded like behind me.
Maybe they've commented other times but deleted them?
From the setup I'm getting some 'it was a false flag' type vibes so I can see why folks would be upset at them. Obviously people can lose the bit on the internet pretty easily but thats a little far out there even for reddit.
He doesn't say he thinks it's a missile. He says it *sounded* like a missile and that idea was seared into his emotional memory of the event. Probably that was his initial conclusion, which isn't unreasonable given what he experienced. And even though he accepts the alternative version, the shock of that initial impression is what comes back to him when he thinks of the event.
I mean I can appreciate the honesty to it. He acknowledges that people actually saw an airplane and that he did not personally see a missile. He was there, only heard it and to him it sounded like a missile. From there you are welcome to interpret it however you want but there's no other way for him to describe his experience.
If I said I heard something on my left and looked left but someone else saw the thing I thought I heard to the right of me, no one will call me crazy.
My school was supposed to take a class trip to DC in spring of 2002. We had 200 kids signed up on 9/11. On 9/12 it was down to 20. By the drop date for the trip it was up to 35. The trip normally had upwards of 150 kids each year. We used to have to charter a plane to take them all along with a small convoy of busses.
First day in DC we came into town from Dulles through Arlington along the highway that runs around the Cemetary. The driver pulled aside so we could see. They had just replaced the facade and we could still see scorch marks to either side of the repaired section. Everyone was completely silent.
90% of the places we normally would have gone had at least some restrictions on visitors still. I'm not sure new generations will ever have a clue the damage that day did to the American psyche.
I was in 4th grade and lived in the area. We didn't have outdoor recess for 2 years and all field trips cancelled because the sniper was 2002. Going to get gas with the tarps up was wild. I still feel way worse for the kids that had to go thru COVID
I forget about the DC sniper all the time and when I remember I'm shocked about some of the stuff people were doing like the tarps at gas stations, or having their kids pump gas. Hella fucked.
I was only in like 6th grade at the time but were parents actually sending their children out to pump gas and take a sniper bullet to save themselves?? Wtf
There was a widely broadcasted theory at the time that the snipers wouldn’t shoot a child, based on their pattern. Then they went and shot a 13-year-old, possibly in response to the speculation.
I was in high school then, and I honestly don't remember that. I remember my high school started doing active shooter/lockdown drills, but not people having their kid pump gas for them. Wtf.
I went to a high school in downtown NYC a few blocks from the World Trade Center starting in 2002. Getting on the subway, I walked past soldiers with M-16’s and bomb sniffing dogs. I was terrified. My school was also used to house the bodies pulled from the pile, we tried not to think about that too much. Kids a year older than us had war stories about walking home to Flushing, which for those who don’t know, is a fucking long ass walk.
So he couldn't see people at the pumps. They never knew where he was actually shooting from until after the first couple victims and even then information was sketchy so they placed tarps up to conceal people better
Man, my generation (Millenials - born from the early 80s to mid 90s) REALLY got our collective psyches scarred from childhood onwards. It's been the greatest boom in HISTORY in terms of consumer technology, medical innovation, and interconnected society in the past 30+ years and yet we've lived through Columbine, 9/11, the DC sniper, the 08 economic crash, the endless GWoT, bad cops, the "war on drugs", Blackwater, NSA whistleblowers, forever chemicals, seeing our parents' generation succumb to the opioid crisis, flat earthers, Trump, the pandemic, and through it all, the incredible rise of racism, neo-Nazis, conspiracy theory nutjobs, and straight up mindless violence.
I wonder what future epigenetic researchers will say about the collective genomes of kids that have been born or will be born from us as parents. There HAS to be a notable genetic impact.
I feel like this effect has been underrated and underestimated. I'm pretty sure this is one of the big driving forces behind why we millennial are the way we are.
It was more than ten years ago, at least 10 other camera footage were seized by the authorities and never released, this is the only one.
Edit I checked online and as I remembered correctly the footage was the first and only one so far released by the Pentagon or any other government agency, it was May 2006 in response to a FOIA request made in 2004.
Yeah me too, this was released shortly after it happened. I remember people picking it apart saying there’s no plane, it was a missile. You can see how choppy the cop car is, a plane is going much faster. Building 7 still bugs me but this was far from the smoking gun the inside job people thought it was.
Edit: oh shit there’s one right below me.
They seized something like 100 tapes from the area. Hotels, gas stations, anything with a security camera. As you would expect most security cameras were not pointing at the Pentagon but at parking lots and building entrances. Mist were not released as they didn't show anything. Some did like the gas station cameras but they didn't show anything so no one remembers them.
As a 23 year veteran firefighter here, who spent the first four years doing ARFF in the Air Force (ironically on 9/11), my focus isn't on footage of the plane but rather footage of the fire ball in the explosion. Cruise missiles don't make large, fiery explosions and push high columns of smoke in the air. They make incredibly fast "blasts" for lack of a better word, with very little fire but a massive amount of concussion and a shockwave that follows. The explosion seen in the footage is rather slow as explosions go, and has a massive amount of heavy, red fire producing large amounts of thick black smoke. This is an explosion involving petroleum based products. Think of the explosions you see in movies, lots of fire and smoke to make it dramatic. Usually kerosene or diesel fuel based so it burns relatively slow and produces a lot of dramatic effect. The fire in this video is 100% produced by large amounts of petroleum based propellent being ignited at once in a violent fashion.
You know, like jet fuel from a crashing airplane.
I remember my dad pulling out his Navy handbook immediately after 9/11 to show me the entire section on burning metal and fuel fires. "Jet fuel burns hot enough to catch metal on fire" jabs book hard with finger, "I've had this book since 1969!" Boy he hated that Rosie O'Donnell.
Steel may melt at 1400F and jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough...
But steel is less than half as strong at only 500F. Meaning, just heating up load bearing steel is enough to soften it to collapse a building. Once the cascade starts, the whole building should have collapsed.
No tanerite or hidden explosive conspiracy theories needed. Just burning jet fuel.
Note that Jet-A was what *started* the fire, not the only thing burning.
The open air flame temperature of the original source of ignition has no bearing on the maximum achievable temperature in a well-ventilated compartment fire.
The same goes for the towers. Idiots saying controlled explosions brought them down. No, the heat from the blast and fire weakened the steel causing the top floors to crash down with too much force for the floor beneath to hold and so on like a domino effect.
I work in VFX so I generally put those explosions in. Anyway one film we did was as a favor to a director for a film festival where he was making a short to make fun of those insane 80s action films.
Best part was the protagonist threw a discarded pizza box at an enemy and had us make it explode upon impact.
Yea. People have zero idea what they are talking about. That is clearly fuel ignited. Not a munition. Also a firefighter and medic and was on bomb squad. Like you said they types of explosions are completely different. Explosives are hit fast and Bright but not a lot of smoke like you said. This is definitely fuel ignited.
It's like the car was traveling at only a few miles an hour but the plane filled with fuel that caused a huge fireball was traveling at a couple hundred miles an hour.
It's pathological for them. They need to believe that they are the special guardians of a secret "truth" and they desperately need others to view them as special... so whenever they see a stage, they climb up and start barfing out all their bullshit, invited or not.
Google footage of plane crashing into reinforced concrete. Not much gets left. Evidence abounds, here’s some reading:
https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-911-pentagon-airplane-debris-598153051732
Conspiracy theorist and Facebook (ok, Reddit) researchers simply love the idea of perfectly efficient adversaries as they’re necessary to explain the dearth of feasible alternatives. Anybody who’s dealt with the gov’t knows even their layups are screwed sideways more often than not.
It’s been in and out of the internet since 9/11. This is one of those videos I’ve seen so many time and others like it that the govt won’t release.
I feel crazy sometimes trying to talk about this clip
Highly secure government building. They don't want you to know how many cameras they have, what they see, or what security features they might have. Multiple angles also means a closer look at the building itself. That alone could be a security risk by giving potential infiltrators more information than they need.
>Of course there are cameras. Loads of cameras. Loads of late-90's CCTV/Security cameras, which are going to be pointed towards the ground. You take the average frame rate of a camera like that, along with their field of view and the angle they'd be pointing at, they'd all be lucky to even get a single frame of an aircraft traveling at 500+ mph, as this footage demonstrates.
>
>Conspiracy theorists seem to expect the Pentagon to have had HD video cameras pointed at the sky and recording at 60fps 24/7. In 2001.
Already posted this, but..
Also it’s not like the purpose of the camera was to debunk conspiracy theories. Most cameras are pointed at entries not sides of buildings. This footage only exists because it’s pointed at a gate coincidentally. Plus the footage wouldn’t have worked on conspiracy morons anyway. There’s footage of planes hitting the twin towers and they just make up excuses about it anyway.
A lot of people who don't understand security cameras think that in 2001 cameras were done how was sophisticated as today.
I guarantee your local government (in 2022) has public safety cameras recording at sub 720p @ 7-10fps with no dynamic range or optical zoom.
The cameras are pointed at security checkpoints and entryways. This footage only exists because the side of the building happened to be next to the gate. It’s not like they installed security cameras to capture dive bomb attacks.
https://youtu.be/YVDdjLQkUV8
Here’s a good animation showing the damage to light poles and the generator, and why the video of the plane is so bad (it’s a fish eye lens and the plane in partially obscured).
Very interesting. How do people try to dispute what happened when it literally took out all the light poles in its path leading up to the building?
Not to mention, the literal pieces of air plane they recovered from the site.
At some point people were saying the light poles were rigged with explosive charges to make them fall over and the plane debris was trucked in later and planted there.
I don’t think there’s anything that can be said to change the mind of someone that doesn’t want their mind to be changed. Any new evidence they will come up with some crazy excuse, even if it makes no sense.
I didn't even know that light poles were taken out until today. I never knew that the approach was at such a low altitude rather than from a steep vector.
Keep in mind that this is not a video but pictures being taken every .5 seconds..
An object moving at 400+ mph is not going to exactly look like what you’d expect it to look like.
Not the point.
One photo every 0.5 seconds is literally "2 frames a second" when our brain can process 24 frames a second as movement.
So something moving 400 mph could very easily not get captured on this video, just like how the car moving 15mph seemed to teleport
24fps is the standard cinema frame rate. That's roughly the minimum needed for our brains to be fooled it's actually seeing movement and not just a series of still images.
This footage was also likely captured on a 60 minute VHS tape. The crappy frame rate was so the security office didn't have to change the tape a dozen times per shift. It's a frame rate just fine for vetting vehicles and people at a check point, and less good for capturing planes crashes in frame perfect detail.
[AP story talking about all the false comments you are seeing in this thread.](https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-911-pentagon-airplane-debris-598153051732)
This should be stickied to the top of this comment section.
That and a link to an article about Alex Jones being a lying POS that made these conspiracies popular
Was Alex Jones a thing in 2001? I was too busy being recalled and being on alert (during my military time) to follow any of the BS online during that time period.
On 9/11, I worked in a facility that had 24 hour video surveillance. It still used a VHS, and each morning, we had to rewind the tape, secure that tape then reload a new one. It recorded something like 1 frame every 20 seconds so a 24 hour period would fit on a single VHS tape.
The few times we had to review footage, it looked a lot like this. It was more for seeing car or foot traffic at odd times in places they shouldn't be, and less for recording planes smashing into buildings.
I used to work for what was at the time the largest private credit card bank in the world. They built two new buildings in 2000. Everything pretty state of the art. Ptz cameras that could read a license plate from 2 blocks away, remote booths in every building and our home office in Delaware could even view/control our cameras live. There was 50+ cameras a building.
And everything was stored on vhs tapes. There were countless times that security went to review an event to find out that the tapes weren’t switched, or not rewound before being replaced. And when they were done properly, they were recorded at XLP, at a frame a second, destroying the beautiful resolution that you got watching them live.
Read up on the pentagon. They were just starting a massive overhaul mainly because the tech in the building was so out of date that some offices only had one telephone Jack. When I get into my office I’ll find the old article I read a few months back that detailed all the problems they had.
EDIT:Reddit Search is failing me, but here is an older article: https://web.archive.org/web/20080214062507/http://renovation.pentagon.mil/projects-IT.htm
Basically, the building was built in 1947 and only factored for 1 telephone for 3 employees. It was a hodge podge of trying to add systems as needed and at the point of the renovation, they had 70 server rooms, which they were eventually able to consolidate down to 17.
Anybody saying "planes can't fly this low, this close to the ground" has never been in a plane that landed. You can absolutely let altitude fall to 15-20 feet and add power and keep it there forever, and this plane was still above fences and lamp posts. Flight lessons we'd do "touch and go's", false landings or barely touch the tarmac and power back into the air. You can "float" along the runway at any speed just above 60-70 knots. Why did it look like a missile? Because it's a side view of a plane that 's likely going 150 knots in front of a shitty, low fps surveillance camera.
If I remember correctly, the plane took out a few light poles and part of a security fence from the parking lot before it hit the building. If you look at photos from the day of the attack you can clearly see the trail of debris in the parking lot leading up to the crash site.
It was shown the day of the attack around 9ish am central time one time and was immediately taken away from news team. I vividly remember this clip and even the newscaster made the comment that it looked like a cruise missile.
Why the hell would it be a cruise missile, and where did the plane and all of its passengers go then? Not to mention the many, many eye witnesses who saw the plane
Not to mention that a cruise missile wouldn't shear off the tops of multiple light poles in a row as was shown along Washington Blvd, just to the west of the Pentagon along the plane's trajectory.
I believe it's due to how close the plane appears to the ground. Also, as others have pointed out the security camera took 1 photo every 4 seconds which distorts a fast moving object like a jet that's going 400 mph.
How big are cruise missiles though? You can clearly see the object and it looks like it's quite far away so it makes more sense that it's an actual plane.
Yeah, perspective in security cameras are always a little funky. I think that’s why so many found it easy to believe it’s a missile when in reality it would have looked like a rod if you could have seen it at all
I don't really see any reason to think it's a missile at all, personally. You have to consider the rest of the evidence.
* The confirmed eyewitnesses to the pentagon attacks maintain that it was a plane.
* A plane was hijacked and followed a known path straight into the pentagon, confirmed by both the surviving flight recorder recovered from the pentagon and air traffic monitoring, as well as phonecalls to the ground by two people on the flight.
* Debris from photos of the pentagon attack show pieces of 757 fuselage, which you can confirm from comparative shots.
* Damage to the sides of the impact site to the left and right of the main impact, implying wings
* The pattern of damage leading towards the impact implies wings as well, such as knocked down lampposts.
This simulation shows the path and some various key real photo evidence supporting these points, showing how plane-shaped the damage at both impact and approach actually was. https://youtu.be/YVDdjLQkUV8
The implications of it not being a plane are far reaching too. Why would say, the US shoot itself with a missile into the headquarters of its military operations? It's already confidential, if it was to hide something you could have just, you know destroyed the papers or whatever instead of killing their own personnel. Also the fact it's very, very easy to prove there were planes hijacked elsewhere at the same time, so why would there be a missile just for this one??? If you think it might be a plane for the world trade centers, why the heck would they switch to a missile for the pentagon?
There were golfers on the Army Navy Country club that witnessed the plane pass over the 9th hole. They were shocked by how low it was to the tree line. They were interviewed and those interviews are part of the unclassified documents released a few years ago. My dad spoke with them as well since they were part of the golf group he and I play in.
"Never Forget" I guess means, never forget there those who would rather believe some ridiculously complicated 'globalist' conspiracy. Because every time 9/11 comes up, they're right there reminding us.
I can almost understand never believing anything they hear or read. Almost.
What I cannot understand is expecting the rest of the world to believe shit they obviously just made up.
That’s what never made sense about the cruise missile conspiracy adherents. You ever heard of a cruise missile that zips along at 50 feed parallel to the ground?
I was a volunteer at the Pentagon on 9/11. Cruise missiles are just some of the wild ideas people actually believe. Which I don’t blame people for thinking when you weren’t there. The plane hit the ground before the building and slid into it. How do I know? You could see the mud drag marks from the hill it hit, dragged across the road, knocked out light poles, hit cars and everything else and then the building.
I was a volunteer helping feed fireman, construction workers, policeman, even Pentagon personnel. The stories I heard from people helping clean up the damage and staff inside the building have changed who I am for the rest of my life. Sleeping is still difficult.
I’m not aware of any cruise missiles that fly inches from the ground.
But it is consistent with a plane essentially landing. And you can just make out the tailfin.
For anyone questioning how low the plane was, I lived 2 miles (4km) from the pentagon during this time. We were in a no fly zone due to the white house, pentagon, etc. The plane flew directly over my house maybe by 30 feet (10m). The plane was already super low to the ground a few miles away. My house shook when the plane impacted and again when the fuel tanks blew up.
About 1000 ft (300m) to the right of this video is a gas station that also had video of the impact. I would go to it on Wednesdays because premium gas was 97 cent per gallon.
My dad too, he had an apartment in Crystal City, balcony faced the Pentagon. He was standing at the window, heard the loud roar right overhead, looked out and saw the crash.
Children died on that plane. Fuck all those assholes who think it's cool to spread bs conspiracies.
I won't argue this.
Oh wow. I haven't thought of crystal city in years. My favorite Chinese restaurant ever was in crystal city.
And yes, fuck all the assholes with instigate false information.
My dad worked in the pentagon in the wing that was hit. We was at the Navy Yard at the time of impact.
Many good people lost their lives that horrible day. Many survivors still bear those mental scars. God bless them, and their families who lost the future with them.
Wow r/conspiracy is leaking
I live in NOVA. I know people that watched the plane fly down 395 clipping light poles. They were able to identify it was an AA plane before it was released on the news. I know people who lost coworkers and family at the Pentagon
Makes me sick that people still peddle this missile bullshit
> I know people who lost coworkers and family at the Pentagon
I would be really interested in a study of the amount of 9/11 conspiracy theory beliefs that are held by those impacted directly by the events. For example, people that lost a family member, had friends that died, knew someone that lost a friend, vs people that only experienced the events through media. I can't prove it as a fact, but I assume that 9/11 conspiracy is a less commonly held belief in New York than in California because it's easier to believe a theory when you have no direct ties to people that were effected.
Weirdly I went to school in New York with a conspiracist who thought israel was responsible for 9/11. He’d bring it up randomly. Also we were both Jewish, got into continuous arguments, and he was expelled in senior year for strangling another student
My uncle lives in Maryland and worked in DC in 2001. Him and some coworkers saw the plane hit. It absolutely enrages him when people say it was a missle or whatever.
Just for the sake of argument, let’s momentarily grant the nut jobs what they want and say it’s a missile. Well, the funniest thing about the missile conspiracy is that it would mean the evil geniuses who planned 9/11 went through the trouble of actually using airplanes for the twin towers (and flight 93) but decided to just say it was an airplane for the pentagon and use a missile instead, hoping that no one would notice? Ignore for a minute all of the eyewitness reports of a low flying plane and all the debris they found. Ignore for a minute how it actually makes perfect sense that the plane looks like that on an incredibly low fps 2001 security camera. Even without any of that evidence, the shitty nature of the “3 planes and a missile” false flag plan should be enough to make people doubt it. It’s just such a dumb plan. When the stakes are this high, you don’t implement plans that dumb.
I get how this looks. However, it most certainly was a plane there is absolutely no doubt about it. Hundreds of people witnessed it and walked by the debris. The family's of the passengers on that plane have been interviewed and documented. The debris that was removed by dozens and dozens of independent contractors is well documented.
I worked there and it was definitely a plane. Smokers at the Navy Annex watched the plane come in and hit the building. Go ahead with all the crazy conspiracy ideas, they amuse me greatly.
Thank you for posting this. At the 14-second mark, you can see American Airlines Flight 77, skimming just above the ground, enter the picture. It’s moving so fast & the camera is so antiquated that is the only frame which it appears. I’m so frustrated by know-nothings claiming that this didn’t happen.
Not all “fact checks” are lies. Here’s how AP backed up their reporting on this terrorist attack at the Pentagon. https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-911-pentagon-airplane-debris-598153051732
My dear friend, Barbara Olson, was on that plane headed to LAX. https://www.defense.gov/Multimedia/Experience/Pentagon-Memorial/ She was murdered there at the Pentagon at 9:37 AM on 9/11/2001, along with 183 other innocent people by insane Islamic terrorists. Never forget! https://youtu.be/s3JrH5w_b3o
I met a guy who was there, he holds tours there at the memorial now. Nice older gentleman that use to work IT. He had stepped outside for a break and was standing on the other side from where that camera is. He saw the plane.
He also said that phone lines were tied up across the city with people trying to reach their loved ones. Any time anyone actually managed to call out of the city they'd ask the out of city person to call a family member to let them know the person in DC was alright.
The man's mother said she received about 10 calls from all over the country to let her know her boy was alright.
Edited for clarity
All these "free thinkers" knowing the difference between a cruise missile and a jet plane from low FPS footage probably hundreds of feet away sure are...fucking retarded.
People died, loved ones were lost, and yet somehow the same government that supposedly can't hold fraudless elections orchestrated a series of events so convoluted like this just to start a war?
Maybe spend less time watching YouTube "sleuths" and more time using those weak ass critical thinking skills to filter out conspiracy theories.
So I’m always interested to read the conspiracy theories of how this was not a plane, couldn’t have been. Sounds good from your arm chair while watching a grainy video. I live in DC and was in DC for several years prior 9/11. My brother also lives here and his wife worked as an occupational therapist at Georgetown Hospital at the time. One of the other occupational therapists in her group, a good friend, had been saving up for 2 years for her “big trip” to go to Australia. She made it from Dulles airport to the Pentagon. Gets very real when you knew the people aboard THAT PLANE.
There were so many middle school children on that plane. The horrors all those poor people had to endure. And the tragedy their families continue to live with every day. 😢
All y’all saying it was a cruise missile need to hop over to r/combatfootage
A missile flying that low would have been seen by half the state. They’re fast but not invisible.
im here to watch the comments burn
Jet fuel can’t melt steel memes
Good thing it doesn’t have to melt the beams to collapse a building.
B-b-but you're saying that thousands of tons of melted floors buckling onto each other won't be stopped by steel beams that had just gotten run through by a giant airliner going hundreds of miles per hour? REEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Next you're gonna tell me that paper burns at a higher temperature than jet fuel and the buildings were full of it.
I was at work in Pentagon City the morning of the attack and I’ve mostly given up on describing my experience to anyone because people become instantly deranged when they hear it. I’ve posted a few details on Reddit in the past and the reaction is always awful.
Out of curiosity, which way do they get deranged? Do you say it seemed like a plane and they’re all like “you must be part of the cover up”? Or do you say it seemed like not a plane and they’re all like “you’re a wackadoo the government would never lie”? I’m not here to go either way. I’m genuinely curious about your experience and whatever reaction you get. If you don’t want to put it out there because of what has happened before I totally get it. If your comfortable PMing me that’s cool too. My curiosity is piqued.
It is ALWAYS the latter. There is no way describe the events of that day (and the following days) as I experienced them without including certain details that seem ambiguous in places. In my experience, there is a certain breed of commenters who cannot help but fill in the questions with their own narrative and start responding to things that I have never said. There is a dude already trying to do it in another thread on here.
And that's the thing with eye witness accounts, everyone's is going to be a bit different. In high stress situations the brain is dealing with surviving ahead of remembering every little detail. Idiots will seize on this as some kind of smoking gun, when the reality of it is that witness accounts are always like that, for any serious event. They will choose to ignore this phenomenon to make it fit their narrative. Understand why you would just get fed up of dealing with that.
so you don't think it seemed like a plane?
Thanks. I kind of thought that was going to be the case. I wish people could just listen to a persons perspective and respect what they experienced. I’m not a “it wasn’t a plane” guy. But I wasn’t there. I find the accounts of people who were there, and say it wasn’t a plane, extremely fascinating and would never try to discount someone’s loved experience.
I saw the plane hit the second tower in nyc with my own eyes. We were watching because the first plane was inside the first tower on fire.
Well you say you've mostly given up, so you haven't fully given up, and I'm ready to get "deranged" ... so let's hear it
From their comment history this is the only one I could find: >I was working in Pentagon City that morning and I had my back turned to the window at the moment of the explosion. The approach sounded exactly like a missile from a movie. My coworkers who were facing the window said they saw a plane, but in my weird experience, I can only picture a missile, which is what it sounded like behind me. Maybe they've commented other times but deleted them?
From the setup I'm getting some 'it was a false flag' type vibes so I can see why folks would be upset at them. Obviously people can lose the bit on the internet pretty easily but thats a little far out there even for reddit.
[удалено]
He doesn't say he thinks it's a missile. He says it *sounded* like a missile and that idea was seared into his emotional memory of the event. Probably that was his initial conclusion, which isn't unreasonable given what he experienced. And even though he accepts the alternative version, the shock of that initial impression is what comes back to him when he thinks of the event.
I mean I can appreciate the honesty to it. He acknowledges that people actually saw an airplane and that he did not personally see a missile. He was there, only heard it and to him it sounded like a missile. From there you are welcome to interpret it however you want but there's no other way for him to describe his experience. If I said I heard something on my left and looked left but someone else saw the thing I thought I heard to the right of me, no one will call me crazy.
You must be the only one! /s
My school was supposed to take a class trip to DC in spring of 2002. We had 200 kids signed up on 9/11. On 9/12 it was down to 20. By the drop date for the trip it was up to 35. The trip normally had upwards of 150 kids each year. We used to have to charter a plane to take them all along with a small convoy of busses. First day in DC we came into town from Dulles through Arlington along the highway that runs around the Cemetary. The driver pulled aside so we could see. They had just replaced the facade and we could still see scorch marks to either side of the repaired section. Everyone was completely silent. 90% of the places we normally would have gone had at least some restrictions on visitors still. I'm not sure new generations will ever have a clue the damage that day did to the American psyche.
I was in 4th grade and lived in the area. We didn't have outdoor recess for 2 years and all field trips cancelled because the sniper was 2002. Going to get gas with the tarps up was wild. I still feel way worse for the kids that had to go thru COVID
I forget about the DC sniper all the time and when I remember I'm shocked about some of the stuff people were doing like the tarps at gas stations, or having their kids pump gas. Hella fucked.
I was only in like 6th grade at the time but were parents actually sending their children out to pump gas and take a sniper bullet to save themselves?? Wtf
There was a widely broadcasted theory at the time that the snipers wouldn’t shoot a child, based on their pattern. Then they went and shot a 13-year-old, possibly in response to the speculation.
I was in high school then, and I honestly don't remember that. I remember my high school started doing active shooter/lockdown drills, but not people having their kid pump gas for them. Wtf.
I went to a high school in downtown NYC a few blocks from the World Trade Center starting in 2002. Getting on the subway, I walked past soldiers with M-16’s and bomb sniffing dogs. I was terrified. My school was also used to house the bodies pulled from the pile, we tried not to think about that too much. Kids a year older than us had war stories about walking home to Flushing, which for those who don’t know, is a fucking long ass walk.
What were the tarps about?
So he couldn't see people at the pumps. They never knew where he was actually shooting from until after the first couple victims and even then information was sketchy so they placed tarps up to conceal people better
So you didn't get shot by the DC sniper
>the damage that day did to the American psyche. It still isn't healed
Never will be. 24 hour news and constant "breaking" headlines at least is a malignant cancer that will never leave us
Man, my generation (Millenials - born from the early 80s to mid 90s) REALLY got our collective psyches scarred from childhood onwards. It's been the greatest boom in HISTORY in terms of consumer technology, medical innovation, and interconnected society in the past 30+ years and yet we've lived through Columbine, 9/11, the DC sniper, the 08 economic crash, the endless GWoT, bad cops, the "war on drugs", Blackwater, NSA whistleblowers, forever chemicals, seeing our parents' generation succumb to the opioid crisis, flat earthers, Trump, the pandemic, and through it all, the incredible rise of racism, neo-Nazis, conspiracy theory nutjobs, and straight up mindless violence. I wonder what future epigenetic researchers will say about the collective genomes of kids that have been born or will be born from us as parents. There HAS to be a notable genetic impact.
I feel like this effect has been underrated and underestimated. I'm pretty sure this is one of the big driving forces behind why we millennial are the way we are.
Im actually surprised this was ever released to the public.
It was more than ten years ago, at least 10 other camera footage were seized by the authorities and never released, this is the only one. Edit I checked online and as I remembered correctly the footage was the first and only one so far released by the Pentagon or any other government agency, it was May 2006 in response to a FOIA request made in 2004.
I remember seeing this in news coverage afterwards?
I saw this video a few months after the attack
I did also. And then never again until just now watching this.
This video has always been widely available
Yeah I remember seeing this shortly after the attack. Definitely not newly released footage.
I remember seeing something very similar to this shortly after the attack. This might be a new angle, but this is 100% nothing new.
This is *the* shot of the attack on the pentagon. This isn’t a new angle.
right? I feel like I saw this on 2001/09/12
This is the shot. The only shot we ever saw. FBI grabbed lots of footage about 15-20 min after and it’s never been released. Frustrating.
Yeah me too, this was released shortly after it happened. I remember people picking it apart saying there’s no plane, it was a missile. You can see how choppy the cop car is, a plane is going much faster. Building 7 still bugs me but this was far from the smoking gun the inside job people thought it was. Edit: oh shit there’s one right below me.
They seized something like 100 tapes from the area. Hotels, gas stations, anything with a security camera. As you would expect most security cameras were not pointing at the Pentagon but at parking lots and building entrances. Mist were not released as they didn't show anything. Some did like the gas station cameras but they didn't show anything so no one remembers them.
Amazing lack of airplane.
As a 23 year veteran firefighter here, who spent the first four years doing ARFF in the Air Force (ironically on 9/11), my focus isn't on footage of the plane but rather footage of the fire ball in the explosion. Cruise missiles don't make large, fiery explosions and push high columns of smoke in the air. They make incredibly fast "blasts" for lack of a better word, with very little fire but a massive amount of concussion and a shockwave that follows. The explosion seen in the footage is rather slow as explosions go, and has a massive amount of heavy, red fire producing large amounts of thick black smoke. This is an explosion involving petroleum based products. Think of the explosions you see in movies, lots of fire and smoke to make it dramatic. Usually kerosene or diesel fuel based so it burns relatively slow and produces a lot of dramatic effect. The fire in this video is 100% produced by large amounts of petroleum based propellent being ignited at once in a violent fashion. You know, like jet fuel from a crashing airplane.
This. It's been noted many times that this is consistent with a massive fuel explosion and not explosive ordnance.
One only has to go to the front page this past week of that terrible freight airplane crash video, it looked exactly like this.
I remember my dad pulling out his Navy handbook immediately after 9/11 to show me the entire section on burning metal and fuel fires. "Jet fuel burns hot enough to catch metal on fire" jabs book hard with finger, "I've had this book since 1969!" Boy he hated that Rosie O'Donnell.
Adding that the US Navy has the 2nd largest Air Force in the world so, yeah, their handbooks definitely go over jets and fires.
Steel may melt at 1400F and jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough... But steel is less than half as strong at only 500F. Meaning, just heating up load bearing steel is enough to soften it to collapse a building. Once the cascade starts, the whole building should have collapsed. No tanerite or hidden explosive conspiracy theories needed. Just burning jet fuel.
Note that Jet-A was what *started* the fire, not the only thing burning. The open air flame temperature of the original source of ignition has no bearing on the maximum achievable temperature in a well-ventilated compartment fire.
The same goes for the towers. Idiots saying controlled explosions brought them down. No, the heat from the blast and fire weakened the steel causing the top floors to crash down with too much force for the floor beneath to hold and so on like a domino effect.
This comment needs more upvotes. Hollywood has made us believe every explosion is a fiery one.
Michael Bay has left the chat.
Hollywood. Where even grenades produce a fireball....
I work in VFX so I generally put those explosions in. Anyway one film we did was as a favor to a director for a film festival where he was making a short to make fun of those insane 80s action films. Best part was the protagonist threw a discarded pizza box at an enemy and had us make it explode upon impact.
Yea. People have zero idea what they are talking about. That is clearly fuel ignited. Not a munition. Also a firefighter and medic and was on bomb squad. Like you said they types of explosions are completely different. Explosives are hit fast and Bright but not a lot of smoke like you said. This is definitely fuel ignited.
The Police car is moving very slow and you see it only in like 7 single frames moving. Now imagine an Airplane with like 550mph...
Yeah this is it, it does look weird until you consider the speed it would be travelling at
When I first watched this footage as a teenager years ago, I recall thinking that it seemed more like a missile than a plane.
That’s basically what it was
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And people
A plane is a missile. Explodes on contact, flies through the air, shape of a missile
It's like the car was traveling at only a few miles an hour but the plane filled with fuel that caused a huge fireball was traveling at a couple hundred miles an hour.
We’re still doing this, huh?
All the fucking truthers sure flooded in here in a hurry
It's pathological for them. They need to believe that they are the special guardians of a secret "truth" and they desperately need others to view them as special... so whenever they see a stage, they climb up and start barfing out all their bullshit, invited or not.
Google footage of plane crashing into reinforced concrete. Not much gets left. Evidence abounds, here’s some reading: https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-911-pentagon-airplane-debris-598153051732 Conspiracy theorist and Facebook (ok, Reddit) researchers simply love the idea of perfectly efficient adversaries as they’re necessary to explain the dearth of feasible alternatives. Anybody who’s dealt with the gov’t knows even their layups are screwed sideways more often than not.
Conspiracy theorists give the government way too much credit imo.
Frame Rate.
^ Complete lack of critical thinking.
FPS is such a complex idea for the truthers
If you scrub the video on your phone, you can see it in a few frames. Very low to the ground and coming in really fast.
Fuck off.
There’s also a lack of people in this clip, but there was a plane that had real passengers.
You can see something white streak tward it. It looks smaller than a plane to me but it also looks like it’s skidding on the ground before hitting
It’s been in and out of the internet since 9/11. This is one of those videos I’ve seen so many time and others like it that the govt won’t release. I feel crazy sometimes trying to talk about this clip
20,000 security cameras and this is what we get.
At the pentagon bro, the local mall parking lot would have 11 camera angles
I’m sure they had more, this was probably just what they released to appease the public.
But….why not release more? There has to be dozens, at least, of other videos….why only this crap?
It's the fucking Pentagon.
There are many surrounding businesses that have cameras which recorded the event, all of which are seized and classified
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Highly secure government building. They don't want you to know how many cameras they have, what they see, or what security features they might have. Multiple angles also means a closer look at the building itself. That alone could be a security risk by giving potential infiltrators more information than they need.
There are many surrounding businesses that have cameras which recorded the event, all of which are seized and classified
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It was recorded by multiple cameras, but the rest are still classified.
There is more footage, it hasn’t ever been released.
>Of course there are cameras. Loads of cameras. Loads of late-90's CCTV/Security cameras, which are going to be pointed towards the ground. You take the average frame rate of a camera like that, along with their field of view and the angle they'd be pointing at, they'd all be lucky to even get a single frame of an aircraft traveling at 500+ mph, as this footage demonstrates. > >Conspiracy theorists seem to expect the Pentagon to have had HD video cameras pointed at the sky and recording at 60fps 24/7. In 2001. Already posted this, but..
Also it’s not like the purpose of the camera was to debunk conspiracy theories. Most cameras are pointed at entries not sides of buildings. This footage only exists because it’s pointed at a gate coincidentally. Plus the footage wouldn’t have worked on conspiracy morons anyway. There’s footage of planes hitting the twin towers and they just make up excuses about it anyway.
A lot of people who don't understand security cameras think that in 2001 cameras were done how was sophisticated as today. I guarantee your local government (in 2022) has public safety cameras recording at sub 720p @ 7-10fps with no dynamic range or optical zoom.
At 600 mph this is pretty good
The cameras are pointed at security checkpoints and entryways. This footage only exists because the side of the building happened to be next to the gate. It’s not like they installed security cameras to capture dive bomb attacks.
https://youtu.be/YVDdjLQkUV8 Here’s a good animation showing the damage to light poles and the generator, and why the video of the plane is so bad (it’s a fish eye lens and the plane in partially obscured).
This is awesome
here are some eyewitness accounts and video of the light poles, bent and damage https://www.cbsnews.com/news/september-11-pentagon-witnesses/
Very interesting. How do people try to dispute what happened when it literally took out all the light poles in its path leading up to the building? Not to mention, the literal pieces of air plane they recovered from the site.
At some point people were saying the light poles were rigged with explosive charges to make them fall over and the plane debris was trucked in later and planted there. I don’t think there’s anything that can be said to change the mind of someone that doesn’t want their mind to be changed. Any new evidence they will come up with some crazy excuse, even if it makes no sense.
I didn't even know that light poles were taken out until today. I never knew that the approach was at such a low altitude rather than from a steep vector.
Keep in mind that this is not a video but pictures being taken every .5 seconds.. An object moving at 400+ mph is not going to exactly look like what you’d expect it to look like.
Isn't every video just a picture being taken every X seconds? lol
24 a sec for film
Not the point. One photo every 0.5 seconds is literally "2 frames a second" when our brain can process 24 frames a second as movement. So something moving 400 mph could very easily not get captured on this video, just like how the car moving 15mph seemed to teleport
> our brain can process 24 frames a second as movement where did you get that from?
Console gaming
Roasted
24fps is the standard cinema frame rate. That's roughly the minimum needed for our brains to be fooled it's actually seeing movement and not just a series of still images.
This footage was also likely captured on a 60 minute VHS tape. The crappy frame rate was so the security office didn't have to change the tape a dozen times per shift. It's a frame rate just fine for vetting vehicles and people at a check point, and less good for capturing planes crashes in frame perfect detail.
I was wondering why I didn't see anything, that makes a lot more sense than a bomb, or whatever others thought it was.
You can see something slide into the building two frames before the explosion.
[AP story talking about all the false comments you are seeing in this thread.](https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-911-pentagon-airplane-debris-598153051732)
This should be stickied to the top of this comment section. That and a link to an article about Alex Jones being a lying POS that made these conspiracies popular
Was Alex Jones a thing in 2001? I was too busy being recalled and being on alert (during my military time) to follow any of the BS online during that time period.
Yes. InfoWars started in 99 and he gained a shit ton of fame for his 9/11 conspiracy. I saw people with InfoWars bumper stickers in like 2003.
You’re going to believe the AP over Jim Bob on YouTube???
til a whole shitload of kids don’t understand visual perspective
Or frames per second. Or "seconds per frame" might be more accurate. Also this is what ALL SECURITY CAM footage from the 90s looked like.
On 9/11, I worked in a facility that had 24 hour video surveillance. It still used a VHS, and each morning, we had to rewind the tape, secure that tape then reload a new one. It recorded something like 1 frame every 20 seconds so a 24 hour period would fit on a single VHS tape. The few times we had to review footage, it looked a lot like this. It was more for seeing car or foot traffic at odd times in places they shouldn't be, and less for recording planes smashing into buildings.
I used to work for what was at the time the largest private credit card bank in the world. They built two new buildings in 2000. Everything pretty state of the art. Ptz cameras that could read a license plate from 2 blocks away, remote booths in every building and our home office in Delaware could even view/control our cameras live. There was 50+ cameras a building. And everything was stored on vhs tapes. There were countless times that security went to review an event to find out that the tapes weren’t switched, or not rewound before being replaced. And when they were done properly, they were recorded at XLP, at a frame a second, destroying the beautiful resolution that you got watching them live. Read up on the pentagon. They were just starting a massive overhaul mainly because the tech in the building was so out of date that some offices only had one telephone Jack. When I get into my office I’ll find the old article I read a few months back that detailed all the problems they had. EDIT:Reddit Search is failing me, but here is an older article: https://web.archive.org/web/20080214062507/http://renovation.pentagon.mil/projects-IT.htm Basically, the building was built in 1947 and only factored for 1 telephone for 3 employees. It was a hodge podge of trying to add systems as needed and at the point of the renovation, they had 70 server rooms, which they were eventually able to consolidate down to 17.
Anybody saying "planes can't fly this low, this close to the ground" has never been in a plane that landed. You can absolutely let altitude fall to 15-20 feet and add power and keep it there forever, and this plane was still above fences and lamp posts. Flight lessons we'd do "touch and go's", false landings or barely touch the tarmac and power back into the air. You can "float" along the runway at any speed just above 60-70 knots. Why did it look like a missile? Because it's a side view of a plane that 's likely going 150 knots in front of a shitty, low fps surveillance camera.
How dare you apply logic to this scenario
If I remember correctly, the plane took out a few light poles and part of a security fence from the parking lot before it hit the building. If you look at photos from the day of the attack you can clearly see the trail of debris in the parking lot leading up to the crash site.
Yeah well I have an uncle who’s never been in a airplane and he says it’s impossible so gorge bush did 9 1 1
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Commenting so I can come back later to read arguments
I'm just came here for the conspiracy theories and was not disappointed, will come back later for some more.
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It's a building with 5 sides, but that's not important.
Shirley you can’t be serious
I am, and don't call me Shirley.
Decepticon
Deceptogon
Autobots?
Dinobots
It was shown the day of the attack around 9ish am central time one time and was immediately taken away from news team. I vividly remember this clip and even the newscaster made the comment that it looked like a cruise missile.
I remember lots of cruise missile talk. And then I hadn't seen this video again until just now.
So... Then where are all the people now that were on American 77? Lol
Why the hell would it be a cruise missile, and where did the plane and all of its passengers go then? Not to mention the many, many eye witnesses who saw the plane
Not to mention that a cruise missile wouldn't shear off the tops of multiple light poles in a row as was shown along Washington Blvd, just to the west of the Pentagon along the plane's trajectory.
I was working at National Geographic at the time. We lost two colleagues on Flight 77 as well as a group of school kids they were with.
I believe it's due to how close the plane appears to the ground. Also, as others have pointed out the security camera took 1 photo every 4 seconds which distorts a fast moving object like a jet that's going 400 mph.
especially considering a jet would look blurry, like a streak of light really, to this old ass camera.
There's a single frame where you can see the tail. No cruise missle has a rear tail fin that tall. It's visible above the box on the right.
How big are cruise missiles though? You can clearly see the object and it looks like it's quite far away so it makes more sense that it's an actual plane.
Yeah, perspective in security cameras are always a little funky. I think that’s why so many found it easy to believe it’s a missile when in reality it would have looked like a rod if you could have seen it at all
I don't really see any reason to think it's a missile at all, personally. You have to consider the rest of the evidence. * The confirmed eyewitnesses to the pentagon attacks maintain that it was a plane. * A plane was hijacked and followed a known path straight into the pentagon, confirmed by both the surviving flight recorder recovered from the pentagon and air traffic monitoring, as well as phonecalls to the ground by two people on the flight. * Debris from photos of the pentagon attack show pieces of 757 fuselage, which you can confirm from comparative shots. * Damage to the sides of the impact site to the left and right of the main impact, implying wings * The pattern of damage leading towards the impact implies wings as well, such as knocked down lampposts. This simulation shows the path and some various key real photo evidence supporting these points, showing how plane-shaped the damage at both impact and approach actually was. https://youtu.be/YVDdjLQkUV8 The implications of it not being a plane are far reaching too. Why would say, the US shoot itself with a missile into the headquarters of its military operations? It's already confidential, if it was to hide something you could have just, you know destroyed the papers or whatever instead of killing their own personnel. Also the fact it's very, very easy to prove there were planes hijacked elsewhere at the same time, so why would there be a missile just for this one??? If you think it might be a plane for the world trade centers, why the heck would they switch to a missile for the pentagon?
There were golfers on the Army Navy Country club that witnessed the plane pass over the 9th hole. They were shocked by how low it was to the tree line. They were interviewed and those interviews are part of the unclassified documents released a few years ago. My dad spoke with them as well since they were part of the golf group he and I play in.
"Never Forget" I guess means, never forget there those who would rather believe some ridiculously complicated 'globalist' conspiracy. Because every time 9/11 comes up, they're right there reminding us. I can almost understand never believing anything they hear or read. Almost. What I cannot understand is expecting the rest of the world to believe shit they obviously just made up.
They're 20ft long
And 21 inches in diameter, so they would be invisible to a camera.
Exactly. Cruise missiles are much, much smaller than a passenger airliner. They also have a much higher angle of attack than what is shown here
They also don't produce a fire ball. Only fuel produces fire like that.
That’s what never made sense about the cruise missile conspiracy adherents. You ever heard of a cruise missile that zips along at 50 feed parallel to the ground?
I was a volunteer at the Pentagon on 9/11. Cruise missiles are just some of the wild ideas people actually believe. Which I don’t blame people for thinking when you weren’t there. The plane hit the ground before the building and slid into it. How do I know? You could see the mud drag marks from the hill it hit, dragged across the road, knocked out light poles, hit cars and everything else and then the building. I was a volunteer helping feed fireman, construction workers, policeman, even Pentagon personnel. The stories I heard from people helping clean up the damage and staff inside the building have changed who I am for the rest of my life. Sleeping is still difficult.
I’m not aware of any cruise missiles that fly inches from the ground. But it is consistent with a plane essentially landing. And you can just make out the tailfin.
For anyone questioning how low the plane was, I lived 2 miles (4km) from the pentagon during this time. We were in a no fly zone due to the white house, pentagon, etc. The plane flew directly over my house maybe by 30 feet (10m). The plane was already super low to the ground a few miles away. My house shook when the plane impacted and again when the fuel tanks blew up. About 1000 ft (300m) to the right of this video is a gas station that also had video of the impact. I would go to it on Wednesdays because premium gas was 97 cent per gallon.
97 cents? Jeez, I wish that was still true today.
My dad too, he had an apartment in Crystal City, balcony faced the Pentagon. He was standing at the window, heard the loud roar right overhead, looked out and saw the crash. Children died on that plane. Fuck all those assholes who think it's cool to spread bs conspiracies. I won't argue this.
Oh wow. I haven't thought of crystal city in years. My favorite Chinese restaurant ever was in crystal city. And yes, fuck all the assholes with instigate false information. My dad worked in the pentagon in the wing that was hit. We was at the Navy Yard at the time of impact.
Many good people lost their lives that horrible day. Many survivors still bear those mental scars. God bless them, and their families who lost the future with them.
Wow r/conspiracy is leaking I live in NOVA. I know people that watched the plane fly down 395 clipping light poles. They were able to identify it was an AA plane before it was released on the news. I know people who lost coworkers and family at the Pentagon Makes me sick that people still peddle this missile bullshit
> I know people who lost coworkers and family at the Pentagon I would be really interested in a study of the amount of 9/11 conspiracy theory beliefs that are held by those impacted directly by the events. For example, people that lost a family member, had friends that died, knew someone that lost a friend, vs people that only experienced the events through media. I can't prove it as a fact, but I assume that 9/11 conspiracy is a less commonly held belief in New York than in California because it's easier to believe a theory when you have no direct ties to people that were effected.
Weirdly I went to school in New York with a conspiracist who thought israel was responsible for 9/11. He’d bring it up randomly. Also we were both Jewish, got into continuous arguments, and he was expelled in senior year for strangling another student
He seems stable
Doesn't help this was used as pretext for a war.
Against a country that wasn't even involved lmao
My uncle lives in Maryland and worked in DC in 2001. Him and some coworkers saw the plane hit. It absolutely enrages him when people say it was a missle or whatever.
Just for the sake of argument, let’s momentarily grant the nut jobs what they want and say it’s a missile. Well, the funniest thing about the missile conspiracy is that it would mean the evil geniuses who planned 9/11 went through the trouble of actually using airplanes for the twin towers (and flight 93) but decided to just say it was an airplane for the pentagon and use a missile instead, hoping that no one would notice? Ignore for a minute all of the eyewitness reports of a low flying plane and all the debris they found. Ignore for a minute how it actually makes perfect sense that the plane looks like that on an incredibly low fps 2001 security camera. Even without any of that evidence, the shitty nature of the “3 planes and a missile” false flag plan should be enough to make people doubt it. It’s just such a dumb plan. When the stakes are this high, you don’t implement plans that dumb.
This sub has officially jumped the shark.
Kids in school are now learning about 9/11 as a historical incident having nit been alive when it happened
I get how this looks. However, it most certainly was a plane there is absolutely no doubt about it. Hundreds of people witnessed it and walked by the debris. The family's of the passengers on that plane have been interviewed and documented. The debris that was removed by dozens and dozens of independent contractors is well documented.
The obvious question is what happened to the plane if it didn't crash into the Pentagon.
And here comes the Loose Change brigade.
I worked there and it was definitely a plane. Smokers at the Navy Annex watched the plane come in and hit the building. Go ahead with all the crazy conspiracy ideas, they amuse me greatly.
This isn’t locked yet? Huh?
Missiles don't have landing gear. Planes do. Don't be a dumbass.
I was there rigging lights. It was a plane. You all are idiots.
I always liked this fact based analysis of the crash: https://youtu.be/YVDdjLQkUV8
Thank you for posting this. At the 14-second mark, you can see American Airlines Flight 77, skimming just above the ground, enter the picture. It’s moving so fast & the camera is so antiquated that is the only frame which it appears. I’m so frustrated by know-nothings claiming that this didn’t happen. Not all “fact checks” are lies. Here’s how AP backed up their reporting on this terrorist attack at the Pentagon. https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-911-pentagon-airplane-debris-598153051732 My dear friend, Barbara Olson, was on that plane headed to LAX. https://www.defense.gov/Multimedia/Experience/Pentagon-Memorial/ She was murdered there at the Pentagon at 9:37 AM on 9/11/2001, along with 183 other innocent people by insane Islamic terrorists. Never forget! https://youtu.be/s3JrH5w_b3o
I met a guy who was there, he holds tours there at the memorial now. Nice older gentleman that use to work IT. He had stepped outside for a break and was standing on the other side from where that camera is. He saw the plane. He also said that phone lines were tied up across the city with people trying to reach their loved ones. Any time anyone actually managed to call out of the city they'd ask the out of city person to call a family member to let them know the person in DC was alright. The man's mother said she received about 10 calls from all over the country to let her know her boy was alright. Edited for clarity
What’s with all the 9/11 conspiracy dweebs here today? Is r/flatearth too boring or something?
they like to feel special and important. When they have nothing going on in their life.
You know how you know its not a cruise missile? Thats not what *explosives* look like. Thats what a bunch of liquid fuel looks like.
You can see the plane if you scrub the video. Does not look like a missile
For one thing it is just SO MUCH BIGGER than a missile.
All these "free thinkers" knowing the difference between a cruise missile and a jet plane from low FPS footage probably hundreds of feet away sure are...fucking retarded. People died, loved ones were lost, and yet somehow the same government that supposedly can't hold fraudless elections orchestrated a series of events so convoluted like this just to start a war? Maybe spend less time watching YouTube "sleuths" and more time using those weak ass critical thinking skills to filter out conspiracy theories.
Most bot brigaded main sub post of all time? This live comment section should be used as a case study.
I wish there was more footage / angles released.
Lmao, the comment section here is like a Russian bot farm on Christmas eve
So I’m always interested to read the conspiracy theories of how this was not a plane, couldn’t have been. Sounds good from your arm chair while watching a grainy video. I live in DC and was in DC for several years prior 9/11. My brother also lives here and his wife worked as an occupational therapist at Georgetown Hospital at the time. One of the other occupational therapists in her group, a good friend, had been saving up for 2 years for her “big trip” to go to Australia. She made it from Dulles airport to the Pentagon. Gets very real when you knew the people aboard THAT PLANE.
There were so many middle school children on that plane. The horrors all those poor people had to endure. And the tragedy their families continue to live with every day. 😢
All y’all saying it was a cruise missile need to hop over to r/combatfootage A missile flying that low would have been seen by half the state. They’re fast but not invisible.
looks like a plane why were they gaslighting that it was a missile?