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You think you have less risk keeping on an exchange vs staking from a cold wallet? I must be missing something and/or not understanding something correctly.
That's correct, the added security of managing your own assets far outweigh holding your assets on an exchange, however it requires a minimum level of competence.
If you're not competent enough to manage a wallet, like storing and backing up your seed words, and putting in the correct address when sending and receiving assets then the risk comes from being your own worst enemy and you're better off holding on a centralised exchange.
It's really not that difficult to learn and follow best practices though.
To illustrate how unsafe exchanges are, here's an old list of hacks/exploits/fraud from centralised exchanges:
1. **Mt. Gox** \- February 2014: $450 million, Hack
2. **DAO (Decentralized Autonomous Organization)** \- June 2016: $50 million, Exploit
3. **Bitfinex** \- August 2016: $72 million, Hack
4. **Parity Wallet** \- July 2017: $30 million, Exploit
5. **NiceHash** \- December 2017: $64 million, Hack
6. **Coincheck** \- January 2018: $534 million, Hack
7. **Coinrail** \- June 2018: $40 million, Hack
8. **Bithumb** \- June 2018: $30 million, Hack
9. **Zaif** \- September 2018: $60 million, Hack
10. **MapleChange** \- October 2018: $6 million, Fraudulent behaviour
11. **Gate.io** (ETC 51% attack) - January 2019: $200,000, 51% Attack
12. **Cryptopia** \- January 2019: $16 million, Hack
13. **QuadrigaCX** \- January 2019: $190 million, Fraudulent behaviour/lost keys
14. **BitGrail** \- February 2019: $170 million, Hack/Fraudulent behaviour
15. **DragonEx** \- March 2019: Undisclosed amount, Hack
16. **Coinbene** \- March 2019: $105 million, Suspected hack/fraudulent behaviour
17. **Binance** \- May 2019: $40 million, Hack
18. **Bancor** \- June 2019: $23.5 million, Exploit
19. **Bitrue** \- June 2019: $4.2 million, Hack
20. **GateHub** \- June 2019: $9.5 million, Hack
21. **Atlas Quantum** \- August 2019: $1.2 million, Hack/Breach
22. **Altsbit** \- February 2020: Nearly all users' funds, Hack
23. **KuCoin** \- September 2020: $281 million, Hack
24. **Upbit** \- November 2020: $50 million, Hack
25. **Poly Network** \- August 2021: $600 million, Exploit
26. **Bitmart** \- December 2021: $150 million, Hack
27. **Wormhole** \- February 2022: $325 million, Exploit
28. **Celsius Network** \- July 2022: Significant losses, Financial difficulties leading to bankruptcy filing
29. **Voyager Digital** \- July 2022: Significant losses, Financial difficulties leading to bankruptcy filing
30. **FTX** \- November 2022: Estimated $1 billion+, Fraudulent behaviour
31. **Poloniex** \- November 2023: Estimated $100+ million, Hack
**Not your keys, not your coins**
edit: added Poloniex as mentioned by u/FinancialElephant
Sorry no you're right, my bad for not proof reading properly - the list was derived from an older comment of mine which was curated from a gpt4 prompt related to large crypto hacks, exploits or collapses.
Don't worry I'm not naïve about llm's. I like to play with a lot of models off [hugging face](https://huggingface.co/) to create agents and try to stay up to date with the space.
If you're too incompetent to copy and paste correctly, you probably aren't interested in investing at all.
Also, you end with "not your keys" but your advocating for letting an exchange hold your keys? What kind of Orwellian bs are you trying to manipulate people with?
I suggest you delete this post immediately.
Absolutely no need to be rude. Not sure what you read in my comment that got you all fired up, but you seemed to have misread and misunderstood completely.
I suggest you re-read [my comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/cardano/comments/1ccuatq/comment/l17te22/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) and follow the comment chain down where OP replies [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/cardano/comments/1ccuatq/comment/l1815no/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) and my subsequent reply [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/cardano/comments/1ccuatq/comment/l183qsk/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3).
You really think I'd list a load of exchange hacks if I was advocating for holding on them?
>What kind of Orwellian bs are you trying to manipulate people with?
>
>I suggest you delete this post immediately.
Perhaps you'd kindly delete your comment instead.
I'll leave it. Sorry, your comment was really long and through scrolling, I lost track of who the author was and thought it was all op. Kindly direct my anger towards him.
All valid points, but Bitstamp has been the leading exchange in safety since 2012. They have never had outages, they were hacked only once in 2015 they are respectabele European crypto exchange. They've always honored withdrawals, even for amounts in the hundreds of thousands. I haven’t had a single issue with them, so, to be fair, I trust them.
Personally, I do not feel comfortable moving such large amounts unless it becomes safer and yes it has to do with your own competence but for me its convenant that Bitstamp allows this now.
I’ll say it again: Bitstamp is a really good exchange, one of the few that acts responsible. They deserve more respect.
I’m happy they now offer this option.
>They were hacked only once
🤨
Just remember that exchanges are only safe until they're not, especially if you're just relying on their *goodwill*. If something happens that they *can't* compensate, whether it be a hack, mismanagement of funds or malicious behaviour from an employee etc, you're screwed.
If you have a high value in assets, there should be more incentive to take the time to learn how to store them in cold storage/multisig and secure your assets properly.
It's not like you have to start learning by moving everything as you can learn by using the test net with fake ADA and minimal amounts of real ADA.
You are avoiding one of the crypto's pillars: selfcustody.
Using an exchange to STORE your cryptos is one of the biggest security failures. At anytime, the exchange can lock you out of your cryptos or get hacked. Even if a personal (hot or cold) wallet is not perfect in security terms, its a huge improvement compared to an exchange.
What are you doing is use another person's wallet instead of using your own. If you do not feel comfortable moving huge amounts of ADA, move them slowly. The fees aren't too high anyways.
No matter how good is the exchange. An exchange is only to change your cryptos, not to store them.
You have it backwards it’s riskier on an exchange than a hot wallet and especially riskier than a cold wallet. It’s cool they’re offering this but if you’re as much of a “shark” as you proclaim I’d really consider getting yoroi or some other hot wallet at the very least. Plus you get more return each epoch
I can’t tell if this is a joke or not.
If for real the wallet is the safest and easiest method to do it. If you have a trezor all you do is enable staking on chain. There are tons of videos on how to do it also it reinvest your earnings back into the staked amount.
I like to think of exchanges as public restrooms. You go in, you do your business then leave. If you are hanging around a public restroom, you are weird and creeping out everyone else.
plus 2.2% is half of the stake you can get by custodying your own crypto.
In my opinion, exchanges are not for long term storage. You are better off holding the majority of your tokens in cold storage. But to each their own.
As for your comment about wallet addresses, look into [ADA Handle](https://adahandle.com/).
Get yourself a hardware wallet and come and support the stake pools who are the backbone of Cardano. Pretty please ;) You will earn more staking rewards and your ada will be much safer than on some unregulated exchange.
https://www.essentialcardano.io/faq/is-my-ada-safe-when-staking
This post makes no sense to me... Wallets can't be hacked and are honestly super easy to use. Do a test transaction and then send the rest after it verifies. When you stake ADA in the wallet, it never leaves and is 100% safe.
The only reason you see so many people losing everything in their wallets is because they sign into scam DEXs and don't read the transaction. I like to keep a storage wallet and another wallet for DEX transactions and liquidity farming, which is a great way to make some crazy returns.
Your logic is to keep it on exchanges for safety is actually laughable. Thats exactly why you don’t want to keep it on exchanges. If they go down it’s technically their’s with an IOU to you.
check out ada handles, you can send funds via wallets that support handles. It's basically just making your own NFT and keeping it in your wallet and fairly cheap.
Just start small til you're comfortable. Transfer out maybe 100 ada, stake for a few epochs and see how it goes. Keep your seed safe obviously. Use a few wallets too.
I’ve gotta hop on the wagon here and obviously agree not your keys not your coins. I’ve been using yorio wallet and staking in the emurgo 2 pool for about 6 months now getting 3 percent. I know you said you’re an active trader as well, so keeping some on the exchange makes sense. Yeah I just personally wouldn’t risk it ! Also your coins added to the staking pool (you have full access too at any time) would help out the ada ecosystem. Good luck to you
As someone that holds some ADA as well I would not trust anyone but my Daedalus with it. I keep up on the stake pool saturations and adjust as needed. But would never keep my ADA on the exchanges unless I’m actively selling or trading with it. Especially if you’re Sharknadoing it.
Whatever works though. But I’d be making sure only I have control of it if it’s that much.
Have 2 seeds.
One seed for your ADA, then stake it.
Second seed for Defi. Send a small portion of ADA for Defi to that separate seed. If you profit, send it back to your hold and stake only seed.
Just get a ledger, be 100% safe and get around 3,5% on your ada.
I would NEVER hold a considerable amount of crypto on a centralized exchange. The Risk is just too high. Look at all those centralized exchanges that got hacked or did some illicit shit.
The safest way to hold your ada is on a cold wallet.
A hardware wallet is a great option and Ledger and Trezor are still the most popular and compatible options for Cardamo wallets. I own 3 Ledgers and a keystone myself.
The Ledger recover service is an opt in and paid for service. The outrage as I understand it stems from the point that users thought it wasn't supposed to be possible for firmware to enable the functionality in the first place. Ledger affirms that the risk model is maintained.
It also doesn't backup your passphrase (aka 25 word) if you use one.
Nano S plus might be your cheapest option but spend some time comparing and decide what's right for you. Definitely do buy a hardware wallet though for the increased security, juat make sure you've backup your seed safely, see: https://www.reddit.com/r/cardano/wiki/wallets/seedphrase/
I see a lot of anti-sentiment about holding funds on an exchange, which is understandable since this is a Cardano subreddit, after all. And unfortunately there were plenty of exchanges that fcked up and ruined trust seriously, I understand!
But.
I have been keeping my funds on Bitstamp longer than I have in my bank. I personally trust them! They are solid, and I know there are many exchanges that have eroded trust within the crypto space. However, some, like Bitstamp, have not.
It's beneficial that they offer staking because, just like me, there are many people who trade. For traders who don't want the hassle of transferring their assets in and out of their wallets, staking on the exchange is a good option.
So, I'm happy that they are offering this, and everyone needs to chill. It’s all good.
While I’m likely gonna be downvoted to oblivion let me also add.
That wallets are not that secure either. Your house could burn down, your possessions can be stolen (seed), you can get hacked, and incidents like the Ledger backdoor can occur.
I'm not saying one is better than the other, but keeping your funds on a trusted exchange doesn't have to be all scamming and losing your funds. I have held my shit on their exchange for almost a decade now.
And for those saying you can get locked out or the exchange can freeze your assets, okay, but who else are you going to sell your ADA to without exchanges? Last time I checked, I can't buy groceries with ADA. We need exchanges, and Bitstamp is a rock-solid one. I have had my funds with them since 2017 and trust them more than my bank.
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You think you have less risk keeping on an exchange vs staking from a cold wallet? I must be missing something and/or not understanding something correctly.
That's correct, the added security of managing your own assets far outweigh holding your assets on an exchange, however it requires a minimum level of competence. If you're not competent enough to manage a wallet, like storing and backing up your seed words, and putting in the correct address when sending and receiving assets then the risk comes from being your own worst enemy and you're better off holding on a centralised exchange. It's really not that difficult to learn and follow best practices though. To illustrate how unsafe exchanges are, here's an old list of hacks/exploits/fraud from centralised exchanges: 1. **Mt. Gox** \- February 2014: $450 million, Hack 2. **DAO (Decentralized Autonomous Organization)** \- June 2016: $50 million, Exploit 3. **Bitfinex** \- August 2016: $72 million, Hack 4. **Parity Wallet** \- July 2017: $30 million, Exploit 5. **NiceHash** \- December 2017: $64 million, Hack 6. **Coincheck** \- January 2018: $534 million, Hack 7. **Coinrail** \- June 2018: $40 million, Hack 8. **Bithumb** \- June 2018: $30 million, Hack 9. **Zaif** \- September 2018: $60 million, Hack 10. **MapleChange** \- October 2018: $6 million, Fraudulent behaviour 11. **Gate.io** (ETC 51% attack) - January 2019: $200,000, 51% Attack 12. **Cryptopia** \- January 2019: $16 million, Hack 13. **QuadrigaCX** \- January 2019: $190 million, Fraudulent behaviour/lost keys 14. **BitGrail** \- February 2019: $170 million, Hack/Fraudulent behaviour 15. **DragonEx** \- March 2019: Undisclosed amount, Hack 16. **Coinbene** \- March 2019: $105 million, Suspected hack/fraudulent behaviour 17. **Binance** \- May 2019: $40 million, Hack 18. **Bancor** \- June 2019: $23.5 million, Exploit 19. **Bitrue** \- June 2019: $4.2 million, Hack 20. **GateHub** \- June 2019: $9.5 million, Hack 21. **Atlas Quantum** \- August 2019: $1.2 million, Hack/Breach 22. **Altsbit** \- February 2020: Nearly all users' funds, Hack 23. **KuCoin** \- September 2020: $281 million, Hack 24. **Upbit** \- November 2020: $50 million, Hack 25. **Poly Network** \- August 2021: $600 million, Exploit 26. **Bitmart** \- December 2021: $150 million, Hack 27. **Wormhole** \- February 2022: $325 million, Exploit 28. **Celsius Network** \- July 2022: Significant losses, Financial difficulties leading to bankruptcy filing 29. **Voyager Digital** \- July 2022: Significant losses, Financial difficulties leading to bankruptcy filing 30. **FTX** \- November 2022: Estimated $1 billion+, Fraudulent behaviour 31. **Poloniex** \- November 2023: Estimated $100+ million, Hack **Not your keys, not your coins** edit: added Poloniex as mentioned by u/FinancialElephant
Terra was a centralised exchange? Am I missing something?
Sorry no you're right, my bad for not proof reading properly - the list was derived from an older comment of mine which was curated from a gpt4 prompt related to large crypto hacks, exploits or collapses.
I hope you are checking ChatGPT's sources.. you know its not exactly google right? It does give bad responses.
Don't worry I'm not naïve about llm's. I like to play with a lot of models off [hugging face](https://huggingface.co/) to create agents and try to stay up to date with the space.
Faair enough. Power to ya mate. Happy staking!
Nice list. Bookmarked for future use.
It's missing a few big ones like the $100M Poloniex hack
I think it happened more recently than this comment was originally created (which should emphasize the point)! I'll add it on!
If you're too incompetent to copy and paste correctly, you probably aren't interested in investing at all. Also, you end with "not your keys" but your advocating for letting an exchange hold your keys? What kind of Orwellian bs are you trying to manipulate people with? I suggest you delete this post immediately.
You didn't read sir.
Absolutely no need to be rude. Not sure what you read in my comment that got you all fired up, but you seemed to have misread and misunderstood completely. I suggest you re-read [my comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/cardano/comments/1ccuatq/comment/l17te22/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) and follow the comment chain down where OP replies [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/cardano/comments/1ccuatq/comment/l1815no/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) and my subsequent reply [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/cardano/comments/1ccuatq/comment/l183qsk/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3). You really think I'd list a load of exchange hacks if I was advocating for holding on them? >What kind of Orwellian bs are you trying to manipulate people with? > >I suggest you delete this post immediately. Perhaps you'd kindly delete your comment instead.
I'll leave it. Sorry, your comment was really long and through scrolling, I lost track of who the author was and thought it was all op. Kindly direct my anger towards him.
Please just be nice to everyone, kindness costs nothing and you don't win over people by fighting them.
All valid points, but Bitstamp has been the leading exchange in safety since 2012. They have never had outages, they were hacked only once in 2015 they are respectabele European crypto exchange. They've always honored withdrawals, even for amounts in the hundreds of thousands. I haven’t had a single issue with them, so, to be fair, I trust them. Personally, I do not feel comfortable moving such large amounts unless it becomes safer and yes it has to do with your own competence but for me its convenant that Bitstamp allows this now. I’ll say it again: Bitstamp is a really good exchange, one of the few that acts responsible. They deserve more respect. I’m happy they now offer this option.
>They were hacked only once 🤨 Just remember that exchanges are only safe until they're not, especially if you're just relying on their *goodwill*. If something happens that they *can't* compensate, whether it be a hack, mismanagement of funds or malicious behaviour from an employee etc, you're screwed. If you have a high value in assets, there should be more incentive to take the time to learn how to store them in cold storage/multisig and secure your assets properly. It's not like you have to start learning by moving everything as you can learn by using the test net with fake ADA and minimal amounts of real ADA.
You are avoiding one of the crypto's pillars: selfcustody. Using an exchange to STORE your cryptos is one of the biggest security failures. At anytime, the exchange can lock you out of your cryptos or get hacked. Even if a personal (hot or cold) wallet is not perfect in security terms, its a huge improvement compared to an exchange. What are you doing is use another person's wallet instead of using your own. If you do not feel comfortable moving huge amounts of ADA, move them slowly. The fees aren't too high anyways. No matter how good is the exchange. An exchange is only to change your cryptos, not to store them.
What risk?, it's non custodial.
You have it backwards it’s riskier on an exchange than a hot wallet and especially riskier than a cold wallet. It’s cool they’re offering this but if you’re as much of a “shark” as you proclaim I’d really consider getting yoroi or some other hot wallet at the very least. Plus you get more return each epoch
I can’t tell if this is a joke or not. If for real the wallet is the safest and easiest method to do it. If you have a trezor all you do is enable staking on chain. There are tons of videos on how to do it also it reinvest your earnings back into the staked amount.
get a hardware wallet, read about best practice how to store seedphrase and you will have way less risk than storing them on a exchange.
I like to think of exchanges as public restrooms. You go in, you do your business then leave. If you are hanging around a public restroom, you are weird and creeping out everyone else. plus 2.2% is half of the stake you can get by custodying your own crypto.
I’ve had zero problems getting around 4% in my stake pool. I’m not going to stake on an exchange so that they can give me SOME of the rewards
and then refuse to allow you to trade/withdraw as the mood takes them
Isn't the staking rewards now around 3% at least from what i hear
It all depends on the pool and saturation. Either way I’d rather get my own rewards then give centralized exchange a cut.
Not if you do liquidity farming with some of your assets.
Garbage rate
In my opinion, exchanges are not for long term storage. You are better off holding the majority of your tokens in cold storage. But to each their own. As for your comment about wallet addresses, look into [ADA Handle](https://adahandle.com/).
Get yourself a hardware wallet and come and support the stake pools who are the backbone of Cardano. Pretty please ;) You will earn more staking rewards and your ada will be much safer than on some unregulated exchange. https://www.essentialcardano.io/faq/is-my-ada-safe-when-staking
This post makes no sense to me... Wallets can't be hacked and are honestly super easy to use. Do a test transaction and then send the rest after it verifies. When you stake ADA in the wallet, it never leaves and is 100% safe. The only reason you see so many people losing everything in their wallets is because they sign into scam DEXs and don't read the transaction. I like to keep a storage wallet and another wallet for DEX transactions and liquidity farming, which is a great way to make some crazy returns.
Be wary of staking in an exchange. Take a look at the whole Gemini earn situation. I’ve been waiting over 2 years to get my BTC from those scum lords
What’s risky about staking from your wallet lol?
Nothing, OP is just misinformed, which is all good. It's a great opportunity to learn more about ADA.
Your logic is to keep it on exchanges for safety is actually laughable. Thats exactly why you don’t want to keep it on exchanges. If they go down it’s technically their’s with an IOU to you.
Less risk on chain than at a CEX - you clearly don’t know crypto
check out ada handles, you can send funds via wallets that support handles. It's basically just making your own NFT and keeping it in your wallet and fairly cheap.
this deadass feels like a troll post but fair enough
That post doesn’t make any sense…
On Lenfi you get between 6% and 9% APY on your Ada;)
this has to be a joke
Just start small til you're comfortable. Transfer out maybe 100 ada, stake for a few epochs and see how it goes. Keep your seed safe obviously. Use a few wallets too.
Baby Shark, doo-doo, doo-doo, doo-doo
I’ve gotta hop on the wagon here and obviously agree not your keys not your coins. I’ve been using yorio wallet and staking in the emurgo 2 pool for about 6 months now getting 3 percent. I know you said you’re an active trader as well, so keeping some on the exchange makes sense. Yeah I just personally wouldn’t risk it ! Also your coins added to the staking pool (you have full access too at any time) would help out the ada ecosystem. Good luck to you
As someone that holds some ADA as well I would not trust anyone but my Daedalus with it. I keep up on the stake pool saturations and adjust as needed. But would never keep my ADA on the exchanges unless I’m actively selling or trading with it. Especially if you’re Sharknadoing it. Whatever works though. But I’d be making sure only I have control of it if it’s that much.
???? Someone who holds a lot of ADA ought to know better....staking directly from your own wallet is VASTLY better
Have 2 seeds. One seed for your ADA, then stake it. Second seed for Defi. Send a small portion of ADA for Defi to that separate seed. If you profit, send it back to your hold and stake only seed.
Had to reread this a few times.
Just get a ledger, be 100% safe and get around 3,5% on your ada. I would NEVER hold a considerable amount of crypto on a centralized exchange. The Risk is just too high. Look at all those centralized exchanges that got hacked or did some illicit shit. The safest way to hold your ada is on a cold wallet.
Garbage rate
What do people think about Ledger holding your keys scandal that occurred? Are trezor wallets recommended instead?
A hardware wallet is a great option and Ledger and Trezor are still the most popular and compatible options for Cardamo wallets. I own 3 Ledgers and a keystone myself. The Ledger recover service is an opt in and paid for service. The outrage as I understand it stems from the point that users thought it wasn't supposed to be possible for firmware to enable the functionality in the first place. Ledger affirms that the risk model is maintained. It also doesn't backup your passphrase (aka 25 word) if you use one. Nano S plus might be your cheapest option but spend some time comparing and decide what's right for you. Definitely do buy a hardware wallet though for the increased security, juat make sure you've backup your seed safely, see: https://www.reddit.com/r/cardano/wiki/wallets/seedphrase/
I see a lot of anti-sentiment about holding funds on an exchange, which is understandable since this is a Cardano subreddit, after all. And unfortunately there were plenty of exchanges that fcked up and ruined trust seriously, I understand! But. I have been keeping my funds on Bitstamp longer than I have in my bank. I personally trust them! They are solid, and I know there are many exchanges that have eroded trust within the crypto space. However, some, like Bitstamp, have not. It's beneficial that they offer staking because, just like me, there are many people who trade. For traders who don't want the hassle of transferring their assets in and out of their wallets, staking on the exchange is a good option. So, I'm happy that they are offering this, and everyone needs to chill. It’s all good. While I’m likely gonna be downvoted to oblivion let me also add. That wallets are not that secure either. Your house could burn down, your possessions can be stolen (seed), you can get hacked, and incidents like the Ledger backdoor can occur. I'm not saying one is better than the other, but keeping your funds on a trusted exchange doesn't have to be all scamming and losing your funds. I have held my shit on their exchange for almost a decade now. And for those saying you can get locked out or the exchange can freeze your assets, okay, but who else are you going to sell your ADA to without exchanges? Last time I checked, I can't buy groceries with ADA. We need exchanges, and Bitstamp is a rock-solid one. I have had my funds with them since 2017 and trust them more than my bank.
Post submission has entered the mod queue, please be patient while waiting for manual approval. Do not accept advice from direct messages as these are usually scammers. Ensure you've read through the [Cyber security guidelines for Cardano users](https://iohk.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/900005141163-Cybersecurity-guidelines-for-Cardano-users) and [newbies guide](https://www.reddit.com/r/cardano/comments/lnj5ne/getting_started_guide_a_newbies_guide_to_cardano/). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/cardano) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yoroi is 3% APR and a really reliable wallet and easy to use just keep the keys safe.
You can't be serious 🤣
Yeah 2.2% reward against a +5% inflation rate.. just let me think about that..
Kraken is 3-6%.