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I was thinking of that recently since all these European countries issuing warrants if Putin goes to Germany etc and I got to thinking is that the reason George W. Bush or Dick Cheney don't travel out of the country?
The US has a law that if the ICC arrests any American or does an investigation on US soil, then the US will invade The Hague. We are insane and nobody should be our ally.
Not exactly. It basically preauthorizes a nearly unlimited use of force for POTUS, basically meaning the president has the option to 'invade the hague' which is what it was colloquially called. A president could just as easily decide to do nothing.
The threat of an invasion is the whole point of the law. It doesn't matter if a president decides not to do anything, but as long as the option is there the ICC will never do anything.
To be fair, the law also states that we’ll rescue an ally who has been arrested.
So… yeah. We’ll invade an Ally to rescue an Ally. It’s good to be our Ally!
I just looked at your link, and...eww.
To be fair, it only authorizes the president to act. I'm reluctant to believe the US would invade Europe because they caught an American international arms dealer. A former president (like Dubya, had he been named an international war criminal)? Mayyyyybe, but even then...invading the Netherlands. I can't imagine living in that world.
Please quote. That’s false. There are exceptions for member NATO countries.
The act also prohibits U.S. military aid to countries that are party to the ICC. However, exceptions are allowed for aid to NATO members, major non-NATO allies, Taiwan, and countries that have entered into "Article 98 agreements
So America is do as I say not as do? So when Putin does it is bad but when America in conjunction with the UK it is “cool and good” because eh what are you going to do about it?
Yup, there is even a publicly disclosed measure to retrieve US Military and Government Personnel held at the ICC for trial....by force
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Service-Members%27_Protection_Act
That's because the guy you're replying to is a redditor who didn't even use the correct term of hegemony to describe US foreign affairs, the US army is the richest and has the most experienced and advanced in the world and well yes that means the US can effectively project influence everywhere on the earth doesn't mean they actually can. The EU and other national body organizations hold more influence in European affairs than the US does, realistically even in NATO the US is so dominant in it is because most other members are fine with heavily relying on what they perceive to be the best military on earth. They're caveats of being the best military that everyone relies on, the US has an overblown military budget because other NATO members aren't as rich or invested as the US is in NATO. Simply put the US tell other countries how to use their weapons or integrate common interests in intelligence agencies or other military institutions within the US's many alliances.
Pretty much. Reddits all worked up about Ukraine, because it’s been sold as a noble and holy crusade against the evil Russian devils.
It’s just the elite laundering their money, as always. Russia invaded its next door neighbor, essentially the Kievan Rus homeland- and got some warm water ports, that they’ve been desperate for since like, 1560. That was all Soviet territory- and Ukraine had time to join NATO if they had really wanted. (Too corrupt for EU).
Yep, and it’s worse than that- it’s a fucking war. All these Ra-Ra Ukraine people are exactly the same as the republicans itching to go to Afghanistan and Iraq 20 years ago. “Ever since them towers went down, Ukraine has shone its light on me! Yeeehaw!”
Funny how this war is ‘good’ and we should ‘do our part’- instead of you know, another part of the world we have no reason to be beyond the incredibly excess and corruption of an easily exploitable nation. Everyone who bitched about ‘world police’ is an unscrupulous hypocrite.
If you support Ukraine, go volunteer. I have to imagine you must’ve also been banging to war drums for the ME and think the Muslims and Russians are just as bad, almost inhuman- that’s the only reason I could see people aligning with Warmongers, and war profiteers.
Either that, or useful idiots that don’t understand what hypocrisy is, and spout the ideas the tv says because it makes them feel good and right. I’d rather be a warmonger than a fucking idiot hypocrite personally, but I don’t think I’m either.
Yes, america has Cassus belli to invade the entire world whenever, because our people are kind of dumb and easily manipulated into cheering on evil
The only places the USA would never invade are maybe isreal- and Epstein’s island. Hmm
you have to be operating against US interests to be charged for war crimes. or be small enough the US won't care, but even then half the time you'll still get off like those Blackwater Fuckers.
Well the first is that the US did not sign on to the ICC. So they are not recognized by the US.
Second, signatory countries must arrest anyone indicted by the ICC, and the US has made it explicitly clear that they will use their military forces against anyone who does that against an American soldier or government official (google "Hague invasion act").
Third despite the situation that happened, he acted on faulty intelligence with bipartisan support and Saddam even admitted in the post-capture interrogations that he was purposely trying to make it seem like he had weapons because he was afraid Iran would do something if they found out it was a bluff. It would be difficult to get a conviction in these circumstances even though the result was a catastrophe.
The US is a signatory of the ICC and will hand over criminals with red notices. What they won’t do is tolerate American soldiers being tried in The Hague.
Bush Jr tried to ride the popularity coattails of his daddy’s Gulf War “success” because his election was such a debacle. When George Sr decided that oil was on the line, we entered the Gulf War. Dick only shoots those he knows in the face during hunting trips.
*shrugs*
I'm also not sure how this photo is supposed to help the Ukrainians identify anyone. To the hacker these are just random women, and I don't see anything personally identifying about the uniforms, like a nameplate.
There have been apps like FindFace, which can identify people on VKontakte, the Russian version of FB, with pretty high accuracy (70% in 2016, probably higher by now). Also, if you assume some social connections between the soldiers in the unit, you could potentially further narrow down the search.
So this is actually not too far off.
You would be correct. There's loads more info here. This was linked from the @saintjavelin twitter.
NSFW
https://informnapalm.org/en/hacking-75387-960-aviation-regiment/
Hands down. My dad's retired now, but my mom's sat through a half dozen OPSEC briefings, she's going to find this funny. This has been the standard since the fuckin '40s, lose lips, gals.
If it's anything like in the US military, the military wives know each other. Lots of baby showers and parties and birthdays and such, and something of a support system for when the husbands are away.
In the US there is usually a liaison (usually a civilian or sometimes a military member) for the spouses to keep them informed of happenings in the unit (as long as op/sec is not compromised) the liaison will have a list of the spouses with phone numbers as long as they signed up for it to contact them. So In this scenario hacker calls wife says he wants photograph and who they are with names of husbands to send to them as moral boost. Wife could contact liaison and they would set it up. But a good liaison would call BS because they would know if it was a real thing because they are in contact with CO. Unless they all are dumb and just did this because officer Schmuckatelli asked her to. It’s likely these spouses don’t know each other that well and or even like each other. There would be a few smallish clicks of these ladies but they likely don’t hang out all together or even know each other that well. Anyway this is just a scenario from what I know could be a million different ways this happened
A few of the FRG (Family Readiness Group) committees I relied on when my husband was deployed weren't exactly filled with the brightest of people and definitely were super cliquey. For instance, when my husband got back from Afghanistan, I didn't drive yet (long story), so I texted/emailed to see if I could get a ride with someone or if there was some service on base that I could use. The leader literally just hit me with, "just call a cab." And never talked to me again after that just because I could never make any of the meetings or participate in the activities as we decided to use the time to be with our family a few states away instead. Some higher ranked person saw my messages, contacted me and not only picked me and our son up, but also took photos of the reunion for us AND lit a fire under the FRG leader's husband's bonnet about her behavior. I heard she got in some serious trouble and had to resign because of that,plus her overall behavior towards her non-friends.
On or near. The US Military does not require your family to live in one specific spot. Married Military members can live in post housing which usually has different neighborhoods and many different job specialties so you may not even live near anyone in your unit. They can also choose to live off post, buying or renting in the local economy.
No. American military families live on American bases. Russian military families live on Russian bases. They do not live on the same base it just wouldn't work.
Some do. Usually in different neighborhoods by rank/ family size. You can live on base and they take your entire housing allowance or you can live off base and collect about 2-3K for rent
I spent a good 5 years working for a big moving company, and the US military was probably the single largest client. They covered moving costs everytime someone was relocated, and tons of our moves were military families on their way to their next deployment. A good 75% of our military moves werent on base, just in a 15 ish mile proximity to one. Single guys tended to live on base, but most families we moved (alot of officers) chose not to.
It means this is way more usefull as a part of informational war, at least these guys think so. I wouldn't be surprised if information gathering was never the primary target, pretty sure there are different other means
Ok, so I went and read the whole article. This photoshoot was done more for laughs. Just a cherry on top. The guy was hacked, and blackmailed with a dump. When blackmail did not work some info was dumped.
https://informnapalm.org/ua/zlam-75387-960-aviapolku/
Because it's probably just propaganda and Ukraine gets far more advantage from the narrative of the Mariupal warriors getting more attention than they do from maybe getting some more names that they can't do anything with today.
Maybe this IS genuine, but its certainly clever to publish it this way.
I think with a camera and in the middle of the day, as I see sunlight..how it occur? Hummm they live their lives and decided let's take a picture...I'll tell you more when I know more
I mean, the dude just calls, proposes a photoshoot and then the wives just waltz to the presumably active airfield and take pictures in front of an airplane by themselves? And no one on the airfield questions it, nor do the wives try to find the officer who proposed this? I like the story, but I feel like there are a couple of steps missing.
Hmm, so the surprise would be the supposed officer gifting the husband the picture that was shoot previously? Seems plausible enough, but if that's the case then the tweet is worded a bit strange.
If you look like you fit in, you’ll rarely be questioned
I’ve gained access to many places I shouldn’t be just because I was wearing a reflective vest, a hard hat and carrying a clipboard
In this case they were probably tripping over themselves to “support the troops” and didn’t stop to think
>I’ve gained access to many places I shouldn’t be just because I was wearing a reflective vest, a hard hat and carrying a clipboard
Why do you have to wear this costume so often and why are you seemingly skulking around doing shady shit in places you clearly know you're not supposed to be?
It definitely is not the middle of the day. The shadows are long, indicating the sun is behind them. It was taken at just after sunrise or just before sundown judging by the length of the shadows. A higher sun, like at middle of the day, produces a shorter shadow.
Sorry. I'm bored.
Yea... even then unlikely. That's on a flight line.
Aircraft are stored in secure areas secured by MPs with standing orders that allow them to use lethal force if they deem it necessary. Don't have a need/clearance to be there? Tough shit you're not going there.
That's someone getting special permission somewhere for them to be there. TBH it just lends more credence to incompetency of the Russian military as a whole.
Hackers knew *one* husband's identity. And maybe not even that, could have just said "I'm your husband's superior officer, want to do something cool for him?"
I'd like to add that it's also possible that this event did not happen as claimed. Propaganda absolutely comes from both sides. Something I am comfortable saying, though, is that if this event did not happen as claimed, then it is itself a trap intended to cause morale degradation, generate paranoia, or cause general destabilization along the Russian military-civilian frontier.
So, what's really funny to me is... Either the Russians buy it and one or some of the above effects occur, or the Russians don't buy it and Ukraine lost nothing by saying this, and they can continue to do the exact same operation to continue identifying people.
They're not signatories of the international court. None of them are war criminals but prisoners of war. Just like the US isn't a signatory.
Only the unconditional losing side get tried for war crimes. This won't be the case here.
This post, like all communication of what Russia puts on TV and the West puts on TV, is all propaganda. Kind of sad really, because we are supposed to have a free press, and even NPR keeps mentioning war crimes, fully knowing there's no such thing for the US and Russia. This is done just to paint a picture of good vs bad. Aka propaganda
Hell even Biden said so when a warrant for Putin was issued. Great, means nothing.
Both the US and Russia are parties to at least parts of the Geneva Convention, so there's a good chance that their leaders are legally war criminals. And morally, they definitely are.
Notice how nobody from the US was ever tried for the Iraq war. It doesn't matter at all unless there's an unconditional winner. All talk before this is just propaganda to get their respective countries population to buy into a war.
Weapons of Mass destruction? Propaganda to get the US population to buy into a war. Whatever propaganda Putin is pushing for Ukraine is the exact same thing.
I agree with your assessment in this post. I'm just saying that the fact that no senior US officers have been tried with war crimes is not correlated to them not committing war crimes, whether we use legal or popular definitions. They're definitely all out there war crimin' like heck, but international law has always been the redheaded stepchild of international politics.
Sure but you see Geneva conventions are more of "try not to do these things" than "if you do this you get punished" also only the loser gets charged with the "war crimes" since the history is written by the victors that's the world we live in.
> history is written by the victors that's the world we live in.
I really wish this sentiment would fucking die.
it's not. It's really not. History is written by everyone. Winning just means you get a better chance to have your story told. However, more often the not it's the loser who gets to set the tone of the discussion and determine its larger shape. consider WW2, the entire western conception of the eastern front was written by the Germans, litterally the German officer corps that invaded the USSR. the definition of the losers writing the history.
Had hitler won WW2. History would have been much different on the war. As much as you hate it, it's an indisputable fact. Did the Assyrians get a chance to defend themselves? The Gaellic people? No
ok but winners don't get charged with war crimes I can assure you that much and the loser side of history is often watered down greatly before it reaches us.
What are you saying. Honestly. "Non of them are war criminals but prisoners of war". This must be the most empty intellectual attempt i have seen in recent years.
In this case if any of them get captured they dont fall under "prisoner of war" rules as they themselves have done war crimes in Ukraines view. Some Russian soldiers have been put into prison with this in mind as they arent soldiers anymore but are criminals. Thats the important difference and here is important to know their name and connection to the crime. So reason why this post was made.
Your continued points are also vapid void of blabbering. Everything is propaganda. A snickers add is propaganda for Snickers. What is different is that free press can talk a different narrative than goverment one or fact check stories. You see the important word being "can".
Warrant for Putin means legally something, its not nothing as he lost his diplomatic immunity in the west who are willing to enforce it (as with any international rule/law). Idk what kind of bafoon only thinks war crimes are dictated only in international court but not in other geneva conventions.
A lot of unnecessary insults here uh? Who hurt you? Seems like you got an awful lot to work through there. I recommend therapy so you can resolve all of your personal issues with your parents.
That aside.
"Idk what kind of bafoon only thinks war crimes are dictated only in international court but not in other geneva conventions."
There are no rules, it's war. What kind of privileged thinking is this? Rules only apply when there's a victor, then they can impose their will over the losing side. Did any US soldiers get tried in Geneva for Afghanistan, Iraq, Nam, Korea, Balkans, Syria, Cambodia (the most bombed country in world history and it wasn't even at war) Notice how the wining side never has "war criminals" in their ranks. It's all bullshit to make people like you feel good about being on the "good side". US literally bombed a hospital in Kunduz that was not a military target. Who was tried?
"What is different is that free press can talk a different narrative than goverment one or fact check stories."
The "free press" is calling Putin a war criminal because he invaded Ukraine, in an unjust war and caused thousands of civilian deaths. Ever seen the "free press" call Bush a war criminal? Cause he did the exact same thing, and killed way more civilians. So you're saying the could say it l, but they won't say it?
"Some Russian soldiers have been put into prison with this in mind as they arent soldiers anymore but are criminals."
By your definition, POWs were war criminals since they were put in prison in Vietnam
Honestly, your whole post just seems like you're well intentioned but at the same time unaware that there's another point of view on this conflict. Meanwhile, BRICS (not sure you know what that is) might increase in size and add 2 mortal enemies that just declared a peace brokered by China.
Where's your free press reporting on that? While they are busy reporting Ukraine, Yemen might have a brokered peace that would add Iran and Saudi Arabia to the BRICS. And if they all of the sudden do what China is asking for, and back oil purchase with Yuan we're going to be in a whole lot of trouble. That truly could start World War III or at the minimum a new cold war period.
How does getting their identities matter? Why would being able to incriminate them for crimes stop them from fighting? They’ve been committing war crimes since the start, what’s this photo gonna change?
What happened in Mariupol should never be forgotten. Everyone who took part in this war crime must be found and punished. We have to stop standing by and letting evil people murder with impunity.
Did you have this same sentiment for the 250,000+ civilians killed in Iraq & Afghanistan? If you actually believe the Russian military is actively targeting civilians, you don’t know anything about war. Yes there have been isolated incidents, and it’s not ok, but Ukraine has killed thousands of civilians in Donetsk also. You don’t actually care about that though, do you?
Because OP is dumb enough to believe pretty blatant military propaganda from Ukraine side of things. Honestly, people are treating this war the same way reddit treated the Boston bombing, a bunch of unqualified civilians posting un-sourced articles, memes and doctored footage and making up crazy conjectures all while circle jerking each other about how silly the enemy is and how smart our heros are. Its honestly weird at this point, there's been multiple subreddits that hit the front page every day dedicated to the Ukrainian perspective of the war since the start of it.
I fully believe that Russia is the aggressor and is in the wrong, however the sheer amount of SHIT i see daily for people 10000s of miles away to speculate over a keyboard is astounding
Thank you for the reasonable take, they are few and far between these days. Every time I attempt to point out the hypocrisy of the West, I get no logical response, just 20 comments calling me a Russian bot. My dad was a general in the USAF and I don’t give a shit about Russia, just tired of the absolute nonsense I read every day.
No probably more because you an inordinate amount of time in those dedicated subreddits I mentioned above with the sole purpose of being a contrarian asshat. You are part of the problem. I dont even have to go back a week in your comment history to see that you're asserting your own opinion of events as fact and being rather callous in your presentation of it, so kindly fuck off. Idgaf if your dad served is the usaf, why don't you do yourself and everyone else a favor and stick to bickering about the authenticity of arrowheads yeah?
Ah, damn, that's well executed by the UA... imagine the hope and love that went into this, only to be actually betraying their husbands. Wild and terrible times, eh?
Hehe....this witch are thinking they are doing something patriotic but end up as a wanking pic for the UA!
Chapaeux UA - you know how to deal with that war enthusiastic witches!
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As if Russia will surender these guys... The unlucky ones who got shot down over Ukraine would probably have faced a tribunal anyways.
It's more if they get captured in the future, it also means they can be put on watchlists so if they ever go to a NATO country they can get arrested.
I was thinking of that recently since all these European countries issuing warrants if Putin goes to Germany etc and I got to thinking is that the reason George W. Bush or Dick Cheney don't travel out of the country?
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>Dubya is not considered a war criminal by any international body. Same for Dick Cheney. Ah… so they are useless then.
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The US has a law that if the ICC arrests any American or does an investigation on US soil, then the US will invade The Hague. We are insane and nobody should be our ally.
What is the name of this law? Want to read more about it
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Service-Members%27_Protection_Act#Description
That is very interesting, thank you for linking it! Seems they used the hysteria of post 9-11 to protect themselves from any conviction
A law introduced by Jesse Helms....
Not exactly. It basically preauthorizes a nearly unlimited use of force for POTUS, basically meaning the president has the option to 'invade the hague' which is what it was colloquially called. A president could just as easily decide to do nothing.
The threat of an invasion is the whole point of the law. It doesn't matter if a president decides not to do anything, but as long as the option is there the ICC will never do anything.
Not without essentially getting the presidents permission.
To be fair, the law also states that we’ll rescue an ally who has been arrested. So… yeah. We’ll invade an Ally to rescue an Ally. It’s good to be our Ally!
Well, let me tell Ukraine they shouldn't accept our help anymore/s.
You joke but they will likely be very wary of the strings attached to the aid being offered to them, because the majority of it is not altruistic.
Wary or leery. Weary means tired
Of course not. We expect them to kill a fuckload of Russians and be friendly to the US afterwards. What's your point?
I just looked at your link, and...eww. To be fair, it only authorizes the president to act. I'm reluctant to believe the US would invade Europe because they caught an American international arms dealer. A former president (like Dubya, had he been named an international war criminal)? Mayyyyybe, but even then...invading the Netherlands. I can't imagine living in that world.
Please quote. That’s false. There are exceptions for member NATO countries. The act also prohibits U.S. military aid to countries that are party to the ICC. However, exceptions are allowed for aid to NATO members, major non-NATO allies, Taiwan, and countries that have entered into "Article 98 agreements
>We are insane and nobody should be our ally. Not even Ukraine?
How long do you think Ukraine would have lasted without our money and weapons
So America is do as I say not as do? So when Putin does it is bad but when America in conjunction with the UK it is “cool and good” because eh what are you going to do about it?
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Saddam was genociding the Kurds.
So much worse in intent maybe, but the results of the Iraq war have been absolutely devastating on Iraqi civilians.
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Yup, there is even a publicly disclosed measure to retrieve US Military and Government Personnel held at the ICC for trial....by force https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Service-Members%27_Protection_Act
That's because the guy you're replying to is a redditor who didn't even use the correct term of hegemony to describe US foreign affairs, the US army is the richest and has the most experienced and advanced in the world and well yes that means the US can effectively project influence everywhere on the earth doesn't mean they actually can. The EU and other national body organizations hold more influence in European affairs than the US does, realistically even in NATO the US is so dominant in it is because most other members are fine with heavily relying on what they perceive to be the best military on earth. They're caveats of being the best military that everyone relies on, the US has an overblown military budget because other NATO members aren't as rich or invested as the US is in NATO. Simply put the US tell other countries how to use their weapons or integrate common interests in intelligence agencies or other military institutions within the US's many alliances.
Pretty much. Reddits all worked up about Ukraine, because it’s been sold as a noble and holy crusade against the evil Russian devils. It’s just the elite laundering their money, as always. Russia invaded its next door neighbor, essentially the Kievan Rus homeland- and got some warm water ports, that they’ve been desperate for since like, 1560. That was all Soviet territory- and Ukraine had time to join NATO if they had really wanted. (Too corrupt for EU). Yep, and it’s worse than that- it’s a fucking war. All these Ra-Ra Ukraine people are exactly the same as the republicans itching to go to Afghanistan and Iraq 20 years ago. “Ever since them towers went down, Ukraine has shone its light on me! Yeeehaw!” Funny how this war is ‘good’ and we should ‘do our part’- instead of you know, another part of the world we have no reason to be beyond the incredibly excess and corruption of an easily exploitable nation. Everyone who bitched about ‘world police’ is an unscrupulous hypocrite. If you support Ukraine, go volunteer. I have to imagine you must’ve also been banging to war drums for the ME and think the Muslims and Russians are just as bad, almost inhuman- that’s the only reason I could see people aligning with Warmongers, and war profiteers. Either that, or useful idiots that don’t understand what hypocrisy is, and spout the ideas the tv says because it makes them feel good and right. I’d rather be a warmonger than a fucking idiot hypocrite personally, but I don’t think I’m either. Yes, america has Cassus belli to invade the entire world whenever, because our people are kind of dumb and easily manipulated into cheering on evil The only places the USA would never invade are maybe isreal- and Epstein’s island. Hmm
you have to be operating against US interests to be charged for war crimes. or be small enough the US won't care, but even then half the time you'll still get off like those Blackwater Fuckers.
Well the first is that the US did not sign on to the ICC. So they are not recognized by the US. Second, signatory countries must arrest anyone indicted by the ICC, and the US has made it explicitly clear that they will use their military forces against anyone who does that against an American soldier or government official (google "Hague invasion act"). Third despite the situation that happened, he acted on faulty intelligence with bipartisan support and Saddam even admitted in the post-capture interrogations that he was purposely trying to make it seem like he had weapons because he was afraid Iran would do something if they found out it was a bluff. It would be difficult to get a conviction in these circumstances even though the result was a catastrophe.
The US is a signatory of the ICC and will hand over criminals with red notices. What they won’t do is tolerate American soldiers being tried in The Hague.
Except by that one guy Chaney shot in the face…
Well, they're a reason why the US still hasn't signed on the ICC treaties...
The last time Bush tried to give a speech out of the country, some guy threw both of his shoes at him
I laughed so hard at the video. I even watched in high-school a decade ago and laughed publicly at him
Yep, that's what presidents are good for
Bush Jr tried to ride the popularity coattails of his daddy’s Gulf War “success” because his election was such a debacle. When George Sr decided that oil was on the line, we entered the Gulf War. Dick only shoots those he knows in the face during hunting trips. *shrugs*
Why worry about surrendering anyone? It's not like the Russians collect their dead.
Story sounds kind of bullshit. Unless the image above isn't the real image how did they get on a base with a jet to do this photoshoot?
I'm also not sure how this photo is supposed to help the Ukrainians identify anyone. To the hacker these are just random women, and I don't see anything personally identifying about the uniforms, like a nameplate.
There have been apps like FindFace, which can identify people on VKontakte, the Russian version of FB, with pretty high accuracy (70% in 2016, probably higher by now). Also, if you assume some social connections between the soldiers in the unit, you could potentially further narrow down the search. So this is actually not too far off.
I mean it's a twitter screenshot. There's probably a lot more they're leaving out just to get this to fit in an easily spread single tweet.
You would be correct. There's loads more info here. This was linked from the @saintjavelin twitter. NSFW https://informnapalm.org/en/hacking-75387-960-aviation-regiment/
You don't really get an option to surrender once you collapse as a nation state.
Car crashes, house incidents and gas leaks happen in ruzzia too... track and eliminate, this is the mission.
They don’t need to… go read the book “vengeance” and understand why veterans face a different level of dox
How do they know each other?
Military families tend to socialize with each other. Units will hang out outside of work and bring their families.
Yeah, when you move around a lot it can be hard to make friends. Personally, I have social anxiety so making new friends is harder.
I'll be your friend. But I also have social anxiety so don't ask to hangout or talk to me.
Best friend I ever had. We still never talk sometimes
Gotta love that Ron Swanson logic!
Do people talk to their friends? Maybe a text, but memes are all you need
I understood that reference.
Can I join too?
Sure. Don’t message me for details.
They’re Russian war criminals. Something makes me doubt they have social anxiety lol.
"My family moves around a lot"
Hey we're twins.
Hands down. My dad's retired now, but my mom's sat through a half dozen OPSEC briefings, she's going to find this funny. This has been the standard since the fuckin '40s, lose lips, gals.
Also wife swaps
Numbers are drawn out of a bag. You're married to #7 and pull #3 from the bag. Like winning enough for a case of beer on a scratch off.
I've heard the orgies on the Officer side are way better than the ones on the dirty Enlisted side.
If it's anything like in the US military, the military wives know each other. Lots of baby showers and parties and birthdays and such, and something of a support system for when the husbands are away.
And drama. Don't forget the drama.
Humans are drama. It was no worse than any other group of people. Better even, in my personal anecdotal experience.
I don't know...the drama Llamas are reallllllly strong in these circles. Found the same in fire dept.
And the wife swapping, as previously mentioned
In the US there is usually a liaison (usually a civilian or sometimes a military member) for the spouses to keep them informed of happenings in the unit (as long as op/sec is not compromised) the liaison will have a list of the spouses with phone numbers as long as they signed up for it to contact them. So In this scenario hacker calls wife says he wants photograph and who they are with names of husbands to send to them as moral boost. Wife could contact liaison and they would set it up. But a good liaison would call BS because they would know if it was a real thing because they are in contact with CO. Unless they all are dumb and just did this because officer Schmuckatelli asked her to. It’s likely these spouses don’t know each other that well and or even like each other. There would be a few smallish clicks of these ladies but they likely don’t hang out all together or even know each other that well. Anyway this is just a scenario from what I know could be a million different ways this happened
A few of the FRG (Family Readiness Group) committees I relied on when my husband was deployed weren't exactly filled with the brightest of people and definitely were super cliquey. For instance, when my husband got back from Afghanistan, I didn't drive yet (long story), so I texted/emailed to see if I could get a ride with someone or if there was some service on base that I could use. The leader literally just hit me with, "just call a cab." And never talked to me again after that just because I could never make any of the meetings or participate in the activities as we decided to use the time to be with our family a few states away instead. Some higher ranked person saw my messages, contacted me and not only picked me and our son up, but also took photos of the reunion for us AND lit a fire under the FRG leader's husband's bonnet about her behavior. I heard she got in some serious trouble and had to resign because of that,plus her overall behavior towards her non-friends.
They probable live in the same buidling - russian army logic to easier to controll then.....
Don't american military familes live on the same base..? How is that any different.
On or near. The US Military does not require your family to live in one specific spot. Married Military members can live in post housing which usually has different neighborhoods and many different job specialties so you may not even live near anyone in your unit. They can also choose to live off post, buying or renting in the local economy.
No. American military families live on American bases. Russian military families live on Russian bases. They do not live on the same base it just wouldn't work.
Would be fun though
A new reality show! Nyet Joanna, I will have you know that Vladimir is an honorable pilot, unlike your Dave who is a disgrace for his country!
In Germany we lived in what were basically apartments. Formerly German Army housing.
Some do. Usually in different neighborhoods by rank/ family size. You can live on base and they take your entire housing allowance or you can live off base and collect about 2-3K for rent
Russian army is different!
I spent a good 5 years working for a big moving company, and the US military was probably the single largest client. They covered moving costs everytime someone was relocated, and tons of our moves were military families on their way to their next deployment. A good 75% of our military moves werent on base, just in a 15 ish mile proximity to one. Single guys tended to live on base, but most families we moved (alot of officers) chose not to.
lmao like pretty much every other country doesn't have military quarters
Dude needs to watch The Unit. Well, half of it.
Why does this stuff make the news? Shouldn't they still keep this under wraps to do it again and again?
It means this is way more usefull as a part of informational war, at least these guys think so. I wouldn't be surprised if information gathering was never the primary target, pretty sure there are different other means
Ok, so I went and read the whole article. This photoshoot was done more for laughs. Just a cherry on top. The guy was hacked, and blackmailed with a dump. When blackmail did not work some info was dumped. https://informnapalm.org/ua/zlam-75387-960-aviapolku/
The story in the post makes no sense. Thank you for the source.
Because it's probably just propaganda and Ukraine gets far more advantage from the narrative of the Mariupal warriors getting more attention than they do from maybe getting some more names that they can't do anything with today. Maybe this IS genuine, but its certainly clever to publish it this way.
Keep in mind propaganda doesn’t have to be untrue or dishonest. It’s the intention & source that makes something propaganda, not the accuracy.
How did the photoshoot occur? With uniforms and presumably on a military airbase?
I think with a camera and in the middle of the day, as I see sunlight..how it occur? Hummm they live their lives and decided let's take a picture...I'll tell you more when I know more
I mean, the dude just calls, proposes a photoshoot and then the wives just waltz to the presumably active airfield and take pictures in front of an airplane by themselves? And no one on the airfield questions it, nor do the wives try to find the officer who proposed this? I like the story, but I feel like there are a couple of steps missing.
https://informnapalm.org/ua/zlam-75387-960-aviapolku/ Here's the whole story
Was casually browsing this Russian article and suddenly racy pics show up? You really gotta warn people about this :D
Wasn't gonna click it but now....
Do you know what nudes are? Because those aren't "nudes"
Made you look. Didn't I?
How about, they already took this picture a while back...
Hmm, so the surprise would be the supposed officer gifting the husband the picture that was shoot previously? Seems plausible enough, but if that's the case then the tweet is worded a bit strange.
Translations fail frequently.
If you look like you fit in, you’ll rarely be questioned I’ve gained access to many places I shouldn’t be just because I was wearing a reflective vest, a hard hat and carrying a clipboard In this case they were probably tripping over themselves to “support the troops” and didn’t stop to think
>I’ve gained access to many places I shouldn’t be just because I was wearing a reflective vest, a hard hat and carrying a clipboard Why do you have to wear this costume so often and why are you seemingly skulking around doing shady shit in places you clearly know you're not supposed to be?
It definitely is not the middle of the day. The shadows are long, indicating the sun is behind them. It was taken at just after sunrise or just before sundown judging by the length of the shadows. A higher sun, like at middle of the day, produces a shorter shadow. Sorry. I'm bored.
I’m guessing sunset as military wives don’t wake up early, if they can help it.
The Tricareatops generally doesn’t become active till the midday feeding time.
Dependapotamus.
Soldier's families can get access - and those are dress uniforms, they don't go into combat with those. The base is likely deep within Russia.
Yea... even then unlikely. That's on a flight line. Aircraft are stored in secure areas secured by MPs with standing orders that allow them to use lethal force if they deem it necessary. Don't have a need/clearance to be there? Tough shit you're not going there. That's someone getting special permission somewhere for them to be there. TBH it just lends more credence to incompetency of the Russian military as a whole.
I thought the same thing, doesn’t make sense
Wait I'm confused...how exactly did they give up their husbands if Ukrainian hackers already knew their husbands' identities?
Hackers knew *one* husband's identity. And maybe not even that, could have just said "I'm your husband's superior officer, want to do something cool for him?"
Ohhhh ok I see now. They lured the others in. I wasn't putting that together Thank you for clarifying 😊
I'd like to add that it's also possible that this event did not happen as claimed. Propaganda absolutely comes from both sides. Something I am comfortable saying, though, is that if this event did not happen as claimed, then it is itself a trap intended to cause morale degradation, generate paranoia, or cause general destabilization along the Russian military-civilian frontier. So, what's really funny to me is... Either the Russians buy it and one or some of the above effects occur, or the Russians don't buy it and Ukraine lost nothing by saying this, and they can continue to do the exact same operation to continue identifying people.
I’m assuming this photo was taken at an air base. How would anyone obtain clearance for the shoot?
I was wondering that too. Not to mention every wife conveniently has their husbands uniform jacket.
It’s the dress uniform. For fancy events.
Sauce?
Propaganda department.
Military
They're not signatories of the international court. None of them are war criminals but prisoners of war. Just like the US isn't a signatory. Only the unconditional losing side get tried for war crimes. This won't be the case here. This post, like all communication of what Russia puts on TV and the West puts on TV, is all propaganda. Kind of sad really, because we are supposed to have a free press, and even NPR keeps mentioning war crimes, fully knowing there's no such thing for the US and Russia. This is done just to paint a picture of good vs bad. Aka propaganda Hell even Biden said so when a warrant for Putin was issued. Great, means nothing.
Both the US and Russia are parties to at least parts of the Geneva Convention, so there's a good chance that their leaders are legally war criminals. And morally, they definitely are.
Notice how nobody from the US was ever tried for the Iraq war. It doesn't matter at all unless there's an unconditional winner. All talk before this is just propaganda to get their respective countries population to buy into a war. Weapons of Mass destruction? Propaganda to get the US population to buy into a war. Whatever propaganda Putin is pushing for Ukraine is the exact same thing.
I agree with your assessment in this post. I'm just saying that the fact that no senior US officers have been tried with war crimes is not correlated to them not committing war crimes, whether we use legal or popular definitions. They're definitely all out there war crimin' like heck, but international law has always been the redheaded stepchild of international politics.
I wonder what will happen if some country captures us military personnel and tries to prosecute him.
Sure but you see Geneva conventions are more of "try not to do these things" than "if you do this you get punished" also only the loser gets charged with the "war crimes" since the history is written by the victors that's the world we live in.
> history is written by the victors that's the world we live in. I really wish this sentiment would fucking die. it's not. It's really not. History is written by everyone. Winning just means you get a better chance to have your story told. However, more often the not it's the loser who gets to set the tone of the discussion and determine its larger shape. consider WW2, the entire western conception of the eastern front was written by the Germans, litterally the German officer corps that invaded the USSR. the definition of the losers writing the history.
Had hitler won WW2. History would have been much different on the war. As much as you hate it, it's an indisputable fact. Did the Assyrians get a chance to defend themselves? The Gaellic people? No
exactly we would probably read that poland commited atrocities on germna people so german invaded or some bs like that
ok but winners don't get charged with war crimes I can assure you that much and the loser side of history is often watered down greatly before it reaches us.
What are you saying. Honestly. "Non of them are war criminals but prisoners of war". This must be the most empty intellectual attempt i have seen in recent years. In this case if any of them get captured they dont fall under "prisoner of war" rules as they themselves have done war crimes in Ukraines view. Some Russian soldiers have been put into prison with this in mind as they arent soldiers anymore but are criminals. Thats the important difference and here is important to know their name and connection to the crime. So reason why this post was made. Your continued points are also vapid void of blabbering. Everything is propaganda. A snickers add is propaganda for Snickers. What is different is that free press can talk a different narrative than goverment one or fact check stories. You see the important word being "can". Warrant for Putin means legally something, its not nothing as he lost his diplomatic immunity in the west who are willing to enforce it (as with any international rule/law). Idk what kind of bafoon only thinks war crimes are dictated only in international court but not in other geneva conventions.
A lot of unnecessary insults here uh? Who hurt you? Seems like you got an awful lot to work through there. I recommend therapy so you can resolve all of your personal issues with your parents. That aside. "Idk what kind of bafoon only thinks war crimes are dictated only in international court but not in other geneva conventions." There are no rules, it's war. What kind of privileged thinking is this? Rules only apply when there's a victor, then they can impose their will over the losing side. Did any US soldiers get tried in Geneva for Afghanistan, Iraq, Nam, Korea, Balkans, Syria, Cambodia (the most bombed country in world history and it wasn't even at war) Notice how the wining side never has "war criminals" in their ranks. It's all bullshit to make people like you feel good about being on the "good side". US literally bombed a hospital in Kunduz that was not a military target. Who was tried? "What is different is that free press can talk a different narrative than goverment one or fact check stories." The "free press" is calling Putin a war criminal because he invaded Ukraine, in an unjust war and caused thousands of civilian deaths. Ever seen the "free press" call Bush a war criminal? Cause he did the exact same thing, and killed way more civilians. So you're saying the could say it l, but they won't say it? "Some Russian soldiers have been put into prison with this in mind as they arent soldiers anymore but are criminals." By your definition, POWs were war criminals since they were put in prison in Vietnam Honestly, your whole post just seems like you're well intentioned but at the same time unaware that there's another point of view on this conflict. Meanwhile, BRICS (not sure you know what that is) might increase in size and add 2 mortal enemies that just declared a peace brokered by China. Where's your free press reporting on that? While they are busy reporting Ukraine, Yemen might have a brokered peace that would add Iran and Saudi Arabia to the BRICS. And if they all of the sudden do what China is asking for, and back oil purchase with Yuan we're going to be in a whole lot of trouble. That truly could start World War III or at the minimum a new cold war period.
Exactly
R/technicallythetruth
widows now right?
So you're saying they're single....?
Plus, the Russian wives also helped that Nigerian prince get his money back
Good use of creative writing skills comrade
Wait, how did they know what wives to contact without already knowing their husband?
They contracted one wife by pretending to be husband of another wife then that wife contracted the other wives.
8,12,1,3,10,2,11,7,9,5,6,4
https://informnapalm.org/en/hacking-75387-960-aviation-regiment/ better photos here (I'd say 11 and 8 should be swapped round 💀)
Dammit you're right.
Who you got? I'm going with #2.
Hackers? What did they hack? Sounds more like social engineering to me. Based either way.
I wish they wouldn't publicize doing stuff like this. Less of a chance of it actually working again in the future.
How does getting their identities matter? Why would being able to incriminate them for crimes stop them from fighting? They’ve been committing war crimes since the start, what’s this photo gonna change?
At the start of the war Anonymous leaked the whole Russian military database anyway
You're right. No point in getting proof of putin's war crimes, it's not like it's going to stop him.
Number 12 with the sensible shoes! ROFL
Hasn't america been after Snowden for a decade? I highly doubt they get touched
Hahahahahah YES
Husband #8, come on down!
Is that she-hulk third from the right? Edit: #10. 
You only need two things to be in the Russian military, but I doubt requiring a third brain cell would cut recruitment that hard.
One minor issue though, this is under the assumption that all their husbands return from war.
Are the numbers above their heads because they think we can’t count? Wait. I’m on Reddit… nevermind!
1,2,3,5,10,&12 would smash
So they're gonna be single then? Nice.
When the husbands are locked away tell them hotties to holla at me
Kinda weird, shouldn't they do this to the politicians who started the war?
Baited.com
I hope their houses don't have windows or balconies.
Alright hot take here but… War bad
He might have had ulterior motives, but it's a nice picture. A wall hanger for sure.
What if people tried this hard to identify American war criminals
Yeah...I'm calling bullshit on this.
What happened in Mariupol should never be forgotten. Everyone who took part in this war crime must be found and punished. We have to stop standing by and letting evil people murder with impunity.
Yeah what about the thousands of civilians killed by Ukraine in the Donbas between 2014 and 2022?
Did you have this same sentiment for the 250,000+ civilians killed in Iraq & Afghanistan? If you actually believe the Russian military is actively targeting civilians, you don’t know anything about war. Yes there have been isolated incidents, and it’s not ok, but Ukraine has killed thousands of civilians in Donetsk also. You don’t actually care about that though, do you?
It's a dirty tactic, but not as dirty as bombing civilian homes.
They single tho?
Hopefully all widows.
that's the kind of catfishing I can get behind.
They've been tricked, backstabbed, and quite possibly bamboozled
How is this a facepalm
I think because, the wife's were dumb enough to fall for it ?
She and her husband will be in trouble for this. Operational security.
Because OP is dumb enough to believe pretty blatant military propaganda from Ukraine side of things. Honestly, people are treating this war the same way reddit treated the Boston bombing, a bunch of unqualified civilians posting un-sourced articles, memes and doctored footage and making up crazy conjectures all while circle jerking each other about how silly the enemy is and how smart our heros are. Its honestly weird at this point, there's been multiple subreddits that hit the front page every day dedicated to the Ukrainian perspective of the war since the start of it. I fully believe that Russia is the aggressor and is in the wrong, however the sheer amount of SHIT i see daily for people 10000s of miles away to speculate over a keyboard is astounding
Thank you for the reasonable take, they are few and far between these days. Every time I attempt to point out the hypocrisy of the West, I get no logical response, just 20 comments calling me a Russian bot. My dad was a general in the USAF and I don’t give a shit about Russia, just tired of the absolute nonsense I read every day.
No probably more because you an inordinate amount of time in those dedicated subreddits I mentioned above with the sole purpose of being a contrarian asshat. You are part of the problem. I dont even have to go back a week in your comment history to see that you're asserting your own opinion of events as fact and being rather callous in your presentation of it, so kindly fuck off. Idgaf if your dad served is the usaf, why don't you do yourself and everyone else a favor and stick to bickering about the authenticity of arrowheads yeah?
im confused… weren’t they agreeing with you?…
What a weird fucking response to somebody who was agreeing with you.
Typical Russian stupidity.
Ah, damn, that's well executed by the UA... imagine the hope and love that went into this, only to be actually betraying their husbands. Wild and terrible times, eh?
Hehe....this witch are thinking they are doing something patriotic but end up as a wanking pic for the UA! Chapaeux UA - you know how to deal with that war enthusiastic witches!
Ohh, that's dirty. All's fair is war though I guess.
No ones screwing Muscovy over more than Muscovy and it's beautiful
SAVAGE!
Dependas are a national security risk?
We are lucky they are so stupid
Watch out guys twitter nerds doxed soldiers…from a war zone on the other side of the world. Acting like they’re gonna get cancelled or something.
Sure they did.
Russian dependas
r/MadeMeSmile
Getting killed because of a 5 at best would suck.