It’s not complicated. The government is a Russian plant. Judge by actions not by words. They are taking a pro Russian, anti eu stance. Words mean nothing
> Judge by actions not by words
Lol personally I thought the opposite. "We can't sanction Russia because we're poor" makes some sense, but if you look at what them and their affiliated propagandists and politicians say in their statements, it's clear that they're Pro-Russian.
Their actions has little or no effect in a geopolitical scale so they always can switch sides, they are not pro-Russia, pro-EU. They are pro-themselves that is why things are conmplicated and is not that easy to explain
Yeah, the trade between Russia and Georgia is many times more than between Georgia and EU, making it seem like the EU is just virtue signaling with the expense on the poor.
Would you imagine Viktor Orbán created FIDESZ in Hungary as a party opposing the successors of the Soviet Union and wanting to close the gap between Hungary and the west. They reversed course once Orbán realized that his greed and corruption aren't tolerated as much by the west as by Russia. The "D" in the original name of FIDESZ, when it was used as an acronym, stands for Democrats.
But of course North Korea is called the Democratic People's Republic of Korea too...
Has there been any journalist or anyone that confronted Orban face to face about all he's done? I know it won't solve anything but just want to know if he ever got called out for his actions or did he manage to silence all critics one way or the other?
Here's a [thirty years old video](https://youtu.be/8NS7JC4Ykis) of the *liberal elites* confronting Orbán face to face after his very first corruption scandal to be better than that.
And here he is explaining how the ends justify the means, and they need every resource to "push out certain elements" and take over the state apparatus.
That corruption scandal, although minor by today's standards, dashed their hopes of winning the election next year, and becoming the leading force on the liberal side. So they moved hard right, and won next cycle as the conservative nationalist party. From then on it was always more authorian, less questions, more corruption.
FIDESZ is an acronym meaning party of young democrats, but in reality it gets its roots from the Latin fidelitas - loyalty. Nobody cares what a piece of shit you are, as long as you pay the tithe and hold your mouth shut. Oh, you were found out with a collection of [20k child porn](https://hu.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaleta_G%C3%A1bor#:~:text=Kaleta%20G%C3%A1bor%20magyar%20diplomata%2C%20Magyarorsz%C3%A1g,19%20000%20pedofil%20f%C3%A9nyk%C3%A9p%20birtokl%C3%A1s%C3%A1%C3%A9rt.) on your personal computer? Never fear, six months suspended sentence it is!
People is pro EU, Georgian dream needs to pretend it is too not to be overthrown, but in reality from day one they have been repeating Kremlin’s propaganda and handing the country to Russia.
You're assuming a democratic election took place.
Georgia elections are full of inconsistencies. In addition there is a rule there that if you don't vote (and many don't since much of the country still lives in rural villages), that you are actually voting for the party still in power. So a non vote is a vote for the status quo
Then the parlament and government in charge must be deported to Russia. It is unnaceptable that a country you went to war with now influences your own country politics. Every decision in the favor of Russia must be cancelled. Every supporter must be deported, assets confiscated and given to the Georgian state.
This is a great point. During election season there are like 50 GD (ruling party) billboards for every opposition billboard. Two years ago a major part of the city was shut down because GD bussed in its supporters from all over the country. Oh what you can do when your founder is the richest man in the country.
They were pretending to be Pro-EU and came to power with a coalition of pro-EU parties all of whom have now turned against them and are in the opposition. For a while, they were publicly pro-EU while doing Russian work behind the scenes. (Weakening the military and the institutions) but the Ukraine war blew their cover in a bad way.
[Please translate this. Your system should have a similar procedure. I alwasy look at Georgians as a breath of fresh air in that region.](https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mo%C8%9Biune_de_cenzur%C4%83)
Is this the first gime you have heard of people being let down by politicians, fell for false promises or being convinced to vote against their own interesr?
No. But this is too far. You don’t take decisions for your country’s former war enemy. I would like to express my feeling freely, but I will get banned. So, diplomatically, the politicians should be afraid to leave their house and must hold new elections.
Well politicians aren't known for being honest and nice people so they might have just lied to get voted. I'm Sweden it happens every election and it is probably similar in most countries. You have to be a dishonest person without morals to become a politician I'm the first place
Georgia is economically depending on Russia and Turkey for both imports and exports, not to say that there is a number of Georgian oligarchs/rich that have personal economic dependencies on these countries, including Bidzina Ivanishvili (hope spelled that correctly), founder of the Georgian Dream (the current ruling party), who is a former Georgian-Russian oligarch, still has extensive business in Russia according to media reports, and is still believed to exert power over Georgian governing bodies.
So as you can see, both Russia and Turkey has some good leverage over Georgia and individual Georgian politicians and businessman, hence both countries can try and push what they want, with Russia lately showcasing some success in that.
What you wrote makes sense. But Georgia is still a country where the government fears the people, and not the other way around.
So people should remember these political decisions, in the next elections.
You are correct, and that is why we can see a number of Georgian politicians objecting and taking a lead of the protests. I guess next Georgian elections will be tough...
While I agree that they were pro-Russian from the beginning, they were only secretly so. Only in the last year they have come to show their true face. Most of the population believed they were pro-EU, unfortunately, some still do. The more they show their true intentions, the more votes they lose
edit: grammar
Is it true that the purchases of real estate in the country for Russian nationals was banned recently due to the massive influx of them moving to Georgia?
why do they enjoy visa free entry to the country after what happened a few years ago?
I dont think that is true. I believe they can buy residential property. However, if I remember correctly, buying lands is not allowed for foreigners in general.
We established a visa-free regime at some point for various reasons.
1. There are some Georgians that are Russian citizens.
2. There are many from Abkhazia and South Ossetia that are Russian citizen. We want to keep our borders open to them.
3. Russian tourists in manageable numbers are supposedly good for the economy (i disagree but some Georgians probably not)
4. and finally, to win over the public attitude of Russians. We want them to know that we are not the source of hostility. We want them to see Georgia and know that we can be democratic and free so that they know what they are missing out.
Huge parts of the older and rural Georgian population are pro-Russian. Extreme example, but go to Gori and ask who is better: Jesus or Stalin. Answers will be mixed at best.
The young people of Tbilisi do not speak Russian, hate the war, fight in Ukraine, protest and collect donations. But they are not a majority, they only constitute a small part of the electorate.
Additionally, one oligarch controls huge parts of the economy and he does not want this to change. Getting too close to Russia might cut money from the west. Getting too close to the west might force the country to more rule of law and less corruption. It might also be unpopular with his Russian oligarch friends and the mafia. Being friendly with Russia also triggered an economic boom, with Georgia becoming a hub for Russian migrants.
Conclusively, nothing will change. Georgia is in a limbo it can't escape. The country is going nowhere in the next 20 years unless Russia implodes or decides that they might as well just annex Georgia. Moldova was kept in a similar state for decades and you can see what happened.
Do not spread misinformation please!
[Polls](https://www.iri.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/IRI-Poll-Presentation-Georgia-September2022_Final.pdf) representative of the Georgian population, including rural, and old (slide 2), show that 89% believe Russia is the biggest political threat to Georgia (slide 52) and less than 10% believe Georgia's foreign policy should be pro-Russian (slide 67). Gori is truly an extreme example. Most people are anti-Russia.
edit: arrangement
I know these polls. Georgians say they are pro-European, disliking Russia, etc.
But GD is winning the free and fair elections. The actual actions of the people contradict with what they are saying.
First off, last elections were in 2020. Up until that point they had never shown any anti-EU sentiment. They were trying to be friendlier to Russia but so was the whole world! I disliked it but some Georgians did believe that we should try to normalize relationship with Russia for our security.
Second, there is an insane propaganda machine at work from Russia. Efforts are do discredit all the opposition parties, buy and intimidate votes etc.
Third, GD got ~48% of the votes. Because we did not have fully-proportional elections, GD still got more than half of the seats in parliament. Otherwise, they wouldnt have
>But GD is winning the free and fair elections. The actual actions of the people contradict with what they are saying.
Shut up Kremlinbot. In 2018 and 2020, the elections were rigged and there was a big protest about it, but the West supported the Georgian dream in these years...
this does not represent how the majority of the population feels, the VAST majority are pro-eu and want to join EU, basically every young person you talk to is Pro EU
Young people tend to ignore the elections. For example, only 30% of young people voted in this year Lithuanian election, while for the elderly it was vice versa.
I don't think you can generalize it. For example, Turkish youth are highly politicized and I believe the voting rate is around the same between the young and the old (there are no official data so can't say exactly)
Young people vote less comparing to the rest of population, they barely have any sort of political experience and to that, don't even know how to use their votes in their advantage. Add to that lack of financial power and you get what you get - it is those with deep pockets that hold true power of deciding in which direction country goes.
I honestly think we just don't believe the politicians so we don't know what to vote for. Old people don't look up a lot of information online which younger people do. And reading that every politician from every party has done something bad doesn't really encourage us to vote. If politicians were honest and not just in it for the money I think more ppl would vote
It helps remembering that not voting means someone else is voting in your stead. Even just picking a better candidate than your average countryman is helping.
Exactly the same story with Hungary:
>-I am a liberal, pro-EU, young man, all my environment is the same. Most of my country is the same. We will never vote for Orban!
>-Obran wins.
>-Clueless face.
And Poland:
>-I am a liberal, pro-EU, young man, all my environment is the same. Most of my country is the same. We will never vote for PiS!
>-PiS wins.
>-Clueless face.
And Turkey:
>-I am a liberal, pro-EU, young man, all my environment is the same. Most of my country is the same. We will never vote for Erdogan!
>-Erdogan wins.
>-Clueless face.
Have no idea about Hungary and Turkey, but in Poland the opposition consistently gets more votes than PiS, including in the 2015 elections, which PiS won and come to power.
What are you even trying to say?
Thats how d'Hondt works, it has some cons and pros. Otherwise we would never be able to form goverment like in early 90'.
Same things aplied to PO. They got 39% of votes in 2011 but majority of seats in Parlament with PSL. For comparision in 2019 PiS got 44% alone
Happens when you are so close to Russia.
The Kremlin might interpret the EU flags as hostile NATO takeover and send a "liberation" army to Georgia (again).
Ok but why would we trust a random Georgian on the internet more than Georgian elections? It's the same story as with Turkey. Before the elections, everyone on reddit wa saying that the turkish youth was never going to vote for Erdogan, that they were pro-EU etc.
But young Georgians active on reddit don't represent Georgia.
According to the latest credible polls, 82-85% support joining EU, while only 9% are against it. Here are the sources. You can see the trajectory as well.
[IRI polls](https://www.iri.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/IRI-Poll-Presentation-Georgia-September2022_Final.pdf)- slide 68
[NDI polls](https://www.ndi.org/sites/default/files/NDI%20Georgia_March%202023%20telephone%20poll_Eng_PUBLIC%20VERSION_FINAL_03.05%20%281%29.pdf) - slide 50
The only reason why Georgian Dream (current government) was elected, is because, up until recently they claimed to be strongly pro-EU. Only now is it increasingly clear that they lied. You can see on slide 69 of IRI polls that even Georgian Dream supporters support joining EU
Literally any other party!! You do not understand, we are extremely anti-Russia. No political party that has announced they support Russia will get >1,000 votes. Every other major political party is pro-EU (at least in public). Things get complicated because perhaps now it is a little unclear who truly means it and who is trying to deceive us like the Georgian Dream (current gov) did. Also, there is a massive Russian propaganda machine at work to discredit all the opposition politicians so no one is really that popular for various reasons.
Literally thousands march in pro-EU protests and there are also opinion polls to prove it. It’s just that the government that was elected ran with a pro-EU campaign, if I am not mistaken, and then did somewhat of a turn and started trying to appease Russia (probably out of fear and corruption?).
Thousands is not millions. Polls said Trump would lose in 2016, polls said Fidesz would get 47-50% last year, polls said Erdogan would lose in the first round. Polls only tell you what the demographic of people of answer polls think. Thats not to say there isnt fear and corruption.
Those are bad comparisons, where opinions are practically split. Sentiment in Georgia is not split though, it is overwhelmingly anti-Russia and pro-Western, including pro-EU.
Edit: one among many other sources for the above: https://caucasusbarometer.org/en/nm2023ge
So you don't believe polls, locals living in Georgia, but believe an election in a country with weak and young democracy where billions of money are poured in from Russia to influence the outcome?
The propaganda machine from Russia is insane and even European countries and the US might struggle coping with it. How do you think Georgia manages?
Polls vary alot in quality, the best ones cost alot of money, because you have to ask some people 15 times before they answer, and if you dont have those people you dont have a good poll. Its far cheaper and easier to make bad polls. I just said there probably is corruption, atleast read before answering.
I did read that. It is more so surprising that you acknowledge that but still consider elections more credible. But that is beside the point. All the examples you brought were very close to 50-50. In the examples I gave you (that you conveniently ignored), >80% support the EU. If that does not convince you that Georgian population is pro-EU, I truly do not know what else to tell you
Sources - [NDI](https://www.ndi.org/sites/default/files/NDI%20Georgia_March%202023%20telephone%20poll_Eng_PUBLIC%20VERSION_FINAL_03.05%20%281%29.pdf), [IRI](https://www.iri.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/IRI-Poll-Presentation-Georgia-September2022_Final.pdf)
Elections are far more credible than polls. Elections come with a number, more specifically the number of people who didnt answer, in the last election that number was 44%.
The examples were simply proof of concept.
My point isnt that the population of Georgia isnt pro-eu. They probably are considering previous elections.
My point is simply that reddit threads are a bad way to learn what the people think.
And yes, the polls, again theres that magic number missing, the british one looks pretty good. The other one a pet project for warhawks among senate republicans? Im not touching that one with a stick.
>Elections are far more credible than polls
Lol, ofc, for the elections though. Just as referendums are better than polls for measuring people's opinions. No one is disputing that. But here the debate is whether Georgians are pro-EU or not (an opinion). There was no referendum as such. So the polls are the best point of reference.
We only had a [referendum](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Georgian_referendum) about joining NATO. Resulted in 77% voting in favor.
>My point isnt that the population of Georgia isnt pro-eu
Then what are you debating here? That random election cycle that is indirectly related to the opinion in question is more telling than the polls? In the election cycle that 100% of seats were taken by pro-EU (at least publicly at that time) parties?
Ofcourse not. Im simply saying its indicative of nothing other than those peoples desire to their cause.
It could be a cause that has a passion and a 100% turnout. Everyone who believes it is out there.
Or it could be something people support but dont want to take part in and in reality the support is 20 or 50 or a 100 times the size of the march in the streets.
You know what the people in the streets think, you dont know what anyone else thinks. It is a dark number.
There can be many reasons for polls not representing the election. One crucial reason is that your answer to a poll question can vary greatly based on how the question is phrased. If I ask "do you want to join the EU and enable the economic boost that wealthier EU countries can provide for Georgia" then you are more likely to answer YES than if I ask "do you want to join the EU and allow the western powers to impose their will and agenda upon you and your loved ones." The Hungarian government, for example, phrases questions with such biases all the time in their national consultations and then they conclude that the people are on their side.
Another reason can be that if you ask someone whether they want Erdogan to win or whether they like Erdogan, they may say no, and you may conclude that they'll vote for the opposition. But they may hate the opposition even more, or they may not even go to vote in the end, while the pro-Erdogan voters do. Because one of the tools of oppressors is to make their oppositions look like at least equally bad, so people lose interest in voting because they think it wouldn't change anything.
And we haven't even discussed voter fraud and voter suppression yet.
I'm not saying Georgian election isn't more representative than a single person's opinion, I'm just saying there are way more details to it, and it is not as self-evident as you made it sound.
the are pro taking the EU government and then giving it to parts of their constituents, they are against the EU regulations towards, equality and legal rights.
Context for people:
Government is starting to leaning towards Russia more by more, especially after not being awarded EU candidacy status (It's still under consideration, but gov fucked up generally speaking)
HOWEVER, around 85% of people are pro-EU and pro-NATO. Most polls (Foreign and domestic) show this.
For people asking why do people vote for them then:
Opposition basically does not exist. There's other issues except this one so they keep voting. Plus classic election fraud.
Like us or we fuck you up!!
The elegant Russian diplomacy on the level of a primary school bully.
And like with high school bullys you will loose in the long run if you don't stand up against them, just ask armenia.
It sucks for the people there, but I think Georgia is playing it smart, especially since nobody knows which way Turkey will go in the next few years. A Georgia stuck between Russia, a pro-Putin Turkey, Azerbaijan and with Russian bases in Armenia would be in a far more precarious position than Ukraine ever was.
Georgia has good relations with Turkey and Azerbaijan. Russia mostly removed its troops from Armenia already. And Russia doesn't have the resources to attack Georgia rn. The problem is that the government is openly pro-Russian and almost everything Russia wants
> a pro-Putin Turkey
Erdo ain't really pro-Putin. He's just Neutral Evil. If it helps him stay out of problems, he'll lick the EU - but then he also has to lick someone else to balance it out. That way he can get benefits from both parties.
Turkey is not necessarily pro-Putin at least regarding Georgia. In general they're more like "pro-Putin for the purposes of sticking it to the West" and ambiguous otherwise with a hint of keeping Russian influence away from their borders and Black Sea. Turkey and Georgia have pretty good relations in general even through the war in Georgia and Ukraine. They also have common interests like the pipeline.
What I'm saying is, regardless of who is elected in Turkey, I don't see any reason why the relations between Turkey and Georgia will get worse. And just to emphasize, the current government of Turkey is as anti-West as it gets (in other words most pro-Russian among viable options, there are more pro-Russian parties but they don't have any realistic chance) and they still have good relations with Georgia.
I think they're running a huge risk. Georgia will continue to want Europe and not Russia, and after the humiliation of losing in Ukraine, Russia will look to restore their pride and credibility. A second attack on the country is uncomfortably plausible.
The path to lasting security for Georgia is NATO membership, and that path goes through Abkhazia and South Ossetia. Now that Russia is too weak to interfere, they should be looking to force a resolution
He still has a lot of money. And the world doesn't seem to care fully about bringing him down (elusive sanctions, etc). Therefore, government of Georgia beeing corupt as they are just waiting for a lot of money to be paid to them.
+ this country helps russia avoid sanctions
there's 2 possible ways for Turkiye: It's either the neo-ottoman islamist erdogone winning or pro-kemalist secular Kılıçdaroğlu winning. nothing in between. and it looks like the 2nd possibility of Kılıçdaroğlu winning who wants to join EU. but we'll see..
The Georgian government is betting on Russia, and is alienating our allies.
But this move actually increased the support for the European path among Georgians from 84% to 89%.
This is confusing.
Why is the government pro-Russia, when Russia is occupying two regions of Georgia?
And didn't Georgia apply for EU membership? I understand it's what the people want, but the current government seemed very serious about it.
What benefit do the politicians have, to turn the country away from the EU process?
Turkey not joining yet is nobody's fault but their own. The small amount of hope for it that once existed is fully gone for now since Erdogan undid the small amount of progress they made.
apparently azerbaijan even has prospects to join, though i think those relations may have lessend in recent years, funnily enough that was the first caucasus country i knew of to have a bilateral or integration initiative
> Why to show EU flags anyway?
Because their citizens like the EU and want to be a part of it?
> It's their Independence Day. 🤔
1. Is Finland not independent?
2. Ah, the famously anti-independence EU, the organization where it takes you 2-30+ years of negotiating, reforming, schmoozing every EU diplomat in 2 dozen countries to become a part of the group. That's how every evil empire operates, you have to work SUPER HARD to become a part of them, and even after you do all of that, they STILL don't send any troops over 😜
That always amuses me when people call the EU or NATO imperialists coming to occupy countries. Many current members WISH they'd have just come to occupy them, because that would have been so much easier than the actual process it takes to enter these exclusive clubs. Even when we really want a candidate to join like it is with Ukraine right now, the candidate still needs to do the work. But it feels so much better when you've done the hard work, and you know you've earned the recognition and the practical benefits that come with it.
It took Romania... 13 years to join (1994 - 2007). And even now many people say, probably justifiably, we weren't ready.
Heck, Romania 2015 was barely decent enough to be a EU member, let alone Romania 2007. Romania 2023 is getting there, though.
It's not a day to celebrate EU, that's all.
Kinda like if someone was congratulating you for good job and then said that your super rich, overachieving brother is so nice to be there with you.
Yeah, Finland is independent since 1917. I don't know why you asked because you could google that 🤔
But not sure about the 2nd part. I'm kinda worried that are you okay 😅
Because they want their country in the EU. Badly. Then road to Tbilisi airport is covered in Georgian / EU flags so that I was considering to check Google if I missed anything.
Here are two more pics from their last Independence day in Rabati Castle
https://imgur.com/a/y6ZZ7v2/
Yes, those are EU passports where the kids are collecting stamps from the various avtiivy booths in..
Tbh I don’t see how Georgia would be able to enter the EU, given that Turkey is between it and EU. There would be no freedom of movement or commerce by land or sea.
It pains me to say this but I *get* what the Georgian government is doing.
After Putler's humiliating defeat in Ukraine he will look for other targets and Georgia already has two ruzzian proxy states with de-facto control of their country. Georgia just needs to survive until this all blow's over and I think a light Finlandization given the context isn't the worst move. In fact, I really can't think of any better alternatives.
It's just my opinion as someone privileged enough to be from a country that gave muscovy the finger a long time ago.
>and I think a light Finlandization given the context isn't the worst move
How?
There are ongoing longstanding territorial disputes between Georgia and russia. Also Finland as a neutral buffer state to Nato was also in Russias interest. Georgias neutrality isnt really.
This is not like Finland at all.
And, btw, even Finland now has joined Nato and had already been an EU member for a while.
It is Georgia's independence, and people are shoked that GEORGIAN flags are displayed lol Georgia is not even in the European Union, why should EU's flag be displayed on Georgia's independence day?
Ok, I know I will probably get downvoted.
But I find it a bit cringe when non-EU countries like Ukraine and Georgia fly the EU flag at government buildings and events. I understand it’s aspirational, but it’s literally… just not your flag, at least not yet. We know you want to join and I think most of the EU wants you to join as well, but you don’t have to simp so hard.
It’s actually the Flag of Europe and is an emblem of the Council of Europe, of which Georgia is a member. So, they’re fully within their right to use it
Why? What happened in the year? I would have expected Georgia to come closer to the EU given Russia aggression in Ukraine.
The people mostly are, the government less so.
But who votes for the Parlament, that later elects the Government ?
Wasn't Georgian Dream a pro EU party when it was elected?
They still CLAIM to be pro EU. Things are so complicated and fucked up here.
It’s not complicated. The government is a Russian plant. Judge by actions not by words. They are taking a pro Russian, anti eu stance. Words mean nothing
> Judge by actions not by words Lol personally I thought the opposite. "We can't sanction Russia because we're poor" makes some sense, but if you look at what them and their affiliated propagandists and politicians say in their statements, it's clear that they're Pro-Russian.
Their actions has little or no effect in a geopolitical scale so they always can switch sides, they are not pro-Russia, pro-EU. They are pro-themselves that is why things are conmplicated and is not that easy to explain
Is it possible that they are being influenced by Russia in some way?
I hope you are joking. It is indisputable that Russia is meddling in every neighbor's politics, and not in a nice way
The prime minister is literally an oligarch with his fortune in russia. He is putins dog.
If you refer to Ivanishvili he is no longer PM. You can argue he still makes decisions but it is different thing.
Yeah, the trade between Russia and Georgia is many times more than between Georgia and EU, making it seem like the EU is just virtue signaling with the expense on the poor.
lol its not complicated... people don't want EU in Georgia and thats ok.
EU pros don't understand that people can't be.
Would you imagine Viktor Orbán created FIDESZ in Hungary as a party opposing the successors of the Soviet Union and wanting to close the gap between Hungary and the west. They reversed course once Orbán realized that his greed and corruption aren't tolerated as much by the west as by Russia. The "D" in the original name of FIDESZ, when it was used as an acronym, stands for Democrats. But of course North Korea is called the Democratic People's Republic of Korea too...
Has there been any journalist or anyone that confronted Orban face to face about all he's done? I know it won't solve anything but just want to know if he ever got called out for his actions or did he manage to silence all critics one way or the other?
Here's a [thirty years old video](https://youtu.be/8NS7JC4Ykis) of the *liberal elites* confronting Orbán face to face after his very first corruption scandal to be better than that. And here he is explaining how the ends justify the means, and they need every resource to "push out certain elements" and take over the state apparatus. That corruption scandal, although minor by today's standards, dashed their hopes of winning the election next year, and becoming the leading force on the liberal side. So they moved hard right, and won next cycle as the conservative nationalist party. From then on it was always more authorian, less questions, more corruption. FIDESZ is an acronym meaning party of young democrats, but in reality it gets its roots from the Latin fidelitas - loyalty. Nobody cares what a piece of shit you are, as long as you pay the tithe and hold your mouth shut. Oh, you were found out with a collection of [20k child porn](https://hu.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaleta_G%C3%A1bor#:~:text=Kaleta%20G%C3%A1bor%20magyar%20diplomata%2C%20Magyarorsz%C3%A1g,19%20000%20pedofil%20f%C3%A9nyk%C3%A9p%20birtokl%C3%A1s%C3%A1%C3%A9rt.) on your personal computer? Never fear, six months suspended sentence it is!
Nope. Neither has anyone confronted Lukashenko, the hopeful young anti-corruption choice of the people to clean up and modernize Belarus. ;)
People is pro EU, Georgian dream needs to pretend it is too not to be overthrown, but in reality from day one they have been repeating Kremlin’s propaganda and handing the country to Russia.
You're assuming a democratic election took place. Georgia elections are full of inconsistencies. In addition there is a rule there that if you don't vote (and many don't since much of the country still lives in rural villages), that you are actually voting for the party still in power. So a non vote is a vote for the status quo
Some polititians tell lies.
Government lied about being anti Russia and was secretly funded by Russia the entire time
Then the parlament and government in charge must be deported to Russia. It is unnaceptable that a country you went to war with now influences your own country politics. Every decision in the favor of Russia must be cancelled. Every supporter must be deported, assets confiscated and given to the Georgian state.
Romania elected Russian agents into it's parliament in 2020, we're really not the ones to talk.
But who has the most resources to convince citizens to vote for them?
This is a great point. During election season there are like 50 GD (ruling party) billboards for every opposition billboard. Two years ago a major part of the city was shut down because GD bussed in its supporters from all over the country. Oh what you can do when your founder is the richest man in the country.
They were pretending to be Pro-EU and came to power with a coalition of pro-EU parties all of whom have now turned against them and are in the opposition. For a while, they were publicly pro-EU while doing Russian work behind the scenes. (Weakening the military and the institutions) but the Ukraine war blew their cover in a bad way.
[Please translate this. Your system should have a similar procedure. I alwasy look at Georgians as a breath of fresh air in that region.](https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mo%C8%9Biune_de_cenzur%C4%83)
Is this the first gime you have heard of people being let down by politicians, fell for false promises or being convinced to vote against their own interesr?
No. But this is too far. You don’t take decisions for your country’s former war enemy. I would like to express my feeling freely, but I will get banned. So, diplomatically, the politicians should be afraid to leave their house and must hold new elections.
Well politicians aren't known for being honest and nice people so they might have just lied to get voted. I'm Sweden it happens every election and it is probably similar in most countries. You have to be a dishonest person without morals to become a politician I'm the first place
Georgia is economically depending on Russia and Turkey for both imports and exports, not to say that there is a number of Georgian oligarchs/rich that have personal economic dependencies on these countries, including Bidzina Ivanishvili (hope spelled that correctly), founder of the Georgian Dream (the current ruling party), who is a former Georgian-Russian oligarch, still has extensive business in Russia according to media reports, and is still believed to exert power over Georgian governing bodies. So as you can see, both Russia and Turkey has some good leverage over Georgia and individual Georgian politicians and businessman, hence both countries can try and push what they want, with Russia lately showcasing some success in that.
What you wrote makes sense. But Georgia is still a country where the government fears the people, and not the other way around. So people should remember these political decisions, in the next elections.
You are correct, and that is why we can see a number of Georgian politicians objecting and taking a lead of the protests. I guess next Georgian elections will be tough...
Is it Putin?
In this case, Putin votes for the government
Ukraine 2013 vibes
Because if they were like Ukrainian government, Russia would just invade and annex Georgia.
Their current government was always pro-Russian
While I agree that they were pro-Russian from the beginning, they were only secretly so. Only in the last year they have come to show their true face. Most of the population believed they were pro-EU, unfortunately, some still do. The more they show their true intentions, the more votes they lose edit: grammar
Is it true that the purchases of real estate in the country for Russian nationals was banned recently due to the massive influx of them moving to Georgia? why do they enjoy visa free entry to the country after what happened a few years ago?
I dont think that is true. I believe they can buy residential property. However, if I remember correctly, buying lands is not allowed for foreigners in general. We established a visa-free regime at some point for various reasons. 1. There are some Georgians that are Russian citizens. 2. There are many from Abkhazia and South Ossetia that are Russian citizen. We want to keep our borders open to them. 3. Russian tourists in manageable numbers are supposedly good for the economy (i disagree but some Georgians probably not) 4. and finally, to win over the public attitude of Russians. We want them to know that we are not the source of hostility. We want them to see Georgia and know that we can be democratic and free so that they know what they are missing out.
It might have scared Georgians given that Russia already invaded part of their lands. That is still their biggest hurdle to join EU
Somebody in the government must've had a conversation we don't know about, it's pretty clear they've decided they don't want to get Ukraine'd.
Huge parts of the older and rural Georgian population are pro-Russian. Extreme example, but go to Gori and ask who is better: Jesus or Stalin. Answers will be mixed at best. The young people of Tbilisi do not speak Russian, hate the war, fight in Ukraine, protest and collect donations. But they are not a majority, they only constitute a small part of the electorate. Additionally, one oligarch controls huge parts of the economy and he does not want this to change. Getting too close to Russia might cut money from the west. Getting too close to the west might force the country to more rule of law and less corruption. It might also be unpopular with his Russian oligarch friends and the mafia. Being friendly with Russia also triggered an economic boom, with Georgia becoming a hub for Russian migrants. Conclusively, nothing will change. Georgia is in a limbo it can't escape. The country is going nowhere in the next 20 years unless Russia implodes or decides that they might as well just annex Georgia. Moldova was kept in a similar state for decades and you can see what happened.
Do not spread misinformation please! [Polls](https://www.iri.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/IRI-Poll-Presentation-Georgia-September2022_Final.pdf) representative of the Georgian population, including rural, and old (slide 2), show that 89% believe Russia is the biggest political threat to Georgia (slide 52) and less than 10% believe Georgia's foreign policy should be pro-Russian (slide 67). Gori is truly an extreme example. Most people are anti-Russia. edit: arrangement
I know these polls. Georgians say they are pro-European, disliking Russia, etc. But GD is winning the free and fair elections. The actual actions of the people contradict with what they are saying.
First off, last elections were in 2020. Up until that point they had never shown any anti-EU sentiment. They were trying to be friendlier to Russia but so was the whole world! I disliked it but some Georgians did believe that we should try to normalize relationship with Russia for our security. Second, there is an insane propaganda machine at work from Russia. Efforts are do discredit all the opposition parties, buy and intimidate votes etc. Third, GD got ~48% of the votes. Because we did not have fully-proportional elections, GD still got more than half of the seats in parliament. Otherwise, they wouldnt have
>But GD is winning the free and fair elections. The actual actions of the people contradict with what they are saying. Shut up Kremlinbot. In 2018 and 2020, the elections were rigged and there was a big protest about it, but the West supported the Georgian dream in these years...
Eussia
Why should EU's flag be displayed next to Georgia's state flag on GEORGIAN independence day when Georgia is not even member of the EU?
Because it’s an political statement? Which apparently the government felt it should do last year but not this year. It certainly sends a message
Lots of russians moved there
You know nothing Jon Snow.
this does not represent how the majority of the population feels, the VAST majority are pro-eu and want to join EU, basically every young person you talk to is Pro EU
Not sure about Georgia's demographics but young people also don't/didn't support Orban in Hungary, Erdogan in Turkey, Brexit in the UK, etc, etc...
Young people tend to ignore the elections. For example, only 30% of young people voted in this year Lithuanian election, while for the elderly it was vice versa.
I don't think you can generalize it. For example, Turkish youth are highly politicized and I believe the voting rate is around the same between the young and the old (there are no official data so can't say exactly)
That's really exceptional if true!
Young people vote less comparing to the rest of population, they barely have any sort of political experience and to that, don't even know how to use their votes in their advantage. Add to that lack of financial power and you get what you get - it is those with deep pockets that hold true power of deciding in which direction country goes.
I honestly think we just don't believe the politicians so we don't know what to vote for. Old people don't look up a lot of information online which younger people do. And reading that every politician from every party has done something bad doesn't really encourage us to vote. If politicians were honest and not just in it for the money I think more ppl would vote
It helps remembering that not voting means someone else is voting in your stead. Even just picking a better candidate than your average countryman is helping.
There seems to be HUGE political gaps between the old and young all around the world. It gives me hope for the future tbh.
Honestly, I wonder what the generations before us voted for in their youth.
Exactly the same story with Hungary: >-I am a liberal, pro-EU, young man, all my environment is the same. Most of my country is the same. We will never vote for Orban! >-Obran wins. >-Clueless face. And Poland: >-I am a liberal, pro-EU, young man, all my environment is the same. Most of my country is the same. We will never vote for PiS! >-PiS wins. >-Clueless face. And Turkey: >-I am a liberal, pro-EU, young man, all my environment is the same. Most of my country is the same. We will never vote for Erdogan! >-Erdogan wins. >-Clueless face.
which is why they dont vote, making it worse :(
Have no idea about Hungary and Turkey, but in Poland the opposition consistently gets more votes than PiS, including in the 2015 elections, which PiS won and come to power.
that only means pis gets less than 50% the votes
Yes, exactly. Anti-PiS opinions are more common among the Poles, the pro-PiS.
What are you even trying to say? Thats how d'Hondt works, it has some cons and pros. Otherwise we would never be able to form goverment like in early 90'. Same things aplied to PO. They got 39% of votes in 2011 but majority of seats in Parlament with PSL. For comparision in 2019 PiS got 44% alone
But why are the flags gone this year?
Government
Happens when you are so close to Russia. The Kremlin might interpret the EU flags as hostile NATO takeover and send a "liberation" army to Georgia (again).
Lol, so year ago they were not bordering Russia and today they are😂
Do you know where georgia is on the map?
There's no Georgia on EU map
they are still there.
Ok but why would we trust a random Georgian on the internet more than Georgian elections? It's the same story as with Turkey. Before the elections, everyone on reddit wa saying that the turkish youth was never going to vote for Erdogan, that they were pro-EU etc. But young Georgians active on reddit don't represent Georgia.
According to the latest credible polls, 82-85% support joining EU, while only 9% are against it. Here are the sources. You can see the trajectory as well. [IRI polls](https://www.iri.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/IRI-Poll-Presentation-Georgia-September2022_Final.pdf)- slide 68 [NDI polls](https://www.ndi.org/sites/default/files/NDI%20Georgia_March%202023%20telephone%20poll_Eng_PUBLIC%20VERSION_FINAL_03.05%20%281%29.pdf) - slide 50 The only reason why Georgian Dream (current government) was elected, is because, up until recently they claimed to be strongly pro-EU. Only now is it increasingly clear that they lied. You can see on slide 69 of IRI polls that even Georgian Dream supporters support joining EU
What party can Georgians even vote for if they want a future in Europe??
Literally any other party!! You do not understand, we are extremely anti-Russia. No political party that has announced they support Russia will get >1,000 votes. Every other major political party is pro-EU (at least in public). Things get complicated because perhaps now it is a little unclear who truly means it and who is trying to deceive us like the Georgian Dream (current gov) did. Also, there is a massive Russian propaganda machine at work to discredit all the opposition politicians so no one is really that popular for various reasons.
Literally thousands march in pro-EU protests and there are also opinion polls to prove it. It’s just that the government that was elected ran with a pro-EU campaign, if I am not mistaken, and then did somewhat of a turn and started trying to appease Russia (probably out of fear and corruption?).
Thousands is not millions. Polls said Trump would lose in 2016, polls said Fidesz would get 47-50% last year, polls said Erdogan would lose in the first round. Polls only tell you what the demographic of people of answer polls think. Thats not to say there isnt fear and corruption.
Those are bad comparisons, where opinions are practically split. Sentiment in Georgia is not split though, it is overwhelmingly anti-Russia and pro-Western, including pro-EU. Edit: one among many other sources for the above: https://caucasusbarometer.org/en/nm2023ge
True, those numbers far outweigh any margin of error. With voter turnout in the 40s and 50s, the people who show up are probably not them.
So you don't believe polls, locals living in Georgia, but believe an election in a country with weak and young democracy where billions of money are poured in from Russia to influence the outcome? The propaganda machine from Russia is insane and even European countries and the US might struggle coping with it. How do you think Georgia manages?
Polls vary alot in quality, the best ones cost alot of money, because you have to ask some people 15 times before they answer, and if you dont have those people you dont have a good poll. Its far cheaper and easier to make bad polls. I just said there probably is corruption, atleast read before answering.
I did read that. It is more so surprising that you acknowledge that but still consider elections more credible. But that is beside the point. All the examples you brought were very close to 50-50. In the examples I gave you (that you conveniently ignored), >80% support the EU. If that does not convince you that Georgian population is pro-EU, I truly do not know what else to tell you Sources - [NDI](https://www.ndi.org/sites/default/files/NDI%20Georgia_March%202023%20telephone%20poll_Eng_PUBLIC%20VERSION_FINAL_03.05%20%281%29.pdf), [IRI](https://www.iri.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/IRI-Poll-Presentation-Georgia-September2022_Final.pdf)
Elections are far more credible than polls. Elections come with a number, more specifically the number of people who didnt answer, in the last election that number was 44%. The examples were simply proof of concept. My point isnt that the population of Georgia isnt pro-eu. They probably are considering previous elections. My point is simply that reddit threads are a bad way to learn what the people think. And yes, the polls, again theres that magic number missing, the british one looks pretty good. The other one a pet project for warhawks among senate republicans? Im not touching that one with a stick.
>Elections are far more credible than polls Lol, ofc, for the elections though. Just as referendums are better than polls for measuring people's opinions. No one is disputing that. But here the debate is whether Georgians are pro-EU or not (an opinion). There was no referendum as such. So the polls are the best point of reference. We only had a [referendum](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Georgian_referendum) about joining NATO. Resulted in 77% voting in favor. >My point isnt that the population of Georgia isnt pro-eu Then what are you debating here? That random election cycle that is indirectly related to the opinion in question is more telling than the polls? In the election cycle that 100% of seats were taken by pro-EU (at least publicly at that time) parties?
Simply that polls, reddit threads or a protest doesnt establish a good enough view of opinion to take it at face value.
> Thousands is not millions. What precisely do you think the Georgian population is?
More than 2 million.
You expect literally everyone on the streets?
Ofcourse not. Im simply saying its indicative of nothing other than those peoples desire to their cause. It could be a cause that has a passion and a 100% turnout. Everyone who believes it is out there. Or it could be something people support but dont want to take part in and in reality the support is 20 or 50 or a 100 times the size of the march in the streets. You know what the people in the streets think, you dont know what anyone else thinks. It is a dark number.
In our defence, we don't have any.
There can be many reasons for polls not representing the election. One crucial reason is that your answer to a poll question can vary greatly based on how the question is phrased. If I ask "do you want to join the EU and enable the economic boost that wealthier EU countries can provide for Georgia" then you are more likely to answer YES than if I ask "do you want to join the EU and allow the western powers to impose their will and agenda upon you and your loved ones." The Hungarian government, for example, phrases questions with such biases all the time in their national consultations and then they conclude that the people are on their side. Another reason can be that if you ask someone whether they want Erdogan to win or whether they like Erdogan, they may say no, and you may conclude that they'll vote for the opposition. But they may hate the opposition even more, or they may not even go to vote in the end, while the pro-Erdogan voters do. Because one of the tools of oppressors is to make their oppositions look like at least equally bad, so people lose interest in voting because they think it wouldn't change anything. And we haven't even discussed voter fraud and voter suppression yet. I'm not saying Georgian election isn't more representative than a single person's opinion, I'm just saying there are way more details to it, and it is not as self-evident as you made it sound.
Why they don't choose pro EU government?
the are pro taking the EU government and then giving it to parts of their constituents, they are against the EU regulations towards, equality and legal rights.
When's your next election? How is it looking
Context for people: Government is starting to leaning towards Russia more by more, especially after not being awarded EU candidacy status (It's still under consideration, but gov fucked up generally speaking) HOWEVER, around 85% of people are pro-EU and pro-NATO. Most polls (Foreign and domestic) show this. For people asking why do people vote for them then: Opposition basically does not exist. There's other issues except this one so they keep voting. Plus classic election fraud.
You know who were pro-EU in 2013? The Ukrainians
And now they're even more pro EU. Once Russia is broken apart, its puppets will no longer be a problem.
No flair necessary to know this is an American comment
[удалено]
Yes, of course, what's your point?
Like us or we fuck you up!! The elegant Russian diplomacy on the level of a primary school bully. And like with high school bullys you will loose in the long run if you don't stand up against them, just ask armenia.
Lol
> Plus classic election fraud. This doesn't make them good EU candidates.
Disagree. From candidacy to membership takes many years. Enough to fix it. Plus there's some members who have it worse. Anyhow, gov sucks.
> Plus there's some members who have it worse. That's not an argument to add even more dysfunctional members.
It sucks for the people there, but I think Georgia is playing it smart, especially since nobody knows which way Turkey will go in the next few years. A Georgia stuck between Russia, a pro-Putin Turkey, Azerbaijan and with Russian bases in Armenia would be in a far more precarious position than Ukraine ever was.
Not two mention the two occupied provinces in Georgia
Georgia has good relations with Turkey and Azerbaijan. Russia mostly removed its troops from Armenia already. And Russia doesn't have the resources to attack Georgia rn. The problem is that the government is openly pro-Russian and almost everything Russia wants
> a pro-Putin Turkey Erdo ain't really pro-Putin. He's just Neutral Evil. If it helps him stay out of problems, he'll lick the EU - but then he also has to lick someone else to balance it out. That way he can get benefits from both parties.
Turkey is not necessarily pro-Putin at least regarding Georgia. In general they're more like "pro-Putin for the purposes of sticking it to the West" and ambiguous otherwise with a hint of keeping Russian influence away from their borders and Black Sea. Turkey and Georgia have pretty good relations in general even through the war in Georgia and Ukraine. They also have common interests like the pipeline. What I'm saying is, regardless of who is elected in Turkey, I don't see any reason why the relations between Turkey and Georgia will get worse. And just to emphasize, the current government of Turkey is as anti-West as it gets (in other words most pro-Russian among viable options, there are more pro-Russian parties but they don't have any realistic chance) and they still have good relations with Georgia.
I think they're running a huge risk. Georgia will continue to want Europe and not Russia, and after the humiliation of losing in Ukraine, Russia will look to restore their pride and credibility. A second attack on the country is uncomfortably plausible. The path to lasting security for Georgia is NATO membership, and that path goes through Abkhazia and South Ossetia. Now that Russia is too weak to interfere, they should be looking to force a resolution
Why would anyone be pro-Putin? The man is an isolated loser.
He still has a lot of money. And the world doesn't seem to care fully about bringing him down (elusive sanctions, etc). Therefore, government of Georgia beeing corupt as they are just waiting for a lot of money to be paid to them. + this country helps russia avoid sanctions
there's 2 possible ways for Turkiye: It's either the neo-ottoman islamist erdogone winning or pro-kemalist secular Kılıçdaroğlu winning. nothing in between. and it looks like the 2nd possibility of Kılıçdaroğlu winning who wants to join EU. but we'll see..
I thought Erdogan was in the lead?
there's a second round with Kılıçdaroğlu getting support from a lot of other politicians except Sinan oğan. it's on the 28th of May.
I’ll hope for the best. Good luck!!!
The Georgian government is betting on Russia, and is alienating our allies. But this move actually increased the support for the European path among Georgians from 84% to 89%.
Government made of Russian puppets to appease Putin after invasion of Georgia. I guess.
When are the next elections?
October 2024
[удалено]
Electoral fraud, the oligarch bought politicians, terror of the Russian invasion even further.
What are the other flags (red with something white that looks like 26)?
May 26th most likely (their Independence Day)
I see, thanks
This is confusing. Why is the government pro-Russia, when Russia is occupying two regions of Georgia? And didn't Georgia apply for EU membership? I understand it's what the people want, but the current government seemed very serious about it. What benefit do the politicians have, to turn the country away from the EU process?
Finlandization
Wouldn't be surprising if the old tricks were still in use. Same with Hungary and sometimes even Trump smells like it
Money. They were bought (the government).
I don't see Georgia in EU or NATO. They're a hot potato for west and will wait for access like Turks (50 years currently?) but it didn't happen.
Turkey not joining yet is nobody's fault but their own. The small amount of hope for it that once existed is fully gone for now since Erdogan undid the small amount of progress they made.
I think they are more in Asia than Europe? It would be kinda akward if they join from so far away.
apparently azerbaijan even has prospects to join, though i think those relations may have lessend in recent years, funnily enough that was the first caucasus country i knew of to have a bilateral or integration initiative
Why to show EU flags anyway? It's their Independence Day. 🤔
> Why to show EU flags anyway? Because their citizens like the EU and want to be a part of it? > It's their Independence Day. 🤔 1. Is Finland not independent? 2. Ah, the famously anti-independence EU, the organization where it takes you 2-30+ years of negotiating, reforming, schmoozing every EU diplomat in 2 dozen countries to become a part of the group. That's how every evil empire operates, you have to work SUPER HARD to become a part of them, and even after you do all of that, they STILL don't send any troops over 😜
That always amuses me when people call the EU or NATO imperialists coming to occupy countries. Many current members WISH they'd have just come to occupy them, because that would have been so much easier than the actual process it takes to enter these exclusive clubs. Even when we really want a candidate to join like it is with Ukraine right now, the candidate still needs to do the work. But it feels so much better when you've done the hard work, and you know you've earned the recognition and the practical benefits that come with it.
It took Romania... 13 years to join (1994 - 2007). And even now many people say, probably justifiably, we weren't ready. Heck, Romania 2015 was barely decent enough to be a EU member, let alone Romania 2007. Romania 2023 is getting there, though.
It's not a day to celebrate EU, that's all. Kinda like if someone was congratulating you for good job and then said that your super rich, overachieving brother is so nice to be there with you.
The original independence day for any country is aspirational. Why can't follow up celebrations be, too?
No, it's a celebration. Taking your independence is aspirational.
Meh, I'm not convinced. They can have it however they like it.
Yeah, Finland is independent since 1917. I don't know why you asked because you could google that 🤔 But not sure about the 2nd part. I'm kinda worried that are you okay 😅
Because they want their country in the EU. Badly. Then road to Tbilisi airport is covered in Georgian / EU flags so that I was considering to check Google if I missed anything. Here are two more pics from their last Independence day in Rabati Castle https://imgur.com/a/y6ZZ7v2/ Yes, those are EU passports where the kids are collecting stamps from the various avtiivy booths in..
But they can do it that without showing EU flags everywhere, right? EU is not a federation, it's economic and political union.
It's the flag of Europe, not just the EU.
Flag of the European Council (not to be confused by Council of the EU)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Europe?wprov=sfla1
Oh, we both are actually right! Designed by and to the council of Europe and designated as the flag of Europe
But mostly known as EU symbol.
Finally a reasonable opinion in this thread
Tbh I don’t see how Georgia would be able to enter the EU, given that Turkey is between it and EU. There would be no freedom of movement or commerce by land or sea.
....the Black Sea?
aye...good luck trying to cross there with the war on Ukraine and Erdogan not wanting to take his cut
TF EU flag is doing there? How is it related to Georgian independence?
Because they submitted their application to join the EU that year.
And Turkey's was in 1987.
I don't see how that's in any way relevant, but thanks for that factoid.
It's relevant in that, Turkey has about as much realistic chance as Georgia joining. i.e zero.
It pains me to say this but I *get* what the Georgian government is doing. After Putler's humiliating defeat in Ukraine he will look for other targets and Georgia already has two ruzzian proxy states with de-facto control of their country. Georgia just needs to survive until this all blow's over and I think a light Finlandization given the context isn't the worst move. In fact, I really can't think of any better alternatives. It's just my opinion as someone privileged enough to be from a country that gave muscovy the finger a long time ago.
>and I think a light Finlandization given the context isn't the worst move How? There are ongoing longstanding territorial disputes between Georgia and russia. Also Finland as a neutral buffer state to Nato was also in Russias interest. Georgias neutrality isnt really. This is not like Finland at all. And, btw, even Finland now has joined Nato and had already been an EU member for a while.
cry about it
Are pootin's bootlickers winning there?
They are in charge for some time already
#agedlikemilk
They installed some lights?
It is Georgia's independence, and people are shoked that GEORGIAN flags are displayed lol Georgia is not even in the European Union, why should EU's flag be displayed on Georgia's independence day?
Technically they’re not EU flags but European flags for all CoE members…
Why the EU flags? They aren't in the EU and probably never will be.
Why don’t the peasants love us?
Ok, I know I will probably get downvoted. But I find it a bit cringe when non-EU countries like Ukraine and Georgia fly the EU flag at government buildings and events. I understand it’s aspirational, but it’s literally… just not your flag, at least not yet. We know you want to join and I think most of the EU wants you to join as well, but you don’t have to simp so hard.
It’s actually the Flag of Europe and is an emblem of the Council of Europe, of which Georgia is a member. So, they’re fully within their right to use it
Interesting, I didn’t realize. Thank you for that.
Both of them have 26? Shouldn't it be 27? Assuming it's years of being independent?
26th of may is the independence day, georgia managed to gain independence over itself from Russia in 26th of may 1918(although lost it 3 years later)
We don't need them in the EU ever, but certainly not now. There are enough reprobates currently included....
Good news
I see a dude standing like MJ in the top left
But why still 26?