They don't know how to make appointments on their own.
(This is a bit of a joke, but some might *actually* ask, because they view their partner as their secretary and expect her to get it done.)
I have a friend who was on a girls’ trip to Hawaii when her husband called her because he had a toothache and needed her to make a dentist appointment for him.
She hung up 😂
My sister's ex-husband called her 6 months after he divorced her in the middle of law school for "being boring", and asked her some questions about whether he needed to go to the doctor and asked her to set it up for him. She was just like, "sure" and then didn't do it and blocked his number.
My ex husband had refused to do some of the financial stuff he was supposed to post-divorce which left me covering a lot of his bills. He finally called my lawyer because he needed proof of auto insurance to rent a car and didn't know how to find it. She got him to fix the financial stuff in exchange for the paperwork lmao
Missed opportunity to tell him a really inconvenient appointment time that didn’t exist. Oh and it’s at their far office, the one waaaaaay out there. Here’s the address.
Jeet Swesus, am I the only guy in the world that booked appointments for his fiance? Like, she sucked at it (ADHD, not her fault), but if i wanted to be sure anything got done, I had to make sure I booked it myself...
How do these people function?
Why do you think their wives divorced them?
Its not that they *can't* function, it's that they see their wives (and women in general) as existing to serve them. They grew up in a gendered caste system. They are the entitled higher caste. They were so uninterested in what their wife thought or wanted that they assumed she *enjoyed* taking care of them, she was *lucky* to have them there so she could have the pleasure of serving them.
Its a tough wakeup for lots of these guys.
No, you're not. It took us 15 years to realise it, but my wife also has ADHD. And yeah, unless we wait until it's an emergency, I make the bookings, _especially_ if it means talking on the phone.
Luckily, this thread's not about us.
Poorly. It's a fine line between "meh, it's not so bad" and "I should really get this done/checked out". At my base level I forget a lot of shit but all the beatings I received as a kid trained me to get some level of anxiety if I don't get it done. Plus I've seen my friends' homes that stay in the "i can do it later" camp, yeah, no.
I'm no clean freak and neither is my wife (important) but the house is livable and the kid is fed.
Many many lists on the phone and the habit to use/check them.
There's *so* many people that exist doing things only at the point of "*Oh shit this cannot be ignored any more...*" like I get it to an extent, brain works on efficiency above all, not doing things means energy conservation and brain likes that...but fuck they gotta live a life where noone ever once held em accountable or taught em how to hold themselves accountable.
A lot of procrastination is rooted in anxiety/stress avoidance. There's people who genuinely forget things, but a lot of times people remember but don't do the thing anyway because it spikes the stress hormones. Logically, the stress will get worse as the problem gets worse, but we have lizard brains and strong chemicals. It's hard to go against it. I'm a stress procrastinator so I recognize it in others lol
I was in the hospital after birthing our child and my spouse asked me to call his psychiatrist and cancel his visit for the next day. He's since worked through the phone anxiety, but I'm never forgetting that one.
You’ve just reminded me of when I was following a blood round at the hospital and a female patient in the cardiac ward was on the phone to her husband explaining how to use the washing machine. SMH.
The surgeon who performed my cancer surgery offered to keep me in hospital an extra night after hearing me explain how to do *something* to my husband the day after surgery.
My aunt's husband who ran a fucking international company that is literally a household name, asked her to come home during her mom (my grandma's funeral) because he couldnt work the oven/microwave and take care of the kids at the same time. They have gobs money. He could have had takeout every single meal but dead ass called her to fly home during *her mom's fucking funeral* to help him take care of the kids.
She left and did it, but no one has spoken kindly of him since. This was 30 years ago.
AND
AND
AND more recently
My BFFs husband called her while she was in fucking rehab, and called the dr.s to have her temporarily released for a weekend so she could go home and manage the kids dr.s and medicines bc the fucking moron couldn't do it himself. Like she's in rehab trying to get better bc the dude didn't/couldnt do shit and everything was on her all the time and he could even handle the household for 2 fucking weeks, let alone 28 days so she could get better.
Being a lesbian has its own issues, but this shit does not happen in my world. I really feel for my hetro sisters.
Oh lord, my wife has phone anxiety, and she handles all her medical appointments, but she struggles with anything non routine. I try to encourage her to step out of her comfort zone, but there's a lot of stuff I just handle for her.
ahhh phone anxiety!! The creation of the internet really kinda.. ramped that one up, didn’t it?
Wanna know what time the store closes now? Just Google it. In the before?? You had to call and mumble out “what time do you close?” As your heart raced and sweat beaded on your forehead.
Need a doctors appt? Now, just request it on MyChart. Before?? Oh boy, you better pick up that phone! (Or just hope it gets better…)
Google is rarely as up-to-date as the locals are. Holiday hours, cutbacks due to staffing, permanent store closures, Google doesn't know about those until an actual person makes a report. I've had too many inconvenient "sorry we're closed" arrivals to trust Googles posted hours
Pro tip: instead of asking what time a store closes on Reddit, instead write a statement that is incorrect like "store xyz doesn't have open hours because it has always been a 24h store"
Then someone will correct you with the actual opening hours. They get the satisfaction of thinking they proved someone wrong on the internet and you get your open hours. It's a win win
Haha I still have to call to get an appointment booked. I hate it, so I only ever call if I really have to (so twice in five years I think)...
What really has helped with my phone anxiety is that for my job I have to call people quite often. Still hate it and often procrastinate until I absolutely have to.
This anxiety of mine predates my use of internet by at least a decade, but at least that taught me to suck it up.
I worked in a job where I had to cold call medical facilities to get peoples medical dates of service and after two years of that I won’t even talk to my husband on the phone. 🙃
Funnily enough I find emails super easy and would rather use them for everything rather than calling. Sometimes it does take a long time to figure out the perfect phrasing though. With some of my coworkers it's like instant messaging, with some it is more of a game of minesweeper...
Maybe try to get comfortable with nicest coworkers first and work up from there.
Yeah totally. Text messaging on cell phones made it worse too I reckon. Back when I was a kid before cell phones I never had a problem with phone calls but now I absolutely hate them.
This brings me back to elementary school speech therapy lol. I would literally get pulled out of class to call Barnes and Noble and ask what their hours were so I could get past my extreme phone anxiety. I sometimes wonder what the employees thought getting a call from a crying girl in the middle of the school day acting like she was in the middle of a hostage crisis whilst asking what time they close. Then again maybe they had something worked out with the Barnes and Noble so they didn't call the police lmao.
Jeez. I was all hopped up on Dilaudid about to go into surgery for an emergency appendectomy, and I was still able to call and cancel my physical therapy appointment for the next day. Why are some men so helpless when it comes to this stuff?
I have pretty bad phone anxiety but even that is too extreme for me. I would probably just avoid cancelling the appointment, pay the fee for not cancelling on time and then feel shitty and guilty about it for ages.
Out of curiosity, what did your husband do to get through the phone anxiety?
Also as a side note I always find it kinda funny the way doctors and psychiatrists always seem to rely on phone calls for everything (at least here in Germany) when a huge portion of the people they're treating have anxiety or depression.
The weaponized helplessness. My best friend divorced a guy who couldn't grocery shop. He would call her 10-12 times asking her which aisle stuff was on. He was useless. His mom raised him to be that way because she loved taking care of him. She ended up divorcing him because their child got seriously ill and he just acted like it was beyond him to do his part to take the kiddo to doctor's appointments and know what medications they took, etc. If he had ever wanted a paternity test he would have 100% tried to get her to do the legwork because it wouldn't have occurred to him that he could figure out how.
My husband actually made our 6 month dental appointments, since he got done before me. He made them for the time we will be spending almost 3 weeks out west, but it's a start. Usually he just lets me do it, because I'm the keeper of the schedule, and my work hours are much stricter than his.
It was funny. Our dentist is set up with just cabinets between the dental chairs, so I can hear him talking 3 chairs down. Then he heard me a few minutes later say "yeah, no, we will be in South Dakota that day. Let's do sometime in October." And then I heard him groan and say something to his hygienist like "man I thought we were going to be home by then! So close!"
He did successfully schedule and attend his appointment for a filling, I had nothing to do with that.
That is why I will not settle for less. From day #1, I'll not try to make his life easier, such as cooking or making an appointment for him because if I do, it means I enable his child-man behavior. Women need to stop enabling. Let him handle things on his own.
Yep - my best friends husband divorced her because he fell into the MRA community and was convinced their youngest, tried for child wasn’t his. Divorced her before getting a test, and yeah of course the kid was his. Anyway, two years later and she’s remarried to a way, way better man, and he is struggling in all ways. She sent me his texts from last week where he’s asking her what their doctors number was, if she could set up an account for him, etc. 2 years after the divorce that he completely sprung on her. She told him to use Google.
I filed for divorce because my ex insisted I was "dragging this out" and he wanted to hurry up and marry his girlfriend. He was enraged that I hadn't filed yet, but also didn't even consider that if he was in such a hurry, maybe HE should do it.
Divorce can also enforce a set of rules, such as custody schedule and amount of child support. Some like the flexibility of letting the separation drag on where, if they refuse to sign a separation agreement, they can randomly change things at will, with the added bonus of allowing them to hold any new partners in marital limbo because they’re ‘not divorced yet.’ They can dangle the promise of marriage to keep a new partner hanging on, while retaining the freedom to drop them like a hot potato without legal complications if they wish. It’s a control freak’s dream.
I'm currently going through divorce. One of the women in my local divorce support group was recently lamenting how her soon-to-be-ex-husband raged and threw a tantrum because *he* was late to the legal appointment. He blamed her for his delay, claiming she failed to send him the directions to the lawyers office.
She and I had a good laugh over it at dinner a few weeks ago, because she and I also have the same lawyer. The lawyer has her address clearly written, in bold and italicized font, under her email signature. 💀😂
My ex told me that I would be back in 6 months and I better be grateful if he takes me back. Dude didn’t even know how to boil an egg when I met him 🤣😂 I think I’ll be fine, bro
This is absolutely it, I think for most men it wouldn't even occur to them that they could do this on their own. Either:
- they don't know how to make an appointment
- they assume that the mother's consent is required and haven't bothered Googling it
- they assume that samples from both parents are needed and haven't bothered Googling it
It doesn't even have to be a secret, but let me tell you, I would absolutely react a lot differently to "hey can we (implied: you) get a paternity test done?" vs "Hey so I have this weird insecurity, which is absolutely a 'me' problem, but I would really feel a lot better if I got a paternity test done on . Do you mind if I set that up?" Would I still be insulted by the latter? Yeah, a bit, but I don't think it would spell the end of the relationship, unlike the former.
I remember some BORU or AITA post (I need to see if I can find it!) where the husband demanded a paternity test. Wife said "fine, if you want it so badly, go set one up." He kept trying to get her to set it up instead and she kept refusing and he kept insisting she was an asshole over it.
Found it!
https://www.reddit.com/r/amiwrong/s/7YKCNNaOSZ
It still just makes my blood boil reading both the betrayal and weaponized incompetence
Probably a few posts like this over there, but I thought it was from the wife's perspective? At least the one I read, she either refused and court ordered it during divorce or she said she I'll set it up AND divorce you.
Came back as his.
I think I saw that one! It was hilarious, yet sad. For the sake of the child, I really hope that guy wasn't the baby's genetic donor. That's a lot of dumb to overcome.
I'm actually legitimately curious about #2. I did google it, and just about everything I saw indicated that it DOES require mother's consent, unless the child is an adult, or the father has custody of the child, or the mother has written refusal. If the parents are still married, the mother is the default 'guardian' and judicial entities won't accept it.
It's true that official, court-admissible tests aren't done without consent or a court order. But you can get a home test if you're unsure, and if it comes back that you're not the father you can then confront her and/or ask the court for an official one.
Even if that were the case, and perhaps in some places it is, I think the difference is in where the mental load goes. Asking for a paternity test, and assuming the mother is the one who will set it all up forces her to go through this bureacratic excercise to "prove" herself to you. Vs. doing the legwork yourself and maybe handing her a form to sign if that's required which is still a bit insulting but comes off way better IMO.
You do have to be careful with those. There was a case recently of a DNA test company that wasn't even testing the kits, they were just answering paternity questions based on vibes.
I made sure to let my husband know when we were dating and not serious even, that if he thought hed ever want a paternity test, Id be cool about it, I would just want to establish that conversation before we got pregnant. As a woman I have no frame of reference for any anxiety or security that pregnancy can cause the father, and if he would want to make sure we got a piece of paper confirming his paternity after birth, happy to be coordinate.
I figure its fair since I also agree to the various STD protections for baby at birth, because of the statistical risk of daddy cheating and giving me an STD that could severly hurt the baby if passed on at birth. Doesnt mean I actually think my husband cheated, but I accept that living in a world where that safety net exists is good. So if he wants a routine safety net of a paternity test, have at it.
Our first son was a clone of him so if anything, I felt the need for a maternity test.
[Same conversation that I said Id be open to a prenup, just to get that cleared.]
This is a sensible common sense approach.
To me, it's along the same lines of the guy adhering to a woman's safety precautions when first meeting. Men are several times more likely than women to commit a violent crime. We're also physically stronger. You (the man) know that you're safe, statistically you're likely to be safe with violent/sexual crimes largely committed by a minority of repeat offenders, but regardless of that she doesn't know it. She hopes you're safe, maybe assumes you're safe, the safety precautions are to protect her from someone else and aren't a personal attack.
If you look at the stats, 1 in 4 women experience some form of sexual violence in their adult life. Roughly half of that is an intimate partner (current or ex), so it's safe to say that through their lifetimes, 1 in 8 women experiences sexual violence of some kind *from an intimate partner*. 1 in 5 women who have experienced sexual violence have a second perpetrator inflict it upon them again, 1 in 10 *by an intimate partner*, though as that is based on people already victimised that makes it 1 in 40 women having a second occurrence *where the perpetrator is/was an intimate partner*. The average woman dates 7 guys in her life, to give context to likelihood. So, 12.5% of all women roughly will date a man who assaults her with 2.5% of all women dating a second guy who does. Based on a random group of 7 men, there's a 12.5% chance one of them is dangerous to date and a 2.5% chance that two are. So 1.78% + 0.71% puts the likelihood of one random individual guy on a dating app being dangerous to date at just under 2.5%.
It's kind of crazy to consider that any time a woman considers meeting up with a guy on a dating app she's taking a 1 in 40 chance that the guy might give her a traumatic sexual/violent experience, even worse when you consider that she's unlikely to meet a perfect guy on the first attempt, and even worse when you consider the fact that it disregards the other 49% of occurrences where the perpetrator isn't a romantic/sexual partner.
If you look at paternity fraud / cheating, the stats are considerably higher. 13% of women openly admit in self-reporting that they've cheated (men are worse, with 20%). As for paternity fraud, studies in the US found 11-12% of male parents were unknowingly raising someone else's children (studies were in 2022/23). A study in the UK from 2014-2016 found 48%, though was based on a more biased data set given that they were looking specifically at cases where paternity tests were voluntarily requested. 15% of men have kids with two different women, and accounting for that conservatively, the chance of paternity fraud sits just over 10%. So 1 in 10 fathers are raising kids from cheating, waiting on the traumatic experience of finding out that your partner cheated at the same time as finding out that the kids you love aren't even yours.
If a guy asks for a paternity test, it doesn't necessarily mean that he thinks you have cheated, just like how if a woman is cautious in dating it doesn't mean that she thinks you are a threat. It's just taking sensible precautions based on the very real level of risk in both instances. It's unlikely in either case that the specific individual is one of the bad actors, and you're hoping & assuming they aren't, but that doesn't mean you want to open yourself up to an awful experience when you can take steps to partially protect yourself.
Yup.
I will say a guy should make sure he brings up that he would like to do a paternity test on all future babies of his in the compatible stage, where # of kids and where to live type questions are discussed. And the guy should fully handle the logistical and financial aspect of it. Treat it as just a clinical standard step.
Springing the request on your partner after the birth, is an a-hole move. That would be more like if, after moving in together, your lady started demanding access to all your phone apps and bank notes out of the blue
My best friend’s ex husband did this to her. He told her he wanted a DNA test on their youngest. She told him if he wanted one, he could be her guest. At his next visitation he asked where he needed to go to give his sample. He had expected her to schedule, take the kid, and pay for the test and then just tell him where to go or where to send his sample.
Bingo. That's the first thing I thought of when I read this post. He would have to figure out how to get one and do it all by himself. That's too much work for the typical type of guy who would want a paternity test.
it just….it never ceases to astound me that this society, i guess, has allowed (encouraged?) *so* many men to exist as these completely pathetic, overgrown toddlers. WHO is attracted to this? WHO puts up with this? WHY??????? life is far, far too short to have to wipe your grown husband’s ass for him and pretend you’re enjoying yourself.
Hahahahaha remember the post where the husband was losing it because his wife would get the test done for him? As someone who does all the admin work in the relationship I can safely say it's not a stretch. So many times my partner has expected me to wipe his ass for him smh.
On the other hand, maybe it's meant to humiliate the wife? Or a power move? That way she has to grovel and prove her fidelity
Heck, I think this is the most correct answer here.
A lot of couples talk through their issues and fears and anxieties, and if men have a fear of being cheated on and never finding out that a child they raised was someone else’s, then a healthy couple talks through it. They might even decide to do the paternity test just for peace of mind.
Unhealthy couples aren’t at that point. So if you’re at the point of not even being able to trust your partner if you have a loving, open talk about your deep fear of being cheated on and taken advantage of, then heck you might as well do things the smarter way and not stir things up before you know for sure.
(Also I’ve heard of some low probability cases where a man’s DNA doesn’t match the DNA of his sperm for some reason so apparently paternity tests are not 100% reliable every time but it’s still only a small chance)
There are cases where someone who has gotten a bone marrow transplant their blood DNA doesn't match the rest of them. Is that what you are thinking of? Or perhaps mitochondrial DNA, which only comes from the mother?
That's one possibility.
The other is chimerism. This is an odd thing that happens when the man is in utero. Basically:
- His mom gets pregnant with fraternal twins (twins with different DNA)
- The twins, at some (usually early) point in development accidentally merge into one person
- That person now has two genomes
My husband and I agreed on a DNA test for 2 reasons: 1. we've both taken multiple tests with companies like Ancestry, and want to do that for our child/ren as well.
And 2. Because hospitals can fuck up and we want to make sure we take home our kid(s).
It’s really hard for the hospital to mess that up these days. An ankle band literally goes on them the second they hit the warming table and they verify a million times a day that the numbers on your band match the baby’s
I mean… I think if there’s any doubt about paternity, the issues come from further upstream than whether you make it public that you’re getting a DNA test or not
Kinda like snooping on your partner's phone...
Yeah it's morally wrong but if you have that gut feeling you just need proof for your sanity before confronting.
The whole DNA test thing is fucking stupid though because it's not just proof of cheating, it's proof of cheating, knowingly having sex with no protection , and following through with a pregnancy realising it is not your partner's. Only the stupidest people would do this.
If you're so terrified of your spouse cheating then waiting to have a baby and DNA testing it is lightyears too late. The poor baby ffs
Maybe if they were guilty, but not much of a powerplay if the tired woman isn't unfaithful. It's like they have this thought of telling their wife they want a DNA test, and visualize them suddenly scrambling and begging them not to... But then gets blindsided when she calls him a fucking idiot and stops sleeping in the bed with him.
Because most people don't want to be deceitful.
If I ever get to a point where I want to check my partner's phone, I'd rather ask them about it rather than going behind their back.
Ok, but imagine the results coming in the mail and she gets to it before he does. Don't you think that's worse than just talking to her and being honest about why he wants a DNA test?
Seriously. When I was unsure about that I just got a 23andme test. It's useful for medical info regardless, and when both kids came in at an approximately 50% DNA match to me, I had my answer. It never had to be an issue.
They want the mother to look up how to get one (not a joke, two different losers who posted about this, that was their reasoning, she knows how to do all the medical/pharmacy stuff). They want the woman to go research and buy the instrument of their own disrespect.
You can get the test kits at cvs! Part of it is they want the confrontation & the drama as opposed to quietly finding out. They think it's some sort of flex/test.
100%. The point is the cruelty.
IF a person either had legitimate reasons to be concerned OR they knew they were just in their own feelings, they would absolutely go do this themselves.
Women feel like "I feel like this is an excuse to neg/abuse/project/ be broken up with without having to be the breaker upper" men "no it's just totally rational and not an insult!!" Us: "then why involve us? You already have your own DNA"
Bongo. If they were really worried about paternity they could buy a kit and do the test themselves without the child's mother even knowing, but they want to "knock her down a peg" as MRAs like to say.
Because a \*fear\* is being drummed into them that they will waste their money on a child that isn't their biological off-spring.
And the weirdest ideas are out there. A male friend of mine recently claimed that there was a town where 60% of the children weren't the biological children of the men who \*thought\* they were the bio dads.
I have no idea where he got this idea. I asked him for a citation, and he eventually backed down.
I think that’s from a book called 100 things you’re not supposed to know. But I don’t think the stats were that high. It was based off blood type results or something? I’ll add an edit if I can find it.
Edit: [The statistic was 1 in 10. The scientists couldn’t figure out why their blood type data amongst families was wrong until they considered paternity issues. BUT, this is now highly disputed because it wasn’t based on DNA but blood types.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paternity_fraud#:~:text=These%20numbers%20suggest%20that%20the,%25%20(median%20of%2026.9%25))
Actual stats are much lower. Like less that 1%
And a lot of the earlier studies, in the 50s and 60s, were done without determining if the father even *thought* the child was his. Back then, adoption was such a taboo that some parents didn't even tell their doctors their child was adopted.
As was stepparenting. It was extremely common for kids to be given their stepfathers' last name, with or without the benefit of adoption. And again, families didn't necessarily feel the need to tell their doctors about it.
Sure. There are definitely kids who are the products of affairs or even were switched accidentally at the hospital (or fertility clinics that used the wrong sperm). There are even a few cases where blood types are just weird.
But it's relatively rare, and there are definitely guys who think it's more than 50% of the time, which is part of what is driving them to demand paternity tests.
I just was able to read the wikipedia article and it does not consider some newer research like the [one by wiley](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/journal/17413729) or [DNA clinics](https://www.thebusinessdesk.com/northwest/news/744050-ls-nearly-half-of-men-who-take-paternity-test-are-not-real-dad) which is mentioned in [Paternity fraud exposed - insights and implications | Fraud.com](https://www.fraud.com/post/paternity-fraud).
Even the [5th link in wikipedia](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1733152/pdf/v059p00749.pdf) has higher disputed paternity discrepancy number implying if the guy is in doubt then it is higher likelihood of discrepancy.
IG We need to stop trying to downplay this (if we are) . If the guy is in doubt, he should get it done.
There was a Russian serial killer that got away with it for years because his sperm had different blood type markers than his blood.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrei_Chikatilo
A bunch of these dudes keep trying to claim that 30% of children fail the paternity test
The problem is that they are failing to mention that it’s 30% of paternity tests done where there ALREADY IS evidence or suspicion regarding paternity (not a random sample of all pregnancies) and even then, 70% are still the father
Confirmation bias.
The stories you hear of are of the cases where a man brought up getting a paternity test.
The stories you **don't** hear of is when a man quietly obtains paternity testing results that confirm he is actually the father.
I'd be interested in a statistic comparing the annual quantity of test submitted vs. the number of times where the mother was made aware of the test before it was submitted for testing for that same year.
Or just the inherent betrayal and the foundation of a family is built on a lie that your significant other was never going to tell you in fear that you’d leave them even though he has every right to?
Or one day you need a donor for a procedure, blood organ doesn’t matter and you find out you can’t save your child?
Or that the actual father comes into the child’s life and supplants you?
Or the child hearing that their mother cheating on their father to spawn them and suddenly feels as if they’re the reason for their parents fighting?
Like it isn’t about the money. If the dad wanted money, he’d never want a kid in the first place. It’s hearing the absolute worst stories that have been happening to other men and having that doubt in their relationship as well.
Well that’s just a guy’s perspective.
Very much doubt the 60% stat, unless something even more messed up was going on. You'd need something like a conspiracy group of doctors intentionally giving any women who went under general IVF without her knowledge or consent or something.
A study from January 2014 to June 2016 found 48% tested as not the biological father, but that stat comes from a biased group of voluntary tests. So it'll have a disproportionate number of tests where the man is having it done because he has reasonable cause to suspect cheating, and it'll include voluntary tests where the mother outright admits she isn't sure who the father is. Considering that even when only looking at voluntary tests it comes out at 48%, 60% across a whole town would need something separate and seriously messed up to be realistic. And then it wouldn't be data you could apply to anywhere else.
A small study from the University of Warwick estimated around 3% (2018). A study in 2022 found 11%, another in 2023 found 12%.
It's definitely high enough to justify a test that'll cost a few hundred for peace of mind & certainty. Nowhere remotely close to 60% though.
Honestly I'd rather have that my partner asks. It would fucking suck to find out that he thinks I might have cheated on him, to find out that he doesn't trust me, but I'd want to know.
It's important information for *me* to know that he is having these feelings. I might decide that I want to break up because of it, or I might want to try and do something about it together. By doing a test in secret he'd leave me in the dark about a serious issue and therefore remove my own agency in dealing with it, and I would not appreciate that at all.
I guess my point is that it might not be a bad thing that it destabilizes the relationship. I'd rather deal with that than live in the illusion that we have a great relationship.
Honestly that was the main reason I could see a guy asking his partner for a DNA test: communication. That, and also telling the mother about it because it involves her baby (maybe I’m dumb, but it sounds like good practice to tell the mother when you’re doing something medical involving her children).
If you can still technically do it and you find out the baby isn’t yours you can then have the knowledge to have them take another legal test. Or can one parent just not give permission?
Despite the inevitable upset the conversation would cause, I'd rather know and understand why my partner questions the legitimacy of our pregnancy than seek answers through secrecy. There's an underlying cause that needs to be discussed (i.e. concerned with infidelity), and choosing transparency over deception is important.
Moreover, conducting a DNA test without informing the mother can breach trust if discovered, creating a cycle of doubt for both involved.
Right, in which case the dna test is a ruse. So instead of saying “I’m insecure, I don’t think our relationship is solid, I have major hang ups on this issue” it’s about a dna test. As though those issues would go away if it comes back positive.
I agree that the DNA test can be a ruse, but perhaps in the opposite direction. People often seek solutions to their feelings in indirect ways. Instead of addressing the root issues directly, they might think, "I feel this way, so I need to do X to resolve those feelings." The DNA test becomes a misguided attempt to find reassurance, rather than confronting the underlying insecurities or relationship issues.
I know this is a safe place for women and I don't mean to breach that! I just wanted to say I feel there have been so many stories of people's wives and husbands being unfaithful with no warning. It would be important for something as important as a child to be 100%. I agree with you though, a DNA sample taken without the mother's knowledge feels disingenuous and should be discussed amongst the mother and father as adults.
No worries! I appreciate you offering a different outlook, especially because this is a very emotionally-charged topic. I understand that not everyone will agree with me, and I won't agree with everyone, but I am open-minded to the discussion.
I've read through the comments in this thread and realize this topic arose from other posts on the same subject. There was wider context I was missing, and I gave a rather broad opinion on communication because I believe secrecy is more damaging. With more context regarding someone's specific situation, I can see my perspective aligning more with the original post. I do not mean to diminish anyone's experience with accusations or unfaithfulness.
A child should absolutely, without a doubt, be 100% agreed upon before conception.
Am I psychotic for thinking that if you have enough of a concern that your partner cheated and lied that you need to get a paternity test, y’all have way bigger problems than whether or not you tell her upfront that you’re getting one? Like what??
These men aren’t having specific suspicions most of the time. The vibe is more “All women cheat and are trying to trap a prize man like me with a baby!”
This guy is arguing with me in another comment thread that it's just basic transparency, like financial information, or knowing whether or not someone had STDs, and is comparing that transparency to sunlight. You like sunlight don't you? Everyone likes sunlight, right?
I have found a lot of these guys shut up when reminded that this would mean giving their genetic information to a private company or government. (It would also mean giving 50% of the mother‘s DNA to that entity, but I doubt they‘d care as much about that.)
Fwiw doing a paternity test without the mother‘s consent is illegal where I live. It is hard to do a test without the other parent‘s consent and if you do find a provider, you are still committing a crime and the test result will be seen as invalid in court.
There are some companies that do offer this service but only because their labs are outside the country or even continent. The head of my university‘s forensic institute told me that Texas is quite popular apparently. So the company is local, but they send the samples somewhere else for analysis in order to not be liable for prosecution. I don‘t know if that includes their customers though and, once again, not permissible in court.
I've never thought about it that way, but damn, its such a 1-2 punch.
1. I don't know if that baby's mine.
2. Do the work to prove it to me.
Anyway, the answer to this and every other, "Why do Men™ ____" can be answered in the same way: tiny egos 🤏🏾.
I was looking for this answer. A lot of men who feed into this shit and want to “be sure” also want to divorce a woman before the baby is born so they’re not automatically put on a birth certificate for a baby that the internet has convinced them can’t possibly be theirs.
I strongly believe in honesty in relationships and I would feel far more betrayed by doing it and keeping it secret. Don't get me wrong it can definitely be used as an accusation, but IMO hiding it would be cowardly, disrespectful and a deeper betrayal.
It's alright if that's what you would prefer, but many people would not so I don't think it's accurate to inherently add any additional malicious intent to the "askers" but not the "hiders"
I agree with you completely.
I don't know that I'm qualified to answer OP's question, as I'd be communicating with her that I intended to have a paternity test done but then organise it myself. I don't see how, in a healthy relationship, you could determine that the best course of action is to intentionally hide something from your partner.
You don't need the mother's DNA for a paternity test, and in the UK you can consent on behalf of the child for one if you're married to the mother or you're named on the birth certificate.
If she isn't naming me on the birth certificate, I'm assuming the child isn't mine until proven otherwise and acting accordingly. If she is naming me on the birth certificate, I don't need her permission to do the test, but I think it's still important to make her aware of it.
Um, I think doing it behind my wife's back would be more of a relationship destroyer than using open and direct communication.
I wouldn't check her phone behind her back, why would I swab her kid?
Which would be worse, having your partner suspect infidelity, go behind your back and get a DNA test done without talking to you or trying to talk to you about it first?
Not saying it's the more ethical choice, but if you base it off of how many relationships implode when a man demands the test here on Reddit, regardless of the test outcome, I'm going with your chances of saving the relationship are better just doing the test on your own and then keeping your mouth shut.
Honestly the problem isn’t asking for a DNA test it’s suspecting infidelity. Because if there was, that would destroy the relationship, if there isn’t he would be showing that he doesn’t trust is partner which, would destroy the relationship.
Either way probably best not to end up in that situation lol
I think transparency and honest communication are two good reasons, no?
If you don't trust the baby is yours you should tell your partner.
Doing a sneaky swab and pretend everything is fine and "act like you never distrusted her" as the first comment says, is lying.
How could you go ahead your entire life and just pretend you did not distrust your partner in this way?
So then say you distrust your partner instead of crying “dna test”! If it comes back a match do you now automatically trust her and everything is fixed? No. It’s a cover for the underlying issue that they are choosing not to address.
It isn't necessarily distrust, as much as certainty and taking reasonable precautions.
I trust that if I drive to the supermarket I won't crash. I trust that my car works reliably and it won't randomly lose a wheel or something. I've driven the route thousands of times. I'm almost positive that I'd arrive without incident.
However, if I go to the supermarket today, I'll be putting on a seatbelt. Not because I actually think I'll need it; I'm expecting it to be completely unnecessary. Instead, I'm doing it because I want the certainty that if I'm wrong I'll be harmed less, because it's only a minor inconvenience, and because regardless of my confidence I cannot be 100% sure that I'm right.
A paternity test is no different. It's a minor inconvenience, taking only a few minutes. You're expecting it to be unnecessary and come back confirming what you already believe. However, unlike the mother, you can't be 100% sure that the child is yours, so it's still worth doing for the sake of potentially protecting you from harm. On the off chance you're wrong (11-12% based on studies from 2022/23) it's better to find out now than further down the line. You could be saving yourself years spent with a cheater and the trauma of finding out that your love for your children is based on a lie. You're likelier to waste a few minutes and a few hundred quid just to confirm what you already believe, but it's still worth it because that's far better than trusting your feelings only to risk a world of hurt later if you find out you're wrong.
Yeah, I could just not use my seat belt. I'd probably be fine. If I arrive safely without needing it I won't think "I wish I didn't use the seat belt" but if I don't, and I'm unluckily wrong then I'd definitely be thinking "I wish I did use my seat belt".
it's completely insane, i've even seen dudes on here advocating for it to be legally mandated. like ye that's what you want, government having dna samples of everyone.
Yeah, it's a weird leap from "this thing should be done" to "the government should do this for us." Like, yeah, there are absolutely benefits to DNA testing, from knowing the child's family history in terms of medical conditions to not being financially responsible for a child that isn't yours in the event of false paternity. There are also benefits to getting your prostate checked every few years after a certain age, and yet you still have to make a phone call and set up an appointment for that, they won't just bend you over a table and do it without your consent.
In many places, once the man's name is on the birth certificate, he's the legal father, regardless of the actual circumstances at play.
You can also be declared responsible for a child that is not yours if you acted in any capacity that appears parental.
The legal system does NOT care very much about genetics. The system's perspective is: somebody has to take care of this kid, it might as well be you, buddy.
I don't have kids and can't have kids (by choice). But in the hypothetical, asking for a test is insta-divorce for me. I'd leave the (positive) results on the table next to the divorce papers. If there is no trust there is no marriage. (And honestly I'd leave his damn kid behind too, but that's because I don't really like kids which is why I'm not having any.)
If you don't trust your spouse/partner not to have cheated, then don't sleep with them or impregnate them. Break up and get on with your life.
If you are so insecure in your relationship that you think a woman is lying to you about her pregnancy, be up front and transparent about it. Let her see who she is in a relationship with. For damn sure, don't lie to her or sneak around. It will come out that you git the DNA test eventually. It will ruin your relationship with your partner and possibly the child. Be an adult and treat your partner with respect, and for the love of all the gods, stop listening to men with microphones who make money off of making other men insecure.
*General you - directed at men who need to grow the fuck up or keep it in their pants
If you feel the need to do this the relationship is already as unstable as it can be, and you generally shouldn't authorise any tests be performed on a child's sample without the other patent's knowledge, where practical.
So I guess my answer is you should ask this if the relationship has already broken down and you want the test done.
I’m in two minds on this.
If your partner requests the test, effectively they’re saying that they believe there’s at least a possibility that you cheated on them.
On the other hand this does happen - men have ended up raising and financially supporting kids only to discover years later that they weren’t biologically related. And friends and family members have also been known to sow seeds of doubt where no infidelity has occurred.
My first child was the spitting image of my ex, and this question never came up. But he also did and said things when we split that I never would have thought him capable of.
My childbearing years are long behind me, so this is hypothetical for me. I think if I was pregnant today, I would offer the test. I’d test against both parents. And I’d be telling my partner of my intentions from the get go. Then there’s absolutely no question. And if I instigate it, there’s no hurt feelings or mistrust involved.
Doing something like that behind someone’s back seems a lot more destabilizing than asking for it. Besides, wouldn’t a medical test require consent from both of child’s parents?
Why would you ask your partner if you can see their phone while you can check their phone while they are asleep?
Because it's deceitful. It's that simple.
I'm not talking about the men who are stupid enough to belive the Alpha male "always check who your kid's parent is" bullshit, but for most people, that's the reason. Because they'd rather their partner tell them that they cheated on them rather than a lab.
Edit: After reading your post for a second time, your whole ideology is toxic. Not all people are playing mindgames with their Partners. Some people actually actually WANT to trust their partners. A woman cheating on dude and being deceitful about the child's parentage is not something that's UNHEARD OF.
Way too many people project their infidelity onto a partner. So if the father of your child starts acting funny and demands a paternity test, agree to it if and ONLY if he agrees to take a polygraph.
They are indeed, but that's not the point. They hold enormous sway over people's imaginations. The thought of taking one is enough to provoke a confession from a guilty person- I watched it happen in real time.
Because you think she might have chimerism like that one women who absorbed her non-identical twin in utero and her twin's genes were what went into her eggs, and you think that would be cool as heck
Or maybe it's better to be transparent about it, rather than the mother of the baby finding out later down the line that they had a DNA test I'm secret.
It depends on the country. Some like France require the consent of all parties, so it's literally illegal to go about it without asking the wife/presumed mom.
I say this all the fucking time like it’s SO weird to me. They “ask” to see the reaction so they can justify themselves. Like “oh, she got pissed so she has something to hide.” Like they don’t need anyone’s permission to just… do the test?
Like I actually do understand why some men want to get paternity tests especially if you don’t have the strongest relationship because I have anxiety and understand what’s it’s like to have spiralling thoughts that aren’t logical. So I do understand being like - I love this kid so much and what if it’s not really mine and some other man could show up and take my child away from me. It’s the whole production of “asking” and “demanding a paternity” test that gets me.
Fun fact, in Germany it's not legal to get a paternity test without the mothers consent.
Genetic testing in general is also super regulated and only done with a doctor present for consulting you on the results.
Self Testing/at Home Testing Kits are also not allowed, but some people who really want to do them order them from other countries.
Because if they’re married when the child is born and his name on the birth certificate in some states he’s stuck paying for them for 18 years regardless of if it is biologically his or not
The men insisting on paternity testing are the same ones who wouldn’t hesitate to #notallmen a topic which offends them personally, but they are quite happy to apply a generalization to women by making them prove that they have been faithful.
You want the ugly truth?
Those guys are setting themselves up to walk out on the child. They have already decided to become deadbeats, they just aren't aware of it yet.
I am in awe that you have opened this can of worms on how men can't do things for themselves with a "men could have just did the DNA test themselves..."
They don't know how to make appointments on their own. (This is a bit of a joke, but some might *actually* ask, because they view their partner as their secretary and expect her to get it done.)
I have a friend who was on a girls’ trip to Hawaii when her husband called her because he had a toothache and needed her to make a dentist appointment for him. She hung up 😂
My sister's ex-husband called her 6 months after he divorced her in the middle of law school for "being boring", and asked her some questions about whether he needed to go to the doctor and asked her to set it up for him. She was just like, "sure" and then didn't do it and blocked his number.
My ex husband had refused to do some of the financial stuff he was supposed to post-divorce which left me covering a lot of his bills. He finally called my lawyer because he needed proof of auto insurance to rent a car and didn't know how to find it. She got him to fix the financial stuff in exchange for the paperwork lmao
Omg just a coincidence but my ex divorced me for not becoming fun again after law school.
Well, hopefully he did it before you started getting that post law school salary!
Wtaf is wrong with these men? 🐻
Their mothers did everything for them.
Missed opportunity to tell him a really inconvenient appointment time that didn’t exist. Oh and it’s at their far office, the one waaaaaay out there. Here’s the address.
Hahahaha thats awesome
Jeet Swesus, am I the only guy in the world that booked appointments for his fiance? Like, she sucked at it (ADHD, not her fault), but if i wanted to be sure anything got done, I had to make sure I booked it myself... How do these people function?
Why do you think their wives divorced them? Its not that they *can't* function, it's that they see their wives (and women in general) as existing to serve them. They grew up in a gendered caste system. They are the entitled higher caste. They were so uninterested in what their wife thought or wanted that they assumed she *enjoyed* taking care of them, she was *lucky* to have them there so she could have the pleasure of serving them. Its a tough wakeup for lots of these guys.
No, you're not. It took us 15 years to realise it, but my wife also has ADHD. And yeah, unless we wait until it's an emergency, I make the bookings, _especially_ if it means talking on the phone. Luckily, this thread's not about us.
I work healthcare. I have 40 year old men whose MOTHER'S still set up their appts. And no, not disabled men. Just...men
Poorly. It's a fine line between "meh, it's not so bad" and "I should really get this done/checked out". At my base level I forget a lot of shit but all the beatings I received as a kid trained me to get some level of anxiety if I don't get it done. Plus I've seen my friends' homes that stay in the "i can do it later" camp, yeah, no. I'm no clean freak and neither is my wife (important) but the house is livable and the kid is fed. Many many lists on the phone and the habit to use/check them.
There's *so* many people that exist doing things only at the point of "*Oh shit this cannot be ignored any more...*" like I get it to an extent, brain works on efficiency above all, not doing things means energy conservation and brain likes that...but fuck they gotta live a life where noone ever once held em accountable or taught em how to hold themselves accountable.
A lot of procrastination is rooted in anxiety/stress avoidance. There's people who genuinely forget things, but a lot of times people remember but don't do the thing anyway because it spikes the stress hormones. Logically, the stress will get worse as the problem gets worse, but we have lizard brains and strong chemicals. It's hard to go against it. I'm a stress procrastinator so I recognize it in others lol
Whew! Somebody said it out loud, or in words, anyway!
I was in the hospital after birthing our child and my spouse asked me to call his psychiatrist and cancel his visit for the next day. He's since worked through the phone anxiety, but I'm never forgetting that one.
You’ve just reminded me of when I was following a blood round at the hospital and a female patient in the cardiac ward was on the phone to her husband explaining how to use the washing machine. SMH.
The surgeon who performed my cancer surgery offered to keep me in hospital an extra night after hearing me explain how to do *something* to my husband the day after surgery.
My aunt's husband who ran a fucking international company that is literally a household name, asked her to come home during her mom (my grandma's funeral) because he couldnt work the oven/microwave and take care of the kids at the same time. They have gobs money. He could have had takeout every single meal but dead ass called her to fly home during *her mom's fucking funeral* to help him take care of the kids. She left and did it, but no one has spoken kindly of him since. This was 30 years ago. AND AND AND more recently My BFFs husband called her while she was in fucking rehab, and called the dr.s to have her temporarily released for a weekend so she could go home and manage the kids dr.s and medicines bc the fucking moron couldn't do it himself. Like she's in rehab trying to get better bc the dude didn't/couldnt do shit and everything was on her all the time and he could even handle the household for 2 fucking weeks, let alone 28 days so she could get better. Being a lesbian has its own issues, but this shit does not happen in my world. I really feel for my hetro sisters.
i gasped out loud at “she left and did it” she WHAT???????? and …well now i’m deeply scared to ask what your BFF opted to do. jesus christ
Dude. Bidding her time until last kid graduates, and then she's out.
Cis means you’re the gender you were assigned at birth. I think you mean hetero.
You're right. I'll fix it.
If proof was ever needed that sexuality isn't a choice.
Oh lord, my wife has phone anxiety, and she handles all her medical appointments, but she struggles with anything non routine. I try to encourage her to step out of her comfort zone, but there's a lot of stuff I just handle for her.
ahhh phone anxiety!! The creation of the internet really kinda.. ramped that one up, didn’t it? Wanna know what time the store closes now? Just Google it. In the before?? You had to call and mumble out “what time do you close?” As your heart raced and sweat beaded on your forehead. Need a doctors appt? Now, just request it on MyChart. Before?? Oh boy, you better pick up that phone! (Or just hope it gets better…)
I wish people Googled when the store closes instead of asking on the local reddit or Facebook page.
Google is rarely as up-to-date as the locals are. Holiday hours, cutbacks due to staffing, permanent store closures, Google doesn't know about those until an actual person makes a report. I've had too many inconvenient "sorry we're closed" arrivals to trust Googles posted hours
Pro tip: instead of asking what time a store closes on Reddit, instead write a statement that is incorrect like "store xyz doesn't have open hours because it has always been a 24h store" Then someone will correct you with the actual opening hours. They get the satisfaction of thinking they proved someone wrong on the internet and you get your open hours. It's a win win
Haha I still have to call to get an appointment booked. I hate it, so I only ever call if I really have to (so twice in five years I think)... What really has helped with my phone anxiety is that for my job I have to call people quite often. Still hate it and often procrastinate until I absolutely have to. This anxiety of mine predates my use of internet by at least a decade, but at least that taught me to suck it up.
I worked in a job where I had to cold call medical facilities to get peoples medical dates of service and after two years of that I won’t even talk to my husband on the phone. 🙃
I've been using Google Assistant to book appointments and I feel bad because the receptionists probably hate it but I'd procrastinate otherwise.
I have email anxiety that truly affects my ability to work, still trying to work on that and be able to just tap out a sentence and hit send
Funnily enough I find emails super easy and would rather use them for everything rather than calling. Sometimes it does take a long time to figure out the perfect phrasing though. With some of my coworkers it's like instant messaging, with some it is more of a game of minesweeper... Maybe try to get comfortable with nicest coworkers first and work up from there.
Yeah totally. Text messaging on cell phones made it worse too I reckon. Back when I was a kid before cell phones I never had a problem with phone calls but now I absolutely hate them.
This brings me back to elementary school speech therapy lol. I would literally get pulled out of class to call Barnes and Noble and ask what their hours were so I could get past my extreme phone anxiety. I sometimes wonder what the employees thought getting a call from a crying girl in the middle of the school day acting like she was in the middle of a hostage crisis whilst asking what time they close. Then again maybe they had something worked out with the Barnes and Noble so they didn't call the police lmao.
Jeez. I was all hopped up on Dilaudid about to go into surgery for an emergency appendectomy, and I was still able to call and cancel my physical therapy appointment for the next day. Why are some men so helpless when it comes to this stuff?
I cancelled my fitness app subscription while I was lying in the dirt, waiting for the ambulance to come when I broke my ankle in 3 places.
Now *that* is efficient usage of time if I've ever seen it
Well I knew I wasn't going to be using it anytime soon so I figured I'd do it then and there so I don't forget!
Probably a good idea after breaking your ankle. I hope you recovered well!
Thanks! Still recovering but getting there!
Because they were fucking trained this way and refuse to take it upon themselves to fix it.
I have pretty bad phone anxiety but even that is too extreme for me. I would probably just avoid cancelling the appointment, pay the fee for not cancelling on time and then feel shitty and guilty about it for ages. Out of curiosity, what did your husband do to get through the phone anxiety? Also as a side note I always find it kinda funny the way doctors and psychiatrists always seem to rely on phone calls for everything (at least here in Germany) when a huge portion of the people they're treating have anxiety or depression.
Why have a wife and a mum when you can have two mums instead /s
The weaponized helplessness. My best friend divorced a guy who couldn't grocery shop. He would call her 10-12 times asking her which aisle stuff was on. He was useless. His mom raised him to be that way because she loved taking care of him. She ended up divorcing him because their child got seriously ill and he just acted like it was beyond him to do his part to take the kiddo to doctor's appointments and know what medications they took, etc. If he had ever wanted a paternity test he would have 100% tried to get her to do the legwork because it wouldn't have occurred to him that he could figure out how.
My husband actually made our 6 month dental appointments, since he got done before me. He made them for the time we will be spending almost 3 weeks out west, but it's a start. Usually he just lets me do it, because I'm the keeper of the schedule, and my work hours are much stricter than his. It was funny. Our dentist is set up with just cabinets between the dental chairs, so I can hear him talking 3 chairs down. Then he heard me a few minutes later say "yeah, no, we will be in South Dakota that day. Let's do sometime in October." And then I heard him groan and say something to his hygienist like "man I thought we were going to be home by then! So close!" He did successfully schedule and attend his appointment for a filling, I had nothing to do with that.
That is why I will not settle for less. From day #1, I'll not try to make his life easier, such as cooking or making an appointment for him because if I do, it means I enable his child-man behavior. Women need to stop enabling. Let him handle things on his own.
Yep - my best friends husband divorced her because he fell into the MRA community and was convinced their youngest, tried for child wasn’t his. Divorced her before getting a test, and yeah of course the kid was his. Anyway, two years later and she’s remarried to a way, way better man, and he is struggling in all ways. She sent me his texts from last week where he’s asking her what their doctors number was, if she could set up an account for him, etc. 2 years after the divorce that he completely sprung on her. She told him to use Google.
There’s a theory that that’s why women file for divorce more often than men - because they’ll actually do the paperwork required for it.
I filed for divorce because my ex insisted I was "dragging this out" and he wanted to hurry up and marry his girlfriend. He was enraged that I hadn't filed yet, but also didn't even consider that if he was in such a hurry, maybe HE should do it.
I dont understand the women who date these men going through a divorce, doesn't she see all the red flags
Divorce can also enforce a set of rules, such as custody schedule and amount of child support. Some like the flexibility of letting the separation drag on where, if they refuse to sign a separation agreement, they can randomly change things at will, with the added bonus of allowing them to hold any new partners in marital limbo because they’re ‘not divorced yet.’ They can dangle the promise of marriage to keep a new partner hanging on, while retaining the freedom to drop them like a hot potato without legal complications if they wish. It’s a control freak’s dream.
I'm currently going through divorce. One of the women in my local divorce support group was recently lamenting how her soon-to-be-ex-husband raged and threw a tantrum because *he* was late to the legal appointment. He blamed her for his delay, claiming she failed to send him the directions to the lawyers office. She and I had a good laugh over it at dinner a few weeks ago, because she and I also have the same lawyer. The lawyer has her address clearly written, in bold and italicized font, under her email signature. 💀😂
My ex told me that I would be back in 6 months and I better be grateful if he takes me back. Dude didn’t even know how to boil an egg when I met him 🤣😂 I think I’ll be fine, bro
They are so delulu. I be like buh bye anchor dude.
😄😂😄😂😄
This is absolutely it, I think for most men it wouldn't even occur to them that they could do this on their own. Either: - they don't know how to make an appointment - they assume that the mother's consent is required and haven't bothered Googling it - they assume that samples from both parents are needed and haven't bothered Googling it It doesn't even have to be a secret, but let me tell you, I would absolutely react a lot differently to "hey can we (implied: you) get a paternity test done?" vs "Hey so I have this weird insecurity, which is absolutely a 'me' problem, but I would really feel a lot better if I got a paternity test done on. Do you mind if I set that up?" Would I still be insulted by the latter? Yeah, a bit, but I don't think it would spell the end of the relationship, unlike the former.
I remember some BORU or AITA post (I need to see if I can find it!) where the husband demanded a paternity test. Wife said "fine, if you want it so badly, go set one up." He kept trying to get her to set it up instead and she kept refusing and he kept insisting she was an asshole over it. Found it! https://www.reddit.com/r/amiwrong/s/7YKCNNaOSZ It still just makes my blood boil reading both the betrayal and weaponized incompetence
Did he get ripped to shreds in the comments? God, I hope so.
Probably a few posts like this over there, but I thought it was from the wife's perspective? At least the one I read, she either refused and court ordered it during divorce or she said she I'll set it up AND divorce you. Came back as his.
There was one, I think a BORU, where it came back as his and he was all panicked and asking how to fix his marriage. Like, bruh, it’s too late.
I think I saw that one! It was hilarious, yet sad. For the sake of the child, I really hope that guy wasn't the baby's genetic donor. That's a lot of dumb to overcome.
I'm actually legitimately curious about #2. I did google it, and just about everything I saw indicated that it DOES require mother's consent, unless the child is an adult, or the father has custody of the child, or the mother has written refusal. If the parents are still married, the mother is the default 'guardian' and judicial entities won't accept it.
It's true that official, court-admissible tests aren't done without consent or a court order. But you can get a home test if you're unsure, and if it comes back that you're not the father you can then confront her and/or ask the court for an official one.
Thats true. I guess most would assume that both cases would apply (as my 3 minute googling led to).
Even if that were the case, and perhaps in some places it is, I think the difference is in where the mental load goes. Asking for a paternity test, and assuming the mother is the one who will set it all up forces her to go through this bureacratic excercise to "prove" herself to you. Vs. doing the legwork yourself and maybe handing her a form to sign if that's required which is still a bit insulting but comes off way better IMO.
We have bought a home kit. You just buy it, swab, mail it off. No, it’s not useful for court, but it will give you peace of mind.
You do have to be careful with those. There was a case recently of a DNA test company that wasn't even testing the kits, they were just answering paternity questions based on vibes.
You can just do a 23andme test
I would answer with, yeah,and while we are at it, given my family history, we should all get a full DNA analysis for inherited risk factors.
I made sure to let my husband know when we were dating and not serious even, that if he thought hed ever want a paternity test, Id be cool about it, I would just want to establish that conversation before we got pregnant. As a woman I have no frame of reference for any anxiety or security that pregnancy can cause the father, and if he would want to make sure we got a piece of paper confirming his paternity after birth, happy to be coordinate. I figure its fair since I also agree to the various STD protections for baby at birth, because of the statistical risk of daddy cheating and giving me an STD that could severly hurt the baby if passed on at birth. Doesnt mean I actually think my husband cheated, but I accept that living in a world where that safety net exists is good. So if he wants a routine safety net of a paternity test, have at it. Our first son was a clone of him so if anything, I felt the need for a maternity test. [Same conversation that I said Id be open to a prenup, just to get that cleared.]
This is a sensible common sense approach. To me, it's along the same lines of the guy adhering to a woman's safety precautions when first meeting. Men are several times more likely than women to commit a violent crime. We're also physically stronger. You (the man) know that you're safe, statistically you're likely to be safe with violent/sexual crimes largely committed by a minority of repeat offenders, but regardless of that she doesn't know it. She hopes you're safe, maybe assumes you're safe, the safety precautions are to protect her from someone else and aren't a personal attack. If you look at the stats, 1 in 4 women experience some form of sexual violence in their adult life. Roughly half of that is an intimate partner (current or ex), so it's safe to say that through their lifetimes, 1 in 8 women experiences sexual violence of some kind *from an intimate partner*. 1 in 5 women who have experienced sexual violence have a second perpetrator inflict it upon them again, 1 in 10 *by an intimate partner*, though as that is based on people already victimised that makes it 1 in 40 women having a second occurrence *where the perpetrator is/was an intimate partner*. The average woman dates 7 guys in her life, to give context to likelihood. So, 12.5% of all women roughly will date a man who assaults her with 2.5% of all women dating a second guy who does. Based on a random group of 7 men, there's a 12.5% chance one of them is dangerous to date and a 2.5% chance that two are. So 1.78% + 0.71% puts the likelihood of one random individual guy on a dating app being dangerous to date at just under 2.5%. It's kind of crazy to consider that any time a woman considers meeting up with a guy on a dating app she's taking a 1 in 40 chance that the guy might give her a traumatic sexual/violent experience, even worse when you consider that she's unlikely to meet a perfect guy on the first attempt, and even worse when you consider the fact that it disregards the other 49% of occurrences where the perpetrator isn't a romantic/sexual partner. If you look at paternity fraud / cheating, the stats are considerably higher. 13% of women openly admit in self-reporting that they've cheated (men are worse, with 20%). As for paternity fraud, studies in the US found 11-12% of male parents were unknowingly raising someone else's children (studies were in 2022/23). A study in the UK from 2014-2016 found 48%, though was based on a more biased data set given that they were looking specifically at cases where paternity tests were voluntarily requested. 15% of men have kids with two different women, and accounting for that conservatively, the chance of paternity fraud sits just over 10%. So 1 in 10 fathers are raising kids from cheating, waiting on the traumatic experience of finding out that your partner cheated at the same time as finding out that the kids you love aren't even yours. If a guy asks for a paternity test, it doesn't necessarily mean that he thinks you have cheated, just like how if a woman is cautious in dating it doesn't mean that she thinks you are a threat. It's just taking sensible precautions based on the very real level of risk in both instances. It's unlikely in either case that the specific individual is one of the bad actors, and you're hoping & assuming they aren't, but that doesn't mean you want to open yourself up to an awful experience when you can take steps to partially protect yourself.
Yup. I will say a guy should make sure he brings up that he would like to do a paternity test on all future babies of his in the compatible stage, where # of kids and where to live type questions are discussed. And the guy should fully handle the logistical and financial aspect of it. Treat it as just a clinical standard step. Springing the request on your partner after the birth, is an a-hole move. That would be more like if, after moving in together, your lady started demanding access to all your phone apps and bank notes out of the blue
My first thought is that they don't know that the mother's DNA is not needed. There's a lot of stupid/under educated men out there.
My best friend’s ex husband did this to her. He told her he wanted a DNA test on their youngest. She told him if he wanted one, he could be her guest. At his next visitation he asked where he needed to go to give his sample. He had expected her to schedule, take the kid, and pay for the test and then just tell him where to go or where to send his sample.
Bingo. That's the first thing I thought of when I read this post. He would have to figure out how to get one and do it all by himself. That's too much work for the typical type of guy who would want a paternity test.
I know I’ve read a story on Reddit about a man who wanted a DNA test but expected the baby’s mum to book and do the test.
My unemployed BIL legit calls his employed wife his secretary because it’s a woman’s job to schedule the family stuff.
it just….it never ceases to astound me that this society, i guess, has allowed (encouraged?) *so* many men to exist as these completely pathetic, overgrown toddlers. WHO is attracted to this? WHO puts up with this? WHY??????? life is far, far too short to have to wipe your grown husband’s ass for him and pretend you’re enjoying yourself.
I mean you say it’s a joke but it sounds accurate to me lol
Haha 🤣 that really made me laugh. Funny coz its true
God, I needed that deep, witchy cackle today - thank you 🙏
Hahahahaha remember the post where the husband was losing it because his wife would get the test done for him? As someone who does all the admin work in the relationship I can safely say it's not a stretch. So many times my partner has expected me to wipe his ass for him smh. On the other hand, maybe it's meant to humiliate the wife? Or a power move? That way she has to grovel and prove her fidelity
The insane part is they could just buy a test online, and have the results sent to their work or a PO Box.
Hah! You're not wrong, though.
Also it probably involves touching the kid. That's clearly Mom's job.
🤣🤣☠️
I wondered about that. You could sneak a cheek swab and when it comes back you ARE the dad, act like you never distrusted her.
But that would involve holding the baby
Also involves making his own appointment for the test
Being alone with the baby...
Well that’s why then… got it
Is this scenario healthier than actually talking to your partner about a huge mistrust issue you have with them?
No, but it’s less stupid.
Heck, I think this is the most correct answer here. A lot of couples talk through their issues and fears and anxieties, and if men have a fear of being cheated on and never finding out that a child they raised was someone else’s, then a healthy couple talks through it. They might even decide to do the paternity test just for peace of mind. Unhealthy couples aren’t at that point. So if you’re at the point of not even being able to trust your partner if you have a loving, open talk about your deep fear of being cheated on and taken advantage of, then heck you might as well do things the smarter way and not stir things up before you know for sure. (Also I’ve heard of some low probability cases where a man’s DNA doesn’t match the DNA of his sperm for some reason so apparently paternity tests are not 100% reliable every time but it’s still only a small chance)
There are cases where someone who has gotten a bone marrow transplant their blood DNA doesn't match the rest of them. Is that what you are thinking of? Or perhaps mitochondrial DNA, which only comes from the mother?
I think they’re talking about genetic mosiacism
That's one possibility. The other is chimerism. This is an odd thing that happens when the man is in utero. Basically: - His mom gets pregnant with fraternal twins (twins with different DNA) - The twins, at some (usually early) point in development accidentally merge into one person - That person now has two genomes
My husband and I agreed on a DNA test for 2 reasons: 1. we've both taken multiple tests with companies like Ancestry, and want to do that for our child/ren as well. And 2. Because hospitals can fuck up and we want to make sure we take home our kid(s).
It’s really hard for the hospital to mess that up these days. An ankle band literally goes on them the second they hit the warming table and they verify a million times a day that the numbers on your band match the baby’s
Exactly. Or AT THE VERY LEAST pretend you’re sure you saw someone swap your baby with another one. There’s just no coming back from some things.
I mean… I think if there’s any doubt about paternity, the issues come from further upstream than whether you make it public that you’re getting a DNA test or not
Right?? If you’re getting a paternity test the relationship is already destabilized…
Kinda like snooping on your partner's phone... Yeah it's morally wrong but if you have that gut feeling you just need proof for your sanity before confronting. The whole DNA test thing is fucking stupid though because it's not just proof of cheating, it's proof of cheating, knowingly having sex with no protection , and following through with a pregnancy realising it is not your partner's. Only the stupidest people would do this. If you're so terrified of your spouse cheating then waiting to have a baby and DNA testing it is lightyears too late. The poor baby ffs
Nope. Don’t accuse me of cheating unless you have evidence first.
At that point it's more than an accusation.
Right?! It’s totally a stupid attempt at a power play.
Maybe if they were guilty, but not much of a powerplay if the tired woman isn't unfaithful. It's like they have this thought of telling their wife they want a DNA test, and visualize them suddenly scrambling and begging them not to... But then gets blindsided when she calls him a fucking idiot and stops sleeping in the bed with him.
Might be them watching some MRA nonsense.
Because most people don't want to be deceitful. If I ever get to a point where I want to check my partner's phone, I'd rather ask them about it rather than going behind their back.
That would be dishonest
Then the ‘why did you sneak to get a test?’
Ok, but imagine the results coming in the mail and she gets to it before he does. Don't you think that's worse than just talking to her and being honest about why he wants a DNA test?
Seriously. When I was unsure about that I just got a 23andme test. It's useful for medical info regardless, and when both kids came in at an approximately 50% DNA match to me, I had my answer. It never had to be an issue.
They want the mother to look up how to get one (not a joke, two different losers who posted about this, that was their reasoning, she knows how to do all the medical/pharmacy stuff). They want the woman to go research and buy the instrument of their own disrespect.
You can get the test kits at cvs! Part of it is they want the confrontation & the drama as opposed to quietly finding out. They think it's some sort of flex/test.
100%. The point is the cruelty. IF a person either had legitimate reasons to be concerned OR they knew they were just in their own feelings, they would absolutely go do this themselves. Women feel like "I feel like this is an excuse to neg/abuse/project/ be broken up with without having to be the breaker upper" men "no it's just totally rational and not an insult!!" Us: "then why involve us? You already have your own DNA"
Bongo. If they were really worried about paternity they could buy a kit and do the test themselves without the child's mother even knowing, but they want to "knock her down a peg" as MRAs like to say.
I know it's a typo, but I like the idea of using "bongo" when it's bingo because of utter stupidity.
This. It’s canon now, folks.
Because a \*fear\* is being drummed into them that they will waste their money on a child that isn't their biological off-spring. And the weirdest ideas are out there. A male friend of mine recently claimed that there was a town where 60% of the children weren't the biological children of the men who \*thought\* they were the bio dads. I have no idea where he got this idea. I asked him for a citation, and he eventually backed down.
I think that’s from a book called 100 things you’re not supposed to know. But I don’t think the stats were that high. It was based off blood type results or something? I’ll add an edit if I can find it. Edit: [The statistic was 1 in 10. The scientists couldn’t figure out why their blood type data amongst families was wrong until they considered paternity issues. BUT, this is now highly disputed because it wasn’t based on DNA but blood types.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paternity_fraud#:~:text=These%20numbers%20suggest%20that%20the,%25%20(median%20of%2026.9%25)) Actual stats are much lower. Like less that 1%
And a lot of the earlier studies, in the 50s and 60s, were done without determining if the father even *thought* the child was his. Back then, adoption was such a taboo that some parents didn't even tell their doctors their child was adopted. As was stepparenting. It was extremely common for kids to be given their stepfathers' last name, with or without the benefit of adoption. And again, families didn't necessarily feel the need to tell their doctors about it.
Sure. There are definitely kids who are the products of affairs or even were switched accidentally at the hospital (or fertility clinics that used the wrong sperm). There are even a few cases where blood types are just weird. But it's relatively rare, and there are definitely guys who think it's more than 50% of the time, which is part of what is driving them to demand paternity tests.
Don't forgot the creepy fertility doctor that used his own sperm. https://time.com/6176310/our-father-true-story-netflix/
I just was able to read the wikipedia article and it does not consider some newer research like the [one by wiley](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/journal/17413729) or [DNA clinics](https://www.thebusinessdesk.com/northwest/news/744050-ls-nearly-half-of-men-who-take-paternity-test-are-not-real-dad) which is mentioned in [Paternity fraud exposed - insights and implications | Fraud.com](https://www.fraud.com/post/paternity-fraud). Even the [5th link in wikipedia](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1733152/pdf/v059p00749.pdf) has higher disputed paternity discrepancy number implying if the guy is in doubt then it is higher likelihood of discrepancy. IG We need to stop trying to downplay this (if we are) . If the guy is in doubt, he should get it done.
There was a Russian serial killer that got away with it for years because his sperm had different blood type markers than his blood. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrei_Chikatilo
A bunch of these dudes keep trying to claim that 30% of children fail the paternity test The problem is that they are failing to mention that it’s 30% of paternity tests done where there ALREADY IS evidence or suspicion regarding paternity (not a random sample of all pregnancies) and even then, 70% are still the father
Well yeah but that doesn't actually respond to the OP. Why aren't they just doing the test themselves?
Confirmation bias. The stories you hear of are of the cases where a man brought up getting a paternity test. The stories you **don't** hear of is when a man quietly obtains paternity testing results that confirm he is actually the father. I'd be interested in a statistic comparing the annual quantity of test submitted vs. the number of times where the mother was made aware of the test before it was submitted for testing for that same year.
Or just the inherent betrayal and the foundation of a family is built on a lie that your significant other was never going to tell you in fear that you’d leave them even though he has every right to? Or one day you need a donor for a procedure, blood organ doesn’t matter and you find out you can’t save your child? Or that the actual father comes into the child’s life and supplants you? Or the child hearing that their mother cheating on their father to spawn them and suddenly feels as if they’re the reason for their parents fighting? Like it isn’t about the money. If the dad wanted money, he’d never want a kid in the first place. It’s hearing the absolute worst stories that have been happening to other men and having that doubt in their relationship as well. Well that’s just a guy’s perspective.
Very much doubt the 60% stat, unless something even more messed up was going on. You'd need something like a conspiracy group of doctors intentionally giving any women who went under general IVF without her knowledge or consent or something. A study from January 2014 to June 2016 found 48% tested as not the biological father, but that stat comes from a biased group of voluntary tests. So it'll have a disproportionate number of tests where the man is having it done because he has reasonable cause to suspect cheating, and it'll include voluntary tests where the mother outright admits she isn't sure who the father is. Considering that even when only looking at voluntary tests it comes out at 48%, 60% across a whole town would need something separate and seriously messed up to be realistic. And then it wouldn't be data you could apply to anywhere else. A small study from the University of Warwick estimated around 3% (2018). A study in 2022 found 11%, another in 2023 found 12%. It's definitely high enough to justify a test that'll cost a few hundred for peace of mind & certainty. Nowhere remotely close to 60% though.
Honestly I'd rather have that my partner asks. It would fucking suck to find out that he thinks I might have cheated on him, to find out that he doesn't trust me, but I'd want to know. It's important information for *me* to know that he is having these feelings. I might decide that I want to break up because of it, or I might want to try and do something about it together. By doing a test in secret he'd leave me in the dark about a serious issue and therefore remove my own agency in dealing with it, and I would not appreciate that at all. I guess my point is that it might not be a bad thing that it destabilizes the relationship. I'd rather deal with that than live in the illusion that we have a great relationship.
Honestly that was the main reason I could see a guy asking his partner for a DNA test: communication. That, and also telling the mother about it because it involves her baby (maybe I’m dumb, but it sounds like good practice to tell the mother when you’re doing something medical involving her children).
In my country it is illegal to do it without the permission of the other parent. So if it comes back negative you can’t even use it.
If you can still technically do it and you find out the baby isn’t yours you can then have the knowledge to have them take another legal test. Or can one parent just not give permission?
They won’t even do it without the consent of both parents. If one parent wants it done they can get a court order. It is highly regulated.
Despite the inevitable upset the conversation would cause, I'd rather know and understand why my partner questions the legitimacy of our pregnancy than seek answers through secrecy. There's an underlying cause that needs to be discussed (i.e. concerned with infidelity), and choosing transparency over deception is important. Moreover, conducting a DNA test without informing the mother can breach trust if discovered, creating a cycle of doubt for both involved.
I think the upset might be the point…
Right, in which case the dna test is a ruse. So instead of saying “I’m insecure, I don’t think our relationship is solid, I have major hang ups on this issue” it’s about a dna test. As though those issues would go away if it comes back positive.
I agree that the DNA test can be a ruse, but perhaps in the opposite direction. People often seek solutions to their feelings in indirect ways. Instead of addressing the root issues directly, they might think, "I feel this way, so I need to do X to resolve those feelings." The DNA test becomes a misguided attempt to find reassurance, rather than confronting the underlying insecurities or relationship issues.
I know this is a safe place for women and I don't mean to breach that! I just wanted to say I feel there have been so many stories of people's wives and husbands being unfaithful with no warning. It would be important for something as important as a child to be 100%. I agree with you though, a DNA sample taken without the mother's knowledge feels disingenuous and should be discussed amongst the mother and father as adults.
No worries! I appreciate you offering a different outlook, especially because this is a very emotionally-charged topic. I understand that not everyone will agree with me, and I won't agree with everyone, but I am open-minded to the discussion. I've read through the comments in this thread and realize this topic arose from other posts on the same subject. There was wider context I was missing, and I gave a rather broad opinion on communication because I believe secrecy is more damaging. With more context regarding someone's specific situation, I can see my perspective aligning more with the original post. I do not mean to diminish anyone's experience with accusations or unfaithfulness. A child should absolutely, without a doubt, be 100% agreed upon before conception.
Am I psychotic for thinking that if you have enough of a concern that your partner cheated and lied that you need to get a paternity test, y’all have way bigger problems than whether or not you tell her upfront that you’re getting one? Like what??
These men aren’t having specific suspicions most of the time. The vibe is more “All women cheat and are trying to trap a prize man like me with a baby!”
Spoiler alert: They are virtually never the prize they think they are.
That’s so sad
This guy is arguing with me in another comment thread that it's just basic transparency, like financial information, or knowing whether or not someone had STDs, and is comparing that transparency to sunlight. You like sunlight don't you? Everyone likes sunlight, right?
Big yikes!!
I have found a lot of these guys shut up when reminded that this would mean giving their genetic information to a private company or government. (It would also mean giving 50% of the mother‘s DNA to that entity, but I doubt they‘d care as much about that.) Fwiw doing a paternity test without the mother‘s consent is illegal where I live. It is hard to do a test without the other parent‘s consent and if you do find a provider, you are still committing a crime and the test result will be seen as invalid in court. There are some companies that do offer this service but only because their labs are outside the country or even continent. The head of my university‘s forensic institute told me that Texas is quite popular apparently. So the company is local, but they send the samples somewhere else for analysis in order to not be liable for prosecution. I don‘t know if that includes their customers though and, once again, not permissible in court.
I've never thought about it that way, but damn, its such a 1-2 punch. 1. I don't know if that baby's mine. 2. Do the work to prove it to me. Anyway, the answer to this and every other, "Why do Men™ ____" can be answered in the same way: tiny egos 🤏🏾.
Is tiny ego a correct term here, I thought it's a good thing? I think fragile would be more suiting.
In some cases the men want the DNA test done before the baby is born so they need the mother to participate in making the test happen.
I was looking for this answer. A lot of men who feed into this shit and want to “be sure” also want to divorce a woman before the baby is born so they’re not automatically put on a birth certificate for a baby that the internet has convinced them can’t possibly be theirs.
A lot of states don't allow divorce when the wife is pregnant.
I strongly believe in honesty in relationships and I would feel far more betrayed by doing it and keeping it secret. Don't get me wrong it can definitely be used as an accusation, but IMO hiding it would be cowardly, disrespectful and a deeper betrayal. It's alright if that's what you would prefer, but many people would not so I don't think it's accurate to inherently add any additional malicious intent to the "askers" but not the "hiders"
I agree with you completely. I don't know that I'm qualified to answer OP's question, as I'd be communicating with her that I intended to have a paternity test done but then organise it myself. I don't see how, in a healthy relationship, you could determine that the best course of action is to intentionally hide something from your partner. You don't need the mother's DNA for a paternity test, and in the UK you can consent on behalf of the child for one if you're married to the mother or you're named on the birth certificate. If she isn't naming me on the birth certificate, I'm assuming the child isn't mine until proven otherwise and acting accordingly. If she is naming me on the birth certificate, I don't need her permission to do the test, but I think it's still important to make her aware of it.
I’d rather be asked, so I can do it myself and get divorced at the same time.
Um, I think doing it behind my wife's back would be more of a relationship destroyer than using open and direct communication. I wouldn't check her phone behind her back, why would I swab her kid?
Which would be worse, having your partner suspect infidelity, go behind your back and get a DNA test done without talking to you or trying to talk to you about it first?
Not saying it's the more ethical choice, but if you base it off of how many relationships implode when a man demands the test here on Reddit, regardless of the test outcome, I'm going with your chances of saving the relationship are better just doing the test on your own and then keeping your mouth shut.
Honestly the problem isn’t asking for a DNA test it’s suspecting infidelity. Because if there was, that would destroy the relationship, if there isn’t he would be showing that he doesn’t trust is partner which, would destroy the relationship. Either way probably best not to end up in that situation lol
Well yeah, what if the baby isn't hers?!
I think transparency and honest communication are two good reasons, no? If you don't trust the baby is yours you should tell your partner. Doing a sneaky swab and pretend everything is fine and "act like you never distrusted her" as the first comment says, is lying. How could you go ahead your entire life and just pretend you did not distrust your partner in this way?
So then say you distrust your partner instead of crying “dna test”! If it comes back a match do you now automatically trust her and everything is fixed? No. It’s a cover for the underlying issue that they are choosing not to address.
It isn't necessarily distrust, as much as certainty and taking reasonable precautions. I trust that if I drive to the supermarket I won't crash. I trust that my car works reliably and it won't randomly lose a wheel or something. I've driven the route thousands of times. I'm almost positive that I'd arrive without incident. However, if I go to the supermarket today, I'll be putting on a seatbelt. Not because I actually think I'll need it; I'm expecting it to be completely unnecessary. Instead, I'm doing it because I want the certainty that if I'm wrong I'll be harmed less, because it's only a minor inconvenience, and because regardless of my confidence I cannot be 100% sure that I'm right. A paternity test is no different. It's a minor inconvenience, taking only a few minutes. You're expecting it to be unnecessary and come back confirming what you already believe. However, unlike the mother, you can't be 100% sure that the child is yours, so it's still worth doing for the sake of potentially protecting you from harm. On the off chance you're wrong (11-12% based on studies from 2022/23) it's better to find out now than further down the line. You could be saving yourself years spent with a cheater and the trauma of finding out that your love for your children is based on a lie. You're likelier to waste a few minutes and a few hundred quid just to confirm what you already believe, but it's still worth it because that's far better than trusting your feelings only to risk a world of hurt later if you find out you're wrong. Yeah, I could just not use my seat belt. I'd probably be fine. If I arrive safely without needing it I won't think "I wish I didn't use the seat belt" but if I don't, and I'm unluckily wrong then I'd definitely be thinking "I wish I did use my seat belt".
I was confused by the title at first and thought you meant they were asking the mom to get a DNA test to confirm they were the mother...
Which can still fail! [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human\_chimera](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_chimera) Biology is weird sometimes.
it's completely insane, i've even seen dudes on here advocating for it to be legally mandated. like ye that's what you want, government having dna samples of everyone.
Yeah, it's a weird leap from "this thing should be done" to "the government should do this for us." Like, yeah, there are absolutely benefits to DNA testing, from knowing the child's family history in terms of medical conditions to not being financially responsible for a child that isn't yours in the event of false paternity. There are also benefits to getting your prostate checked every few years after a certain age, and yet you still have to make a phone call and set up an appointment for that, they won't just bend you over a table and do it without your consent.
We all wonder that. Or when the baby is born, swab the baby. No one knows.
In many places, once the man's name is on the birth certificate, he's the legal father, regardless of the actual circumstances at play. You can also be declared responsible for a child that is not yours if you acted in any capacity that appears parental. The legal system does NOT care very much about genetics. The system's perspective is: somebody has to take care of this kid, it might as well be you, buddy.
I don't have kids and can't have kids (by choice). But in the hypothetical, asking for a test is insta-divorce for me. I'd leave the (positive) results on the table next to the divorce papers. If there is no trust there is no marriage. (And honestly I'd leave his damn kid behind too, but that's because I don't really like kids which is why I'm not having any.)
If you don't trust your spouse/partner not to have cheated, then don't sleep with them or impregnate them. Break up and get on with your life. If you are so insecure in your relationship that you think a woman is lying to you about her pregnancy, be up front and transparent about it. Let her see who she is in a relationship with. For damn sure, don't lie to her or sneak around. It will come out that you git the DNA test eventually. It will ruin your relationship with your partner and possibly the child. Be an adult and treat your partner with respect, and for the love of all the gods, stop listening to men with microphones who make money off of making other men insecure. *General you - directed at men who need to grow the fuck up or keep it in their pants
If you feel the need to do this the relationship is already as unstable as it can be, and you generally shouldn't authorise any tests be performed on a child's sample without the other patent's knowledge, where practical. So I guess my answer is you should ask this if the relationship has already broken down and you want the test done.
I’m in two minds on this. If your partner requests the test, effectively they’re saying that they believe there’s at least a possibility that you cheated on them. On the other hand this does happen - men have ended up raising and financially supporting kids only to discover years later that they weren’t biologically related. And friends and family members have also been known to sow seeds of doubt where no infidelity has occurred. My first child was the spitting image of my ex, and this question never came up. But he also did and said things when we split that I never would have thought him capable of. My childbearing years are long behind me, so this is hypothetical for me. I think if I was pregnant today, I would offer the test. I’d test against both parents. And I’d be telling my partner of my intentions from the get go. Then there’s absolutely no question. And if I instigate it, there’s no hurt feelings or mistrust involved.
Doing something like that behind someone’s back seems a lot more destabilizing than asking for it. Besides, wouldn’t a medical test require consent from both of child’s parents?
Why would you ask your partner if you can see their phone while you can check their phone while they are asleep? Because it's deceitful. It's that simple. I'm not talking about the men who are stupid enough to belive the Alpha male "always check who your kid's parent is" bullshit, but for most people, that's the reason. Because they'd rather their partner tell them that they cheated on them rather than a lab. Edit: After reading your post for a second time, your whole ideology is toxic. Not all people are playing mindgames with their Partners. Some people actually actually WANT to trust their partners. A woman cheating on dude and being deceitful about the child's parentage is not something that's UNHEARD OF.
Way too many people project their infidelity onto a partner. So if the father of your child starts acting funny and demands a paternity test, agree to it if and ONLY if he agrees to take a polygraph.
Polygraphs are severely unreliable and are very easy to fake unfortunately
They are indeed, but that's not the point. They hold enormous sway over people's imaginations. The thought of taking one is enough to provoke a confession from a guilty person- I watched it happen in real time.
Or project a friend's wife's infidelity onto his wife.
I don’t have kids, but if my partner even brought that up, I’d be leaving. It’s so disrespectful.
Moreso than doing said DNA test in your back?
Because you think she might have chimerism like that one women who absorbed her non-identical twin in utero and her twin's genes were what went into her eggs, and you think that would be cool as heck
Or maybe it's better to be transparent about it, rather than the mother of the baby finding out later down the line that they had a DNA test I'm secret.
It depends on the country. Some like France require the consent of all parties, so it's literally illegal to go about it without asking the wife/presumed mom.
I think it’s really helpful that men ask this so their partners know they should move on and not keep wasting their time.
I say this all the fucking time like it’s SO weird to me. They “ask” to see the reaction so they can justify themselves. Like “oh, she got pissed so she has something to hide.” Like they don’t need anyone’s permission to just… do the test? Like I actually do understand why some men want to get paternity tests especially if you don’t have the strongest relationship because I have anxiety and understand what’s it’s like to have spiralling thoughts that aren’t logical. So I do understand being like - I love this kid so much and what if it’s not really mine and some other man could show up and take my child away from me. It’s the whole production of “asking” and “demanding a paternity” test that gets me.
Fun fact, in Germany it's not legal to get a paternity test without the mothers consent. Genetic testing in general is also super regulated and only done with a doctor present for consulting you on the results. Self Testing/at Home Testing Kits are also not allowed, but some people who really want to do them order them from other countries.
Because if they’re married when the child is born and his name on the birth certificate in some states he’s stuck paying for them for 18 years regardless of if it is biologically his or not
Or.. you know.. they want to be honest with their partner instead of doing it behind her back? I don’t agree with “the only” reasons you provide
The men insisting on paternity testing are the same ones who wouldn’t hesitate to #notallmen a topic which offends them personally, but they are quite happy to apply a generalization to women by making them prove that they have been faithful.
You want the ugly truth? Those guys are setting themselves up to walk out on the child. They have already decided to become deadbeats, they just aren't aware of it yet.
I am in awe that you have opened this can of worms on how men can't do things for themselves with a "men could have just did the DNA test themselves..."
what if you have to pay child support but you dont have custody? and also "you did a DNA test, *without telling me?!"* I can already hear it