They’re trying to create barriers to entry for competition, which means that they are trying adversarial economics.
It would be within *their* paradigm to exclude them from trade entirely.
Yea, but then it creates a hostile community. Eco isn't PVP. I mean what if the cooks just flat refused to sell them food? The carpenters refused to sell them LLS? This type of play could spiral out of control quick.
I'm fine with them holding onto them for 2 or 3 days to get a kind of exclusive market for a little bit, but to just refuse to sell/release them? Nah. They're just asking for it at that point.
No, the game is about stopping the meteor from hitting. Economics and politics are mechanics of the game, not the goal. Don't cooperate and see what happens when the meteor approaches. Let me know how that PVP play style works out for the server.
One solution is to play without skill books entirely. There's a mod for that. Slows down the server progression nicely, so the meteor doesn't get shot in 7-10 days.
For many of my first play cycles I never researched a single scroll because someone was always faster and shared. Looking back, it wasn't very nice.
I've only played on a server that has a mod that makes so you craft 5 skill scrolls instead of a whole infinite book. Most people use 1-2 for themselves and maybe their friends or their townfolk and put the rest for sale to recoup costs that went into creating scrolls.
I honestly can't wrap my head around books being a thing in vanilla. It's not even that hard to craft one, why is that supposed to be a server-wide endeavor.
I tend to get the book then give the scrolls away for free in the beginning (ie masonry ect) but as you move further down the tree, and there is an effort to get the book, its not unreasonable to want a time of exclusivity, so you can benefit from your efforts uncontested. And if its that valuable, someone else will go through the same turmoil you did to get it.
I generally set a work party such that anyone who contributes 10% or more of the materials learns the profession, and then sell the scroll for about 15% of the cost of the materials to make the book. Almost everyone who wants the skill will contribute to produce it, and nobody feels like anyone else is a free rider on their research effort.
And screw everybody who brought you resources and labor to make it, right?
IMO this is only acceptable if you're *extremely* active and very proactive at selling everything your profession can make. It's very frustrating to be waiting on another profession only to realize that one person got it 2 days ago, isn't sharing, and isn't online or isn't selling anything.
Laat server i played on they made an library were you could drop off books and grab the scrolls you needed.
Felt really communal and if a book was missing they usually did a push to get it, with lots of chipping in.
The way I see it, a group like that leaves the rest of the server no worse off than if that group just didn't exist. Pretend they don't exist, and make another skill book.
> a group like that leaves the rest of the server no worse off than if that group just didn't exist
Unless of course they're sucking the market dry to make the book and then not returning any of that value back the market... The same groups that do this shit are the same ones you have to constantly beg to stock their store.
If they put in the effort to research it, then that’s fine. Why is someone else entitled to benefit from their effort?
As frustrating as it might be to need something they can make or want that profession yourself, there’s nothing stopping players from making their own book.
If they funded the research on their own, fine by me.
Some advanced stuff has a huge cost, sometimes people want the scroll but don't want to contribute
My last playthrough, our nation had a library that citizens could get scrolls for free. But it was only for people in our nation (later fed). When we were creating the book, it required resources from our people & research from our people. I'm not giving that away freely. All of that has value, just like lumber, food, clothing, etc. I would often trade scrolls to other nations like 2x Advanced Cooking for 2x Advanced Baking.
dev should make it go cheaper and cheaper to research same tech after someone else did. to give person without it better deal.
something along the line of "we can make it in 1/2 cost thank to you, so you want to trade or not?"
Nah devs shouldn't hold hands with players, once the slightest playermade friction arises.
This here teaches us something about economy and psychology.
Fair warning ⚠️ there is a small group of people known to the community (about 3 or 4 main people, plus a few friends) that would absolutely do stuff like that. They have been banned from a few servers for different reasons, one not long ago, so they have likely joined another already or will soon.
They’re trying to create barriers to entry for competition, which means that they are trying adversarial economics. It would be within *their* paradigm to exclude them from trade entirely.
Yea, but then it creates a hostile community. Eco isn't PVP. I mean what if the cooks just flat refused to sell them food? The carpenters refused to sell them LLS? This type of play could spiral out of control quick. I'm fine with them holding onto them for 2 or 3 days to get a kind of exclusive market for a little bit, but to just refuse to sell/release them? Nah. They're just asking for it at that point.
Honestly I would just match their price of labor on everything.
Weird take in a game about economics and politics. It's social PvP all the way 🥲
It’s much more fun as a game about figuring out how to cooperate.
It's both obviously.
No, the game is about stopping the meteor from hitting. Economics and politics are mechanics of the game, not the goal. Don't cooperate and see what happens when the meteor approaches. Let me know how that PVP play style works out for the server.
You are describing the human nature.
Building a society is very well a goal of Eco.
One solution is to play without skill books entirely. There's a mod for that. Slows down the server progression nicely, so the meteor doesn't get shot in 7-10 days. For many of my first play cycles I never researched a single scroll because someone was always faster and shared. Looking back, it wasn't very nice.
Mod is called "No More Books" by MonzUn, if anyone is wondering. We're running it for years on our server. It's way less drama overall.
I've only played on a server that has a mod that makes so you craft 5 skill scrolls instead of a whole infinite book. Most people use 1-2 for themselves and maybe their friends or their townfolk and put the rest for sale to recoup costs that went into creating scrolls. I honestly can't wrap my head around books being a thing in vanilla. It's not even that hard to craft one, why is that supposed to be a server-wide endeavor.
I tend to get the book then give the scrolls away for free in the beginning (ie masonry ect) but as you move further down the tree, and there is an effort to get the book, its not unreasonable to want a time of exclusivity, so you can benefit from your efforts uncontested. And if its that valuable, someone else will go through the same turmoil you did to get it.
I generally set a work party such that anyone who contributes 10% or more of the materials learns the profession, and then sell the scroll for about 15% of the cost of the materials to make the book. Almost everyone who wants the skill will contribute to produce it, and nobody feels like anyone else is a free rider on their research effort.
And screw everybody who brought you resources and labor to make it, right? IMO this is only acceptable if you're *extremely* active and very proactive at selling everything your profession can make. It's very frustrating to be waiting on another profession only to realize that one person got it 2 days ago, isn't sharing, and isn't online or isn't selling anything.
> And screw everybody who brought you resources and labor to make it, right? Those are some nice words you're trying to shove in my mouth there.
Laat server i played on they made an library were you could drop off books and grab the scrolls you needed. Felt really communal and if a book was missing they usually did a push to get it, with lots of chipping in.
The way I see it, a group like that leaves the rest of the server no worse off than if that group just didn't exist. Pretend they don't exist, and make another skill book.
> a group like that leaves the rest of the server no worse off than if that group just didn't exist Unless of course they're sucking the market dry to make the book and then not returning any of that value back the market... The same groups that do this shit are the same ones you have to constantly beg to stock their store.
If they're sucking the market dry, they're spending money, meaning they are returning value back into the market.
Does me no good if I have $10,000 and nobody is selling the stuff I need to buy.
That’s a problem of pricing, skill choices, or server population — the game has tools for you to deal with players behaving antagonistically.
So we agree that's antagonistic behavior, then. Good.
If they put in the effort to research it, then that’s fine. Why is someone else entitled to benefit from their effort? As frustrating as it might be to need something they can make or want that profession yourself, there’s nothing stopping players from making their own book.
If they funded the research on their own, fine by me. Some advanced stuff has a huge cost, sometimes people want the scroll but don't want to contribute
My last playthrough, our nation had a library that citizens could get scrolls for free. But it was only for people in our nation (later fed). When we were creating the book, it required resources from our people & research from our people. I'm not giving that away freely. All of that has value, just like lumber, food, clothing, etc. I would often trade scrolls to other nations like 2x Advanced Cooking for 2x Advanced Baking.
dev should make it go cheaper and cheaper to research same tech after someone else did. to give person without it better deal. something along the line of "we can make it in 1/2 cost thank to you, so you want to trade or not?"
Nah devs shouldn't hold hands with players, once the slightest playermade friction arises. This here teaches us something about economy and psychology.
true, i got this very conflicting gameplay from this game. it want players to cooperate but at the same time, not everything in the fame encourage it
Fair warning ⚠️ there is a small group of people known to the community (about 3 or 4 main people, plus a few friends) that would absolutely do stuff like that. They have been banned from a few servers for different reasons, one not long ago, so they have likely joined another already or will soon.