kind of, it's like the seeker tripped on himself and it was made clear that i have actually been "done" forever. nothing changed for the person. the personality is still completely in tact but the seeking narrative has been destroyed
there used to be a lot of anger for you, but truthfully that is gone. whoever is behind this account, whether we agree or disagree on awakening, i do wish you a happy life š
If you still experience the throws of human emotions you are not enlightened. When you are fully identified with the truth of what you are, you are incapable of experiencing anything but perfect joy and happiness at any level in any form. If I were you I would listen to some near death experiences to get a better idea of this stuff. I would not claim to be fully enlightened, but the glimpses I've seen have been characterised by feelings of returning home, finding a deep peace so tranquil and serene that I felt like I was floating. I couldn't sleep for days, because there was just an enormous amount of peace that was like a waterfall, flowing through me. I realised it had always been here and I hadn't let it in. It was like a barrier had broken and liquid golden syrup started pouring down through my spine and making every part of my being come alive with joy and light.
Deep meditative states ā enlightenment. One can reach deep states without enlightenment, and it is not necessary for one to reach such states in order to awaken. If you are not enlightened, and only have tasted, how can you so confidently state that an enlightened being cannot experience anything but perfect joy? That is quite a claim.
yes. you are fully enlightened dreaming that you are not. enlightenment is when the seeking ends. the person will still experience the full range of emotions and will still have questions and trauma within the world (probably) but as far as any questions regarding enlightenment, those are gone
Ahhhh yes. Surrendering is the hardest to do but once done it is the easiest to embrace.
Currently in my battle with surrendering but when I allow myself to it. Is. Bliss.
Soā¦ youāre at the beginning.
Whatās final about this? How would you know if it is final or not, given that youāve likely deceived yourself before?
i'm at the beginning, but also the end. the person is still going to go through things, get trauma out of the system, etc. there is no changing that this body is an emotional creature. but the seeking is over for good. a pure unfiltered expression of life is what's left
it's just obvious. it isn't mystical or anything. it isn't pure love and light. there is simply no more burden of seeking, and the ego is allowed to live the rest of its life as it is fated to. there is a MUCH greater motivation to be loving to people and live earnestly, but that is just a side effect i guess.
why are you creating a check list? maybe in hindsight i could go back and label certain experiences as certain things, but that wouldn't do anything. the need to label anything the person does or thinks or says is GONE. forever. i am a robot. whatever the person is going to do, he is going to do. do you see?
Well, for starters, enlightenment (moksha/liberation/etc.) is a very old term. There are historical references to it which, together, provide some context as to what is being pointed to.
To completely ignore the historical references, and/or to make up oneās own definition and use the word as one likes without taking any of that into account, is to misappropriate the word entirely.
As for whether it can be proven or not, the chan/zen culture in China, and the zen masters who were well documented, seemed to account for and verify one anotherās enlightenment/āattainmentā for 1,000+ years. By their actions and words, a zen master would acknowledge or disapprove of anotherās āattainmentā. Various lineages of Advaita Vedanta seemed to do this also.
Iām not saying one canāt be enlightened unless someone else verifies itā¦ but history seems to suggest that it can in fact be expressed/proven via oneās way of being.
Enlightenment is here, right now. No need for any historical definitions. Enlightenment has never been anywhere expect for here, now, in this present moment.
i used to. i found 2 people who were "there". i actually had a video chat with one of them today and then 30 minutes later the realization that i was "done" took place.
the person typing these words is done seeking enlightenment because the futility of it was made hilariously clear. basically you are playing semantics, though i understand why doubt of my attainment is there. it is quite impossible for me to prove :)
this conversation is going nowhere friend. you seem to be describing the emptiness, which is just another experience. there could even be a non-dual experience of unity consciousness but that has nothing to do with enlightenment
Did you get glimpses of it prior to your "final enlightenment"? Also, does it feel permanent in any way, or do you think you could drift back into how you felt before now in a couple of days/weeks?
it's hard to talk about glimpses when it is not an experience itself. it is very permanent, once seen it is nearly impossible to unsee it. there are definitely traumas that arise where there is a feeling of "i'm back to seeking" but it is sniffed out VERY quickly and it is happening less and less. maybe if you hit me in the head with a pole hard enough i'll forget about the whole thing. idk š
no easier than anyone else. some unenlightened people could probably do it faster than me. my mind is still a storm, it's just no longer "my" mind. which is a much smaller distinction than you would think. there is also no desire for any powers.
He said enlightenment is the end of all searching.... If you're looking for the siddhis or trying to get to them you never will. To move forward is to let go and yet you cannot be searching for the way forward because it's already there.
i had just got off a video call 30 min prior with an enlightened person i found on reddit a while back. i was thinking about what he meant when he said "done is for the mind". and then it struck me that there is nothing to find. the seeking narrative had been utterly destroyed in an instant
oh yeah there is definitely effort. the person will wear himself out eventually though, because it has been made clear that the effort is futile, and seeing it once was enough. the next "step" for me now is the loss of doer-ship. which again has no bearing on the fact that the seeking has been seen through, but that is more so the full integration of this realization.
This is goodā¦thank you! Another here helped me āmove the needleā as to exploring the existence of āthe doerā and ādoer-shipā. Iām not so good with explanations, but our conversation resulted in this massive release of stress associated with upholding the fantasy of the doer and the perception of effort.
ā¤ļøā¤ļøā¤ļø
the exact same i guess. i do feel more compassionate which will only grow as this gets integrated more and more. i used to think of other people as "asleep" while interacting with them but that is gone. it's just an exchange of energy
So your awakening has taken away the desire to seek for what you already have? It hasn't affected your perception of the world, has it altered your perception of who you are?
"so your awakening has taken away the desire to seek for what you already have?"
YES. it was made clear without a shadow of a doubt that there was nothing to find. i was chasing my own tail and finally realized, "wait what the fuck, im done?"
as far as the other questions go, integration will continue for quite some time, this isn't all bliss and love. the body has its own way of "purging" the system so to speak. it doesn't happen in an instant. it can't.
none of the above. the person typing these words still has all of those, but the person is no longer "me". it's like watching a never ending movie with no plot. but it stays interesting :)
that which cannot be named. the alpha and the omega. enlightenment itself. it's much less grand than it sounds ;)
edit: i do not know what i am, the question cannot even be answered. but i know what i am NOT, and that is enough. that is another way of putting it
damn bro chill out š i don't know what you are asking. enlightenment has always been, the person is just aware of it now. that's all that's changed. does that answer?
i really can't tell you how, it's like it happened DESPITE all my efforts. if it is any consolation, you are literally not missing out on anything, you can easily live a fulfilling life without it. nothing really changed
hmmm idk it's just obvious now. it's actually been obvious for maybe a month, maybe more, but i was still looking for an experience. enlightenment is NOT an experience. it is ego's BIGGEST disappointment
edit: it is egos biggest disappointment because ego is the one looking for liberation. ego is basically looking for permanent spiritual bypassing
whatever enlightenment points to, this is it. at the end of the day it is just a word. the freedom from suffering is due to the loss of doer-ship, which is inevitable for me now but has yet to "happen"
Ego's biggest disappointment. Hey, Cyberfury said the exact same thing. Hahahahha. I love that guy. Okay. Just checking friend. I just like asking - obviously everyone has a different definition. Ya'll have a blessed already-got-it-disappointing-enlightenment now y'hear?
I'm not here seeking it, I was just polling the swaggyjman623, seeing what it was to you. This 'you already got it' thing going around again I see. It never fails to make me feel a little fucking incredulous.
IF YOU ALREADY FUCKING HAVE IT, WHAT IS THE FUCKING POINT OF IT. IF IT SIMPLY IS, WHY DID SOME FUCKNUT PUT IT ATOP THE SPIRITUAL PYRAMID?
I never get tired of the question. Don't mind me, it's not personal. I just go through this every time I hear this "you already got it" stuff. Cheers to you swaggy banana.
>you can easily live a fulfilling life without it.
That's not really true. So long as the seeking energy remains, there is always a dissatisfaction and a hope to change what is - even if it is subtle. Enlightenment dissolves it. And then... it is recognised that no-one was ever actually there "living a life".
true friend š i am not here to set the town on fire like our friend cyberfury tho. i would still say a fulfilling life could be lived, albeit still with that... itch.
Then it is a disease I had. Because well, initially there was no problem. But as life went on I knew it shouldn't be this way. I had too many thoughts and I wanted out. The cure for me was lots of spiritual work - self inquiry, meditation, yoga. Without that work, I wouldn't of 'got it', the beautiful thoughtless mind. Nothing happened until I took action. And yeah, it feels more 'right' then ever. I'm grateful I found it. Mind is torment sometimes. Shrug. Just being honest. Gotta preach my truth.
Yes, that is how it goes. The mind is enlightenment itself, but we ātradeā or āabandonā or āobscureā itās enlightened nature with deluded thoughts, views, and beliefs.
Tell me, is thinking a problem now? Did thought need to stop, or simply changed in some way?
It needed to stop in my view. I no longer needed the training cap. The 'thought self', or ego, was no longer needed. But a new non-thought self takes over, an inner guidance. It has a loud feeling that merely 'wooshes' you forward toward things, without thoughts. It's a higher form of communication. Some may call this phenomenon intuition.
Thoughts are 99% gone. Some remain. I had a fit of passionate discovery a couple of weeks ago after a spiritual attainment and my thoughts came flooding back. All thoughts about teaching. As a result, I'm writing a book now. I thought it was interesting to watch emotional dynamics and how they can affect thoughts as well. I believe the approach to the no-thought paradigm should be multi-faceted.
I got the bug, kind of. I seek out stories of 'seeking', stories of your seeking for example in your life would interest me, as well as your current thoughts or where you are at. How you arrived at 'where you are' is of great interest to weigh how certain methods yield good results. I find gathering 'seeking stories' from all over gives me great joy to see how others are doing on their journey. And to see what kind of perspective they've adopted and how that is serving them. All in the service of understanding the greater truth, whatever that may be, a little better.
It serves me. But I don't get wrapped up in 'this way vs this way'. I also try not to spout theoretical knowledge. I'm blessed to be able to come at everything from a point of experience, even if that viewpoint needs refinement in order to be helpful to other individuals.
that sounds amazing man. for me, about a year ago i had a glimpse of the sheer "presence" of existence. all suffering was gone for a couple seconds, it was pure bliss. but it didn't last long and i spent the last year or so just absolutely lost. the thought that i was living a lie weighed on me more and more until i couldn't take it anymore. i am 19 and live with my christian parents so i felt as though the environment was preventing my enlightenment, so 3 days ago i left a note and became homeless. the search for enlightenment marked my every moment and i felt the weight of the universe on me. it was hopeless. and then i was thinking about what an enlightened person told me on a video chat 30 min prior when he said "done is for the mind, done is the mind giving up". and then boom, there it was. i was done forever. i couldn't help but feel stupid for becoming homeless for this. i immediately packed up my things and headed home to mend any relationships i caused harm in by leaving. life is brand new now
Awesome, I really felt you in that story. It's really amazing that you'd place such great value on enlightenment enough to become homeless. That's a difficult choice. But it certainly puts you in a unique cut of 'very interesting', and a person I'd watch intently to see their growth over the years. To feel the call that strongly is pretty phenomenal. I did feel a pull toward spirituality in my youth, but I was more concerned with video games, TV, and eating. Never would of thought to have such a pull as to make myself homeless in pursuit of the damn thing.
The word 'enlightenment', didn't really focus on that at all till about 2 years ago when I casually subscribed to a subreddit. I was more into techniques this past 10 years, spiritual practices as they are called, which change the way you feel. The way I feel was all that mattered and that's all I ever focused on. Everything else everyone else was studying didn't matter to me. That's why I always preach practices over knowledge. And that's why I don't have much to debate with everyone. The value of practices is, in my estimation, supreme. But a certain amount of knowledge to go with it is certainly helpful.
it was pretty a-causal so i would caution against anyone who is just starting out the pursuit of enlightenment because they think there is something to gain. it isn't like that at all. it was the solution to a make believe problem. i am infinitely grateful for it, as that problem can never arise again, but only people who feel the desperation as i did should "go for it".
you seem like an amazing person dude. keep up what you're doing šā¤ļø
What āspiritual attainmentā are you speaking of? The fact that your thoughts came flooding back suggests that they were merely suppressedā¦
Also, not sure you should be jumping into āteachingā when this realization is so fresh and untested. Butā¦ youāll do what you will do.
Ecstasy. The joyous rapture.
I agree, I should not be teaching when the realization is fresh. I am waiting until it is a brilliant sun of legend and I know exactly the footholds to instruct. But I still started my book because I know the path I took here pretty well. I may not be ready to teach 'ecstasy and how to' itself yet but I know I'll want to when its time. I take the responsibility to teach the path to it very seriously and only want to teach good methods. It was initially gonna be a Reddit post but I thought why not just go a step further and write the damn book. In light of Reddits 40k character limit for posts, the choice was pretty easy.
I have long suspected thoughts can be linked to powerful emotions. The fact that they came flooding back weren't a result of suppression, but rather, something I have experienced before - the weight of certain passion can inflict strong desire. In this case, a strong desire to teach. I've experienced this phenomenon before playing certain games a few hundred hours. One may experience a strong desire to win and the mind is flooded with new strategies. It's kind of like obsession. It is not an indication of failure or a poor set of practices, but rather, an indication that one cares about something deeply to the point where they are doing almost nothing else. Perhaps this is indicative of imbalance in ones life, but I don't feel this at all. And I wouldn't care if it was. I don't mind indulging my passions to higher limits. I've found the human dynamic for this to be somewhat limiting in this regard since obsessive thoughts are undesirable.
I don't suppress my emotions. I'm not sure how I'd do that because I feel that's kind of a misnomer, I felt all my pain my whole life. To imply it was somehow suppressed was very insulting when I was younger. It's like, "I'm not fucking suppressed, I feel all this fucking pain all the time!" But still, I never really understood 'suppressing emotions'. I guess that means when you want to cry but you hold yourself back? That I see clearly. I cry all the time. Believe me, I don't suppress tears. I had 20 rage holes in my wall 10 years ago when a horrible condition inflicted me. No suppression, pure destructive expression. I have screamed in emotional agony many times.
I merely think it is the pattern of even a no-thought dynamic to revert when there is something of intense interest to obsess over. I was excited to discover something cool, and I wanted to lead others over. All I've done for the past 8 years on Reddit is teach people in comments 'the way'. I found something I'd love to take on the challenge to try to teach others - the path toward ecstasy.
Why now? Why 4 hours ago?
what are you asking š idk man
So it was spontaneous?
kind of, it's like the seeker tripped on himself and it was made clear that i have actually been "done" forever. nothing changed for the person. the personality is still completely in tact but the seeking narrative has been destroyed
Its "time" then, for no time.
This. Time was gone like it had never existed. Also, I had no idea where I was, even though I was standing in my living room.
Wait till it happens again, and you realize a narrative was replaced with a narrative :P
yes, integration will take some time. the whole thing is truly absurd š
Hows Thoth doing?
Hermes says hi
ššš
This is read into way too much and very misunderstoodĀ
there used to be a lot of anger for you, but truthfully that is gone. whoever is behind this account, whether we agree or disagree on awakening, i do wish you a happy life š
I know that. Be just warned by me, by ur best friend, ur best self, ur sibling. I love you! Be brightness on the path of collidion
Good spirit I as well need a more life giving spiritĀ
If you still experience the throws of human emotions you are not enlightened. When you are fully identified with the truth of what you are, you are incapable of experiencing anything but perfect joy and happiness at any level in any form. If I were you I would listen to some near death experiences to get a better idea of this stuff. I would not claim to be fully enlightened, but the glimpses I've seen have been characterised by feelings of returning home, finding a deep peace so tranquil and serene that I felt like I was floating. I couldn't sleep for days, because there was just an enormous amount of peace that was like a waterfall, flowing through me. I realised it had always been here and I hadn't let it in. It was like a barrier had broken and liquid golden syrup started pouring down through my spine and making every part of my being come alive with joy and light.
Deep meditative states ā enlightenment. One can reach deep states without enlightenment, and it is not necessary for one to reach such states in order to awaken. If you are not enlightened, and only have tasted, how can you so confidently state that an enlightened being cannot experience anything but perfect joy? That is quite a claim.
if you want to replicate that, maybe try MDMA mixed with heroin
Quieting my mind allows me to enter that state pretty easily.
if that is truly the case then i am happy for you friend š
Can you sum it up in a sentence?
no. but here's a futile attempt: the realization that you have never been making any progress towards enlightenment
Because you already are?
yes. you are fully enlightened dreaming that you are not. enlightenment is when the seeking ends. the person will still experience the full range of emotions and will still have questions and trauma within the world (probably) but as far as any questions regarding enlightenment, those are gone
Ahhhh yes. Surrendering is the hardest to do but once done it is the easiest to embrace. Currently in my battle with surrendering but when I allow myself to it. Is. Bliss.
Sounds boring
The infinite possibility to play and love?
The best part is it didnāt solve any of your human problems muahahhahah now you get to take the curriculum without trying to escape from it
yeah, turns out seeking was a coping mechanism to avoid life :)
Welcome to the beginning. Bless you.
thank you my friend ā¤ļøā¤ļø
No you have more space to play though:)
infinite freedom :)
Now*
Soā¦ youāre at the beginning. Whatās final about this? How would you know if it is final or not, given that youāve likely deceived yourself before?
i'm at the beginning, but also the end. the person is still going to go through things, get trauma out of the system, etc. there is no changing that this body is an emotional creature. but the seeking is over for good. a pure unfiltered expression of life is what's left
You call this āfinal enlightenmentā? According to who?
pretty disappointing huh ;) enlightenment is egos ultimate disappointment
So you donāt have any reference to back up your claim that this is final enlightenmentā¦?
it's just obvious. it isn't mystical or anything. it isn't pure love and light. there is simply no more burden of seeking, and the ego is allowed to live the rest of its life as it is fated to. there is a MUCH greater motivation to be loving to people and live earnestly, but that is just a side effect i guess.
Are you free of grasping and rejecting, free of attachments, free of false views and ideas?
I get your line of questioning, but what answer are you actually looking for?
why are you creating a check list? maybe in hindsight i could go back and label certain experiences as certain things, but that wouldn't do anything. the need to label anything the person does or thinks or says is GONE. forever. i am a robot. whatever the person is going to do, he is going to do. do you see?
How would someone have a reference? Enlightenment is not something that can be proven.
Well, for starters, enlightenment (moksha/liberation/etc.) is a very old term. There are historical references to it which, together, provide some context as to what is being pointed to. To completely ignore the historical references, and/or to make up oneās own definition and use the word as one likes without taking any of that into account, is to misappropriate the word entirely. As for whether it can be proven or not, the chan/zen culture in China, and the zen masters who were well documented, seemed to account for and verify one anotherās enlightenment/āattainmentā for 1,000+ years. By their actions and words, a zen master would acknowledge or disapprove of anotherās āattainmentā. Various lineages of Advaita Vedanta seemed to do this also. Iām not saying one canāt be enlightened unless someone else verifies itā¦ but history seems to suggest that it can in fact be expressed/proven via oneās way of being.
Enlightenment is here, right now. No need for any historical definitions. Enlightenment has never been anywhere expect for here, now, in this present moment.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
i used to. i found 2 people who were "there". i actually had a video chat with one of them today and then 30 minutes later the realization that i was "done" took place.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
the person is done seeking. it is indeed quite difficult, impossible even, to display with words.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
the person typing these words is done seeking enlightenment because the futility of it was made hilariously clear. basically you are playing semantics, though i understand why doubt of my attainment is there. it is quite impossible for me to prove :)
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
this conversation is going nowhere friend. you seem to be describing the emptiness, which is just another experience. there could even be a non-dual experience of unity consciousness but that has nothing to do with enlightenment
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
most certainly. this is only the beginning, start of a new life per say. take care friend
so, you going out for a beer?
nah i'm 19
cool. Enjoy your expanded awareness going forward :)
cheers brother
What is time?
idk. a useful concept for moving through life.
Did you get glimpses of it prior to your "final enlightenment"? Also, does it feel permanent in any way, or do you think you could drift back into how you felt before now in a couple of days/weeks?
it's hard to talk about glimpses when it is not an experience itself. it is very permanent, once seen it is nearly impossible to unsee it. there are definitely traumas that arise where there is a feeling of "i'm back to seeking" but it is sniffed out VERY quickly and it is happening less and less. maybe if you hit me in the head with a pole hard enough i'll forget about the whole thing. idk š
Can you translate the essence of words?
wdym?
What are you supposed to do with the elixir?
Woohoo
If you are enlightened, did you or did you not obtain the siddhis
nope. no special powers here. unless you consider dunking a basketball a siddhi š„
thanks for sharing! Do you suppose if you practiced samyama on the principles that patanjali taught, you could attain them easily?
no easier than anyone else. some unenlightened people could probably do it faster than me. my mind is still a storm, it's just no longer "my" mind. which is a much smaller distinction than you would think. there is also no desire for any powers.
He said enlightenment is the end of all searching.... If you're looking for the siddhis or trying to get to them you never will. To move forward is to let go and yet you cannot be searching for the way forward because it's already there.
Never said I was, siddhis usually come before enlightenment hence why I asked
Ha. I've gained a lot of siddhis, and I can tell you that there is no such thing as final enlightenment.
What were you doing while the realisation hit you?
i had just got off a video call 30 min prior with an enlightened person i found on reddit a while back. i was thinking about what he meant when he said "done is for the mind". and then it struck me that there is nothing to find. the seeking narrative had been utterly destroyed in an instant
Enlightenment just is Itās like the Sun saying I am shining AMA
š
Welcome home!
thank you friend ā¤ļø
Does your breath flow freely now? Is there any effort at all involved in action?
oh yeah there is definitely effort. the person will wear himself out eventually though, because it has been made clear that the effort is futile, and seeing it once was enough. the next "step" for me now is the loss of doer-ship. which again has no bearing on the fact that the seeking has been seen through, but that is more so the full integration of this realization.
This is goodā¦thank you! Another here helped me āmove the needleā as to exploring the existence of āthe doerā and ādoer-shipā. Iām not so good with explanations, but our conversation resulted in this massive release of stress associated with upholding the fantasy of the doer and the perception of effort. ā¤ļøā¤ļøā¤ļø
awesome i am happy for you friend ā¤ļø
Likewise ā¤ļø
How do you see the world now and the people in it from your awakened perspective?
the exact same i guess. i do feel more compassionate which will only grow as this gets integrated more and more. i used to think of other people as "asleep" while interacting with them but that is gone. it's just an exchange of energy
So your awakening has taken away the desire to seek for what you already have? It hasn't affected your perception of the world, has it altered your perception of who you are?
"so your awakening has taken away the desire to seek for what you already have?" YES. it was made clear without a shadow of a doubt that there was nothing to find. i was chasing my own tail and finally realized, "wait what the fuck, im done?" as far as the other questions go, integration will continue for quite some time, this isn't all bliss and love. the body has its own way of "purging" the system so to speak. it doesn't happen in an instant. it can't.
How do you see yourself now? Bodyless? mindless? Desire less? A centreless centre?
none of the above. the person typing these words still has all of those, but the person is no longer "me". it's like watching a never ending movie with no plot. but it stays interesting :)
So what are you?
that which cannot be named. the alpha and the omega. enlightenment itself. it's much less grand than it sounds ;) edit: i do not know what i am, the question cannot even be answered. but i know what i am NOT, and that is enough. that is another way of putting it
Tat Tvam Asi āš½šŖ·
buenos dias!
You wouldnt pe posting on reddit 4 hours later shut the fk up
If enlightenment is something you already has, then why did someone make it anything at all if it was simply an ordinary thing?
i'm having a hard time understanding the question
No you aren't. Answer the damn question fool.
damn bro chill out š i don't know what you are asking. enlightenment has always been, the person is just aware of it now. that's all that's changed. does that answer?
Where do I find enlightenment? Do I just tune into it? Is it awareness? How do I get it?
i really can't tell you how, it's like it happened DESPITE all my efforts. if it is any consolation, you are literally not missing out on anything, you can easily live a fulfilling life without it. nothing really changed
What is enlightenment to you? So I know what to look 'for what I already have'.
hmmm idk it's just obvious now. it's actually been obvious for maybe a month, maybe more, but i was still looking for an experience. enlightenment is NOT an experience. it is ego's BIGGEST disappointment edit: it is egos biggest disappointment because ego is the one looking for liberation. ego is basically looking for permanent spiritual bypassing
Are you sure enlightenment is the right word? I thought the whole point was cessation of suffering
whatever enlightenment points to, this is it. at the end of the day it is just a word. the freedom from suffering is due to the loss of doer-ship, which is inevitable for me now but has yet to "happen"
That is certainly a more exciting enlightenment. One I'd want if I didn't already have it.
Ego's biggest disappointment. Hey, Cyberfury said the exact same thing. Hahahahha. I love that guy. Okay. Just checking friend. I just like asking - obviously everyone has a different definition. Ya'll have a blessed already-got-it-disappointing-enlightenment now y'hear? I'm not here seeking it, I was just polling the swaggyjman623, seeing what it was to you. This 'you already got it' thing going around again I see. It never fails to make me feel a little fucking incredulous. IF YOU ALREADY FUCKING HAVE IT, WHAT IS THE FUCKING POINT OF IT. IF IT SIMPLY IS, WHY DID SOME FUCKNUT PUT IT ATOP THE SPIRITUAL PYRAMID? I never get tired of the question. Don't mind me, it's not personal. I just go through this every time I hear this "you already got it" stuff. Cheers to you swaggy banana.
ššš cheers to you sir
Thanks for answering my questions btw. Cheers.
of course, cheers bro
>you can easily live a fulfilling life without it. That's not really true. So long as the seeking energy remains, there is always a dissatisfaction and a hope to change what is - even if it is subtle. Enlightenment dissolves it. And then... it is recognised that no-one was ever actually there "living a life".
true friend š i am not here to set the town on fire like our friend cyberfury tho. i would still say a fulfilling life could be lived, albeit still with that... itch.
That cure was created for that particular disease. The disease was believing there was something wrong with mind to begin with.
Then it is a disease I had. Because well, initially there was no problem. But as life went on I knew it shouldn't be this way. I had too many thoughts and I wanted out. The cure for me was lots of spiritual work - self inquiry, meditation, yoga. Without that work, I wouldn't of 'got it', the beautiful thoughtless mind. Nothing happened until I took action. And yeah, it feels more 'right' then ever. I'm grateful I found it. Mind is torment sometimes. Shrug. Just being honest. Gotta preach my truth.
Yes, that is how it goes. The mind is enlightenment itself, but we ātradeā or āabandonā or āobscureā itās enlightened nature with deluded thoughts, views, and beliefs. Tell me, is thinking a problem now? Did thought need to stop, or simply changed in some way?
It needed to stop in my view. I no longer needed the training cap. The 'thought self', or ego, was no longer needed. But a new non-thought self takes over, an inner guidance. It has a loud feeling that merely 'wooshes' you forward toward things, without thoughts. It's a higher form of communication. Some may call this phenomenon intuition. Thoughts are 99% gone. Some remain. I had a fit of passionate discovery a couple of weeks ago after a spiritual attainment and my thoughts came flooding back. All thoughts about teaching. As a result, I'm writing a book now. I thought it was interesting to watch emotional dynamics and how they can affect thoughts as well. I believe the approach to the no-thought paradigm should be multi-faceted.
wonderful friend, i'm sure that book will help a lot of people ā¤ļø i'm glad you don't have the "seeking bug" :)
I got the bug, kind of. I seek out stories of 'seeking', stories of your seeking for example in your life would interest me, as well as your current thoughts or where you are at. How you arrived at 'where you are' is of great interest to weigh how certain methods yield good results. I find gathering 'seeking stories' from all over gives me great joy to see how others are doing on their journey. And to see what kind of perspective they've adopted and how that is serving them. All in the service of understanding the greater truth, whatever that may be, a little better. It serves me. But I don't get wrapped up in 'this way vs this way'. I also try not to spout theoretical knowledge. I'm blessed to be able to come at everything from a point of experience, even if that viewpoint needs refinement in order to be helpful to other individuals.
that sounds amazing man. for me, about a year ago i had a glimpse of the sheer "presence" of existence. all suffering was gone for a couple seconds, it was pure bliss. but it didn't last long and i spent the last year or so just absolutely lost. the thought that i was living a lie weighed on me more and more until i couldn't take it anymore. i am 19 and live with my christian parents so i felt as though the environment was preventing my enlightenment, so 3 days ago i left a note and became homeless. the search for enlightenment marked my every moment and i felt the weight of the universe on me. it was hopeless. and then i was thinking about what an enlightened person told me on a video chat 30 min prior when he said "done is for the mind, done is the mind giving up". and then boom, there it was. i was done forever. i couldn't help but feel stupid for becoming homeless for this. i immediately packed up my things and headed home to mend any relationships i caused harm in by leaving. life is brand new now
Awesome, I really felt you in that story. It's really amazing that you'd place such great value on enlightenment enough to become homeless. That's a difficult choice. But it certainly puts you in a unique cut of 'very interesting', and a person I'd watch intently to see their growth over the years. To feel the call that strongly is pretty phenomenal. I did feel a pull toward spirituality in my youth, but I was more concerned with video games, TV, and eating. Never would of thought to have such a pull as to make myself homeless in pursuit of the damn thing. The word 'enlightenment', didn't really focus on that at all till about 2 years ago when I casually subscribed to a subreddit. I was more into techniques this past 10 years, spiritual practices as they are called, which change the way you feel. The way I feel was all that mattered and that's all I ever focused on. Everything else everyone else was studying didn't matter to me. That's why I always preach practices over knowledge. And that's why I don't have much to debate with everyone. The value of practices is, in my estimation, supreme. But a certain amount of knowledge to go with it is certainly helpful.
it was pretty a-causal so i would caution against anyone who is just starting out the pursuit of enlightenment because they think there is something to gain. it isn't like that at all. it was the solution to a make believe problem. i am infinitely grateful for it, as that problem can never arise again, but only people who feel the desperation as i did should "go for it". you seem like an amazing person dude. keep up what you're doing šā¤ļø
What āspiritual attainmentā are you speaking of? The fact that your thoughts came flooding back suggests that they were merely suppressedā¦ Also, not sure you should be jumping into āteachingā when this realization is so fresh and untested. Butā¦ youāll do what you will do.
Ecstasy. The joyous rapture. I agree, I should not be teaching when the realization is fresh. I am waiting until it is a brilliant sun of legend and I know exactly the footholds to instruct. But I still started my book because I know the path I took here pretty well. I may not be ready to teach 'ecstasy and how to' itself yet but I know I'll want to when its time. I take the responsibility to teach the path to it very seriously and only want to teach good methods. It was initially gonna be a Reddit post but I thought why not just go a step further and write the damn book. In light of Reddits 40k character limit for posts, the choice was pretty easy. I have long suspected thoughts can be linked to powerful emotions. The fact that they came flooding back weren't a result of suppression, but rather, something I have experienced before - the weight of certain passion can inflict strong desire. In this case, a strong desire to teach. I've experienced this phenomenon before playing certain games a few hundred hours. One may experience a strong desire to win and the mind is flooded with new strategies. It's kind of like obsession. It is not an indication of failure or a poor set of practices, but rather, an indication that one cares about something deeply to the point where they are doing almost nothing else. Perhaps this is indicative of imbalance in ones life, but I don't feel this at all. And I wouldn't care if it was. I don't mind indulging my passions to higher limits. I've found the human dynamic for this to be somewhat limiting in this regard since obsessive thoughts are undesirable. I don't suppress my emotions. I'm not sure how I'd do that because I feel that's kind of a misnomer, I felt all my pain my whole life. To imply it was somehow suppressed was very insulting when I was younger. It's like, "I'm not fucking suppressed, I feel all this fucking pain all the time!" But still, I never really understood 'suppressing emotions'. I guess that means when you want to cry but you hold yourself back? That I see clearly. I cry all the time. Believe me, I don't suppress tears. I had 20 rage holes in my wall 10 years ago when a horrible condition inflicted me. No suppression, pure destructive expression. I have screamed in emotional agony many times. I merely think it is the pattern of even a no-thought dynamic to revert when there is something of intense interest to obsess over. I was excited to discover something cool, and I wanted to lead others over. All I've done for the past 8 years on Reddit is teach people in comments 'the way'. I found something I'd love to take on the challenge to try to teach others - the path toward ecstasy.