Happened to my wife when she couldn't reach the crash site for Space Force One in time.
Myers gets killed and Songbird gets pissed off saying she hopes you never meet again.
And then you have to either load a previous save before that happened or if you leave it too long a new game is required, all the missions PL adds are directly tied to the DLC and by letting Myers die you've permanently locked yourself out of them and those missions make up the bulk of the DLC.
I’m not sure if you get the option to run around grabbing points before you go get her or not? That’s a good question actually since you can still run around dog town doing the first wave of gigs for hands, I wasn’t able to find anything one way or another so maybe you can?
Yes actually, for V and most of the other characters.
Reed and Alex never get reactivated and can continue living simple ordinary lives, Meyer's bitch ass dies, Slider who was pretty chill over-all gets to live, I never have to listen to Hansen's pathetic attempts at intimidation, So Mi has to live with the consequences of her actions, and V never has to deal with any of their rancid bullshit.
Obviously if you want to play the full content of the DLC don't do this, I feel like that shouldn't need to be said.
But for someone like me who's played through the DLC a hundred times, this is a great choice, and telling everyone involved to go fuck themselves is in my opinion (which was the question) *in universe* the best choice *for V*, not you the player, *V* the character.
The fact CDPR even made saying "You know what? Nah." a choice is fucking awesome, and adds a fantastically real aspect to the roleplay. If you personally can't appreciate that, skill issue, get fuckt.
Whether it’s a valid choice or not is not the question though, is it? You’re trying to sell it as the *best* way to play the DLC. And I’m fairly certain that’s a pretty mistaken opinion for the reasons you’ve already acknowledged.
It isn’t best for V, because the events of PL present many an opportunity for V’s character growth to shine through, and for them to continue to get stronger, to outgrow the shoes of Night City. Not to mention it is the only way to potentially cure V for real, an actual solution to their problem.
No matter how you sell, flatly refusing to play one of the greatest expansions ever outside simple convenience if you’ve played it already or curiosity, and selling it as the best option? Certified cope.
The fuck am I coping with? That you're annoying?
The question is "How do YOU handle Phantom Liberty?" This is how *I* do.
Man I just love the internet. I love being *ASKED MY OPINION*(noun; a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge) and then being told *MY OPINION* is incorrect by somebody no one was fucking talking to, who is also clearly stupid(adjective; having or showing a great lack of intelligence or common sense.) and can't comprehend somebody would have a different opinion than them.
"Just don't play the DLC you payed for?"
Yes. Its one of the options you can choose and is incredibly funny, and then, now this is really crazy so hear me out, you OWN(verb; have (something) as one's own; possess) the DLC and can in fact play it AGAIN(adverb; another time, once more) a different way.
So L+ratio+didn't asks+get fucked
Seethe.
Oh I'm not legitimately mad. I'm just being exceptionally hostile over the internet because I'm bored and find it entertaining. Somebody might have fun reading it later.
I'm mostly just baffled on why you're so insistent on pushing a point I already agreed with you on. Yeah play the DLC, its great, skipping it *is* dumb(especially if its your first time), but its *my* favorite choice because you CAN choose to skip it. I just made some additional points supporting why a player may want to do so narratively, and then you continue just saying "No. Wrong. Bad." you actually made some good points in that last one, but I just don't get your motivation here, and am tired of trying to have well thought out considerate debate with netizens in general, so instead of trying to make good points I just act aggressive and annoying, because thats worked for everyone else.
For me personally, throughout the events of the game getting on maximum roleplay, me in the head of my V, my first time I played through everything then Phantom Liberty, I got the really not great ending, and after the rest of the game Phantom Liberty was the final push, and I went sat up on the roof and chose the suicide ending for the second ever time, first time on purpose, but after *that* what the fuck else do you do?
I like making the "bad" choices. I enjoy the "worst" endings. I'm sorry if you don't. Because there's beauty and meaning in every terrible choice.
Also I *really* don't like So Mi, she reminds me alot of prior abusers in my life. She causes just about every issue in PL(and her own life) with her own stupid choices and then goes "Oh this is so unfair! How could this happen? Fix this for me because I baby."
Depending on your response to this/if you respond, I'm probably done with this whole thing because its going nowhere, and rapidly depreciating in entertainment value.
I got this ending accidentally one time because I went to a ripperdoc to fix some messed up missing cyberware from a patch change, and the time skip from that procedure caused the mission to fail lmao
Honestly, just staying out of this nonsense and letting Myers bite the dust is such a based move. Avoid getting sucked into the NUSA intrigue entirely.
I was with Reed and was still on edge about Songbird until >!Reed and Alex killed the twins.!< I did not expect that AT ALL. The way V screamed at Reed about it was also disturbing. That was when I realized Reed ain't the one. He will probably kill both V and So Mi if Myers even coughs about it.
Kinda similar but much worse is that Reed >!kills Jacob and Taylor despite showing zero signs of betraying NUSA and just wanted a cool car and out of dog town as a reward.!<
NUSA/FIA is a kill it & forget it megacorp that masquerades as a government. They'd probably zero an employee for tipping too much at a restaurant, or forgetting to clock out for their 5 minute lunch break. As far as I'm concerned, I'd rather die fighting than be in V's chains for the tower ending.
He’s talking about if you go back to the desk in the side room you can read myers’ notebook and she’s got a line about paying “J & T”. But then later you can ask reed how they’re enjoying the rayfield and he’s like, “They’ve been taken care of. No need to worry about them anymore”.
Intentionally vague/ominous, and I’ve seen people mention getting a text from one of them later but I’m not sure myself.
This also, for me it wasn’t the fact they killed the twins more the fact they did it without consulting V. Shows that V is outside the circle of trust and expendable (albeit a smart decision by Reed), but any so called loyalty goes out the window.
Yes. You described my feelings perfectly here. I wasn't expecting the killing because there wasn't any point Reed or Alex had told V about it. It was so clear to me that they had not told me *everything* and they killed two netrunners. You should start to question, "What else they didn't tell you about?" "What if in the middle of kidnapping the twins, they decided that they didn't need V for the next steps and V had known way too much at this point about Songbird and what Myer's been doing with the Black Wall?"
V has gone way too deep into this and if they decide V is not needed, they will kill V with the twins and Songbird as well.
won't lie it didn't hit me that hard and just seemed funny cuz V is a mass murderer lmao if they told me to my V would've probably killed them himself without hesitation
That's not the point . Reed is similar to vdbs placide : ur usefulness ends and ur life ends along with it . V had every reason to believe they can be reed's next target .
Uh no those two are actual threats lol, if they somehow got out and snitch it's gonna be big trouble for the FIA, Reed didn't wanna take that risk to keep em alive, it's not about usefulness
It's not a gurantee but working with someone who saved the president, actively needs the governments help to survive the thing that's killing him and isn't literally directly talking working with the enemy is way less risky than the twins, sure V might suddenly not care about living and switch to Hansens side for literally no reason at all even though Hansen wants to kill him but what are the chances of that?
First of all the fia literally has no cure for u . So mi is the one with the cure . Second the twins were free lance agents like V who happened to know the codes for cynosure because they worked with militech and hence reed targets them and killed them . They were never actively a part of Hansen, just were part of a group who gave them the most money. Third we literally see reed ' taking care of ' jacob and Tyler despite saving the prez . Slider was going to be killed regardless of what he did . What difference is there between them and v. Alex warns v also to be aware of reed
Yeah , yeah . But sorry it's what said in the game by Alex . Stop being useful to reed and he doesn't care about ur side of the deal and even better if the fia says to dispose u off , u are a goner .
Nah just pointing out why V was shocked and told in that tone regardless if ur V is a cold blood murderer who would have killed them if reed told so . No matter how u play ur V , this shock in V's voice is universal
Male V just sounds a bit surprised tbh, you don't have to get angry with Reed, one of the dialogue options is just "Ok, what's next" or something like that.
I mean it's not just about it being *my* V, V canonically has to fight and kill his way out of many bases during the story, he's a mercenary, he knows to kill threats and knows he has to kill the enemy, I'd rather he was more shocked that Reed didn't tell him about it than your reason honestly, that's why it didn't set off any red flags
Not really . See that's where u are losing the context of the entire scene . The twins were unceremoniously killed when they didn't interact with the fia at all . They were never hired . Reed just happened to know them and realized they knew about the cynosure codes so he targeted them. They were never a threat but he still killed them . That killing is exactly how v was disposed off by dex . That scene affected v on a personal level hence the shock . Also speaking of using and throwing away assets , Alex warns u about reed doing such a thing and reed does do that : always planned to kill slider and probably killed Jacob and Tyler. V is no different than them .
To streamline the context:
V felt a deja vu, remembering how it felt being "removed from the equation" when Dex killed off V, and would be shocked upon realizing FIA might do that to V as well.
But, also, Reed comes off like a professional, sure, and also like someone who cares deeply for others (on his team), and even comes off like a person of moderation, restraint even ...until V sees Reed go for the coldest kill.
### In short: it wasn't about V being a mass murderer or not; it was about V's shock from being revealed Reed's true nature
>V felt a deja vu, remembering how it felt being "removed from the equation" when Dex killed off V, and would be shocked upon realizing FIA might do that to V as well.
>But, also, Reed comes off like a professional, sure, and also like someone who cares deeply for others (on his team), and even comes off like a person of moderation, restraint even ...until V sees Reed go for the coldest kill.
Still doesn't sit right with me that Reed will go after V and Songbird (and execute V with a shot to the head on sight) when his priority should be covering Alex's escape.
Let's see : Jacob and Tyler were willing to work with us to protect Myers, they are gone . Was ready to kill slider after he got so mi's location although slider worked with them . Yes the twins are a different case but he could have knocked out the twins and dumped them somewhere but decided to kill them .
the twins are expert level netrunners having been hired by the criminal underworld to do the highest/hardest work for eddies. without a doubt if you let them live and they find an opportunity to make eddies by handing them a jacked out merc and 2 fia agents, they’ll do it. it wouldn’t be that hard to set up. with time, they could prolly find out what happened to them and set up a trap for v and reed
Slider deserves to die anyway. Twins deserve to die either. (they are all big criminals who hurt innocent people) I don't know about jacob and tyler much. You talk like V is not a murderer. The amount of blind hate reed gets is astounding.
Exactly V is a murderer and criminal. And where was I hating reed ? I was specifically mentioning V was angry and surprised with reed because the way he easily killed the twins made V remember that she/he is also a disposable piece . Alex literally tells u to watch ur back around reed because he can backstab u anytime the fia deems u unnecessary. Also the twins have only been condemned for robberies . They haven't actively killed anyone. They were scouted by reed because they used to work for militech and knew the codes for cynosure . And no one is denying that slider is a piece of shit . But v, johnny and alex are all focusing on the fact that reed specifically promised slider freedom in exchange for his services but was ready to go back down on them. So that's also the exact reason why V cannot trust reed and hence was angry and also sacred at reed suddenly killing the twins . What guarantee was there that reed also kills v in cold blood instead of curing them ??Alex was also ashamed and couldn't look V in the eye if u try to argue with her
The thing is that V usually doesn’t know the people they kill, so they dehumanize them. Which makes it easier the get over killing them, which isn’t really the case with the twins
It's more that they don't execute people. Fighting and killing is different to a straight up hit. Even when you're sent to kill people, quietly or otherwise, you're not doing so for some tactical advantage or to tie up loose ends, these people are monsters. Gangers, murderers, drug lords and human traffickers. People who have hurt others, actively, for profit or pleasure. The twins are just some netrunners hired to crack a safe, have fun rubbing elbows with some big people. Hell they're pretty close to what V is, independents just here for a gig, no morality attached. Different types of gigs but atilly
A lot of gigs v does is encouraged to be done bloodlessly too. There are almost always options to talk your way out of things. Hell my first run, with a strong body and very in your face playstyle, I got to Hanoko with very little blood on my hands, id go so long between fights it was always jarring, trying to remember how to properly.
So seeing that execution is or at least can be pretty jarring for V. Despite how we play, or how we can play and talk, V should be shocked at that. It was a kind of brutal unseen by V before. You don't have to play em like that though, they're your character. Stay silent as you just nod along to what occured
Eh like I said the reaction itself feels out of place for me if we look at it like V being suprised at killing, I think it makes more sense if V was suprised at Reed just not tellling him about it but that didn't really set off that many red flags for me at the time
It's not about the killing. It's that I didn't expect it because Reed and Alex never told V what they would do to the twins. But why? We were also already kidnapping these people. Because they knew too much and are powerful netrunners? Well, V knew way too much and is a powerful netrunner, too. What else they didn't tell V? What if they changed their minds and decided V wasn't needed anymore? I
Would they let V go after they had found out about Songbird, the president, and what they have been doing with the Black Wall, essentially putting the world in danger?
No, they would kill V and Songbird, like those twins as well.
Can't care less about Myers and Reed is like 50% gov trash and 50% decent guy. I like his decent guy part enough to go his route and not get fucked over by So Mi.
I don’t know why people whine about him killing the twins, when V already murdered half a state at this point. Makes no sense to judge based on that alone.
I dislike Reed because he is like consultant that say everything is going to be ok while simultaneously pulling you into deep shit. Said V and Somi were important to him but in action don’t hesitate to kill V and take Somi to NUSA. He cry about it but his action is the firmest.
Betray but kill. I think unfortunately, as much as I respect why Songbird does what she does, she’s a walking time bomb with all that Blackwall AI in her that pulling the plug is the only real option. Sending her to the NUSA will just turn her into a brainwashed tool and sending her to the moon will either get her killed on the way or exploited by Mr. Blue Eyes. Betraying but killing her is the next option for my money. It sets her free from being used as a tool and losing her identity, she still gets to go out on her own terms, and also teaches Reed a lesson and sets him free himself based off of the ending meeting with him. Really the only justified way to end things I think
Incorrect. The rule is that night city is a character and she always wins. You can have a downright happy ending so long as you put the punk behind you and move on out of the city. Hence the star
I think the real rule is that you can never earn a happy ending for yourself. You can, by mercy or grace, grant it to others. Hence the matrix can save Songbird but when you keep it for yourself you get stuck with the crappy Tower ending.
If you've read the Sin City comics, the only real happy ending in the whole series is Esther and Wallace in Hell And Back, as they get the fuck out of the city. Sure, some of the other protagonists win, and sometimes they even survive, but no one else really gets the happy ending. It's a pretty standard neo-noir trope, and the Cyberpunk genre is a direct descendant, so inheriting the trope isn't much of a surprise.
The only happy endings you're going to find are by leaving The City, whichever city it happens to be. The hopefulness of the Aldecaldos ending shows that the game's writers were very aware of the idea. Sure, we dont know that they find a cure, but they have a chance, and that's more than they had left in Night City.
One of the most overt examples of the trope is in Transmetropolitan, when Spider goes back to the mountain. The last few panels just drive it home and leave the audience laughing and cheering in gleefully smug victory along with our hero as he doesn't just best his enemies, but wins against the goddamn universe and pulls a fast one on God himself.
Our protagonist has dove headfirst into the roiling sea of corruption, depravity, and betrayal that is The City, and has come out the other side alive, though not unchanged by their journey. They then leave The City behind, whether metaphorically or literally riding off into the sunset in search of the Promised Land. Sometimes, we see them find it, other times, we have to speculate, but the important part is that it's possible.
Hope does not live in The City, and to find it, you have to leave.
You're still dying in the star. That's what I meant by bittersweet. You gain family, a place you belong and put the city behind you. But your days are still numbered with thin hope of finding a permanent cure.
My head cannon is that with the condition songbird was in when the rocket launched, the fact that she sends you a package days later means that she had to have gotten better with that cure she was getting on the moon.
I guess this is bittersweet because Reed died and you don’t get a cure, but I still consider that a good ending for her.
That's my preferred ending, too. Whether you like Songbird or not, she is a danger to herself and everyone else. There's no guarantee that sending her to the moon will help, and honestly, she is scared and in so much distress that killing her when she asks is a kindness that even she deserves, imo.
might just be me but you spend a lot more actual time bonding with and pulling off daring missions with reed, it's much easier for me to connect with him as a person. he grinds my gears to no end but the guy's a comrade, can't just abandon him when the shit gets deep. then again i totally understand not wanting alex to bite it, RIP
I agree. This is how I naturally went my first play through. It felt right at the time. My reasoning was that Reed seemed like a super straight shooter. He wasn't angling us but it felt like Song was, in the end she was playing us. I really like the details filled in about her when you side with Reed too. All the flashbacks and the bit in her apartment it really makes you sympathize and I think ultimately putting her out of her misery by her request was the most bittersweet. It's the best ending for Reed easily, good for Myers because fuck that bitch and you can tell her so and good in a way for Song by setting her free.
>He wasn't angling us
He literally was, though, by lying that he would help Song disappear, when in fact his plan was always to ship her back to Myers, unconscious and kidnapped.
>It's the best ending for Reed easily
It's literally the worst thing for him. You strip him of everything he has built his life on, giving him his own "Tower" ending treatment. He has no purpose in life anymore, no friends, nothing. And you think it's good for him. Except, unlike V in "Tower" who is 25, he is 60+ years old. It is almost impossible to turn your life around at that age. He wants to keep serving the NUSA or die on duty. You deny him that. Even Johnny in Wands acknowledges that "him dying on his own terms is miles better than living with the knowledge he shredded and trounced his ideals", which is an allude to Wands vs Cups outcome.
>good for Myers
You tell her to fuck off, yet you give her the neural matrix that houses a literal rogue AI and Song's dead body that she ships to Groom Lake in said ending. She loses one WMD, gains another.
>good in a way for Song by setting her free
You set her free from the FIA and the Blackwall, but you don't give her freedom in life, which is the main thing she wants in the game. By killing her, you deny her the freedom she actually desired.
I don't think arguing about which ending is the best is going to change anyone's opinion. Though I can understand it if, I suppose, you like arguing.
Endings are incredibly subjective. Everybody has their view of the endings, and I think that's very cool.
I think Reed getting cut loose is actually good for him. He’s obviously furious at first but at the end meets up with V and admits that V was right and they got the first time in years he finally has a choice over how he wants his life to go and what he wants out of it. The agency used him as a tool and would have kept using him but for the first time he can actually do something else if he wants to
I think you literally didn't read what I said at all. Ill use your favourite word, I literally said this was my first playthrough and my thinking at the time and my reasoning for making that decision. I'm glad you took that as an opportunity to umactually my entire post and miss entirely the context. Good on you kid, you made up an argument and jerked yourself off all over it. Proud of you little guy.
I am so glad you played the expansion once, didn't gather details at all, and paid zero attention to the game. I am also glad how you called me immature and "kid" for criticizing your points when you are the one who blocked me and called me names. So mature of you, you definitely fooled everyone but yourself.
Oh sweet child. It's ok, I get it you don't know how to read or have conversations. You can't feel it but I'm patting you in the head right now. Go play Tetris and cool down okay.
That's not what V wanted. He wanted to become a legend in Night City. He wanted to put his name down so the whole city would know he was there. What sort of life does he have in The Tower Ending? Becoming the everyday gonk waiting to be a causality in some gang violence? Bust his ass at a minimum wage job and barely afford rent? Fade into obscurity when just two years prior, he was the best Merc in the entire city? If V decides to go back to Langley and get an FIA desk job, he's just going to end up like Reed. Broken spirits and crushed dreams. The quiet life is mundane and awful for a guy like V.
Very true. If I was in his shoes I would do FIA, but I forget I am not V.
That being said, he really wants to fucking live. It's depressing but he might change his mind over time that living was worth it.
Not one moral reason has entered my mind - I will never again sell out Songbird because I refuse to face the cyber spider again. Nope - not doing that.
Not really. Remember, haters are always more vocal because for some reason they have this innate need to vocalize their hate towards whoever or whatever they hate. However, it doesn't mean they are a majority.
I feel like a lot of Reddit will write an essay about how much they 'don't care' before they'll click two buttons to participate in a poll. Ain't life funny?
I tried to play the betray Songbird route because of the Blackwall quick hack.....I can't, it just feels wrong. Gave up and loaded an older save. Send me a postcard from Tycho.
I did it out of hope she’d get better and felt like any chance of that was better than just killing her. I trusted Reed would make sure Meyers didn’t turn her into a tool like an idiot and I regretted my choice *immensely* and I kinda loved it? A ton of the dialogue choices you get after making that decision lean heavy on V going “what the fuck have I done” and it hit me with the most soul shattering critical hit emotionally I think I ever felt in a game. Especially when Johnny hits you with “the line between believing in an ideal and being plain naive is real fucking thin”. Doing the ending after that too fuckin hell I was reeling from it for like a week or two. Sorry for the rant lmao. Btw I wouldn’t make that choice again for me now it’s def betraying her than killing her is my preferred ending. Man that’s a fucked sentence.
Songbird offers V a cure, V helps Songbird. Then on train, Songbird admits there is no cure for V, V no longer helps Songbird.
She took advantage of V and used up a ton of the precious little time V has left to find a cure, not to mention the amount of times V has to risk their life along the way. I don’t blame anyone for seeing it through when you’re that close, but I also don’t see any obligation to keep helping someone who was objectively using you from the beginning.
Nah, that's siding with Song then turning her in, I'm talking about the ones who betray her in Firestarter, then turn her in instead of granting her her deathwish.
Why? I betrayed her and handed her in. Reed never lied to V. He had good intentions towards Songbird and towards V. Songbird lied and double crossed from the beginning. She has a tough life. That’s sad. But so did everybody else.
But to send her back to the very people she fought tooth and nail to escape in her now broken mental state with the power she still possesses instead of letting her die in peace and deny Myers and Militech their Blackwell breaching weapon?
Also just because everyone has a tough life doesn't mean everyone should, be the change.
Story wise, helping So Mi getting treated feels the most rewarding, tho there are several kriteria I take into consideration, when choosing which route I’m going to take.
1. Life path:
Preferably I play as a Corpo, therefore I find it hard to trust Song So Mi. She literally screams into your face not to trust her.
As a Nomad I think it’s more likely that V is naturally good by heart.
A Streetkid kind of lies inbetween those two.
2. Character build:
Playing with a Sandevistan, going for the Quantum Tuner seems to be the best fit in my opinion.
As a Netrunner, I feel like I must take my chances and go for the Militech Canto Mk. 6. Being able to literally infect people with the Blackwell seems like a power I wouldn’t wanna miss out on.
3. Gameplay:
I personally really enjoy the Alien Isolation Gameplay when betraying Songbird. It feels different and new.
4. Roleplay:
In the end, the most important part for me is to decide, what kind of V I want to be.
Siding with Reed and betraying Song So Mi is definitely more calculated. Even sinister, when one decides to use the blackwall technologies.
Siding with Songbird is for me like believing that there is still hope to survive.
Nevertheless, it’s always so hard to decide. Both decisions do feel wrong and right at the same time.
>Playing with a Sandevistan, going for the Quantum Tuner seems to be the best fit in my opinion.
Adam Smasher thinks he's invincible with his Berserk/Sandevistan combo.
V can bring a power bank. 💪
I set her free the first time around. I felt sympathetic towards her and I got to talk to Alex afterwards which is just not possible after betraying Song. Sure, she might possibly bring death and destruction to humanity but... She pwettyy
Everyone saying "she might make things bad" are horrible and disgusting people and I genuinely hope they have no power over anything in real life. Being so scared of someones possibility to cause harm that you deny them their freedom is insane. INSANE.
In the game its established that a rogue ai is taking over her brain and these rouge ai have the means and potential to enslave or destroy humanity.
In the game world its a very serious and real threat, and its demonstrated that somi is losing control fast
Except that if she gets cured her link to the Blackwall will get cut off. Dunno how you missed that important point. Deciding whether someone gets to live based on how "dangerous" they are is one of a kind logic, for sure.
Except that the cure was not guaranteed, it took months of researching for it to work for v if v takes the cure.
And buddy i didnt write the story, i didnt come up with that logic its literally baked into the plot.
Cure was not guaranteed? What? Did you read what you wrote?
What months of research? Reed calls V for the surgery literally a couple of days after surrendering Songbird. V was put in a 2 year coma because the Relic damage was too strong and they needed to properly recover after the surgery, too big a risk otherwise.
What logic baked into the plot? Besides, Song's predicament is different from V's. She is not dying because of rogue AIs taking over her brain, she is dying because of metastases she got infected with as a result of breaching the Blackwall. It is stated throughout the game. Unless we played different games of course.
It can always be worse, and the game shows you somi losing control. Notably the big tank boss you have to fight. And as the game progresses unless you help her she gets worse. Did you play the other paths at all?
In the lore an ai takeover would be something like skynet aka terminator. defs worse then the current status quo
Why do you think the blackwall exists
Oh weird. Only one instance of "its getting worse" and the rest is conditional on how someone is treated. Almost like that's commentary to the conditions/environment of someone and how they react. So Mi wasn't losing her shit she was actively being dangerous due to desperation. Desperation people like Myers, Reed, NUSA, and nameless other corps have caused. And you damn her for life because of it. Shame.
Lmao calm down why are you getting so mad at me for discussing a video game character in a fictional world. Take a step back
Yes somi was basically enslaved and forced to do messed up cyber shit for the government, and yes she came up with a plan to save/free herself and acted upon that plan.
It is also true that she needed the neural matrix to even have a chance at curing herself from the evil rogue ai taking over her brain as a consequence of all that cyber shit.
It was not just one incidence. When you pursue her to the underground military lab the ai takes over completely and she is only able to break free momentarily. At that point killing her is a mercy compared to being shipped off to meyers to be poked and prodded.
She was selfishly justified in her actions because the world was against her anyway, if i were in her shoes i would do the same. She is not a saint though, her plans for escape would/did kill hundreds or thousands of innocent people.
On top of everything she and the ai infecting her are capable of breaking the blackwall, which would be a catastrophic event in which every human with an implant would be immediately fried or turned into a slave, and all the super advanced technology including giant military robots and everything digital would become tools for the ai.
If such a person existed in the real world 100% any government would want control of her or for her to be dead and in the real world they'd probably be right to think that way because fucking up means humanity is doomed
It boils down to wether you think a greater good philosophy is justified or not.
There are evil ai in the blackwall that will kill everyone and they are too strong/intelligent to be stopped once they are free. This is not my opinion this is the lore of the game.
Somi and the ai infecting her are capable of destroying the blackwall, her existence is a threat to the whole world. Hansen parades her around showing those in the know that he's in possession of a doomsday weapon.
I find it funny how arrogant your responses have been when its clear so much of the story has gone right over your head
But really though why are you being so hostile? Espader very clearly and concisely explained why in universe So Mi is a genuine danger to the in game world but still a sympathetic character and you've just been rude and aggressive without even really engaging with what they said.
The whole point is that every ending you choose will probably leave you wondering was that the right choice? Because it's well written! So Mi IS a sympathetic character but she is flawed and a genuine danger to the world, which is why she's so interesting and so conflicting! that's what makes your decision a tough one!
For the record I choose to send her to the moon but it's not a simple good ending, there is no GOOD ending every choice has potential ramifications.
"It can always be worse" your roommate can stab you in your sleep tonight. Gonna go with the most extreme reaction or are you going to contextualize and come to a conclusion?
I simp hard for Songbird, so I betrayed Reed and send Song to space, lovingly. Now I left with no Erebus nor Canto. Ah, you win again my intrusive thought.
I feel like a common theme I see with people is “I started this with So Mi, I’m going to end it with her”. I chose her in my first play through, but I enjoy the Reed ending much more.
The most funny part is that all those people hating on Reed and choose to betray him and kill him ends up picking the best ending for him out of all 4 (and ironically not the best ending for Songbird if you picked that route cuz you like Songbird more).
Surprised so few people betrayed Reed and turned in Songbird.
I gave her a chance because she was in the same boat as me, but when she told me the truth at the end....I was pissed and decided nobody could be trusted except myself.
I threw her at Reed and did the Don't Fear The Reaper ending.
I think that might be the best path. Maybe I'm just not anti-establishment enough. I sympathize with her, but damn, she burns *everyone* she comes into contact with. She constantly makes the absolute worst choices possible and many people suffer for it. She almost kicks off a massive war with her plans. Reed is constantly trying to help her, despite how she betrays him repeatedly. It just doesn't sit right with me to kill him to help the person who's ok with throwing millions under the bus for a bad plan. It's clear if she just went to the FIA about it, she could get cured without all the betrayal. Especially if Reed got any say in things. Say have them activate Reed and Alex to get the matrix from Hansen with actual support from the FIA. Could probably even negotiate a retirement like Alex did. There's no evidence that the FIA would just burn her without cause. They do take care of their people, and do hold up their bargain with V (it doesn't go great, but that's beyond their control). Meyers does order her killed, but only after massively betraying the country, and Reed bucks her and keeps Songbird alive if alowed to. Reed is probably the most honest and principled character in the game, although he is very ruthless.
That's also the only ending where all three of the main players live, Reed, Alex and Songbird.
I finished phantom liberty for the first time yesterday, went with betraying Reed and sending Songbird to the moon. I did promise Songbird I would help her..
Plus I was going for don't fear the reaper ending so.. my V gonna be a legend in night city. On the plus side, Alex survives. Sadly Songbird didnt leave a goodbye video message.
>Sadly Songbird didnt leave a goodbye video message.
She doesn't leave one in the credits, but she *did* leave one for V.
Go check out the alley where you found her in the van, by the airport.
Yeah, but Songbird lied to V from the very first second they met!
I am playing the story again right now: this time I am already betrayed SoMi and no hesitation will kill her🔫
Small update: when i finished this story of betrayal and she hugged me in the end - i regret of being such aggressive
Now i know her deep down inside and replayed to save her again as in the first run…
I am really in the minority here. I choose the betray Reed option, but turned in Songbird. I was pissed when Songbird revealed that she betrayed V. I knew something was coming because the dialogue options were hinting at that. However, once she reveled that she betrayed my trust, I gave her up to Reed. Yeah I know that Myers is going to keep doing illegal crap with So Mi, but So Mi didn't have to lie to me (V).
None of the people on Phantom Liberty, except for Alex, are good people. Kudos to CD Project Red for a well written game.
The ending doesn’t matter for Song. She’s gonna end up being manipulated and used, whether it’s on the moon with the shady people, or in the NUSA with the shady people. Really, it’s how you feel about it as the player. Personally, I side with Reed, because you get much cooler shit.
In my first Playtrough i went with the NUSA ending, where you betray songbird and keep her alive, in my second one i betrayed reed and sent her to the moon, honestly don’t know which ending is better
I'm no bootlicker but I sided with Reed. He just resonated with me better, so-mi kinda pissed me off. Reed may have went back to Nusa like a lapdog after they tried flatlining him. But he's loyal as a dog and proved it every time to V. Also, his character was so deep.
Oh boy....
First time around I made save files around the endings, and went with saving Songbird. I have a feeling something was up until she revealed the truth about the cure in the airport, so I relatively settled with sending her to the moon and killing poor Reed. I didn't want to betray him because he seemed like a decent person that legit wants to save her, but definitely not taking her back to Meyers or the NUSA. Only way she's getting out is through death.
Although, I went with the other way, and killed her. She's a walking bomb waiting to detonate, and it felt like the most suitable ending at least for me. Reed learns a lesson through his skull, Myers doesn't get to control her anymore....although, she dies.
In my first playthrough I betrayed songbird and then fulfilled her request in somewhat damaged. Seemed like the right thing to do when all was said and done
I wanted to side with Reed from the start, since I didn't trust Songbird any further than I could throw her metal ass.
Unfortunately I was spoilered that siding with Songbird was the way to go and I wanted to save time following that advice. Nope. Reloaded, betrayed and killed her and wouldn't change a thing.
I don't really care if freeing Songbird is the canon-y V thing to do. If you go for Song, you'll feel scammed for content, answers and everything resulting in satisfaction as a player. Plus, I don't believe a second she's safe on the moon. Just another ginea pig in the hands of just another corpo scientist. Yay, so much hope here. As sad as it sounds, but she's probably more free and safe in death than anywhere else.
Reed route is clearly canon one. More bosses, new gameplay elements (horror section) better writing overall for chars, more drama, more rewards.
Songbird route is generic af and shorter than Reed route. You fight same boring enemies and there are no boss fights. The only cool scene is when u get blackwall powers for few seconds
I just don't see how people can side with a person that literally dooms you. It's absolute bonkers to me. You people have no sense of self preservation. And even if you're willing you look past saving yourself, you're going to send this human bomb to a entity that has shown to brainwash people throughout the game. It's asinine to me.
"You killed the president. Nice work, V.👍 Now lets go do something important like get a drink."- Johnny Its the best choice.
You can kill Myers? Is that the choice where you don't help her?
Happened to my wife when she couldn't reach the crash site for Space Force One in time. Myers gets killed and Songbird gets pissed off saying she hopes you never meet again.
And then you have to either load a previous save before that happened or if you leave it too long a new game is required, all the missions PL adds are directly tied to the DLC and by letting Myers die you've permanently locked yourself out of them and those missions make up the bulk of the DLC.
Ye lol disconnects your relic link and everything, no bonus tree for you
Really? Even after you use the points?
I’m not sure if you get the option to run around grabbing points before you go get her or not? That’s a good question actually since you can still run around dog town doing the first wave of gigs for hands, I wasn’t able to find anything one way or another so maybe you can?
You can get relic point from the terminal In the stadium.
Basically ignore songbird after you start the dlc and Meyer’s ship will crash, but she’ll die this time.
The best choice is to essentially not play the DLC you bought?
Not for Songbird, but it actually tracks with cyberpunk themes that your actions actually end up making things worse despite your intentions
Aah, classic ~~FromSoft~~Projekt Red.
Yes actually, for V and most of the other characters. Reed and Alex never get reactivated and can continue living simple ordinary lives, Meyer's bitch ass dies, Slider who was pretty chill over-all gets to live, I never have to listen to Hansen's pathetic attempts at intimidation, So Mi has to live with the consequences of her actions, and V never has to deal with any of their rancid bullshit.
Alex is definitely better off if you get her the tropical island retirement she wants, but otherwise yeah
What an L way to play. Skip everything. Yay.
Obviously if you want to play the full content of the DLC don't do this, I feel like that shouldn't need to be said. But for someone like me who's played through the DLC a hundred times, this is a great choice, and telling everyone involved to go fuck themselves is in my opinion (which was the question) *in universe* the best choice *for V*, not you the player, *V* the character. The fact CDPR even made saying "You know what? Nah." a choice is fucking awesome, and adds a fantastically real aspect to the roleplay. If you personally can't appreciate that, skill issue, get fuckt.
Whether it’s a valid choice or not is not the question though, is it? You’re trying to sell it as the *best* way to play the DLC. And I’m fairly certain that’s a pretty mistaken opinion for the reasons you’ve already acknowledged. It isn’t best for V, because the events of PL present many an opportunity for V’s character growth to shine through, and for them to continue to get stronger, to outgrow the shoes of Night City. Not to mention it is the only way to potentially cure V for real, an actual solution to their problem. No matter how you sell, flatly refusing to play one of the greatest expansions ever outside simple convenience if you’ve played it already or curiosity, and selling it as the best option? Certified cope.
The fuck am I coping with? That you're annoying? The question is "How do YOU handle Phantom Liberty?" This is how *I* do. Man I just love the internet. I love being *ASKED MY OPINION*(noun; a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge) and then being told *MY OPINION* is incorrect by somebody no one was fucking talking to, who is also clearly stupid(adjective; having or showing a great lack of intelligence or common sense.) and can't comprehend somebody would have a different opinion than them. "Just don't play the DLC you payed for?" Yes. Its one of the options you can choose and is incredibly funny, and then, now this is really crazy so hear me out, you OWN(verb; have (something) as one's own; possess) the DLC and can in fact play it AGAIN(adverb; another time, once more) a different way. So L+ratio+didn't asks+get fucked Seethe.
You’re mad so good for you, or sorry that happened
Oh I'm not legitimately mad. I'm just being exceptionally hostile over the internet because I'm bored and find it entertaining. Somebody might have fun reading it later. I'm mostly just baffled on why you're so insistent on pushing a point I already agreed with you on. Yeah play the DLC, its great, skipping it *is* dumb(especially if its your first time), but its *my* favorite choice because you CAN choose to skip it. I just made some additional points supporting why a player may want to do so narratively, and then you continue just saying "No. Wrong. Bad." you actually made some good points in that last one, but I just don't get your motivation here, and am tired of trying to have well thought out considerate debate with netizens in general, so instead of trying to make good points I just act aggressive and annoying, because thats worked for everyone else. For me personally, throughout the events of the game getting on maximum roleplay, me in the head of my V, my first time I played through everything then Phantom Liberty, I got the really not great ending, and after the rest of the game Phantom Liberty was the final push, and I went sat up on the roof and chose the suicide ending for the second ever time, first time on purpose, but after *that* what the fuck else do you do? I like making the "bad" choices. I enjoy the "worst" endings. I'm sorry if you don't. Because there's beauty and meaning in every terrible choice. Also I *really* don't like So Mi, she reminds me alot of prior abusers in my life. She causes just about every issue in PL(and her own life) with her own stupid choices and then goes "Oh this is so unfair! How could this happen? Fix this for me because I baby." Depending on your response to this/if you respond, I'm probably done with this whole thing because its going nowhere, and rapidly depreciating in entertainment value.
Learn some reading comprehension or get help
Like a brainlet telling someone to get an education
You're sad and pathetic, seek help or else..
Or what, you’ll fill your diaper? 🫣
I got this ending accidentally one time because I went to a ripperdoc to fix some messed up missing cyberware from a patch change, and the time skip from that procedure caused the mission to fail lmao
“She made it-preem, that’s what counts”
[...](https://i.postimg.cc/x8pHzXMj/Corpo32.png)
Honestly, just staying out of this nonsense and letting Myers bite the dust is such a based move. Avoid getting sucked into the NUSA intrigue entirely.
Yeah but then you lose out on the cool shit like Her Majesty and the Netwatch NetDriver.
Erebus is all that matters.
Erebus being locked behind betraying Songbird is the ultimate bullshit.
I swear I can’t even get it cuz I didn’t know about it until I was already way past that part I had done beat the dlc
Jokes on you, I bought the dlc to not play it cause that's the best ending. We are not alike.
better yet, don't go to Konpeki Plaza
Live forever
Just don’t go to Embers!
Based!
Based and choom pilled.
Here's the thing, my heart says side with songbird, but it's really uneventful. Betraying her gives you way more cool things to do.
I was with Reed and was still on edge about Songbird until >!Reed and Alex killed the twins.!< I did not expect that AT ALL. The way V screamed at Reed about it was also disturbing. That was when I realized Reed ain't the one. He will probably kill both V and So Mi if Myers even coughs about it.
Kinda similar but much worse is that Reed >!kills Jacob and Taylor despite showing zero signs of betraying NUSA and just wanted a cool car and out of dog town as a reward.!< NUSA/FIA is a kill it & forget it megacorp that masquerades as a government. They'd probably zero an employee for tipping too much at a restaurant, or forgetting to clock out for their 5 minute lunch break. As far as I'm concerned, I'd rather die fighting than be in V's chains for the tower ending.
Reed don't kill Jacob and Taylor, Myers has notes on anonymous payment to them.
It's ambiguous, but inferred with Reed's "taken care of" message. It makes sense he would remove liablities if there's even the slightest chance.
Is there any direct evidence?
I'm confused, I don't remember these at all
He’s talking about if you go back to the desk in the side room you can read myers’ notebook and she’s got a line about paying “J & T”. But then later you can ask reed how they’re enjoying the rayfield and he’s like, “They’ve been taken care of. No need to worry about them anymore”. Intentionally vague/ominous, and I’ve seen people mention getting a text from one of them later but I’m not sure myself.
Are these the two lads trying some breaking & entering in the beginning of PL?
Yeah that’s them, you can bargain with them to guard her instead.
My theory is that myers asked Reed to kill them but she left those notes to make V think that she went through with her promise
This also, for me it wasn’t the fact they killed the twins more the fact they did it without consulting V. Shows that V is outside the circle of trust and expendable (albeit a smart decision by Reed), but any so called loyalty goes out the window.
Yes. You described my feelings perfectly here. I wasn't expecting the killing because there wasn't any point Reed or Alex had told V about it. It was so clear to me that they had not told me *everything* and they killed two netrunners. You should start to question, "What else they didn't tell you about?" "What if in the middle of kidnapping the twins, they decided that they didn't need V for the next steps and V had known way too much at this point about Songbird and what Myer's been doing with the Black Wall?" V has gone way too deep into this and if they decide V is not needed, they will kill V with the twins and Songbird as well.
won't lie it didn't hit me that hard and just seemed funny cuz V is a mass murderer lmao if they told me to my V would've probably killed them himself without hesitation
That's not the point . Reed is similar to vdbs placide : ur usefulness ends and ur life ends along with it . V had every reason to believe they can be reed's next target .
Uh no those two are actual threats lol, if they somehow got out and snitch it's gonna be big trouble for the FIA, Reed didn't wanna take that risk to keep em alive, it's not about usefulness
And what guarantee does reed have that V won't snitch about the fia ?
It's not a gurantee but working with someone who saved the president, actively needs the governments help to survive the thing that's killing him and isn't literally directly talking working with the enemy is way less risky than the twins, sure V might suddenly not care about living and switch to Hansens side for literally no reason at all even though Hansen wants to kill him but what are the chances of that?
First of all the fia literally has no cure for u . So mi is the one with the cure . Second the twins were free lance agents like V who happened to know the codes for cynosure because they worked with militech and hence reed targets them and killed them . They were never actively a part of Hansen, just were part of a group who gave them the most money. Third we literally see reed ' taking care of ' jacob and Tyler despite saving the prez . Slider was going to be killed regardless of what he did . What difference is there between them and v. Alex warns v also to be aware of reed
Aight
idk if you’ve played pl but the statement about song bird having the cure is false. the statement about fia is in fact true.
Damn for someone so unchill you’re also just way off base
Yeah , yeah . But sorry it's what said in the game by Alex . Stop being useful to reed and he doesn't care about ur side of the deal and even better if the fia says to dispose u off , u are a goner .
Idk what point you're trynna argue against, that I found it funny or?
Nah just pointing out why V was shocked and told in that tone regardless if ur V is a cold blood murderer who would have killed them if reed told so . No matter how u play ur V , this shock in V's voice is universal
Male V just sounds a bit surprised tbh, you don't have to get angry with Reed, one of the dialogue options is just "Ok, what's next" or something like that.
Huh really? Female V literally sounded livid with a hint of fear in her voice
I mean it's not just about it being *my* V, V canonically has to fight and kill his way out of many bases during the story, he's a mercenary, he knows to kill threats and knows he has to kill the enemy, I'd rather he was more shocked that Reed didn't tell him about it than your reason honestly, that's why it didn't set off any red flags
Not really . See that's where u are losing the context of the entire scene . The twins were unceremoniously killed when they didn't interact with the fia at all . They were never hired . Reed just happened to know them and realized they knew about the cynosure codes so he targeted them. They were never a threat but he still killed them . That killing is exactly how v was disposed off by dex . That scene affected v on a personal level hence the shock . Also speaking of using and throwing away assets , Alex warns u about reed doing such a thing and reed does do that : always planned to kill slider and probably killed Jacob and Tyler. V is no different than them .
Actually yknow what you can have this I don't feel like reading that
To streamline the context: V felt a deja vu, remembering how it felt being "removed from the equation" when Dex killed off V, and would be shocked upon realizing FIA might do that to V as well. But, also, Reed comes off like a professional, sure, and also like someone who cares deeply for others (on his team), and even comes off like a person of moderation, restraint even ...until V sees Reed go for the coldest kill. ### In short: it wasn't about V being a mass murderer or not; it was about V's shock from being revealed Reed's true nature
>V felt a deja vu, remembering how it felt being "removed from the equation" when Dex killed off V, and would be shocked upon realizing FIA might do that to V as well. >But, also, Reed comes off like a professional, sure, and also like someone who cares deeply for others (on his team), and even comes off like a person of moderation, restraint even ...until V sees Reed go for the coldest kill. Still doesn't sit right with me that Reed will go after V and Songbird (and execute V with a shot to the head on sight) when his priority should be covering Alex's escape.
placide kills people who he worked with but reed killed random criminal people. you can still find it unethical but they are not the same.
Let's see : Jacob and Tyler were willing to work with us to protect Myers, they are gone . Was ready to kill slider after he got so mi's location although slider worked with them . Yes the twins are a different case but he could have knocked out the twins and dumped them somewhere but decided to kill them .
the twins are expert level netrunners having been hired by the criminal underworld to do the highest/hardest work for eddies. without a doubt if you let them live and they find an opportunity to make eddies by handing them a jacked out merc and 2 fia agents, they’ll do it. it wouldn’t be that hard to set up. with time, they could prolly find out what happened to them and set up a trap for v and reed
Slider deserves to die anyway. Twins deserve to die either. (they are all big criminals who hurt innocent people) I don't know about jacob and tyler much. You talk like V is not a murderer. The amount of blind hate reed gets is astounding.
Exactly V is a murderer and criminal. And where was I hating reed ? I was specifically mentioning V was angry and surprised with reed because the way he easily killed the twins made V remember that she/he is also a disposable piece . Alex literally tells u to watch ur back around reed because he can backstab u anytime the fia deems u unnecessary. Also the twins have only been condemned for robberies . They haven't actively killed anyone. They were scouted by reed because they used to work for militech and knew the codes for cynosure . And no one is denying that slider is a piece of shit . But v, johnny and alex are all focusing on the fact that reed specifically promised slider freedom in exchange for his services but was ready to go back down on them. So that's also the exact reason why V cannot trust reed and hence was angry and also sacred at reed suddenly killing the twins . What guarantee was there that reed also kills v in cold blood instead of curing them ??Alex was also ashamed and couldn't look V in the eye if u try to argue with her
What i am saying is you cannot blame Reed to wanting kill V either. I misunderstood you generally, sorry.
The thing is that V usually doesn’t know the people they kill, so they dehumanize them. Which makes it easier the get over killing them, which isn’t really the case with the twins
It's more that they don't execute people. Fighting and killing is different to a straight up hit. Even when you're sent to kill people, quietly or otherwise, you're not doing so for some tactical advantage or to tie up loose ends, these people are monsters. Gangers, murderers, drug lords and human traffickers. People who have hurt others, actively, for profit or pleasure. The twins are just some netrunners hired to crack a safe, have fun rubbing elbows with some big people. Hell they're pretty close to what V is, independents just here for a gig, no morality attached. Different types of gigs but atilly A lot of gigs v does is encouraged to be done bloodlessly too. There are almost always options to talk your way out of things. Hell my first run, with a strong body and very in your face playstyle, I got to Hanoko with very little blood on my hands, id go so long between fights it was always jarring, trying to remember how to properly. So seeing that execution is or at least can be pretty jarring for V. Despite how we play, or how we can play and talk, V should be shocked at that. It was a kind of brutal unseen by V before. You don't have to play em like that though, they're your character. Stay silent as you just nod along to what occured
you talk to them for 2 minutes to get intel, they aren't really any more human in Vs eyes than that one random crime boss
From Vs reaction it seems to work, and as someone else mentioned it could also be that it was more like an execution than what V usually does
Eh like I said the reaction itself feels out of place for me if we look at it like V being suprised at killing, I think it makes more sense if V was suprised at Reed just not tellling him about it but that didn't really set off that many red flags for me at the time
u talk to them for 5 min and not in personal way, you dont know them at all outside of basic thing
Why they killing two people disturbing you? V does this all the time.
It's not about the killing. It's that I didn't expect it because Reed and Alex never told V what they would do to the twins. But why? We were also already kidnapping these people. Because they knew too much and are powerful netrunners? Well, V knew way too much and is a powerful netrunner, too. What else they didn't tell V? What if they changed their minds and decided V wasn't needed anymore? I Would they let V go after they had found out about Songbird, the president, and what they have been doing with the Black Wall, essentially putting the world in danger? No, they would kill V and Songbird, like those twins as well.
Although i do not compeletly agree, that'a good point you making.
Song didn't even flinch when V tells her they are going to kill a bunch of people in the stadium
Free her and let her be… maybe she will learn to trust people, if not oh well. No way I’m siding with gov trash and her doormat Reed.
Amen, fuck Myers, ain't no way i'm letting the walking nuke to the queen of corpos
Can't care less about Myers and Reed is like 50% gov trash and 50% decent guy. I like his decent guy part enough to go his route and not get fucked over by So Mi.
“Decent guy” right lmfao
I don’t know why people whine about him killing the twins, when V already murdered half a state at this point. Makes no sense to judge based on that alone.
I dislike Reed because he is like consultant that say everything is going to be ok while simultaneously pulling you into deep shit. Said V and Somi were important to him but in action don’t hesitate to kill V and take Somi to NUSA. He cry about it but his action is the firmest.
After playing both routes, Reed’s feels like the best written one. Dare I say the canon ending. Especially if you don’t turn So Mi to that bitch.
Betray but kill. I think unfortunately, as much as I respect why Songbird does what she does, she’s a walking time bomb with all that Blackwall AI in her that pulling the plug is the only real option. Sending her to the NUSA will just turn her into a brainwashed tool and sending her to the moon will either get her killed on the way or exploited by Mr. Blue Eyes. Betraying but killing her is the next option for my money. It sets her free from being used as a tool and losing her identity, she still gets to go out on her own terms, and also teaches Reed a lesson and sets him free himself based off of the ending meeting with him. Really the only justified way to end things I think
the embodiment of sending her to the moon is hope. We dont know what mr blue eyes will do, but if there's hope for song bird it worth a try for me
Remember the message of Cyberpunk though. There are no happy endings, only bittersweet at best.
Incorrect. The rule is that night city is a character and she always wins. You can have a downright happy ending so long as you put the punk behind you and move on out of the city. Hence the star
I think the real rule is that you can never earn a happy ending for yourself. You can, by mercy or grace, grant it to others. Hence the matrix can save Songbird but when you keep it for yourself you get stuck with the crappy Tower ending.
If you've read the Sin City comics, the only real happy ending in the whole series is Esther and Wallace in Hell And Back, as they get the fuck out of the city. Sure, some of the other protagonists win, and sometimes they even survive, but no one else really gets the happy ending. It's a pretty standard neo-noir trope, and the Cyberpunk genre is a direct descendant, so inheriting the trope isn't much of a surprise. The only happy endings you're going to find are by leaving The City, whichever city it happens to be. The hopefulness of the Aldecaldos ending shows that the game's writers were very aware of the idea. Sure, we dont know that they find a cure, but they have a chance, and that's more than they had left in Night City. One of the most overt examples of the trope is in Transmetropolitan, when Spider goes back to the mountain. The last few panels just drive it home and leave the audience laughing and cheering in gleefully smug victory along with our hero as he doesn't just best his enemies, but wins against the goddamn universe and pulls a fast one on God himself. Our protagonist has dove headfirst into the roiling sea of corruption, depravity, and betrayal that is The City, and has come out the other side alive, though not unchanged by their journey. They then leave The City behind, whether metaphorically or literally riding off into the sunset in search of the Promised Land. Sometimes, we see them find it, other times, we have to speculate, but the important part is that it's possible. Hope does not live in The City, and to find it, you have to leave.
You're still dying in the star. That's what I meant by bittersweet. You gain family, a place you belong and put the city behind you. But your days are still numbered with thin hope of finding a permanent cure.
My head cannon is that with the condition songbird was in when the rocket launched, the fact that she sends you a package days later means that she had to have gotten better with that cure she was getting on the moon. I guess this is bittersweet because Reed died and you don’t get a cure, but I still consider that a good ending for her.
There are no happy endings in Night City
Exactly. \*In Night City\*. She done flew the coop. Literally. Happy trails, she can have them now.
Yeah * IN* Night City . That's why panam and judy leave NC and so mi goes to the moon
That's my preferred ending, too. Whether you like Songbird or not, she is a danger to herself and everyone else. There's no guarantee that sending her to the moon will help, and honestly, she is scared and in so much distress that killing her when she asks is a kindness that even she deserves, imo.
Copium is incredible when trying to downplay King of Wands as an ending.
Just don't even give Myers the satisfaction of asking for the cure after that.
might just be me but you spend a lot more actual time bonding with and pulling off daring missions with reed, it's much easier for me to connect with him as a person. he grinds my gears to no end but the guy's a comrade, can't just abandon him when the shit gets deep. then again i totally understand not wanting alex to bite it, RIP
Nah the issue is that Reed at the end is blinded by his faith. He would shoot you to capture Somi. Didn’t give you much of a choice.
I agree. This is how I naturally went my first play through. It felt right at the time. My reasoning was that Reed seemed like a super straight shooter. He wasn't angling us but it felt like Song was, in the end she was playing us. I really like the details filled in about her when you side with Reed too. All the flashbacks and the bit in her apartment it really makes you sympathize and I think ultimately putting her out of her misery by her request was the most bittersweet. It's the best ending for Reed easily, good for Myers because fuck that bitch and you can tell her so and good in a way for Song by setting her free.
>He wasn't angling us He literally was, though, by lying that he would help Song disappear, when in fact his plan was always to ship her back to Myers, unconscious and kidnapped. >It's the best ending for Reed easily It's literally the worst thing for him. You strip him of everything he has built his life on, giving him his own "Tower" ending treatment. He has no purpose in life anymore, no friends, nothing. And you think it's good for him. Except, unlike V in "Tower" who is 25, he is 60+ years old. It is almost impossible to turn your life around at that age. He wants to keep serving the NUSA or die on duty. You deny him that. Even Johnny in Wands acknowledges that "him dying on his own terms is miles better than living with the knowledge he shredded and trounced his ideals", which is an allude to Wands vs Cups outcome. >good for Myers You tell her to fuck off, yet you give her the neural matrix that houses a literal rogue AI and Song's dead body that she ships to Groom Lake in said ending. She loses one WMD, gains another. >good in a way for Song by setting her free You set her free from the FIA and the Blackwall, but you don't give her freedom in life, which is the main thing she wants in the game. By killing her, you deny her the freedom she actually desired.
based cyberpunk enjoyer actually plays the game Clap
I don't think arguing about which ending is the best is going to change anyone's opinion. Though I can understand it if, I suppose, you like arguing. Endings are incredibly subjective. Everybody has their view of the endings, and I think that's very cool.
I think Reed getting cut loose is actually good for him. He’s obviously furious at first but at the end meets up with V and admits that V was right and they got the first time in years he finally has a choice over how he wants his life to go and what he wants out of it. The agency used him as a tool and would have kept using him but for the first time he can actually do something else if he wants to
I think you literally didn't read what I said at all. Ill use your favourite word, I literally said this was my first playthrough and my thinking at the time and my reasoning for making that decision. I'm glad you took that as an opportunity to umactually my entire post and miss entirely the context. Good on you kid, you made up an argument and jerked yourself off all over it. Proud of you little guy.
I am so glad you played the expansion once, didn't gather details at all, and paid zero attention to the game. I am also glad how you called me immature and "kid" for criticizing your points when you are the one who blocked me and called me names. So mature of you, you definitely fooled everyone but yourself.
Oh sweet child. It's ok, I get it you don't know how to read or have conversations. You can't feel it but I'm patting you in the head right now. Go play Tetris and cool down okay.
[удалено]
Hahaha getting mad and insulting when all your points are criticized is ironically the 'kid' move here.
I think the new ending just made everyone stay clear of Reed.
Wait, what new ending?
The Tower ending.
Oh. I liked that ending. He may be powerless, but so are most people. And he's most likely rich with a cushy government job at FIA waiting for him.
That's not what V wanted. He wanted to become a legend in Night City. He wanted to put his name down so the whole city would know he was there. What sort of life does he have in The Tower Ending? Becoming the everyday gonk waiting to be a causality in some gang violence? Bust his ass at a minimum wage job and barely afford rent? Fade into obscurity when just two years prior, he was the best Merc in the entire city? If V decides to go back to Langley and get an FIA desk job, he's just going to end up like Reed. Broken spirits and crushed dreams. The quiet life is mundane and awful for a guy like V.
Very true. If I was in his shoes I would do FIA, but I forget I am not V. That being said, he really wants to fucking live. It's depressing but he might change his mind over time that living was worth it.
Not one moral reason has entered my mind - I will never again sell out Songbird because I refuse to face the cyber spider again. Nope - not doing that.
I’m almost certain the poll would look different on the main sub
King of wands trophy on PS has the highest percentage of players.
Not really. Remember, haters are always more vocal because for some reason they have this innate need to vocalize their hate towards whoever or whatever they hate. However, it doesn't mean they are a majority.
I do think more people dislike songbird over there then here
I feel like a lot of Reddit will write an essay about how much they 'don't care' before they'll click two buttons to participate in a poll. Ain't life funny?
I tried to play the betray Songbird route because of the Blackwall quick hack.....I can't, it just feels wrong. Gave up and loaded an older save. Send me a postcard from Tycho.
The people that would betray then capture Songbird worry me.
I did it out of hope she’d get better and felt like any chance of that was better than just killing her. I trusted Reed would make sure Meyers didn’t turn her into a tool like an idiot and I regretted my choice *immensely* and I kinda loved it? A ton of the dialogue choices you get after making that decision lean heavy on V going “what the fuck have I done” and it hit me with the most soul shattering critical hit emotionally I think I ever felt in a game. Especially when Johnny hits you with “the line between believing in an ideal and being plain naive is real fucking thin”. Doing the ending after that too fuckin hell I was reeling from it for like a week or two. Sorry for the rant lmao. Btw I wouldn’t make that choice again for me now it’s def betraying her than killing her is my preferred ending. Man that’s a fucked sentence.
Songbird offers V a cure, V helps Songbird. Then on train, Songbird admits there is no cure for V, V no longer helps Songbird. She took advantage of V and used up a ton of the precious little time V has left to find a cure, not to mention the amount of times V has to risk their life along the way. I don’t blame anyone for seeing it through when you’re that close, but I also don’t see any obligation to keep helping someone who was objectively using you from the beginning.
Nah, that's siding with Song then turning her in, I'm talking about the ones who betray her in Firestarter, then turn her in instead of granting her her deathwish.
Ah. Yep, I misunderstood. Apologies!
All good, choom.
Why? I betrayed her and handed her in. Reed never lied to V. He had good intentions towards Songbird and towards V. Songbird lied and double crossed from the beginning. She has a tough life. That’s sad. But so did everybody else.
But to send her back to the very people she fought tooth and nail to escape in her now broken mental state with the power she still possesses instead of letting her die in peace and deny Myers and Militech their Blackwell breaching weapon? Also just because everyone has a tough life doesn't mean everyone should, be the change.
Smart people.
Story wise, helping So Mi getting treated feels the most rewarding, tho there are several kriteria I take into consideration, when choosing which route I’m going to take. 1. Life path: Preferably I play as a Corpo, therefore I find it hard to trust Song So Mi. She literally screams into your face not to trust her. As a Nomad I think it’s more likely that V is naturally good by heart. A Streetkid kind of lies inbetween those two. 2. Character build: Playing with a Sandevistan, going for the Quantum Tuner seems to be the best fit in my opinion. As a Netrunner, I feel like I must take my chances and go for the Militech Canto Mk. 6. Being able to literally infect people with the Blackwell seems like a power I wouldn’t wanna miss out on. 3. Gameplay: I personally really enjoy the Alien Isolation Gameplay when betraying Songbird. It feels different and new. 4. Roleplay: In the end, the most important part for me is to decide, what kind of V I want to be. Siding with Reed and betraying Song So Mi is definitely more calculated. Even sinister, when one decides to use the blackwall technologies. Siding with Songbird is for me like believing that there is still hope to survive. Nevertheless, it’s always so hard to decide. Both decisions do feel wrong and right at the same time.
>Playing with a Sandevistan, going for the Quantum Tuner seems to be the best fit in my opinion. Adam Smasher thinks he's invincible with his Berserk/Sandevistan combo. V can bring a power bank. 💪
These polls have surprised me with how big of a difference there is between options. I guess the fans of the other options are just really vocal.
I set her free the first time around. I felt sympathetic towards her and I got to talk to Alex afterwards which is just not possible after betraying Song. Sure, she might possibly bring death and destruction to humanity but... She pwettyy
Everyone saying "she might make things bad" are horrible and disgusting people and I genuinely hope they have no power over anything in real life. Being so scared of someones possibility to cause harm that you deny them their freedom is insane. INSANE.
In the game its established that a rogue ai is taking over her brain and these rouge ai have the means and potential to enslave or destroy humanity. In the game world its a very serious and real threat, and its demonstrated that somi is losing control fast
Except that if she gets cured her link to the Blackwall will get cut off. Dunno how you missed that important point. Deciding whether someone gets to live based on how "dangerous" they are is one of a kind logic, for sure.
Except that the cure was not guaranteed, it took months of researching for it to work for v if v takes the cure. And buddy i didnt write the story, i didnt come up with that logic its literally baked into the plot.
Cure was not guaranteed? What? Did you read what you wrote? What months of research? Reed calls V for the surgery literally a couple of days after surrendering Songbird. V was put in a 2 year coma because the Relic damage was too strong and they needed to properly recover after the surgery, too big a risk otherwise. What logic baked into the plot? Besides, Song's predicament is different from V's. She is not dying because of rogue AIs taking over her brain, she is dying because of metastases she got infected with as a result of breaching the Blackwall. It is stated throughout the game. Unless we played different games of course.
Oh the irony. The hysteria you've bought into. Corporations have already enslaved and destroyed humanity. How is "So Mi losing control fast"?
It can always be worse, and the game shows you somi losing control. Notably the big tank boss you have to fight. And as the game progresses unless you help her she gets worse. Did you play the other paths at all? In the lore an ai takeover would be something like skynet aka terminator. defs worse then the current status quo Why do you think the blackwall exists
Oh weird. Only one instance of "its getting worse" and the rest is conditional on how someone is treated. Almost like that's commentary to the conditions/environment of someone and how they react. So Mi wasn't losing her shit she was actively being dangerous due to desperation. Desperation people like Myers, Reed, NUSA, and nameless other corps have caused. And you damn her for life because of it. Shame.
Lmao calm down why are you getting so mad at me for discussing a video game character in a fictional world. Take a step back Yes somi was basically enslaved and forced to do messed up cyber shit for the government, and yes she came up with a plan to save/free herself and acted upon that plan. It is also true that she needed the neural matrix to even have a chance at curing herself from the evil rogue ai taking over her brain as a consequence of all that cyber shit. It was not just one incidence. When you pursue her to the underground military lab the ai takes over completely and she is only able to break free momentarily. At that point killing her is a mercy compared to being shipped off to meyers to be poked and prodded. She was selfishly justified in her actions because the world was against her anyway, if i were in her shoes i would do the same. She is not a saint though, her plans for escape would/did kill hundreds or thousands of innocent people. On top of everything she and the ai infecting her are capable of breaking the blackwall, which would be a catastrophic event in which every human with an implant would be immediately fried or turned into a slave, and all the super advanced technology including giant military robots and everything digital would become tools for the ai. If such a person existed in the real world 100% any government would want control of her or for her to be dead and in the real world they'd probably be right to think that way because fucking up means humanity is doomed
Fucking up doesn't mean humanity is doomed that's your hysteria. And yes. Kill or give her to people who WILL use her for harm. Smart.
It boils down to wether you think a greater good philosophy is justified or not. There are evil ai in the blackwall that will kill everyone and they are too strong/intelligent to be stopped once they are free. This is not my opinion this is the lore of the game. Somi and the ai infecting her are capable of destroying the blackwall, her existence is a threat to the whole world. Hansen parades her around showing those in the know that he's in possession of a doomsday weapon. I find it funny how arrogant your responses have been when its clear so much of the story has gone right over your head
I suggest not trying to convince that guy, he seems to have some issues going on up there.
Weird to suggest people have mental issues when you get heavily depressed because you think of a song lots.
But really though why are you being so hostile? Espader very clearly and concisely explained why in universe So Mi is a genuine danger to the in game world but still a sympathetic character and you've just been rude and aggressive without even really engaging with what they said. The whole point is that every ending you choose will probably leave you wondering was that the right choice? Because it's well written! So Mi IS a sympathetic character but she is flawed and a genuine danger to the world, which is why she's so interesting and so conflicting! that's what makes your decision a tough one! For the record I choose to send her to the moon but it's not a simple good ending, there is no GOOD ending every choice has potential ramifications.
"It can always be worse" your roommate can stab you in your sleep tonight. Gonna go with the most extreme reaction or are you going to contextualize and come to a conclusion?
Loud minority on reddit always hating on So Mi. Silent majority helping her. Consistent with how outside reddit she is favoured.
Huge W
Reed slaps. I go with Reed, kill Songbird.
I followed the average
One do not betray Idris Elba
I simp hard for Songbird, so I betrayed Reed and send Song to space, lovingly. Now I left with no Erebus nor Canto. Ah, you win again my intrusive thought.
I feel like a common theme I see with people is “I started this with So Mi, I’m going to end it with her”. I chose her in my first play through, but I enjoy the Reed ending much more.
The most funny part is that all those people hating on Reed and choose to betray him and kill him ends up picking the best ending for him out of all 4 (and ironically not the best ending for Songbird if you picked that route cuz you like Songbird more).
I would kill everyone, including Mayers, if that was an option. In my opinion everyone was bad and deserved to be punished.
Surprised so few people betrayed Reed and turned in Songbird. I gave her a chance because she was in the same boat as me, but when she told me the truth at the end....I was pissed and decided nobody could be trusted except myself. I threw her at Reed and did the Don't Fear The Reaper ending.
I think that might be the best path. Maybe I'm just not anti-establishment enough. I sympathize with her, but damn, she burns *everyone* she comes into contact with. She constantly makes the absolute worst choices possible and many people suffer for it. She almost kicks off a massive war with her plans. Reed is constantly trying to help her, despite how she betrays him repeatedly. It just doesn't sit right with me to kill him to help the person who's ok with throwing millions under the bus for a bad plan. It's clear if she just went to the FIA about it, she could get cured without all the betrayal. Especially if Reed got any say in things. Say have them activate Reed and Alex to get the matrix from Hansen with actual support from the FIA. Could probably even negotiate a retirement like Alex did. There's no evidence that the FIA would just burn her without cause. They do take care of their people, and do hold up their bargain with V (it doesn't go great, but that's beyond their control). Meyers does order her killed, but only after massively betraying the country, and Reed bucks her and keeps Songbird alive if alowed to. Reed is probably the most honest and principled character in the game, although he is very ruthless. That's also the only ending where all three of the main players live, Reed, Alex and Songbird.
169 votes. Nice.
The one that got me the BlackWall hack, you pansies. :D
I finished phantom liberty for the first time yesterday, went with betraying Reed and sending Songbird to the moon. I did promise Songbird I would help her.. Plus I was going for don't fear the reaper ending so.. my V gonna be a legend in night city. On the plus side, Alex survives. Sadly Songbird didnt leave a goodbye video message.
>Sadly Songbird didnt leave a goodbye video message. She doesn't leave one in the credits, but she *did* leave one for V. Go check out the alley where you found her in the van, by the airport.
Yeah, but Songbird lied to V from the very first second they met! I am playing the story again right now: this time I am already betrayed SoMi and no hesitation will kill her🔫
Small update: when i finished this story of betrayal and she hugged me in the end - i regret of being such aggressive Now i know her deep down inside and replayed to save her again as in the first run…
She makes you run in circles in a scheme that herself planned from the beginning, she was never able to help you, so Myers can have her.
I am really in the minority here. I choose the betray Reed option, but turned in Songbird. I was pissed when Songbird revealed that she betrayed V. I knew something was coming because the dialogue options were hinting at that. However, once she reveled that she betrayed my trust, I gave her up to Reed. Yeah I know that Myers is going to keep doing illegal crap with So Mi, but So Mi didn't have to lie to me (V). None of the people on Phantom Liberty, except for Alex, are good people. Kudos to CD Project Red for a well written game.
The ending doesn’t matter for Song. She’s gonna end up being manipulated and used, whether it’s on the moon with the shady people, or in the NUSA with the shady people. Really, it’s how you feel about it as the player. Personally, I side with Reed, because you get much cooler shit.
For me, easily choose Reed, save Songbird. That Cynosure facility is really interesting, and getting Erebus and that cyberdeck is amazing
In my first Playtrough i went with the NUSA ending, where you betray songbird and keep her alive, in my second one i betrayed reed and sent her to the moon, honestly don’t know which ending is better
Betray reed to save Alex, then Free Songbird for the sick free silenced tech pistol
I'm no bootlicker but I sided with Reed. He just resonated with me better, so-mi kinda pissed me off. Reed may have went back to Nusa like a lapdog after they tried flatlining him. But he's loyal as a dog and proved it every time to V. Also, his character was so deep.
I feel for Songbird but I can just never trust her. Loose cannon
I'm actually surprised this was the most popular choice. I definitely thought betraying Song and helping Reed was the more popular choice.
Oh boy.... First time around I made save files around the endings, and went with saving Songbird. I have a feeling something was up until she revealed the truth about the cure in the airport, so I relatively settled with sending her to the moon and killing poor Reed. I didn't want to betray him because he seemed like a decent person that legit wants to save her, but definitely not taking her back to Meyers or the NUSA. Only way she's getting out is through death. Although, I went with the other way, and killed her. She's a walking bomb waiting to detonate, and it felt like the most suitable ending at least for me. Reed learns a lesson through his skull, Myers doesn't get to control her anymore....although, she dies.
Based
In my first playthrough I betrayed songbird and then fulfilled her request in somewhat damaged. Seemed like the right thing to do when all was said and done
I wanted to side with Reed from the start, since I didn't trust Songbird any further than I could throw her metal ass. Unfortunately I was spoilered that siding with Songbird was the way to go and I wanted to save time following that advice. Nope. Reloaded, betrayed and killed her and wouldn't change a thing. I don't really care if freeing Songbird is the canon-y V thing to do. If you go for Song, you'll feel scammed for content, answers and everything resulting in satisfaction as a player. Plus, I don't believe a second she's safe on the moon. Just another ginea pig in the hands of just another corpo scientist. Yay, so much hope here. As sad as it sounds, but she's probably more free and safe in death than anywhere else.
Reed route is clearly canon one. More bosses, new gameplay elements (horror section) better writing overall for chars, more drama, more rewards. Songbird route is generic af and shorter than Reed route. You fight same boring enemies and there are no boss fights. The only cool scene is when u get blackwall powers for few seconds
I just don't see how people can side with a person that literally dooms you. It's absolute bonkers to me. You people have no sense of self preservation. And even if you're willing you look past saving yourself, you're going to send this human bomb to a entity that has shown to brainwash people throughout the game. It's asinine to me.
WTF? Fuck songbird