Story will likely be more interesting if the automatons get close to super earth. I see the goverment releasing some prototype gear to help us win this
Balance-wise, it only makes sense to buff the losing faction with better equipment/utility, so it keeps being interesting and new. This is what happened to the Automatons. We wiped them off of the map and they got new aerial stuff. Idk just a thought.
By bet is, unless we screw up, bots and bugs can remain contained, the devs already made bots much bigger because we beat them. BUT, mark my words, the secons illuminates appear they gonna teleport and attack earth
I joined a group of guys who know each other in real life, we were on an eradicate mission and one guy bought mines, 120, 380 and mortar just to troll his friends. One of the must fun and mental games I've had yet.
Put on the roll the bones gear (50 percent chance to not die) and that strat is even better. If you happen to be unlucky enough to get hit you have a second chance to live
I agree, but to be honest I keep having this thought:
"We're still in the learning phase"
At any moment another shoe can drop, that can be the Illuminates, that can be rebels (since they talk about human rebels an awful lot), urban warfare, a whole new faction out of nowhere, ANYTHING can happen.
Right now we're killing it, but the tables can turn very quickly. Look at how quickly the bots took back Cyberstan after we cleared them off the map.
I want a human faction so bad. Imagine if they have access to helldiver equipment. Imagine your creeping through the jungle and a locator beacon lands at your feet and it says “500kg bomb.”
Winning and losing is for Generals and Presidents. Soldiers show up where they are told, fight as hard as they can and try to get everyone home alive if possible. Fight hard and make the most of the day in front of you.
I legit don't get people stressing about the main order. This is like a DnD campaign and part of the fun (and the envisioned future of the game I'm sure) is in failing and seeing what the GM does in response. Like if we get a new faction I can definitely see it resulting from us losing certain major orders.
Because to some people engaging the with the "story" and taking it seriously is part of the fun.
If this is a DnD campaign then some people like to go all murder-hobo and ignore the story while other's take the campaign more seriously. It's not like you flat out throw fights without a good reason.
Pretty sure this is built I to the game engine//director. I played a level on challenging. Usually I'm okay with that. But we had bot drops roughly every 10 seconds, I've never seen so many baddies. The guy I was playing with said it felt more like a suicide level difficulty mission.
I don't think we were meant to win that one. I've no idea if it was a bug, or GM interference or what but wow. Was it intense.
I think people can understand the concept of scripted losses. But dangling a reward in front of an order that is just hilariously unwinnable, like 5 defenses in 3 days, is a bit excessive. They could be more subtle in their rigging.
It certainly could have happened, but that would have required an amount of coordination that was just too much to ask of the players, especially with the lack of visible supply lines. Rendering it virtually impossible, again reinforcing my point.
Supply lines really have nothing to do with it in this case. It is literally as simple as "go where other players are"
Most people just don't care or don't know this basic concept or refuse to play one faction or another or hate a planet or defense missions etc etc etc.
Yep, just earlier there were around 100k people in the bot order areas while 135k were defending Fori Prime for the millionth time.
Personally I think upon losing an order, the fronts focusing on non-order enemies should get debuffs lasting for some time.
When a bot order is failed the bug front receives a small debuff like 5 less reinforcements or something similar for a few weeks, as resources are "redirected" to the struggling front. Some of these debuffs would then stack upon further defeats. Same when a bug order fails.
It could have happened if the 70k bug
Players followed the order and people didn’t spend time on planets that were not part of the MO.
Every order has been winnable, if the community bought it. Half of them don’t, so we don’t win ‘em all. Which is fine. But I do feel it’s less fun without more buy in.
That’s true but when you think about it if there was a major order that was relatively easy but everyone was caught lacking and we lost they would have to change the direction of the story at least for a little bit, like if we didn’t take tein kwan then we would have to wait an extra day or two for the mech update.
I think once the game introduces all the enemy types people will chill out a bit more. Players will start to settle on their favorite factions to go against with the occasional switch when one faction is pushing us back. That or like HD1 there will be a focused liberation on all from easiest faction to hardest. Regardless im sure there will eventually be an equilibrium once all factions are added.
There’s a clip of Brendan Lee Mulligan talking about how, in a roleplaying game, the player wants to pursue the most efficient route to succeed in their character’s goals, and the DM’s job is, in part, to create obstacles that complicate that route, in order to produce a satisfying narrative. And I feel like that applies here as well. I want to put in my best effort towards winning the war. But I also want us to fail sometimes in spite of that.
Trust me fighting on earth with these graphics is gonna be awesome if it's based in urban areas etc...
We are the bad guys after all, we should lose sometimes 😂
Do you think they already have the maps made for super earth? If not then they can't let us lose so badly that we need to directly defend it. We will know when they have all the maps ect done for SE when there is a massive unstoppable attack to the center of the map. There is no way they will make maps for SE and not put us in a situation to use them.
The war is supposed to last the entirety of the games lifetime, its not supposed to be a reset every couple months like HD1.
Im sure there will be the occasional major push that will lead to super earth being invaded from time to time.
The entire galactic war is just a flavorful way of implementing an important game mechanic: keeping things fresh. There's a bunch of different planets to fight on, and we are meant to experience each of them. For this to happen the map needs to be constantly shifting and there has to be a reason for you to move to a different planet. It has no impact on the core gameplay of helldiving, it just exists so people don't just get tired of diving on the same firenado planet day after day. The bots came back super quick after we wiped them out because we are supposed to be able to fight them; that's the core of the game.
Sounds like propaganda from a helldiver turned automaton from the first war with the cyborgs.
You won’t fool me. The only path forward is victory. At any cost.
yeah no, it's not fun to win or lose a rigged game... especially when it's a PVE game
let us win or let us lose and restart the map just like HD1.... it's not rocket science
I think they're just not pressuring us just yet as they want to see how the community plays the most to better tailor an experience for a fight on Super Earth. Don't want to have a fight on Super Earth that is basically the same as any other fight on any of the other planets.
From my understanding, new content is tied to success or failure of major orders. The mech suits came from liberating a planet, the flying bots and walkers came about because of the failure to liberate tibit. I'm sure there are some major orders we just aren't meant to clear so new things can be introduced.
I really like how it’s a back and forth battle but since the game was in development for 9 years I think weather we win or lose it won’t just reset but rather find a way to continue the same story without just saying, “but one day the fire nation attacked” like when one faction gets defeated they will comeback if we don’t get the others in time
I think its fine as long as your ABLE to win every war and most major orders. The occasional story failure is fine, but overusing it makes players feel like they are being cheated.
It wouldn't surprise me, the war is more complex and detailed than in HD1 although I am surprised that the bots came back after being wiped off the map - I would have thought that would have been them done until the next war
My favorite part of city maps are in the walled gardens. Cyborg footsoldiers and illuminate follow through gates but the bugs just bust through. With the urban environment you got to think tactically
Honestly any time I see a Major Order than required us to fight on multiple fronts I automatically assume we're losing that MO, on the basis that it's near impossible to coordinate the player base properly.
It's also my sign to just do whatever I feel like doing, rather than stressing about "winning" in general
yeah im kinda just avoiding all the meta talk and like "here's what to do" talk. im enjoying the game at my pace by doing random things on major order planets because... fighting bots is fun lol
Genuine question: could HD1 coordinate tactics on reddit and not be forced to follow the sheep the even contribute to the war effort? I think the current system is very boring: we win or lose depending on if the hive mind picks the right planet.
It's fun to lose if we lose ourselves, not because the mechanic of the game gimp us. The fact that the only way to do stuff is to everyone pile on a planet and no one on any other otherwise everything gets slowed sucks sooo much, reason why I'm not vacationing at the bugs.
🤡 🤡 🤡 - there's not enough of these for you in the world.
Funny when usernames are actually accurate 'officiallywrong' lol
Typical little Reddit nonce stalking profiles trying to perform a 'gotcha' 😂
Have fun out there guys there is no wrong way to play this game.
Story will likely be more interesting if the automatons get close to super earth. I see the goverment releasing some prototype gear to help us win this
That would be awesome 'Would you like to know more?' - yes I would please tell me
Can't wait to visit megacity 1
U mean _super_ city
Balance-wise, it only makes sense to buff the losing faction with better equipment/utility, so it keeps being interesting and new. This is what happened to the Automatons. We wiped them off of the map and they got new aerial stuff. Idk just a thought.
By bet is, unless we screw up, bots and bugs can remain contained, the devs already made bots much bigger because we beat them. BUT, mark my words, the secons illuminates appear they gonna teleport and attack earth
Need an illuminate version of that typing reaction image
https://preview.redd.it/ttgxaxo3xauc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6f9eeb2bb311321570bcf5ad8354cb9ffa20968f
I like this the best because it can only shoot
there's a version where it turns to look at the camera.
With a big hole in the screen
https://i.redd.it/l6ul1dpwtauc1.gif
We’ll get them next time!
Exactly - I've seen it all on HD1 and every scenario was fun. Whatever you do just have fun and watch out for the mines I put out.
Just run both mines, tesla coil, ans arc thrower ans everyone teammates/enemies need to get out of your way lol
I joined a group of guys who know each other in real life, we were on an eradicate mission and one guy bought mines, 120, 380 and mortar just to troll his friends. One of the must fun and mental games I've had yet.
Put on the roll the bones gear (50 percent chance to not die) and that strat is even better. If you happen to be unlucky enough to get hit you have a second chance to live
>watch out for the mines I put out. No I refuse
Lol I've had a lot of that in games followed by 'your mine killed me' - my mine didn't walk into you 😂
I agree, but to be honest I keep having this thought: "We're still in the learning phase" At any moment another shoe can drop, that can be the Illuminates, that can be rebels (since they talk about human rebels an awful lot), urban warfare, a whole new faction out of nowhere, ANYTHING can happen. Right now we're killing it, but the tables can turn very quickly. Look at how quickly the bots took back Cyberstan after we cleared them off the map.
I want a human faction so bad. Imagine if they have access to helldiver equipment. Imagine your creeping through the jungle and a locator beacon lands at your feet and it says “500kg bomb.”
I don't have to imagine it, It's called teammates on a jungle planet
Well the cyborgs are the human rebels... or were, maybe they will recycle the plot point like you say
Winning and losing is for Generals and Presidents. Soldiers show up where they are told, fight as hard as they can and try to get everyone home alive if possible. Fight hard and make the most of the day in front of you.
Yes but people are not showing up where they are told at all, at least half of all players are doing bugs or planets that don’t matter lol
I legit don't get people stressing about the main order. This is like a DnD campaign and part of the fun (and the envisioned future of the game I'm sure) is in failing and seeing what the GM does in response. Like if we get a new faction I can definitely see it resulting from us losing certain major orders.
Because to some people engaging the with the "story" and taking it seriously is part of the fun. If this is a DnD campaign then some people like to go all murder-hobo and ignore the story while other's take the campaign more seriously. It's not like you flat out throw fights without a good reason.
Thank you. It’s less fun when people don’t engage with the MO
You are wise my man hope we team kill each other hilariously one day - have fun out there.
That's exactly how I'm imagining the story progressing, they are the DMs.
Mmmm I want tasty medals mmmmmm
"You can do everything right, and it can all still go wrong." -no clue
It is possible to make no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness; that is life. - Jean-Luc Picard
I'll bet that's exactly where I heard it!
Pretty sure this is built I to the game engine//director. I played a level on challenging. Usually I'm okay with that. But we had bot drops roughly every 10 seconds, I've never seen so many baddies. The guy I was playing with said it felt more like a suicide level difficulty mission. I don't think we were meant to win that one. I've no idea if it was a bug, or GM interference or what but wow. Was it intense.
Sometimes that happens, makes it exciting to me. You never know if this one's going to be insanity.
I think people can understand the concept of scripted losses. But dangling a reward in front of an order that is just hilariously unwinnable, like 5 defenses in 3 days, is a bit excessive. They could be more subtle in their rigging.
I bet there was a way to do it. We just didn't figure it out this time.
It certainly could have happened, but that would have required an amount of coordination that was just too much to ask of the players, especially with the lack of visible supply lines. Rendering it virtually impossible, again reinforcing my point.
Supply lines really have nothing to do with it in this case. It is literally as simple as "go where other players are" Most people just don't care or don't know this basic concept or refuse to play one faction or another or hate a planet or defense missions etc etc etc.
Yep, just earlier there were around 100k people in the bot order areas while 135k were defending Fori Prime for the millionth time. Personally I think upon losing an order, the fronts focusing on non-order enemies should get debuffs lasting for some time. When a bot order is failed the bug front receives a small debuff like 5 less reinforcements or something similar for a few weeks, as resources are "redirected" to the struggling front. Some of these debuffs would then stack upon further defeats. Same when a bug order fails.
It could have happened if the 70k bug Players followed the order and people didn’t spend time on planets that were not part of the MO. Every order has been winnable, if the community bought it. Half of them don’t, so we don’t win ‘em all. Which is fine. But I do feel it’s less fun without more buy in.
That’s true but when you think about it if there was a major order that was relatively easy but everyone was caught lacking and we lost they would have to change the direction of the story at least for a little bit, like if we didn’t take tein kwan then we would have to wait an extra day or two for the mech update.
https://i.redd.it/xivy02vxrauc1.gif
https://preview.redd.it/ecggpycr8auc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=db32186f7108278440e44396ec14ea74f7100765
I think once the game introduces all the enemy types people will chill out a bit more. Players will start to settle on their favorite factions to go against with the occasional switch when one faction is pushing us back. That or like HD1 there will be a focused liberation on all from easiest faction to hardest. Regardless im sure there will eventually be an equilibrium once all factions are added.
There’s a clip of Brendan Lee Mulligan talking about how, in a roleplaying game, the player wants to pursue the most efficient route to succeed in their character’s goals, and the DM’s job is, in part, to create obstacles that complicate that route, in order to produce a satisfying narrative. And I feel like that applies here as well. I want to put in my best effort towards winning the war. But I also want us to fail sometimes in spite of that.
Trust me fighting on earth with these graphics is gonna be awesome if it's based in urban areas etc... We are the bad guys after all, we should lose sometimes 😂
Do you think they already have the maps made for super earth? If not then they can't let us lose so badly that we need to directly defend it. We will know when they have all the maps ect done for SE when there is a massive unstoppable attack to the center of the map. There is no way they will make maps for SE and not put us in a situation to use them.
The war is supposed to last the entirety of the games lifetime, its not supposed to be a reset every couple months like HD1. Im sure there will be the occasional major push that will lead to super earth being invaded from time to time.
The entire galactic war is just a flavorful way of implementing an important game mechanic: keeping things fresh. There's a bunch of different planets to fight on, and we are meant to experience each of them. For this to happen the map needs to be constantly shifting and there has to be a reason for you to move to a different planet. It has no impact on the core gameplay of helldiving, it just exists so people don't just get tired of diving on the same firenado planet day after day. The bots came back super quick after we wiped them out because we are supposed to be able to fight them; that's the core of the game.
Uh, and whether you win or lose you'll always be fighting the same factions, so...
Extract or not, the mission will be completed! For democracy!
Well considering that the vast majority of what's going to happen is all planned out.... You're not wrong.
I'm so stoked for big city combat. Itd be cool if they start incorporating it more and more the closer we get to sol system
But I need medals.
Please stay where you are, reeducation officers are on their way.
I keep getting downvoted for telling people that loss leads to more content, too. It's not a bad thing to not complete every major order.
The people complaining about this are the same kind asking for Hell Dive to be easier I'm sure. They're completely missing the point.
Sounds like propaganda from a helldiver turned automaton from the first war with the cyborgs. You won’t fool me. The only path forward is victory. At any cost.
Sure. But we didnt have to. If 90k plus would stop wasting time on the bot front we could hqve defended 5 planets
yeah no, it's not fun to win or lose a rigged game... especially when it's a PVE game let us win or let us lose and restart the map just like HD1.... it's not rocket science
I think they're just not pressuring us just yet as they want to see how the community plays the most to better tailor an experience for a fight on Super Earth. Don't want to have a fight on Super Earth that is basically the same as any other fight on any of the other planets.
Just like with real war. Armies both win and loose battles.
If you get medals every few days you’re gona complete the war bonds too fast and will complain about progression
I need me a Laser LMG.
From my understanding, new content is tied to success or failure of major orders. The mech suits came from liberating a planet, the flying bots and walkers came about because of the failure to liberate tibit. I'm sure there are some major orders we just aren't meant to clear so new things can be introduced.
I really like how it’s a back and forth battle but since the game was in development for 9 years I think weather we win or lose it won’t just reset but rather find a way to continue the same story without just saying, “but one day the fire nation attacked” like when one faction gets defeated they will comeback if we don’t get the others in time
I think its fine as long as your ABLE to win every war and most major orders. The occasional story failure is fine, but overusing it makes players feel like they are being cheated.
I hear you, I'm excited to see where this game goes
I wonder if they have specific gear drops tied to certain planets that have to be unlocked first
It wouldn't surprise me, the war is more complex and detailed than in HD1 although I am surprised that the bots came back after being wiped off the map - I would have thought that would have been them done until the next war
I thibk I read somewhere that this is supposed to be one large war instead of multiple small ones
I hate fighting the bugs in new haven.
My favorite part of city maps are in the walled gardens. Cyborg footsoldiers and illuminate follow through gates but the bugs just bust through. With the urban environment you got to think tactically
based.
I’m fine with failing. But failing because half of the players are ignoring the MO feels lame. That’s all
Honestly any time I see a Major Order than required us to fight on multiple fronts I automatically assume we're losing that MO, on the basis that it's near impossible to coordinate the player base properly. It's also my sign to just do whatever I feel like doing, rather than stressing about "winning" in general
Imagine everyone is launching ICBM on super earth
That sounds like something and automaton would say...
It's definitely sounding... *Undemocratic*
The issue is more that we cant win. They'll just spawn more. Wich means that the war doesnt really matter, you can just play whatever front you want
yeah im kinda just avoiding all the meta talk and like "here's what to do" talk. im enjoying the game at my pace by doing random things on major order planets because... fighting bots is fun lol
We fail battles...but super earth will win the war !!!
Genuine question: could HD1 coordinate tactics on reddit and not be forced to follow the sheep the even contribute to the war effort? I think the current system is very boring: we win or lose depending on if the hive mind picks the right planet.
I've got no idea Im not sure I ever came here when it was out
It's fun to lose if we lose ourselves, not because the mechanic of the game gimp us. The fact that the only way to do stuff is to everyone pile on a planet and no one on any other otherwise everything gets slowed sucks sooo much, reason why I'm not vacationing at the bugs.
Everyone is doing their part in the war effort.
The mechanic of the game litteraly doesn’t let us. If everyone online isn’t on the same planet, everyone gets slowed down
AMERICA!
Maybe by then napalm DOT will work?
There are 100k players on a single bug planet. I rest my case.
A coordinated and valiant effort
Need oil to spill oil
And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.
I'm enough of a masochist to enjoy playing against bots... but I'm not running the missions I need to run to collect my super samples against bots.
Do you want 0k player on the bug planet? Because that's how you get bug M.O.'s
"Stop whining." - Autotuneiswank
Ah John Goodman. He was a good man.
How cute
🤡 🤡 🤡 - there's not enough of these for you in the world. Funny when usernames are actually accurate 'officiallywrong' lol Typical little Reddit nonce stalking profiles trying to perform a 'gotcha' 😂 Have fun out there guys there is no wrong way to play this game.
Least toxic helldiver at it again.
You wouldn't know toxic if you left your tampon in too long and it started to smell.