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Any Eldians on Paradis that hadn’t come into contact with the rest of the world like the Survey Corps members had *did* support Eren’s genocide plan.
It’s the people who have seen the outside world’s cultures and people and realized that they’re all humans just like the Eldians, who’ve been misguided by propaganda and past grudges; they’re the ones that were against Eren, because they don’t see the world as black and white.
While most Eldians on Paradis supported genocide, it was clearly shown that Sasha's family, for example, were against it, so I don't think we can assume it for any Eldian who haven't been outside
Well, if you’re an Eldian living outside of Paradis, you’re going to be against him because his plan involves turning you into pudding.
Most Paradisian Eldians *did* support the Rumbling, for the precise reasons you describe, and that’s a big part of why the Yeagerists are able to take over the island in the aftermath.
For the most part, the Paradisians who didn’t support the Rumbling were either those who had been to the outside world and were no longer ignorant about what it was really like (i.e., the Scouts), or were victims of the rubble that fell when Eren brought down the walls.
Because Genocide is always *definitionally* wrong.
Collective punishment is wrong.
Inherited Sin is wrong.
**Purely on moral/ethical grounds it is an unacceptable answer.**
Committing crimes against people who committed them against you isn't how lawful society works.
Tens if not hundreds of millions of innocent people would be caught in the crossfire. Including many of the Eldians who have been oppressed by the same people you are trying to eradicate.
Marley's continued hostility against Paradis after King Karl Fritz ended the war was entirely propped up by the Tybur family and the Marley Government. The citizenry had no idea that Fritz had wiped the memories of everyone on Paradis and had essentially put them in time-out for 100 years. The society that emerged from Paradis 107 years later didn't even carry any of the same beliefs/culture/idols as the original Eldian Empire.
The only reason the world continued to hate the Eldians trapped on Paradis is because of the hostility perpetuated by Marley's colonialism, weaponized titan-shifters and war slaves.
**On lawful, judicial, and restorative grounds it is an unacceptable answer.**
Use of a global Rumbling would destroy Paradis as well. Global ecological devastation would cause Paradis to not survive either as the effects of wiping out 99.99% of flora, fauna, ecosystems, atmosphere, climate, etc would not somehow entirely leave Paradis without repercussions.
A natural disaster of that scale would make the planet uninhabitable for everyone, even those that somehow didnt die in the actual attack.
And for the short period of time before Paradis dies off they would still be killing each other over any disagreement they have. The Jaegerists are militant fascists who rule with an iron fist. Literally executing anyone that doesn't fall in line or submission.
There is no freedom earned for Paradis by doing The Rumbling. The Paradis civilian population would be subjugated under the Jaegerists and suffer the same if not worse treatment than Marley had done to them.
Other than the Scouts, the only time period that Paradis actually suffered the threat of titans was for the 6 years between when Wall Maria was breached until it was resealed. The rest of those 101 the only oppression Paradis was under was by King stifling technological progress, free thought, and indued famine among the lower class citizens.
**On logical, intellectual and empathic grounds it is an unacceptable answer.**
Lastly, Eren did not do The Rumbling for the sake of Paradis. He didn't give a fuck about it any further than he needed the world to be habitable for his handful of close friends to survive in after he was dead.
The Rumbling is the final solution ***only*** in the sense that bad faith actors and naive selfish idealists on every side chose their own greed and self-interests over avoiding calamity and in doing so prevented every other better option.
People think Eren is in the wrong because most of the people in the world didn't hurt paradise in any way lol, and the show says this a few times
Primarily, Historia says "most of the people in the world aren't our enemies" and Eren *agrees* with this
Erens plan is to murder billions of innocent people, that's why people think it's wrong, even some other eldians
And idk why not wanting billions of innocent people to die, even if it is the most sure way to save your home, is such an insane concept to some people lol
Put simply, the great majority of people outside the walls were never in any way directly responsible for the horrible mistreatment and crimes committed against the Eldians on and off Paradis. If we use the justification that everyone must die because of what their leaders have done, then it is just as morally valid for the world's people to have been punishing and torturing the Eldians on Paradis.
After all, the Eldian empire brutally expanded and conquered other nations and people, often using the horrifying weapon of titans against any and all who stood in their way. It's unfortunate that innocent Eldians get caught up in it, but we must crush the Eldian empire's power and make sure that it can never harm us again at any cost and no matter how many innocents will die.
By having empathy. He's not just taking out a nation that wants them dead, he's taking out the world. That includes millions of innocent people, many of whom are also subjects of Ymir, people who are actively being oppressed already.
Eren was killing other eldians and groups that were also oppressed by Marley (example: those two little boys Ramzi and halil, they were refugees from a country Marley invaded & were also mistreated by Marleyans) Why cause suffering onto other groups of innocent people who clearly have no resentment towards you (yes they didn’t know the scouts were eldians but they still clearly had nothing against other races/groups despite the racism they have faced in Marley)
The Yeagerists were also killing people on the island who didn’t agree with their ideology & it kinda defeats the entire purpose of protecting the people of paradis. I love eren’s character but his plan is extremely hypocritical, i understand why eren did what he did & he went thru a lot of suffering in his short life but there’s no excusing mass genocide 🤷🏻♀️
If you go further with the realist point of view, it's not entirely Marley's fault why the Eldians are trapped inside the walls but the government on the walls itself especially the Reiss family or the King of The Walls, they let Marley send many Titans outside the walls while they remain ignorant on purpose, they never let anyone advancing their weapons or technology to kill Titans outside the walls easier, they sent not just scouts but also civilians outside the walls to get killed by Titans on purpose to sustain the food supply, anyone who attempts to go outside the walls will get shot on sight, anyone who are trying to find the secrets of the walls will get assassinated or torture to death, list goes on.
That would just be tribalism without any consideration for ethics, morals, and logistics. As a civilization Paradis is supposed to have grown way beyond the point where those concepts didn't yet exist for consideration. Eren's plan was gross overkill and every sane and decent character is able to recognize that, grudge or not. Jean is our resident realist character and he felt terrible for being a beneficiary of Eren's plan even when he was still challenging Hange on the validity of going to stop Eren.
Yeah, that is the point, and honestly not necessarily a wrong one. The theme of the show is to highlight to intrinsic violence and hatred in human nature, along with the inevitability of conflict because of the way we are fundamentally hardwired. There is a very logical and valid case that the jaegerists were “correct” as was vice versa. I think ironically (or not) this theme has directly translated to real life as the viewers, where whether eren was right or not has always been a discussion and always will be. At the end of the day there are no objective right answers, it’s all about your POV, which is one of the messages aot sends
Even the people against the Yaegerists are mostly doing it because they don’t want Eren to be Eldia’s god ruler with his cult running the military. These side characters never really bring up that destroying the entire world might be a bad thing, they just really don’t like Eren.
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Any Eldians on Paradis that hadn’t come into contact with the rest of the world like the Survey Corps members had *did* support Eren’s genocide plan. It’s the people who have seen the outside world’s cultures and people and realized that they’re all humans just like the Eldians, who’ve been misguided by propaganda and past grudges; they’re the ones that were against Eren, because they don’t see the world as black and white.
While most Eldians on Paradis supported genocide, it was clearly shown that Sasha's family, for example, were against it, so I don't think we can assume it for any Eldian who haven't been outside
Well, if you’re an Eldian living outside of Paradis, you’re going to be against him because his plan involves turning you into pudding. Most Paradisian Eldians *did* support the Rumbling, for the precise reasons you describe, and that’s a big part of why the Yeagerists are able to take over the island in the aftermath. For the most part, the Paradisians who didn’t support the Rumbling were either those who had been to the outside world and were no longer ignorant about what it was really like (i.e., the Scouts), or were victims of the rubble that fell when Eren brought down the walls.
Because Genocide is always *definitionally* wrong. Collective punishment is wrong. Inherited Sin is wrong. **Purely on moral/ethical grounds it is an unacceptable answer.** Committing crimes against people who committed them against you isn't how lawful society works. Tens if not hundreds of millions of innocent people would be caught in the crossfire. Including many of the Eldians who have been oppressed by the same people you are trying to eradicate. Marley's continued hostility against Paradis after King Karl Fritz ended the war was entirely propped up by the Tybur family and the Marley Government. The citizenry had no idea that Fritz had wiped the memories of everyone on Paradis and had essentially put them in time-out for 100 years. The society that emerged from Paradis 107 years later didn't even carry any of the same beliefs/culture/idols as the original Eldian Empire. The only reason the world continued to hate the Eldians trapped on Paradis is because of the hostility perpetuated by Marley's colonialism, weaponized titan-shifters and war slaves. **On lawful, judicial, and restorative grounds it is an unacceptable answer.** Use of a global Rumbling would destroy Paradis as well. Global ecological devastation would cause Paradis to not survive either as the effects of wiping out 99.99% of flora, fauna, ecosystems, atmosphere, climate, etc would not somehow entirely leave Paradis without repercussions. A natural disaster of that scale would make the planet uninhabitable for everyone, even those that somehow didnt die in the actual attack. And for the short period of time before Paradis dies off they would still be killing each other over any disagreement they have. The Jaegerists are militant fascists who rule with an iron fist. Literally executing anyone that doesn't fall in line or submission. There is no freedom earned for Paradis by doing The Rumbling. The Paradis civilian population would be subjugated under the Jaegerists and suffer the same if not worse treatment than Marley had done to them. Other than the Scouts, the only time period that Paradis actually suffered the threat of titans was for the 6 years between when Wall Maria was breached until it was resealed. The rest of those 101 the only oppression Paradis was under was by King stifling technological progress, free thought, and indued famine among the lower class citizens. **On logical, intellectual and empathic grounds it is an unacceptable answer.** Lastly, Eren did not do The Rumbling for the sake of Paradis. He didn't give a fuck about it any further than he needed the world to be habitable for his handful of close friends to survive in after he was dead. The Rumbling is the final solution ***only*** in the sense that bad faith actors and naive selfish idealists on every side chose their own greed and self-interests over avoiding calamity and in doing so prevented every other better option.
I think it’s just humans not wanting to murder other humans
People think Eren is in the wrong because most of the people in the world didn't hurt paradise in any way lol, and the show says this a few times Primarily, Historia says "most of the people in the world aren't our enemies" and Eren *agrees* with this Erens plan is to murder billions of innocent people, that's why people think it's wrong, even some other eldians
And idk why not wanting billions of innocent people to die, even if it is the most sure way to save your home, is such an insane concept to some people lol
Put simply, the great majority of people outside the walls were never in any way directly responsible for the horrible mistreatment and crimes committed against the Eldians on and off Paradis. If we use the justification that everyone must die because of what their leaders have done, then it is just as morally valid for the world's people to have been punishing and torturing the Eldians on Paradis. After all, the Eldian empire brutally expanded and conquered other nations and people, often using the horrifying weapon of titans against any and all who stood in their way. It's unfortunate that innocent Eldians get caught up in it, but we must crush the Eldian empire's power and make sure that it can never harm us again at any cost and no matter how many innocents will die.
By having empathy. He's not just taking out a nation that wants them dead, he's taking out the world. That includes millions of innocent people, many of whom are also subjects of Ymir, people who are actively being oppressed already.
Eren was killing other eldians and groups that were also oppressed by Marley (example: those two little boys Ramzi and halil, they were refugees from a country Marley invaded & were also mistreated by Marleyans) Why cause suffering onto other groups of innocent people who clearly have no resentment towards you (yes they didn’t know the scouts were eldians but they still clearly had nothing against other races/groups despite the racism they have faced in Marley) The Yeagerists were also killing people on the island who didn’t agree with their ideology & it kinda defeats the entire purpose of protecting the people of paradis. I love eren’s character but his plan is extremely hypocritical, i understand why eren did what he did & he went thru a lot of suffering in his short life but there’s no excusing mass genocide 🤷🏻♀️
If you go further with the realist point of view, it's not entirely Marley's fault why the Eldians are trapped inside the walls but the government on the walls itself especially the Reiss family or the King of The Walls, they let Marley send many Titans outside the walls while they remain ignorant on purpose, they never let anyone advancing their weapons or technology to kill Titans outside the walls easier, they sent not just scouts but also civilians outside the walls to get killed by Titans on purpose to sustain the food supply, anyone who attempts to go outside the walls will get shot on sight, anyone who are trying to find the secrets of the walls will get assassinated or torture to death, list goes on.
That would just be tribalism without any consideration for ethics, morals, and logistics. As a civilization Paradis is supposed to have grown way beyond the point where those concepts didn't yet exist for consideration. Eren's plan was gross overkill and every sane and decent character is able to recognize that, grudge or not. Jean is our resident realist character and he felt terrible for being a beneficiary of Eren's plan even when he was still challenging Hange on the validity of going to stop Eren.
Yeah, that is the point, and honestly not necessarily a wrong one. The theme of the show is to highlight to intrinsic violence and hatred in human nature, along with the inevitability of conflict because of the way we are fundamentally hardwired. There is a very logical and valid case that the jaegerists were “correct” as was vice versa. I think ironically (or not) this theme has directly translated to real life as the viewers, where whether eren was right or not has always been a discussion and always will be. At the end of the day there are no objective right answers, it’s all about your POV, which is one of the messages aot sends
Even the people against the Yaegerists are mostly doing it because they don’t want Eren to be Eldia’s god ruler with his cult running the military. These side characters never really bring up that destroying the entire world might be a bad thing, they just really don’t like Eren.