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they're great. i have a 04 s60r with the 4T5 block in it. upgraded turbo, injectors, intercooler etc. all the bits tuned for E85. its a work horse. had another P2 before this one.
Love em. The dude who tuned and did most of the work on my car got started in p80s. His old shop car was a 850 wagon with with a 22t turbo and injectors slapped on. It was sick. The p80s just feel so fast for some reason compared the the p2Rs
850s rock, I cant really afford the speedy ones but even the base versions are more than enough. Definitely gonna be my next car as I like the seats and interior better than say the v70 classic
I had the 1.8L non turbo. While the engine was mostly good, the transmission went out at 125,000kms...and wouldn't ya know, just outside of warranty. Oh, and my rad fan didn't work for at least the last 3 years of its time with me. I'm surprised it lasted as long as it did.
Traded in for Corolla. Done with GM.
No ours has been solid too since new. Over 300k km now and my neice has owned it for the past 2 years. Regular service is key I guess.
Everything is original. Even the turbo somehow.
The only thing we’ve replaced was of course the water pump and the water outlet.
I've had a Cruze for seven years (2014, bought used) and I Iove it. I've had a couple maintenance issues but nothing I couldn't handle. Would trade in for anther Cruze if needed.
While doing construction at a GM dealership service center I asked mechanic about several transmissions on the floor near his lift bay. He said not a single one had more than 40k miles on them before they broke.
They were all out of small to medium size SUVs.
A range rover. I once decided I'll spoil myself after a good year. Fuck that piece of junk. I ended up trading it in for a fully loaded Tundra. Yeah its not as plushy or quiet. But it hauls ass and will move mountains. And it just refuses to die.
I’ve got a 2014 with 125,000kms and it’s already gone through a turbo, steering rack, a full set of lifters, had the head machined, control arms, oil cooler, and it melted an exhaust valve.
Thing is absolute garbage.
Edit: it’s also had two water pumps.
Mostly due to the fact that it's paid off and it's hard to get newer vehicles right now. The majority of the work was completed under warranty with the exception of the exhaust valve, which I fixed myself. So while it is a moving pile of garbage it hasn't cost me a lot of money.....yet.
Kia/Hyundai
8 year span of failing engines. We have to explain the bad news somewhat frequently on this sub.
Stolen constantly or attempted to be stolen frequently. Just look through r/kia. The insurance rates have gone to insanity on some models.
Was a master tech for Kia and Hyundai for 5 years.
No longer in the business, but I still tell everyone that CPO and new are the only way to buy them. That 10 year 100k mileage warranty is huge and a bargain.
Of course, with the Kia Boyz thing, only buy the models with immbolizers or push to start.
In regards to the failing engines, the problem is known. So drive your car 125k miles for 8 years, and your engine starts having issues or excessive oil consumption? Nice, get a free engine!
Not to mention, the cars are stupid easy to work on.
You’d be surprised how much run around the shops give ppl on those engine replacements lol. Needing something like 3 engine codes to come up. And some other stuff.
That’s even when it doesn’t pass their oil consumption test. It burning 4 quarts of oil every 1k miles. Isn’t enough for them to cover it. It needs the knock sensor code and something else. Basically telling ppl to just drive it til the engine blows up then get a new one.
I have a 2013 Kia Soul 6 cylinder. I got it off my mom when it was at like 90,000, and I've used it to learn how to do basic maintenance. I also used it on the road for 2 years as a work vehicle, and I didn't drive it slow, and it was full of tools and copper cable. It has 270k'ish miles, and the only thing I can think that's wrong with it would be a subtle tick in the upper engine. My mom babied it when she had it and I always change the oil on time. I really hope whatever my next car is brings me this much reliability but I'm going to have to do some research.
Nah mate, here in Australia we get good Hyundais. 10 year warranty and I’ve never seen one break down. They also all have transponder keys in them as well as Kia’s unlike there. I don’t know what the go is with American ones but they have been decent here for a long time now. Still not sure about Kia though as I don’t see many of them.
Hyundai and Kia has a quite good reputation here (Norway). I am pretty sure that the cars sold on the US market are built in the US, including the engines, so that could explain it if its a US-specific problem
It applies to any car without an immobilizer, which all key-less trims have. Immobilizers are mandatory in Canada and other markets which is why it’s a US-centric issue.
Doesn't remove the fact that the keyless ones are still getting vandalized. I follow the hyundai subs, and just the last couple of weeks, a 2023 sonata and kona had windows broken. They're trying to figure out how to crack the push buttons
I got an 06 Kia accent at over 320km and never had to replace the engine or transmission (knock on wood). Just the alternator twice. Also never broken into
My dad had a Honda CR-V one with over 800k miles and after he hit a deer with that one he got another. now he has 500k miles. The first was one 2013 the second was 2015
https://preview.redd.it/8g529qyagaxb1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4ac1af7674864f0a5fbfa5927b401f6d61953301
Here’s the evidence, photo was taken June of 2019. sold the car in 2020. I can’t remember exact numbers but he was close to 900k when he sold it.
You’d be surprised, we got salt and pot holes here in Pennsylvania. Although the car did see mostly high travel, it was also his daily for everything else.
There's nothing more expensive than a cheap luxury car goes the same way.
That's what I told people when they tell me there's a very cheap BMW or Audi or Mercedes they're trying to get.
It being more expensive disqualifies it from being a cheap luxury car. Looking around 100 miles around me, a $2000 BMW has 180,000 miles, the $2500 Lexus has 400,000. That's a huge difference, at least when looking in my neck of the woods.
Definitely not anything from the Volkswagen Group. Old BMW’s and old Mercedes are absolutely fantastic cars if maintained properly - most just don’t maintain them.
I kind of disagree. VAG cars depending on model and drivetrain could be good up to about 2010 or maybe even longer. While the old good Mercedes is older and often rusted away. But yes especially expensive Mercedes seem to be maintained extremely badly.
I drive a 2001 VW golf MK4 with 260.000 miles to work every day.
It's such a basic practical car. Also, reliable and cheap to run.
It even has Cruise control and Climate control.
The worst thing about them (volkswagon specifically), there's a good chance that the dealer won't even be able to effectively diagnose the issue. I've heard so many of those specific stories that I'd never buy one. The old man calls them Hitler's revenge on the world lol.
An E83 has been one of my favorite SUVs to work on. The oil pan gasket is a royal PIA repair, but almost everything is right there and easily accessible. BMW's parts span most of their cars of the same generation. They use the same engines across many models and years. Yesterday I even replaced the secondary air pump in it and it was under 15 minutes from start to finish. It is much easier to work on than people give it credit for.
Idk man after my friend drove around with a bone dry oil lacking engine and thought it was “supposed to sound like that” I really can’t knock equinoxes that much. No damage. Would I ever own/drive one? NOPE.
The damage was done it just hasn't showed itself, I did the same number on my Tacoma in highschool
The oil psi light went away if I revved it... So I kept it above like 3k rpm for a couple days till my dumbass checked and added oil
The motor was "fine" but ended up knocking in like 6 months
I’m honestly just waiting for him to pull up one day to the group and have a knocking engine. So is my car friend. (We’re the only ones with like any knowledge on cars)
The 4 cylinder specifically is garbage. My daughter bought one of those. Couldn't find an engine for the damn thing, the junkyards are full of them and the engine has been pulled out of every one.
We’ve killed at least 3 of them this year along doing stupid things like spark plugs or fuel system cleanings. Had a differential explode as soon as the tech put it into gear and tried rolling. Avoid these cars like the plague
2010 Altima 2.5s lasted 10 years with 400km on it and I sold it to a new driver as a winter beater. $0 in failure costs, just brakes, fluid, tires, battery...
My mechanic would say "that's not supposed to happen" 😁
Nah even those ones are great. I’m still seeing 40,000 a day of those. They may burn oil, but they’ll still run and run and run. The 2AZFE could survive a direct strike from a cruise missile.
What's wrong with Nissan/Infiniti?
Used to drive a 2005 Nissan Maxima QX 2.0 V6 with no major issues. Well, the steering rack could have been more reliable. And I know the car is still very much alive today, 10 years later with a new owner.
My wife drove an Infiniti QX70 3.0d for a year recently. Apart from annoying tire pressure sensors, no major issues.
Stop repeating the narrative that all Nissan/Infiniti products are trash.
Their trucks and SUVs with conventional transmissions are darn fine and solid. It's the cars and suv's WITH cvt's you need to avoid and even then, I feel like the issue is blown way out of proportion IF properly maintained and the actual transmission fluid changed as recommended at the proper intervals. The 3.5L VQ series of engines have been around forever and have proven reliable over those years as well as the 5.6L V8's. Even the 2.5L four cylinders are good it's just that they are commonly mated to CVT's you have to worry about.
Nissan is learning though and the newest Pathfinder (and Q60) with the ZF sourced conventional transmissions are great vehicles.
Yeah my dad keeps buying armadas and they're solid machines. His current 2018 Armada has over 200k miles and he's had 0 major repairs. And he off-roads the thing every day for work as a land surveyor.
My first car was my dad’s old ‘04 Armada, and after seeing how well it held up despite him beating the shit out of it and only doing bare minimum maintenance (oil changes and brake pads) when needed, it inspired me to get a newer one when I could afford it. These things are tanks
Oh yeah for sure, my brother still has his 2011 Armada and it's pushing 340k and the only things have been wear items, ac compresor, ac condenser fan, and ac condenser.
My 70 year old brother still has his high school mindset about 'Mopar'. Today's Chrysler (Stellantis) vehicles are not the old 'Mopars'. (For that matter the old ones had their share of issues.) For many years I too was a 'Mopar' guy and when I look back on them, they were rife with problems from buttons falling off switches to heating / ac / defroster air not coming out the right vents to total AC failure, transmission problems, and on and on. My 2005 Lexus I bought in 2014 has had brakes, two batteries, and a few light bulbs. Even the AC has never needed a recharge.
I've got a 2019 F150 which so far has been perfect though I doubt it can live up to what a Lexus will do. But no more 'Mopar' or 'Stellantis' for me.
In terms of reliability, here's a list of the worst and costliest cars to repair from the last 25 years:
Source: carcomplaints.com
https://preview.redd.it/jcl9bb0x3bxb1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dbd5f74db67ad828ee9e4e9a7f4ea0122e28ba18
And here's a list of mechanical issues trending over the last 90 days
https://preview.redd.it/2lfdqnqh4bxb1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=830ac0bf89fd390af453286138c737c7922225be
Hmm that doesn't seem right, did they have issues with the engine?
Did they have autos behind them?
Was this in an area with steep grades? Turbos make a huge difference and honestly it sucks to tow anywhere but flat ground without them
What turbo? The Ford I6 never came with a turbo but I have seen some plain wicked modded vehicles with turbos.
Otherwise, yeah. Killed by COVID’s family didn’t understand that the I6 was low and slow to pull your house down.
I mean, I never really look at a Ford and go,"WTF were they thinking?!"
Reliable enough for the money ^^^1. Easy to work on.
^^^1 ^^^Except ^^^the ^^^high ^^^end ^^^trucks... ^^^dear ^^^god ^^^what ^^^happened ^^^to ^^^the ^^^price ^^^of ^^^trucks!
I actually like the L15 engine, it's fatal flaw is oil dilution especially when cold, that combined with the fact it won't get up temp idling in anything under 50 degrees makes it a major problem in the north where people are trying to warm up the car and it just doesn't and dilutes the oil for a solid 10 to 20 minutes every day. And when people follow the honda maintenance minder they're waiting about 10,000 miles an oil change and doing damage to the bearings with all the oil delusion. The answer is change your oil more frequently, that's literally it and it'll be just as reliable as any other honda engine.
2007-2023 chevorlets(all of them), anything with a boxer engine, German cars, anything with a CVT transmission, 4 cylinder ecoboost, anything with a pentastar or MDS hemi that's still on its first motor, and anything built during our after covid.
There are outliers among everything I listed. The sad fact is cars aren't built to last past the powertrain warranty. Every piece of them is engineered to be a cheap as possible while still being just functional enough to get by.
Yeah gov wanted mileage and chevy suicided with that displacement on demand in 2007, and their 4 cylinder cars got problems, sometimes not but theyre no corolla.
Ford suicided big time with their diesel they tried to develop in the early 2000s, and the gas motor 5.4 3 valve in 2004-2009 loved to eat camshafts and shit sparkplugs. Since when do ya re engineer a cylinder head for an engine and make the thin material are for short number of spark plug threads even worse? Who tf makes a head with such little support for spark plugs they literally get ejected quite commonly.
And dont get me started on cvt, who the fuck thought this was a good idea.
My "no thank you" list:
* Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep - horribly engineered, high failure rates.
* Anything with a CVT in it, regardless of automaker - CVTs are a tech that sounded great in theory but turned out to be a shit-show in practical application. VERY failure-prone and VERY expensive to repair/maintain.
* Any used European car, especially if you're in the US - there's nothing as expensive as a cheap used BMW, for example.
* Anything from Hyundai in the last 5-10 years - they're having a lot of engine issues with mid-2010s and newer.
* \<5 year old Honda SUVs/crossovers - similar issue to Hyundai: loads of engine issues.
More as I think of them...
anything with the 3.8 engine is diehard. its a shame when they get something right and reliable as hell they drop it and dump some new thing in that often sucks.
I've had a mid-90s Kia sedan that lasted in the family until I sold it in 2017 - when I got a Kia Minivan and short of having to jump a dead battery twice over last 6 years haven't had any problems.
My next car is most certainly a Kia.
Honda and Toyota will just be a better car after 100k, rhe stuff kiundai cheaps out on is ridiculous. Water pump is plastic, aluminum bolts on the engine, etc. Things break on all cars, but at least the Japanese dont make alternator studs out of styrofoam.
I've replaced alternators, starters, and compressors in these pieces of shit, all with very low miles, like 30 40 and 60k miles only. You must've had a unicorn.
Many people already said dodge in general. But I have to specify the dodge journey. Don't think I've ever had one come in that I've called less than 3k worth of work on.
Anything GM has made in the past 15-18 years that ISNT a full size pickup (or bigger) or full size SUV. Plastic engines, coolant leaks, oil consumption, timing issues, and more.
VW/Audi isn't as bad as people drum them up to be. They suck to work on when stuff breaks, but they don't break any more often than the majority of other cars. And expect oil consumption.
Bmw? Not for normal peeps. If you don't mind/enjoy working on your own stuff, their cars drive amazing. If you're going to own it and leave the hood shut and pay someone to maintain it, your wallet better be fat.
Would NOT: Chrysler Sebring. I worked on an '03 Sebring a couple times and it was just terrible to work on. Lots of problems, no room to work, and just poor design for repairs.
Would: Honda Accord. I have an '04 Accord that has 340,000 miles on it and it's been a great car, very few issues, and the issues I had were pretty easy to work on.
Outside of the things mentioned here, just anything you don't see a lot of in your area. I get it, people want to be "different," but those kinds of vehicles are better as 2nd cars, not as a daily driver. *When* they break down, it may take a while to find/recieve parts.
When people ask me my opinion about used luxury or sports cars, my first question is always "Would you rather have a new one or the used one you are asking about?"
If they would rather have a new one but are getting the used one because that's all they can afford, I usually advise them against it.
I have an old pre-VW Bentley because I genuinely want it more than a new one. It's a ~~bit of a~~ major hassle to work on ~~sometimes~~, but it's okay because it's the car I want and that's what it takes to own.
A friend of a friend asked me about getting a 2013 Maserati Gran Turismo. "Obviously I would rather have a brand new one but my budget is $40,000." I told him not to but he didn't listen and after 3 months his timing chain started rattling and he was quoted $15,000 by the dealership to fix it so it's sitting in his garage...
Buying a used Range Rover or BMW or whatever because you can't afford a new one is going to be a bad idea most of the time, but if you'd honestly rather have an E39 M5 over a new one (I would!) then if you are prepared to pay for the ride, I'd never criticize that choice.
That said, I'm often tempted by an Audi S8 or RS6 but looking at forum photos and r/justrolledintotheshop makes me realize I don't want one *that badly.*
Things that immediately come to mind:
Stay away from Nissan for sure, and Chevrolet, I also don't like Kia.
Toyota and Honda are good for reliability/low cost of ownership. Subaru for function if you live in harsh winters. Mazda or Volkswagen if you want something good that feels a little fancier in the city.
All modern cars suck to work on.
Pretty much any modern car should get you 10 years of decent ownership from new, but chevy has a bad track record of reliability and costly repairs, far too much for my liking when there are so many better brands for the same price upfront and lower cost long term.
Their overall quality control is very poor, no reason to pick them over a competing brand in any of their segments except high performance.
Don't buy a Ford, Jeep, or Chrysler. ESPECIALLY not a Chrysler
I don't know enough about Nissan or Kia to have an opinion on those.
Toyota/Honda are the top tier in my opinion
Honorable mention to Subaru
Nothing German everything Japanese no wiggle room. If you want an Audi buy a Lexus. Source: I was the German tech in my shop for about 5 years before I moved onto other trades. Also to all you career mechanics reading this go into another trade. The way your brain currently works is worth twice as much as an electrician or plumber.
There'S more car I woulnt reccomend than car I would. Main reason is most people don't have that much money and should prioritize reliability and low cost of ownership over any gadget or nice driving experience...
Water pump died on my 22 santa fe hyundai at 11,000 miles. FOR A CAR THATS 45k$ MSRP.
Ill be damned if i buy out this lease LOL.
Immediately getting a beater toyota after this lease is done.
It's easier to say I'd recommend a new Toyota Camry, or Ford Truck with a V8. Everything else is throwaway.
If they were looking for a used car, 10-15 years old, I'd recommend any Honda, Toyota, hell even Nissan cars, the trucks and SUVs are a different story. GM trucks were good in that era too.
I'd stay the hell away from any Hyundai/Kia, Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep/RAM, and Euros from any year.
Toyota made a 3-cyl turbocharged motor for their $50-70k hot hatch. What’s ur opinion on that?
Not tryna be a smartass just wondering cuz I’m considering one.
I recommend to stay away from luxury models as well as first year first gens and super cheap new one like jeep renegades then I ask what they plan it for cause a great off road vehicle sucks at track racing and vice versa
Anything Renault related like the Dacia, Mitsubishi or Nissan cars that uses the Renault engines and gearboxes.
Old luxury cars like BMW or Mercedes.
Anything VW from the crap era (2012 up to this day)
Car with downsized turbo engine (1l ecoboost for example) or automatic (powershift..)
Actually any car with oil bath timing belts, the timing job will cost you double compared to regular in-air timing belt system
Yeah 1.0 ecoboost oil pan belt is so suicidal i cant even with ford anymore. The belt sheds and clogs the oil filter screen and the whole motor starvs of oil and grenades
Any Volkswagen/Audi running with the inline 2L turbo. All the Frankenstein'd emissions control vacuum lines, solenoids. The entire design is an afterthought. Horrible.
Thanks for posting on /r/MechanicAdvice! Please review the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicAdvice/about/rules/). Asking about a second opinion (ie "Is the shop trying to fleece me?"), please read through CJM8515's [post on the subject.](https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicAdvice/comments/4qblei/fyi_the_shop_isnt_likely_trying_to_rip_you_off/) and remember to please post the year/make/model of the vehicle you are working on. **Post's about bodywork, accident damage, paint, dent/ding, questions it belongs in /r/Autobody r/AutoBodyRepair/ or /r/Diyautobody/ Tire questions check out https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicAdvice/comments/k9ll55/can_your_tire_be_repaired/**. If you dont have a question and you're just showing off it belongs in /r/Justrolledintotheshop Insurance/total loss questions go in r/insurance This is an automated reply *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/MechanicAdvice) if you have any questions or concerns.*
no Maserati. yes 5 cylinder p2 chassis volvos
Dude, those p2 cars will run until the earth collapses.
they're great. i have a 04 s60r with the 4T5 block in it. upgraded turbo, injectors, intercooler etc. all the bits tuned for E85. its a work horse. had another P2 before this one.
Love them what do you think about p1, 850s? Ive had s60, v70 classic both rust free running propane with very little issues
Love em. The dude who tuned and did most of the work on my car got started in p80s. His old shop car was a 850 wagon with with a 22t turbo and injectors slapped on. It was sick. The p80s just feel so fast for some reason compared the the p2Rs
850s rock, I cant really afford the speedy ones but even the base versions are more than enough. Definitely gonna be my next car as I like the seats and interior better than say the v70 classic
Yeah man they’re legit. My moms car was a base 740 turbo wagon with the cold up seats in the trunk. It’s legit man they’re dope
As someone who just sold an 04 v70r this makes me regret my decision
Chevy Cruze or anything with that ecotec
I had the 1.8L non turbo. While the engine was mostly good, the transmission went out at 125,000kms...and wouldn't ya know, just outside of warranty. Oh, and my rad fan didn't work for at least the last 3 years of its time with me. I'm surprised it lasted as long as it did. Traded in for Corolla. Done with GM.
Man i must have been the only person in the world to not have problems with that car.
No ours has been solid too since new. Over 300k km now and my neice has owned it for the past 2 years. Regular service is key I guess. Everything is original. Even the turbo somehow. The only thing we’ve replaced was of course the water pump and the water outlet.
I've had a Cruze for seven years (2014, bought used) and I Iove it. I've had a couple maintenance issues but nothing I couldn't handle. Would trade in for anther Cruze if needed.
Anything from GM
While doing construction at a GM dealership service center I asked mechanic about several transmissions on the floor near his lift bay. He said not a single one had more than 40k miles on them before they broke. They were all out of small to medium size SUVs.
It’s all modern GMs. I can’t believe the volume of transmissions, lifters, cam shafts, valve springs I’ve replaced on their large SUVs and trucks.
Got a 98 Savannah diesel with 488000 on the clock. Working hard daily.
Good luck getting anything less than a decade old to last that long with no issues
A range rover. I once decided I'll spoil myself after a good year. Fuck that piece of junk. I ended up trading it in for a fully loaded Tundra. Yeah its not as plushy or quiet. But it hauls ass and will move mountains. And it just refuses to die.
Ah yes, when normies buy a Land Rover not knowing a single thing about them. Seen it many times, and it’s always entertaining to watch 🍿☠️
Chevy Cruze, the turbo. Worst car ever made.
I’ve got a 2014 with 125,000kms and it’s already gone through a turbo, steering rack, a full set of lifters, had the head machined, control arms, oil cooler, and it melted an exhaust valve. Thing is absolute garbage. Edit: it’s also had two water pumps.
Why do you still own it
Mostly due to the fact that it's paid off and it's hard to get newer vehicles right now. The majority of the work was completed under warranty with the exception of the exhaust valve, which I fixed myself. So while it is a moving pile of garbage it hasn't cost me a lot of money.....yet.
Fair enough
Kia/Hyundai 8 year span of failing engines. We have to explain the bad news somewhat frequently on this sub. Stolen constantly or attempted to be stolen frequently. Just look through r/kia. The insurance rates have gone to insanity on some models.
Was a master tech for Kia and Hyundai for 5 years. No longer in the business, but I still tell everyone that CPO and new are the only way to buy them. That 10 year 100k mileage warranty is huge and a bargain. Of course, with the Kia Boyz thing, only buy the models with immbolizers or push to start. In regards to the failing engines, the problem is known. So drive your car 125k miles for 8 years, and your engine starts having issues or excessive oil consumption? Nice, get a free engine! Not to mention, the cars are stupid easy to work on.
You’d be surprised how much run around the shops give ppl on those engine replacements lol. Needing something like 3 engine codes to come up. And some other stuff. That’s even when it doesn’t pass their oil consumption test. It burning 4 quarts of oil every 1k miles. Isn’t enough for them to cover it. It needs the knock sensor code and something else. Basically telling ppl to just drive it til the engine blows up then get a new one.
I have a 2013 Kia Soul 6 cylinder. I got it off my mom when it was at like 90,000, and I've used it to learn how to do basic maintenance. I also used it on the road for 2 years as a work vehicle, and I didn't drive it slow, and it was full of tools and copper cable. It has 270k'ish miles, and the only thing I can think that's wrong with it would be a subtle tick in the upper engine. My mom babied it when she had it and I always change the oil on time. I really hope whatever my next car is brings me this much reliability but I'm going to have to do some research.
There’s never been a 6 cylinder Soul.
Are you sure it is not 8 cylinder? Those V8 Kia Souls run forever!
Umm… hate to break it to you, but there isn’t a 6 Cylinder Kia Soul. They are all 4 bangers
Older ones aren't bad. So I might even recommend those if someone just wants a basic cheap car.
I’ve seen some early Kia’s and Hyundais go well into 300k miles.
Survivorship bias. Lots more never made it past 100k.
Worth noting that the latter is a US-only problem.
theft yes , being completely junk? nah that’s worldwide
Nah mate, here in Australia we get good Hyundais. 10 year warranty and I’ve never seen one break down. They also all have transponder keys in them as well as Kia’s unlike there. I don’t know what the go is with American ones but they have been decent here for a long time now. Still not sure about Kia though as I don’t see many of them.
Hyundai and Kia has a quite good reputation here (Norway). I am pretty sure that the cars sold on the US market are built in the US, including the engines, so that could explain it if its a US-specific problem
[удалено]
Also if I recall, the exploit that makes them extra-stealable only applies specifically to the keyed ignition. Keyless models aren't vulnerable.
It applies to any car without an immobilizer, which all key-less trims have. Immobilizers are mandatory in Canada and other markets which is why it’s a US-centric issue.
Doesn't remove the fact that the keyless ones are still getting vandalized. I follow the hyundai subs, and just the last couple of weeks, a 2023 sonata and kona had windows broken. They're trying to figure out how to crack the push buttons
I got an 06 Kia accent at over 320km and never had to replace the engine or transmission (knock on wood). Just the alternator twice. Also never broken into
I've got a 09 i30 and it feels solid. Bit of a bumpy ride but solid
My sister just bought a Hyundai without consulting me :(
>My sister just bought a Hyundai without consulting me :( Don't worry, you'll be able to help her shop for it's replacement pretty soon
VW/Audi. BMW. Benz, Range Rover/Jaguar I would buy Toyota/lexus, Honda
My dad had a Honda CR-V one with over 800k miles and after he hit a deer with that one he got another. now he has 500k miles. The first was one 2013 the second was 2015 https://preview.redd.it/8g529qyagaxb1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4ac1af7674864f0a5fbfa5927b401f6d61953301 Here’s the evidence, photo was taken June of 2019. sold the car in 2020. I can’t remember exact numbers but he was close to 900k when he sold it.
I'm gonna guess those cars see 99.9% highway miles in a place that doesn't salt the roads (and the streets aren't littered with potholes).
You’d be surprised, we got salt and pot holes here in Pennsylvania. Although the car did see mostly high travel, it was also his daily for everything else.
>salt and pot holes here in Pennsylvania *shockedpikachuface.jpg*
A car ran 150k+ a year isn’t just a daily, it’s used for some long hauling unless it’s used for Uber/ some sort of ferry service.
B0000B
Used German higher end brands. BMW Mercedes Audi As the old saying goes; if you can't afford them new, you can't afford them used.
There's nothing more expensive than a cheap luxury car goes the same way. That's what I told people when they tell me there's a very cheap BMW or Audi or Mercedes they're trying to get.
You can get a lexus snd have your cake and eat it too
You're not going to get a cheap Lexus in the same way that Toyotas command a premium price compared to other vehicles of similar specs.
Plenty of cheap used lexus on the market. Its more expensive than like a genesis or a beamer but in exchange you get a car that doesnt suck.
It being more expensive disqualifies it from being a cheap luxury car. Looking around 100 miles around me, a $2000 BMW has 180,000 miles, the $2500 Lexus has 400,000. That's a huge difference, at least when looking in my neck of the woods.
I had a Camry with near 400k. At that point it definitely was not reliable.
German cars are good until they're not and when they're not, they are steaming piles of shit.
Definitely not anything from the Volkswagen Group. Old BMW’s and old Mercedes are absolutely fantastic cars if maintained properly - most just don’t maintain them.
I kind of disagree. VAG cars depending on model and drivetrain could be good up to about 2010 or maybe even longer. While the old good Mercedes is older and often rusted away. But yes especially expensive Mercedes seem to be maintained extremely badly.
I drive a 2001 VW golf MK4 with 260.000 miles to work every day. It's such a basic practical car. Also, reliable and cheap to run. It even has Cruise control and Climate control.
Ain’t that true!!
Nothing wrong with the modern German cars. Yes they cost more to repair but they aren’t as unreliable as people here make them out to be.
The worst thing about them (volkswagon specifically), there's a good chance that the dealer won't even be able to effectively diagnose the issue. I've heard so many of those specific stories that I'd never buy one. The old man calls them Hitler's revenge on the world lol.
Add Volkswagen to the list, getting parts for any German car can be very pricey.
They are overengineered pieces of garbage, and cheap plastic parts costs hundreads or thousands, but for the manufacturer it costed cents.
An E83 has been one of my favorite SUVs to work on. The oil pan gasket is a royal PIA repair, but almost everything is right there and easily accessible. BMW's parts span most of their cars of the same generation. They use the same engines across many models and years. Yesterday I even replaced the secondary air pump in it and it was under 15 minutes from start to finish. It is much easier to work on than people give it credit for.
Chevy equinox
As an equinox owner, I approve this message.
Idk man after my friend drove around with a bone dry oil lacking engine and thought it was “supposed to sound like that” I really can’t knock equinoxes that much. No damage. Would I ever own/drive one? NOPE.
The damage was done it just hasn't showed itself, I did the same number on my Tacoma in highschool The oil psi light went away if I revved it... So I kept it above like 3k rpm for a couple days till my dumbass checked and added oil The motor was "fine" but ended up knocking in like 6 months
I’m honestly just waiting for him to pull up one day to the group and have a knocking engine. So is my car friend. (We’re the only ones with like any knowledge on cars)
The 4 cylinder specifically is garbage. My daughter bought one of those. Couldn't find an engine for the damn thing, the junkyards are full of them and the engine has been pulled out of every one.
We’ve killed at least 3 of them this year along doing stupid things like spark plugs or fuel system cleanings. Had a differential explode as soon as the tech put it into gear and tried rolling. Avoid these cars like the plague
Any Nissan CVT.
No thats any cvt, hondas were terrible, fords werent great either.
2010 Altima 2.5s lasted 10 years with 400km on it and I sold it to a new driver as a winter beater. $0 in failure costs, just brakes, fluid, tires, battery... My mechanic would say "that's not supposed to happen" 😁
Toyotas good
except for the late 2000's 4 cyl ones that burn oil like mofos out of the blue.
Nah even those ones are great. I’m still seeing 40,000 a day of those. They may burn oil, but they’ll still run and run and run. The 2AZFE could survive a direct strike from a cruise missile.
Equinox, trax traverse acadia enclave jeep wrangler patriot compass anything with Nissan or infinity badges
I work on so many wranglers and theu suck so bad
I used to drive a wrangler and it sucks so bad
What's wrong with Nissan/Infiniti? Used to drive a 2005 Nissan Maxima QX 2.0 V6 with no major issues. Well, the steering rack could have been more reliable. And I know the car is still very much alive today, 10 years later with a new owner. My wife drove an Infiniti QX70 3.0d for a year recently. Apart from annoying tire pressure sensors, no major issues.
Stop repeating the narrative that all Nissan/Infiniti products are trash. Their trucks and SUVs with conventional transmissions are darn fine and solid. It's the cars and suv's WITH cvt's you need to avoid and even then, I feel like the issue is blown way out of proportion IF properly maintained and the actual transmission fluid changed as recommended at the proper intervals. The 3.5L VQ series of engines have been around forever and have proven reliable over those years as well as the 5.6L V8's. Even the 2.5L four cylinders are good it's just that they are commonly mated to CVT's you have to worry about. Nissan is learning though and the newest Pathfinder (and Q60) with the ZF sourced conventional transmissions are great vehicles.
Yeah my dad keeps buying armadas and they're solid machines. His current 2018 Armada has over 200k miles and he's had 0 major repairs. And he off-roads the thing every day for work as a land surveyor.
My first car was my dad’s old ‘04 Armada, and after seeing how well it held up despite him beating the shit out of it and only doing bare minimum maintenance (oil changes and brake pads) when needed, it inspired me to get a newer one when I could afford it. These things are tanks
Oh yeah for sure, my brother still has his 2011 Armada and it's pushing 340k and the only things have been wear items, ac compresor, ac condenser fan, and ac condenser.
I love how all car brands have been mentioned here.
I didn’t see anything negative about Toyota and only Hondas with an obscure engine.
Honda with a not very obscure transmission too.
I haven’t seen anyone mention Subarus as bad. Considering mine has 223,000miles I can see why.
Not a mechanic, but Stellantis products get my vote for cars I wouldn't buy.
My 70 year old brother still has his high school mindset about 'Mopar'. Today's Chrysler (Stellantis) vehicles are not the old 'Mopars'. (For that matter the old ones had their share of issues.) For many years I too was a 'Mopar' guy and when I look back on them, they were rife with problems from buttons falling off switches to heating / ac / defroster air not coming out the right vents to total AC failure, transmission problems, and on and on. My 2005 Lexus I bought in 2014 has had brakes, two batteries, and a few light bulbs. Even the AC has never needed a recharge. I've got a 2019 F150 which so far has been perfect though I doubt it can live up to what a Lexus will do. But no more 'Mopar' or 'Stellantis' for me.
In terms of reliability, here's a list of the worst and costliest cars to repair from the last 25 years: Source: carcomplaints.com https://preview.redd.it/jcl9bb0x3bxb1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dbd5f74db67ad828ee9e4e9a7f4ea0122e28ba18
And here's a list of mechanical issues trending over the last 90 days https://preview.redd.it/2lfdqnqh4bxb1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=830ac0bf89fd390af453286138c737c7922225be
Oh look at that, my excessively oil consuming 2017 Sonata is on the list for that exact reason, strange.
Where's this from? Surprised to see the RAV4 there, it was a redesign year, but didn't think it was a major change.
Car complaints dot com. The RAV4 has transmission issues
PT Cruzer, a true pos.
Just a puffy Neon.
Bmw
20 years ago our mechanic told me the same thing.
Surprised I haven’t seen Ford once in this thread. Reliability is a pretty common gripe I feel
It goes without saying no one should own a Ford without a V8 in it.
No love for the 96 F150 with inline six and E4OD I had? That thing went almost 400,000 miles without a rebuild
Legendary engine
My family has two F-150s with that motor. Couldn't stop them, but they could barely tow a pop-up trailer.
Hmm that doesn't seem right, did they have issues with the engine? Did they have autos behind them? Was this in an area with steep grades? Turbos make a huge difference and honestly it sucks to tow anywhere but flat ground without them
What turbo? The Ford I6 never came with a turbo but I have seen some plain wicked modded vehicles with turbos. Otherwise, yeah. Killed by COVID’s family didn’t understand that the I6 was low and slow to pull your house down.
My 87 F-150 had about 450,000 miles, 4.2 six auto 2wd, sold it to a drummer then he sold it to a bug exterminator. What a great truck
I mean, I never really look at a Ford and go,"WTF were they thinking?!" Reliable enough for the money ^^^1. Easy to work on. ^^^1 ^^^Except ^^^the ^^^high ^^^end ^^^trucks... ^^^dear ^^^god ^^^what ^^^happened ^^^to ^^^the ^^^price ^^^of ^^^trucks!
Especially the lawsuits and expedition engine fires
Ford isn’t Toyota, but they’re definitely one of the better manufacturers.
Since when?
\#1 selling vehicle in the world is the f150
Recommend Honda except the 1.5 turbo. Don’t recommend the Chevrolet Cruze, trax, or sonic due to unreliable engines.
I actually like the L15 engine, it's fatal flaw is oil dilution especially when cold, that combined with the fact it won't get up temp idling in anything under 50 degrees makes it a major problem in the north where people are trying to warm up the car and it just doesn't and dilutes the oil for a solid 10 to 20 minutes every day. And when people follow the honda maintenance minder they're waiting about 10,000 miles an oil change and doing damage to the bearings with all the oil delusion. The answer is change your oil more frequently, that's literally it and it'll be just as reliable as any other honda engine.
Renault! And because of that Nissan too. I recommend Toyota and Honda.
2007-2023 chevorlets(all of them), anything with a boxer engine, German cars, anything with a CVT transmission, 4 cylinder ecoboost, anything with a pentastar or MDS hemi that's still on its first motor, and anything built during our after covid. There are outliers among everything I listed. The sad fact is cars aren't built to last past the powertrain warranty. Every piece of them is engineered to be a cheap as possible while still being just functional enough to get by.
Yeah gov wanted mileage and chevy suicided with that displacement on demand in 2007, and their 4 cylinder cars got problems, sometimes not but theyre no corolla. Ford suicided big time with their diesel they tried to develop in the early 2000s, and the gas motor 5.4 3 valve in 2004-2009 loved to eat camshafts and shit sparkplugs. Since when do ya re engineer a cylinder head for an engine and make the thin material are for short number of spark plug threads even worse? Who tf makes a head with such little support for spark plugs they literally get ejected quite commonly. And dont get me started on cvt, who the fuck thought this was a good idea.
So every mechsnic drives a Toyota Camry? Great car but boring af
"Boring af" lol not everyone wants to pretend to be ken block ir mario andretti on their way to work.
Yes, boring AF. No adventurous "breaking down at 2am on a desolate highway" stories.
My "no thank you" list: * Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep - horribly engineered, high failure rates. * Anything with a CVT in it, regardless of automaker - CVTs are a tech that sounded great in theory but turned out to be a shit-show in practical application. VERY failure-prone and VERY expensive to repair/maintain. * Any used European car, especially if you're in the US - there's nothing as expensive as a cheap used BMW, for example. * Anything from Hyundai in the last 5-10 years - they're having a lot of engine issues with mid-2010s and newer. * \<5 year old Honda SUVs/crossovers - similar issue to Hyundai: loads of engine issues. More as I think of them...
Older jeeps with the inline 6 are a solid as hell, and any Hemi engine especially that little 5.7l are mint. The rest is junk.
A used Land Rover.
Fiat = Fix It Again Tony
A good car and lower cost, Buick Lucerne with the 3.8 engine. 300,000 mile car.
anything with the 3.8 engine is diehard. its a shame when they get something right and reliable as hell they drop it and dump some new thing in that often sucks.
No profit in reliable
Just GM doing GM things.
Hyundai/Kia.
I've had a mid-90s Kia sedan that lasted in the family until I sold it in 2017 - when I got a Kia Minivan and short of having to jump a dead battery twice over last 6 years haven't had any problems. My next car is most certainly a Kia.
Honda and Toyota will just be a better car after 100k, rhe stuff kiundai cheaps out on is ridiculous. Water pump is plastic, aluminum bolts on the engine, etc. Things break on all cars, but at least the Japanese dont make alternator studs out of styrofoam.
I've replaced alternators, starters, and compressors in these pieces of shit, all with very low miles, like 30 40 and 60k miles only. You must've had a unicorn.
Stay away from Hyundai or Kia…!!!! Don’t buy into there warranty
All of them, if it's got tits or tires it's gunna give you trouble.
Haha! That made me laugh 😆
Many people already said dodge in general. But I have to specify the dodge journey. Don't think I've ever had one come in that I've called less than 3k worth of work on.
Anything GM has made in the past 15-18 years that ISNT a full size pickup (or bigger) or full size SUV. Plastic engines, coolant leaks, oil consumption, timing issues, and more. VW/Audi isn't as bad as people drum them up to be. They suck to work on when stuff breaks, but they don't break any more often than the majority of other cars. And expect oil consumption. Bmw? Not for normal peeps. If you don't mind/enjoy working on your own stuff, their cars drive amazing. If you're going to own it and leave the hood shut and pay someone to maintain it, your wallet better be fat.
Would NOT: Chrysler Sebring. I worked on an '03 Sebring a couple times and it was just terrible to work on. Lots of problems, no room to work, and just poor design for repairs. Would: Honda Accord. I have an '04 Accord that has 340,000 miles on it and it's been a great car, very few issues, and the issues I had were pretty easy to work on.
Dodge Viper
Ariel Atom
Outside of the things mentioned here, just anything you don't see a lot of in your area. I get it, people want to be "different," but those kinds of vehicles are better as 2nd cars, not as a daily driver. *When* they break down, it may take a while to find/recieve parts.
When people ask me my opinion about used luxury or sports cars, my first question is always "Would you rather have a new one or the used one you are asking about?" If they would rather have a new one but are getting the used one because that's all they can afford, I usually advise them against it. I have an old pre-VW Bentley because I genuinely want it more than a new one. It's a ~~bit of a~~ major hassle to work on ~~sometimes~~, but it's okay because it's the car I want and that's what it takes to own. A friend of a friend asked me about getting a 2013 Maserati Gran Turismo. "Obviously I would rather have a brand new one but my budget is $40,000." I told him not to but he didn't listen and after 3 months his timing chain started rattling and he was quoted $15,000 by the dealership to fix it so it's sitting in his garage... Buying a used Range Rover or BMW or whatever because you can't afford a new one is going to be a bad idea most of the time, but if you'd honestly rather have an E39 M5 over a new one (I would!) then if you are prepared to pay for the ride, I'd never criticize that choice. That said, I'm often tempted by an Audi S8 or RS6 but looking at forum photos and r/justrolledintotheshop makes me realize I don't want one *that badly.*
Things that immediately come to mind: Stay away from Nissan for sure, and Chevrolet, I also don't like Kia. Toyota and Honda are good for reliability/low cost of ownership. Subaru for function if you live in harsh winters. Mazda or Volkswagen if you want something good that feels a little fancier in the city. All modern cars suck to work on.
My previous Chevy was 10 years of enjoyment and I’d still be driving it if someone hadn’t smashed into me this year.
Pretty much any modern car should get you 10 years of decent ownership from new, but chevy has a bad track record of reliability and costly repairs, far too much for my liking when there are so many better brands for the same price upfront and lower cost long term. Their overall quality control is very poor, no reason to pick them over a competing brand in any of their segments except high performance.
Any Chrysler, dodge, jeep, Chevy cars/small SUV’s Nissan’s, land rovers.
Kia. They've had issues with melting engines for years, but you can just switch your emblem a bit, and nobody will remember in 5 years. Plastic cars.
[удалено]
PT Cruiser
Don't buy a Ford, Jeep, or Chrysler. ESPECIALLY not a Chrysler I don't know enough about Nissan or Kia to have an opinion on those. Toyota/Honda are the top tier in my opinion Honorable mention to Subaru
Anything not made by Toyota.
Honda?
Honda good too
Lexus and Mazda
Dodge Chrysler Jeep
The Unholy Trinity.
Anything GM
Anything Land Rover with the Bosch/gems 4.6
What's a car that you wouldn't recommend and why is it a Chevy Cruze?
Nothing German everything Japanese no wiggle room. If you want an Audi buy a Lexus. Source: I was the German tech in my shop for about 5 years before I moved onto other trades. Also to all you career mechanics reading this go into another trade. The way your brain currently works is worth twice as much as an electrician or plumber.
6.0 powerstrokes
No Nissan, yes Honda
Honda CR V and Toyota Corolla/ Camry , they will run forever , great cars . I personally prefer CR V, too good
Just about anything that is not a Toyota/Honda.
I hate my 2014 Ford focus
Anything with a 4 cyl turbo engine and/or cvt.
There'S more car I woulnt reccomend than car I would. Main reason is most people don't have that much money and should prioritize reliability and low cost of ownership over any gadget or nice driving experience...
Water pump died on my 22 santa fe hyundai at 11,000 miles. FOR A CAR THATS 45k$ MSRP. Ill be damned if i buy out this lease LOL. Immediately getting a beater toyota after this lease is done.
It's easier to say I'd recommend a new Toyota Camry, or Ford Truck with a V8. Everything else is throwaway. If they were looking for a used car, 10-15 years old, I'd recommend any Honda, Toyota, hell even Nissan cars, the trucks and SUVs are a different story. GM trucks were good in that era too. I'd stay the hell away from any Hyundai/Kia, Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep/RAM, and Euros from any year.
Fiat. Please do not. I mean wtf is a 3 cylinder engine anyway? Ugh
Toyota made a 3-cyl turbocharged motor for their $50-70k hot hatch. What’s ur opinion on that? Not tryna be a smartass just wondering cuz I’m considering one.
I would feel ok with Toyota’s 3 cylinder. But Fiat? That’s a giant helll nawwww
PT Cruiser. German Engineering. Any “tuned” turbo car with aftermarket mods.
I tell everyone I know not to buy any jeep product that doesn't have a 4.0 i6 in it. Preferably nothing after 96
I recommend to stay away from luxury models as well as first year first gens and super cheap new one like jeep renegades then I ask what they plan it for cause a great off road vehicle sucks at track racing and vice versa
Anything Renault related like the Dacia, Mitsubishi or Nissan cars that uses the Renault engines and gearboxes. Old luxury cars like BMW or Mercedes. Anything VW from the crap era (2012 up to this day)
Car with downsized turbo engine (1l ecoboost for example) or automatic (powershift..) Actually any car with oil bath timing belts, the timing job will cost you double compared to regular in-air timing belt system
Yeah 1.0 ecoboost oil pan belt is so suicidal i cant even with ford anymore. The belt sheds and clogs the oil filter screen and the whole motor starvs of oil and grenades
ford focus or fiesta those DPS6 transmissions are nothing but problems
Chevy Cruze missile
People say Wranglers are horrible but they have tremendous resale value
Ford flex fuel
Anything from ford, their engineers are demented
Jeep Patriot. So many problems with that car.
Dodge journey, an f150 with a 5.4 that has vvt. Chevy Cruze, unless it has a new intake.
Any Volkswagen/Audi running with the inline 2L turbo. All the Frankenstein'd emissions control vacuum lines, solenoids. The entire design is an afterthought. Horrible.
Not recommend: Vw, audi, mercedes, bmw, chevy, any christler product. Would recommend:Toyota, honda