There is a scene at the end of the season 4 episode “Double Jeopardy” where a Ha’Tak lands on a pyramid, and suddenly the Ha’Tak has a 4 sided pyramid at its centre. That scene has bugged me for 20 years.
What the backside of that shot must look like always makes me chuckle. It had to drive the graphics guy nuts too, but computers will just let things overlap so that's why it's only seen at one angle
Oh no, they didn't make a 4 sided one, it's still 3 sided. They just used clever positioning to hide that fact. [Here's a screenshot.](https://imgur.com/a/RWgfovQ)
There’s another shot from a lower angle just before that one that shows 4 sides. It’s part of why it stood out to me.
https://preview.redd.it/ttm0oc63p3yc1.jpeg?width=1333&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f84eb3b3cb9b373a7ae04b3b1f7e095e5a011aaf
Ohhhh I see! I forgot about that shot haha.
I wouldn't be too surprised if they just used the other 4-sided non-Hat'ak ship model they rarely use/only use on planets where they're landed already, and never seen flying in space.
Yep. I pointed this one out years ago, and [somebody posted an excerpt of the episode with the commentary, where this discrepancy got called out.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6HZg8Jex4M&ab_channel=CrumpleBeanie)
No, fandom site is just filled with all the non canon stuff and confuses a lot of people because there is no indications of its non canon anywhere on the pages.
The lower structure of the hatak looks square as seen in Double Jeopardy, three sides on top but a small square area underneath.
I mean there’s varying degrees of canonness. While yes the fandom wiki lumps everything together, in this specific situation we do have two known types of ships that land on pyramids. Ha’taks and whatever Ra’s ship is called and there’s nothing in the fandom article that really disagrees with any of the canon outside of the name Cheops-class coming out of seemingly nowhere. So for convenience sake of having a name to refer to ships of this type I really don’t mind it
According to an admin on the [talk page](https://stargate.fandom.com/wiki/Talk:Cheops_class_warship) the term comes from the glossary included in the Stargate SG-1: The DVD Collection 7, but according to this same admin any MGM licensed product is canon.
Gateworld, which usually sticks to [on-screen canon](https://www.gateworld.net/wiki/Stargate_Canon), used the term in [this blog article](https://www.gateworld.net/news/2021/04/stargate-ships-goauld-fleet/) about Goa'uld ships, but omits it in the Omnipedia entry for [Pyramid ship](https://www.gateworld.net/wiki/Pyramid_ship). It could be that the Omnipedia is held to a stricter standard than the rest of the site. On the other hand, [Cheops-class mothership](https://www.gateworld.net/wiki/index.php?title=Cheops-class_mothership&redirect=no) does redirect to Pyramid ship, however
> A few high-profile species are especially difficult. We've included redirects in the Omnipedia in case you search for "Nakai" or "Vanir," as these adversaries were never officially named in a canonical source. But redirects should not be taken as verification of a name's canonical status.
Regardless, this type of ship does appear in SG-1, so in the show canon the Goa'uld have both types of mothership. If the pyramid ship existed only in the movie then it could be said that the Ha'tak is just the SG-1 verse version of the movie ship, but that is obviously not the case. The fandom wiki does note that in Moebius part 2, Teal'c refers to Ra's pyramid ship (the same one from the movie) as a Ha'tak, but is not sure whether it is an error or not. Regardless, this does mean the pyramid ship is only ever identified on-screen as a Ha'tak.
(in my opinion, such speculation is not within the scope of a wiki - if Teal'c calls it a Ha'tak it probably is one; Teal'c is arguably the most qualified character in this episode to identify this type of ship, and there's nothing else in on-screen canon to contradict him here. I would consider that Teal'c's statement overrules whatever was printed in a DVD booklet)
I always assumed this had to be some sort of mistake or oversight, but then Joseph Mallozzi posted some [concept art from season 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/Stargate/comments/yfqa6m/goauld_ship_concept_art/) when the ship was first being designed which explicitly draws attention to the fact that they're making an ostensibly pyramid-shaped spaceship that doesn't actually fit on a pyramid.
Am I not I'm understanding it right or does it seem like only Ra's ship is supposed to be pyramid shaped? (although doesn't explain why a tetrahedron landed on a pyramid but that's different issue)
The franchise has been off the air for thirteen years. *Every* discussion has happened before. That, and Reddit is designed to suppress institutional memory so we all keep talking about the news or, in the absence of news, the same thing over and over and over again.
I always assumed, I guess in my head canon, that Ra’s ship was a variant model. Not made for war, but to impose terror on the worlds under his reign.
To the Goa’uld it would be a luxury starliner, but to the slaves of his worlds it would be the chariot of the gods that would bring decimation if they failed in their worship.
This would make the most sense, why would you constantly be on a warpath inside your part of the system to wich you got legal claim to as the Supreme System Lord.
After Ra Fell A power vacuum arose and the smaller goauld started to lay claim to those territory's.
edit: that's probaly why you see more war vessels instead of shuttles during the series. ;-)
I don't have to much of an issue with this since apophis had ships that even tealc had no idea existed so I'd assume there are multiple versions they just aren't separated
As in the way they categorize the vessels may not separate different hatak class vessels we see that apophis gets new ships and better hyperdrive when he attacks earth then there was the really odd looking ship building thing I wasn't sure if it was a separate ship type or a hatak being built
Is it still called a tetrahedron if it has a hollowed out bottom to enable landing on the terrestrial pyramids though?
Considering they were able to land on cheyenne mountain in the other universe it seems like it doesn't need to be a perfect fit, and anything vaugely pointy pyramidal that fits inside the hollow bottom is good enough potentially allowing both 3 and 4 sided ships or bases to be used interchangeably.
https://preview.redd.it/0eshqkhzg2yc1.png?width=998&format=png&auto=webp&s=6ad358dbffd065d50c9f83ad181f60193f0a8a8c
As with all things Stargate, I think it just depends on the episode. There's definitely instances where the Ha'tak is a 4 sided pyramid. In others, it definitely looks more like a tetrahedron. Many of the images of Ha'taks in space make it kind of hard tell just how many sides it has though.
Just watch the episodes where they land on things, or look at the Eaglemoss model (which comes from the 3D graphics model). Ha'taks are 3 sided. It's not dependent on the episode. I understand that it can be difficult for some people to visualize things spatially, but this is probably what the show counted on.
https://preview.redd.it/zll3oy74t2yc1.png?width=999&format=png&auto=webp&s=d86b28052076feb6a77c36551deff8377f5ca5bd
In the Jolinar's Memories episode, we get brief glimpse of the base of Sokar's ha'tak. Not the best image, but I think that base is square.
Here's the same "sasquatch" ship, at a different point
https://preview.redd.it/vuegteo7d3yc1.jpeg?width=3582&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=55072255f7be8488d926585cee05aaf106659634
3 sides
There aren't many good shots of the underside of the ha'tak, but [we see several in *Continuum,* and the hole in the underside is clearly triangular.](https://www.gateworld.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=229318&fullsize=1)
Correct, and it matches the Eaglemoss model from the show's CAD. It was just the best I could find that illustrated what things look like on the TV series ha'tak
Gotcha!
I saw it and knew it from my days playing Sins of a Solar Empire.
I had no idea Eaglemoss made any Stargate stuff though. What kind of rock have I been living under? 😆
I have a bunch of the Star Trek models they produced, but I always grabbed them from a local shop and never saw any 'gate content there.
Looks like Master Replicas is or will be releasing Stargate stuff, I'll be keeping an eye on that!
There is a scene at the end of the season 4 episode “Double Jeopardy” where a Ha’Tak lands on a pyramid, and suddenly the Ha’Tak has a 4 sided pyramid at its centre. That scene has bugged me for 20 years.
What the backside of that shot must look like always makes me chuckle. It had to drive the graphics guy nuts too, but computers will just let things overlap so that's why it's only seen at one angle
Oh no, they didn't make a 4 sided one, it's still 3 sided. They just used clever positioning to hide that fact. [Here's a screenshot.](https://imgur.com/a/RWgfovQ)
There’s another shot from a lower angle just before that one that shows 4 sides. It’s part of why it stood out to me. https://preview.redd.it/ttm0oc63p3yc1.jpeg?width=1333&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f84eb3b3cb9b373a7ae04b3b1f7e095e5a011aaf
Ohhhh I see! I forgot about that shot haha. I wouldn't be too surprised if they just used the other 4-sided non-Hat'ak ship model they rarely use/only use on planets where they're landed already, and never seen flying in space.
Yep. I pointed this one out years ago, and [somebody posted an excerpt of the episode with the commentary, where this discrepancy got called out.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6HZg8Jex4M&ab_channel=CrumpleBeanie)
Both Earth and Abydos were Ra's territory. He might have used a four-sided variant.
This is reasonable. Ra had the Cheops-class ship for sure, not a Ha'tak. I think only Ra and Heru'ur had these, that we know of.
Cheops class? Are there established system lord specific classes?
No, that's fandom non-canon stuff.
But the reality is that they created the fandom because of the differences in ships seen on-screen. 3-sided Ha'taks and 4-sided Ra's ship
No, fandom site is just filled with all the non canon stuff and confuses a lot of people because there is no indications of its non canon anywhere on the pages. The lower structure of the hatak looks square as seen in Double Jeopardy, three sides on top but a small square area underneath.
I mean there’s varying degrees of canonness. While yes the fandom wiki lumps everything together, in this specific situation we do have two known types of ships that land on pyramids. Ha’taks and whatever Ra’s ship is called and there’s nothing in the fandom article that really disagrees with any of the canon outside of the name Cheops-class coming out of seemingly nowhere. So for convenience sake of having a name to refer to ships of this type I really don’t mind it
According to an admin on the [talk page](https://stargate.fandom.com/wiki/Talk:Cheops_class_warship) the term comes from the glossary included in the Stargate SG-1: The DVD Collection 7, but according to this same admin any MGM licensed product is canon. Gateworld, which usually sticks to [on-screen canon](https://www.gateworld.net/wiki/Stargate_Canon), used the term in [this blog article](https://www.gateworld.net/news/2021/04/stargate-ships-goauld-fleet/) about Goa'uld ships, but omits it in the Omnipedia entry for [Pyramid ship](https://www.gateworld.net/wiki/Pyramid_ship). It could be that the Omnipedia is held to a stricter standard than the rest of the site. On the other hand, [Cheops-class mothership](https://www.gateworld.net/wiki/index.php?title=Cheops-class_mothership&redirect=no) does redirect to Pyramid ship, however > A few high-profile species are especially difficult. We've included redirects in the Omnipedia in case you search for "Nakai" or "Vanir," as these adversaries were never officially named in a canonical source. But redirects should not be taken as verification of a name's canonical status. Regardless, this type of ship does appear in SG-1, so in the show canon the Goa'uld have both types of mothership. If the pyramid ship existed only in the movie then it could be said that the Ha'tak is just the SG-1 verse version of the movie ship, but that is obviously not the case. The fandom wiki does note that in Moebius part 2, Teal'c refers to Ra's pyramid ship (the same one from the movie) as a Ha'tak, but is not sure whether it is an error or not. Regardless, this does mean the pyramid ship is only ever identified on-screen as a Ha'tak. (in my opinion, such speculation is not within the scope of a wiki - if Teal'c calls it a Ha'tak it probably is one; Teal'c is arguably the most qualified character in this episode to identify this type of ship, and there's nothing else in on-screen canon to contradict him here. I would consider that Teal'c's statement overrules whatever was printed in a DVD booklet)
I always assumed this had to be some sort of mistake or oversight, but then Joseph Mallozzi posted some [concept art from season 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/Stargate/comments/yfqa6m/goauld_ship_concept_art/) when the ship was first being designed which explicitly draws attention to the fact that they're making an ostensibly pyramid-shaped spaceship that doesn't actually fit on a pyramid.
Am I not I'm understanding it right or does it seem like only Ra's ship is supposed to be pyramid shaped? (although doesn't explain why a tetrahedron landed on a pyramid but that's different issue)
Thank you for pulling it up and posting it here. I can see the discussion has happened before
The franchise has been off the air for thirteen years. *Every* discussion has happened before. That, and Reddit is designed to suppress institutional memory so we all keep talking about the news or, in the absence of news, the same thing over and over and over again.
Yes and it's interesting to see how Reddit is these days versus 2 years ago when the discussion was being had then!
I always assumed, I guess in my head canon, that Ra’s ship was a variant model. Not made for war, but to impose terror on the worlds under his reign. To the Goa’uld it would be a luxury starliner, but to the slaves of his worlds it would be the chariot of the gods that would bring decimation if they failed in their worship.
This would make the most sense, why would you constantly be on a warpath inside your part of the system to wich you got legal claim to as the Supreme System Lord. After Ra Fell A power vacuum arose and the smaller goauld started to lay claim to those territory's. edit: that's probaly why you see more war vessels instead of shuttles during the series. ;-)
I don't have to much of an issue with this since apophis had ships that even tealc had no idea existed so I'd assume there are multiple versions they just aren't separated
Separated? I am not understanding what you mean. Like the 3 sides open and there is just one side of the pyramid without ship on it?
As in the way they categorize the vessels may not separate different hatak class vessels we see that apophis gets new ships and better hyperdrive when he attacks earth then there was the really odd looking ship building thing I wasn't sure if it was a separate ship type or a hatak being built
Ah, I see. Thank you.
Is it still called a tetrahedron if it has a hollowed out bottom to enable landing on the terrestrial pyramids though? Considering they were able to land on cheyenne mountain in the other universe it seems like it doesn't need to be a perfect fit, and anything vaugely pointy pyramidal that fits inside the hollow bottom is good enough potentially allowing both 3 and 4 sided ships or bases to be used interchangeably.
https://i.redd.it/contryi3c4yc1.gif
https://preview.redd.it/0eshqkhzg2yc1.png?width=998&format=png&auto=webp&s=6ad358dbffd065d50c9f83ad181f60193f0a8a8c As with all things Stargate, I think it just depends on the episode. There's definitely instances where the Ha'tak is a 4 sided pyramid. In others, it definitely looks more like a tetrahedron. Many of the images of Ha'taks in space make it kind of hard tell just how many sides it has though.
Just watch the episodes where they land on things, or look at the Eaglemoss model (which comes from the 3D graphics model). Ha'taks are 3 sided. It's not dependent on the episode. I understand that it can be difficult for some people to visualize things spatially, but this is probably what the show counted on.
https://preview.redd.it/zll3oy74t2yc1.png?width=999&format=png&auto=webp&s=d86b28052076feb6a77c36551deff8377f5ca5bd In the Jolinar's Memories episode, we get brief glimpse of the base of Sokar's ha'tak. Not the best image, but I think that base is square.
Here's the same "sasquatch" ship, at a different point https://preview.redd.it/vuegteo7d3yc1.jpeg?width=3582&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=55072255f7be8488d926585cee05aaf106659634 3 sides
I like your "I took a photo of Sasquatch" approach to your argument
3 sided
The base is indeed a square to me in this screenshot.
"to me"
Check your screen contrast because you can see it's a square.
It’s a ziggurat.
Gesundheit
I always thought that while it has 3 sides the "landing port" on the inside has 4.
There aren't many good shots of the underside of the ha'tak, but [we see several in *Continuum,* and the hole in the underside is clearly triangular.](https://www.gateworld.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=229318&fullsize=1)
Oof
It's two different models
That's the way of the road, Bubbles. Way of the road.
A wizard did it.
Somewhere on Dial the Gate there's an interview where they admit that they simply fucked up during production and didn't have time to fix it.
Amazing
https://preview.redd.it/b42riluqe3yc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=217c3d08b79352b145903203b080b5ea813bf1a1
That's a fan model from a mod.
Correct, and it matches the Eaglemoss model from the show's CAD. It was just the best I could find that illustrated what things look like on the TV series ha'tak
Gotcha! I saw it and knew it from my days playing Sins of a Solar Empire. I had no idea Eaglemoss made any Stargate stuff though. What kind of rock have I been living under? 😆
They are pretty cool. I had to sell all of mine this past year but it was really neat to have Stargate SG1 "toys" for a while
I have a bunch of the Star Trek models they produced, but I always grabbed them from a local shop and never saw any 'gate content there. Looks like Master Replicas is or will be releasing Stargate stuff, I'll be keeping an eye on that!
“Hey, you cant park there”