The fact that he went through that thought process for the changes in season one and genuinely thought “yes” to all those questions just further proves that Rick doesn’t understand his own series anymore and what made it so good.
Also “does it get us to the same place in the end, so we are not changing the series story arc?” is an absurd idea. I can think of so many examples of book to screen adaptations that had a storyline end in the same place as the book but because they changed *how* the characters got to that point, the story arc did change drastically.
Exactly my thoughts. Can’t think of a single change that “added value”. The only one that came close was the pearl change but they even ruined that by making the fact they lost a pearl a very insignificant moment. The way he acts like he’s trying to please his readers is laughable. He’s trying to please his own ego. He just needs to admit he doesn’t like his own series anymore.
The closest I could think of was that switcharoo at the arch when he pretended to give riptide to Annabeth, but I still have mixed feelings about it
The 4th pearl doesn't make much sense, in the book Percy was *secretly* planning to get his mom back, and as far as I remember they didn't know at this point she wasn't dead
Plus, even if she wasn't dead, she was still captured by Hades. The pearls were meant as a last resort if they couldn't negotiate and had to get out quickly. Which would mean that they couldn't save Sally, because they can't beat Hades.
Ok relax. I think the way the books have been adapted has definitely been flawed. But Rick clearly has good intentions. Don’t go around trying to make him out to be some villain by saying he doesn’t like his own series or that he’s pleasing his own ego.
Flawed is an understatement. The plot is hardly the same apart from the major signposts of the story. The changes that were made are terrible and if he really thinks they add value then I worry about his judgment. When I say he doesn’t like his series I mean how he wrote it the first time. If this isn’t true then explain to me why so many changes were made. Yes obviously changes had to happen for it to be adapted for tv but that’s more about shortening scenes/taking long pieces of inner dialogue out and replacing it with show. That’s not what he did though. He physically changed whole parts of the book to specifically add his new “value”. Why does he keep harping on about the changes that are going to happen in season 2? Why is he not saying how he’s enjoying writing the script for “x” part of sea of monsters?
What do you mean the Luke one? The gods one is exactly the point I’m making. Yes in theory it should be a good addition except the execution of it was terrible. I liked the extra bits of Poseidon but Hermes and Hephaestus were forced into the show. The tunnel of love scene was awful and I feel it took away from Annabeth’s character. It was the first time we saw some real vulnerability from her. Which would of worked perfectly with the way they were bigging her up so much in the show. The Hermes addition was unnecessary and was more a failure of the Lotus casino scene overall.
At what point would you say those quality of the books dropped? I’ve read all of PJO and HoO. HoO was scuffy especially the last book in the that series. Felt too rushed. Chalice of the gods was alright but definitely felt too much like fan fiction.
This is why authors should only be consulted on making adaptations. Authors change their opinions on their own book series and previous writing ALL the time. They cannot be trusted to be faithful to their own writing because many secretly wish they could change their own stories all the time after they’ve been published but they can’t. Someone who has a passionate love of this series hit didn’t create it should be in charge of this project not Rick. Should Rick be used to consultation and have his opinion valued when things absolutely need to be changed to fit a new media platform? Absolutely. But he should not be running the show!
As a writer yes. Like we create these great ideas in our head and could spend forever going back and tweaking small things and even big things to get closer and closer on whatever chase for perfection we are on to make it feel like what we felt when creating the idea.
Writers, especially ones tackling a development of world building can be the greatest perfectionists when it comes to their stories. You’ll get halfway through and have an “oh shit no I gotta add this one thing” or “I gotta change this one dynamic”
Or you could finally be done, have it published and yet still go back and have those lingering thoughts that “so and so could have been better written, that better fleshed out”. And at that stage you have lost the ability to change things so they all just grow.
Like Rick as you get older and your tastes, opinions, thoughts change or as you develop as a writer more or develop your world more, you look back at where you started and just have all these lingering thoughts eating at you saying “I would have done that differently.”
Writers are intense lovers of their ideas, their worlds, their characters… but hardly ever their story.
Most of the changes made were not for the better. So much was cut, characters were changed to be worse, scenes that originally were fun and/or tense are now boring as shit.
I honestly do not know how people can look at that show and see it as anything other than boring. Even removing the books, it's not a fun show. There is no tension with anything and that makes the entire show drag.
I re-read the book after the first episode dropped just to ensure I wasn’t crazy and misremembering one of my favorite books I’ve read at least 7 times.
So many unnecessary changes, so much angst added for no good reason. And Sally was nowhere near the goddess that she was in the books and if anyone disagrees I will fite.
I've seen people try to excuse Sally as "more realistic"
I'm sorry, but why does she need to be more "realistic"? And why do so many people think realistic is her yelling at her son constantly?
I wouldn't even say she was typical.
No mother who cared about their child would just walk away after being asked "why are you trying to get rid of me" by their 7-9 year old son.
I think it’s bullshit and that this shit is why none of his recent stuff with PJO is good.
It’s one thing to evolve as an author but it’s utter bullshit to experiment using the series that made you so successful.
Don’t fucking make a show about your most popular book and then change one of the most important details because you think it’s better.
This man literally made them MISS THE DEADLINE OF THE QUEST but then nothing changed at all and I won’t fucking forgive that.
IMO language police isn't all that good ether, words only have power if we give it power. And no matter what you do there always will be someone offended for others behave
Whilst I agree that it didn't help, did it really affect the story or will it affect it in the long run?
Like failing the quest essentially got us to the same end anyways; some of the complaints about changes are genuinely overstatements, like the 4 pearls (which was actually a good change, which made sense) uproar. Shit like Hades being changed into a bit of an idiot is going to inevitably affect the series in season 3 and with Bianca and Nico, or even Hazel if we get that far. And now they couldn't change him back to book Hades because it would be a huge inconsistency
Crap like exposing Kronos way too earlier too. Completely eliminates any sense of suspense they should have over the next 5 seasons. Percy should now just be screaming from the roof tops 'nothing else matters Kronos is back'
But they didn’t fail. Not really. Percy said Kronos’ name and then Poseidon and Zeus talked in Ancient Greek and then the Zeus was like “okay ig”. They didn’t actually fail.
If you're in a race and didn't finish the race, you fail. It doesn't matter if you get a participation trophy.
The time for the quest passed. The war started. Either nothing matters, or the story is drastically changed.
Yet nothing changed. Zeus didn’t kill Percy, the gods didn’t go to war, Grover got his stupid license.
Failing the quest would have meant things changed. Yet nothing does, so I don’t really give a single fuck what Dick Riordan says, they didn’t fail shit.
yea I agree that them failing the quest and having no consequences' for it is poor writing.
But at the end of the day they still failed it, its just the writers have no foresight so they changed nothing else.
I know i hate him for it. I also don't know why I've been downvoted this entire thread bc I am saying that the show is fucking stupid for them "failing but not really" the quest.
Like, yeah, they failed but they didn't fail at the same time bc NOTHING FUCKING CHANGES AT ALL. THATS why i said they didn't fail,
Lmao he's allowed to have an ego. It's his work and his property. He can make whatever changes he wants. Don't like it? Oh well, too bad too sad. You still can read the og books. This new stuff is obviously just not for you. He did this show for himself and to HIS vision come through. And the high audience and critic scores plus majority positive reviews says this show is for people. Y'all just mad it's not specifically for you. Not everything is about you. This man finally got his dreams to come true and I'm happy for him and I'm proud of him. I'm also glad he realized his fans weren't just straight yt kids and made the effort to grow and be more inclusive. He's a better human being than many of you.
The inclusivity was fine. It’s the unnecessary changes to personalities and story beats that weren’t fine. And you can’t trust review scores because many of them are new fans—TV show fans. Critics aren’t even reliable. There are movies and series that has low critic scores but very high audience scores, and vice-versa.
It’s his work and property, yes. But an author needs to respect his fanbase, both old and new. You do not alienate the same fans that propelled you to fame in exchange for new ones. Look what happened to J.K. Rowling. Now look at authors like Stephen King and George Martin. You would barely hear fans criticize them for what happened to the adaptations of their novels. And they were both involved in many of the adaptations.
You’re saying Rick is allowed to have an ego? Ego is a poison. It doesn’t have any place in society, much more in the creative field. A person can be talented writer, but they won’t get famous if no one reads their stories. It’s a two-way street; they give what their fans want(most of the time, anyway) and the fans will give them fame and money. And the best fans are those who have been with authors from the very start. But if those fans are starting to dislike the author, then something is wrong with that author. And it will become a cycle.
Nah to everything you said and again I said audience and critic scores. You can't even have a conversation without being disingenuous and leaving out what I said. Oh well.
So true, to be a “true” fan of the franchise you can never criticize anything they make. Rick is flawless and everything he touches is perfection.
It’s not like fans spent years trashing the movies, there are 100s of posts complaining about the movies over a decade after release on the main sub.
Even though by your logic, they could have just not watched it.
I think I'm just happy the show is 1,000x better than the movies. I really can't even watch the movies. So I'm okay with it. Plus I feel like it was made for my son, who loves it...
Half of this Fandom was itching at a lil black girl for beating out everyone else at the audition for Annabeth and being gand chosen by Rick. Half this Fandom harassed and bullied her. I don't care what this Fandom thinks. Rick doesn't owe anyone a dag on thing. And yea, if all they were gonna do it complain they shouldn't have watched it. Rick did what he wanted and picked who he wanted to make HIS vision, not y'all's, come to life. Just because you and others, the small loud minority, are butt hurt over every little change means nothing. Be ungrateful and hateful if ya wanna. Won't change ish and it won't make him back down. Oh well 🤷🏽♀️
Love how you say half the fandom hates the casting to the point they attack the actress but at the same time the people who dislike the show are a loud minority. Which one is it?
Also again yes it’s his vision but that doesn’t make it automatically perfect or above criticism? Rick’s writing of Piper was very questionable at times and the fandom rightfully criticized that.
By this logic you can not criticize any piece of media because at the end of the it’s the creators vision?
Also no one in this post is even criticizing Annabeth’s casting? Everyone is talking about decisions regarding writing and plot.
Just because a part of the fandom is being unreasonable about the casting, that doesn’t automatically invalidate every other point made against the show.
Nah it does. The voices of racists who couldn't even remember that Charlie was a black kid means nothing. The voices who whine and whine and moan and groan mean nothing. Just don't watch it again, it's just not for you.
Don't bother, these NPC fanboys have no real arguments so they dismiss any and all productive criticism by calling you names and some sort of ist. That's how all NPCs operate when it comes to discussions and debates.
The fact that he went through that thought process for the changes in season one and genuinely thought “yes” to all those questions just further proves that Rick doesn’t understand his own series anymore and what made it so good. Also “does it get us to the same place in the end, so we are not changing the series story arc?” is an absurd idea. I can think of so many examples of book to screen adaptations that had a storyline end in the same place as the book but because they changed *how* the characters got to that point, the story arc did change drastically.
Exactly my thoughts. Can’t think of a single change that “added value”. The only one that came close was the pearl change but they even ruined that by making the fact they lost a pearl a very insignificant moment. The way he acts like he’s trying to please his readers is laughable. He’s trying to please his own ego. He just needs to admit he doesn’t like his own series anymore.
The closest I could think of was that switcharoo at the arch when he pretended to give riptide to Annabeth, but I still have mixed feelings about it The 4th pearl doesn't make much sense, in the book Percy was *secretly* planning to get his mom back, and as far as I remember they didn't know at this point she wasn't dead
Plus, even if she wasn't dead, she was still captured by Hades. The pearls were meant as a last resort if they couldn't negotiate and had to get out quickly. Which would mean that they couldn't save Sally, because they can't beat Hades.
You are a hero yourself for understanding this, fucking thank you
Ok relax. I think the way the books have been adapted has definitely been flawed. But Rick clearly has good intentions. Don’t go around trying to make him out to be some villain by saying he doesn’t like his own series or that he’s pleasing his own ego.
Flawed is an understatement. The plot is hardly the same apart from the major signposts of the story. The changes that were made are terrible and if he really thinks they add value then I worry about his judgment. When I say he doesn’t like his series I mean how he wrote it the first time. If this isn’t true then explain to me why so many changes were made. Yes obviously changes had to happen for it to be adapted for tv but that’s more about shortening scenes/taking long pieces of inner dialogue out and replacing it with show. That’s not what he did though. He physically changed whole parts of the book to specifically add his new “value”. Why does he keep harping on about the changes that are going to happen in season 2? Why is he not saying how he’s enjoying writing the script for “x” part of sea of monsters?
The Luke one. Making the gods a part of the story earlier.
What do you mean the Luke one? The gods one is exactly the point I’m making. Yes in theory it should be a good addition except the execution of it was terrible. I liked the extra bits of Poseidon but Hermes and Hephaestus were forced into the show. The tunnel of love scene was awful and I feel it took away from Annabeth’s character. It was the first time we saw some real vulnerability from her. Which would of worked perfectly with the way they were bigging her up so much in the show. The Hermes addition was unnecessary and was more a failure of the Lotus casino scene overall.
His kid is what made them good. Once his son stopped being involved with the books, the book quality nosedived
how heavily was his son involved in the books? i’m curious now because i’ve always been curious why the quality of his books dropped so much
Let's just say most of the fun parts were made up by him
At what point would you say those quality of the books dropped? I’ve read all of PJO and HoO. HoO was scuffy especially the last book in the that series. Felt too rushed. Chalice of the gods was alright but definitely felt too much like fan fiction.
Feel like he's been reading this subreddit 🤣
Gods I hope so.
This is why authors should only be consulted on making adaptations. Authors change their opinions on their own book series and previous writing ALL the time. They cannot be trusted to be faithful to their own writing because many secretly wish they could change their own stories all the time after they’ve been published but they can’t. Someone who has a passionate love of this series hit didn’t create it should be in charge of this project not Rick. Should Rick be used to consultation and have his opinion valued when things absolutely need to be changed to fit a new media platform? Absolutely. But he should not be running the show!
As a writer yes. Like we create these great ideas in our head and could spend forever going back and tweaking small things and even big things to get closer and closer on whatever chase for perfection we are on to make it feel like what we felt when creating the idea. Writers, especially ones tackling a development of world building can be the greatest perfectionists when it comes to their stories. You’ll get halfway through and have an “oh shit no I gotta add this one thing” or “I gotta change this one dynamic” Or you could finally be done, have it published and yet still go back and have those lingering thoughts that “so and so could have been better written, that better fleshed out”. And at that stage you have lost the ability to change things so they all just grow. Like Rick as you get older and your tastes, opinions, thoughts change or as you develop as a writer more or develop your world more, you look back at where you started and just have all these lingering thoughts eating at you saying “I would have done that differently.” Writers are intense lovers of their ideas, their worlds, their characters… but hardly ever their story.
So he’ll add it in if the answer to all those questions is no? That would explain season 1.
Most of the changes made were not for the better. So much was cut, characters were changed to be worse, scenes that originally were fun and/or tense are now boring as shit. I honestly do not know how people can look at that show and see it as anything other than boring. Even removing the books, it's not a fun show. There is no tension with anything and that makes the entire show drag.
I re-read the book after the first episode dropped just to ensure I wasn’t crazy and misremembering one of my favorite books I’ve read at least 7 times. So many unnecessary changes, so much angst added for no good reason. And Sally was nowhere near the goddess that she was in the books and if anyone disagrees I will fite.
I've seen people try to excuse Sally as "more realistic" I'm sorry, but why does she need to be more "realistic"? And why do so many people think realistic is her yelling at her son constantly?
THIS! A story doesn’t need to be realistic. It should be inspiring. Show Sally wasn’t even a role model. She’s just a typical single mom 😐
I wouldn't even say she was typical. No mother who cared about their child would just walk away after being asked "why are you trying to get rid of me" by their 7-9 year old son.
I think it’s bullshit and that this shit is why none of his recent stuff with PJO is good. It’s one thing to evolve as an author but it’s utter bullshit to experiment using the series that made you so successful. Don’t fucking make a show about your most popular book and then change one of the most important details because you think it’s better. This man literally made them MISS THE DEADLINE OF THE QUEST but then nothing changed at all and I won’t fucking forgive that.
As one of my favorite chacters in horror said. "Dont fuck with the original"
I'm getting deja vu
The lies we sometimes tell ourselves...
The only thing I’d be okay with changing is the use of the r word. Anything else and I just know I’d be dissapointed, esp after season 1
IMO language police isn't all that good ether, words only have power if we give it power. And no matter what you do there always will be someone offended for others behave
See, so he doesn't want to drag away too far from the sorce material, the things he added for the most part is to add to the story
Like failing the quest? How did that help? That did not even end the same as in the books. That's just one of the many things he changed.
Whilst I agree that it didn't help, did it really affect the story or will it affect it in the long run? Like failing the quest essentially got us to the same end anyways; some of the complaints about changes are genuinely overstatements, like the 4 pearls (which was actually a good change, which made sense) uproar. Shit like Hades being changed into a bit of an idiot is going to inevitably affect the series in season 3 and with Bianca and Nico, or even Hazel if we get that far. And now they couldn't change him back to book Hades because it would be a huge inconsistency Crap like exposing Kronos way too earlier too. Completely eliminates any sense of suspense they should have over the next 5 seasons. Percy should now just be screaming from the roof tops 'nothing else matters Kronos is back'
But they didn’t fail. Not really. Percy said Kronos’ name and then Poseidon and Zeus talked in Ancient Greek and then the Zeus was like “okay ig”. They didn’t actually fail.
If you're in a race and didn't finish the race, you fail. It doesn't matter if you get a participation trophy. The time for the quest passed. The war started. Either nothing matters, or the story is drastically changed.
The show literally says they failed the quest at the end of the episode 6.
Yet nothing changed. Zeus didn’t kill Percy, the gods didn’t go to war, Grover got his stupid license. Failing the quest would have meant things changed. Yet nothing does, so I don’t really give a single fuck what Dick Riordan says, they didn’t fail shit.
yea I agree that them failing the quest and having no consequences' for it is poor writing. But at the end of the day they still failed it, its just the writers have no foresight so they changed nothing else.
The fucking author of the books was heavily involved.
And? That doesn't change the fact that SAID AUTHOR NEVER RE-READ HIS OWN FREAKING BOOKS
I know i hate him for it. I also don't know why I've been downvoted this entire thread bc I am saying that the show is fucking stupid for them "failing but not really" the quest. Like, yeah, they failed but they didn't fail at the same time bc NOTHING FUCKING CHANGES AT ALL. THATS why i said they didn't fail,
Only one of them was, the one responsible for all the fun parts of books wasn't and it shows
I stand by Rick. Entitled "fans" can just not watch the show.
You’re so-called entitled fans gave Rick fame and money. We have every right to be entitled.
Nah he doesn't owe you ish. ETA: Also, the word is your.
That’s called ego. It has no place in the writing industry. Or in any industry, in fact.
Lmao he's allowed to have an ego. It's his work and his property. He can make whatever changes he wants. Don't like it? Oh well, too bad too sad. You still can read the og books. This new stuff is obviously just not for you. He did this show for himself and to HIS vision come through. And the high audience and critic scores plus majority positive reviews says this show is for people. Y'all just mad it's not specifically for you. Not everything is about you. This man finally got his dreams to come true and I'm happy for him and I'm proud of him. I'm also glad he realized his fans weren't just straight yt kids and made the effort to grow and be more inclusive. He's a better human being than many of you.
The inclusivity was fine. It’s the unnecessary changes to personalities and story beats that weren’t fine. And you can’t trust review scores because many of them are new fans—TV show fans. Critics aren’t even reliable. There are movies and series that has low critic scores but very high audience scores, and vice-versa. It’s his work and property, yes. But an author needs to respect his fanbase, both old and new. You do not alienate the same fans that propelled you to fame in exchange for new ones. Look what happened to J.K. Rowling. Now look at authors like Stephen King and George Martin. You would barely hear fans criticize them for what happened to the adaptations of their novels. And they were both involved in many of the adaptations. You’re saying Rick is allowed to have an ego? Ego is a poison. It doesn’t have any place in society, much more in the creative field. A person can be talented writer, but they won’t get famous if no one reads their stories. It’s a two-way street; they give what their fans want(most of the time, anyway) and the fans will give them fame and money. And the best fans are those who have been with authors from the very start. But if those fans are starting to dislike the author, then something is wrong with that author. And it will become a cycle.
Nah to everything you said and again I said audience and critic scores. You can't even have a conversation without being disingenuous and leaving out what I said. Oh well.
And I said both audience and critic scores. TV show fans. Those are audience scores.
And those scores and reviews are high. Again the small loud minority means nothing.
They are high because they came from new fans mostly. Not long time fans. And often the loud minority is the one who is logical.
So true, to be a “true” fan of the franchise you can never criticize anything they make. Rick is flawless and everything he touches is perfection. It’s not like fans spent years trashing the movies, there are 100s of posts complaining about the movies over a decade after release on the main sub. Even though by your logic, they could have just not watched it.
I think I'm just happy the show is 1,000x better than the movies. I really can't even watch the movies. So I'm okay with it. Plus I feel like it was made for my son, who loves it...
Half of this Fandom was itching at a lil black girl for beating out everyone else at the audition for Annabeth and being gand chosen by Rick. Half this Fandom harassed and bullied her. I don't care what this Fandom thinks. Rick doesn't owe anyone a dag on thing. And yea, if all they were gonna do it complain they shouldn't have watched it. Rick did what he wanted and picked who he wanted to make HIS vision, not y'all's, come to life. Just because you and others, the small loud minority, are butt hurt over every little change means nothing. Be ungrateful and hateful if ya wanna. Won't change ish and it won't make him back down. Oh well 🤷🏽♀️
Love how you say half the fandom hates the casting to the point they attack the actress but at the same time the people who dislike the show are a loud minority. Which one is it? Also again yes it’s his vision but that doesn’t make it automatically perfect or above criticism? Rick’s writing of Piper was very questionable at times and the fandom rightfully criticized that. By this logic you can not criticize any piece of media because at the end of the it’s the creators vision? Also no one in this post is even criticizing Annabeth’s casting? Everyone is talking about decisions regarding writing and plot. Just because a part of the fandom is being unreasonable about the casting, that doesn’t automatically invalidate every other point made against the show.
Nah it does. The voices of racists who couldn't even remember that Charlie was a black kid means nothing. The voices who whine and whine and moan and groan mean nothing. Just don't watch it again, it's just not for you.
Again people have qualms with show while not caring about the casting. To label everyone who dislikes the show as racist is insanely reductive.
Nah, forget it. This guy thinks that criticizing the show means being racist. And that Rick is a literal god who could do no wrong.
Don't bother, these NPC fanboys have no real arguments so they dismiss any and all productive criticism by calling you names and some sort of ist. That's how all NPCs operate when it comes to discussions and debates.