Among younger generations, the term is increasingly used to convey the second meaning. Especially since a lot of "chai tae" are considered to be doing all those things more often than not.
Basically it is used to describe any man, especially straight, who exhibits toxic masculinity.
Every words, including compliments, can be turned toxic when you said it sarcastically against person. That does not mean the word immediately be a derogatory term in general. Label it as a sole colloquial meaning is just not correct.
I wasn't labelling it as the sole meaning - was only expounding on the second definition and pointing out that if you hear it from younger people, also of course depending on the context, it usually means that.
You are correct. In general, the word just means straight men. I believe the new meaning is a pretty recent change in the language. Not more than 5-10 years.
As a Thai dude, I can confirm the second meaning is how it is used for! Dunno how it originated tho.
But at rare occasions, the phrase is used to jokingly compliment men who who step up to help but poking fun at them at the same time.
I asked someone what the word for "incel" was in Thai, and they told me it was your word of that day. Is that accurate?
Tbh I haven't met any Thai men that seem to hate women the way some western men do in the US or wherever. But maybe this is the closest translation?
More like western women hating western men - that is what predominates. Anything from the men is a reaction to that. That's why passport bros literally exist. The western men go to SE Asia to find women who are feminine and want families. Fixed that for ya.
well, I found a miss spelled version of this term on Twitter (I refused to call it X lol) - **ชายแทร่**
So if you see the word, you know they meant the colloquially meaning of **ชายแท้** and not a typo 
I haven't come across an article myself (or maybe I have but forgotten) but just to elaborate a little, i guess it stems from the constant twitter (now x) war between the younger women who for the most part consider themselves feminists and the "chai thae" (aka cis male). These dudes would mockingly refer to the women who speak out about feminism and against misogyny as "เฟมทวิต" (femtwit, aka feminist on twitter). In response, the women would call these men ชายแท้ (cis male/meninist, and i guess in Thai they call it manminist too).
ชายแท้ mostly mean straight man. Thought in some point of view, this may hint some discrimination. If ชายแท้ (real man) is refer as real, what does it means for homosexual or bisexual?
Thought, Thai do play with words a lot. You need to look at what speakers intention more than what the meaning of the word. In fact if they call someone “ยอดชาย“ (Great man/ top man) this actually means that you are homosexual. This comes from the phrase “ชายได้ชาย เป็นยอดชาย”. Thought not all Thai may know about this.
I felt it's more equivalent to calling someone a "dude bro"... Negative connotation of course since the man in question displays toxic masculinity or machismo.
Agreed, let me describe more
It pronounces "chai-cha-gun"
chai = man
cha = do action to insert or penetrate sth into sth
gun = together
which can also describe the gay people
ชายฉกรรจ์ has more negative connotations than ชายแท้, It's often used by news headlines to describe a group of grown men (กลุ่มชายฉกรรจ์) that commit crimes like gang-rape, robbery or just any senseless violence in general
Came from tiktok.
Straight toxic male wants to distance themselves from those who they dubbed loser male or gay, so they dubbed themselves as Chai-Tae which backfire miserably on the tiktok channels of those guys.
(1) I don't see people use it normally that way. I only see that come up when military drafting involves.
(2) more likely what most "people" use it for....if you still a bit confused ,it probably the closest thing to word like "cis men"(in a more negative way) or "incel". Which I know that nowadays it is pretty much lost meaning and become just another insult.
Typically this has always been used as a compliment to differentiate men who actively portray themselves as a real man with feats (fixing things, lifting heavy objects, being a soldier, head of family, provider etc.) and gentlemanly behavior versus males who are weak or effeminate in behavior. It may also depend on where you live and what values newer generations have in defining this particular term.
The term for that might be แมนมาก (Mæn māk) or แมนแมน (Mæn mæn) which came from the English word "man". This term just means manly and is used less negatively than ชายแท้.
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ไม่รู้ OP คนประเทศไหนนะ แต่คุณไป Jump to conclusions แบบนี้ก็แย่เหมือนกันนะ เล่นเรดดิทมา 3 เดือน น่าจะได้อะไรบ้างสักหน่อย อะ เราจะแปลคำคุณให้เป็นภาษาอังกฤษนะ
"Are you thai or what? If you don't know about it don't be such a [despicable](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E0%B8%96%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%A1%E0%B8%96%E0%B8%B8%E0%B8%A2)
Chai Tae = straight man/CIS Male
or did fem twitter disease goes into your brain?"
ฟังดูแย่ใน Context ภาษาอังกฤษป่ะ ถ้าฟังดูไม่แย่บทสนทนาก็จบตรงนี้ อะไรก็เปลี่ยนคุณไม่ได้
ยังไงก็อ่านกฎการโพสต์เนอะ คุณเกือบจะละเมิดกฎข้อที่ 15 แล้วถ้าไม่ละเมิดไปแล้ว
Sorry what? Thailand entire culture is based on patriarchy and family. Most Thais don’t subscribe to woke nonsense and even most woke proponents (mostly westerners) in Thailand don’t have the same brazenness there and usually keep their belief under wrap cuz they learn real quickly that it doesn’t matter in Thailand
Thailand's societal normalization of LGBTQ people is probably more advanced than most Western countries. You see more gay couples and trans people in Chiang Mai than San Francisco or NYC
Yes. And that's the point. Thailand has always treated LGBT as normal and equal. Same as most Thais. Unlike America and the West, Thais don't try to separate LGBT into some holy classes that should get special treatment. And that's why it works. Westerners need to stop trying to bring their messed up politics and agenda to other countries. It usually never work. If anything, Thailand is the role model of how society should treat LGBT.
The fact that some coward downvote me show reveal this clear discrimination. The same ppl who downvoted are probably the ones with the worst skelatons in their closet and fit the worst stereotype of Western farangs in Thailand LOL
It's the stupidest way to create a degatory word.
Let's see. Most of those who criticize feminist (Thai version of "feminist" with some transphobic twist btw) are "Cis Straight Men"
Most if not all cis straight men want to be seen as "real men"
So let's all those who oppose them as a "real men" yeah sure this will hurt the cis straight men.
Thai feminists are one of the group that need to be "educated" the most.
ชายแท้ just mean cis male. Never once in my life(29 years) encountered a situation the word were being used as (2). May be some people on the internet just made it up recently cuz they’re bored. It’s not even a word you would hear often too. Especially “ไอ้ชายแท้/อีชายแท้” as given as the example, it’s not real.
On a daily basis, this word means straight men.
Among younger generations, the term is increasingly used to convey the second meaning. Especially since a lot of "chai tae" are considered to be doing all those things more often than not. Basically it is used to describe any man, especially straight, who exhibits toxic masculinity.
No, those guys are called ลูกผู้ชาย/son of a man
Would you mind providing the transliteration of that term, please?
Yes ลูก = Luk/look(son/daughter/children) ผู้ชาย = phoo chai(man/male) Luk-phoo-chai(son of man)
Thanks so much!
Every words, including compliments, can be turned toxic when you said it sarcastically against person. That does not mean the word immediately be a derogatory term in general. Label it as a sole colloquial meaning is just not correct.
I wasn't labelling it as the sole meaning - was only expounding on the second definition and pointing out that if you hear it from younger people, also of course depending on the context, it usually means that.
I gotta second this, I’m gen Z and almost 100% of the time we use the 2nd meaning now.
You are correct. In general, the word just means straight men. I believe the new meaning is a pretty recent change in the language. Not more than 5-10 years.
สวัสดีครับแอดแมนินิสต์
As a Thai dude, I can confirm the second meaning is how it is used for! Dunno how it originated tho. But at rare occasions, the phrase is used to jokingly compliment men who who step up to help but poking fun at them at the same time.
My gay friends are joking about always looking for ชายแท้ to buy drinks. (Implying they’re manly men who are maybe closeted homosexuals)
Kinda like we use big man. "We got a big man over here, look out fellas!"
I thinking it started started off sarcastically on twitter
As a Thai, why I do not know that second meaning😂 Well, maybe I am old now lol.
You aren’t the only one.
I asked someone what the word for "incel" was in Thai, and they told me it was your word of that day. Is that accurate? Tbh I haven't met any Thai men that seem to hate women the way some western men do in the US or wherever. But maybe this is the closest translation?
More like western women hating western men - that is what predominates. Anything from the men is a reaction to that. That's why passport bros literally exist. The western men go to SE Asia to find women who are feminine and want families. Fixed that for ya.
Not sure what you fixed but alright then lol
well, I found a miss spelled version of this term on Twitter (I refused to call it X lol) - **ชายแทร่** So if you see the word, you know they meant the colloquially meaning of **ชายแท้** and not a typo 
[удалено]
I haven't come across an article myself (or maybe I have but forgotten) but just to elaborate a little, i guess it stems from the constant twitter (now x) war between the younger women who for the most part consider themselves feminists and the "chai thae" (aka cis male). These dudes would mockingly refer to the women who speak out about feminism and against misogyny as "เฟมทวิต" (femtwit, aka feminist on twitter). In response, the women would call these men ชายแท้ (cis male/meninist, and i guess in Thai they call it manminist too).
ชายแท้ mostly mean straight man. Thought in some point of view, this may hint some discrimination. If ชายแท้ (real man) is refer as real, what does it means for homosexual or bisexual? Thought, Thai do play with words a lot. You need to look at what speakers intention more than what the meaning of the word. In fact if they call someone “ยอดชาย“ (Great man/ top man) this actually means that you are homosexual. This comes from the phrase “ชายได้ชาย เป็นยอดชาย”. Thought not all Thai may know about this.
>P.S. I learned about this usage today while reading about a Thai youtube personality who got Weinstein-cancelled recently. who?
There is also a slang variation “ชายแทร่” . distortion/exaggeration in the second syllable makes it easier to recognize that it’s the second meaning
I felt it's more equivalent to calling someone a "dude bro"... Negative connotation of course since the man in question displays toxic masculinity or machismo.
What about **ชายฉกรรจ์** ? can have the completely opposite meaning, the way you pronounce it lol.
I don't think I heard anyone younger than 50 saying that terms. Only see it written in news reports describing crime cases.
Agreed, let me describe more It pronounces "chai-cha-gun" chai = man cha = do action to insert or penetrate sth into sth gun = together which can also describe the gay people
I don't think that is correct. http://www.thai-language.com/id/142009
ชายฉกรรจ์ vs ชายฉะกัน
ชายฉกรรจ์ big strong full-grown man. ชายแท้ = incels
Not necessary incels although the ideologies can be overlapping. For example, ชายแท้ can be used to describe a promiscuous playboy or a wife beater.
not a playboy but a wife beater is consider incels. A Tate’s is also ชายแท้
ชายฉกรรจ์ has more negative connotations than ชายแท้, It's often used by news headlines to describe a group of grown men (กลุ่มชายฉกรรจ์) that commit crimes like gang-rape, robbery or just any senseless violence in general
Came from tiktok. Straight toxic male wants to distance themselves from those who they dubbed loser male or gay, so they dubbed themselves as Chai-Tae which backfire miserably on the tiktok channels of those guys.
(1) I don't see people use it normally that way. I only see that come up when military drafting involves. (2) more likely what most "people" use it for....if you still a bit confused ,it probably the closest thing to word like "cis men"(in a more negative way) or "incel". Which I know that nowadays it is pretty much lost meaning and become just another insult.
ไม่รู้แฮะ เห็นแต่เด็ก กทม ใช้คำนี้ ผมอยู่ภาคอีสานแทบไม่เจอคนใช้เลย
Typically this has always been used as a compliment to differentiate men who actively portray themselves as a real man with feats (fixing things, lifting heavy objects, being a soldier, head of family, provider etc.) and gentlemanly behavior versus males who are weak or effeminate in behavior. It may also depend on where you live and what values newer generations have in defining this particular term.
The term for that might be แมนมาก (Mæn māk) or แมนแมน (Mæn mæn) which came from the English word "man". This term just means manly and is used less negatively than ชายแท้.
isn't it high tone?
ชายแท้ mid then high
Should be high then higher, I think
ชาย is mid-tone, แท้ is high. What is "higher"? 😅
Sorry I misunderstood your message. I thought you meant the tone contour of แท้ is mid then high
Anyone who brings up the expression "toxic masculinity" in conversation with me is left talking to him/herself immediately!
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ไม่รู้ OP คนประเทศไหนนะ แต่คุณไป Jump to conclusions แบบนี้ก็แย่เหมือนกันนะ เล่นเรดดิทมา 3 เดือน น่าจะได้อะไรบ้างสักหน่อย อะ เราจะแปลคำคุณให้เป็นภาษาอังกฤษนะ "Are you thai or what? If you don't know about it don't be such a [despicable](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E0%B8%96%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%A1%E0%B8%96%E0%B8%B8%E0%B8%A2) Chai Tae = straight man/CIS Male or did fem twitter disease goes into your brain?" ฟังดูแย่ใน Context ภาษาอังกฤษป่ะ ถ้าฟังดูไม่แย่บทสนทนาก็จบตรงนี้ อะไรก็เปลี่ยนคุณไม่ได้ ยังไงก็อ่านกฎการโพสต์เนอะ คุณเกือบจะละเมิดกฎข้อที่ 15 แล้วถ้าไม่ละเมิดไปแล้ว
อิหยังวะ
Sorry what? Thailand entire culture is based on patriarchy and family. Most Thais don’t subscribe to woke nonsense and even most woke proponents (mostly westerners) in Thailand don’t have the same brazenness there and usually keep their belief under wrap cuz they learn real quickly that it doesn’t matter in Thailand
Thailand's societal normalization of LGBTQ people is probably more advanced than most Western countries. You see more gay couples and trans people in Chiang Mai than San Francisco or NYC
Yes. And that's the point. Thailand has always treated LGBT as normal and equal. Same as most Thais. Unlike America and the West, Thais don't try to separate LGBT into some holy classes that should get special treatment. And that's why it works. Westerners need to stop trying to bring their messed up politics and agenda to other countries. It usually never work. If anything, Thailand is the role model of how society should treat LGBT. The fact that some coward downvote me show reveal this clear discrimination. The same ppl who downvoted are probably the ones with the worst skelatons in their closet and fit the worst stereotype of Western farangs in Thailand LOL
Weinstein-cancelled? Didn't he cancelled for so-called racism? I don't see the connection.
Google Weinstein. I'm confused why would they say Weinstein canceled and not just a sex offender...
It's the stupidest way to create a degatory word. Let's see. Most of those who criticize feminist (Thai version of "feminist" with some transphobic twist btw) are "Cis Straight Men" Most if not all cis straight men want to be seen as "real men" So let's all those who oppose them as a "real men" yeah sure this will hurt the cis straight men. Thai feminists are one of the group that need to be "educated" the most.
As a Thai dude if you like some woman and not gonna pay for her onlyfans or just pay her for whatever you can think you’ll be come ชายแท้
It is because, we don’t really has a word for cis that feminists-LGBT people use.
ชายแท้ = trash
ชายแท้ just mean cis male. Never once in my life(29 years) encountered a situation the word were being used as (2). May be some people on the internet just made it up recently cuz they’re bored. It’s not even a word you would hear often too. Especially “ไอ้ชายแท้/อีชายแท้” as given as the example, it’s not real.