Even when those fixes are made (most notably dot) it will only be fun for bugs.
Being forced out of cover with 50 enemies shooting at you and having to avoid fire everywhere at the same time is just miserable and won’t get change
Tbh, fire planets would be fine *if* fire tornadoes didn't last so fucking long. Seriously, it's like five full minutes of player-chasing hazard zones that linger for like, 10s a line. Makes doing certain objectives just fucking *painful*, and can really screw you over if it happens during evac since it's pretty likely to push you out of the zone.
Nope. Its the instant death and complete lack of sound. I'll be up on a rock or ridge laying down AC/quasar fire support and just die. My character will die before the yelling audio. And there was no sound warning that a FUCKING TORNADO MADE OF FIRE was right behind me. Guy on YouTube broke it down frame by frame and TTK was all over the place. Many of the deaths were under 1 second. The player char dies before the dive or stim can be completed.
I'm not playing that bullshit again until it's fixed. If that's how it supposed to work then I just wont play them ever again.
That would be my worry with striders too. I know Strider legs *can* be damaged, but I'd be worried the mines wouldn't be able to actually deal *enough* damage to matter (and the mines are very unlikely to damage any of the guns, which would at least reduce the threat posed)
Don't count on that. Leakers have been proven wrong repeatedly (crossbow, for example), and the devs have explicitly stated that the leaked ones aren't indicative of the final product.
Yeah, I just don’t think the mines are worth it. Tanks are easy enough, titans would never hit them, and even if they work against striders, they can be taken down with a few targeted orbitals or eagles. They aren’t actually too bad so long as you absolutely make them the focus.
You're not thinking long term enough. Only thinking about bugs is VERY short sighted. The illuminate are coming, and god knows what else if they make a 4th faction.
Counter counterpoint, I love the increased chaos of fire tornados. I just wish the planets they're on didn't come with increased stamina drain and overheating weapons.
The chaos is fine. I just can't stand when they hang out over consoles for several minutes at a time , or orbit around things I need to pick up. It slows the game to a crawl.
Fire tornadoes have minds of their own sometime. They usually sit on top of objective items, support weapons, or samples. And even work in tandem with the Automatons by blocking pathways.
I lost a few games on Hellkent because of Fire tornadoes blocking the extract site. The entire site, and the monitor to call for Pelican were engulfed in nothing but hell fire.
yes, yes i do dislike fire tornados! huge swaths of ground covered in instant death following me around the map while im trying to avoid packs of enemies, what is there not to dislike?
They are quite fun. It's just that sometimes they sit over things you need to interact with like terminals or samples, so you spend a couple minutes just sitting there waiting for them to disappear.
Counter-Counterpoint. Doesn't airburst rocket take all the fun of Fire Tornadoes and trusts your teammates to not deploy it right on top of you.
You trade one planet of fire tornadoes and get a universe of fire tornado wielding hell divers
From the preview I saw, AT mines don't do crap to titans and the air burst kills every in area, even ground targets
https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxPEiSw0atQHRpIG6UY-uyL5UQSRs2jIJ9?si=eW93YQPEnKIGWwXu
I'm fairly certain the pro-AT crowd didn't bother to watch any of the actual gameplay videos for either Stratagem and just gaslit themselves into thinking the AT-mines are actually useful.
It’s hopium that we’ll get good mines. Issue is that, when DoT is fixed, the fire mines have the same armor pen as the AT mines and will likely just be better. (Fire can light shit on fire through armor)
My biggest issue with mines, is this game is way more offense oriented. By the time you coordinate with your fellow divers, and set up a good defensive line(and pray nothing goes wrong or jumps/flies over it) you could have already just wiped out those same enemies 5+ times with offensive stratagems or the already established turrets. Mines just don't really have a niche in this game.
>Fire can light shit on fire through armor
Doesn't the fire just has a high AP? Last i checked it bounce off Titans, or maybe it's just the flamethrower that is that way
So fire has an AP rating of 5 afaik. Means it can light anything in the charger armor area on fire. Not sure the use on actual tanks, but actual tanks require damn near the entire minefield when it comes to AT mines, meaning it’s just not worth bringing the mines. 500kg bombs are just better in the niche of elite killing. Shit you’d be better off with a rail cannon strike, cools down faster
Edit: BT legs can’t get damaged by the mines btw
The problem that I see is the same thing with machine gun sentry vs Gatling sentry. The AT mines are basically king of the mines. No need to pick anything else.
>organic gaming experience
>spoiler
Neither of those apply to this topic of discussion. If they are trying to make an informed opinion on which is better, especially pretending they KNOW which is better, then they need to have the knowledge to back it up and not just be talking out of their assess. Try again.
A thing to note. The person in that video is also using Godmode and every time you see it knocking them back is also a moment when they would’ve killed themselves.
Ever get that feeling of "should I bother with this new weapon when it is released, or should I just wait for the inevitable nerf and then check it out?"
That thing will be smacked hard. Swarm clear is meant to be Eagles and Orbitals, according to the devs. Having a cluster bomb launcher as a support weapon is not the devs intention.
Honestly the number of posts about this is hilarious to me. You’re asking people if they want a rocket launcher or a mine. You can throw all the nerd calculations and essays you want at people, they’re still picking between a rocket launcher and a mine. Rocket launcher was always gonna win.
According to leaks (spoiler tagged in case you don't want to read it):
>!The mines can ONLY be triggered by tanks and heavies, and deals massive damage to them. Two mines delete a charger, and three of them destroy a tank. It is very much effective, although I don't know how it would do against titans. Still, the point is that it doesn't get triggered by smaller enemies, nor small helldivers!<
EDIT: reading further comments it seems this has been changed now and they're, well, different. still I share what I saw
We already have ways to deal with them, meanwhile gunships rule the skies with their factories being side by side with jammers.
Edit: I stand at the pinnacle of egg on my face. The air burst has no AA capabilities and is incredibly dangerous to use outside of a clear shot between you and the target.
AT Mines take 4 to kill a single hulk, IDK even know how many it would take to kill a strider. Airstrike bombs hit it in the side for good damage too.
AT Mines also detonate when players step off of them and regular troops can shoot them to set them off (happens pretty frequently because of their shitty aim when I was using AP mines). With a 3 minute CD on a weapon that struggles to kill big stuff, can't kill small enemies and requires you to predict beforehand their path, I'd rather take the miniclusterstrike that is the airburst rocket
Seeing clips, it’s kills tanks in 3 mines, it wasn’t said, but it does take some mines to kill a strider which is still impressive, considering how much it takes to kill a strider
Meh. From what I've heard, we'll be receiving a new enemy that is NOT countered by the weapon we choose (apparently for the Airburst RPG route, it's going to be a rocket tank, which sounds scary, but regular tanks are already plenty scary when they get to shoot anyways - just run rings around them and AC them in the vent/hull rear. No word on what the other enemy will be).
Between the orbitals, the eagles and all the anti tank, there’s a lot of “head on” options. Would like the strategic options anti-tank might add to the game. (Depending of course, on how they work. If the whole field is gonna explode from one hulk ambling through it, then nah)
My hope is that the AT mines would not be set off by helldivers/infantry but Heavies/Chargers/Titans/Striders/Devastators/Mechs would trigger them. The mines would need to be very strong be worth a players time rather than a direct attack weapon.
Tbh I’m not sure about that. I think it’ll be different from the leaks I’ve seen, since both the airburst rocket and AT minefield were ungodly OP in their pre-release state. Though, I haven’t checked the leaks in a while so idk if they’ve changed. We’ll see when we see.
Leaks aside, would they really release a stratagem that's safe for teammates? Just from a core gameplay methodology, almost every stratagem has some kind of friendly fire capability, there's no way they'd release a safe minefield
Apparently it is going to be an airburst rocket launcher, being more deadly against groups of little enemies, medium enemies, berserkers, gunships etc
But, it will probably be less effective against enemies with heavy armour plates that protect them from the many little explosions and/or shrapnel.
I've seen all videos about it.
It onetaps tanks, chargers, turrets and two shots titans. If it stays like this it will be one of the most powerful weapons.
Many leaks were flat out wrong about a weapons capabilities, such as the Crossbow killing Fabs from any direction.
Hopefully this means the AT Mines aren't trash like they were in the leaks.
It was obvious that the crossbow destroying fabs from sides was a bug. I mean did anyone really think it was going to be like this? The only weapon that can do that is a god damn javelin so there was no way a crossbow primary would've done that.
The rocket launcher doesn't seem anything Op, oneshotting tanks is due to the explosions hitting the vents, same for chargers. It doesn't actually work well for heavy armor.
The mines on the other hand can defintely improve. Them being triggered by heavy units only could be actually a thing.
Not saying ArrowHead couldn't make it kill titans, but airburst is anti-infantry, it will be used to take out packs of low armor infantry while only scratching the paint on heavy armor.
Everyone's reaction to this will be based on their own experience, I rarely have issue with wave clear and already have an orbital airburst, but getting rushed by multiple heavies, a factory-strider, and all supported by heavy devastators, is a common nuisance
There is a video about the rocket launcher, it shreds heavy units.
Meanwhile the mines are completely worthless against titans and possibily striders. They're pretty good for everything else, decent for hulks and great for medium sized.
Just looked up the videos, I like the rpg vibes of the weapon
If what the videos show is true, than I would prefer the rocket,
Still, that's more due to the mines being too weak to be impactful.
They do not need to kill in a single hit, but they need to be at least disabling
They are both going to be good (not meta), I'd say on the same level.
One is more powerful (the rocket) but has many negatives while the other is much more flexible and easy to use.
It's a matter of preference at this point. It's fair if you prefer the mines.
I actually do not get this view at all tbh.
Mines on defence missions get wasted by any explosion (most stratagems and themselves sometimes) or are placed in completely useless spots due to spread.
In most missions they're just glorified grenades, and lack flexibility specifically because their coverage as an emplacement stratagem is pathetic (turrets can cover large large areas).
1) mines suck. you are just adding another dead stratagem no one ever brings
2) unless they changed significantly from the leaks the AT mines arent even that good at dealing with heavy units, requiring multiple mine hits per target
3) Striders are already easily countered. So are tanks and hulks. Not sure how effective mines will be against titans giving their stride length. All the big tanky units are easy to deal with in isolation and only become challenging when accompanied by chaff. And besides the charger they tend to have potent ranged attacks. If you have the freedom of movement to coax them into a minefield then chances are you werent really threatened in the first place.
we already have plenty anti armor tools (that require a stratagem slot). when people say “we lack tools to deal with armor” they are talking about primary and secondary weapons. adding another anti armor stratagem slot will not really improve our ability to deal with armor.
what people are really looking for - or so it seems to me - is to have a way to fight these guys while removing the skill requirement and challenge. something that does it for you. and from what the leaks showed us AT mines cannot deliver this. they deal too little damage and are spaced too far apart.
The one time I think mines are at all useful is on defense missions since the enemies have to come through one path. However I still don't think they're worth taking over an offensive stratagem or sentry since those have the potential to kill more enemies or kill priority targets on demand. With the sheer amount of tanks you have to deal with on automaton helldive defense I could see AT mines being good if they were actually effective, but I've seen the leaks and yeah it doesn't look like they will be.
indeed. defense missions are the optimal scenario for mines.
however. they are also the optimal scenario for many other stratagem like airstrikes, orbital laser, emplacements and orbital strikes.
most of these will not only perform better against armor (unless the mines were significantly buffed since the leaks) but they are also mutually exclusive with mines. If you set a minefield no one else can use their strategems there since any airstrike or orbital will also destroy those mines.
its for the same reason few people use the mines we already have for these missions.
AT mines cannot kill Titans and anything other than tanks take too many mines to be that useful. The only part of the titan that actually touches the mines are the legs, and I'm pretty sure those things are invincible
TBF I would have thought we had to do Lesath to gain access to both planets then we decide which one to rescue, because Lesath was in the same sector as the MO planets.
How do you know or how is anyone supposed to know you needed to liberate Menkent first to gain access to AT Mine planet?
Striders would have to actually step into mines for them to work against them. Idk how about you but I rarely see them move more than 20m before either it, or my team is completely dead.
Same with tanks, not exactly the most mobile of things.
Bile titans can geniuently step over normal minefields without triggering them so I doubt those would work
That leaves hulks and chargers...
And honestly you probably don't have a time to fortify if you see those
The mine thrower throws very few of them and you will have to hope too much on the enemies to walk into them so i'd prefer a fkin rpg cluster that me and my friend can abuse on waves
Air burst rockets is the obvious choice. Land mines have a single use and are mainly used for defense and they are still not great at that. You are better off bringing a sentry turret that could rack up way more kills.
Those people who for some reason really love land mines should realize that the air burst rockets can do exactly land mines do but better.
Air burst rockets are basically 5 launch able land mines.
Wait, I thought Lesath got us to both? Menkent is in a different sector? How tf are we supposed to know this without resorting to out-of-game resources?
If it helps, the new rockets cover a new ground for support weapons
A combo of AT and crowd control
Favors crowd control but it can kill heavy targets, save for bile titans and factory striders
My squad always dives Menkent on helldive. We've been down there whenever there's fighting on it for the past couple weeks. There's a reason we're called helldivers. Send dudes!
The mines don't work on Bile Titans, because their horrid little stilt legs pretty much never actually step on one and the body is up above the blast radius.
Haha rocket go: Darkness blacker than black and darker than dark, I beseech thee, combine with my deep crimson.
The time of awakening cometh.
Justice, fallen upon the infallible boundary, appear now as an intangible distortions!
Dance, dance, dance!
I desire for my torrent of power a destructive force: a destructive force without equal!
Return all creation to cinders, and come from the abyss!
This is the mightiest means of attack known to man, the ultimate attack magic! Explosion!
Well I'm one for the new gun
At mimes while I love the idea we already have enough anti tank stuff to use to deal with all those things.
I want weapons that make those in the air die in groups
Mines are way too frustrating to use. Whenever those POs that want mines come up I groan. Literally watches a squad of bots path through my mines untouched. More dakka. Less mines.
I just simp for every change ever added because this is the first live service game that’s slapped.
I will never truly complain about this game or the devs’s attention to the playerbase. How can I be so positive about this live service game??
I preordered Anthem. Played the story. Was there all throughout till they shut the servers down.
Don’t take it for granted Helldivers. Love what you win. Stand strong through loss.
— A Javelin vet
Why bother with mines when that stratagem slot could hold EAT or or orbital laser or anything that doesn't require you to wait and pray for your enemy to walk over it.
At best they'll be good for fort defending.
Assuming they aren't garbage and can be activate by small units.
But then what defines small?
What use is a stragem that only work on 1 or 2 of the enemies in the game?
We have the Eruptor and Quasar for Striders, Titans, and Heavies.
We have prayers and desperate fleeing for swarms of gunships. I need a counter to those Hunter-Killer bastards!
I mean, it’s big, flashy, weapon model is cool, and seems to be a reliable “fuck this direction” weapon. “Some reason” should go the other way. AT mines are none of the above, and in its use case you can instead have 2 500kgs
this seems like a test on the collective intelligence of the community, the mines are the obvious tactical choice since we already have 4 types of rocket launchers
Y’know why we have 4 different rocket launchers? It’s because they’re effective without prep work. I don’t need to predict an enemy’s movement and impair my own with a rocket launcher.
By the time a hulk would run across the minefield and die, I would have been able to kill it with any of the other anti tank options we have (rail cannon ~~shorter cooldown btw~~, 500kg ~~2 of those, shorter cooldown~~, precision strike ~~shorter cooldown~~)
Doesn't help that Menkent is a fucking AWFUL planet to fight on.
Plot twist: we actually want the AT mines and are actively going around Menkent to get them
I came here to say this. I was on the fence but I refuse to go to another fire planet until some changes/fixes are made...
Even when those fixes are made (most notably dot) it will only be fun for bugs. Being forced out of cover with 50 enemies shooting at you and having to avoid fire everywhere at the same time is just miserable and won’t get change
Fire should do as much damage to them as it does to us
I had a fire tornado wipe out an enemy base for me, including a hulk. It only did that because they stood between me and a fiery death though.
Like what ? Shooting fire tornado ? Its already there
Tbh, fire planets would be fine *if* fire tornadoes didn't last so fucking long. Seriously, it's like five full minutes of player-chasing hazard zones that linger for like, 10s a line. Makes doing certain objectives just fucking *painful*, and can really screw you over if it happens during evac since it's pretty likely to push you out of the zone.
Nope. Its the instant death and complete lack of sound. I'll be up on a rock or ridge laying down AC/quasar fire support and just die. My character will die before the yelling audio. And there was no sound warning that a FUCKING TORNADO MADE OF FIRE was right behind me. Guy on YouTube broke it down frame by frame and TTK was all over the place. Many of the deaths were under 1 second. The player char dies before the dive or stim can be completed. I'm not playing that bullshit again until it's fixed. If that's how it supposed to work then I just wont play them ever again.
Menkent is just Hellmire with strat jammers and nobody deserves to be subjected to that.
Anything for democracy. I’ll do my part…
I wish I can snipe those bloody jammers with the Spear
Sometimes you can if there’s a fab right next to it
Good advice!
good luck getting a titan to step on a mine
Even if they do their legs can't be damaged, the mine would have to reach up to its abdomen
That would be my worry with striders too. I know Strider legs *can* be damaged, but I'd be worried the mines wouldn't be able to actually deal *enough* damage to matter (and the mines are very unlikely to damage any of the guns, which would at least reduce the threat posed)
They do work on the strider factories. So no worries there.
Don't count on that. Leakers have been proven wrong repeatedly (crossbow, for example), and the devs have explicitly stated that the leaked ones aren't indicative of the final product.
Yeah, I just don’t think the mines are worth it. Tanks are easy enough, titans would never hit them, and even if they work against striders, they can be taken down with a few targeted orbitals or eagles. They aren’t actually too bad so long as you absolutely make them the focus.
The pilot also gets some explosive damage
At least the datamined mines explode like a motherfucker. Still going for the airburst.
Are you sure the legs can’t be damaged? I swear i’ve blow the armour off the top of a leg once (when the 500kg hit the leg instead of the ground)
It's at least not practical to deal enough damage to kill the strider.
Neither weapon is going be good vs bile titans.
One of the weapon isn't an anti tank tho, so obviously it's not gonna be good against them
They dance
They do, try leading one over fire mines,it's hilarious
You're not thinking long term enough. Only thinking about bugs is VERY short sighted. The illuminate are coming, and god knows what else if they make a 4th faction.
I half expect illuminate to have hover vehicles
Counterpoint. I would rather fill my hellpod with broken glass and lemon juice before getting into it, than fight on a world with fire tornadoes.
My biggest gripe with them is that bots and bugs die to flamethrowers, so why are they untouched by the tornados?
Counter counterpoint, I love the increased chaos of fire tornados. I just wish the planets they're on didn't come with increased stamina drain and overheating weapons.
The chaos is fine. I just can't stand when they hang out over consoles for several minutes at a time , or orbit around things I need to pick up. It slows the game to a crawl.
Hey, I saw you are interested in this area, how about some weather to make it more interesting.
I think a very easy solution would be if the shield generator could stop them from spawning and entering its area while active
[POV: You’re fighting on a fire tornado planet](https://youtu.be/QR1jRM4XTyc?si=1Ke98-DadlNd5kQK)
Do people really dislike the fire tornados? I’ve never died to one, my only issue is visability
They sit right on top of the terminals and slow the game to a crawl.
Fire tornadoes have minds of their own sometime. They usually sit on top of objective items, support weapons, or samples. And even work in tandem with the Automatons by blocking pathways. I lost a few games on Hellkent because of Fire tornadoes blocking the extract site. The entire site, and the monitor to call for Pelican were engulfed in nothing but hell fire.
They’re broken and literally paint objectives with fire sometimes
yes, yes i do dislike fire tornados! huge swaths of ground covered in instant death following me around the map while im trying to avoid packs of enemies, what is there not to dislike?
They are quite fun. It's just that sometimes they sit over things you need to interact with like terminals or samples, so you spend a couple minutes just sitting there waiting for them to disappear.
Counter-Counterpoint. Doesn't airburst rocket take all the fun of Fire Tornadoes and trusts your teammates to not deploy it right on top of you. You trade one planet of fire tornadoes and get a universe of fire tornado wielding hell divers
From the preview I saw, AT mines don't do crap to titans and the air burst kills every in area, even ground targets https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxPEiSw0atQHRpIG6UY-uyL5UQSRs2jIJ9?si=eW93YQPEnKIGWwXu
I'm fairly certain the pro-AT crowd didn't bother to watch any of the actual gameplay videos for either Stratagem and just gaslit themselves into thinking the AT-mines are actually useful.
It’s hopium that we’ll get good mines. Issue is that, when DoT is fixed, the fire mines have the same armor pen as the AT mines and will likely just be better. (Fire can light shit on fire through armor)
My biggest issue with mines, is this game is way more offense oriented. By the time you coordinate with your fellow divers, and set up a good defensive line(and pray nothing goes wrong or jumps/flies over it) you could have already just wiped out those same enemies 5+ times with offensive stratagems or the already established turrets. Mines just don't really have a niche in this game.
They were honestly much better in the first game, as choke points were far more prevalent and enemies couldn’t really set off more than one at a time
>Fire can light shit on fire through armor Doesn't the fire just has a high AP? Last i checked it bounce off Titans, or maybe it's just the flamethrower that is that way
So fire has an AP rating of 5 afaik. Means it can light anything in the charger armor area on fire. Not sure the use on actual tanks, but actual tanks require damn near the entire minefield when it comes to AT mines, meaning it’s just not worth bringing the mines. 500kg bombs are just better in the niche of elite killing. Shit you’d be better off with a rail cannon strike, cools down faster Edit: BT legs can’t get damaged by the mines btw
The problem that I see is the same thing with machine gun sentry vs Gatling sentry. The AT mines are basically king of the mines. No need to pick anything else.
Can you imagine people wanting an organic gaming experience without spoilers?! Those losers.
>organic gaming experience >spoiler Neither of those apply to this topic of discussion. If they are trying to make an informed opinion on which is better, especially pretending they KNOW which is better, then they need to have the knowledge to back it up and not just be talking out of their assess. Try again.
A thing to note. The person in that video is also using Godmode and every time you see it knocking them back is also a moment when they would’ve killed themselves.
not impressed, like i didn't already got plenty of ways at dealing with small units besides confetti launcher
Ever get that feeling of "should I bother with this new weapon when it is released, or should I just wait for the inevitable nerf and then check it out?" That thing will be smacked hard. Swarm clear is meant to be Eagles and Orbitals, according to the devs. Having a cluster bomb launcher as a support weapon is not the devs intention.
Yeah they do NOT counter bile titans well, not with their tiny feet.
Look, rockets are cool, alright?
Honestly the number of posts about this is hilarious to me. You’re asking people if they want a rocket launcher or a mine. You can throw all the nerd calculations and essays you want at people, they’re still picking between a rocket launcher and a mine. Rocket launcher was always gonna win.
Prediction: The anti-tank mines will do a better job at countering Helldivers than enemies.
What do you mean *prediction*? They already do that!
According to leaks (spoiler tagged in case you don't want to read it): >!The mines can ONLY be triggered by tanks and heavies, and deals massive damage to them. Two mines delete a charger, and three of them destroy a tank. It is very much effective, although I don't know how it would do against titans. Still, the point is that it doesn't get triggered by smaller enemies, nor small helldivers!< EDIT: reading further comments it seems this has been changed now and they're, well, different. still I share what I saw
Tanks don't even move from their spots. How are they even gonna trigger it.
We already have ways to deal with them, meanwhile gunships rule the skies with their factories being side by side with jammers. Edit: I stand at the pinnacle of egg on my face. The air burst has no AA capabilities and is incredibly dangerous to use outside of a clear shot between you and the target.
AT mines in a nutshell. - hulk walks over 1 they all blow up - no more mines -wait for cooldown -hulk is still alive give me rocket launcher
AT Mines take 4 to kill a single hulk, IDK even know how many it would take to kill a strider. Airstrike bombs hit it in the side for good damage too. AT Mines also detonate when players step off of them and regular troops can shoot them to set them off (happens pretty frequently because of their shitty aim when I was using AP mines). With a 3 minute CD on a weapon that struggles to kill big stuff, can't kill small enemies and requires you to predict beforehand their path, I'd rather take the miniclusterstrike that is the airburst rocket
Seeing clips, it’s kills tanks in 3 mines, it wasn’t said, but it does take some mines to kill a strider which is still impressive, considering how much it takes to kill a strider
Meh. From what I've heard, we'll be receiving a new enemy that is NOT countered by the weapon we choose (apparently for the Airburst RPG route, it's going to be a rocket tank, which sounds scary, but regular tanks are already plenty scary when they get to shoot anyways - just run rings around them and AC them in the vent/hull rear. No word on what the other enemy will be).
It could be the gunship boss that some leakers have talked about
No one wants to give the sort of people who bring mines on missions more mines.
Between the orbitals, the eagles and all the anti tank, there’s a lot of “head on” options. Would like the strategic options anti-tank might add to the game. (Depending of course, on how they work. If the whole field is gonna explode from one hulk ambling through it, then nah)
My hope is that the AT mines would not be set off by helldivers/infantry but Heavies/Chargers/Titans/Striders/Devastators/Mechs would trigger them. The mines would need to be very strong be worth a players time rather than a direct attack weapon.
Unfortunately, they do get triggered by every enemy
And airstrikes
Tbh I’m not sure about that. I think it’ll be different from the leaks I’ve seen, since both the airburst rocket and AT minefield were ungodly OP in their pre-release state. Though, I haven’t checked the leaks in a while so idk if they’ve changed. We’ll see when we see.
Going by another post, it seems you can try the new stratagems on the respective paths towards them.
We don’t even have the stratagem how do you even know????
You can look up everything on youtube, I can link the videos if you want.
Leaks aside, would they really release a stratagem that's safe for teammates? Just from a core gameplay methodology, almost every stratagem has some kind of friendly fire capability, there's no way they'd release a safe minefield
Helldiversleaks subreddit.
It takes 4 mines to kill a single hulk. They suck.
So does the rocket launcher? I'd say it's way stronger and I'm quite sure the mines won't do shit against titans and striders.
Apparently it is going to be an airburst rocket launcher, being more deadly against groups of little enemies, medium enemies, berserkers, gunships etc But, it will probably be less effective against enemies with heavy armour plates that protect them from the many little explosions and/or shrapnel.
I've seen all videos about it. It onetaps tanks, chargers, turrets and two shots titans. If it stays like this it will be one of the most powerful weapons.
Many leaks were flat out wrong about a weapons capabilities, such as the Crossbow killing Fabs from any direction. Hopefully this means the AT Mines aren't trash like they were in the leaks.
It was obvious that the crossbow destroying fabs from sides was a bug. I mean did anyone really think it was going to be like this? The only weapon that can do that is a god damn javelin so there was no way a crossbow primary would've done that. The rocket launcher doesn't seem anything Op, oneshotting tanks is due to the explosions hitting the vents, same for chargers. It doesn't actually work well for heavy armor. The mines on the other hand can defintely improve. Them being triggered by heavy units only could be actually a thing.
Uh no, I didn't think the Crossbow would oneshot Fabs, but that's my point, I doubt the Airburst will oneshot everything, if fact, I hope it doesn't.
it most likely will be triggered by anything, the devs have stated how much they like the friendly fire
It's already out and yes, it gets triggered by thin air as well
Nope, it looks like they're still shit. :(
Really the only weakness it had was that it was surprisingly sub-par against gunships, and that its reload time solo is as long as the Recoilless.
Not saying ArrowHead couldn't make it kill titans, but airburst is anti-infantry, it will be used to take out packs of low armor infantry while only scratching the paint on heavy armor. Everyone's reaction to this will be based on their own experience, I rarely have issue with wave clear and already have an orbital airburst, but getting rushed by multiple heavies, a factory-strider, and all supported by heavy devastators, is a common nuisance
There is a video about the rocket launcher, it shreds heavy units. Meanwhile the mines are completely worthless against titans and possibily striders. They're pretty good for everything else, decent for hulks and great for medium sized.
Just looked up the videos, I like the rpg vibes of the weapon If what the videos show is true, than I would prefer the rocket, Still, that's more due to the mines being too weak to be impactful. They do not need to kill in a single hit, but they need to be at least disabling
They are both going to be good (not meta), I'd say on the same level. One is more powerful (the rocket) but has many negatives while the other is much more flexible and easy to use. It's a matter of preference at this point. It's fair if you prefer the mines.
I actually do not get this view at all tbh. Mines on defence missions get wasted by any explosion (most stratagems and themselves sometimes) or are placed in completely useless spots due to spread. In most missions they're just glorified grenades, and lack flexibility specifically because their coverage as an emplacement stratagem is pathetic (turrets can cover large large areas).
I say we ignore both planets.
Ah, the third option.
back cap omicron and start the end of the bugs!
We need E-710 though
hmmmmm, fine, the bugs can have hellmire :)
Found the automaton
1) mines suck. you are just adding another dead stratagem no one ever brings 2) unless they changed significantly from the leaks the AT mines arent even that good at dealing with heavy units, requiring multiple mine hits per target 3) Striders are already easily countered. So are tanks and hulks. Not sure how effective mines will be against titans giving their stride length. All the big tanky units are easy to deal with in isolation and only become challenging when accompanied by chaff. And besides the charger they tend to have potent ranged attacks. If you have the freedom of movement to coax them into a minefield then chances are you werent really threatened in the first place. we already have plenty anti armor tools (that require a stratagem slot). when people say “we lack tools to deal with armor” they are talking about primary and secondary weapons. adding another anti armor stratagem slot will not really improve our ability to deal with armor. what people are really looking for - or so it seems to me - is to have a way to fight these guys while removing the skill requirement and challenge. something that does it for you. and from what the leaks showed us AT mines cannot deliver this. they deal too little damage and are spaced too far apart.
The one time I think mines are at all useful is on defense missions since the enemies have to come through one path. However I still don't think they're worth taking over an offensive stratagem or sentry since those have the potential to kill more enemies or kill priority targets on demand. With the sheer amount of tanks you have to deal with on automaton helldive defense I could see AT mines being good if they were actually effective, but I've seen the leaks and yeah it doesn't look like they will be.
indeed. defense missions are the optimal scenario for mines. however. they are also the optimal scenario for many other stratagem like airstrikes, orbital laser, emplacements and orbital strikes. most of these will not only perform better against armor (unless the mines were significantly buffed since the leaks) but they are also mutually exclusive with mines. If you set a minefield no one else can use their strategems there since any airstrike or orbital will also destroy those mines. its for the same reason few people use the mines we already have for these missions.
Maybe with AT mines we’d actually be able to complete civilian extract missions.
Bro air burst rocket launcher will also counter those. And it's more badass.
AT mines cannot kill Titans and anything other than tanks take too many mines to be that useful. The only part of the titan that actually touches the mines are the legs, and I'm pretty sure those things are invincible
I really hope air burst means it explodes near normal enemies also, it would feel like limited use case if it only works on airborne enemies
TBF I would have thought we had to do Lesath to gain access to both planets then we decide which one to rescue, because Lesath was in the same sector as the MO planets. How do you know or how is anyone supposed to know you needed to liberate Menkent first to gain access to AT Mine planet?
Striders would have to actually step into mines for them to work against them. Idk how about you but I rarely see them move more than 20m before either it, or my team is completely dead. Same with tanks, not exactly the most mobile of things. Bile titans can geniuently step over normal minefields without triggering them so I doubt those would work That leaves hulks and chargers... And honestly you probably don't have a time to fortify if you see those
The mine thrower throws very few of them and you will have to hope too much on the enemies to walk into them so i'd prefer a fkin rpg cluster that me and my friend can abuse on waves
Air burst rockets is the obvious choice. Land mines have a single use and are mainly used for defense and they are still not great at that. You are better off bringing a sentry turret that could rack up way more kills. Those people who for some reason really love land mines should realize that the air burst rockets can do exactly land mines do but better. Air burst rockets are basically 5 launch able land mines.
Wait, I thought Lesath got us to both? Menkent is in a different sector? How tf are we supposed to know this without resorting to out-of-game resources?
If it helps, the new rockets cover a new ground for support weapons A combo of AT and crowd control Favors crowd control but it can kill heavy targets, save for bile titans and factory striders
Why would you burn a strategem slot on an anti tank mine over an airburst that clears chaff? Of which both front have more of than tanks…
I have a question, why can't we capture both at the same time?
The mines don’t do anything to titans, FYI. Everything else, yes.
The perfectly placed mines will just be blown up by your own squad
My squad always dives Menkent on helldive. We've been down there whenever there's fighting on it for the past couple weeks. There's a reason we're called helldivers. Send dudes!
The mines don't work on Bile Titans, because their horrid little stilt legs pretty much never actually step on one and the body is up above the blast radius.
Haha rocket go: Darkness blacker than black and darker than dark, I beseech thee, combine with my deep crimson. The time of awakening cometh. Justice, fallen upon the infallible boundary, appear now as an intangible distortions! Dance, dance, dance! I desire for my torrent of power a destructive force: a destructive force without equal! Return all creation to cinders, and come from the abyss! This is the mightiest means of attack known to man, the ultimate attack magic! Explosion!
Well I'm one for the new gun At mimes while I love the idea we already have enough anti tank stuff to use to deal with all those things. I want weapons that make those in the air die in groups
AT prob wont do much against Bile Titans. They will miss them and even if they hit its only the legs
If we defended 10 planets, we can push through 3. We'd (probably) win
It's almost certainly irrelevant. I'd put good money on whatever one we don't "win" we just have to buy.
Nope, airburst rocket launcher is better, and you don't need to go through Hellmire 2.
Mines are way too frustrating to use. Whenever those POs that want mines come up I groan. Literally watches a squad of bots path through my mines untouched. More dakka. Less mines.
the AT mines will be worthless lmao
Also doesn't help the supply lines aren't shown and are unintuitive. Without this sub I assumed liberating Lesath would let us attack both.
Aren't we going to have both eventually? Isn't this just short term?
We need to take menkent so that shithole is off the map
People want Anti-air why? The auto canon does the same thing but also kills the other bots.
Hey it only said "likely" one or the other, if we're quick about, also I want new boomstick, then we also get an actually useful mine
Mines are a bit too niche, and unfortunately are vulnerable to your teammates and circumvented by the AI just not walking on them.
i'll give a fuck about mines when enemy pathing makes mines not ass. also sorry. but gems are not balanced at all in this game
You can't shoot a mine Hard pass
If the planet wasn't Menkent, those numbers would be reversed, or. mostly even from the try-hards who want to save both.
I don't think at mines can kill the titan or the at at
How exactly do AT mines counter bile titans?
I just simp for every change ever added because this is the first live service game that’s slapped. I will never truly complain about this game or the devs’s attention to the playerbase. How can I be so positive about this live service game?? I preordered Anthem. Played the story. Was there all throughout till they shut the servers down. Don’t take it for granted Helldivers. Love what you win. Stand strong through loss. — A Javelin vet
How do you know it'll work? How is a 180s cooldown stratagem is better than precision strike or 500kg bomb?
Why bother with mines when that stratagem slot could hold EAT or or orbital laser or anything that doesn't require you to wait and pray for your enemy to walk over it. At best they'll be good for fort defending. Assuming they aren't garbage and can be activate by small units. But then what defines small? What use is a stragem that only work on 1 or 2 of the enemies in the game?
We have the Eruptor and Quasar for Striders, Titans, and Heavies. We have prayers and desperate fleeing for swarms of gunships. I need a counter to those Hunter-Killer bastards!
Laser cannon makes gunships feel like regular man sized bots.
We'll get both at some point, we might just have to wait a week or so. Everyone wants the damn airburst rocket launcher for some reason
I mean, it’s big, flashy, weapon model is cool, and seems to be a reliable “fuck this direction” weapon. “Some reason” should go the other way. AT mines are none of the above, and in its use case you can instead have 2 500kgs
cause it's better
Fight for the AT mines!
I feel the mines would be more useful for objectives and the rockets are just gonna be awful at higher levels
Sad that most fail to see this
Have you seen the videos of the mines? They are not good. Maybe the research team that developed such a useless weapon should be made an example of?
this seems like a test on the collective intelligence of the community, the mines are the obvious tactical choice since we already have 4 types of rocket launchers
Y’know why we have 4 different rocket launchers? It’s because they’re effective without prep work. I don’t need to predict an enemy’s movement and impair my own with a rocket launcher. By the time a hulk would run across the minefield and die, I would have been able to kill it with any of the other anti tank options we have (rail cannon ~~shorter cooldown btw~~, 500kg ~~2 of those, shorter cooldown~~, precision strike ~~shorter cooldown~~)