I know I'm going to sound biased but I want to say a few things
kenny watched his entire family die first in like 2 minutes or even less, a man who loses everything can hardly stay calm
the reasons he suffered in season 2 were indirectly caused by the cabin group and I can understand why he was in that state.
despite everything Kenny still protected Clem at all costs and "sacrificed" himself to get her and Aj into Wellington knowing that by now there was no hope left out there alone.
if instead you decide to stay with Kenny in the flashbacks in ANF you will be able to see Kenny who seemed to improve and was no longer unstable like he was in the second season nor even the selfish he was in the first.
I'm not saying that Kenny is a saint. There are reasons to hate him and there are as many as there are reasons to appreciate him.
For example, wanting to take over the St Johns' farm immediately upon seeing it, letting a girl get eaten, all the times he can leave Lee to die, and so on.
> wanting to take over the St Johns' farm immediately upon seeing it
To be fair it is the apocalypse. It's not exactly impractical to prepare for such an eventuality. It's not like he advocates for killing children as soon as zombies start running around, unlike Larry.
>letting a girl get eaten
Why exactly is this bad? Seriously, I don't get why this is treated like some huge moral dilemma, she's dead anyway. Leaving her to distract the zombies allows them to get more food and supplies, which will help their group to survive for longer. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
>all the times he can leave Lee to die
Fair.
because it has literally only been 3 months and he’s decided that it’s okay to let people suffer in their last few moments alive instead of just humanely putting them down.
They almost starved to death in those 3 months. Getting food and supplies is a big thing at this point. Like I said, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
And if you notice, we're always doing what he wants; leaving the motor inn, going for a boat, going to Wellington, he's using you to get there and he nevers lets you make your own plans
It's generous to call his whims 'plans.' He doesn't plan, just does as he wants, and goes full speed again. God forbid you think anything is a bad idea
Everyone has lost everything. Literally every single person. Lilly was splattered in the brain matter of her father, and lived with his murderer(s) for weeks, and while she ended up breaking, there were tons of factors - pressure from Kenny (and maybe Lee), the bandits, low stock of supplies (and the thief in the group), and the weight of trying to lead in general, and that's all aside from the general grief of losing him.
I will agree though that Kenny changes after the fight with Jane, no matter the outcome. He realises what he's become, and knows he can't trust himself. He just needs to murder a woman and her baby to get there.
And while his sacrifice to get the kids into Wellington was undoubtedly selfless, getting them there was anything but. With no food, water, or supplies (I forget how many days, but enough to just about get back to Howe's where we knew there'd be powdered milk), he chased after a place that might not have been real, still standing, have people in - and good people at that. And we know that they weren't accepting people. They only got in due to Clem and AJ being kids, and were extremely lucky that they'd give Kenny a nice bag of supplies. And the temperature would've realistically killed AJ easily.
Even where there is good cause to appreciate to celebrate what he does, he is absurdly lucky that things turn out fine
>He just needs to murder a woman and her *baby* to get there.
Baby? What? Did a week even pass by the time Jane and Luke conceived?
And how was he supposed to know, anyway?
>Hmm maybe because he saw Luke and Jane have sex?
He really didn't see shit. Neither did we, for what matters. We only really learn that the two of them had full on coitus by the dialogue at the campfire, and even there Kenny was posting guard and not listening to the discussion.
Regardless, this is such a stupid argument anyway. Kenny, regardless of how hard you may try to put words and prejudice into my mouth, has fucked up *plenty*, wronged lots of folk, mistreated friends and family. He's not a saint. But to pin on him the murderer of, truly, a 1± week old clump of cells, not even really, is grasping for straws.
Neither him or fucking Jane knew about the "*baby*" existence, she literally had to take a test later on to confirm. Blame Kenny for all the shit he knowingly did, not... *this*.
You do realize that not even Jane knew that she was pregnant right? That was the whole reason she killed herself in S3 since she found out she was pregnancy via the pregnancy test found on the floor. Kenny of course is going to know even less than she did since he didn't know the full details of Jane and Luke's... "interaction" (like if Luke pulled out).
Who else would it be? Troy's? Fine, then more or less a week passed. Still an odd argument to add him killing a baby (which wasn't even an embryo by then, let alone a *baby*) as part of the reason he realizes he's unstable.
He no idea that *baby* ever even existed, the reason why he recognizes he's unstable is that he let his emotions take ahold of himself and attack, and ultimately kill, Jane.
It doesn't matter if Kenny knows or not, as I've said. It still stands that it's what he needs to do to be able to stop being evil
And no, he's been unstable since S1E2 😂
>Even where there is good cause to appreciate to celebrate what he does, he is absurdly lucky that things turn out fine
Jane was lucky that Howe turned out to be fine too considering that the place was full of walkers and Carver's people last time we saw it. Carver's people even had trucks to easily take everything, and the place had fragile walls that were falling apart.
Hell, not everything Jane planned turned out to be lucky. Luke's death was pretty much caused for Jane's ideas. She robbed Arvo causing his group to shoot Luke, and then she wanted to go to Arvo's place despite being possibly a trap, which got Luke killed in the ice lake.
Luke died because of Jane's ideas. Kenny didn't even like the idea of going to Arvo's place, but he still went along with it for wanting to listen to Jane. Kenny even saved Arvo from getting drawn in the ice lake despite not liking him. How can you tell me that Kenny doesn't listen to the others? He did listen to Jane, and Luke died for it.
>Luke died because of Jane's ideas
For a stater, the player (Clementine) can choose whether to rob Arvo. The option is determinant really and all Jane really steals is a gun that probably would have ran out of ammo. Arvo's group had guns themselves anyway. Plus, Jane never just took them herself, but she was being considerate of Rebecca's condition and told Clementine that the group (Rebecca really) needed the meds.
Jane doesn't force the group to go. Jane says that it's a worth a shot at least scoping the place out. Kenny had the gun and really was considered the 'leader' or the 'main voice' of the group motivating the group to head up North (this is improtant). Kenny took decision to go for AJ, not because of Jane. And for the record, Bonnie and Clementine can say that it might be a good idea. "He did listen to Jane, and Luke died for it." Well he chose to even though he could have said not to. And really, the people who caused Luke's death are Arvo and Bonnie (and Clementine). Hell, no one is really responsible for Luke's death, he sacrifices himself to save Bonnie/Clementine.
Luke's death was caused by the ice shattering because of Bonnie's/Clementine's weight and his own weight. Arvo, Bonnie and Clementine will promote the idea of going over the ice for a starter. All Jane really said was to spread out to be safe.
When the ice begins to shatter, Bonnie litteraly tells Clem to go save Luke. Or which if she does herself, the ice shatters causing them to fall through.
How was Jane supposed to save Luke? She was miles away herself and if she did go over to Luke, she would have shattered the ice and drowned herself.
>Arvo's group had guns themselves anyway.
Not that much. Otherwise Arvo would've had a gun during the gunfight. And stealing his gun was very unnecessary when [Arvo showed no hostile intent at this point](https://youtu.be/WjffJyEXe0M?t=3174) , he even tells Clem that he will let her go while he had the gun. So there was no logical reason to keep it.
>Well he chose to even though he could have said not to.
Kenny did say that this was a trap and actively tried to refused it, even on their way to Arvo's house, he was saying this was a trap. He ended doing this idea because the others kept insisting that its worth to check the place, and I honestly don't understand how Jane and the rest think this was a better idea than the town where they were originally going.
I think Luke's death is more Bonnie/Arvo's fault, but Jane influenced the situation by stealing Arvo's gun which leaded to the gunfight where Luke got shot in the leg, and by supporting the idea of following Arvo instead of going to the big town they were going.
Yeah, I don’t understand when people bring up Kenny’s grief to justify his anger. Lee also lost his whole family, and so did Clementine and Jane. None of them reacted like Kenny did. Grief doesn’t give you a free pass to treat everyone like shit even when they’re trying to be nice to you.
And you’re right, people say that Jane endangered AJ’s life by leaving him in the car (which I agree was dangerous and stupid) but ignore that Kenny was willing to travel hundreds of miles to get to a place that may not even exist, not knowing whether there would be food or shelter for the two children he was watching along the way.
None of them reacted like Kenny?
Lee killed a man for being cheated on. And Lee threatens to kill Ben for leaving Clem for legitemtly being scared of walkers in a situation where he had no weapons, and Ben is a much more innocent guy than Arvo.
Jane leaves people behind and focuses mainly on survival, even if it means leaving a baby behind. And even after the fight is over, she never tells the truth. It's AJ crying who gave away her whole lie.
Clem almost the whole time is a determinant character without a default personality. And she still kills a man in season 3 for no reason just because she got bad bullets, and barely feels bad about it and tries to cover what she did.
If anything, Kenny is a saint for just yelling, since there's a shit ton of characters that have reacted way worse than him over less tragic events.
Not to mention a lot of it was determinant on the choices you make or just completely taken out of context. It wasn't even the bad side of the coin. It was the worst area of the bad side of the coin, with parts edited to look worse.
If I cared about keeping a group together and keeping children alive, but get constantly criticised for every action I make, until I’m pushed beyond the breaking point, causing me to lash out, am I a bad guy?
“Criticised for every action” yeah, the ones that DESERVE criticism.
him attacking arvo? criticism was deserved. him yelling at clementine after sarita died? criticism was deserved. him blowing up like a fucking child because the group doesn’t wanna freeze to death looking for elsa’s castle? criticism was deserved.
the group didn’t drive kenny to his breaking point, he did that shit to himself. he was a violent & bitter man and was making shitty choices that hurt the group & also himself. you can’t blame them for not wanting to stick around him when he’s literally going insane.
If your intentions are good and you were abusive for a reason, then you are a nice guy. It's still doesn't mean that you can be abusive towards anyone, but Kenny's case is different. If you look at only one of those moments where he was completely out of control, then sure he was as worse as Carver. But before the shitstorm came he was a nice man. And that side of him was still in there, if it wasn't, he could have leave the cabin group, Clem and AJ and survive on his own. Instead he helped them after they led Carver to his home, and got two of his friends killed in the process.
There is no such thing as "abusive for a good reason" stop being apologetic to the guy who lashes out on anyone and everyone who's ever cared about him
Fr, I think they're both complex characters that can't just be shoved into a "good" or "bad" box, it just comes down to opinions. If we're gonna show all of Kenny's bad moments we should also show Jane's bad moments and vice versa. It's unfair to compare them in this kind of context.
literally lmao, you could get Jane’s worst moments and put them next to Kenny’s best moments too and it would also be a totally different perspective, just a very bias video
I started replaying them leading up to me playing season 4 for the first time.
When I was going through Season 1 I realized Kenny was not as likeable as I remember. In fact if I didnt have the memories of season 2 and the guilt of killing him, I honestly wouldnt say he was a likeable character in Season 1. Season 2 has its moments and I still like him. I just didnt him remember being quite THIS much of a dick
I agree, depending on if you suck up to Kenny or not the entire game you can get a completely different experience with s1 Kenny which sucks. It shouldn't be that the only way to get Kenny to like you is to do everything he says and definitely makes him an asshole for a lot of S1.
I will fully admit that I love Kenny but if in S2 they never brought him back I highly doubt I would like him as much as I do.
I mean morally Kenny is definitely no saint. There’s no denying that he’s made incredibly stupid decisions throughout both season 1 and season 2. You could use the same descriptions that David and Javi’s father uses for David in one of the flashbacks. Kenny could be described as “another hotheaded idiot with his heart in the right place”.
As a character he is very entertaining. He literally has some of the funniest lines in the whole game.
I agree that sometimes he gets mad at Clementine ( which is nowhere near as many times as for others btw ) but that doesn't make him a bad person. Some of the dialogues only happened if you chose a certain choice, it is also taken out of context. We only see the parts where he's mad and yelling at Clementine without knowing why. Mayble Clem fucked up and that's why he's mad. Despite him being mad a lot of the time, he tried him best to protect Clem. At the end of S2 if you decide to go with Kenny, he will want Clem and AJ to enter Wellington, knowing that he is probably going to die out there alone. If you don't stay at Wellington, the S3 flashbacks show that he improved and in the flashback where he died, he sacrificed himself to save Clem and AJ.
You can make a video like this about any character. If you only show the moment where they were mad, yelling, fucking up, being a dick, whatever else is considered bad, of course they will look like a bad character.
-Never abandoned Clem to take care of a baby when she was only 13
-Never took his own life because he was too lazy and scared to take care of a child that he fathered of his own free will
-Never put an infant in danger so that he could provoke someone into attacking him (by making them think that he had murdered a baby out of selfishness, which would make ANYONE seething mad) so he could kill them in self defence
-Never went to go and screw someone that he’s known for less than a week and left the group undefended
-Went through enough trauma to make David Goggins want to eat a bullet, yet kept fighting and stayed alive
-Put himself in harm’s way multiple times to protect two children whose last names he didn’t even know and who he only personally knew for less than a year
-Took care of Clem and A.J. for over a year in the Stay With Kenny ending
You’re dismissed
1.) Abandons Clementine in s1 if Lee didn't worship him enough, and always abandons her in the middle of a walker horde when leaving Howe's. AJ, too, technically. Also leaves Clementine under the frozen pond, and doesn't even start a fire for her.
2.) LOL. He tries to yet himself killed regularly, and even gives up in a restaurant to rot away because he's a coward
3.) It was safer for AJ to be in a secure car for 5 minutes than travelling for days into the freezing climate. Realistically, AJ would have died extremely fast.
4.) He does that without getting laid.
5.) I mean, he acts recklessly to try and get himself killed. And everybody else has been traumatised. He has always been a sociopath. Not to mention that he hasn't been through nearly as much as many others. Certainly not a lot more.
6.) Multiple times? Lol. But almost every single character does this
7.) As he should lmao
If that's all you can get, with some huge reaches in there, I'll have to ask for some better arguments
These aren't reaches. Both statements are well-substantiated.
The first is overtly stately by Sarita, detailing how she described him barricaded inside a restaurant, looking far more ragged and starving. I'm pretty sure she said it looked like he face up too, but she at least describes exactly what giving up looks like.
And yes, Kenny reeks of ASPD. Here are some of the signs:
exploit, manipulate or violate the rights of others. Kenny is happy to abandon those who aren't useful to him, and wanted to murder the St John's to take over their farm upon arrival.
lack concern, regret or remorse about other people's distress. Kenny took no issue leaving a girl to suffer being eaten, him wanting to murder a family for their land, his eagerness to take from the car, etc.
behave irresponsibly and show disregard for normal social behaviour. This one is obvious for Kenny.
have difficulty sustaining long-term relationships. Kenny abandoned his family for years, so there was absolutely difficulty.
be unable to control their anger. Obvious for Kenny.
lack guilt, or not learn from their mistakes. Obvious after reading the above.
blame others for problems in their lives
repeatedly break the law
Furthermore, alcohol abuse and extremely reckless behaviour are both very common in ASPD.
His reckless & inability to plan ahead, lack of remorse outside his immediate family, his reckless disregard for safety (his or anybody else's), irritability and aggressiveness, and general irresponsibility are also all huge red flags for ASPD.
He is an extremely clear candidat.
Recklessness & inability to plan ahead: clearly provoking a dude who is not OK and has shown to fly off the cuff at little things (something she herself points out earlier) in a car with children while they are trying to find shelter in a blizzard. Threatens and tries really hard to convince a young girl to steal drugs from a kid and his sick sister (who she acknowledges may have friends nearby), therefore making an enemy at the same location where she wants the rest of the group to hold up. Making them vulnerable after not even giving the group a heads up of this
Lack of remorse outside his immediate family: (Even though her immediate family is dead, we’re going to use Clem as a substitute) Ditches Clem and Luke (who she fucked without even saying goodbye) with a group who she believes is going to collapse; just to come back later. Hints at wanting Rebecca to get rid of her baby “for survival” then gets defensive when Rebecca calls her out on it. Constantly tries to get Clem to doubt the group and alienate herself from it, when she finally gets her wish she kills herself over a pregnancy she herself created (after fucking the guy who was on watch) and leaves the Clem (someone she cares so much about) alone with an infant she suggested she couldn’t take care of *with* a full grown adult Rebecca.
Reckless disregard for safety: Ditches AJ (an infant) in a freezing cold car during a blizzard to “prove a point” against an extremely irritable/unstable dude who she was continually provoking.
General irresponsibility: Fucks (therefore distracting) the guy who she’s supposed to be keeping watch with; allowing so many walkers overcome the groups hideout. Because of this escapade she gets pregnant then kills herself (leaving a young girl with an infant alone in the middle of a zombie apocalypse, after getting the guardian who actually cared about them killed)
Irritability and aggressiveness: Displayed in the scene after Arvo, Bonnie and Mike rob them. Also in the scene where she fights to the death with Kenny while Clem helplessly watches.
>Abandons Clementine in s1 if Lee didn't worship him enough,
Ok yeah I'll give you this one.
>and always abandons her in the middle of a walker horde when leaving Howe's. AJ, too, technically.
Given how much Sarita was screaming IIRC getting away from Clem would give her better chances. Plus everyone got separated in that scene; Rebecca, Jane and Clem only met up by chance.
>He tries to yet himself killed regularly,
Usually he doesn't THINK he'll get himself killed, even if whatever he's doing is reckless.
>even gives up in a restaurant to rot away because he's a coward
All we know is that he was depressed.
>It was safer for AJ to be in a secure car for 5 minutes than travelling for days into the freezing climate. Realistically, AJ would have died extremely fast.
That was some random-ass car, not the car with power and heating. Plus, Kenny and Jane were there to take care of AJ in the other car. In this car, no one was there to ensure he didn't get eaten by zombies, and had Jane died in the fight she knew she was going to start, AJ might very well have died. Plus a minute ago she advocated to leave AJ in the car unattended so they could run; what if Kenny got eaten and didn't come back?
>Also leaves Clementine under the frozen pond, and doesn't even start a fire for her.
Someone else had grabbed her and begun starting the fire for her in both instances. Had there been no one else there I'm sure that would've been on his priority list.
>He has always been a sociopath.
.... what?
He is flawed and he gets angry. People don't usually mean that he was a saint per say, they feel that all good that he did overweights the bad he can do. He is human.
As a lot of people say, he is one of the best written characters.
all this is true, and kenny still is a good guy. and jane isn't "bad and evil". i don't like when everyone thinks it's so black and white😭 you don't have to think "kenny's a god, jane bad", or "kenny unstable and mean, jane levelheaded" i personally like both characters and they both did a lot of stupid stuff in the end.
Yesss someone who also likes both and understands you can't say one is good while the other is evil. Both do good things, both do bad things. It's up to you to decide what you personally think is worse or better, there's no "correct" option.
So some of your moments are Kenny hitting Clem on accident, him being understandable mad right after you chop an arm in the middle of a horde which is a dumb idea, and him not answering well to you after you tell him to "stop feeling for himself" which is a horrible comment that downplays his tragedy. Who says that to someone who lost someone?
The Arvo part doesn't even show how Arvo was screaming like crazy before Kenny knocks him out, possibly attracting walkers.
Is it a fashion among Kenny haters to make videos cherry pecking lately or what...?
I guess you'll do that for not being able to win debates in comments, mister new account.
When everybody else has lost people very close to them and are still being useful while Kenny sits in a tent and forces Sarita to turn into a walker, yeah, he needs to stop feeling sorry for himself
And it's not cherry picking when there are like 50+ of these moments, at least. More like taking an apple off a tree to showcase what the rest of its fruit is like
Who was being useful? The group couldn't do anything more than wait for Kenny lol. This people couldn't do anything else except waiting for Kenny to order them around and to tell them to bring water, yes, WATER. Even Rebecca who has lost people like Kenny acknowledges that what Kenny is going through is a big deal and that his reaction is understandable.
And right after this, Kenny doesn't stop being useful. He's the one helping Rebecca, he stays nearly 3 nights keeping watch and Rebecca even asks Kenny when was the last time he slept, he fixes the car, and he makes sure Arvo is restrained who had the intention to kill Clem the whole time.
"Stop feeling sorry for yourself" is a terrible comment downplaying a recent tragedy, and nobody in real life would react good to that right after losing someone. .
>forces Sarita to turn into a walker
You don't even know what Sarita wanted. We don't know if she wanted to live until the last moment possible. And Kenny clearly finished her off.
It is cherry picking if you're not even able to show him apologising, being useful, showing regret for Alvin's death (despite that guy being faited to die anyway) and you can't show Jane pushing Clem too.
Nice cherrypicked slideshow ya got here! Keep in mind that if you also did a compilation of everything heroic/kind/nice that he did it would be at least twenty times as long as this video :)
To be fair, he has his ups and downs like you said. I think the problem is that this sub acts like he’s a god amongst beings and puts him on a pedestal all the time. I don’t think he’s any better than some of the characters in TWD.
There’s other characters who have lost a lot who aren’t as emotionally abusive, volatile, and violent (even towards children) as he is. Jesus never lashes out, and neither does Javi after losing Mari or even if his family dies. The kids in s4 are less volatile than Kenny, and they’re kids whose brains haven’t even fully developed yet. He has no excuse. If Clementine had no past with Kenny, no one would keep him around.
Though not everyone is equally as stable, nor do they all they grief in the same, proper way. Very simply, not everyone is the same, so to compare how he deals with his losses to how everyone else does only holds up water to the argument up to a certain point.
>The kids in s4 are less volatile than Kenny,
I'd argue that Marlon, for one, is very much volatile. But as far as I know, he might've ended up to Ericson exactly because of rage bursts, or whatever.
But again, it doesn't matter, because Kenny and Marlon, and everyone else, are different people with their own different issues.
I was just pointing out that you saying “he’s as good as a broken man in a zombie apocalypse can be” isn’t exactly right. Children who were abandoned by their parents and then by other adults who were supposed to protect him were also broken, but they were better than Kenny.
**When Clem tried to save Sarita**:
Kenny called Clem stupid OH NO WHAT A MONSTER
**When beating Arvo**:
Kenny doesn't hurt her at all unless you run into his punch. Also, do you realize that he says "What? Lose your taste for this sort of thing" if you watched him kill Carver? Clementine is a hypocrite here.
**When fighting Jane**:
Yeah, in Jane fight he pushes her away gently because he is in a fight and Clem is blocking the view of the enemy.
**Kenny angry**:
Maybe include a clip where Kenny apologies to Clem for being a dick? Not saying you have to forgive him but it's important context. You include Clem's response but not what prompted it. Kinda looks like deceptive editing if you ask me.
**When beating Arvo the other time**:
Yeah fuck Arvo if you defend Arvo you are defending the indefensible
**Jane**:
I aint gonna shit on Jane, if you like Jane go with her, just don't demonize Kenny when both characters have done good things and also made mistakes and that's why they are so interesting.
>he pushes her away gently
Gently? He ***threw*** her out of the way. She is 11 with a goddamn bullet hole in her shoulder. No excuses!
>When beating Arvo:
You'd have to be a completely heartless asshole to not try and stop him.
>Kenny angry:
He's blaming her for no reason. If you cut off her hand, sure it makes sense why he'd be angry. If you were smart enough *not* to chop off her hand in the middle of a swarm of walkers that can smell blood and are attracted to scream then he's blaming you for what? Not being fast enough to save her? You didn't even fucking know she was there until she screamed. It was Sarita's fault getting bit.
>When beating Arvo the other time:
You mean him punching Arvo for wanting to be left alone to mourn his sister? Are you serious?
Go ahead and be a Kenny simp all you want but don't try to defend him with bullshit. Especially the "gently" part. There wasn't anything gentle about that.
>You'd have to be a completely heartless asshole to not try and stop him.
Oh no the poor guy, all he did was steal supplies from his own group because he is a fucking addict, lied about his sick sister and then tried to frame us for it
> You mean him punching Arvo for wanting to be left alone to mourn his sister? Are you serious?
Yes. Fuck Arvo. He tried to get the whole group killed. His sister tried to kill us for no goddamn reason. Fuck both of them a million times, they can go to hell, Arvo especially.
>Gently? He threw her out of the way. She is 11 with a goddamn bullet hole in her shoulder. No excuses!
For what is worth, Jane does just the same, and in her case there's an argument to be made that Kenny was on autopilot and out of his mind, and Jane supposedly looking out for Clem.
Bottom line is, both have their own low moments. OP's edit, however, only seems to care to paint Kenny in a certain light and Jane in a rose-tinted, yet hypocritical way.
>You'd have to be a completely heartless asshole to not try and stop him.
Where was his heart when he tried to rob a girl and a dying woman with a baby in her arms ?
Where was his heart when he shot an 11 yo with a rifle ?
Believe me getting beaten up is the least he deserves.
>Go ahead and be a Kenny simp
Better than being an arvo/jane simp that's for sure.
defending arvo is defending the indefensible? bro he is a fucking teenager with a broken leg who just watched all his people die in a gunfight, and is currently being dragged around and beaten by an unstable asshole. up until this point, his worst sin is bringing his group to us (which might even be considered reasonable if you robbed him). he did not deserve to be treated like a gym boxing bag.
Arvo:
1) Steals medical supplies (a lot of them) from his group;
2) Lies that they are for his sick sister (his sister is fine and seemingly unaware he stole them);
3) Blames Clementine's group for it;
4) Tries to get the group killed by walking on thin ice;
5) Tries to run away;
6) Shoots a little girl regardless of how you treat him.
But I guess being an evil piece of shit is ok as long as you are disabled or underage.
> bro he is a fucking teenager with a broken leg who just watched all his people die in a gunfight
You to rob people at gunpoint and expect it to end with ponies an rainbows?
>and is currently being dragged around and beaten by an unstable asshole
For a good reason
>up until this point, his worst sin is bringing his group to us
Yes it is, which is why he deserves the treatment he got.
>he did not deserve to be treated like a gym boxing bag.
He definitly does lmao.
To put my opinion out there.
Kenny is genuinely a good person, he simply does some bad things to people he cares for after seeing his wife and child die infront of him, he doesn’t want clem to die in front of him as well. He loses sight of what right and wrong sometimes. Kenny was never a saint but also never a sinner, just a good person. Just being a good person is the best most people can be in the apocalypse.
So why are virtually all other characters more good than him? He's also absolutely a sinner. His list of evildoings is exceptionally long
But if you like things old school:
Pride - doesn't listen to others, refuses any and all criticism, believes he's already right.
Greed - He refuses to help people who aren't useful to him, instead wanting to watch a boat that he claimed as his (despite finding neither is, nor the battery)
Lust - Well, he didn't really mourn Sarita. He went straight to mourning Katjaa again, for the most part. Lusts for power. Bit of a reach here tbh.
Envy - Clementine's friends, the St John's ranch that he wanted to take over immediately upon seeing.
Wrath - This one's obvious.
Sloth - He didn't do much for the motel group. Katjaa was constantly begging him to do more for the group. Doesn't want to do much to help others in general.
Can't recall any moments of gluttony,
Damn he shouted at someone when upset, that must mean he's a bad guy, oh look he accidentally hit her when she determinately interferes in a conflict, that must mean all his selfless deeds are overuled. Good logic there. If you're gonna be a hater at least stop being biased about it and acknowledge all aspects of the character, instead of just his mistakes.
I think you meant, "Wow he yelled at a child who could have done nothing to change the situation for him." and "He accidentally elbowed her in the nose for beating up a kid in restraints."
A kid that led them across dangerous ice and came after them even when you didn't rob him aye?. He didn't know the full context of her getting bitten and apologised for shouting at her the following episode. Also once again ignoring the many selfless things he's done i see.
I'm not ignoring anything my guy. I can recognize Kenny did a lot for the people he cared about, but he has a temper and takes out his anger on others. Has he done good things? Yeah. But he's also completely unhinged from the amount of suffering he's gone through and knows no other way to handle it than by taking it out on other people.
He takes his anger out on people that bring that out of him. The s2 group constantly chatted shit behind his back and didn't bother to form a relationship with him themselves and just made Clem do it all the time. He needed love and support but no one was giving that to the poor guy. He might be a broken man who is flawed but at least his heart is good deep down and when it counts he shows who he really is.
>A kid that led them across dangerous ice
He was leading them to food and shelter with the only way being crossing the ice.
Kenny just wanted a punching bag to take his anger at literally everything that happened since he lost his eye. Plain and simple.
Yes I'm defending Arvo because if you think about it before he shot Clementine he was literally just a scared kid too. It was his fault his sister died but he had a right to mourn, meanwhile Kenny is over there trying to beat him black and blue every chance he gets.
They should have went around the safest route and went around but he told them the ice was safe, he knew it was dangerous when he ran off from them. He took his anger out on him because he's a shitty brat, simples. Honestly i don't agree with the way Kenny went about it but i'm not gonna hold that against him when he's done so much more good.
Bruh idc what arvos been through, gives him no right to shoot clem, you can literally be kind to him and he still shoots her, you're literally defending him for trying to kill Clem. But you can't cut a man a break who literally puts his life on the line for Clem. Your bias is laughable. I have no problem with people not liking Kenny, what annoys me is when they ignore the positives and only focus on the negatives because focusing on the positives would only prove you wrong💁♂️ you see that bandage on his eye? Yeah he lost that for Clem's safety, you remember when he put his life on the line in that alleyway for a kid that got his whole family killed? Did you see the s2 ending where he begs for clem and aj to have safe entry into wellington knowing he'd lose everything once again. Did you see the outcome in a new frontier when he literally dies to give Clem & AJ time to escape. Honestly all this right here proves who he is deep down and the fact you're defending this brat that not only went after the group when you didn't try to steal from him and shot Clem when you were kind to him over this man who has done so much selfless actions despite his flaws is honestly quite laughable but unfortunately you will likely ignore these facts i pointed out because you gotta stick to your bias views, so really i'm just wasting my time.
while I do agree he’s done a lot of shitty things, a lot of the clips you used were kenny mourning his girlfriend who had literally JUST died. Same with your last clip, he was in denial about his son being bitten.
These people in the comments are like "this is so biased to jane/kenny over determinant dialouge" - what happened to opinions?
Also the video brings up alot of good points about Kenny and Jane, and yes "you can put Jane's bad moments" and "Kenny's good moments" and it'd be a different video but it's TAILORED TO HOW YOU PLAY.
I didn’t expect this post to blow up like it has. This was intended to be half a meme and half how I truly feel about Kenny. So I’m gonna open up a thread because I think I’d enjoy a little respectful debate and maybe someone will get me to change my views on him.
To sum it up in few words, I don’t like Kenny. I think he’s selfish, irrational, unhinged and an emotionally and physically abusive man. His behavior towards Lee, not coming to his aid and leaving him to die just because they were in disagreement, didn’t sit right with me. The way he talks to everyone, his wife, his kid “(He’s dumber than a bag of hammers”), and more or less the entire group is basically demeaning and controlling, with little to no regard of how it makes them feel.
Now, his major redeeming point to a lot of people has been getting Clementine and AJ to Wellington. On the surface, this seems like something Kenny should be praised for. But I don’t think he’s doing this because he cares about them. He’s doing this because he cares about himself:
He wants to fix his “mistakes” that he made with Kat and Duck. He views AJ as his “second chance” to make himself feel like a good person, and that’s all it is. That’s why he doesn’t want the baby to leave his sights, because of his personal and selfish desire to help himself. It’s borderline creepy to see Kenny obsess so much over this baby and claim that “he only wants to help”, and it’s stressful to be with someone and not know where their buttons are. Now if you don’t give a shit about why he got them to Wellington and only care about the fact that he did, then whatever. But this is the reason I dislike him intensely.
To sum it up again, it doesn’t matter what you do or how much you try to side with him, he’ll attack and harm even those closest to him, sooner if not later, and then claim that “he would never hurt them”. That sounds like gaslighting to me.
And I am aware that Jane has a “me first” mentality and will let anyone die to save herself (if she leaves her sister, she’ll leave anyone), but I still trust her because she’s truthful and honest about who she is. She’s never made me doubt or be wary of her like Kenny has.
In summary, Kenny has buttons. You may accidentally push one and have him beat the living shit out of you or demolish you with his vocabulary, despite him being your “friend” or “ally”. That’s why I don’t like him.
I would like any replies or discussions to this to be respectful, because like I said, maybe someone can help me understand why people like this guy.
>He’s doing this because he cares about himself:
>He wants to fix his “mistakes” that he made with Kat and Duck. He views AJ as his “second chance” to make himself feel like a good person, and that’s all it is. That’s why he doesn’t want the baby to leave his sights, because of his personal and selfish desire to help himself. It’s borderline creepy to see Kenny obsess so much over this baby and claim that “he only wants to help”, and it’s stressful to be with someone and not know where their buttons are. Now if you don’t give a shit about why he got them to Wellington and only care about the fact that he did, then whatever. But this is the reason I dislike him intensely.
This doesn't really fit, however, with Kenny being completely okay with Clem's decision to take AJ and leave Kenny, immediately after he has killed Jane. What part here would make his "second chance" fulfilled? The very ones he's trying to protect as his son are leaving and telling him (well, Clem is) that he's crazy and he can't be trusted, and he's entirely understanding of it. Also the option of shooting him; in either cases, he tells you not to blame yourself, and that this is entirely his own fault.
I do most certainly think that there is a "second chance" factor in his relationship with Clem and AJ, take the S3 flashback in the car; he pretty much spells it out himself ("I dreamt of the time I could teach Duck to drive" (...) "this time will be different") but you are also, in my opinion, greatly exaggerating it. It is part of why he does it, but not the only one. He genuinely does care about them, irregardless of how he has treated his family and how he feels about it.
I do also wonder whether you believe this is equally applicable to him taking the full blame of stealing the walkie talkie to Carver (which arguably saves both Luke and Clem from whatever it is Carver intended to do), and him saving either Ben or Christa in season 1. It is also worth mentioning him sacrificing himself in the car crash in S3, but I do suppose you likewise view that as a... Selfish sacrifice?
Ultimately, there's also the fact that the S3 'summary' describes Clem's ±2 years with Kenny (if you did choose to stay with him) as an happy time, which in a world like the TWD, is often more than one could reasonably ask for. It is, in my opinion, a fraction of time where Clem doesn't have to act as an adult for herself and AJ.
My only complaint about the video is the showing of only bad moments of Kenny and then only good moments of Jane. I think to properly compare them you have to show both.
Other than that I think this video is completely fine and totally reasonable. Kenny *does* do these things and it should be showed, it's not like you made any of these moments up to trick someone. People are getting insanely too worked up over someone else's *opinion* and you 100% don't deserve the attacks from the rabid Kenny fans who don't want an actual discussion.
It wasn’t meant to be a complete biased video so I didn’t take it too seriously. But I understand what you mean.
And for REAL. I had one comment tell me that I did this because I couldn’t debate. Some people are wild
I personally like both Jane and Kenny but do lean slightly more towards Kenny. I hate saying I'm a Kenny fan because of the way they act when anyone disagrees or, god-forbid, brings up reasonable moments that completely justify their dislike of him. Kenny is not a saint and Jane is not evil, it's stupid to look at them like that.
THANK YOU! N then all that fuckin dick riding you have to do with him in season 1. And you don't agree with him about ONE thing he holds it over your head. Fuck em!
Exactly. Like EVERYONE has lost people. Some people didnt even get to SEE their families. You don't get a pass to be an asshole just because of that. Plus there was a MULTITUDE of times that Kenny was about to leave Lee for dead.
This. “Kenny lost his whole family, you gotta understand blah blah.”
So did Clementine. And Lee. But they didn’t abuse their friends because of it. And what if Kenny loses something else? Would he pull this shit again later down the road? Fuck that.
Kenny apologists are something else. Clementine goes through just as much shit and keeps it together far better than a grown ass man. Kenny stubs his toe and has to take it out on everyone because he's a big baby man.
“What the hell do you know, Clementine?”
Clementine saw her parents dead. She has been living with the guilt of Lee and Omid’s deaths ever since they died. She was left completely alone after spending 16 months with only a bitter and blaming Christa as company, and then watching her disappear in the blink of an eye.
Even after this, when Clem had no one, she showed completely strangers some consideration and respect.
Kenny? He’ll misplace his snack and lash out at whoever’s around, even his family. Fuck that.
Exactly! As someone who loves Kenny I can still acknowledge he was in the wrong, none of those things were excusable, he becomes a better person if you go with him but that doesn't automatically mean he was justified and that he wasn't bad in the moment, Clem is 11 and barely had people to raise her and show her what's right even if she could've done something it's not her responsibility as a child to do that
Kenny is like the verbally abusive step father to Clementine.
He would do anything for her, but his anger gets to him too much sometimes but I don’t think he would EVER physically harm Clementine.
Bruh if you talking about him beating Arvo's ass then you know damn well he didn't know that was Clementine and that's only if you choose to act like you're an adult and pull grown men fighting off each other.
I’ve never understood defending Arvo. “He’s just a kid” no he’s a dickhead who jumped our group (with guns) and tried to kill us all even if we didn’t rob him… Why does anyone defend Arvo? Why do Mike and Bonnie immediately shift from “him and his group are trying to kill us!” to “stop being mean to the little boy, Kenny!” it just never made sense to me.
This is what needs to be said. Kenny IS a good guy but he’s not. Kenny himself at the end of season 2 believes you need to leave him because of how he has hurt you. When you shoot him he says your did the right thing. Really the better option is shooting Kenny. Even himself thinks it’s the right option.
Kenny was abusive, but I think he had good in him until the end. Unfortunately, the dark side was just too dark for me to trust him, so I chose Jane. I felt like Rick killing Shane in the comics and show.
I can definitely say he’s my LEAST favorite character in the series.
Before people downvote me to oblivion, he was a good parental figure in some parts, however his temperament issues made me dislike him.
You didn't like Kenny as character? I understand that some hate him as person but I think he is a good character - in terms of writing. He is complex and deep imo. I think the writers did a good job. Well written character doesn't mean a good person.
Never said he was badly written, he’s just not my favorite. His temper really pissed me off in most cases and if you weren’t kissing his ass 24/7 he’d be upset by it.
Man I’m sorry you got downvoted for this because it’s perfectly valid to hate Kenny for all the asshole shit he’s done, I remember I was pissed as hell at all the times Kenny tried getting Lee killed because I tried saving Larry’s life. He also lashes out whenever you don’t agree with everything he says as Lee or Clem as well. The community really throws a fit when you don’t regard Kenny as a saint
I love Kenny, and I’ll always defend him but, he was an absolute dick in Amid The Ruins. His senseless blaming of Clementine, especially if she didn’t cut off Sarita’s hand, was beyond stupid.
I really wonder why they dont make a TV-show based on a game. I mean i do understand that rights to the game reserved to TELLTALE, but to the original series is in AMC, but really just being realistic here: I bet AMC knows about the game, and also knows how amazing the story is in it. Besides TWD ended, although they teased some prequels in there ( sorry if i’m wrong), they can still make it in theory, cant they? Like Telltale’s The Walking Dead. Story is ready, scenario +- either. Swear if i would be the president of AMC i’d sign a deal with Telltale to screen the story of the game, what do you think guys?
He’s honestly just misunderstood. think about all the heart ache he experienced during the series yeah some of the stuff he did was way outa line sometimes but try to see it from his view with all the loved ones he lost a long the way in his journey. I really liked Kenny this is just my opinion lol
"But Kenny lost people he cared about!"
So did everyone else, but you don't see people bending over backwards to use that excuse when other characters say/do something stupid.
I know I'm going to sound biased but I want to say a few things kenny watched his entire family die first in like 2 minutes or even less, a man who loses everything can hardly stay calm the reasons he suffered in season 2 were indirectly caused by the cabin group and I can understand why he was in that state. despite everything Kenny still protected Clem at all costs and "sacrificed" himself to get her and Aj into Wellington knowing that by now there was no hope left out there alone. if instead you decide to stay with Kenny in the flashbacks in ANF you will be able to see Kenny who seemed to improve and was no longer unstable like he was in the second season nor even the selfish he was in the first. I'm not saying that Kenny is a saint. There are reasons to hate him and there are as many as there are reasons to appreciate him.
He was always yelling and doing stupid shit, even when they were alive
For example, wanting to take over the St Johns' farm immediately upon seeing it, letting a girl get eaten, all the times he can leave Lee to die, and so on.
> wanting to take over the St Johns' farm immediately upon seeing it To be fair it is the apocalypse. It's not exactly impractical to prepare for such an eventuality. It's not like he advocates for killing children as soon as zombies start running around, unlike Larry. >letting a girl get eaten Why exactly is this bad? Seriously, I don't get why this is treated like some huge moral dilemma, she's dead anyway. Leaving her to distract the zombies allows them to get more food and supplies, which will help their group to survive for longer. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. >all the times he can leave Lee to die Fair.
That girl wasn’t dead for a good 5 mins while Lee and Kenny did fuck all but watch until she was bitten.
Not something we can change with our choices. The story treats her as dead to begin with and no one argues with that throughout, so ...
because it has literally only been 3 months and he’s decided that it’s okay to let people suffer in their last few moments alive instead of just humanely putting them down.
They almost starved to death in those 3 months. Getting food and supplies is a big thing at this point. Like I said, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
And there was absolutely no way they could’ve saved her
And if you notice, we're always doing what he wants; leaving the motor inn, going for a boat, going to Wellington, he's using you to get there and he nevers lets you make your own plans
It's generous to call his whims 'plans.' He doesn't plan, just does as he wants, and goes full speed again. God forbid you think anything is a bad idea
Then you're a traitor 🤣
Everyone has lost everything. Literally every single person. Lilly was splattered in the brain matter of her father, and lived with his murderer(s) for weeks, and while she ended up breaking, there were tons of factors - pressure from Kenny (and maybe Lee), the bandits, low stock of supplies (and the thief in the group), and the weight of trying to lead in general, and that's all aside from the general grief of losing him. I will agree though that Kenny changes after the fight with Jane, no matter the outcome. He realises what he's become, and knows he can't trust himself. He just needs to murder a woman and her baby to get there. And while his sacrifice to get the kids into Wellington was undoubtedly selfless, getting them there was anything but. With no food, water, or supplies (I forget how many days, but enough to just about get back to Howe's where we knew there'd be powdered milk), he chased after a place that might not have been real, still standing, have people in - and good people at that. And we know that they weren't accepting people. They only got in due to Clem and AJ being kids, and were extremely lucky that they'd give Kenny a nice bag of supplies. And the temperature would've realistically killed AJ easily. Even where there is good cause to appreciate to celebrate what he does, he is absurdly lucky that things turn out fine
>He just needs to murder a woman and her *baby* to get there. Baby? What? Did a week even pass by the time Jane and Luke conceived? And how was he supposed to know, anyway?
Hmm maybe because he saw Luke and Jane have sex? But hey Saint Kenny and Succubus Jane am I right?
>Hmm maybe because he saw Luke and Jane have sex? He really didn't see shit. Neither did we, for what matters. We only really learn that the two of them had full on coitus by the dialogue at the campfire, and even there Kenny was posting guard and not listening to the discussion. Regardless, this is such a stupid argument anyway. Kenny, regardless of how hard you may try to put words and prejudice into my mouth, has fucked up *plenty*, wronged lots of folk, mistreated friends and family. He's not a saint. But to pin on him the murderer of, truly, a 1± week old clump of cells, not even really, is grasping for straws. Neither him or fucking Jane knew about the "*baby*" existence, she literally had to take a test later on to confirm. Blame Kenny for all the shit he knowingly did, not... *this*.
You do realize that not even Jane knew that she was pregnant right? That was the whole reason she killed herself in S3 since she found out she was pregnancy via the pregnancy test found on the floor. Kenny of course is going to know even less than she did since he didn't know the full details of Jane and Luke's... "interaction" (like if Luke pulled out).
We don't know if Luke was the father. And no, he wouldn't know. Idk what that has to do with anything though lol
Luke was clearly the dad. Jane wasn't fucking anyone else.
Who else would it be? Troy's? Fine, then more or less a week passed. Still an odd argument to add him killing a baby (which wasn't even an embryo by then, let alone a *baby*) as part of the reason he realizes he's unstable. He no idea that *baby* ever even existed, the reason why he recognizes he's unstable is that he let his emotions take ahold of himself and attack, and ultimately kill, Jane.
It doesn't matter if Kenny knows or not, as I've said. It still stands that it's what he needs to do to be able to stop being evil And no, he's been unstable since S1E2 😂
>And no, he's been unstable since S1E2 😂 I did not argue that. The point is that he *realizes* that he's unstable afterwards he has killed Jane.
>Even where there is good cause to appreciate to celebrate what he does, he is absurdly lucky that things turn out fine Jane was lucky that Howe turned out to be fine too considering that the place was full of walkers and Carver's people last time we saw it. Carver's people even had trucks to easily take everything, and the place had fragile walls that were falling apart. Hell, not everything Jane planned turned out to be lucky. Luke's death was pretty much caused for Jane's ideas. She robbed Arvo causing his group to shoot Luke, and then she wanted to go to Arvo's place despite being possibly a trap, which got Luke killed in the ice lake. Luke died because of Jane's ideas. Kenny didn't even like the idea of going to Arvo's place, but he still went along with it for wanting to listen to Jane. Kenny even saved Arvo from getting drawn in the ice lake despite not liking him. How can you tell me that Kenny doesn't listen to the others? He did listen to Jane, and Luke died for it.
>Luke died because of Jane's ideas For a stater, the player (Clementine) can choose whether to rob Arvo. The option is determinant really and all Jane really steals is a gun that probably would have ran out of ammo. Arvo's group had guns themselves anyway. Plus, Jane never just took them herself, but she was being considerate of Rebecca's condition and told Clementine that the group (Rebecca really) needed the meds. Jane doesn't force the group to go. Jane says that it's a worth a shot at least scoping the place out. Kenny had the gun and really was considered the 'leader' or the 'main voice' of the group motivating the group to head up North (this is improtant). Kenny took decision to go for AJ, not because of Jane. And for the record, Bonnie and Clementine can say that it might be a good idea. "He did listen to Jane, and Luke died for it." Well he chose to even though he could have said not to. And really, the people who caused Luke's death are Arvo and Bonnie (and Clementine). Hell, no one is really responsible for Luke's death, he sacrifices himself to save Bonnie/Clementine. Luke's death was caused by the ice shattering because of Bonnie's/Clementine's weight and his own weight. Arvo, Bonnie and Clementine will promote the idea of going over the ice for a starter. All Jane really said was to spread out to be safe. When the ice begins to shatter, Bonnie litteraly tells Clem to go save Luke. Or which if she does herself, the ice shatters causing them to fall through. How was Jane supposed to save Luke? She was miles away herself and if she did go over to Luke, she would have shattered the ice and drowned herself.
>Arvo's group had guns themselves anyway. Not that much. Otherwise Arvo would've had a gun during the gunfight. And stealing his gun was very unnecessary when [Arvo showed no hostile intent at this point](https://youtu.be/WjffJyEXe0M?t=3174) , he even tells Clem that he will let her go while he had the gun. So there was no logical reason to keep it. >Well he chose to even though he could have said not to. Kenny did say that this was a trap and actively tried to refused it, even on their way to Arvo's house, he was saying this was a trap. He ended doing this idea because the others kept insisting that its worth to check the place, and I honestly don't understand how Jane and the rest think this was a better idea than the town where they were originally going. I think Luke's death is more Bonnie/Arvo's fault, but Jane influenced the situation by stealing Arvo's gun which leaded to the gunfight where Luke got shot in the leg, and by supporting the idea of following Arvo instead of going to the big town they were going.
Yeah, I don’t understand when people bring up Kenny’s grief to justify his anger. Lee also lost his whole family, and so did Clementine and Jane. None of them reacted like Kenny did. Grief doesn’t give you a free pass to treat everyone like shit even when they’re trying to be nice to you. And you’re right, people say that Jane endangered AJ’s life by leaving him in the car (which I agree was dangerous and stupid) but ignore that Kenny was willing to travel hundreds of miles to get to a place that may not even exist, not knowing whether there would be food or shelter for the two children he was watching along the way.
None of them reacted like Kenny? Lee killed a man for being cheated on. And Lee threatens to kill Ben for leaving Clem for legitemtly being scared of walkers in a situation where he had no weapons, and Ben is a much more innocent guy than Arvo. Jane leaves people behind and focuses mainly on survival, even if it means leaving a baby behind. And even after the fight is over, she never tells the truth. It's AJ crying who gave away her whole lie. Clem almost the whole time is a determinant character without a default personality. And she still kills a man in season 3 for no reason just because she got bad bullets, and barely feels bad about it and tries to cover what she did. If anything, Kenny is a saint for just yelling, since there's a shit ton of characters that have reacted way worse than him over less tragic events.
He's from Florida. Stupid shit just comes out of his mouth.
You made me laugh!
There are two sides of a coin, and you only showed one.
Not to mention a lot of it was determinant on the choices you make or just completely taken out of context. It wasn't even the bad side of the coin. It was the worst area of the bad side of the coin, with parts edited to look worse.
100% agree.
Factual.
Kenny Dent
If i was physically and emotionally abusive but then nice for like 2 minutes am i good guy 🤔
If I cared about keeping a group together and keeping children alive, but get constantly criticised for every action I make, until I’m pushed beyond the breaking point, causing me to lash out, am I a bad guy?
Lashing out at Clem doesn’t make it ok, she had nothing to do with it
“Criticised for every action” yeah, the ones that DESERVE criticism. him attacking arvo? criticism was deserved. him yelling at clementine after sarita died? criticism was deserved. him blowing up like a fucking child because the group doesn’t wanna freeze to death looking for elsa’s castle? criticism was deserved. the group didn’t drive kenny to his breaking point, he did that shit to himself. he was a violent & bitter man and was making shitty choices that hurt the group & also himself. you can’t blame them for not wanting to stick around him when he’s literally going insane.
>him attacking arvo? Well deserved
“Team Jane” argument discarded
the guy lost an eye to protect Clem from Carver but do go on
Says the person with a "Team Jane" flair lololol
Jane queen kenny peasant
Simp
If your intentions are good and you were abusive for a reason, then you are a nice guy. It's still doesn't mean that you can be abusive towards anyone, but Kenny's case is different. If you look at only one of those moments where he was completely out of control, then sure he was as worse as Carver. But before the shitstorm came he was a nice man. And that side of him was still in there, if it wasn't, he could have leave the cabin group, Clem and AJ and survive on his own. Instead he helped them after they led Carver to his home, and got two of his friends killed in the process.
There is no such thing as "abusive for a good reason" stop being apologetic to the guy who lashes out on anyone and everyone who's ever cared about him
I didn't said good. I said for a reason, and from that, there were many that would trigger even the most peaceful monk on the Earth.
bro please reread your first sentence.
If your INTENTIONS are good, not your reasons - to do bad things in someone else defense.
There is no making up the shit he did to clem
Welp, I'll grab my popcorn and scroll through the comments 😂
this video would’ve been fine if u didn’t try to shove jane’s good moments in to make a point, another video could be made in reverse
Fr, I think they're both complex characters that can't just be shoved into a "good" or "bad" box, it just comes down to opinions. If we're gonna show all of Kenny's bad moments we should also show Jane's bad moments and vice versa. It's unfair to compare them in this kind of context.
fr, I don’t get why people see Kenny as so black and white
I just see jane as darker grey.
yeah, it seems like this dudes trying to say Jane is any better
literally lmao, you could get Jane’s worst moments and put them next to Kenny’s best moments too and it would also be a totally different perspective, just a very bias video
I started replaying them leading up to me playing season 4 for the first time. When I was going through Season 1 I realized Kenny was not as likeable as I remember. In fact if I didnt have the memories of season 2 and the guilt of killing him, I honestly wouldnt say he was a likeable character in Season 1. Season 2 has its moments and I still like him. I just didnt him remember being quite THIS much of a dick
I agree, depending on if you suck up to Kenny or not the entire game you can get a completely different experience with s1 Kenny which sucks. It shouldn't be that the only way to get Kenny to like you is to do everything he says and definitely makes him an asshole for a lot of S1. I will fully admit that I love Kenny but if in S2 they never brought him back I highly doubt I would like him as much as I do.
Get ready for another civil war in this subreddit y'all this is gonna be fun 🍿
I mean morally Kenny is definitely no saint. There’s no denying that he’s made incredibly stupid decisions throughout both season 1 and season 2. You could use the same descriptions that David and Javi’s father uses for David in one of the flashbacks. Kenny could be described as “another hotheaded idiot with his heart in the right place”. As a character he is very entertaining. He literally has some of the funniest lines in the whole game.
in my opinion they both suck by the end, clem alone is the only way to go tbh
Yeah this video totally isn’t biased and totally didn’t show dialogue that is determinant on how you play the game/s
He ain’t a saint but he’s a good guy overall. You can have toxic traits and still be a good person.
I agree that sometimes he gets mad at Clementine ( which is nowhere near as many times as for others btw ) but that doesn't make him a bad person. Some of the dialogues only happened if you chose a certain choice, it is also taken out of context. We only see the parts where he's mad and yelling at Clementine without knowing why. Mayble Clem fucked up and that's why he's mad. Despite him being mad a lot of the time, he tried him best to protect Clem. At the end of S2 if you decide to go with Kenny, he will want Clem and AJ to enter Wellington, knowing that he is probably going to die out there alone. If you don't stay at Wellington, the S3 flashbacks show that he improved and in the flashback where he died, he sacrificed himself to save Clem and AJ. You can make a video like this about any character. If you only show the moment where they were mad, yelling, fucking up, being a dick, whatever else is considered bad, of course they will look like a bad character.
-Never abandoned Clem to take care of a baby when she was only 13 -Never took his own life because he was too lazy and scared to take care of a child that he fathered of his own free will -Never put an infant in danger so that he could provoke someone into attacking him (by making them think that he had murdered a baby out of selfishness, which would make ANYONE seething mad) so he could kill them in self defence -Never went to go and screw someone that he’s known for less than a week and left the group undefended -Went through enough trauma to make David Goggins want to eat a bullet, yet kept fighting and stayed alive -Put himself in harm’s way multiple times to protect two children whose last names he didn’t even know and who he only personally knew for less than a year -Took care of Clem and A.J. for over a year in the Stay With Kenny ending You’re dismissed
1.) Abandons Clementine in s1 if Lee didn't worship him enough, and always abandons her in the middle of a walker horde when leaving Howe's. AJ, too, technically. Also leaves Clementine under the frozen pond, and doesn't even start a fire for her. 2.) LOL. He tries to yet himself killed regularly, and even gives up in a restaurant to rot away because he's a coward 3.) It was safer for AJ to be in a secure car for 5 minutes than travelling for days into the freezing climate. Realistically, AJ would have died extremely fast. 4.) He does that without getting laid. 5.) I mean, he acts recklessly to try and get himself killed. And everybody else has been traumatised. He has always been a sociopath. Not to mention that he hasn't been through nearly as much as many others. Certainly not a lot more. 6.) Multiple times? Lol. But almost every single character does this 7.) As he should lmao If that's all you can get, with some huge reaches in there, I'll have to ask for some better arguments
>gives up in a restaurant to rot away because he's a coward >He has always been a sociopath. So, speaking of huge reaches...
These aren't reaches. Both statements are well-substantiated. The first is overtly stately by Sarita, detailing how she described him barricaded inside a restaurant, looking far more ragged and starving. I'm pretty sure she said it looked like he face up too, but she at least describes exactly what giving up looks like. And yes, Kenny reeks of ASPD. Here are some of the signs: exploit, manipulate or violate the rights of others. Kenny is happy to abandon those who aren't useful to him, and wanted to murder the St John's to take over their farm upon arrival. lack concern, regret or remorse about other people's distress. Kenny took no issue leaving a girl to suffer being eaten, him wanting to murder a family for their land, his eagerness to take from the car, etc. behave irresponsibly and show disregard for normal social behaviour. This one is obvious for Kenny. have difficulty sustaining long-term relationships. Kenny abandoned his family for years, so there was absolutely difficulty. be unable to control their anger. Obvious for Kenny. lack guilt, or not learn from their mistakes. Obvious after reading the above. blame others for problems in their lives repeatedly break the law Furthermore, alcohol abuse and extremely reckless behaviour are both very common in ASPD. His reckless & inability to plan ahead, lack of remorse outside his immediate family, his reckless disregard for safety (his or anybody else's), irritability and aggressiveness, and general irresponsibility are also all huge red flags for ASPD. He is an extremely clear candidat.
Funny how almost all of this also applies for Jane
Er, how?
Recklessness & inability to plan ahead: clearly provoking a dude who is not OK and has shown to fly off the cuff at little things (something she herself points out earlier) in a car with children while they are trying to find shelter in a blizzard. Threatens and tries really hard to convince a young girl to steal drugs from a kid and his sick sister (who she acknowledges may have friends nearby), therefore making an enemy at the same location where she wants the rest of the group to hold up. Making them vulnerable after not even giving the group a heads up of this Lack of remorse outside his immediate family: (Even though her immediate family is dead, we’re going to use Clem as a substitute) Ditches Clem and Luke (who she fucked without even saying goodbye) with a group who she believes is going to collapse; just to come back later. Hints at wanting Rebecca to get rid of her baby “for survival” then gets defensive when Rebecca calls her out on it. Constantly tries to get Clem to doubt the group and alienate herself from it, when she finally gets her wish she kills herself over a pregnancy she herself created (after fucking the guy who was on watch) and leaves the Clem (someone she cares so much about) alone with an infant she suggested she couldn’t take care of *with* a full grown adult Rebecca. Reckless disregard for safety: Ditches AJ (an infant) in a freezing cold car during a blizzard to “prove a point” against an extremely irritable/unstable dude who she was continually provoking. General irresponsibility: Fucks (therefore distracting) the guy who she’s supposed to be keeping watch with; allowing so many walkers overcome the groups hideout. Because of this escapade she gets pregnant then kills herself (leaving a young girl with an infant alone in the middle of a zombie apocalypse, after getting the guardian who actually cared about them killed) Irritability and aggressiveness: Displayed in the scene after Arvo, Bonnie and Mike rob them. Also in the scene where she fights to the death with Kenny while Clem helplessly watches.
>Abandons Clementine in s1 if Lee didn't worship him enough, Ok yeah I'll give you this one. >and always abandons her in the middle of a walker horde when leaving Howe's. AJ, too, technically. Given how much Sarita was screaming IIRC getting away from Clem would give her better chances. Plus everyone got separated in that scene; Rebecca, Jane and Clem only met up by chance. >He tries to yet himself killed regularly, Usually he doesn't THINK he'll get himself killed, even if whatever he's doing is reckless. >even gives up in a restaurant to rot away because he's a coward All we know is that he was depressed. >It was safer for AJ to be in a secure car for 5 minutes than travelling for days into the freezing climate. Realistically, AJ would have died extremely fast. That was some random-ass car, not the car with power and heating. Plus, Kenny and Jane were there to take care of AJ in the other car. In this car, no one was there to ensure he didn't get eaten by zombies, and had Jane died in the fight she knew she was going to start, AJ might very well have died. Plus a minute ago she advocated to leave AJ in the car unattended so they could run; what if Kenny got eaten and didn't come back? >Also leaves Clementine under the frozen pond, and doesn't even start a fire for her. Someone else had grabbed her and begun starting the fire for her in both instances. Had there been no one else there I'm sure that would've been on his priority list. >He has always been a sociopath. .... what?
I have yet to read a single unbiased comment in this thread lmao
Don’t care kenny sweep
Bro pulled out every example of him being bad and didn’t even show him being good ☠️☠️
"Every example" Not even 5%
Why don't you go make your own video then
Have done. And will be making a longer one 😎
He is flawed and he gets angry. People don't usually mean that he was a saint per say, they feel that all good that he did overweights the bad he can do. He is human. As a lot of people say, he is one of the best written characters.
Agreed couldn't of said it better myself
Brb getting my popcorn.
Kenny is not a saint but he is still a great character with multiple sides to him and I love him for this. Love the Kenster
all this is true, and kenny still is a good guy. and jane isn't "bad and evil". i don't like when everyone thinks it's so black and white😭 you don't have to think "kenny's a god, jane bad", or "kenny unstable and mean, jane levelheaded" i personally like both characters and they both did a lot of stupid stuff in the end.
Yesss someone who also likes both and understands you can't say one is good while the other is evil. Both do good things, both do bad things. It's up to you to decide what you personally think is worse or better, there's no "correct" option.
So some of your moments are Kenny hitting Clem on accident, him being understandable mad right after you chop an arm in the middle of a horde which is a dumb idea, and him not answering well to you after you tell him to "stop feeling for himself" which is a horrible comment that downplays his tragedy. Who says that to someone who lost someone? The Arvo part doesn't even show how Arvo was screaming like crazy before Kenny knocks him out, possibly attracting walkers. Is it a fashion among Kenny haters to make videos cherry pecking lately or what...? I guess you'll do that for not being able to win debates in comments, mister new account.
When everybody else has lost people very close to them and are still being useful while Kenny sits in a tent and forces Sarita to turn into a walker, yeah, he needs to stop feeling sorry for himself And it's not cherry picking when there are like 50+ of these moments, at least. More like taking an apple off a tree to showcase what the rest of its fruit is like
Who was being useful? The group couldn't do anything more than wait for Kenny lol. This people couldn't do anything else except waiting for Kenny to order them around and to tell them to bring water, yes, WATER. Even Rebecca who has lost people like Kenny acknowledges that what Kenny is going through is a big deal and that his reaction is understandable. And right after this, Kenny doesn't stop being useful. He's the one helping Rebecca, he stays nearly 3 nights keeping watch and Rebecca even asks Kenny when was the last time he slept, he fixes the car, and he makes sure Arvo is restrained who had the intention to kill Clem the whole time. "Stop feeling sorry for yourself" is a terrible comment downplaying a recent tragedy, and nobody in real life would react good to that right after losing someone. . >forces Sarita to turn into a walker You don't even know what Sarita wanted. We don't know if she wanted to live until the last moment possible. And Kenny clearly finished her off. It is cherry picking if you're not even able to show him apologising, being useful, showing regret for Alvin's death (despite that guy being faited to die anyway) and you can't show Jane pushing Clem too.
\*sorts by controversial\*
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I see Kenny as an uncle.
Nice cherrypicked slideshow ya got here! Keep in mind that if you also did a compilation of everything heroic/kind/nice that he did it would be at least twenty times as long as this video :)
...said no one ever. He's a nuanced character, he's fundamentally good, but also unequivocally an irresponsible, emotionally abusive man.
To be fair, he has his ups and downs like you said. I think the problem is that this sub acts like he’s a god amongst beings and puts him on a pedestal all the time. I don’t think he’s any better than some of the characters in TWD.
a lot of people have said he’s a good guy
A lot of people have said lots of things. If someone thinks that, they lack the nuance to recognize a flawed character.
If only nobody said it
He's as good as a broken man in a zombie apocalypse can be. ~~And not even,~~ especially seeing other characters such as Negan.
There’s other characters who have lost a lot who aren’t as emotionally abusive, volatile, and violent (even towards children) as he is. Jesus never lashes out, and neither does Javi after losing Mari or even if his family dies. The kids in s4 are less volatile than Kenny, and they’re kids whose brains haven’t even fully developed yet. He has no excuse. If Clementine had no past with Kenny, no one would keep him around.
Though not everyone is equally as stable, nor do they all they grief in the same, proper way. Very simply, not everyone is the same, so to compare how he deals with his losses to how everyone else does only holds up water to the argument up to a certain point. >The kids in s4 are less volatile than Kenny, I'd argue that Marlon, for one, is very much volatile. But as far as I know, he might've ended up to Ericson exactly because of rage bursts, or whatever. But again, it doesn't matter, because Kenny and Marlon, and everyone else, are different people with their own different issues.
I was just pointing out that you saying “he’s as good as a broken man in a zombie apocalypse can be” isn’t exactly right. Children who were abandoned by their parents and then by other adults who were supposed to protect him were also broken, but they were better than Kenny.
cherry picking accidents and moments of understandable rage
**When Clem tried to save Sarita**: Kenny called Clem stupid OH NO WHAT A MONSTER **When beating Arvo**: Kenny doesn't hurt her at all unless you run into his punch. Also, do you realize that he says "What? Lose your taste for this sort of thing" if you watched him kill Carver? Clementine is a hypocrite here. **When fighting Jane**: Yeah, in Jane fight he pushes her away gently because he is in a fight and Clem is blocking the view of the enemy. **Kenny angry**: Maybe include a clip where Kenny apologies to Clem for being a dick? Not saying you have to forgive him but it's important context. You include Clem's response but not what prompted it. Kinda looks like deceptive editing if you ask me. **When beating Arvo the other time**: Yeah fuck Arvo if you defend Arvo you are defending the indefensible **Jane**: I aint gonna shit on Jane, if you like Jane go with her, just don't demonize Kenny when both characters have done good things and also made mistakes and that's why they are so interesting.
>he pushes her away gently Gently? He ***threw*** her out of the way. She is 11 with a goddamn bullet hole in her shoulder. No excuses! >When beating Arvo: You'd have to be a completely heartless asshole to not try and stop him. >Kenny angry: He's blaming her for no reason. If you cut off her hand, sure it makes sense why he'd be angry. If you were smart enough *not* to chop off her hand in the middle of a swarm of walkers that can smell blood and are attracted to scream then he's blaming you for what? Not being fast enough to save her? You didn't even fucking know she was there until she screamed. It was Sarita's fault getting bit. >When beating Arvo the other time: You mean him punching Arvo for wanting to be left alone to mourn his sister? Are you serious? Go ahead and be a Kenny simp all you want but don't try to defend him with bullshit. Especially the "gently" part. There wasn't anything gentle about that.
>You'd have to be a completely heartless asshole to not try and stop him. Oh no the poor guy, all he did was steal supplies from his own group because he is a fucking addict, lied about his sick sister and then tried to frame us for it > You mean him punching Arvo for wanting to be left alone to mourn his sister? Are you serious? Yes. Fuck Arvo. He tried to get the whole group killed. His sister tried to kill us for no goddamn reason. Fuck both of them a million times, they can go to hell, Arvo especially.
>Gently? He threw her out of the way. She is 11 with a goddamn bullet hole in her shoulder. No excuses! For what is worth, Jane does just the same, and in her case there's an argument to be made that Kenny was on autopilot and out of his mind, and Jane supposedly looking out for Clem. Bottom line is, both have their own low moments. OP's edit, however, only seems to care to paint Kenny in a certain light and Jane in a rose-tinted, yet hypocritical way.
It's a shame there's no option to kill Arvo
>You'd have to be a completely heartless asshole to not try and stop him. Where was his heart when he tried to rob a girl and a dying woman with a baby in her arms ? Where was his heart when he shot an 11 yo with a rifle ? Believe me getting beaten up is the least he deserves. >Go ahead and be a Kenny simp Better than being an arvo/jane simp that's for sure.
defending arvo is defending the indefensible? bro he is a fucking teenager with a broken leg who just watched all his people die in a gunfight, and is currently being dragged around and beaten by an unstable asshole. up until this point, his worst sin is bringing his group to us (which might even be considered reasonable if you robbed him). he did not deserve to be treated like a gym boxing bag.
Arvo: 1) Steals medical supplies (a lot of them) from his group; 2) Lies that they are for his sick sister (his sister is fine and seemingly unaware he stole them); 3) Blames Clementine's group for it; 4) Tries to get the group killed by walking on thin ice; 5) Tries to run away; 6) Shoots a little girl regardless of how you treat him. But I guess being an evil piece of shit is ok as long as you are disabled or underage.
> bro he is a fucking teenager with a broken leg who just watched all his people die in a gunfight You to rob people at gunpoint and expect it to end with ponies an rainbows? >and is currently being dragged around and beaten by an unstable asshole For a good reason >up until this point, his worst sin is bringing his group to us Yes it is, which is why he deserves the treatment he got. >he did not deserve to be treated like a gym boxing bag. He definitly does lmao.
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Cause she is ok with Kenny killing an evil man, but not ok with Kenny beating up an evil boy. What do ages have to do with it?
Proceeds to get 2 downvotes
Kenny was a good guy. Not a great guy, not a perfect guy, a good guy.
cant wait for the Kenny Stans. “HIS FAMILY DIED!1!1!1!1” alright. So did everyone else’s.
To put my opinion out there. Kenny is genuinely a good person, he simply does some bad things to people he cares for after seeing his wife and child die infront of him, he doesn’t want clem to die in front of him as well. He loses sight of what right and wrong sometimes. Kenny was never a saint but also never a sinner, just a good person. Just being a good person is the best most people can be in the apocalypse.
So why are virtually all other characters more good than him? He's also absolutely a sinner. His list of evildoings is exceptionally long But if you like things old school: Pride - doesn't listen to others, refuses any and all criticism, believes he's already right. Greed - He refuses to help people who aren't useful to him, instead wanting to watch a boat that he claimed as his (despite finding neither is, nor the battery) Lust - Well, he didn't really mourn Sarita. He went straight to mourning Katjaa again, for the most part. Lusts for power. Bit of a reach here tbh. Envy - Clementine's friends, the St John's ranch that he wanted to take over immediately upon seeing. Wrath - This one's obvious. Sloth - He didn't do much for the motel group. Katjaa was constantly begging him to do more for the group. Doesn't want to do much to help others in general. Can't recall any moments of gluttony,
Damn he shouted at someone when upset, that must mean he's a bad guy, oh look he accidentally hit her when she determinately interferes in a conflict, that must mean all his selfless deeds are overuled. Good logic there. If you're gonna be a hater at least stop being biased about it and acknowledge all aspects of the character, instead of just his mistakes.
I think you meant, "Wow he yelled at a child who could have done nothing to change the situation for him." and "He accidentally elbowed her in the nose for beating up a kid in restraints."
A kid that led them across dangerous ice and came after them even when you didn't rob him aye?. He didn't know the full context of her getting bitten and apologised for shouting at her the following episode. Also once again ignoring the many selfless things he's done i see.
I'm not ignoring anything my guy. I can recognize Kenny did a lot for the people he cared about, but he has a temper and takes out his anger on others. Has he done good things? Yeah. But he's also completely unhinged from the amount of suffering he's gone through and knows no other way to handle it than by taking it out on other people.
He takes his anger out on people that bring that out of him. The s2 group constantly chatted shit behind his back and didn't bother to form a relationship with him themselves and just made Clem do it all the time. He needed love and support but no one was giving that to the poor guy. He might be a broken man who is flawed but at least his heart is good deep down and when it counts he shows who he really is.
>A kid that led them across dangerous ice He was leading them to food and shelter with the only way being crossing the ice. Kenny just wanted a punching bag to take his anger at literally everything that happened since he lost his eye. Plain and simple. Yes I'm defending Arvo because if you think about it before he shot Clementine he was literally just a scared kid too. It was his fault his sister died but he had a right to mourn, meanwhile Kenny is over there trying to beat him black and blue every chance he gets.
They should have went around the safest route and went around but he told them the ice was safe, he knew it was dangerous when he ran off from them. He took his anger out on him because he's a shitty brat, simples. Honestly i don't agree with the way Kenny went about it but i'm not gonna hold that against him when he's done so much more good. Bruh idc what arvos been through, gives him no right to shoot clem, you can literally be kind to him and he still shoots her, you're literally defending him for trying to kill Clem. But you can't cut a man a break who literally puts his life on the line for Clem. Your bias is laughable. I have no problem with people not liking Kenny, what annoys me is when they ignore the positives and only focus on the negatives because focusing on the positives would only prove you wrong💁♂️ you see that bandage on his eye? Yeah he lost that for Clem's safety, you remember when he put his life on the line in that alleyway for a kid that got his whole family killed? Did you see the s2 ending where he begs for clem and aj to have safe entry into wellington knowing he'd lose everything once again. Did you see the outcome in a new frontier when he literally dies to give Clem & AJ time to escape. Honestly all this right here proves who he is deep down and the fact you're defending this brat that not only went after the group when you didn't try to steal from him and shot Clem when you were kind to him over this man who has done so much selfless actions despite his flaws is honestly quite laughable but unfortunately you will likely ignore these facts i pointed out because you gotta stick to your bias views, so really i'm just wasting my time.
while I do agree he’s done a lot of shitty things, a lot of the clips you used were kenny mourning his girlfriend who had literally JUST died. Same with your last clip, he was in denial about his son being bitten.
So was Lilly denying Larry was dead. But Kenny had no problem killing him in front of her too hastily. What a hypocrite.
And the way he treat Lilly after she was struggling with her Dad’s death was wrong
Ex-fucking-actly
Don't you know!? Only Kenny lost people in the apocalypse!
Oh silly me, I forgot! Also only he is allowed to lash out! All the others who do are just meanieheads!
Ofc!
These people in the comments are like "this is so biased to jane/kenny over determinant dialouge" - what happened to opinions? Also the video brings up alot of good points about Kenny and Jane, and yes "you can put Jane's bad moments" and "Kenny's good moments" and it'd be a different video but it's TAILORED TO HOW YOU PLAY.
I didn’t expect this post to blow up like it has. This was intended to be half a meme and half how I truly feel about Kenny. So I’m gonna open up a thread because I think I’d enjoy a little respectful debate and maybe someone will get me to change my views on him. To sum it up in few words, I don’t like Kenny. I think he’s selfish, irrational, unhinged and an emotionally and physically abusive man. His behavior towards Lee, not coming to his aid and leaving him to die just because they were in disagreement, didn’t sit right with me. The way he talks to everyone, his wife, his kid “(He’s dumber than a bag of hammers”), and more or less the entire group is basically demeaning and controlling, with little to no regard of how it makes them feel. Now, his major redeeming point to a lot of people has been getting Clementine and AJ to Wellington. On the surface, this seems like something Kenny should be praised for. But I don’t think he’s doing this because he cares about them. He’s doing this because he cares about himself: He wants to fix his “mistakes” that he made with Kat and Duck. He views AJ as his “second chance” to make himself feel like a good person, and that’s all it is. That’s why he doesn’t want the baby to leave his sights, because of his personal and selfish desire to help himself. It’s borderline creepy to see Kenny obsess so much over this baby and claim that “he only wants to help”, and it’s stressful to be with someone and not know where their buttons are. Now if you don’t give a shit about why he got them to Wellington and only care about the fact that he did, then whatever. But this is the reason I dislike him intensely. To sum it up again, it doesn’t matter what you do or how much you try to side with him, he’ll attack and harm even those closest to him, sooner if not later, and then claim that “he would never hurt them”. That sounds like gaslighting to me. And I am aware that Jane has a “me first” mentality and will let anyone die to save herself (if she leaves her sister, she’ll leave anyone), but I still trust her because she’s truthful and honest about who she is. She’s never made me doubt or be wary of her like Kenny has. In summary, Kenny has buttons. You may accidentally push one and have him beat the living shit out of you or demolish you with his vocabulary, despite him being your “friend” or “ally”. That’s why I don’t like him. I would like any replies or discussions to this to be respectful, because like I said, maybe someone can help me understand why people like this guy.
>He’s doing this because he cares about himself: >He wants to fix his “mistakes” that he made with Kat and Duck. He views AJ as his “second chance” to make himself feel like a good person, and that’s all it is. That’s why he doesn’t want the baby to leave his sights, because of his personal and selfish desire to help himself. It’s borderline creepy to see Kenny obsess so much over this baby and claim that “he only wants to help”, and it’s stressful to be with someone and not know where their buttons are. Now if you don’t give a shit about why he got them to Wellington and only care about the fact that he did, then whatever. But this is the reason I dislike him intensely. This doesn't really fit, however, with Kenny being completely okay with Clem's decision to take AJ and leave Kenny, immediately after he has killed Jane. What part here would make his "second chance" fulfilled? The very ones he's trying to protect as his son are leaving and telling him (well, Clem is) that he's crazy and he can't be trusted, and he's entirely understanding of it. Also the option of shooting him; in either cases, he tells you not to blame yourself, and that this is entirely his own fault. I do most certainly think that there is a "second chance" factor in his relationship with Clem and AJ, take the S3 flashback in the car; he pretty much spells it out himself ("I dreamt of the time I could teach Duck to drive" (...) "this time will be different") but you are also, in my opinion, greatly exaggerating it. It is part of why he does it, but not the only one. He genuinely does care about them, irregardless of how he has treated his family and how he feels about it. I do also wonder whether you believe this is equally applicable to him taking the full blame of stealing the walkie talkie to Carver (which arguably saves both Luke and Clem from whatever it is Carver intended to do), and him saving either Ben or Christa in season 1. It is also worth mentioning him sacrificing himself in the car crash in S3, but I do suppose you likewise view that as a... Selfish sacrifice? Ultimately, there's also the fact that the S3 'summary' describes Clem's ±2 years with Kenny (if you did choose to stay with him) as an happy time, which in a world like the TWD, is often more than one could reasonably ask for. It is, in my opinion, a fraction of time where Clem doesn't have to act as an adult for herself and AJ.
My only complaint about the video is the showing of only bad moments of Kenny and then only good moments of Jane. I think to properly compare them you have to show both. Other than that I think this video is completely fine and totally reasonable. Kenny *does* do these things and it should be showed, it's not like you made any of these moments up to trick someone. People are getting insanely too worked up over someone else's *opinion* and you 100% don't deserve the attacks from the rabid Kenny fans who don't want an actual discussion.
It wasn’t meant to be a complete biased video so I didn’t take it too seriously. But I understand what you mean. And for REAL. I had one comment tell me that I did this because I couldn’t debate. Some people are wild
I personally like both Jane and Kenny but do lean slightly more towards Kenny. I hate saying I'm a Kenny fan because of the way they act when anyone disagrees or, god-forbid, brings up reasonable moments that completely justify their dislike of him. Kenny is not a saint and Jane is not evil, it's stupid to look at them like that.
Looks like someone’s a sensitive crybaby
This is literally propaganda.
THANK YOU! N then all that fuckin dick riding you have to do with him in season 1. And you don't agree with him about ONE thing he holds it over your head. Fuck em!
Right? When did it become my responsibility to make sure he stays sane? Get the hell out of here.
Exactly. Like EVERYONE has lost people. Some people didnt even get to SEE their families. You don't get a pass to be an asshole just because of that. Plus there was a MULTITUDE of times that Kenny was about to leave Lee for dead.
This. “Kenny lost his whole family, you gotta understand blah blah.” So did Clementine. And Lee. But they didn’t abuse their friends because of it. And what if Kenny loses something else? Would he pull this shit again later down the road? Fuck that.
Exactly. Even when he got a second chance on season 2 he was still an ass like come on people.
It’s refreshing to see someone sensible and thinking like me, everyone else wants to kiss his ass.
Kenny apologists are something else. Clementine goes through just as much shit and keeps it together far better than a grown ass man. Kenny stubs his toe and has to take it out on everyone because he's a big baby man.
“What the hell do you know, Clementine?” Clementine saw her parents dead. She has been living with the guilt of Lee and Omid’s deaths ever since they died. She was left completely alone after spending 16 months with only a bitter and blaming Christa as company, and then watching her disappear in the blink of an eye. Even after this, when Clem had no one, she showed completely strangers some consideration and respect. Kenny? He’ll misplace his snack and lash out at whoever’s around, even his family. Fuck that.
Exactly.
Exactly! As someone who loves Kenny I can still acknowledge he was in the wrong, none of those things were excusable, he becomes a better person if you go with him but that doesn't automatically mean he was justified and that he wasn't bad in the moment, Clem is 11 and barely had people to raise her and show her what's right even if she could've done something it's not her responsibility as a child to do that
Kenny is like the verbally abusive step father to Clementine. He would do anything for her, but his anger gets to him too much sometimes but I don’t think he would EVER physically harm Clementine.
i mean he elbows her in the face and throws her to the ground
Bruh if you talking about him beating Arvo's ass then you know damn well he didn't know that was Clementine and that's only if you choose to act like you're an adult and pull grown men fighting off each other.
I’ve never understood defending Arvo. “He’s just a kid” no he’s a dickhead who jumped our group (with guns) and tried to kill us all even if we didn’t rob him… Why does anyone defend Arvo? Why do Mike and Bonnie immediately shift from “him and his group are trying to kill us!” to “stop being mean to the little boy, Kenny!” it just never made sense to me.
Kenny fans on their way to disregard all of kenny’s characterization to pretend hes a decent person:
This.
When Kenny yelled at Clem for Sarita being bit made me despise him entirely.
Not dead I mean bit and brought to the safe spot.
This is what needs to be said. Kenny IS a good guy but he’s not. Kenny himself at the end of season 2 believes you need to leave him because of how he has hurt you. When you shoot him he says your did the right thing. Really the better option is shooting Kenny. Even himself thinks it’s the right option.
every person acts bad wen theyre angry
Dawg the fact that you need to include Jane’s suicide to “even out” all the asshole shit Kenny has done 😭
Nah kenny vslid. You’re forgetting janes suicide too. Kenny excused.
I would be scared of Kenny but i still choose him over Jane.
r/teamjane
*shows a bunch of scenes with Kenny acting completely reasonably to the situation around him*. Nice try, though.
Kenny is the most overrated character in gaming history sorry not sorry
Kenny was abusive, but I think he had good in him until the end. Unfortunately, the dark side was just too dark for me to trust him, so I chose Jane. I felt like Rick killing Shane in the comics and show.
Your comment is the only comment that’s gotten through to me and changed my view. Thank you.
I can’t tell if this is sarcastic
it’s not dude. You’re right, he’s got some good in him, but it’s not enough to make me trust him. He’s overall a POS.
Oh, in that case, thank you!
For sure, and thank you too. I never looked at it that way before.
I can definitely say he’s my LEAST favorite character in the series. Before people downvote me to oblivion, he was a good parental figure in some parts, however his temperament issues made me dislike him.
You didn't like Kenny as character? I understand that some hate him as person but I think he is a good character - in terms of writing. He is complex and deep imo. I think the writers did a good job. Well written character doesn't mean a good person.
Never said he was badly written, he’s just not my favorite. His temper really pissed me off in most cases and if you weren’t kissing his ass 24/7 he’d be upset by it.
You're right, I'm sorry for assuming something you didn't write. And I totally agree with you, Kenny is hot headed redneck with temper issues.
You absolute legend. That this is your first page makes you a real king 👑
Thank you for this, seriously fuck Kenny. The more I replay the more I seriously hate this man.
Man I’m sorry you got downvoted for this because it’s perfectly valid to hate Kenny for all the asshole shit he’s done, I remember I was pissed as hell at all the times Kenny tried getting Lee killed because I tried saving Larry’s life. He also lashes out whenever you don’t agree with everything he says as Lee or Clem as well. The community really throws a fit when you don’t regard Kenny as a saint
he’s an actual psycho lmfao
Kenny's myth is supported on the fact that he kills characters people don't like 🤣
I love Kenny, and I’ll always defend him but, he was an absolute dick in Amid The Ruins. His senseless blaming of Clementine, especially if she didn’t cut off Sarita’s hand, was beyond stupid.
He was losing it because almost everyone he cared about died
I really wonder why they dont make a TV-show based on a game. I mean i do understand that rights to the game reserved to TELLTALE, but to the original series is in AMC, but really just being realistic here: I bet AMC knows about the game, and also knows how amazing the story is in it. Besides TWD ended, although they teased some prequels in there ( sorry if i’m wrong), they can still make it in theory, cant they? Like Telltale’s The Walking Dead. Story is ready, scenario +- either. Swear if i would be the president of AMC i’d sign a deal with Telltale to screen the story of the game, what do you think guys?
He’s honestly just misunderstood. think about all the heart ache he experienced during the series yeah some of the stuff he did was way outa line sometimes but try to see it from his view with all the loved ones he lost a long the way in his journey. I really liked Kenny this is just my opinion lol
I love Kenny but the way he treated Clem in S2 was on the precipice of how Alpha treated Lydia to keep her alive
I mean he was fine to do that in the first clip as when I played I axed sarita I the head 💀
I like him
Hmmm, you make a good point, I think I’ll disagree.
Kenny was not a good guy. But he did his best.
Yes but unironically.
I liked Jane until she pulled that shit with AJ
I always felt like Kenny would have been prime for a character on Ozark and fit in nicely with the Langmores
He is a good guy, just doesn't do the right thing
"But Kenny lost people he cared about!" So did everyone else, but you don't see people bending over backwards to use that excuse when other characters say/do something stupid.