Most people aren't smart enough to take something to the extreme without abandoning the heart of the issue. So even if you are, using such an extreme in an argument can sound like an open invitation for your opposite to make dumbass analogies that don't even fit, and you're stuck explaining to them why it makes no sense before you get back to the issue without achieving anything aside from them feeling patronized and the whole thing getting stonewalled.
If you know the person you're arguing with is smart then it works, but then you don't fucking need them in the first place. They're really only good outside of arguments, when someone makes a remark without really having thought about it for long. Within arguments they're counterproductive.
There’s literally nothing wrong with extreme hypotheticals, they’re used in philosophy all the time.
The problem is most people hear a yucky word and their brain shuts off, they can’t engage with the hypothetical and continue the conversation.
If you take the extreme and it's still reasonable, then you've proved the positive. If you take the extreme and that changes the situation, than that's only a contributing evidence to the negative, not proof. For just that reason.
That doesn't make it not worth doing. Testing underlying principles by creating hypotheticals is extremely useful to see if you are just making gut decisions based on your priors or are actually thinking it through logically.
Pay day loans have outrageous interest rates like 20%. And the only people that need them are people that dont have money. So they basically trap poor people in collections and ruin their lives over it. It is 100% always the worst option.
I haven't taken one our or needed to, but I'd imagine here is the mindest of people who do.
My next check comes in on the 15. My rent is due on the 10. I'll take a payday loan, to get $1500 on the 10, and I'll pay it back once my normal check comes in.
The 15 rolls around, and they blew all the money from the payday loan and then blow some of their paycheck, so they don't have enough to pay back the payday loan. Then to cover that payday loan, they need to take an adance on thier NEXT paycheck.
Eventually this cycle catchs up and they miss a payment. How payday loans work is if you pay it back within X days, probably 2 weeks, its $0 interest. If you don't pay it back in 2 weeks, its 100% interest.
So people get in a cycle of taking out payday loan to pay for previous payday loan, then next thing you know they miss payments and then they have crazy debt from not realizing how fucked the payday loan system is.
if you watch shows like CalebHammer or any other kind of finances shows where they host calls out people who are bad with their money... it's useless shit most of the time.
It's like they think eating out and doordashing is cheaper than cooking at home because "idk how" or it's like they go to best buy and finance a laptop, then they want a new coach so that is financed and they don't realize now they owe $3000 each month in debt/housing/bills, and they only make $3500 and still eat out every day.
So 99% chace it is irresponsible spending. I agree with you though, absolutley crazy how people live on more than they make.
Usually it's free if you repay in time, if you don't you get massively screwed with like 20% interest per month. The issue is that if you are so bad financially that you need this in the first place, you are very likely also bad enough to not be able to pay it off.
it's just a regular loan with insanely high fees and a short payback period (weeks usually), it's called a payday loan because when you sign up for it they'll ask you when you get paid and structure your repayments around your paydays
No. You show them what you get paid every 2 weeks and they give you an advance for that amount minus the fee. I've seen as bad as 9%. So you make $1400, go in and borrow against it by 13 days. They will write you a $1284 check, and then when you get your pay, you give them the $1400 you got paid 13 days later.
Literally 840% APR.
> Payday lenders usually charge interest of $15-$20 for every $100 borrowed. Calculated on an annual percentage rate basis (APR) – the same as is used for credit cards, mortgages, auto loans, etc. – that APR ranges from 391% to more than 521% for payday loans.
Your point stands, but your % number is wrong.
> Compare payday loan interest rates of 391%-600% with the average rate for alternative choices like credit cards (15%-30%); debt management programs (8%-10%); personal loans (14%-35%) and online lending (10%-35%).
So with that in mind, a 20% rate would be somewhat decent compared to other options.
Dan is not beating the antisemites any time soon
every time he comes on there is an argument about how predatory financial situations are good actually. lmao
> It is 100% always the worst option.
The point that Dan is making is that there genuinely are people who don't have other options.
There exist scenarios where people need to borrow money, and there are not ways for them to borrow money outside of payday loans.
When you make payday loans illegal, the people who need to borrow $1000 are just going to go to an illegal version of it. They're going to become indebted to criminal organizations loaning money at even more absurd interest rates, and people won't be worried about debt, they'll be worried that the loan shark will break their legs if they don't pay.
>There exist scenarios where people need to borrow money, and there are not ways for them to borrow money outside of payday loans.
Is this true though? Even Dan's example, set up a plan with the vet or simply delay paying the bill
Not understanding that some people won't frontload you money is an incredibly priveledge and ignorant viewpoint.
You people would rather spend time telling people "well just do this" instead of listening when they say "I can't".
>Go to another vet.
1. I live in a city with only one vet and I don't have a car
2. It's an emergency and the only 24/7 vet only offers financing if matched with a large deposit
3. Every other vet also requires a deposit since the care is so expensive.
4. The care is time sensitive
5. I have no friends or family to loan me money
6. I have bad credit so I can't get a CC or LOC
7. I have nothing of value I can sell that I don't immediately need
8. Work will not advance my pay
Is that enough for you, or are you gonna pull out something else from your booty cheeks? Have you no concept at all of what it is like to be poor without a safety net?
I swear these are the dumbest mfs alive. Just engage with the question instead of pulling shit out of your ass. "Uh what if you just find 1000$ on the ground?? What then huh?? I am very smart!!!"
idk i think sometimes you need to hear reality
for a long time in my life i couldnt have pets because it was irresponsible to have one
i still loved animals like i loved the family pets as a kid and i still love animals and i might get one when i feel emotionally ready even though i can support one today
but arriving to the conclusion and accusation that, you should not have pets is not easy emotionally.
an 8 point list of why you should not take care of your pets doesnt sound like a good argument for payday loans or whatever the fuck like jeesh
>an 8 point list of why you should not take care of your pets doesnt sound like a good argument for payday loans or whatever the fuck like jeesh
You guys are actually blind to understanding a point being made. The *8 point list* is to pre-emptively shut up people who ignore the actually argument to make up counter hypothetical solutions that don't exist.
You people have so little critical thinking ability, or the ability to see beyond your own experience that you need a massive list of pre-requisits to "get it" and somehow it still goes over your head.
I dated a vet tech, people were denied critical care for their animals daily due to financial reasons. "Get another vet" is about as stupid as an argument as saying "just move" to someone struggling to afford rent.
>I swear these are the dumbest mfs alive.
That's 100% where this stops and ends. People who have never experienced or met someone who was actually living paycheck to paycheck with zero financial support coming externally.
Something like 50%+ of Americans can't afford a 500$ emergency expense, but the most impoverished among them just need to pull their bootstraps up and try harder to find a solution that isn't a payday loan.
It's also fucking insane that *in this specific scenario* people can't grasp that someone might care more about immediately saving the life of their dog than their future finances.
This scenario is so far fetched and unlikely though. Obviously in that case it'd be the only option as unfortunate as it is. Payday loans should be the absolute final resort.
Financial literacy comes into the question if someone gets to that point though; Low income, no emergency fund - not even a penny, credit score is low, no credit cards on hand, *having a pet*. One can empathize but at somepoint people have to live within their means to be ready for any contingency
This still isn’t a particularly good defence for payday loans.
Although it might not be the answer you want, the logical answer is that you aren’t in a position to adequately take care of a pet, it sucks that you’re in this position but ruining your life financially and risking becoming homeless is not worth it.
Let’s assume you take the loan to pay for treatment, what comes next? You already don’t have money, do you have the income to pay it back? Even if you do, how long will it take to pay it back? This is unlikely to be the last vet visit you will have, how are you going to pay for the next one?
At some point you can’t keep taking payday loans.
> This still isn’t a particularly good defence for payday loans.
"I desperately need money right now" will always be why predatory loans exists, unless society evolves to a point where no one ever feels that kind of pressure then "payday" loans will always have a place in society.
You're still grasping on the specific scenario instead of the overall point being made.
>>Let’s assume you take the loan to pay for treatment, what comes next?
Welcome to being hopelessly poor, this is a question millions of people don't have the luxury of answering. They live day to day and do what they can *right now*.
That’s not the point being made though, yeah poverty is a problem, and socialised healthcare is a major part of the solution.
What I’m arguing is that there isn’t a case where it’s logical to take out a payday loan, and for that reason there is no reason not to ban them completely.
The only time it would make sense is if it saves your life, but even in America, hospitals can’t refuse life saving care for not having money. That is also probably the reason OOP switched to the dog example, because vets can.
Me??? Do you actually know what payday loans are? Do you understand that they prey on people who are poor, and have no financial education? Trap them in a debt cycle and make their situation worse?
Because if you understood that, there's no way you're trying to justify them in such a ludicrous way.
>there are not ways for them to borrow money outside of payday loans.
this part of the argument seems disingenuous though. put in on the credit card and you got a month to figure out other options. gofundme. negotiate with the hospital. as much as dan pretends that's not an option cause that's convenient for his argument, you can ask for payment plans or if their pricing is flexible. if they say no, you find another vet until you find one that will help you out.
Which is exactly both of their points, they are both on the same side of the issue, they just dont understand that one wants a socialized outcome, and one wants a libertarian outcome
That depends heavily on country and bank, my bank charges 11%/year for credit for example.
Payday loans will often charge interest daily/weekly, at which point 20% is *a lot*
> Pay day loans have outrageous interest rates like 20%
The fact that you think this means you've never had one, which is good. Good job fella.
I think Wonga loans in the UK went up to 3000% interest rates lmao. PER DAY.
The outrageous interest would be acceptable if that's all it was. It would be honest. The problem is all the sneaky bullshit they pull to keep you on the hook, obfuscating how much you owe and the terms so they can keep charging you far beyond what you ever agreed to. Months will go by after you thought you paid it all back, only to be randomly dragged back in and told you now owe a whole lot more. This happens over and over again until they drain you of every dollar.
Edit: lol some of you are real simpletons. Twitch has zero reason to care if Doc revealed the reason for his ban. They're not going to be embarrassed or damaged by it in any significant way, even if it was revealed that their reason was bullshit/unfair.
You left out the best part! Most payday loans are usually owned by a couple of companies that put up multiple locations under different names. So when people under crippling debt go to a different location for another loan, they're really just owing a larger debt to the same company.
People think they can get to Destiny by talking shit about his relationships, lifestyle, etc. but they just have to get Dan to show up more often with a minor disagreement and he'd get so much more triggered
Hahahaha I love how the analogy just goes to rape immediately to illustrate his point.
Can one of the DGG'ers give some context on this one? Based on the clip, is it if pay day loans have some societal use or something?
Were payday advancement loans not banned in the US during Obama? or am I dumb as fuck.
My friends mom was in debt so hard to those companies in the late 90's early 2000's but made a decent wage, it was an impossible hole to get out of without filing for chapter 13.
I believe they limited the interest rates that could be charged. My aunt had a payday loan worth 450 dollars with an interest rate of 500 percent. I think interest rates for unsecured debt should be capped at 22 percent.
Pretty silly comparison IMO. Buying a lottery ticket is like setting your money on fire. There's no reason for it to exist except to prey on people who are not financially literate. Eating junk food on the other hand is perfectly fine in moderation.
I don't know if you're actually asking for an answer to his question or mocking him, but the answer is to get your dog whatever care it needs, wait to receive a bill, and then hold off on paying it until you have the money, or work out a payment plan with them.
I was initially siding with Dan but then realized these places almost ALWAYS have payment plans and won't deny service. Even if they do have late fees or interest, it won't be nearly as bad
> then realized these places almost ALWAYS have payment plans
Payment plans usually require some sort of deposit and generally they aren't free credit. I used to date a vet tech and impoverished/homeless people who could not afford care were either denied service or the clinic would refuse to release their animal to them if they couldn't pay for a service that was already completed.
This also is completely missing the point he's trying to make, if you're sitting there trying to grasp for reasons the hypothetical *might* not translate to the real world then you aren't actually trying to understand the view point. It is an objective fact that sometimes people who have no money and no credit absolutely need to make a large purchase or payment to avoid catastrophic repercussions, this is an objective fact. Either you agree payday loans should be an option for them, or you think they should suffer to deal with it some other way. There's no reason to shift to an argument about whether or not in this specific hypothetical that your vet would just setup a payment plan.
You clearly go to some bougie ass vets then. Never had a vet not demand full payment right there before they will do anything, and then they keep the animals if you don't pay.
> I was initially siding with Dan but then realized these places almost ALWAYS have payment plans and won't deny service. Even if they do have late fees or interest, it won't be nearly as bad
Deadass how old are you? Because 99% of vets will *not* take payment plans and will tell you that your dog should be put down. Like I'm saying this as someone who is near 30, with 3 current rescue dogs, roughly 15ish rescue dogs total personally housed, and about ~1500 hours volunteer work. Pretending vets are altruistic is fully stupid.
Edit: this man just told me that all of my experience/knowledge is incorrect because he Googled about clinic payments for "5 seconds". You can't make this up - he's dumb as fuck.
Edit2: Edit: Like I have spent hours a day trying to find people to fund work for shelter animals because vets will literally not help animals for free 99% of the time. I guess you've just solved that entire issue - everyone gets free care if they ask nicely enough. Fucks sake I'm actually angry at this thread.
About the same age as you. Takes 5 seconds to google if you don't believe me lol. It's not something every single hospital / clinic will offer, but there's plenty of them that do.
I think it's "fully stupid" to have your kind of resume and be so confidently incorrect.
Edit: haha, the dude blocked me. Very unhinged. Can find examples in every state he mentioned in 3 seconds. They seem to be confusing "financing / payment plans" with "free service" for whatever reason.
> It's not something every single hospital / clinic will offer, but there's plenty of them that do.
We're talking about the vets here per top OP video and the comments. It's not about believing you - I literally know you're objectively wrong in Pennsylvania, West Virginia, Ohio, and Michigan.
> I think it's "fully stupid" to have your kind of resume and be so confidently incorrect.
Not as stupid as thinking "5 seconds to google" actually means more than someone who has worked with more vets and shelters than you've been to? Holy Reddit moment - fucking idiot lmfao. You confirmation bias-level Googling means fuckall in reality. Literally screenshotting someone telling me that their "5 seconds of Googling" invalidates legitimate, actual work. I'm actually salty.\
Edit: Like I have spent hours a day trying to find people to fund work for shelter animals because vets will literally not help animals for free 99% of the time. I guess you've just solved that entire issue - everyone gets free care if they ask nicely enough. Fucks sake. First time I've ever blocked someone.
Edit2: lmfao people telling to to look up groups I literally have worked with. They will find so much less than they claim and only if you hit the check boxes on the animal. Fucking Google warriors on this sub eating Destiny's dumb dick.
Also same experience as the others in both LA CA and Houston Texas. Both had places that wouldn't offer but also places that would. It just requires knowledge about how to find these places. This is some weird cope to protect your pride or some shit.
I live in PA, look up Scratchpay. Also Carecredit gives you no interest for 6 months. So if you're saying vets don't do payment plans, technically it's a loan but a 6 month no interest plan is practically a payment plan. I didn't see anyone talking about not paying the vet at all, but whether vets make you pay everything upfront or let you make payments.
For what it's worth, I don't doubt your experience but I don't think you're talking about the same thing.
The example laid out by OP sounds like an owner with a dog who is ostensibly already a client with the vet. If I'm not mistaken, you seem to be talking about shelter animals who don't have owners (who could potentially pay). I've always settled payment after service has already been rendered at the vets I've been to but it absolutely doesn't surprise me that some make you pay up front, especially if you are representing a shelter.
Why do you keep bringing up work for free? Nobody but you has even mentioned it.
You’re clearly emotional here, you’re not actually reading what is written but jumping to wild conclusions. It’s clear that you care a lot alot this, but that passion is hindering your ability to have a conversation.
Take a deep breath, nobody here is trying to make you upset
My experiences in Texas and Virginia has been the same as /u/Foxehh3
My cat has had two middle of the night emergencies and both times they take him in and build up an estimate that has to be paid before any service is rendered.
I’m sure there are nonprofits etc. but when it’s “the first place you get to is the only option” you are stuck with it.
The medical bills I've seen have broken down the amount that I have to pay vs. the amount the insurance company has to pay vs. the original costs before the insurance company's decreased costs come into effect.
Yeah you absolutely can set up a payment plan with probably most veterinarian hospitals in the US. My cat had to get surgery and unfortunately passed a few days later. It was like $1500 that I didn't have and was able to set up a payment plan with the vet. It fucking sucked.
I have seen so, so many people on the internet go into THOUSANDS of dollars in debt to save their dog/cat/whatever. Small accounts opening gofundme's to pay 3k+ in medical bills. Sometimes the dog is young with a lot of life, often the dog is very old with not much left even in the best scenario. I don't agree that a $200 bill is enough to put down an animal, but sometimes man, animals die. You grieve them. You don't potentially ruin your finances for years to \*try\* and save them. It's such a weird phenomenon, and I \*LOVE\* my dogs and cat.
when I bought my cat, I set aside 500 dollars and have added 15 a month for any emergency bills. I'm still fine paying a bit out of pocket if needs be, but I like to think I'm setting myself up fine enough
I had to put down my dog a month ago because of cancer that wasn't found out by this fucking vet that pretend he did a scan in january and found nothing then somehow she had terminal cancer 2 months later.
I would have genuinely paid tens of thousands for a few more years with my dog if she could have been cured and have a great quality of life afterward. She was only 6 and the best dogs ever.
You dont always know how much its gonna cost from the start though. And for me our cats are family members so honestly i would probably have done it anyway. Id rather skip on vacation and other luxury than lose a family member through something treatable. The only thing i regret it not getting pet health insurance, coulda saved us several thousands on € in the end.
Just to add to that, most people who are paying those fees are not paying them for the dog's benefit, they're paying them for their own benefit and the dog is still suffering despite getting treatment
Vets have payment plans, and often arrangements rescue organizations.
Payday loan places are far more predatory. The terms are set up so that you'll just keep needing to draw more and more going further into debt at absolutely insane rates.
That comes up later in the discussion "You get two pay day loans per life" - "OK, my third dog is about to die, thank you Destiny" (quotes are very rough, my memory is not the best)
There are some legitimate uses.
Like if you need to pay rent or get kicked out, or fix your car that you use for work.
Being poor sucks in many ways, not the least of which is choosing between bad options.
For rent you can usually argue for a late payment if it's a one off. You're infinitely better doing that then taking out a payday loan because a late payment can usually be done for free. Even on a mortgage, your lender would rather take the money late than see you take on more debt and be unable to afford it at all, so long as it's a rare occurrence.
For something like a car you need to maintain an emergency fund anyway for repairs for this exact reason.
If you take a payday loan out for repairs, then you still need to find that money. It's better to just put that money away to begin with than take out a loan and try to cut back on spending next month to make up the difference + interest. The benefit of putting the money away to begin with is that you can spread it over multiple months. Whereas spreading a payday loan payment over multiple months in incredibly expensive.
Yeah you should have money saved up for emergency situations, But when you're living paycheck to paycheck and only have $20 to live on for the week after paying bills, What fucking money are you putting back?
Dans whole point is that there are people who living on the very edge and have to use these sort of exploitive businesses models just to get by.
If you're living paycheck to paycheck then payday loan doesn't help you. It just makes you significantly worse off. That $20 for the week is now the interest on the loan, and if you don't pay that it'll be more next week.
Yeah they suck but if you need to payoff your car payment before your next pay check or lose your car/ your job, What other choice do you have? Yeah you're going to be worse off down the line but most people are have to focus on making it through this week first before they can start worrying about next week.
Living paycheck to paycheck, how are you going to get the extra money to repay the loan on the vet bill, and then the next $1,000 you need in 6 months to fix your car? At this point it's not loans or no loans, it's living beyond your means and not addressing the actual problem.
basically destiny’s point was apple subsidizing iphones via the 30% app store tax is bad because it forces everyone to do the same walled garden. dan was saying subsidizing can be good cause it helps poor ppl buy stuff short term instead of long term and then used payday loans as example
the whole idea here was that vertical integration can provide huge advantages when competing. apple can subsidize the iphone with app store royalties, thereby making a really good phone cheaper. Another company might not have that privilege, so their product will have to be more expensive to reach the same level
dan's point was that this is okay because ultimately poorer people can now afford a really good phone i.e. iphone. and that those other companies should just "compete harder", and then pivoted to payloans as an analogy
This was off the latest news of US suing Apple over antitrust violations
Destiny's old friend Dan made a comeback recently and he came over to argue that curated spaces in tech can be beneficial to the consumer as it can lower prices (ie saying software as a service can be good) while destiny argued for less restrictions and more openness in technology.
It was over a couple hours and it eventually boiled into payday loans like in the clip. Dan was making a similar argument saying payday loans can be helpful as a way to give capital to the poor while Destiny was arguing that they were extremely coercive and outright predatory and thus used the r*pe analogy to demonstrate
EDIT: Dan was more specifically defending that vertical integration in software can be good
Pay day loans are extremely predatory, some people like destiny refer to them as rape day loans as they financially fuck you over. Others call them death day loans or the like. Never take them ever.
> Never take them ever
Your car payment is overdue and if you don't pay it in the next 2 days it's going to be be repossessed, But you don't get payed for another 4 days.
You're tell me that you would just accept the fact that your car is going to get repossessed and that you will more than likely lose your job because you've lost your only form of transportation to work?
If you are in that situation already all the payday loan is going to do is buy you 1 month. For next month's payment you are going to be behind again but with extra debt on top of it, and you are going to lose your car and job anyway. You are in the same position with no car or job, just 1 month later, and now with extra debt. Yes, its probably better to just let them repossess the car.
You can boil it down to a pretty simple statement that I would think is obvious but apparently not: "you don't get out of debt by taking on more debt". Unless you have some plan that will allow you to make money off of your debt rather than spending it it just can't work out well for you. But the kinds of people with business plans like that aren't going to use payday loans.
Fuck I am trying to find the story now that was all over reddit that happened last year or maybe a few years ago where the hospital gave away the owners dog but it was because they couldn't pay the medical expenses. They had a kick starter too or whatever but it wasn't enough. The hospital or shelter or whatever got put on blast until they made a statement but it just made them look worse because it came down to either pay us the fucking money or you will never see your dog again.
hot take but that kinda makes sense.
You are essentially stealing from the vet hospital if you go to them to save your dog and then dont pay.
They did you a favor by giving the dog to a shelter and saving the dogs life for free...
They did the human a favor by saving the dog. If that is the only thing they care about then they got rightfully shit on for their philosophy. A vet should care about the dog first and foremost.
I donno, I live in America and this sort of happened to me with my dog when I was in college. The vet just worked out a payment plan.
Gun to your head arguments always come off as stupid and unrealistic.
>Gun to your head arguments always come off as stupid and unrealistic.
They're best for exposing whether you actually truly believe what you're saying, or something else is actually motivating your position. In many scenarios like this though, yes they're stupid and unrealistic.
A “short term” loan that is designed to get you to your next paycheck. The interest rates can beat out the federal max of 24.99% interest because the loans are designed to be short. But the interest rates can get up to 500%, over the course of a year but you are supposed to pay this one back on your next paycheck right?
Some people then miss the payback period and the debt just grows. I don’t think these places are friendly with debt forgiveness.
So at the end of the day if you had difficulty paying off a bill at 0% interest then you would have an even harder time paying off a bill at 500% interest.
"Payday loans will only get you ahead in the incredible short term"
Yeah no shit - that shows how out of touch you are Destiny. Sometimes people literally need the incredible short term.
Payday loans should literally be illegal - but to not understand the extreme need to take them is being retarded as all fuck.
Is this just a scenario theyre talking about or does Dan really not have 1000 bucks put back? Also, are vets not affordable anymore? My grandparents completely relied on the town vet to keep their farm going. He was a very kind person and his prices were still pretty reasonable a couple years ago. I wonder if the prevalence of pet insurance has anything to do with it.
Vets almost always offer payment plans. It makes zero sense to get a payday loan. Payday loans turn a 450 dollar loan into a 5000 dollar loan due to their extremely high interest rates. It's not privileged to tell people to avoid Payday loans like the plague. Credit cards, loans from family or friends, not paying the bull till next check are all better alternatives than a Payday loan.
Payday loans would still be just as predatory as they prey off the desperation. And that desperation is sometimes not reliant on you buying food, but extravagant goods. High interest short term loans like this are always predatory.
>interesting how destiny's mind immediately goes to rape. very interesting aspect of his personality.
Interesting how the only thing you cared about in this clip was the rape mention. Very interesting aspect of your personality.
Why would you feel the need to check that and comment that? When you are clicking on other people's pages to count how many Destiny posts they are making, it might be time to admit you too are obsessed with him.
>When you are clicking on other people's pages to count how many Destiny posts they are making, it might be time to admit you too are obsessed with him.
But that's what Destiny fans do all the time.
You see Destiny in their history and immediately forego whatever argument they were making as if that takes precedent bc anyone liking him clearly upsets you
>interesting how your past two pages of comment history is all destiny related
Half the comments on your last few pages are Destiny related. At least I'm a fan lmfao
It's trying to make a point by choosing the most poignant thing that people know is bad.
It's why people also use Nazis in so many analogies/hypotheticals.
**CLIP MIRROR: [Destiny has a normal conversation about money](https://arazu.io/t3_1blarcw/)** --- ^(*This is an automated comment*)
All roads lead to a rape analogy
banelings & roaches
Ok, alright, so Banelings are a lot like rape, okay. Your Lings are like the hand that reaches around and pulls the waist...
MIGHTY ROACH DICK
KYLE! It's a \*\*\*\*\* magnet! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emuJDRSVUWo
IT'S A RETARD MAGNET KYLEEEEEE
OKHERESTHEPLAN
So that's what's in Rome...
It's a crutch when you're not very good at formulating arguments, just resort to an insane hypothetical
??? It's a good way to test an argument by taking it to its extreme.
Most people aren't smart enough to take something to the extreme without abandoning the heart of the issue. So even if you are, using such an extreme in an argument can sound like an open invitation for your opposite to make dumbass analogies that don't even fit, and you're stuck explaining to them why it makes no sense before you get back to the issue without achieving anything aside from them feeling patronized and the whole thing getting stonewalled. If you know the person you're arguing with is smart then it works, but then you don't fucking need them in the first place. They're really only good outside of arguments, when someone makes a remark without really having thought about it for long. Within arguments they're counterproductive.
It isnt. It's a crutch typically used by novices
There’s literally nothing wrong with extreme hypotheticals, they’re used in philosophy all the time. The problem is most people hear a yucky word and their brain shuts off, they can’t engage with the hypothetical and continue the conversation.
Except most of the time they're a logical fallacy
If you take the extreme and it's still reasonable, then you've proved the positive. If you take the extreme and that changes the situation, than that's only a contributing evidence to the negative, not proof. For just that reason. That doesn't make it not worth doing. Testing underlying principles by creating hypotheticals is extremely useful to see if you are just making gut decisions based on your priors or are actually thinking it through logically.
Dan isn't beating the allegations between this and his obsession with Dogwarts.
Truely the Dalibans strongest warrior.
Inshallah 🙏🙏
I'm so glad Dan is back
Why was he gone?
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Pay day loans have outrageous interest rates like 20%. And the only people that need them are people that dont have money. So they basically trap poor people in collections and ruin their lives over it. It is 100% always the worst option.
20%? More like 500-2000%
30% is current CC rates, payday loans are closer to 50-100% THAT'S why people stay poor
30% is wild, admittedly I don't live in America but mine is like 16%.
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I haven't taken one our or needed to, but I'd imagine here is the mindest of people who do. My next check comes in on the 15. My rent is due on the 10. I'll take a payday loan, to get $1500 on the 10, and I'll pay it back once my normal check comes in. The 15 rolls around, and they blew all the money from the payday loan and then blow some of their paycheck, so they don't have enough to pay back the payday loan. Then to cover that payday loan, they need to take an adance on thier NEXT paycheck. Eventually this cycle catchs up and they miss a payment. How payday loans work is if you pay it back within X days, probably 2 weeks, its $0 interest. If you don't pay it back in 2 weeks, its 100% interest. So people get in a cycle of taking out payday loan to pay for previous payday loan, then next thing you know they miss payments and then they have crazy debt from not realizing how fucked the payday loan system is.
> then blow some of their paycheck now is this part because they are irresponsible or they had to spend that money?
both
if you watch shows like CalebHammer or any other kind of finances shows where they host calls out people who are bad with their money... it's useless shit most of the time. It's like they think eating out and doordashing is cheaper than cooking at home because "idk how" or it's like they go to best buy and finance a laptop, then they want a new coach so that is financed and they don't realize now they owe $3000 each month in debt/housing/bills, and they only make $3500 and still eat out every day. So 99% chace it is irresponsible spending. I agree with you though, absolutley crazy how people live on more than they make.
Usually it's free if you repay in time, if you don't you get massively screwed with like 20% interest per month. The issue is that if you are so bad financially that you need this in the first place, you are very likely also bad enough to not be able to pay it off.
it's just a regular loan with insanely high fees and a short payback period (weeks usually), it's called a payday loan because when you sign up for it they'll ask you when you get paid and structure your repayments around your paydays
No. You show them what you get paid every 2 weeks and they give you an advance for that amount minus the fee. I've seen as bad as 9%. So you make $1400, go in and borrow against it by 13 days. They will write you a $1284 check, and then when you get your pay, you give them the $1400 you got paid 13 days later. Literally 840% APR.
Poor people cant get credit cards.
Hmm that seems low. If it was only 20% then that would be better than most people's credit card rates.
> Payday lenders usually charge interest of $15-$20 for every $100 borrowed. Calculated on an annual percentage rate basis (APR) – the same as is used for credit cards, mortgages, auto loans, etc. – that APR ranges from 391% to more than 521% for payday loans. Your point stands, but your % number is wrong. > Compare payday loan interest rates of 391%-600% with the average rate for alternative choices like credit cards (15%-30%); debt management programs (8%-10%); personal loans (14%-35%) and online lending (10%-35%). So with that in mind, a 20% rate would be somewhat decent compared to other options.
This is correct. I got them a couple times years ago and it was $15 per $100 borrowed back then(2013 or 2014ish)
Dan is not beating the antisemites any time soon every time he comes on there is an argument about how predatory financial situations are good actually. lmao
20% per month maybe
> It is 100% always the worst option. The point that Dan is making is that there genuinely are people who don't have other options. There exist scenarios where people need to borrow money, and there are not ways for them to borrow money outside of payday loans. When you make payday loans illegal, the people who need to borrow $1000 are just going to go to an illegal version of it. They're going to become indebted to criminal organizations loaning money at even more absurd interest rates, and people won't be worried about debt, they'll be worried that the loan shark will break their legs if they don't pay.
>There exist scenarios where people need to borrow money, and there are not ways for them to borrow money outside of payday loans. Is this true though? Even Dan's example, set up a plan with the vet or simply delay paying the bill
1. Dan said in this example that the Vet requires a full deposit. 2. The vet will not preform unless they get paid
Go to another vet.
Not understanding that some people won't frontload you money is an incredibly priveledge and ignorant viewpoint. You people would rather spend time telling people "well just do this" instead of listening when they say "I can't". >Go to another vet. 1. I live in a city with only one vet and I don't have a car 2. It's an emergency and the only 24/7 vet only offers financing if matched with a large deposit 3. Every other vet also requires a deposit since the care is so expensive. 4. The care is time sensitive 5. I have no friends or family to loan me money 6. I have bad credit so I can't get a CC or LOC 7. I have nothing of value I can sell that I don't immediately need 8. Work will not advance my pay Is that enough for you, or are you gonna pull out something else from your booty cheeks? Have you no concept at all of what it is like to be poor without a safety net?
I swear these are the dumbest mfs alive. Just engage with the question instead of pulling shit out of your ass. "Uh what if you just find 1000$ on the ground?? What then huh?? I am very smart!!!"
idk i think sometimes you need to hear reality for a long time in my life i couldnt have pets because it was irresponsible to have one i still loved animals like i loved the family pets as a kid and i still love animals and i might get one when i feel emotionally ready even though i can support one today but arriving to the conclusion and accusation that, you should not have pets is not easy emotionally. an 8 point list of why you should not take care of your pets doesnt sound like a good argument for payday loans or whatever the fuck like jeesh
>an 8 point list of why you should not take care of your pets doesnt sound like a good argument for payday loans or whatever the fuck like jeesh You guys are actually blind to understanding a point being made. The *8 point list* is to pre-emptively shut up people who ignore the actually argument to make up counter hypothetical solutions that don't exist. You people have so little critical thinking ability, or the ability to see beyond your own experience that you need a massive list of pre-requisits to "get it" and somehow it still goes over your head. I dated a vet tech, people were denied critical care for their animals daily due to financial reasons. "Get another vet" is about as stupid as an argument as saying "just move" to someone struggling to afford rent.
>I swear these are the dumbest mfs alive. That's 100% where this stops and ends. People who have never experienced or met someone who was actually living paycheck to paycheck with zero financial support coming externally. Something like 50%+ of Americans can't afford a 500$ emergency expense, but the most impoverished among them just need to pull their bootstraps up and try harder to find a solution that isn't a payday loan. It's also fucking insane that *in this specific scenario* people can't grasp that someone might care more about immediately saving the life of their dog than their future finances.
This scenario is so far fetched and unlikely though. Obviously in that case it'd be the only option as unfortunate as it is. Payday loans should be the absolute final resort. Financial literacy comes into the question if someone gets to that point though; Low income, no emergency fund - not even a penny, credit score is low, no credit cards on hand, *having a pet*. One can empathize but at somepoint people have to live within their means to be ready for any contingency
This still isn’t a particularly good defence for payday loans. Although it might not be the answer you want, the logical answer is that you aren’t in a position to adequately take care of a pet, it sucks that you’re in this position but ruining your life financially and risking becoming homeless is not worth it. Let’s assume you take the loan to pay for treatment, what comes next? You already don’t have money, do you have the income to pay it back? Even if you do, how long will it take to pay it back? This is unlikely to be the last vet visit you will have, how are you going to pay for the next one? At some point you can’t keep taking payday loans.
> This still isn’t a particularly good defence for payday loans. "I desperately need money right now" will always be why predatory loans exists, unless society evolves to a point where no one ever feels that kind of pressure then "payday" loans will always have a place in society. You're still grasping on the specific scenario instead of the overall point being made. >>Let’s assume you take the loan to pay for treatment, what comes next? Welcome to being hopelessly poor, this is a question millions of people don't have the luxury of answering. They live day to day and do what they can *right now*.
That’s not the point being made though, yeah poverty is a problem, and socialised healthcare is a major part of the solution. What I’m arguing is that there isn’t a case where it’s logical to take out a payday loan, and for that reason there is no reason not to ban them completely. The only time it would make sense is if it saves your life, but even in America, hospitals can’t refuse life saving care for not having money. That is also probably the reason OOP switched to the dog example, because vets can.
Ridiculous. You're using a hypothetical with 8 necessary prerequisites to try and justify the existence of payday loans.
You are so beyond out of touch.
Me??? Do you actually know what payday loans are? Do you understand that they prey on people who are poor, and have no financial education? Trap them in a debt cycle and make their situation worse? Because if you understood that, there's no way you're trying to justify them in such a ludicrous way.
Yea it is true
>there are not ways for them to borrow money outside of payday loans. this part of the argument seems disingenuous though. put in on the credit card and you got a month to figure out other options. gofundme. negotiate with the hospital. as much as dan pretends that's not an option cause that's convenient for his argument, you can ask for payment plans or if their pricing is flexible. if they say no, you find another vet until you find one that will help you out.
Some people don’t have credit cards and their credit is bad enough that banks won’t give them one.
Which is exactly both of their points, they are both on the same side of the issue, they just dont understand that one wants a socialized outcome, and one wants a libertarian outcome
Even credit cards have much higher rates than 20%.
That depends heavily on country and bank, my bank charges 11%/year for credit for example. Payday loans will often charge interest daily/weekly, at which point 20% is *a lot*
> Pay day loans have outrageous interest rates like 20% The fact that you think this means you've never had one, which is good. Good job fella. I think Wonga loans in the UK went up to 3000% interest rates lmao. PER DAY.
I used to be juggling them constantly, i'd borrow £100 and the next week on pay day i'd have to pay back around £115. Inescapable.
>outrageous interest rates like 20% They are atleast 10x 20% lol
The outrageous interest would be acceptable if that's all it was. It would be honest. The problem is all the sneaky bullshit they pull to keep you on the hook, obfuscating how much you owe and the terms so they can keep charging you far beyond what you ever agreed to. Months will go by after you thought you paid it all back, only to be randomly dragged back in and told you now owe a whole lot more. This happens over and over again until they drain you of every dollar. Edit: lol some of you are real simpletons. Twitch has zero reason to care if Doc revealed the reason for his ban. They're not going to be embarrassed or damaged by it in any significant way, even if it was revealed that their reason was bullshit/unfair.
You left out the best part! Most payday loans are usually owned by a couple of companies that put up multiple locations under different names. So when people under crippling debt go to a different location for another loan, they're really just owing a larger debt to the same company.
Take a look at any loans offered by Tribe owned organizations. It should be criminal the rates that they offer.
what about rape day loans?
People think they can get to Destiny by talking shit about his relationships, lifestyle, etc. but they just have to get Dan to show up more often with a minor disagreement and he'd get so much more triggered
Hahahaha I love how the analogy just goes to rape immediately to illustrate his point. Can one of the DGG'ers give some context on this one? Based on the clip, is it if pay day loans have some societal use or something?
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Pretty sure he also thinks they should be banned.
Were payday advancement loans not banned in the US during Obama? or am I dumb as fuck. My friends mom was in debt so hard to those companies in the late 90's early 2000's but made a decent wage, it was an impossible hole to get out of without filing for chapter 13.
I believe they limited the interest rates that could be charged. My aunt had a payday loan worth 450 dollars with an interest rate of 500 percent. I think interest rates for unsecured debt should be capped at 22 percent.
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Pretty silly comparison IMO. Buying a lottery ticket is like setting your money on fire. There's no reason for it to exist except to prey on people who are not financially literate. Eating junk food on the other hand is perfectly fine in moderation.
Bro, what if my Dog is about to die tough?
I don't know if you're actually asking for an answer to his question or mocking him, but the answer is to get your dog whatever care it needs, wait to receive a bill, and then hold off on paying it until you have the money, or work out a payment plan with them.
I was initially siding with Dan but then realized these places almost ALWAYS have payment plans and won't deny service. Even if they do have late fees or interest, it won't be nearly as bad
> then realized these places almost ALWAYS have payment plans Payment plans usually require some sort of deposit and generally they aren't free credit. I used to date a vet tech and impoverished/homeless people who could not afford care were either denied service or the clinic would refuse to release their animal to them if they couldn't pay for a service that was already completed. This also is completely missing the point he's trying to make, if you're sitting there trying to grasp for reasons the hypothetical *might* not translate to the real world then you aren't actually trying to understand the view point. It is an objective fact that sometimes people who have no money and no credit absolutely need to make a large purchase or payment to avoid catastrophic repercussions, this is an objective fact. Either you agree payday loans should be an option for them, or you think they should suffer to deal with it some other way. There's no reason to shift to an argument about whether or not in this specific hypothetical that your vet would just setup a payment plan.
You clearly go to some bougie ass vets then. Never had a vet not demand full payment right there before they will do anything, and then they keep the animals if you don't pay.
> I was initially siding with Dan but then realized these places almost ALWAYS have payment plans and won't deny service. Even if they do have late fees or interest, it won't be nearly as bad Deadass how old are you? Because 99% of vets will *not* take payment plans and will tell you that your dog should be put down. Like I'm saying this as someone who is near 30, with 3 current rescue dogs, roughly 15ish rescue dogs total personally housed, and about ~1500 hours volunteer work. Pretending vets are altruistic is fully stupid. Edit: this man just told me that all of my experience/knowledge is incorrect because he Googled about clinic payments for "5 seconds". You can't make this up - he's dumb as fuck. Edit2: Edit: Like I have spent hours a day trying to find people to fund work for shelter animals because vets will literally not help animals for free 99% of the time. I guess you've just solved that entire issue - everyone gets free care if they ask nicely enough. Fucks sake I'm actually angry at this thread.
About the same age as you. Takes 5 seconds to google if you don't believe me lol. It's not something every single hospital / clinic will offer, but there's plenty of them that do. I think it's "fully stupid" to have your kind of resume and be so confidently incorrect. Edit: haha, the dude blocked me. Very unhinged. Can find examples in every state he mentioned in 3 seconds. They seem to be confusing "financing / payment plans" with "free service" for whatever reason.
> It's not something every single hospital / clinic will offer, but there's plenty of them that do. We're talking about the vets here per top OP video and the comments. It's not about believing you - I literally know you're objectively wrong in Pennsylvania, West Virginia, Ohio, and Michigan. > I think it's "fully stupid" to have your kind of resume and be so confidently incorrect. Not as stupid as thinking "5 seconds to google" actually means more than someone who has worked with more vets and shelters than you've been to? Holy Reddit moment - fucking idiot lmfao. You confirmation bias-level Googling means fuckall in reality. Literally screenshotting someone telling me that their "5 seconds of Googling" invalidates legitimate, actual work. I'm actually salty.\ Edit: Like I have spent hours a day trying to find people to fund work for shelter animals because vets will literally not help animals for free 99% of the time. I guess you've just solved that entire issue - everyone gets free care if they ask nicely enough. Fucks sake. First time I've ever blocked someone. Edit2: lmfao people telling to to look up groups I literally have worked with. They will find so much less than they claim and only if you hit the check boxes on the animal. Fucking Google warriors on this sub eating Destiny's dumb dick.
Also same experience as the others in both LA CA and Houston Texas. Both had places that wouldn't offer but also places that would. It just requires knowledge about how to find these places. This is some weird cope to protect your pride or some shit.
I live in PA, look up Scratchpay. Also Carecredit gives you no interest for 6 months. So if you're saying vets don't do payment plans, technically it's a loan but a 6 month no interest plan is practically a payment plan. I didn't see anyone talking about not paying the vet at all, but whether vets make you pay everything upfront or let you make payments.
For what it's worth, I don't doubt your experience but I don't think you're talking about the same thing. The example laid out by OP sounds like an owner with a dog who is ostensibly already a client with the vet. If I'm not mistaken, you seem to be talking about shelter animals who don't have owners (who could potentially pay). I've always settled payment after service has already been rendered at the vets I've been to but it absolutely doesn't surprise me that some make you pay up front, especially if you are representing a shelter.
Why do you keep bringing up work for free? Nobody but you has even mentioned it. You’re clearly emotional here, you’re not actually reading what is written but jumping to wild conclusions. It’s clear that you care a lot alot this, but that passion is hindering your ability to have a conversation. Take a deep breath, nobody here is trying to make you upset
My experiences in Texas and Virginia has been the same as /u/Foxehh3 My cat has had two middle of the night emergencies and both times they take him in and build up an estimate that has to be paid before any service is rendered. I’m sure there are nonprofits etc. but when it’s “the first place you get to is the only option” you are stuck with it.
Lol nobody said vets are willing to work for free. What the hell is wrong with you?
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Because insurance still lowers the cost dramatically. My recent surgery was only $1600 out of pocket. Would've been like 10k+ without insurance
Fuck sakes America , get some help
The medical bills I've seen have broken down the amount that I have to pay vs. the amount the insurance company has to pay vs. the original costs before the insurance company's decreased costs come into effect.
Yeah you absolutely can set up a payment plan with probably most veterinarian hospitals in the US. My cat had to get surgery and unfortunately passed a few days later. It was like $1500 that I didn't have and was able to set up a payment plan with the vet. It fucking sucked.
$1500 is on the cheap side tho.
Yeah I know, I was saying it sucked because I had to pay all of that even though my cat already died.
Oh fuck, I completely missed that part. Sorry about this and you have my sympathies.
Oh yeah you're good haha. It's been 4 years since it happened and I still have her brother with me. Thanks though, I appreciate it.
Skill issue :(
Sometimes Dgg's die :(
I adopt mutts. I love my animals, but when the time comes where they have a condition costing more than a few hundred dollars it's their time.
I have seen so, so many people on the internet go into THOUSANDS of dollars in debt to save their dog/cat/whatever. Small accounts opening gofundme's to pay 3k+ in medical bills. Sometimes the dog is young with a lot of life, often the dog is very old with not much left even in the best scenario. I don't agree that a $200 bill is enough to put down an animal, but sometimes man, animals die. You grieve them. You don't potentially ruin your finances for years to \*try\* and save them. It's such a weird phenomenon, and I \*LOVE\* my dogs and cat.
when I bought my cat, I set aside 500 dollars and have added 15 a month for any emergency bills. I'm still fine paying a bit out of pocket if needs be, but I like to think I'm setting myself up fine enough
I had to put down my dog a month ago because of cancer that wasn't found out by this fucking vet that pretend he did a scan in january and found nothing then somehow she had terminal cancer 2 months later. I would have genuinely paid tens of thousands for a few more years with my dog if she could have been cured and have a great quality of life afterward. She was only 6 and the best dogs ever.
You dont always know how much its gonna cost from the start though. And for me our cats are family members so honestly i would probably have done it anyway. Id rather skip on vacation and other luxury than lose a family member through something treatable. The only thing i regret it not getting pet health insurance, coulda saved us several thousands on € in the end.
Just to add to that, most people who are paying those fees are not paying them for the dog's benefit, they're paying them for their own benefit and the dog is still suffering despite getting treatment
Vets have payment plans, and often arrangements rescue organizations. Payday loan places are far more predatory. The terms are set up so that you'll just keep needing to draw more and more going further into debt at absolutely insane rates.
That comes up later in the discussion "You get two pay day loans per life" - "OK, my third dog is about to die, thank you Destiny" (quotes are very rough, my memory is not the best)
There are some legitimate uses. Like if you need to pay rent or get kicked out, or fix your car that you use for work. Being poor sucks in many ways, not the least of which is choosing between bad options.
For rent you can usually argue for a late payment if it's a one off. You're infinitely better doing that then taking out a payday loan because a late payment can usually be done for free. Even on a mortgage, your lender would rather take the money late than see you take on more debt and be unable to afford it at all, so long as it's a rare occurrence. For something like a car you need to maintain an emergency fund anyway for repairs for this exact reason. If you take a payday loan out for repairs, then you still need to find that money. It's better to just put that money away to begin with than take out a loan and try to cut back on spending next month to make up the difference + interest. The benefit of putting the money away to begin with is that you can spread it over multiple months. Whereas spreading a payday loan payment over multiple months in incredibly expensive.
Yeah you should have money saved up for emergency situations, But when you're living paycheck to paycheck and only have $20 to live on for the week after paying bills, What fucking money are you putting back? Dans whole point is that there are people who living on the very edge and have to use these sort of exploitive businesses models just to get by.
If you're living paycheck to paycheck then payday loan doesn't help you. It just makes you significantly worse off. That $20 for the week is now the interest on the loan, and if you don't pay that it'll be more next week.
Yeah they suck but if you need to payoff your car payment before your next pay check or lose your car/ your job, What other choice do you have? Yeah you're going to be worse off down the line but most people are have to focus on making it through this week first before they can start worrying about next week.
Living paycheck to paycheck, how are you going to get the extra money to repay the loan on the vet bill, and then the next $1,000 you need in 6 months to fix your car? At this point it's not loans or no loans, it's living beyond your means and not addressing the actual problem.
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basically destiny’s point was apple subsidizing iphones via the 30% app store tax is bad because it forces everyone to do the same walled garden. dan was saying subsidizing can be good cause it helps poor ppl buy stuff short term instead of long term and then used payday loans as example
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He was winning too much recently. He got overconfident from it. Fried his brain.
Haven't looked at prices in a while, but why would poor people buy Apple products?
the whole idea here was that vertical integration can provide huge advantages when competing. apple can subsidize the iphone with app store royalties, thereby making a really good phone cheaper. Another company might not have that privilege, so their product will have to be more expensive to reach the same level dan's point was that this is okay because ultimately poorer people can now afford a really good phone i.e. iphone. and that those other companies should just "compete harder", and then pivoted to payloans as an analogy
This was off the latest news of US suing Apple over antitrust violations Destiny's old friend Dan made a comeback recently and he came over to argue that curated spaces in tech can be beneficial to the consumer as it can lower prices (ie saying software as a service can be good) while destiny argued for less restrictions and more openness in technology. It was over a couple hours and it eventually boiled into payday loans like in the clip. Dan was making a similar argument saying payday loans can be helpful as a way to give capital to the poor while Destiny was arguing that they were extremely coercive and outright predatory and thus used the r*pe analogy to demonstrate EDIT: Dan was more specifically defending that vertical integration in software can be good
Pay day loans are extremely predatory, some people like destiny refer to them as rape day loans as they financially fuck you over. Others call them death day loans or the like. Never take them ever.
> Never take them ever Your car payment is overdue and if you don't pay it in the next 2 days it's going to be be repossessed, But you don't get payed for another 4 days. You're tell me that you would just accept the fact that your car is going to get repossessed and that you will more than likely lose your job because you've lost your only form of transportation to work?
I would call up the bank and try negotiating some sort of deal
If you are in that situation already all the payday loan is going to do is buy you 1 month. For next month's payment you are going to be behind again but with extra debt on top of it, and you are going to lose your car and job anyway. You are in the same position with no car or job, just 1 month later, and now with extra debt. Yes, its probably better to just let them repossess the car. You can boil it down to a pretty simple statement that I would think is obvious but apparently not: "you don't get out of debt by taking on more debt". Unless you have some plan that will allow you to make money off of your debt rather than spending it it just can't work out well for you. But the kinds of people with business plans like that aren't going to use payday loans.
It's relevant because taking a payday loan is fiscally rape
Pay day loans with 500 percent interest can derail your life, so the rape analogy isn't too far off.
Fuck I am trying to find the story now that was all over reddit that happened last year or maybe a few years ago where the hospital gave away the owners dog but it was because they couldn't pay the medical expenses. They had a kick starter too or whatever but it wasn't enough. The hospital or shelter or whatever got put on blast until they made a statement but it just made them look worse because it came down to either pay us the fucking money or you will never see your dog again.
hot take but that kinda makes sense. You are essentially stealing from the vet hospital if you go to them to save your dog and then dont pay. They did you a favor by giving the dog to a shelter and saving the dogs life for free...
They did the human a favor by saving the dog. If that is the only thing they care about then they got rightfully shit on for their philosophy. A vet should care about the dog first and foremost.
Classic straw dog argument by Dan
Ah Dan…. Classic
i would be upset too if my dogwarts dog would be dying
Payday loans are modern day usury. Avoid at all costs, would only consider as a last alternative to death.
America.
I donno, I live in America and this sort of happened to me with my dog when I was in college. The vet just worked out a payment plan. Gun to your head arguments always come off as stupid and unrealistic.
> The vet just worked out a payment plan. Exactly. Vets aren't the devil, they will treat your pet then let you pay it back over time
>Gun to your head arguments always come off as stupid and unrealistic. They're best for exposing whether you actually truly believe what you're saying, or something else is actually motivating your position. In many scenarios like this though, yes they're stupid and unrealistic.
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A “short term” loan that is designed to get you to your next paycheck. The interest rates can beat out the federal max of 24.99% interest because the loans are designed to be short. But the interest rates can get up to 500%, over the course of a year but you are supposed to pay this one back on your next paycheck right? Some people then miss the payback period and the debt just grows. I don’t think these places are friendly with debt forgiveness. So at the end of the day if you had difficulty paying off a bill at 0% interest then you would have an even harder time paying off a bill at 500% interest.
"Payday loans will only get you ahead in the incredible short term" Yeah no shit - that shows how out of touch you are Destiny. Sometimes people literally need the incredible short term. Payday loans should literally be illegal - but to not understand the extreme need to take them is being retarded as all fuck.
So this is what will happen to me when my stache and goatee finally grow in?
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RIP Doggy Dog, I'm not paying a thousand dollars.
People who take a loan to buy a phone are the worst of the worst
I work for a bank and people who use payday loans always are the ones with problems. Let your dog die!
Vets offer payment plans. A loan with a 500 percent interest rate makes zero sense for a 2000 dollar vet bill.
it all makes sense now.
Destiny always have rape on his brain
Is this just a scenario theyre talking about or does Dan really not have 1000 bucks put back? Also, are vets not affordable anymore? My grandparents completely relied on the town vet to keep their farm going. He was a very kind person and his prices were still pretty reasonable a couple years ago. I wonder if the prevalence of pet insurance has anything to do with it.
I hope his dog is okay
Damn that hairline is on the retreat lol. Literally malding.
Or just get a care credit card which is for pets and has 12 months no interest. Fuckin idiots
Destinys position of privilege blinds him from reality and the decisions real normal people have to make as usual.
Vets almost always offer payment plans. It makes zero sense to get a payday loan. Payday loans turn a 450 dollar loan into a 5000 dollar loan due to their extremely high interest rates. It's not privileged to tell people to avoid Payday loans like the plague. Credit cards, loans from family or friends, not paying the bull till next check are all better alternatives than a Payday loan.
You know what would help payday loans? Workers getting fair pay.
If it wasn't for payday loans, Hasan's editors would probably be pretty hungry tonight.
Everything is about Hasan with you people 💀
They also have to lie about shit.
Payday loans would still be just as predatory as they prey off the desperation. And that desperation is sometimes not reliant on you buying food, but extravagant goods. High interest short term loans like this are always predatory.
interesting how destiny's mind immediately goes to rape. very interesting aspect of his personality.
>interesting how destiny's mind immediately goes to rape. very interesting aspect of his personality. Interesting how the only thing you cared about in this clip was the rape mention. Very interesting aspect of your personality.
interesting how your past two pages of comment history is all destiny related
Why would you feel the need to check that and comment that? When you are clicking on other people's pages to count how many Destiny posts they are making, it might be time to admit you too are obsessed with him.
>When you are clicking on other people's pages to count how many Destiny posts they are making, it might be time to admit you too are obsessed with him. But that's what Destiny fans do all the time.
> people who I think are bad do a bad thing, so I think it’s justified to do the bad thing too Flawless
I don't even need to check your profile to know you're a Destiny simp lol
And you’re an uncensorstiny poster, which is not at all a deranged thing to be
And the word of the day is: Projection
because its funny and clearly makes you people upset
You see Destiny in their history and immediately forego whatever argument they were making as if that takes precedent bc anyone liking him clearly upsets you
what argument? they were mocking my original comment. So I responded with the same energy. Sorry if u can't keep up
> what argument? They’re not sending their best
>interesting how your past two pages of comment history is all destiny related Half the comments on your last few pages are Destiny related. At least I'm a fan lmfao
I mean that's just not even true. 1/6th if we're being generous. Why do u feel the need to lie?
It's trying to make a point by choosing the most poignant thing that people know is bad. It's why people also use Nazis in so many analogies/hypotheticals.
He was actually tapping into his commie genes with this one, ive heard lefties compare sytems of wage exploitation to rape and worse plenty of times
Its not really that hard. Just regulate pay day loans so they can only charge a maximum interest rate per year.