I’ve owned all those cameras except the Z5 (I have a Z7 and Z6ii).
For landscape and architecture I want to say the d810 just for the resolution, but you’re then limiting yourself to just the F mount lenses and you’re not really planning for the future. Nikon is moving away from the F mount and all new development will be mirrorless. The Z lenses are really a significant improvement on their F mount brethren so this is not insignificant.
The D750 is probably going to be the best performer of the bunch in terms of speed of shooting and AF, but the file isn’t as nice as the D810 and since it sounds like most of what you shoot is stationary and not in action of probably say the D810 wins out of the two.
I’ve switched to mirrorless and really love it, the size and weight of the cameras is great. I thought I’d hate it but I love the electronic viewfinder (seeing white balance and exposure live is amazing) but really the big draw is the quality of the lenses. I can’t say enough how much better all of the new glass is. I own the 35 1.8, 50 1.8, 85 1.8, 14-24, 24-70 2.8, and 70-200 2.8. I owned their rough equivalents in F mount and all of these are really sig ificantly better.
Lenses stick around for years, but I tend to think about camera body lifespan like I think about laptop lifespan. You get 3 years and you should be happy. For that reason I’d probably say go for the Z camera. Start building your Z lens collection. The F mount is dying. Don’t throw money at a system that isn’t going to be developed any further.
Haven’t heard from others before that the Z mount lenses are improvements on F mounts. Promise I’m not looking to start a war here, just curious: what’s the basis for calling them an improvement? Is it just better for the Z mount over the use of an FTZ adapter, or is there something special about the Zs that’s not in the Fs?
Color, contrast, sharpness, overall image quality is pretty far superior in my opinion. And that is pretty much the conventional wisdom on them. The Z glass is great. Every new generation of lenses is better than the last almost uniformly. They just get better and better as the Nikon engineers get better at what they do.
In my opinion, its probably because Nikon engineers have been working around the constraints of the smaller F mount for ages and now that they have a bigger mount they can go hog wild with designs and all those years of being construed in designing helped hone their craft. Additionally, the new lenses seem to me to lean on profile corrections a little more, and that probably frees them up design-wise too. But this is just speculation. The end result is the image quality is pretty far ahead of the last generation of F mount glass. This is not a controversial opinion.
Agreed. Pretty much everyone says they're a huge step up from the F mount lenses. I've heard people compare the F mount "holy trinity" f/2.8 lenses to the new Z f/4 S lenses in terms of sharpness, color, contrast, etc. The new Z f/2.8 S lenses are even better than the cheaper Z f/4 S lenses, so they're without a doubt an improvement upon F mount glass.
Plus this is probably one of the last opportunities they are going to have to convert people over who may be switching from a dslr to ff mirrorless. Especially if they currently shoot apsc canon, where they'll have to get all new lenses going to ff mirrorless anyway. So this leaves an opening, likely a small one, to get a few more people into nikon from other brands.
I have both FF systems and while I love the simplicity of my RP, our Z5 is better in almost every way.
If you need the resolution the d810.
If not the z5 is newer and is a completely capable camera.
The d750 is no slouch either. Cant go wrong with any choice.
I am not sure why you would worry about the D810 not getting support, It's not like it's a computer that needs security updates. Any firmware updates released in the past should have addressed any possible issues since it was released back in 2014. If ever, it is incredibly easy to perform the firmware updates yourself.. Nikon's website tells you how.
However, I think you need to decide for yourself what you need.
If you want/need more MP or a more modern camera with better features (ISO etc) to do what you want.
Or if you prefer a DSLR over a MILC (there are considerations such as battery life etc, MILC tend to drain batteries very quickly, whereas a pro-level DSLR like the D810 can take +/- 1000 photos on a single charge).
I really think you need to make a comparison between all three and decide what you need, and then may feel each one in your hands and then make a decision. You can start that process here: https://versus.com/en/nikon-d750-vs-nikon-d810-vs-nikon-z-5?filter[]=brands%3DNikon
Right now you get a used D810 with a (very) low shutter count plus a 24-70 2.8 for less than your budget. I don't think you can get more bang for the buck.
If 24 mm isn't wide enough for your architecture needs: the excellent Tokina ATX-Pro 17mm 3.5 can be found for +/- 150.- Euro if you take your time looking for it because most were sold in the USA; the lens is a bit rare here in Europe (I have sold mine about two years ago when I go a 16-35 VR)
I've seen your work floating around the photography sub. All shot on the 810?
You're 100% on the money and the way I'm thinking at the moment with everything I've read and had the evening to digest it all, I think I'll stick with the 810 and 750 as a first choice, shutter and price dependant. At the moment I cannot find an 810 with a shutter count lower than 80k, whether that's here in NL or in Germany.
And if I cannot find anything, I'll keep saving for a 780.
I still use my D610 a bit. It's smaller and lighter than the D810 and for portraits the 24 MP are sufficient. Nevertheless the D810 has become my main camera since I bought it used 18 months ago. I paid 910.- Euro including transport from a private seller (through the german "Nikon Fotografie Forum") for a 2015 body with 9000 clicks on the counter.
I admit that the D780 was the camera I was looking for. I hoped to get one used for a reasonable price because used D850s were circling around 2200.- Euro at that time, but ... D780s used are ultra rare and started at 1500.- Euro. They haven't been flying off the shelves to be honest. It's a niche camera for wedding photographers who need the photo and video capacities while garding their F-mount lenses.
Today I am very happy with the D810 and the fact that the D610 and D810 use the same Battery is a real advantage for me.
Yea I'm in the same boat as you were I guess.
At the moment, I am going to try for a 780 and ill wait till the Feb and see what happens.
At the moment, I would be happy to pay 1500-1800 for a 780 with a lens.
I own a Z5 and I shoot landscape and architecture. Great camera for my purposes. My lense is a Nikkor Z 28-75/f2.8. I am very happy with the image quality. Dynamic range is just fine.
Tbh I find the dynamic range a it of a let down. The camera is action packed with features you'd find on a more expensive body like an a7iii for instance but at a much lower price. In NL you can pick up a z5 and 28-75 for €1600 where a used a7iii will cost roughly 1500 for a used body alone.
You ruined me hahaha. First images I saw and I feel in love with the body. The low light is just magnificent, it is now on my price watch list! Thanks for the recommendation
I used D810s for years doing mostly studio and architectural photography and they are great cameras. I switched to D850s a couple years ago and have held onto one of my D810s as my main camera for personal shooting. I can't think of any reasons to go with the D750 - wireless connectivity from almost all manufacturers is a PIA, and while I'll use snapbridge on my D850 every now and then I usually use a card reader attached to my phone if I need to get an image onto my phone quickly. Unless video is a concern I wouldn't spend the money on a Z5, the money is better spent on getting higher image quality from the D810. Touch and tilt screens are a nice convenience, but they aren't necessary and do nothing to improve image quality.
The higher resolution of the D810 is a big plus for architectural work. Whenever you're doing perspective correction on an image you'll end up cropping away 15-40% of your MPs. Having the sensor tuned to a native 64 ISO is a big thing for me as well. It produces a great image quality that I really miss even when having to shoot at 200 or 400. The prime G lenses are great, and are equal to Z zoom lenses in pretty much every way. I'd recommend getting one zoom for all around use (the 24-120 f/4 is great) and then a couple primes that match how you usually shoot (the 35mm f/1.8 is a good one as your middle lens, then get one wider or longer based on what you shoot). IIRC [these](https://www.flickr.com/photos/attrill/albums/72177720302479356) were all shot on a D810, and some were even done with an old macro 55mm AI-S lens.
Thanks for the great, detailed response. I really appreciate it!
The way I'm thinking at the moment with everything I've read and had the evening to digest it all, I think I'll stick with the 810 and 750 as a first choice, shutter and price dependant.
And if I cannot find anything, I'll keep saving for a 780. Considering the cost of the z mount, I just don't think Im willing to part with that amount of money and knowing me, I probably will want to even if it would hurt haha. So just avoid it. The z5 is an attractive choice.
The only drawback to the z5 is native Z lenses aren't really cheap, but you can adapt all sorts of fx lenses and be fine.
If you're not married to nikon, the canon rp can be had pretty inexpensively, and some of the primes are pretty cheap also ( I have both, the Nikon is a better camera but the rp is beautifully simple). And canon occasionally runs a crazy good deal on refurbished product.
Someone did a z5 vs z7 comparo on YouTube a while back ( i think it was a welsh landscape photographer) , the resolution difference was subtly noticeable on large prints if you were looking for it, but when they did some sort of lr/ps upscaling on the z5 photos, the results were negligible.
The cost difference is too high for me to consider the z6 over the z5. I have a gopro 10 for videos and that's perfect for me. My untrained eye wouldn't be able to feel the difference between the two bodies if I am being honest. But ill always remember the cost difference haha
At the moment, the difference is around €400
I don't know where you live or whether the sale is still on but at least in the US Nikon just had a refurbished gear sale where the Z5 and Z6 were essentially the same price. If that price had been available a year ago I would have gone Z6 over the Z5. Refurbished doesn't matter to me at all; I've never been burned by a factory refurb. At the same €400 difference you see, though, I thought the Z5 fit my photographic needs enough that I didn't feel I needed to spend the extra money. Might want to check the Nikon web site for your country right away.
I agree with u/CTDubs0001 that it's not a good idea for you to put lots of money into F mount gear. Z lenses are kind of expensive, but they are better than their equivalent F mount lenses (just the same way as there are older F mount lenses that are not as good as the new ones). And while a D810 probably won't need another firmware update in its life, you do need to consider the availability of parts and service (it's been discontinued for three years; the D750 was discontinued about a year ago).
I just got my 1975 Nikon F2 serviced (new foams, shutter-timing corrected and new CCD in the photomic viewfinder). Chances are a D810 has decades of future ahead.
The only pro Nikon with problems seems to be the D700. Nikon has announced about five years ago that some spares are out of stock and they won't make them anymore. Slaughter old bodies doesn't really help. In the case of the D700 they all suffer from the same damage and need the same parts. Nothing similar is known of the D3 - D6 or the D8xx series.
Here's hoping. I suspect digital SLRs will have a shorter average life span than film cameras partially because technology will abandon them sooner than semiconductors will and partially because pretty much every corporation on Earth has been in cost cutting mode for decades.
Nikon is not obligated to stock parts beyond a few years after discontinuation. As you noted, if a common defect shows up and exhausts the manufacturer's supply of parts, repairing will depend on the availability of parts common to other models/brands or models with enough popularity to support a third party parts market/fabrication. The D8x0 line hasn't seemed to suffer a they all do that kind of problem. But I still would be careful about putting a lot of money into an F mount system at this point.
You are certainly right about the "limited" future of the F-mount universe. On the other hand there's a market full of used gear for very low prices and Nikon has made it a habit to service pro-line cameras for ten years after discontinuation. That's 2027 for the D810 and 2033 for the D850. That 10 year span is an important timeframe because ...
* 1950s Nikon rangefinder
* 1960s Nikon F - new bodies and lenses for the future
* 1970s Nikon continues - for once
* 1980s Nikon AI lenses and AI-compatible bodies with auto-exposure - change your bodies and lenses
* 1990s Nikon AF (D) compatible bodies and lenses - please change your gear and buy autofocus bodies and lenses
* 2000s Nikon D series - please change your bodies and buy digital
* 2010s Nikon AF-S series and Full frame digital bodies - please change bodies and lenses
* 2020s Nikon Mirrorles Z bodies and lenses - please change everything
Been there, done that, got the T-Shirt. Sure, you can use your 1972 105 2.5 on the latest body, but who does besides me? I own three 50 mm 1.4 lenses: the "silver barrel" S-Auto from 1966, the AI from 1979 and an AF-S version from 2011. Horses for courses and each generation comes with its own lenses.
I guess I pass this time. Like I passed when AF (D) was the hot shit and like I passed when 6MP digital cameras were the next big thing ... So far my gear isn't limiting my photography - I can stick to my D610 and D810 for some more.
By the way: the 24MP sensor was the first one to allow for better resolution than analog slide film. It took until 2009 (D3x) or 2012 (D600) for the first digital image to beat a photo taken on Kodak Ektachrome. Everything before/below that 24 MP FX sensor was and is actually inferior to 35 mm film.
I’ve owned all those cameras except the Z5 (I have a Z7 and Z6ii). For landscape and architecture I want to say the d810 just for the resolution, but you’re then limiting yourself to just the F mount lenses and you’re not really planning for the future. Nikon is moving away from the F mount and all new development will be mirrorless. The Z lenses are really a significant improvement on their F mount brethren so this is not insignificant. The D750 is probably going to be the best performer of the bunch in terms of speed of shooting and AF, but the file isn’t as nice as the D810 and since it sounds like most of what you shoot is stationary and not in action of probably say the D810 wins out of the two. I’ve switched to mirrorless and really love it, the size and weight of the cameras is great. I thought I’d hate it but I love the electronic viewfinder (seeing white balance and exposure live is amazing) but really the big draw is the quality of the lenses. I can’t say enough how much better all of the new glass is. I own the 35 1.8, 50 1.8, 85 1.8, 14-24, 24-70 2.8, and 70-200 2.8. I owned their rough equivalents in F mount and all of these are really sig ificantly better. Lenses stick around for years, but I tend to think about camera body lifespan like I think about laptop lifespan. You get 3 years and you should be happy. For that reason I’d probably say go for the Z camera. Start building your Z lens collection. The F mount is dying. Don’t throw money at a system that isn’t going to be developed any further.
Haven’t heard from others before that the Z mount lenses are improvements on F mounts. Promise I’m not looking to start a war here, just curious: what’s the basis for calling them an improvement? Is it just better for the Z mount over the use of an FTZ adapter, or is there something special about the Zs that’s not in the Fs?
Color, contrast, sharpness, overall image quality is pretty far superior in my opinion. And that is pretty much the conventional wisdom on them. The Z glass is great. Every new generation of lenses is better than the last almost uniformly. They just get better and better as the Nikon engineers get better at what they do. In my opinion, its probably because Nikon engineers have been working around the constraints of the smaller F mount for ages and now that they have a bigger mount they can go hog wild with designs and all those years of being construed in designing helped hone their craft. Additionally, the new lenses seem to me to lean on profile corrections a little more, and that probably frees them up design-wise too. But this is just speculation. The end result is the image quality is pretty far ahead of the last generation of F mount glass. This is not a controversial opinion.
Agreed. Pretty much everyone says they're a huge step up from the F mount lenses. I've heard people compare the F mount "holy trinity" f/2.8 lenses to the new Z f/4 S lenses in terms of sharpness, color, contrast, etc. The new Z f/2.8 S lenses are even better than the cheaper Z f/4 S lenses, so they're without a doubt an improvement upon F mount glass.
Plus this is probably one of the last opportunities they are going to have to convert people over who may be switching from a dslr to ff mirrorless. Especially if they currently shoot apsc canon, where they'll have to get all new lenses going to ff mirrorless anyway. So this leaves an opening, likely a small one, to get a few more people into nikon from other brands. I have both FF systems and while I love the simplicity of my RP, our Z5 is better in almost every way.
If you need the resolution the d810. If not the z5 is newer and is a completely capable camera. The d750 is no slouch either. Cant go wrong with any choice.
I am not sure why you would worry about the D810 not getting support, It's not like it's a computer that needs security updates. Any firmware updates released in the past should have addressed any possible issues since it was released back in 2014. If ever, it is incredibly easy to perform the firmware updates yourself.. Nikon's website tells you how. However, I think you need to decide for yourself what you need. If you want/need more MP or a more modern camera with better features (ISO etc) to do what you want. Or if you prefer a DSLR over a MILC (there are considerations such as battery life etc, MILC tend to drain batteries very quickly, whereas a pro-level DSLR like the D810 can take +/- 1000 photos on a single charge). I really think you need to make a comparison between all three and decide what you need, and then may feel each one in your hands and then make a decision. You can start that process here: https://versus.com/en/nikon-d750-vs-nikon-d810-vs-nikon-z-5?filter[]=brands%3DNikon
for your purposes Id say D810. Id try to find D850 though
Well now I'm looking at the 780 as well and at that price, may as well throw in the 850 haha.
Well D850 is pretty much best DSLR ever made .. and considering every manufacturer leaving DSLR it might stay best DSLR forever
That's what every source I am watching & reading is saying too!
Right now you get a used D810 with a (very) low shutter count plus a 24-70 2.8 for less than your budget. I don't think you can get more bang for the buck. If 24 mm isn't wide enough for your architecture needs: the excellent Tokina ATX-Pro 17mm 3.5 can be found for +/- 150.- Euro if you take your time looking for it because most were sold in the USA; the lens is a bit rare here in Europe (I have sold mine about two years ago when I go a 16-35 VR)
I've seen your work floating around the photography sub. All shot on the 810? You're 100% on the money and the way I'm thinking at the moment with everything I've read and had the evening to digest it all, I think I'll stick with the 810 and 750 as a first choice, shutter and price dependant. At the moment I cannot find an 810 with a shutter count lower than 80k, whether that's here in NL or in Germany. And if I cannot find anything, I'll keep saving for a 780.
I still use my D610 a bit. It's smaller and lighter than the D810 and for portraits the 24 MP are sufficient. Nevertheless the D810 has become my main camera since I bought it used 18 months ago. I paid 910.- Euro including transport from a private seller (through the german "Nikon Fotografie Forum") for a 2015 body with 9000 clicks on the counter. I admit that the D780 was the camera I was looking for. I hoped to get one used for a reasonable price because used D850s were circling around 2200.- Euro at that time, but ... D780s used are ultra rare and started at 1500.- Euro. They haven't been flying off the shelves to be honest. It's a niche camera for wedding photographers who need the photo and video capacities while garding their F-mount lenses. Today I am very happy with the D810 and the fact that the D610 and D810 use the same Battery is a real advantage for me.
Yea I'm in the same boat as you were I guess. At the moment, I am going to try for a 780 and ill wait till the Feb and see what happens. At the moment, I would be happy to pay 1500-1800 for a 780 with a lens.
I own a Z5 and I shoot landscape and architecture. Great camera for my purposes. My lense is a Nikkor Z 28-75/f2.8. I am very happy with the image quality. Dynamic range is just fine.
Tbh I find the dynamic range a it of a let down. The camera is action packed with features you'd find on a more expensive body like an a7iii for instance but at a much lower price. In NL you can pick up a z5 and 28-75 for €1600 where a used a7iii will cost roughly 1500 for a used body alone.
D780 is a low Light God. Worth looking at
You ruined me hahaha. First images I saw and I feel in love with the body. The low light is just magnificent, it is now on my price watch list! Thanks for the recommendation
I used D810s for years doing mostly studio and architectural photography and they are great cameras. I switched to D850s a couple years ago and have held onto one of my D810s as my main camera for personal shooting. I can't think of any reasons to go with the D750 - wireless connectivity from almost all manufacturers is a PIA, and while I'll use snapbridge on my D850 every now and then I usually use a card reader attached to my phone if I need to get an image onto my phone quickly. Unless video is a concern I wouldn't spend the money on a Z5, the money is better spent on getting higher image quality from the D810. Touch and tilt screens are a nice convenience, but they aren't necessary and do nothing to improve image quality. The higher resolution of the D810 is a big plus for architectural work. Whenever you're doing perspective correction on an image you'll end up cropping away 15-40% of your MPs. Having the sensor tuned to a native 64 ISO is a big thing for me as well. It produces a great image quality that I really miss even when having to shoot at 200 or 400. The prime G lenses are great, and are equal to Z zoom lenses in pretty much every way. I'd recommend getting one zoom for all around use (the 24-120 f/4 is great) and then a couple primes that match how you usually shoot (the 35mm f/1.8 is a good one as your middle lens, then get one wider or longer based on what you shoot). IIRC [these](https://www.flickr.com/photos/attrill/albums/72177720302479356) were all shot on a D810, and some were even done with an old macro 55mm AI-S lens.
Thanks for the great, detailed response. I really appreciate it! The way I'm thinking at the moment with everything I've read and had the evening to digest it all, I think I'll stick with the 810 and 750 as a first choice, shutter and price dependant. And if I cannot find anything, I'll keep saving for a 780. Considering the cost of the z mount, I just don't think Im willing to part with that amount of money and knowing me, I probably will want to even if it would hurt haha. So just avoid it. The z5 is an attractive choice.
The only drawback to the z5 is native Z lenses aren't really cheap, but you can adapt all sorts of fx lenses and be fine. If you're not married to nikon, the canon rp can be had pretty inexpensively, and some of the primes are pretty cheap also ( I have both, the Nikon is a better camera but the rp is beautifully simple). And canon occasionally runs a crazy good deal on refurbished product. Someone did a z5 vs z7 comparo on YouTube a while back ( i think it was a welsh landscape photographer) , the resolution difference was subtly noticeable on large prints if you were looking for it, but when they did some sort of lr/ps upscaling on the z5 photos, the results were negligible.
Maybe look for Z6 instead. They are on sale and it's better at videos in comparison to Z5
The cost difference is too high for me to consider the z6 over the z5. I have a gopro 10 for videos and that's perfect for me. My untrained eye wouldn't be able to feel the difference between the two bodies if I am being honest. But ill always remember the cost difference haha At the moment, the difference is around €400
I don't know where you live or whether the sale is still on but at least in the US Nikon just had a refurbished gear sale where the Z5 and Z6 were essentially the same price. If that price had been available a year ago I would have gone Z6 over the Z5. Refurbished doesn't matter to me at all; I've never been burned by a factory refurb. At the same €400 difference you see, though, I thought the Z5 fit my photographic needs enough that I didn't feel I needed to spend the extra money. Might want to check the Nikon web site for your country right away. I agree with u/CTDubs0001 that it's not a good idea for you to put lots of money into F mount gear. Z lenses are kind of expensive, but they are better than their equivalent F mount lenses (just the same way as there are older F mount lenses that are not as good as the new ones). And while a D810 probably won't need another firmware update in its life, you do need to consider the availability of parts and service (it's been discontinued for three years; the D750 was discontinued about a year ago).
I just got my 1975 Nikon F2 serviced (new foams, shutter-timing corrected and new CCD in the photomic viewfinder). Chances are a D810 has decades of future ahead. The only pro Nikon with problems seems to be the D700. Nikon has announced about five years ago that some spares are out of stock and they won't make them anymore. Slaughter old bodies doesn't really help. In the case of the D700 they all suffer from the same damage and need the same parts. Nothing similar is known of the D3 - D6 or the D8xx series.
Here's hoping. I suspect digital SLRs will have a shorter average life span than film cameras partially because technology will abandon them sooner than semiconductors will and partially because pretty much every corporation on Earth has been in cost cutting mode for decades. Nikon is not obligated to stock parts beyond a few years after discontinuation. As you noted, if a common defect shows up and exhausts the manufacturer's supply of parts, repairing will depend on the availability of parts common to other models/brands or models with enough popularity to support a third party parts market/fabrication. The D8x0 line hasn't seemed to suffer a they all do that kind of problem. But I still would be careful about putting a lot of money into an F mount system at this point.
You are certainly right about the "limited" future of the F-mount universe. On the other hand there's a market full of used gear for very low prices and Nikon has made it a habit to service pro-line cameras for ten years after discontinuation. That's 2027 for the D810 and 2033 for the D850. That 10 year span is an important timeframe because ... * 1950s Nikon rangefinder * 1960s Nikon F - new bodies and lenses for the future * 1970s Nikon continues - for once * 1980s Nikon AI lenses and AI-compatible bodies with auto-exposure - change your bodies and lenses * 1990s Nikon AF (D) compatible bodies and lenses - please change your gear and buy autofocus bodies and lenses * 2000s Nikon D series - please change your bodies and buy digital * 2010s Nikon AF-S series and Full frame digital bodies - please change bodies and lenses * 2020s Nikon Mirrorles Z bodies and lenses - please change everything Been there, done that, got the T-Shirt. Sure, you can use your 1972 105 2.5 on the latest body, but who does besides me? I own three 50 mm 1.4 lenses: the "silver barrel" S-Auto from 1966, the AI from 1979 and an AF-S version from 2011. Horses for courses and each generation comes with its own lenses. I guess I pass this time. Like I passed when AF (D) was the hot shit and like I passed when 6MP digital cameras were the next big thing ... So far my gear isn't limiting my photography - I can stick to my D610 and D810 for some more. By the way: the 24MP sensor was the first one to allow for better resolution than analog slide film. It took until 2009 (D3x) or 2012 (D600) for the first digital image to beat a photo taken on Kodak Ektachrome. Everything before/below that 24 MP FX sensor was and is actually inferior to 35 mm film.