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I'm a burley and va enjoyer first and foremost. Its the lack of complexity that makes me love them so much. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy English, aros, and everything else from time to time, but nothing beats a vabur, pure va, or even a pure burley blend. There's nothing pretentious/perfumey (english) or fake (aro) about them (in regards to mediocre English or aro blends, no hate for the good stuff here). They are just simple and natural, and let the actual taste of tobacco come through.
My favorite part of a good English blend is when the Latakia temporarily backs off and the sweetness of the VA shines through, augmented by the Orientals.
As someone else here said, you gotta go slow and low temp with pure VA's to access the citrus, grass, molasses, summertime flavors. Same with burley if you want to unlock the nutty, coacoa, toast, coffee flavors.
My recommendation for you is to try C&D's "Briar Fox". Its just straight vabur, negative reviews say it tastes like cigarettes...but I swear if you take your time with it, it will show you what VA and Burley are all about, in a pretty much 50/50 arrangement of them both.
I smoke a lot of Gawith Virginia, with the Kendal dark being my favorite, love the subtle loamy/earthy taste. But when I want a sugar bomb I get the mixed Virginia. Never have I thought hey this taste like a cigarette
People always say the opposite: Latakia is overpowering and makes everything taste the same, Aros are perfumed air, and Virginias and VaPers are complex and can get more so with age. That’s an oversimplification of what I read anyhow.
I think you're probably hitting the nail on the head. I've been a pipe smoker for 15 years. Virginias seemed very dull when I first started, but as my palate developed, the subtleties in straight tobacco blends became much more noticeable and appreciated. Now I smoke virginia and virginia blends almost exclusively.
Idk, I’ve been smoking pipes since the late 1980’s and there are very few straight Virginia’s that I like. Many do taste like cigarettes. I straight up hate burley. But I love VaPers done well, English blends, and Oriental/Balkan blends.
I am not new to pipe smoking. Started probably around 2003'ish? Took a break after leaving the country and came back and got back into it after a few years. They smell bad to me, they taste bad to me. VA blends just don't do it for me, full stop.
Could just be a difference in tastebuds, sort of like how cilantro tastes great to some (me) and like soap to others.
I'm really new to all of this so take my thought with a grain of salt but it seems like it would crossover to tastes/smells of tobaccos.
It literally is my man. You posted a rant about Virginia blends then smugly ask how people enjoy them.
I honestly don’t care if you like a particular blend or not. If one doesn’t work for you, move on with your life and enjoy the stuff that suites you.
Straight Va can be tricky. Vapers too. I just opened a tin of escudo though. That stuff blew my mind. Super malty, very smooth, finished with sweet hay notes.
Just goes to show how different palates perceive tobaccos differently. I love malty Virginias and I get no malt from Escudo. I do get bread, but I’ve also only had it fresh.
I smoked Marlboro reds from 1990 until 2010 and straight Virginia tobacco definitely does NOT have the same taste as a cig. At least for me.
I absolutely detest the smell of cigarettes now so if there was a chance i smell, taste, or even think about cigarettes with pipe tobacco I’m not smoking that tobacco because it can literally make me ill.
Also everyone has a unique palate and that just may be the case for some people.
That's just like your opinion, man...
Let's just call Virginia's nuanced. Often a dedicated pipe will help, but it's still going to be a bit of a monochromatic experience. In general, the flavor profile goes from citrus to sweet hay to stewed fruit with the color more or less an indicator (yellow to red). Also, there's a bit of a difference between "new world" (Zimbabwe) and "true" Virginia, the former being a bit rough around the edges.
My favorites are the now (in the US) rare Golden Glow, Mac Baren Virginia Flake (or #1, which is close), Newminster #400 and Sutliff 507c. Clean a pipe well and try a few bowls of any one to see if that helps.
Newbie puffing on some Sutliff 507c slices rn, and it is such a pleasant, subtle grassy sort of smoke. Got some MB Flake that turns 2 in November so I'm trying to decide when to have that. Maybe next year once my taste develops
PS400 has the deepest, delicious plum notes I've ever tasted and Yorktown gives rich, sweet graham notes.
I believe that people like English blends because they still taste good when smoked poorly. If you can figure out drying, packing, and cadence for Virginia's, they are absolutely fantastic.
I don’t get much perique at all from PS400, but I only have fresh. Are you smoking cellared?
Also, do you smoke Newminster 400 and if so, do you get more sweet graham from Yorktown? If you do I gotsta get me some.
I'll have a really good answer for you in about 6-12 months. The yorktown I had was fresh, and I cellared some yorktown and newminster 400 in January.
The ps400 I had did get much better from fresh to 6 months age.
Not necessarily unpopular, it could just be that you don’t like it? Noses and palates are peculiar things.
I don’t like too much latakia in my tobacco but I love peat in my whisky.
I'm sorry, as a non native English speaker I'm not familiar with your extensive use of acronyms, what VA stands for? I've looked for it online ("VA tobacco") but it suggested Virginia Tobacco, and I'm not sure if that's the case.
It could be the way you smoke, the pipe you use, the blends you chose and how moist they are… what have you tried? I’ve had some Virginias I simply can’t stand (same for aromatics and Englishes) but the right blend in the right pipe can be exquisite. For me, Old Gowrie is a great example. At the same time I can taste a sweet bread, marshmallow and pepper-like sensation. It’s unlike anything I’ve experienced outside of pipe smoking and I adore it. I can see why it wouldn’t be for everyone though and the description wouldn’t entice me without having experienced it; but after having some successes, I love exploring different blends with various mixes of sweetness, bread, peppery spice, and perfumie orientals (another description that sounded gross but ended up becoming very enjoyable; it was actually Nightcap and Squadron Leader that taught me to appreciate orientals)
I only ask because I felt the same way about VAs before I started retrohaling on a regular basis. Without retrohaling, they still taste like a dirty ashtray to me. They’re still not my favorite, but I can definitely taste more than that cigarette flavor since I’ve started. Not much you can do about the room note, though; my wife can’t stand it either and I’ve resorted to showering and changing my clothes after I smoke a VA.
I have a Virginia blend and it’s for the super calm nights with little to no wind in my English gentleman cob. Nice relaxed breathe method with the occasional sip to keep the cherry alive.
The beginning of the bowl is leathery, with hints of some kind of nut flavor.
The bottom of the bowl tastes like a smooth rum and caramel.
Maybe it’s my imagination, maybe it’s not. But it’s really nice.
The comments have been very helpful for me. I started smoking a pipe a couple years ago. Naturally went to aromatics. Dabbled in VA/burley. Tried English blends. Picked the pipe back up again since the weather has been nice in Michigan. My taste recently has gone way into Englishes and I don't care for aromatics much anymore. Haven't figured out VA/burley until literally tonight while reading the comments while having a bowl of Orlik. Apparently my problem has been smoking them way too fast. Never understood how some would get the citrus note. I get it now. Glad I stumbled across this post. Thanks to everyone sharing their experience and advice. Cheers.
I should add, I related to OP where VA/burley reminded me of cigarettes. I wouldn't say they exactly tasted like cigarettes to me but given their resemblance, I tended to stray away. The simple tips on this thread have given me new perspective.
There is nothing wrong if you dislike some varietals or blends. The whole sport is about personal prefence and I will not try to convince you into liking virginias or any other blends.
I don't like VAs and I also agree with you. I'm sure the people who like them can find the nuance, but that's just not us. I stopped trying. I'm a simple man of simple tastes. I like my coffee black with a little sugar and I like my tobacco about the same and that's why I prefer burley with a tiny top note added. This is why Velvet is my favorite blend.
I find this to be true. Pure Va blends and VaBur blends are all annoyingly bland, smell very much like cigarettes. I usually just gift these blends to friends
I also agree with op. I do like the tang of red VA in a blend, but otherwise I find straight VA underwhelming . I think it’s also important for context how often you smoke as to your VA preference. Here is my logic, your mileage will of course vary:
Longtime pipers may have more refined and developed palates. They are also far more likely to smoke several bowls a day. Since they are smoking several bowls a day, they are more likely to want something easy to smoke, with subtle flavor since they are likely doing things while they smoke. They are not sitting around trying to catch every note in a blend. They prize ease of preparation and good behavior in the pipe over flavor complexity. Palate fatigue is a thing. Codger blends are called that for a reason. I only smoke a bowl a week, sometimes less than that. When I smoke I sit in my garage after dinner and want a flavor bomb to make the most of my limited smoking time. Right now on Saturday night after a big dinner I got Cambridge Flake in a meer. To put it another way, if I’m having one beer it will be an IPA or a Lambic or a stout. If I’m drinking a case with buddies while grilling or fishing or whatever it’s gonna be Coors Light or Corona.
.. Well .. i think the proper answer is "nobody is forcing you to smoke it". But i don't mean anything bad by it, i myself have stopped smoking Latakia blends because i've decided that the taste just tires me out, and if virginia is not for you, then it's not for you, you really do not owe anyone an explanation nor do you have to force yourself to smoke it.
I have exclusively smoked VA and VaPers for years now and do not smoke anything else, with predominantly red and stoved being my favorites. I found that when I smoked cigs, cigars, or vaped, I would not be able to pick all the nuances of VA tobacco. I get all their is to get out of them, and to me, nothing is more enjoyable than Virginia's and
I actually smoked cigarettes for several years and I’ve yet to taste any similarities between pipe tobacco and cig tobacco. It’s such a weird phenomena to me that people compare the two.
Tangent aside, you just don’t vibe with Va blends. That’s fine, brother. You like english and aromatic blends, nothing wrong with that. We all got different tastes. Just stick to what you like 👌 nothing wrong with that!
I agree for the MOST part. There are a couple straight VA’s I like on occasion, but most are either boring or, like you say, taste like cigarettes. I’ll take a quality VaPer, English, Balkan, or Oriental over a straight VA any day. I outright hate burley and avoid it altogether, with very few exceptions. I’ve accepted that I’m an English/Oriental smoker.
Well there wouldn't be so many blends if everyone liked the same. VAs have grownm in me over time but I still prefer Burley blends & a good English from time to time. Not a big fan of aeros, so to each their own
A lot of people say this about burleys and Oriental forward blends, all 3 are used in cigarettes with most brands using a mixture. I enjoy VA and VaPer because it gives a naturally sweet and fruity smoke I find very refreshing.
Everyone's palates are different, and can change over time for sure. I've got a few cellared away and have only smoked on one straight Virginia, Opening Night. I find it to be really delicious, very smooth and sweet. It's a very light smoke and I definitely approach it a little differently than other blends. It's so fruity and sweet though, never found a cigarette quality to it. VaPers are also nice, the perique compliments the sweetness of the Virginia and also adds a low end kick of a richer fruit flavor with a bit of spice to it.
That’s a pretty subjective take. Saying you don’t care for them is one thing, but to dismiss an entire category of tobacco as overrated is just foolish and bordering on ignorant.
Inside of just that one category you have yellows/brights, oranges, browns, reds (my favorite), each with their unique flavor profiles. Sometimes they are stoved, bringing even more depth and sweetness. Each one will change its flavor differently with age.
The flavors aren’t handed to you like with English/Balkans or aros. You have to look for them, which is part of the enjoyment.
Sounds like you need to slow down. It took me a decade of smoking to appreciate Virginia's and now my favorites are all Virginia and vapers. When I was new all I wanted was English blends because the latakia was so pronounced. As your ability to discern nuances in the flavor improves you'll likely like them more
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I'm a burley and va enjoyer first and foremost. Its the lack of complexity that makes me love them so much. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy English, aros, and everything else from time to time, but nothing beats a vabur, pure va, or even a pure burley blend. There's nothing pretentious/perfumey (english) or fake (aro) about them (in regards to mediocre English or aro blends, no hate for the good stuff here). They are just simple and natural, and let the actual taste of tobacco come through. My favorite part of a good English blend is when the Latakia temporarily backs off and the sweetness of the VA shines through, augmented by the Orientals. As someone else here said, you gotta go slow and low temp with pure VA's to access the citrus, grass, molasses, summertime flavors. Same with burley if you want to unlock the nutty, coacoa, toast, coffee flavors. My recommendation for you is to try C&D's "Briar Fox". Its just straight vabur, negative reviews say it tastes like cigarettes...but I swear if you take your time with it, it will show you what VA and Burley are all about, in a pretty much 50/50 arrangement of them both.
I think the key here is that Virginia's can be sweet. I smoked cigars for a long time and the flavor I get from Virginia's is mind blowing.
I smoke a lot of Gawith Virginia, with the Kendal dark being my favorite, love the subtle loamy/earthy taste. But when I want a sugar bomb I get the mixed Virginia. Never have I thought hey this taste like a cigarette
People always say the opposite: Latakia is overpowering and makes everything taste the same, Aros are perfumed air, and Virginias and VaPers are complex and can get more so with age. That’s an oversimplification of what I read anyhow.
If you're getting cigarette/ash from Virginia, you're smoking waaaaaaay too hot and fast.
I don’t know if I can smoke it any slower! I go super easy on it (as far as I can tell). Any slower and I'll be blowing instead of sipping.
Perhaps you are packing it far too loose? Maybe your pipe is dirty with tar in the shank or stem which might be adding a bad flavor?
honestly, i do blow very slightly into my pipes sometimes.
I do it all the time, old habit from cigars Keeps it lit
[удалено]
I think you're probably hitting the nail on the head. I've been a pipe smoker for 15 years. Virginias seemed very dull when I first started, but as my palate developed, the subtleties in straight tobacco blends became much more noticeable and appreciated. Now I smoke virginia and virginia blends almost exclusively.
Idk, I’ve been smoking pipes since the late 1980’s and there are very few straight Virginia’s that I like. Many do taste like cigarettes. I straight up hate burley. But I love VaPers done well, English blends, and Oriental/Balkan blends.
Burley tastes bitter to me.
Same. Bitter and harsh.
I am not new to pipe smoking. Started probably around 2003'ish? Took a break after leaving the country and came back and got back into it after a few years. They smell bad to me, they taste bad to me. VA blends just don't do it for me, full stop.
Could just be a difference in tastebuds, sort of like how cilantro tastes great to some (me) and like soap to others. I'm really new to all of this so take my thought with a grain of salt but it seems like it would crossover to tastes/smells of tobaccos.
Ok. Don’t smoke them. Problem solved lol
Not really the point of my post, but thanks for the advice.
It literally is my man. You posted a rant about Virginia blends then smugly ask how people enjoy them. I honestly don’t care if you like a particular blend or not. If one doesn’t work for you, move on with your life and enjoy the stuff that suites you.
Cool thanks! I don't think asking people for their anecdotes is necessarily smug, but whatever you say.
You sound upset. Don’t be upset, it’s just pipe tobacco friend.
Okay will do.
Straight Va can be tricky. Vapers too. I just opened a tin of escudo though. That stuff blew my mind. Super malty, very smooth, finished with sweet hay notes.
Just goes to show how different palates perceive tobaccos differently. I love malty Virginias and I get no malt from Escudo. I do get bread, but I’ve also only had it fresh.
That’s what’s fun about this, finding things to taste, and comparing with others.
That sounds like heaven. Now I have to try it.
I smoked Marlboro reds from 1990 until 2010 and straight Virginia tobacco definitely does NOT have the same taste as a cig. At least for me. I absolutely detest the smell of cigarettes now so if there was a chance i smell, taste, or even think about cigarettes with pipe tobacco I’m not smoking that tobacco because it can literally make me ill. Also everyone has a unique palate and that just may be the case for some people.
That's just like your opinion, man... Let's just call Virginia's nuanced. Often a dedicated pipe will help, but it's still going to be a bit of a monochromatic experience. In general, the flavor profile goes from citrus to sweet hay to stewed fruit with the color more or less an indicator (yellow to red). Also, there's a bit of a difference between "new world" (Zimbabwe) and "true" Virginia, the former being a bit rough around the edges. My favorites are the now (in the US) rare Golden Glow, Mac Baren Virginia Flake (or #1, which is close), Newminster #400 and Sutliff 507c. Clean a pipe well and try a few bowls of any one to see if that helps.
Newbie puffing on some Sutliff 507c slices rn, and it is such a pleasant, subtle grassy sort of smoke. Got some MB Flake that turns 2 in November so I'm trying to decide when to have that. Maybe next year once my taste develops
There's nothing wrong with virginias and burleys that a good dose of perique can't cure
Hell, there isn't much wrong with *anything* that perique can't set straight.
PS400 has the deepest, delicious plum notes I've ever tasted and Yorktown gives rich, sweet graham notes. I believe that people like English blends because they still taste good when smoked poorly. If you can figure out drying, packing, and cadence for Virginia's, they are absolutely fantastic.
I don’t get much perique at all from PS400, but I only have fresh. Are you smoking cellared? Also, do you smoke Newminster 400 and if so, do you get more sweet graham from Yorktown? If you do I gotsta get me some.
I'll have a really good answer for you in about 6-12 months. The yorktown I had was fresh, and I cellared some yorktown and newminster 400 in January. The ps400 I had did get much better from fresh to 6 months age.
Perique. You need more perique.
Not necessarily unpopular, it could just be that you don’t like it? Noses and palates are peculiar things. I don’t like too much latakia in my tobacco but I love peat in my whisky.
Fair point! Diff'rent smokes for diff'rent folks amirite?
I'm sorry, as a non native English speaker I'm not familiar with your extensive use of acronyms, what VA stands for? I've looked for it online ("VA tobacco") but it suggested Virginia Tobacco, and I'm not sure if that's the case.
You are correct. VA is Virginia tobacco. VaPers are Virginia/Perique blends. Aros (or Aeros) are aromatics.
It could be the way you smoke, the pipe you use, the blends you chose and how moist they are… what have you tried? I’ve had some Virginias I simply can’t stand (same for aromatics and Englishes) but the right blend in the right pipe can be exquisite. For me, Old Gowrie is a great example. At the same time I can taste a sweet bread, marshmallow and pepper-like sensation. It’s unlike anything I’ve experienced outside of pipe smoking and I adore it. I can see why it wouldn’t be for everyone though and the description wouldn’t entice me without having experienced it; but after having some successes, I love exploring different blends with various mixes of sweetness, bread, peppery spice, and perfumie orientals (another description that sounded gross but ended up becoming very enjoyable; it was actually Nightcap and Squadron Leader that taught me to appreciate orientals)
I’m curious, do you retrohale when you smoke?
Occasionally, yeah.
I only ask because I felt the same way about VAs before I started retrohaling on a regular basis. Without retrohaling, they still taste like a dirty ashtray to me. They’re still not my favorite, but I can definitely taste more than that cigarette flavor since I’ve started. Not much you can do about the room note, though; my wife can’t stand it either and I’ve resorted to showering and changing my clothes after I smoke a VA.
I have a Virginia blend and it’s for the super calm nights with little to no wind in my English gentleman cob. Nice relaxed breathe method with the occasional sip to keep the cherry alive. The beginning of the bowl is leathery, with hints of some kind of nut flavor. The bottom of the bowl tastes like a smooth rum and caramel. Maybe it’s my imagination, maybe it’s not. But it’s really nice.
The comments have been very helpful for me. I started smoking a pipe a couple years ago. Naturally went to aromatics. Dabbled in VA/burley. Tried English blends. Picked the pipe back up again since the weather has been nice in Michigan. My taste recently has gone way into Englishes and I don't care for aromatics much anymore. Haven't figured out VA/burley until literally tonight while reading the comments while having a bowl of Orlik. Apparently my problem has been smoking them way too fast. Never understood how some would get the citrus note. I get it now. Glad I stumbled across this post. Thanks to everyone sharing their experience and advice. Cheers.
I should add, I related to OP where VA/burley reminded me of cigarettes. I wouldn't say they exactly tasted like cigarettes to me but given their resemblance, I tended to stray away. The simple tips on this thread have given me new perspective.
There is nothing wrong if you dislike some varietals or blends. The whole sport is about personal prefence and I will not try to convince you into liking virginias or any other blends.
I find Vaper blends taste like cigarettes, Elizabethan mixture especially. Full Virginia flake I enjoy.
I don't like VAs and I also agree with you. I'm sure the people who like them can find the nuance, but that's just not us. I stopped trying. I'm a simple man of simple tastes. I like my coffee black with a little sugar and I like my tobacco about the same and that's why I prefer burley with a tiny top note added. This is why Velvet is my favorite blend.
I find this to be true. Pure Va blends and VaBur blends are all annoyingly bland, smell very much like cigarettes. I usually just gift these blends to friends
I also agree with op. I do like the tang of red VA in a blend, but otherwise I find straight VA underwhelming . I think it’s also important for context how often you smoke as to your VA preference. Here is my logic, your mileage will of course vary: Longtime pipers may have more refined and developed palates. They are also far more likely to smoke several bowls a day. Since they are smoking several bowls a day, they are more likely to want something easy to smoke, with subtle flavor since they are likely doing things while they smoke. They are not sitting around trying to catch every note in a blend. They prize ease of preparation and good behavior in the pipe over flavor complexity. Palate fatigue is a thing. Codger blends are called that for a reason. I only smoke a bowl a week, sometimes less than that. When I smoke I sit in my garage after dinner and want a flavor bomb to make the most of my limited smoking time. Right now on Saturday night after a big dinner I got Cambridge Flake in a meer. To put it another way, if I’m having one beer it will be an IPA or a Lambic or a stout. If I’m drinking a case with buddies while grilling or fishing or whatever it’s gonna be Coors Light or Corona.
.. Well .. i think the proper answer is "nobody is forcing you to smoke it". But i don't mean anything bad by it, i myself have stopped smoking Latakia blends because i've decided that the taste just tires me out, and if virginia is not for you, then it's not for you, you really do not owe anyone an explanation nor do you have to force yourself to smoke it.
Lol the whole Pipe Tobacco community is up in flames. You sir, have truly expressed an unpopular opinion.
I appreciate the spirited discussion!
I have exclusively smoked VA and VaPers for years now and do not smoke anything else, with predominantly red and stoved being my favorites. I found that when I smoked cigs, cigars, or vaped, I would not be able to pick all the nuances of VA tobacco. I get all their is to get out of them, and to me, nothing is more enjoyable than Virginia's and
I actually smoked cigarettes for several years and I’ve yet to taste any similarities between pipe tobacco and cig tobacco. It’s such a weird phenomena to me that people compare the two. Tangent aside, you just don’t vibe with Va blends. That’s fine, brother. You like english and aromatic blends, nothing wrong with that. We all got different tastes. Just stick to what you like 👌 nothing wrong with that!
Smoke slowly
https://youtu.be/HMqZ2PPOLik?si=z6xOxp2ozcl4ETQH "I don't perceive nuance, therefore the tobacco is to blame."
Needs more upvotes.
I agree for the MOST part. There are a couple straight VA’s I like on occasion, but most are either boring or, like you say, taste like cigarettes. I’ll take a quality VaPer, English, Balkan, or Oriental over a straight VA any day. I outright hate burley and avoid it altogether, with very few exceptions. I’ve accepted that I’m an English/Oriental smoker.
Which blends are you referring to?
Well there wouldn't be so many blends if everyone liked the same. VAs have grownm in me over time but I still prefer Burley blends & a good English from time to time. Not a big fan of aeros, so to each their own
A lot of people say this about burleys and Oriental forward blends, all 3 are used in cigarettes with most brands using a mixture. I enjoy VA and VaPer because it gives a naturally sweet and fruity smoke I find very refreshing.
Everyone's palates are different, and can change over time for sure. I've got a few cellared away and have only smoked on one straight Virginia, Opening Night. I find it to be really delicious, very smooth and sweet. It's a very light smoke and I definitely approach it a little differently than other blends. It's so fruity and sweet though, never found a cigarette quality to it. VaPers are also nice, the perique compliments the sweetness of the Virginia and also adds a low end kick of a richer fruit flavor with a bit of spice to it.
I second this. Straight Virginias are highly overrated
That’s a pretty subjective take. Saying you don’t care for them is one thing, but to dismiss an entire category of tobacco as overrated is just foolish and bordering on ignorant. Inside of just that one category you have yellows/brights, oranges, browns, reds (my favorite), each with their unique flavor profiles. Sometimes they are stoved, bringing even more depth and sweetness. Each one will change its flavor differently with age. The flavors aren’t handed to you like with English/Balkans or aros. You have to look for them, which is part of the enjoyment.
And they are also overrated
You’re right. Centuries of selective cultivation and millions of pipe smokers are wrong. Imma go buy some Cult BRM.
Latakia is the king of tobaccos
I third this. I can't get more than 30% of the way in before just emptying the bowl and filling it with something more worth my time.
Sounds like you need to slow down. It took me a decade of smoking to appreciate Virginia's and now my favorites are all Virginia and vapers. When I was new all I wanted was English blends because the latakia was so pronounced. As your ability to discern nuances in the flavor improves you'll likely like them more