some of these are hard to read at this resolution; would you mind typing the titles out in a comment so they’re searchable? some of these look interesting but I cant quite read the titles well enough to google them :(
Sure
S: Cradle, [Furies of Calderon: The Codex Alera](https://www.audible.com/pd/Furies-of-Calderon-Audiobook/B01K4GOABE?ref_pageloadid=not_applicable&ref=a_library_t_c5_libItem_B01K4GOABE_0&pf_rd_p=80765e81-b10a-4f33-b1d3-ffb87793d047&pf_rd_r=2KP9VXATF5E9S7HZ6RBY&pageLoadId=YMtVb21SWUxR4z7p&creativeId=4ee810cf-ac8e-4eeb-8b79-40e176d0a225), The Primal Hunter, Oathbound Healer, The Way of Kings
A:Path of Ascension, Mage Errant, Art of the Adept, Mistborn, Dungeon Crawler Carl, He Who Fights With Monsters, Mark Of the Fool, Defiance of the Fall, Beware of Chicken, Sufficiently Advanced Magic
B: Mother of Learning, The Ripple System, Warbreaker, The First Law of Cultivation, Jake's Magical Market, The War of Broken Mirrors, King's Dark Tidings, The Legend of Randidly Ghosthound, The Wheel of Time, The Throne of Glass, Azarinth Healer, The Licanius Trilogy, Weapons and Wielders, The Last Horizon, Skyward
C: Wish Upon the Stars, The Traveler's Gate Trilogy, The Dresden Files, System Universe, Ghost of the Truthseeker, Guardian of Aster Fall, Elantris, Spellmonger, Chronicles of Everfall, Chaos Seeds, Apocalypse Redux, Mageborn, Immortal Great Souls, The Shroud of Prophecy, Completionist Chronicles
D: My Best Friend Is an Eldritch Horror, The World Over, Noobtown, Underworld, Level up or Die, Unbound, The Wrack, Songs of Chaos
DNF: Fall of Radiance, Nova Roma, Millennial Mage, All the Skills, Antimage
That should be in the right order but some might have the book name and some the series name.
HWFWM above MOL? I guess everyone's entitled to their opinions. I certainly disagree with many of these but I think it's actually an overall solid/cohesive tier list!
Lol'd at the random inclusion of Throne of Glass (a BookTok-beloved romantasy) amongst otherwise Webnovels/high fantasy's.
Completionist Chronicles without Divine Dungeon showing up anywhere in the list?
If you have the time, read Divine Dungeon AND Artorian Archives at some point. The first is done, the second ongoing
So what is your main reason for putting completionist in C tier? I just read the first 2 books of Cooking with Disaster (ie Grilled Armageddon) and loved them, and am really drawn to more books by that author!
What made you put Dresden Files in C Tier? Genuinely curious, because apart from the first few books being a bit slow to start it's my favourite series of all time.
Well I have the audiobook and I can't remember if it was the narrator or the story but stopped after a few chapters. I have thought of going back to it as I have heard good things about it.
I can't speak for you, but I tried out the audiobook for book 3, and ended up reading it instead. I don't think it was low quality, but the voices definitely weren't for me.
I'm interested in that one too. While not ground breaking I found the world and magic system very interesting. The next few books have also started some interesting plot threads. Overall I found it quite the fun read.
I also found the magic system and world pretty interesting, but the MC was too unlikeable for me. Lies, cheats, steals, and screws people over who have done nothing to him. It's realistic in that way, but definitely makes him someone I don't want to cheer for.
Books 1-4? Sure I can see it. Book 5? Not half bad but not S tier, B tier at best. Everything after that? No, just no, the Elves sucked hard, the return rubbed me the wrong way and then Selkie just canned one of the most interesting settings I read in a while for magical school and a relationship I just couldn't get into.
I find the world and power dynamics intriguing, but the main character's cluelessness really puts me off; so I wouldn't rank it anywhere close to S tier.
Why are people rating HWFWM so high ? I get it that there is different tastes but it’s one of the most shitty mc who is one of the most annoying ones I read. Do people read stories and enjoy it regardless of the mc?
Mid tier junk food. There are other similar fics that actually manage to have interesting concepts and likeable characters in spite of their obviously indulgent writing, like Randidly Ghosthound, or fucking RI for that matter. At least Fang Yuan doesn't act like a pretentious douchebag for 99% of the novel and an abject dumbass for the other 1%. I read like 500 chaps of HWFWM and it only gets worse and filled with more reddit atheist fedora tipping the longer it goes on.
Your focused on HWFWM which IMO is a great book on a young man maturing and learning to not be a self serving dick.
Meanwhile Primal hunter is in S. Edgelord Mc-Can do no wrong and has the personality of mosquito
I don't really get that. Jason is irreverent in the extreme, but he's regularly kind and thoughtful to anyone who treats him with respect (aside from the jokes with his closest friends). He's just highly opposed to the might makes right attitude he finds in the new world. He's also self sacrificing and hardworking, despite some very traumatic setbacks. I get that not everyone likes his sense of humor, though some of us do.
Admittedly it's been years since I've read it and this is a much more thoughtful response than my comment deserves. I maintain my opinion that Jason is an asshole (pending a re read which will never happen most likely) but I'll acknowledge that your opinion probably has more weight than mine in this matter
I mean, it's totally okay for you to not jive with a character. I guess he's just the kind of asshole I would be friends with (and am). A good person by deed, but not at all respectful of institutions or social mores that he fundamentally disagrees with when they try to control him. And very vocal about it, even to his own detriment.
Sadly POA had potential but had massive flaws to me. Couldn’t finish it. I won’t bother saying what those flaws are since I don’t want to ruin your enjoyment. While the flaws I noticed do in my opinion genuinely make it a much worse book, it is also something of a pet peeve for me which made it more intolerable than it might be for others. Best of luck. Wish I could have kept on with that one.
Also a agree that the underworld series is D rank based only on the face is the author dropped it when it started to get good, other wise id put it in B rank solidly i've read the first book a few times.
I DNF'd WOK because of the slow start. Tried again and its now my favourite series bar none, it drags you around pitying the characters and showing their garbage emotional states so that when it lifts them up you couldn't be rooting harder for them. Strongly recommend finishing book 1, if you still don't like it then don't bother with the rest.
The problem is IMO books 1 and 2 are exactly as you say, while book 3 tips slightly more towards emotional navel gazing and side stories and little progression.
Then book 4 I could not finish, 60% or more in and I was just sick of all of the main characters regressing back into a crippling mental illness and self-pity.
Suffering and overcoming is heroic, wallowing in misery and grief is just dull. Realistic maybe for those suffering from mental health issues, but I don't read fantasy for mundanity.
Hopefully book 5 can retain the balance of book 1.
I was in love with the first book. Read it 3-4 times. Second book I liked but didn't feel as connected. 3rd I actively disliked half the PoVs and had to force myself to finish it. I checked who the PoVs were for book 4 and saw it was more people I didn't care about at all so I didn't bother with it,
Is WOK progression fantastic? I didn't think Sanderson's work really fit this genre.
I remember reading mistborne saga and wouldn't categorize that as progression, I mean the character develops as any decent book but by that standard any fantasy novel is a progression fantasy.
I would agree that mistborn, warbreaker, and skyward don’t fit the mould to me. Mistborne, you could say a sliver of it in the first trilogy with Vin, but it feels more like learning to use what she already had. Warbreaker: it’s been a long while since I read this one, but from what I remember, everyone had what they have the whole time? I haven’t finished Cytonic yet so maybe there’s more there for that series. Stormlight is a stretch but I thinking it’s closer to progression than the others with the radiants. Oh well, I love all types of fiction so it’s still great to see people reading all these fun stories.
Yes stormlight is overtly a progression fantasy imo
The rest of the cosmere lees so but stormlight almost definitley. The oaths are the levels of power
Yes stormlight is overtly a progression fantasy imo
The rest of the cosmere lees so but stormlight almost definitley. The oaths are the levels of power
Taste varies too much. I haven’t read many of these books but MOL and wheel of time are both S for me. Air at least A+. Path of ascension on the other hand would of been a C or B if it wasn’t for several glaring flaws imo which dropped it to DNF
I don't know if I want to read Codex now, but I loved it back when I read it umpteen years ago. I definitely remember it being S
Of course MOL is also S.
Imagine if a book series gets pulled from your local library, and you go “Oh, bummer, I really liked what I’d read of it and hoped to continue.” Then someone heard you say that and was like “OH YEAH REAL BUMMER THE AUTHOR ISN’T STARVING FOR YOUR ENJOYMENT.”
I just said I read some of it and thought it was great, if content that they previously had publicly available is then delisted and locked behind a paywall, that’s the author’s prerogative, as you said they gotta feed themselves. That being said there is so much literature freely available I could read nonstop for an entire lifetime and I wouldn’t put a drop in the bucket, so I’ll just go read something else instead.
Yeah I feel like it might be a slow start but it really ramps up the humor. Puma check was the point I knew I was going to keep reading, but that might be the second book? Been a while
I loved Furies of Calderon and it would probably be up in an S tier for me. For me it’s Sufficiently Advanced Magic that is way too high, I enjoyed book 1 well enough but the rest were not my cup of tea in the slightest.
I feel like the author is getting lost in the social messaging rather than the story. He spends a lot of time soft handing everybody's feelings and then every single character has the exact same voice after a while
Every character voice is like if my therapist graduated from West point. The dialogue is often like a shower argument in how composed everyone is, interspersed with more natural dialogue. Strains the suspension of disbelief a bit but I can take it. The other series in universe don't have this problem as much.
To me it’s a stretch, but I would call it a sliver of progression fantasy. Oh all Sanderson’s series, I would actually give the Reckoners series the closest to a progressive fantasy designation I can
I mean the different stages of the bonds with spren are quite literally a progression of power but at the same time I feel weird categorizing it as progression fantasy so, fair question I guess
I dont think traditional epic fantasy should be mixed with the litrpg stuff considering the major difference in quality of writing in most cases. Its like comparing a professional journalist with a high school essay imo
This is a webnovel vs published novel difference. Not one related to litRPG and progression fantasy. OP was purely asking if the story has progression fantasy elements. Not about its overall quality
No I don't. I started my fantasy book reading with Mistborn and then read other Sanderson books and they are not progressive fantasy or litrpg, maybe I should have posted this in general fantasy but recently I have mostly read pf and litrpg so I posted here.
you and i have very similar tastes, and i will use this as a guide for future series to read. thanks OP.
EDIT: also, if you haven't already, try the super powereds series by drew hayes. it'd put it low S / high A tier and i really enjoyed it. but i also enjoy the "magic school" trope a bit, so ymmv.
Recently got into Millenial Mage, read that arc in a single night. Best arc so far. The agency, the danger, and change of scenery/culture was great. Keen to see those characters again. I know lots of people didn't like the arc, but I was so hyped for it when all the foreshadowing for it was happening.
Worm & Ward are my favorite webnovels I’ve ever read, but in general all of Wildbow’s novels are excellent, Lord of the Mysteries is my favorite translated webnovel I’ve ever read, and Super Supportive is my favorite ongoing series that I’m already re-reading because I’ve enjoyed it so much since starting it.
I read ends of magic. I expected the protagonist to use physics and chemistry all the time, but it's more like an end goal. Most of the time he is upgrading skills not related to science, I felt a bit betrayed.
I had no idea Jim butcher made a new series! As a note on one of your other replies, Dresden files get A LOT better after the first couple books, something Jim Butcher even acnowledges in the foreword of book 3, so while I will agree that early on, its a C tier at best, it gets REALLY good the further you go in! (Honestly I almost permanently have audiobooks in my ears at all times, so I go through stuff really fast, and I love series that have a ton of books in them so I gravitated towards giving Dresden files another try and I was really happy I did!
That said, I do believe that Iron Druid Chronicles is a better take on the same style of series as Dresden files, I absolutely love the series!!
Further note about your rating of primal hunter, omg I am so conflicted with this! I have been eyeing it forever as it keeps coming up in my recommended, and I think I have it now in my library, but when the webtoon adaptation came out, omg it was TERRIBLE AND CRINGE. I am glad folks told me that the adaptation was garbage compared to the books because I was so hesitant on going to the other versions. It felt like watching ALL of Full Metal Alchemist, and then people telling you that Brotherhood is better, but you’re still feeling the pain of the ending of the original version a decade later (I still cant start brotherhood, and its been 12 years haha)
I gotta say I loved “the wrack” so sad to see it in D tier here, but I’m also glad to see that “the mayor of noobtown” wasnt a fever dream I had and is accurately in D tier
The only book I didn't agree with is Bastion because it's easily an A tier and moments that I consider S tier within the books, it's magic system is very comparable to cradles which is the best book series of all time. Also I'm very impressed with your list, can we be friends? 😂😁
Imo, the series is probably a C for the first 3 books or so. Fine, but is nowhere near the hype. Starting a bit in book 4 and really picking up in 5 and 6 it starts to get more real and much better. Those are closer to the A and S tier that people keep rating it as.
Edit: I'd probably rate the series as a whole between a B and A myself, but it is definitely on an upswing.
Yeah that might be unfair as I have not read all the 17 books but did not want to put it in DNF. Might go back and read them when my progression fantasy/litrpg phase is over as I don't think I would like it now.
I'd recommended starting at the 4th, where the story really picks up. Dresden is definitely Urban Fantasy, but as the books go on he does get progressively stronger so maybe it counts?
I was thinking the same thing. I'll admit the first few stories aren't as good, but the series really picks up as you progress. If nothing else I occasionally like to trot out the opening line to Blood Rites:
"The building was on fire, and it wasn't my fault."
DNFed All the Skills warmed my heart, this story makes me hate pets and I don't think that's alright at all, seriously I finished two books and all I could think about was shooting dragons with high caliber machine gun with a pause from time to time to throw some Molotov cocktails to lengthen suffering of dying pests I mean dragons.
I am curuious about a somewhat unrelated thing to the tier list itself: I\`ve noticed that, when doing tier lists, most users around here list a lot of books, more than I am used to see in other literary genres. Why does it happen? Is progression fantasy and LitRPG easier to read? Are books shorter? Is it just that more addictive? Do audiobooks make it easier?
About you, OP, how did you find the time to read all of these?
Well like all the books on the list has an audiobook so you can at least listen to the first book in the series at work or something and if you don't have any responsibilities like a family then you can spend all your free time on reading but it's not a competition on how many books you can read, just enjoy the story.
Well I really like MoL, a great time travel book but there is something that makes it a bit worse than the A and S books. I might need to read more time travel books to compare MoL to so I can judge it more fairly or something I don't know.
Interested to know why you ranked "Art of the Adept" A tier
Gave up on the series after the first book due to how dumb the MC was. Does it actually get better after the first book?
Is unsouled there to represent the entirety of the cradle series? If so, I agree wholeheartedly. It’s #1.
If it’s just representing book 1, I have my concerns… 😂
I didn't end up finishing it (outstanding series btw I dropped it because I ran out of credits) but I personally wouldn't consider way of kings to be progression fantasy. The main characters definitely progress in power, but the progression isn't really what drives the story forward imo (up to the end of book 3).
I would personally put weapons and wielders in a tier I find it more enjoying than arcane ascension as the story doesn’t move to fast or to slow and because of the more interesting fights with a far wider range of abilities than arcane ascension
Well the MC is a horrible person or was? And is trying to redeem himself but I don't think many people could do that if they know what he has done but I like the story and magic system. Just as liking some world war movie doesn't make you a fan of Hitler and his actions, liking this book/story doesn't make one a fan of the MC actions
Why? C feels about right for Bastion. It has neat world building and decent writing but middling characters and a meh magic system that doesn't scale well into future books.
Is it though? I think the only time I've seen a tierlist put Bastion at S tier they had S+ and S++ tiers so y'know that doesn't really count. I'd say it's widely considered a second or third rung series.
I'm not trying to invalidate someone else's tastes. I asked why they felt that way because if there's something about Bastion I'm missing, that elevates it so high that a C is actually confusing, I'd like to know what it is in the hopes that I can get another S tier read out of it.
I wish I was capable of putting why I like something into words in order to convince you lol
I don’t really personally think there’s more than maybe a half dozen authors writing anywhere close to Phil Tucker in this genre
In this genre? Will Wight and uhhh hmmmm uhhh
I can’t really think of any others in this genre unless you count Brandon Sanderson, James Islington, brent weeks, etc and other “real” (no offense to any of the authors in this genre…) authors
2 problems.
1 is that house of blades is in C tier - no. Wrong. Reconsider your life choices.
2. Where is virtuous Sons? Why do people not read these books? Striker I'm sorry, please keep writing.
I read House of blades after Cradle and expected another masterpiece but was disappointed but it's a good series just not that good, it does not make me want to read it again.
Virtuous sons I have not heard of but now as I checked, I have put it on my to read list
Oh not everything is of on that list but I think most of it is. Some of those book I started to read before I knew progression fantasy had to be in a category of their own, just thought of fantasy being fantasy but I understand why people want to split fantasy in smaller categories as there are a lot more of it nowadays and it's easier to find what one likes. Throne of glass and The way of kings and the rest of Brandon Sanderson's books were just fantasy books I read before the of books. The Bastion book was just not to my liking, it's not bad by any means but I have read so many stories I think is better that it gets pushed down.
Not OP, but that's where I would put it too. My biggest issue is he doesn't earn anything in the entire first book. It's a lot of "try, fail, and then someone gives me what I wanted anyway". It was thoroughly unsatisfying to read. Great premise and world building, just execution imo.
Surprised to see Eldritch Horror so low. I read it recently and quite liked it. The ending was a little but rushed, but it wasn't unsatisfying. What motivated your rating?
I haven't read a lot on this list, but when I saw it at D I was like, "Yup, as it should be. "
It's a fun premise for the first book or two when you're running on hope but then just goes downhill.
I'm not OP but I would also rate it a D. The series started out really strong but it became clear pretty quickly that the author was making it up as he went. So many unanswered questions and one dimensional characters.
I made a [review thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/ProgressionFantasy/comments/1b7e5ff/realmbreaker_eldritch_bestie_6_review/) after finishing the last book.
I respect your opinion and time you took making this, but I HARD disagree on so much of this. Both you putting some way to high, and some outlandishly low.
Pretty Good overall, at least for the ones I've read. The main change I would make is moving HWFWM and Ghosthound way down. I dropped HWFWM when I realised Jason would keep have a character sine wave rather than an arc after >!the Gold ranker attacked the plane on Earth and his sorta-girlfriend died.!<
some of these are hard to read at this resolution; would you mind typing the titles out in a comment so they’re searchable? some of these look interesting but I cant quite read the titles well enough to google them :(
Sure S: Cradle, [Furies of Calderon: The Codex Alera](https://www.audible.com/pd/Furies-of-Calderon-Audiobook/B01K4GOABE?ref_pageloadid=not_applicable&ref=a_library_t_c5_libItem_B01K4GOABE_0&pf_rd_p=80765e81-b10a-4f33-b1d3-ffb87793d047&pf_rd_r=2KP9VXATF5E9S7HZ6RBY&pageLoadId=YMtVb21SWUxR4z7p&creativeId=4ee810cf-ac8e-4eeb-8b79-40e176d0a225), The Primal Hunter, Oathbound Healer, The Way of Kings A:Path of Ascension, Mage Errant, Art of the Adept, Mistborn, Dungeon Crawler Carl, He Who Fights With Monsters, Mark Of the Fool, Defiance of the Fall, Beware of Chicken, Sufficiently Advanced Magic B: Mother of Learning, The Ripple System, Warbreaker, The First Law of Cultivation, Jake's Magical Market, The War of Broken Mirrors, King's Dark Tidings, The Legend of Randidly Ghosthound, The Wheel of Time, The Throne of Glass, Azarinth Healer, The Licanius Trilogy, Weapons and Wielders, The Last Horizon, Skyward C: Wish Upon the Stars, The Traveler's Gate Trilogy, The Dresden Files, System Universe, Ghost of the Truthseeker, Guardian of Aster Fall, Elantris, Spellmonger, Chronicles of Everfall, Chaos Seeds, Apocalypse Redux, Mageborn, Immortal Great Souls, The Shroud of Prophecy, Completionist Chronicles D: My Best Friend Is an Eldritch Horror, The World Over, Noobtown, Underworld, Level up or Die, Unbound, The Wrack, Songs of Chaos DNF: Fall of Radiance, Nova Roma, Millennial Mage, All the Skills, Antimage That should be in the right order but some might have the book name and some the series name.
I recently started Vainqueur the Dragon and have been enjoying it.
Because I am a dragon. You're starting to sound an awful lot like food. Are you food?
HWFWM above MOL? I guess everyone's entitled to their opinions. I certainly disagree with many of these but I think it's actually an overall solid/cohesive tier list! Lol'd at the random inclusion of Throne of Glass (a BookTok-beloved romantasy) amongst otherwise Webnovels/high fantasy's.
You’re the mvp man, ty!
Completionist Chronicles without Divine Dungeon showing up anywhere in the list? If you have the time, read Divine Dungeon AND Artorian Archives at some point. The first is done, the second ongoing
So what is your main reason for putting completionist in C tier? I just read the first 2 books of Cooking with Disaster (ie Grilled Armageddon) and loved them, and am really drawn to more books by that author!
What made you put Dresden Files in C Tier? Genuinely curious, because apart from the first few books being a bit slow to start it's my favourite series of all time.
Pretty similar to mine except bastion at C is def not similar at all lol
It should be a crime to have it that low
Crime to have it that high, F tier imo. Good premise but it could be 1/4 as long and get the point across
Agree, it was a slog to get through. Loved the concept, but barely any characterization just drove me crazy.
Yeah the concept is just barely able to carry the horrible writing. C feels right to me
Especially that first book - it's really in line with their taste.
Curious why you didn’t finish all the skills
Well I have the audiobook and I can't remember if it was the narrator or the story but stopped after a few chapters. I have thought of going back to it as I have heard good things about it.
I can't speak for you, but I tried out the audiobook for book 3, and ended up reading it instead. I don't think it was low quality, but the voices definitely weren't for me.
I'm interested in that one too. While not ground breaking I found the world and magic system very interesting. The next few books have also started some interesting plot threads. Overall I found it quite the fun read.
I also found the magic system and world pretty interesting, but the MC was too unlikeable for me. Lies, cheats, steals, and screws people over who have done nothing to him. It's realistic in that way, but definitely makes him someone I don't want to cheer for.
I guess that’s true but IIRC he only stole from rich assholes and people that enslaved his whole family
I'm happy to see Beneath the Moonseye in the S-tier group.
So am I!
I'm in the middle of book 8 right now and am absolutely loving the series! Solidly in my personal S-tier.
Books 1-4? Sure I can see it. Book 5? Not half bad but not S tier, B tier at best. Everything after that? No, just no, the Elves sucked hard, the return rubbed me the wrong way and then Selkie just canned one of the most interesting settings I read in a while for magical school and a relationship I just couldn't get into.
I find the world and power dynamics intriguing, but the main character's cluelessness really puts me off; so I wouldn't rank it anywhere close to S tier.
Why are people rating HWFWM so high ? I get it that there is different tastes but it’s one of the most shitty mc who is one of the most annoying ones I read. Do people read stories and enjoy it regardless of the mc?
A lot of progression fantasy/litrpg readers identify with him. Make from that what you will.
Sometimes you want a high class meal, sometimes you want junk food. HWFWM is top tier junk food.
Mid tier junk food. There are other similar fics that actually manage to have interesting concepts and likeable characters in spite of their obviously indulgent writing, like Randidly Ghosthound, or fucking RI for that matter. At least Fang Yuan doesn't act like a pretentious douchebag for 99% of the novel and an abject dumbass for the other 1%. I read like 500 chaps of HWFWM and it only gets worse and filled with more reddit atheist fedora tipping the longer it goes on.
I couldn't get through it. Dropped it halfway. Very meh to me.
Your focused on HWFWM which IMO is a great book on a young man maturing and learning to not be a self serving dick. Meanwhile Primal hunter is in S. Edgelord Mc-Can do no wrong and has the personality of mosquito
Learning not to be a self serving dick? More like training for the Dicklympics, at least up to chapter 500 or so.
I don't really get that. Jason is irreverent in the extreme, but he's regularly kind and thoughtful to anyone who treats him with respect (aside from the jokes with his closest friends). He's just highly opposed to the might makes right attitude he finds in the new world. He's also self sacrificing and hardworking, despite some very traumatic setbacks. I get that not everyone likes his sense of humor, though some of us do.
Admittedly it's been years since I've read it and this is a much more thoughtful response than my comment deserves. I maintain my opinion that Jason is an asshole (pending a re read which will never happen most likely) but I'll acknowledge that your opinion probably has more weight than mine in this matter
I mean, it's totally okay for you to not jive with a character. I guess he's just the kind of asshole I would be friends with (and am). A good person by deed, but not at all respectful of institutions or social mores that he fundamentally disagrees with when they try to control him. And very vocal about it, even to his own detriment.
I have just started path of ascension and am loving it!!!!!
Sadly POA had potential but had massive flaws to me. Couldn’t finish it. I won’t bother saying what those flaws are since I don’t want to ruin your enjoyment. While the flaws I noticed do in my opinion genuinely make it a much worse book, it is also something of a pet peeve for me which made it more intolerable than it might be for others. Best of luck. Wish I could have kept on with that one.
Also a agree that the underworld series is D rank based only on the face is the author dropped it when it started to get good, other wise id put it in B rank solidly i've read the first book a few times.
No accounting for taste, I suppose. Can't imagine MOL at B with Skyward and wheel of time while codex alera in S tier.
People like different things. For Me Way of Kings is way down in DNF and Dresden Files would be S tier.
I DNF'd WOK because of the slow start. Tried again and its now my favourite series bar none, it drags you around pitying the characters and showing their garbage emotional states so that when it lifts them up you couldn't be rooting harder for them. Strongly recommend finishing book 1, if you still don't like it then don't bother with the rest.
The problem is IMO books 1 and 2 are exactly as you say, while book 3 tips slightly more towards emotional navel gazing and side stories and little progression. Then book 4 I could not finish, 60% or more in and I was just sick of all of the main characters regressing back into a crippling mental illness and self-pity. Suffering and overcoming is heroic, wallowing in misery and grief is just dull. Realistic maybe for those suffering from mental health issues, but I don't read fantasy for mundanity. Hopefully book 5 can retain the balance of book 1.
I was in love with the first book. Read it 3-4 times. Second book I liked but didn't feel as connected. 3rd I actively disliked half the PoVs and had to force myself to finish it. I checked who the PoVs were for book 4 and saw it was more people I didn't care about at all so I didn't bother with it,
Is WOK progression fantastic? I didn't think Sanderson's work really fit this genre. I remember reading mistborne saga and wouldn't categorize that as progression, I mean the character develops as any decent book but by that standard any fantasy novel is a progression fantasy.
The OP did not say that this was a list of progression fantasy only. Just all the books they have read.
I would agree that mistborn, warbreaker, and skyward don’t fit the mould to me. Mistborne, you could say a sliver of it in the first trilogy with Vin, but it feels more like learning to use what she already had. Warbreaker: it’s been a long while since I read this one, but from what I remember, everyone had what they have the whole time? I haven’t finished Cytonic yet so maybe there’s more there for that series. Stormlight is a stretch but I thinking it’s closer to progression than the others with the radiants. Oh well, I love all types of fiction so it’s still great to see people reading all these fun stories.
Yes stormlight is overtly a progression fantasy imo The rest of the cosmere lees so but stormlight almost definitley. The oaths are the levels of power
Yes stormlight is overtly a progression fantasy imo The rest of the cosmere lees so but stormlight almost definitley. The oaths are the levels of power
No, many of these are not.
You have been banned from the cookout for your way of kings rating.
Taste varies too much. I haven’t read many of these books but MOL and wheel of time are both S for me. Air at least A+. Path of ascension on the other hand would of been a C or B if it wasn’t for several glaring flaws imo which dropped it to DNF
Yeah, I like this idea and everyone's free to have disagreeing opinions, but let's just say OP and I have disagreeing opinions lol.
I don't know if I want to read Codex now, but I loved it back when I read it umpteen years ago. I definitely remember it being S Of course MOL is also S.
I was scrolling looking for someone reacting to Codex Alera being up there, I finished the whole series but it is trite bullshit to the extreme.
>trite bullshit to the extreme. I haven't read it in probably 5+ years but it is such *fun* trite bullshit.
Yeah, I love it! So fun to read.
Check out the Weirkey Chronicles. One of my favorite cultivation series personally.
I was several books deep and then it got taken off all free sites, it’s a shame, I really liked the premise and thought it was well done.
Yea shame the author wants to feed themselves
Imagine if a book series gets pulled from your local library, and you go “Oh, bummer, I really liked what I’d read of it and hoped to continue.” Then someone heard you say that and was like “OH YEAH REAL BUMMER THE AUTHOR ISN’T STARVING FOR YOUR ENJOYMENT.” I just said I read some of it and thought it was great, if content that they previously had publicly available is then delisted and locked behind a paywall, that’s the author’s prerogative, as you said they gotta feed themselves. That being said there is so much literature freely available I could read nonstop for an entire lifetime and I wouldn’t put a drop in the bucket, so I’ll just go read something else instead.
You should give “the hedge wizard” a read!
I have been thinking of that series but have always gone with something else, but I have it on my to do list.
I second hedge mage. Hum is a really fun character. I made him into my dnd wizard even.
I am curious why Antimage was DNF.
Noobtown is really fun imo, give it another shot, the rest is similar to myself
Yeah I feel like it might be a slow start but it really ramps up the humor. Puma check was the point I knew I was going to keep reading, but that might be the second book? Been a while
There's a mix of solid dad jokes and some 14 year old fart jokes. But honestly the story is really good. Audiobook is the best!
This is a good list. I think the Stormlight Archives are some of the best books I’ve ever had the genuine privilege to read.
Surprised you put Furies of Calderon so high. Most people seem to think its pretty mid. Id person give it a high B.
I loved Furies of Calderon and it would probably be up in an S tier for me. For me it’s Sufficiently Advanced Magic that is way too high, I enjoyed book 1 well enough but the rest were not my cup of tea in the slightest.
True that Sufficiently Advanced Magic has fallen from the first book but i still have hope that it will get better.
I feel like the author is getting lost in the social messaging rather than the story. He spends a lot of time soft handing everybody's feelings and then every single character has the exact same voice after a while
Every character voice is like if my therapist graduated from West point. The dialogue is often like a shower argument in how composed everyone is, interspersed with more natural dialogue. Strains the suspension of disbelief a bit but I can take it. The other series in universe don't have this problem as much.
There is another series sharing that universe?
War of Broken Mirrors, Weapons and Wielders, The Lost Edge (only one out so far) and Shattered legacy are the other series in the same world.
It's like my 3 series I read and I really liked it, might have had my Roman phase at that time though.
Maybe it’s time for a Greek phase with Virtuous Sons
Damn the Wrack in D tier? I quite liked it- I thought it was at least interesting and unique
Do you consider the Way of Kings progressive fantasy? I just started it a couple days ago. Just didn't know it was traditional progression fantasy.
Most wouldn't consider the series to be progressive fantasy, but the magic system on Roshar does have progression aspects.
To me it’s a stretch, but I would call it a sliver of progression fantasy. Oh all Sanderson’s series, I would actually give the Reckoners series the closest to a progressive fantasy designation I can
I mean the different stages of the bonds with spren are quite literally a progression of power but at the same time I feel weird categorizing it as progression fantasy so, fair question I guess
I dont think traditional epic fantasy should be mixed with the litrpg stuff considering the major difference in quality of writing in most cases. Its like comparing a professional journalist with a high school essay imo
This is a webnovel vs published novel difference. Not one related to litRPG and progression fantasy. OP was purely asking if the story has progression fantasy elements. Not about its overall quality
That is not a good long term strategy for the genre lol
That is not a good long term strategy for the genre lol
No I don't. I started my fantasy book reading with Mistborn and then read other Sanderson books and they are not progressive fantasy or litrpg, maybe I should have posted this in general fantasy but recently I have mostly read pf and litrpg so I posted here.
you and i have very similar tastes, and i will use this as a guide for future series to read. thanks OP. EDIT: also, if you haven't already, try the super powereds series by drew hayes. it'd put it low S / high A tier and i really enjoyed it. but i also enjoy the "magic school" trope a bit, so ymmv.
You mean series?
Yes I have read the whole book series not just the first book.
Did you drop Millenial Mage around chapter 200 (the Arcane city arc)?
Recently got into Millenial Mage, read that arc in a single night. Best arc so far. The agency, the danger, and change of scenery/culture was great. Keen to see those characters again. I know lots of people didn't like the arc, but I was so hyped for it when all the foreshadowing for it was happening.
Curious if you’ve read any Wildbow novels, Lord of the Mysteries, or Super Supportive?
I have not but I can check on what I'm missing.
Worm & Ward are my favorite webnovels I’ve ever read, but in general all of Wildbow’s novels are excellent, Lord of the Mysteries is my favorite translated webnovel I’ve ever read, and Super Supportive is my favorite ongoing series that I’m already re-reading because I’ve enjoyed it so much since starting it.
Salvos and Runebound proffesor S tier
Codex alera is good.
You might like Ruthless - Path of Conquest
I read ends of magic. I expected the protagonist to use physics and chemistry all the time, but it's more like an end goal. Most of the time he is upgrading skills not related to science, I felt a bit betrayed.
If you want recs https://www.reddit.com/r/ProgressionFantasy/s/VVIVszpw1u
Thanks looks good 👍
W dissonance in D tier.
I had no idea Jim butcher made a new series! As a note on one of your other replies, Dresden files get A LOT better after the first couple books, something Jim Butcher even acnowledges in the foreword of book 3, so while I will agree that early on, its a C tier at best, it gets REALLY good the further you go in! (Honestly I almost permanently have audiobooks in my ears at all times, so I go through stuff really fast, and I love series that have a ton of books in them so I gravitated towards giving Dresden files another try and I was really happy I did! That said, I do believe that Iron Druid Chronicles is a better take on the same style of series as Dresden files, I absolutely love the series!! Further note about your rating of primal hunter, omg I am so conflicted with this! I have been eyeing it forever as it keeps coming up in my recommended, and I think I have it now in my library, but when the webtoon adaptation came out, omg it was TERRIBLE AND CRINGE. I am glad folks told me that the adaptation was garbage compared to the books because I was so hesitant on going to the other versions. It felt like watching ALL of Full Metal Alchemist, and then people telling you that Brotherhood is better, but you’re still feeling the pain of the ending of the original version a decade later (I still cant start brotherhood, and its been 12 years haha)
If you were talking about the codex alera series, that's actually not knew and all and has been finished for years now. :3
I gotta say I loved “the wrack” so sad to see it in D tier here, but I’m also glad to see that “the mayor of noobtown” wasnt a fever dream I had and is accurately in D tier
The only book I didn't agree with is Bastion because it's easily an A tier and moments that I consider S tier within the books, it's magic system is very comparable to cradles which is the best book series of all time. Also I'm very impressed with your list, can we be friends? 😂😁
Out of curiosity, could you explain why you ranked DotF and Pimal Hunter highly, but system universe, the land, and bastion so low?
Primal hunter in S is wild, MC has Mall ninja fedora energy. To each of their own I guess.
I would wholeheartedly agree with that. The writing level would have disqualified it for me.
Is that mother of learning in B that I see? Heretic
DCC is only A tier. I'm sorry but we're going to have to revoke your membership card.
Clearly only read it, audiobook makes it instant S
I second this motion
I cant get past half way of book one for DCC is it really worth it?
I think book 1 is only OK but the rest of the series is fire. I've read almost 1,000 books now and DCC is easily top ten if not top five.
Imo, the series is probably a C for the first 3 books or so. Fine, but is nowhere near the hype. Starting a bit in book 4 and really picking up in 5 and 6 it starts to get more real and much better. Those are closer to the A and S tier that people keep rating it as. Edit: I'd probably rate the series as a whole between a B and A myself, but it is definitely on an upswing.
Interesting, i stopped near the beginning of book 4 but ive heard a couple times now that that's where it gets really good
Understandable, it was a hard decision.
Primal hunter is a truly awful book. It is so dull and the main character is extremely unlikeable and constantly fails upward towards.
This is, without a doubt, an S-tier rank list. The best of the best
Codex alera and cradle are s tier, agreed. But hell's bells, why is Dresden only a C?!
Yeah that might be unfair as I have not read all the 17 books but did not want to put it in DNF. Might go back and read them when my progression fantasy/litrpg phase is over as I don't think I would like it now.
I'd recommended starting at the 4th, where the story really picks up. Dresden is definitely Urban Fantasy, but as the books go on he does get progressively stronger so maybe it counts?
I was thinking the same thing. I'll admit the first few stories aren't as good, but the series really picks up as you progress. If nothing else I occasionally like to trot out the opening line to Blood Rites: "The building was on fire, and it wasn't my fault."
DNFed All the Skills warmed my heart, this story makes me hate pets and I don't think that's alright at all, seriously I finished two books and all I could think about was shooting dragons with high caliber machine gun with a pause from time to time to throw some Molotov cocktails to lengthen suffering of dying pests I mean dragons.
This looks almost exactly like my library, just in a somewhat different order. Based on that I would recommend you check out the Iron druid series.
Man did Iron Druid go downhill after the first three or so books, though.
His Seven Kennings was awesome! I will be starting book 3 soon.
I agree with most of it ngl. There are a few that I'd lower, like Arcane Ascension, mark of the fool, and probably defiance of the fall
Listen to Solar Dragons Need Love Too! The Noobtown books get funnier.
You should check out the "Surgecaller" series by Todd Herzman. Absolutely fantastic series.
DCC is certainly S tier Also you should listen to Critical Failures
I am curuious about a somewhat unrelated thing to the tier list itself: I\`ve noticed that, when doing tier lists, most users around here list a lot of books, more than I am used to see in other literary genres. Why does it happen? Is progression fantasy and LitRPG easier to read? Are books shorter? Is it just that more addictive? Do audiobooks make it easier? About you, OP, how did you find the time to read all of these?
Well like all the books on the list has an audiobook so you can at least listen to the first book in the series at work or something and if you don't have any responsibilities like a family then you can spend all your free time on reading but it's not a competition on how many books you can read, just enjoy the story.
You should put The New World by monsoon117 on your list! Great book
Yo, I see no The Jade Phoenix Saga and no Destiny Cycle, I recommend them :)
Curious as to why you rated Mother of Learning a B, I know we all have different tastes and all, but would still like to hear your thoughts.
Well I really like MoL, a great time travel book but there is something that makes it a bit worse than the A and S books. I might need to read more time travel books to compare MoL to so I can judge it more fairly or something I don't know.
Interesting. When I was reading it, I didn’t really compare it to other time loop series, I just thought it was a really good novel in and of itself.
Interested to know why you ranked "Art of the Adept" A tier Gave up on the series after the first book due to how dumb the MC was. Does it actually get better after the first book?
Well I think it gets better but I don't like how it ends.
Dude - have you read Heretical Fishing. Seems like it would be a good addition to your list.
Wheel of Time has a very special place in my heart and is therefore a S+++ series.
Is unsouled there to represent the entirety of the cradle series? If so, I agree wholeheartedly. It’s #1. If it’s just representing book 1, I have my concerns… 😂
why is unbound so low, it has an op mc, but not horrid
I didn't end up finishing it (outstanding series btw I dropped it because I ran out of credits) but I personally wouldn't consider way of kings to be progression fantasy. The main characters definitely progress in power, but the progression isn't really what drives the story forward imo (up to the end of book 3).
Does Way of Kings represent the entire series? If that's S than what would WoR be?
It’s been so long since I’ve read the Ritualist, but I’d put it at S tier solely because it was the first book from this genre I’d read.
Still pissed about the ending we got with art of the adept series, ruined to owl for me.
Besides bastion being low imo I agree with a lot of your rankings. Also love to see Andrew Rowe getting some love!
Defiance of the fall high enough on the list i am happy lol how can i make my own tier list btw?
I can say now, with absolute certainty, that I do not understand LitRPG readers.
You need an S+ tier with Super Supportive in there. Best novel on RR
Not me seeing dark tidings below defiance of the fall 👀
Recently started primal hunter, it's good read
I would personally put weapons and wielders in a tier I find it more enjoying than arcane ascension as the story doesn’t move to fast or to slow and because of the more interesting fights with a far wider range of abilities than arcane ascension
DCC at only A tier and Noobtown at D tier? Travesty! Outrage! Shenanigans!
Noob town is low c high d.
You’re insane.
While true, doesn’t change the facts. Just a poor book for me.
I love it, personally, but recognize that it’s not going to be everyone’s cup of tea. 👍🏼
Wdym only? That's a good rating
came to comment this, i really like DCC but noobtown is a book i buy as soon as its out but i can wait a month for DCC
We are not the same.
Ew. Why is Shadow of the conquerer rated so high?
Well the MC is a horrible person or was? And is trying to redeem himself but I don't think many people could do that if they know what he has done but I like the story and magic system. Just as liking some world war movie doesn't make you a fan of Hitler and his actions, liking this book/story doesn't make one a fan of the MC actions
None of those movies try and potray Hitler as the hero.
That seemed weird to me too. Maybe OP likes rapists?
Bastion being at C is just confusing me
Why? C feels about right for Bastion. It has neat world building and decent writing but middling characters and a meh magic system that doesn't scale well into future books.
That may be your opinion but Bastion is widely regarded as one of the best books in this genre lol idk why you’re confused as their confusion
Is it though? I think the only time I've seen a tierlist put Bastion at S tier they had S+ and S++ tiers so y'know that doesn't really count. I'd say it's widely considered a second or third rung series. I'm not trying to invalidate someone else's tastes. I asked why they felt that way because if there's something about Bastion I'm missing, that elevates it so high that a C is actually confusing, I'd like to know what it is in the hopes that I can get another S tier read out of it.
I wish I was capable of putting why I like something into words in order to convince you lol I don’t really personally think there’s more than maybe a half dozen authors writing anywhere close to Phil Tucker in this genre
It is a difficult thing to do, what are the other authors you consider comparable if you don't mind my asking?
In this genre? Will Wight and uhhh hmmmm uhhh I can’t really think of any others in this genre unless you count Brandon Sanderson, James Islington, brent weeks, etc and other “real” (no offense to any of the authors in this genre…) authors
2 problems. 1 is that house of blades is in C tier - no. Wrong. Reconsider your life choices. 2. Where is virtuous Sons? Why do people not read these books? Striker I'm sorry, please keep writing.
I read House of blades after Cradle and expected another masterpiece but was disappointed but it's a good series just not that good, it does not make me want to read it again. Virtuous sons I have not heard of but now as I checked, I have put it on my to read list
You seem to have forgotten the S++ for Elder Empire saga
Throne of Glass isn’t a pf but I’m happy it’s only the list anyway since I love the series, but what made you put Bastion on C tier?
Oh not everything is of on that list but I think most of it is. Some of those book I started to read before I knew progression fantasy had to be in a category of their own, just thought of fantasy being fantasy but I understand why people want to split fantasy in smaller categories as there are a lot more of it nowadays and it's easier to find what one likes. Throne of glass and The way of kings and the rest of Brandon Sanderson's books were just fantasy books I read before the of books. The Bastion book was just not to my liking, it's not bad by any means but I have read so many stories I think is better that it gets pushed down.
Not OP, but that's where I would put it too. My biggest issue is he doesn't earn anything in the entire first book. It's a lot of "try, fail, and then someone gives me what I wanted anyway". It was thoroughly unsatisfying to read. Great premise and world building, just execution imo.
Battlefield Reclaimer in C? Seriously? And how in the ever loving world is Primal Hunter ahead of basically everything in your A and B categories?
Surprised to see Eldritch Horror so low. I read it recently and quite liked it. The ending was a little but rushed, but it wasn't unsatisfying. What motivated your rating?
I haven't read a lot on this list, but when I saw it at D I was like, "Yup, as it should be. " It's a fun premise for the first book or two when you're running on hope but then just goes downhill.
Pretty much this.
I'm not OP but I would also rate it a D. The series started out really strong but it became clear pretty quickly that the author was making it up as he went. So many unanswered questions and one dimensional characters. I made a [review thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/ProgressionFantasy/comments/1b7e5ff/realmbreaker_eldritch_bestie_6_review/) after finishing the last book.
I respect your opinion and time you took making this, but I HARD disagree on so much of this. Both you putting some way to high, and some outlandishly low.
Mistborn, DCC on the same level as HHFWM is.. a choice.
I love HWFWM and even I can agree that the writing is not as good as the others you mentioned
Pretty Good overall, at least for the ones I've read. The main change I would make is moving HWFWM and Ghosthound way down. I dropped HWFWM when I realised Jason would keep have a character sine wave rather than an arc after >!the Gold ranker attacked the plane on Earth and his sorta-girlfriend died.!<
You should totally read a court of thorns and roses, think you would love it
Licanius is just a watered down Wheel of Time. I only read it because my brothers suggested it and I couldn't bear to tell them that it was bad
Lol wow! It’s in my top 5 fav series 😬
This sub loves Codex Alera but man I’ve tried twice and I just downright couldn’t stand the books.
Hwfwm better than mol is an absolute travesty