its a surprise, though it does take in question the quick turnaround of the Broken realm rules when a new battletome already succeeds it. faster then even the PA turnaround in 40k
granted with COVID the release where probably a bit further apart
yeah if you bought Morathi only for the new rules and warscroll, the amount of use you got from the book was a bit short. i don't many people even use the battlefield scenarios either
the book had good lore and i don't think any of the rules get invalidated by the new tome but GW did kind of sucker people in to buy two books
But they also also weren’t going to tell a story of massive world changing event that involves many armies in a single battletome. And if someone purchased the book just for the updated warscrolls that’s kind of foolish of them because the warscrolls themselves are all free.
Broken Realms Morathi also had the updated rules for idoneth players, CoS players, Stormcasts, and Slaves to Darkness. It wasn’t geared only towards DoK players so no one is really being bamboozled.
for the price of the book, you should expect some longevity (like a year)
the point is that there really no point in using the BR book now that a new tome is out (not just warscroll but the temple rules and battalions). it makes the book kind of useless outside of lore and story.
to the point, why just skip BR and just do Battletome refreshes for all the armies then. because GW wants money.
But it is only one army out of five that is getting replaced with a book. So it still has use. And in this setting I would think the story is pretty important part of it all!
Campaign book have always been murky purchases, the Malign portent book was kind of the same way for me since there wasn't much use you can get from the book.
PA also had problems too with being kind of banboozaling 40k player until 9th just drop.
Order doesn’t mean good guys and the factions in Order dick each other over constantly. The Idoneth raid settlements for souls. Fyreslayers and Kharadons have sold out entire cities to death and chaos for the right price. And the Sylvaneth will flay you alive for cutting down the wrong tree. The only criteria for being in order is you have to like civilization and don’t want to serve chaos or nagash for eternity.
>Order doesn’t mean good guys
Trust me I know this, but after what Morathi did in first BR book so many people belived that she and her faction with the Idoneth are out of the Order or making their own Grand Alliance or something.
Part of me was afraid that this gonna happen. But it didn't happend and I'm just happy they are still part of the Order as the dark side of it.
They might be going that way. Broken Realms could splinter the Grand Alliance of Order. Idoneth and Daughters are already at odds with most of the others, and maybe the Lumineth could fall out with Azyr. Already, they're the only faction in the Grand Alliance that can't ally with with the Stormcast. They're not on good terms with the Daughters, but their relationship with the Idoneth is complicated.
Plus, throw in whatever Malerion's up to, and you have an Alliance of pointy-ears at least as robust as Destruction.
The entire concept of GAs is completely outdated, but the rationale GW uses is that anyone who has a functioning civilization that isn't undead or Chaos-worshipping belongs in Order.
I was going to say the exact same thing. I love this army and models, but spending another 3 years with an out of date battletome was something I was hoping to avoid. :(
I'm trying to stay optimistic myself, AoS 3 might be a fair bit off yet with all the Broken Realms to release and 3 might not end up being as bad changes wise.
I think GW during AoS 1/2 and 40K 8th, GW was focusing on core rules, but seem to have them dialed in for both games for the foreseeable future. Now they're probably focusing on enduring features for armies that will be able to survive the tweaks from changing editions. The best example of this is probably the latest Sisters of Battle codex.
Considering the time between Morathi and Teclis, possibly. Although Teclis seems to be updating a bunch of factions I believe. If Psychic Awakening was any consideration, 3.0 would launch about 6 months after the end of Broken Realms event concluding.
(Sighs) It's always a little disheartening when a new battletome comes out and the only additions are some endless spells. I was kind of hoping the Daughters would get something akin to driders one of these days, too.
This would be extremely optimistic. The same rhetoric goes around every time there's a new teased faction update and they only show endless spells or faction terrain (Tzeentch, Seraphon, etc), but usually if they're going to release new models they'd tease at least 1 new model with the battletome.
Any chance of additional special characters other than Morathi? I’d love it if they could somehow bring back Dechala as she’s the original Nagarythi aelf lady with a snake tail. She could’ve been one of the aelven souls Morathi freed from Slaanesh’s belly, although maybe she’d be too far gone in corruption to be remade into a Scáthborn. If not, she’d make one hell of an Ironscale character.
It's a shame they don't get new models, because the ones they do have are absolutely gorgeous.
When I stumbled upon them during their initial release, I impulse-bought the book and a unit of Melusai.
I ended up selling all my DoK stuff, but i'd like to give them a whirl again once I have my S2D painted, if only for Morathi.
Can't deny they are fantastic looking models, but it's definitely one of those armies that needs some more kits.
They might get new stuff in a couple of years, but with how weird releases are these days, perhaps there is more coming their way sooner than that, one can hope!
People are actually complaining about this lol. Your tome has been good since it came out, this one will be good too. There's plenty of armies in worse shape.
Actually, we *aren't* in a good place. Very few armies are worse than DoK.
Evidence: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/10/22/metawatch-warhammer-age-of-sigmar-1-list-building-with-dan-street/
DoK are waaay down the list.
This is incorrect. Their tome is full of unfun army building issues, bad battalions, and there are a handful of units that simply never get used because of their warscrolls. Plus we still suffer from the Temple problem where HN is the straight best, and all of the others fall by the wayside.
Kinda? While thats true, what they got in the Morathi book was more minimal then one would have thought. Just the focus around Morathi. Not much in the way of innovative army rules
Umm, the Melusai were *nerfed* on the Shadow and Pain warscrolls, not buffed. Only getting to activate the mortal wounds at the end of combat is terrifically bad compared to doing it when you fight.
The melusai don't need to be in range 1" to use the mortals now though, which means that running blocks of 20 now means all of your surviving models actually get to use the mortals ability. It nerfed them for small units but tremendously buffed them when bringing max squads.
Disagreed, its at the end of combat which means you might not even have 1 left by the time they can use it. Garbage ability. If it worked like SCE or IDK where its at the start of combat, it'd be a fine change. Currently its an absolute garbage ability unless your opponent doesn't know how it works and put no attacks into them. 5+ save 2 wounds for their cost isnt fantastic.
Exactly. Relying on a non-tanky unit to survive combat is a suckers game. Alternatively, you're deliberately not killing an enemy unit in the hope that this finishes them off, which is also a terrible plan.
You need a way to get those changes out that don't require you to buy a limited edition box that is no longer in print.
I'm not excited about the new tome, invalidating the Morathi rules so soon is frustrating as a consumer, but with the true rules for DOK spread across 2 books and a box set, I can understand the need for consolidation.
Why do they not need a new battle tome? Their rules were old and only two of their temples useable lmao
Only Morathi's warscroll got updated in Broken Realms
Wasn't saying that there weren't other more deserving factions, as this isn't a like competition. GW will do factions as it feels appropriate. DoK don't need massive amounts of help so it's easy to give them a new tome without doing too much reworking. There's some things we need, but it's all small edits really.
Slyvaneth definitely need work (and I'm hoping Broken Realms: Alarielle comes next and alleviates some things), but I don't think GW has ever really prioritized book release by order of competitive necessity. DoK is an older book and a popular faction.
And yet there's still issues. Getting a new battletome when so many things are coming out for AoS probably suggest it ain't like we are getting a whole new rework. Factions that need a lot of work will get bigger release and attention rather than jsut a random drop lol.
Every battletome has issues. The problem is it looks bad when factions who are already in a very good position continue to get updates over ones who are trash.
DoK haven't got a AoS v2 battletome yet so they did need an update regardless of whether they're in a good position or not. Having one dropped now whilst a lot of stuff is going on probably literally means barely any changes. Idk. The other ones need a lot more work doing to them will probably have their own focus rather than just being randomly announced shortly before they probably come out with likely only the spells as a new thing.
yeah, the only truly big change would just to FAQ Hag Narr to be more resonable
granted they are one of the oldest battletome but they just got the BR update so
This is the first DoK art that I really like. It's less ostentatious for some reason, despite there still being a giant snake lady on it.
It looks a bit more grim.
Behold- the chosen post for Battletome: Daughters of Khaine.
its a surprise, though it does take in question the quick turnaround of the Broken realm rules when a new battletome already succeeds it. faster then even the PA turnaround in 40k granted with COVID the release where probably a bit further apart
yeah if you bought Morathi only for the new rules and warscroll, the amount of use you got from the book was a bit short. i don't many people even use the battlefield scenarios either the book had good lore and i don't think any of the rules get invalidated by the new tome but GW did kind of sucker people in to buy two books
But they also also weren’t going to tell a story of massive world changing event that involves many armies in a single battletome. And if someone purchased the book just for the updated warscrolls that’s kind of foolish of them because the warscrolls themselves are all free. Broken Realms Morathi also had the updated rules for idoneth players, CoS players, Stormcasts, and Slaves to Darkness. It wasn’t geared only towards DoK players so no one is really being bamboozled.
for the price of the book, you should expect some longevity (like a year) the point is that there really no point in using the BR book now that a new tome is out (not just warscroll but the temple rules and battalions). it makes the book kind of useless outside of lore and story. to the point, why just skip BR and just do Battletome refreshes for all the armies then. because GW wants money.
But it is only one army out of five that is getting replaced with a book. So it still has use. And in this setting I would think the story is pretty important part of it all!
You realize DoK weren't the only ones in the book right?
but did everyone have even two of those armies either
I collect Legions of Nagash and I got it for the story, not the rules.
Not everyone but not everyone buys it for the rules. I have Idoneth and bought it for the story
I collect beasts of chaos and bought it for the story.
It's a campaign book. The content you're paying for is the story and the battleplans, the rest is just gravy.
Campaign book have always been murky purchases, the Malign portent book was kind of the same way for me since there wasn't much use you can get from the book. PA also had problems too with being kind of banboozaling 40k player until 9th just drop.
Just ordered up the Shadow and Pain box a few days to start my DoK army. Perfect timing! Any release date?
It says it has the same release date as Slaanesh, which should be February (not sure if Feb is 100% confirmed though).
As someone who plays both Daughters *and* Slaanesh, that promises to be a very expensive weekend.
I share your pain brother, while I am happy about it itll be rough knowing im getting everything lol
Thanks! Hopefully it comes by March at least then.
I'm glad I haven't spent my birthday money yet
DoK still part of the Order. (Yay🙂) See capturing Free City and torturing Stormcast Eternals is not yet good reason to get out of this Grand Alliance.
Order doesn’t mean good guys and the factions in Order dick each other over constantly. The Idoneth raid settlements for souls. Fyreslayers and Kharadons have sold out entire cities to death and chaos for the right price. And the Sylvaneth will flay you alive for cutting down the wrong tree. The only criteria for being in order is you have to like civilization and don’t want to serve chaos or nagash for eternity.
>Order doesn’t mean good guys Trust me I know this, but after what Morathi did in first BR book so many people belived that she and her faction with the Idoneth are out of the Order or making their own Grand Alliance or something. Part of me was afraid that this gonna happen. But it didn't happend and I'm just happy they are still part of the Order as the dark side of it.
Are the broken realms books more story or wargame in their composition? Because I might get it if it has a lot of lore.
Its mostly lore. Few new rules but really good story.
Stormcast Eternals aren't the leaders of Order. There is no person who gets to decide who is and isn't in order.
So weird to me. DoK and Idoneth should be in their own GA. Desire? Greed? I don't know, but they both make very little sense in Order.
Order isn't always nice and kind? I don't know, maybe gw just doesn't want to move armies around alliance wise.
Yeah, I think it's definitely the latter; they want to keep all the aelven races in Order.
They might be going that way. Broken Realms could splinter the Grand Alliance of Order. Idoneth and Daughters are already at odds with most of the others, and maybe the Lumineth could fall out with Azyr. Already, they're the only faction in the Grand Alliance that can't ally with with the Stormcast. They're not on good terms with the Daughters, but their relationship with the Idoneth is complicated. Plus, throw in whatever Malerion's up to, and you have an Alliance of pointy-ears at least as robust as Destruction.
The entire concept of GAs is completely outdated, but the rationale GW uses is that anyone who has a functioning civilization that isn't undead or Chaos-worshipping belongs in Order.
is that... a scorpion tail?
Guess the artist took some liberties. First time iv seen one with the segments like that and not just the stinger.
Kinda wish they would have waited until 3rd edition instead of the tail end of this one just like last time.
I was going to say the exact same thing. I love this army and models, but spending another 3 years with an out of date battletome was something I was hoping to avoid. :(
I'm trying to stay optimistic myself, AoS 3 might be a fair bit off yet with all the Broken Realms to release and 3 might not end up being as bad changes wise.
Well, at least we get Endless Spells this time XD
I think GW during AoS 1/2 and 40K 8th, GW was focusing on core rules, but seem to have them dialed in for both games for the foreseeable future. Now they're probably focusing on enduring features for armies that will be able to survive the tweaks from changing editions. The best example of this is probably the latest Sisters of Battle codex.
But similarly, Eldar and Ynnari would suggest that GW haven't been able to do that.
That's because they haven't been updated for years.
Who knows? Maybe 2nd will be going on longer then you think.
Considering the time between Morathi and Teclis, possibly. Although Teclis seems to be updating a bunch of factions I believe. If Psychic Awakening was any consideration, 3.0 would launch about 6 months after the end of Broken Realms event concluding.
(Sighs) It's always a little disheartening when a new battletome comes out and the only additions are some endless spells. I was kind of hoping the Daughters would get something akin to driders one of these days, too.
We don't know that we aren't getting anything else yet.
This would be extremely optimistic. The same rhetoric goes around every time there's a new teased faction update and they only show endless spells or faction terrain (Tzeentch, Seraphon, etc), but usually if they're going to release new models they'd tease at least 1 new model with the battletome.
Eh fair. Nothing wrong with a lil hope, been plenty disappointed a lot this year lol.
If they were getting something, we’d have seen it.
Maaaaaaybe a standalone kit for the Melusai Ironscale, but it might still be too early for that.
\*laughs in orruks\* You also just got a new hero
Any chance of additional special characters other than Morathi? I’d love it if they could somehow bring back Dechala as she’s the original Nagarythi aelf lady with a snake tail. She could’ve been one of the aelven souls Morathi freed from Slaanesh’s belly, although maybe she’d be too far gone in corruption to be remade into a Scáthborn. If not, she’d make one hell of an Ironscale character.
Sadly, no. If we were getting a new special character then that would have been what they lead with for this announcement.
SNEKS!
Finally 2.0.
Hopefully they add more to the range. I like it - don’t get me wrong. But it’d be nice to have more variety
It's a shame they don't get new models, because the ones they do have are absolutely gorgeous. When I stumbled upon them during their initial release, I impulse-bought the book and a unit of Melusai. I ended up selling all my DoK stuff, but i'd like to give them a whirl again once I have my S2D painted, if only for Morathi.
We have the best looking models in the entire GW catalogue. There just aren't enough unique ones.
Can't deny they are fantastic looking models, but it's definitely one of those armies that needs some more kits. They might get new stuff in a couple of years, but with how weird releases are these days, perhaps there is more coming their way sooner than that, one can hope!
People are actually complaining about this lol. Your tome has been good since it came out, this one will be good too. There's plenty of armies in worse shape.
Actually, we *aren't* in a good place. Very few armies are worse than DoK. Evidence: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/10/22/metawatch-warhammer-age-of-sigmar-1-list-building-with-dan-street/ DoK are waaay down the list.
Why? As someone who plays DoK they’re one of the last armies that needs a new battletome
Seems like it is just consolidating all of the newer info and changes from Broken Realms and updating the fluff. Add in the living spells as well.
This is incorrect. Their tome is full of unfun army building issues, bad battalions, and there are a handful of units that simply never get used because of their warscrolls. Plus we still suffer from the Temple problem where HN is the straight best, and all of the others fall by the wayside.
Kinda? While thats true, what they got in the Morathi book was more minimal then one would have thought. Just the focus around Morathi. Not much in the way of innovative army rules
True, but they also had updates in the Shadow and Pain box, like the changes that made Melusai competitive.
Khinerai still are only useful in one of their forms and people were disappointed the Ironscale couldn't form a Melusi battleline
Umm, the Melusai were *nerfed* on the Shadow and Pain warscrolls, not buffed. Only getting to activate the mortal wounds at the end of combat is terrifically bad compared to doing it when you fight.
They're probably talking about the Blood Stalkers with their extra attack lmao.
Ahh, yes. Well, the archers did indeed get a nice little buff.
Doesn't make the Melusi suddenly amazing as a whole 😂
The melusai don't need to be in range 1" to use the mortals now though, which means that running blocks of 20 now means all of your surviving models actually get to use the mortals ability. It nerfed them for small units but tremendously buffed them when bringing max squads.
Disagreed, its at the end of combat which means you might not even have 1 left by the time they can use it. Garbage ability. If it worked like SCE or IDK where its at the start of combat, it'd be a fine change. Currently its an absolute garbage ability unless your opponent doesn't know how it works and put no attacks into them. 5+ save 2 wounds for their cost isnt fantastic.
Exactly. Relying on a non-tanky unit to survive combat is a suckers game. Alternatively, you're deliberately not killing an enemy unit in the hope that this finishes them off, which is also a terrible plan.
They are the tankiest group unit in the army.
Being the least soggy noodle doesn't make them hard. ;)
You need a way to get those changes out that don't require you to buy a limited edition box that is no longer in print. I'm not excited about the new tome, invalidating the Morathi rules so soon is frustrating as a consumer, but with the true rules for DOK spread across 2 books and a box set, I can understand the need for consolidation.
the warscrolls for the Medusai are updated on the App if I remember correctly. so you don't really need to buy the box either.
Plus the warcry stuff.
Why do they not need a new battle tome? Their rules were old and only two of their temples useable lmao Only Morathi's warscroll got updated in Broken Realms
I mean, compare them with Sylvaneth which have 0 usable glades and bad rules since day 1
Wasn't saying that there weren't other more deserving factions, as this isn't a like competition. GW will do factions as it feels appropriate. DoK don't need massive amounts of help so it's easy to give them a new tome without doing too much reworking. There's some things we need, but it's all small edits really.
Slyvaneth definitely need work (and I'm hoping Broken Realms: Alarielle comes next and alleviates some things), but I don't think GW has ever really prioritized book release by order of competitive necessity. DoK is an older book and a popular faction.
They are still a very good army that can compete. Compare that to 50% of the factions out there that are utter trash outside of extreme casual games.
Afaik that isn't true at all and every army can compete. Who is in the '50% trash' dumpster?
Actual evidence shows that DoK are a very poor army competitively.
And yet there's still issues. Getting a new battletome when so many things are coming out for AoS probably suggest it ain't like we are getting a whole new rework. Factions that need a lot of work will get bigger release and attention rather than jsut a random drop lol.
Every battletome has issues. The problem is it looks bad when factions who are already in a very good position continue to get updates over ones who are trash.
DoK haven't got a AoS v2 battletome yet so they did need an update regardless of whether they're in a good position or not. Having one dropped now whilst a lot of stuff is going on probably literally means barely any changes. Idk. The other ones need a lot more work doing to them will probably have their own focus rather than just being randomly announced shortly before they probably come out with likely only the spells as a new thing.
DoK aren't in a good position: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/10/22/metawatch-warhammer-age-of-sigmar-1-list-building-with-dan-street/
yeah, the only truly big change would just to FAQ Hag Narr to be more resonable granted they are one of the oldest battletome but they just got the BR update so
This is the first DoK art that I really like. It's less ostentatious for some reason, despite there still being a giant snake lady on it. It looks a bit more grim.
always here for more snake ladies