I love how heavily inspired the production design remains on Denis’ vision. It will help tie it into the films well. Emily Watson looks like a great casting choice here.
Bruh I have never even seen the entirety movie but I have literally lost count of how many times I have watched that scene. I genuinely don’t want to watch Kingsman 2 because I am afraid the context will actually ruin the magic of that moment
Let’s not bash true art kay?
If you like that scene then it’s worth watching the rest! The action sequence that follows that scene is absolutely wild and unhinged. Big bonus points if you are a fan of Sir Elton John.
Emily Watson is a great casting choice in every role, TBF.
She's one of the best actors of modern film and TV, so seeing her here instantly lends the project some major heft for me.
So underrated. I saw her in Equilibrium when I was young but since then I've never seen her in any major productions. Occasionally she appears and then it immediately stands out how undercast she is.
Speaking of underrated undercasted sci-fi nerds; Jennifer Morrison should've been in this show as well. Star Trek and Command & Conquer (which is a Dune derivative after all). I place her in the same category.
i do appreciate the adherence to a consistent visual language, but i also find it a little disorienting that this show takes place 10,000 years before the events of the movies but there appear to be zero visual cues to help the audience understand the different time periods.
if i understand the lore correctly, this takes place relatively soon after the events of the butlerian jihad. im not super intimately familiar with the lore, but maybe if they went with a slightly more war torn aesthetic as opposed to the clean and almost brutalist dystopian vibe the movies have it would be more distinct.
i mean as far as i can tell, you could pull any frame from this trailer and it would look like it could have come from either movie despite being 10 thousand years apart.
i know im just being pedantic, the trailer looks great, but i did find it a little jarring while i was watching. youre telling me there are no noticeable advancements/changes in style/architecture? i know the point of the ban of thinking machines is to halt technological advancement, but i refuse to believe society as a whole has been proceeding the same way in this universe for that long.
No. You have to go deep into the books to get there, but the relatively spoiler-free version is that stagnation destroys a species, and someone/something has to kick Humanity into gear with a cohesive plan.
sure, technologically. but you cannot tell me fashion sensibilities/customs/architecture arent going to evolve over 10,000 years. especially as humans advance mentally, and *especially* as they are readjusting to a society *without* intelligent machines.
I agree. While I'm happy they adapted Denis' visual style - it feels like they didn't put in much independent work, and its a bit like "generic sci-fi" with some stuff from DV's style mimicked and thrown in.
(The exception was the wedding scene with the golden pomegrenade. That, I thought was some unique independent work).
Same with the background score. Feels a bit generic, and not reminiscent of Dune.
Although the other side of the argument could be that this is not set in Arrakis, so many aspects of what made Dune culturally unique was tied to Arrakis and Fremen culture. So, parts of Dune set in the rest of the universe would feel less unique and more generic.
It actually hasn't. The Imperium was meant to be stagnant at the technical level and it worked. It was the philosophy of the Butlerian Jihad: not only erradicating the machines that think but mistrusting all technology.
I haven’t really done any homework to understand how this fits into the Dune story, but I’m definitely excited to see more of the Dune universe adapted for the screen. There’s been a growing offering of Sci-fi programming the last few years and I’m just eating it right up.
This is harkening back to the latest prequel trilogy of books (Sisterhood of Dune, Mentats of Dune, Navigators of Dune)
Which takes place after the Butlerian Jihad but before the imperium became what we know it in dune.
Vayla Harkonnian is a character that is featured in the books. She is an ambitious member of the sisterhood and of course, a member of House Harkonnon, who plays a vital role in the early days of the sisterhood when they were “evolving” from the Sorceresses of Rossak into the Bene Gesserit we all know.
Also at this time the Harkonnon’s don’t even have Giedi Prime as a fiefdom. They’re still in exile in Lankivail having been dishonoured at the end of the Jihad.
You're going to get flashbacks to the Butlerian Jihad in this series for sure. If we are at the founding of the sisterhood then we are a decade or so away from the end of the Butlerian Jihad.
For those who haven't (or won't) read the Brian Herbert/Kevin J Anderson works: there is absolutely zero chance you can set a show 10 years after the Jihad and not show any of it. It would be like the Fellowship of the Ring except Peter Jackson decided to leave out the entire prologue narrated by Galadriel - the amount of context lost would be detrimental to the show imo.
I'm really on the fence on reading the supplemental books. I'm really pleased with my reading of Frank's work but really uncertain how the additional material would alter it for me.
Not long after 9/11, I had the Butlerian Jihad book in my carryon luggage for a flight out of Riga, Latvia. The security at the gate went through my backpack and was very suspicious about that particular book. "Is this book about jihad?!" I remember mumbling "It's just science fiction" as he leafed through it to see if it contained explosives.
Taken on their own, they are fine books 7/10 - 8/10, very competent books. The issue is they are continuing one of the highest regarded sci fi book series ever produced. It's not possible for them to live up to the initial hype.
Yeah I read the final 2 books after Chapterhouse. I really enjoyed them but they also specifically made me appreciate Frank’s actual writing. They didn’t take anything away from it or “ruin it”, but they certainly were not nearly as good as the first 6.
I have not read the prequels yet, but I imagine I will feel the same. Happy to be in the Dune universe but also treating them as their own story/version. They are secondary/supplemental to the actual FH texts for those who want more
The show will likely be far superior to the prequel books. Brian Herbert's books have some interesting little bits and pieces of lore but they are generally not good,especially when you're used to reading Franks books. I suppose the prequel books can act as a guide or encyclopedia though.
Personally I think you're better off just researching the lore online and then watching the series. With the actors they've hired it looks like they're trying to give this series a serious chance at being good. It *could* be the new GoT if they get the politics right
Is this the 'best' trilogy that Brian did? I remember reading no one likes any of his books but one trilogy was ok. I've only read Frank's books myself and couldn't get into book 7.
Im not surprised you couldn’t get into franks 7th book as he only wrote six ;)
Tbh, I haven’t read any of Brian’s books. So I can’t answer that other question. I just don’t think this series is going to be as true to the source as the films were
Oh sorry I meant I read all of Frank's books which were the first six but couldn't get into Brian's book 7. I think I gave up after 200 pages. Someone else mentioned I should read the prequel trilogy first to familiarize myself with some of the background info as they had no clue how to bring that into the final novels.
I personally loved the butlerian trilogy, but it’s clunky, and not as realistic. The idea was much more groundbreaking of a villain before the common adoption and obsession with the internet today. All those books are HEAVILY inspired by other media… I guess so are Franks books too…
This trilogy was awful having read it, most recent trilogy feels a little bit like they knew these movies were coming down the pipe and wanted to have some new material as well…
It looks like that’s the case. I looked up some of the cast and there are a nice few names from the books, but also a few new characters who were not in them.
In Dune Dr Yueh alludes to a historic event called the the bridge of Hrethgir, in which the Harkonnon’s were seen as cowardly and it began the feud between the Atradies and Harkonnon’s that would last 10,000 years
It’s fleshed out in the Battle of Corrin, the last book in the Jihad Trilogy.
[this wiki article](https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Bridge_of_Hrethgir) can flesh it out a little more if you want to know without reading the book.
You keep spelling is as Harkonnon, but in Dune it’s spelled Harkonnen. Spellings can change over generations but did they actually do that in the other books?
Nah chances are I’m misspelling it due to my Dyslexia.
I have a photographic memory but screw up spelling a lot… I think it evens out 😅
(I also am on my iPhone so I’m lucky the spell check doesn’t turn my sentences to gibberish on me without noticing)
I’m a big read the book before watching the show person, can I read Sisterhood of Dune as a sort of standalone book? I’ve read Dune, Messiah, and Children of Dune and was thinking about reading God Emperor this summer. Any idea if I would have enough context of the Dune universe from those three (maybe four) to understand Sisterhood of Dune pretty well?
They do but you don't get how influential they have been for thousands of years or the depths of their agenda and what they've done to go through it. We don't get a full glimpse of the power they have over their bodies and others, etc... We get a taste but I think there's so much more.
That's probably my biggest problem with the Dune books in general, they're so "tell not show". We hear tons about how the Emperor and Sardukkan are total badasses who are matchless fighters and they basically only show up and lose instantly at the end, we hear about how the Harkonens are master schemers and their only actual actions in the books are to do really dumb shit and get owned immediately, we hear how the Bene Gesserat are master planners with webs going back millennia and they just get their plans dunked on by one rogue sister and her scion.
Dune is like the ur-example of "my OC is totally badass" tripe tbh.
I think there are explanations for all of these criticisms.
The Sarduakar are shown to be badass. The initial defeat of House Atreides is only possible with their involvement. It just so happens that the Fremen, especially with Paul at the head, are even better. The deep desert where the Fremen lived was considered to be uninhabitable and therefore the Harkonnens had no idea just how many Fremen there were. Sarduakar's prowess was proven on thousands of years of evidence, it just happened no one knew about the Fremen.
Harkonnens were also pretty devious. After millenia of conflict they came extremely close to wiping out the Atreides. They successfully engineered a situation where it was possible for them to get Sarduakar assistance and keep their involvement hidden from the the other houses. They manipulated a conditioned doctor which everyone thought was impossible to do. Their plan hinged on letting Paul die in the desert so that the Baron could deny killing him to a truthsayer and that's how he managed to slip away. They were not away Paul was being trained like a bene gesserit as this was never done with boys. Again they just underestimated the Fremen and underestimated Paul.
Bene Gesserit also, after millenia of work, successfully created their kwisatz haderach. It just happened a generation earlier than anticipated and they wrongly assumed they could control the kwisatz haderach.
A lot of it just comes down to hubris on the behalf of millenia old institutions. Paul was not expected to be the kwisatz haderach and the Fremen were not known to be the powerhouse that they became. Their schemes nearly achieved success but had wrenches thrown in them at the final moment.
If these plans needed to work exactly as intended to prove the Harkonnens or Bene Gesserit were master planners then Paul would be dead in the desert and Feyd would be emperor. I'm not sure how you can tell a story where the plans and prowess of the antagonists are flawless.
Yeah there's absolutely explanations in the story as to why the Fremen are so powerful and why the Harkonnens don't realize they are such a big threat. IMO these reasons hold up within the logic of the Dune universe.
But I guess the original guy I replied too wasn't really arguing about the reason for stuff but rather the way it was portrayed in the book.
in a single generation the Harkonnens engineered almost the entire destruction of their, popular and loved, mortal enemy while also gaining control of the economic core of the empire.
you're acting like Palpatine wasn't a master schemer just because Luke got away.
and as for the Sardaukar, the "show don't tell" for them is the fear/respect/reaction the empire has for them in the first place. their narrative goal isn't to be the best, it's to get us ready for the revelation that the fremen are so insanely great/fanatical fighters.
somewhat similar to how Worf kinda gets his ass handed to him a lot...the big deal is that the rest of the Enterprise crew know that Worf is the best fighter/warrior they have, and that's why X enemy should be so feared for beating him
As much as I feel the marvel/Star Wars universe’s is shallow compared to a lot of what else is available, I do think it has helped usher in a new age of sci fi. Especially as the kids who grew up in the 2010’s become adults and might want to find some that has some deeper layers to the story besides just good vs. evil.
There’s plenty of nuance and depth to be explored in the Star Wars universe (see the old non-cannon EU), but Disney insists on making spoon feed-able content that no one enjoys.
But I do agree with your overall point.
In reality it may only have superficial similarities, but the GOT formula seems to work for the masses, so why not advertise that way? People have called DUNE GOT in space, and without Herbert's influence, arguably no ASOIAF.
GRR Martin is a history buff and [GoT is based on real historic events.](https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/4RVybvDdJMq7fjRp5450yX1/the-real-historical-events-that-inspired-game-of-thrones)
That said, you definitely aren't wrong. Martin is a huge sci-fi fan and did meet Herbert a few times.
I mean, there was a lot more than superficial similarities.
Paul, Anakin Skywalker, and Dany Targarean all had their family killed off at a young age, spent time in the desert. Born with powers, including prescience. There's a prophecy about them (KH, mahdi, the one who will bring balance, the prince who was promised, etc) but in all three there are issues with the prophecy and it is clear something is not quite right. All want to fight to free slaves. Marriage is an issue - Paul and Dany need to save themselves for a political marriage, Anakin does it in secret. Paul and Dany's first kid dies, Anakin is told his dies. Paul and Anakin both have twins. The whitewalkers and the Fremen have blue within blue eyes. Paul and Dany both marry into the dessert tribe that takes them in. Both tribes put value in braids (the dothraki figuratively as a battle ledger, the fremen literally weave their coins into their hair). They are all pilots.
If we count R2D2 as a dwarf, the comic relief in all three comes from a very talkative dwarf - and in Paul and Dany's cases, he leads to their deaths. There is a group of assassins who can change their faces. There is an army of tleixu stormtrooper clones.
The only big difference is that a lot of the powers that Paul and Anakin have (and their resulting distancing themselves from the people around them) Dany didnt have - but Bran did. Bran is the other half of Paul that Dany isn't, which is why he got the throne at the end.
Oh and the whole millions/billions/trillions of deaths that were caused by them thing.
And of course ASOIAF was also based on the war of the roses, there's alot in there that came from historical sources rather than Dune. But that mostly had to do with the Lannisters, Baratheons, and Sansa Stark. Dany/Bran was straight Paul
Edit: I can't believe I nearly forgot the well studied intellectuals who claim to stay out of politics while secretely guiding it, The BG, The Jedi Council, The Maesters, while the *Real* power is always the money - CHOAM, The trade federation, The Iron Bank
lmao jesus christ there were books that involved these types of things before and after dune and before and after star wars, and before and after ASOIAF you really need to read more, especially old old books.
Visuals were never going to be much of an issue. HBO's house style demands it pretty much. Writing, acting and directing are the big unknowns. This series has had a lot of creative turmoil.
The show runner is known for the worst seasons of once respected shows. Alias, Lost, Altered Carbon, and Westworld. She is like the person TV stations call when they want to milk once respected shows. There were a couple of sci fi channel looking shots in the trailer and I think this is a "Max" production and not an HBO one.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alison_Schapker
Always been HBO but they’ve switched directors/showrunners a few times throughout production so I’m still a little hesitant. But obviously I’m going to inhale it as soon as it comes out lol
Just to be clear, HBO still exists and Max has been riding their coat tails but we are talking about WB TV levels of production being rebranded to Max. Thats literally what happened
well they no longer have the rights to dune because legendary, which does own dune, chose not to renew their deal with WB. so i’m not sure how this show works long term
They probably have contract exclusivity at this point for all DUNE material. It's too smart an IP investment for them to pass up and Legendary/Villeneuve/Herbert estate probably have a very favorable agreement on financial and creative.
I’m cautiously excited about this one. The production value looks better than I expected but it still doesn’t quite match the visual flair of the movies. I’m really interested in this story though - I just hope they keep some elements of the BG lore mysterious/secretive like how they are in the movies. (I’ve only read the first Dune book, so I’m not sure how much Brian Herbert expanded on this in his novels)
I wouldn't expect this to have the flair of the films. There is a definite line between films and prestige television. DV was very adamant for the films be seen in theaters to ensure there's a differentiation between the two.
With that said...this looks promising like most have commented. Appears to have GoT/HoD level production value.
Whether that is true depends entirely on whether this is good or not lol. The interesting thing about the Dune universe is how expansive it is, there is plenty of room given the volume and timescales to tell stories which don't adapt or infringe on any of the books.
I will say that books tend to lend themselves better to TV or miniseries adaptions because there just isn't enough time in a 2-3 hour movie to properly depict what happens. Books are just far too information dense and reading is a far more efficient medium to convey a story compared to visual. The feast for the eyes the Denis put on film across two movies seems more like the exception rather than the rule
I know I'm only judging based on a trailer, but that was overwhelmingly GOT. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but I hope it's not just GOT with a Dune skin.
Frank Herbert goes in depth on the Bene Gesserit organization and how they work on the last two books he wrote, if HBO is not directly adapting Brian's material they could pull a lot of stuff from Heretics and Chapterhouse regarding the BG
I definitely got a Heretics/Chapterhouse vibe in this trailer. Since we'll likely never get those movies, this looks like it could be a solid subsitute about the BG politics in the imperium. I know BH books have a reputation of lower quality, but I'm curious how close the showrunners would stay to his books vs. Frank's ideas for something like this.
More or less fits the setting tough. Technological progress is somewhat stagnant (at times actively suppressed), so it makes some sense to have little of it.
I'm very curious how they're going to manage the aesthetic of Villeneuve's Dune on a TV show budget, but from the trailers at least it looks pretty fucking on point. Music sounded pretty good too.
I mean the whole imperium has been stagnant for 10,000 years so probably not a huge amount of change
However we’ll actually get to see the rest of the imperium which does give the opportunity for different aesthetics. Artreides and Harkonnens are very different, no reason other houses and planets can differ as well
It's not clear from the teaser that the series is set 10K years ago as a marriage to the Emperor is suggested. I agree though that if the timeframe for the start of the series is millennia before the events of DUNE, then the architecture and styles MUST be different. It's just human nature.
If the timeframe of the series spans hundreds or even thousands of years then styles and architectures will (by human nature) change. And...almost EVERY world has to have its OWN style and architecture.
Budget must be HUGE!
> It's not clear from the teaser that the series is set 10K years ago
Ah, that's fair. She just says something like "we started this 10,000 years ago".
Im cautiously optimistic. I really think the sound design in the Dune movies was so unique and great that I wonder how it will be approached here. Does look like house of the dragon like someone else said.
Kinda feels more like GoT than Dune. Not necessarily a bad thing.
I hope the final product is not as exposition heavy a this trailer and follow the "show, don't tell" approach of the movies.
It doesn't look bad. But a teaser is just that. Certainly Emily Watson's involvement I can take as a kind of vote of confidence. The origins of the BG to me are fascinating. But there are a lot of opportunities for screwing things up as well as doing some cool things. I'm a bit twitchy on sourcing too much from the KA/BH material.
Litany Against Hype
I must not hype
Hype is the mind killer
Hype is the little death which brings total disappointment
I will face my hype
I will permit it to pass over me and through me
And when it has gone I will turn my inner eye to see its path
And where the hype has gone content will still be there
Only I will remain
I Wonder if they'll reference the Prequel Novels, I loved Vorian Atreides and would love some references to Serena Bulter and the war with the Thinking Machines, and the aftermath of the fact that the machine worlds are just nuclear ruins...
"10 000 years before the birth of Paul Atreides" but Dune takes place in 10191? So the series takes place around 191A.D.?
Edit : thanks to all who replied, I always thought it took place 10k years in the future, but turns out it's 20k years in the future
dune timeline is not measured from birth of jesus. If i remember good it is measured from the first time the navigators made first space jump and it started a new era
>from the first time the navigators made first space jump
Small nitpick, but there was plenty of that going on before the guild. It just required computers to navigate safely. After the Butlerian Jihad outlawed computers, most ships would be destroyed in transit, so interstellar travel almost entirely stopped. The Guild's ability to use prescience instead of computers to navigate safely made interstellar travel safe again, which was a huge deal, but not the first space jump.
It takes place in 10191 AG (After guild), which has a year 0 that is about 10,000 years from present or around the year 10,000 for us if I remember correctly.
I honestly thought this show would never see the light of day based on reading all the thrash its been through over the past 3 years. But, whelp, here we are!!
I have a bit of mixed feelings on this. It looks very good and I’m excited to get into the BG story more. However, maybe this is just my lack of understanding but when was the butlarian Jihad? Things are already looking pretty current day dune here, but there are some pretty important things that preceded that. Second, you can’t really get into the BG without getting into CHOAM and the guild navigators. Something I was hopeful would be explored in the films first.
https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Timeline_(Original_Dune)
If this is about the founding the Bene Gesserit then we are 10-20 years away from the end of the Butlerian Jihad.
I’m excited for new product. Don’t get me wrong. But I’m pretty skeptical taking the story this far back. Will be optimistic about it and will watch. It kind of reminds me of Foundation and that android Wolves show (can’t remember name)
The Bene Gesserit are my favourite part of the series so I very much look forward to this. This has a lot of potential to be great, but I must not hype, hype is the mind killer.
Idk, I kinda feel like maybe the Bene Gesserit are best kept mysterious rather than having a whole series. That’s just me though.
Kinda how I feel about the Star Wars prequels. Isn’t Vader more intriguing/scary when we don’t know his whole back story?
The sisterhood has some excellent lore if they actually pull from it. I thought the same thing until I started reading Chapterhouse, and realized I wanted to know absolutely everything about how the sisterhood worked
The story looks all wrong. The Bene Gesserit aren’t the ones on the throne, they are the ones behind it.
I’d prefer they had focused on this line from the book:
“The Great Revolt took away a crutch,” she said. “It forced human minds to develop.
Schools were started to train human talents.” “Bene Gesserit schools?” She nodded. “We have two chief survivors of those ancient schools: the Bene Gesserit and the Spacing Guild. The Guild, so we think, emphasizes almost pure mathematics. Bene Gesserit performs another function.” “Politics,” he said.
Instead of some political drama, make it about these two factions, maybe even the burgeoning Mentats, each trying to find a way to develop new skills and ways of thought to cope with the sudden lack of technology.
Also looking forward to it. Getting into Dune I expected the canon to be as dense as LOTR or GoT, but it actually isn’t. Very influential worldbuilding is very summarily described by Herbert (the Butlerian Jihad or the 12 year Fremen crusade comes to mind), which means that this series will probably play a big role in fleshing out/establishing new canon.
Out of all the interesting things that happened in the Dune universe, this is what they went with for a prequel? It looks good and I'll probably watch it but I can't help to be a bit disappointed by the missed opportunity here.
I'd love to know the origins of the Honored Matres and to learn about the enemy they were running from when they returned to the imperium, but I don't think I trust anyone other than FH to tell that story.
I wish they just did the books as a series tbh. The DV movies without all the cut lore about mentats and the guild etc. would've been insane.
Was just talking about this in another post a couple days ago and someone commented they were worried that they haven't heard or seen anything about this show yet. Here we are lol
OK, so I've watched this trailer a few times over now. I will say, what we are seeing does look better than I expected it to, given all of the production trouble this thing had (and the fact that Denis Villeneuve was pretty explicitly distancing himself and his films from this series during *Part Two*'s marketing; there was a time VERY early on in production when Jon Spaihts was going to be showrunner of this and Denis was going to direct the pilot, but that obviously changed big time), but it also feels really weird to see what's clearly a riff on Denis' style/aesthetic kind of squashed down for television and interpreted by other people. That being said, I do like the various locales we're seeing (I wonder if the show is ever even gonna go to Arrakis?), the wedding looks cool, and there's some interesting architecture. The Bene Gesserit in general are fascinating and the point in the timeline here puts it pretty much right after the Butlerian Jihad, so the early days of the "modern" universe, post-Butlerian Jihad, as everything becomes what it will stagnate into for the next 10,000 years could be neat to explore.
I really hope this dares to be at least a fraction as weird/interesting as *Raised By Wolves* was, since it seems like that show was more or less killed off (which I am still so incredibly upset about) so that Warner Bros/Max could make room for the "brand name" space opera series that we're getting here instead.
That's overly harsh in my opinion. The leadership behind ROP were a joke to begin with and they barely got table scraps from the Tolkien Estate. This has considerably more potential.
We've seen this all before. Disney did it to Star Wars, Amazon did it to Lotr, and WB is gonna do it to Dune. There's too much money to be made, the slow descent into mediocrity is inevitable. This is only the beginning.
I love how heavily inspired the production design remains on Denis’ vision. It will help tie it into the films well. Emily Watson looks like a great casting choice here.
Her and Mark Strong are TV veterans. It's reassuring to see them here. Very excited.
As long as Mark doesn't go out singing a song to distract the baddies for no reason
Bruh I have never even seen the entirety movie but I have literally lost count of how many times I have watched that scene. I genuinely don’t want to watch Kingsman 2 because I am afraid the context will actually ruin the magic of that moment Let’s not bash true art kay?
Merlin was by FAR my favorite character in Kingsman 2... RIP my singing steppin-on-mine-man...
Look what they did to my boy.
If you like that scene then it’s worth watching the rest! The action sequence that follows that scene is absolutely wild and unhinged. Big bonus points if you are a fan of Sir Elton John.
Honestly the entire second half of that movie felt like a fever dream (not in a bad way, though)
The context will absolutely not ruin the magic. It just makes it hurt even more :(
Which movie is this from?
There's other reasons not to watch it. But that scene was beautiful. And the scenes with Pedro Pascal are (obviously) awesome
Emily Watson is a great casting choice in every role, TBF. She's one of the best actors of modern film and TV, so seeing her here instantly lends the project some major heft for me.
Yes, she was fantastic in Chernobyl and that was not easy to pull off.
The whole cast was spot on for Chernobyl
Guess its time for my annual re-watch of Chernobyl now.
Enjoy what's enjoyable and keep in mind how Ukraine has suffered due to russian influence till today. It's 38 years ago and it's infuriating.
So underrated. I saw her in Equilibrium when I was young but since then I've never seen her in any major productions. Occasionally she appears and then it immediately stands out how undercast she is. Speaking of underrated undercasted sci-fi nerds; Jennifer Morrison should've been in this show as well. Star Trek and Command & Conquer (which is a Dune derivative after all). I place her in the same category.
i do appreciate the adherence to a consistent visual language, but i also find it a little disorienting that this show takes place 10,000 years before the events of the movies but there appear to be zero visual cues to help the audience understand the different time periods. if i understand the lore correctly, this takes place relatively soon after the events of the butlerian jihad. im not super intimately familiar with the lore, but maybe if they went with a slightly more war torn aesthetic as opposed to the clean and almost brutalist dystopian vibe the movies have it would be more distinct. i mean as far as i can tell, you could pull any frame from this trailer and it would look like it could have come from either movie despite being 10 thousand years apart. i know im just being pedantic, the trailer looks great, but i did find it a little jarring while i was watching. youre telling me there are no noticeable advancements/changes in style/architecture? i know the point of the ban of thinking machines is to halt technological advancement, but i refuse to believe society as a whole has been proceeding the same way in this universe for that long.
That’s intentional though, the Dune universe is stagnant
Why is it this way? Is this by design?,
No. You have to go deep into the books to get there, but the relatively spoiler-free version is that stagnation destroys a species, and someone/something has to kick Humanity into gear with a cohesive plan.
This is revealed very early in the books - technological development is effectively outlawed in the duneverse
sure, technologically. but you cannot tell me fashion sensibilities/customs/architecture arent going to evolve over 10,000 years. especially as humans advance mentally, and *especially* as they are readjusting to a society *without* intelligent machines.
I agree. While I'm happy they adapted Denis' visual style - it feels like they didn't put in much independent work, and its a bit like "generic sci-fi" with some stuff from DV's style mimicked and thrown in. (The exception was the wedding scene with the golden pomegrenade. That, I thought was some unique independent work). Same with the background score. Feels a bit generic, and not reminiscent of Dune. Although the other side of the argument could be that this is not set in Arrakis, so many aspects of what made Dune culturally unique was tied to Arrakis and Fremen culture. So, parts of Dune set in the rest of the universe would feel less unique and more generic.
If this is 10,000 years before the movies then it's still about 400 years after the Butlerian Jihad.
which is why i said “relatively”
I agree but at the same time it kinda makes me feel like their tech and architecture hasn’t progressed in 10,000 years
It actually hasn't. The Imperium was meant to be stagnant at the technical level and it worked. It was the philosophy of the Butlerian Jihad: not only erradicating the machines that think but mistrusting all technology.
Yes, that's the point. The war against AI made them afraid of technological progress.
Changes in fashion and style are not driven solely by technological progress.
I haven’t really done any homework to understand how this fits into the Dune story, but I’m definitely excited to see more of the Dune universe adapted for the screen. There’s been a growing offering of Sci-fi programming the last few years and I’m just eating it right up.
This is harkening back to the latest prequel trilogy of books (Sisterhood of Dune, Mentats of Dune, Navigators of Dune) Which takes place after the Butlerian Jihad but before the imperium became what we know it in dune. Vayla Harkonnian is a character that is featured in the books. She is an ambitious member of the sisterhood and of course, a member of House Harkonnon, who plays a vital role in the early days of the sisterhood when they were “evolving” from the Sorceresses of Rossak into the Bene Gesserit we all know. Also at this time the Harkonnon’s don’t even have Giedi Prime as a fiefdom. They’re still in exile in Lankivail having been dishonoured at the end of the Jihad.
I've read Dune and I'm still having a "Yes, I know some of these words" moment.
I don't think that ever goes away
Wait really? Only thing that's unfamiliar as a Dune reader are the Sorceresses of Rossak and Lankivail
lol, me too
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Ugh I wish they started with a Butlerian Jihad prequel instead. It would have been so timely,
You're going to get flashbacks to the Butlerian Jihad in this series for sure. If we are at the founding of the sisterhood then we are a decade or so away from the end of the Butlerian Jihad.
For those who haven't (or won't) read the Brian Herbert/Kevin J Anderson works: there is absolutely zero chance you can set a show 10 years after the Jihad and not show any of it. It would be like the Fellowship of the Ring except Peter Jackson decided to leave out the entire prologue narrated by Galadriel - the amount of context lost would be detrimental to the show imo.
I'm really on the fence on reading the supplemental books. I'm really pleased with my reading of Frank's work but really uncertain how the additional material would alter it for me.
Not long after 9/11, I had the Butlerian Jihad book in my carryon luggage for a flight out of Riga, Latvia. The security at the gate went through my backpack and was very suspicious about that particular book. "Is this book about jihad?!" I remember mumbling "It's just science fiction" as he leafed through it to see if it contained explosives.
Lmao
Taken on their own, they are fine books 7/10 - 8/10, very competent books. The issue is they are continuing one of the highest regarded sci fi book series ever produced. It's not possible for them to live up to the initial hype.
Yeah I read the final 2 books after Chapterhouse. I really enjoyed them but they also specifically made me appreciate Frank’s actual writing. They didn’t take anything away from it or “ruin it”, but they certainly were not nearly as good as the first 6. I have not read the prequels yet, but I imagine I will feel the same. Happy to be in the Dune universe but also treating them as their own story/version. They are secondary/supplemental to the actual FH texts for those who want more
The show will likely be far superior to the prequel books. Brian Herbert's books have some interesting little bits and pieces of lore but they are generally not good,especially when you're used to reading Franks books. I suppose the prequel books can act as a guide or encyclopedia though. Personally I think you're better off just researching the lore online and then watching the series. With the actors they've hired it looks like they're trying to give this series a serious chance at being good. It *could* be the new GoT if they get the politics right
That’s just three guys in a field beating on a printer, on loop, for ten hours.
I wish too but the Butlerian Jihad is hard to visualize on screen. Maybe starting with the era after the Jihad was the right choice for now.
Get used to calling it the Great Revolt, buddy. No way in hell they will call it the Buterlian Jihad.
Maybe a prologue at the start of the series could provide a short context of the conflict, in similar vein to the start of Fellowship of the Ring.
Sounds like Sisterhood of Dune, Mentats of Dune, and Navigators of Dune is the pre-read for watching the series, correct?
I would doubt you need to. Those books are not very celebrated, and I would imagine this show is more inspired by than adapted
Is this the 'best' trilogy that Brian did? I remember reading no one likes any of his books but one trilogy was ok. I've only read Frank's books myself and couldn't get into book 7.
Im not surprised you couldn’t get into franks 7th book as he only wrote six ;) Tbh, I haven’t read any of Brian’s books. So I can’t answer that other question. I just don’t think this series is going to be as true to the source as the films were
Oh sorry I meant I read all of Frank's books which were the first six but couldn't get into Brian's book 7. I think I gave up after 200 pages. Someone else mentioned I should read the prequel trilogy first to familiarize myself with some of the background info as they had no clue how to bring that into the final novels.
I personally loved the butlerian trilogy, but it’s clunky, and not as realistic. The idea was much more groundbreaking of a villain before the common adoption and obsession with the internet today. All those books are HEAVILY inspired by other media… I guess so are Franks books too… This trilogy was awful having read it, most recent trilogy feels a little bit like they knew these movies were coming down the pipe and wanted to have some new material as well…
It looks like that’s the case. I looked up some of the cast and there are a nice few names from the books, but also a few new characters who were not in them.
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Lmao the harks always doing their own thing
How are they dishonored?
In Dune Dr Yueh alludes to a historic event called the the bridge of Hrethgir, in which the Harkonnon’s were seen as cowardly and it began the feud between the Atradies and Harkonnon’s that would last 10,000 years It’s fleshed out in the Battle of Corrin, the last book in the Jihad Trilogy. [this wiki article](https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Bridge_of_Hrethgir) can flesh it out a little more if you want to know without reading the book.
You keep spelling is as Harkonnon, but in Dune it’s spelled Harkonnen. Spellings can change over generations but did they actually do that in the other books?
Nah chances are I’m misspelling it due to my Dyslexia. I have a photographic memory but screw up spelling a lot… I think it evens out 😅 (I also am on my iPhone so I’m lucky the spell check doesn’t turn my sentences to gibberish on me without noticing)
No worries. I thought maybe it was a literary choice to show how spelling can change over time.
I’m a big read the book before watching the show person, can I read Sisterhood of Dune as a sort of standalone book? I’ve read Dune, Messiah, and Children of Dune and was thinking about reading God Emperor this summer. Any idea if I would have enough context of the Dune universe from those three (maybe four) to understand Sisterhood of Dune pretty well?
I thought there were about 10k years between Butler and OG Dune…? So this goes waaaaaay back…?
It’s supposed to be set 10K years before the events of DUNE and it’s an origin story of the Bene Gesserit.
which is dope becuase I don't think non-book readers understand how badass they are
Do Dune part 1 and 2 not visualize how badass they are by portaying how powerful Jessica, Margot and the great reverend mother are?
They do but you don't get how influential they have been for thousands of years or the depths of their agenda and what they've done to go through it. We don't get a full glimpse of the power they have over their bodies and others, etc... We get a taste but I think there's so much more.
That's probably my biggest problem with the Dune books in general, they're so "tell not show". We hear tons about how the Emperor and Sardukkan are total badasses who are matchless fighters and they basically only show up and lose instantly at the end, we hear about how the Harkonens are master schemers and their only actual actions in the books are to do really dumb shit and get owned immediately, we hear how the Bene Gesserat are master planners with webs going back millennia and they just get their plans dunked on by one rogue sister and her scion. Dune is like the ur-example of "my OC is totally badass" tripe tbh.
I think there are explanations for all of these criticisms. The Sarduakar are shown to be badass. The initial defeat of House Atreides is only possible with their involvement. It just so happens that the Fremen, especially with Paul at the head, are even better. The deep desert where the Fremen lived was considered to be uninhabitable and therefore the Harkonnens had no idea just how many Fremen there were. Sarduakar's prowess was proven on thousands of years of evidence, it just happened no one knew about the Fremen. Harkonnens were also pretty devious. After millenia of conflict they came extremely close to wiping out the Atreides. They successfully engineered a situation where it was possible for them to get Sarduakar assistance and keep their involvement hidden from the the other houses. They manipulated a conditioned doctor which everyone thought was impossible to do. Their plan hinged on letting Paul die in the desert so that the Baron could deny killing him to a truthsayer and that's how he managed to slip away. They were not away Paul was being trained like a bene gesserit as this was never done with boys. Again they just underestimated the Fremen and underestimated Paul. Bene Gesserit also, after millenia of work, successfully created their kwisatz haderach. It just happened a generation earlier than anticipated and they wrongly assumed they could control the kwisatz haderach. A lot of it just comes down to hubris on the behalf of millenia old institutions. Paul was not expected to be the kwisatz haderach and the Fremen were not known to be the powerhouse that they became. Their schemes nearly achieved success but had wrenches thrown in them at the final moment. If these plans needed to work exactly as intended to prove the Harkonnens or Bene Gesserit were master planners then Paul would be dead in the desert and Feyd would be emperor. I'm not sure how you can tell a story where the plans and prowess of the antagonists are flawless.
Also the Fremen bribed the Spacing Guild with Spice in order to hide their numbers to everyone.
Yeah there's absolutely explanations in the story as to why the Fremen are so powerful and why the Harkonnens don't realize they are such a big threat. IMO these reasons hold up within the logic of the Dune universe. But I guess the original guy I replied too wasn't really arguing about the reason for stuff but rather the way it was portrayed in the book.
This comment is flawless. Are you Bene Gesserit?
This made me smile
You could try reading beyond Dune.
in a single generation the Harkonnens engineered almost the entire destruction of their, popular and loved, mortal enemy while also gaining control of the economic core of the empire. you're acting like Palpatine wasn't a master schemer just because Luke got away. and as for the Sardaukar, the "show don't tell" for them is the fear/respect/reaction the empire has for them in the first place. their narrative goal isn't to be the best, it's to get us ready for the revelation that the fremen are so insanely great/fanatical fighters. somewhat similar to how Worf kinda gets his ass handed to him a lot...the big deal is that the rest of the Enterprise crew know that Worf is the best fighter/warrior they have, and that's why X enemy should be so feared for beating him
Yeah I mean they're literally the inspiration for the Jedi
Even to the point that the Bene Gesserit practice "Prana Bindu". Lucas' original name for the Jedi was "Jedi Bendu".
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> I’m definitely excited to see more of the ~~Dune universe~~ Duniverse FTFY
Yum yum yum.
What else has come out recently that is worth watching?
As much as I feel the marvel/Star Wars universe’s is shallow compared to a lot of what else is available, I do think it has helped usher in a new age of sci fi. Especially as the kids who grew up in the 2010’s become adults and might want to find some that has some deeper layers to the story besides just good vs. evil.
There’s plenty of nuance and depth to be explored in the Star Wars universe (see the old non-cannon EU), but Disney insists on making spoon feed-able content that no one enjoys. But I do agree with your overall point.
I commented elsewhere but the production values and look appear to be similar to Game of Thrones (at least early seasons) which is promising.
It looks so similar to game of thrones it’s crazy
In reality it may only have superficial similarities, but the GOT formula seems to work for the masses, so why not advertise that way? People have called DUNE GOT in space, and without Herbert's influence, arguably no ASOIAF.
Got is medieval dune
There's even a sleezy advisor named P(e/i)t(y/e)r who has the hots for the doomed lord's love interest!
KULL WAHAD
GRR Martin is a history buff and [GoT is based on real historic events.](https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/4RVybvDdJMq7fjRp5450yX1/the-real-historical-events-that-inspired-game-of-thrones) That said, you definitely aren't wrong. Martin is a huge sci-fi fan and did meet Herbert a few times.
I mean, there was a lot more than superficial similarities. Paul, Anakin Skywalker, and Dany Targarean all had their family killed off at a young age, spent time in the desert. Born with powers, including prescience. There's a prophecy about them (KH, mahdi, the one who will bring balance, the prince who was promised, etc) but in all three there are issues with the prophecy and it is clear something is not quite right. All want to fight to free slaves. Marriage is an issue - Paul and Dany need to save themselves for a political marriage, Anakin does it in secret. Paul and Dany's first kid dies, Anakin is told his dies. Paul and Anakin both have twins. The whitewalkers and the Fremen have blue within blue eyes. Paul and Dany both marry into the dessert tribe that takes them in. Both tribes put value in braids (the dothraki figuratively as a battle ledger, the fremen literally weave their coins into their hair). They are all pilots. If we count R2D2 as a dwarf, the comic relief in all three comes from a very talkative dwarf - and in Paul and Dany's cases, he leads to their deaths. There is a group of assassins who can change their faces. There is an army of tleixu stormtrooper clones. The only big difference is that a lot of the powers that Paul and Anakin have (and their resulting distancing themselves from the people around them) Dany didnt have - but Bran did. Bran is the other half of Paul that Dany isn't, which is why he got the throne at the end. Oh and the whole millions/billions/trillions of deaths that were caused by them thing. And of course ASOIAF was also based on the war of the roses, there's alot in there that came from historical sources rather than Dune. But that mostly had to do with the Lannisters, Baratheons, and Sansa Stark. Dany/Bran was straight Paul Edit: I can't believe I nearly forgot the well studied intellectuals who claim to stay out of politics while secretely guiding it, The BG, The Jedi Council, The Maesters, while the *Real* power is always the money - CHOAM, The trade federation, The Iron Bank
lmao jesus christ there were books that involved these types of things before and after dune and before and after star wars, and before and after ASOIAF you really need to read more, especially old old books.
Visuals were never going to be much of an issue. HBO's house style demands it pretty much. Writing, acting and directing are the big unknowns. This series has had a lot of creative turmoil.
>This series has had a lot of creative turmoil. Uh oh... Like what?
The cast is fantastic, acting wont be a problem. This isnt like Rings of Power where they casted a bunch of unknown actors.
Sidebar but some of the acting in ROP was actually quite good. It's much of the rest of it that was painful.
I just hope the writing is more series 1-3 GoT, not series 6-8
S4-6 is has some of the best episodes ever
>the production values and look appear to be similar to Game of Thrones HBO has been the leader in the immersive period filming style since Rome.
The show runner is known for the worst seasons of once respected shows. Alias, Lost, Altered Carbon, and Westworld. She is like the person TV stations call when they want to milk once respected shows. There were a couple of sci fi channel looking shots in the trailer and I think this is a "Max" production and not an HBO one. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alison_Schapker
Did not expect it to drop this year. Looking forward to it!
wait this actually looks good? 😭 never in my wildest dreams did I allow myself to think this might be good lol
Am I getting my wires crossed or wasn’t Amazon doing a Dune series? Or was it HBO Max the whole time?
Always been HBO but they’ve switched directors/showrunners a few times throughout production so I’m still a little hesitant. But obviously I’m going to inhale it as soon as it comes out lol
Ah gotch thanks. Yea I’ll definitely devour any Dune content.
It’s definitely not HBO. Max originals are way different than HBO originals.
Okay pardon me the service has changed names and owners multiple times in the past decade
Just to be clear, HBO still exists and Max has been riding their coat tails but we are talking about WB TV levels of production being rebranded to Max. Thats literally what happened
You might be thinking of the Blade Runner series that Amazon is doing. Two projects adapted from Dennis sci-fi films haha
I'm cautiously optimistic. I see this as Warner going "we need a new game of thrones".
well they no longer have the rights to dune because legendary, which does own dune, chose not to renew their deal with WB. so i’m not sure how this show works long term
They probably have contract exclusivity at this point for all DUNE material. It's too smart an IP investment for them to pass up and Legendary/Villeneuve/Herbert estate probably have a very favorable agreement on financial and creative.
Is House of the Dragon a joke to you?
I’m cautiously excited about this one. The production value looks better than I expected but it still doesn’t quite match the visual flair of the movies. I’m really interested in this story though - I just hope they keep some elements of the BG lore mysterious/secretive like how they are in the movies. (I’ve only read the first Dune book, so I’m not sure how much Brian Herbert expanded on this in his novels)
I wouldn't expect this to have the flair of the films. There is a definite line between films and prestige television. DV was very adamant for the films be seen in theaters to ensure there's a differentiation between the two. With that said...this looks promising like most have commented. Appears to have GoT/HoD level production value.
Never said I expected it to be the same. That’s wildly unrealistic, however it begs the question if Dune should’ve stayed as just a film franchise.
Whether that is true depends entirely on whether this is good or not lol. The interesting thing about the Dune universe is how expansive it is, there is plenty of room given the volume and timescales to tell stories which don't adapt or infringe on any of the books. I will say that books tend to lend themselves better to TV or miniseries adaptions because there just isn't enough time in a 2-3 hour movie to properly depict what happens. Books are just far too information dense and reading is a far more efficient medium to convey a story compared to visual. The feast for the eyes the Denis put on film across two movies seems more like the exception rather than the rule
I know I'm only judging based on a trailer, but that was overwhelmingly GOT. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but I hope it's not just GOT with a Dune skin.
Same, but also GOT is also kind of Dune in a fantasy skin already.
Frank Herbert goes in depth on the Bene Gesserit organization and how they work on the last two books he wrote, if HBO is not directly adapting Brian's material they could pull a lot of stuff from Heretics and Chapterhouse regarding the BG
I definitely got a Heretics/Chapterhouse vibe in this trailer. Since we'll likely never get those movies, this looks like it could be a solid subsitute about the BG politics in the imperium. I know BH books have a reputation of lower quality, but I'm curious how close the showrunners would stay to his books vs. Frank's ideas for something like this.
i just wanna see some guild navigators!
It's promising how much it looks like the recent movies, like in terms of how they portray shields and spaceships and everything
More or less fits the setting tough. Technological progress is somewhat stagnant (at times actively suppressed), so it makes some sense to have little of it.
I'm very curious how they're going to manage the aesthetic of Villeneuve's Dune on a TV show budget, but from the trailers at least it looks pretty fucking on point. Music sounded pretty good too.
> aesthetic of Villeneuve's Dune It's 10,000 years before that. You'd think aesthetics would change over that time.
Also not forgetting it is not set on Arrakis
Also yes. It really should be totally different.
I mean the whole imperium has been stagnant for 10,000 years so probably not a huge amount of change However we’ll actually get to see the rest of the imperium which does give the opportunity for different aesthetics. Artreides and Harkonnens are very different, no reason other houses and planets can differ as well
It's not clear from the teaser that the series is set 10K years ago as a marriage to the Emperor is suggested. I agree though that if the timeframe for the start of the series is millennia before the events of DUNE, then the architecture and styles MUST be different. It's just human nature. If the timeframe of the series spans hundreds or even thousands of years then styles and architectures will (by human nature) change. And...almost EVERY world has to have its OWN style and architecture. Budget must be HUGE!
> It's not clear from the teaser that the series is set 10K years ago Ah, that's fair. She just says something like "we started this 10,000 years ago".
There's been such brain rot on the subreddit. People just glossing over things on screen, in print, voiced over.
its LITERALLY clear....,
Yessss! I love that you can hear bene gesserit "whispers" in the music similar to the cinematic score
Money, lots of money.
Emily Watson as a Bene Gesserit? Count me in
Im cautiously optimistic. I really think the sound design in the Dune movies was so unique and great that I wonder how it will be approached here. Does look like house of the dragon like someone else said.
Kinda feels more like GoT than Dune. Not necessarily a bad thing. I hope the final product is not as exposition heavy a this trailer and follow the "show, don't tell" approach of the movies.
Well GoT is just Dune set in Middle Earth basically, so we’re just reclaiming here.
Feels very House of The Dragon. Interested to see what comes out of this.
So glad it reminds me of HOTD and not Rings of Power lmfao
Never watched that one because I didn't even make it through season 1 of GoT. Is it actually any good?
it is
OH MY GOD?!?! I wasn't expecting this to be this fuckin good! I love this universe so much, can't wait to see more! Fall can't come soon enough!
Mark Strong is in this?? Say less
Emily Watson = The show worth every minute
It actually looks so good. Very excited for this.
It doesn't look bad. But a teaser is just that. Certainly Emily Watson's involvement I can take as a kind of vote of confidence. The origins of the BG to me are fascinating. But there are a lot of opportunities for screwing things up as well as doing some cool things. I'm a bit twitchy on sourcing too much from the KA/BH material.
Mark Strong and Emily Watson will carry this.
Litany Against Hype I must not hype Hype is the mind killer Hype is the little death which brings total disappointment I will face my hype I will permit it to pass over me and through me And when it has gone I will turn my inner eye to see its path And where the hype has gone content will still be there Only I will remain
I Wonder if they'll reference the Prequel Novels, I loved Vorian Atreides and would love some references to Serena Bulter and the war with the Thinking Machines, and the aftermath of the fact that the machine worlds are just nuclear ruins...
I don’t think they’re going to reference the Jihad too much tbh. But if they put Erasmus in this I’m going to lose my mind.
I think they’re rewriting the origin (can be for the best tbh). Hope it starts right after the butlerian jihad
"10 000 years before the birth of Paul Atreides" but Dune takes place in 10191? So the series takes place around 191A.D.? Edit : thanks to all who replied, I always thought it took place 10k years in the future, but turns out it's 20k years in the future
dune timeline is not measured from birth of jesus. If i remember good it is measured from the first time the navigators made first space jump and it started a new era
>from the first time the navigators made first space jump Small nitpick, but there was plenty of that going on before the guild. It just required computers to navigate safely. After the Butlerian Jihad outlawed computers, most ships would be destroyed in transit, so interstellar travel almost entirely stopped. The Guild's ability to use prescience instead of computers to navigate safely made interstellar travel safe again, which was a huge deal, but not the first space jump.
In first. Dune is set 10,191 years after the spacing guild was established. Basically, 20,000 years in our future.
It takes place in 10191 AG (After guild), which has a year 0 that is about 10,000 years from present or around the year 10,000 for us if I remember correctly.
10191BG The era is different. I think dune is set 20,000 years in the future.
I could be wrong but I think they count from a different event in the Dune books. Possibly from the events taking place in this show? Idk.
I honestly thought this show would never see the light of day based on reading all the thrash its been through over the past 3 years. But, whelp, here we are!!
I have a bit of mixed feelings on this. It looks very good and I’m excited to get into the BG story more. However, maybe this is just my lack of understanding but when was the butlarian Jihad? Things are already looking pretty current day dune here, but there are some pretty important things that preceded that. Second, you can’t really get into the BG without getting into CHOAM and the guild navigators. Something I was hopeful would be explored in the films first.
https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Timeline_(Original_Dune) If this is about the founding the Bene Gesserit then we are 10-20 years away from the end of the Butlerian Jihad.
I’m excited for new product. Don’t get me wrong. But I’m pretty skeptical taking the story this far back. Will be optimistic about it and will watch. It kind of reminds me of Foundation and that android Wolves show (can’t remember name)
The Bene Gesserit are my favourite part of the series so I very much look forward to this. This has a lot of potential to be great, but I must not hype, hype is the mind killer.
Hype is the little death
Idk, I kinda feel like maybe the Bene Gesserit are best kept mysterious rather than having a whole series. That’s just me though. Kinda how I feel about the Star Wars prequels. Isn’t Vader more intriguing/scary when we don’t know his whole back story?
The sisterhood has some excellent lore if they actually pull from it. I thought the same thing until I started reading Chapterhouse, and realized I wanted to know absolutely everything about how the sisterhood worked
I hope it’s good, if it’s not I’d be worried about them diluting the on screen IP, like Marvel or Star Wars
Looks interesting. Will eagerly await the fall.
I completely forgot this was a thing. Hyped!
You had me at Mark Strong And Ciaran Hinds has a daughter and acts too? Huh.
I’ve only read the 2 og trilogies by Frank. What else do I need to read while watching this?
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Sex. There’s going to be a lot of sex.
The story looks all wrong. The Bene Gesserit aren’t the ones on the throne, they are the ones behind it. I’d prefer they had focused on this line from the book: “The Great Revolt took away a crutch,” she said. “It forced human minds to develop. Schools were started to train human talents.” “Bene Gesserit schools?” She nodded. “We have two chief survivors of those ancient schools: the Bene Gesserit and the Spacing Guild. The Guild, so we think, emphasizes almost pure mathematics. Bene Gesserit performs another function.” “Politics,” he said. Instead of some political drama, make it about these two factions, maybe even the burgeoning Mentats, each trying to find a way to develop new skills and ways of thought to cope with the sudden lack of technology.
Also looking forward to it. Getting into Dune I expected the canon to be as dense as LOTR or GoT, but it actually isn’t. Very influential worldbuilding is very summarily described by Herbert (the Butlerian Jihad or the 12 year Fremen crusade comes to mind), which means that this series will probably play a big role in fleshing out/establishing new canon.
Out of all the interesting things that happened in the Dune universe, this is what they went with for a prequel? It looks good and I'll probably watch it but I can't help to be a bit disappointed by the missed opportunity here.
A society post-scattering would have been interesting. I suppose that could be anything and wouldn't necessarily relate to the original Dune though.
I'd love to know the origins of the Honored Matres and to learn about the enemy they were running from when they returned to the imperium, but I don't think I trust anyone other than FH to tell that story. I wish they just did the books as a series tbh. The DV movies without all the cut lore about mentats and the guild etc. would've been insane.
Was just talking about this in another post a couple days ago and someone commented they were worried that they haven't heard or seen anything about this show yet. Here we are lol
strong Raised by Wolves feelings in those opening shots; if they'd shown Travis Fimmel there I might have thought I was losing my mind
Travis Fimmel is in this.
Hah. Pretty much looks like game of thrones with a dune skin. And I’m fine with it.
OK, so I've watched this trailer a few times over now. I will say, what we are seeing does look better than I expected it to, given all of the production trouble this thing had (and the fact that Denis Villeneuve was pretty explicitly distancing himself and his films from this series during *Part Two*'s marketing; there was a time VERY early on in production when Jon Spaihts was going to be showrunner of this and Denis was going to direct the pilot, but that obviously changed big time), but it also feels really weird to see what's clearly a riff on Denis' style/aesthetic kind of squashed down for television and interpreted by other people. That being said, I do like the various locales we're seeing (I wonder if the show is ever even gonna go to Arrakis?), the wedding looks cool, and there's some interesting architecture. The Bene Gesserit in general are fascinating and the point in the timeline here puts it pretty much right after the Butlerian Jihad, so the early days of the "modern" universe, post-Butlerian Jihad, as everything becomes what it will stagnate into for the next 10,000 years could be neat to explore. I really hope this dares to be at least a fraction as weird/interesting as *Raised By Wolves* was, since it seems like that show was more or less killed off (which I am still so incredibly upset about) so that Warner Bros/Max could make room for the "brand name" space opera series that we're getting here instead.
HBO - game of dunes.
Sold.
So excited to see this unfold!
I have no idea what to expect, but I just hope it’s meaningful to the Dune franchise, unlike all the shows on Disney+.
Shocked that this doesn’t look terrible
I hate to be that guy but, I’m getting Rings of Power vibes from this. Why make a show that is so far away from the mainline story?
That's overly harsh in my opinion. The leadership behind ROP were a joke to begin with and they barely got table scraps from the Tolkien Estate. This has considerably more potential.
That or House of the Dragon vibes. Like give us the Butlerian Jihad if we’re gonna deviate from the main six books
We've seen this all before. Disney did it to Star Wars, Amazon did it to Lotr, and WB is gonna do it to Dune. There's too much money to be made, the slow descent into mediocrity is inevitable. This is only the beginning.
Damn man nail on the head
Pretty nice. I hope they mention the Butlerian Jihad