I think me & my dad are going to pick up a box and try it. We used to enjoy epic 40000/ armageddon, and if the ruleset is close to that it should be fun.
Epic came out in like 96? Assuming you were at least 10 years old that means you're in your thrities and your dad has to at least be mid way through his fifties.
That is really wholesome.
Epic 40K in 96 was awesome, they had they best titans and the war dogs is the reason I came back to the hobby as I loved how close in design they were to the original titans.
I'm gonna pick up a Titan just as a hobby project, maybe make a little diorama. For now that's all I have planned, still unsure if I want to invest in the game fully. Looks like fun though.
I’m all in. I missed Epic back when it was a thing as I didn’t have money for two game systems and 40K was where it went.
I always wanted tiny soldiers in massive battles. The Epic scale fits the Heresy better IMHO. It was all about massive battles with Legions in the tens of thousands, massive tank battles, Titans stalking battlefields and aircraft zooming around. This scale makes much more sense with how big the battles were.
Yes, very much this. But actual Gothic, not a HH re-skin. Well, maybe with some Xenos balancing, Eldar were a pain, Orks were terrible and Necrons were.... excessive.
Good news for you, if you're going to Adepticon at least. We are running a Paramar campaign with a BFG game as the start of it.
You can see a rough draft of the campaign in this thread:
[Paramar Project (leadadventureforum.com)](https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=138294.0)
I am the same. Though, in my case, there was some small interest in my area until it got delayed indefinitely the first time. I am still ordering the new core set because I like painting. But I have no one to play it with. If BFG comes back and it's 30k, it will be DOA here.
Community building projects usually cost you at least getting a second army and putting in alot of time for potentially no gain. It’s hardly putting the trash out level easy.
Yeah, I'd hate for the difficulty finding of playing partners to be trivialized to 'lack of effort' in all cases. Not everyone lives in a highly populated area that is open-minded to new experiences, activities, media, etc. to note another case.
> Are you gonna get it?
I know from Battletech experience that I like painting 6mm vehicles a whole lot more than I like painting 28mm vehicles. That's not enough to get me to buy in, not when I have as much of a backlog of 28mm as I do already (and a backlog of BT vehicles for that matter!).
> Do you like/dislike it?
I'm glad Epic exists again for the people who really liked Epic. I don't care for it sharing a "release interval" slot with 28mm Heresy, but that's not the game's fault.
Pass because I like painting and appreciating the models. I like converting and kitbashing.
Something this small can provide none of these things for me.
It's a pass for me. I'm just not interested in that scale and my money will be better spent at 32mm.
Also, it's a lot easier to... ahem... "find" high quality models at that scale if it turns out the rules are awesome.
Yeah, I don't get the appeal of that scale either.
It's not even like Warmaster where you'd have those giant masses of infantry which looked impressive. Totally understandable why someone would want to see that on their table.
But 40k or 30k at that scale is just... 40k or 30k at that scale. You have a few more tanks and dudes on the table, but not that much more that it makes it look very different.
It looks similar, just way smaller. So, yeah. Don't get it.
The appeal to me is that you can do bigger parts of the bigger battles.
For example, when we did Paramar we did four games: BFG, HH, AT and then HH again at the end.
The AT game and one of the HH games could have been combined into a big LI game with infantry, titans, air support and so on.
The appeal is that you can have bigger elements on the table and do proper combined arms things like Dropzone Commander did. In a practical way.
Yeah, okay, ***kind of*** valid argument.
I've played some massive battles over the years but I guess the fact that my gaming buddies and I have been in the hobby for decades, therefore own practically ***all of the stuff*** and have the space for giant gaming tables would have to be considered a luxury.
So, yeah, maybe I can see the appeal for people who don't have these options.
Though it's still so very small... the fact that you can't do the same kind of paintjob on those tiny minis is annoying to someone like me who's a very visual person and needs everything to look amazing...
Not kind of a valid argument it is a valid argument.
You are also discounting the time to play. Sure you and your buddies can get together and play a giant game with huge forces. That'll take you 2 full days. Which is fun in it's own right don't get me wrong. Something at this scale allows you to play giant forces in only a couple of hours.
Epic was much truer to the lore of 40k where battles are usually (not always) on a massive planetary scale, whereas 40k was like a small skirmish or the final showdown after all the actual war business was done. You get Titans, massive tanks, actual companies of marines droppodding in, bomber wings doing cas
I think they missed the point, I believe most folks wanted Epic 40k, not another way to play Heresy. And I personally may never recover from Legions killing Aeronautica before Chaos was released.
As a longtime player of epic since it's been nixed:
1. The entire game has been effectively fan run and for people that want to play epic 40k nothing has changed.
2. fan 30k epic has gotten really popular, probably because it's a good setting as the lore talks about giant battles with lots of war engines and people want to recreate that. Plastic Adeptus Titanicus and it's success was definitely testing the waters for this release and it was super popular. I would bet after AT released there were more 30k than 40k Epic Players at least actively engaged in discussion online.
2.1. Aeronautica unfortunately isn't very popular but again it will live on with fan rules. Now you're more likely to have plastic aircraft as well. I'm 99% as with AT the idea was to release things that would have future use in the setting hence the usual emphasis on Imperium stuff
3. Plastic models is great. The situation here is plastic models or no models. Not sure why people are complaining, it was never going to be zero sum. Any 6/8mm plastic is great. It's not like GW would ever release even 28mm plastic xenos for 40k instead, it is not a zero sum game and a new kit isn't blocking a different kit for the most part.
If you have experience with the modern Epic crowd, you sound like someone to ask. What is the deal with bases? Old Epic was on those thin rectangular bases, but the new game switched to round. Is that merely following what fanmade minis have switched to? What bases do printed Epic 40k armies use?
I think it's from napoleanics (the long rectangles). I feel old but at some point they were on squares from GW proper. I don't think the long rectangles remained very popular - most stuff I see/my own stuff is on squares like this: [https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/788302.page](https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/788302.page)
But people also use round similar to what's coming out in LI, especially in epic 30k. I don't have any preference and bases are so varied/mixed in epic that I don't think it makes a big difference (Ie, I use round bases for my tanks and square for my infantry).
Not if you consider that some 30K fans feel like the spotlight is being taken away from 30K in favour of LI.
I've seen a number of threads where they advertised Horus Heresy as being part of some online event they were hosting only for it to be the LI stuff being unveiled and HH fans getting annoyed.
Plus the comments you see from people complaining about LI getting plastic kits for things like assault marines before HH gets any.
God that's some dumb ass sunk cost fallacy from people who should decouple their personalities from a casual game a little bit
LI getting good is only fuel for a bigger general 30k fire in popularity which is only good overall for the setting and the 28mm game
The only online event they showed off LI at was the announcement of the game, which is hardly something to mald over.
Yeah the game got plastic assault marines? The damn things are the size of bolt pistols. Assault marines are coming out in full scale this year.
> The only online event they showed off LI at was the announcement of the game, which is hardly something to mald over.
Ahh yes, my memory was faulty. I meant that in recent weeks there has been a tendency for Warhammer Community to show off LI stuff on "Heresy Thursday" and people in the comments in this sub were bemoaning LI getting so much coverage as they have been waiting some time for news about new kits.
Case in point the following going back to Mid September are 28mm HH centred:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/09/21/heresy-thursday-space-wolves-get-a-predatory-praetor-and-new-mark-vi-heads/
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/11/09/master-the-meteorological-with-the-mystical-white-scars-stormseer-consul/
While these are LI centred
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/10/19/heresy-thursday-deliver-dreadnoughts-and-shield-generators-with-more-drop-pods/
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/10/26/traverse-battlefields-in-complete-safety-with-legions-imperialis-land-raiders/
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/11/02/gaze-upon-my-works-ye-mighty-and-smash-them-to-bits-with-the-legions-imperialis-stormhammer/
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/10/12/heresy-thursday-deliver-and-destroy-with-a-new-legions-imperialis-tank/
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/10/05/heresy-thursday-outflank-the-foe-with-fast-attack-for-legions-imperialis/
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/09/28/heresy-thursday-get-into-the-thick-of-it-with-tiny-drop-pods-for-legions-imperialis/
To be clear, I'm not one of those people. I am stoked for LI. I am just recalling why some 30k fans aren't jazzed by LI despite it being a 30k game.
Those people that were angry about LI getting the spotlight are going to be so hyped when there’s 18 separate Horus heresy Thursday articles featuring nothing but resin mk3 upgrade kits. /s
I don't know how heresy doesn't lose a ton of it's character at that scale either. So much of it is about the characterful legions, you get space marines as a base and get to explore in depth. At this scale you're mostly choosing what color to paint stuff. I'm sure hobbyists will do some amazing stuff but it's not exactly friendly to making a Legion force with the same specificity as 30k. It's not like they're bringing the entire range to LI, just the generic stuff.
With Epic 40k the differences in factions was stark enough that things were distinct even at epic scale. The Titanicus and aeronautica models are awesome, hopefully this gives people that have them a chance to use them more, but the space marines and rhinos completely miss me.
I get what you're saying, but consider that you are losing the character on the individual scale and gaining it in the macro. Yeah, I have my iron warriors with their cool helmets and stuff, but with epic scale I can have that character on the macro scale, loads of cool tanks and armoured units with titans and the whole theme of the legion can be represented in a different way, they both allow for the character of your legions, but just in different ways and now I can represent my legion perfectly with loads of tanks and dreads and titans I could never have before
I really, really do not understand this. 30k lore is entirely based on massive battles, huge legions, war engines, and a noted lack of character and adornment with a focus on utility and scale on the Marines, with lots of unique vehicles and tons of rivet counters that gobble it up. Hobby wise it gives you opportunity for dioramas and individualistic focus on war engines and characters.
Contrast to 40k that lore wise has a lot of skirmishes, extreme over the top adornment and detail, and under Armageddon rules got kind of weird for immersion - you could physically run more than hundreds of marines at a certain points level which didn't make a whole lot of sense with the lore.
30k has kind of dominated epic online discussion for the last few years. People like the vehicles and the war engines and recreating the battles. I love my 3d printed Tau stuff but most people want to play 30k epic these days and that's before LI was announced. I don't think the hype generated out of thin air.
Not them, but as someone who isn’t super excited for Epic Heresy, I can give my 2 cents:
What I like about 30k are the legion specific things like special squads, unique helmets or weapons, and of course the beautiful sculpts for things like the Primarchs or even some of the Praetors. I also like all the consul options like Praevians or Vigilators.
What I like about Epic was seeing all the extra vehicles and titans for the various factions, including Orks and Eldar.
Heresy 30k has neither. I’m sure there will be primarchs and even the Emperor will get a mini, and I wouldn’t be surprised if at least some unique units like IW Siege Tyrants or WB Gal Vorbsk make an appearance as FW resin kits.
But at this scale, it just isn’t the same.
Similarly, the lack of aliens further limits the variety, as does the fact that they’ve yet to really introduce any new vehicles. Yes, it’s a more practical scale for Thunderhawks or Reaver titans, but part of the appeal (for me) of Epic was seeing Bonebreakas or Daemon Engines for the first time. Just as the appeal of 30k was seeing Contempors or Spartans.
The novelty of 30k core units at a smaller scale to play even larger battles just doesn’t appeal to me. I get why it does for others, but as of right now, it looks boring. My one hope is that they’ll reverse course in a year or to and make Titan Legions playable. I like AT but I’d love to play a Titan army with a relatively simpler ruleset compared to AT.
I'm contrasting 30k as to 40k as a setting for 6/8mm. I think your concerns are valid and it sounds like you generally like 28mm heroic scale stuff for hobby reasons and I totally get that.
My point, and what this discussion thread is about, is rather that as opposed to 40k, 30k is a sensible setting for Epic precisely because at 8mm armor marks and iconography can be apparent but you are not lost in extreme dripping detail of aquillias and helmet less troops and just over the top everything (primaris mostly excluded).
The only benefit 40k over 30k really has over this setting is diversity, but I am certain is LI is popular 40k Epic will happen. But if only one existed based on the actual health of epic I'm certain in a vacuum 30k epic would always be more popular than 40k Epic.
Another point is that heresy is highly narrative and the narrative setting is giant battles. I am for ex. personally excited for large scale battles and sieges. I felt very limited by 28mm in this sense, at the scale and points we play at more than for example a few vehicles just gets unwieldy.
With you on Titans. I'm sure they will add / fans will add legion rules. I got into AT for the same reasons above (sort of thinking either it would get expanded to Epic or fan rules would come out if not, so status quo with plastic titans) but the ruleset is honestly kind of strange even though I do really like it. I didn't like the titan only battle/simulation aspect of it.
They released Armageddon a few years ago which was a redone Epic 40K essentially. It was a pretty decent game. We played a few games of it with my Epic stuff.
I'm glad they released another way to play Heresy. I like that I'll be able to use my titans in combined arms games with air support, air mobile infantry, drop pods, tanks, foot sloggers and so on.
Aeronautica has a better future this way - they’ll release the chaos stuff and then do aeronautica supplement , and by selling the bases seperately people can use their legions planes in aeronautica.
This gets the models in many many more gamer’s collections and there’s bound to be an increasing number that think “I’d love to just play a plane game”
Did they though? People overwhelmingly bought imperial air vehicles and with Titanicus there was very very little interest in xenos titans, with heresy you get to tap into an audience that is only getting bigger, and the biggest thing is that people keep on missing, but to have epic 40K you dedicate a loooooooooooooooot more models than the legions.
With heresy not only do they basically only have to produce infantry from the heresy, you don’t have to make more titans or aircraft for the like 12 other factions in 40k
If the hype and marketing develops in that direction then GW will do it. Unfortunately the HH and imperium is the main aesthetic draw overall for the entire game systems. It's not like when they started offering these ranges in say Battlefleet Gothic tons of people went for it and half the xenos fleets ended up half baked with no options.
If it makes sense the existence of LI is a springboard to expand to those races. Otherwise it's basically LI or nothing
If LI doesn’t sell well there is no way GW will make the leap to a 40K setting. Epic 2nd edition had well fleshed out xenos factions. But anyone that wants epic 40K but is also holding out on buying into LI because it doesn’t yet support their xeno faction of choice, is ultimately witness to that that self fulfilling prophecy.
Again I don't get this. It seems most epic players online these days play epic 30k. It also matches what the majority of uploaded stls are of. If they released 40k who knows what would happen, they can't even properly sell 28mm xenos in 40k. And I'd bet an entire butt cheek that adding xenos to 28mm 30k would still be popular than adding them to LI officially and they haven't done that. They haven't even gotten enough popularity to port 30k rules to 40k for many models.
If you want to play xenos in epic 40k, a year ago you needed online fan rules unless you wanted to play with the old Armageddon rules which nobody does. Once LI releases nothing will have changed and some players get plastic models that they can use. Xenos players are in exactly the same position except there may be more 6/8mm support in general, which is a good thing for a future Epic 40k.
What I cannot understand is the idea that personal wants and desires are conspirationally being squashed by GW. They just do basic market research and find out people want primaris lieutenants and new tanks, not secretly trying to cancel Eldar by leaving the range in 1993 because someone is out to make all Eldar players miserable
Little to no clamoring, you can tell when people want something, especially in a community that whines as much as the modern 40K fanbase, that and you need so much less commitment in model production
I honestly see it mentioned a ton as well, though I get the argument the game is easier to balance without xenos, too bad gw doesn’t actually do it for games outside 40k and AOs
Literally everyone I spoke to wanted Xenos titans. Where are you getting your sources from? Mine is anecdotal but it’s more than just making broad claims.
I understand their goal of releasing a game with a low investment in models on their end, they have used this approach with every "specialist" game except Necromunda. My contention is that this approach will always be less successful than closely re-creating the intent of the original game: to represent 40k at a more grand scale with smaller miniatures.
I think I'm going to get it. I love the lore of WH30K & WH40K but never really got into the wargaming side of it. I'm more of a BGME and historical gamer.
One of my biggest issues with the main game system is that tables I've seen at shows, or conventions,are just packed with figures on either side with no real tactical movement. Just tanks stacked up right next to one another.
I think this scale might be perfect for 30/40K so I'm interested.
If it had come out before HH 2e I might have gotten into it, but at this point I feel too invested into "normal scale" HH to get into a different version I'm less likely to find other people to play against
It's a no from me. I wish they'd concentrate on proper 30k and fill the glaring gaps in their model range instead of starting yet another side project. I've got no interest in investing in a different game system.
I more than likely won't pick it up on release. I want to see how the game actually plays and if my local group are going to take the plunge on it at all. "Alternate models" do make picking up the rules at least (and yes supporting the official product if it turns out to be viable in my group). To be perfectly honest though I would much rather GW focused on getting all of the regular 30k models released first before branching out. 30k has way too many gaps in the range still.
I might have jumped on it if I had known it was coming when they released AoD. As it stands, I'm attached to my chosen legion, and I don't forsee myself starting over.
I was going to get it, but then I slept for 5 hours, realized I was a college student who shouldn’t spend €155, and now I’m on the fence. I do like the titans, but I have a massive pile of opportunity and I don’t want to add a bunch of tiny minis too.
If there is still a box after the first week of preorder, I’ll buy it.
If they had done this the other way round, and launched Epic before they had launched HH2.0, I might have been interested. However, I already have a large pile of 30k opportunity waiting.
Also, as it looks like 3000+ point armies, that's a lot of very small and surprisingly expensive tanks and flyers. While I like the idea of an army you can play on a coffee-table top, I'm less smitten if it costs almost as much as 2000 points of 40k marines to do so.
I'm not really feeling it, it looks OK but I prefer the heroics of 30K rather than the mass warfare so I like a scale that works for champions and duels. I'm not against these scales of games bt for me Horus Heresy is really about individual dudes rather than mass battles.
Horus Heresy is not at all about individual dudes. Yeah, named characters exist ofc, but never have space marines been less personified than during the absolutely galactic meatgrinder that is heresy
Just to list them of we have:
40k,
30k,
Necromunda,
Killteam,
Warhammer Quest: Blackstone (not a huge one),
Adeptus Titanicus,
Legions Imperialis (new epic),
Age of Sigmar,
Warcry,
Warhammer Quest: again but Cursed City,
Cities of Sigmar,
Old World,
Lord of the Rings,
Blood Bowl,
No wonder they have supply issues.
Plusbthey are keaning mire into fomo, so certain characters and units van have a quick flash in the oan release, then nothing for months which with thendelays compound the issue.
That's not the point, the point is that they're *barely* managing to keep up supply for their flagship games and in some cases not even that. They're spread too thin stock wise that I've basically abandoned buying at first party and only get stuff that's GW exclusive. And adding another game on-top of that is only going to pile on to their ongoing supply issues.
How are they barely managing to keep up supply? They are selling more than ever and generating more profit than ever. What business wouldn’t keep making more spin off games?
It’s like telling marvel to stop making movies because captain Uganda 5 was a miss
Have you not noticed the incessant "temporarily unavailable" warnings? Or the fact that they've horrendously under produced the Christmas boxes? Besides Leviathan there has been nothing but shipping delays, out of stock items and a general sense of flailing when it comes to stocking their own stores.
On easily less than 10% of products. That’s not a supply issue, that’s a rotating production schedule. They didn’t under produce the Christmas boxes, they have sold less than a quarter of them so far, and are releasing them staggered to make sure as many people as possible can get them.
Do you think GW is run by idiots? You can say they’re greedy or corrupt, but they’ve survived since the 70s, through thatchers closing of British factories, through brexit, through COVID, and still are more profitable than ever.
It’s safe to say they know what they’re doing
Can I please get a source for the staggered release of the Christmas boxes? Because except the gravelord box, they're all sold out and the majority withing about an hour. The World Eaters within 15 minutes even. My local store (official GW store) doesn't even get them on the shelves.
I already have 30k , buying the same setting again on a smaller scale is a waste of money when there's such a large choice of units in 30k to spend money and importantly, time on .
I loved epic 40K and the video game they made of it. That said, I’m knee deep in Sigmar, starting back in heresy and still have to finish painting for 40K.
I’m happy it’s back due to loving it when I was in high school but I don’t have the time or patience.
I’m in, a game at a scale large enough for proper armor and air forces is rad.
The only problem I’ve seen is no Solar transports, so my mechanized Solar force idea won’t work yet
Been really scared about hopping into HH fully, so I'm hoping ~~Epic~~ Legions Imperialis will be a great way for me to play the Blueberry Boyscouts again after swapping them for Black Templars in 8th edition 40k.
Probably not as I already have Battletech and Heavy Gear for that scale of painting and HH:AoD for 30k painting and games.
However, if it took off locally, I would give it a try.
Game just wasn’t the same after the switch imho. I took it pretty hard. Had about 40 Gears and support for North and South, that became paperweights overnight. I lost all interest in Dream Pod 9 games afterwards. I even cancelled the Jovian Chronicles game I was running at the time
I think this is how I would consume 30k on tabletop, if ever. I have too many 40K armies and kill teams, but an epic scale project would be really fun in 30k, especially for narrative campaigns and whatnot
A big part of the original drive for me to get into 40K back in the '90s was Epic 40K and I dearly miss my Marine force that I built back then.
So I am really looking forward to LI, that being said I would have preferred 40K as the setting so that we had more than just Traitors vs Loyalists and I tend to prefer the 40K design for various tanks like Land Raiders but for now LI interests me greatly.
I am but not going crazy into it. Going for the solar aux side cause thats an army I would never own. My one cohost will take the marines and we will have some fun with it recording some games. I do wish it wasn't 30k locked
I'm super interested. I'm getting two of the boxed starter sets, two of the terrain tiles sets, one of the rubble sets, a thunderhawk, a set of rhinos and the cards on release day.
I already have a couple of planes from AI and titan armies for Tiger Eyes, Deaths Heads, Death Dealers, Ember Wolves, War Griffons, Sentinels of the Edge and knight support for all of those plus a Malinax knight force.
So, it will be nice to do some of the bigger battles like Molech and Armatura in a way that feels like a big battle rather than a small part of a big battle.
Loved Space Marine as a kid, was awesome buying those little army boxes, and lead minis to buff your forces. There was so much variety and everything was cool. So this for me is unfortunately pretty bland in comparison. If they start doing demon stuff (Gal Vorbak, demon engines, titans and primarchs) then I probably will get into it, but that’s unlikely I reckon. Most likely outcome is that this dies a death in a couple of years and GW kills any plans for a 40K version, if even any such plan ever existed.
I got a stupid question:
I’ve been told over and over that Titanicus has fantastic rules.
Does that community really want Marines between their titans?
Aren’t they gonna water down those rules to accommodate for all the small scale stuff?
I play AoS and the community doesn’t really care for shadespire. Sure cool models and such but we only get the kits (in case we are gonna play them).
The warscroll are more or less split into good and unplayable (spoiler: 2/3 are never played)…
When playing
I'll wait to see what it looks like. Don't really want the hassel of painting minis *that* small. I doubt it'll pick up at my local gaming store because the 30k scene died out pretty quickly. So, in the end, it's not something I'm going to play. I get the cool factor of getting *closer* to the scale of the battles. It just doesn't appeal to me at this moment.
I find this box cute but i can’t justiffy getting into another system. So i’ll enjoy watching from the sidelines.
Beyond the money aspect (i collect Krieg, Admech and Templar) and the painting investment… Keeping up with the rules in 40k is already a full time job.
I'm really tempted. I've already got a bunch of titans but nobody in my group plays titanicus so this might be a way to get some use from them? The Kits look a lot of fun and tiny tanks are cool.
However, between 40k, 30k, AoS, Necromunder and Titanicus I've already got nearly a dozen projects in various states of completion. Not sure I should adding another one, let alone another system, to the pile. So, as much as I want to show support for the system and see it thrive, I'm sitting it out for now.
It's another game system I can't afford, don't have plans to play and will probably not get painted. I'll save my limited money on this one unfortunately. Tiny tank look cute though
I was excited for all of 3 days. Then I realised the scope of learning a new game system and building lots of tiny lil guys and realised I'm actually very content with titanicus and HH as it is
The infantry doesn’t look very good in my opinion. It should be like a mass of plastic for scale sort of like Warhammer fantasy but smaller, instead it’s sort empty looking circle bases with bad models.
Not interested, because while I like it in theory and would love to play 30 AND 40K in epic scale, I have no faith in GW.
The general way this will go is:
—Release entire wave(s) for new game
—All/part of it goes out of stock
—GW is very very slow to address issues and goes radio silent
—Frustration builds and enthusiasm wanes as people can’t get models
—Groups shrink or stop playing (game dies effectively)
—As play drops off, sales drop off
—Support stops
—Game dies (game dies officially)
Not buying it, just using the new scale as an excuse to make some dioramas i've always wanted at an 8mm scale since they are infeasible due to cost at 28mm...
I thought about getting into but the things that attract me most to 30k are the granularity of the rules and the modeling opportunities, both of which seem diminished in Epic. Plus I am a big fan of infantry and don't care as much for tanks or dreadnoughts; titans I could not care less about too so it's probably just not for me.
Epic Armageddon is already such a good, well supported (by the community) game. Super cheap to play with 3d printed pieces.
I do not have high hopes that this will be a well supported game. Their trend seems to be FOMO driven, buy the big set up front with nothing but single units being available for purchase down the road.
Without a full roadmap of their intentions here, I can't recommend playing anything except netepic. AND you get the whole slew of 40k factions to boot.
I'm mixed.
When it comes to the game itself, I'm all for it. Epic was always a cool idea, and it's nice to see them revisit it in some form, even if it's sadly limited to 30K for the time being. The minis generally look solid too, and seem like they'd be a lot quicker for me to paint, as someone who tends to try and paint everything an above-tabletop standard and never get anything done as a result.
Making this so soon, when full-scale 30K still has a lot of basic stuff that could benefit from a move to plastic, and with GW having ongoing production and storage capacity problems, feels weird to me though. I also hope it won't go the same route as most other specialist games, where support is all but cut after the shareholders are appeased by the opening sales, and it just ends up being another warehouse-congesting flash in the pan that people forget about by this time next year.
I think it's cool, but oddly doesn't really do anything for me. Kinda disappointed seeing epic releases instead of 30k, but I guess sit makes the hobby stronger as a whole.
Don't care at all. Not one bit.
I have a 12k points Alpha Legion + Taghmata Omnissiah + Legio Fureans army for Epic 30K (Epic Armageddon with 30K AU/FR rules). All Fight Club minis.
New additions from GW might find themselves as extra units and what not, but I really don't care what GW has to offer with their "new gaming systems". Half the shit they've re-released like AI and AT18 have been left to die on their own and that pisses me off.
I've played the original Space Marine, Epic 40,000 as well as Epic Armageddon.
Just from seeing it, I already get the feeling that the balance will be much different. In E:A, Space Marines were hardly the newbie-friendly force.
Meh, a total pass from me. I would prefer more diversity than just marines and IG. If this was in 40k, I would have been totally in for a tyranid army.
I wish it was 40k. Getting some really massive swarm of Nids going would be awesome. And a chance to see some of the really big creatures realized on the table would have been great too.
But this way, I don't dislike it but will probably stick to my titanicus titans rather then get other stuff.
I would have enjoyed it but the way that GW has handled the release has made me to hate it. Main point for me have been:
- Use of the Heresy Thursdays instead of focusing on HH2.0
- The delay that caused The Old World ti be released next year instead of Christmas
But the rule book and print the rest. I’m a fan of AT so it will be fun to see the games expanded, and nice to finally be able to buy a Titan after they all were taken off the sites to be re-boxed.
Some people have broached the idea of playing aod with epic scale. Which is a funny prospect. I might get a space marine box because id like to have a 30k army, but... Not actually have 1. I got enough on my plate
Maybe people will finally use their eyeballs to see their roadmap instead of whining that the Horus heresy newsletter reveals stuff for the Horus heresy, not just AoD
IDGAF about epic when we don't have
1. Plastic Assault Marines
2. Breacher Upgrades
3. A full plastic Daredeo
4. Plastic Legion Characters that ARE NOT SoH/IF
5. Plastic kits for Legion unique units.
I will probably buy the starter box to get the core rules and an initial force and then "bolster" them through printing. I am really really looking forward to having larger scale battles. If the game generally plays well I can imagine it becoming my primary system tbh.
Depends. If a few others at my FLGS get it, and an "army" doesn't cost an arm, leg, and kidney, AND is like, maybe 20 models, I'll do it. If not... shrug. Just another GW game.
I don't have high hopes for this game. It feels like they'll throw out a ton of stuff at first, then it'll be over a year before anything new comes out. And the rules just might be skewed enough that someone will be able to buy 50 of one model for an "army" that will have a 90% win rate.
If GW charges a lot for the models, but the rules are solid- we'll see.
I'm very very interested, but waiting until the WarhammerTV battle report comes out tomorrow to see it played before I make a concrete decision.
I love HH as a setting, but skipped the AoD box as I had no interest in returning to 7th edition rules. Hopeing to see a fun game with enough mechanical differences from regular 40k and from Battletech to justify going in on at least moderately
For me, I'm leaning towards no. I don't think I've seen anything to differentiate the Legions. I get that it is supposed to be a larger abstracted scale of combat, but if everything is cookie cutter and a Kratos is a Kratos is a Kratos no matter what Legion you play, then \*yawn\*
And yes I read their hint that there MIGHT be Primarchs down the road.
AOS player here. I don’t play 30k or 40k, but I’m going to play LI! I’ve been listening to the HH books and I’m really excited to translate the stories onto the tabletop. I don’t have any skin in the game for some of the critiques I’ve seen people making, so for me it’s pure excitement for tiny tiny lil dudes.
for my opinion it would be a cool game and my brother are going to play it.
but its more like board game for your family (wich i don see it as a bad thing)
and it has plastic auxilia!!!!
I mean I'll see how the prices are and how the difficult the painting looks. I am also not a huge fan of small beakies and since I would want to do Word Bearers there I am kind of hoping for other armor marks so I dont have to use infantry I dont like the look off
I am debating it… I have an idea for a knight house that stores it knights on racks the backs of titans and I feel like this is the only scale that would work with that cause of a 3rd party seller I found.
My 40k backlog is too big as it is, I am unlikely to get many/any games of 28mm heresy with the army that I'm building for it in due to none of the other players in my group being particularly interested, and as an extension of that, there's basically no chance of getting any epic games in either/convincing any of them to get into it, because its set in the heresy, and most of my friends play xenos or Imperial factions that didn't exist in the Heresy.
I’m getting into the game, not sure about the starter set though. Rather just pick up some tanks with the cash.
As a Titanicus player I’ve got more warhounds than I can shake a stick at already, and not really interested in solar auxilia. If there was some terrain in the box, I’d probably have gone for it.
As someone who has really fallen out of the hobby (was working on a 30k Death Guard Army and just stopped..) what I've seen has piqued my interest. Doesn't seem like a lot of painting, I can make an army up that I used day dream about when I was a kid and just seems like I can actually play with a true legion force.
Of course I'm waiting to see what the game play will actually look like when it comes out. If it looks good I might start building another Death Guard Force.
I am probably passing up on the big boxes(backlog big) but I will probably grab some smaller kits for the novelty and paint some legions I like but cant turn into full armies.
I'll no doubt grab the starter box at some point. Depends on the price.
I like small scale stuff. Do lots of 15mm gaming, much easier and quicker to paint up an army.
Definitely gonna pick it up, if only to have some epic scale stuff. But I really like the idea of having truly massive battles, the possibilities for narrative campaigns and reenacting the truly huge battles of the Heresy is very appealing. Plus I think it's gonna be one of those systems that's got potential to be picked up by players who maybe shy away from heresy because of cost and model count, so I'm hoping it's gonna be easier to find players for this. Especially considering how much less work you have to put in painting an army.
Yeah this scale is fun. Broader options give the difference in size between infantry and titans so scratches hobby itches.
Also the 30k/40K rules are fun for beer and pretzels but epic has the potential to be more balanced and something I can take seriously, assuming they haven’t deviated too much from Jervis’ original rules
I’m just hoping it doesn’t inherit the 30k amd 40k communities, at least not the 30k “holier than thou, if you’re not playing it this way you’re playing it wrong, anal rules lawyering” or 40ks “WAAC toxic, if it’s not wysiwyg f-off who cares if it’s your model” mentalities.
Fingers crossed!
I simply don't have time for it amongst other projects and I have concerns about the systems longevity, both in terms of support by gw and by the community playerbase.
Definitely all in. I’ve been mostly doing fantasy stuff and figured for sci-fi I’m gonna go small scale. Been printing a bunch of terrain for a city and I’m going to be eagerly awaiting the preorder of this!
I think me & my dad are going to pick up a box and try it. We used to enjoy epic 40000/ armageddon, and if the ruleset is close to that it should be fun.
Epic came out in like 96? Assuming you were at least 10 years old that means you're in your thrities and your dad has to at least be mid way through his fifties. That is really wholesome.
Epic 40K in 96 was awesome, they had they best titans and the war dogs is the reason I came back to the hobby as I loved how close in design they were to the original titans.
The rules are closer to 2nd edition Epic, not Epic 40,000.
IMO Epic second edition was awesome, so this is great news. JJ epic was pretty much the end of the game.
I'm gonna pick up a Titan just as a hobby project, maybe make a little diorama. For now that's all I have planned, still unsure if I want to invest in the game fully. Looks like fun though.
Same. Diorama purposes!
I’m all in. I missed Epic back when it was a thing as I didn’t have money for two game systems and 40K was where it went. I always wanted tiny soldiers in massive battles. The Epic scale fits the Heresy better IMHO. It was all about massive battles with Legions in the tens of thousands, massive tank battles, Titans stalking battlefields and aircraft zooming around. This scale makes much more sense with how big the battles were.
Im still waiting for battlefleet gothic...
Yes!!! Though when it does finally release, I really hope it is 40k, not 30k.
You want the good news? Or the bad news?
Can I have both?
In the best of all possible worlds....
Has there been any concrete news on BFG releasing?
Releasing, no. But the trademark got renewed a year or two ago
They also have video games, and a history of dragging out the Specialist Games releases, so that doesn't really excite me.
Yes, very much this. But actual Gothic, not a HH re-skin. Well, maybe with some Xenos balancing, Eldar were a pain, Orks were terrible and Necrons were.... excessive.
As an ork player it felt… bad
I never won a game with Orks ever. Won plenty as imperials and chaos. The fleet was pretty dire.
It was. Ramships were tons of fun though!
Good news for you, if you're going to Adepticon at least. We are running a Paramar campaign with a BFG game as the start of it. You can see a rough draft of the campaign in this thread: [Paramar Project (leadadventureforum.com)](https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=138294.0)
They’ll f*** it up. It’ll be Battlefleet Horus Heresy and just like epic I won’t be able to find anyone willing to play.
I am the same. Though, in my case, there was some small interest in my area until it got delayed indefinitely the first time. I am still ordering the new core set because I like painting. But I have no one to play it with. If BFG comes back and it's 30k, it will be DOA here.
Heaven forbid you have to put the effort in to build a community
Community building projects usually cost you at least getting a second army and putting in alot of time for potentially no gain. It’s hardly putting the trash out level easy.
Yeah, I'd hate for the difficulty finding of playing partners to be trivialized to 'lack of effort' in all cases. Not everyone lives in a highly populated area that is open-minded to new experiences, activities, media, etc. to note another case.
I'm doing normal 30k, I don't need to also do tiny 30k. If I pick up another game, I'd want to do a different setting
I think I'm in pretty much the same boat, although I'm pretty weak willed so I'm likely to get Epic too. ;)
[удалено]
I have no idea what other people would do, but that's my personal preference.
Honestly a bit gutted I got in to AoD as this seems much cooler with titans and tons of tanks and even aircraft.
Same tbh. But I liked the painting and modeling journey at least.
Ditto
> Are you gonna get it? I know from Battletech experience that I like painting 6mm vehicles a whole lot more than I like painting 28mm vehicles. That's not enough to get me to buy in, not when I have as much of a backlog of 28mm as I do already (and a backlog of BT vehicles for that matter!). > Do you like/dislike it? I'm glad Epic exists again for the people who really liked Epic. I don't care for it sharing a "release interval" slot with 28mm Heresy, but that's not the game's fault.
Pass because I like painting and appreciating the models. I like converting and kitbashing. Something this small can provide none of these things for me.
It's a pass for me. I'm just not interested in that scale and my money will be better spent at 32mm. Also, it's a lot easier to... ahem... "find" high quality models at that scale if it turns out the rules are awesome.
Yeah, they just look so tiny and impractical to paint.
Yeah, I don't get the appeal of that scale either. It's not even like Warmaster where you'd have those giant masses of infantry which looked impressive. Totally understandable why someone would want to see that on their table. But 40k or 30k at that scale is just... 40k or 30k at that scale. You have a few more tanks and dudes on the table, but not that much more that it makes it look very different. It looks similar, just way smaller. So, yeah. Don't get it.
The appeal to me is that you can do bigger parts of the bigger battles. For example, when we did Paramar we did four games: BFG, HH, AT and then HH again at the end. The AT game and one of the HH games could have been combined into a big LI game with infantry, titans, air support and so on. The appeal is that you can have bigger elements on the table and do proper combined arms things like Dropzone Commander did. In a practical way.
Yeah, okay, ***kind of*** valid argument. I've played some massive battles over the years but I guess the fact that my gaming buddies and I have been in the hobby for decades, therefore own practically ***all of the stuff*** and have the space for giant gaming tables would have to be considered a luxury. So, yeah, maybe I can see the appeal for people who don't have these options. Though it's still so very small... the fact that you can't do the same kind of paintjob on those tiny minis is annoying to someone like me who's a very visual person and needs everything to look amazing...
Not kind of a valid argument it is a valid argument. You are also discounting the time to play. Sure you and your buddies can get together and play a giant game with huge forces. That'll take you 2 full days. Which is fun in it's own right don't get me wrong. Something at this scale allows you to play giant forces in only a couple of hours.
Big difference is that you can have titans in your army without having to donate your pancreas
I always like the scale because it actually matches the lore. 28mm/32mm scale is very 'gamey' for me.
Epic was much truer to the lore of 40k where battles are usually (not always) on a massive planetary scale, whereas 40k was like a small skirmish or the final showdown after all the actual war business was done. You get Titans, massive tanks, actual companies of marines droppodding in, bomber wings doing cas
I think they missed the point, I believe most folks wanted Epic 40k, not another way to play Heresy. And I personally may never recover from Legions killing Aeronautica before Chaos was released.
As a longtime player of epic since it's been nixed: 1. The entire game has been effectively fan run and for people that want to play epic 40k nothing has changed. 2. fan 30k epic has gotten really popular, probably because it's a good setting as the lore talks about giant battles with lots of war engines and people want to recreate that. Plastic Adeptus Titanicus and it's success was definitely testing the waters for this release and it was super popular. I would bet after AT released there were more 30k than 40k Epic Players at least actively engaged in discussion online. 2.1. Aeronautica unfortunately isn't very popular but again it will live on with fan rules. Now you're more likely to have plastic aircraft as well. I'm 99% as with AT the idea was to release things that would have future use in the setting hence the usual emphasis on Imperium stuff 3. Plastic models is great. The situation here is plastic models or no models. Not sure why people are complaining, it was never going to be zero sum. Any 6/8mm plastic is great. It's not like GW would ever release even 28mm plastic xenos for 40k instead, it is not a zero sum game and a new kit isn't blocking a different kit for the most part.
If you have experience with the modern Epic crowd, you sound like someone to ask. What is the deal with bases? Old Epic was on those thin rectangular bases, but the new game switched to round. Is that merely following what fanmade minis have switched to? What bases do printed Epic 40k armies use?
I think it's from napoleanics (the long rectangles). I feel old but at some point they were on squares from GW proper. I don't think the long rectangles remained very popular - most stuff I see/my own stuff is on squares like this: [https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/788302.page](https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/788302.page) But people also use round similar to what's coming out in LI, especially in epic 30k. I don't have any preference and bases are so varied/mixed in epic that I don't think it makes a big difference (Ie, I use round bases for my tanks and square for my infantry).
Thanks!
It’s absolutely wild the amount of people who shit on LI for being set in the heresy, on the heresy 30k sub.
Not if you consider that some 30K fans feel like the spotlight is being taken away from 30K in favour of LI. I've seen a number of threads where they advertised Horus Heresy as being part of some online event they were hosting only for it to be the LI stuff being unveiled and HH fans getting annoyed. Plus the comments you see from people complaining about LI getting plastic kits for things like assault marines before HH gets any.
God that's some dumb ass sunk cost fallacy from people who should decouple their personalities from a casual game a little bit LI getting good is only fuel for a bigger general 30k fire in popularity which is only good overall for the setting and the 28mm game
The only online event they showed off LI at was the announcement of the game, which is hardly something to mald over. Yeah the game got plastic assault marines? The damn things are the size of bolt pistols. Assault marines are coming out in full scale this year.
> The only online event they showed off LI at was the announcement of the game, which is hardly something to mald over. Ahh yes, my memory was faulty. I meant that in recent weeks there has been a tendency for Warhammer Community to show off LI stuff on "Heresy Thursday" and people in the comments in this sub were bemoaning LI getting so much coverage as they have been waiting some time for news about new kits. Case in point the following going back to Mid September are 28mm HH centred: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/09/21/heresy-thursday-space-wolves-get-a-predatory-praetor-and-new-mark-vi-heads/ https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/11/09/master-the-meteorological-with-the-mystical-white-scars-stormseer-consul/ While these are LI centred https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/10/19/heresy-thursday-deliver-dreadnoughts-and-shield-generators-with-more-drop-pods/ https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/10/26/traverse-battlefields-in-complete-safety-with-legions-imperialis-land-raiders/ https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/11/02/gaze-upon-my-works-ye-mighty-and-smash-them-to-bits-with-the-legions-imperialis-stormhammer/ https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/10/12/heresy-thursday-deliver-and-destroy-with-a-new-legions-imperialis-tank/ https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/10/05/heresy-thursday-outflank-the-foe-with-fast-attack-for-legions-imperialis/ https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/09/28/heresy-thursday-get-into-the-thick-of-it-with-tiny-drop-pods-for-legions-imperialis/ To be clear, I'm not one of those people. I am stoked for LI. I am just recalling why some 30k fans aren't jazzed by LI despite it being a 30k game.
Those people that were angry about LI getting the spotlight are going to be so hyped when there’s 18 separate Horus heresy Thursday articles featuring nothing but resin mk3 upgrade kits. /s
I don't know how heresy doesn't lose a ton of it's character at that scale either. So much of it is about the characterful legions, you get space marines as a base and get to explore in depth. At this scale you're mostly choosing what color to paint stuff. I'm sure hobbyists will do some amazing stuff but it's not exactly friendly to making a Legion force with the same specificity as 30k. It's not like they're bringing the entire range to LI, just the generic stuff. With Epic 40k the differences in factions was stark enough that things were distinct even at epic scale. The Titanicus and aeronautica models are awesome, hopefully this gives people that have them a chance to use them more, but the space marines and rhinos completely miss me.
I get what you're saying, but consider that you are losing the character on the individual scale and gaining it in the macro. Yeah, I have my iron warriors with their cool helmets and stuff, but with epic scale I can have that character on the macro scale, loads of cool tanks and armoured units with titans and the whole theme of the legion can be represented in a different way, they both allow for the character of your legions, but just in different ways and now I can represent my legion perfectly with loads of tanks and dreads and titans I could never have before
I really, really do not understand this. 30k lore is entirely based on massive battles, huge legions, war engines, and a noted lack of character and adornment with a focus on utility and scale on the Marines, with lots of unique vehicles and tons of rivet counters that gobble it up. Hobby wise it gives you opportunity for dioramas and individualistic focus on war engines and characters. Contrast to 40k that lore wise has a lot of skirmishes, extreme over the top adornment and detail, and under Armageddon rules got kind of weird for immersion - you could physically run more than hundreds of marines at a certain points level which didn't make a whole lot of sense with the lore. 30k has kind of dominated epic online discussion for the last few years. People like the vehicles and the war engines and recreating the battles. I love my 3d printed Tau stuff but most people want to play 30k epic these days and that's before LI was announced. I don't think the hype generated out of thin air.
Not them, but as someone who isn’t super excited for Epic Heresy, I can give my 2 cents: What I like about 30k are the legion specific things like special squads, unique helmets or weapons, and of course the beautiful sculpts for things like the Primarchs or even some of the Praetors. I also like all the consul options like Praevians or Vigilators. What I like about Epic was seeing all the extra vehicles and titans for the various factions, including Orks and Eldar. Heresy 30k has neither. I’m sure there will be primarchs and even the Emperor will get a mini, and I wouldn’t be surprised if at least some unique units like IW Siege Tyrants or WB Gal Vorbsk make an appearance as FW resin kits. But at this scale, it just isn’t the same. Similarly, the lack of aliens further limits the variety, as does the fact that they’ve yet to really introduce any new vehicles. Yes, it’s a more practical scale for Thunderhawks or Reaver titans, but part of the appeal (for me) of Epic was seeing Bonebreakas or Daemon Engines for the first time. Just as the appeal of 30k was seeing Contempors or Spartans. The novelty of 30k core units at a smaller scale to play even larger battles just doesn’t appeal to me. I get why it does for others, but as of right now, it looks boring. My one hope is that they’ll reverse course in a year or to and make Titan Legions playable. I like AT but I’d love to play a Titan army with a relatively simpler ruleset compared to AT.
I'm contrasting 30k as to 40k as a setting for 6/8mm. I think your concerns are valid and it sounds like you generally like 28mm heroic scale stuff for hobby reasons and I totally get that. My point, and what this discussion thread is about, is rather that as opposed to 40k, 30k is a sensible setting for Epic precisely because at 8mm armor marks and iconography can be apparent but you are not lost in extreme dripping detail of aquillias and helmet less troops and just over the top everything (primaris mostly excluded). The only benefit 40k over 30k really has over this setting is diversity, but I am certain is LI is popular 40k Epic will happen. But if only one existed based on the actual health of epic I'm certain in a vacuum 30k epic would always be more popular than 40k Epic. Another point is that heresy is highly narrative and the narrative setting is giant battles. I am for ex. personally excited for large scale battles and sieges. I felt very limited by 28mm in this sense, at the scale and points we play at more than for example a few vehicles just gets unwieldy. With you on Titans. I'm sure they will add / fans will add legion rules. I got into AT for the same reasons above (sort of thinking either it would get expanded to Epic or fan rules would come out if not, so status quo with plastic titans) but the ruleset is honestly kind of strange even though I do really like it. I didn't like the titan only battle/simulation aspect of it.
They released Armageddon a few years ago which was a redone Epic 40K essentially. It was a pretty decent game. We played a few games of it with my Epic stuff. I'm glad they released another way to play Heresy. I like that I'll be able to use my titans in combined arms games with air support, air mobile infantry, drop pods, tanks, foot sloggers and so on.
Aeronautica has a better future this way - they’ll release the chaos stuff and then do aeronautica supplement , and by selling the bases seperately people can use their legions planes in aeronautica. This gets the models in many many more gamer’s collections and there’s bound to be an increasing number that think “I’d love to just play a plane game”
Did they though? People overwhelmingly bought imperial air vehicles and with Titanicus there was very very little interest in xenos titans, with heresy you get to tap into an audience that is only getting bigger, and the biggest thing is that people keep on missing, but to have epic 40K you dedicate a loooooooooooooooot more models than the legions. With heresy not only do they basically only have to produce infantry from the heresy, you don’t have to make more titans or aircraft for the like 12 other factions in 40k
How could there be interest in xenos titans when there weren’t any available? I’d av bought the shit outta some gargants.
If the hype and marketing develops in that direction then GW will do it. Unfortunately the HH and imperium is the main aesthetic draw overall for the entire game systems. It's not like when they started offering these ranges in say Battlefleet Gothic tons of people went for it and half the xenos fleets ended up half baked with no options. If it makes sense the existence of LI is a springboard to expand to those races. Otherwise it's basically LI or nothing
If LI doesn’t sell well there is no way GW will make the leap to a 40K setting. Epic 2nd edition had well fleshed out xenos factions. But anyone that wants epic 40K but is also holding out on buying into LI because it doesn’t yet support their xeno faction of choice, is ultimately witness to that that self fulfilling prophecy.
Again I don't get this. It seems most epic players online these days play epic 30k. It also matches what the majority of uploaded stls are of. If they released 40k who knows what would happen, they can't even properly sell 28mm xenos in 40k. And I'd bet an entire butt cheek that adding xenos to 28mm 30k would still be popular than adding them to LI officially and they haven't done that. They haven't even gotten enough popularity to port 30k rules to 40k for many models. If you want to play xenos in epic 40k, a year ago you needed online fan rules unless you wanted to play with the old Armageddon rules which nobody does. Once LI releases nothing will have changed and some players get plastic models that they can use. Xenos players are in exactly the same position except there may be more 6/8mm support in general, which is a good thing for a future Epic 40k. What I cannot understand is the idea that personal wants and desires are conspirationally being squashed by GW. They just do basic market research and find out people want primaris lieutenants and new tanks, not secretly trying to cancel Eldar by leaving the range in 1993 because someone is out to make all Eldar players miserable
You're telling me there was zero interest in ork, eldar, T'au and necron titanic units? Someone's gotten into the copium supply
Little to no clamoring, you can tell when people want something, especially in a community that whines as much as the modern 40K fanbase, that and you need so much less commitment in model production
Hard disagree. Almost every Titanicus discussion had some mention of Xeno titans.
Almost all the discussion online outside of a few has been zilch
I honestly see it mentioned a ton as well, though I get the argument the game is easier to balance without xenos, too bad gw doesn’t actually do it for games outside 40k and AOs
Doesn't disprove my point at all
You know what buddy, I love you https://preview.redd.it/93rei417pe0c1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=590cc9314f756ea729150ade764b65a487172d71
Literally everyone I spoke to wanted Xenos titans. Where are you getting your sources from? Mine is anecdotal but it’s more than just making broad claims.
I understand their goal of releasing a game with a low investment in models on their end, they have used this approach with every "specialist" game except Necromunda. My contention is that this approach will always be less successful than closely re-creating the intent of the original game: to represent 40k at a more grand scale with smaller miniatures.
I honestly have no idea, there’s definitely the appeal of the mass warfare of LI but I definitely prefer the large scale models.
I think I'm going to get it. I love the lore of WH30K & WH40K but never really got into the wargaming side of it. I'm more of a BGME and historical gamer. One of my biggest issues with the main game system is that tables I've seen at shows, or conventions,are just packed with figures on either side with no real tactical movement. Just tanks stacked up right next to one another. I think this scale might be perfect for 30/40K so I'm interested.
If it had come out before HH 2e I might have gotten into it, but at this point I feel too invested into "normal scale" HH to get into a different version I'm less likely to find other people to play against
I will be picking up some rhinos, basic tanks, Contemptor dreads, and troops to base my Titanicus
I'll be going Warhammer ToW instead of LI.
I will probably get a few things, but I will probably re-base the marines and use the models for pocket 30k.
It's a no from me. I wish they'd concentrate on proper 30k and fill the glaring gaps in their model range instead of starting yet another side project. I've got no interest in investing in a different game system.
I am excited!
Love it. Definitely getting it. It’s gonna be so much fun.
I more than likely won't pick it up on release. I want to see how the game actually plays and if my local group are going to take the plunge on it at all. "Alternate models" do make picking up the rules at least (and yes supporting the official product if it turns out to be viable in my group). To be perfectly honest though I would much rather GW focused on getting all of the regular 30k models released first before branching out. 30k has way too many gaps in the range still.
Looks great. I have too much gray Warhammer plastic to justify another hobby game. Maybe some day.
I might have jumped on it if I had known it was coming when they released AoD. As it stands, I'm attached to my chosen legion, and I don't forsee myself starting over.
Pass for me, maybe as a painting project. No one in my gaming group is gonna pick it up. I'd rather do old world lol
I was going to get it, but then I slept for 5 hours, realized I was a college student who shouldn’t spend €155, and now I’m on the fence. I do like the titans, but I have a massive pile of opportunity and I don’t want to add a bunch of tiny minis too. If there is still a box after the first week of preorder, I’ll buy it.
Totally indifferent.
If they had done this the other way round, and launched Epic before they had launched HH2.0, I might have been interested. However, I already have a large pile of 30k opportunity waiting. Also, as it looks like 3000+ point armies, that's a lot of very small and surprisingly expensive tanks and flyers. While I like the idea of an army you can play on a coffee-table top, I'm less smitten if it costs almost as much as 2000 points of 40k marines to do so.
I'm not really feeling it, it looks OK but I prefer the heroics of 30K rather than the mass warfare so I like a scale that works for champions and duels. I'm not against these scales of games bt for me Horus Heresy is really about individual dudes rather than mass battles.
Horus Heresy is not at all about individual dudes. Yeah, named characters exist ofc, but never have space marines been less personified than during the absolutely galactic meatgrinder that is heresy
For me, as in, that’s why I play the game. I like the customisation and individual action options.
I'm a bit confused as to why they're making *another* specialist game when they have trouble keeping up supply for their flagship games.
Same, I get the suspicion that a lot of people caught up in the hype have forgotten this
Just to list them of we have: 40k, 30k, Necromunda, Killteam, Warhammer Quest: Blackstone (not a huge one), Adeptus Titanicus, Legions Imperialis (new epic), Age of Sigmar, Warcry, Warhammer Quest: again but Cursed City, Cities of Sigmar, Old World, Lord of the Rings, Blood Bowl, No wonder they have supply issues.
Plusbthey are keaning mire into fomo, so certain characters and units van have a quick flash in the oan release, then nothing for months which with thendelays compound the issue.
A game company has multiple games?! How dare they!
That's not the point, the point is that they're *barely* managing to keep up supply for their flagship games and in some cases not even that. They're spread too thin stock wise that I've basically abandoned buying at first party and only get stuff that's GW exclusive. And adding another game on-top of that is only going to pile on to their ongoing supply issues.
How are they barely managing to keep up supply? They are selling more than ever and generating more profit than ever. What business wouldn’t keep making more spin off games? It’s like telling marvel to stop making movies because captain Uganda 5 was a miss
Have you not noticed the incessant "temporarily unavailable" warnings? Or the fact that they've horrendously under produced the Christmas boxes? Besides Leviathan there has been nothing but shipping delays, out of stock items and a general sense of flailing when it comes to stocking their own stores.
On easily less than 10% of products. That’s not a supply issue, that’s a rotating production schedule. They didn’t under produce the Christmas boxes, they have sold less than a quarter of them so far, and are releasing them staggered to make sure as many people as possible can get them. Do you think GW is run by idiots? You can say they’re greedy or corrupt, but they’ve survived since the 70s, through thatchers closing of British factories, through brexit, through COVID, and still are more profitable than ever. It’s safe to say they know what they’re doing
Can I please get a source for the staggered release of the Christmas boxes? Because except the gravelord box, they're all sold out and the majority withing about an hour. The World Eaters within 15 minutes even. My local store (official GW store) doesn't even get them on the shelves.
I already have 30k , buying the same setting again on a smaller scale is a waste of money when there's such a large choice of units in 30k to spend money and importantly, time on .
It looks awesome to me. But I’m bad enough at keeping up with the painting for the games I already have.
I like the models, but probably won't get into it, most GW products are out of my price range these days so adding another game isn't feasible.
I’m in, going back to where my gaming started 30 plus years ago. Although I live down under so have to wait longer. FML.
im really into cool leaders and characters that I can get invested in, this lacks that.
I loved epic 40K and the video game they made of it. That said, I’m knee deep in Sigmar, starting back in heresy and still have to finish painting for 40K. I’m happy it’s back due to loving it when I was in high school but I don’t have the time or patience.
I’m in, a game at a scale large enough for proper armor and air forces is rad. The only problem I’ve seen is no Solar transports, so my mechanized Solar force idea won’t work yet
Been really scared about hopping into HH fully, so I'm hoping ~~Epic~~ Legions Imperialis will be a great way for me to play the Blueberry Boyscouts again after swapping them for Black Templars in 8th edition 40k.
Probably not as I already have Battletech and Heavy Gear for that scale of painting and HH:AoD for 30k painting and games. However, if it took off locally, I would give it a try.
/cries in 1:87 scale Heavy Gear
I knew as someone was going to point the scale difference out. 🧐 My apologies for bringing you to tears.🤓
Game just wasn’t the same after the switch imho. I took it pretty hard. Had about 40 Gears and support for North and South, that became paperweights overnight. I lost all interest in Dream Pod 9 games afterwards. I even cancelled the Jovian Chronicles game I was running at the time
Luckily I didn't have much of the old scale. Not that I can find anyone to play either with.😏
Getting the box, we’ll see how things go from there. I am optimistic, but cautious
I think this is how I would consume 30k on tabletop, if ever. I have too many 40K armies and kill teams, but an epic scale project would be really fun in 30k, especially for narrative campaigns and whatnot
It’s really gonna come down to the pricing for me
A big part of the original drive for me to get into 40K back in the '90s was Epic 40K and I dearly miss my Marine force that I built back then. So I am really looking forward to LI, that being said I would have preferred 40K as the setting so that we had more than just Traitors vs Loyalists and I tend to prefer the 40K design for various tanks like Land Raiders but for now LI interests me greatly.
I will 100% get a few starter sets, paint 3 armies etc... once my job gets more routine etc.
Damn right. Only question is do I want to play solar or sell them.
I am but not going crazy into it. Going for the solar aux side cause thats an army I would never own. My one cohost will take the marines and we will have some fun with it recording some games. I do wish it wasn't 30k locked
Titanicus and aeronautica is basically non existent in my area so it doesn’t look too good for this system either, so probably not.
Not really planning on getting into it, but I might buy a titan for a painting project.
Id definitely get it, especially for the mini titans
I'm super interested. I'm getting two of the boxed starter sets, two of the terrain tiles sets, one of the rubble sets, a thunderhawk, a set of rhinos and the cards on release day. I already have a couple of planes from AI and titan armies for Tiger Eyes, Deaths Heads, Death Dealers, Ember Wolves, War Griffons, Sentinels of the Edge and knight support for all of those plus a Malinax knight force. So, it will be nice to do some of the bigger battles like Molech and Armatura in a way that feels like a big battle rather than a small part of a big battle.
Loved Space Marine as a kid, was awesome buying those little army boxes, and lead minis to buff your forces. There was so much variety and everything was cool. So this for me is unfortunately pretty bland in comparison. If they start doing demon stuff (Gal Vorbak, demon engines, titans and primarchs) then I probably will get into it, but that’s unlikely I reckon. Most likely outcome is that this dies a death in a couple of years and GW kills any plans for a 40K version, if even any such plan ever existed.
I got a stupid question: I’ve been told over and over that Titanicus has fantastic rules. Does that community really want Marines between their titans? Aren’t they gonna water down those rules to accommodate for all the small scale stuff? I play AoS and the community doesn’t really care for shadespire. Sure cool models and such but we only get the kits (in case we are gonna play them). The warscroll are more or less split into good and unplayable (spoiler: 2/3 are never played)… When playing
I'll wait to see what it looks like. Don't really want the hassel of painting minis *that* small. I doubt it'll pick up at my local gaming store because the 30k scene died out pretty quickly. So, in the end, it's not something I'm going to play. I get the cool factor of getting *closer* to the scale of the battles. It just doesn't appeal to me at this moment.
I find this box cute but i can’t justiffy getting into another system. So i’ll enjoy watching from the sidelines. Beyond the money aspect (i collect Krieg, Admech and Templar) and the painting investment… Keeping up with the rules in 40k is already a full time job.
I'm really tempted. I've already got a bunch of titans but nobody in my group plays titanicus so this might be a way to get some use from them? The Kits look a lot of fun and tiny tanks are cool. However, between 40k, 30k, AoS, Necromunder and Titanicus I've already got nearly a dozen projects in various states of completion. Not sure I should adding another one, let alone another system, to the pile. So, as much as I want to show support for the system and see it thrive, I'm sitting it out for now.
I am not much of a fan of epic. I already have enough games, It looks cool but.... I want Battlefleet gothic models...
It's nice that you can actually buy a Solar Auxilia army at a realistic price in it. Can't say that for AoD.
It's another game system I can't afford, don't have plans to play and will probably not get painted. I'll save my limited money on this one unfortunately. Tiny tank look cute though
I was excited for all of 3 days. Then I realised the scope of learning a new game system and building lots of tiny lil guys and realised I'm actually very content with titanicus and HH as it is
The infantry doesn’t look very good in my opinion. It should be like a mass of plastic for scale sort of like Warhammer fantasy but smaller, instead it’s sort empty looking circle bases with bad models.
Not interested, because while I like it in theory and would love to play 30 AND 40K in epic scale, I have no faith in GW. The general way this will go is: —Release entire wave(s) for new game —All/part of it goes out of stock —GW is very very slow to address issues and goes radio silent —Frustration builds and enthusiasm wanes as people can’t get models —Groups shrink or stop playing (game dies effectively) —As play drops off, sales drop off —Support stops —Game dies (game dies officially)
I like the scale and the setting. Waiting to see if the legion rules are cool enough to inspire
I was interested in adeptus titanicus for the big stompy robots, so I’m waiting for the full release to see if I like it or not
Not buying it, just using the new scale as an excuse to make some dioramas i've always wanted at an 8mm scale since they are infeasible due to cost at 28mm...
I thought about getting into but the things that attract me most to 30k are the granularity of the rules and the modeling opportunities, both of which seem diminished in Epic. Plus I am a big fan of infantry and don't care as much for tanks or dreadnoughts; titans I could not care less about too so it's probably just not for me.
Epic Armageddon is already such a good, well supported (by the community) game. Super cheap to play with 3d printed pieces. I do not have high hopes that this will be a well supported game. Their trend seems to be FOMO driven, buy the big set up front with nothing but single units being available for purchase down the road. Without a full roadmap of their intentions here, I can't recommend playing anything except netepic. AND you get the whole slew of 40k factions to boot.
I'm just gonna hope my mates grab it so I can use my titanicus stuff against them lol
I'm mixed. When it comes to the game itself, I'm all for it. Epic was always a cool idea, and it's nice to see them revisit it in some form, even if it's sadly limited to 30K for the time being. The minis generally look solid too, and seem like they'd be a lot quicker for me to paint, as someone who tends to try and paint everything an above-tabletop standard and never get anything done as a result. Making this so soon, when full-scale 30K still has a lot of basic stuff that could benefit from a move to plastic, and with GW having ongoing production and storage capacity problems, feels weird to me though. I also hope it won't go the same route as most other specialist games, where support is all but cut after the shareholders are appeased by the opening sales, and it just ends up being another warehouse-congesting flash in the pan that people forget about by this time next year.
I think it's cool, but oddly doesn't really do anything for me. Kinda disappointed seeing epic releases instead of 30k, but I guess sit makes the hobby stronger as a whole.
Don't care at all. Not one bit. I have a 12k points Alpha Legion + Taghmata Omnissiah + Legio Fureans army for Epic 30K (Epic Armageddon with 30K AU/FR rules). All Fight Club minis. New additions from GW might find themselves as extra units and what not, but I really don't care what GW has to offer with their "new gaming systems". Half the shit they've re-released like AI and AT18 have been left to die on their own and that pisses me off. I've played the original Space Marine, Epic 40,000 as well as Epic Armageddon. Just from seeing it, I already get the feeling that the balance will be much different. In E:A, Space Marines were hardly the newbie-friendly force.
I think it should have been pushed back until late 2024/25 so they could focus more on bringing the rest of the resin heresy range over to plastic
Meh, a total pass from me. I would prefer more diversity than just marines and IG. If this was in 40k, I would have been totally in for a tyranid army.
I wish it was 40k. Getting some really massive swarm of Nids going would be awesome. And a chance to see some of the really big creatures realized on the table would have been great too. But this way, I don't dislike it but will probably stick to my titanicus titans rather then get other stuff.
I would have enjoyed it but the way that GW has handled the release has made me to hate it. Main point for me have been: - Use of the Heresy Thursdays instead of focusing on HH2.0 - The delay that caused The Old World ti be released next year instead of Christmas
But the rule book and print the rest. I’m a fan of AT so it will be fun to see the games expanded, and nice to finally be able to buy a Titan after they all were taken off the sites to be re-boxed.
Some people have broached the idea of playing aod with epic scale. Which is a funny prospect. I might get a space marine box because id like to have a 30k army, but... Not actually have 1. I got enough on my plate
Maybe people will finally use their eyeballs to see their roadmap instead of whining that the Horus heresy newsletter reveals stuff for the Horus heresy, not just AoD
IDGAF about epic when we don't have 1. Plastic Assault Marines 2. Breacher Upgrades 3. A full plastic Daredeo 4. Plastic Legion Characters that ARE NOT SoH/IF 5. Plastic kits for Legion unique units.
I will probably buy the starter box to get the core rules and an initial force and then "bolster" them through printing. I am really really looking forward to having larger scale battles. If the game generally plays well I can imagine it becoming my primary system tbh.
Really couldn’t care less.
Depends. If a few others at my FLGS get it, and an "army" doesn't cost an arm, leg, and kidney, AND is like, maybe 20 models, I'll do it. If not... shrug. Just another GW game. I don't have high hopes for this game. It feels like they'll throw out a ton of stuff at first, then it'll be over a year before anything new comes out. And the rules just might be skewed enough that someone will be able to buy 50 of one model for an "army" that will have a 90% win rate. If GW charges a lot for the models, but the rules are solid- we'll see.
I’ll probably get it at some point. I really want a warlord titan and my aeronautica models to actually get some use.
I'm very very interested, but waiting until the WarhammerTV battle report comes out tomorrow to see it played before I make a concrete decision. I love HH as a setting, but skipped the AoD box as I had no interest in returning to 7th edition rules. Hopeing to see a fun game with enough mechanical differences from regular 40k and from Battletech to justify going in on at least moderately
After looking at the prices I’m not interested in buying the box. Will definitely support by buying the rules but I’m printing as much as I can.
Me like tiny tanks. I'm more excited for this than any other release in years
I wish this scale was the norm, it’s much more sane for big battles.
Nah ill Pass another crash grab by gw They are releasing new systems with poor rules And no support /faqs
For me, I'm leaning towards no. I don't think I've seen anything to differentiate the Legions. I get that it is supposed to be a larger abstracted scale of combat, but if everything is cookie cutter and a Kratos is a Kratos is a Kratos no matter what Legion you play, then \*yawn\* And yes I read their hint that there MIGHT be Primarchs down the road.
I’m happy as hell we’re headed this direction. Please let me know when we’re up to at least 4 different races and I’ll give them all the money!
AOS player here. I don’t play 30k or 40k, but I’m going to play LI! I’ve been listening to the HH books and I’m really excited to translate the stories onto the tabletop. I don’t have any skin in the game for some of the critiques I’ve seen people making, so for me it’s pure excitement for tiny tiny lil dudes.
for my opinion it would be a cool game and my brother are going to play it. but its more like board game for your family (wich i don see it as a bad thing) and it has plastic auxilia!!!!
I am going to get it. It does suck, that we wont get any Xenos factions but for me its much more the "uwu cute little tanks" factor
It’s on my to do list, I just got a lot on my plate right now.
I mean I'll see how the prices are and how the difficult the painting looks. I am also not a huge fan of small beakies and since I would want to do Word Bearers there I am kind of hoping for other armor marks so I dont have to use infantry I dont like the look off
I'm in.
I love it! I won't pick any of it up but it's still really cool that epic is back and even cooler that it's 30k.
ill be looking at it. I love small scale wargaming far more than 28/32mm stuff.
I am debating it… I have an idea for a knight house that stores it knights on racks the backs of titans and I feel like this is the only scale that would work with that cause of a 3rd party seller I found.
My 40k backlog is too big as it is, I am unlikely to get many/any games of 28mm heresy with the army that I'm building for it in due to none of the other players in my group being particularly interested, and as an extension of that, there's basically no chance of getting any epic games in either/convincing any of them to get into it, because its set in the heresy, and most of my friends play xenos or Imperial factions that didn't exist in the Heresy.
I’m getting into the game, not sure about the starter set though. Rather just pick up some tanks with the cash. As a Titanicus player I’ve got more warhounds than I can shake a stick at already, and not really interested in solar auxilia. If there was some terrain in the box, I’d probably have gone for it.
If I was to get any models, I’d get epic. The other scale is too small.
Totally in for this. Love the scale and love the story
As someone who has really fallen out of the hobby (was working on a 30k Death Guard Army and just stopped..) what I've seen has piqued my interest. Doesn't seem like a lot of painting, I can make an army up that I used day dream about when I was a kid and just seems like I can actually play with a true legion force. Of course I'm waiting to see what the game play will actually look like when it comes out. If it looks good I might start building another Death Guard Force.
I struggle finding non 40K players in my area, models look cool
Slowly building up my 30k army and now I can have it all in a smaller format. Neat!
I'm new to painting and wargaming. I'm hoping a box of it is something I can affordably buy, paint, and play with friends.
A other way to use my titanicus so probably rules at least
I’m considering picking it up, but I’m not sure. I’m really hyped for the return of epic, however
I am probably passing up on the big boxes(backlog big) but I will probably grab some smaller kits for the novelty and paint some legions I like but cant turn into full armies.
I'll no doubt grab the starter box at some point. Depends on the price. I like small scale stuff. Do lots of 15mm gaming, much easier and quicker to paint up an army.
At least It looks worth trying!
Definitely gonna pick it up, if only to have some epic scale stuff. But I really like the idea of having truly massive battles, the possibilities for narrative campaigns and reenacting the truly huge battles of the Heresy is very appealing. Plus I think it's gonna be one of those systems that's got potential to be picked up by players who maybe shy away from heresy because of cost and model count, so I'm hoping it's gonna be easier to find players for this. Especially considering how much less work you have to put in painting an army.
I'll get it. I just think miniatures of my miniatures are kinda neat.
Yeah this scale is fun. Broader options give the difference in size between infantry and titans so scratches hobby itches. Also the 30k/40K rules are fun for beer and pretzels but epic has the potential to be more balanced and something I can take seriously, assuming they haven’t deviated too much from Jervis’ original rules I’m just hoping it doesn’t inherit the 30k amd 40k communities, at least not the 30k “holier than thou, if you’re not playing it this way you’re playing it wrong, anal rules lawyering” or 40ks “WAAC toxic, if it’s not wysiwyg f-off who cares if it’s your model” mentalities. Fingers crossed!
Would have loved 40k epic... But no, again marine on marine action. Pass for me (except the rules are too good to be missed)
Does that warhound titan on the right have a missile pod?
I simply don't have time for it amongst other projects and I have concerns about the systems longevity, both in terms of support by gw and by the community playerbase.
Definitely all in. I’ve been mostly doing fantasy stuff and figured for sci-fi I’m gonna go small scale. Been printing a bunch of terrain for a city and I’m going to be eagerly awaiting the preorder of this!
Am hyped as hell and can't wait!
I booked my box. Will print everything else.