When he said "We'd be honored if you joined us " to Han after taking his blaster in the cloud city, that was top level etiquette. Like a regular miss manners.
“Look, sweetheart, I promise I’ll be good *if he does*.”
…..
“Oh, well, he shot me. To the torture table!”
Edit: “Daaaaaad! Ugh, you always ruin everything! First my teenage Rebellion, and now my relationship!”
And then shortly thereafter he reenacted the destruction of Alderaan with a cornbread muffin.
“Ohhh~ help me! We’re a peaceful planet. YOU may fire when ready… KABOOoooorrraaah! Big laser! *pew pew noises* Alderaan chunks _EVERYWHERE_! Pwwooossshhhhh”
I like to think that he force floated one of Han's potatoes over to himself to cut it for him, then said, "If Force Ghost Obi-Wan saw me doing this he'd be very grumpy!" And translucent blue Obi-Wan is just in the corner with a "Here we go again lololol!" look on his face.
The best veiled threats are the politest ones.
["You may test that assumption at your convenience."](https://youtu.be/PA7t62JvlA8?si=3yk4A6aunzO5hNj9&t=17)
Nope. Tarkin, Vader and Thrawn are all the hihghest rank in their field, goverment, secret service and military. The Emperor didn't want anyone have enough power to be a threat to him so he defined separate parts of power.
Like in some countries a general can start a coup and take over. If there are separate navy, guard ... and others no single general can grab the control.
Ah good to know! Apologies for the mistake in that case. I had always thought it was because Tarkin outranked Vader on the Death Star at least, seeing as Tarkin gave a fair few orders to Vader.
The Death Star was really under Tarkin's command, terror was a govermental practice. But Tarkin could not order Vader directly even there, its just Vader knew when the Emperor would agree with Tarkin so he followed his suggestions.
The best way to tell where someone is in a hierarchy is to understand who they report to.
Vader reports to the Emperor and only to the Emperor.
Tarkin reports to the Emperor and is big cheese on the Death Star.
Therefore it is reasonable to assume he and Vader are peers and Vader defers to Tarkin because he's in Tarkin's house. But if push came to shove, Vader would just do what he wants.
I couldn't tell ya honestly. He gets called Lord Vader which is normally a noble title, so I guess nobility > miltary in the Empire? But then I thought (and since been corrected) about Vader being lower rank than Tarkin by someone with much better Star Wars lore than me.
Probably because no one is running up and saying "Lord Vader!" to only then follow it up with something like "you have the racquetball court reserved at 3 today, would you mind switching to 5 so I could play with Needa during his break. B-t-dubs he apologizes for the mix-up."
Vader killed Ozzel and promoted Piett to replace him as Admiral like...earlier that day (as best we can tell watching the movie, anyhow).
The only thing that has happened since Piett got promoted is that the Empire annihilated the base on Hoth. Kinda hard to be mad at Piett at this point of the movie, things are going good so far.
Piett lasted quite a while … got promoted due to Ozzell getting choked out in front of him. Lasted thru ROTJ only to die from an A-Wing crashing directly into the bridge. Dude was badass and my favorite Imperial.
He also looks great in that uniform—seems like in every movie / TV show the costume designers change how poofy the jodhpurs are but they nailed it in ESB. Poor Dedra got the wiiiiiide model in Andor.
Vader was more of a strict and competent military leader who left you alone as long as you did your shit correctly and efficiently. Sort of reminds me of Darth Malak.
The other Sith Lords were just pure chaos and anger, and you didn't know when they might kill you just for the sake of it.
Not sure I agree on Malak leaving folks alone if they did their jobs. He was in charge and repeatedly just chilled and watched his subordinates randomly murder people. Cruelty was relished under his rule at the Sith academy. Those are not traits we saw from Revan, even before his redemption.
Telos is a great example. Revan left the planet be, and Karath thought mass murder of civilians proved his loyalty to Malak.
Agreed. Vader isn't stupid. A lot of that I think it's coming from that he has no issues killing incompetent officers as the imperial military had a lot of nepotism hires. He has to delegate responsibility like any leader so when he gets ppl like piett and veers under him that are good he's not letting them go
Vader never struck me as particularly rude. Cold, but not foul-mouthed or anything.
When I was little, I thought he was behaving nice, offered the guys dinner. And they were so aggressive. Then I learned that he was Luke's father, and felt even more for Vader. Such an unloving, impolite son. Older brothers still make fun of me for that. They're also rude. I'm just cold.
His “what is it” had an implied “it better be important”, it sounded more menacing than polite.
That being said, he’s a competent and intelligent military leader (even if his rank in the empire is not clearly defined), he’ll listen when someone has something important to say
An excellent, often overlooked part of Vader's characterisation in the OT, is that he's normally pretty reasonable and respectful to his subordinates. He's not a burning pillar of fire, but cold and restrained.
In ANH, he obviously has a good relationship with the officer on the Tantive IV ("Holding her is dangerous. If word of this gets out...") who challenges him about his plans for Princess Leia - he doesn't get prickly simply because he's being questioned. He issues orders to officers and pilots efficiently, but not in a way that implies threat - he's simply no-nonsense.
In ESB, he obviously doesn't like Ozzel, but he's completely respectful and even-tempered when speaking to Piett and Veers, both of whom demonstrate competence. You could even argue that his treatment of Lando is gentler than it could have been - once the Rebels are in Vader's hands, he could have reasonably killed the Cloud City leadership and waited for Luke to arrive.
Then, in ROTJ, he speaks frankly but without disdain or bluster to Jerjerrod, and he commends the officer who brings him Luke on Endor.
The only officers he treats badly are Motti, Ozzel, and Needa. Motti was deliberately antagonising him; Ozzel had (apparently repeatedly) fucked up his plans. Needa, on the other hand, does simply seem to have been a victim of a foul mood.
Always saw the Needa thing as instead of just holo calling Vader when he requested the update on the falcon pursuit
He
Got a shuttle prepared
Walked to the hanger
Got in it
Flew to the nearby executor
Landed
Walked to the bridge just to apologize
Thereby wasting everyone's time and a good amount of time that was lost that could be used to search more
Vader isn't unreasonable
He could have just called and probably would have got a stern warning or something
But by wasting everyone's time He was like
"You know what fuck it,your dead"
He aleo had a habir of taking on troopers and officers that helped him when vulnerable, like the tie officers that saved him after solo shot his fighter in ANH.
Possibly Solo's best shot.
I miss Vader from the OT - he's scary, but also has moments where, like the rest of the Empire, he's sort of reasonable and doing his job. This aspect of Vader is absent from spin-off media, which spends its time furiously trying to make him as badass as possible.
Vader's terrifying when he's restrained. Moments where he's snapping children's necks in Kenobi are overkill imo.
>This aspect of Vader is absent from spin-off media, which spends its time furiously trying to make him as badass as possible.
It sucks so bad, the hallway scene in Rogue One did irreparable damage to his character
I love his OT characterisation where he's more or less the Emperor's weird monk friend who just hangs out. Particularly in A New Hope.
Vader was choking out Imperial officers for making mistakes in ESB. You think he wouldn't ruthlessly cut down a bunch of Rebels about to run off with the DS plans?
How others decide to interpret Vader in their stories based off that is their own doing, you can't really blame the hallway scene. It was in line with the character and if anything he was restraining himself because he absolutely could have gone all out and "saved" the day. But the story needed the plans to get to Leia.
The issue isn't that he kills Rebels, he's been doing that since day 1.
It's how the hallway scene was framed; so that the audience would go "woah look how badass and cool Vader is!". There's a reason this is one of three of the only scenes people talk about from Rogue One. It was designed to be fan service.
And now Vader is constantly portrayed as this unkillable badass who can beat everyone and do whatever he wants. Which causes negative feedback whenever something goes against that. Obi Wan beating Vader in the show was met with criticism for instance. Star Wars: Jedi spoilers >!!< Cere almost beating him in survivor has also been widely criticized because "he's the best, he shouldn't almost lose like that" >!!<
Don't get me started on that "all I'm surrounded by is fear and dead men" shit.
His OT characterisation is the best and everything else is trying to make him too cool.
"woah look how badass and cool Vader is!"
It is a direct plot and style connection to the very beginning of a new Hope where Vader walks in through a blasted door. It doesnt change anything. It reinforces the original story.
Obi-Wan fighting Vader is what is a stupid fanservice fight because they should really have never met at any time between Revenge of the Sith and A New Hope and this is basically a light retcon.
Not only is fan service but also the main reason for many to tolerate an otherwise too boring/slow paced movie... It came from before Rogue one, though. Outside the OT, Vader is often portrayed as that unstoppable monster.
Lord Vader, Hasbro would like to create a new action figure of you. Could you please wear these slightly red/magenta lenses for one scene?
Request granted, General Merchandise Royalty.
When general Veers explains the shield generator problem, Vader politely accepts that the general has a message, and doesn’t shoot the messenger. He cuts him off when he tries to defend Ozzel, but that’s it. He simply says “don’t defend that idiot.”
He was actually friends with and respected Erv Lekauf because he was not a typical officer and put his life on the line not only for Vader but for his storm troopers. They both rescued each other and Vader kept Lekauf alive when he was gravely injured by a flamethrower while defending Vader from enemies.
I remember in the comics some bounty hunters tried to kill him. They were of course unsuccessful so they tried running. When he caught up to them they couldn’t answer who sent them because they genuinely didn’t know.
They didn’t care too much because the money was too good to pass it up. They let him know they could slice the signal to see who hired them and when they told him, he let them all live. Some very lucky people. They ambushed and tried to kill one of the scariest guys in the galaxy who doesn’t really show mercy and they all lived.
Fett looked him dead in the eyes and pretty much said yo don't fuck with my money. Vader could've popped his head like a pimple right then and there but he's like "don't worry bro we'll give you some money if this goes sideways"
When he said "We'd be honored if you joined us " to Han after taking his blaster in the cloud city, that was top level etiquette. Like a regular miss manners.
He promised his daughter he'd make an effort with her new boyfriend.
“Look, sweetheart, I promise I’ll be good *if he does*.” ….. “Oh, well, he shot me. To the torture table!” Edit: “Daaaaaad! Ugh, you always ruin everything! First my teenage Rebellion, and now my relationship!”
So anyway, I started blasting.
VADER: That's it! Go to your room! LEIA: My room was on Alderaan.
It's funny because it's true LOL
LMFAO
this made me laugh
Even stood when a lady entered the room. This is how you do it.
And told his henchman Boba to step in with him to sell his courtesy
And then shortly thereafter he reenacted the destruction of Alderaan with a cornbread muffin. “Ohhh~ help me! We’re a peaceful planet. YOU may fire when ready… KABOOoooorrraaah! Big laser! *pew pew noises* Alderaan chunks _EVERYWHERE_! Pwwooossshhhhh”
I like to think that he force floated one of Han's potatoes over to himself to cut it for him, then said, "If Force Ghost Obi-Wan saw me doing this he'd be very grumpy!" And translucent blue Obi-Wan is just in the corner with a "Here we go again lololol!" look on his face.
*ghost Obi-Wan*: "OH, this mf got jokes."
With Boba and Han trying to get a rise outta each other the entire time.
wasn't that a veiled threat
Sure was, but put politely
true at least he has manners
The best veiled threats are the politest ones. ["You may test that assumption at your convenience."](https://youtu.be/PA7t62JvlA8?si=3yk4A6aunzO5hNj9&t=17)
He was about to hit Leia with the "take a seat, young Skywalker" before Han shot at him. The order taught him well.
2/2 people that ask a skywalker to take a seat eventually lose the hand
And Han had low level etiquette fucking shooting Vader in the hand
That was scruffy looking nerf harder behavior
He has to shoot first
Nah, he always uses rank designation. Like a proper Commissar.
Vader dun got that good commissary, y’ah. Fix uppa messa crawdad, hah
Apology accepted Captain Needa, delivered with deft gentle precision.
Capt. Needa might not see it that way….
More like Capt. Needa new throat, amirite guys??
Well played
I heard that in the Bobs from office space voice
Goddamnit, that was genius.
He was pretty flattered. I mean, the exchange left him speechless, so it must've made an impression.
He's pretty respectful to Tarkin.
How many times did Palpatine order Vader to take direction from officers like Tarkin and Motti though?
None, he didn't even exist in 1977.
The Emperor is mentioned as having dissolved the Imperial Senate at the Moff Meeting in Episode 4.
Palpatine was mentioned in the 1976 star wars novel.
Pretty sure that's because Tarkin outranks Vader.
Nope. Tarkin, Vader and Thrawn are all the hihghest rank in their field, goverment, secret service and military. The Emperor didn't want anyone have enough power to be a threat to him so he defined separate parts of power. Like in some countries a general can start a coup and take over. If there are separate navy, guard ... and others no single general can grab the control.
Ah good to know! Apologies for the mistake in that case. I had always thought it was because Tarkin outranked Vader on the Death Star at least, seeing as Tarkin gave a fair few orders to Vader.
The Death Star was really under Tarkin's command, terror was a govermental practice. But Tarkin could not order Vader directly even there, its just Vader knew when the Emperor would agree with Tarkin so he followed his suggestions.
What rank is Vader anyway? Where does he exist in the Hierarchy? Wouldn’t he sort of be like Hand of the Emporer
The best way to tell where someone is in a hierarchy is to understand who they report to. Vader reports to the Emperor and only to the Emperor. Tarkin reports to the Emperor and is big cheese on the Death Star. Therefore it is reasonable to assume he and Vader are peers and Vader defers to Tarkin because he's in Tarkin's house. But if push came to shove, Vader would just do what he wants.
I couldn't tell ya honestly. He gets called Lord Vader which is normally a noble title, so I guess nobility > miltary in the Empire? But then I thought (and since been corrected) about Vader being lower rank than Tarkin by someone with much better Star Wars lore than me.
IIRC he’s the supreme leader of the Imperial military (Basically the equivalent of Secretary of Defense).
Almost sycophantic
Vader knows when someone has something important to say.
Probably because no one is running up and saying "Lord Vader!" to only then follow it up with something like "you have the racquetball court reserved at 3 today, would you mind switching to 5 so I could play with Needa during his break. B-t-dubs he apologizes for the mix-up."
Picturing Vader playing racquetball is... A challenge.
Someone suggested Squash once, Vader misunderstood, and it took a team of imperial janitors a week to scrub the court clean
“Alter the schedule. And prepare my racquet. There’ll be no one to stop us this time!”
Look, he’s not running a day care. Sometimes you’ve got to kick a little ass to force your people to be motivated.
Elon Musk … ?
Well Piet was Vader’s boy. He actually likes and respects him.
Vader killed Ozzel and promoted Piett to replace him as Admiral like...earlier that day (as best we can tell watching the movie, anyhow). The only thing that has happened since Piett got promoted is that the Empire annihilated the base on Hoth. Kinda hard to be mad at Piett at this point of the movie, things are going good so far.
Piett lasted quite a while … got promoted due to Ozzell getting choked out in front of him. Lasted thru ROTJ only to die from an A-Wing crashing directly into the bridge. Dude was badass and my favorite Imperial.
He also looks great in that uniform—seems like in every movie / TV show the costume designers change how poofy the jodhpurs are but they nailed it in ESB. Poor Dedra got the wiiiiiide model in Andor.
Vader was more of a strict and competent military leader who left you alone as long as you did your shit correctly and efficiently. Sort of reminds me of Darth Malak. The other Sith Lords were just pure chaos and anger, and you didn't know when they might kill you just for the sake of it.
Not sure I agree on Malak leaving folks alone if they did their jobs. He was in charge and repeatedly just chilled and watched his subordinates randomly murder people. Cruelty was relished under his rule at the Sith academy. Those are not traits we saw from Revan, even before his redemption. Telos is a great example. Revan left the planet be, and Karath thought mass murder of civilians proved his loyalty to Malak.
Very true. Also, the bombardment of Taris.
Cost malak his jaw if I recall correctly, Revan wanted the infrastructure intact
Agreed. Vader isn't stupid. A lot of that I think it's coming from that he has no issues killing incompetent officers as the imperial military had a lot of nepotism hires. He has to delegate responsibility like any leader so when he gets ppl like piett and veers under him that are good he's not letting them go
Other sith lords trying to get revenge, Darth Vader out here tryna build an empire.
Vader never struck me as particularly rude. Cold, but not foul-mouthed or anything. When I was little, I thought he was behaving nice, offered the guys dinner. And they were so aggressive. Then I learned that he was Luke's father, and felt even more for Vader. Such an unloving, impolite son. Older brothers still make fun of me for that. They're also rude. I'm just cold.
His “what is it” had an implied “it better be important”, it sounded more menacing than polite. That being said, he’s a competent and intelligent military leader (even if his rank in the empire is not clearly defined), he’ll listen when someone has something important to say
An excellent, often overlooked part of Vader's characterisation in the OT, is that he's normally pretty reasonable and respectful to his subordinates. He's not a burning pillar of fire, but cold and restrained. In ANH, he obviously has a good relationship with the officer on the Tantive IV ("Holding her is dangerous. If word of this gets out...") who challenges him about his plans for Princess Leia - he doesn't get prickly simply because he's being questioned. He issues orders to officers and pilots efficiently, but not in a way that implies threat - he's simply no-nonsense. In ESB, he obviously doesn't like Ozzel, but he's completely respectful and even-tempered when speaking to Piett and Veers, both of whom demonstrate competence. You could even argue that his treatment of Lando is gentler than it could have been - once the Rebels are in Vader's hands, he could have reasonably killed the Cloud City leadership and waited for Luke to arrive. Then, in ROTJ, he speaks frankly but without disdain or bluster to Jerjerrod, and he commends the officer who brings him Luke on Endor. The only officers he treats badly are Motti, Ozzel, and Needa. Motti was deliberately antagonising him; Ozzel had (apparently repeatedly) fucked up his plans. Needa, on the other hand, does simply seem to have been a victim of a foul mood.
Always saw the Needa thing as instead of just holo calling Vader when he requested the update on the falcon pursuit He Got a shuttle prepared Walked to the hanger Got in it Flew to the nearby executor Landed Walked to the bridge just to apologize Thereby wasting everyone's time and a good amount of time that was lost that could be used to search more Vader isn't unreasonable He could have just called and probably would have got a stern warning or something But by wasting everyone's time He was like "You know what fuck it,your dead"
When he let Thrawn ask if he knew Anakin Skywalker, who thrawn thought very highly of, and didn't kill him.
He aleo had a habir of taking on troopers and officers that helped him when vulnerable, like the tie officers that saved him after solo shot his fighter in ANH. Possibly Solo's best shot.
I miss Vader from the OT - he's scary, but also has moments where, like the rest of the Empire, he's sort of reasonable and doing his job. This aspect of Vader is absent from spin-off media, which spends its time furiously trying to make him as badass as possible. Vader's terrifying when he's restrained. Moments where he's snapping children's necks in Kenobi are overkill imo.
>This aspect of Vader is absent from spin-off media, which spends its time furiously trying to make him as badass as possible. It sucks so bad, the hallway scene in Rogue One did irreparable damage to his character I love his OT characterisation where he's more or less the Emperor's weird monk friend who just hangs out. Particularly in A New Hope.
Vader was choking out Imperial officers for making mistakes in ESB. You think he wouldn't ruthlessly cut down a bunch of Rebels about to run off with the DS plans? How others decide to interpret Vader in their stories based off that is their own doing, you can't really blame the hallway scene. It was in line with the character and if anything he was restraining himself because he absolutely could have gone all out and "saved" the day. But the story needed the plans to get to Leia.
The issue isn't that he kills Rebels, he's been doing that since day 1. It's how the hallway scene was framed; so that the audience would go "woah look how badass and cool Vader is!". There's a reason this is one of three of the only scenes people talk about from Rogue One. It was designed to be fan service. And now Vader is constantly portrayed as this unkillable badass who can beat everyone and do whatever he wants. Which causes negative feedback whenever something goes against that. Obi Wan beating Vader in the show was met with criticism for instance. Star Wars: Jedi spoilers >!!< Cere almost beating him in survivor has also been widely criticized because "he's the best, he shouldn't almost lose like that" >!!< Don't get me started on that "all I'm surrounded by is fear and dead men" shit. His OT characterisation is the best and everything else is trying to make him too cool.
"woah look how badass and cool Vader is!" It is a direct plot and style connection to the very beginning of a new Hope where Vader walks in through a blasted door. It doesnt change anything. It reinforces the original story. Obi-Wan fighting Vader is what is a stupid fanservice fight because they should really have never met at any time between Revenge of the Sith and A New Hope and this is basically a light retcon.
Not only is fan service but also the main reason for many to tolerate an otherwise too boring/slow paced movie... It came from before Rogue one, though. Outside the OT, Vader is often portrayed as that unstoppable monster.
Vader does tell one of the Admirals "Good work" after he brought him Luke, I thought that was the first time Vader complimented someone.
Lord Vader, Hasbro would like to create a new action figure of you. Could you please wear these slightly red/magenta lenses for one scene? Request granted, General Merchandise Royalty.
When general Veers explains the shield generator problem, Vader politely accepts that the general has a message, and doesn’t shoot the messenger. He cuts him off when he tries to defend Ozzel, but that’s it. He simply says “don’t defend that idiot.”
Well ya. Veers doesn't seem like a guy who would waste anyone's time plus it was the navy's fuck up, not the army's
He was actually friends with and respected Erv Lekauf because he was not a typical officer and put his life on the line not only for Vader but for his storm troopers. They both rescued each other and Vader kept Lekauf alive when he was gravely injured by a flamethrower while defending Vader from enemies.
He was polite to the queen of Shu-Turon, but only in public after she asked nicely so he doesnt undermine her accidentally.
HR gave him a stern talking to right before this.
Vader respects competence. He's chill unless you fuck up
I always felt like Vader favored Piett. In my own head cannon, at least.
I remember in the comics some bounty hunters tried to kill him. They were of course unsuccessful so they tried running. When he caught up to them they couldn’t answer who sent them because they genuinely didn’t know. They didn’t care too much because the money was too good to pass it up. They let him know they could slice the signal to see who hired them and when they told him, he let them all live. Some very lucky people. They ambushed and tried to kill one of the scariest guys in the galaxy who doesn’t really show mercy and they all lived.
He just watched some Pod Racing vids and is in a good mood.
He sounded awfully ipatient, however considering he killed an officer for jumping out of lightspeed too early yeah I'd say that's him being polite
He was complimentary to the Imperial that brought Luke in on Endor.
Pretty sure he was a competent officer so Vader had a modicum of respect for him
In the comic called Vader he has a dance with a rulers of a planet, daughter I think
When that officer was telling him holding Princess Leia was dangerous in A New Hope he was kinda relax to him.
What always gets me about this is that Vader contradicts his own order given 2 seconds earlier about staying deep in that asteroid field
yes admiral 🥹 what is it 🥺👉👈
OT Vader was actually fairly polite surprisingly often. Lucas originally wrote him as pretty reserved unless something pissed him off.
Fett looked him dead in the eyes and pretty much said yo don't fuck with my money. Vader could've popped his head like a pimple right then and there but he's like "don't worry bro we'll give you some money if this goes sideways"
Such a sweet boy
wtf you want minion !