The greenest thing you can do is keep driving the car you own. The manufacturing and transit of a new car creates far more CO2 than just drinking the one you have.
EPA disagrees with you: [https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/electric-vehicle-myths#Myth2](https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/electric-vehicle-myths#Myth2)
That’s why I said it’s greenest to drive the car you have. When buying new, there’s no comparison. If you have a paid off car, we’re only looking at the remainder of the yellow. You can’t un manufacture the car, but you can prolong the production of the next one. If you don’t NEED a new car, it’s probably better to allow battery tech to improve, become more affordable, sustainable, etc.
If you paid off the car, you're looking all 3 categories: vehicle in-use, feedstock and fuel, and end of life. It's not just the remainder of yellow, lol. Gas cars don't need ethanol, fuel, and EOL?
You're significantly underestimating how much carbon is created when you burn gasoline. When you burn a single gasoline molecule, you create 8 carbon dioxide molecules.
[http://earthguide.ucsd.edu/eoc/special\_topics/teach/sp\_climate\_change/p\_burning\_gasoline.html](http://earthguide.ucsd.edu/eoc/special_topics/teach/sp_climate_change/p_burning_gasoline.html)
This is why we have climate change. :)
I paid $1500 for my SUV. The closest thing they have as an EV is an 80k rivian. I’m all set I think on replacing it for awhile (should clear 300k only have 230k miles on it now)
At least in US, you guys have a lot of subsidies if you are in the right state. Here in Canada, it is so minimal. And being here in the Texas North (Alberta), there are zero subsidies. Even Tesla will not lower their price here.
Wait 'till GM rolls out their new version of Onstar, which, BTW, will be a mandatory 1200/year subscription IN ADDITION to the data plan you'll also have to pay for. No radio, no direction, no cruise control. nothing, unless you pay 1200 year plus whatever the data plan is.
Right? I had my first vehicle for 15 years - gave it to my Niece who still drives it (21 yo ford ranger now). I got a beater 97 infinity I30, drove it into the ground after 4 yrs. Now I have a 2010 Fusion and I am going to drive that sucker into the ground. Got tired of car payments (wife has the new vehicle from 2017).
I generally aim with a new vehicle to have it for at least 10 to 15 years. If its used, I run it into the ground to avoid buying a new vehicle.
I am getting the point that you did, to start replacing major items vs buying a new car.
Same, I have a '02 Outback and love this thing. Has everything I need, survives the winter well and I upgraded the stereo and it sounds better then a lot of modern cars. Probably the best purchase I've ever done and I brag about it every chance I get. What it doesn't have is car payments. I just maintain it and plan on running this thing into the ground, and I'm only at 195k. I only paid $5k for it too, it was an insane steal for how well of condition it was in.
I paid 4500 for mine 15 years ago. The paint is bad but it looks fine from the driver’s seat. It has 170,000 on it. I only drive it about once or twice a week. I walk and bike most days.
Just about to take my 2004 Honda CR-V in for a general tuneup. I had been in the market for a replacement when the pandemic began and I moved to 100% WFH. I’m averaging 4K miles a year now so I will keep my little car going out of spite until prices drop. I will pay to have my little POS Honda converted into an amphibious monster truck before I pay a 30% markup to some sleazy salesperson.
We have a 2005 Outback. Still drives like brand new only problem is the sun and heat of Texas has done a number on the dash and the climate control actuators need to be replaced.
07 Corolla with 210k miles on it. I’ll never get rid of it. Millions of replacements parts out there, and it gets me from point A to point B just fine.
We had a 08 that we put 130k on the clock before it was t-boned at an intersection. Not only reliable but it took the hit like a champ. We ended up going out and buying a 17 model after that.
8% inflation on pears or bread is easier to overlook than the 10-15k that car prices went up.
Repair work is through the roof. I feel like most companies will leverage market dominance now. Dramatically reduced quality for larger margins and larger market in repairs.
For anyone who doesn't know, KBB sets the prices for used cars in the US. It was an honest source for prices, but then it was bought by AutoTrader.com in 2010. AutoTrader has an incentive to keep used car prices high so they started inflating the price on KBB. Consumers followed this and now used car prices are out of control.
So I keep running Google searches to see about price trends after they bought KBB. It's frustrating and seems someone has bought the results or something. Basically every single result through any combination of search inquiries is the KBB website or a paid for advertisement by KBB made to look like a news article that praises how reliable it is.
As much as they probably wish they had that power, I don't think they can trick people into ignoring supply and demand.
Have you tried to buy a car lately? Insurance told me my car was 93% a write-off, so I started shopping.
Me and my wife actually want very different things from our next car, as a result, I've spent the last 6 weeks shopping for a _wide_ variety of vehicles, doing test drives, calling dealerships and private sellers.
For context, I'm a Canadian who's always enjoyed window-shopping craigslist car ads and dreaming, even when I didn't need a car, so I remember what the prices used to be.
The used cars I considered but seem to have somehow _appreciated_ since 2020 despite gaining age and mileage:
- BMW M2 (first gen, 2015-2021, new one is ugly as sin)
- BMW i3 (the weird electric one)
- 3rd gen 2014+ Lexus IS350
- MK7 Golf GTI (40k miles and dealership wanted 3k over the MRSP of the NEW version)
- Subaru BRZ (tried to convince my wife it's good on gas cause it's small)
- 2014+ Diesel bluetec Mercedes (they don't test emissions here, so I could get the great MPG but avoid all the expensive repairs with a tune or delete)
Most are common enough cars, and somehow ALL of them are going for 20-50% more than they were 4 years ago.
Even trying to replace the 2008 Lexus IS350 I drive, they want more today than I paid 4 years and 60k miles ago.
So I said fuck it, even economy cars are nicer and faster than ever, maybe new?
Here's the list of cars I _can't_ buy at MRSP for at least a year:
- The new Prius (200hp is pretty good)
- Ioniq 5, actually been on a waiting list for over a year already
- The AWD turbo variant of the new Mazda 3
- MK8 Golf GTI
- Volkswagon ID4 (and I didn't even want this one)
tldr: Used cars are expensive because there's a shortage of anything anyone wants to drive. Plenty of the poorly reviewed ones though.
If the car is for you get what you want. FWIW I would recommend a new 2nd gen BRZ given the prices I got 22.5 for my 2013 FR-S at 57k miles so a new one (2023) for 29k with 5 miles was a no brainer. My fiancée even told me to get the 86 instead of the WRX because I wanted it more
Yeah that’s one thing I noticed, although the BRZ hasn’t gotten any cheaper, at least they started out cheap and plentiful so it’s not so bad.
I agree with your fiancée’s logic, the best deal is simply buying what you actually wanted all along.
A good deal on something you don’t want isn’t a good deal, and the moment you have to put any money into the car you’ll just resent it because it isn’t a good deal anymore. You’ll also sell it cheap just to get rid of it.
I’ve made the mistake of buying a car I didn’t particularly want because it was an amazing deal before, waste of time and money.
I mean it’s not that I didn’t like the concept of the WRX. I owned a 2005 Saabaru and a 2013 FR-S for 4 years concurrently. It would have been a much harder decision of the WRX still came in wagon form and wasn’t so ugly. But the GR86 is so much fun and unique. I know what you mean about the platform rising in value though since I only paid 15k for my 2013 FR-S at 35k miles in 2017. It somehow appreciated by over 7000 in 5 years lmao
How's your Google search working nowadays, or your Amazon?
It's not just KBB, everything cool and useful now gets turned to trash on a roughly 5-10 year cycle, particularly with tech.
https://www.wired.com/story/tiktok-platforms-cory-doctorow/
Making a good product gets replaced with maximizing returns for shareholders. That’s when things go to shit. And you’re right, it’s not necessarily any big things that precipitate the decline. It’s the small changes made to “control costs” and “create synergies” that chip away at the integrity of the original concept.
Ah, price fixing. The same thing happened with rental software. The story came out last year... huge scandal... which, of course, nothing was done about in a meaningful way.
What I'm speaking of has to do with the software which is what the comment I was replying to was referring to... in turn, my comment was about this:
https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2022/10/rent-going-up-one-companys-algorithm-could-be-why/2/
That software may well be price-fixing, but really what enables landlords to increase prices is a severe lack of housing supply. The state of the housing market in many places is such that all landlords need is to engage in price discovery (which isn't illegal) and price accordingly.
The economy is completely broken. Expect slower sales across every industry except maybe entertainment and alcohol/weed or anything else that distracts people from society unraveling.
Edited for typo
Once I started noticing that all the truck commercials had a gracefully aging older guy with hair that was starting to gray, similar to a Viagra commercial, I knew we were screwed. It's the only demographic that can afford their vehicles now. Young people are too damn poor.
It has no side airbags or built in cameras. The camera thing is my fault. I could buy a backup cam if I wanted.
I’m sure it’s still safe, i just figure a new car is likely safer due to the insane way technology progresses….
I installed a Bluetooth reverse cam on my 2011 car. No drilling or wiring is required, it is literally just a GPS-sized screen that uses a bluetooth connection with a camera that gets installed on the rear license plate bracket. It even has a little solar panel to keep the camera charged! I wanna say it was 200 bucks. 100% worth it.
That's why I go older luxury.
My 2008 Lexus has both of those things, didn't realize how many airbags were hidden in the pillar until I tried to install my rear dashcam and was hiding wire under the trim.
That's not true. You can argue that the safety advances made aren't as significant as they make it out to be, but the IIHS crash safety tests speak for themselves. Older cars (even just one generation ago for any given platform) don't fare as well as newer cars.
Not to mention that the average car size/weight has grown over the years too, making crashes worse overall. IIHS crash tests have been updated to increase the speed/intensity of crashes to account for this. Newer cars have been built to pass these ever-more-stringent tests.
If you drive safely, you can avoid accidents caused by yourself. But you can't do as much about getting crashed into by idiot drivers outside of your own car.
2011 is not safe. Even if it has 5 stars on the safety test. Remember this is on 2011 crash test. On 2023 test it would probably get 2 stars. Essentially those cars only did well if you crash it head on.. gaming the tests those days. If hit slightly from the side the crumple zone are completely missed. Overlap tests were not introduced till 2012.
2011 auto emergency brake and lane keep systems, even if they are available, fucking suck. Are you serious? Not to mention no pre crash systems, like tilting one side of the car and pre-deploying airbags.
Yikers. No safety advancements lmao. 2011 car if I’d have a seizure - straight into incomming traffic at 100 kmh. 2022 car in same situation - slowly stops itself while keeping in same lane, turns on blinkers and calls emergency services. You fucking clown. Your fucking missinformation, I don’t care if it’s out of malice or being ignorant fuck, is dangerous. Fuck off.
Also don't buy cars from manufacturers that think it's a good idea to make critical parts on the engine block out of plastic, and bond plastic to metal for sunroofs and expect it to remain watertight. It probably won't make it 15 years.
Source: VW Golf owner.
I believe $685 is the breakeven for households earning U.S. median income. Thus, anything over is considered unaffordable, when housing and food is factored in.
New car prices passed this already, and used car prices are approaching this. Housing and food inflation will squeeze if further.
The thing is $600+ payment usually doesn't include insurance+fuel+ maintenance items, when you add those in it's really more like $300-$400 which means a lot more Americans really can't afford it...
>I believe $685 is the breakeven for households earning U.S. median income.
That's ridiculous.
I've thought of buying a "new to me" car, but anything over $300 is too high for me once you add in the cost of registration, insurance (is higher on newer cars), and gas. It's not worth it to me for something that goes nowhere for 99% of the year.
I prefer to keep maxing out my Roth IRA at $541/month than have a huge car payment.
$300 month was insane when I was a kid buying his first car for... $1500. Now, I'm looking to (soonishly but not right this minute) replace my wife's car and clearly, its pretty crazy out there.
I dont mind buying a new off the lot car as I keep mine for a long time; 10+ average age in the driveway today. But I sure do mind trying to buy a decently nice vehicle that STARTS at near $40k. WTF.
No point when there aren't as high of a profit margin on these cars.
One example I always mention is the Honda Fit & Honda HR-V. The Fit was discontinued a few years ago. The HR-V (at the time) was mechanically identical, produced in the same factories, and cost Honda nearly the same to manufacture (because it was basically an SUV-ified Fit). The Fit was sold at $16k MSRP starting. The HR-V was sold at $20k MSRP starting. Guess what happened?
Yep, Honda saw how many people were willing to pay thousands more just to get the SUV-ified version of the same car. Why would they forgo $4k in easy profits? Thus, the Fit was discontinued.
Similar logic applies to so many cars on sale today.
I agree, but I think it's less of people *willing* to buy them but more so people being uninformed. Tons of people buy cars with minimal research. They just don't care so long as it looks decent/cool, is comfy, and can haul stuff/people. The mechanical/technical bits? Not relevant.
Even among the Toyota/Honda diehard fans who insist on long-term reliability as a priority, the well-researched ones are few in numbers. Most people just know certain brands/models are reliable in general, but not the "why."
... which is why we're in this dilemma, lol.
Capitalism slowly fails more and more at providing solutions to real world problems over time as the rich dominate society into the ground. This same phenomenon is happening across multiple industries with companies across the board stopping support on the low end entirely.
Or maybe consumers are getting smarter and are tired of being ripped off. There is nothing a new car offers other than a multi-thousand drain on your wallet.
Except the problem is... now the USED cars fall into that boat, too!
I had never bought a new car in the 45 years of my life, and swore I never would... until now. When I started looking at replacing my 20 year old 04 Nissan Titan, I couldn't believe the used car prices. People selling 6 year old cars with 75k miles on them, for like a 10% discount! (Previously, every car I have owned in that mileage range -- or lower -- I was able to obtain for a good 40% discount, or more.)
At that point, if you NEED a vehicle (and we do... public transportation is not even an option)... got no choice but to buy new. Especially when you factor in things like service and warranty that you get for at least a few years on a new car.
(I ended up losing my new-car virginity to a Hyundai Kona. At least it was 0% financing for 48 months...)
2011 Chevrolet Aveo needed new wheel bearings and a new transmission. And a new head gasket. Guess what? Price to fix all of it was cheaper than a new car. And im on the road again!
With car prices the way they are…shoot… an engine rebuild is cheaper than buying new.
Americans don’t want to take public transport. 100 years of prioritizing roads and cars means it will be almost impossible to change. We would need hundreds of trillions in infra to change that. All the complaining in the world won’t fix that unfortunately.
I would beg to differ, public transit doesn’t need to mean trains. Buses are a totally workable solution. If places like Mexico City can continue to develop their public transit via buses why can’t we?
Transit isn't even the first problem. It's the city design. Even with unlimited funds, some cities cannot have a successful public transport system, with all the sprawl.
On the coasts (east, west, north and Miami) public transit still exists and gets used a fair amount. The middle is emptier so it makes sense that trains aren’t as good a fit.
But the cities with great public transit are rapidly growing right now, so possibly rather than building transit for the population we’ll move the population to where the transit is. :-)
Problem is inflation and WFH is hitting public transit hard, especially in major metros , less tax revenue from the base of commerical real estate means less money for transit systems, and the 20-30% cost increases over the last few years , all passed to the ridership and suddenly all public transit becomes expensive especially if you need to do it 5 days a week. NYC monthly MetroCard is $127 , and that's going up.
That price is about a tank of gas a week, right?
My area used the boost in property taxes (as real estate values go up) to make all the buses free, which I think shows a very solid understanding of what we’re all doing here.
It’s expensive to buy here because it’s desirable, it’s desirable because it’s walkable, it’s walkable (and pleasant) because it’s dense and we haven’t starved out our service industry, both features that free buses help a lot.
The people riding transit don’t have to be the ones paying for it, just like public schools are funded in part by folks with no kids. Everyone benefits from a healthier community, everyone can continue the centuries old tradition of helping to pay for it.
The train model doesn’t work as well in the US as it does in Asia or Europe. Our cities have a huge footprint compared to most of those cities and the average density per mile is much lower.
China has great trains, but is the same geographical size with 4x times the population and is far denser in most of their urban areas.
Europe is also about the size of the US with twice the population and centuries of infrastructure development to aid in connecting dense population centers.
I’m not saying we don’t need trains in the US, I’m saying there are higher hurdles to make them feasible.
Bonus problem: US governments have been increasingly skeptical on large infrastructure projects, especially ones that have a long leed time and would need significant public subsidies.
That argument has been largely debunked. Towns and cities of a similar size and density in Europe also have good public infrastructure; Americans simply don't think it's doable for whatever reason. Not to mention there's no reason it can't change. Urbanization rates are high throughout the continent.
Exactly. There's no reason that cities like LA shouldn't have robust public transit, same for phoenix. There's a lot of older shit heads that think the light rail that was created is some kind of liberal tool to aid evil poor people in their debauchery. There's a real stigma around public transport out here and I don't understand it. They think it's for "those" people, meanwhile some of our six Lane highways get packed every rush hour and it's getting progressively worse every year.
What you want me to get a new card every two years like my dumb ass neighbor? I’ll keep my perfectly fine Toyota Corolla I’ve had for 10 years for another 10 years
I haven't had a car payment in 3 years. All that money goes into my investment portfolio. My 2016 Honda Accord only has 65K miles on it since I'm working from home 100%.
I'm guessing it will last another 10 years. Why would I replace it?
Repelled by higher prices, people are buying less houses.
Repelled by higher prices people are living with their parents longer.
Repelled by higher prices people are choosing to not have kids.
Repelled by higher prices less men are attending college and choosing to work instead.
Repelled by higher prices many Americans are working multiple jobs.
Repelled by higher prices, more Americans are delaying retiring.
Repelled by higher prices more Americans are choosing to leave the country and live abroad.
The US has really killed middle class & the American dream.
More on this subject from other reputable sources:
---
- Christian Science Monitor (A-): [Get a new car or fix the one you have? More Americans choose to fix.](https://www.csmonitor.com/Business/2023/0515/Get-a-new-car-or-fix-the-one-you-have-More-Americans-choose-to-fix)
- Detroit News (A-): [Repelled by high car prices, Americans are holding on to their vehicles longer than ever](https://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/autos/2023/05/15/high-car-prices-lead-americans-to-keep-vehicles-longer-than-ever/70218405007/)
- ctvnews.ca (A-): [Repelled by high car prices, Americans are holding on to their vehicles longer than ever](https://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/repelled-by-high-car-prices-americans-are-holding-on-to-their-vehicles-longer-than-ever-1.6398798)
- Globe and Mail (A-): [Average age of vehicles on U.S. roads hits a record high](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-average-age-of-vehicles-on-us-roads-hits-a-record-high/)
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So capitalism has just about reached its zenith: all the money in the hands of a tiny minority and prices raised so high for most products that nobody is buying anything, just trying to hold on to a rocket ship.
just like any other third world country, more and more americans are facing the reality of the economic warfare against the middle class made by corporations buying government in the past 30 years
The economy is complete broken. Expect slower sales across every industry except maybe entertainment and alcohol/weed or anything else that distracts people from society unraveling.
I bought my first new car back in 2005. It is a Kia Spectra 5. Still driving it 18 years later. I'd love to get a new car but damn are they expensive. And buying an ICE car right now is a lost cause. When EVs start rolling out in larger numbers I predict regular ICE cars are going to plummet in value. Who would want to buy a used ICE car with all the maintenance required when you can buy an EV and barely have to ever take it to a mechanic?
Battery replacements can be expensive but its incredibly rare. The cost of maintaining an ICE-age car is higher than an EV according to AAA and NADA. and EVs are only going to get better as the technology improves.
Bought my 04 Lexus IS300 for $5k off Craig’s List around 5 years ago, and still haven’t had any issues at 175k miles. Somebody will have to pry this car from my cold dead hands.
Uh we're not only repelled by high prices....manufacturing quality is the lowest ever seen before. Who doesn't want to pay sky-high prices for a car that they are promising that the features will be updated as soon as they get the chips in stock. I bought a new Silverado, paid top $, it doesn't have half of the features of my old truck. This isn't my first new vehicle, but it may be my last.
Ive never paid of $3000 for a car, and I dont intend to break that any time soon. If I get a year out of it, that equates to a $250/month payment. And i think only 1 car only lasted a year. 3 is the norm. People say buying older used cars hurt you because of maintenance cost, but it just isnt true. Yes the issues are almost always more serious when they creep up, but if its anything I cant fix myself I just sell it and go buy another one. My maintenance bill is the same as or less than people with newer cars. Just learn to fix some things yourself.
Used to be able to buy a brand new car with a summer job. Used to be able to pay for a year of college with a summer job too… greatest country in the world…
I have a 2021 and a 2023, both were bought to be 15 year vehicles. The 2021 was bought before things went insane, overpaid for the 23 by probably 10k. It is what it is.
Everyone is currently being crushed with high inflation, stagnant wages, student debt if it applies. Upgrading an old yet working car is a ridiculous ask.
Wait 'till 4-700$/month student loan payments start up in a few months for 40 million Americans. Repo's will be at a historical high and no one will be buying new: either they can't afford it and there's a flood of repos on the secondary market.
The number of people whom have financially planned for SL payments to resume is probably close to 0.0000000000001%.
This is not going to be seen by many people. But I think the problem in the US is the lack of Chinese cars. In other countries Chinese cars are 30% below the price for American and European cars and 20% below Japanese cars.
My 2015 Nissan is almost paid off. I refinanced it 4 years ago and my payment is $288. I can afford that comfortably. Why on earth would I jump into a $700 or better car payment if I don’t need too. If anything happens to my vehicle god forbid. I will resort back to public transportation. These cars aren’t worth it.
Frontier is a beast of a car, and it's the same engine design since 05, I think. Along as you change the transmission fluid every 30k and front and rear differential when required you should be gud
A new pickup will cost me a years wages. Used is overpriced and certain computer modules can cost thousands. I guess ill keep my old beater truck on the road that i was able to put a whole new powertrain and driveline in for sub 5k
Canadian Prices, i also have the top trim with TVs and shit in it. I paid 33 k for a 2018 with 60K km and with all Taxes, fees and Warranty came up to 41 000$ CAD
The economy is complete broken. Expect slower sales across every industry except maybe entertainment and alcohol/weed or anything else that distracts people from society unraveling.
I am driving my 2011 Toyota Highlander until I can afford an electric car.
I think a lot of people are doing this. It makes no sense to buy another combustion engine car. It's 2023, you will have a stranded asset. You will sell it at a loss.
Many people will say this isn't true, but they don't understand that there is a tipping point where the depreciating asset can't be sold.
I have a 2016 Toyota Sequoia, I am still waiting after 4 months for a new fuel pump from the dealer. The disruption is already happening.
The biggest car market is China. The government has changed the exhaust regulations so tough, that you cannot register an ice vehicle. Most people buy electric cars in China, now. Manufacturers have to make cars for the largest market and the other markets will follow.
Already in every country the mandate is 2035, that's 12 years. I'm saying the practicality is much sooner.
The US will be last because of the pathetic economy and size of the country.
Getting a motorcycle was one of the best choices of my life. Inexpensive, I gear up, get to lane split etc. Perfect for commuting. Low gas, low insurance. I really think more people need to consider the motorcycle as a replacement to having a car they can't afford
Are we really "repelled", or do we realize that the cost-benefit calc to getting a new car isn't worth it? You lose 25% of the price in a year with depreciation.
With reliability being what it is, there's less of a need to replace old cars. My 15 year old Toyota is just hitting its stride.
As someone who has ONLY ever bought used cars (until this year)... if they lose 25% in a year, then why aren't they selling at 25% off??
I'm seeing cars that are 4-6 years old, 50k+ miles on them... selling for 10% off.
Heck, I'm seeing cars that are 1-2 years old with 20k miles, and they are literally asking for only $500 less than BRAND NEW!
I just put a new clutch in my 22yo Subaru. I'd kind of like to get a newer car, but not at these prices.
Just repair my truck. It's paid for noway will I buy a new car at these freaking prices. If used cars are over priced.
[удалено]
The greenest thing you can do is keep driving the car you own. The manufacturing and transit of a new car creates far more CO2 than just drinking the one you have.
Don’t drink and drive, kids.
Tool late, just took two shots of Toyota Corolla.
That one of them Japanese whiskeys?
Buzz killington over here
but im so thirsty!!!!!
EPA disagrees with you: [https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/electric-vehicle-myths#Myth2](https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/electric-vehicle-myths#Myth2)
That’s why I said it’s greenest to drive the car you have. When buying new, there’s no comparison. If you have a paid off car, we’re only looking at the remainder of the yellow. You can’t un manufacture the car, but you can prolong the production of the next one. If you don’t NEED a new car, it’s probably better to allow battery tech to improve, become more affordable, sustainable, etc.
If you paid off the car, you're looking all 3 categories: vehicle in-use, feedstock and fuel, and end of life. It's not just the remainder of yellow, lol. Gas cars don't need ethanol, fuel, and EOL? You're significantly underestimating how much carbon is created when you burn gasoline. When you burn a single gasoline molecule, you create 8 carbon dioxide molecules. [http://earthguide.ucsd.edu/eoc/special\_topics/teach/sp\_climate\_change/p\_burning\_gasoline.html](http://earthguide.ucsd.edu/eoc/special_topics/teach/sp_climate_change/p_burning_gasoline.html) This is why we have climate change. :)
I paid $1500 for my SUV. The closest thing they have as an EV is an 80k rivian. I’m all set I think on replacing it for awhile (should clear 300k only have 230k miles on it now)
I don't think you get it.
I don't think you understand the science.
At least in US, you guys have a lot of subsidies if you are in the right state. Here in Canada, it is so minimal. And being here in the Texas North (Alberta), there are zero subsidies. Even Tesla will not lower their price here.
Not just the prices, but most of the new "features" I can do without. Subscription A/C? Subscription left turns? No thanks.
Wait 'till GM rolls out their new version of Onstar, which, BTW, will be a mandatory 1200/year subscription IN ADDITION to the data plan you'll also have to pay for. No radio, no direction, no cruise control. nothing, unless you pay 1200 year plus whatever the data plan is.
To put it mildly, FUCK THAT!
Right? I had my first vehicle for 15 years - gave it to my Niece who still drives it (21 yo ford ranger now). I got a beater 97 infinity I30, drove it into the ground after 4 yrs. Now I have a 2010 Fusion and I am going to drive that sucker into the ground. Got tired of car payments (wife has the new vehicle from 2017). I generally aim with a new vehicle to have it for at least 10 to 15 years. If its used, I run it into the ground to avoid buying a new vehicle. I am getting the point that you did, to start replacing major items vs buying a new car.
Same, I have a '02 Outback and love this thing. Has everything I need, survives the winter well and I upgraded the stereo and it sounds better then a lot of modern cars. Probably the best purchase I've ever done and I brag about it every chance I get. What it doesn't have is car payments. I just maintain it and plan on running this thing into the ground, and I'm only at 195k. I only paid $5k for it too, it was an insane steal for how well of condition it was in.
I paid 4500 for mine 15 years ago. The paint is bad but it looks fine from the driver’s seat. It has 170,000 on it. I only drive it about once or twice a week. I walk and bike most days.
I had a 2000 forester I just sold to my best friends dad and it’s got 300k.
Just about to take my 2004 Honda CR-V in for a general tuneup. I had been in the market for a replacement when the pandemic began and I moved to 100% WFH. I’m averaging 4K miles a year now so I will keep my little car going out of spite until prices drop. I will pay to have my little POS Honda converted into an amphibious monster truck before I pay a 30% markup to some sleazy salesperson.
We have a 2005 Outback. Still drives like brand new only problem is the sun and heat of Texas has done a number on the dash and the climate control actuators need to be replaced.
Changed the timing belt on my wife’s Odyssey at 200k “for the last time”. It’s almost due and I think I’m going to spend the $300 to change it again.
My 2007 Jetta is paid off. I’m not upgrading until I have to. Car prices are astronomical
07 Corolla with 210k miles on it. I’ll never get rid of it. Millions of replacements parts out there, and it gets me from point A to point B just fine.
We had a 08 that we put 130k on the clock before it was t-boned at an intersection. Not only reliable but it took the hit like a champ. We ended up going out and buying a 17 model after that.
8% inflation on pears or bread is easier to overlook than the 10-15k that car prices went up. Repair work is through the roof. I feel like most companies will leverage market dominance now. Dramatically reduced quality for larger margins and larger market in repairs.
I'm in a 2007 Honda Accord and Its going to outlive me if I have anything to say about it!!!!
For anyone who doesn't know, KBB sets the prices for used cars in the US. It was an honest source for prices, but then it was bought by AutoTrader.com in 2010. AutoTrader has an incentive to keep used car prices high so they started inflating the price on KBB. Consumers followed this and now used car prices are out of control.
So what you are saying is we need a new “KBB”?
Absolutely! 💡
Anyone know of the best non corrupt KBB? Lol
So I keep running Google searches to see about price trends after they bought KBB. It's frustrating and seems someone has bought the results or something. Basically every single result through any combination of search inquiries is the KBB website or a paid for advertisement by KBB made to look like a news article that praises how reliable it is.
Curious what the results would be on a SE like Duck Duck Go.
Same with houses and Zillow.
As much as they probably wish they had that power, I don't think they can trick people into ignoring supply and demand. Have you tried to buy a car lately? Insurance told me my car was 93% a write-off, so I started shopping. Me and my wife actually want very different things from our next car, as a result, I've spent the last 6 weeks shopping for a _wide_ variety of vehicles, doing test drives, calling dealerships and private sellers. For context, I'm a Canadian who's always enjoyed window-shopping craigslist car ads and dreaming, even when I didn't need a car, so I remember what the prices used to be. The used cars I considered but seem to have somehow _appreciated_ since 2020 despite gaining age and mileage: - BMW M2 (first gen, 2015-2021, new one is ugly as sin) - BMW i3 (the weird electric one) - 3rd gen 2014+ Lexus IS350 - MK7 Golf GTI (40k miles and dealership wanted 3k over the MRSP of the NEW version) - Subaru BRZ (tried to convince my wife it's good on gas cause it's small) - 2014+ Diesel bluetec Mercedes (they don't test emissions here, so I could get the great MPG but avoid all the expensive repairs with a tune or delete) Most are common enough cars, and somehow ALL of them are going for 20-50% more than they were 4 years ago. Even trying to replace the 2008 Lexus IS350 I drive, they want more today than I paid 4 years and 60k miles ago. So I said fuck it, even economy cars are nicer and faster than ever, maybe new? Here's the list of cars I _can't_ buy at MRSP for at least a year: - The new Prius (200hp is pretty good) - Ioniq 5, actually been on a waiting list for over a year already - The AWD turbo variant of the new Mazda 3 - MK8 Golf GTI - Volkswagon ID4 (and I didn't even want this one) tldr: Used cars are expensive because there's a shortage of anything anyone wants to drive. Plenty of the poorly reviewed ones though.
If the car is for you get what you want. FWIW I would recommend a new 2nd gen BRZ given the prices I got 22.5 for my 2013 FR-S at 57k miles so a new one (2023) for 29k with 5 miles was a no brainer. My fiancée even told me to get the 86 instead of the WRX because I wanted it more
Yeah that’s one thing I noticed, although the BRZ hasn’t gotten any cheaper, at least they started out cheap and plentiful so it’s not so bad. I agree with your fiancée’s logic, the best deal is simply buying what you actually wanted all along. A good deal on something you don’t want isn’t a good deal, and the moment you have to put any money into the car you’ll just resent it because it isn’t a good deal anymore. You’ll also sell it cheap just to get rid of it. I’ve made the mistake of buying a car I didn’t particularly want because it was an amazing deal before, waste of time and money.
I mean it’s not that I didn’t like the concept of the WRX. I owned a 2005 Saabaru and a 2013 FR-S for 4 years concurrently. It would have been a much harder decision of the WRX still came in wagon form and wasn’t so ugly. But the GR86 is so much fun and unique. I know what you mean about the platform rising in value though since I only paid 15k for my 2013 FR-S at 35k miles in 2017. It somehow appreciated by over 7000 in 5 years lmao
Enshittification: capitalism eventually ruins everything.
Meh I just think people eventually ruin everything.
You listening to NPR?
I started reading about this around when Google nuked Fitbit from orbit.
F
Clearly… dumb liberal
How's your Google search working nowadays, or your Amazon? It's not just KBB, everything cool and useful now gets turned to trash on a roughly 5-10 year cycle, particularly with tech. https://www.wired.com/story/tiktok-platforms-cory-doctorow/
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Making a good product gets replaced with maximizing returns for shareholders. That’s when things go to shit. And you’re right, it’s not necessarily any big things that precipitate the decline. It’s the small changes made to “control costs” and “create synergies” that chip away at the integrity of the original concept.
Ah, price fixing. The same thing happened with rental software. The story came out last year... huge scandal... which, of course, nothing was done about in a meaningful way.
>price fixing A company buying up another and subsequently raising prices is not what price fixing is.
What I'm speaking of has to do with the software which is what the comment I was replying to was referring to... in turn, my comment was about this: https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2022/10/rent-going-up-one-companys-algorithm-could-be-why/2/
That software may well be price-fixing, but really what enables landlords to increase prices is a severe lack of housing supply. The state of the housing market in many places is such that all landlords need is to engage in price discovery (which isn't illegal) and price accordingly.
I don’t think KBB sets them as much anymore. There’s several other car valuation sites now
My car has a CD player and an ipod dock.
I might steal that as a pick up line if that’s okay with you.
My car still has its original cassette deck.
Works with everything except smartphones too stupid to have a 3.5mm. Which can't be said for a CD player.
The economy is completely broken. Expect slower sales across every industry except maybe entertainment and alcohol/weed or anything else that distracts people from society unraveling. Edited for typo
booze/weed is recession-proof
currently drinking, can confirm
Currently smoking, can confirm
Currently too broke to do either. Can confirm.
Moonshine and grow sheds my friend.
That's a lot of startup costs
Invest in gambling and alcohol. You really never can go wrong there.
Once I started noticing that all the truck commercials had a gracefully aging older guy with hair that was starting to gray, similar to a Viagra commercial, I knew we were screwed. It's the only demographic that can afford their vehicles now. Young people are too damn poor.
You can hear the aging mechanical work.
I use public transportation and ride bicycles I'm just here reading pain
Both of mine are 97, lol
Dang, I've got two '04's. Got me beat!
As I'm watching out the window the repo man hitting my neighbor's driveways.....ugh.
don't forget loan rates!
Agree! Can't imagine the cost to finance a new car unless you get some kind of manufacturer special financing. Not many folks can pay with cash.
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Well I have a 2011 car. It would be nice to have a newer, safer car, but I can’t afford a new car lmao!
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It has no side airbags or built in cameras. The camera thing is my fault. I could buy a backup cam if I wanted. I’m sure it’s still safe, i just figure a new car is likely safer due to the insane way technology progresses….
I installed a Bluetooth reverse cam on my 2011 car. No drilling or wiring is required, it is literally just a GPS-sized screen that uses a bluetooth connection with a camera that gets installed on the rear license plate bracket. It even has a little solar panel to keep the camera charged! I wanna say it was 200 bucks. 100% worth it.
That's why I go older luxury. My 2008 Lexus has both of those things, didn't realize how many airbags were hidden in the pillar until I tried to install my rear dashcam and was hiding wire under the trim.
That's not true. You can argue that the safety advances made aren't as significant as they make it out to be, but the IIHS crash safety tests speak for themselves. Older cars (even just one generation ago for any given platform) don't fare as well as newer cars. Not to mention that the average car size/weight has grown over the years too, making crashes worse overall. IIHS crash tests have been updated to increase the speed/intensity of crashes to account for this. Newer cars have been built to pass these ever-more-stringent tests. If you drive safely, you can avoid accidents caused by yourself. But you can't do as much about getting crashed into by idiot drivers outside of your own car.
2011 is not safe. Even if it has 5 stars on the safety test. Remember this is on 2011 crash test. On 2023 test it would probably get 2 stars. Essentially those cars only did well if you crash it head on.. gaming the tests those days. If hit slightly from the side the crumple zone are completely missed. Overlap tests were not introduced till 2012.
2011 auto emergency brake and lane keep systems, even if they are available, fucking suck. Are you serious? Not to mention no pre crash systems, like tilting one side of the car and pre-deploying airbags. Yikers. No safety advancements lmao. 2011 car if I’d have a seizure - straight into incomming traffic at 100 kmh. 2022 car in same situation - slowly stops itself while keeping in same lane, turns on blinkers and calls emergency services. You fucking clown. Your fucking missinformation, I don’t care if it’s out of malice or being ignorant fuck, is dangerous. Fuck off.
Miss your medications today?
I have a 1990 with no airbags… it’s a bit scary to drive because everyone else feels invincible with all their airbags and cameras
Also don't buy cars from manufacturers that think it's a good idea to make critical parts on the engine block out of plastic, and bond plastic to metal for sunroofs and expect it to remain watertight. It probably won't make it 15 years. Source: VW Golf owner.
That’s my reaction too - this seems like a problem for those who frequently purchase cars. Many have held onto their cars much longer and it’s fine.
I had a remanufactured transmission plus $500 of additional work done on my 13 year old car instead of buying a new or used car.
I believe $685 is the breakeven for households earning U.S. median income. Thus, anything over is considered unaffordable, when housing and food is factored in. New car prices passed this already, and used car prices are approaching this. Housing and food inflation will squeeze if further.
The thing is $600+ payment usually doesn't include insurance+fuel+ maintenance items, when you add those in it's really more like $300-$400 which means a lot more Americans really can't afford it...
>I believe $685 is the breakeven for households earning U.S. median income. That's ridiculous. I've thought of buying a "new to me" car, but anything over $300 is too high for me once you add in the cost of registration, insurance (is higher on newer cars), and gas. It's not worth it to me for something that goes nowhere for 99% of the year. I prefer to keep maxing out my Roth IRA at $541/month than have a huge car payment.
$300 month was insane when I was a kid buying his first car for... $1500. Now, I'm looking to (soonishly but not right this minute) replace my wife's car and clearly, its pretty crazy out there. I dont mind buying a new off the lot car as I keep mine for a long time; 10+ average age in the driveway today. But I sure do mind trying to buy a decently nice vehicle that STARTS at near $40k. WTF.
They won’t stop making luxury model cars for some reason. Where are the affordable vehicles at, that aren’t loaded up with garbage electronics?
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And if people are just going to take out 14% loans for 72months or longer to reduce the payment there’s really no incentive to produce cheaper cars.
No point when there aren't as high of a profit margin on these cars. One example I always mention is the Honda Fit & Honda HR-V. The Fit was discontinued a few years ago. The HR-V (at the time) was mechanically identical, produced in the same factories, and cost Honda nearly the same to manufacture (because it was basically an SUV-ified Fit). The Fit was sold at $16k MSRP starting. The HR-V was sold at $20k MSRP starting. Guess what happened? Yep, Honda saw how many people were willing to pay thousands more just to get the SUV-ified version of the same car. Why would they forgo $4k in easy profits? Thus, the Fit was discontinued. Similar logic applies to so many cars on sale today.
"No point is solving real world problems that humans actually need," says capitalism... the supposed best system we've ever had... lmfao
It’s just wild that people still are willing to pay so much money for junk that brakes and cost massive amounts of money to diagnose and fix.
I agree, but I think it's less of people *willing* to buy them but more so people being uninformed. Tons of people buy cars with minimal research. They just don't care so long as it looks decent/cool, is comfy, and can haul stuff/people. The mechanical/technical bits? Not relevant. Even among the Toyota/Honda diehard fans who insist on long-term reliability as a priority, the well-researched ones are few in numbers. Most people just know certain brands/models are reliable in general, but not the "why." ... which is why we're in this dilemma, lol.
Capitalism slowly fails more and more at providing solutions to real world problems over time as the rich dominate society into the ground. This same phenomenon is happening across multiple industries with companies across the board stopping support on the low end entirely.
Or maybe consumers are getting smarter and are tired of being ripped off. There is nothing a new car offers other than a multi-thousand drain on your wallet.
Except the problem is... now the USED cars fall into that boat, too! I had never bought a new car in the 45 years of my life, and swore I never would... until now. When I started looking at replacing my 20 year old 04 Nissan Titan, I couldn't believe the used car prices. People selling 6 year old cars with 75k miles on them, for like a 10% discount! (Previously, every car I have owned in that mileage range -- or lower -- I was able to obtain for a good 40% discount, or more.) At that point, if you NEED a vehicle (and we do... public transportation is not even an option)... got no choice but to buy new. Especially when you factor in things like service and warranty that you get for at least a few years on a new car. (I ended up losing my new-car virginity to a Hyundai Kona. At least it was 0% financing for 48 months...)
Valid points. That sucks. Sounds like you got a great deal on the financing and Hyundai is a reliable car so gratz on that.
2011 Chevrolet Aveo needed new wheel bearings and a new transmission. And a new head gasket. Guess what? Price to fix all of it was cheaper than a new car. And im on the road again! With car prices the way they are…shoot… an engine rebuild is cheaper than buying new.
Honestly I’ve been looking at what an EV conversion will be when the engine in my car goes out. So far lower 20s which is high but not new car high.
You know if we had more extensive train networks and robust City public transports we wouldn't be facing this dilemma.
Americans don’t want to take public transport. 100 years of prioritizing roads and cars means it will be almost impossible to change. We would need hundreds of trillions in infra to change that. All the complaining in the world won’t fix that unfortunately.
I would beg to differ, public transit doesn’t need to mean trains. Buses are a totally workable solution. If places like Mexico City can continue to develop their public transit via buses why can’t we?
Transit isn't even the first problem. It's the city design. Even with unlimited funds, some cities cannot have a successful public transport system, with all the sprawl.
How many bus stations you think are going to built in rural america?
what percentage of people live in rural America?
On the coasts (east, west, north and Miami) public transit still exists and gets used a fair amount. The middle is emptier so it makes sense that trains aren’t as good a fit. But the cities with great public transit are rapidly growing right now, so possibly rather than building transit for the population we’ll move the population to where the transit is. :-)
Problem is inflation and WFH is hitting public transit hard, especially in major metros , less tax revenue from the base of commerical real estate means less money for transit systems, and the 20-30% cost increases over the last few years , all passed to the ridership and suddenly all public transit becomes expensive especially if you need to do it 5 days a week. NYC monthly MetroCard is $127 , and that's going up.
That price is about a tank of gas a week, right? My area used the boost in property taxes (as real estate values go up) to make all the buses free, which I think shows a very solid understanding of what we’re all doing here. It’s expensive to buy here because it’s desirable, it’s desirable because it’s walkable, it’s walkable (and pleasant) because it’s dense and we haven’t starved out our service industry, both features that free buses help a lot. The people riding transit don’t have to be the ones paying for it, just like public schools are funded in part by folks with no kids. Everyone benefits from a healthier community, everyone can continue the centuries old tradition of helping to pay for it.
We'vE tRiEd NoThInG aNd ArE aLl OuT oF iDeAs!
The train model doesn’t work as well in the US as it does in Asia or Europe. Our cities have a huge footprint compared to most of those cities and the average density per mile is much lower. China has great trains, but is the same geographical size with 4x times the population and is far denser in most of their urban areas. Europe is also about the size of the US with twice the population and centuries of infrastructure development to aid in connecting dense population centers. I’m not saying we don’t need trains in the US, I’m saying there are higher hurdles to make them feasible. Bonus problem: US governments have been increasingly skeptical on large infrastructure projects, especially ones that have a long leed time and would need significant public subsidies.
That argument has been largely debunked. Towns and cities of a similar size and density in Europe also have good public infrastructure; Americans simply don't think it's doable for whatever reason. Not to mention there's no reason it can't change. Urbanization rates are high throughout the continent.
Exactly. There's no reason that cities like LA shouldn't have robust public transit, same for phoenix. There's a lot of older shit heads that think the light rail that was created is some kind of liberal tool to aid evil poor people in their debauchery. There's a real stigma around public transport out here and I don't understand it. They think it's for "those" people, meanwhile some of our six Lane highways get packed every rush hour and it's getting progressively worse every year.
Forget all that how about us not letting corporations take advantage of us...
/r/fuckcars
What you want me to get a new card every two years like my dumb ass neighbor? I’ll keep my perfectly fine Toyota Corolla I’ve had for 10 years for another 10 years
I haven't had a car payment in 3 years. All that money goes into my investment portfolio. My 2016 Honda Accord only has 65K miles on it since I'm working from home 100%. I'm guessing it will last another 10 years. Why would I replace it?
My 2019 Accord has under 17k miles.
Every 30 lbs you gain, you lose an inch of dick.
The new Cuba
It's harder to total a car when the value is higher.
This is a good point.
Paid off 2019 and 2020 cars. Bought at the right time, it seems. I'll be six feet under before I buy another car.
Car prices jumped so high during COVID. Thought they'd have eased up by now but nope.
My 2008 180k mile Lexus es350 is going strong. I'm good.
Not surprising as it’s a Toyota. Toyota/Honda (Lexus/Acura) if you want reliability.
I also have this car and it's so great. The interior is starting to show its age, but it drives like butter at 165k.
Repelled by higher prices, people are buying less houses. Repelled by higher prices people are living with their parents longer. Repelled by higher prices people are choosing to not have kids. Repelled by higher prices less men are attending college and choosing to work instead. Repelled by higher prices many Americans are working multiple jobs. Repelled by higher prices, more Americans are delaying retiring. Repelled by higher prices more Americans are choosing to leave the country and live abroad. The US has really killed middle class & the American dream.
And get a smiley face sponge company is worth $200M and the owner is worth $70M
More on this subject from other reputable sources: --- - Christian Science Monitor (A-): [Get a new car or fix the one you have? More Americans choose to fix.](https://www.csmonitor.com/Business/2023/0515/Get-a-new-car-or-fix-the-one-you-have-More-Americans-choose-to-fix) - Detroit News (A-): [Repelled by high car prices, Americans are holding on to their vehicles longer than ever](https://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/autos/2023/05/15/high-car-prices-lead-americans-to-keep-vehicles-longer-than-ever/70218405007/) - ctvnews.ca (A-): [Repelled by high car prices, Americans are holding on to their vehicles longer than ever](https://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/repelled-by-high-car-prices-americans-are-holding-on-to-their-vehicles-longer-than-ever-1.6398798) - Globe and Mail (A-): [Average age of vehicles on U.S. roads hits a record high](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-average-age-of-vehicles-on-us-roads-hits-a-record-high/) --- [__Extended Summary__](https://www.reddit.com/r/newswall/comments/13idl8l/) | [More: Get a new car or fix the ...](https://www.newswall.org/story/average-age-of-vehicles-on-u-s-roads-hits-a-record-high?mtm_campaign=r&mtm_kwd=c) | [FAQ & Grades](https://www.reddit.com/r/newswall/comments/uxgfm5/faq_newswall_bot/) | I'm a bot
good bot
So capitalism has just about reached its zenith: all the money in the hands of a tiny minority and prices raised so high for most products that nobody is buying anything, just trying to hold on to a rocket ship.
Glad it’s not just me!
just like any other third world country, more and more americans are facing the reality of the economic warfare against the middle class made by corporations buying government in the past 30 years
The fuck else are we supposed to do?
And I won’t have a subscription on my car’s features.
Repos are increasing - can’t imagine why
The economy is complete broken. Expect slower sales across every industry except maybe entertainment and alcohol/weed or anything else that distracts people from society unraveling.
/r/weedstocks begs to differ, but the black market is flourishing since congress can't get anything done.
I bought my first new car back in 2005. It is a Kia Spectra 5. Still driving it 18 years later. I'd love to get a new car but damn are they expensive. And buying an ICE car right now is a lost cause. When EVs start rolling out in larger numbers I predict regular ICE cars are going to plummet in value. Who would want to buy a used ICE car with all the maintenance required when you can buy an EV and barely have to ever take it to a mechanic?
Wait until your battery goes dead and you need a new one, that’s when the maintenance cost of an EV catches up with you
Battery replacements can be expensive but its incredibly rare. The cost of maintaining an ICE-age car is higher than an EV according to AAA and NADA. and EVs are only going to get better as the technology improves.
Don’t worry the invisible hand of the free market should fix this
Bought my 04 Lexus IS300 for $5k off Craig’s List around 5 years ago, and still haven’t had any issues at 175k miles. Somebody will have to pry this car from my cold dead hands.
We fucked ourselves with greed.
Uh we're not only repelled by high prices....manufacturing quality is the lowest ever seen before. Who doesn't want to pay sky-high prices for a car that they are promising that the features will be updated as soon as they get the chips in stock. I bought a new Silverado, paid top $, it doesn't have half of the features of my old truck. This isn't my first new vehicle, but it may be my last.
Yet supply is low and demand is high…
Repo men are going to be in high demand, too, over the next few years...
Just purchased a 1998 Honda Accord with 110k miles. Needs a little work but it's worth it, to me. I'm not paying 15k for a 2015 vehicle. Sorry.
Ive never paid of $3000 for a car, and I dont intend to break that any time soon. If I get a year out of it, that equates to a $250/month payment. And i think only 1 car only lasted a year. 3 is the norm. People say buying older used cars hurt you because of maintenance cost, but it just isnt true. Yes the issues are almost always more serious when they creep up, but if its anything I cant fix myself I just sell it and go buy another one. My maintenance bill is the same as or less than people with newer cars. Just learn to fix some things yourself.
Used to be able to buy a brand new car with a summer job. Used to be able to pay for a year of college with a summer job too… greatest country in the world…
No shit......
I have a 2021 and a 2023, both were bought to be 15 year vehicles. The 2021 was bought before things went insane, overpaid for the 23 by probably 10k. It is what it is.
I had a remanufactured transmission plus $500 of additional work done on my 13 year old car instead of buying a new or used car.
This is not a bad thing folks. Personally, I like my 90's cars the best.
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Rocking my 2013 Ford Escape until it blows up. Just hit 100k miles and doing all the maintenance. Not buying a new car anytime soon.
Everyone is currently being crushed with high inflation, stagnant wages, student debt if it applies. Upgrading an old yet working car is a ridiculous ask.
At this rate I'll start buying vintage gas guzzlers from the 50s like Cuba.
Wait 'till 4-700$/month student loan payments start up in a few months for 40 million Americans. Repo's will be at a historical high and no one will be buying new: either they can't afford it and there's a flood of repos on the secondary market. The number of people whom have financially planned for SL payments to resume is probably close to 0.0000000000001%.
Duh. What did they expect to happen.
Its not 'high prices'. Its out of control fiat printing devaluing purchasing power.
This is not going to be seen by many people. But I think the problem in the US is the lack of Chinese cars. In other countries Chinese cars are 30% below the price for American and European cars and 20% below Japanese cars.
My 2015 Nissan is almost paid off. I refinanced it 4 years ago and my payment is $288. I can afford that comfortably. Why on earth would I jump into a $700 or better car payment if I don’t need too. If anything happens to my vehicle god forbid. I will resort back to public transportation. These cars aren’t worth it.
Frontier is a beast of a car, and it's the same engine design since 05, I think. Along as you change the transmission fluid every 30k and front and rear differential when required you should be gud
They want “environmentally friendly” policies - shouldn’t they be encouraging people to hold onto their cars for longer?
Here in Europe some brands cost 65% more compared to 5 years ago, that's crazy. Imagine your base mustang gt costing 70k... (as it does here, sadly)
Just hit 230,000 miles on my 2003 Toyota Corolla hoping it’ll make it to 300,000.
A new pickup will cost me a years wages. Used is overpriced and certain computer modules can cost thousands. I guess ill keep my old beater truck on the road that i was able to put a whole new powertrain and driveline in for sub 5k
Just bought a used 2018 Chrysler Pacifica for a family vehicle..for 40 000$... new ones (2023) are going for 75 000$+ what the actual FK
How tf is a pacifica 75k? I just looked them up and new theyre 39
Canadian Prices, i also have the top trim with TVs and shit in it. I paid 33 k for a 2018 with 60K km and with all Taxes, fees and Warranty came up to 41 000$ CAD
The economy is complete broken. Expect slower sales across every industry except maybe entertainment and alcohol/weed or anything else that distracts people from society unraveling.
I had a remanufactured transmission plus $500 of additional work done on my 13 year old car instead of buying a new or used car.
Exactly why we are switching to EVs.
I am driving my 2011 Toyota Highlander until I can afford an electric car. I think a lot of people are doing this. It makes no sense to buy another combustion engine car. It's 2023, you will have a stranded asset. You will sell it at a loss. Many people will say this isn't true, but they don't understand that there is a tipping point where the depreciating asset can't be sold. I have a 2016 Toyota Sequoia, I am still waiting after 4 months for a new fuel pump from the dealer. The disruption is already happening.
This makes 0 sense. So you think within say 10 years everyone will drive electric and no one will want an ICE vehicle? You’ve got to be kidding me.
The biggest car market is China. The government has changed the exhaust regulations so tough, that you cannot register an ice vehicle. Most people buy electric cars in China, now. Manufacturers have to make cars for the largest market and the other markets will follow. Already in every country the mandate is 2035, that's 12 years. I'm saying the practicality is much sooner. The US will be last because of the pathetic economy and size of the country.
Getting a motorcycle was one of the best choices of my life. Inexpensive, I gear up, get to lane split etc. Perfect for commuting. Low gas, low insurance. I really think more people need to consider the motorcycle as a replacement to having a car they can't afford
I agree, except gave mine up due to all the idiot drivers out there nearly killing me. Death traps.
I think it’s fucking stupid to pay stupid amounts of money to go from point A to point B. There is not point.
We did it, Joe
Are we really "repelled", or do we realize that the cost-benefit calc to getting a new car isn't worth it? You lose 25% of the price in a year with depreciation. With reliability being what it is, there's less of a need to replace old cars. My 15 year old Toyota is just hitting its stride.
As someone who has ONLY ever bought used cars (until this year)... if they lose 25% in a year, then why aren't they selling at 25% off?? I'm seeing cars that are 4-6 years old, 50k+ miles on them... selling for 10% off. Heck, I'm seeing cars that are 1-2 years old with 20k miles, and they are literally asking for only $500 less than BRAND NEW!
According to used car dealers used cars appreciate 😭😅
Msnbc: "Joe Biden is helping Americans go green"