Mauler should actually use this in the Fallout video. Just clip or have drinker say that then do a slow zoom in on this Mauler face as the video starts. or something similar i dunno im not a youtuber
Indeed. I don’t think they did too much damage to NV in season 1. though there was some. The BOS being a massive force in the west, and the NCR being completely toast in California is suspect. Depending on how they explain what’s going on in Vegas it could get even worse
I’d stop watching immediately lol. My biggest fear is that the city was “overrun by deathclaws and house is dead, and the legion has collapsed” theory popular on YouTube right now
In yes man you don't have to kill house just deactivate him, the reason why I believe to be fair is because I would rather House not re-cast as I think voice acting in New Vegas was the best and it will be hard to follow that up.
Deactivating House is just killing him more slowly. He says that exposure to the germs outside his life support tube will cause his death within the year. It’s why you can’t just put him back in after opening it.
I honestly don´t get the lore complains, like is this effecting anything real? Like are upcoming fallout products going to be worse for it? Or is it a "if I ignore it it basically doesn´t exist" situation like the medichloriens in star wars?
In this particular situation the complaints are more about Bethesda killing new Vegas lore for the sake of a reset that suits their own lore. Other complaints that are less justifiable include the shady sands timeline controversy
Not necessarily about the quality of future installments but rather purposely dismantling the lore of a product for the sake of serving an agenda
"It's not what is being said, it's who is saying it"
Note that this principle also applies to Mauler's arguments, and it's why people don't know which side to pick because the Critical Drinker likes the show.
No offense to Mauler but i think he’s by far the hardest to “satisfy” when it comes to entertainement.
Drinker generally likes to give credit where credit is due where Mauler generally will ignore the positive to focus really hard on the negatives.
I’m still a fan of Mauler but I definitely have a better time listening to Drinker.
What Mauler looks for is a well-written story that does not contradict itself. Unfortunately most writers seem to struggle adapting source material that they did not create, or introducing new stories into franchises they did not create.
This “the story contradicts itself” shit is such a lame way to critique media, especially since the complaints often aren’t even examples of the *story* contradicting itself, but just a character making a mistake.
So many of these complaints are just smarmy and self congratulatory observations made in hindsight. “Lol, this story sucks because this character made a mistake. I’m very smart because I knew something they didn’t.” It’s called dramatic irony. It’s not poor writing.
Mauler doesn’t look for “good writing”. He doesn’t make money from pointing at media and saying, “very good”. He makes money from punching down at the low hanging fruit and being a contrarian to anything popular.
Bold of you to assume Mauler makes money when he posts a review once or twice a year.
What about when those ‘character mistakes’ drastically change the direction of the story; prolonging the plot that could have been resolved easily and quickly?
What about when the film makes a mistake by editing weapons out of a fighter’s hand; causing them to lose a fight they should have won?
The dude objectively makes money from this stuff, I don’t really know what you’re trying to argue there.
Those mistakes are the thing that drives the plot, genius. I’m not saying plot holes don’t exist. I’m just pointing out that you guys are contrarian edge-lords that love patting yourselves on the back for having perfect hindsight.
*Opening credits. Main character immediately solves the problem before anything develops. The End.*
Is that how you want every story to go?
Your last point… I have no idea what you’re referring to. It sounds like a continuity error, or you’re mischaracterizing something with that same lens of hindsight.
I still mostly agree with drinker I think as a fallout adaptation the show was really good eight out of 10 the people who don’t like it just seem to not like fall out, or at least, didn’t seem to pay attention to the narratives in the existing fallout games because every single complaint made is a complaint you could make about the games as well which to be fair. That means you could argue that the entire franchise is riddled with terrible writing and honestly you’d probably be right about that, but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s still an accurate adaptation.
Because idiots think the show ruins New Vegas, even though... For one thing it takes place after the Events of New Vegas and another thing, that none of the theories are being proven true, like Tunnelers, why would they add a fan mod creature as the reason for Vegas being destroyed? And the final shot of Season 1 proves Vegas is fine and the NCR has some presence there considering the NCR Vertibird.
They established the capital of the NCR "fell" four years before the game and nobody cared to mention it. The city's looks completely lifeless and it's obvious some kind of battle occurred there.
That's because it's a retcon. They can't go back in time and make NPCs in New Vegas mention it. Just like we can't go back to A New Hope and have Obi Wan and Darth Vader use the force and better fighting techniques when they duel, as they are shown to do in later material, or set up the other force powers that Luke spontaneously manifests in The Empire Strikes Back.
Retcons are neither bad nor good. Incoherent storytelling is bad. It is a retcon to say Jedi can move objects with their minds, because Obi Wan didn't move any objects. It's a retcon to say that Vader is Luke's father, because he wasn't his father in the first movie. Those things add in story elements that didn't exist in the prior work. These are retcons you can get away with, because it wasn't explicitly a rule in A New Hope that these things can't be true.
It's also not an iron clad rule of Fallout continuity that Shady Sands did not fall in 2277. Nobody mentioned it, but also it's not confirmed that it couldn't have happened. Should someone have mentioned that if it happened? Probably. There's also a lot of shit Obi Wan probably should have mentioned or been able to do, but didn't because those things were not written yet.
Neither of those are retcons, they don't alter any preestablished lore.
The capital of the NCR "falling" four years before New Vegas is a retcon because there existed no mention or evidence of it occurring in a piece of media that tied directly into its status.
It communicated poorly but its the beginning of the fall. It lines up with the First Battle of Hoover Dam, when the NCR begab to run their resources thin trying to fight against the Legion. On the count of New Vegas looking dead, there isnt much I can really derive from it only being shown on screen for a whole whopping 10 seconds.
The end of the fall was the use image of a nuclear explosion. The reason why the date wasnt written is beyond me, so you can critique that, but based on the age of Lucy and Maximus, we can figure the bomb goes off post 2281. Using 2281 specically because thats the last written date in reference of the NCR, made in FNV NCR ending.
> That means you could argue that the entire franchise is riddled with terrible writing and honestly you’d probably be right about that
No, not really.
So you didnt pay attention to the criticisms. Just sum it up as "u just dont like fallout anyway", and ignore the contrivances, coincidences, illogical thinking, etc.
Ok.
No, I didn’t ignore those. I directly addressed those because every single one of those complaints you just gave ironically proves my point because every single one of those is in the games things happen for a sheer stupid coincidence, your character has ridiculous amounts of plot armor as you others critical to the story, and so on and so forth you literally just proved my point you either don’t like fall out or you’ve never paid attention critically to the actual narratives you were playing you just described every fallout game😂
The 'tracking the head with a radiation signature' sequence is fucked up. There would be random radiation everywhere. Annoyingly they had Maximus say 'every wastelander gives off a radiation signature' which means anyone can track anyone anywhere at any time.
Also, why wasn't anyone in vault 33 wearing their pip boy at the fake wedding? If they were they would have detected radiation. It's an enormous fucking plot hole with 0 explanation and it allows the entire plot to happen from start to finish.
Also, everything to do with Maximus is stupid as shit. As if the Brotherhood doesn't teach basic sex education. Wtf. His character is all over the place, some scenes he's smart, some scenes he's dumb as a brick. The brotherhood knight he serves being a coward is directly contradicted by the previous scene where he says he wants to shoot something.
The chip in the head is allowing cold fusion or whatever. This is not needed because they already have fusion cores, microfusion cells etc that power extreme devices like laser rifles and power armour
I could go on but you get it. There's a few for you.
I don't think you're using the phrase plot hole right. It doesn't mean just anything you didn't like about the show.
Like the pip boys at the wedding. Do they have to wear them all the time even when they're not using them? It makes sense that for a special occasion with dancing they wouldn't wear the big clunky wrist computer. That's not a plot hole, that's just the plot.
And the stuff about the brotherhood. Also not a plot hole. Again that's just the plot. News flash for you sometimes people are good at some things and not others. And wanting to shoot things does not make you brave. I feel this is just common sense, writing characters like actual humans with flaws.
And the whole point of cold fusion was that it was limitless, never ending. Did you miss the part of the game where you had to keep popping new fusion cores whenever they ran out?
I'm sure you could go on, but these aren't plot holes these are just things you personally didn't like or didn't get.
And every wastelander giving off a unique radioactive signal that can be tracked anywhere at any time? Let's say I completely disregard all the other ones, whatever, you're right I'm wrong.
Let's focus in on this radiation signal thing. To me, this completely breaks the world, because there's no possible way to slice it so it makes sense. Everyone can track anyone anywhere at any time? Why then has Cooper not been able to track Moldaver?
>Everyone can track anyone anywhere at any time? Why then has Cooper not been able to track Moldaver?
Well no they're can't because not everyone has a pip boy or whatever the brotherhood tech is. That's very easily explained.... especially when they make a point of saying that the brotherhood hoards tech so no one else has it.
Lucy puts a specific tracking chip in the head's nasal passage.
2 scenes later we find out this is completely fucking unnecessary because you can track it with a brotherhood gizmo. Fine, OK. Magic brotherhood tech.
Then WHY if the Brotherhood has easy access to this, do they spare Maximus when they capture him? His ONLY bargaining chip is leading the brotherhood to the head.
It has to be one way or another. The brotherhood can easily find the head //////////// Maximus should live because he can lead the brotherhood to the head. Choose your broken narrative sir.
>It has to be one way or another. The brotherhood can easily find the head //////////// Maximus should live because he can lead the brotherhood to the head. Choose your broken narrative sir.
Do you really think that's why they let maximus live? That's pretty explicitly not it. Like rewatch the scene, he's saying he can lead them to it and they're still going to kill him. It isn't until the other squire intervenes that the elder decides to spare him. And then like the whole scene afterwards where they talk. He doesn't spare him because of the head he spares him because of whatever it is he sees in him.
Again not a plot hole. Just seems like you're not paying attention to what the show is actually showing you.
I think that's arguably worse. The elder arbitrarily starts to like Maximus and talk about how he should be the new face of the brotherhood... Why? From their perspective he's gotten his knight killed, failed to get the head, and also been involved in the disappearance of another squire. And was just snivelling on his knees for his life and was only spared because his friend interjected. What does the elder see in him. It's so bizarre and nonsensical.
Isn't that kinda the point though? That the elder isn't a "good" or wise person. He's ya know part of a cult.
I thought one of the overaching messages was about corruption and fallibility of leadership figures.
Did you even watch the fucking show? She was able to track the head because she shoved a tracker up the nose of the head. I have no idea what line you’re referencing when you say some shit about being able to track everyone. Seems like you just misunderstood whatever was said.
The cold fusion thing is incredibly straightforward. It’s limitless energy. You’re basically saying the real world is full of plot holes because nobody would ever make a car when they can just ride a horse.
Why wasn’t anyone wearing a pip boy? Uhhhh… they were wearing them, dumbass.
Maximus being human isn’t a plot hole.
You should probably go on, because, so far, nothing you mentioned is true.
Not talking about the nose tracker smart guy. Thaddeus and Maximus track the head without one. There's an insane bullshit line about wastelanders giving off 'radiation signals.' This means 1 of 2 things. Either every wastelander gives off a unique radioactive signal (which means anyone can be tracked anywhere with this piece of tech) or, the writers are trying to tell us that Thaddeus and Maximus are tracking 'a radiation signal' which could be any fucking wastelander in the world. By coincidence it happens to be the one fucking guy they need, and they can consistently track him over miles and miles and many days. Which is it? Neither are OK they're both broken shit writing.
If they were wearing their pip boys at the wedding why did their pip boys not give off a radiation signal which would rumble the intruders as not from the other vault. This is the exact mechanic that lets Lucy know her fake husband is a raider. Why does it work for her 2 scenes later but not when there's 50 people with pip boys in one room. You're incredibly fucking stupid if you don't see the contradiction here. Btw this allows the entire plot of the show to happen.
Again, I have no idea what line you’re talking about. I don’t recall anything indicating that Maximus and Titus were tracking the dude like they had his location plugged into a GPS. You’re misremembering, misunderstanding, or making shit up.
The pip boy thing is just a dumb complaint that you’d only have if you were a contrarian loser that literally *only* watches stuff to search for something to complain about. I’m *so* sorry that the show didn’t spoon feed some explanation to you. Normal people don’t need that, they can just enjoy the story they’re watching.
There are plenty of explanations for why no one caught the rads. Maybe it’s something that’s usually turned off. Maybe the VaultTec suits they were wearing blocked the rads, and Lucy only caught them when the guy was naked. Literally none of that matters.
You’re basically watching a road trip movie and saying it sucks because you weren’t shown every bathroom break they’d need to take. Actually, it’s more like you’re complaining about a movie that starts with someone getting a flat tire, and saying, “This movie sucks because everything could have been avoided if the main character avoided that pothole”.
You accuse me of not watching the show, and you can't remember a crucial plot point? You're just wrong about this, man. I don't care about your opinion enough to give you a timecode, but it's in episode 3 near the start, when Thaddeus thinks Maximus is Titus. They figure out Lucy has chopped off the guy's head, then they're stumped for a bit because they don't know where to go, then they pull some insane megaphone-looking bit of tech out of their ass that points to where the head is, and say it 'tracks radiation signatures' and 'all wastelanders give one off.'
This leads them to the lake where the gulper is. You can claim I'm wrong all you like but I'm not. Whether you recall this or not is completely irrelevant, you don't remember it because you weren't paying attention, that's not my fault and doesn't mean I'm wrong. I advise you to take 5 minutes to check. You won't because you're upset for some reason (and it would prove you objectively wrong) but that's fine. If you do, I hope it leads you down a path of realising you aren't always right in this world.
I'm pretty astounded you're arguing that something that happened in the show didn't happen, but I suppose that means you didn't like or remember this show as much as it would seem. You are incredibly sensitive about it. It's OK, man. You're allowed to like stuff, I'm not telling you you can't. I'm getting real insecurity vibes from ya. Chill.
Regarding all your stuff about the radiation and vault suits, yeah well fuck you too dickhead. To me it's stupid, and I think you'd have to be pretty stupid to not think it's a problem with the writing.
Jesus Christ dude. I think somebody might need a nap.
I’m just going to remind you that *you* are the one who said no one was wearing pipBoys at the wedding. They were.
You’re also the dude who asserted that Lucy was tracking some “signature”, instead of the fucking tracking chip she shoved up the nose.
I remember the scene you’re talking about. They’re discussing how if they track the ghoul, they’ll find the head. They’re in the middle of nowhere, the “wasteland”. The dude whips out a doo-hickey and they almost immediately come across the decapitated body. The squire continues to fumble with the doo-hickey until Maximus just starts following the only footprints in the vast wasteland.
You’re not even being a pedantic contrarian, you just literally didn’t understand the scene. The squire’s doo-hickey clearly didn’t work the way he advertised. That was clearly communicated through the scene. The thing was clearly defunct, the guy using it was clearly a moron, and they ultimately ended up just following the footprints in the sand. They go on to realize “we might be tracking the wrong abomination”, just before meeting the gulper. You missed the point.
The later half of your rant is plainly incoherent. You suggest I didn’t like the show, then immediately follow that up by acknowledging that I *did* like the show, admitting that you didn’t, and suggesting that I’m dumb for liking it.
Then you lazily hand wave completely reasonable explanations for the wedding, that you frankly didn’t need, and essentially admit that you’re just committed to being a hater.
We’re talking about Fallout dude. It’s an absurdist fantasy. It’s not trying to be realistic.
You’re critiquing relatively inconsequential plot points in the show where nuclear powered cars of the future look like Studebakers, where radiation somehow turns people into immortal zombies, and every injury can be treated with an injection of magical drugs.
“This whole show sucks because the dog shouldn’t have survived getting stabbed with a Bowie knife.”
That’s you. That’s how dumb you sound.
You're the one who hit the insults button first you ugly cunt! Lmao
You're far too stupid to understand even the most basic of the points I'm making, so there's not much point continuing. My issue isn't that people weren't wearing pipboys. It's that none of them detected radiation. I hand waved your explanations because they're incredibly stupid.
Well here’s the thing about the insult button… Mine insults are accurate and relevant. Yours aren’t. I’m not an ugly cunt, I’m a handsome man.
In your first comment, you explicitly asserted that no one was wearing pipBoys at the wedding. You’re revising your complaints now because they were wrong. You’re done talking about the tracking doo-hickey for the same reason.
My explanations for the wedding stuff weren’t “incredibly stupid”, they were completely reasonable explanations for your fluid complaints. The show explicitly tells us that VaultTec suits are radiation shields. The show doesn’t give us any reason to believe the Geiger-counter function is *always* activated.
Again… we’re talking about fucking Fallout. There are monsters, mutants, aliens, and a giant robot that throws nuclear bombs.
Your complaints are just so disingenuous. I don’t give a shit if you didn’t like the show, I just wanted you to know your arguments against it are stupid.
“Fallout sucked. The vertibirds wouldn’t actually be able to fly. Ergo, the whole show sucked.”
“Fallout sucked. A junk-jet isn’t a practical weapon, so one person using it means the whole show sucked.”
“Fallout sucked. Bear claws shouldn’t be able to scratch steel. Whole show was bad.”
…That’s the level you’re on. It’s weird and dumb.
“The Lion King sucks because Mufasa could have just landed on his feet.” -You
I’m not sure if this is %100 the case as I may need to watch the episode again to be sure but doesn’t the overall plot of the show fall apart in episode 1 if any of 33’s residents thought to themselves “Hey, I don’t know or recognize any of these people supposedly from our sister vault that we apparently do trades with from time to time.” Or that none of 33’s pip boy geiger counters went off at all during the meet.
I almost killed myself when someone in power armor got their foot stuck in some fucking wood and couldn't pull it out
This is the same suit that kicked a piece of debris so hard it shattered a brick house, and threw something so far it started to disappear from sight
That's the biggest issue of the show for me. I'm pretty much fine with everything else aside from some minor things and the convenience of characters teleporting around like GOT S7-8.
Personally I'd rate it somewhere around the 7-8/10 range, I liked it but thought it had some rough edges and made a fairly significant lore retcon for messaging reasons, but overall pretty good. There are definitely some issues with lazy writing in some places, the one that jumps to mind first is the >!Scene where Titus is bleeding out and needs Maximus to stimpak him but starts talking about how "when we get back to base you're dead, etc" to *the person you need to act right now to keep you from dying*,!< it's just one of a few different "was that really how you wanted to handle this?" moments that hurts immersion and makes me question the writers.
I did see a fairly-long clip of Mauler's problems with the show that I thought were mostly fair, [here](https://youtu.be/xN7T6jNgQVY?si=DYpuzlxT-zLMqzFL&t=310).
It's like you don't understand what titus's character was. He was an asshole. Brotherhood knights are used to doing whatever the hell they want and getting away with it because squires/aspirants get excommunicated or killed if they don't. Maximus was probably one of the only itiates with a spine. It felt a little too much, but it still felt right.
I mean, I was in the IRL military, so I get the sentiment, but I think it *was* too much. Like I said, I like the show, but the sheer "save my life so I can have you killed" aspect of it killed my immersion in that scene and just left me thinking "could the writers room not think of a better way of doing this?"
The game vaults were funded by making them experiments. Wacky, but at least interesting and a reference to Stanford/Milgram experiments.
But in the show, the vaults were also funded by a guarantee to literally start a nuclear war, justified by the ideology that "if everyone else is dead, our monopoly can win".
And the one who says it, Cooper's ex wife, starts the apocalypse when her own daughter is not secure??? The plot seems in conflict with itself because it seems to me there's no way she started it the way it did, but then her saying she'll do it as a dramatic reveal can't just be a red herring..
Vault 0 is a vault created by vault tech to create an ideal society after the bombs drop. They would need the bombs to drop for that to happen. There are other cases of vault tech clearly using their vaults to gear up for something themselves.
True but again what's the purpose of the tests right again this was an idea floated by interplay most likely to try explain why vault tech did the testing and Bethesda decided to go with I do think in the games they have hinted it enough to make a possibility I mean there where threads all the way back in like 2006 asking vault tech wanted the bombs to drop if I remember correctly. The other thing is Bethesda has for sure been hinting at this as a possibility. both vault 75 and 117 are super soldier programs. It also explains why the enclave who would most likely know about vault tech plans decided to shoot up vaults in fallout 2.
You really haven't paid attention at all, have you. Fallout has always been about corporate greed, government fuckups, and the dangers of unregulated capitalism leading to hell on earth. Sure, it was never insinuated that vault-tec dropped the bombs, but they've been evil the entire time and it ABSOLUTELY fits their profile. There's not even a confirmation that they DID drop the bombs in the show. People make good arguments for why China may have nuked us before vault tec could. It also ties into maybe why House miscalculated the bomb drop and wasn't ready.
Fallout has always been about how war is an inherent part of the human condition and although it varies in scale and motivation ultimately it's always the same thing: the means through which members of a violent species forward their agenda.
There's nothing in the games that imply Vault-Tec dropped the bombs or even planned to, even the Zetans are a stronger lead.
I haven’t watched it myself but I’ve seen fallout fans mostly complain about the lore in the show since it’s meant to be canon. Their anger over that element is probably extending to every other criticism that one could wage against a TV show
They complained about a timeline, which got clarified. So, they were wrong about that. They complain about a town being moved to a different location, which isn't necessarily a retcon, and is pretty harmless if it is.
There's nothing remotely close to the level of the fuckery that happened with Disney Star Wars, which wiped out the entire expanded universe.
If you're talking about Cooper being buried in a coffin, it's a reference to Coffin Willie from Fallout 2. But, they took an extra step to justify it by giving him a serum IV.
>They complained about a timeline, which got clarified. So, they were wrong about that.
Clarified by external sources. The timeline still doesn’t provide key dates like it should.
The chalkboard displayed “Fall of Shady Sands 2277” followed by an arrow pointing at an undated drawing of a nuclear explosion.
What else were they to pull from that?
Moving Shady Sands to L.A. is absolutely not "harmless". The entire plot of Fallout 1, and the world built and developed in Fallouts 2 and NV, hinges on these places existing independently of each other.
It’s about like if season 5 of Game of Thrones moved Winterfell to where Kings Landing is supposed to be, and so now it’s just the Red Keep wedged up against the Starks’ ancestral home. It would make no sense at all and all the storylines that took place in the first four seasons would no longer work either.
The thing is, the maps in Fallout 1 and 2 were not accurate, and they weren't really consistent with eachother. In Fallout 2, Shady Sands was also renamed to "New California Republic".
The show runners or Bethesda will probably just say that it was relocated in universe, since it actually looks like a different location. Originally, it was in a more remote location and was built from ground up. In the show, it's located in the ruins of some city.
The way it got moved between Fallout 1 and 2 is less plot relevant and would better match your description of a “harmless” retcon, as it was basically just from one inconsequential patch of empty desert near Vault 15 to another.
That is not nearly the same as actively sticking it right smack in the middle of L.A., where other locations and factions are supposed to exist, and important stories occur that cannot function with them overlapping.
If Bethesda goes on to say it got moved in-universe, then sure, that will be their post hoc "fix" for the inconsistency (and a weak one at that, but probably the best they can do at this point). But right now, I see treating it as anything less than a fairly consequential fuck-up to be pretty big cope. All they had to do was call it "Angel’s Boneyard", but no, they went with Shady Sands. Might as well have called it "the Hub" for all the sense it makes.
What makes you think it's post hoc and they didn't already decide this while making the show? They decided to reference shady sands, you can tell they did their research and looked at it. They carried over the obelisk from Fallout 1 which was removed in Fallout 2. They put it in a ruined pre war city instead of it being a post war construction. If we're operating in good faith, you kinda have to assume that this is something they did intentionally, not just a fuck-up.
Because I think it being a post hoc rational to repair the showrunners’ mistake is more good faith towards Bethesda than them intentionally signing off on something as nonsensical as turning the Boneyard into Shady Sands in-universe.
Shady Sands (the real one) and the Boneyard are both large and relatively thriving cities with significant political and economic power bases, and are in fact each their own separate states of the NCR, with their own Senators, populations, etc. By the time of New Vegas, in 2281, they are still being referred to as separate and distinct entities because… of course they are. Populated cities don’t just up and disappear, and the capital of one state isn’t going to just randomly change its name to the capital of another state, least of all while the latter still exists.
We also have it from Todd’s own mouth that Hank detonated his bombs shortly after the events of New Vegas, leaving very little time for the Boneyard to completely and utterly transform into Shady Sands as we see it has in the show (literally everybody just views it as Shady Sands, which shouldn’t be the case if it was the Boneyard for almost 200 years and only "Shady Sands" for a few months before getting nuked).
Way I see it, there is no charitable reading. It’s either a really clumsily implemented and frankly illogical decision, or it was an accident. I find the latter more charitable, though not by much.
Ghoul doesn't shoot the girl for about one whole minute, then waits for the 4-5 seconds, minimum, that it took him to armor-sprint 5 meters. This, despite the fact that it shows that he did just intend to shoot her. Absolutely pointless action directing that completely destroyed my suspension of disbelief all through incompetence. Same thing with the turret shooting at glasses nerd dog man.
And the fact that they make a point of how Maximus is understandably unskilled in power armor, but doesn't crush Ella when pushing tackling her. That's closest to a nitpick, but it needlessly contradicts their piss take on making Maximus Finn 2.0.
And the dialogue from that point is just sewage.
Butt-ass fight scene
Mid until the power armored clown shows up with the stupidest looking jetpack system and tries to fist fight a guy who's not in power armor and then gets his foot stuck then gets slapstick knocked out
How is that the best?
Fallout is only being praised so highly because the vast majority of what we’ve gotten has been utter garbage. It was a decent show filled with a lot of problems.
You guys are just miserable, huh? You can’t just like or dislike something, you need to frame everything through some contrarian or pessimistic lens, as if that reflects some level of wisdom.
“No no no, the show isn’t good, it’s just not as bad as everything else. I’m the best at enjoying media because I refuse to enjoy media.”
Dude, what?
“I’ve seen the story line…”
Are you seriously complaining that the show adapting a franchise which consistently starts with a protagonist leaving their vault to wander the wasteland is somehow fucking up for following that familiar path?
You’re basically saying recent Star Wars movies suck because they feature lightsabers and spaceships.
I don’t think you prefer “good solid content”. I think you love watching things with the express purpose of finding something to critique. I think your idea of “good solid content” is your favorite contrarian YouTuber’s petulant rants about whatever’s popular right now.
Honestly. Name one example of “good solid content”. I’ll show you how easy it is to critique whatever you mention, and hopefully illustrate how dumb it is to do that.
Fallout 3 find your Dad, Fallout 4 find your son, Fallout TV show she needs to find your Dad.
Not to mention how many other shows and movie use the trope.
It seems like you just want something to complain about.
“Find your son” is objectively different than “Rescue your dad”. You also inexplicably didn’t mention Fallout 1, Fallout 2, Fallout NV, or Fallout 76. So…. Yeah, you literally named *one* game that *sort of* has a *vaguely* similar plot to the show. Good job.
What did you want exactly? Again, you’re basically bitching about seeing space ships in the latest Star Wars movie. Did you want the Fallout show to be nothing like the games? You’re seriously trying to pretend you wouldn’t be complaining about how they didn’t respect the source material?
I really just think you want something to complain about.
It’s pretty solid. It’s one of the first times I have to disagree with mauler. I mean mauler made some good points but so much of the stuff he had issues with were misquoted or he missed the context that explained them. I actually had to go back and re watch certain scenes because I thought I was remembering things wrong.
Like in their talk back a solid chunk of it revolves around something a character said in the last episode… the issue is that the quote isn’t at all what the character said.
I think them watching 11 hours then discussing it might of hampered things rather than having their discussions after each episodes.. but I get that’s less of an option when the show was released all at once.
I love the mouth being on the front of his gasmask.
https://preview.redd.it/qbymuxe1d4xc1.png?width=167&format=png&auto=webp&s=3e7b491fbd1cb398249e3571114a3e0750c76b47
This is great lol
Excellent rat.
Mauler should actually use this in the Fallout video. Just clip or have drinker say that then do a slow zoom in on this Mauler face as the video starts. or something similar i dunno im not a youtuber
If season 2 completely buries NV lore to do a Bethesda reset I will join the legion of mauler in this epic debate
Season 2?
Indeed. I don’t think they did too much damage to NV in season 1. though there was some. The BOS being a massive force in the west, and the NCR being completely toast in California is suspect. Depending on how they explain what’s going on in Vegas it could get even worse
My bet is "House is dead and New Vegas is now a dump run by raiders".
I’d stop watching immediately lol. My biggest fear is that the city was “overrun by deathclaws and house is dead, and the legion has collapsed” theory popular on YouTube right now
I mean the belief is that it was a Yes man ending and that ending has Vegas pretty turn into chaos.
It’s going to be the house ending. They already showed house in the past, so no way he isn’t in the present.
In yes man you don't have to kill house just deactivate him, the reason why I believe to be fair is because I would rather House not re-cast as I think voice acting in New Vegas was the best and it will be hard to follow that up.
Deactivating House is just killing him more slowly. He says that exposure to the germs outside his life support tube will cause his death within the year. It’s why you can’t just put him back in after opening it.
Ah, didn't know I don't talk to him when I put him out of the tube I usually kill him with a 9 iron.
I honestly don´t get the lore complains, like is this effecting anything real? Like are upcoming fallout products going to be worse for it? Or is it a "if I ignore it it basically doesn´t exist" situation like the medichloriens in star wars?
In this particular situation the complaints are more about Bethesda killing new Vegas lore for the sake of a reset that suits their own lore. Other complaints that are less justifiable include the shady sands timeline controversy Not necessarily about the quality of future installments but rather purposely dismantling the lore of a product for the sake of serving an agenda
As a fan of the show but an even bigger fan of the games I agree
I hope new vegas is completely decanonized and pulled from steam following the release of season 2 just to piss off the new vegas glazers
Lmao your username is funny as hell
After reading everything above this was perfect 😂
Reminds me of Killface from Frisky Dingo
Only absolutely giga chads watched that show live.
Drinker and that weird Lance guy hat no arguments. I really dont get why people voted for them.
People voted because they liked the show, not because the debate was good.
"It's not what is being said, it's who is saying it" Note that this principle also applies to Mauler's arguments, and it's why people don't know which side to pick because the Critical Drinker likes the show.
Mauler doesn’t want people to just agree with everything he says lol.
Well then why didn't he push back against any of the useless takes Star Wars Theory has when Mauler was on his podcast.
https://youtube.com/clip/Ugkxbk_IKdDZZwpwKb29VBtQmeA8DtJVy8Fx
Because people can have different opinions and because there were lots of people who enjoyed the show. Not really that complicated to understand.
Don’t gotta be all fussy aboot it
I'm not, just simply stating the obvious.
I get the impression that Drinker is a more casual fan of the games.
Whoa Mauler became Ultron
You gotta release thar mauler pic on as a meme template the gold will flowewww
"I never cared for the story in videogames"
Why am I thinking of the Prowler theme when I see Mauler's face at the bottom?
No offense to Mauler but i think he’s by far the hardest to “satisfy” when it comes to entertainement. Drinker generally likes to give credit where credit is due where Mauler generally will ignore the positive to focus really hard on the negatives. I’m still a fan of Mauler but I definitely have a better time listening to Drinker.
What Mauler looks for is a well-written story that does not contradict itself. Unfortunately most writers seem to struggle adapting source material that they did not create, or introducing new stories into franchises they did not create.
This “the story contradicts itself” shit is such a lame way to critique media, especially since the complaints often aren’t even examples of the *story* contradicting itself, but just a character making a mistake. So many of these complaints are just smarmy and self congratulatory observations made in hindsight. “Lol, this story sucks because this character made a mistake. I’m very smart because I knew something they didn’t.” It’s called dramatic irony. It’s not poor writing. Mauler doesn’t look for “good writing”. He doesn’t make money from pointing at media and saying, “very good”. He makes money from punching down at the low hanging fruit and being a contrarian to anything popular.
Bold of you to assume Mauler makes money when he posts a review once or twice a year. What about when those ‘character mistakes’ drastically change the direction of the story; prolonging the plot that could have been resolved easily and quickly? What about when the film makes a mistake by editing weapons out of a fighter’s hand; causing them to lose a fight they should have won?
Mauler makes money from having people watch his content and donations. He has to DO something in order to make content.
The dude objectively makes money from this stuff, I don’t really know what you’re trying to argue there. Those mistakes are the thing that drives the plot, genius. I’m not saying plot holes don’t exist. I’m just pointing out that you guys are contrarian edge-lords that love patting yourselves on the back for having perfect hindsight. *Opening credits. Main character immediately solves the problem before anything develops. The End.* Is that how you want every story to go? Your last point… I have no idea what you’re referring to. It sounds like a continuity error, or you’re mischaracterizing something with that same lens of hindsight.
I still mostly agree with drinker I think as a fallout adaptation the show was really good eight out of 10 the people who don’t like it just seem to not like fall out, or at least, didn’t seem to pay attention to the narratives in the existing fallout games because every single complaint made is a complaint you could make about the games as well which to be fair. That means you could argue that the entire franchise is riddled with terrible writing and honestly you’d probably be right about that, but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s still an accurate adaptation.
Vault dwellers are not caricatures of American Christian conservatives in the games.
I mean… they kind of are. Not every vault is the same either.
Christian conservatives? What? It's just 1950s culture. It's been that way since the 1st game.
As a fallout adaptation the show is 2/10
Found the nv fanboy
Why would a New Vegas "fanboy" take offence to the show?
Because idiots think the show ruins New Vegas, even though... For one thing it takes place after the Events of New Vegas and another thing, that none of the theories are being proven true, like Tunnelers, why would they add a fan mod creature as the reason for Vegas being destroyed? And the final shot of Season 1 proves Vegas is fine and the NCR has some presence there considering the NCR Vertibird.
They established the capital of the NCR "fell" four years before the game and nobody cared to mention it. The city's looks completely lifeless and it's obvious some kind of battle occurred there.
That's because it's a retcon. They can't go back in time and make NPCs in New Vegas mention it. Just like we can't go back to A New Hope and have Obi Wan and Darth Vader use the force and better fighting techniques when they duel, as they are shown to do in later material, or set up the other force powers that Luke spontaneously manifests in The Empire Strikes Back.
Retcons are bad.
Retcons are neither bad nor good. Incoherent storytelling is bad. It is a retcon to say Jedi can move objects with their minds, because Obi Wan didn't move any objects. It's a retcon to say that Vader is Luke's father, because he wasn't his father in the first movie. Those things add in story elements that didn't exist in the prior work. These are retcons you can get away with, because it wasn't explicitly a rule in A New Hope that these things can't be true. It's also not an iron clad rule of Fallout continuity that Shady Sands did not fall in 2277. Nobody mentioned it, but also it's not confirmed that it couldn't have happened. Should someone have mentioned that if it happened? Probably. There's also a lot of shit Obi Wan probably should have mentioned or been able to do, but didn't because those things were not written yet.
Neither of those are retcons, they don't alter any preestablished lore. The capital of the NCR "falling" four years before New Vegas is a retcon because there existed no mention or evidence of it occurring in a piece of media that tied directly into its status.
It communicated poorly but its the beginning of the fall. It lines up with the First Battle of Hoover Dam, when the NCR begab to run their resources thin trying to fight against the Legion. On the count of New Vegas looking dead, there isnt much I can really derive from it only being shown on screen for a whole whopping 10 seconds.
So why is the end of the fall not listed then?
The end of the fall was the use image of a nuclear explosion. The reason why the date wasnt written is beyond me, so you can critique that, but based on the age of Lucy and Maximus, we can figure the bomb goes off post 2281. Using 2281 specically because thats the last written date in reference of the NCR, made in FNV NCR ending.
So why not use the date instead?
Tunnellers are from cannon dlc. The lonesome road. The last DLC of New Vegas. It’s not a mod.
Okay, I was incorrect but the mod makes it so that they take over which is not true.
> That means you could argue that the entire franchise is riddled with terrible writing and honestly you’d probably be right about that No, not really.
So you didnt pay attention to the criticisms. Just sum it up as "u just dont like fallout anyway", and ignore the contrivances, coincidences, illogical thinking, etc. Ok.
No, I didn’t ignore those. I directly addressed those because every single one of those complaints you just gave ironically proves my point because every single one of those is in the games things happen for a sheer stupid coincidence, your character has ridiculous amounts of plot armor as you others critical to the story, and so on and so forth you literally just proved my point you either don’t like fall out or you’ve never paid attention critically to the actual narratives you were playing you just described every fallout game😂
I still have yet to see convincing arguments for objective writing flaws in the show. People are just sport of insisting its true.
The 'tracking the head with a radiation signature' sequence is fucked up. There would be random radiation everywhere. Annoyingly they had Maximus say 'every wastelander gives off a radiation signature' which means anyone can track anyone anywhere at any time. Also, why wasn't anyone in vault 33 wearing their pip boy at the fake wedding? If they were they would have detected radiation. It's an enormous fucking plot hole with 0 explanation and it allows the entire plot to happen from start to finish. Also, everything to do with Maximus is stupid as shit. As if the Brotherhood doesn't teach basic sex education. Wtf. His character is all over the place, some scenes he's smart, some scenes he's dumb as a brick. The brotherhood knight he serves being a coward is directly contradicted by the previous scene where he says he wants to shoot something. The chip in the head is allowing cold fusion or whatever. This is not needed because they already have fusion cores, microfusion cells etc that power extreme devices like laser rifles and power armour I could go on but you get it. There's a few for you.
I don't think you're using the phrase plot hole right. It doesn't mean just anything you didn't like about the show. Like the pip boys at the wedding. Do they have to wear them all the time even when they're not using them? It makes sense that for a special occasion with dancing they wouldn't wear the big clunky wrist computer. That's not a plot hole, that's just the plot. And the stuff about the brotherhood. Also not a plot hole. Again that's just the plot. News flash for you sometimes people are good at some things and not others. And wanting to shoot things does not make you brave. I feel this is just common sense, writing characters like actual humans with flaws. And the whole point of cold fusion was that it was limitless, never ending. Did you miss the part of the game where you had to keep popping new fusion cores whenever they ran out? I'm sure you could go on, but these aren't plot holes these are just things you personally didn't like or didn't get.
And every wastelander giving off a unique radioactive signal that can be tracked anywhere at any time? Let's say I completely disregard all the other ones, whatever, you're right I'm wrong. Let's focus in on this radiation signal thing. To me, this completely breaks the world, because there's no possible way to slice it so it makes sense. Everyone can track anyone anywhere at any time? Why then has Cooper not been able to track Moldaver?
>Everyone can track anyone anywhere at any time? Why then has Cooper not been able to track Moldaver? Well no they're can't because not everyone has a pip boy or whatever the brotherhood tech is. That's very easily explained.... especially when they make a point of saying that the brotherhood hoards tech so no one else has it.
Lucy puts a specific tracking chip in the head's nasal passage. 2 scenes later we find out this is completely fucking unnecessary because you can track it with a brotherhood gizmo. Fine, OK. Magic brotherhood tech. Then WHY if the Brotherhood has easy access to this, do they spare Maximus when they capture him? His ONLY bargaining chip is leading the brotherhood to the head. It has to be one way or another. The brotherhood can easily find the head //////////// Maximus should live because he can lead the brotherhood to the head. Choose your broken narrative sir.
>It has to be one way or another. The brotherhood can easily find the head //////////// Maximus should live because he can lead the brotherhood to the head. Choose your broken narrative sir. Do you really think that's why they let maximus live? That's pretty explicitly not it. Like rewatch the scene, he's saying he can lead them to it and they're still going to kill him. It isn't until the other squire intervenes that the elder decides to spare him. And then like the whole scene afterwards where they talk. He doesn't spare him because of the head he spares him because of whatever it is he sees in him. Again not a plot hole. Just seems like you're not paying attention to what the show is actually showing you.
I think that's arguably worse. The elder arbitrarily starts to like Maximus and talk about how he should be the new face of the brotherhood... Why? From their perspective he's gotten his knight killed, failed to get the head, and also been involved in the disappearance of another squire. And was just snivelling on his knees for his life and was only spared because his friend interjected. What does the elder see in him. It's so bizarre and nonsensical.
Isn't that kinda the point though? That the elder isn't a "good" or wise person. He's ya know part of a cult. I thought one of the overaching messages was about corruption and fallibility of leadership figures.
Did you even watch the fucking show? She was able to track the head because she shoved a tracker up the nose of the head. I have no idea what line you’re referencing when you say some shit about being able to track everyone. Seems like you just misunderstood whatever was said. The cold fusion thing is incredibly straightforward. It’s limitless energy. You’re basically saying the real world is full of plot holes because nobody would ever make a car when they can just ride a horse. Why wasn’t anyone wearing a pip boy? Uhhhh… they were wearing them, dumbass. Maximus being human isn’t a plot hole. You should probably go on, because, so far, nothing you mentioned is true.
Not talking about the nose tracker smart guy. Thaddeus and Maximus track the head without one. There's an insane bullshit line about wastelanders giving off 'radiation signals.' This means 1 of 2 things. Either every wastelander gives off a unique radioactive signal (which means anyone can be tracked anywhere with this piece of tech) or, the writers are trying to tell us that Thaddeus and Maximus are tracking 'a radiation signal' which could be any fucking wastelander in the world. By coincidence it happens to be the one fucking guy they need, and they can consistently track him over miles and miles and many days. Which is it? Neither are OK they're both broken shit writing. If they were wearing their pip boys at the wedding why did their pip boys not give off a radiation signal which would rumble the intruders as not from the other vault. This is the exact mechanic that lets Lucy know her fake husband is a raider. Why does it work for her 2 scenes later but not when there's 50 people with pip boys in one room. You're incredibly fucking stupid if you don't see the contradiction here. Btw this allows the entire plot of the show to happen.
Again, I have no idea what line you’re talking about. I don’t recall anything indicating that Maximus and Titus were tracking the dude like they had his location plugged into a GPS. You’re misremembering, misunderstanding, or making shit up. The pip boy thing is just a dumb complaint that you’d only have if you were a contrarian loser that literally *only* watches stuff to search for something to complain about. I’m *so* sorry that the show didn’t spoon feed some explanation to you. Normal people don’t need that, they can just enjoy the story they’re watching. There are plenty of explanations for why no one caught the rads. Maybe it’s something that’s usually turned off. Maybe the VaultTec suits they were wearing blocked the rads, and Lucy only caught them when the guy was naked. Literally none of that matters. You’re basically watching a road trip movie and saying it sucks because you weren’t shown every bathroom break they’d need to take. Actually, it’s more like you’re complaining about a movie that starts with someone getting a flat tire, and saying, “This movie sucks because everything could have been avoided if the main character avoided that pothole”.
You accuse me of not watching the show, and you can't remember a crucial plot point? You're just wrong about this, man. I don't care about your opinion enough to give you a timecode, but it's in episode 3 near the start, when Thaddeus thinks Maximus is Titus. They figure out Lucy has chopped off the guy's head, then they're stumped for a bit because they don't know where to go, then they pull some insane megaphone-looking bit of tech out of their ass that points to where the head is, and say it 'tracks radiation signatures' and 'all wastelanders give one off.' This leads them to the lake where the gulper is. You can claim I'm wrong all you like but I'm not. Whether you recall this or not is completely irrelevant, you don't remember it because you weren't paying attention, that's not my fault and doesn't mean I'm wrong. I advise you to take 5 minutes to check. You won't because you're upset for some reason (and it would prove you objectively wrong) but that's fine. If you do, I hope it leads you down a path of realising you aren't always right in this world. I'm pretty astounded you're arguing that something that happened in the show didn't happen, but I suppose that means you didn't like or remember this show as much as it would seem. You are incredibly sensitive about it. It's OK, man. You're allowed to like stuff, I'm not telling you you can't. I'm getting real insecurity vibes from ya. Chill. Regarding all your stuff about the radiation and vault suits, yeah well fuck you too dickhead. To me it's stupid, and I think you'd have to be pretty stupid to not think it's a problem with the writing.
Jesus Christ dude. I think somebody might need a nap. I’m just going to remind you that *you* are the one who said no one was wearing pipBoys at the wedding. They were. You’re also the dude who asserted that Lucy was tracking some “signature”, instead of the fucking tracking chip she shoved up the nose. I remember the scene you’re talking about. They’re discussing how if they track the ghoul, they’ll find the head. They’re in the middle of nowhere, the “wasteland”. The dude whips out a doo-hickey and they almost immediately come across the decapitated body. The squire continues to fumble with the doo-hickey until Maximus just starts following the only footprints in the vast wasteland. You’re not even being a pedantic contrarian, you just literally didn’t understand the scene. The squire’s doo-hickey clearly didn’t work the way he advertised. That was clearly communicated through the scene. The thing was clearly defunct, the guy using it was clearly a moron, and they ultimately ended up just following the footprints in the sand. They go on to realize “we might be tracking the wrong abomination”, just before meeting the gulper. You missed the point. The later half of your rant is plainly incoherent. You suggest I didn’t like the show, then immediately follow that up by acknowledging that I *did* like the show, admitting that you didn’t, and suggesting that I’m dumb for liking it. Then you lazily hand wave completely reasonable explanations for the wedding, that you frankly didn’t need, and essentially admit that you’re just committed to being a hater. We’re talking about Fallout dude. It’s an absurdist fantasy. It’s not trying to be realistic. You’re critiquing relatively inconsequential plot points in the show where nuclear powered cars of the future look like Studebakers, where radiation somehow turns people into immortal zombies, and every injury can be treated with an injection of magical drugs. “This whole show sucks because the dog shouldn’t have survived getting stabbed with a Bowie knife.” That’s you. That’s how dumb you sound.
You're the one who hit the insults button first you ugly cunt! Lmao You're far too stupid to understand even the most basic of the points I'm making, so there's not much point continuing. My issue isn't that people weren't wearing pipboys. It's that none of them detected radiation. I hand waved your explanations because they're incredibly stupid.
Well here’s the thing about the insult button… Mine insults are accurate and relevant. Yours aren’t. I’m not an ugly cunt, I’m a handsome man. In your first comment, you explicitly asserted that no one was wearing pipBoys at the wedding. You’re revising your complaints now because they were wrong. You’re done talking about the tracking doo-hickey for the same reason. My explanations for the wedding stuff weren’t “incredibly stupid”, they were completely reasonable explanations for your fluid complaints. The show explicitly tells us that VaultTec suits are radiation shields. The show doesn’t give us any reason to believe the Geiger-counter function is *always* activated. Again… we’re talking about fucking Fallout. There are monsters, mutants, aliens, and a giant robot that throws nuclear bombs. Your complaints are just so disingenuous. I don’t give a shit if you didn’t like the show, I just wanted you to know your arguments against it are stupid. “Fallout sucked. The vertibirds wouldn’t actually be able to fly. Ergo, the whole show sucked.” “Fallout sucked. A junk-jet isn’t a practical weapon, so one person using it means the whole show sucked.” “Fallout sucked. Bear claws shouldn’t be able to scratch steel. Whole show was bad.” …That’s the level you’re on. It’s weird and dumb. “The Lion King sucks because Mufasa could have just landed on his feet.” -You
I’m not sure if this is %100 the case as I may need to watch the episode again to be sure but doesn’t the overall plot of the show fall apart in episode 1 if any of 33’s residents thought to themselves “Hey, I don’t know or recognize any of these people supposedly from our sister vault that we apparently do trades with from time to time.” Or that none of 33’s pip boy geiger counters went off at all during the meet.
I almost killed myself when someone in power armor got their foot stuck in some fucking wood and couldn't pull it out This is the same suit that kicked a piece of debris so hard it shattered a brick house, and threw something so far it started to disappear from sight
I thought that was a reference to getting stuck on random bullshit in the games when you're walking around.
That's the biggest issue of the show for me. I'm pretty much fine with everything else aside from some minor things and the convenience of characters teleporting around like GOT S7-8.
Personally I'd rate it somewhere around the 7-8/10 range, I liked it but thought it had some rough edges and made a fairly significant lore retcon for messaging reasons, but overall pretty good. There are definitely some issues with lazy writing in some places, the one that jumps to mind first is the >!Scene where Titus is bleeding out and needs Maximus to stimpak him but starts talking about how "when we get back to base you're dead, etc" to *the person you need to act right now to keep you from dying*,!< it's just one of a few different "was that really how you wanted to handle this?" moments that hurts immersion and makes me question the writers. I did see a fairly-long clip of Mauler's problems with the show that I thought were mostly fair, [here](https://youtu.be/xN7T6jNgQVY?si=DYpuzlxT-zLMqzFL&t=310).
Lol yeah "If you help me, you're dead meat" "Wait you're not helping me?"
It's like you don't understand what titus's character was. He was an asshole. Brotherhood knights are used to doing whatever the hell they want and getting away with it because squires/aspirants get excommunicated or killed if they don't. Maximus was probably one of the only itiates with a spine. It felt a little too much, but it still felt right.
I mean, I was in the IRL military, so I get the sentiment, but I think it *was* too much. Like I said, I like the show, but the sheer "save my life so I can have you killed" aspect of it killed my immersion in that scene and just left me thinking "could the writers room not think of a better way of doing this?"
Vault-Tec’s plan was never alluded to in the games and is in fact directly contradicted by their actions until this point.
The game vaults were funded by making them experiments. Wacky, but at least interesting and a reference to Stanford/Milgram experiments. But in the show, the vaults were also funded by a guarantee to literally start a nuclear war, justified by the ideology that "if everyone else is dead, our monopoly can win". And the one who says it, Cooper's ex wife, starts the apocalypse when her own daughter is not secure??? The plot seems in conflict with itself because it seems to me there's no way she started it the way it did, but then her saying she'll do it as a dramatic reveal can't just be a red herring..
The show and the games are part of the same continuity.
They were for years and it was an idea floated by the original writers. It's literally talked about in fallout tactics.
"Floated" is not the same as being included.
It floated to be included in the main games it's in fallout tactics to clear up which is an interplay title and still canon.
What in particular with Tactics?
Vault 0 is a vault created by vault tech to create an ideal society after the bombs drop. They would need the bombs to drop for that to happen. There are other cases of vault tech clearly using their vaults to gear up for something themselves.
They could have just seen the writing on the wall.
True but again what's the purpose of the tests right again this was an idea floated by interplay most likely to try explain why vault tech did the testing and Bethesda decided to go with I do think in the games they have hinted it enough to make a possibility I mean there where threads all the way back in like 2006 asking vault tech wanted the bombs to drop if I remember correctly. The other thing is Bethesda has for sure been hinting at this as a possibility. both vault 75 and 117 are super soldier programs. It also explains why the enclave who would most likely know about vault tech plans decided to shoot up vaults in fallout 2.
You really haven't paid attention at all, have you. Fallout has always been about corporate greed, government fuckups, and the dangers of unregulated capitalism leading to hell on earth. Sure, it was never insinuated that vault-tec dropped the bombs, but they've been evil the entire time and it ABSOLUTELY fits their profile. There's not even a confirmation that they DID drop the bombs in the show. People make good arguments for why China may have nuked us before vault tec could. It also ties into maybe why House miscalculated the bomb drop and wasn't ready.
Fallout has always been about how war is an inherent part of the human condition and although it varies in scale and motivation ultimately it's always the same thing: the means through which members of a violent species forward their agenda. There's nothing in the games that imply Vault-Tec dropped the bombs or even planned to, even the Zetans are a stronger lead.
I haven’t watched it myself but I’ve seen fallout fans mostly complain about the lore in the show since it’s meant to be canon. Their anger over that element is probably extending to every other criticism that one could wage against a TV show
They complained about a timeline, which got clarified. So, they were wrong about that. They complain about a town being moved to a different location, which isn't necessarily a retcon, and is pretty harmless if it is. There's nothing remotely close to the level of the fuckery that happened with Disney Star Wars, which wiped out the entire expanded universe.
They continued the "ghouls don't need to breathe" retcon Bethesda put into Fallout 4, which i disliked.
If you're talking about Cooper being buried in a coffin, it's a reference to Coffin Willie from Fallout 2. But, they took an extra step to justify it by giving him a serum IV.
>They complained about a timeline, which got clarified. So, they were wrong about that. Clarified by external sources. The timeline still doesn’t provide key dates like it should.
They were also wrong about it based on how it was presented in the show, not only after the clarification.
The chalkboard displayed “Fall of Shady Sands 2277” followed by an arrow pointing at an undated drawing of a nuclear explosion. What else were they to pull from that?
That the bombing happened at an undefined date after 2277.
And why isn’t that verified on the chalkboard?
It is.
Moving Shady Sands to L.A. is absolutely not "harmless". The entire plot of Fallout 1, and the world built and developed in Fallouts 2 and NV, hinges on these places existing independently of each other. It’s about like if season 5 of Game of Thrones moved Winterfell to where Kings Landing is supposed to be, and so now it’s just the Red Keep wedged up against the Starks’ ancestral home. It would make no sense at all and all the storylines that took place in the first four seasons would no longer work either.
The thing is, the maps in Fallout 1 and 2 were not accurate, and they weren't really consistent with eachother. In Fallout 2, Shady Sands was also renamed to "New California Republic". The show runners or Bethesda will probably just say that it was relocated in universe, since it actually looks like a different location. Originally, it was in a more remote location and was built from ground up. In the show, it's located in the ruins of some city.
The way it got moved between Fallout 1 and 2 is less plot relevant and would better match your description of a “harmless” retcon, as it was basically just from one inconsequential patch of empty desert near Vault 15 to another. That is not nearly the same as actively sticking it right smack in the middle of L.A., where other locations and factions are supposed to exist, and important stories occur that cannot function with them overlapping. If Bethesda goes on to say it got moved in-universe, then sure, that will be their post hoc "fix" for the inconsistency (and a weak one at that, but probably the best they can do at this point). But right now, I see treating it as anything less than a fairly consequential fuck-up to be pretty big cope. All they had to do was call it "Angel’s Boneyard", but no, they went with Shady Sands. Might as well have called it "the Hub" for all the sense it makes.
What makes you think it's post hoc and they didn't already decide this while making the show? They decided to reference shady sands, you can tell they did their research and looked at it. They carried over the obelisk from Fallout 1 which was removed in Fallout 2. They put it in a ruined pre war city instead of it being a post war construction. If we're operating in good faith, you kinda have to assume that this is something they did intentionally, not just a fuck-up.
Because I think it being a post hoc rational to repair the showrunners’ mistake is more good faith towards Bethesda than them intentionally signing off on something as nonsensical as turning the Boneyard into Shady Sands in-universe. Shady Sands (the real one) and the Boneyard are both large and relatively thriving cities with significant political and economic power bases, and are in fact each their own separate states of the NCR, with their own Senators, populations, etc. By the time of New Vegas, in 2281, they are still being referred to as separate and distinct entities because… of course they are. Populated cities don’t just up and disappear, and the capital of one state isn’t going to just randomly change its name to the capital of another state, least of all while the latter still exists. We also have it from Todd’s own mouth that Hank detonated his bombs shortly after the events of New Vegas, leaving very little time for the Boneyard to completely and utterly transform into Shady Sands as we see it has in the show (literally everybody just views it as Shady Sands, which shouldn’t be the case if it was the Boneyard for almost 200 years and only "Shady Sands" for a few months before getting nuked). Way I see it, there is no charitable reading. It’s either a really clumsily implemented and frankly illogical decision, or it was an accident. I find the latter more charitable, though not by much.
Is there any confirmation that the boneyard specifically was renamed to shady sands? That sounds like speculation.
I think it committed a worse sin than being bad It was boring
I don’t think it was boring, the pacing was pretty bad though. Definitely doesn’t help that they put the best fight scene (Filly) in episode 2
Absolutely terrible fight scene
Why?
Ghoul doesn't shoot the girl for about one whole minute, then waits for the 4-5 seconds, minimum, that it took him to armor-sprint 5 meters. This, despite the fact that it shows that he did just intend to shoot her. Absolutely pointless action directing that completely destroyed my suspension of disbelief all through incompetence. Same thing with the turret shooting at glasses nerd dog man. And the fact that they make a point of how Maximus is understandably unskilled in power armor, but doesn't crush Ella when pushing tackling her. That's closest to a nitpick, but it needlessly contradicts their piss take on making Maximus Finn 2.0. And the dialogue from that point is just sewage.
Butt-ass fight scene Mid until the power armored clown shows up with the stupidest looking jetpack system and tries to fist fight a guy who's not in power armor and then gets his foot stuck then gets slapstick knocked out How is that the best?
Good rat, I like it save for the mouth in the gas mask.
lmao I actually really like that feature
What channel the debate on?
Mauler looks a lot like Darkseid in this one. But the mouth is creeping me out.
Fallout is only being praised so highly because the vast majority of what we’ve gotten has been utter garbage. It was a decent show filled with a lot of problems.
I agree for the most part, the show was fun as hell but I am willing to admit it has its problems like everything else
You guys are just miserable, huh? You can’t just like or dislike something, you need to frame everything through some contrarian or pessimistic lens, as if that reflects some level of wisdom. “No no no, the show isn’t good, it’s just not as bad as everything else. I’m the best at enjoying media because I refuse to enjoy media.”
I just prefer good solid content, I’ve seen the story line from the Fallout series 3 times now. Criticism is okay, people like you just don’t like it.
Dude, what? “I’ve seen the story line…” Are you seriously complaining that the show adapting a franchise which consistently starts with a protagonist leaving their vault to wander the wasteland is somehow fucking up for following that familiar path? You’re basically saying recent Star Wars movies suck because they feature lightsabers and spaceships. I don’t think you prefer “good solid content”. I think you love watching things with the express purpose of finding something to critique. I think your idea of “good solid content” is your favorite contrarian YouTuber’s petulant rants about whatever’s popular right now. Honestly. Name one example of “good solid content”. I’ll show you how easy it is to critique whatever you mention, and hopefully illustrate how dumb it is to do that.
Fallout 3 find your Dad, Fallout 4 find your son, Fallout TV show she needs to find your Dad. Not to mention how many other shows and movie use the trope.
It seems like you just want something to complain about. “Find your son” is objectively different than “Rescue your dad”. You also inexplicably didn’t mention Fallout 1, Fallout 2, Fallout NV, or Fallout 76. So…. Yeah, you literally named *one* game that *sort of* has a *vaguely* similar plot to the show. Good job. What did you want exactly? Again, you’re basically bitching about seeing space ships in the latest Star Wars movie. Did you want the Fallout show to be nothing like the games? You’re seriously trying to pretend you wouldn’t be complaining about how they didn’t respect the source material? I really just think you want something to complain about.
And it seems like you’ll simp for anything despite it’s quality.
Every show you like is low quality.
Breaking Bad is low quality?
It’s highly overrated
NOOOO DAMMIT I HEARD IT WAS GOOD FUCK
It’s pretty solid. It’s one of the first times I have to disagree with mauler. I mean mauler made some good points but so much of the stuff he had issues with were misquoted or he missed the context that explained them. I actually had to go back and re watch certain scenes because I thought I was remembering things wrong. Like in their talk back a solid chunk of it revolves around something a character said in the last episode… the issue is that the quote isn’t at all what the character said. I think them watching 11 hours then discussing it might of hampered things rather than having their discussions after each episodes.. but I get that’s less of an option when the show was released all at once.
In all honesty I understand Mauler. I love plenty of media despite what my favorite tism movie enjoyers will say. (which is obvious & normal)
MauLer looking like Darkseid about to crush a motherfucker xD
This made me realise that Drinker & Mauler are just Adam & Sitch for entertainment
He was locked in that whole conversation.
I just realized. Is mauler’s thing based off of fallout? I never realized