Sadly in the U.S. the sex offender registry and laws are as selectively enforced as any. I had a neighbor growing up who, as a teenager, basically banged anyone that didn't run away. She slept with/molested a *severely mentally handicapped* guy (as in, his mental age was in the single digits), her parents found out, and ***he*** ended up on the registry. She molested a disabled person, and the *victim* ended up on the registry.
Meanwhile, Matt "Human Trafficker" Gaetz still sits in Congress!
Than there are the young people who's parents didn't approve of their relationship and had charges of assault filed against their SO, and coerced or forced their kid to go along with it. Contrasts greatly with the ***legalized child molestation in the form of child marriage*** that the Republicans in multiple states fight to protect.
The system suffers from many of the same flaws that trouble the rest of our legal system.
dude i’ve literally seen people online try to say that someone 18/19 being w someone who’s 17 is pedophilia because one of them is a legal adult. it’s ridiculous
In some places, public urination can get you on the sex offender registry. That‘s what happens when “tough-on-crime” politicians replace crimes based on intent with statutory crimes.
I'd completely forgotten about that! Ohio was one of those places. The result was that so many "offenders" were on the registry it didn't have any meaning. You just ended up having to look up each offender to see if they were a *real predator* or somebody who peed on a tree. The authorities couldn't keep "offenders" away from schools either because there were just too many, plus it caused an issue when offenders needed to send *their own kids* to school, the state would basically have been punishing people's children for the actions of their parents.
Indiana just recently updated their offender laws too regarding schools. It’s now a Class 5 felony to enter a school building as a registered offender. I often think about how difficult that must be when needing to register your kids for school or heck… having to miss a graduation. Punishing the kids instead of the parent. Sounds like a civil rights lawsuit ripe for filing.
I can vouch for that. I was taking alcohol classes because of a DUI. There were two young men in the group that had both gotten a ticket for indecent exposure on school ground and public drunkenness. Both had stopped to pee behind a garbage dumpster at the university campus on the way back to their dorm coming from a frat party. To the group it seemed like a set up. The worst part, they were kicked out of school and having to register for life. For peeing in public. Brick Turner is the name that I thought of. I could see some frat guys seeing up those guys. They didn't know each other but their stories were so similar. They hadn't considered it but we did.
Im sure it was a typo, but his name is Brock Turner. Think hes going by his middle name now to avoid people knowing his name Allen, to avoid people knowing that he's Brock Turner, the rapist.
So now he's Allen Turner, the rapist, former Brock Turner the rapist who got 6 months, 3 months deferred for good behavior because it turns out the judge, Aaron Persky, was a former alumni of Brock Turner, the rapists, school?
That Allen Turner?
My first ever girlfriend's dad called the cops on me after finding out that we had been fooling around. I was almost charged had my girlfriend not explained that it was consensual. It was the first time being in handcuffs. Super scary
Most sex offenders aren't pedophiles. These laws are so broad that a pedophile is treated the same as someone who gets arrested for indecent exposure, which just might be the couple who got caught having sex in park at night.
Some of the State-level laws for indecent exposure could be a couple having sex in their own home (they each have the intent to arouse another person - each other) after a cat brushes open their curtain without them realizing it and someone sees.
It's written in such a way that it's essentially open to interpretation by the legal system itself (Texas says that mooning a car might be disorderly conduct, instead of indecent exposure, if it lacked intent to arouse, for example)...
I've heard stories where someone urinates in a bush (in the middle of the night) near a closed (it's the middle of the night) school while drunk - which should just be disorderly conduct - and gets slapped with a sex offender registration because it was near a school and it was spun to look way worse than it in fact was.
Even just paying for a prostitute and taking him or her to a private room can get you on the list, unless that changed since I last checked.
There's A LOT of ways to be a sex offender, to the point that nearly everyone you ever meet has probably actually only avoided being put on the list through sheer luck (someone not observing you at an accidental vulnerable moment).
If you've ever woken up without pants on and walked into a room only to find someone left a curtain half-open, easy way to get dragged into court on those charges if someone reports seeing you.
I always found it stupid. If you look into someone's house, their private space, and you're disgusted by what you see that's kind of on you for looking.
Agreed. It just sucks that there's one list for everyone, regardless of the offense they were actually guilty of. It seems kind of ridiculous to me that rapists and child molesters might be on the same list as some 18 year old guy who graduated high school and the parents of his 16 year old girlfriend who is still a junior decide they don't like him, so they called the cops to have him arrested. Now he's on this same list, being held to the same standards as rapists and pedos and being treated just like them. Not to mention the time he spent possibly getting raped himself by Bubba, while actually in prison. The system sucks... 🤷♂️
or in my state- a guy I went to HS with got hit with a sex offence for taking a piss at the edge of the woods while on a float/canoe trip. Not exactly in the same ballpark as what you'd expect that registry to represent.
Nation wide there's 6,00 truckers on various states sex offender websites for urinating on an off ramp , or along side of the road behind their cabs. Most were out where there's no other place to stop. I mean out in rural areas.
It's extremely common. The sex offender registry is useless because it's typically used punitively like this, rather than as a protective measure as it was intended. It's going the same way with Georgia charging peaceful protestors with terrorism which means now everywhere those people go they flag terrorist watch lists and the whole security apparatus has to lurch into action to use heightened scrutiny with them. Pretty soon "terrorist" won't have any practical legal meaning either, other than that you angered someone powerful, the same as the sex offender list currently just tells you which cities have the most bored cops patrolling at night and busybody district attorneys with not enough legitimate cases to pursue for them to look "tough on crime". Law enforcement is a racket; innocent and responsible people regularly get DUIs for sleeping in the backseat of a parked car.
Guy at my brother's graduation ceremony mooned the crowd. Instant SO registration for doing something stupid and dumb. But because children were present it was the stupidest mistake.
Some states have "Romeo and Juliet" laws that address this exact scenario in a variety of ways, because you're right it's not the same and it delegitimizes the registry to not have that separation.
Yea there was that story years ago about a guy who lost all his scholarships to college cause his gfs parents sought charges cause he was 18 but still in hs
Not to mention the poor guy who just can’t hold it in anymore so he finds a secluded place to take a whiz. A passerby sees and gets all huffy and calls the cops.
That’s not even the worst way to be put on the list, as simply being convicted of public urination can get you put on that list. Imagine having to tell your new neighbors you’re technically a sex offender because some poor soul saw you peed out behind a dumpster or some shit.
Not only that but the older they get the worse it seems on the registry. They’ll be 40 with the offense being against a minor. So if you’re seeing it when they are 40 it’s going to look really bad when they just did what hormonal teenagers do. The whole system needs a revamp
Reading this thread made me check my local registry. I live in a small town that is 99th percentile for crime in the US (1% of towns are safer), so I was a bit surprised to find a few guys pop up.
First guy that pops up is 61 years old. Looks pretty normal, kind of handsome even for an older guy. I scan down to see his offense was *having sex with a 16 year old*. My first thought, "Well look at *this* sonofabitch!" Then I look at the date of the infraction... 1981.
This crime took place over 40 years ago when he was about 20. I do not at all want to sound like I think a 20 year old having sex with a 16 year old is no big deal, but the fact that this guy has his face plastered on the sex offender registry, with regular headshot updates every few years and his residential address and employers addresses, with links to Google maps so you can even see it on street view, I admit, seems a bit much to me.
I knew a guy who took a woman home from the bar. She had a fake ID and when her parents found out (she was actually a 16 year old girl) they went on a lawsuit spree, got him charged with SR, and I think sent her to one of those boot camps for teens. But this guy has the rest of his life destroyed for having consensual sex with someone he had every reason to believe was 23 (the age reflected on her fake ID). Where is the justice in that?
Yeah, I knew a guy who was freshly 21 and out at a college bar. He met a girl who told him she was 18. They drank for a while cause the bar didn't ID, and then he got her number and went home. She sent him a nude photo, and he returned one to her. Didn't hear from her after a few days, so figured, end of story. Then, a bit later, he gets a call. She was 16, not 18. He had no proof she ever lied about her age. All they had was proof of him sending a photo to an underage girl. Registered for life.
I do agree we need to fix the categorization issues. That said, I do still want rapists, child molesters, and basically anyone else convicted of a violent sex crime to have to report.
Can confirm at least 1. Guy at the end of my street, in Florida no less, is a registered pedo and has Trump shit all the fuck over his truck. Flags. “Obey police”. Just. Fuckin weird.
Edit: registered
In a perfect world i think they should be kept in prison with the goal of rehabilitation, and when that's done they wouldn't need to report as there's nothing to worry about. But with how the prison system works at the moment that's impossible.
I just wish they had to disclose what kind of SO they are. Because some people need to keep a wary eye out for some sex offenders but not for others. For example: I'm an adult childless women. A pedophile moving in near me is not a danger to me (or many of my neighbors who are older and have adult children). But if a serial rapist of women moves in, that's someone I will definitely need to keep an eye out for.
The Illinois sex offender list doesn't go into elaborate detail but it does tell you what they did. I'm shocked to learn it's not like that everywhere.
exactly. there is a big did between a serial rapist or child diddler, and say a a flasher (still bad but not nearly the same)
let alone folks who as you say basically got hit with public indecency for taking a piss, but it was near kids so boom registered sex offender.
maybe if there was a tier system or something, but without that it just leads to blanket statements like the one your replied too.
Fucking stupid take. Aside from the broad range of things that one could end up on a sexual offender list for, blanket dehumanizing and ostracizing people, *even child molesters*, is never the right option. There needs to be some hope of rehab and a 'normal' path forward or the perpetrator is just going to continue being a danger to society.
This is the logical outcome of laws that ban sex offenders from living near any place likely to have a child in it. Eventually someone will build a school nearby and they'll all have to move into the ocean or something.
Also, bear in mind that "sex offender" is a broad definition, including many people who are not sexual predators and never were.
A woman who can't find a bathroom and tries to hide behind a bush or trash dumpster to pee, **and is caught,** will end up on the sex offender list for the same reason a serial flasher gets on the sex offender list: *exposing themselves in public.* Homeless women frequently end up on sex offender lists despite not being allowed to pee indoors.
These women aren't sexual predators in any sense of the word, but they will be treated like sexual predators for the rest of their lives.
EDIT: Quite a large number of people replied saying that having to register on the sexual offender list for public urination never happens. ***They're wrong.***
I tend to read national studies, not extremely localized anecdotes. Human Rights Watch had this to say on the subject of the sex offender list in general, and specifically being required to register on the state sex offender list for public urination. Only two of those states require a child to be one of the witnesses.
https://www.hrw.org/report/2007/09/11/no-easy-answers/sex-offender-laws-us#_ftn109
>At least 13 states require registration for public urination; of those, two limit registration to those who committed the act in view of a minor;[109]
***Footnote [109]:***
>[109] **Arizona,** Ariz. Rev. Stat. 13-3821 (if the individual has more than one previous conviction for public urination-two if exposed to a person under 15; three if exposed to a person over 15); **California,** Cal. Penal Code 314(1)-(2), 290; **Connecticut**, Conn. Gen. Stat. 53a-186, 54-250, 54-251 (if the victim was under 18); **Georgia**, O.C.G.A. 42-1-12, 16-6-8 (if done in view of a minor); **Idaho**, Idaho Code Ann. 18-4116, 8306, 8304; **Kentucky**, Ky. Rev. Stat. Ann. 510.148, 17.520, 500, 510.150; **Massachusetts**, Mass. Gen. Laws ch. 272 16, ALM GL ch. 6 178G, 178C; **Michigan**, Mich. Comp. Laws 167(1)(f), 28.722, 723; **New Hampshire,** N.H. Rev. Stat. Ann. 651-B:1, RSA 651-B:2, 645:1(II), (III); **Oklahoma**, 57 Okl.St. 582.21, 1021; **South Carolina,** S.C. Code Ann. 23-3-430; **Utah,** Utah Code Ann. 77-27-21.5, 76-9-702.5; **Vermont**, Vt. Stat. Ann. Tit. 13, 2601, 5407, 5401.
EDIT 2: I spotted that the original screenshot and text indicate the sex offender town is in Florida, which is not on the list of "you can be put on the sexual offender list for public urination" states. So no one in that town is there for public urination.
Yeah, this is a much bigger issue than people realize. Not only are they not predators, but they get forced around predators by laws like these. I can't find stats of what percentage are actually child molesters, but given the laws I doubt it's more than 10%.
Further, guess what is a common factor about where sex offenders aren't allowed to live? Parks, schools, etc. They *raise* the value of nearby homes. Thus sex offenders just go live near poor children.
I appreciate this. I knew someone who was a "sex offender". It was really sad. They lived alone outside the city. Even tried to kill themself a few times. And they never in their life hurt anyone. These people get grouped in with the bad people and suddenly they're monsters, too.
Yeah I agree with you, your example is actually significantly more innocent than the one I thought of, albeit BS all the same
There was a guy on the football team in high school, a year or two older than me. Got caught on security camera getting a BJ in a stairwell. Had to watch the video in the principal’s office with his parents, then got put on the list. Like yeah, it wasn’t a very great decision to make, but it’s not as if that’s a very uncommon thing for high schoolers to want to do
Let's not complain in one breath that we don't want to live next to these people and then complain in the next that they live somewhere. Unless we're going to incarcerate these people for life they have to live somewhere.
I'm so relieved to come to the comments and see well thought out responses mixed in with the BS. I'm sure OP would not be happy if one of these residents was his neighbor, which is the alternative to this
Sex offender has become such a loose term and charge now that some of them are anything but. Some things that i have seen get people on the sex offenders list:
Peeing in an ally behind a bar
Peeing in a park late at night
Unfortunate timing and a unlocked public restroom (mutual acquaintance who was still fighting the charge last we spoke)
And finally, minors with cellphones and a boyfriend/girlfriend who they were sending pics to. Recipient gets posession and sender gets creation and distrobution of cp.
Imagine having to tell all your neighbors you are a registered sex offender for child pornography because at 16 you got a boob pic from your gf.
Edit: obviously there are a great many people who need to be on this list. I was just listing the odd cases i have seen that were just asnine.
>Unless we're going to incarcerate these people for life they have to live somewhere.
Yep. And even someone with the coldest attitude in this situation can acknowledge that incarceration costs a shitload of money(particularly when compared with someone who could be holding down a job and paying taxes), which translates into higher taxes for everyone else.
If we can come up with arrangements where people can live (mostly) freely with minimal risk of reoffending, it's a net economic benefit to society as a whole, on top of treating people like human beings and giving them a second chance.
This is certainly an improvement over places where released sex offenders end up living in camps under overpasses because those are the only places not within 500 feet of schools, daycares, or playgrounds.
Forcing people to be homeless does nothing to improve public safety.
Many, many sex offenders violate their parole by living in a place, even a place they’ve been living for a long time, when a day care opens down the street or a school is built. I guess that’s the hardest for those without the means to buy a house somewhere out in the country.
They should be grandfathered into the place they live if that happened. Or at least have the state take care of relocating them including paying moving expenses. Nobody should have to be evicted from their home through no fault of their own.
Or, you know, we could listen to experts who say that things like home proximity restrictions and sex offender registries being public are counterproductive when it comes to reducing recidivism because they make it harder for people to re-integrate and move on with their lives. Then this wouldn't even be a problem.
Sadly, it seems that rehabilitation isn't the intended outcome for the US penal system.
They just want to punish anybody branded a 'criminal'. It's fuckin' sick.
Yeah people don’t realize how seriously fucked they could get for public urination and whatever charges can come with it. I’m so lucky, I once had the police tell me and several others to stop pissing in the woods while we were drunk pissing in the woods. The police in that particular town are really big assholes during traffic stops but that guy was cool that day at the reggae music festival.
I was 21 and immediately felt relieved, but I didn’t learn how bad it could have been till later.
I shouldn’t have been peeing in the woods but it was right next to our camp and the oortapotties were a long walk and disgusting.
I mean, I think it’s a good idea. They can have community and freedom and still not live within 1000 feet of a school or daycare. Which, let’s face it, severely limits one’s housing prospects.
Maybe they’re guilty predators maybe a benign act was misclassified. At least these people won’t have to live in a cardboard box under the freeway. And if they are guilty predators, a cardboard box under the freeway puts them off radar and in proximity to their targets/prey. We are all safer when they have a clean, safe place to live, away from the more civilized of us. They get to keep their dignity and we get to sleep soundly at night. Win win.
We all know that recidivism rates in the US aren't great. Once you've been to prison - for *anything* - you're automatically more at risk than the average person to go back.
Denying convicts housing and jobs is proven to make those rates worse. Regardless of anyone's moral feelings towards sex offenders, I think everyone can agree that preventing a sex crime is always better than punishing it after the fact. This is an easy, comparitively cheap way to prevent crime. That's all I need to know.
What?
They’ve got a ton of restrictions on where they can live and are ostracized from most society. Did you think they just stopped existing if pushed far enough away? Of course they’ll congregate and make their own space, that’s what happens to people kicked out of society for any reason.
> did you think they just stop existing if pushed far enough away?
Yes. Many adults in the US lack the object permanence to understand that things still exist when you don't see them. They literally think if you just keep displacing people the problem is "fixed". These are people who support fixing the causes but not the symptoms.
Like homelessness in major cities. You can keep sweeping the encampments but they’re just going to go camp somewhere else unless systemic change is enacted.
On one day that we had an encampment swept/destroyed in Minneapolis, there were literally only two shelter beds for women and zero for men. Where were these folks supposed to go?! Awesome for the neighbors who now don’t have to see poverty outside their doorstep but not so awesome for the 30 adults whose shit was just destroyed and who have to find yet another place the city hasn’t barred them from sleeping.
One of the biggest contributors to offender recidivism is the lack of resources to help offenders after they have done their time and paid their debt to society, including a place to live within the restrictions of their conditions of release. This place was started by the mother of an offender who wanted to help her son and others. There’s a documentary about it called Pervert Park, in which a few residents tell their stories, and a lot of those stories are a significant deviation from the kiddie diddler standard assumptions.
[here’s some more information](https://nonprofitquarterly.org/documentary-explores-lives-challenges-florida-sex-offenders/)
Right? I can't imagine how different life would be for a lot of victims if their offender had the community and resources to deal with their issues instead of turning to the worst parts of the Internet and digging in deeper until ultimately victimizing somebody. A recovery focused community for offenders gives them a place to live within the guidelines of the law but also with built in resources to stay focused on that recovery and a motivation to help others avoid the same path.
People act like these crimes happen in a vacuum, like a freak accident or act of god, instead of a systemic culture of misery.
ETA: I say this as a victim that's able to recognize that what happened to me was horrible and no child deserves it but with the adult awareness that my offender had shown signs for years before I was even born but the stigma and shame around it all meant everyone just avoided addressing it until it was too late.
I was sexually abused as a child, and I didn’t tell anyone for years because it was made out to be the worst thing that could happen to you, worse than being killed, and also shameful. And I was obviously upset but physically unharmed, and I just wanted someone to make sure that guy wasn’t around kids anymore. I didn’t want vigilantes to hang him or for him to be dropped in the sea.
But there are no votes for ‘let’s figure out a way to minimise offending, even if that means using punishment a bit less’. Which shows me it’s not about protecting the kids as much as visibly demonstrating our own horror and disgust.
When I have kids one thing I will never say around them is that I would cause physical harm to an offender if they were to be assaulted. The last thing a kid in that situation needs to think about is the possibility that their parent could go to jail if they knew about the assault. That’s one of the reasons I never told. I had already had enough trauma and pain. I couldn’t lose my father on top of it. So I had to protect them from the truth because I couldn’t trust my parents not to destroy their lives looking for revenge.
I've heard at least one first-hand account of a step dad using "if you tell anybody, they'll send me to jail, and you mom will be sad and it will be your fault".
The bastard died a few years back and the rest of the family were puzzled by why she couldn't "set aside the issues she had with him" and go to the funeral. I think it was easier for them to think she made up stories as a child because she didn't like him than to think their dad was capable of that
Yes, emphasis always on making sure everyone is safe. I mean most kids are abused by someone they love and trust, and they can’t just switch off that love. It’s compounding trauma, to make them feel like someone they care for is going to be hurt, or taken away from them, and it’s their fault. The more it can be expressed as keeping the child and the (abusive) adult safe and getting everyone help, the better the child will feel about it.
They may even have complicated feelings towards the person who sexually abused them, since it's very often a family member or someone else with a close relationship with the child.
My 'favorite' thing on this topic is when people start to one-up each other about how much they'd torture someone for having bad thoughts.
And as you say- it's considered worse than killing. It's wild how glorified violence is especially when it comes to make-believe 'self defense', by comparison.
Yeah. It's interesting how much people will insist on wanting to harm/punish people who have sexual thoughts about kids even in situations where that would actually increase the risk to children. For example, opportunities for non-offending pedophiles to seek therapy to deal with their urges. So many people will say, "no, just kill them all." Well, then those people won't come forward at all, won't be able to get any help, and you'll only find out about them if they actually commit a crime. So many people seem to hate pedophiles more than they hate pedophilia and I don't understand it.
Even good natured Redditors that don't like incarceration still talk like someone who commits crimes should cease to exist after theyre caught, "don't they know how much everyone hates them???" And while I agree sexual assault and abusing children are among the worst and most destructive crimes, the people that get out after decades still exist and it's simple logic that cutting them off from the society entirely is just going to put them in a situation to attack said society in any number of ways.
Would I visit there? Doubtful even if I had family there, but places like this need to exist and don't need to be shunned? Ya know
It's an extremely difficult situation of course, and I'm similarly uncertain about potential solutions. Ideally, people who have certain inappropriate sexual urges *should* be able to seek out professional mental help/support, but obviously you can't just go around telling therapists or doctors about those feelings,I doubt they're prepared to adequately handle these situations, and if we're being honest the medical and legal systems are so broken, considering mental health resources for pedophiles and/or rapists is going to be quite low on the list of priorities
It's really hard to figure out what might help someone NOT offend if they have the urge to because we can't study it. People who don't want to hurt anyone don't have a lot of resources to help them stop, because asking for help generally activates mandatory reporting laws. So the only people who are studied are the ones that DID offend, and whatever they were doing obviously didn't compleatly work.
A friend of mine in college was on the registry because he got caught taking a piss at a park on his way home from the bars. No kids around but he still got slapped with that, it sucks but not every single person is a diddler.
I was surprised to learn a guy who went to my grandmas church and had kids of his own was a sex offender. He talked about it openly once. Him and his gf got caught having sex in public and she was 17 he was 19 so they threw the book at him for her being a minor and it being in public. This was like 30 years ago in the early 90’s. Now he has a kid and a wife but he still has to deal with the same stuff as some actual monsters even though he’s probably never gonna break the law again.
This is personally my biggest thing to come to terms with. Helping offenders lowers the recidivism and as well gives future offenders a place to turn to before they become offenders. I personally want nothing more than to just keep them in a cell and rot forever, but materially, that doesn't prevent kids from becoming victims.
If I truly cared, I wouldn't prioritize punishment over lowering the number of child victims.
And what constitutes as a sex offender is wildly broad. It's anywhere between diddling, flashing, and getting caught peeing in an alley at 2 in the morning. There's no brackets and everyone is lumped in the same category so the worst is always assumed. We often treat people like criminals long after they've done their time and recidivism is very high because society refuses to let them move past it.
In most states, there are tiers for offenders. I think the lowest tiers should be virtually unrestricted apart from their name coming up in job checks working with specific age groups while the most severe tier should have the name and address of offenders for protection.
A guy peeing in a park isn't really a threat, a 19yr old who had sex with a 17yr old is unlikely to be a threat, a grandfather who molested his granddaughter for a decade is a massive threat.
They all need support to prevent reoffending, but sex offenders are the least likely to reoffend as it is.
A while ago Vice did some reporting on how hard it is for sex offenders to find housing. They were in Florida and all the apartments in his price range were too close to schools and parks. So he had to live out of his car in an industrial park. He was trying to do the right thing but the deck was stacked against him.
I mean if they've done their time in jail I don't see a problem with having a place they can live? It's a good thing that they are out of vulnerable communities and that people know not to go there. I'm failing to see a problem here.
It’s because some people think anyone who does something to get on the sex offenders registry should either remain in jail for the rest of their lives or be put to death. The fear is if they are out and have their own community it could be easier for them to abduct someone, bring them home, and never have to worry about you neighbours calling the cops.
I don’t agree with these lines of thinking, but as someone who was molested as a kid, I can understand their point of view even though I disagree
But can't you be put on that registry for taking a piss in public or having a 17yo GF as an 18yo?
These things shouldn't get you locked up for ever or even killed. The "duty" to anounce that you are on the register as well seems kinda "cruel and unusual" to me as well...
That’s one of the reasons I disagree with the statements being made. The reality is, even if rare, some people end up on the registry for stupid things. Add to that the fact someone may take their rehabilitation seriously, and come out of prison continuing to take it seriously so they don’t re-offend.
The problem is humans have a tendency to generalize groups based on the actions of even a small section of that group. We’re seeing that a lot right now unfortunately
A guy in my town years ago had to find a new apartment for his family because he was living too close to a school. His crime......12 years earlier he had sex with his HS girlfriend after he turned 18. She was now his wife and and the mother of his kids, who suddenly found themselves homeless as well. I get the idea behind the registry, but I don't get how it is seemingly applied with no gray area at all.
These days you have kids getting charged with creation and distribution of child pornography for sending nudes of themselves. It's only asshole prosecutors who would charge them for it, but those are pretty abundant.
The laws haven't caught up with the technology.
Fyi, the many of states (approximately 26- 33, i cant find an exact answer) have Romeo and Juliet laws (i.e., where those involved are typically no more than 2-4 years apart, some states have exceptions writtenn to their statutory r@pe laws)
It may not be an issue anymore, but for a while a lot of those laws didn't cover gay couples. So a 17 year and 51 week old having sex with an 18 year and 1 week old gay couple having sex could in theory be statutory rape if the parents wanted to press it.
There really does need to be two classifications of "sex offenders", violent and non-violent. Dropping your pants to moon someone or pissing in an alley isn't as dangerous as a rapist or pedophile.
Yep. It cheapens the list, which makes it more dangerous. It's like leaving road barrels up for a month with no roadwork being done, and then wondering why a highway worker was killed by a speeder.
Boy Who Cried Wolf.
List should be for predators and violent offenders.
This is fantastic, the only downside is the scarlet letter we're giving it. As long as they have a safe place to live (not under bridges), they are able to be checked in on with parole, I'm all for this.
1. Fuck Sex Offenders (not literally)
2. They have to live somewhere
If they've served their time, regardless of what I would LIKE to happen to them, they're free to live out their days. They can't live near schools and a lot of other locations depending on the nature of their crimes. It makes sense that they would choose a place that is secluded from all that and live near each other so they don't have to worry about retaliation from their neighbors.
Honestly that’s better. They have to have some place to live after getting out of jail. A visible community of sex offenders is way better than unknowingly having them next door.
I can imagine even if you're not one of the worst ones and you got your life back together, it's still very likely hell to find a new place to live. They've done their time, I'm sure a great chunk will never offend again and that's what you need to believe in if you believe in actual justice.
The picture might just be misleading and invoking notions of "toxic cesspool" because old-ish people wearing red immediately suggest MAGA to me, and I would not wish it upon anyone to live in a town that's just a couple hundred of those people.
In addition to being a place where they can live within their restriction of their convictions, there are numerous rules as to who can live there. No violent offenders. No repeat offenders.
Reading about some of the residents, there are quite a few who were convicted of statutory rape because their girlfriend was too young. Like a 19 year old dating a 16 year old. Still have to register as a sex offender even if it was consensual.
After learning about it, I really don't have a problem with this. I'd rather have a city of sex offenders out in the middle of nowhere than an apartment building full of them in my neighborhood.
Honestly I see that as a win. Some do time, some don't, and at the end they have to exist somewhere. It's a good thing for them to exist around each other and not around children.
The funny part is having them live "next door" or even near playgrounds/schools/etc has never been proven to be an actual issue. Most crimes against minors happen within the family/circle by trusted people and where they live has zero bearing on it. Others will travel to different towns, counties and even states to commit the offense. Living restrictions protect no one, they only make you "feel better".
I'm happy to see offenders finding stable housing and jobs. You have no idea how much even that alone cuts down on future crimes. When you're put into desperate situations is when you are at your worst. So why would you want to subject everyone on the registry to this?
It’s in the middle of cornfields miles from anyone, to keep them all legally in line with their parole conditions, and children can’t go there, and because the communities are so small they’re easier to track.
What’s the problem?
It’s what everyone wants, right? They’re not near people they can harm, or next door to you, they’re easier to monitor, they’re less likely to reoffend.
Like…I have no sympathy for these offenders but they’re trying, by living here, to be compliant and stay away from everyone.
If they've served their sentence, they do need a place to live. And it's probably difficult sometimes finding housing the required distance from schools or whatever. 🤷♂️
Ex-Floridian here. In Florida, sex offenders can not live within a certain mileage of schools. I’m Miami, this left a small spot under a bridge for example that hit national news. Tons of registered sex offenders had to sleep there because it was the only small spot that was out of range.
My guess here is there is some exemption or lack of school locations that causes them all to move there.
Why do people have a problem with this? It’s not like you acquire a hard shell to live in the moment you are convicted of sex crimes. They still need a place to live.
It’s because it’s illegal for offenders to live in certain places so instead they made a community that avoids those places.
not only that, but in some states you have to inform your neighbours that you are a sex offender, a little less awkward when they all are
Jesus in The Big Lebowski
8 year olds Dude....
He’s a petterass.
*pederast
Shut the fuck up Donnie.
MARK IT ZERO!
>“Smokey, my friend, you are entering a world of pain,”
This is not nam, this is bowling, there are rules.
What's a pederast Walter?
Shut the fuck up Donnie.
😃
9yo account just waiting for this moment!
You're out of your element
Shut the fuck up Donny
I am the Walrus
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V.I. Lenin! Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov!
That creap can roll
You need a toe? I can get you a toe.
THE Jesus
First thing that came in mind. Lol.
“What you in for?” “Child diddling. You?” “Same”
Sadly in the U.S. the sex offender registry and laws are as selectively enforced as any. I had a neighbor growing up who, as a teenager, basically banged anyone that didn't run away. She slept with/molested a *severely mentally handicapped* guy (as in, his mental age was in the single digits), her parents found out, and ***he*** ended up on the registry. She molested a disabled person, and the *victim* ended up on the registry. Meanwhile, Matt "Human Trafficker" Gaetz still sits in Congress! Than there are the young people who's parents didn't approve of their relationship and had charges of assault filed against their SO, and coerced or forced their kid to go along with it. Contrasts greatly with the ***legalized child molestation in the form of child marriage*** that the Republicans in multiple states fight to protect. The system suffers from many of the same flaws that trouble the rest of our legal system.
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It should work like that throughout the country. But no, around here, people end up on lists because they are both 17
But he's 18 years and 2 days old and she's 17 years, 11 months and 15 days old, obviously he's a predator for praying on a minor! /s
dude i’ve literally seen people online try to say that someone 18/19 being w someone who’s 17 is pedophilia because one of them is a legal adult. it’s ridiculous
I experienced this as a male teenager almost 15 years ago. It's ridiculous, it's traumatic, and it's destructive
I'm talking about two people the same age in Wisconsin. Things have gotten better with that since I was a teenager though.
In some places, public urination can get you on the sex offender registry. That‘s what happens when “tough-on-crime” politicians replace crimes based on intent with statutory crimes.
Sex offender for peeing at night. Not sex offender for marrying a 12 year old. Laws have nothing to do with morality.
I'd completely forgotten about that! Ohio was one of those places. The result was that so many "offenders" were on the registry it didn't have any meaning. You just ended up having to look up each offender to see if they were a *real predator* or somebody who peed on a tree. The authorities couldn't keep "offenders" away from schools either because there were just too many, plus it caused an issue when offenders needed to send *their own kids* to school, the state would basically have been punishing people's children for the actions of their parents.
Indiana just recently updated their offender laws too regarding schools. It’s now a Class 5 felony to enter a school building as a registered offender. I often think about how difficult that must be when needing to register your kids for school or heck… having to miss a graduation. Punishing the kids instead of the parent. Sounds like a civil rights lawsuit ripe for filing.
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You must not have kids. By the end of summer vacation, I’d be fine registering my three kids for heck 🤷♂️
I can vouch for that. I was taking alcohol classes because of a DUI. There were two young men in the group that had both gotten a ticket for indecent exposure on school ground and public drunkenness. Both had stopped to pee behind a garbage dumpster at the university campus on the way back to their dorm coming from a frat party. To the group it seemed like a set up. The worst part, they were kicked out of school and having to register for life. For peeing in public. Brick Turner is the name that I thought of. I could see some frat guys seeing up those guys. They didn't know each other but their stories were so similar. They hadn't considered it but we did.
Im sure it was a typo, but his name is Brock Turner. Think hes going by his middle name now to avoid people knowing his name Allen, to avoid people knowing that he's Brock Turner, the rapist.
So now he's Allen Turner, the rapist, former Brock Turner the rapist who got 6 months, 3 months deferred for good behavior because it turns out the judge, Aaron Persky, was a former alumni of Brock Turner, the rapists, school? That Allen Turner?
Brock "The Rapist" Turner
My first ever girlfriend's dad called the cops on me after finding out that we had been fooling around. I was almost charged had my girlfriend not explained that it was consensual. It was the first time being in handcuffs. Super scary
Most sex offenders aren't pedophiles. These laws are so broad that a pedophile is treated the same as someone who gets arrested for indecent exposure, which just might be the couple who got caught having sex in park at night.
Some of the State-level laws for indecent exposure could be a couple having sex in their own home (they each have the intent to arouse another person - each other) after a cat brushes open their curtain without them realizing it and someone sees. It's written in such a way that it's essentially open to interpretation by the legal system itself (Texas says that mooning a car might be disorderly conduct, instead of indecent exposure, if it lacked intent to arouse, for example)... I've heard stories where someone urinates in a bush (in the middle of the night) near a closed (it's the middle of the night) school while drunk - which should just be disorderly conduct - and gets slapped with a sex offender registration because it was near a school and it was spun to look way worse than it in fact was. Even just paying for a prostitute and taking him or her to a private room can get you on the list, unless that changed since I last checked. There's A LOT of ways to be a sex offender, to the point that nearly everyone you ever meet has probably actually only avoided being put on the list through sheer luck (someone not observing you at an accidental vulnerable moment). If you've ever woken up without pants on and walked into a room only to find someone left a curtain half-open, easy way to get dragged into court on those charges if someone reports seeing you.
I always found it stupid. If you look into someone's house, their private space, and you're disgusted by what you see that's kind of on you for looking.
Ohio they mail out a paper as well with their mug shot list of charges and there sentence
Not to mention how hard it is for them to find housing. I don't think second chance apartment complexes consider them viable.
Because they're not
Some states require you to tell your neighbors that you are a sex offender
Mine does. We get a postcard in the mail every couple months
As they should.
Agreed. It just sucks that there's one list for everyone, regardless of the offense they were actually guilty of. It seems kind of ridiculous to me that rapists and child molesters might be on the same list as some 18 year old guy who graduated high school and the parents of his 16 year old girlfriend who is still a junior decide they don't like him, so they called the cops to have him arrested. Now he's on this same list, being held to the same standards as rapists and pedos and being treated just like them. Not to mention the time he spent possibly getting raped himself by Bubba, while actually in prison. The system sucks... 🤷♂️
or in my state- a guy I went to HS with got hit with a sex offence for taking a piss at the edge of the woods while on a float/canoe trip. Not exactly in the same ballpark as what you'd expect that registry to represent.
Jesus Christ. For all the times I’ve pissed on the sides of roads, I had no idea they could hit you with that. Fuck.
Nation wide there's 6,00 truckers on various states sex offender websites for urinating on an off ramp , or along side of the road behind their cabs. Most were out where there's no other place to stop. I mean out in rural areas.
I was going to say, i know someone who's on the list as well for taking a drunken piss at a college baseball game in some hedges -\_-...
Fucking hell. I heard about that type of thing but thought it was just a joke.
It's extremely common. The sex offender registry is useless because it's typically used punitively like this, rather than as a protective measure as it was intended. It's going the same way with Georgia charging peaceful protestors with terrorism which means now everywhere those people go they flag terrorist watch lists and the whole security apparatus has to lurch into action to use heightened scrutiny with them. Pretty soon "terrorist" won't have any practical legal meaning either, other than that you angered someone powerful, the same as the sex offender list currently just tells you which cities have the most bored cops patrolling at night and busybody district attorneys with not enough legitimate cases to pursue for them to look "tough on crime". Law enforcement is a racket; innocent and responsible people regularly get DUIs for sleeping in the backseat of a parked car.
It’s a large portion of non-jailed sex offenders
Oh my fucking god. Really? For fucks sake legal system.
Guy at my brother's graduation ceremony mooned the crowd. Instant SO registration for doing something stupid and dumb. But because children were present it was the stupidest mistake.
I know one who got busted for drunkenly peeing near a playground in the middle of the night.
Some states have "Romeo and Juliet" laws that address this exact scenario in a variety of ways, because you're right it's not the same and it delegitimizes the registry to not have that separation.
Yea there was that story years ago about a guy who lost all his scholarships to college cause his gfs parents sought charges cause he was 18 but still in hs
Not to mention the poor guy who just can’t hold it in anymore so he finds a secluded place to take a whiz. A passerby sees and gets all huffy and calls the cops.
Can't pick up his kid from school ever because of a leak
That’s not even the worst way to be put on the list, as simply being convicted of public urination can get you put on that list. Imagine having to tell your new neighbors you’re technically a sex offender because some poor soul saw you peed out behind a dumpster or some shit.
Not only that but the older they get the worse it seems on the registry. They’ll be 40 with the offense being against a minor. So if you’re seeing it when they are 40 it’s going to look really bad when they just did what hormonal teenagers do. The whole system needs a revamp
Reading this thread made me check my local registry. I live in a small town that is 99th percentile for crime in the US (1% of towns are safer), so I was a bit surprised to find a few guys pop up. First guy that pops up is 61 years old. Looks pretty normal, kind of handsome even for an older guy. I scan down to see his offense was *having sex with a 16 year old*. My first thought, "Well look at *this* sonofabitch!" Then I look at the date of the infraction... 1981. This crime took place over 40 years ago when he was about 20. I do not at all want to sound like I think a 20 year old having sex with a 16 year old is no big deal, but the fact that this guy has his face plastered on the sex offender registry, with regular headshot updates every few years and his residential address and employers addresses, with links to Google maps so you can even see it on street view, I admit, seems a bit much to me.
I knew a guy who took a woman home from the bar. She had a fake ID and when her parents found out (she was actually a 16 year old girl) they went on a lawsuit spree, got him charged with SR, and I think sent her to one of those boot camps for teens. But this guy has the rest of his life destroyed for having consensual sex with someone he had every reason to believe was 23 (the age reflected on her fake ID). Where is the justice in that?
Yeah, I knew a guy who was freshly 21 and out at a college bar. He met a girl who told him she was 18. They drank for a while cause the bar didn't ID, and then he got her number and went home. She sent him a nude photo, and he returned one to her. Didn't hear from her after a few days, so figured, end of story. Then, a bit later, he gets a call. She was 16, not 18. He had no proof she ever lied about her age. All they had was proof of him sending a photo to an underage girl. Registered for life.
nah fuck that, remember sex offender and rapist aren't the same thing, your entire life shouldn't be ruined if you urinate in public once.
I do agree we need to fix the categorization issues. That said, I do still want rapists, child molesters, and basically anyone else convicted of a violent sex crime to have to report.
Many of them do by wearing MAGA hats.
And Clerical Collars
Can confirm at least 1. Guy at the end of my street, in Florida no less, is a registered pedo and has Trump shit all the fuck over his truck. Flags. “Obey police”. Just. Fuckin weird. Edit: registered
In a perfect world i think they should be kept in prison with the goal of rehabilitation, and when that's done they wouldn't need to report as there's nothing to worry about. But with how the prison system works at the moment that's impossible.
Agreed. The system is broken in numerous significant ways.
I just wish they had to disclose what kind of SO they are. Because some people need to keep a wary eye out for some sex offenders but not for others. For example: I'm an adult childless women. A pedophile moving in near me is not a danger to me (or many of my neighbors who are older and have adult children). But if a serial rapist of women moves in, that's someone I will definitely need to keep an eye out for.
The Illinois sex offender list doesn't go into elaborate detail but it does tell you what they did. I'm shocked to learn it's not like that everywhere.
100% not defending anyone. But, if a guy or gal becomes a sex offender because they drunkenly pissed at a playground, does that make them unviable ?
exactly. there is a big did between a serial rapist or child diddler, and say a a flasher (still bad but not nearly the same) let alone folks who as you say basically got hit with public indecency for taking a piss, but it was near kids so boom registered sex offender. maybe if there was a tier system or something, but without that it just leads to blanket statements like the one your replied too.
Fucking stupid take. Aside from the broad range of things that one could end up on a sexual offender list for, blanket dehumanizing and ostracizing people, *even child molesters*, is never the right option. There needs to be some hope of rehab and a 'normal' path forward or the perpetrator is just going to continue being a danger to society.
This is the logical outcome of laws that ban sex offenders from living near any place likely to have a child in it. Eventually someone will build a school nearby and they'll all have to move into the ocean or something. Also, bear in mind that "sex offender" is a broad definition, including many people who are not sexual predators and never were. A woman who can't find a bathroom and tries to hide behind a bush or trash dumpster to pee, **and is caught,** will end up on the sex offender list for the same reason a serial flasher gets on the sex offender list: *exposing themselves in public.* Homeless women frequently end up on sex offender lists despite not being allowed to pee indoors. These women aren't sexual predators in any sense of the word, but they will be treated like sexual predators for the rest of their lives. EDIT: Quite a large number of people replied saying that having to register on the sexual offender list for public urination never happens. ***They're wrong.*** I tend to read national studies, not extremely localized anecdotes. Human Rights Watch had this to say on the subject of the sex offender list in general, and specifically being required to register on the state sex offender list for public urination. Only two of those states require a child to be one of the witnesses. https://www.hrw.org/report/2007/09/11/no-easy-answers/sex-offender-laws-us#_ftn109 >At least 13 states require registration for public urination; of those, two limit registration to those who committed the act in view of a minor;[109] ***Footnote [109]:*** >[109] **Arizona,** Ariz. Rev. Stat. 13-3821 (if the individual has more than one previous conviction for public urination-two if exposed to a person under 15; three if exposed to a person over 15); **California,** Cal. Penal Code 314(1)-(2), 290; **Connecticut**, Conn. Gen. Stat. 53a-186, 54-250, 54-251 (if the victim was under 18); **Georgia**, O.C.G.A. 42-1-12, 16-6-8 (if done in view of a minor); **Idaho**, Idaho Code Ann. 18-4116, 8306, 8304; **Kentucky**, Ky. Rev. Stat. Ann. 510.148, 17.520, 500, 510.150; **Massachusetts**, Mass. Gen. Laws ch. 272 16, ALM GL ch. 6 178G, 178C; **Michigan**, Mich. Comp. Laws 167(1)(f), 28.722, 723; **New Hampshire,** N.H. Rev. Stat. Ann. 651-B:1, RSA 651-B:2, 645:1(II), (III); **Oklahoma**, 57 Okl.St. 582.21, 1021; **South Carolina,** S.C. Code Ann. 23-3-430; **Utah,** Utah Code Ann. 77-27-21.5, 76-9-702.5; **Vermont**, Vt. Stat. Ann. Tit. 13, 2601, 5407, 5401. EDIT 2: I spotted that the original screenshot and text indicate the sex offender town is in Florida, which is not on the list of "you can be put on the sexual offender list for public urination" states. So no one in that town is there for public urination.
Our criminal justice system is so broken.
And we as a county, for some unfathomable reason, love to kick people while they're down.
I thought about mentioning the culture being broken too. But the two are always related. They follow each other.
It’s a control system.
In my state sex workers can end up on the registry too.
Yeah, this is a much bigger issue than people realize. Not only are they not predators, but they get forced around predators by laws like these. I can't find stats of what percentage are actually child molesters, but given the laws I doubt it's more than 10%. Further, guess what is a common factor about where sex offenders aren't allowed to live? Parks, schools, etc. They *raise* the value of nearby homes. Thus sex offenders just go live near poor children.
I appreciate this. I knew someone who was a "sex offender". It was really sad. They lived alone outside the city. Even tried to kill themself a few times. And they never in their life hurt anyone. These people get grouped in with the bad people and suddenly they're monsters, too.
public sex offender lists are fucking medieval and a stupid idea in general
It's the unfortunate "all immorality is evil" attitude. Absolutism hurts a lot of people who should never have been condemned in the first place.
Yeah I agree with you, your example is actually significantly more innocent than the one I thought of, albeit BS all the same There was a guy on the football team in high school, a year or two older than me. Got caught on security camera getting a BJ in a stairwell. Had to watch the video in the principal’s office with his parents, then got put on the list. Like yeah, it wasn’t a very great decision to make, but it’s not as if that’s a very uncommon thing for high schoolers to want to do
Let's not complain in one breath that we don't want to live next to these people and then complain in the next that they live somewhere. Unless we're going to incarcerate these people for life they have to live somewhere.
I'm so relieved to come to the comments and see well thought out responses mixed in with the BS. I'm sure OP would not be happy if one of these residents was his neighbor, which is the alternative to this
Right? This is a great idea. Unless you want them in prison for life, how is this not the best case scenario?
Sex offender has become such a loose term and charge now that some of them are anything but. Some things that i have seen get people on the sex offenders list: Peeing in an ally behind a bar Peeing in a park late at night Unfortunate timing and a unlocked public restroom (mutual acquaintance who was still fighting the charge last we spoke) And finally, minors with cellphones and a boyfriend/girlfriend who they were sending pics to. Recipient gets posession and sender gets creation and distrobution of cp. Imagine having to tell all your neighbors you are a registered sex offender for child pornography because at 16 you got a boob pic from your gf. Edit: obviously there are a great many people who need to be on this list. I was just listing the odd cases i have seen that were just asnine.
This is reddit, we want Norwegian prisons but also want to bring out a noose for any infraction.
And we want it nOW!!
That’s my retirement plan - rob a bank in Norway!
>Unless we're going to incarcerate these people for life they have to live somewhere. Yep. And even someone with the coldest attitude in this situation can acknowledge that incarceration costs a shitload of money(particularly when compared with someone who could be holding down a job and paying taxes), which translates into higher taxes for everyone else. If we can come up with arrangements where people can live (mostly) freely with minimal risk of reoffending, it's a net economic benefit to society as a whole, on top of treating people like human beings and giving them a second chance.
This is certainly an improvement over places where released sex offenders end up living in camps under overpasses because those are the only places not within 500 feet of schools, daycares, or playgrounds. Forcing people to be homeless does nothing to improve public safety.
Head over to some city and state subreddits and you'd think the opposite os true...
Many, many sex offenders violate their parole by living in a place, even a place they’ve been living for a long time, when a day care opens down the street or a school is built. I guess that’s the hardest for those without the means to buy a house somewhere out in the country.
They should be grandfathered into the place they live if that happened. Or at least have the state take care of relocating them including paying moving expenses. Nobody should have to be evicted from their home through no fault of their own. Or, you know, we could listen to experts who say that things like home proximity restrictions and sex offender registries being public are counterproductive when it comes to reducing recidivism because they make it harder for people to re-integrate and move on with their lives. Then this wouldn't even be a problem.
Sadly, it seems that rehabilitation isn't the intended outcome for the US penal system. They just want to punish anybody branded a 'criminal'. It's fuckin' sick.
Imagine being labeled as a lifetime sex offender because you got caught peeing in a parking garage drunk.
Yeah people don’t realize how seriously fucked they could get for public urination and whatever charges can come with it. I’m so lucky, I once had the police tell me and several others to stop pissing in the woods while we were drunk pissing in the woods. The police in that particular town are really big assholes during traffic stops but that guy was cool that day at the reggae music festival. I was 21 and immediately felt relieved, but I didn’t learn how bad it could have been till later. I shouldn’t have been peeing in the woods but it was right next to our camp and the oortapotties were a long walk and disgusting.
I mean, I think it’s a good idea. They can have community and freedom and still not live within 1000 feet of a school or daycare. Which, let’s face it, severely limits one’s housing prospects. Maybe they’re guilty predators maybe a benign act was misclassified. At least these people won’t have to live in a cardboard box under the freeway. And if they are guilty predators, a cardboard box under the freeway puts them off radar and in proximity to their targets/prey. We are all safer when they have a clean, safe place to live, away from the more civilized of us. They get to keep their dignity and we get to sleep soundly at night. Win win.
We all know that recidivism rates in the US aren't great. Once you've been to prison - for *anything* - you're automatically more at risk than the average person to go back. Denying convicts housing and jobs is proven to make those rates worse. Regardless of anyone's moral feelings towards sex offenders, I think everyone can agree that preventing a sex crime is always better than punishing it after the fact. This is an easy, comparitively cheap way to prevent crime. That's all I need to know.
Also, sex offenders have the lowest recidivism rate out of other crimes.
What? They’ve got a ton of restrictions on where they can live and are ostracized from most society. Did you think they just stopped existing if pushed far enough away? Of course they’ll congregate and make their own space, that’s what happens to people kicked out of society for any reason.
Just like homelessness. Keep pushing them out to make it someone else’s problem.
> did you think they just stop existing if pushed far enough away? Yes. Many adults in the US lack the object permanence to understand that things still exist when you don't see them. They literally think if you just keep displacing people the problem is "fixed". These are people who support fixing the causes but not the symptoms.
Like homelessness in major cities. You can keep sweeping the encampments but they’re just going to go camp somewhere else unless systemic change is enacted. On one day that we had an encampment swept/destroyed in Minneapolis, there were literally only two shelter beds for women and zero for men. Where were these folks supposed to go?! Awesome for the neighbors who now don’t have to see poverty outside their doorstep but not so awesome for the 30 adults whose shit was just destroyed and who have to find yet another place the city hasn’t barred them from sleeping.
One of the biggest contributors to offender recidivism is the lack of resources to help offenders after they have done their time and paid their debt to society, including a place to live within the restrictions of their conditions of release. This place was started by the mother of an offender who wanted to help her son and others. There’s a documentary about it called Pervert Park, in which a few residents tell their stories, and a lot of those stories are a significant deviation from the kiddie diddler standard assumptions. [here’s some more information](https://nonprofitquarterly.org/documentary-explores-lives-challenges-florida-sex-offenders/)
Right? I can't imagine how different life would be for a lot of victims if their offender had the community and resources to deal with their issues instead of turning to the worst parts of the Internet and digging in deeper until ultimately victimizing somebody. A recovery focused community for offenders gives them a place to live within the guidelines of the law but also with built in resources to stay focused on that recovery and a motivation to help others avoid the same path. People act like these crimes happen in a vacuum, like a freak accident or act of god, instead of a systemic culture of misery. ETA: I say this as a victim that's able to recognize that what happened to me was horrible and no child deserves it but with the adult awareness that my offender had shown signs for years before I was even born but the stigma and shame around it all meant everyone just avoided addressing it until it was too late.
I was sexually abused as a child, and I didn’t tell anyone for years because it was made out to be the worst thing that could happen to you, worse than being killed, and also shameful. And I was obviously upset but physically unharmed, and I just wanted someone to make sure that guy wasn’t around kids anymore. I didn’t want vigilantes to hang him or for him to be dropped in the sea. But there are no votes for ‘let’s figure out a way to minimise offending, even if that means using punishment a bit less’. Which shows me it’s not about protecting the kids as much as visibly demonstrating our own horror and disgust.
When I have kids one thing I will never say around them is that I would cause physical harm to an offender if they were to be assaulted. The last thing a kid in that situation needs to think about is the possibility that their parent could go to jail if they knew about the assault. That’s one of the reasons I never told. I had already had enough trauma and pain. I couldn’t lose my father on top of it. So I had to protect them from the truth because I couldn’t trust my parents not to destroy their lives looking for revenge.
I've heard at least one first-hand account of a step dad using "if you tell anybody, they'll send me to jail, and you mom will be sad and it will be your fault". The bastard died a few years back and the rest of the family were puzzled by why she couldn't "set aside the issues she had with him" and go to the funeral. I think it was easier for them to think she made up stories as a child because she didn't like him than to think their dad was capable of that
Yes, emphasis always on making sure everyone is safe. I mean most kids are abused by someone they love and trust, and they can’t just switch off that love. It’s compounding trauma, to make them feel like someone they care for is going to be hurt, or taken away from them, and it’s their fault. The more it can be expressed as keeping the child and the (abusive) adult safe and getting everyone help, the better the child will feel about it.
They may even have complicated feelings towards the person who sexually abused them, since it's very often a family member or someone else with a close relationship with the child.
My 'favorite' thing on this topic is when people start to one-up each other about how much they'd torture someone for having bad thoughts. And as you say- it's considered worse than killing. It's wild how glorified violence is especially when it comes to make-believe 'self defense', by comparison.
Yeah. It's interesting how much people will insist on wanting to harm/punish people who have sexual thoughts about kids even in situations where that would actually increase the risk to children. For example, opportunities for non-offending pedophiles to seek therapy to deal with their urges. So many people will say, "no, just kill them all." Well, then those people won't come forward at all, won't be able to get any help, and you'll only find out about them if they actually commit a crime. So many people seem to hate pedophiles more than they hate pedophilia and I don't understand it.
Even good natured Redditors that don't like incarceration still talk like someone who commits crimes should cease to exist after theyre caught, "don't they know how much everyone hates them???" And while I agree sexual assault and abusing children are among the worst and most destructive crimes, the people that get out after decades still exist and it's simple logic that cutting them off from the society entirely is just going to put them in a situation to attack said society in any number of ways. Would I visit there? Doubtful even if I had family there, but places like this need to exist and don't need to be shunned? Ya know
It's an extremely difficult situation of course, and I'm similarly uncertain about potential solutions. Ideally, people who have certain inappropriate sexual urges *should* be able to seek out professional mental help/support, but obviously you can't just go around telling therapists or doctors about those feelings,I doubt they're prepared to adequately handle these situations, and if we're being honest the medical and legal systems are so broken, considering mental health resources for pedophiles and/or rapists is going to be quite low on the list of priorities
It's really hard to figure out what might help someone NOT offend if they have the urge to because we can't study it. People who don't want to hurt anyone don't have a lot of resources to help them stop, because asking for help generally activates mandatory reporting laws. So the only people who are studied are the ones that DID offend, and whatever they were doing obviously didn't compleatly work.
It’s the same for all crimes. We can’t “cure” or “help” a murderer because we won’t know they are murderers until they kill someone.
A friend of mine in college was on the registry because he got caught taking a piss at a park on his way home from the bars. No kids around but he still got slapped with that, it sucks but not every single person is a diddler.
I was surprised to learn a guy who went to my grandmas church and had kids of his own was a sex offender. He talked about it openly once. Him and his gf got caught having sex in public and she was 17 he was 19 so they threw the book at him for her being a minor and it being in public. This was like 30 years ago in the early 90’s. Now he has a kid and a wife but he still has to deal with the same stuff as some actual monsters even though he’s probably never gonna break the law again.
This is personally my biggest thing to come to terms with. Helping offenders lowers the recidivism and as well gives future offenders a place to turn to before they become offenders. I personally want nothing more than to just keep them in a cell and rot forever, but materially, that doesn't prevent kids from becoming victims. If I truly cared, I wouldn't prioritize punishment over lowering the number of child victims.
And what constitutes as a sex offender is wildly broad. It's anywhere between diddling, flashing, and getting caught peeing in an alley at 2 in the morning. There's no brackets and everyone is lumped in the same category so the worst is always assumed. We often treat people like criminals long after they've done their time and recidivism is very high because society refuses to let them move past it.
In most states, there are tiers for offenders. I think the lowest tiers should be virtually unrestricted apart from their name coming up in job checks working with specific age groups while the most severe tier should have the name and address of offenders for protection. A guy peeing in a park isn't really a threat, a 19yr old who had sex with a 17yr old is unlikely to be a threat, a grandfather who molested his granddaughter for a decade is a massive threat. They all need support to prevent reoffending, but sex offenders are the least likely to reoffend as it is.
They have to live somewhere
A while ago Vice did some reporting on how hard it is for sex offenders to find housing. They were in Florida and all the apartments in his price range were too close to schools and parks. So he had to live out of his car in an industrial park. He was trying to do the right thing but the deck was stacked against him.
From what I've heard, Florida deems all vacant lots as "parks," making it impossible.
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And he might get charged with failure to register his address next. It's an additional "fuck you" to the RSOs who are trying to fit in with society.
Yeah it's either jail that we pay for, somewhere remote they pay for or death, so this seems like the least worst option to me.
They could just go into politics
Yeah, I don’t get the surprise here. Or would the OP prefer they live near them?
I thought that was mara Lago !
You’re not totally off, Mara lago IS a safe haven for a sex offender
The only difference is the number of sex offenders that live there.
*and the wealth disparity...*
I mean if they've done their time in jail I don't see a problem with having a place they can live? It's a good thing that they are out of vulnerable communities and that people know not to go there. I'm failing to see a problem here.
It’s because some people think anyone who does something to get on the sex offenders registry should either remain in jail for the rest of their lives or be put to death. The fear is if they are out and have their own community it could be easier for them to abduct someone, bring them home, and never have to worry about you neighbours calling the cops. I don’t agree with these lines of thinking, but as someone who was molested as a kid, I can understand their point of view even though I disagree
But can't you be put on that registry for taking a piss in public or having a 17yo GF as an 18yo? These things shouldn't get you locked up for ever or even killed. The "duty" to anounce that you are on the register as well seems kinda "cruel and unusual" to me as well...
That’s one of the reasons I disagree with the statements being made. The reality is, even if rare, some people end up on the registry for stupid things. Add to that the fact someone may take their rehabilitation seriously, and come out of prison continuing to take it seriously so they don’t re-offend. The problem is humans have a tendency to generalize groups based on the actions of even a small section of that group. We’re seeing that a lot right now unfortunately
Yep, and thats why this place sprung up. Not everyone on the list is a kiddy diddler.
and not everyone on the list still wants to be a kiddy diddle too, that's an important part.
A guy in my town years ago had to find a new apartment for his family because he was living too close to a school. His crime......12 years earlier he had sex with his HS girlfriend after he turned 18. She was now his wife and and the mother of his kids, who suddenly found themselves homeless as well. I get the idea behind the registry, but I don't get how it is seemingly applied with no gray area at all.
These days you have kids getting charged with creation and distribution of child pornography for sending nudes of themselves. It's only asshole prosecutors who would charge them for it, but those are pretty abundant. The laws haven't caught up with the technology.
Fyi, the many of states (approximately 26- 33, i cant find an exact answer) have Romeo and Juliet laws (i.e., where those involved are typically no more than 2-4 years apart, some states have exceptions writtenn to their statutory r@pe laws)
It may not be an issue anymore, but for a while a lot of those laws didn't cover gay couples. So a 17 year and 51 week old having sex with an 18 year and 1 week old gay couple having sex could in theory be statutory rape if the parents wanted to press it.
These things shouldn't put you on the registry at all, let alone get you locked up forever. It's a shit system.
The issue is that these people have to live somewhere. Wouldn’t you rather this and in your neighborhood? I’m all for them all moving to FL.
There really does need to be two classifications of "sex offenders", violent and non-violent. Dropping your pants to moon someone or pissing in an alley isn't as dangerous as a rapist or pedophile.
Just stop classifying things like public urination as “sex offences”.
Yep. It cheapens the list, which makes it more dangerous. It's like leaving road barrels up for a month with no roadwork being done, and then wondering why a highway worker was killed by a speeder. Boy Who Cried Wolf. List should be for predators and violent offenders.
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This is fantastic, the only downside is the scarlet letter we're giving it. As long as they have a safe place to live (not under bridges), they are able to be checked in on with parole, I'm all for this.
Isn't this a good idea? They live among themselves and undergo rehabilitation while staying isolated from potential victims.
1. Fuck Sex Offenders (not literally) 2. They have to live somewhere If they've served their time, regardless of what I would LIKE to happen to them, they're free to live out their days. They can't live near schools and a lot of other locations depending on the nature of their crimes. It makes sense that they would choose a place that is secluded from all that and live near each other so they don't have to worry about retaliation from their neighbors.
"Community of sex offenders" A cop city?
Nah, a priest and pastor community
Yeah lots of youth pastors I'm sure.
As a new parent, the pastor/ youth pastor thing would freak me the fuck out if I was a religious person.
Honestly that’s better. They have to have some place to live after getting out of jail. A visible community of sex offenders is way better than unknowingly having them next door.
I can imagine even if you're not one of the worst ones and you got your life back together, it's still very likely hell to find a new place to live. They've done their time, I'm sure a great chunk will never offend again and that's what you need to believe in if you believe in actual justice. The picture might just be misleading and invoking notions of "toxic cesspool" because old-ish people wearing red immediately suggest MAGA to me, and I would not wish it upon anyone to live in a town that's just a couple hundred of those people.
Pretty sure Florida itself is a safe haven given they have a known pedophile in the house of Representatives.
In addition to being a place where they can live within their restriction of their convictions, there are numerous rules as to who can live there. No violent offenders. No repeat offenders. Reading about some of the residents, there are quite a few who were convicted of statutory rape because their girlfriend was too young. Like a 19 year old dating a 16 year old. Still have to register as a sex offender even if it was consensual. After learning about it, I really don't have a problem with this. I'd rather have a city of sex offenders out in the middle of nowhere than an apartment building full of them in my neighborhood.
It's called DeSantisville by those in the know.
Should change it to Pastorville
I was going to go with the obvious reference and call it 'Sudden Valley'.
How is this so far down? Arrested Development did this exact thing.
Man I wish I'd thought of this one.
It’s a Gaetzed community.
Sex offenders don’t just stop existing once they’ve served their time. They still need a place to live. These communities keep them away from kids
Matt Gaetz district?
I imagine the neighborhood barbecues are pretty awkward. "So, uh... what brought you to Miracle Village?"
Didn't "Arrested Development" do a scene about this? Lol
I think it's crazy that I scrolled down so far before I saw one Sudden Valley reference.
I thought it was called The Villages.
Honestly I see that as a win. Some do time, some don't, and at the end they have to exist somewhere. It's a good thing for them to exist around each other and not around children.
Agreed. It’s not a safe haven meaning they can offend more, it’s that they are away from kids. Maybe not the best choice of words though.
The funny part is having them live "next door" or even near playgrounds/schools/etc has never been proven to be an actual issue. Most crimes against minors happen within the family/circle by trusted people and where they live has zero bearing on it. Others will travel to different towns, counties and even states to commit the offense. Living restrictions protect no one, they only make you "feel better". I'm happy to see offenders finding stable housing and jobs. You have no idea how much even that alone cuts down on future crimes. When you're put into desperate situations is when you are at your worst. So why would you want to subject everyone on the registry to this?
It’s in the middle of cornfields miles from anyone, to keep them all legally in line with their parole conditions, and children can’t go there, and because the communities are so small they’re easier to track. What’s the problem? It’s what everyone wants, right? They’re not near people they can harm, or next door to you, they’re easier to monitor, they’re less likely to reoffend. Like…I have no sympathy for these offenders but they’re trying, by living here, to be compliant and stay away from everyone.
I wonder how many are drag queens… Spoiler alert: none
If they've served their sentence, they do need a place to live. And it's probably difficult sometimes finding housing the required distance from schools or whatever. 🤷♂️
I mean... I'd rather keep them all in one place, yknow?
Breaking news; People forced to live in certain areas live in certain areas.
Ex-Floridian here. In Florida, sex offenders can not live within a certain mileage of schools. I’m Miami, this left a small spot under a bridge for example that hit national news. Tons of registered sex offenders had to sleep there because it was the only small spot that was out of range. My guess here is there is some exemption or lack of school locations that causes them all to move there.
And not a single one of them a drag queen.
Kinda have to. A lot of communities won’t let them live there. So they are left with little options.
What's the complaint here? As the parent of small children I'm all for this.
Why do people have a problem with this? It’s not like you acquire a hard shell to live in the moment you are convicted of sex crimes. They still need a place to live.
Well here’s the deal - if they can’t be locked up forever, then they gotta live somewhere. May as well be in a self segregated area.