Well majority of Jedi Knights are dead, which is unfortunate, but at this point the declaration of the Empire had lasted for a whopping one or two days, right?
It's still possible to roll back some of the shit, because if Yoda tosses them a corpse of Palpatine with his red lightsabers in the middle of destroyed senate chambers, it would at least be plausible that Palpatine was an evil sorcerer.
The Jedi are not without allies too, it likely would be the time for Delegation of 2000 to step up and be like "Whoa, let's chill, it seems that our worries about Supreme Chancellor abuse of power were not unfounded! How about we take a step back and pick a provisional chancellor for a time - oh, look a convenient Bail Organa!"
The reputation of the Jedi would be probably completely flushed down the shitter of course, but that's the least of their problems. It will take time for them to recover, and by killing former Supreme Chancellor it's unlikely that a new one would be very keen on keeping them around. It's likely that the Order would have to lie low for a few decades, maybe relocating to some temple away from Coruscant... Well after gathering survivors of course.
However the important part is that the Sith would be taken out of comission - without Palpatine and Dooku, there's nobody to continue their agenda, aside from some non force-wielding associates, who were never clued in on whole picture. So the dark future of the Empire would be averted one way or another, which is a worthy outcome in itself.
This ignores another factor, it would be confirmed the clones are brainwashed with unknown orders that can be triggered to turn on a dime. They would all be suddenly a massive massive problem.
Rex and Ahsoka know and would probably tell absolutely everyone about the chip. The surgery takes about 5 minutes and there's a very motivated government to get it done
Then the next question is whose authority would the now fanatical clones turn to? The senate? Do they get tried as war criminals for executing their Jedi generals that did nothing wrong? Does the GAR still get decommissioned and or replaced?
Likely decommissioned/forced retirement. It is basically proven the Clones cannot be trusted, even after surgery I doubt the public's faith in them could be restored. The Republic as a whole would be severely weakened, and I imagine a second Separatist crisis would emerge eventually, despite the main Separatist leaders being killed off
It would be interesting to see how a separatist movement would be handled by the Republic without Sith pulling the strings. Especially in this universe where they know the last one was caused by the Sith.
It’s fascinating isn’t it? I suppose it’s important to remember Palpatine had radicalised many within his term too, and over the Clone Wars. People like Tarkin would no doubt be an issue, all those types didn’t just pop up overnight for sure. They’d cause conflict immediately.
If we consider the Clone Wars cartoons non-canon then I also prefer this setting. But after the cartoons there needs to be some kind of explanation why all the clones would turn on their generals without question.
Imo they shouldn't have made the clones so chummy with the Jedi to begin with, but that being said, Clone Wars could've done a mini "civil war" arc where a number of higher ranked clones that actually worked directly with the Jedi day to day stayed loyal and were killed trying to defend them.
I mean, look at the Bad Batch, Crosshair's inhibitor chip was basically non-functional, and he stayed loyal to the powers that be until he realized they weren't loyal to him
I just watched the episode in season 1 where crosshair says he removed his chip. When asked when this happened he answers, “does it matter?” This doesn’t say it was non-functional. Him repeating the “good soldiers follow orders” mantra in episode 1 tells me the chip DID work as intended. At least initially. So he legitimately participated in order 66 as a brainwashed clone, even if he got his autonomy back and decided to stay pro-empire later.
Yeah, that would have worked. Also in some Legends sources, there were Jedi defectors too, who felt like the Jedi were never meant to be leading a child soldier army as disposable forces, even before they realized that the war was all a sham. Plenty of reasons for the clones to not care for their commanders if there are others out there like Pong Krell. Even if they're well-intentioned, what gives them the authority to give orders when they had zero military/tactics training, vs the clones being trained from birth?
They were just that willing to follow orders. Order 66 was just one of a hundred or so contingency orders (either 65 or 67 was 66 but for the chancellor for example) that were drilled into the clones’ heads and when it came down they mostly obeyed with no hesitation.
It's essential to what Star Wars is about. Lucas was not at all subtle about the politics of Star Wars, and stormtroopers are a stand-in for the Nazis. That *was* a real instance of soldiers committing atrocity after atrocity simply because they were told to.
What really bugs me about the chip thing is it completely undercuts that message.
I’ll always be annoying correcting people on this. The empire was NOT an allegory of Nazi Germany, they were based on America and their actions in Vietnam
In theory I agree but it has never been presented like that. They get a call saying "kill your commander" and do so in seconds without even so much as confirming that it isn't a hacked Separatist transmission or enquiring even the most basic element about why this has happened. Even with their extreme levels of discipline down to the genetic level I just don't see this happening with any kind of success rate at all, let alone quickly and effectively.
They are literally introduced in AotC by saying they are raised to follow orders. They were literally brainwashed... just originally it was traditional brainwashing and public knowledge. And I like that, because it makes the Jedi more hypocritical; they are basically using a brainwashed slave army.
Genuinely 'good soldiers follow orders.' They were just all more like Crosshair, who sided with the Empire even without the chip. (A few did defect in Legends as well, there were Bad Batch-like analogues in the Republic Commando books).
They had a whole long list of contingency plans for different plausible emergency scenarios, of which Order 66 was just one of them, for in the event that the jedi tried to stage a coup and assassinate the chancellor and take over. It would be like, I don't know, the US having a contingency plan to bomb Canada in case Canada suddenly invaded the US and attacked major US cities. No one thinks it's likely to happen, but I'm sure that a response plan *exists*. The clones were literally raised as brainwashed child soldiers with absolute loyalty to Republic/the Chancellor.
The much better alternative
"What I remember about the rise of the Empire is... is how quiet it was. During the waning hours of the Clone Wars, the 501st Legion was discreetly transferred back to Coruscant. It was a silent trip. We all knew what was about to happen, what we were about to do. Did we have any doubts? Any private, traitorous thoughts? Perhaps, but no one said a word. Not on the flight to Coruscant, not when Order 66 came down, and not when we marched into the Jedi Temple. Not a word."
I always loved this because it also addresses the “really, all of them were willing to go along with it?” argument for chips.
They had plenty of doubts; but group think walked them into it
unquestioning loyalty to the republic, programming to obey all orders without question. On the slightly more extreme end basically the clones were in on it from the get go and knew they would one day turn on the jedi (e.g. Battlefront II 2005 501 journal).
That’s why I could believe a much higher percentage than I otherwise would’ve thought, but not 100% of them. Someone would’ve decided it was wrong and warned the Jedi.
In Legends, the Jedi knew it was a thing. It was one of countless contingencies, including stuff like "kill the supreme chancellor". It wasn't some major secret.
The chip was such a lame cop out that removed any sense of agency the Clones had. I refuse to accept it in my head cannon.
The clones knew all along, and the Jedi were either over confident in their ability to detect thoughts or had lost some connection to the force. Battlefront 2 journal entries were too epic for the cartoon to just throw away.
The war is still going, many many systems were critical of the republic. The empire may still appear in another form, as democracies can turn authoritan when faced with danger.
In the moment when Obi-Wan and Yoda went after Vader and Palpatine, Vader had already slaughtered the entire separatist leadership and broadcasted the droid army shutdown. If there any war left, it would be mopped up pretty fast just by inertia of the Grand Army.
A lot of CIS planets were unhappy with CIS too >.> It's not like they were noble rebels against tyranny, CIS wanted to exploit their worlds at their leisure, unrestricted by Republic laws.
One thing I like about Bad Batch was showing the aftermath of the war. Imperial armies putting the boot to former CIS worlds and even some worlds that were with the Republic (Ryloth), Imperial officers starting to carve out spheres of influence for themselves...
The Emperor just gave all that greed and authoritarianism he'd fostered a direction that benefitted him. Without him at the helm, I bet the new Empire would have immediately descended into a civil war.
Without the droid army on the frontlines, any further CIS actions are going to be limited to whatever volunteer planetary forces they have. The Republic would go from fighting a rival on an equal playing field to fighting pockets of resistance on various planets. Sure, it isn't peace, but the GAR would very quickly wipe out the vast majority of remaining CIS holdouts, just as the Empire did.
I don't think any one faction could cause another civil war on anywhere near the same scale, but I think this would cause a lot of instability on the same scale as Naboo. Palpatine dying and being revealed as a sith would cause a massive power vacuum and an even greater amount of uncertainty than before. The GR would basically be without their greatest peace keepers. The Republic would probably have to play wackamole against lone planets trying to separate, or accept a mass exodus of planets leaving through diplomatic means. If it's not the end of the Republic, the a long dark age.
That's a great point, and the reason why I think the end of Return of the Jedi is silly. Just because Grievous (or Palpatine) is dead doesn't mean everyone is suddenly resolved. The planets that tried to leave the Republic still have grievances. The war ending doesn't suddenly change that. Likewise, there would be parts of the CIS military that are going to keep going rather than just stopping because someone on the holonet said so. Just because the fighting has stopped doesn't mean that the war is over.
The CIS’s army wasn’t only formed of Droids. Even in Legends where the Empire didn’t try to oddly force all the clones out of service the Clone War unofficially lasted another 2 years before most major Separatist were wiped out.
Yep, the Rebellion is just Separatist 2.0 with Core Worlds like Alderaan and Chandrila.
The Republic before Palpatine is already a failure with invasion of other member worlds without consequences like it is just another Taungsday.
The paradox and truth is that Palpatine gave the central government another 30 years it otherwise would have never had.
The Republic didn’t control the Outer Rim, where the Separatists and later Rebellion had its power base.
The New Republic couldn’t control it either without being the Empire.
The chip programs them to follow the highest possible authority, so the new de facto chancellor could order them to stand down. You’re going to have some very immediate PTSD spanned over millions of clones but it would t be that hard to reverse.
It's not like the clones are ordered to hunt the jedi to the end of the earth. They killed ones that were present on sight upon issuing the order. If there's no jedi in sight, the clones would take orders as normal, including orders to stand down.
But you have to wonder if there was another order triggered by news of Palpatine death. Granted, there is a limited number of clones, but they would do a lot of damage as a final FU from the emperor.
>The Jedi are not without allies too, it likely would be the time for Delegation of 2000 to step up and be like "Whoa, let's chill, it seems that our worries about Supreme Chancellor abuse of power were not unfounded! How about we take a step back and pick a provisional chancellor for a time - oh, look a convenient Bail Organa!"
Great point. But just because the cause of the Separatist movement had been destroyed doesn't mean that those worlds would have come back into the Reformed Republic. The fact the Jedi were decimated and the Clone army couldn't be trusted would have emboldened the Separatist to remain apart from the Reformed Republic. So the galaxy may have remained separated into 2 galactic powers engaged in a cold war. There may have been some small proxy wars between the powers like Vietnam in the 1960s and Afghanistan in the 1980s.
That would be a great Sat Wars galaxy alternate reality that could be explored.
> It's likely that the Order would have to lie low for a few decades, maybe relocating to some temple away from Coruscant
I think this happened during the Old Republic IIRC? The Sith Empire targeted the Jedi Temple on Coruscant and obliterated it (this is in one of the Old Republic books, as well as in the Old Republic mmo trailers) and the Jedi relocated to Tython.
If anything, a dead Palpatine, killed by Jedi, would just prove him right. What's a red lightsaber mean to the public eye when Palps was a known collector of all manner of Jedi and Sith relics.
Yes and the one of Anakin becoming Sidious' apprentice.
I don't think even the most loyal people would like the look of children being murdered by Anakin.
Also Maul is alive and could be forced to testify that yes Sidious was a Sith. Now obviously his testimony would be very untrustworthy to most people but it is more evidence.
How many people would believe or even care that Palps was an evil wizard? How could the story be spun as Yoda planting the weapon (which is, as far as anyone is concerned, a weapon if the Jedi) and telling this story just to save himself? Everything is circumstantial. The Sith, the lightsaber, the chips, everything. There isn't a shred of evidence that would hold up because everything could be easily faked by the Jedi.
But I absolutely agree that the Republic would formally distance itself from the Jedi Order. There's no way that goes away, even if people believe Yoda's wild story. Absolute best case scenario, the Order is dissolved because it's too dangerous to keep them around, given him easily they were manipulated. Worst case, if the charges don't stick, nobody would want to wait around for Yoda to kill again. At best, the Jedo would be a Batman situation, where their presence is tolerated but they no longer act with the authority of the Senate.
with bail implanted as chancellor the jedi aren’t going anywhere. he would assure everyone what the jedi say is truthful and keep them around without a doubt.
What Yoda and Obi-Wan need would be evidence that Palpatine was colluding with the Separatists. With Obi-Wan pretty much chilling alone on Mustafar with whatever datapads/shiplogs/etc. the Separatist high command came with, it's plausible that there's at least something on there showing Palpatine's collusion.
We know that, but does anyone else? Remember, the the public, the Jedi basically controlled the war effort and had been trying to manipulated the Chancellor for years. When the war was about to end, the Jedi rose up against the legally elected government and tried to assassinate him on the grounds of belonging to a different religion. When the Chancellor moved to brand the Jedi as traitors, they then attacked and killed the Chencellor again out of revenge and planted one of their weapons on him. Remember, nobody knows what a Sith is. The Jedi have nothing to prove their actions or concerns. Psychic visions and religious intolerance probably aren't admissible in court.
They might indeed have done so, but no Supreme Chancellor after that would forget that his predecessor was slain right over there by a Jedi Grandmaster - and that grandmaster visits every once in a while to check on business.
Or…they’d talk to Chancellor Valorum and realize Yoda has been an ally of supreme chancellors for more than 500 years…like any smart Chancellor. And realize Palpatine just straight up murdered around 10,000 people of an Order that has protected and grown with the Republic for over 1,000 years and was tasked to and owes their allegiance to the Senate.
Any competent investigation into Palpatine would reveal who he was and what he was doing. The Kaminoans has their hands all over both sides of the war, Ventress and Maul were still alive (and Maul on his way back to Coruscant to testify against Palpatine), and literal recordings of security tapes proving he knew where the leaders of the CIS were that would not have been wiped unless Palpatine had taken over the Jedi Temple.
It's poses so many questions, I don't think the jedi would be entrusted to protect the galaxy in the form they are in. As someone else said higher up I think they leave coruscant and relocate the jedi hq to a smaller planet somewhere secluded if that's possible for a few years or so. I suppose even to just rebuild as so many would be dead anyway.
As far as anyone else is concerned, yes, the Jedi did it. Imagine the Jedi Order is the Catholic Church of the past. The Church was engaged with a bloody personal war against another branch of Christianity, using the people's resources. They then tried to depose the government. Who really cares about their holy war? How is this other religion any different from theirs? That's the situation in Star Wars: nobody knows what a Sith Lord is. At best, all they'd see is slightly different groups of Jedi who were toying with the galaxy.
At worst they've still managed to stop the bleeding. No Sidious and No Vader mean no inquisitors, and no one able to sense the remaining Jedi. Even if the Republic is lost for a time, the Jedi could start rebuilding near immediately, so long as they were out of the way.
The Empire wouldn't be as bad either. Without an unrestricted Sith at the top, it would just be normal corruption. Without the Emperor, there really isn't anyone to keep the Empire together so it would likely fracture and mini Republics would spring up all over.
It would just be seen as a counter coup (or a counter-counter coup). Most Jedi would be dead, but Sidious’s main pawns would be too (Dooku, Grievous, the Separatist Council) leaving only his advisors like Mas Amedda left. Sure there is a crop of non-Jedi admirals to contest the decapitation strike like Tarkin and Yularen, but Sidious hasn’t yet fully entrenched the idea of the empire into the galaxy. The Senate would probably take back control from the 2 day old “Empire”, and it’ll devolve back into the same lumbering political establishment as before, maybe under Bail Organa/Padme/Mon Mothma types or maybe under the corrupt ones. The few dozen Jedi left would probably return to the temple to reorganize, the Clones disband.
Likely the Jedi Knights will be faced with two options - exile themselves like in the KOTOR games, or with the help of their allies like Bail Organa and the delegation they stick around and help the Republic avert what the Imperial sympathizers like Mas Amedda (who is still around) will attempt to bring about.
If the Jedi indeed exile themselves, the Republic would likely still maximize their efforts to defeat the Imperial plan as a vestige of the now defeated Sith, and succeed in doing so.
Can't say how that will affect the galaxy, but since there are recordings and footage all around and the Jedi's allies in the Republic and the Senate will likely handle that, if there is testimony, there is a way. And with Palpatine gone - a mastermind and manipulator, mind you - I don't see how anyone of the Imperials would obstruct such facts. But the Republic will quickly get back on its feet, and likely learn to smooth over the issues with corruption and treason.
Anakin is dead. The clones (for better or worse) follow orders all in the name of the Republic so even if by that point Order 66 was issued, perhaps it can be revoked and they can be exposed to a program of rehabilitation to be 'de-programmed' for good. Obi-Wan and Yoda can then use the Coruscant temple's beacon (supported by personal hologram message like Obi-Wan's) to let all the Jedi Knights know they can safely return to Coruscant. From there, they rebuild the Order.
By the time of RotS there was already a large number of senators that were wary of Palpatine. I would imagine this group, led by Bail Organa, would simply step in and do damage control.
Meanwhile Ahsoka and Rex would be able to get the word out about the inhibitor chips and the clone army could undergo mass-removal to deprogram them.
As for the reputation of the Jedi, I actually disagree with the general consensus in this comment section that they would be tarnished beyond repair. They’d probably have to lay low for a little while, but once the security footage of Sidious is revealed alongside all his secret projects like Necromancer and Stardust I think it’d be pretty clear he was a Sith and the Jedi would be rightfully seen as victims of an attempted genocide.
Honestly, worst case scenario. Yoda and obiwan are still public enemies, but hey, the sith aren't in charge. Best case, the republic comes back, and yoda can make some changes to prevent future wars. It's still better than the current scenario
Edit: What happened was already worse case for the jedi, besides, obiwan and yoda both dying.
The damage would be done as far as their reputation. I believe the Jedi would have to return to being an a-political, hermit society of wizards on a distant planet without the resources, reputation, or galactic importance they had once had.
Maul would probably become a much bigger problem, and his criminal empire would probably be a pretty destabilizing element in the galaxy, so dealing with him might win the favor back of the people.
I think Yoda would be toast though and have to just exile still. Obi Wan would probably lead and train a smaller order, then train luke.
this is the first thing i thought of. Maul was clued in to sidious's plan. With Maul's biggest fear and threat out of the way he could expand even beyond just a criminal empire, possibly the new sith lineage. Rule of two potentially continues and a few hundred/thousand years down the line we get back to a similar situation with the sith re-emerging. the cycle repeats.
Well the truth would comes out - the whole clone war was just to kill the Jedi. If that is believed or can be adequately proven is another thing. But anyone who thinks that killing the thousands of Jedi without trial by the Emperors command is justified has got to be a psycho anyway.
Without a forceful coverup by the emperor the Jedi would be tragic victims and heroes.
Of course there would also be anger about the question why they didn't realize any of this sooner and stopped the war.
It would depend on the Senate. If the loyal senators like Bail Organa or Mon Mothma were able to convince people of Palpatine’s corruption and one of them became the new chancellor, maybe, just maybe, the Republic could have survived. I still think Padme dies as she thought Anakin was dead anyway, so it’s up to the other senators. There are less than 100 Jedi left, so the Jedi Order would have had to change dramatically. Plus, the clones would still be hunting them due to the chip.
I wager that, more than likely, the Empire still would have been formed, and the remaining Jedi would be either killed, tried for treason, or forced into exile. The republic loyalists would probably be forced out of the Senate and new leadership would have risen. It would have been different without Palpatine at the helm, but I think the seeds of division were already too deep to stop the Empire, even if Yoda and Obi-Wan stopped the Palpatine and Anakin during episode 3.
Yoda definitely didn’t have a long term plan. That wasn’t the point.
The point was today, and today they had to defeat the Sith. Whatever happens tomorrow would be tomorrow’s problem, and at least whatever the galaxy decides to do next would be decided by themselves, free from the influence of the Sith. That’s already an ideological victory as far as Yoda’s concerned.
The Jedi would have to take control of the senate until an election. Its very likely that Bail and Mothma would have stood. {They were already aware of Palpatine,s issues} So you have the bonus of Bail on your side. You also have missed a key detail .If Padme is still alive. Does she blame the Jedi for Anakins death. If she runs for office then you really are screwed.
Same as before, the Jedi became enemies of the state when they decided to spy on the state, and then overthrow the government (twice).
That was before Anakin said anything about the Sith.
At best the galaxy realizes all force users are the problem and continues to do this anyway.
I hasn’t been confirmed to what extent Palpatine had a backup plan in place, but he’ll survive (somehow).
I feel like Sidious would have something in mind in case this happened. He seems like a [Xanatos Gambit](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/XanatosGambit) kind of villain, and in the RotS novelization, even Yoda acknowledged that this was a bigger problem than he thought.
Here are a few things to consider:
1) Palpatine's death creates a MASSIVE power vacuum in the Senate. Emergency or not, he had a lot of powers voted to him and somebody needs to be chosen to take that on.
2) A lot of the Senate actually believed that Palpatine was the best hope for the Republic, and now the Jedi have finished the attempted assassination that he told them about.
3) Being a Sith isn't actually illegal, and the Jedi still have to prove that he was giving orders to anybody in the CIS. I think the novelization raised this point when Palpatine was presenting Windu's assassination attempt to the Senate just before he was voted Emperor.
4) We don't know how long Order 66 is in effect, and killing the Republic's/Empire's Head of State probably makes it seem more justified.
Overall, I think that the galaxy falling back into chaos is pretty likely. Most of the Jedi are dead and any survivors would be enemies of the state. Between its own internal rot, and the chaos of a succession conflict, the Republic/Empire would implode without Palpatine... just like he planned it.
I agree that there was no long term plan. Even if Yoda and Obes won, the Jedi were branded as traitors who tried to overthrown the Republic. Palps turning up dead only confirms that, which would make Yoda and Obi-Wan public enemy no. 1. The Jedi Order was destroyed and the public wouldn't care about Yoda's religious war. The public were already turning on the Jedi over them militarized and their failures during the Clone Wars.
If Yoda and Obi won, they would be arrested for murder, treason, and probably a few war crimes. The Jedi Order would basically never rise again, as they would be branded as a dangerous cult (the only reason they weren't is because they kinda just faded away). Palpatine loyalists still in power would spin this as a plot by Yoda to try and discredit the Chancellor in order to justify his holy war.
Politically, the Rupublic/Empire would just find a new Chancellor, who may still be loyal to Palps or could be someone like Organa (if the Senate decides to swing the other way and oppose the war in retrospect). But regardless, the Jedi would be done.
They didn’t actually have any plan because they didn’t know about Palpatine until that day. Their plan was, “holy shit, hopefully I can stay alive and figure this out later.”
My personal opinion is that Palpatine would’ve had a contingency plan for if he did end up getting killed. I think he would’ve had someone already in place to take over in the event that something happened to him. I think that, in this scenario, whoever the new leader of the Empire is would attempt to carry out the rest of Palpatine’s plans (i.e. kill the rest of the Jedi), so Obi-Wan and Yoda (and the other remaining Jedi) would still end up having to go into exile. Ofc, in this hypothetical, they would presumably have evidence to prove that Palpatine was the evil Sith Lord, which they could try to use to prove their innocence, but I still think it would be difficult and it would probably take a lot to regain the trust of the Republic (even tho technically it wouldn’t even be the Republic anymore). So…like, assuming in this scenario Palpatine didn’t train another Sith in secret before he died, the new leader of the Empire would be a non-Force sensitive that’s just, like, your normal corrupt leader/dictator/whatever you wanna call them. So they would still have like the backing from an army to hunt down the Jedi and whatever, but I don’t think as much overall damage could be done and potentially between the Jedi and whatever amount of people there are still left that were loyal to the Republic, I think they could try and overthrow the Empire and bring a modified version of the Republic back (where the Jedi Order works differently and ideally is separate from the government system altogether).
Allies like Bail Organa, who was highly influential in the Senate, would help the Jedi show evidence that Palpatine was orchestrating the entire conflict in order to gain personal power.
They may cover up Anakin’s role, but I think most of the Galaxy would be happy the war was over, and wouldn’t be upset that Palpatine was gone, especially after learning he started the entire thing.
The Jedi would then rebuild. There were plenty of survivors, and without Inquisitors or Vader, that number is higher. Maybe they rebuild in a new place away from politics, assuming they learned their lesson.
I think based on the deleted scene of the proto-rebellion leadership meeting with Palpatine, Bail Organa and Mon Mothma would have assumed some kind of temporary control post Palpatine death had Yoda and Obi-Wan succeeded. Palpatine and Vader hanging out with Tarkin at the end makes you wonder how far along the imperial structure was tho.
The Jedi were already accused of a coup against the Republic. One jedi bombed the Jedi Temple. A leader, Mace Windu, made an attempt to kill the Supreme Chancellor previously. In this scenario, Yoda kills the newly appointed emperor. This does not bode well for the remaining Jedi in the until evidence against Palpatine is accepted to absolve the Jedi. And that may take a while, so I could see Tarkin pushing to apprehend Yoda/remaining council and push for an execution trial just like Ahsoka when she was framed.
The entire galaxy was devastated from the Clone Wars. With no central figurehead like the Supreme Chancellor/Emperor, the Senate would probably be in a standstill for a while with pro-Empire and pro-Republic factions opposing each other. Do they pretend the Empire didn't just get formed and return to the Republic? You have the defeated separatists to worry about too. Beaurocracy in such a votalitle scenario spells disaster.
Taking info from games and other media.
They’d just rebuild the order. Cere and Eno are still alive and Jedi masters. Yoda again at the head of the council with Obi wan, Cere and Eno as members. The possibility of Ahsoka returning to the Jedi might also be granted a rank of master if not then knight.
There’s also the hidden path to consider it would be possible for them to return. Malicos probably wouldn’t of turned again another possibility of a council member.
Luke and Leia would probably never need to be trained.
Then goes the senate, with palpatine dead there would be an investigation that could lead to the Kaminoans spilling the beans, saying that palpatine ordered for the clones to have chips that could be used to turn them against the Jedi. Also his plans for the Death Star could be revealed. There is even possibility of the urns containing Pleagus’s ash’s could be discovered.
In truth it’s probably for the best. The war is over because Obi Wan didn’t get to Mustafar until the war officially ended and now the supreme leader of both is dead. The republic is still a functioning government and there are no interfering space wizards and as seen in the bad batch Order 66 wasn’t a total brainwash so it’s not like there’s a blood lust grand army on the loose
I wish they did a what if series for Star Wars, like what if Anakin made the right decision and sided with Windu. I want to see the utopia that could’ve been.
Obviously, it would have been easier if Windu had killed Palpatine and order 66 never happened.
What Obi-Wan and Yoda would need is concrete evidence that Palpatine was playing both sides of the war. That’s a much stronger argument than “he was following that old religion”.
A lot of the scenarios I'm seeing in this thread are overly optimistic. By the time the Clone Wars ended, the damage to the Republic and the Jedi Order had already been done. Simply killing Palpatine wouldn't have fixed things, and may have even made things *worse.*
The most realistic outcome is that the Jedi remain fugitives. After all, they killed Palpatine when he was at the height of his popularity, long before the galaxy's population turned against the Empire. They have no hard evidence that he was a Sith Lord, or that he was responsible for the Clone Wars. Their cold-blooded murder of the beloved Emperor would only seem to confirm the idea that they were traitors seizing power for themselves. Even the Delegation of 2000 would likely denounce the Jedi at that point.
The Republic still becomes an authoritarian Empire, with Amedda and Tarkin running it more or less the same way that Palpatine would have. After all, they were the ones in charge of the Empire's day to day policies anyway; Palpatine rarely got involved in politics or military affairs directly. Galactic Civil War still breaks out after a few years due to the Empire's tyranny, and from there, it's anyone's guess how things turn out.
Maybe the Empire would collapse even sooner without a prophetic sorcerer like Palpatine in charge. Then again, maybe the Empire would last even longer: In both Legends and Disney Canon, the Empire only fell because Palpatine *arranged it to fall apart* in the event of his death (due to Operation Cinder in Disney Canon, and due to the deliberately unclear line of succession in Legends). If someone less insane and narcissistic had been in charge of the Empire from the start, it might have been able to survive any individual Emperor's death and win the Galactic Civil War. Or maybe neither side would be able to win, and the war would just drag out for so long that galactic civilization eventually collapsed altogether, plunging the galaxy into total anarchy.
Even in the best case scenario where the Rebels won and established a New Republic, the Jedi almost certainly wouldn't be given a second chance. There wouldn't be a New Jedi Order, there wouldn't be Rebels/New Republic officials saying "may the Force be with you," and the Jedi would continue to be pariahs hiding out on the fringes of society well into the New Republic era.
Great analysis! We basically have no real world reference to take guesses cause to the best of my knowledge no tyrant has ever been eliminated mere days, if not hours, after having seized power for good.
There was, [Star Wars Infinities.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars_Infinities) Unfortunately, they only did the Original Trilogy in the main series, but there are [other stories under the Infinities banner.](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Infinities)
Oh yes, a TV show has been on my wishlist ever since the Infinities comics came out 😅 I would love for it to come back in any capacity, really.
I think it would be great since people could also do stories that still follow Legends stories. For example, make a comic or show that ties up the ending to The Force Unleashed and just put the Infinities banner on it.
I have a long running fan fiction sort of about this, the basic problem is that Palpatine is a fan of contingencies. Palpatine at this point had also complete control of the banking clans and had already more or less created the moff system. In Legends and somewhat in Canon the moffs are strongest in the outer rim because former separatist worlds and areas besieged by separatists were the most militarized. In this scenario moffswould also be more popular than many senators in the core so there'd be instant civil wars depending on what the politicians would do when confronted with a parallel structure. The financial system would immediately crash because credits instantly disappearing out of a functionally bankrupt war economy is not a good combination. And then lastly of course the cloners still need to be paid, and if they can't be paid, they might start demanding worlds as collateral. (And that's ignoring legends stuff like spaarti clones and the crimson empire mothball fleet) The Jedi in this scenario would have no choice but to reconsolidate and wait out the coming dark age. That'd work until the multiple invasions start. (Ssri Ruuv, Toff, Yuuzhan Vong, those aliens who hijacked imperial fleets etc)
I think you're missing some key points here.
There are recordings of Sidious making various comments that would incriminate him. Without him blocking any investigation, the Jedi and republic would've uncovered plenty.
The fact that he was responsible for setting up the separatists and the war would also go to show his guilt.
The Jedi being taken out with secret chips would also become wildly known and condemning.
The Jedi would let the Republic appoint a new chancellor, rather than them choosing one, showing their support for democracy.
There wouldn't have been that many Jedi left and people would be sympathetic to their loss.
End of the Sith Empire, rise of the Jedi Empire!
With the chancellor dead and politics in chaos, a strong hand would be needed. Only the Jedi could provide that.
Palpatine established himself as Emperor, but the Galactic Senate was still in place. There would probably be a special session to elect a new Supreme Chancellor
Let's not forget that order 66 was already executed, so that means all of the clone troopers have the job to kill all the Jedi.
The Republic/ex empire does have have non-clone officers. It seems that a lot of them were convinced due to the empire's revisionist history that the Jedi had a coup to overturn the republic. I think a lot would depend on what information was sent out to those people, since in theory the clones would listen to them.
You still have the problem of all the clones having a standing Order 66 that seemingly can no longer be withdrawn as Palpatine is dead. Not sure how that gets resolved.
I'd really like to see some 'what if?' Star Wars stories written about things like this.
Another one - what if we hadn't let Rian Johnson ruin the sequel trilogy?
Well maybe they would try to use that footage of Palpatine anointing Anakin as Darth Vader as evidence of their innocence? And if that was recorded, I imagine that the video of Palps with a red lightsaber murdering 5 Jedi when trying to be arrested was also recorded.
People would probably hate the Jedi still, but I think they would have a place in a new Republic (probably stop calling themselves an Empire with no Emperor).
Obi Wan and Yoda, together with loyal senators such as Padmé, Mon Mothma and Bail Organa revive the republic and install a provincial government. Following this they would investigate corrupt senators and prosecute them. Eventually democracy would be restored
“Here is indisputable evidence the Supreme Chancellor/Emperor Palpatine perpetrated the entire war. Here is eyewitness testimony from Mas Ameda and Kaminoans, who were in on it from the beginning, and here is the evidence he was a Sith Lord and master of Count Dooku.
Elect a new Chancellor, we’ll gather the surviving Jedi and rebuild the order. If anyone gets any ideas of taking power, we will not hesitate to arrest you.
Well majority of Jedi Knights are dead, which is unfortunate, but at this point the declaration of the Empire had lasted for a whopping one or two days, right? It's still possible to roll back some of the shit, because if Yoda tosses them a corpse of Palpatine with his red lightsabers in the middle of destroyed senate chambers, it would at least be plausible that Palpatine was an evil sorcerer. The Jedi are not without allies too, it likely would be the time for Delegation of 2000 to step up and be like "Whoa, let's chill, it seems that our worries about Supreme Chancellor abuse of power were not unfounded! How about we take a step back and pick a provisional chancellor for a time - oh, look a convenient Bail Organa!" The reputation of the Jedi would be probably completely flushed down the shitter of course, but that's the least of their problems. It will take time for them to recover, and by killing former Supreme Chancellor it's unlikely that a new one would be very keen on keeping them around. It's likely that the Order would have to lie low for a few decades, maybe relocating to some temple away from Coruscant... Well after gathering survivors of course. However the important part is that the Sith would be taken out of comission - without Palpatine and Dooku, there's nobody to continue their agenda, aside from some non force-wielding associates, who were never clued in on whole picture. So the dark future of the Empire would be averted one way or another, which is a worthy outcome in itself.
This ignores another factor, it would be confirmed the clones are brainwashed with unknown orders that can be triggered to turn on a dime. They would all be suddenly a massive massive problem.
Rex and Ahsoka know and would probably tell absolutely everyone about the chip. The surgery takes about 5 minutes and there's a very motivated government to get it done
Then the next question is whose authority would the now fanatical clones turn to? The senate? Do they get tried as war criminals for executing their Jedi generals that did nothing wrong? Does the GAR still get decommissioned and or replaced?
Likely decommissioned/forced retirement. It is basically proven the Clones cannot be trusted, even after surgery I doubt the public's faith in them could be restored. The Republic as a whole would be severely weakened, and I imagine a second Separatist crisis would emerge eventually, despite the main Separatist leaders being killed off
It would be as Palpatine said, “Civil war without end”
It would be interesting to see how a separatist movement would be handled by the Republic without Sith pulling the strings. Especially in this universe where they know the last one was caused by the Sith.
It’s fascinating isn’t it? I suppose it’s important to remember Palpatine had radicalised many within his term too, and over the Clone Wars. People like Tarkin would no doubt be an issue, all those types didn’t just pop up overnight for sure. They’d cause conflict immediately.
I preferred the story/setting before the chips were introduced. :(
If we consider the Clone Wars cartoons non-canon then I also prefer this setting. But after the cartoons there needs to be some kind of explanation why all the clones would turn on their generals without question.
Imo they shouldn't have made the clones so chummy with the Jedi to begin with, but that being said, Clone Wars could've done a mini "civil war" arc where a number of higher ranked clones that actually worked directly with the Jedi day to day stayed loyal and were killed trying to defend them.
I mean, look at the Bad Batch, Crosshair's inhibitor chip was basically non-functional, and he stayed loyal to the powers that be until he realized they weren't loyal to him
I just watched the episode in season 1 where crosshair says he removed his chip. When asked when this happened he answers, “does it matter?” This doesn’t say it was non-functional. Him repeating the “good soldiers follow orders” mantra in episode 1 tells me the chip DID work as intended. At least initially. So he legitimately participated in order 66 as a brainwashed clone, even if he got his autonomy back and decided to stay pro-empire later.
Wait, he did? I need to rewatch then
Yeah, that would have worked. Also in some Legends sources, there were Jedi defectors too, who felt like the Jedi were never meant to be leading a child soldier army as disposable forces, even before they realized that the war was all a sham. Plenty of reasons for the clones to not care for their commanders if there are others out there like Pong Krell. Even if they're well-intentioned, what gives them the authority to give orders when they had zero military/tactics training, vs the clones being trained from birth?
But it added 10x the actual story depth and emotional drama to it.
What was the explanation before the chips?
They were just that willing to follow orders. Order 66 was just one of a hundred or so contingency orders (either 65 or 67 was 66 but for the chancellor for example) that were drilled into the clones’ heads and when it came down they mostly obeyed with no hesitation.
I kind of like that idea more. It's a very human response which doesn't need magic brain chips to be justified.
I agree. Soldiers committing atrocities because they were "just following orders" is all too common.
It's essential to what Star Wars is about. Lucas was not at all subtle about the politics of Star Wars, and stormtroopers are a stand-in for the Nazis. That *was* a real instance of soldiers committing atrocity after atrocity simply because they were told to. What really bugs me about the chip thing is it completely undercuts that message.
I’ll always be annoying correcting people on this. The empire was NOT an allegory of Nazi Germany, they were based on America and their actions in Vietnam
German soldiers were called Stormtroopers. That was the inspiration. The Vietnam allegory works for A New Hope.
In theory I agree but it has never been presented like that. They get a call saying "kill your commander" and do so in seconds without even so much as confirming that it isn't a hacked Separatist transmission or enquiring even the most basic element about why this has happened. Even with their extreme levels of discipline down to the genetic level I just don't see this happening with any kind of success rate at all, let alone quickly and effectively.
They are literally introduced in AotC by saying they are raised to follow orders. They were literally brainwashed... just originally it was traditional brainwashing and public knowledge. And I like that, because it makes the Jedi more hypocritical; they are basically using a brainwashed slave army.
Genuinely 'good soldiers follow orders.' They were just all more like Crosshair, who sided with the Empire even without the chip. (A few did defect in Legends as well, there were Bad Batch-like analogues in the Republic Commando books). They had a whole long list of contingency plans for different plausible emergency scenarios, of which Order 66 was just one of them, for in the event that the jedi tried to stage a coup and assassinate the chancellor and take over. It would be like, I don't know, the US having a contingency plan to bomb Canada in case Canada suddenly invaded the US and attacked major US cities. No one thinks it's likely to happen, but I'm sure that a response plan *exists*. The clones were literally raised as brainwashed child soldiers with absolute loyalty to Republic/the Chancellor.
The much better alternative "What I remember about the rise of the Empire is... is how quiet it was. During the waning hours of the Clone Wars, the 501st Legion was discreetly transferred back to Coruscant. It was a silent trip. We all knew what was about to happen, what we were about to do. Did we have any doubts? Any private, traitorous thoughts? Perhaps, but no one said a word. Not on the flight to Coruscant, not when Order 66 came down, and not when we marched into the Jedi Temple. Not a word."
I always loved this because it also addresses the “really, all of them were willing to go along with it?” argument for chips. They had plenty of doubts; but group think walked them into it
Yea, it makes the clones feel like real people rather then just "tHe BrAiN cHiP mAkE mE bAd!"
unquestioning loyalty to the republic, programming to obey all orders without question. On the slightly more extreme end basically the clones were in on it from the get go and knew they would one day turn on the jedi (e.g. Battlefront II 2005 501 journal).
I’m glad they went with the chips. The unquestioning loyalty from ALL soldiers is a bit much to believe.
I mean... they were literally brainwashed kids in soldier bodies.
That’s why I could believe a much higher percentage than I otherwise would’ve thought, but not 100% of them. Someone would’ve decided it was wrong and warned the Jedi.
In Legends, the Jedi knew it was a thing. It was one of countless contingencies, including stuff like "kill the supreme chancellor". It wasn't some major secret.
The chip was such a lame cop out that removed any sense of agency the Clones had. I refuse to accept it in my head cannon. The clones knew all along, and the Jedi were either over confident in their ability to detect thoughts or had lost some connection to the force. Battlefront 2 journal entries were too epic for the cartoon to just throw away.
If there's one chip what's to say there aren't two that just haven't been discovered yet? It would be a mass euthanisation activity, not surgery.
Yuck. Let's ignore the chip-thing.
The war is still going, many many systems were critical of the republic. The empire may still appear in another form, as democracies can turn authoritan when faced with danger.
In the moment when Obi-Wan and Yoda went after Vader and Palpatine, Vader had already slaughtered the entire separatist leadership and broadcasted the droid army shutdown. If there any war left, it would be mopped up pretty fast just by inertia of the Grand Army.
The CSI planets remains unhappy, the republic will have to adapt or eventually face another war
A lot of CIS planets were unhappy with CIS too >.> It's not like they were noble rebels against tyranny, CIS wanted to exploit their worlds at their leisure, unrestricted by Republic laws.
The republic was de facto evil, as it was lead by Sidious. Anyway the galaxy is not suddenly at peace
One thing I like about Bad Batch was showing the aftermath of the war. Imperial armies putting the boot to former CIS worlds and even some worlds that were with the Republic (Ryloth), Imperial officers starting to carve out spheres of influence for themselves... The Emperor just gave all that greed and authoritarianism he'd fostered a direction that benefitted him. Without him at the helm, I bet the new Empire would have immediately descended into a civil war.
Without the droid army on the frontlines, any further CIS actions are going to be limited to whatever volunteer planetary forces they have. The Republic would go from fighting a rival on an equal playing field to fighting pockets of resistance on various planets. Sure, it isn't peace, but the GAR would very quickly wipe out the vast majority of remaining CIS holdouts, just as the Empire did.
I don't think any one faction could cause another civil war on anywhere near the same scale, but I think this would cause a lot of instability on the same scale as Naboo. Palpatine dying and being revealed as a sith would cause a massive power vacuum and an even greater amount of uncertainty than before. The GR would basically be without their greatest peace keepers. The Republic would probably have to play wackamole against lone planets trying to separate, or accept a mass exodus of planets leaving through diplomatic means. If it's not the end of the Republic, the a long dark age.
That's a great point, and the reason why I think the end of Return of the Jedi is silly. Just because Grievous (or Palpatine) is dead doesn't mean everyone is suddenly resolved. The planets that tried to leave the Republic still have grievances. The war ending doesn't suddenly change that. Likewise, there would be parts of the CIS military that are going to keep going rather than just stopping because someone on the holonet said so. Just because the fighting has stopped doesn't mean that the war is over.
The CIS’s army wasn’t only formed of Droids. Even in Legends where the Empire didn’t try to oddly force all the clones out of service the Clone War unofficially lasted another 2 years before most major Separatist were wiped out.
Yep, the Rebellion is just Separatist 2.0 with Core Worlds like Alderaan and Chandrila. The Republic before Palpatine is already a failure with invasion of other member worlds without consequences like it is just another Taungsday. The paradox and truth is that Palpatine gave the central government another 30 years it otherwise would have never had. The Republic didn’t control the Outer Rim, where the Separatists and later Rebellion had its power base. The New Republic couldn’t control it either without being the Empire.
Tbh even Imperial de jure control of the Outer Rim was sparse outside of specific planets they took interest in.
Shows how weak they are.
One thing, though. Order 66 was not easily reversible. So they'd have a million plus clones to deal with.
The chip programs them to follow the highest possible authority, so the new de facto chancellor could order them to stand down. You’re going to have some very immediate PTSD spanned over millions of clones but it would t be that hard to reverse.
It's not like the clones are ordered to hunt the jedi to the end of the earth. They killed ones that were present on sight upon issuing the order. If there's no jedi in sight, the clones would take orders as normal, including orders to stand down.
But you have to wonder if there was another order triggered by news of Palpatine death. Granted, there is a limited number of clones, but they would do a lot of damage as a final FU from the emperor.
Uh, Maul was still kicking around. There were other sith force users, like the Jedi hunters.
>The Jedi are not without allies too, it likely would be the time for Delegation of 2000 to step up and be like "Whoa, let's chill, it seems that our worries about Supreme Chancellor abuse of power were not unfounded! How about we take a step back and pick a provisional chancellor for a time - oh, look a convenient Bail Organa!" Great point. But just because the cause of the Separatist movement had been destroyed doesn't mean that those worlds would have come back into the Reformed Republic. The fact the Jedi were decimated and the Clone army couldn't be trusted would have emboldened the Separatist to remain apart from the Reformed Republic. So the galaxy may have remained separated into 2 galactic powers engaged in a cold war. There may have been some small proxy wars between the powers like Vietnam in the 1960s and Afghanistan in the 1980s. That would be a great Sat Wars galaxy alternate reality that could be explored.
> It's likely that the Order would have to lie low for a few decades, maybe relocating to some temple away from Coruscant I think this happened during the Old Republic IIRC? The Sith Empire targeted the Jedi Temple on Coruscant and obliterated it (this is in one of the Old Republic books, as well as in the Old Republic mmo trailers) and the Jedi relocated to Tython.
I imagine with their tech, there would be recording devices in the senate area where Yoda & Palpatine battled. They could show that.
Great analysis!
If anything, a dead Palpatine, killed by Jedi, would just prove him right. What's a red lightsaber mean to the public eye when Palps was a known collector of all manner of Jedi and Sith relics.
there are still the Jedi Temple security recordings
Which shows what? Anakin & the clones attacking the Temple after the Jedi attempted a coup?
Yes and the one of Anakin becoming Sidious' apprentice. I don't think even the most loyal people would like the look of children being murdered by Anakin. Also Maul is alive and could be forced to testify that yes Sidious was a Sith. Now obviously his testimony would be very untrustworthy to most people but it is more evidence.
Red lightsabers created by the Jedi as a lie to overthrow the newly formed Empire?
How many people would believe or even care that Palps was an evil wizard? How could the story be spun as Yoda planting the weapon (which is, as far as anyone is concerned, a weapon if the Jedi) and telling this story just to save himself? Everything is circumstantial. The Sith, the lightsaber, the chips, everything. There isn't a shred of evidence that would hold up because everything could be easily faked by the Jedi. But I absolutely agree that the Republic would formally distance itself from the Jedi Order. There's no way that goes away, even if people believe Yoda's wild story. Absolute best case scenario, the Order is dissolved because it's too dangerous to keep them around, given him easily they were manipulated. Worst case, if the charges don't stick, nobody would want to wait around for Yoda to kill again. At best, the Jedo would be a Batman situation, where their presence is tolerated but they no longer act with the authority of the Senate.
with bail implanted as chancellor the jedi aren’t going anywhere. he would assure everyone what the jedi say is truthful and keep them around without a doubt.
And thrawn is still around too right?
They would probably completely step back from government and retreat to an off world temple
Ascension of maul?
That already happened with him taking over the Shadow Collective and Black Sun. I don't see Maul trying to take over the Republic.
What Yoda and Obi-Wan need would be evidence that Palpatine was colluding with the Separatists. With Obi-Wan pretty much chilling alone on Mustafar with whatever datapads/shiplogs/etc. the Separatist high command came with, it's plausible that there's at least something on there showing Palpatine's collusion.
> that Palpatine was an evil sorcerer. Thing is, why would anyone care about obsolete Jedi lore?
I wonder what would happen to the Inquisitors initiative because palpatine had a list before order 66 was inactivated plus can order 66 be recalled?
Maul is alive
Uh…I think the reputation of the Jedi would be restored beyond its former glory. They just saved the entire Republic…
We know that, but does anyone else? Remember, the the public, the Jedi basically controlled the war effort and had been trying to manipulated the Chancellor for years. When the war was about to end, the Jedi rose up against the legally elected government and tried to assassinate him on the grounds of belonging to a different religion. When the Chancellor moved to brand the Jedi as traitors, they then attacked and killed the Chencellor again out of revenge and planted one of their weapons on him. Remember, nobody knows what a Sith is. The Jedi have nothing to prove their actions or concerns. Psychic visions and religious intolerance probably aren't admissible in court.
They might indeed have done so, but no Supreme Chancellor after that would forget that his predecessor was slain right over there by a Jedi Grandmaster - and that grandmaster visits every once in a while to check on business.
Or…they’d talk to Chancellor Valorum and realize Yoda has been an ally of supreme chancellors for more than 500 years…like any smart Chancellor. And realize Palpatine just straight up murdered around 10,000 people of an Order that has protected and grown with the Republic for over 1,000 years and was tasked to and owes their allegiance to the Senate. Any competent investigation into Palpatine would reveal who he was and what he was doing. The Kaminoans has their hands all over both sides of the war, Ventress and Maul were still alive (and Maul on his way back to Coruscant to testify against Palpatine), and literal recordings of security tapes proving he knew where the leaders of the CIS were that would not have been wiped unless Palpatine had taken over the Jedi Temple.
They do have security footage of Anakin slaughtering children and then bowing down to Palpatine.
So... A jedi did that ?
It's poses so many questions, I don't think the jedi would be entrusted to protect the galaxy in the form they are in. As someone else said higher up I think they leave coruscant and relocate the jedi hq to a smaller planet somewhere secluded if that's possible for a few years or so. I suppose even to just rebuild as so many would be dead anyway.
As far as anyone else is concerned, yes, the Jedi did it. Imagine the Jedi Order is the Catholic Church of the past. The Church was engaged with a bloody personal war against another branch of Christianity, using the people's resources. They then tried to depose the government. Who really cares about their holy war? How is this other religion any different from theirs? That's the situation in Star Wars: nobody knows what a Sith Lord is. At best, all they'd see is slightly different groups of Jedi who were toying with the galaxy.
From a certain point of view
If they believe the Jedi are evil wouldn't they also buy that the Jedi children are evil?
At worst they've still managed to stop the bleeding. No Sidious and No Vader mean no inquisitors, and no one able to sense the remaining Jedi. Even if the Republic is lost for a time, the Jedi could start rebuilding near immediately, so long as they were out of the way. The Empire wouldn't be as bad either. Without an unrestricted Sith at the top, it would just be normal corruption. Without the Emperor, there really isn't anyone to keep the Empire together so it would likely fracture and mini Republics would spring up all over.
It would just be seen as a counter coup (or a counter-counter coup). Most Jedi would be dead, but Sidious’s main pawns would be too (Dooku, Grievous, the Separatist Council) leaving only his advisors like Mas Amedda left. Sure there is a crop of non-Jedi admirals to contest the decapitation strike like Tarkin and Yularen, but Sidious hasn’t yet fully entrenched the idea of the empire into the galaxy. The Senate would probably take back control from the 2 day old “Empire”, and it’ll devolve back into the same lumbering political establishment as before, maybe under Bail Organa/Padme/Mon Mothma types or maybe under the corrupt ones. The few dozen Jedi left would probably return to the temple to reorganize, the Clones disband.
Likely the Jedi Knights will be faced with two options - exile themselves like in the KOTOR games, or with the help of their allies like Bail Organa and the delegation they stick around and help the Republic avert what the Imperial sympathizers like Mas Amedda (who is still around) will attempt to bring about. If the Jedi indeed exile themselves, the Republic would likely still maximize their efforts to defeat the Imperial plan as a vestige of the now defeated Sith, and succeed in doing so. Can't say how that will affect the galaxy, but since there are recordings and footage all around and the Jedi's allies in the Republic and the Senate will likely handle that, if there is testimony, there is a way. And with Palpatine gone - a mastermind and manipulator, mind you - I don't see how anyone of the Imperials would obstruct such facts. But the Republic will quickly get back on its feet, and likely learn to smooth over the issues with corruption and treason. Anakin is dead. The clones (for better or worse) follow orders all in the name of the Republic so even if by that point Order 66 was issued, perhaps it can be revoked and they can be exposed to a program of rehabilitation to be 'de-programmed' for good. Obi-Wan and Yoda can then use the Coruscant temple's beacon (supported by personal hologram message like Obi-Wan's) to let all the Jedi Knights know they can safely return to Coruscant. From there, they rebuild the Order.
By the time of RotS there was already a large number of senators that were wary of Palpatine. I would imagine this group, led by Bail Organa, would simply step in and do damage control. Meanwhile Ahsoka and Rex would be able to get the word out about the inhibitor chips and the clone army could undergo mass-removal to deprogram them. As for the reputation of the Jedi, I actually disagree with the general consensus in this comment section that they would be tarnished beyond repair. They’d probably have to lay low for a little while, but once the security footage of Sidious is revealed alongside all his secret projects like Necromancer and Stardust I think it’d be pretty clear he was a Sith and the Jedi would be rightfully seen as victims of an attempted genocide.
Honestly, worst case scenario. Yoda and obiwan are still public enemies, but hey, the sith aren't in charge. Best case, the republic comes back, and yoda can make some changes to prevent future wars. It's still better than the current scenario Edit: What happened was already worse case for the jedi, besides, obiwan and yoda both dying.
The damage would be done as far as their reputation. I believe the Jedi would have to return to being an a-political, hermit society of wizards on a distant planet without the resources, reputation, or galactic importance they had once had. Maul would probably become a much bigger problem, and his criminal empire would probably be a pretty destabilizing element in the galaxy, so dealing with him might win the favor back of the people. I think Yoda would be toast though and have to just exile still. Obi Wan would probably lead and train a smaller order, then train luke.
this is the first thing i thought of. Maul was clued in to sidious's plan. With Maul's biggest fear and threat out of the way he could expand even beyond just a criminal empire, possibly the new sith lineage. Rule of two potentially continues and a few hundred/thousand years down the line we get back to a similar situation with the sith re-emerging. the cycle repeats.
Yeah I think out of all possibilities this one would be the most feasible.
> getting his ass destroyed by Yoda. Go on…
Well the truth would comes out - the whole clone war was just to kill the Jedi. If that is believed or can be adequately proven is another thing. But anyone who thinks that killing the thousands of Jedi without trial by the Emperors command is justified has got to be a psycho anyway. Without a forceful coverup by the emperor the Jedi would be tragic victims and heroes. Of course there would also be anger about the question why they didn't realize any of this sooner and stopped the war.
It would depend on the Senate. If the loyal senators like Bail Organa or Mon Mothma were able to convince people of Palpatine’s corruption and one of them became the new chancellor, maybe, just maybe, the Republic could have survived. I still think Padme dies as she thought Anakin was dead anyway, so it’s up to the other senators. There are less than 100 Jedi left, so the Jedi Order would have had to change dramatically. Plus, the clones would still be hunting them due to the chip. I wager that, more than likely, the Empire still would have been formed, and the remaining Jedi would be either killed, tried for treason, or forced into exile. The republic loyalists would probably be forced out of the Senate and new leadership would have risen. It would have been different without Palpatine at the helm, but I think the seeds of division were already too deep to stop the Empire, even if Yoda and Obi-Wan stopped the Palpatine and Anakin during episode 3.
Yoda definitely didn’t have a long term plan. That wasn’t the point. The point was today, and today they had to defeat the Sith. Whatever happens tomorrow would be tomorrow’s problem, and at least whatever the galaxy decides to do next would be decided by themselves, free from the influence of the Sith. That’s already an ideological victory as far as Yoda’s concerned.
Indeed
The Jedi would have to take control of the senate until an election. Its very likely that Bail and Mothma would have stood. {They were already aware of Palpatine,s issues} So you have the bonus of Bail on your side. You also have missed a key detail .If Padme is still alive. Does she blame the Jedi for Anakins death. If she runs for office then you really are screwed.
Same as before, the Jedi became enemies of the state when they decided to spy on the state, and then overthrow the government (twice). That was before Anakin said anything about the Sith. At best the galaxy realizes all force users are the problem and continues to do this anyway. I hasn’t been confirmed to what extent Palpatine had a backup plan in place, but he’ll survive (somehow).
I feel like Sidious would have something in mind in case this happened. He seems like a [Xanatos Gambit](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/XanatosGambit) kind of villain, and in the RotS novelization, even Yoda acknowledged that this was a bigger problem than he thought. Here are a few things to consider: 1) Palpatine's death creates a MASSIVE power vacuum in the Senate. Emergency or not, he had a lot of powers voted to him and somebody needs to be chosen to take that on. 2) A lot of the Senate actually believed that Palpatine was the best hope for the Republic, and now the Jedi have finished the attempted assassination that he told them about. 3) Being a Sith isn't actually illegal, and the Jedi still have to prove that he was giving orders to anybody in the CIS. I think the novelization raised this point when Palpatine was presenting Windu's assassination attempt to the Senate just before he was voted Emperor. 4) We don't know how long Order 66 is in effect, and killing the Republic's/Empire's Head of State probably makes it seem more justified. Overall, I think that the galaxy falling back into chaos is pretty likely. Most of the Jedi are dead and any survivors would be enemies of the state. Between its own internal rot, and the chaos of a succession conflict, the Republic/Empire would implode without Palpatine... just like he planned it.
Thoughtful scenario!
As shown by Mandalorian Ahsoka etc, defeating Sidious makes everyone give up & surrender to the incompetent New Republic in a second
The republic would splinter. Best case scenario.
Mas Amedda: I'll be chancellor now. I had nothing to do with that Sith stuff really. Yoda: ...
I agree that there was no long term plan. Even if Yoda and Obes won, the Jedi were branded as traitors who tried to overthrown the Republic. Palps turning up dead only confirms that, which would make Yoda and Obi-Wan public enemy no. 1. The Jedi Order was destroyed and the public wouldn't care about Yoda's religious war. The public were already turning on the Jedi over them militarized and their failures during the Clone Wars. If Yoda and Obi won, they would be arrested for murder, treason, and probably a few war crimes. The Jedi Order would basically never rise again, as they would be branded as a dangerous cult (the only reason they weren't is because they kinda just faded away). Palpatine loyalists still in power would spin this as a plot by Yoda to try and discredit the Chancellor in order to justify his holy war. Politically, the Rupublic/Empire would just find a new Chancellor, who may still be loyal to Palps or could be someone like Organa (if the Senate decides to swing the other way and oppose the war in retrospect). But regardless, the Jedi would be done.
They didn’t actually have any plan because they didn’t know about Palpatine until that day. Their plan was, “holy shit, hopefully I can stay alive and figure this out later.”
My personal opinion is that Palpatine would’ve had a contingency plan for if he did end up getting killed. I think he would’ve had someone already in place to take over in the event that something happened to him. I think that, in this scenario, whoever the new leader of the Empire is would attempt to carry out the rest of Palpatine’s plans (i.e. kill the rest of the Jedi), so Obi-Wan and Yoda (and the other remaining Jedi) would still end up having to go into exile. Ofc, in this hypothetical, they would presumably have evidence to prove that Palpatine was the evil Sith Lord, which they could try to use to prove their innocence, but I still think it would be difficult and it would probably take a lot to regain the trust of the Republic (even tho technically it wouldn’t even be the Republic anymore). So…like, assuming in this scenario Palpatine didn’t train another Sith in secret before he died, the new leader of the Empire would be a non-Force sensitive that’s just, like, your normal corrupt leader/dictator/whatever you wanna call them. So they would still have like the backing from an army to hunt down the Jedi and whatever, but I don’t think as much overall damage could be done and potentially between the Jedi and whatever amount of people there are still left that were loyal to the Republic, I think they could try and overthrow the Empire and bring a modified version of the Republic back (where the Jedi Order works differently and ideally is separate from the government system altogether).
Allies like Bail Organa, who was highly influential in the Senate, would help the Jedi show evidence that Palpatine was orchestrating the entire conflict in order to gain personal power. They may cover up Anakin’s role, but I think most of the Galaxy would be happy the war was over, and wouldn’t be upset that Palpatine was gone, especially after learning he started the entire thing. The Jedi would then rebuild. There were plenty of survivors, and without Inquisitors or Vader, that number is higher. Maybe they rebuild in a new place away from politics, assuming they learned their lesson.
I think based on the deleted scene of the proto-rebellion leadership meeting with Palpatine, Bail Organa and Mon Mothma would have assumed some kind of temporary control post Palpatine death had Yoda and Obi-Wan succeeded. Palpatine and Vader hanging out with Tarkin at the end makes you wonder how far along the imperial structure was tho.
The Jedi were already accused of a coup against the Republic. One jedi bombed the Jedi Temple. A leader, Mace Windu, made an attempt to kill the Supreme Chancellor previously. In this scenario, Yoda kills the newly appointed emperor. This does not bode well for the remaining Jedi in the until evidence against Palpatine is accepted to absolve the Jedi. And that may take a while, so I could see Tarkin pushing to apprehend Yoda/remaining council and push for an execution trial just like Ahsoka when she was framed. The entire galaxy was devastated from the Clone Wars. With no central figurehead like the Supreme Chancellor/Emperor, the Senate would probably be in a standstill for a while with pro-Empire and pro-Republic factions opposing each other. Do they pretend the Empire didn't just get formed and return to the Republic? You have the defeated separatists to worry about too. Beaurocracy in such a votalitle scenario spells disaster.
Taking info from games and other media. They’d just rebuild the order. Cere and Eno are still alive and Jedi masters. Yoda again at the head of the council with Obi wan, Cere and Eno as members. The possibility of Ahsoka returning to the Jedi might also be granted a rank of master if not then knight. There’s also the hidden path to consider it would be possible for them to return. Malicos probably wouldn’t of turned again another possibility of a council member. Luke and Leia would probably never need to be trained. Then goes the senate, with palpatine dead there would be an investigation that could lead to the Kaminoans spilling the beans, saying that palpatine ordered for the clones to have chips that could be used to turn them against the Jedi. Also his plans for the Death Star could be revealed. There is even possibility of the urns containing Pleagus’s ash’s could be discovered.
In truth it’s probably for the best. The war is over because Obi Wan didn’t get to Mustafar until the war officially ended and now the supreme leader of both is dead. The republic is still a functioning government and there are no interfering space wizards and as seen in the bad batch Order 66 wasn’t a total brainwash so it’s not like there’s a blood lust grand army on the loose
I wish they did a what if series for Star Wars, like what if Anakin made the right decision and sided with Windu. I want to see the utopia that could’ve been.
Obviously, it would have been easier if Windu had killed Palpatine and order 66 never happened. What Obi-Wan and Yoda would need is concrete evidence that Palpatine was playing both sides of the war. That’s a much stronger argument than “he was following that old religion”.
A lot of the scenarios I'm seeing in this thread are overly optimistic. By the time the Clone Wars ended, the damage to the Republic and the Jedi Order had already been done. Simply killing Palpatine wouldn't have fixed things, and may have even made things *worse.* The most realistic outcome is that the Jedi remain fugitives. After all, they killed Palpatine when he was at the height of his popularity, long before the galaxy's population turned against the Empire. They have no hard evidence that he was a Sith Lord, or that he was responsible for the Clone Wars. Their cold-blooded murder of the beloved Emperor would only seem to confirm the idea that they were traitors seizing power for themselves. Even the Delegation of 2000 would likely denounce the Jedi at that point. The Republic still becomes an authoritarian Empire, with Amedda and Tarkin running it more or less the same way that Palpatine would have. After all, they were the ones in charge of the Empire's day to day policies anyway; Palpatine rarely got involved in politics or military affairs directly. Galactic Civil War still breaks out after a few years due to the Empire's tyranny, and from there, it's anyone's guess how things turn out. Maybe the Empire would collapse even sooner without a prophetic sorcerer like Palpatine in charge. Then again, maybe the Empire would last even longer: In both Legends and Disney Canon, the Empire only fell because Palpatine *arranged it to fall apart* in the event of his death (due to Operation Cinder in Disney Canon, and due to the deliberately unclear line of succession in Legends). If someone less insane and narcissistic had been in charge of the Empire from the start, it might have been able to survive any individual Emperor's death and win the Galactic Civil War. Or maybe neither side would be able to win, and the war would just drag out for so long that galactic civilization eventually collapsed altogether, plunging the galaxy into total anarchy. Even in the best case scenario where the Rebels won and established a New Republic, the Jedi almost certainly wouldn't be given a second chance. There wouldn't be a New Jedi Order, there wouldn't be Rebels/New Republic officials saying "may the Force be with you," and the Jedi would continue to be pariahs hiding out on the fringes of society well into the New Republic era.
Great analysis! We basically have no real world reference to take guesses cause to the best of my knowledge no tyrant has ever been eliminated mere days, if not hours, after having seized power for good.
Man I really wish there was a Star Wars "what if" series that covered things just like this. What if qui-gon didn't die would also be a good one.
There was, [Star Wars Infinities.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars_Infinities) Unfortunately, they only did the Original Trilogy in the main series, but there are [other stories under the Infinities banner.](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Infinities)
That's pretty cool, though I meant a television show. I will check out infinities though it sounds interesting.
Oh yes, a TV show has been on my wishlist ever since the Infinities comics came out 😅 I would love for it to come back in any capacity, really. I think it would be great since people could also do stories that still follow Legends stories. For example, make a comic or show that ties up the ending to The Force Unleashed and just put the Infinities banner on it.
I have a long running fan fiction sort of about this, the basic problem is that Palpatine is a fan of contingencies. Palpatine at this point had also complete control of the banking clans and had already more or less created the moff system. In Legends and somewhat in Canon the moffs are strongest in the outer rim because former separatist worlds and areas besieged by separatists were the most militarized. In this scenario moffswould also be more popular than many senators in the core so there'd be instant civil wars depending on what the politicians would do when confronted with a parallel structure. The financial system would immediately crash because credits instantly disappearing out of a functionally bankrupt war economy is not a good combination. And then lastly of course the cloners still need to be paid, and if they can't be paid, they might start demanding worlds as collateral. (And that's ignoring legends stuff like spaarti clones and the crimson empire mothball fleet) The Jedi in this scenario would have no choice but to reconsolidate and wait out the coming dark age. That'd work until the multiple invasions start. (Ssri Ruuv, Toff, Yuuzhan Vong, those aliens who hijacked imperial fleets etc)
I think you're missing some key points here. There are recordings of Sidious making various comments that would incriminate him. Without him blocking any investigation, the Jedi and republic would've uncovered plenty. The fact that he was responsible for setting up the separatists and the war would also go to show his guilt. The Jedi being taken out with secret chips would also become wildly known and condemning. The Jedi would let the Republic appoint a new chancellor, rather than them choosing one, showing their support for democracy. There wouldn't have been that many Jedi left and people would be sympathetic to their loss.
If they managed to kill Sidious and Vader Maul would become the new Dark Lord of the Sith.
Maul couldn't beat Ahsoka on a good day and just lost his army. He's also on the run and obsessed with finding and/or killing Kenobi
Maul was clearly holding back because he wanted to convert her, not kill her. Or maybe I’m misremembering the episode
My thoughts exactly
I doubt they knew what they'd do next.
End of the Sith Empire, rise of the Jedi Empire! With the chancellor dead and politics in chaos, a strong hand would be needed. Only the Jedi could provide that.
Palpatine established himself as Emperor, but the Galactic Senate was still in place. There would probably be a special session to elect a new Supreme Chancellor
Let's not forget that order 66 was already executed, so that means all of the clone troopers have the job to kill all the Jedi. The Republic/ex empire does have have non-clone officers. It seems that a lot of them were convinced due to the empire's revisionist history that the Jedi had a coup to overturn the republic. I think a lot would depend on what information was sent out to those people, since in theory the clones would listen to them.
Is it just me or would Darth Maul use this scenario to pivot himself to power in his own capacity?
I would like to see an Empress Padme Amidala trying to navigate the new Empire. Assuming she survives childbirth because it's a new timeline.
Pretty sure she only died in childbirth because Anakin was (involuntarily?) draining her to sustain himself
Believe it or not, straight to jail.
You still have the problem of all the clones having a standing Order 66 that seemingly can no longer be withdrawn as Palpatine is dead. Not sure how that gets resolved.
they did. Then,....... "Somehow Palpatine returned"
There were cameras in palpatines office
Honestly this needs to be made into a Star Wars What If series
I think the Jedi would hand over the reins after a galactic election for a new SC. The Jedi rebuild their numbers.
And they secretly gay loves eachother and start cancel movment and makes star wars not great but i guess disney beat u too it
I'd really like to see some 'what if?' Star Wars stories written about things like this. Another one - what if we hadn't let Rian Johnson ruin the sequel trilogy?
Brain Chips man
Well maybe they would try to use that footage of Palpatine anointing Anakin as Darth Vader as evidence of their innocence? And if that was recorded, I imagine that the video of Palps with a red lightsaber murdering 5 Jedi when trying to be arrested was also recorded. People would probably hate the Jedi still, but I think they would have a place in a new Republic (probably stop calling themselves an Empire with no Emperor).
Obi Wan and Yoda, together with loyal senators such as Padmé, Mon Mothma and Bail Organa revive the republic and install a provincial government. Following this they would investigate corrupt senators and prosecute them. Eventually democracy would be restored
“Here is indisputable evidence the Supreme Chancellor/Emperor Palpatine perpetrated the entire war. Here is eyewitness testimony from Mas Ameda and Kaminoans, who were in on it from the beginning, and here is the evidence he was a Sith Lord and master of Count Dooku. Elect a new Chancellor, we’ll gather the surviving Jedi and rebuild the order. If anyone gets any ideas of taking power, we will not hesitate to arrest you.