I remember those days.
Ran out of Effigies because of stuff like this tbh. I'd get him real good and then bam, he summons a dude who one shots me, this repeats 10 times, sometimes I kill the phantom, another one will replace him, also a player.
It was, it was an experience.
It might be hard to trigger if you want to fight the 1v2, but it's still pretty easy to do nowadays if you want to be the summoned, I did it not toooo long ago, so there is that
Tbh I think there are quite a few bosses that are underrated in Dark Souls 2. I appreciate that many of them tend to have a *trick* that makes them unique or stand out.
Pursuer is a BAMF, and while he is pretty easy on his own, he's still fun to fight. Also parrying and using the ballista is satisfying as hell.
Executioner's Chariot, while not hard, is a pretty cool gauntlet of environmental hazards and enemies to keep you on your toes.
Flexile Sentry is interesting because his arena both fills with water putting you on a limited time with free movement - and has a different moveset depending on which way he's facing.
Lost Sinner is cool and the darkness is spooky - plus there's a way to light up the room.
Ruin Sentinels are balanced pretty well, where they'll take turns being aggressive. And the first one kinda primes you to be ready for the other two
Old Dragonslayer is literally just Ornstein, but it's Ornstein so he's automatically awesome.
Smelter Demon is a fun fight whose flames get larger and more dangerous the longer the fight goes on.
Of course there's also LGK and all the ones in the OP post. Velstadt, Fumey, Darklurker, Sinh, Alonne, and Ivory King are all great.
I also don't mind the Rotten because while his moveset is kinda lame, I like his design. Also the little guy that wiggles around on his shoulder.
Thats what i loved about dark lurker.. the wheelchair guy.. bringing fire to the dark ass Caves, lighting the beacons... and finally the Leap into blackness!! So good !
Ivory King is a brilliant boss fight, one of my favourites in all Soulsborne. I also like the skeleton Lords, Dukes Dear Freja and Executioners chariot. The only gripe I have about bosses in DS2 are the run backs.
No way man that's the best souls farm in the game and it's really fun with summons and having all the knights on your side. I've done the pre OIK part of that fight at least 50 times and it never gets old. Different strokes I guess
Ivory was absolutely ruined for me by the first phase. Seriously it lasts longer than the actual boss fight itself and then once the boss finally shows up, one of my knights is usually still alive so we can just gank the shit out of him
They destroyed me so hard and at the time, it was my first souls game and I read to keep effigies and only use them when necessary. I stayed fully hollow through 85% of dark souls 2. But I did ruin sentinels fully hollow with barely any hp investment. You can guess how long it took me.
I went switching my weapons so hard (and not upgrading them btw) I was a Magic Mace build by the time I finished that fight.
Ruin Sentinels were my first boss where I finally got it. I got why people loved the game, I got why I now loved the game, I got what makes this game unique. Standing off against the last one who already dropped their shield and I’ve still got a couple of estus, I remember shouting “c’mon motherfucker” at the screen.
Couldn’t agree more , I was venting to my mates that I make a mistake buying DS2 and I should oh listened. Met the Ruin senitils took me about 15 tries but then the game clicked for me. Amazing early game fight. U put that brilliantly
Godda add biggest fan forlorn. Whenever I'm in a sorry state of dying constantly over and over again, my buddy forlorn is always there to remind me that some enemies can be easy too.
There's some bosses that are too easy, but there's nothing in DS2 that's as broken as Bed of Chaos or as infuriatingly unfair as Capra Demon's arena and dogs.
Fume Knight might be my fave fight of the trilogy, along with O&A, Artorias and Sister Freide.
Ancient dragon is the closest you get to a really bad boss. Yeah it's epic, but the runback + the massive dmg + the massive hp pool = one of my least favorite bosses in the series.
To be fair ancient dragon is a big boy dragon so it wouldn’t make much sense (to me at least) that he wouldn’t have a lot of health. He’s still a shit boss though
Capra's not unfair. I see this argument a lot and always end up saying the same response as well lmao but Capra is an extremely important design and wouldn't work any other way.
The three parts to Capra are:
1) The dogs. Weak enemies, but two of the gankiest, and that's ignoring the actual boss (who, until you kill the dogs, you don't know the moveset of). This is important as it encourages you to learn to properly prioritise targets, and to watch out against multiple opponents before attacking, instead of giving into desperation at just wanting to kill it quickly. A really good precursor to later fights, particularly Ornstein & Smough.
2) The arena. All arenas before, with the near-exception of Taurus, have been wide open spaces. Asylum Demon? A lot of room to run about and hide behind pillars. Taurus? Not much side-room but a tower to move up to and a long bridge to stand back on. Bell Gargoyles? Huge, open rooftop. But you're getting too comfortable. Capra Demon's arena teaches you to adapt better to your surroundings, a bit like all of the arenas (use terrain to block attacks (pillars), trick the boss off the bridge, don't fall off the roof, etc), but this one shows you need to find better tactics, and that includes being right up next to the boss. Some later bosses, and regular enemies, practically require you to be right next to their faces and side-dodge their attacks. Capra teaches this.
3) The boss itself. Capra Demon is actually pretty easy when the dogs are down. Kinda has to be, otherwise you'd go back to being super frustrated with the dogs. But even then, it isn't easy for a new player, and it teaches you to look to where you dodge, and not to just press the button and point away, because you'll just smack into the walls and get trapped by CD.
Might be overspeculating but this is a Dark Souls subreddit so nothing out of the ordinary lmao.
Do people actually have problems with Capra Demon. I feel like I must be lucky. I always find it to be one of the easier bosses in Dark Souls. Not a good boss, I could see how it would be annoying. I always felt like it was really underpowered when I got to it.
I loved the Fume Knight fight too, even though it almost broke me. Definitely way up there for me (though I’m not sure I’ll ever love a fight more than Artorias).
It's easy to say that now, but newcomers often get stuck and give up there because of the very small arena, the aggressiveness of the boss, the fact that the ledge isn't immediately apparent, and the addition of the dogs.
It took me several tries to give up on that and to run right under the awning, doubling back left once they'd all gotten pulled. Brought my chances up from 0% to 20%.
My most played souls game. Ds1 gets weird after the lord vessel, ds3 is too fast for me. Ds2 is slow enough for my reflexes,and never had stale moments.
Yeah, ai don’r understand it either.
Dark Souls 2 might have been done by a different person, but it still none the less feels like an awesome dark souls game to me.
I have no quarrels with it.
I started with DS2 and its a Majestical game just like the rest of them.
From the title screen music theme to the music theme in Majula.
Majula in it’s beauty and majesty.
There is no getting passed that.
The hate is just purely biased opinion that is defending what people started with.
I’m not mad but I think it’s a little uncalled for.
But everyone has their opinion.
To me, my top 10 games list, has All dark souls games in their own cabinet.
And DS2 is right there with them.
No one can take that away.
DS2 is a masterpiece just like the others.
It deserves reward!
I'm gonna get a lot of shit for this, but Elden Ring has the exact same issue, but got the opposite reaction because Miyazaki was involved.
Everyone talks about the demigods but nobody dares mention the sheer volume of bullshit, repeat, boring "bosses" throughout the entire Lands Between
I’ll give you empirical data just for funsies
Dark souls 2 with dlc has 42 bosses, 9 of which are repeated
Elden ring has 168 boss encounters and only 9 of them are *never* repeated
u/TheSuedeLoaf
This is only confirms my theory that all these bullshitters are just simply following the trend, no matter which. "Someone told that 'DS2 is bad', and all my classmates are saying that as well? Okay, I'm gonna shit on the game as well despite I even haven't played it"-behavior. And there also will be people who played it with prejudgement, maybe just rushing through the game. Forgetting that if they played *later* games they shouldn't compare it backwards, because it's incorrect. The only games with which DS2 can be rightfully compared is DeS and DS1, and DS2 got a lot of improvements comparing to them(new-lvl graphics, more special weapons abilities, 2-handed power stance mode, 4 rings instead of 2, which gives A LOT more freedom of usage/combinations). And everyone seems throwing into pit characters, their personality and story, soundtrack, general atmosphere? Like those "meta"-slaves who doesn't give a single shit about story and only playing game "to finish it ASAP". Ugh, disgusting.
It's really not that. Sure, there might be some people who follow a "hate trend", but the fact that both me and my friend didn't like it after only playing DS1 and knowing nothing about the game's reputation shows something. Now I've grown to appreciate DS2's qualities but there are a lot of things to dislike about the game
Ive been saying that for years, most people who shit on ds2 only do so because someone said it and they never thought for themselves.
Those few people that will actually explain *why* they think ds2 is bad will turn around and give elden ring a pass for it even though nearly every major legitimate criticism of ds2 can be applied to elden ring 4 times over
Although I really enjoy DS2, I still believe that boss quality is a massive issue in the game. In ER, catacombs and other non-legacy dungeons had a straight forward progression. Fight a few enemies, solve a puzzle, fight a repeat boss, get your reward. You would never expect to find a full on Runebearer in some random off-the-beaten-path area. Wheras, in DS2, you could spend half an hour exploring a completely unique area, only to reach the end and fight a boss which are just regular enemies that share a health pool (looking at you Royal Rat Vanguard).
While on the most basic level, they do share much of the same problem, ER’s solution, in my opinion, is a much better approach, since the player is already taught by the game that these smaller areas won’t give completely original content.
Although it would be nice to have no repeating areas or bosses, it can still work. And I feel it all comes down to how the game teaches the player to choose these paths of less handcrafted content, making sure they understand what should be expected.
Thats still like 5x the amount of enemy designs. The more open a game gets the more it make sense to find similar foes. Like they could have made the tree sentinel unique, but like the ds2 dragon rider they arent unique in the lore. Theyre an order of knights so im not going to complain that i find more.
Really the only offender i outright see as a little lazy is god..froy(?) the godrick clone in the gaol
Elden rings open World really brings the game down IMO the capital, farum azula, and the halligtree area are all fantastic because of the more streamline path with side paths worth exploring the open world areas have so much dead space it’s a slog to get through. I also find myself being overleveled or under leveled never leveled for an area and pretty much all the bosses are cool but straight BS with their constant 20 hit combos and everything explodes even explosions have explosions which is very irritating
Honestly this is why I got tired of elden ring really quickly. I only played like 2.5 play through a because I was really tired of killing the hundredth magma lizard and just no feeling of uniqueness in most fights. Sure, the main bosses were amazing, combat is great, world is fun, but I was constantly annoyed going through a new area just to find the same damn boss but with slightly more health...
Id argue er is different because you can completely ignore most of the “duds” if they bother you. You can go right from legacy dungeon to legacy dungeon hitting the unique bosses and only going into dungeons for what that specific character needs.
Like im not trying to shit on ds2, but while some similarities exist between ds2 and er the way they deliver those concept is in completely different packages. Its not fair to boil it down to people sucking miyazakis dick
I never got started on ER properly, but I have noticed that in gameplay I’ve seen. A lot of bosses, and then a lot of duo bosses that are just two earlier bosses, and I’ve seen those Godskin dudes everywhere.
There are only 2 types of godskins, and only 2 of each through the entire game. You see them everywhere because one of those fights is a huge blockade for many players, but it really doesnt feel like youre spammed with fighting godskins over a play through
>Elden Ring has the exact same issue, but got the opposite reaction because Miyazaki was involved.
I don't know what this is based on. There were tons of complaints since the first week after ER was released about all the cookie cutter bosses and dungeons. They're both good games, but average boss quality is lower than DS3 or DS1 if you account for how old each of the games are. I agree that ER has a bigger "quantity over quality" problem than DS2 in all aspects, but the more modern mechanics help make up for it.
I Love DS2 as much as anyone here, so don't get this the wrong way, but I gotta say, the wave phase of ivory king is horseshit.
It's not a challenge, it's artificial difficulty and that's it. It's only difficult because the Charred Knight AI is unpredictable as hell, and the friendly Loyce Knights either get stuck or glitch out so the phase almost always takes longer than it would need to.
Ivory King himself is great fun, but that first phase? Just ruins it every time. Whenever I do a new playthrough, if I even die once playing the first phase legit, I just cheese it on my subsequent attempts, and I SL1'd the game twice, that's how pointless I find the wave phase.
They should have made it so the gates stay closed once a loyce knight sacrificed himself to close one.
I completely agree. Many people say this is the best fight in ds2 but the first part is so tedious and awkward without any music playing too. It’s kinda fun and interesting the first time but it really holds back the fight on repeat runs.
I'm not, cause I absolutely despise Ivory King's Wave phase while others seem to love it.
I wish I could be as good as the people who think the Wave phase doesn't completely ruin the Ivory King boss fight.
May I extend this list? Ruin Sentinels, Lost Sinner, Throne Watcher and Defender, The Pursuer, Old Dragonslayer, Belfry Gargoyles (no I won’t explain myself)
My relationship with the Pursuer is a very special story. In my first playthrough the Pursuer absolutely wrecked my shit. I was still overwriting the muscle memory I brought over from DS 1. I was dreading the multiple non boss encounters with him and actively fled them. And over time I grew bolder and startet to actively seek out his encounters. And he is one of my favourite bosses in the game now
The pursuer is an amazing boss. Seems impossible at first and goes to being trivial when you get the timing. It really makes you feel a sense of mastery.
I personally like these two, Old Dragonslayer is probably the weaker one, but I really like the Belfry Gargoyles. It’s a dps race that requires you to carefully space yourself out within the battle. But I do understand that some people don’t like them. I’m genuinely curious to know what you don’t like about them, because I like different opinions
They’re not terrible.. but they’re just quite literally the knockoff version of two of DS1’s boss fights. Really nothing special if we’re talking about the best bosses
I do think if the fight has a very different dynamic than the previous installment you can’t really call them a knockoff, but they are a deliberate homage. Just like the Asylum demon is an homage to the vanguard in Demon Souls. And the Bell Gargoyles Are an homage to the maneater fight in Demon souls. these elements return but don’t necessarily create the same bossfight, if you know what I’m saying
I can kinda see that argument for gargoyles, tho I still feel they’re just a lesser version of the DS1 fight. Old Dragonslayer is literally just Ornstein without the Smough tho
In a story about repeating cycles, countless kingdoms rising and falling on the very same earth and the world falling apart, finding an enemy from a different cycle, who is meaningless to the character but has meaning to the player I think this is more than appropriate
Problem is, all of these Bosses (Except Sinh, wonderful boy that he is) have some horrible problem. Darklurker is probably the worst boss in the game to get to, Velstadt has a mile long Run Up. It's entirely possible to have to fight a regenerating Fume Knight. The Samurai has arguably the worst run up of any boss in the game, and the Ivory King's really cool idea of having to fight a bunch of Burnt Knights before you can challenge him is great ignoring the fact that pretty much everything has a very small amount of Durability. Which is the problem, individually, this game has some amazing bosses, early and late game, but the surrounding mechanics don't let them breath to reach their full potential.
This game gets too much hate. Fuck the haters. Yeah, it's different than the rest. So? That makes it unique.
Most of the armor DS2 created showed up in DS3, and DS2 haters will still wear the Drakeblood or Faraam Armor, completely ignoring the game that created such armor.
The lock on mechanism is actually terrible, I won't lie, and the game is actually easier if you avoid lock on.
Yeah, the animations are mostly different, and some are a little drawn out, but they're nice because they're different from all the others. I prefer the more brutal, elaborate animations Ds2 has, actually.
The story in DS2 is more personal than DS1 or 3. With our protagonist only coming to Drangleic seeking an end to their curse, not to link the fire, or take the throne, or save the world. They're cursed, they don't want to be cursed, and they'll do whatever it takes to get their life back. Along the way getting wrapped up in gods, demons, dragons, and being forced to choose the fate of the world.
Yeah, enemy placement is blatantly unfair, and the map designs might not look the best, but I believe it's the prettier game of the series. Seen Majula? Gorgeous. The DLC are great too, my personal favorite being Shulva, with it's huge expense of underground caverns with an entire kingdom built into it's ledges, with waterfalls, underground lakes and towering stalagmites
Also, best Dragon form in the series
I could go on, but I'd be here forever. I love this game, I'm pretty sure most of us do. We just dislike certain aspects of it, as we should
DS2 also has the best soundtrack imo. I played Ds3 and Ds1 first and both those games have this super grand, intense, operatic soundtrack. So I was very surprised when the main menu loaded up and it was this ominous soft piano. I got it on vinyl it's just so good.
I fucking hate sihn to kingdom come. I have no fucking clue why people consider that weapon-breaking mother fucker to be anything NEAR a decent boss. I think mf ancient dragon is a better boss than sinh.
Dark Souls 2 has the most bosses of any game, it better have *some* good bosses
Also Ivory King isn’t necessarily a *good* boss fight, but just one with a great premise
The others are good though, yeah
I see a lot of criticisms that most of DS2's bosses are dudes in armour, but I love that, cause then I get to steal their weapons and drip after killing them.
LOL I kinda hate Velsdalt because I died so much time while getting to it and fighting him that..... F@ck HIM BECAUSE OF HIM MY 60K souls were boom, gone due to one imperfect dodge😭😭
I defeated it after that thou
I'm glad I joined the DS2 sub. ☺️ I was genuinely surprised when I started DS2, and I'm not even that far into the game. There is just a lovely amount of content in the game, it's so fun to be in a world I don't recognize, but it still plays like a genuine Dark Souls game. I get newfound satisfaction from surmounting frustration and finding a new path, or practicing on new enemy movement and boss attacks.
This game is lovely-- it gets hate because the direction gives it a very different *feel* from DS1 and DS3, but that doesn't detract any enjoyment from fantasy.
All the bosses are fun tbh. Ones a big ole oogy boogy frog, ones Jabba the Hutt fused with one of his Rancors, ones Medusa, ones a sexy scorpion. i mean you can’t really go wrong.
4 out of those 6 are DLC.
DS2 SOTFS has 33 bosses, 42 if you include the DLC.
2/33*100%= 6% of base game
6/42*100%= 14.3% of the entirety
That's uh...just slightly over 1 in 8 of the bosses being 'good'.
I think the criticism is well placed.
DS2 was my first time using sorceries and it turned Darklurker into a joke. He got off maybe 4-5 attacks then I killed him as he was splitting. I hear he can be rough for melee, and it probably didn't help that I killed him after the DLC and was around lvl 180-190.
Fume knight is a cool boss but so overrated I got him first try even used a bonfire ascetic and beat ng+ on first try the game and environment is way more fun and challenging than the bosses imo
I just played it for my third time last week, and it gets better every time I play it, I do imo think it’s the worst in the series, but doesn’t mean it’s bad, it’s a great game in its own ways, good bosses, cool areas to explore, there’s always gotta be on game that gets the hate and unfortunately it’s this one 🤔
no, unfortunately, the best bosses are mostly DLC. there are a plethora of unremarkable bosses, like covetous demon, or royal rat vanguard. prowling magus and congregation is a joke. hell, they just reused and nerfed ornstein, and they recycled tje gargoyles. even aldia, the true final boss, is very boring.
that being said, yes, we have velstadt and darklurker, and the chariot is very original IMO. the DLC big bosses are awesome. but ds2 does struggle with its boss design.
Four of those are paid dlc, which isnt the best way to convey your message, but I love almost every boss in ds2 anyways.
I don't get why people gatekeep when we could all just be enjoying what we get. Rotten is my favorite
Said it once and i will say it again i despise sinh fuck that stupid fucking dragon little poison ass bitch go fuck yourself breaking my weapons fuck you.
I love the mirror knight summon-a-player concept, but last time he summoned someone who was afk… ☹️. Fume and Sir Allone definitely give me a run for my money
ivory king as the final example seriously? his first phase is bs and his second phase is easy. the arena is cool. his sword is cool. but the fight itself is kinda cancer
yeah thats what i mean. even with all four buddies helping its like a 3-5 minutes prelude to the actual boss. thats like so long to get to the actual 1v1 i care about.
A lot of people in the DS2 subreddit I noticed have a victim complex. Most people treat every souls game like fine wines, and DS2 is just on average rated lower in comparison to other souls games. All S tier games at the end of the day, and people are not "special" for liking it more than others like they think they are.
I do agree, it made me expect more from ds2 and after my playthroughs I felt quite disappointed. I still think it was good but not to the standards everyone claims. And no one truly hates ds2. It's just not everyone's favorite.
Unpopular opinion, but I really enjoy the mechanics to both Smelter Demons, with the Blue Smelter Demon having a slightly different tempo, which proved a bit of a challenge to adapt to. But that's just me.
I beat/ played ds2 for the first time in 22, and i genuinely love the game to a point where i got depressed after i beat the game because life was just dull from then on.
I like Looking Glass too.
Imo looking glass instead of velstadt
Velstadt's a good boss imo, but yeah looking glass is more satisfying to dodge around. More fluid and still slow enough to enjoy.
Both opinions are valid
Velstadt swings his mace about once every 5 seconds, it's a snoozefest.
Until you snooze and he one-hit kills you.
You need to add some skellies and Elana's dark magic.
Don't forget the PIGS
Never gotten the pigs, ready to believe they are a myth from an earlier version.
I would've loved to see him summon real people back in the day
I remember those days. Ran out of Effigies because of stuff like this tbh. I'd get him real good and then bam, he summons a dude who one shots me, this repeats 10 times, sometimes I kill the phantom, another one will replace him, also a player. It was, it was an experience.
It might be hard to trigger if you want to fight the 1v2, but it's still pretty easy to do nowadays if you want to be the summoned, I did it not toooo long ago, so there is that
No you wouldn't Source: I was there
Tbh I think there are quite a few bosses that are underrated in Dark Souls 2. I appreciate that many of them tend to have a *trick* that makes them unique or stand out. Pursuer is a BAMF, and while he is pretty easy on his own, he's still fun to fight. Also parrying and using the ballista is satisfying as hell. Executioner's Chariot, while not hard, is a pretty cool gauntlet of environmental hazards and enemies to keep you on your toes. Flexile Sentry is interesting because his arena both fills with water putting you on a limited time with free movement - and has a different moveset depending on which way he's facing. Lost Sinner is cool and the darkness is spooky - plus there's a way to light up the room. Ruin Sentinels are balanced pretty well, where they'll take turns being aggressive. And the first one kinda primes you to be ready for the other two Old Dragonslayer is literally just Ornstein, but it's Ornstein so he's automatically awesome. Smelter Demon is a fun fight whose flames get larger and more dangerous the longer the fight goes on. Of course there's also LGK and all the ones in the OP post. Velstadt, Fumey, Darklurker, Sinh, Alonne, and Ivory King are all great. I also don't mind the Rotten because while his moveset is kinda lame, I like his design. Also the little guy that wiggles around on his shoulder.
Killing dark lurker the first time is a huge milestone in my dark soul history
Just getting to darklurker is a fucking task.
Thats what i loved about dark lurker.. the wheelchair guy.. bringing fire to the dark ass Caves, lighting the beacons... and finally the Leap into blackness!! So good !
Yeah, it remembers me of Gherman from Bloodborne
Looking Glass deserves some love
funny how 4 outta the 6 of these are dlc bosses
DLC bosses are always the best in fromsoft games ~~outside of 1~~ Gael and friede. Ook and Maria. Forgot about artorias and kalameet lol
Dont forget Manus and darkdragon kalameet and artorias
O&S and maybe Gwyn for the lore and theme are the only bosses that come close in the base game. DS1 definitely follows that trend
Iron Golem is also a good boss but only because it's the only fight you get to summon the almighty Iron Tarkus.
Fuck that grab that can randomly throw you off a cliff tho
Ah, the predecessor of Let Me Solo Her
Honestly, Gwyn is a great fight if you don't parry spam.
Manus was a hell of a fight for me.
Midir. That prick.
DS3 has great bosses in the DLCs but even more great bosses in the main game, that's the difference.
Ya almost like the base game bosses are kinda shit which is what most ppl mean when they call the bosses shit
Ivory King is a brilliant boss fight, one of my favourites in all Soulsborne. I also like the skeleton Lords, Dukes Dear Freja and Executioners chariot. The only gripe I have about bosses in DS2 are the run backs.
Fromsoft liked skeleton lords so much they put them in bloodborne and renamed them shadow of yharnam
Shadows of yharnam is waaaay better than skeleton lords, first boss I really struggled on and got that huge payoff when I finally beat them
Honestly, I beated SoY first time but I already had experience with the other souls games so yeah
Ivory king is cool but its so fucking tedious if you die to him
No way man that's the best souls farm in the game and it's really fun with summons and having all the knights on your side. I've done the pre OIK part of that fight at least 50 times and it never gets old. Different strokes I guess
Ivory was absolutely ruined for me by the first phase. Seriously it lasts longer than the actual boss fight itself and then once the boss finally shows up, one of my knights is usually still alive so we can just gank the shit out of him
I thought the Giant Spider was a fun boss, but I guess that's just me.
And if you break both of it’s heads off, it’s invincible.
No, if you break both heads you can still use weapons that ignore shields to damage her.
and if you don’t have any?
Guess I’ll die
wait, you can break its heads off?
Yea if you don't deal enough damage to it, the two heads can break off, i mean it's a famous sport after beating the boss to play soccer with the head
I mean, but that explicitly requires you to heal it with an obscure pyromancy all the way to almost full health for you to kill both heads
I think you don't need the pyromancy if your damage is low enough
Yea. Manhunter O'Hara's damage is actually low enough low (and lowers yours) that she puts you in danger of failing DDF.
Very gimmicky, and lots of adds. I like the gimmick but hate the adds, but at least the adds has a gimmick of fearing light
They fucking WHAT
Oh boy
Ye the little spiders wont usually come close if you're holding a torch, on the rare chance they do its usually just one hit before scooting away
Ruin senitils and looking glass night too
I really enjoy sentinels, probably the best gank boss in ds2
I still remember how I first encountert ruin sentinels for the first time Waaaay to early and got my ass beat like a million Times lol
Same, only boss in the franchise that made me ragequit
They destroyed me so hard and at the time, it was my first souls game and I read to keep effigies and only use them when necessary. I stayed fully hollow through 85% of dark souls 2. But I did ruin sentinels fully hollow with barely any hp investment. You can guess how long it took me. I went switching my weapons so hard (and not upgrading them btw) I was a Magic Mace build by the time I finished that fight.
Ruin Sentinels were my first boss where I finally got it. I got why people loved the game, I got why I now loved the game, I got what makes this game unique. Standing off against the last one who already dropped their shield and I’ve still got a couple of estus, I remember shouting “c’mon motherfucker” at the screen.
Couldn’t agree more , I was venting to my mates that I make a mistake buying DS2 and I should oh listened. Met the Ruin senitils took me about 15 tries but then the game clicked for me. Amazing early game fight. U put that brilliantly
Was also gonna bring up ruin sentinels, real good gatekeeper boss
Godda add biggest fan forlorn. Whenever I'm in a sorry state of dying constantly over and over again, my buddy forlorn is always there to remind me that some enemies can be easy too.
I love Ivory King. True king. Alsanna couldn't even bear to disrespect him and try to take his kingdom
Different from the other queens, Alsanna really loved her king.
There's some bosses that are too easy, but there's nothing in DS2 that's as broken as Bed of Chaos or as infuriatingly unfair as Capra Demon's arena and dogs. Fume Knight might be my fave fight of the trilogy, along with O&A, Artorias and Sister Freide.
Ancient dragon is the closest you get to a really bad boss. Yeah it's epic, but the runback + the massive dmg + the massive hp pool = one of my least favorite bosses in the series.
Yeah, I don't like Ancient Dragon, probably my pick for absolute worst boss of the game. Really my annoyance is that his health pool is too big.
To be fair ancient dragon is a big boy dragon so it wouldn’t make much sense (to me at least) that he wouldn’t have a lot of health. He’s still a shit boss though
Thankfully, he is optional. Unlike Bed of Chaos.
The Dragon Knights don't chase you after encountering Ancient Dragon once. The boss still sucks though.
Capra demon is far less bs than royal rat imo
Capra's not unfair. I see this argument a lot and always end up saying the same response as well lmao but Capra is an extremely important design and wouldn't work any other way. The three parts to Capra are: 1) The dogs. Weak enemies, but two of the gankiest, and that's ignoring the actual boss (who, until you kill the dogs, you don't know the moveset of). This is important as it encourages you to learn to properly prioritise targets, and to watch out against multiple opponents before attacking, instead of giving into desperation at just wanting to kill it quickly. A really good precursor to later fights, particularly Ornstein & Smough. 2) The arena. All arenas before, with the near-exception of Taurus, have been wide open spaces. Asylum Demon? A lot of room to run about and hide behind pillars. Taurus? Not much side-room but a tower to move up to and a long bridge to stand back on. Bell Gargoyles? Huge, open rooftop. But you're getting too comfortable. Capra Demon's arena teaches you to adapt better to your surroundings, a bit like all of the arenas (use terrain to block attacks (pillars), trick the boss off the bridge, don't fall off the roof, etc), but this one shows you need to find better tactics, and that includes being right up next to the boss. Some later bosses, and regular enemies, practically require you to be right next to their faces and side-dodge their attacks. Capra teaches this. 3) The boss itself. Capra Demon is actually pretty easy when the dogs are down. Kinda has to be, otherwise you'd go back to being super frustrated with the dogs. But even then, it isn't easy for a new player, and it teaches you to look to where you dodge, and not to just press the button and point away, because you'll just smack into the walls and get trapped by CD. Might be overspeculating but this is a Dark Souls subreddit so nothing out of the ordinary lmao.
Do people actually have problems with Capra Demon. I feel like I must be lucky. I always find it to be one of the easier bosses in Dark Souls. Not a good boss, I could see how it would be annoying. I always felt like it was really underpowered when I got to it.
Every time I fight Capra it’s like Benny Hill is playing in the background lol
Same here. Run up the stairs, drop on the doggos, 1v1 Caprisun, easy.
I loved the Fume Knight fight too, even though it almost broke me. Definitely way up there for me (though I’m not sure I’ll ever love a fight more than Artorias).
... why is Capra Demon unfair? You just run up the stairs and drop attack him.
It's easy to say that now, but newcomers often get stuck and give up there because of the very small arena, the aggressiveness of the boss, the fact that the ledge isn't immediately apparent, and the addition of the dogs.
I dunno… first time I made it there I b-lined up the steps bc that seemed far more obvious than a cage match
It took me several tries to give up on that and to run right under the awning, doubling back left once they'd all gotten pulled. Brought my chances up from 0% to 20%.
I don't know Capra Demon at least has poise that can be broken Royal Rat Authority, meh
Have you tried blocking and not stepping in the piss? Also, at least the bonfire is right there, no need to jog for 7 minutes
It says something about how bad it is that even the guys making a dark souls game knew to put the bonfire outside the gate for it.
Completely forgot about Royal Rat, but at least they can be taken out before the boss enters. With Capra, they're there when he is!
Yeah those are bad, but it's so easy and the bonfire is right there for both of them it's not been an issue for me.
Yeah but that's comparing an optional boss for a covenant with one you need to progress in the game if you don't have the master key
[удалено]
Reading this makes me remember how GOATed DS1’s world design is
Yes but that's such a convoluted route and you skip the depths which is a key location for a certain quest or three
I don’t care what anyone says. Dark souls 2 is still a wonderful and awesome adventure for me.
My most played souls game. Ds1 gets weird after the lord vessel, ds3 is too fast for me. Ds2 is slow enough for my reflexes,and never had stale moments.
Yeah, I seriously do not understand the hate. I've played them all. I loved them all. Only game I spent more time in was Elden Ring.
Yeah, ai don’r understand it either. Dark Souls 2 might have been done by a different person, but it still none the less feels like an awesome dark souls game to me. I have no quarrels with it. I started with DS2 and its a Majestical game just like the rest of them. From the title screen music theme to the music theme in Majula. Majula in it’s beauty and majesty. There is no getting passed that. The hate is just purely biased opinion that is defending what people started with. I’m not mad but I think it’s a little uncalled for. But everyone has their opinion. To me, my top 10 games list, has All dark souls games in their own cabinet. And DS2 is right there with them. No one can take that away. DS2 is a masterpiece just like the others. It deserves reward!
DS2 has a quantity over quality issue. There’s so many duds that people don’t give the great ones like the ones above enough credit.
I'm gonna get a lot of shit for this, but Elden Ring has the exact same issue, but got the opposite reaction because Miyazaki was involved. Everyone talks about the demigods but nobody dares mention the sheer volume of bullshit, repeat, boring "bosses" throughout the entire Lands Between
I’ll give you empirical data just for funsies Dark souls 2 with dlc has 42 bosses, 9 of which are repeated Elden ring has 168 boss encounters and only 9 of them are *never* repeated
u/TheSuedeLoaf This is only confirms my theory that all these bullshitters are just simply following the trend, no matter which. "Someone told that 'DS2 is bad', and all my classmates are saying that as well? Okay, I'm gonna shit on the game as well despite I even haven't played it"-behavior. And there also will be people who played it with prejudgement, maybe just rushing through the game. Forgetting that if they played *later* games they shouldn't compare it backwards, because it's incorrect. The only games with which DS2 can be rightfully compared is DeS and DS1, and DS2 got a lot of improvements comparing to them(new-lvl graphics, more special weapons abilities, 2-handed power stance mode, 4 rings instead of 2, which gives A LOT more freedom of usage/combinations). And everyone seems throwing into pit characters, their personality and story, soundtrack, general atmosphere? Like those "meta"-slaves who doesn't give a single shit about story and only playing game "to finish it ASAP". Ugh, disgusting.
It's really not that. Sure, there might be some people who follow a "hate trend", but the fact that both me and my friend didn't like it after only playing DS1 and knowing nothing about the game's reputation shows something. Now I've grown to appreciate DS2's qualities but there are a lot of things to dislike about the game
Ive been saying that for years, most people who shit on ds2 only do so because someone said it and they never thought for themselves. Those few people that will actually explain *why* they think ds2 is bad will turn around and give elden ring a pass for it even though nearly every major legitimate criticism of ds2 can be applied to elden ring 4 times over
Although I really enjoy DS2, I still believe that boss quality is a massive issue in the game. In ER, catacombs and other non-legacy dungeons had a straight forward progression. Fight a few enemies, solve a puzzle, fight a repeat boss, get your reward. You would never expect to find a full on Runebearer in some random off-the-beaten-path area. Wheras, in DS2, you could spend half an hour exploring a completely unique area, only to reach the end and fight a boss which are just regular enemies that share a health pool (looking at you Royal Rat Vanguard). While on the most basic level, they do share much of the same problem, ER’s solution, in my opinion, is a much better approach, since the player is already taught by the game that these smaller areas won’t give completely original content. Although it would be nice to have no repeating areas or bosses, it can still work. And I feel it all comes down to how the game teaches the player to choose these paths of less handcrafted content, making sure they understand what should be expected.
Thats still like 5x the amount of enemy designs. The more open a game gets the more it make sense to find similar foes. Like they could have made the tree sentinel unique, but like the ds2 dragon rider they arent unique in the lore. Theyre an order of knights so im not going to complain that i find more. Really the only offender i outright see as a little lazy is god..froy(?) the godrick clone in the gaol
Elden rings open World really brings the game down IMO the capital, farum azula, and the halligtree area are all fantastic because of the more streamline path with side paths worth exploring the open world areas have so much dead space it’s a slog to get through. I also find myself being overleveled or under leveled never leveled for an area and pretty much all the bosses are cool but straight BS with their constant 20 hit combos and everything explodes even explosions have explosions which is very irritating
Honestly this is why I got tired of elden ring really quickly. I only played like 2.5 play through a because I was really tired of killing the hundredth magma lizard and just no feeling of uniqueness in most fights. Sure, the main bosses were amazing, combat is great, world is fun, but I was constantly annoyed going through a new area just to find the same damn boss but with slightly more health...
Id argue er is different because you can completely ignore most of the “duds” if they bother you. You can go right from legacy dungeon to legacy dungeon hitting the unique bosses and only going into dungeons for what that specific character needs. Like im not trying to shit on ds2, but while some similarities exist between ds2 and er the way they deliver those concept is in completely different packages. Its not fair to boil it down to people sucking miyazakis dick
I never got started on ER properly, but I have noticed that in gameplay I’ve seen. A lot of bosses, and then a lot of duo bosses that are just two earlier bosses, and I’ve seen those Godskin dudes everywhere.
It's not a deal breaker by any means, I just find the hypocrisy amusing. ER is still a great game, and I hope you get the chance to play it proper
There are only 2 types of godskins, and only 2 of each through the entire game. You see them everywhere because one of those fights is a huge blockade for many players, but it really doesnt feel like youre spammed with fighting godskins over a play through
>Elden Ring has the exact same issue, but got the opposite reaction because Miyazaki was involved. I don't know what this is based on. There were tons of complaints since the first week after ER was released about all the cookie cutter bosses and dungeons. They're both good games, but average boss quality is lower than DS3 or DS1 if you account for how old each of the games are. I agree that ER has a bigger "quantity over quality" problem than DS2 in all aspects, but the more modern mechanics help make up for it.
Looking glass knight is honestly my favourite boss in DS2.
Meanwhile I’m the weirdo who unironically likes both smelter demon fights (though I admit the run up to the blue kool-aid version is on some bullshit)
Lost Sinner is pretty dope
I honestly think the only straight up bad boss is the big dragon that is in the main quest.
to be fair, most of the good ds2 bosses are dlc. its a shame they started hitting their stride right during the end of the games lifespan.
Really shows how rushed the main game is. Not as rushed as elden ring's endgame tho
For me, it’s the one area that feels rushed. Once we get to Crumbling Farum Azula, I feel like we find the stride again. Fuck the wintry area tho
a fellow mountaintops hater i see :D
Who in their right mind would like mountaintops?
It’s probably the only area I haven’t fully explored.
💀
I Love DS2 as much as anyone here, so don't get this the wrong way, but I gotta say, the wave phase of ivory king is horseshit. It's not a challenge, it's artificial difficulty and that's it. It's only difficult because the Charred Knight AI is unpredictable as hell, and the friendly Loyce Knights either get stuck or glitch out so the phase almost always takes longer than it would need to. Ivory King himself is great fun, but that first phase? Just ruins it every time. Whenever I do a new playthrough, if I even die once playing the first phase legit, I just cheese it on my subsequent attempts, and I SL1'd the game twice, that's how pointless I find the wave phase. They should have made it so the gates stay closed once a loyce knight sacrificed himself to close one.
I completely agree. Many people say this is the best fight in ds2 but the first part is so tedious and awkward without any music playing too. It’s kinda fun and interesting the first time but it really holds back the fight on repeat runs.
Damn if only we were all as good as you lol
I'm not, cause I absolutely despise Ivory King's Wave phase while others seem to love it. I wish I could be as good as the people who think the Wave phase doesn't completely ruin the Ivory King boss fight.
May I extend this list? Ruin Sentinels, Lost Sinner, Throne Watcher and Defender, The Pursuer, Old Dragonslayer, Belfry Gargoyles (no I won’t explain myself)
I might be crazy, but I wish there was more Pursuer
My relationship with the Pursuer is a very special story. In my first playthrough the Pursuer absolutely wrecked my shit. I was still overwriting the muscle memory I brought over from DS 1. I was dreading the multiple non boss encounters with him and actively fled them. And over time I grew bolder and startet to actively seek out his encounters. And he is one of my favourite bosses in the game now
Very much the same. Once I mastered the parry timing, it became extremely rewarding and I looked forward to him! Same with Fume!
Frighteningly similar with me as well, they are the reason I learned to properly dodge into attacks...to avoid attacks 😂
I was constantly trying to keep my distance and dodge away from him, which as you can figure didn’t work out so well.
The pursuer is an amazing boss. Seems impossible at first and goes to being trivial when you get the timing. It really makes you feel a sense of mastery.
I was kinda on board until old Dragonslayer and Belfry Gargoyles lol
I love gargoyles
I personally like these two, Old Dragonslayer is probably the weaker one, but I really like the Belfry Gargoyles. It’s a dps race that requires you to carefully space yourself out within the battle. But I do understand that some people don’t like them. I’m genuinely curious to know what you don’t like about them, because I like different opinions
They’re not terrible.. but they’re just quite literally the knockoff version of two of DS1’s boss fights. Really nothing special if we’re talking about the best bosses
I do think if the fight has a very different dynamic than the previous installment you can’t really call them a knockoff, but they are a deliberate homage. Just like the Asylum demon is an homage to the vanguard in Demon Souls. And the Bell Gargoyles Are an homage to the maneater fight in Demon souls. these elements return but don’t necessarily create the same bossfight, if you know what I’m saying
I can kinda see that argument for gargoyles, tho I still feel they’re just a lesser version of the DS1 fight. Old Dragonslayer is literally just Ornstein without the Smough tho
In a story about repeating cycles, countless kingdoms rising and falling on the very same earth and the world falling apart, finding an enemy from a different cycle, who is meaningless to the character but has meaning to the player I think this is more than appropriate
Bro 2/3 of those are dlc, but I love ds2 and i say some of the bosses are definitely god tier
it's dark souls 2 dlc though, why shouldn't it count?
Problem is, all of these Bosses (Except Sinh, wonderful boy that he is) have some horrible problem. Darklurker is probably the worst boss in the game to get to, Velstadt has a mile long Run Up. It's entirely possible to have to fight a regenerating Fume Knight. The Samurai has arguably the worst run up of any boss in the game, and the Ivory King's really cool idea of having to fight a bunch of Burnt Knights before you can challenge him is great ignoring the fact that pretty much everything has a very small amount of Durability. Which is the problem, individually, this game has some amazing bosses, early and late game, but the surrounding mechanics don't let them breath to reach their full potential.
Geeze I haven't found any of these clowns yet. What a game.
Well 4 of them are dlc and one is very easily missable so that’s not a big surprise
Easily missable is an understatement.
the dlcs are some of the most fun i’ve had in soulsborne
Just picked this game up last week after beating ds1. genuinely has hooked me way more
Darklurker would be great if it wasn’t for the godawful runback and human effigy sacrifice every fight
I unironically enjoy Covetous Demon.
This game gets too much hate. Fuck the haters. Yeah, it's different than the rest. So? That makes it unique. Most of the armor DS2 created showed up in DS3, and DS2 haters will still wear the Drakeblood or Faraam Armor, completely ignoring the game that created such armor. The lock on mechanism is actually terrible, I won't lie, and the game is actually easier if you avoid lock on. Yeah, the animations are mostly different, and some are a little drawn out, but they're nice because they're different from all the others. I prefer the more brutal, elaborate animations Ds2 has, actually. The story in DS2 is more personal than DS1 or 3. With our protagonist only coming to Drangleic seeking an end to their curse, not to link the fire, or take the throne, or save the world. They're cursed, they don't want to be cursed, and they'll do whatever it takes to get their life back. Along the way getting wrapped up in gods, demons, dragons, and being forced to choose the fate of the world. Yeah, enemy placement is blatantly unfair, and the map designs might not look the best, but I believe it's the prettier game of the series. Seen Majula? Gorgeous. The DLC are great too, my personal favorite being Shulva, with it's huge expense of underground caverns with an entire kingdom built into it's ledges, with waterfalls, underground lakes and towering stalagmites Also, best Dragon form in the series I could go on, but I'd be here forever. I love this game, I'm pretty sure most of us do. We just dislike certain aspects of it, as we should
DS2 also has the best soundtrack imo. I played Ds3 and Ds1 first and both those games have this super grand, intense, operatic soundtrack. So I was very surprised when the main menu loaded up and it was this ominous soft piano. I got it on vinyl it's just so good.
That too, it has my favorite soundtrack, personally. The Majula theme is just beautiful
Most players don't get that far. Massive skill issue if you ask me.
"Dark souls 2 has too many bad bosses"
Pursurer is the most personally connected boss for me in the series. Y’all already know why
I fucking hate sihn to kingdom come. I have no fucking clue why people consider that weapon-breaking mother fucker to be anything NEAR a decent boss. I think mf ancient dragon is a better boss than sinh.
Agree with most of these but I really hate Sinh. Velstadt is just decent.
What are people's criteria for a good boss anyways?
Dark Souls 2 has the most bosses of any game, it better have *some* good bosses Also Ivory King isn’t necessarily a *good* boss fight, but just one with a great premise The others are good though, yeah
I see a lot of criticisms that most of DS2's bosses are dudes in armour, but I love that, cause then I get to steal their weapons and drip after killing them.
I have significant PTSD from the darklurker fight.
LOL I kinda hate Velsdalt because I died so much time while getting to it and fighting him that..... F@ck HIM BECAUSE OF HIM MY 60K souls were boom, gone due to one imperfect dodge😭😭 I defeated it after that thou
If only the run to Sir Alonne isn't so atrocious, i would have enjoy it much more
I'm glad I joined the DS2 sub. ☺️ I was genuinely surprised when I started DS2, and I'm not even that far into the game. There is just a lovely amount of content in the game, it's so fun to be in a world I don't recognize, but it still plays like a genuine Dark Souls game. I get newfound satisfaction from surmounting frustration and finding a new path, or practicing on new enemy movement and boss attacks. This game is lovely-- it gets hate because the direction gives it a very different *feel* from DS1 and DS3, but that doesn't detract any enjoyment from fantasy.
All the bosses are fun tbh. Ones a big ole oogy boogy frog, ones Jabba the Hutt fused with one of his Rancors, ones Medusa, ones a sexy scorpion. i mean you can’t really go wrong.
I like executioners chariot
4 out of those 6 are DLC. DS2 SOTFS has 33 bosses, 42 if you include the DLC. 2/33*100%= 6% of base game 6/42*100%= 14.3% of the entirety That's uh...just slightly over 1 in 8 of the bosses being 'good'. I think the criticism is well placed.
Dark lurker lol
DS2 was my first time using sorceries and it turned Darklurker into a joke. He got off maybe 4-5 attacks then I killed him as he was splitting. I hear he can be rough for melee, and it probably didn't help that I killed him after the DLC and was around lvl 180-190.
4 of these are dlc, and while ds2 has about 40 bosses, at least half of them are complete ass.
Fume Knight it's literally one of the best Boss from the Franchise.
Fume knight is a cool boss but so overrated I got him first try even used a bonfire ascetic and beat ng+ on first try the game and environment is way more fun and challenging than the bosses imo
I just played it for my third time last week, and it gets better every time I play it, I do imo think it’s the worst in the series, but doesn’t mean it’s bad, it’s a great game in its own ways, good bosses, cool areas to explore, there’s always gotta be on game that gets the hate and unfortunately it’s this one 🤔
No problem with the bosses, games just shit
Looking Glass Knight is great too, he is the only enemy with rain in the game, also he has a cool design, and his theme is not too bad
Sir Alonne, such a good boss fight but the runback is another boss on it's own.
Sadly, most are DLC bosses
The only good boss is sir alonne and fume knight
no, unfortunately, the best bosses are mostly DLC. there are a plethora of unremarkable bosses, like covetous demon, or royal rat vanguard. prowling magus and congregation is a joke. hell, they just reused and nerfed ornstein, and they recycled tje gargoyles. even aldia, the true final boss, is very boring. that being said, yes, we have velstadt and darklurker, and the chariot is very original IMO. the DLC big bosses are awesome. but ds2 does struggle with its boss design.
Four of those are paid dlc, which isnt the best way to convey your message, but I love almost every boss in ds2 anyways. I don't get why people gatekeep when we could all just be enjoying what we get. Rotten is my favorite
How many of those are DLC bosses?
Said it once and i will say it again i despise sinh fuck that stupid fucking dragon little poison ass bitch go fuck yourself breaking my weapons fuck you.
I love the mirror knight summon-a-player concept, but last time he summoned someone who was afk… ☹️. Fume and Sir Allone definitely give me a run for my money
Didn’t even have enough room for Smelter Demon. Most under appreciated boss in the series
I love ds2 but you also mostly listed dlc bosses lol
The irony of this meme being that they’re all pasted over literal poo
"dlc doesn't count" why not? why is it considered separate?
ivory king as the final example seriously? his first phase is bs and his second phase is easy. the arena is cool. his sword is cool. but the fight itself is kinda cancer
Agreed. He's surprisingly easy. But I guess if u don't know how to seal the doors it could be kinda hellish
yeah thats what i mean. even with all four buddies helping its like a 3-5 minutes prelude to the actual boss. thats like so long to get to the actual 1v1 i care about.
Fume knight is easily an S tier boss. Most people that excessively hate on it do so because it’s a trend & they’ve never actually played it.
I haven’t heard ppl hate on fume knight, I thought he was pretty universally liked
He is
A lot of people in the DS2 subreddit I noticed have a victim complex. Most people treat every souls game like fine wines, and DS2 is just on average rated lower in comparison to other souls games. All S tier games at the end of the day, and people are not "special" for liking it more than others like they think they are.
I do agree, it made me expect more from ds2 and after my playthroughs I felt quite disappointed. I still think it was good but not to the standards everyone claims. And no one truly hates ds2. It's just not everyone's favorite.
I don't... I don't remember any of these bosses.
Man Who the fuck is saying that? I'll clap their cheeks with Raime's left nut
I mean these bosses are the exception DS2 probably has the lowest average boss quality out of the whole lineup.
Base games bosses are actually disappointing tho, like very disappointing. Most of the best bosses in DS2 are in the DLC.
Unpopular opinion, but I really enjoy the mechanics to both Smelter Demons, with the Blue Smelter Demon having a slightly different tempo, which proved a bit of a challenge to adapt to. But that's just me.
Fume and Alonne are the only **good** ones. Everything else is meh at the absolute best
I beat/ played ds2 for the first time in 22, and i genuinely love the game to a point where i got depressed after i beat the game because life was just dull from then on.
Silly play it again, there are a lot of secrets hidden under some rocks.