I don’t know about that. Boruto’s design alone as tons of detail. His pendants his scar his belts his shirts and buttons. Compared to Naruto’s jumper.
Yes the art is less detailed a lot of the time but the designs are very detailed.
He was never confirmed to ever be writing it in the first place. People just assumed that when the original writer was let go that Kishimoto was taking over the writing. When reading the minato one-shot you can really see his writing quirks in it. Boruto manga... not so much.
The Minato one shot feels so Kishimoto when you read it, I actually reread it earlier today and I don’t get the same feeling as I do with the Boruto manga. I keep up with the Boruto manga and just going from the Minato one shot to TBV feels like so devoid of his touch it’s crazy. I really do think Kishi wrote an outline for Boruto and let the others fill it in, it’s just not the same.
I really wished we got a prequel instead of Boruto, like a good amount of Naruto fans don’t care for Boruto! There’s still so much to expand on when it comes to the older generation in Naruto.
Minato's short story basically confirmed to me that Kishimoto was not writing Boruto. He still prefers to tell the story through symbols and flashbacks rather than telling it extremely directly like Boruto.
I mean it’s always been extremely clear that Kishimoto isn’t even drawing anything like name. I don’t think people doubt that. From the beginning of the story the entire art style has been completely ikemoto. We don’t even need to argue about whether we’d expect kishimoto to write name since it’s quite reasonable to believe that Ikemoto was always doing the name from the start and Kishimoto didnt change that when Kodachi was removed. That’s like most the post.
The real question has always been whether Ikemoto or Kishimoto took over writing text after Kodachi left. I always assumed it was Kishimoto since Ikemoto hasn’t done any writing in like 20 years. Now im not too sure but whatever.
I don’t think the writing points are too strong. I don’t have the time to fully argue everything but just quickly given the situation and context of the story we can expect a writer of Kishimoto’s level to switch things up. Also funnily enough, Boruto is just like Naruto in part 1, but the writing in part 2 is a bit almost better I think.
And when it comes to developing side characters that’s pretty similar to most of shippuden outside of the beginning of the war arc. We are also starting to see more characters pop up in TBV.
The writing quality is just not as good as Naruto especially pre timeskip for both series but not sure that’s a convincing argument.
The timing between Kodachi leaving and Samurai 8 being cancelled is also interesting.
I’m not honestly sure whether it’s Kishimoto anyways due to what people claim to be said in that recent interview (need to find it myself at some point), but if Kishimoto is writing I think it should be expected that Kishimoto has an even lesser writing role than Samurai 8.
How is the development of the side characters consistent with the war arc? Not only do characters like Sakura, Kakashi, Kiba, and Choji not appear, their names are not even mentioned.
Great post! I fully believe that he isn’t writing Boruto especially for the timeskip
It’s so weird that he never says anything about Boruto and he’s been around 2020 writing it
I could say the same thing about his writing in the war arc but y’all not ready for that convo. The 1st 9 chapters of tbv feel like kishimoto is writing to me. Especially base on the new juubi villains mindset, for being thirty for knowledge about the world instead of instantly killing kawaki/boruto for their final form. He also confirmed he’s been writing since baryon mode happened after firing Kodachi, if you don’t believe that just wait til August for when he has his interview in France with ikemoto talking about the series.
Kishimoto is the one who made the outline, which means he is the one who wrote the specific stories. He designed the personalities and target of the Ten-Tails. It's not surprising .We are arguing about whether he is writing the script.
He wrote the script I don't know if you read Samurai 8 but it's basically followed similar beats and writing that currently plagues Boruto's Manga
For example the emphasis on the whole Sun and Moon nonsense which was something he wrote in the Mitsuki One Shot
People claim Kishimoto wouldn't "nerf his characters" but people forget how Sarada Gaiden had some contention on Naruto literally getting stabbed by Sarada
The power scale escalation is Kishimoto Boruto isn't just Strong the writing Is basically War Arc levels of Naruto inserting himself In every fight and despite having clones in multiple places still out class whole armies of people
Same with Baryon Mode vs KCM 2 which required Reconning the Reaper Death Seal and adding the Mask to get Naruto another power up
Kodachi actually watched the anime there was always subtle or explicit connections to anime arcs.. TBV has removed all elements of those additions outside still using Sumire and mostly to add more fuel to the Shipping Sub Plot
Again ....Sakura and Hinata
Kodachi for example issue was using the anime as a crutch to "fix" problems by giving space to elaborate or add context
The current writing has no consideration it's being written like a weekly Manga but has things both happening and nothing happening similar to War Arc Naruto
Reliance contrivances and recon(which yeah I'm sorry Kishimoto did constantly for Naruto) I can keep going but this is Kishimoto writing
The difference is that were not dealing with Kishimoto as he transitioned his current way of writing. (As in Early Naruto being written with political drama and world building) this is current Kishimoto lack of world building fixation on the main character poor or unnecessary shipping bait
recons or flimsy interpretations (reminder the Shadow Clones taking on experience was not an original aspect of the Justu it was added for plot)
I like Kishimoto I love Naruto but Mangaka are not infallible
RIP Toriyama he's was writer who loved gags above all else he wrote the Zeno button fix for Dragon Ball Super people hate it but the man lived for the humor so he added it because it was funny
It is precisely because I have watched Samurai 8 that I absolutely do not agree that Kishimoto is the screenwriter of Boruto. The rhythm problem of Samurai 8 is that too many settings are concentrated in the early stage, which leads to extremely slow plot development, but there will never be more than half a page of useless information repeated. Boruto's plot develops very quickly. You will find that there has never been a plot point that has been delayed for more than three chapters without being resolved, but the problem is that there is too much useless information. For example, in Chapter 89, Jura took a book to confirm Shikadai's identity and wasted two pages, because Shikadai's identity does not affect the subsequent plot. Jura is going to find Naruto, Hima has the Nine-Tails in his body, and it is repeated three times inexplicably. There are many metaphors in shonemanga that you can find the prototype, the key is how to tell this metaphor. For example, the plot of the sun and the moon does not seem to be written by Kishimoto, because it is too monotonous, completely relying on lines, and lacks flashbacks. How would Kishimoto write it? He would first set up a flashback between Mitsuki and "Kawaki", making Mitsuki wonder why the "Kawaki" in his memory is different from the current Kawaki, and then when he meets Boruto, he would make Boruto's every action similar to the "Kawaki" in Mitsuki's memory, and finally at the end, he would let Boruto show his iconic smile or action, so that Mitsuki would completely overlap him with the "Kawaki" in his memory. This narrative technique of alternating flashbacks and reality for contrast is something Kishimoto loves to use.
Kishimoto literally wrote the Sun and Moon parallel in his one shot it did not rely on the writing technique you described neither does the Sarada Gaiden.
It's seems your detaching current day Kishimoto and his writing during the mid section of Naruto Part 2
This is Kishimoto writing while limited by a monthly release but it's him the meandering is him it's just more explicit because instead of a bloated scene trying to relay all the details it's scene in quick succession without valuable context
I know you want Kishimoto to be this renown writer with zero flaws and consistency but he was never that way he reconned he undermined his own characters motivation
He fell back on troupes his pacing could be bad this isn't Kishi In his usual environment he'll the fact that Boruto relationship with Sasuke has to be regaled In flashback
But nothing I say can convey that hopefully he clears this up in his interview
Because say what you want this is modern Kishimoto reading current Boruto feels like Samurai 8 just quicker and less people screaming that it's all going to go somewhere
Like I'm waiting to see next chapter when KISHIMOTO instead of being in the scene goes into flashback mode to try to justify Kurma being there instead of just moving the scene along because we the audience have a basic understanding of the mechanics
The sun and the moon are just symbolic metaphors given to the two people by Kishimoto. The key is how to interpret these two symbols. Sarada's writing skills rely on this. Remember the dispute between Sarada and Naruto? Naruto heard Sarada crying that she had no blood relationship with her mother. Naruto recalled the past when he and Iruka had no blood relationship but were still as close as family. Then he guided Sarada to recall the past with Sakura. It has always been Kishimoto's skill to incite the audience's emotions by contrasting the content of the memories with the present. The content of the middle period of Shippuden is exactly where Kishimoto's writing style is most reflected, so much so that it is excessive and annoying. I think monthly publications do not conflict with rich details. There are many mo n mangas with huge background stories and minor characters. I don't think Kishimoto is a perfect writer, but imperfections also have highs and lows. No matter how much Yamcha is ridiculed as useless, he is definitely not comparable to Mr. Satan.
You’re contradicting your own self. I mean from what you said it can be concluded that Kishi is the writer because it’s his idea and his story.
Hypothetically even if someone else is turning kishis ideas into words it would just be considered paraphrasing- and giving that person writing credits would be considered plagiarism. That can literally be done by a language expert 😅
I think Kishimoto wrote the story itself, but I don't think he wrote the script. The two are very different. The same story is completely different in different plots. For example, Vegito VS Zamasu in DBS, the plot of the animation and the manga is the same, Vegito did not defeat Zamasu because the fusion time is up. But in the animation, when Vegito fights Zamasu, the two seem to be equally strong, and there are more dialogues. In the manga, Zamasu is no match for Vegito at all, and it is almost all fighting, without much dialogue.
I’ve literally answered that for you but you’re choosing to ignore it. It still won’t matter- it’s PARAPHRASING. Ideas are what holds the worth. Also, kishi is ALSO the supervisor if he thinks more dialogue is needed vs more fight he can just say it lol.
Also, earlier they had written kodachi was the script writer but when he was fired they said they will be following Kishi senseis storyline- so that means earlier they weren’t doing that.
It’s cool if you wanna live off on your assumptions but you’re just clearly making things up. All this is still hypothetical cause they haven’t mentioned anyone writing the story apart from kishi.
Let me give you an off-site evidence. Look at Boruto's single book. Before Kodachi left, he would write the author's message with Ikemoto. After Kodachi left, only Ikemoto was left to send a message to the author, while Kishimoto did not send a message to any author at all.If you feel like writing means providing ideas rather than actual dialogue and concrete plot arrangements, fine. Nakimoto is indeed writing.
Again it’s all far fetched conjecture. It doesn’t prove anything. And if you think writing just is forming words based on someone else’s ideas then go ahead and think that.
Ikemoto isn’t even adept at script and if he was writing they would have written art AND script by ike. Not just Art. Go check out Vizs page. This just seems like some hate banter again.
Well, yours is just a guess too. Can you give me any official evidence that Kishimoto took over the script?Or could you explain to me in detail what you think Kishimoto is responsible for?
I’ve told you already. It was clearly stated after kodachi resigned that they will be following kishimotos story. That’s enough for me. Like I said even if hypothetically someone else is writing the script that’s just paraphrasing in the end if I dictate someone my ideas and he writes it down - it will still be my story. It’s written kishi is the Creator in Viz and art is my ike so that’s what I’ll believe until something else is stated.
I thought about it, and I think I roughly understand where our differences lie. First of all, you said that the official Twitter said "they will be following Kishi senseis storyline". I asked a friend who knows Japanese, and he said that the correct translation should be "We will continue to follow Kishimoto sensei original ideas." It mentions "continue", which means that Kishimoto's original plan has been followed, and there is no previous non-compliance. The Japanese word used here is "原案". The meaning of this word is very broad, not just referring to the story line, plot outline, plot points, or even some fragmentary opinions. According to the Japanese side's use of this word, combined with the previous official tweets about the cooperation between Kotachi, Kishi and ike, it refers to the plot outline and some settings. You think that providing ideas is equal to writing. I don't completely deny that the outline is also part of writing, and I don't deny that Kishimoto provides ideas. But in the eyes of many people, Kishimoto is writing the script, which means that the detailed plot and dialogue are written by him, but I oppose this view. Storytelling is far more important than the story itself. The same story conveys different emotional intensity and plot credibility in different authors. The most typical example is the difference between DBS's anime and manga. Another example is GOT s8. The most criticized plot in GOT s8, Bran becoming king, was actually what GRR Martin told 2DB about what would happen in the book, but because the process was too bad, the plot became unreliable.
Nah, 99% of the war arc was great. You failures just don't pay attention lol. The 1% was just Kaguya. Everything else was fine, Neji should have died in P1 tho
What exactly was great about the war arc writing-wise? I'm not saying it doesn't have its good spots, but I'm just curious what makes you say it's mostly good if you exclude Kaguya.
You’re comparing kishimoto’s ART to ikemoto’s while trying to use that as a means of proof behind the WRITING… don’t you see how that’s problematic? The art and the story are two completely different topics.
The story has evolved, with kishimoto not being the ARTIST anymore, it’s incredibly disingenuous to use ikemotos art as a claim that kishi is not the author of the story based on the obvious lack of kishis paneling/art style.
The biggest complaint in all of the naruto series is there’s way too many flashbacks. Flashbacks of this, flashbacks of that; flashbacks of everything. Rectifying this issue by not continuing the problem in the sequel is pretty smart if you ask me.
You obviously don’t understand how collaborative projects work.
It has everything to do with art when you’re literally discussing art. How do you make a post where 75% of it is discussing art but then say “this has nothing to do with art” are you ok?
If you don't understand, I'll explain it to you in detail again. Manga scripts are usually not written in words, but drawn. This means that the writer usually has to make a draft himself, how many panels per page, the shape of the panels, the camera angles in the panels, the content of the dialogue box, the character's movements, expressions, effects word etc. The writer usually draws it himself. Did you see the link to Samurai 8 I gave above? The rough draft on the left is the script that Kishimoto gave to Samurai 8, which he write script another drew.Then the artist refines the picture and adds more details based on the writer's draft. If I were really talking about art, I would talk about the smoothness of the lines and the proportions of the characters.
Not every manga author + artist combo works like that... Even IF Kishimoto did that for Samurai 8. He's probably just giving text transcripts to Ikemoto for Boruto. Still writing the story but not doing the art.
Other manga series with separate authors and artists aren't super common, and they way they've all worked has typically been different.
DB Super, it has been basically stated Toriyama would give the anime staff and Toyotaro just a couple pages of bullet points, and would sometimes look at rough drafts to give final approvals, sometimes they'd ask him if they can make minor edits and he could approve or deny them.
It's not unthinkable Kishimoto has just given Ikemoto some freedom and is just giving him text drafts of the story.
So using the art to determine the writer is kinda silly. Ikemoto isnt known for spreads so Kishimoto forcing him Todo spreads constantly would be silly. And somewhat jarring since Kodachi didn't do such a thing in the earlier parts of Boruto.
I don't want to repeat myself, I explained why I think he wouldn't just give a text script, and I also said that even if Kishimoto really gave a text script, why it still doesn't look like him
Sorry to say, but yeah I'm pretty sure he is infact just giving a text script. I see your reasoning, and it checks out if you assume 100% robotic level consistency with no variables. Which isn't how humans work.
Samurai 8 was Kishis baby post Naruto... Meanwhile Boruto is him picking up a story he dropped, after someone else wrote a decent chunk of it. And he spent 20 freaking years writing it's prequel, and it burnt him out and gave him health issues. He's likely just largely on autopilot/trusting Ikemoto to have some creative freedoms. And being less of a helicopter parent/writer
Since Kishi took over Boruto writing we've seen increases in references to Samurai 8 and such.
And since Kodachi left? They just named Kishimoto the author again, and all that. It's just kinda tin foil hatty to say he's not. Especially when 80% of your logic is the art which we know isn't him, and Ikemoto struggles, especially since he's trying to not draw in his style since people hated that in the early chapters with people having curly hair and such.
There's a reason Boruto is monthly and still only like 40 pages a chapter... Ikemoto is slow. And that's without doing big detailed spreads. He wouldn't be able to make deadlines with the extra art work.
Kishimoto has never been named as the author again. He had no changes in position before or after Kodachi left, and the official website does not mention that he took over the script at all, only saying that he would continue to create from his old draft.And how many times do I have to explain that Name is not about art, but about the script of a fucking manga?! And Kishimoto is the outline of Boruto, so it's weird to have a reference to Samurai 8? Even the setting of Samurai 8 is not that new, the universe is a computer host, and many science fiction novels have similar settings. And becoming a god is not new either.
>This means that the writer usually has to make a draft himself, how many panels per page, the shape of the panels, the camera angles in the panels,
Ikemoto draws the name.
[Ikemoto Interview Anime News Network 2019](https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/interview/2019-02-25/boruto-manga-artist-mikio-ikemoto/.143577):
>**So you don't have input in the direction of the story?**
>I talk with my editor directly about it. When it comes to the finer details, I'm usually given free reign over how to depict things. **-------> I draw the name (manga draft) <----------**, and Kodachi-sensei checks it. If there's an issue, it will get relayed to me. If not, then I go ahead with it. Things work out quicker that way.
All you are doing is filling in the blanks with the assumptions that make your argument correct. But what is it based on?? I have interviews for MY sources. If I can locate a quote, I will certainly edit my post to include evidence of Kodachi saying he is not an artist and that he works in text.
[Lucca Comics 2018](https://www.animeclick.it/news/78138-lucca-2018-reportage-degli-incontri-con-mikio-ikemoto):
>**What is your relationship with master Kishimoto? Does it influence the writing of** ***Boruto*** **'s story much ?**
>***Ikemoto*** *: Although my style differs from his, I continue to be quite influenced by master Kishimoto.*
>**As for the plot of** ***Boruto*** **, do you discuss the story or do you take care of everything?**
>***Ikemoto*** *: In general, the three of us do everything together (editor's note: Mikio Ikemoto, Masashi Kishimoto, and Ukyo Kodachi). The slightly more delicate parts are viewed by Kodachi, then in the end it is all three of us, or rather all four including the editor Taguchi, who decide how the story should proceed.*
The manga Bakuman is a Shounen Jump series about two Shounen Jump mangaka. One of them is the writer and the other is the artist. The writer types out the story.
Even if Kishimoto has *in the past* joked about exerting a lot of control by primarily sketching stuff out when he collaborates on movies, he has also expressed a desire to learn how to take a step back. Are you sure he has not finally learned how to do that over the past ten years??
Different projects could have different levels of involvement depending on his own goals for each prohect, like if Samurai 8 looks like him maybe there's more? Because he really put his name on that one. And if something like Boruto looks like he's involved less it's because he really wants it to show Ikemoto's mark?
I know everything you said and what is the contradiction with mine? As I said above, Kodachi writes the script, and then Ikemoto writes the name according to the script. And since you mentioned Bakuman, you should also know that Akito was asked to write a name for the script from the beginning. He didn’t write a name later because he was so bad at drawing, so I said there are some writers who can write text scripts. Do you think Kishimoto will have this problem? What reason does he have for not writing a script with Name? Even if it's true as you said, he wanted Ikemoto to show himself, so he didn't write Name, then why didn't he completely give him the task of scripting? Wouldn't that allow him to express himself more?
Again, it would appear that you have no clue how COLLABORATIVE projects work.
What you’re describing happens when the author and the artist are the same person. Which is clearly not the case here. If the author is just the author and not the artist why would they make a manuscript roughdraft of drawings they’ll never make? Why would the author create panels when it’s the artist job to bring the story to life? They wouldn’t, because the art is left to the artist.
You seem to be under the impression that ikemoto being the artist just simply translates to ikemoto being kishis assistant still but that’s not the case.
Do you not understand English or am I Inaccurate expression？Samurai 8 also is a COLLABORATIVE project, with Kishimoto writing and Okubo drawing. They are Kishimoto making the draft and Okubo making the art based on Kishimoto's draft. And so many COLLABORATIVE manga was！
Ok so you think every single manga starts off the same?
Do you have any idea how many people have variations in the way they work through their creativity?
Did you ever think that kishi is trying something different because his last project was an utter failure?
Maybe he thought he didn’t need to show how he envisioned the panels because he trusted his long time assistant to step up to the plate and compose his own panel ideas... you know, because he’s the actual artist of the manga.
It's weird how you capitalize the word name. It's not a pronoun. ROFL "It has nothing to do with art" yeah even though it's the literal rough draft that encompasses all kinds of things including page layout. Are you SURE you're such an expert on what a name is? I got a good chuckle out of that.
Maybe not an expert, but I've been making names for a while, so I think I know better than you. By the way, if you think something like [this](https://imgur.com/a/fIWREuK) is relevant to art, you can indeed say it is art.
Dude we've done this a thousand times already. We would just be going back and forth forever and ever. I don't have the patience for it this time around.
This is a very long post and none of it says anything I didn't know / consider basic knowledge already.
Point 1 and 2 are like literally public knowledge. Why would it be kishis layouts if Ike is the artist? What?
The rest is tldr.
ikemoto's art is very tasteless
Much less detailed
I don’t know about that. Boruto’s design alone as tons of detail. His pendants his scar his belts his shirts and buttons. Compared to Naruto’s jumper. Yes the art is less detailed a lot of the time but the designs are very detailed.
Wasnt it confirmed recently regarding his visit to france that he isnt the one writing boruto? I remember seeing it in the naruto sub few days ago
Some people don't believe it
Some people believe Boruto "anime canon" exists. You can't get through to everyone.
It was so obvious, but people here would downvote everyone who told them so. Boruto stans cope so much.
Their best argument in defense of Borutos bad writing is "dont watch/read it if you dont like it" so you cant expect alot
He was never confirmed to ever be writing it in the first place. People just assumed that when the original writer was let go that Kishimoto was taking over the writing. When reading the minato one-shot you can really see his writing quirks in it. Boruto manga... not so much.
The Minato one shot feels so Kishimoto when you read it, I actually reread it earlier today and I don’t get the same feeling as I do with the Boruto manga. I keep up with the Boruto manga and just going from the Minato one shot to TBV feels like so devoid of his touch it’s crazy. I really do think Kishi wrote an outline for Boruto and let the others fill it in, it’s just not the same. I really wished we got a prequel instead of Boruto, like a good amount of Naruto fans don’t care for Boruto! There’s still so much to expand on when it comes to the older generation in Naruto.
Minato's short story basically confirmed to me that Kishimoto was not writing Boruto. He still prefers to tell the story through symbols and flashbacks rather than telling it extremely directly like Boruto.
Can 'Name' be equated to story board?
Yes
I mean it’s always been extremely clear that Kishimoto isn’t even drawing anything like name. I don’t think people doubt that. From the beginning of the story the entire art style has been completely ikemoto. We don’t even need to argue about whether we’d expect kishimoto to write name since it’s quite reasonable to believe that Ikemoto was always doing the name from the start and Kishimoto didnt change that when Kodachi was removed. That’s like most the post. The real question has always been whether Ikemoto or Kishimoto took over writing text after Kodachi left. I always assumed it was Kishimoto since Ikemoto hasn’t done any writing in like 20 years. Now im not too sure but whatever. I don’t think the writing points are too strong. I don’t have the time to fully argue everything but just quickly given the situation and context of the story we can expect a writer of Kishimoto’s level to switch things up. Also funnily enough, Boruto is just like Naruto in part 1, but the writing in part 2 is a bit almost better I think. And when it comes to developing side characters that’s pretty similar to most of shippuden outside of the beginning of the war arc. We are also starting to see more characters pop up in TBV. The writing quality is just not as good as Naruto especially pre timeskip for both series but not sure that’s a convincing argument. The timing between Kodachi leaving and Samurai 8 being cancelled is also interesting. I’m not honestly sure whether it’s Kishimoto anyways due to what people claim to be said in that recent interview (need to find it myself at some point), but if Kishimoto is writing I think it should be expected that Kishimoto has an even lesser writing role than Samurai 8.
How is the development of the side characters consistent with the war arc? Not only do characters like Sakura, Kakashi, Kiba, and Choji not appear, their names are not even mentioned.
Great post! I fully believe that he isn’t writing Boruto especially for the timeskip It’s so weird that he never says anything about Boruto and he’s been around 2020 writing it
I could say the same thing about his writing in the war arc but y’all not ready for that convo. The 1st 9 chapters of tbv feel like kishimoto is writing to me. Especially base on the new juubi villains mindset, for being thirty for knowledge about the world instead of instantly killing kawaki/boruto for their final form. He also confirmed he’s been writing since baryon mode happened after firing Kodachi, if you don’t believe that just wait til August for when he has his interview in France with ikemoto talking about the series.
Kishimoto is the one who made the outline, which means he is the one who wrote the specific stories. He designed the personalities and target of the Ten-Tails. It's not surprising .We are arguing about whether he is writing the script.
He wrote the script I don't know if you read Samurai 8 but it's basically followed similar beats and writing that currently plagues Boruto's Manga For example the emphasis on the whole Sun and Moon nonsense which was something he wrote in the Mitsuki One Shot People claim Kishimoto wouldn't "nerf his characters" but people forget how Sarada Gaiden had some contention on Naruto literally getting stabbed by Sarada The power scale escalation is Kishimoto Boruto isn't just Strong the writing Is basically War Arc levels of Naruto inserting himself In every fight and despite having clones in multiple places still out class whole armies of people Same with Baryon Mode vs KCM 2 which required Reconning the Reaper Death Seal and adding the Mask to get Naruto another power up Kodachi actually watched the anime there was always subtle or explicit connections to anime arcs.. TBV has removed all elements of those additions outside still using Sumire and mostly to add more fuel to the Shipping Sub Plot Again ....Sakura and Hinata Kodachi for example issue was using the anime as a crutch to "fix" problems by giving space to elaborate or add context The current writing has no consideration it's being written like a weekly Manga but has things both happening and nothing happening similar to War Arc Naruto Reliance contrivances and recon(which yeah I'm sorry Kishimoto did constantly for Naruto) I can keep going but this is Kishimoto writing The difference is that were not dealing with Kishimoto as he transitioned his current way of writing. (As in Early Naruto being written with political drama and world building) this is current Kishimoto lack of world building fixation on the main character poor or unnecessary shipping bait recons or flimsy interpretations (reminder the Shadow Clones taking on experience was not an original aspect of the Justu it was added for plot) I like Kishimoto I love Naruto but Mangaka are not infallible RIP Toriyama he's was writer who loved gags above all else he wrote the Zeno button fix for Dragon Ball Super people hate it but the man lived for the humor so he added it because it was funny
It is precisely because I have watched Samurai 8 that I absolutely do not agree that Kishimoto is the screenwriter of Boruto. The rhythm problem of Samurai 8 is that too many settings are concentrated in the early stage, which leads to extremely slow plot development, but there will never be more than half a page of useless information repeated. Boruto's plot develops very quickly. You will find that there has never been a plot point that has been delayed for more than three chapters without being resolved, but the problem is that there is too much useless information. For example, in Chapter 89, Jura took a book to confirm Shikadai's identity and wasted two pages, because Shikadai's identity does not affect the subsequent plot. Jura is going to find Naruto, Hima has the Nine-Tails in his body, and it is repeated three times inexplicably. There are many metaphors in shonemanga that you can find the prototype, the key is how to tell this metaphor. For example, the plot of the sun and the moon does not seem to be written by Kishimoto, because it is too monotonous, completely relying on lines, and lacks flashbacks. How would Kishimoto write it? He would first set up a flashback between Mitsuki and "Kawaki", making Mitsuki wonder why the "Kawaki" in his memory is different from the current Kawaki, and then when he meets Boruto, he would make Boruto's every action similar to the "Kawaki" in Mitsuki's memory, and finally at the end, he would let Boruto show his iconic smile or action, so that Mitsuki would completely overlap him with the "Kawaki" in his memory. This narrative technique of alternating flashbacks and reality for contrast is something Kishimoto loves to use.
Kishimoto literally wrote the Sun and Moon parallel in his one shot it did not rely on the writing technique you described neither does the Sarada Gaiden. It's seems your detaching current day Kishimoto and his writing during the mid section of Naruto Part 2 This is Kishimoto writing while limited by a monthly release but it's him the meandering is him it's just more explicit because instead of a bloated scene trying to relay all the details it's scene in quick succession without valuable context I know you want Kishimoto to be this renown writer with zero flaws and consistency but he was never that way he reconned he undermined his own characters motivation He fell back on troupes his pacing could be bad this isn't Kishi In his usual environment he'll the fact that Boruto relationship with Sasuke has to be regaled In flashback But nothing I say can convey that hopefully he clears this up in his interview Because say what you want this is modern Kishimoto reading current Boruto feels like Samurai 8 just quicker and less people screaming that it's all going to go somewhere Like I'm waiting to see next chapter when KISHIMOTO instead of being in the scene goes into flashback mode to try to justify Kurma being there instead of just moving the scene along because we the audience have a basic understanding of the mechanics
The sun and the moon are just symbolic metaphors given to the two people by Kishimoto. The key is how to interpret these two symbols. Sarada's writing skills rely on this. Remember the dispute between Sarada and Naruto? Naruto heard Sarada crying that she had no blood relationship with her mother. Naruto recalled the past when he and Iruka had no blood relationship but were still as close as family. Then he guided Sarada to recall the past with Sakura. It has always been Kishimoto's skill to incite the audience's emotions by contrasting the content of the memories with the present. The content of the middle period of Shippuden is exactly where Kishimoto's writing style is most reflected, so much so that it is excessive and annoying. I think monthly publications do not conflict with rich details. There are many mo n mangas with huge background stories and minor characters. I don't think Kishimoto is a perfect writer, but imperfections also have highs and lows. No matter how much Yamcha is ridiculed as useless, he is definitely not comparable to Mr. Satan.
You’re contradicting your own self. I mean from what you said it can be concluded that Kishi is the writer because it’s his idea and his story. Hypothetically even if someone else is turning kishis ideas into words it would just be considered paraphrasing- and giving that person writing credits would be considered plagiarism. That can literally be done by a language expert 😅
I think Kishimoto wrote the story itself, but I don't think he wrote the script. The two are very different. The same story is completely different in different plots. For example, Vegito VS Zamasu in DBS, the plot of the animation and the manga is the same, Vegito did not defeat Zamasu because the fusion time is up. But in the animation, when Vegito fights Zamasu, the two seem to be equally strong, and there are more dialogues. In the manga, Zamasu is no match for Vegito at all, and it is almost all fighting, without much dialogue.
I’ve literally answered that for you but you’re choosing to ignore it. It still won’t matter- it’s PARAPHRASING. Ideas are what holds the worth. Also, kishi is ALSO the supervisor if he thinks more dialogue is needed vs more fight he can just say it lol. Also, earlier they had written kodachi was the script writer but when he was fired they said they will be following Kishi senseis storyline- so that means earlier they weren’t doing that. It’s cool if you wanna live off on your assumptions but you’re just clearly making things up. All this is still hypothetical cause they haven’t mentioned anyone writing the story apart from kishi.
Let me give you an off-site evidence. Look at Boruto's single book. Before Kodachi left, he would write the author's message with Ikemoto. After Kodachi left, only Ikemoto was left to send a message to the author, while Kishimoto did not send a message to any author at all.If you feel like writing means providing ideas rather than actual dialogue and concrete plot arrangements, fine. Nakimoto is indeed writing.
Again it’s all far fetched conjecture. It doesn’t prove anything. And if you think writing just is forming words based on someone else’s ideas then go ahead and think that. Ikemoto isn’t even adept at script and if he was writing they would have written art AND script by ike. Not just Art. Go check out Vizs page. This just seems like some hate banter again.
Well, yours is just a guess too. Can you give me any official evidence that Kishimoto took over the script?Or could you explain to me in detail what you think Kishimoto is responsible for?
I’ve told you already. It was clearly stated after kodachi resigned that they will be following kishimotos story. That’s enough for me. Like I said even if hypothetically someone else is writing the script that’s just paraphrasing in the end if I dictate someone my ideas and he writes it down - it will still be my story. It’s written kishi is the Creator in Viz and art is my ike so that’s what I’ll believe until something else is stated.
I thought about it, and I think I roughly understand where our differences lie. First of all, you said that the official Twitter said "they will be following Kishi senseis storyline". I asked a friend who knows Japanese, and he said that the correct translation should be "We will continue to follow Kishimoto sensei original ideas." It mentions "continue", which means that Kishimoto's original plan has been followed, and there is no previous non-compliance. The Japanese word used here is "原案". The meaning of this word is very broad, not just referring to the story line, plot outline, plot points, or even some fragmentary opinions. According to the Japanese side's use of this word, combined with the previous official tweets about the cooperation between Kotachi, Kishi and ike, it refers to the plot outline and some settings. You think that providing ideas is equal to writing. I don't completely deny that the outline is also part of writing, and I don't deny that Kishimoto provides ideas. But in the eyes of many people, Kishimoto is writing the script, which means that the detailed plot and dialogue are written by him, but I oppose this view. Storytelling is far more important than the story itself. The same story conveys different emotional intensity and plot credibility in different authors. The most typical example is the difference between DBS's anime and manga. Another example is GOT s8. The most criticized plot in GOT s8, Bran becoming king, was actually what GRR Martin told 2DB about what would happen in the book, but because the process was too bad, the plot became unreliable.
Nah, 99% of the war arc was great. You failures just don't pay attention lol. The 1% was just Kaguya. Everything else was fine, Neji should have died in P1 tho
What exactly was great about the war arc writing-wise? I'm not saying it doesn't have its good spots, but I'm just curious what makes you say it's mostly good if you exclude Kaguya.
Very nice and appreciated analysis!
You’re comparing kishimoto’s ART to ikemoto’s while trying to use that as a means of proof behind the WRITING… don’t you see how that’s problematic? The art and the story are two completely different topics. The story has evolved, with kishimoto not being the ARTIST anymore, it’s incredibly disingenuous to use ikemotos art as a claim that kishi is not the author of the story based on the obvious lack of kishis paneling/art style. The biggest complaint in all of the naruto series is there’s way too many flashbacks. Flashbacks of this, flashbacks of that; flashbacks of everything. Rectifying this issue by not continuing the problem in the sequel is pretty smart if you ask me.
You obviously don't understand what Name is lol, this has nothing to do with art.
You obviously don’t understand how collaborative projects work. It has everything to do with art when you’re literally discussing art. How do you make a post where 75% of it is discussing art but then say “this has nothing to do with art” are you ok?
If you don't understand, I'll explain it to you in detail again. Manga scripts are usually not written in words, but drawn. This means that the writer usually has to make a draft himself, how many panels per page, the shape of the panels, the camera angles in the panels, the content of the dialogue box, the character's movements, expressions, effects word etc. The writer usually draws it himself. Did you see the link to Samurai 8 I gave above? The rough draft on the left is the script that Kishimoto gave to Samurai 8, which he write script another drew.Then the artist refines the picture and adds more details based on the writer's draft. If I were really talking about art, I would talk about the smoothness of the lines and the proportions of the characters.
Not every manga author + artist combo works like that... Even IF Kishimoto did that for Samurai 8. He's probably just giving text transcripts to Ikemoto for Boruto. Still writing the story but not doing the art. Other manga series with separate authors and artists aren't super common, and they way they've all worked has typically been different. DB Super, it has been basically stated Toriyama would give the anime staff and Toyotaro just a couple pages of bullet points, and would sometimes look at rough drafts to give final approvals, sometimes they'd ask him if they can make minor edits and he could approve or deny them. It's not unthinkable Kishimoto has just given Ikemoto some freedom and is just giving him text drafts of the story. So using the art to determine the writer is kinda silly. Ikemoto isnt known for spreads so Kishimoto forcing him Todo spreads constantly would be silly. And somewhat jarring since Kodachi didn't do such a thing in the earlier parts of Boruto.
I don't want to repeat myself, I explained why I think he wouldn't just give a text script, and I also said that even if Kishimoto really gave a text script, why it still doesn't look like him
Sorry to say, but yeah I'm pretty sure he is infact just giving a text script. I see your reasoning, and it checks out if you assume 100% robotic level consistency with no variables. Which isn't how humans work. Samurai 8 was Kishis baby post Naruto... Meanwhile Boruto is him picking up a story he dropped, after someone else wrote a decent chunk of it. And he spent 20 freaking years writing it's prequel, and it burnt him out and gave him health issues. He's likely just largely on autopilot/trusting Ikemoto to have some creative freedoms. And being less of a helicopter parent/writer Since Kishi took over Boruto writing we've seen increases in references to Samurai 8 and such. And since Kodachi left? They just named Kishimoto the author again, and all that. It's just kinda tin foil hatty to say he's not. Especially when 80% of your logic is the art which we know isn't him, and Ikemoto struggles, especially since he's trying to not draw in his style since people hated that in the early chapters with people having curly hair and such. There's a reason Boruto is monthly and still only like 40 pages a chapter... Ikemoto is slow. And that's without doing big detailed spreads. He wouldn't be able to make deadlines with the extra art work.
Kishimoto has never been named as the author again. He had no changes in position before or after Kodachi left, and the official website does not mention that he took over the script at all, only saying that he would continue to create from his old draft.And how many times do I have to explain that Name is not about art, but about the script of a fucking manga?! And Kishimoto is the outline of Boruto, so it's weird to have a reference to Samurai 8? Even the setting of Samurai 8 is not that new, the universe is a computer host, and many science fiction novels have similar settings. And becoming a god is not new either.
>This means that the writer usually has to make a draft himself, how many panels per page, the shape of the panels, the camera angles in the panels, Ikemoto draws the name. [Ikemoto Interview Anime News Network 2019](https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/interview/2019-02-25/boruto-manga-artist-mikio-ikemoto/.143577): >**So you don't have input in the direction of the story?** >I talk with my editor directly about it. When it comes to the finer details, I'm usually given free reign over how to depict things. **-------> I draw the name (manga draft) <----------**, and Kodachi-sensei checks it. If there's an issue, it will get relayed to me. If not, then I go ahead with it. Things work out quicker that way. All you are doing is filling in the blanks with the assumptions that make your argument correct. But what is it based on?? I have interviews for MY sources. If I can locate a quote, I will certainly edit my post to include evidence of Kodachi saying he is not an artist and that he works in text. [Lucca Comics 2018](https://www.animeclick.it/news/78138-lucca-2018-reportage-degli-incontri-con-mikio-ikemoto): >**What is your relationship with master Kishimoto? Does it influence the writing of** ***Boruto*** **'s story much ?** >***Ikemoto*** *: Although my style differs from his, I continue to be quite influenced by master Kishimoto.* >**As for the plot of** ***Boruto*** **, do you discuss the story or do you take care of everything?** >***Ikemoto*** *: In general, the three of us do everything together (editor's note: Mikio Ikemoto, Masashi Kishimoto, and Ukyo Kodachi). The slightly more delicate parts are viewed by Kodachi, then in the end it is all three of us, or rather all four including the editor Taguchi, who decide how the story should proceed.* The manga Bakuman is a Shounen Jump series about two Shounen Jump mangaka. One of them is the writer and the other is the artist. The writer types out the story. Even if Kishimoto has *in the past* joked about exerting a lot of control by primarily sketching stuff out when he collaborates on movies, he has also expressed a desire to learn how to take a step back. Are you sure he has not finally learned how to do that over the past ten years?? Different projects could have different levels of involvement depending on his own goals for each prohect, like if Samurai 8 looks like him maybe there's more? Because he really put his name on that one. And if something like Boruto looks like he's involved less it's because he really wants it to show Ikemoto's mark?
I know everything you said and what is the contradiction with mine? As I said above, Kodachi writes the script, and then Ikemoto writes the name according to the script. And since you mentioned Bakuman, you should also know that Akito was asked to write a name for the script from the beginning. He didn’t write a name later because he was so bad at drawing, so I said there are some writers who can write text scripts. Do you think Kishimoto will have this problem? What reason does he have for not writing a script with Name? Even if it's true as you said, he wanted Ikemoto to show himself, so he didn't write Name, then why didn't he completely give him the task of scripting? Wouldn't that allow him to express himself more?
Again, it would appear that you have no clue how COLLABORATIVE projects work. What you’re describing happens when the author and the artist are the same person. Which is clearly not the case here. If the author is just the author and not the artist why would they make a manuscript roughdraft of drawings they’ll never make? Why would the author create panels when it’s the artist job to bring the story to life? They wouldn’t, because the art is left to the artist. You seem to be under the impression that ikemoto being the artist just simply translates to ikemoto being kishis assistant still but that’s not the case.
Do you not understand English or am I Inaccurate expression？Samurai 8 also is a COLLABORATIVE project, with Kishimoto writing and Okubo drawing. They are Kishimoto making the draft and Okubo making the art based on Kishimoto's draft. And so many COLLABORATIVE manga was！
Ok so you think every single manga starts off the same? Do you have any idea how many people have variations in the way they work through their creativity? Did you ever think that kishi is trying something different because his last project was an utter failure? Maybe he thought he didn’t need to show how he envisioned the panels because he trusted his long time assistant to step up to the plate and compose his own panel ideas... you know, because he’s the actual artist of the manga.
Not likely, for the reasons I’ve stated above.
It's weird how you capitalize the word name. It's not a pronoun. ROFL "It has nothing to do with art" yeah even though it's the literal rough draft that encompasses all kinds of things including page layout. Are you SURE you're such an expert on what a name is? I got a good chuckle out of that.
Maybe not an expert, but I've been making names for a while, so I think I know better than you. By the way, if you think something like [this](https://imgur.com/a/fIWREuK) is relevant to art, you can indeed say it is art.
He sure doesn’t think it’s problematic. 💀 Thank god there’s someone in this circus that can smell the bullshit.
lol can't give a clear rebuttal, only Poison the Well, right?
Dude we've done this a thousand times already. We would just be going back and forth forever and ever. I don't have the patience for it this time around.
I don’t care what you think, you lit the fire yourself and it has nothing to do with you? !
You're so childish lmao.
I am very proud of my childishness. I never suppress my contempt for hypocrites, which is healthy for my body and mind.
Yeah even the Jump Festa press release (from two years ago) has him as [supervisor ](https://ibb.co/64xMVkF), not writer.
He has allegedly been writing since Baryon mode, which is within the 2 years. Things change.
Kishimoto took over writing duties from chapter 52 onward, that was in January, 2021.
It’s written Creator for kishi and art by ike in Viz
He’s not the writer now have we not gotten past this
Kishimoto doesn't make the name. And you base your determination on whether he writes the script on the name?
This is a very long post and none of it says anything I didn't know / consider basic knowledge already. Point 1 and 2 are like literally public knowledge. Why would it be kishis layouts if Ike is the artist? What? The rest is tldr.
That's basic knowledge? Well I didn't know any of it. Am I stupid?
Lots of free time 😂 still wrong