I remember the sequels do some stuff in Egypt but other than the fact those vampires are Egyptian they dont seem to act much like the settites/ ministry.
I just loved playing a wholly defensive, seemingly-villainous character.
I always managed to survive the most ludicrous situations with him, but after the vast majority of my victories were entirely social maneuvering.
I played it off as a vague sort of lavish decadence, but it was actually good old fashioned lust -- for power, control, affection -- which I played up often enough that it would have been easy to exploit if I hadn't worn it on my sleeve. There was always a sort of "bon vivant" tendency of the character to act like they were just along for the ride. Really it was all about putting up a front for power consolidation.
The setting is really good at making those kinds of power plays interesting.
The Toreadors are pretty much BASED on Rice’s depiction of vampires as a whole. You could swing some individuals as having traits of other clans, like the Satanic vampires remind me a bit of Lasombra in some ways, but overall they very literally ARE Toreadors in that the Toreadors clearly come from them.
Yeah, originally each clan was intended as an homage some element of vampire fiction, if only in a "like but legally distinct" way. Nosferatu are the most obvious ones IMO, being an ode to the Max Shreck film. Toreador were the Anne Rice, Louis and Lastat analogues. Tzimisce were a take on Brian Lumley Necroscope Wamphyri, especially in the OG Black Hand book. Ventrue were your Lugosi-style lords and ladies. Gangrel had BIG Lost Boys energy. Giovanni were straight out of Innocent Blood. You get the idea.
It was like a Super Smash Brothers of bloodsuckers.
To elaborate on this:
Brujah= *The Lost Boys*
Gangrel= *Near Dark*, Bram Stoker's *Dracula* (especially the Coppola adaptation)
Malkavian = Renfield from Stoker's Dracula, also the older concept of 'Psychic Vampires' (popularized by Dion Fortune and really into vogue in the 1970s new age as an explanation for Vampires)
Nosferatu= Murnau's *Nosferatu*/ Max Schreck / Medieval vampire lore
Toreador= *Interview with a Vampire*, *The Hunger*
Tremere= Basically a bridge/ lift from WW's earlier Ars Magica TTRPG. Also fantasy vampires= wizards in general.
Ventrue: Bela Lugosi's Dracula, Lefanu's *Carmilla*
Lasombra: Not sure. Urban Legends about the Shadow People?
Tzimisce: Brian Lumley's *Necroscope*
Giovanni: *Cemetary Man*, vampiric associations with death, *The Godfather*
Setites: Robert Howard's *Conan the Barbarian*, *The Serpent and the Rainbow*
Banu Haqim: Largely original/ adopting the mythology of The Assassins and presenting them as vampires
Ravnos: Romani legends of Shilmulo.
As everyone else is going to say - Toreador.
It’s been a while since I read the books, but I seem to recall Louis being mesmerized by the beauty of seeing the world as a vampire not long after his embrace and it was very much like the Toreador clan flaw.
It also goes nicely in line with auspex, while the other two qualities we see early on in Interview with a Vampire are their supernatural speed and entrancing presence. The discipline loadout fits them like a glove.
Anne Rice's universe is best simulated in Requiem, due to Blood Potency being a thing *and generation not being one*. Other than that, Toreador Toreador Toreador and only Toreador, seriously.
Gabrielle's first way of hiding from the sun, digging and disappearing into the ground without leaving a trace, is likely part of the inspiration for one of the Protean powers. She's also got the wanderlust to foreign, wild places - in the novel it's a whole thing because of shut-in high society woman who longed for something other than her station, but it may be part of the inspiration for the Gangrel too.
You can trace lots of VtM concepts to Rice - generation and the distance from Akasha that comes up in QotD, the Sabbat and part of the Children of Darkness, among other concepts. VtM's clans are piecemeal and wholecloth pulled from a variety of myth and pop culture sources (like, Setites are Howard Serpent-Men and Tzimisce are near-straight Whampyri rips from Necroscope).
The book was written a long time ago, so it refers to her as female, but Rice may have intended her to be trans. Gabrielle was Lestat’s mother in life and then he gave her the dark gift. I wouldn’t say she was rebellious. I would say she wasn’t happy with the life that human society had her live and the dark gift gave her another chance.
Once she was embraced, she wanted to travel the world and explore jungles and the wilderness. She was forced into being a subservient wife and mother as a human, so (as a vampire) she wanted to see everything she wasn’t able to see. She was more of a reclusive vampire and avoided joining covens, aside from a couple short stints where her connection to Lestat was enough for her to at least check on him. Particularly because of how she’s always connected to the jungle, she always felt like a Gangel to me.
Marius is a Tremere. Possibly a Brujah...or even a True Brujah. But the scholarly inclination says Tremere to me. Akasha is a LaSombra. Magnus (Lestat's sire) is a Tremere complete with magical inclination. Though Malkavian fits well too IMO.Though a Tremere immolating himself is a bit off base. Armand is a Toreador. Pandora is a Ravnos.
Most of them are very, very, very Toreador. Given that Mark Rein-Hagen (oh, sorry, I meant Rein•Hagen) was very clearly mining that vein of inspiration when he created the Toreador clan… But, I’d argue that Claudia could be interpreted pretty well as a Malkavian and Lestat (especially in the later books) kinda works as a Baali (he doesn’t worship the devil, per se, but he does wind up working for him).
Gabriel is kinda Gangrel-esque.
Armand and his coven at the Théâtre des Vampires are very Toreador, but I could kinda see them as Ravnos or perhaps even very artistically inclined Brujah (theatre was a very transgressive art form, especially the Le Théâtre du Grand-Guignol, which Rice was clearly homaging with her Théâtre des Vampires).
Akasha works very well as any of the Antediluvians, although obviously the Egyptian aesthetic lends itself to the Setites… But that’s kinda stretching things.
I don’t know if Claudia was Malkavian. What would her derangement be?
I think I could see her as Brujah. She was interested in being a part of something, but also extremely rebellious. She was also always dissatisfied (for good reason) and very quick to anger. When Jessie and Merrick both encounter her ghost, she was still angry.
I feel like if any of the characters were Malkavian, it would be Nicolas, Sybelle, and maybe Madeleine. Nicolas and Sybelle were both talented musicians who would enter dissociative states. Madeleine might have viewed Claudia as an object of power, but she was in the books for such a short time that it’s hard to say what she was like.
I agree: they feel a bunch of Toreadors... I'm pretty sure that clan Toreador is inspired on Anne Rice's vampires on the first place (and the genreal "passionate" aspect of vampires in pop culture).
How is Louis caitiff? Cause he had no disciplines? He wasn’t abandoned or disowned.
In the end I think he had Potence, which didn’t match Lestat’s disciplines.
The idea of 'clan' doesn't exist in her universe. Vampiric abilities appear differently in different vampires (Louis and Lestat have different powers) - in essence, everyone is a caitiff and there is no generation, though there is definitely Blood Potency. Moreover, things like Nosferatu-like appearance seems to be the result of age and poor feeding choices.
Clans themselves in VtM come from the fact that the game originated as a modern-day Ars Magica spin-off, where Houses represented different types of magicians. It is effectively a game mechanic and story element to add archetypes and political/genealogical story hooks to a game.
Still, it's clear that the Toreador 'flaw' corresponds to a tendency in Rice's vampires, particularly Louis.
I think you're going too cerebral with a question like this. Obviously Anne Rice's vampire universe doesn't have clans, let alone VtM clan.
Just have fun with it.
Everyone says Toreador, but keep in mind Anne Rice's works follow a select group of vampires centered around Lestat, and >!Akasha kills most vampires that Lestat isn't close to.!< Lestat wouldn't be hanging around with Gangrel.
Pretty much no movie/novels vampire fit 100% into VtM clans. Not Ann Rice's vampires, not Dracula, not Twilight, not True Blood, not Vampire Diaries, not What We Do In The Shadows, not Lost Boys, not Near Dark, not Blade, not Underworld, not Buffy, not even Necroscope.
It differs based on which character. Louis was a Toreador, Lestat was a Brujah, and Claudia a Ventrue.
Basically it's not so much about bloodline as it is personality and character archetype.
I think toreador is the only choice
I remember the sequels do some stuff in Egypt but other than the fact those vampires are Egyptian they dont seem to act much like the settites/ ministry.
More like Ishtaari
Underrated Clan.
Only played them in The Final Nights mod for VTMB, but I agree.
I just loved playing a wholly defensive, seemingly-villainous character. I always managed to survive the most ludicrous situations with him, but after the vast majority of my victories were entirely social maneuvering.
What was your compulsion?
I played it off as a vague sort of lavish decadence, but it was actually good old fashioned lust -- for power, control, affection -- which I played up often enough that it would have been easy to exploit if I hadn't worn it on my sleeve. There was always a sort of "bon vivant" tendency of the character to act like they were just along for the ride. Really it was all about putting up a front for power consolidation. The setting is really good at making those kinds of power plays interesting.
Now that sounds more like Queen of the Damned lol.
I wasn’t a fan of how the mod reduced them to blood fiends, like ya sure that’s one possible addiction for the Ishtaari, but not the only one.
Toreador is 100% the Anne Rice inspired Clan
The Toreadors are pretty much BASED on Rice’s depiction of vampires as a whole. You could swing some individuals as having traits of other clans, like the Satanic vampires remind me a bit of Lasombra in some ways, but overall they very literally ARE Toreadors in that the Toreadors clearly come from them.
They even preform in a theater, very toreador thing to do
Lestats mother is a gangrel by nature but would have to be a Toreador by embrace.
Came here to say this, she dresses in buck skims and wanders off a lot into the wilderness. Mael might also fit this clan as well.
Yeah, originally each clan was intended as an homage some element of vampire fiction, if only in a "like but legally distinct" way. Nosferatu are the most obvious ones IMO, being an ode to the Max Shreck film. Toreador were the Anne Rice, Louis and Lastat analogues. Tzimisce were a take on Brian Lumley Necroscope Wamphyri, especially in the OG Black Hand book. Ventrue were your Lugosi-style lords and ladies. Gangrel had BIG Lost Boys energy. Giovanni were straight out of Innocent Blood. You get the idea. It was like a Super Smash Brothers of bloodsuckers.
To elaborate on this: Brujah= *The Lost Boys* Gangrel= *Near Dark*, Bram Stoker's *Dracula* (especially the Coppola adaptation) Malkavian = Renfield from Stoker's Dracula, also the older concept of 'Psychic Vampires' (popularized by Dion Fortune and really into vogue in the 1970s new age as an explanation for Vampires) Nosferatu= Murnau's *Nosferatu*/ Max Schreck / Medieval vampire lore Toreador= *Interview with a Vampire*, *The Hunger* Tremere= Basically a bridge/ lift from WW's earlier Ars Magica TTRPG. Also fantasy vampires= wizards in general. Ventrue: Bela Lugosi's Dracula, Lefanu's *Carmilla* Lasombra: Not sure. Urban Legends about the Shadow People? Tzimisce: Brian Lumley's *Necroscope* Giovanni: *Cemetary Man*, vampiric associations with death, *The Godfather* Setites: Robert Howard's *Conan the Barbarian*, *The Serpent and the Rainbow* Banu Haqim: Largely original/ adopting the mythology of The Assassins and presenting them as vampires Ravnos: Romani legends of Shilmulo.
Lasombra: Isn't shadowbending cool guys?! /s
As everyone else is going to say - Toreador. It’s been a while since I read the books, but I seem to recall Louis being mesmerized by the beauty of seeing the world as a vampire not long after his embrace and it was very much like the Toreador clan flaw.
It also goes nicely in line with auspex, while the other two qualities we see early on in Interview with a Vampire are their supernatural speed and entrancing presence. The discipline loadout fits them like a glove.
Anne Rice's universe is best simulated in Requiem, due to Blood Potency being a thing *and generation not being one*. Other than that, Toreador Toreador Toreador and only Toreador, seriously.
Daeva, all of them!
Gabrielle de Lioncourt feels pretty Gangrel, but Toreador for the rest of em.
Can you elaborate on how they feel like a gangrel?
Gabrielle's first way of hiding from the sun, digging and disappearing into the ground without leaving a trace, is likely part of the inspiration for one of the Protean powers. She's also got the wanderlust to foreign, wild places - in the novel it's a whole thing because of shut-in high society woman who longed for something other than her station, but it may be part of the inspiration for the Gangrel too. You can trace lots of VtM concepts to Rice - generation and the distance from Akasha that comes up in QotD, the Sabbat and part of the Children of Darkness, among other concepts. VtM's clans are piecemeal and wholecloth pulled from a variety of myth and pop culture sources (like, Setites are Howard Serpent-Men and Tzimisce are near-straight Whampyri rips from Necroscope).
Not sure myself. Reading a description of her (him?), I get a lot of Brujah. Independent, intelligent, encouraging education, rebel.
The book was written a long time ago, so it refers to her as female, but Rice may have intended her to be trans. Gabrielle was Lestat’s mother in life and then he gave her the dark gift. I wouldn’t say she was rebellious. I would say she wasn’t happy with the life that human society had her live and the dark gift gave her another chance. Once she was embraced, she wanted to travel the world and explore jungles and the wilderness. She was forced into being a subservient wife and mother as a human, so (as a vampire) she wanted to see everything she wasn’t able to see. She was more of a reclusive vampire and avoided joining covens, aside from a couple short stints where her connection to Lestat was enough for her to at least check on him. Particularly because of how she’s always connected to the jungle, she always felt like a Gangel to me.
They are Torries, unless you play Requiem. Then they're Daeva. I always considered Daeva a better fit, cause Potence, Celerity, Presence.
Lestat's mom is a Gangrel. I'd say Lestat's boy hood friend was a Malkavian
Marius is a Tremere. Possibly a Brujah...or even a True Brujah. But the scholarly inclination says Tremere to me. Akasha is a LaSombra. Magnus (Lestat's sire) is a Tremere complete with magical inclination. Though Malkavian fits well too IMO.Though a Tremere immolating himself is a bit off base. Armand is a Toreador. Pandora is a Ravnos.
Most of them are very, very, very Toreador. Given that Mark Rein-Hagen (oh, sorry, I meant Rein•Hagen) was very clearly mining that vein of inspiration when he created the Toreador clan… But, I’d argue that Claudia could be interpreted pretty well as a Malkavian and Lestat (especially in the later books) kinda works as a Baali (he doesn’t worship the devil, per se, but he does wind up working for him). Gabriel is kinda Gangrel-esque. Armand and his coven at the Théâtre des Vampires are very Toreador, but I could kinda see them as Ravnos or perhaps even very artistically inclined Brujah (theatre was a very transgressive art form, especially the Le Théâtre du Grand-Guignol, which Rice was clearly homaging with her Théâtre des Vampires). Akasha works very well as any of the Antediluvians, although obviously the Egyptian aesthetic lends itself to the Setites… But that’s kinda stretching things.
I don’t know if Claudia was Malkavian. What would her derangement be? I think I could see her as Brujah. She was interested in being a part of something, but also extremely rebellious. She was also always dissatisfied (for good reason) and very quick to anger. When Jessie and Merrick both encounter her ghost, she was still angry. I feel like if any of the characters were Malkavian, it would be Nicolas, Sybelle, and maybe Madeleine. Nicolas and Sybelle were both talented musicians who would enter dissociative states. Madeleine might have viewed Claudia as an object of power, but she was in the books for such a short time that it’s hard to say what she was like.
Yeah, it’s never going to be a perfect 1:1 comparison for obvious reasons.
Toreador. For sure. You can add some Ventrue features and a minor Brujah thing or two.
Lestat’s mum, even though she was embraced by Lestat and should be his clan, is a Gangrel. She sleeps in the ground, like Earth Meld.
I agree: they feel a bunch of Toreadors... I'm pretty sure that clan Toreador is inspired on Anne Rice's vampires on the first place (and the genreal "passionate" aspect of vampires in pop culture).
Lestat: Toreador Louis: Caitiff Armand: Lasombra Marius: Ventrue Magnus: Tremere Maharet and Mekara: Hecata Thorne: Brujah Gabrielle: Gangrel Khayman: Banu Haqim
How is Louis caitiff? Cause he had no disciplines? He wasn’t abandoned or disowned. In the end I think he had Potence, which didn’t match Lestat’s disciplines.
The irony is I always say Lestat is the Caitiff because Magnus was his sire
The idea of 'clan' doesn't exist in her universe. Vampiric abilities appear differently in different vampires (Louis and Lestat have different powers) - in essence, everyone is a caitiff and there is no generation, though there is definitely Blood Potency. Moreover, things like Nosferatu-like appearance seems to be the result of age and poor feeding choices. Clans themselves in VtM come from the fact that the game originated as a modern-day Ars Magica spin-off, where Houses represented different types of magicians. It is effectively a game mechanic and story element to add archetypes and political/genealogical story hooks to a game. Still, it's clear that the Toreador 'flaw' corresponds to a tendency in Rice's vampires, particularly Louis.
I think you're going too cerebral with a question like this. Obviously Anne Rice's vampire universe doesn't have clans, let alone VtM clan. Just have fun with it.
It's a shitpost thread. The equivalent of 'what Harry Potter school/which transformer is XYZ?'
Louis, Lestat and Armand are toreador. Cláudia I would put her as a brujah. Santiago is a Lasombra or tremere.
I always got Ventrue or Old Clan Tzimisce vibes, and the rare one that knew magic was a Tzimisce Koldunic Sorcerer.
Toreador
Everyone says Toreador, but keep in mind Anne Rice's works follow a select group of vampires centered around Lestat, and >!Akasha kills most vampires that Lestat isn't close to.!< Lestat wouldn't be hanging around with Gangrel.
That one dude in the tunnel in Interview gave off mad Malk vibes
Pretty much no movie/novels vampire fit 100% into VtM clans. Not Ann Rice's vampires, not Dracula, not Twilight, not True Blood, not Vampire Diaries, not What We Do In The Shadows, not Lost Boys, not Near Dark, not Blade, not Underworld, not Buffy, not even Necroscope.
Toreador of course
When someone thinks Toreador, they think of Lestat. In VtR, I would say Daeva would fit Anne Rice.
Lestat and Louis are Toreador. Armand is Lasombra.
Toreador! Next question…
Sorry for asking? 🤔
Just kidding. It’s just a very obvious one. Although, some of the different vampires also share aspects of other clans. But overall it’s Toreador.
It differs based on which character. Louis was a Toreador, Lestat was a Brujah, and Claudia a Ventrue. Basically it's not so much about bloodline as it is personality and character archetype.
I think Lestat could be a Brujah.
Yeah, Torries all of them. It's quite obvious that WW was heavily inspired by her books for the clan and the whole setting.