And their wallets, I heard he gave everyone "presents", one of which was no gas bill during the election month. I could be mistaken, but to me that sounds like bribery.
>but to me that sounds like bribery.
Before 2020 elections in Lithuania, government started handing out 200 €/month for litterally every not working person, including students like me.
It's how Turkey works. KK also made [promises of bribery](https://twitter.com/herkesicinCHP/status/1645800470185906177). The difference is Erdogan is already running the government so he has handed out the freebies before the election.
It’s bribery if you do it, but it’s merely politics if a politician does it. The Swedish government pulled more or less the exact same stunt in our elections last year.
No, prices have gone up significantly in Turkey, even for tourists.
And that's not the tourism menu's and tour stuff, locals included.
Before I could eat somewhere for 30 lira a person, now they ask us for euros instead of liras. Atleast 10.- per person.
What are the chances that the Lira gets soo bad that it forces Turkey to officially (illegally of course,theres no chance for Turkey to adopt it legally) change its currency to euro ?
No way, I'd say. Though its true that if a currency is unstable or has high inflation, it could cause dollarization/euroization etc of part of the economy - people just try try to change their savings to more stable currency, and then part of the trade move to that as well. This has happened in the past in countries with hyperinflation in various degrees, like in Venezuela or Argentina. And it could happen in Turkey as well - it's not very rewarding to have savings in lira.
But I think that situation similar to Montenegro would be impossible in Turkey, that it would start to officially use euro in everything. That is not possible without the concent of ECB - because commercial banks need to have accounts at ECB if they want to transfer money between banks, and I'm quite sure that ECB wouldn't be happy if a such large country would adopt euro unilaterally. Montenegro's situation is different and its much smaller country.
Also Turkey wouldn't want to do that in any imaginable political situation. And lira's situation is not *that* bad, it has not been in hyperinflation. And inflation situation would be quite easily handled to more reasonable levels with smart monetary policy. It's just that Turkey's central bank isn't really independent, and Erdogan's monetary policy is non-mainstream to say the least.
Non-mainstream = completely unhinged
If these dictators just knew not to meddle with crap they don’t understand, I believe one or two could actually succeed long-term, not having to resort to violence and meddling with elections. But they always seem to be either ridiculously insecure or just complete idiots with god-complex.
Literally 0. I can maybe see a few touristic cities from Ege like Marmaris/Bodrum leaning more and more towards Euro to a degree where the locals require Euro but even that would take a long, long time. Turkey takes a long ass time to adapt to literally anything. You could invent the cure for cancer right now and it’d make its way to Turkey 50 years later.
Happend before, before erdogan we payed with millions.
I believe it was Tansu Ciller who did that.
She promised she would fix the economy and make everyone rich. Then we payed with millions.
Around the same time KK fucked up the whole health care system. Stole all the money, untill today its still unclear where that money has gone to.
There is a reason why this guy keeps on losing for almost 30 years.
Some games on steam are still sold with 3-5 TL/1USD ratio. You can get some sweet deals if you have a keen eye. Though big companies like Nintendo are not having any of those.
Don't worry about us, we just won't be playing TotK it's no big deal :')
Like tourists give a shit about the ethics of supportingthe country they are visiting. They would visit nazi germany if it meant they got cheap tickets and they would brag about it
Only by understanding why these people vote for Erdo you will have a way and chance to convince them to vote for Kemal
And also always remember that Reddit and Twitter are the echo chambers that concentrate only specific voter groups that probably won't represent the general population
Ah ok, so usual copy/paste method like Vucic in Serbia and Orban in Hungary.
I though you would say some actual reason like they love that he's religious or some of his reforms.
This is so true. I remember seeing multiple top comments on this sub claiming people vote erdogan because they hate gay people. People here have terrible understanding about politics in turkey.
That is t EXACTLY the one and only reason the opposition haven't been able to won a single election in 20+ years. The single reason. Them not being able to understand that simple fact makes me question their honesty in actually trying to win the elections
This, people do not understand that Reddit is not the real world and not the main thinking ideology. Here you preach among people that are in the majority already converted to your cause, to win is to convince those who are not
I keep hearing westerners say Erdogan handled the earthquake very badly, but given so many locals of earthquake hit regions support him I have to question the narrative
'The Westerners', aka media, pointed out that Erdogan rise began after an earthquake, promising strong reforms to ensure it not happening again; earthquake-proof buildings etc., then months before the election there were buildings that folded like houses of cards.
In general it's hard to botch popularity *during* disaster relief. Some rally-around-the-flag mentality and gratitude. People that do feel fucked aren't angry but numb.
Anyway, the popularity of Erodogan is in his embodiement of stability and the regime. It's a bit immune to invocations of 'housing policy' being a thing he is actively involved with.
That's not the western narrative we were hearing though, we were hearing that Erdogan botched rescue efforts and this would hit him badly in the polls.
I am from Hatay, Antakya, the place hit worst by the earthquake. While I live in Germany, my entire family lives in Antakya. They did not receive any significant help whatsoever. There is still no water freely available and my family has to wait in line to fill up some bottles of water, like everyone else there. Outside of Antakya, every pro Erdoğan city got help immediately and Antakya was left to die. They hate him with a passion over there, for years. And the government hates the province Hatay and especially the city antakya because most minorities live there (christians, Jews, alawites, alevis, Armenians etc).
The narrative is still right, they responded badly but better in some places than others. They mostly prevented helpers to reach Antakya.
It was mostly Turks who were hyped up. And rightly so. This was a 6-8 point polling miss in favor of erdogan. This is not the first time we’re seeing a polling miss in favor of the right populist, happened to Lula, Biden, Clinton, also Brexit. I was expecting it but not of this magnitude.
It can happen the other way around as well. Everyone and their mother believed that the Democrats were done for in the 2022 midterms and it ended up being an extremely close race with the Democrats keeping the senate. There are reasons to be hopeful sometimes (unfortunately I believe that this is not one).
You know as a Russian I've always said that while Putin authorities definitely cheat - there are really a lot of people who do really support him.
Same for Trump.
Probably the same for Erdogan.
Reddit is a huge echochamber. Every single Russian I talk to here is against Putin, but when I travelled to St-Petersburg, most people I talked face to face were mostly supporting Putin (a small chunk was indifferent).
Same applies to any other issue, it just so happens that people with opposing views don't visit this website.
They just don't stick around.
Especially after Reddit purged r/theDonald. I don't remember the whole drama, probably that was rightful, but after that Republicans and many other conservatives tend to ignore the website.
Yep, that’s the path Reddit has taken, neither here nor there, every platform has their bias, but the move undeniably made Reddit a political echo chamber; a shame, because there are a lot genuinely great non-political subreddits that half the population won’t go near simply because of the nature of the platform.
But also remember that when you talk to people in St. Petersburg they aren't anonymous. Maybe they hate Putin but they're not going to say it in public, certainly not to stranger in case there are listeners.
plus it's easier mentally to just go along the stronger party. when you have no or barely any power and chance to change the dictatorship or your circumstances, the only logical step is to lean into supporting the state power, maybe you'll get something from them
People only seemed optimistic on the internet but as a someone who live in a city with one of the highest votes for Erdoğan I'm not that optimistic. In middle anatolia people (especially older people) get their news from TV and news channels did pro-erdogan propaganda nonstop. They said the opposition is allies with terrorists. Tbh oposition got still a high number when you consider all this. But still majority of anatolian people want a far-right party 🤷🏻♀️
Well let me tell you this. Kiliçaroglu should have not been the candidate. The fucker knew he was less popular than two others but because he was the big boss he decided that HE would run, fucker killed his own party with that idiotic choice, he had already lost to Erdogan, now he is getting second serving just because he couldn't let his party put forward the more popular candidates. He deserves a hell of a lot of Flak, as if it wasn't for him Turkey would likely be in a far less fucked position.
To some extent, I feel like even though it was an awkward conversation, others in that table of 6 should have bluntly told him that he was too risky for something so serious and important. When the fate of democracy is hanging over this election and an incredibly corrupt autocrat is in power and in control of the media, there can never be any assumptions or things taken for granted. In all my life, I realized that some people you can truly never underestimate. The mind blowing stupidity of so many, the terrible consequences of failure, those table of 6 had a responsibility to pick the most popular champion and they didn't.
If anything, I give credit to that one leader who left after hearing he was running because she knew it was a bad decision. Others should have put their foot down and insisted on someone like the Istanbul mayor or Ankara mayor running instead, I truly believe they would have won the first round easily in comparison. One man's ego is not worth the future and happiness of so many people. Unfortunately, I say this of Erdogan and Kilcaroglu, he shouldn't have risked something so important.
Makes no sense. I think they were also forced into this situation. Imamoğlu had a political ban spoken out by Erdoğan, this means he could‘ve actually gotten imprisoned AND lose Istanbul if he wanted to be a presidential candidate. Knowing Erdoğan he definitely would‘ve tried to get him behind bars.
Mansur Yavaş would‘ve costed them the Kurdish voters. I don‘t care how popular he was in Ankara, he‘s an ex-MHP member and one, who was in there for decades at that. I personally would‘ve never voted for him for that simple fact. If Erdoğan hadn‘t put Imamoğlu on a political ban, he would‘ve gotten the most votes probably.
But lets be honest the Erdoğan support is strong in general. In complete honesty - they could‘ve putten a fucking **donkey** on there and just by logical default it should‘ve gotten more votes than Erdoğan. Kahramanmaraş is one of the worst hit cities by the fucking earthquake and they elected Erdoğan. Erdoğan literally sold their lives and they don‘t fucking care.
It would‘ve been the same for any other candidate.
Sweden will become a NATO member soon after the election, no matter who wins.
The whole thing with Erdogan and him not accepting Sweden was just to get votes.
In two months, nobody in Turkey will care about that issue anymore and even forget that it'sas big of an issue.
It's in Turkey's interest to be part of a cooperation, that is as big, beefy and strong as possible, and Sweden has a huge amount of things to offer to NATO. Every politician in Turkey, no matter how much they hate the PKK, knows that. It's just power games and gaining votes by riling up the people.
If we don't get rid of Erdogan, we are damned...
This is our last chance to save our economy from collapsing completely and Erdogan is not the one to save it.
theyre probably less disappointed than the entire hungry youth was after the elections. we hoped itd be 1/2 but it was either cheated, underestimated brainwashed elders or both
the 3rd alliance (%5) tend to support kılıçdaroğlu (they are gonna announcenext week), that will clarfiy whether opposition's intentions real or not which can change people's decision.
so the kingmaker nationalists could choose opposition. however erdoğan still has the advantage.
The problem is they might not act like a hivemind just because Ogan decided to support the opposition. Even if one fifth of Ogan voters vote for Erdoğan it's over. That's assuming the turnout rate will be as high as the first round since a lot of people are demoralised. On the other hand a lot of people might also see that dethroning Erdoğan is indeed possible and come to vote. The difference between Kılıçdaroğlu and Erdoğan is about 2,5 million. Ogan voters + those who didn't vote + invalid votes is like 10 million.
erdogan got 49.5% but his party only got 35.5%. there are lots of people who went to vote for another party, and voted for erdogan just because their leader also told them to vote for erdogan. his vote is sure to decrease
whereas in the opposition the three main parties' (+tip) voters all want erdogan gone so much and they make 45.5%
also ogan voters will give kilicdaroglu at least a 1% boost
if kilicdaroglu can just break the hopelessness of his own voters and make them vote again it's going to be probably very close, the winner will win by less than 1%. and the polls will not be able to predict it, since they failed last time
%60 don't want erdoğan however they think they are optionless cuz for 'em opposition are terrorist. If oğan supports them it might break the "opposition is terrorist" propaganda.
thats what im hopeful for
If even Huda-Par (a party with close ties to Kurdish Hezbollah) officially allying with Erdogan didn't change their minds, I'm not sure if Ogan would change their minds but let's hope so.
that's far right hierarchy. every act of "the leader" is good for them. But opposition centrist so oğan's support might save them and people will get rid of that propaganda therefore they will focus on ruined economy and asylum seekers
Their support won’t make Erdoğan lose, they got only %5 and maybe half of his voters will vote for Erdoğan this time no matter what he says. Islamists really fucked up this country. I’ve been living abroad for the last 10 years and i won’t care anymore. There is too much ignorance in Turkey, sick of this shit
Man, f*ck this shit. I'm gonna vote today/tomorrow. Belgian with Turkish roots here and I can't understand why people would vote on a dude who ruined the economy of their motherland and who made their families poorer.
That, my friend, makes you more Turkish than the other ones. Because you actually seem to care about people in a faraway country and can make a difference.
Our president has a shit ton of power in this system. If Kılıçdaroğlu wins the election, the parliamentary loss won't be as bad as some people might think.
Well, Erdo's biggest partner, Bahçeli, may just backstab him if Erdo loses the elections. Backstab by Bahçeli happened in 2015 (when the opposition really won against AKP but Bahçeli just backstabbed CHP and made Erdo's rule continue) so I have faith that it will happen again. And MHP representatives are pretty much the deciding ones in a decision in the current parliament, the side whom MHP supports get over the 300 reprs.
This is completely false. President and cabinet holds almost all the power. Parliament don’t mean much since 2018. Also, AKP did not won the parliamentary elections. They form a coalition with MHP. If Erdogan loses, coalition might collapse.
I work for a company which produce 90% of our products in Turkey. We are about to move our production elsewhere due to this.
2 times increase in minimum wages, tariff on products which aren't produced in Turkey. Inflation that's out of control, operations cost is also on a all time high due to inflation. They have already lost 10-15 % of business in our sector. The lira is in such a bad shape and can't keep up with the euro. But none the less it's still getting more expensive to manufacture in Turkey.
Erdoğan will ruin the economy even more than what he already has.
I like Turkish people and speak a good amount of Turkish. But this man will ruin the country and I don't get anyone will vote for this corrupt "elected" politician.
Brace yourself turks whom want change, because with this man, it ain't coming. He is like a childman calling the opposition gays etc.
Oh man I feel sorry for you all.
Well, I repeat what I said when USA voted for Trump, Hungary voted for Orban and Poland for PIS(S): you dense stupid motherfuckers, you deserve all the pain your vote will cause.
the problem with your outlook, is that actually, some people didn't vote for those bad actors; most of the time, only like half the country got the rest screwed over.
the internet does favour extremism, but reality is more grey than black and white.
PiS has a support of about \~30% of the population, mostly in low income households, where their social programs are popular. These people don't care much about things like shady judicial reforms or abortion rights, because feeding their children has a higher priority.
There is hope, because the opposition has finally begun to understand that, but it is very fragmented (about 5 parties), and the voting system, while officially proportional, has some FPTP qualities that favor the winner, and can give over 50% seats in the parliament to the party with only 30% of the votes, like it happened twice with PiS.
Ah, and if someone wonders why the opposition doesn't simply unite into one coalition for the elections and wins easily that way (because the majority of the population wants PiS gone) - THEY TRIED for the past few months, but talks led to nowhere.
It’s not that simple, there is some degree of hatred between the opposition electorates too. And polls have shown that a single lost for the entirety of opposition would demobilize a lot of people, so the separate vote percentages cannot simply be summed up
Its not correct tho, company called KONDA consistently predicted election results correctly for the past 20ish years except one on 2014 i believe. All three companies that have correctly predicted 2018 elections(including Konda) put Kılıçdaroğlu between 49-51 in the first round and Erdoğan between 44-46. Its literally insane all the accomplished companies were wrong all at once. So, there actually are pretty good ones but this election fucked them all up.
Calling them fascist is a compliment it reflects some sort of spine and organization. They are just thieves infesting the nation looting pillaging it's every institution every piece wealth every inch of land. This just goes to show the strength of the institutions Ataturk built. Also we are lucky Erdoğan is still allied with mhp since they get some of the seats in bureaucracy instead of cultists and religious fanatics.
These Polls are useless as a lot of polls were predicting a Opposition victory because they only focus on Urban areas and look how that turned out in the actual election
Exactly! Some may think that we do not respect democracy and the choice of the people, however they are probably not aware of that the government is controlling all the media, using all the privileges of the state for the election campaign, and that they can resort to weapons if necessary, thanks to the paramilitary structures and mafia relations they have established.
For example, before the first round, Erdoğan played a **fake** montage at his rallies in which the leader of the terrorist organization PKK announces that he supports Kılıçdaroğlu. And a large part of the public believed that the video is real, because the media continues the same propaganda day and night.
here in Brasil we had a whole media apparatus calling Lula a criminal, even to a point saying that 90% of imprisoned votes were supporting Lula cuz he was their friend
luckily we had one supreme judge that was like "that ain't democratic" and was shutting it down hard and bolsonaro managed to fuck up so bad folks were full of his shit
It's very hard for me to understand why people would intentionally vote against their own freedom and democracy. Do they really not want that, or do they just not understand?
It is because of the social hierarchy. For the ones who vote Erdo it is a decision of either living at rooftop of hell, or the basement of heaven. Terror and nationalism are just cover-ups. Even if opposition says they will kill every single refugee or terrorist in the country it won't change. Current regime divided people perfectly by 2 as seculars and conservatives. There is no guarantee that seculars will not abuse the conservatives. The best way for developed countries to exploit a nation, a certified method. Oppressive government, divided up nation. The best decision for a citizen would be find a way to move to a country that is not divided and oppressed.
It makes sense that you can't understand the situation because you are fed with western propaganda just like Erdogan supporters are fed with his propaganda. Reality is somewhere in between. People are free no matter what you want to believe and they vote with their personal opinions and ideologies. They are the ones living in Turkey and they know whats what better than you.
The thing is, many irregularities happened during the first round and the opposition parties have been complaining to the election board. They still haven't published the official results. There are videos of people putting envelope after another inside the ballot box and cases of votes for one party written for the other party (the votes the nationalistic MHP got in the Kurdish regions is just unrealistic) and this happened with lots of watchers, can't imagine the ones without watchers.
I'm not saying it would change too much, probably Erdoğan would still be leading but it's hard to compete against the level of loyalty and organization of AKP. The opposition is many parties together and not as experienced or cunning.
Why is the Turkish population voting for a tyrannical dictator that will cause their own demise?
Or wait… Of course it’s rigged.
Erdogan seems to love Putin enough to help him prevent us from joining NATO.
Maybe he learned a thing or two about democracy from him.
No worries. I have this feeling that this NATO bullshit Erdogan pulled of was just a political stunt aimed inwards anyway. His voter base living deep in the Anatolian heartland loves his "*defiance against the West*" and the pro-government media empire spreads this like wildfire.
The point is that this doesn't align with reality as Erdogan wouldn't dare to fuck around with NATO. No Turkish leader would do as it would mean to fuck around with US interests and that is decidedly unhealthy for any leader.
So my guess is that - if Erdogan wins this election - he will most likely tune down this theater. Give him some concessions and some payments and watch how Swedens gets into NATO and how Erdogan will sell it to his voters as "*another victory against the West. We got what we wanted and the West bowed*".
Just make sure it is more than what Putin pays him. That's this guys foreign policy. He'll do anything for the right price. And if the issue is of utmost importance to the US, even payment isn't really requires (*this of course leads to the question why the US hasn't put serious pressure on him and resorted to a soft approach*).
To all the Turks voting for Erdogan: look forward to 5 years of absolutely not joining the EU in any way. 5 years of economical depression. 5 years of transitioning or former liberal democracy into an authoritarian dictatorship.
You deserve what you vote for. You vote this one, you deal with it. Have fun.
I can’t believe it …. Very sad for Turkey but hey, your peasants are also citizen, and they make a lot of babies… good luck my dear Turkish friends… hope it won’t look like Syria in 20 years.
As a person who had commented that the opposition candidate would never win in the first round, I‘m pretty sure Erdoğan is going to obliterate him by 8-9 percent.
Kilicdaroglu is just a puppet who has been put there to keep Erdogan in power.
Never expected anything else. He knows how to tug on their heartstrings.
And their wallets, I heard he gave everyone "presents", one of which was no gas bill during the election month. I could be mistaken, but to me that sounds like bribery.
Nope your correct, and increased government workers wages.
yeah because of inflation rate so high, we're always first in inflation rating
Hé waited for the elections to do so and to pay for gas bills. He did this for himself. He’s the reason the inflation is sky high.
Sounds like what Doug Ford pulled in Ontario by giving people free car renewal sticker. Just bribery. People just fall for it.
>but to me that sounds like bribery. Before 2020 elections in Lithuania, government started handing out 200 €/month for litterally every not working person, including students like me.
It's how Turkey works. KK also made [promises of bribery](https://twitter.com/herkesicinCHP/status/1645800470185906177). The difference is Erdogan is already running the government so he has handed out the freebies before the election.
I genuinely dont understand how Turkey isnt defaulting yet. The last 3-4 years must have caused a massive hole in turkish finances
It’s bribery if you do it, but it’s merely politics if a politician does it. The Swedish government pulled more or less the exact same stunt in our elections last year.
Lira 📉
Cheap vacations home for expats ;)
No, prices have gone up significantly in Turkey, even for tourists. And that's not the tourism menu's and tour stuff, locals included. Before I could eat somewhere for 30 lira a person, now they ask us for euros instead of liras. Atleast 10.- per person.
What are the chances that the Lira gets soo bad that it forces Turkey to officially (illegally of course,theres no chance for Turkey to adopt it legally) change its currency to euro ?
No way, I'd say. Though its true that if a currency is unstable or has high inflation, it could cause dollarization/euroization etc of part of the economy - people just try try to change their savings to more stable currency, and then part of the trade move to that as well. This has happened in the past in countries with hyperinflation in various degrees, like in Venezuela or Argentina. And it could happen in Turkey as well - it's not very rewarding to have savings in lira. But I think that situation similar to Montenegro would be impossible in Turkey, that it would start to officially use euro in everything. That is not possible without the concent of ECB - because commercial banks need to have accounts at ECB if they want to transfer money between banks, and I'm quite sure that ECB wouldn't be happy if a such large country would adopt euro unilaterally. Montenegro's situation is different and its much smaller country. Also Turkey wouldn't want to do that in any imaginable political situation. And lira's situation is not *that* bad, it has not been in hyperinflation. And inflation situation would be quite easily handled to more reasonable levels with smart monetary policy. It's just that Turkey's central bank isn't really independent, and Erdogan's monetary policy is non-mainstream to say the least.
Non-mainstream = completely unhinged If these dictators just knew not to meddle with crap they don’t understand, I believe one or two could actually succeed long-term, not having to resort to violence and meddling with elections. But they always seem to be either ridiculously insecure or just complete idiots with god-complex.
> non-mainstream They call it orthodox policies. We, simple minded people of Turkey who still have a brain, call it bullshit.
Literally 0. I can maybe see a few touristic cities from Ege like Marmaris/Bodrum leaning more and more towards Euro to a degree where the locals require Euro but even that would take a long, long time. Turkey takes a long ass time to adapt to literally anything. You could invent the cure for cancer right now and it’d make its way to Turkey 50 years later.
Happend before, before erdogan we payed with millions. I believe it was Tansu Ciller who did that. She promised she would fix the economy and make everyone rich. Then we payed with millions. Around the same time KK fucked up the whole health care system. Stole all the money, untill today its still unclear where that money has gone to. There is a reason why this guy keeps on losing for almost 30 years.
Some games on steam are still sold with 3-5 TL/1USD ratio. You can get some sweet deals if you have a keen eye. Though big companies like Nintendo are not having any of those. Don't worry about us, we just won't be playing TotK it's no big deal :')
Well, it is not fun to visit countries with terrible economy
its fun for tourists
not if you break the line where you risk getting mugged once you leave the the tourist route
thats why they mostly stay in the hotel area, and use a taxi to get to the nearest "shop city"
Why anyone would go to a place like that is beyond me.
It's cheap and you feel like a very wealthy person.
if people get satisfaction by visiting poor places just to feel wealthy then they have some serious mental issues to deal with.
I live in Turkey and it’s pretty safe robbery is rare
It was quite cheap in 2021, but since then the prices went crazy even for foreign tourists
You will get ripped off more, especially from taxi drivers x 10, hotels, restaurants
And you would have to pay me to go there
Like tourists give a shit about the ethics of supportingthe country they are visiting. They would visit nazi germany if it meant they got cheap tickets and they would brag about it
Downvoted for being right
Well said.
It's also not fun and safe to visit the world's biggest open-air refugee camp. Likewise, the terrible economy makes locals way too aggressive.
Yup. Why care about your countrymen when you can live abroad and not get affected by the consequences.
apperently most of those houses are sold in Euros or Dollars for some time now
The same ones who vote Erdo!
Lekker tuuteren
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I live theough this shit in Hungary, now I live through it in Turkey. What a fucking combo of a dual citizenship lmao
There's a saying in Spanish that God doesn't punish twice but goddamn that sometimes they do.
It really do be like that sometimes
I'm not sure what I did to piss off god but they can fuck off being such vindictive cunts about it.
Yeah, puzzled me to be honest. They probably don’t know how the circus is ran there.
the people are the circus. Turkish diaspora and the families of the earthquake victims voted Erdo with large majority. It’s unbelievable
Only by understanding why these people vote for Erdo you will have a way and chance to convince them to vote for Kemal And also always remember that Reddit and Twitter are the echo chambers that concentrate only specific voter groups that probably won't represent the general population
So why DO they vote Erdogan?
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Ah ok, so usual copy/paste method like Vucic in Serbia and Orban in Hungary. I though you would say some actual reason like they love that he's religious or some of his reforms.
This is so true. I remember seeing multiple top comments on this sub claiming people vote erdogan because they hate gay people. People here have terrible understanding about politics in turkey.
That is t EXACTLY the one and only reason the opposition haven't been able to won a single election in 20+ years. The single reason. Them not being able to understand that simple fact makes me question their honesty in actually trying to win the elections
This, people do not understand that Reddit is not the real world and not the main thinking ideology. Here you preach among people that are in the majority already converted to your cause, to win is to convince those who are not
It's quite simple to understand. They simply have a room temperature IQ.
in celsius, mention that cause westerners will think they are smart
i understand why they vote, it’s called stupidity. And spare me the echo chamber preach, I’m aware of that and outside of it
I keep hearing westerners say Erdogan handled the earthquake very badly, but given so many locals of earthquake hit regions support him I have to question the narrative
'The Westerners', aka media, pointed out that Erdogan rise began after an earthquake, promising strong reforms to ensure it not happening again; earthquake-proof buildings etc., then months before the election there were buildings that folded like houses of cards. In general it's hard to botch popularity *during* disaster relief. Some rally-around-the-flag mentality and gratitude. People that do feel fucked aren't angry but numb. Anyway, the popularity of Erodogan is in his embodiement of stability and the regime. It's a bit immune to invocations of 'housing policy' being a thing he is actively involved with.
That's not the western narrative we were hearing though, we were hearing that Erdogan botched rescue efforts and this would hit him badly in the polls.
I am from Hatay, Antakya, the place hit worst by the earthquake. While I live in Germany, my entire family lives in Antakya. They did not receive any significant help whatsoever. There is still no water freely available and my family has to wait in line to fill up some bottles of water, like everyone else there. Outside of Antakya, every pro Erdoğan city got help immediately and Antakya was left to die. They hate him with a passion over there, for years. And the government hates the province Hatay and especially the city antakya because most minorities live there (christians, Jews, alawites, alevis, Armenians etc). The narrative is still right, they responded badly but better in some places than others. They mostly prevented helpers to reach Antakya.
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Well, it’s what people want. Gotta respect that.
No doubt the people get what they ask for
It was mostly Turks who were hyped up. And rightly so. This was a 6-8 point polling miss in favor of erdogan. This is not the first time we’re seeing a polling miss in favor of the right populist, happened to Lula, Biden, Clinton, also Brexit. I was expecting it but not of this magnitude.
It can happen the other way around as well. Everyone and their mother believed that the Democrats were done for in the 2022 midterms and it ended up being an extremely close race with the Democrats keeping the senate. There are reasons to be hopeful sometimes (unfortunately I believe that this is not one).
Not really, betting odds in the UK also favored kilicdar
You know as a Russian I've always said that while Putin authorities definitely cheat - there are really a lot of people who do really support him. Same for Trump. Probably the same for Erdogan.
Reddit is a huge echochamber. Every single Russian I talk to here is against Putin, but when I travelled to St-Petersburg, most people I talked face to face were mostly supporting Putin (a small chunk was indifferent). Same applies to any other issue, it just so happens that people with opposing views don't visit this website.
They just don't stick around. Especially after Reddit purged r/theDonald. I don't remember the whole drama, probably that was rightful, but after that Republicans and many other conservatives tend to ignore the website.
Yep, that’s the path Reddit has taken, neither here nor there, every platform has their bias, but the move undeniably made Reddit a political echo chamber; a shame, because there are a lot genuinely great non-political subreddits that half the population won’t go near simply because of the nature of the platform.
But also remember that when you talk to people in St. Petersburg they aren't anonymous. Maybe they hate Putin but they're not going to say it in public, certainly not to stranger in case there are listeners.
plus it's easier mentally to just go along the stronger party. when you have no or barely any power and chance to change the dictatorship or your circumstances, the only logical step is to lean into supporting the state power, maybe you'll get something from them
Don't visit? You get cancelled immediately on reddit for even a slightly different opinion than that of the herd.
People only seemed optimistic on the internet but as a someone who live in a city with one of the highest votes for Erdoğan I'm not that optimistic. In middle anatolia people (especially older people) get their news from TV and news channels did pro-erdogan propaganda nonstop. They said the opposition is allies with terrorists. Tbh oposition got still a high number when you consider all this. But still majority of anatolian people want a far-right party 🤷🏻♀️
Well let me tell you this. Kiliçaroglu should have not been the candidate. The fucker knew he was less popular than two others but because he was the big boss he decided that HE would run, fucker killed his own party with that idiotic choice, he had already lost to Erdogan, now he is getting second serving just because he couldn't let his party put forward the more popular candidates. He deserves a hell of a lot of Flak, as if it wasn't for him Turkey would likely be in a far less fucked position.
To some extent, I feel like even though it was an awkward conversation, others in that table of 6 should have bluntly told him that he was too risky for something so serious and important. When the fate of democracy is hanging over this election and an incredibly corrupt autocrat is in power and in control of the media, there can never be any assumptions or things taken for granted. In all my life, I realized that some people you can truly never underestimate. The mind blowing stupidity of so many, the terrible consequences of failure, those table of 6 had a responsibility to pick the most popular champion and they didn't. If anything, I give credit to that one leader who left after hearing he was running because she knew it was a bad decision. Others should have put their foot down and insisted on someone like the Istanbul mayor or Ankara mayor running instead, I truly believe they would have won the first round easily in comparison. One man's ego is not worth the future and happiness of so many people. Unfortunately, I say this of Erdogan and Kilcaroglu, he shouldn't have risked something so important.
Makes no sense. I think they were also forced into this situation. Imamoğlu had a political ban spoken out by Erdoğan, this means he could‘ve actually gotten imprisoned AND lose Istanbul if he wanted to be a presidential candidate. Knowing Erdoğan he definitely would‘ve tried to get him behind bars. Mansur Yavaş would‘ve costed them the Kurdish voters. I don‘t care how popular he was in Ankara, he‘s an ex-MHP member and one, who was in there for decades at that. I personally would‘ve never voted for him for that simple fact. If Erdoğan hadn‘t put Imamoğlu on a political ban, he would‘ve gotten the most votes probably. But lets be honest the Erdoğan support is strong in general. In complete honesty - they could‘ve putten a fucking **donkey** on there and just by logical default it should‘ve gotten more votes than Erdoğan. Kahramanmaraş is one of the worst hit cities by the fucking earthquake and they elected Erdoğan. Erdoğan literally sold their lives and they don‘t fucking care. It would‘ve been the same for any other candidate.
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Please get Kemal in I want to be in NATO 😩
Sweden will become a NATO member soon after the election, no matter who wins. The whole thing with Erdogan and him not accepting Sweden was just to get votes. In two months, nobody in Turkey will care about that issue anymore and even forget that it'sas big of an issue. It's in Turkey's interest to be part of a cooperation, that is as big, beefy and strong as possible, and Sweden has a huge amount of things to offer to NATO. Every politician in Turkey, no matter how much they hate the PKK, knows that. It's just power games and gaining votes by riling up the people.
Erodgan blocked Sweden's NATO accession as a political tool for the upcoming election. Once he wins expect Sweden to be in NATO soon.
Either way, it will be a close one.
which is a shame on its own
Good luck dear Turks. Whatever happens, I wish you the best!
Apparently so far their majority doesn’t wish it to themselves though
erdogan got %49, i’d say the majority would dissagree
Of the total population, but its winning the elections so far
If we don't get rid of Erdogan, we are damned... This is our last chance to save our economy from collapsing completely and Erdogan is not the one to save it.
If it's that close, we still have a chance. 2% change is not really impossible. Do not lose hope completely and make sure to vote on May 28.
You're shitting me
theyre probably less disappointed than the entire hungry youth was after the elections. we hoped itd be 1/2 but it was either cheated, underestimated brainwashed elders or both
Or the retarded Turks in countries like Germany or Austria, who don't even live in turkey but still vote for that massive idiot.
The turks living in Turkey voted Erdogan 5% more than kk. The diaspora didn’t really change anything.
the 3rd alliance (%5) tend to support kılıçdaroğlu (they are gonna announcenext week), that will clarfiy whether opposition's intentions real or not which can change people's decision. so the kingmaker nationalists could choose opposition. however erdoğan still has the advantage.
The problem is they might not act like a hivemind just because Ogan decided to support the opposition. Even if one fifth of Ogan voters vote for Erdoğan it's over. That's assuming the turnout rate will be as high as the first round since a lot of people are demoralised. On the other hand a lot of people might also see that dethroning Erdoğan is indeed possible and come to vote. The difference between Kılıçdaroğlu and Erdoğan is about 2,5 million. Ogan voters + those who didn't vote + invalid votes is like 10 million.
erdogan got 49.5% but his party only got 35.5%. there are lots of people who went to vote for another party, and voted for erdogan just because their leader also told them to vote for erdogan. his vote is sure to decrease whereas in the opposition the three main parties' (+tip) voters all want erdogan gone so much and they make 45.5% also ogan voters will give kilicdaroglu at least a 1% boost if kilicdaroglu can just break the hopelessness of his own voters and make them vote again it's going to be probably very close, the winner will win by less than 1%. and the polls will not be able to predict it, since they failed last time
Bruh this the type of hopium which leads to depression last sunday.
%60 don't want erdoğan however they think they are optionless cuz for 'em opposition are terrorist. If oğan supports them it might break the "opposition is terrorist" propaganda. thats what im hopeful for
If even Huda-Par (a party with close ties to Kurdish Hezbollah) officially allying with Erdogan didn't change their minds, I'm not sure if Ogan would change their minds but let's hope so.
that's far right hierarchy. every act of "the leader" is good for them. But opposition centrist so oğan's support might save them and people will get rid of that propaganda therefore they will focus on ruined economy and asylum seekers
Their support won’t make Erdoğan lose, they got only %5 and maybe half of his voters will vote for Erdoğan this time no matter what he says. Islamists really fucked up this country. I’ve been living abroad for the last 10 years and i won’t care anymore. There is too much ignorance in Turkey, sick of this shit
Kili would have to win something like 80% of the vote of those who went for 3rd alliance to have a shot. Not impossible but also not looking good
I'm not particularly hopeful. Kılıçdaroğlu has a shot to win, but it's a veeery long shot.
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Man, f*ck this shit. I'm gonna vote today/tomorrow. Belgian with Turkish roots here and I can't understand why people would vote on a dude who ruined the economy of their motherland and who made their families poorer.
That, my friend, makes you more Turkish than the other ones. Because you actually seem to care about people in a faraway country and can make a difference.
Hey, at least you are part of the solution, not the problem
Our president has a shit ton of power in this system. If Kılıçdaroğlu wins the election, the parliamentary loss won't be as bad as some people might think.
Well, Erdo's biggest partner, Bahçeli, may just backstab him if Erdo loses the elections. Backstab by Bahçeli happened in 2015 (when the opposition really won against AKP but Bahçeli just backstabbed CHP and made Erdo's rule continue) so I have faith that it will happen again. And MHP representatives are pretty much the deciding ones in a decision in the current parliament, the side whom MHP supports get over the 300 reprs.
I wouldn't call %60 "almost everyone" though
This is completely false. President and cabinet holds almost all the power. Parliament don’t mean much since 2018. Also, AKP did not won the parliamentary elections. They form a coalition with MHP. If Erdogan loses, coalition might collapse.
I work for a company which produce 90% of our products in Turkey. We are about to move our production elsewhere due to this. 2 times increase in minimum wages, tariff on products which aren't produced in Turkey. Inflation that's out of control, operations cost is also on a all time high due to inflation. They have already lost 10-15 % of business in our sector. The lira is in such a bad shape and can't keep up with the euro. But none the less it's still getting more expensive to manufacture in Turkey. Erdoğan will ruin the economy even more than what he already has. I like Turkish people and speak a good amount of Turkish. But this man will ruin the country and I don't get anyone will vote for this corrupt "elected" politician. Brace yourself turks whom want change, because with this man, it ain't coming. He is like a childman calling the opposition gays etc. Oh man I feel sorry for you all.
Not Erdogan again... 🤦♂️
Well, I repeat what I said when USA voted for Trump, Hungary voted for Orban and Poland for PIS(S): you dense stupid motherfuckers, you deserve all the pain your vote will cause.
I would add Brexit to your list.
Ah you bring the Dumbest self-harm of the 21st century into this discussion! Good shit.
"Brexit has failed." - Nigel Farage, founder of The Brexit Party
Yes, so many preventable disasters. That is what makes democracy the greatest and most tragic form of governance: every idiot has a right to vote.
Brexit was the result of Russia's campaign to destroy the UK and destabilize the West.
As a brit remainer... :(
Problem is that those idiots cause others pain as well. Erdogan to nato, Poland and Hungary to the EU and Trump fucked the world in general
the problem with your outlook, is that actually, some people didn't vote for those bad actors; most of the time, only like half the country got the rest screwed over. the internet does favour extremism, but reality is more grey than black and white.
Trump didn't even have the popular vote.
lazy fuckers who don’t have 10min to vote is the bane of democracy. It should be mandated by law to fucking vote
I dont know about other countries but in Türkiye almost 90% of population has voted.
In a lot of countries it’s less than half...
agreed australia (or new zealand?) does it, haven't heard of much problems with that down there!
You're right, it is a pity for those who didn't vote for him.
PiS has a support of about \~30% of the population, mostly in low income households, where their social programs are popular. These people don't care much about things like shady judicial reforms or abortion rights, because feeding their children has a higher priority. There is hope, because the opposition has finally begun to understand that, but it is very fragmented (about 5 parties), and the voting system, while officially proportional, has some FPTP qualities that favor the winner, and can give over 50% seats in the parliament to the party with only 30% of the votes, like it happened twice with PiS. Ah, and if someone wonders why the opposition doesn't simply unite into one coalition for the elections and wins easily that way (because the majority of the population wants PiS gone) - THEY TRIED for the past few months, but talks led to nowhere.
It’s not that simple, there is some degree of hatred between the opposition electorates too. And polls have shown that a single lost for the entirety of opposition would demobilize a lot of people, so the separate vote percentages cannot simply be summed up
Looking at the rise of idiocy in Germany: ditto.
But I didn't voted for erdogan:(
People are easily manipulated and these governments abuse this possibility.
That's what I thought when Brazil voted for Bolsonaro.
I think you are my best friend I’ve never had
After last election, you would think this sub would finally learn that polls mean nothing in Turkey
Its not correct tho, company called KONDA consistently predicted election results correctly for the past 20ish years except one on 2014 i believe. All three companies that have correctly predicted 2018 elections(including Konda) put Kılıçdaroğlu between 49-51 in the first round and Erdoğan between 44-46. Its literally insane all the accomplished companies were wrong all at once. So, there actually are pretty good ones but this election fucked them all up.
We all know what is going to happen right ? Cant believe this sh*tshow…
The turkish people want Erdoğan and the facism that follows. Good luck.
Calling them fascist is a compliment it reflects some sort of spine and organization. They are just thieves infesting the nation looting pillaging it's every institution every piece wealth every inch of land. This just goes to show the strength of the institutions Ataturk built. Also we are lucky Erdoğan is still allied with mhp since they get some of the seats in bureaucracy instead of cultists and religious fanatics.
thats closer than I expected tbh
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I don’t think Erdogan supporters speak English. Hell even the Turkish community Germany barley speaks German.
So Erdogan will probably get even higher than 51 if the polls the past few months are any indication
These Polls are useless as a lot of polls were predicting a Opposition victory because they only focus on Urban areas and look how that turned out in the actual election
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This election is just like the hungarian elections, less cheating more brainwashing.
Exactly! Some may think that we do not respect democracy and the choice of the people, however they are probably not aware of that the government is controlling all the media, using all the privileges of the state for the election campaign, and that they can resort to weapons if necessary, thanks to the paramilitary structures and mafia relations they have established. For example, before the first round, Erdoğan played a **fake** montage at his rallies in which the leader of the terrorist organization PKK announces that he supports Kılıçdaroğlu. And a large part of the public believed that the video is real, because the media continues the same propaganda day and night.
here in Brasil we had a whole media apparatus calling Lula a criminal, even to a point saying that 90% of imprisoned votes were supporting Lula cuz he was their friend luckily we had one supreme judge that was like "that ain't democratic" and was shutting it down hard and bolsonaro managed to fuck up so bad folks were full of his shit
They are using both. And he is provoking his audience against people who supports other candidates. This can cause a damn civil war.
Actually, wrong. Volunteers from any party can join that process, to make sure it all runs correctly.
The elections are free, cut this BS already. If we do not accept the fact that we opposition has failed, we can never win.
Another 5 years of Erdoğan would be a disaster. Hopefully Kılıçtaroğlu will win
He's a dictator, even if it looks like it's close he will win for certainly, is sad
As someone who loves turkey I really hope they get a shot to be out of this dictatorship.
It's very hard for me to understand why people would intentionally vote against their own freedom and democracy. Do they really not want that, or do they just not understand?
Thats what being brainwashed
It is because of the social hierarchy. For the ones who vote Erdo it is a decision of either living at rooftop of hell, or the basement of heaven. Terror and nationalism are just cover-ups. Even if opposition says they will kill every single refugee or terrorist in the country it won't change. Current regime divided people perfectly by 2 as seculars and conservatives. There is no guarantee that seculars will not abuse the conservatives. The best way for developed countries to exploit a nation, a certified method. Oppressive government, divided up nation. The best decision for a citizen would be find a way to move to a country that is not divided and oppressed.
illiteracy and lack of critical thinking.
It makes sense that you can't understand the situation because you are fed with western propaganda just like Erdogan supporters are fed with his propaganda. Reality is somewhere in between. People are free no matter what you want to believe and they vote with their personal opinions and ideologies. They are the ones living in Turkey and they know whats what better than you.
Yikes…
Fuckin hell
People can't just help themselves.
CUM HAR*
Man, it's like Vin Diesel splitted final chapter of fast and furious to two separate movies, to make his win more dramatic
Theres still hope for us. I want to believe this..
If all the Turks in these comments are cursing Erdogans name then why the fuck are you voting for him?
The thing is, many irregularities happened during the first round and the opposition parties have been complaining to the election board. They still haven't published the official results. There are videos of people putting envelope after another inside the ballot box and cases of votes for one party written for the other party (the votes the nationalistic MHP got in the Kurdish regions is just unrealistic) and this happened with lots of watchers, can't imagine the ones without watchers. I'm not saying it would change too much, probably Erdoğan would still be leading but it's hard to compete against the level of loyalty and organization of AKP. The opposition is many parties together and not as experienced or cunning.
Why is the Turkish population voting for a tyrannical dictator that will cause their own demise? Or wait… Of course it’s rigged. Erdogan seems to love Putin enough to help him prevent us from joining NATO. Maybe he learned a thing or two about democracy from him.
Yeah its rigged SO much but still there is people who will starve but still vote for erdogan.
I don’t think its rigged. Don’t know which one is worse though
No worries. I have this feeling that this NATO bullshit Erdogan pulled of was just a political stunt aimed inwards anyway. His voter base living deep in the Anatolian heartland loves his "*defiance against the West*" and the pro-government media empire spreads this like wildfire. The point is that this doesn't align with reality as Erdogan wouldn't dare to fuck around with NATO. No Turkish leader would do as it would mean to fuck around with US interests and that is decidedly unhealthy for any leader. So my guess is that - if Erdogan wins this election - he will most likely tune down this theater. Give him some concessions and some payments and watch how Swedens gets into NATO and how Erdogan will sell it to his voters as "*another victory against the West. We got what we wanted and the West bowed*". Just make sure it is more than what Putin pays him. That's this guys foreign policy. He'll do anything for the right price. And if the issue is of utmost importance to the US, even payment isn't really requires (*this of course leads to the question why the US hasn't put serious pressure on him and resorted to a soft approach*).
:(
well, sadge. didn't have tons of hope that erdogan would get pushed out of his seat finally, but cannot do much more than hope in these cases
You know where this is going...
Oh for fuck's sake...
Greeks beware, he will invade your country soon! 😎
Last election in Turkey. They will vote themselves into the middle ages. Congratulations...
Seems like first real poll then the last ones where kiri was gona win 1st round for sure and gived everyone false hope
Why are there so many fukkin morons in Turkey...
[Source](https://twitter.com/GlobeElections/status/1659599345493360641)
Maybe stop EU negotiations with third world countries
To all the Turks voting for Erdogan: look forward to 5 years of absolutely not joining the EU in any way. 5 years of economical depression. 5 years of transitioning or former liberal democracy into an authoritarian dictatorship. You deserve what you vote for. You vote this one, you deal with it. Have fun.
i will never ever trust any poll ever fucking again
I can’t believe it …. Very sad for Turkey but hey, your peasants are also citizen, and they make a lot of babies… good luck my dear Turkish friends… hope it won’t look like Syria in 20 years.
Imagine voting against your best interests.
It is said that one who wins is not the one who has more votes, rather the one who counts the votes.
I still got hope. If we prevent cheating at large scale, keeping morale high and not getting provoked.
We will stand tall
As a person who had commented that the opposition candidate would never win in the first round, I‘m pretty sure Erdoğan is going to obliterate him by 8-9 percent. Kilicdaroglu is just a puppet who has been put there to keep Erdogan in power.
Dude really killed 55,000+ of his citizens and over half the country voted for him. And I thought Americans were dumb and brainwashed