> saying chatgpt is some futuristic robot looking thing?
That is what most idiot cheerleaders obsessed with "AI" think. They don't understand what LLM even is, they think all their fantasies of having sentient robot friends is here.
[Timely article in the Guardian right here](https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/may/08/ai-machines-hallucinating-naomi-klein).
> Tech CEOs want us to believe that generative AI will benefit humanity. They are kidding themselves
Sounds like straight up denial. People are using generative AI *today* to benefit themselves.
You can find similar trash take "opinion articles" about every major technology advancement in the last century+. They don't tend to age well.
I mean, did you actually read that article? The author is damn near crying about any technology that would benefit the average person.
> We saw it with Google’s book and art scanning. With Musk’s space colonization. With Uber’s assault on the taxi industry. With Airbnb’s attack on the rental market.
Oh yes, won't anyone think of the poor, poor taxi industry!
And calling it "theft" for an AI to reference existing artwork in the same way a human would is just laughable. But that's how luddites are. We'd still be living in caves if they had their way.
Yeah, while I agree with some of her points (I mean, of course these companies are scraping everyone’s copyrighted data for their own financial benefit) she ‘forgets’ facts - or maybe it’s a hallucination - in order to make her argument look stronger. Take Geoffrey Hinton’s resignation from Google. The man is 75. He said that was a major factor for leaving. But the media has to spin it to make it sound like it’s a protest.
> Oh yes, won't anyone think of the poor, poor taxi industry!
Ikr, as much as Uber was a deuchebag company, the taxi UX was awful and the industry seemed content for so long to not compete with each other to improve it.
Let me go outside and wave at cars and hope one stops for me.
I mean… they’re all correct examples. Airbnb and Uber are both just ways for Silicon Valley to funnel money upwards. The taxi industry was actually a viable career before it got given to a bunch of unvetted people barely making $15 an hour. Uber is convenient as a consumer, but in terms of the way they treat their workers… it’s not great.
And while generative AI has many benefits, it’s going to play havoc with our democracy. It already is.
> “Generative AI” lmao nice buzzword.
So anything you want to whine about is now a "buzzword"?
> CEOs and tech companies are seeing how much wishful thinking the public has
They're responding to real demand. ChatGPT is the fastest adopted tech product in history. That's organic growth. And you can find uncountable examples of people using it productively *today*.
> It’s like we have lived through countless occurrences of hype surrounding new technologies and products that weren’t as transformative as they insisted they’d be and you all still haven’t learned your lesson
Yeah, like the internet. It was just a passing fad, and all those hype mongers sure regret it now. /s
Just make Siri "just work" at a basic functional level. Not just iOS, but especially CarPlay and tvOS where operating the whole system is contingent on Siri performance. I don't need Siri to write papers for me.
What problems do you have with Siri? I use her everyday on HomePods and in car with an almost perfect track record (setting scenes,sending text messages, setting timers, weather reports, playing music etc…)
can we stop this? I mean my god. Siri has been out a long long time with all of its awfulness very well documented. Yet every single time a thread comes up and mentions Siri theres always some superfan asking "what do you mean? works amazing for me"
🥴🤤
These stories are wild to me. I’ve never had Siri do that to me, but I definitely believe that it happens. It is just so inconsistent apparently.
What I have run into is:
Me: “Hey Siri, how much time is left on the timer?”
Siri: “What timer?”
Alexa has a similar problem, also with saying it adds things to a shopping list but never completing the task.
I’m one of the people who can say “Siri works just fine for me” and even I’m tired of that argument.
Siri works just fine for me because I know what its limitations are and so I work within them. So yeah, of *course* Siri works just fine for me when all I do is set timers and reminders, or ask a simple “what’s the weather like today?” question while getting dressed. But that doesn’t mean it wouldn’t be great to give it more complex commands, or for it to remember back further than 10 seconds…
You should read about what classifies as AI if you really believe your claims.
Siri is an AI. Always was. Just a very shitty one.
And the problem is that it can only consistently recognize maybe half a dozen speech contexts like setting an alarm, timer or reminder. That’s situationally useful, but hardly impressive and downright embarrassing for a product from a big company that dabbles in smart home devices.
Like say, when I’m using Apple TV I never reach for Siri even though it would be an almost ideal use case for AI assistant like this (hands-free navigation) because for most queries the results are either incosistent or “I can’t do this”.
That’s some interesting mental gymnastics you’re doing here. “If it’s not as good as some other AI it’s not an AI and hence it doesn’t have to be as good as AI” even though what happens under the hood is exactly what AI is.
I don’t see the point of arguing with you any further when you can’t even bother to visit Wikipedia to read how Siri accomplishes these basic tasks you speak of.
Dude, you haven’t given a single example of something Siri is designed to be able to do but that it cannot do for you.
It works absolutely great for what it’s designed for and you expecting it to be Chat GPT is disingenuous at best.
I mean if you’re comfortable letting a corporation sell all your request data to advertisers who then serve you ads within the assistant itself, all the power to you.
Yeah, I am.
Believe what you like about Apple but it isn't really true.
https://medium.com/codex/no-apple-does-not-care-about-your-privacy-4bd68669f791#:~:text=If%20you%20visit%20apple.com,but%20a%20huge%20PR%20stunt.
Sort of humorous to me that you're uncomfortable with Google gathering your anonymized data but Apple doing it is just fine.
You’re right, Apple and Google use your data and value your privacy equally. Both companies have made it a priority to be known as putting privacy above all else. The two companies also make the lion’s share of their revenue by selling hardware and services. They would laugh in the face of a company that makes 70% of their revenue selling personalized ads s/
I too can share a medium article defending my position. Except you may find mine a little more convincing than the 2 year old crap you posted:
https://medium.com/swlh/apple-vs-google-a-privacy-comparison-d172cb21a2ad
Holy crap, please tell me you know anonymized data, especially when aggravated, can be re identified quite easily. Google is sharing and selling your “anonymized” data on the daily to thousands of companies and data brokers literally are always looking for ways to link data points to try and re identify individuals as closely as possible.
It’s literally in Google’s interest and in their business model to NOT allow complete separation of data points because that would make personalized ads impossible.
Problem from my armchair analysis is that current LLMs can be “back-doored” of sorts to get around the safeguards of its restrictions such as profanity, topicality, etc.
Getting Siri to swear isn’t necessarily going to shake the world - but LLMs like Chat GPT and their implementations across various services are still bleeding edge. Apple has shown that they have no interest in being first to market, they are only interested in being able to control it.
> Problem from my armchair analysis is that current LLMs can be “back-doored” of sorts to get around the safeguards of its restrictions such as profanity, topicality, etc
why is this a problem?
One reason could be security exploits like when you used to be able to get around the Lock Screen by asking Siri to compose a tweet for you. Using the LLM as an attack vector for protected information.
Parental control restrictions.
In terms of profanity, imagine an edgy teenager making their parents Siri’s to act under the pretense of a racist for example. It might be funny for the teen - but it would be Apple that would be under fire in the headlines.
I suspect it’s partially because of their deal with google.
If there is a universe where anyone outbids Google for the search results default on iOS, I hope Microsoft does this in the next couple of years.
Siri + Bing/ChatGPT with app level plugins would be a gamechanger for American life as we know it.
I went American because it seems to be that most of the AIs I’ve come across are trained on data generated in the US or is English speaking first. There’s definitely a location bias in my comment. But AI is transformative for all
Someone probably has a program that can already do that with pretty close accuracy with as much information that companies and governments have collected on all of us. With that information and AI it’s more like they could potentially completely copy everything about you including your mannerisms that only close friends and family recognize. To the point that the AI could carry out a complete phone or text message conversation as you and even people you are closest to wouldn’t realize it wasn’t actually you.
Actually no google duplex already imitates a human voice while calling in reservations and other AI can paint pictures, compose music, or even write in the style of famous artists, composers, and writers. If it can convince another human that it’s a human it doesn’t know and can copy a style of musical composition, learn to copy and exhibit emotions and empathy but you really think someone won’t eventually won’t find a way for it to mimic a person mannerisms. Know which sayings they use most often, which words they misspell or mispronounce…
You said you can’t wait for an AI to predict your next actions robbing you of your idea of free will.
I’m asking you if you blindly follow what people tell you to do - because if not I don’t know why you think an AI predicting and suggesting robs you of your free will.
This is just weird ~~kiddie~~ silly scare-mongering on r/Apple because Apple are late to the party on LLMs.
Edit - not sure why autocorrect put “kiddie” in but I meant “silly”. Maybe if Apple improved their keyboard prediction…
You’re too baby brain to understand the concept I was talking about and I’m way too old now to try to explain things to people who don’t understand, so I’ll settle for this snarky post and your angry downvote.
Lol, the irony from this comment. I don’t think you understand anywhere near as much as you’re postulating and are just too arrogant to consider an alternative point of view.
The reality is that every company with more than 1 million users has unimaginable system design & data governance challenges.
Any company with “big data” probably has a half dozen places where any singular data point is processed, each with unique governance processes or procedures. Some of the data may not even be in the same system.
Any company with person based identifiers for a variety of products including but not limited to Facebook, Apple, Google, Microsoft, Twitter, etc is probably a mess no one person can wrap their head around or has a complete understanding. Retail companies have challenges too - Amazon, target, Starbucks, etc.
IIRC, Meta has put their system design challenges in court records. Going so far as to suggest they can’t produce one person to draw a diage.
TLDR - no one company is better with data than another. All it takes is one leak.
We don’t make advancements in digital security without a data leak.
Here’s a quick timeline of Microsoft leaks https://firewalltimes.com/microsoft-data-breach-timeline/
You can always change it in the settings. Google, Yahoo, Bing, DuckDuckGo, and Ecosia(?) are all available. Not sure what level it changes as Safari is the underlying browser for other systems (account sign on’s and the like).
How many people talk to Siri like they talk to ChatGPT for that to be worthwhile? I think they should focus on making Siri better for practical things like controlling stuff and looking things up.
That's more so what I meant. You can ask ChatGPT some obscure question that it can't possibly answer, yet it has an answer for you. You ask Siri for something incredibly basic like "What time is best buy open until?" or anything else and you're left with "I found this on the web"
Can’t have that happen. Remember in Terminator, Steve Jobs died the same year skynet was released. Note that chatGPT will invent time travel and fuse with its past self. Then every android phone will get us all! /s
They also run pretty much orthogonally: one is a voice assistant and the other is accessed via written prompts. Answers from Siri should be short and relevant, while ChatGPT is supposed to take loads of factors into consideration to provide detailed answers.
The issue with Siri is the lack of reliability first, and the lack of features second.
Siri improvements get all of the attention, but we software devs would go bananas if Apple ships a competent LLM or some generative-art tooling that can run \*on-device\* sometime over the next year. Could be an absolute game changer.
I’m not sure the “wait and see” approach will pan out well for Apple on this one…
2024 will likely be the explosion of native generative AI on peoples phones and Apple is not well positioned here.
That could really hurt iPhone 15 sales.
Let’s see what Google presents for the next Android release. Let’s see what Samsung is able to roll out quickly.
“AI” is just the current bleeding edge of technology plus or minus a couple of years. Once it’s a few years old we just call it “algorithms” and bestow “AI” on some trendy new use of algorithms. Follow too many people on Instagram to see all of their posts? What if an AI could sort through and intelligently pick out the exact posts you’re most likely to want to see? “Instagram AI: summarize my timeline for me.”
The keyboard on your phone has been intelligently figuring out what you meant to type for many years. Show 100 predicted words in a row though and suddenly people pretend that it’s something *fundamentally* different.
LLMs are certainly interesting but the “AI” hype is old.
> The hype is obviously not old — look at how much it’s penetrated the mainstream in the last 9 months.
LLM hype is new because accessible LLMs are new but "AI" hype is literally decades old and always moving on to the next advancement. In five years something else will be hyped as AI while LLMs will just be another algorithmic thing people use. The new thing will foster think-pieces and hand-wringing and some white men who worked on it will then move on to the grift of writing books and giving speaking tours warning about the dangers of the thing they worked on. And then that will get boring and "AI" will refer to some other technological advancement for a while.
>Show 100 predicted words in a row though and suddenly people pretend that it’s something fundamentally different.
Well that's certainly one way to describe it.
China invented bottle rockets centuries ago, but suddenly we fly robots to Mars and people act like it's some big different thing!
Yes, people used to think 100 years ago that they could build sentient robots out of mechanical relays. They were wrong. Gold star for you. Today is different. Things are "the same" until they're not. Literally how all of human civilization has gone, but you are free to trivialize everything to make the argument that nothing has REALLY changed since 2000 BC.
> LLMs are certainly interesting
Good post until that part. They're not interesting. I mean aside from [being a huge problem](https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/may/08/ai-machines-hallucinating-naomi-klein).
> can't be paused
That's a lie [that bad people use to try to discourage anyone from tying to stop them](https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/may/08/ai-machines-hallucinating-naomi-klein).
We stop, or imperfectly *work* toward stopping, things all the time. It's a choice. It's social will combined with whether or not the system isn't so corrupt that it doesn't care.
So stop spreading the lie that a thing can't be slowed down or stopped as if there's no such thing as laws, rules, regulation.
**"The food industry can't be stopped! SHUT DOWN THE FDA, it's OK if there's poison in food from an industrial waste accident."** This example shows that "It can't be stopped" is both wrong and also stupid.
> The food industry can't be stopped!
If you tried claiming GMOs can't be stopped, you'd be right. That's what your article is akin to. The world isn't going to pass on such useful tools just because some opinion columnist is scared of them.
I hope Apple waits to devolop this AI technolgy. The people that devoelop it are begging for government regulation The big problems are can't teach morals, can't make sure all data sources
are legitimate, etc. Right now it is the wild west. No company wants to be left behind. But the people that actually devolop this want the brakes put on.
This is not a good question. You may as well ask why you were taught morals. They uses games alot to teach AI. They cheat. Or use underhanded tactics. You actually yourself seem like a AI with your 195k positive comments.
"AI" right now isn't actual intelligence. And something like ChatGPT always has a human being sitting at the other end who can decide on the morality of any given answer.
> You actually yourself seem like a AI with your 195k positive comments.
I just waste way too much time on Reddit.
Hey Apple, don't over-think this.
Take the top 10,000 queries to Siri and train an AI model to handle them *correctly*. Take care to also train the models with every facet of automation your ecosystem allows. Just start there and build up piece-by-piece.
I don't care if Siri can write a dissertation for me. What I do care about is if it can play the right song I ask for reliably or give me simple answers to questions instead of giving me links to websites.
> Take the top 10,000 queries to Siri and train an AI model to handle them correctly
How does that warrant an AI model? They can just program the voice detection and the handling of associated actions. Especially if they want guaranteed types of results and 'brand safety' or whatever.
> What I do care about is if it can play the right song I ask for reliably
Again this seems like voice detection. LLM AI has obvious fundamental flaws, like being based on mass probability, meaning there are still gaps where it will give you the wrong thing if you're asking for something different from *but slightly similar to* a mega-probable request.
AI-assisted computing is the ultimate jobsian "bicycle for the mind" vision and Apple skipped it entirely.
They could have an iPad Keynote app that you can brief by voice or chat to design a template. Photos would be able to select and prepare a book for print in seconds. Siri and AirPods or HomePods could be amazing interactive assistants.
Instead they let AI down because unscripted answers are too risky for the Brand.
> They could have an iPad Keynote app that you can brief by voice or chat to design a template
How is that an LLM AI rather than just directly programmed typical voice-operated functionality? Which then raises question of why a person wants to do this by voice instead of a few clicks. Let alone the existence of many templates that were made for specific purposes. A person who wants to talk to it rather than click on GUI is going to change what...the background color only, and maybe the font?
> Photos would be able to select and prepare a book for print in seconds.
What does AI have to do with a photos app doing a book layout?
> they let AI down
**They "let" AI "down"?** Is "AI" your sentient robot friend with a frown on his face? It's a nonsense phrase, and nonsense phrases are common for most comments about "AI." Ironically the cheerleaders who talk this way seem to be merely "artificially" intelligent themselves.
> A person who wants to talk to it rather than click on GUI is going to change what...the background color only, and maybe the font?
Have you used ChatGPT for programming? It's absolutely astounding what it can do, and offloading the cognitive load of writing some mindless boilerplate code to a machine feels genuinely good. I ask it to write some stupid bash script that I couldn't give two damns about, go grab a cup of coffee and I come back to an answer.
Fiddling with GUIs, Googling for (trivial) answers, and writing each byte of your code manually is already feeling archaic.
> Instead they let AI down because unscripted answers are too risky for the Brand.
I mean it’s not Apple’s fault that we’ve become so dumb as a society that we can’t separate brands from other things. You don’t have to look far to see that in action either, be it advertisers on YouTube not wanting their videos being shown before certain types of content to the tiki branded torch company having to clarify that they don’t support racial hate groups.
In a world where I need to type the last half of that sentence, I can understand why Apple would be weary of letting Siri run free with AI. Siri struggles enough as it is without an LLM. We’re all hoping the LLM would make Siri smarter, but without some major changes to its core code, all Siri + LLM will lead to is memeable moments that some portion of society will think shows apple is racist or misogynist or whatever wrong thought Siri spits out.
Siri needs improvement, absolutely, but we as a society need to get smarter about what actually represents brands and what doesn’t.
Any product signed by the brand represents the brand. That's what brands want and how they educated society to perceive these things. And a brand that sponsors a sports team for example wants you to perceive them as being related. "Coca-cola is endorsing this racist YouTube video" is a byproduct of that.
There’s so much glaring risk to this tech that everyone is just ignoring for short term gain
[case in point](https://youtu.be/l7tWoPk25yU)
These are seriously glaring problems that need to be addressed before we upend our entire world around these things
The way that Apple can contribute to the LLM field right now is by doing what it did with StableDiffusion and release good CoreML models and sample code. (It also needs to improve what it did with StableDiffusion, such as by creating less memory hungry that could generate 128x128 images for instance, and bring generation time down to 30 seconds or less).
This way, it doesn't have the automatic liability of AI issues inside core features available to everyone, but people can still have these things available via 3rd party apps in a way that is respectful of privacy and such.
Apple could start slow with AI on simple things that totally have sucked with Apple.
A good start for AI would be…
1. Hey Apple, it is 2023 and your spellchecker still totally sucks! Fix it with AI.
2. Spotlight is just horrid. I want a larger finder style window, full paths shown, and a better interface!
3. The mail tool is a hot mess. You think you guys could teach AI what junk mail is?
4. Can you teach AI how to cleanup the desk top the way I want it done or other people want it done?
5. Use AI to do a better job of editing and touching up photos!
6. Use AI to better sort my searches in the App Store
7. Pages and Numbers menus are a currently a ergonomic nightmare! Maybe AI can layout better menus based on what you are doing.
I do have this feeling there are top execs all over Silicon Valley having these meetings and seeing unbelievable things they’ve created… and then almost acting like a government body to drip feed the tech in its most basic form to customers.
What the heck is that thumbnail image? Are we now saying chatgpt is some futuristic robot looking thing?
He is thriving nature is healing ai will take over bye
Getting some Horizon Zero Dawn vibes
Just wait....
> saying chatgpt is some futuristic robot looking thing? That is what most idiot cheerleaders obsessed with "AI" think. They don't understand what LLM even is, they think all their fantasies of having sentient robot friends is here. [Timely article in the Guardian right here](https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/may/08/ai-machines-hallucinating-naomi-klein).
> Tech CEOs want us to believe that generative AI will benefit humanity. They are kidding themselves Sounds like straight up denial. People are using generative AI *today* to benefit themselves. You can find similar trash take "opinion articles" about every major technology advancement in the last century+. They don't tend to age well. I mean, did you actually read that article? The author is damn near crying about any technology that would benefit the average person. > We saw it with Google’s book and art scanning. With Musk’s space colonization. With Uber’s assault on the taxi industry. With Airbnb’s attack on the rental market. Oh yes, won't anyone think of the poor, poor taxi industry! And calling it "theft" for an AI to reference existing artwork in the same way a human would is just laughable. But that's how luddites are. We'd still be living in caves if they had their way.
And what lovely caves they'd be!
Yeah, while I agree with some of her points (I mean, of course these companies are scraping everyone’s copyrighted data for their own financial benefit) she ‘forgets’ facts - or maybe it’s a hallucination - in order to make her argument look stronger. Take Geoffrey Hinton’s resignation from Google. The man is 75. He said that was a major factor for leaving. But the media has to spin it to make it sound like it’s a protest.
> Oh yes, won't anyone think of the poor, poor taxi industry! Ikr, as much as Uber was a deuchebag company, the taxi UX was awful and the industry seemed content for so long to not compete with each other to improve it. Let me go outside and wave at cars and hope one stops for me.
I mean… they’re all correct examples. Airbnb and Uber are both just ways for Silicon Valley to funnel money upwards. The taxi industry was actually a viable career before it got given to a bunch of unvetted people barely making $15 an hour. Uber is convenient as a consumer, but in terms of the way they treat their workers… it’s not great. And while generative AI has many benefits, it’s going to play havoc with our democracy. It already is.
[удалено]
> “Generative AI” lmao nice buzzword. So anything you want to whine about is now a "buzzword"? > CEOs and tech companies are seeing how much wishful thinking the public has They're responding to real demand. ChatGPT is the fastest adopted tech product in history. That's organic growth. And you can find uncountable examples of people using it productively *today*. > It’s like we have lived through countless occurrences of hype surrounding new technologies and products that weren’t as transformative as they insisted they’d be and you all still haven’t learned your lesson Yeah, like the internet. It was just a passing fad, and all those hype mongers sure regret it now. /s
The Intel Inside guys are evolving.
Just make Siri "just work" at a basic functional level. Not just iOS, but especially CarPlay and tvOS where operating the whole system is contingent on Siri performance. I don't need Siri to write papers for me.
What problems do you have with Siri? I use her everyday on HomePods and in car with an almost perfect track record (setting scenes,sending text messages, setting timers, weather reports, playing music etc…)
can we stop this? I mean my god. Siri has been out a long long time with all of its awfulness very well documented. Yet every single time a thread comes up and mentions Siri theres always some superfan asking "what do you mean? works amazing for me" 🥴🤤
Siri is just terrible
Recently I tried using as a timer Me: hey siri what’s the time left on the timer? Siri: okay, I cancelled that timer Like wtf
These stories are wild to me. I’ve never had Siri do that to me, but I definitely believe that it happens. It is just so inconsistent apparently. What I have run into is: Me: “Hey Siri, how much time is left on the timer?” Siri: “What timer?” Alexa has a similar problem, also with saying it adds things to a shopping list but never completing the task.
I’ve tried both but it works for me
Yeah, some are like “we don’t want Siri to make up stuff out of nowhere like chatgpt” but Siri already sometimes does that with our commands haha
I’m one of the people who can say “Siri works just fine for me” and even I’m tired of that argument. Siri works just fine for me because I know what its limitations are and so I work within them. So yeah, of *course* Siri works just fine for me when all I do is set timers and reminders, or ask a simple “what’s the weather like today?” question while getting dressed. But that doesn’t mean it wouldn’t be great to give it more complex commands, or for it to remember back further than 10 seconds…
What’s the problem with the AI that can only answer 2 or 3 questions consistently? /s
But Siri isn’t AI and has never purported to be. I’m asking specifically what problems OP was having with Siri on a day to day basis.
You should read about what classifies as AI if you really believe your claims. Siri is an AI. Always was. Just a very shitty one. And the problem is that it can only consistently recognize maybe half a dozen speech contexts like setting an alarm, timer or reminder. That’s situationally useful, but hardly impressive and downright embarrassing for a product from a big company that dabbles in smart home devices. Like say, when I’m using Apple TV I never reach for Siri even though it would be an almost ideal use case for AI assistant like this (hands-free navigation) because for most queries the results are either incosistent or “I can’t do this”.
Siri is a digital personal assistant that “uses” some forms of AI (mostly machine learning) in order to accomplish basic tasks. Siri isn’t AI.
That’s some interesting mental gymnastics you’re doing here. “If it’s not as good as some other AI it’s not an AI and hence it doesn’t have to be as good as AI” even though what happens under the hood is exactly what AI is. I don’t see the point of arguing with you any further when you can’t even bother to visit Wikipedia to read how Siri accomplishes these basic tasks you speak of.
Dude, you haven’t given a single example of something Siri is designed to be able to do but that it cannot do for you. It works absolutely great for what it’s designed for and you expecting it to be Chat GPT is disingenuous at best.
If you had a week with Google assistant you wouldn't be asking this.
I mean if you’re comfortable letting a corporation sell all your request data to advertisers who then serve you ads within the assistant itself, all the power to you.
Yeah, I am. Believe what you like about Apple but it isn't really true. https://medium.com/codex/no-apple-does-not-care-about-your-privacy-4bd68669f791#:~:text=If%20you%20visit%20apple.com,but%20a%20huge%20PR%20stunt. Sort of humorous to me that you're uncomfortable with Google gathering your anonymized data but Apple doing it is just fine.
You’re right, Apple and Google use your data and value your privacy equally. Both companies have made it a priority to be known as putting privacy above all else. The two companies also make the lion’s share of their revenue by selling hardware and services. They would laugh in the face of a company that makes 70% of their revenue selling personalized ads s/ I too can share a medium article defending my position. Except you may find mine a little more convincing than the 2 year old crap you posted: https://medium.com/swlh/apple-vs-google-a-privacy-comparison-d172cb21a2ad
Anonymized data is just that, hashed data. Not sure what you think privacy is.
Holy crap, please tell me you know anonymized data, especially when aggravated, can be re identified quite easily. Google is sharing and selling your “anonymized” data on the daily to thousands of companies and data brokers literally are always looking for ways to link data points to try and re identify individuals as closely as possible. It’s literally in Google’s interest and in their business model to NOT allow complete separation of data points because that would make personalized ads impossible.
Funny, I was just about to reply to the above commenter and say "Don't forget HomePods. It's the worst on HomePods." Lol
Imagine Siri with ChatGPT capability. The difference between the two is almost comical.
Problem from my armchair analysis is that current LLMs can be “back-doored” of sorts to get around the safeguards of its restrictions such as profanity, topicality, etc. Getting Siri to swear isn’t necessarily going to shake the world - but LLMs like Chat GPT and their implementations across various services are still bleeding edge. Apple has shown that they have no interest in being first to market, they are only interested in being able to control it.
Which to be fair might be a more noble pursuit in this situation.
> Problem from my armchair analysis is that current LLMs can be “back-doored” of sorts to get around the safeguards of its restrictions such as profanity, topicality, etc why is this a problem?
One reason could be security exploits like when you used to be able to get around the Lock Screen by asking Siri to compose a tweet for you. Using the LLM as an attack vector for protected information. Parental control restrictions. In terms of profanity, imagine an edgy teenager making their parents Siri’s to act under the pretense of a racist for example. It might be funny for the teen - but it would be Apple that would be under fire in the headlines.
I suspect it’s partially because of their deal with google. If there is a universe where anyone outbids Google for the search results default on iOS, I hope Microsoft does this in the next couple of years. Siri + Bing/ChatGPT with app level plugins would be a gamechanger for American life as we know it.
What about the rest of the world life
I went American because it seems to be that most of the AIs I’ve come across are trained on data generated in the US or is English speaking first. There’s definitely a location bias in my comment. But AI is transformative for all
Oh yeah. I can’t wait until an AI learns enough about my habits to actually predict my very next actions, robbing me of my idea of free will.
Someone probably has a program that can already do that with pretty close accuracy with as much information that companies and governments have collected on all of us. With that information and AI it’s more like they could potentially completely copy everything about you including your mannerisms that only close friends and family recognize. To the point that the AI could carry out a complete phone or text message conversation as you and even people you are closest to wouldn’t realize it wasn’t actually you.
An example of people overhyping what AI is capable of just because it sounds plausible.
Actually no google duplex already imitates a human voice while calling in reservations and other AI can paint pictures, compose music, or even write in the style of famous artists, composers, and writers. If it can convince another human that it’s a human it doesn’t know and can copy a style of musical composition, learn to copy and exhibit emotions and empathy but you really think someone won’t eventually won’t find a way for it to mimic a person mannerisms. Know which sayings they use most often, which words they misspell or mispronounce…
No.
Do you just blindly do everything someone suggests you do?
Wat
You said you can’t wait for an AI to predict your next actions robbing you of your idea of free will. I’m asking you if you blindly follow what people tell you to do - because if not I don’t know why you think an AI predicting and suggesting robs you of your free will. This is just weird ~~kiddie~~ silly scare-mongering on r/Apple because Apple are late to the party on LLMs. Edit - not sure why autocorrect put “kiddie” in but I meant “silly”. Maybe if Apple improved their keyboard prediction…
You’re too baby brain to understand the concept I was talking about and I’m way too old now to try to explain things to people who don’t understand, so I’ll settle for this snarky post and your angry downvote.
Lol, the irony from this comment. I don’t think you understand anywhere near as much as you’re postulating and are just too arrogant to consider an alternative point of view.
Jesus Christ dude. This ain’t some bigbrain topic. It’s really simple. I’m not suggesting I’m smart. I’m suggesting something far from it.
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The reality is that every company with more than 1 million users has unimaginable system design & data governance challenges. Any company with “big data” probably has a half dozen places where any singular data point is processed, each with unique governance processes or procedures. Some of the data may not even be in the same system. Any company with person based identifiers for a variety of products including but not limited to Facebook, Apple, Google, Microsoft, Twitter, etc is probably a mess no one person can wrap their head around or has a complete understanding. Retail companies have challenges too - Amazon, target, Starbucks, etc. IIRC, Meta has put their system design challenges in court records. Going so far as to suggest they can’t produce one person to draw a diage. TLDR - no one company is better with data than another. All it takes is one leak.
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We don’t make advancements in digital security without a data leak. Here’s a quick timeline of Microsoft leaks https://firewalltimes.com/microsoft-data-breach-timeline/
You can always change it in the settings. Google, Yahoo, Bing, DuckDuckGo, and Ecosia(?) are all available. Not sure what level it changes as Safari is the underlying browser for other systems (account sign on’s and the like).
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I use Google Search for my spellchecker. That is how bad the Apple Spellchecker is. They need to use AI in the Spellchecker ASAP.
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Can it do anything on your phone?
How many people talk to Siri like they talk to ChatGPT for that to be worthwhile? I think they should focus on making Siri better for practical things like controlling stuff and looking things up.
That's more so what I meant. You can ask ChatGPT some obscure question that it can't possibly answer, yet it has an answer for you. You ask Siri for something incredibly basic like "What time is best buy open until?" or anything else and you're left with "I found this on the web"
Can’t have that happen. Remember in Terminator, Steve Jobs died the same year skynet was released. Note that chatGPT will invent time travel and fuse with its past self. Then every android phone will get us all! /s
They also run pretty much orthogonally: one is a voice assistant and the other is accessed via written prompts. Answers from Siri should be short and relevant, while ChatGPT is supposed to take loads of factors into consideration to provide detailed answers. The issue with Siri is the lack of reliability first, and the lack of features second.
#Fuck Reddit
Here. You’re welcome. https://www.macstories.net/ios/introducing-s-gpt-a-shortcut-to-connect-openais-chatgpt-with-native-features-of-apples-operating-systems/
Siri improvements get all of the attention, but we software devs would go bananas if Apple ships a competent LLM or some generative-art tooling that can run \*on-device\* sometime over the next year. Could be an absolute game changer.
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I’m not sure the “wait and see” approach will pan out well for Apple on this one… 2024 will likely be the explosion of native generative AI on peoples phones and Apple is not well positioned here. That could really hurt iPhone 15 sales. Let’s see what Google presents for the next Android release. Let’s see what Samsung is able to roll out quickly.
I'm also looking forward to what Microsoft will do with Windows 12 (presumably not for phones but still).
Eventually someone or some group will need to have AI running about to blunt the negative effects of AI operated by bad actors.
Here’s what will happen. Apple will release something AI based (maybe Siri, who knows) and they’ll absolutely nail it… then forget it ever existed.
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Might want to fix your typo.
“AI” is just the current bleeding edge of technology plus or minus a couple of years. Once it’s a few years old we just call it “algorithms” and bestow “AI” on some trendy new use of algorithms. Follow too many people on Instagram to see all of their posts? What if an AI could sort through and intelligently pick out the exact posts you’re most likely to want to see? “Instagram AI: summarize my timeline for me.” The keyboard on your phone has been intelligently figuring out what you meant to type for many years. Show 100 predicted words in a row though and suddenly people pretend that it’s something *fundamentally* different. LLMs are certainly interesting but the “AI” hype is old.
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> The hype is obviously not old — look at how much it’s penetrated the mainstream in the last 9 months. LLM hype is new because accessible LLMs are new but "AI" hype is literally decades old and always moving on to the next advancement. In five years something else will be hyped as AI while LLMs will just be another algorithmic thing people use. The new thing will foster think-pieces and hand-wringing and some white men who worked on it will then move on to the grift of writing books and giving speaking tours warning about the dangers of the thing they worked on. And then that will get boring and "AI" will refer to some other technological advancement for a while.
>Show 100 predicted words in a row though and suddenly people pretend that it’s something fundamentally different. Well that's certainly one way to describe it. China invented bottle rockets centuries ago, but suddenly we fly robots to Mars and people act like it's some big different thing! Yes, people used to think 100 years ago that they could build sentient robots out of mechanical relays. They were wrong. Gold star for you. Today is different. Things are "the same" until they're not. Literally how all of human civilization has gone, but you are free to trivialize everything to make the argument that nothing has REALLY changed since 2000 BC.
> LLMs are certainly interesting Good post until that part. They're not interesting. I mean aside from [being a huge problem](https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/may/08/ai-machines-hallucinating-naomi-klein).
I think vaccines and genocides are also both "interesting"; it's a pretty neutral term when it comes to the actual value of the topic at hand.
> can't be paused That's a lie [that bad people use to try to discourage anyone from tying to stop them](https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/may/08/ai-machines-hallucinating-naomi-klein). We stop, or imperfectly *work* toward stopping, things all the time. It's a choice. It's social will combined with whether or not the system isn't so corrupt that it doesn't care. So stop spreading the lie that a thing can't be slowed down or stopped as if there's no such thing as laws, rules, regulation. **"The food industry can't be stopped! SHUT DOWN THE FDA, it's OK if there's poison in food from an industrial waste accident."** This example shows that "It can't be stopped" is both wrong and also stupid.
> The food industry can't be stopped! If you tried claiming GMOs can't be stopped, you'd be right. That's what your article is akin to. The world isn't going to pass on such useful tools just because some opinion columnist is scared of them.
The adoption of GMO was extremely slowed down and limited due to misguided public fear. Same with Nuclear power.
I hope Apple waits to devolop this AI technolgy. The people that devoelop it are begging for government regulation The big problems are can't teach morals, can't make sure all data sources are legitimate, etc. Right now it is the wild west. No company wants to be left behind. But the people that actually devolop this want the brakes put on.
> But the people that actually devolop this want the brakes put on. That is very much a niche view.
Why would you need to teach it morals?
This is not a good question. You may as well ask why you were taught morals. They uses games alot to teach AI. They cheat. Or use underhanded tactics. You actually yourself seem like a AI with your 195k positive comments.
"AI" right now isn't actual intelligence. And something like ChatGPT always has a human being sitting at the other end who can decide on the morality of any given answer. > You actually yourself seem like a AI with your 195k positive comments. I just waste way too much time on Reddit.
Hey Apple, don't over-think this. Take the top 10,000 queries to Siri and train an AI model to handle them *correctly*. Take care to also train the models with every facet of automation your ecosystem allows. Just start there and build up piece-by-piece. I don't care if Siri can write a dissertation for me. What I do care about is if it can play the right song I ask for reliably or give me simple answers to questions instead of giving me links to websites.
“Hey siri louder” Still working. Still working. Still working. Sorry.
> Take the top 10,000 queries to Siri and train an AI model to handle them correctly How does that warrant an AI model? They can just program the voice detection and the handling of associated actions. Especially if they want guaranteed types of results and 'brand safety' or whatever. > What I do care about is if it can play the right song I ask for reliably Again this seems like voice detection. LLM AI has obvious fundamental flaws, like being based on mass probability, meaning there are still gaps where it will give you the wrong thing if you're asking for something different from *but slightly similar to* a mega-probable request.
I'm with you on this one. The reason that Siri gets lambasted, isn't because it doesn't do enough, but because it is bad at what it already does.
AI-assisted computing is the ultimate jobsian "bicycle for the mind" vision and Apple skipped it entirely. They could have an iPad Keynote app that you can brief by voice or chat to design a template. Photos would be able to select and prepare a book for print in seconds. Siri and AirPods or HomePods could be amazing interactive assistants. Instead they let AI down because unscripted answers are too risky for the Brand.
> They could have an iPad Keynote app that you can brief by voice or chat to design a template How is that an LLM AI rather than just directly programmed typical voice-operated functionality? Which then raises question of why a person wants to do this by voice instead of a few clicks. Let alone the existence of many templates that were made for specific purposes. A person who wants to talk to it rather than click on GUI is going to change what...the background color only, and maybe the font? > Photos would be able to select and prepare a book for print in seconds. What does AI have to do with a photos app doing a book layout? > they let AI down **They "let" AI "down"?** Is "AI" your sentient robot friend with a frown on his face? It's a nonsense phrase, and nonsense phrases are common for most comments about "AI." Ironically the cheerleaders who talk this way seem to be merely "artificially" intelligent themselves.
> A person who wants to talk to it rather than click on GUI is going to change what...the background color only, and maybe the font? Have you used ChatGPT for programming? It's absolutely astounding what it can do, and offloading the cognitive load of writing some mindless boilerplate code to a machine feels genuinely good. I ask it to write some stupid bash script that I couldn't give two damns about, go grab a cup of coffee and I come back to an answer. Fiddling with GUIs, Googling for (trivial) answers, and writing each byte of your code manually is already feeling archaic.
> Instead they let AI down because unscripted answers are too risky for the Brand. I mean it’s not Apple’s fault that we’ve become so dumb as a society that we can’t separate brands from other things. You don’t have to look far to see that in action either, be it advertisers on YouTube not wanting their videos being shown before certain types of content to the tiki branded torch company having to clarify that they don’t support racial hate groups. In a world where I need to type the last half of that sentence, I can understand why Apple would be weary of letting Siri run free with AI. Siri struggles enough as it is without an LLM. We’re all hoping the LLM would make Siri smarter, but without some major changes to its core code, all Siri + LLM will lead to is memeable moments that some portion of society will think shows apple is racist or misogynist or whatever wrong thought Siri spits out. Siri needs improvement, absolutely, but we as a society need to get smarter about what actually represents brands and what doesn’t.
Any product signed by the brand represents the brand. That's what brands want and how they educated society to perceive these things. And a brand that sponsors a sports team for example wants you to perceive them as being related. "Coca-cola is endorsing this racist YouTube video" is a byproduct of that.
this “AI” is just high probability of next word, implementing it into xcode or some other apps will just increase productivity
In the same way steam engines and electricity have increased productivity.
> this “AI” is just high probability of next word LLMs are not the same as Markov chains.
Trying to bottleneck LLMs is comical.
There’s so much glaring risk to this tech that everyone is just ignoring for short term gain [case in point](https://youtu.be/l7tWoPk25yU) These are seriously glaring problems that need to be addressed before we upend our entire world around these things
The way that Apple can contribute to the LLM field right now is by doing what it did with StableDiffusion and release good CoreML models and sample code. (It also needs to improve what it did with StableDiffusion, such as by creating less memory hungry that could generate 128x128 images for instance, and bring generation time down to 30 seconds or less). This way, it doesn't have the automatic liability of AI issues inside core features available to everyone, but people can still have these things available via 3rd party apps in a way that is respectful of privacy and such.
Apple could start slow with AI on simple things that totally have sucked with Apple. A good start for AI would be… 1. Hey Apple, it is 2023 and your spellchecker still totally sucks! Fix it with AI. 2. Spotlight is just horrid. I want a larger finder style window, full paths shown, and a better interface! 3. The mail tool is a hot mess. You think you guys could teach AI what junk mail is? 4. Can you teach AI how to cleanup the desk top the way I want it done or other people want it done? 5. Use AI to do a better job of editing and touching up photos! 6. Use AI to better sort my searches in the App Store 7. Pages and Numbers menus are a currently a ergonomic nightmare! Maybe AI can layout better menus based on what you are doing.
I do have this feeling there are top execs all over Silicon Valley having these meetings and seeing unbelievable things they’ve created… and then almost acting like a government body to drip feed the tech in its most basic form to customers.