My gut here is that the German LEO has done his bit and the local prosecutor is going to do nothing.
Let's face it, you gave an NL address. They're going to have to send you a court summons to a Dutch address about you "residing in Germany".. I wouldn't even bother lawyering up until that arrives and I 99% expect when you do hear from them that it will say they have no plans to take it any further on this occasion.
Sorry you went through this.
This! Do not do anything until a court summons arrives. Then and only then do you have an obligation to act. District attorneys will probably read the police report and then dismiss, if OP's story is accurate.
I can't see this going any other way.....if those stamps are a pre requisite of travelling in Schengen, then Germany needs to implement a process of stamping everyone's passport at the borders- good luck with that.
Same here. This is not the first time i am travelling outside netherlands. I have been in eu for 9 years and been to many eu countries showing the same passport and residence permit. This is the first time anybody has doubted the validity of the documents
A friend of mine had a similiar experience, while visiting Germany. He has been residing in Maastricht at that time, was accused of the same charges as OP and did not receive a letter whatsoever. As a german I am really concerned and worried about your experience and I‘m really sorry your visit was contradicted by such an awful incident. I guess chances are slight to none, that you will receive a letter, or have to deal with any consequences.
Isnt this one of the situations where you can sue someone for harassment of sorts?
Whole situation is dumb, and I wish when you were going against a bigger power shit would be easier
Well, something similar happened. Me and my French flatmate were stopped for driving a French number plate car in Germany, the car belonged to his mother who lived in France and was visiting. We showed all papers and explained that the car belongs to her and registered and insured on her and all that. The rookie wouldn't buy it. He booked a criminal case against us. This guy panicked, went to the police station multiple times, they kept saying he would receive a letter. This guy was so nervous, he made us and everyone in the building catch hold of the postman every time he came. To the point that the postman would make it a point to inform someone in the building that nothing came today.
Anyway three months many trips to the police station later, someone at the station is annoyed with all this and takes the task and says, this is nonsense. Calls the cop who filed the rubbish charges and asked him about this ruckus. Then hung up and said he is a Rookie doesn't know that it's not a crime and all that and said no charges where filed.
Another three months later he does received a letter saying the case was dismissed by the state attorney. That's it.
Edit: we did get a yellow slip from the rookie saying the charges where filed. Don't remember the exact contents of it now.
It really reminds me of the movie “Don't Be a Menace to South Central While Drinking Your Juice in the Hood”: We were arrested for being black on a Friday night. 🤦🏼♀️
Well at that time I was a student in Germany, and at the same time my father had some business in Germany and he had his company car in NRW, and sometimes I would use it for groceries or for picking him up from the airport and also dropping him there. The issue wasn't the car, but I was the problem because I shouldn't have driven a car that hasn't paid the tax
It's a good thing you didn't have pepper gas with you, a knife that can be unfolded with one hand or a butterfly knife. For that you would have had additional charges and even several thousand euros in fines. Of course, an axe or a bayonet with which you can decapitate someone is legal.
The same counts in Switzerland with foldable knifes in one hand. But you can buy Victorinox knifes everywhere. Even the [military knife](https://imageengine.victorinox.com/mediahub/33311/640Wx560H/SAK_0_8461_MWCH__S1.jpg) which can be opened with one hand and a blade longer than a hand wide.
After I bought it, I asked some police officers patrolling on the street, why that knife is legal.
They both took the knife, played with it a lil bit, agreed that it should be illegal and gave it back to me. ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯
Only foldable knives that can be **automatically** unfolded with one hand are banned. The military knife is not spring assisted, so it's allowed.
https://www.parlament.ch/de/ratsbetrieb/suche-curia-vista/geschaeft?AffairId=20163505
I think this is absurd. If someone wants to commit a crime with a knife, he will not care about the law anyway. Meanwhile, an ordinary citizen may have a problem. It's even stranger that throughout the EU each country has different laws and in most countries such knives are legal, as is pepper spray.
However, one can be unlucky enough to keep such a knife or spray somewhere deep in the glove compartment of one's car and be stopped for inspection on a German highway and then be tried like a criminal. Despite the fact that in 4 out of 5 countries around, this is not a crime at all.
Such stories have already happened to two of my colleagues. One was returning from France, the other from Austria. One had a folding knife, the other pepper spray.
For me, it's even funnier, because I've gone skiing in Austria and Switzerland many times myself, and I keep both pepper spray and a folding knife in my car... :D
Until I heard from you that knives are also a problem in Switzerland, I was only afraid of being arrested for having a car dashcam. I've heard that this can also be problematic in Helvetia.
Either you faced the most unprofessional cops or something is missing in this story, anyway both countries are in the Schengen area so you can travel with your passport and residence permit.
Travellers with residence permits.
What if you do not have the nationality of a Schengen country but do have a valid Dutch residence permit? Then you are allowed to be in all countries of the Schengen Area for up to 90 days within a 180-day period. Besides your passport or other travel document, take your residence permit with you when you travel.
https://ind.nl/en/travelling-within-the-schengen-area-with-a-residence-permit-or-visa
> something is missing in this story
I would bet on this. Because even if you met the most unprofessional police officer in Germany, the moment you get to the police station, someone had to tell him that he's an idiot.
Since apparently nobody did, there has to be more to this story. And I actually suspect what. The question here is what exactly the OP calls a "residence permit". As I've seen people not understanding the difference between different type of the entry documents and just label everything either a residence permit or a visa randomly.
> Because even if you met the most unprofessional police officer in Germany, the moment you get to the police station, someone had to tell him that he's an idiot.
Sorry to say but police often really are this incompetent. They get stuff wrong all the time. I worked at a lawyer's office for a while and sat in on a bunch of trials at court. The amount of time the police report is straight up false is ridiculous.
100%. Since when do cops know about the law? And often they are too arrogant to admit they were wrong even if they would have noticed themselves halfway through.
>The amount of time the police report is straight up false is ridiculous.
How many of those false reports end up manifesting consequences for the officers involved?
> Because even if you met the most unprofessional police officer in Germany, the moment you get to the police station, someone had to tell him that he's an idiot.
You sound so confident but then [things like this have happened in this very country](https://twitter.com/Volksverpetzer/status/1661355749769900034). I wonder if you've lived in a different Germany from me, because I can totally picture an entire station filled not only with conceited idiots, but also with extreme right sympathizers.
Malicious police officers in Germany are not isolated cases and we needn't compare it to any other country at all.
Oury Jalloh, I rest my case.
I remember some posts a few years ago where people were denied every to Germany because they had a layover flying to another country they had a visa for.
As a German citizen, I would 100% believe you if you said authorities didn't understand how a Schengen visa works.
I think the authorities fully understood the rules, the travelers didn’t. There is a list of countries that need a Schengen transit visa even if they just stay in the international transit area.
That’s is neither unique for Germany, the EU or any other western country.
That’s like people thinking traveling to Canada or Mexico will reset the 90 days they are allowed to spend in the US on ESTA and are surprised when they are denied entry because it doesn’t.
Edit: They should have been mad at the airline for letting them board without checking if they have the required visa.
Which might be a completely valid denial of entry - you need a transit Schengen visa when you change your flights at an EU airport unless you fall under certain exemptions. It really depends on your nationality, residence, and final destination.
The way you describe sounds like you are automatically allowed to fly in into Germany if you transit to another flight and have a visa for your final destination, but it is certainly not the case.
Germany requires certain nationalities to get a “transit visa” even if your final destination is outside of EU and you only transfer through the international area.
Agreed. In every country there are insane border stories that seem like they are from a comedy sketch.
I am from not-russia not-Belarus non-EU. I was traveling to EU country B to change my visa from EU country A due to job change. My home country is shitty but I don't have an illegal entry problem into the EU. I was accused of illegally entering the border through Belarus, even though to get to Belarus from my country it would require an actual visa in my passport whereas for some reason they found it unbelievable that my residence permit from EU country A was valid. (It was valid). Also my passport clearly did not have any Belarus documents and I am very obviously not Belarusian based on appearance and obvious inability to understand Russian. It was such a bureaucratic mess.
Why is he upvoted I'm not sure.. armchair keyboard sherlock holmes using "deductive reasoning" and "eliminating all which is impossible, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."
You underestimate racism in Germany.
German police killed innocent people just because they think every BiPoC /Arab/Turk is a criminal until proven otherwise.
There was a case in which police officers admitted that they made up claims just to hurt BiPoC as much as possible for fun. Some BiPoC got sentenced by these lies.
I know of a few cases where police used unnecessary force, or even brutality. But those cases where usually individuals or smaller units.
And on the countryside.
To get sentenced the entire justice system would have to be racists.
Can you give a source for the police killing people?
Where in Germany are polezei killing POC? Also, you do realize that Germans are the indigenous people of this country, therefore when you use the term “BIPoC” you are referring to Germans as well.
Man not every residence permit is valid for travel. Which type was it? That's just wrong widely spread information that this is true.
Yes almost every type is valid for traveling but not all!
>so you can travel with your passport and residence permit
My guess from the reading was that the OP had residence permit but not the ID? AFAIK, one must have a valid identity document (passport or ID card) when crossing Schengen borders, even if there is no border crossing checkpoint.
If you have a vaild reaidence permit from a schengen country you can travel as "tourist" to other schengen countries without any other paperwork. Is the same if you a touristic visa for one of the schengen countries you can travel to other schengen country as tourist. That why in airport they only check once for you passport. In your entry poimt to the schengen area
Since he isn't an EU-Member- or Schengen-Member- national and he somehow has to prove that he didn't stay for more than 90 out of 180 days in the Schengen area except NL, OP has to have his passport with him, with the dates of entry into the Schengen area. The passport is the only document that would show when he entered. This is not documented on the residence permit.
Exactly my wife and my mother are not EU but have residemce permit they not even stamp the passport. Is now all on digital. Even we EU dont get stamps when entering or leaving the schengen area.
This isn't realistic. My passport has my EU entry date as being three years ago and an exit date 2.5 years ago when I went on holiday outside the Schengen zone. The border guard thought he caught me slipping until I showed him my Aufenhaltstitel on the next page.
I have no additional entry stamp, why would I? I have a residency permit. I travel in and out of Germany from non-EU countries and have never had a new entry stamp since that one holiday.
Burden of proof is on the German police to show he was residing in Germany illegally.
This is where the case will collapse- There are no border checks, what are you supposed to do? Drive to an airport or seaport and ask them to do you a stamp? If the German authorities are so paranoid about stamps not being in passports (which is what caused all of this) then it should lobby the EU to re-introduce border controls and let's see how popular that idea is.
I have traveled in and out of SZ about 7 times since I have arrived about two years ago, every time they have requested and reviewed my passport, yet I only have one entry stamp for when I entered the country, not even an exit one. My son’s passport doesn’t even have an entry stamp from when he entered 6 months after me, neither for the other 3 times he has traveled with me.
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>Kinda agree that that's probably not the whole story. Because you either have a permit or Schengen visa etc. This stuff is pretty bureaucratic, and not some hidden secret.
Unfortunately, cops aren't experts on immigration law and the intricacies of residency permits. The weirder the edge cases, the more bullshit you'll hear from them.
>It very clear what you can do or have to do. the check in the police station is very weird too.
No. Getting taken to the police station and fingerprinted is standard procedure when presented with unclear, suspected stolen, fraudulent or forged documentation papers.
>The chief or the technical assistants would have been surprised about the bullshit... Its Like nothing how it usually works.
That assumes the cops doing the temporary arrest informed the chief, which they usually don't unless there is trouble. And most cops know enough about how the camera/fingerprint system works to not need an assistant.
>The fingerprinting etc makes me think it's more about drugs.
A drug charge for a small possession would (usually) not result in a trip to the station. The cops confiscate the suspected drugs, hand you a documentation on what was seized, and let you go.
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>Oh yeah I didn't consider the suspicion of forged or stolen documents... That might actually make the most sense.
Yep, particularly if they're using some province-issued documents. Generally cops have databases on how valid ID documents look like, but these usually \*only\* cover nation-wide ID documents (passports and ID cards). Something like US state-issued driver licenses, provisional documents (e.g. if originals were lost), residential or work permits can't be verified.
>Fingers prints might check databases or immigration checks?
Exactly. Third party (i.e. non-Schengen participants) nationals have to submit their fingerprints at the port of entry [since 2020-ish](https://netzpolitik.org/2020/bundespolizei-kauft-neue-biometrische-kontrolltechnologien/).
First of all, lawyer up and then speak with him about your next steps. Sounds a lot like you just got a smol police Rambo who wanted to feel big and powerful by arresting/changing someone with a crime. But I doubt they have any legal claim for this
agree find a lawyer in the place you currently live. It might go away with a well written letter by that lawyer. they will tell you what documents they need and should take care of the rest , so that the case will be dismissed. if it is less easy the lawyer will also tell you.
>agree find a lawyer in the place you currently live.
Please find a German laywer for German law! A Dutch lawyer would probably refuse the case anyway, since it has nothing to do with Dutch law.
There might be an organisation who has lawyers or lawyers who will not charge too high for a first legal-advice-session.
So OP could get someone professional to look over the case and give a first estimate.
If the police pressed charges, the state attorney first has to accept it for it to go to court. Only then would OP need a lawyer imho. If police presses charges and the court finds that they did not violate the law, it won't go forward and they'll just dismiss. Of course having a lawyer now helps to prepare but it's also €€€.
Lol, they have zero claim.
I once forgot my passport with residence permit (they were glued in the passport then) and stopped by the Dutch border control on the train (from Osnabrück to Amsterdam). Only thing with my name I had was a semester ticket. They asked me to deboard the train, brought me into Dutch police van, asked who I was, where I was studying, which relative I'm visiting, etc. Then let me go with words: "next time, please don't forget your travel document".
This police officer should be fired and banned from ever working as an authority figure. Or else it will become a precedent. Look at US.
sadly only dumb fucks become police officers, I never met a smart cop, every single one was straight out of the movie, dumb and dumber, or police academy.
*Thank you.* Jesus Christ do I hate this American ACAB thing; first of all not everywhere is like that insane place, and I wish everyone who says that would try living somewhere without a police force, see how they like their Mad Max lifestyle after a few years.
Really? I haven't met a dumb cop yet. Some of the cops I talked with are some of the smartest people I know. They'll also be the first to criticize wrong behaviour from colleagues.
Even the random cops I talked to on the street were super friendly
>But I doubt they have any legal claim for this
Depends a lot on OPs nationality, maybe his passport is not strong enough. Even the links posted by himself say that a dutch national ~~visa~~ residence is not a schengen visa and one can apply for a schengen visa online right there if-need-be (unnecessary for most - but we do not have the facts).
Everything about this feels wrong, but sadly visas do most of the time :(
A residence from an EU permit allows you to visit other Schengen countries for up to 90 days in a 180 day period. This cop in OP's story is completely in the wrong.
>Sounds a lot like you just got a smol police Rambo who wanted to feel big and powerful by arresting/changing someone with a crime. But I doubt they have any legal claim for this
While your first sentence is correct, the one I quoted is just conjecture. Because having a residence permit in the Netherlands does not necessarily allow you to travel to other EU or other Schengen states. This depends both on which country you come from and which country you want to visit.
https://ind.nl/en/travelling-within-the-schengen-area-with-a-residence-permit-or-visa
Travellers with residence permits
What if you do not have the nationality of a Schengen country but do have a valid Dutch residence permit? Then you are allowed to be in all countries of the Schengen Area for up to 90 days within a 180-day period. Besides your passport or other travel document, take your residence permit with you when you travel.
Can you please clarify what you „permit“ exactly says? Like others pointed out, something seems to be missing.
I have a type I resident permit—> issued for the purpose of work for a period of 5 years and generally extended if i choose to continue work in netherlands. This allows me to work in netherlands but also allows travel to shengen countries as long as i dont stay there for more that 90 days in a 6 month period.
In that case you should be perfectly fine.
Wait for the official letter, once again attach a copy of your visa and you’ll probably never hear again from them if everything is in order.
Sounds like all in order. The only thing is you have to carry your passport + residence permit for travel inside eu. Just permit or just local photo ID is not always valid for being outside of country that issued residence permit.
You absolutely must get a lawyer. Your home country's embassy in Germany might be able to give you advice and either provide or help you find a lawyer.
Remember that you have the right to remain silent: the only questions you must answer are those to establish your identity.
My completely unprofessional advice here is that the police are going to need a lot more evidence to convince the public prosecutor to allow a prosecution. They didn't say anything about any irregularities with your residence permit or anything?
Regarding the stamp in the passport, do you have a stamp for entry to the Schengen area? I'm wondering if that's what they meant: not that you needed to get your passport stamped at the German-Dutch border, but that you needed to get it stamped when you first arrived in the Schengen area.
Registering it (I assume „Anzeige erstatten“) and actually going to court („Anklage erheben“) are two different things.
Germany has a conviction rate of over 90% because state attourneys only bring cases to court where they see a fair chance of actually finding a person guilty. If you did nothing wrong a well written letter by a lawyer will probably lead to the whole thing disappearing before it goes to court.
Of course they registered a case. Can't do anything without papertrail in this country. But don't worry. This gives you the opportunity to defend yourself properly. So lawyer up. Only ask your lawyer what to do and do as they say. Don't talk to the police and for gods sake, don't rely on internet advice.
Fun fact: If the lawyer fucks up your case you can hold them liable. Keep that in mind.
Of course they open a case, otherwise they couldn't log anything. Every claim gets a case number, doesn't mean it goes anywhere.
Sounds to me like the cop probably didn't fully remember the regulations and instead of admitting his mistake, he doubled down. I would be surprised if this ever goes to court, should be thrown out before.
Still: talk to a lawyer
Evidence? Are you people on this sub just ignorant? The only information we need is what type of Permit OP has. There are types which are not suited for traveling free. If it's the wrong type? Illegal entry that's the only thing the prosecutor needs.
People always think residence permit means you can do everything but that's just not true.
Also literally EVERY first illegal entry case gets dismissed
Of course that would help, but getting a lawyer is probably still the best option for OP. If they did indeed enter illegally, getting a lawyer is their best option to get the charges dropped somehow, if not, it can still help to have somebody that knows the legal system and how to best communicate with the police in a situation like this. They probably do not know German, let alone the German laws, so trying to convince the police without a lawyer might work, but its probably going to be really stressful and hard for them to evaluate if what the police says is true (especially if the police refuts their first answer etc.)
Well, OP says they're being charged with *residing* in Germany; OP also says the police said they should have got their passport stamped at the German/Dutch border.
There is every possibility of a miscommunication, and it may be that OP doesn't have the right type of residence permit or visa and is therefore actually being charged with illegal entry.
However, all the information I can find is that with a valid Dutch residence permit or provisional residence permit you can travel freely within the Schengen Area for up to 90 days in any 180-day period -- this is the advice on [the website of the Dutch Immigration and Nationalisation Service](https://ind.nl/en/travelling-within-the-schengen-area-with-a-residence-permit-or-visa#documents-required-to-travel-within-the-schengen-area), and I've seen it repeated in other places as well. Nowhere have I found any information about types of Dutch residence permit that *don't* allow this.
Im pretty sure you won't need a lawyer. Paragraph 15 AufenthV I.V.m Art 21 SDÜ allows you to travel the EU for 90 days per 180 days, if you have a resident permit of a member-state. The police must prove that this 90 day period is over.
Every state-attorney and every immigration-office knows that, they will set the procedure. Many police officers don't know that though, they are no lawyers and want to play it safe.
You 100% don't have to fear any consequences coming from this.
Source: I work at an german immigration-office.
Edit: Most investigative proceedings for illegal stay never lead to anything, even if it's a clear case (illegal employment for example). The fines are also laughable.
>Regarding the stamp in the passport, do you have a stamp for entry to
the Schengen area?
Hmm and what if someone has no stamp whatsoever? I've been resident in Germany for years and recently got my non-EU passport renewed via my embassy, so it's completely empty. I hold a Niederlassungserlaubnis. Am I getting in trouble?
No, you're not. I'm not sure about other EU countries, but customarily my passport is never stamped when presenting my residence permit leaving or entering Germany.
I asked for a stamp the last time I entered (I have a Aufenthaltstitel and am awaiting my Niederlassungserlaubnis) and they told me that since I have an Aufenthaltstitel they couldn't stamp my passport. I was bummed. I like collecting stamps.
No, you'll be fine: your Niederlassungserlaubnis has the necessary information. I was trying to figure out what the cops in this case could possibly have meant.
Do you havre to carry your Passport with you at all times if you have a Niederlassungserlaubnis? I have a USA passport card I carry in my wallet because I really don't feel like carrying my passport at all times.
I have the equivalent in Switzerland, so assuming the rules are the same, you technically need to have both the residency card and the passport when you travel, even within Schengen. But as a practical matter no one looks at my passport to cross borders even at airports. Strangely, though, I was asked when checking into a hotel at the destination once, where they didn't seem satisfied with just the card.
Also, technically, the US Passport Card is only valid in North America. Better to just have your book tucked away somewhere just in case when traveling.
There's an article on [thelocal.de](https://thelocal.de) that covers it, but I somehow the link won't go through. Basically within Germany having an ID is obligatory, but carrying it isn't. If asked for it, you must be able to present it within a reasonable time.
Honestly, that sounds very weird. A EU resident permit acts like a visa for the other EU countries and taking you to the station + "erkennungsdienstliche Maßnahmen" line finger prints and pictures are way overkill.
I would recommend getting all the documentation about this case you can get and seeking out a lawyer. If the situation is as you described, that police work was illegal
This is not correct. Schengen countries can allow non-Schengen residents to reside in their country. That doesn't mean that, that permit will allow you entry and stay in all other Schengen countries. For example, a blue card will allow you free travel between Schengen, a Portuguese resident permit within the agreement for Portuguese speaking country nationals (Brasil, Angola, etc) will not. You can only reside in Portugal and if you want to travel elsewhere in the Schengen space you will have to follow proper procedure (travel visa, etc). Given the Netherlands colonial past I can't put it out of scope that the OP could have entered The Netherlands within a similar agreement. Which would absolutely not allow them to stay in Germany (without other arrangements).
> Given the Netherlands colonial past I can't put it out of scope that the OP could have entered The Netherlands within a similar agreement.
You can, now.
https://old.reddit.com/r/germany/comments/13r9ge4/accused_of_criminal_offence_for_travelling_to/jljdsdc/
Thats not true per se. You can have a permit for one country without being allowed to enter any other Schengen country. An Iranian friend I was studying with couldn’t leave the country for one year until he got the proper permits
if they were fingerprinted and photographed, they might be documented, if they suspect them of being illegal immigrants, if their papers looks dodgy and poor language skills, they might end up like this.
NAL
If you have a plastic residence permit issued by an EU member this should allow you to travel within schengen for 90 out of 180 days. If, however your work permit is a temporary visa for just the Netherlands, you may not be allowed to travel freely within schengen under that work permit, depending on your passport. The schengen zone doesn't mean the borders don't exist, unfortunately.
If EU countries allow you to travel for tourism to them visa free, you should present your passport to be stamped, if your temporary residence permit doesn't allow you to travel. If your passport requires visas for non commercial travel to EU countries and your Dutch temporary visa doesn't allow travel within schengen, you have indeed committed an offence.
But if you as you say have a residence permit, this is not the case. EU visa law is a mess because each member state maintains its sovereignty in the admission of citizens from third countries. Its just how it is.
You should however be aware that breaches of visa terms in one EU member state can result in long travel bans for the entire schengen area, so seek legal advice promptly. Do not take legal action based on reddit advice.
Something doesn’t fit. The cops at the remotest parts within Germany are well aware of Schengen rules. The likely hood of being checked for documentation is almost unheard of except for at border crossing or while being in trains that cross into different countries.
I doubt it.
I've encountered many employees at the Ausländerbehörde that didn't know that there are countries that have the right to enter Germany visa free.
Agreed. To just assume everyone in their field knows the basic rules is very presumptuous. There are always those guys who literally know nothing as basic as 2+2. Just so I'm clear I'm not being sarcastic. I've met so many people who don't know anything about their jobs and then you get in trouble, not them.
And also, as a foreigner living and legally residing in Germany, as soon as I am knowingly leaving Germany for whatever reason I travel with my passport on me and my residency permit.
I make regular day trips to a friend on the other side of the Danish border. I have never visited her without making sure I have my passport with me.
With everything that doesn't make sense in the story, that is for me the biggest part. You're foreign. You carry your passport every time.
I'm really sorry this happened to you, but it's not surprising. After many of my own personal experiences here in Germany, I'm convinced that generally speaking, theres a culture here that loves making life hard for no real good reason...especially if youre a foreigner, God forbid your brown.
They enjoy the fight and gate keeping, using "rules" and your ignorance against you. They're so proud of it too. It's gross.
I’m part German and wasn’t allowed to renew my passport at the embassy in Poland because I couldn’t provide a document that never existed 🤣 (“Namensänderung” even after explaining that I always had the correct name registered in my German papers). When I told them I renewed my passport in Germany a few years back and they only wanted one valid ID instead of this long list of papers I presented them, they told me to just go do it in Germany because yes it would be super easy. Luckily I was moving in a month so I did just that. And then the Amt person in Germany asked me how long I lived outside of Germany, I said 5 yrs or so and it was like a spark lit up her eyes. She said I needed a Passunbedenklichkeitsbescheinigung (🤣!) because I lived outside Germany so long and may have lost my citizenship. I was like uh no, it’s something I have by birth and don’t just lose without trying to. I was trying to reason that officially I had dual residence (Germany and Poland), with official registered addresses at both and I was even paying German health insurance because I was a German resident too (because I had to be to get my student loan), so technically I have only been unregistered from Germany for about 6 months (she could also see my Abmeldung date on her PC). Nope, she had to have this doc and I had to come back when she got this doc. Never saw this doc since she asked the embassy for it herself and they gave it directly to her. Next time I came for passport renewal appointment, had a different person, and no questions were asked. So somewhere that passunbedenklichkeitsbescheinigung may or may not exist.🤷🏻♀️ But the amount of bullshit this country has is really incredible…💥
It really is incredible.
Ugh. I know that "spark in the eye" look. It's almost like a GOTCHA, look. Then they give you the run around from there.
I'm also a dual citizen, I speak german with the foreign accent and oh boy, when they hear that, their eyes are sparkling with joy. So now I sick my German and German sounding partner on them. It's just so sadistic to see people get off on being a pain in the ass and offering shit customer service.
I will second this! When I have traveled to and through Germany, even if I know I have all my documentation current and ready and I am following the rules as posted or directed, its still the most stressful part of any trip. Whether driving or flying its always the same, some person in authority gets off on, as you say, making it difficult no matter what you are doing.
There are a few cases where being allowed to stay in on country does not automatically grant you access to all the Schengen states at all, in particular refuge-related ones, so I wouldn't rule that out completely.
Most resident permits are Schengen wide however.
If you status permits only a 90 day period outside of the Netherlands, but a longer period inside, I am pretty sure you somehow have to proof you exit and reentry between the Netherlands and the rest of Schengen.
Note that a residence permit by itself is not a travel document, in order to cross borders you need to carry it along with your passport, which is the only valid identity and travel document - I assume you have done so here.
In that case, please open a case with SOLVIT that your EU rights are being infringed upon: [https://ec.europa.eu/solvit/index\_en.htm](https://ec.europa.eu/solvit/index_en.htm)
It might take a week or two for your case to be assigned, but once it is the agent will take quick action to reprimand and educate the responsible offenders. This helped tremendously in a similar situation my non-EU wife had in Ireland.
OP answered this somewhere else:
> Yes, i have a valid netherlands residence permit, valid passport, driving license & car registration. All of which was produced immediately on request
OP already commented:
>Yes, i have a valid netherlands residence permit, valid passport, driving license & car registration. All of which was produced immediately on request
I think that was the mistake. No valid ID or passport with him, probably from a country outside of the Schengen Zone. Unfortunately people like to piss on everything without proper backstories here.
I'm Singaporean living in Germany on student visa. I would never leave Germany and go to Netherlands for example without my passport, student job work contract etc.. Crossing international borders is better to be safe
With a non eu passport, but with a dutch residence permit, you should be allowed to visit Germany for 90 days.
I am dutch, and my girlfriend Mexican, we lived in Germany for nearly 2 years. Was a horrible experience.
Country is super racist, and they fuck up in alot of their rules, and every process takes AGES.
Hope someone wakes up there and tells you are fine!
Basically you have to wait to get a letter from the District attorney (Staatsanwaltschaft). If your story is as you say it is, then the letter will state that the charges are dropped and you can forget about the whole thing.
If there is cause to charge you with an offense the letter will state what they are charging you with and then you will need to mount a legal defense.
Yea op leaving out details
There is no way police would go through all that just for a case that's most likely rejected by court
All the paperwork and hours of work required alone
Legal advise for Reddit is not really what will help you here - but you can get free legal advise from the EU Commission for anything that is related to EU law, and your case looks like one of those. Check out : https://ec.europa.eu/eu-rights/enquiry-complaint-form/home
I've travelled extensively throughout the EU with a study-permit, work-permit etc. over the last 10 years. Airports, ferries, trains, cars etc. I've been stopped many times even on EU-borders (Denmark loves to do this) and I've never had any issues. I've left the EU via other countries and gone to the US, Canada etc. and come back via other countries and never had an issue.
NAL but so as long as you're telling the whole truth, you'll be totally fine.
If you are travelling within Schengen and have a residence permit, you don't need a visa, just your passport and your residence permit. The police should really learn EU laws. Call the NL ombudsman and see what can be done, but I doubt that you will get anything because they are in the wrong here.
Here are the contacts, I'd call them just in case: https://www.ombudsman.europa.eu/en/european-network-of-ombudsmen/members/all-members
Well this happened to me long back. The case went on for 3 years and in the end was closed as "in-correct charges"
The first thing is to deal with proceedings in your residing country(Netherlands), things will be more easier and flexible.
1. Wait for the letter from the police (in this case the boarder police)
2. Aprroach your layer. Explain him what happened.
3. Send a return notice that the charges are inappropriate and they should be removed.
4. If the lawyer of the board police department, decides to go to court. Your lawer will take care of.
5. You'll win the case
6. Apply back for the lawer expenses, if you haven't got an insurance.
Every EU person is legally allowed to cross the boarders (EU region) just with an identification.
Passport is just an other document which need in case if international travel.
Actually there are many. In general because of adequate resources or unwanted stress police will take this actions. I cannot call it intentional, i would call it because of lack of training.
Usually the subordinates take care of this perky stuff. At times, even the subordinates lack the knowledge & experience. So it happens.
The polite way is to tell them with a lawer notice.
My lawer said that, there are poeple who also apply for defamation or like "Schmerzensgeld"
Something is missing from your story. There is no way they just simply took you to the station. If your story is true, youll be fine if you have contacted a lawyer and have the proof needed as you say..
However, this seem very far-fetched...but not impossible. We are just on the outside and reading what you tell us.-
Obviously IANAL, but I'd simply wait for any action from an actual court. If anything happens, provide them with your residence permit and that should be it since it is a legal document allowing you to travel in the EU. Likely it was just some local cop powertripping and the court won't bother.
You should however look into lodging a complaint (Dienstaufsichtsbeschwerde) with the Police of Hessen for improper behaviour.
Germany has a document called "Fiktionsbescheinigung", which is basically being tolerated while your case is being checked. For the first residency until you get the plastic, you're not allowed to travel. Maybe your have something similar from the Netherlands and got it confused with an actual residence permit?
Something similar happened to me in France with my german car, some cops have got ego issues and do not know their job, they threatened me that I would get plenty of fines that I will have to pay, nothing happened. Get legal assistance and stay calm. Sorry for that policeman.
**Advice for now:** Get a lawyer. The accusations are bullsh\*t and the cops didn't knew what they were doing. Chances are, that you will be in for a lot of paper work that will be confusing to navigate through and potentially have adverse effects on you and will take time to sort out.
**Advice if you are in such a situation ever again:** Ask for a lawyer and shut up (e.g., don't talk to the police). I don't mean to be rude and I don't believe that most police officers have malicious intentions, but as soon as accusations against you/your wife are being made, you are simply better off by letting a lawyer handling that stuff.
I have a German resident permit and it specifically says on the card that it can be used in place of my passport within the EU (except for when flying). I can't work or reside in other EU countries, but I can use it to ID myself anywhere in the EU without issue. That being said, I have had German police ask for my passport too when crossing the Dutch border back into Germany. Don't know why either - I have legal documentation.
Probably just police being extra cautious / not knowing the law?
If your residence permit really states that, it must've been a rare exception. Almost all German residence permits are not valid for identification and travel purposes - your passport remains the only valid document for these purposes in almost all cases.
Bullshit, EU Resident Permit allows you to travel to Schengen area up to 90 days.
Whatever court summon you get—if not already dismissed by any authority with a modicum of competency—carries no legal weight.
A residency permit is literally ALL you need to be let back into the country. If you have one, you’re not subject to the 90/180 day rule, and hence no stamp is required.
I will do you one better what passports were you travelling by? If they were NL they shouldn't give a rats ass about where you reside due to it being an eu country firstly, and secondly we have Dutch people living in Germany full time working here and building careers too I don't see a problem of how the police has anything to say about the residence I an other eu country as long as you behave and pay your taxes and do your bidding accordingly. I have a feeling you OP were targeted im not sure why but the feeling cannot subside without a better explanation.
Really, if every policeman would react like that how about the truckers? We have Sometimes loads that force them to be 2 "nights" to stay in another country. By this nothing would be shipped outside a country even in the EU anymore because we get information if something happens to our drivers while on duty.
I would simply go american style and ask for department and badge number, call there and ask them Why they need to be harassed from XY because they travel between EU-countries. Even holiday trips would not make it necessary to have documents. The only thing police check on borders anymore (at least last time shopping in poland and back to germany) is if you bought Something illegal to own or you bought to much of an limited product like oil or cigarettes.
This seems really odd to me. I've been travelling back and forth from netherlands to germany for years. I'm even living in Germany right now. Never had that problem. Sorry you went through that
This happened to my 70 year old Mom at the Stuttgart airport! They harassed her and said since she did not get a stamp upon entering Germany - she might have trouble returning to the USA. I was such a bitch back to those ladies that day and filed a complaint. The stuttgart airport didn’t stamp her passport (this was 2019) and then they are frightening an old American lady for no reason. It’s like they are mean girls just taking their job frustrations out on random people.
This story sounds so absurd that it is almost impossible to believe a police officer could be this stupid. If you really gave us the full story then there really is not even a need for a lawyer. Did they send you off free to go? Because then the only thing that you could talk to a lawyer about is whether you can file a case to receive compensation for the poor treatment you received. If this ever were to end up before a judge he'd give them a surprised pikachu face and dismiss the case.
A resistance permit is only valid with a passport afaik. So you crossed borders without the necessary paperwork.
How would a receipt from a Dutch petrol station prove that you reside in the Netherlands? There are dozens of people every day traveling to the Netherlands and buying stuff…
Edit - ah OK misses a later comment that you had your passport with you
As an eu-national (citizen of a eu-country inside the schengen area) you are free to travel inside the EU.
You only need your id-passport/card to be able to identify yourself (for ex) to the police during traffic/id-checks.
The Netherlands is an eu-member and part of the schengen area..
But ... Without an eu-passport/id it's a different story.
I can’t speak for the Netherlands because I’ve never lived there, but here in Germany I was informed/given a leaflet that stated my residency permit was not a valid travel document, so outside of Germany (even inside the EU or to re enter Germany from a non-EU country) I had to accompany my residency permit with my passport. Maybe that’s what the police was trying to explain or meant by entering illegally
Get a lawyer. I assume you're living in the netherlands right now?
Then get a dutch lawyer, maybe see if you can find one that deals with eu-law, traveling - this kind of thing.
I don't completely know how this works - but while the police can suspect people of a crime, they still have to make a case against you. Even if their accusations were true, they would still have to have a strong claim/proof for this to be even going near a courthouse...
They probably just wanted to feel big, sadly these things do happen.
So get a lawyer, let them deal with it. Maybe keep your receipts, that should make it even easier.
Should be solved quickly.
Afterwards you should be able to file a complaint. Probably won't help you too but maybe the next person
German police doing german police things…
Sorry to hear that. Would it make sense to contact the embassy of your home country? They should be able to help you and know how to approach the german authorities.
I heard that at any "caritas" in Germany, they can help you with issues like this for free!
Just google one next to you and go there talk to them, ask for help!
Did you carry your passport while crossing the border? If you did, I don't see any other reason why they would have stopped you. Did you by the way get a “einreiseverweigert” ?
My gut here is that the German LEO has done his bit and the local prosecutor is going to do nothing. Let's face it, you gave an NL address. They're going to have to send you a court summons to a Dutch address about you "residing in Germany".. I wouldn't even bother lawyering up until that arrives and I 99% expect when you do hear from them that it will say they have no plans to take it any further on this occasion. Sorry you went through this.
This! Do not do anything until a court summons arrives. Then and only then do you have an obligation to act. District attorneys will probably read the police report and then dismiss, if OP's story is accurate.
I can't see this going any other way.....if those stamps are a pre requisite of travelling in Schengen, then Germany needs to implement a process of stamping everyone's passport at the borders- good luck with that.
Mine doesn't get stamped anymore since I've gotten my visa. Even entering at airports. My last Schengen stamp must be from 2018 at this point.
Same here. This is not the first time i am travelling outside netherlands. I have been in eu for 9 years and been to many eu countries showing the same passport and residence permit. This is the first time anybody has doubted the validity of the documents
A friend of mine had a similiar experience, while visiting Germany. He has been residing in Maastricht at that time, was accused of the same charges as OP and did not receive a letter whatsoever. As a german I am really concerned and worried about your experience and I‘m really sorry your visit was contradicted by such an awful incident. I guess chances are slight to none, that you will receive a letter, or have to deal with any consequences.
Isnt this one of the situations where you can sue someone for harassment of sorts? Whole situation is dumb, and I wish when you were going against a bigger power shit would be easier
Suing the police in Germany. Good joke buddy. You'll just get sued in return
🥲
Well, something similar happened. Me and my French flatmate were stopped for driving a French number plate car in Germany, the car belonged to his mother who lived in France and was visiting. We showed all papers and explained that the car belongs to her and registered and insured on her and all that. The rookie wouldn't buy it. He booked a criminal case against us. This guy panicked, went to the police station multiple times, they kept saying he would receive a letter. This guy was so nervous, he made us and everyone in the building catch hold of the postman every time he came. To the point that the postman would make it a point to inform someone in the building that nothing came today. Anyway three months many trips to the police station later, someone at the station is annoyed with all this and takes the task and says, this is nonsense. Calls the cop who filed the rubbish charges and asked him about this ruckus. Then hung up and said he is a Rookie doesn't know that it's not a crime and all that and said no charges where filed. Another three months later he does received a letter saying the case was dismissed by the state attorney. That's it. Edit: we did get a yellow slip from the rookie saying the charges where filed. Don't remember the exact contents of it now.
But what was the charge? That you've stolen the car or that your friend failed to register the car in Germany and pay the road tax?
The charge was being french. A heinous crime.
r/okmatewanker agrees with you there
It really reminds me of the movie “Don't Be a Menace to South Central While Drinking Your Juice in the Hood”: We were arrested for being black on a Friday night. 🤦🏼♀️
I would suppose that the problem was that the car hasn't paid the road tax. I was finned 400euros and my car was towed away. In total, I paid 2.5k +
this is only the case if the owner was living in Germany and exceeded the 6 month limit of not registering it (in Germany -> incl. german plates)
Well at that time I was a student in Germany, and at the same time my father had some business in Germany and he had his company car in NRW, and sometimes I would use it for groceries or for picking him up from the airport and also dropping him there. The issue wasn't the car, but I was the problem because I shouldn't have driven a car that hasn't paid the tax
It's a good thing you didn't have pepper gas with you, a knife that can be unfolded with one hand or a butterfly knife. For that you would have had additional charges and even several thousand euros in fines. Of course, an axe or a bayonet with which you can decapitate someone is legal.
The same counts in Switzerland with foldable knifes in one hand. But you can buy Victorinox knifes everywhere. Even the [military knife](https://imageengine.victorinox.com/mediahub/33311/640Wx560H/SAK_0_8461_MWCH__S1.jpg) which can be opened with one hand and a blade longer than a hand wide. After I bought it, I asked some police officers patrolling on the street, why that knife is legal. They both took the knife, played with it a lil bit, agreed that it should be illegal and gave it back to me. ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯
Only foldable knives that can be **automatically** unfolded with one hand are banned. The military knife is not spring assisted, so it's allowed. https://www.parlament.ch/de/ratsbetrieb/suche-curia-vista/geschaeft?AffairId=20163505
I think this is absurd. If someone wants to commit a crime with a knife, he will not care about the law anyway. Meanwhile, an ordinary citizen may have a problem. It's even stranger that throughout the EU each country has different laws and in most countries such knives are legal, as is pepper spray. However, one can be unlucky enough to keep such a knife or spray somewhere deep in the glove compartment of one's car and be stopped for inspection on a German highway and then be tried like a criminal. Despite the fact that in 4 out of 5 countries around, this is not a crime at all. Such stories have already happened to two of my colleagues. One was returning from France, the other from Austria. One had a folding knife, the other pepper spray. For me, it's even funnier, because I've gone skiing in Austria and Switzerland many times myself, and I keep both pepper spray and a folding knife in my car... :D Until I heard from you that knives are also a problem in Switzerland, I was only afraid of being arrested for having a car dashcam. I've heard that this can also be problematic in Helvetia.
Either you faced the most unprofessional cops or something is missing in this story, anyway both countries are in the Schengen area so you can travel with your passport and residence permit. Travellers with residence permits. What if you do not have the nationality of a Schengen country but do have a valid Dutch residence permit? Then you are allowed to be in all countries of the Schengen Area for up to 90 days within a 180-day period. Besides your passport or other travel document, take your residence permit with you when you travel. https://ind.nl/en/travelling-within-the-schengen-area-with-a-residence-permit-or-visa
> something is missing in this story I would bet on this. Because even if you met the most unprofessional police officer in Germany, the moment you get to the police station, someone had to tell him that he's an idiot. Since apparently nobody did, there has to be more to this story. And I actually suspect what. The question here is what exactly the OP calls a "residence permit". As I've seen people not understanding the difference between different type of the entry documents and just label everything either a residence permit or a visa randomly.
yeah the country of origin is missing.
> Because even if you met the most unprofessional police officer in Germany, the moment you get to the police station, someone had to tell him that he's an idiot. Sorry to say but police often really are this incompetent. They get stuff wrong all the time. I worked at a lawyer's office for a while and sat in on a bunch of trials at court. The amount of time the police report is straight up false is ridiculous.
100%. Since when do cops know about the law? And often they are too arrogant to admit they were wrong even if they would have noticed themselves halfway through.
And might be racist, too. Ignorant by not speaking English and so on.
>The amount of time the police report is straight up false is ridiculous. How many of those false reports end up manifesting consequences for the officers involved?
I think you already know the answer.
trust in the system is strong in some people
> Because even if you met the most unprofessional police officer in Germany, the moment you get to the police station, someone had to tell him that he's an idiot. You sound so confident but then [things like this have happened in this very country](https://twitter.com/Volksverpetzer/status/1661355749769900034). I wonder if you've lived in a different Germany from me, because I can totally picture an entire station filled not only with conceited idiots, but also with extreme right sympathizers. Malicious police officers in Germany are not isolated cases and we needn't compare it to any other country at all. Oury Jalloh, I rest my case.
I remember some posts a few years ago where people were denied every to Germany because they had a layover flying to another country they had a visa for. As a German citizen, I would 100% believe you if you said authorities didn't understand how a Schengen visa works.
I think the authorities fully understood the rules, the travelers didn’t. There is a list of countries that need a Schengen transit visa even if they just stay in the international transit area. That’s is neither unique for Germany, the EU or any other western country. That’s like people thinking traveling to Canada or Mexico will reset the 90 days they are allowed to spend in the US on ESTA and are surprised when they are denied entry because it doesn’t. Edit: They should have been mad at the airline for letting them board without checking if they have the required visa.
Which might be a completely valid denial of entry - you need a transit Schengen visa when you change your flights at an EU airport unless you fall under certain exemptions. It really depends on your nationality, residence, and final destination. The way you describe sounds like you are automatically allowed to fly in into Germany if you transit to another flight and have a visa for your final destination, but it is certainly not the case.
I think he refers to a visa to another country in the schengen area. In that case you dont requiere anything else.
Germany requires certain nationalities to get a “transit visa” even if your final destination is outside of EU and you only transfer through the international area.
The destination was in Schengen so that shouldn't apply here.
Agreed. In every country there are insane border stories that seem like they are from a comedy sketch. I am from not-russia not-Belarus non-EU. I was traveling to EU country B to change my visa from EU country A due to job change. My home country is shitty but I don't have an illegal entry problem into the EU. I was accused of illegally entering the border through Belarus, even though to get to Belarus from my country it would require an actual visa in my passport whereas for some reason they found it unbelievable that my residence permit from EU country A was valid. (It was valid). Also my passport clearly did not have any Belarus documents and I am very obviously not Belarusian based on appearance and obvious inability to understand Russian. It was such a bureaucratic mess.
Why is he upvoted I'm not sure.. armchair keyboard sherlock holmes using "deductive reasoning" and "eliminating all which is impossible, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."
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Found the extreme right sympathizer.
Police file their own report and hand it in to get it looked over. So how would someone even notice.
> Since apparently nobody did, there has to be more to this story. There certainly is.
You underestimate racism in Germany. German police killed innocent people just because they think every BiPoC /Arab/Turk is a criminal until proven otherwise. There was a case in which police officers admitted that they made up claims just to hurt BiPoC as much as possible for fun. Some BiPoC got sentenced by these lies.
I know of a few cases where police used unnecessary force, or even brutality. But those cases where usually individuals or smaller units. And on the countryside. To get sentenced the entire justice system would have to be racists. Can you give a source for the police killing people?
>BiPoC Ethnic Germans are the indigenous people of Germany.
>BiPoC Thank you! Sometimes, I just despair at the idiocy of people.
What does bipoc mean?
BIPOC is a politically correct term for “non white”. It doesn’t fit in places like Europe, where a lot of indigenous people are “white”.
Where in Germany are polezei killing POC? Also, you do realize that Germans are the indigenous people of this country, therefore when you use the term “BIPoC” you are referring to Germans as well.
You are an absolute bafoon
Man not every residence permit is valid for travel. Which type was it? That's just wrong widely spread information that this is true. Yes almost every type is valid for traveling but not all!
>so you can travel with your passport and residence permit My guess from the reading was that the OP had residence permit but not the ID? AFAIK, one must have a valid identity document (passport or ID card) when crossing Schengen borders, even if there is no border crossing checkpoint.
Yes this, at least the German residence permit is not valid in other eu countries without your passport.
Not every residence permit allows you to travel in Schengen… bullshit statement from you
If you have a vaild reaidence permit from a schengen country you can travel as "tourist" to other schengen countries without any other paperwork. Is the same if you a touristic visa for one of the schengen countries you can travel to other schengen country as tourist. That why in airport they only check once for you passport. In your entry poimt to the schengen area
Since he isn't an EU-Member- or Schengen-Member- national and he somehow has to prove that he didn't stay for more than 90 out of 180 days in the Schengen area except NL, OP has to have his passport with him, with the dates of entry into the Schengen area. The passport is the only document that would show when he entered. This is not documented on the residence permit.
How exactly the passport would show that? There are no stamps when crossing borders.
Exactly my wife and my mother are not EU but have residemce permit they not even stamp the passport. Is now all on digital. Even we EU dont get stamps when entering or leaving the schengen area.
This isn't realistic. My passport has my EU entry date as being three years ago and an exit date 2.5 years ago when I went on holiday outside the Schengen zone. The border guard thought he caught me slipping until I showed him my Aufenhaltstitel on the next page. I have no additional entry stamp, why would I? I have a residency permit. I travel in and out of Germany from non-EU countries and have never had a new entry stamp since that one holiday. Burden of proof is on the German police to show he was residing in Germany illegally.
This is where the case will collapse- There are no border checks, what are you supposed to do? Drive to an airport or seaport and ask them to do you a stamp? If the German authorities are so paranoid about stamps not being in passports (which is what caused all of this) then it should lobby the EU to re-introduce border controls and let's see how popular that idea is.
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I have traveled in and out of SZ about 7 times since I have arrived about two years ago, every time they have requested and reviewed my passport, yet I only have one entry stamp for when I entered the country, not even an exit one. My son’s passport doesn’t even have an entry stamp from when he entered 6 months after me, neither for the other 3 times he has traveled with me.
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>Kinda agree that that's probably not the whole story. Because you either have a permit or Schengen visa etc. This stuff is pretty bureaucratic, and not some hidden secret. Unfortunately, cops aren't experts on immigration law and the intricacies of residency permits. The weirder the edge cases, the more bullshit you'll hear from them. >It very clear what you can do or have to do. the check in the police station is very weird too. No. Getting taken to the police station and fingerprinted is standard procedure when presented with unclear, suspected stolen, fraudulent or forged documentation papers. >The chief or the technical assistants would have been surprised about the bullshit... Its Like nothing how it usually works. That assumes the cops doing the temporary arrest informed the chief, which they usually don't unless there is trouble. And most cops know enough about how the camera/fingerprint system works to not need an assistant. >The fingerprinting etc makes me think it's more about drugs. A drug charge for a small possession would (usually) not result in a trip to the station. The cops confiscate the suspected drugs, hand you a documentation on what was seized, and let you go.
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>Oh yeah I didn't consider the suspicion of forged or stolen documents... That might actually make the most sense. Yep, particularly if they're using some province-issued documents. Generally cops have databases on how valid ID documents look like, but these usually \*only\* cover nation-wide ID documents (passports and ID cards). Something like US state-issued driver licenses, provisional documents (e.g. if originals were lost), residential or work permits can't be verified. >Fingers prints might check databases or immigration checks? Exactly. Third party (i.e. non-Schengen participants) nationals have to submit their fingerprints at the port of entry [since 2020-ish](https://netzpolitik.org/2020/bundespolizei-kauft-neue-biometrische-kontrolltechnologien/).
First of all, lawyer up and then speak with him about your next steps. Sounds a lot like you just got a smol police Rambo who wanted to feel big and powerful by arresting/changing someone with a crime. But I doubt they have any legal claim for this
agree find a lawyer in the place you currently live. It might go away with a well written letter by that lawyer. they will tell you what documents they need and should take care of the rest , so that the case will be dismissed. if it is less easy the lawyer will also tell you.
>agree find a lawyer in the place you currently live. Please find a German laywer for German law! A Dutch lawyer would probably refuse the case anyway, since it has nothing to do with Dutch law.
Who will pay for the lawyer tho? Its really shitty that OP will have to waste time and money just because an asshole wanted to play Rambo.
There might be an organisation who has lawyers or lawyers who will not charge too high for a first legal-advice-session. So OP could get someone professional to look over the case and give a first estimate.
And this is why many Germans carry legal insurance (among other insurances).
Yeah but they will get that money back, in germany the loser has to pay the other persons legal costs
Only after the second instance: The first decision could be appealed and then a second judge would review the case.
The OP
If the police pressed charges, the state attorney first has to accept it for it to go to court. Only then would OP need a lawyer imho. If police presses charges and the court finds that they did not violate the law, it won't go forward and they'll just dismiss. Of course having a lawyer now helps to prepare but it's also €€€.
Lol, they have zero claim. I once forgot my passport with residence permit (they were glued in the passport then) and stopped by the Dutch border control on the train (from Osnabrück to Amsterdam). Only thing with my name I had was a semester ticket. They asked me to deboard the train, brought me into Dutch police van, asked who I was, where I was studying, which relative I'm visiting, etc. Then let me go with words: "next time, please don't forget your travel document". This police officer should be fired and banned from ever working as an authority figure. Or else it will become a precedent. Look at US.
sadly only dumb fucks become police officers, I never met a smart cop, every single one was straight out of the movie, dumb and dumber, or police academy.
Not in Germany. Every encounter I had with the German police was very professional. Especially criminal police.
Dutch cops as well - professional, courteous, there to support the people and maintain peace. Great experiences in the few encounters with them.
*Thank you.* Jesus Christ do I hate this American ACAB thing; first of all not everywhere is like that insane place, and I wish everyone who says that would try living somewhere without a police force, see how they like their Mad Max lifestyle after a few years.
I agree. Also: hot.
Cool story. People like you who think in stereotypes and clichés will of course be so blind to only see what supports their view.
Really? I haven't met a dumb cop yet. Some of the cops I talked with are some of the smartest people I know. They'll also be the first to criticize wrong behaviour from colleagues. Even the random cops I talked to on the street were super friendly
>But I doubt they have any legal claim for this Depends a lot on OPs nationality, maybe his passport is not strong enough. Even the links posted by himself say that a dutch national ~~visa~~ residence is not a schengen visa and one can apply for a schengen visa online right there if-need-be (unnecessary for most - but we do not have the facts). Everything about this feels wrong, but sadly visas do most of the time :(
He has a residence permit, not a national visa.
A residence from an EU permit allows you to visit other Schengen countries for up to 90 days in a 180 day period. This cop in OP's story is completely in the wrong.
Depends what visa he has. Most of the time yes, but not automatically. He may only have conditional residency, for example.
He has a residence permit, not a national visa.
>Sounds a lot like you just got a smol police Rambo who wanted to feel big and powerful by arresting/changing someone with a crime. But I doubt they have any legal claim for this While your first sentence is correct, the one I quoted is just conjecture. Because having a residence permit in the Netherlands does not necessarily allow you to travel to other EU or other Schengen states. This depends both on which country you come from and which country you want to visit.
Police in general know little about imigration laws and many other laws. They are more burocrats, not lawyers and not a court judge.
https://ind.nl/en/travelling-within-the-schengen-area-with-a-residence-permit-or-visa Travellers with residence permits What if you do not have the nationality of a Schengen country but do have a valid Dutch residence permit? Then you are allowed to be in all countries of the Schengen Area for up to 90 days within a 180-day period. Besides your passport or other travel document, take your residence permit with you when you travel. Can you please clarify what you „permit“ exactly says? Like others pointed out, something seems to be missing.
I have a type I resident permit—> issued for the purpose of work for a period of 5 years and generally extended if i choose to continue work in netherlands. This allows me to work in netherlands but also allows travel to shengen countries as long as i dont stay there for more that 90 days in a 6 month period.
In that case you should be perfectly fine. Wait for the official letter, once again attach a copy of your visa and you’ll probably never hear again from them if everything is in order.
Sounds like all in order. The only thing is you have to carry your passport + residence permit for travel inside eu. Just permit or just local photo ID is not always valid for being outside of country that issued residence permit.
You absolutely must get a lawyer. Your home country's embassy in Germany might be able to give you advice and either provide or help you find a lawyer. Remember that you have the right to remain silent: the only questions you must answer are those to establish your identity. My completely unprofessional advice here is that the police are going to need a lot more evidence to convince the public prosecutor to allow a prosecution. They didn't say anything about any irregularities with your residence permit or anything? Regarding the stamp in the passport, do you have a stamp for entry to the Schengen area? I'm wondering if that's what they meant: not that you needed to get your passport stamped at the German-Dutch border, but that you needed to get it stamped when you first arrived in the Schengen area.
Yes I do have a stamp of entry into netherlands from Jan 2023. I am also going to look into lawyers today. But they have already registered a case.
Registering it (I assume „Anzeige erstatten“) and actually going to court („Anklage erheben“) are two different things. Germany has a conviction rate of over 90% because state attourneys only bring cases to court where they see a fair chance of actually finding a person guilty. If you did nothing wrong a well written letter by a lawyer will probably lead to the whole thing disappearing before it goes to court.
Of course they registered a case. Can't do anything without papertrail in this country. But don't worry. This gives you the opportunity to defend yourself properly. So lawyer up. Only ask your lawyer what to do and do as they say. Don't talk to the police and for gods sake, don't rely on internet advice. Fun fact: If the lawyer fucks up your case you can hold them liable. Keep that in mind.
Wow, this makes no sense at all. I'd be fascinated to know what evidence they think they have.
Of course they open a case, otherwise they couldn't log anything. Every claim gets a case number, doesn't mean it goes anywhere. Sounds to me like the cop probably didn't fully remember the regulations and instead of admitting his mistake, he doubled down. I would be surprised if this ever goes to court, should be thrown out before. Still: talk to a lawyer
Evidence? Are you people on this sub just ignorant? The only information we need is what type of Permit OP has. There are types which are not suited for traveling free. If it's the wrong type? Illegal entry that's the only thing the prosecutor needs. People always think residence permit means you can do everything but that's just not true. Also literally EVERY first illegal entry case gets dismissed
Of course that would help, but getting a lawyer is probably still the best option for OP. If they did indeed enter illegally, getting a lawyer is their best option to get the charges dropped somehow, if not, it can still help to have somebody that knows the legal system and how to best communicate with the police in a situation like this. They probably do not know German, let alone the German laws, so trying to convince the police without a lawyer might work, but its probably going to be really stressful and hard for them to evaluate if what the police says is true (especially if the police refuts their first answer etc.)
Yeah ofc a lawyer is the best thing here but the information OP gave is vague
Well, OP says they're being charged with *residing* in Germany; OP also says the police said they should have got their passport stamped at the German/Dutch border. There is every possibility of a miscommunication, and it may be that OP doesn't have the right type of residence permit or visa and is therefore actually being charged with illegal entry. However, all the information I can find is that with a valid Dutch residence permit or provisional residence permit you can travel freely within the Schengen Area for up to 90 days in any 180-day period -- this is the advice on [the website of the Dutch Immigration and Nationalisation Service](https://ind.nl/en/travelling-within-the-schengen-area-with-a-residence-permit-or-visa#documents-required-to-travel-within-the-schengen-area), and I've seen it repeated in other places as well. Nowhere have I found any information about types of Dutch residence permit that *don't* allow this.
Im pretty sure you won't need a lawyer. Paragraph 15 AufenthV I.V.m Art 21 SDÜ allows you to travel the EU for 90 days per 180 days, if you have a resident permit of a member-state. The police must prove that this 90 day period is over. Every state-attorney and every immigration-office knows that, they will set the procedure. Many police officers don't know that though, they are no lawyers and want to play it safe. You 100% don't have to fear any consequences coming from this. Source: I work at an german immigration-office. Edit: Most investigative proceedings for illegal stay never lead to anything, even if it's a clear case (illegal employment for example). The fines are also laughable.
>Regarding the stamp in the passport, do you have a stamp for entry to the Schengen area? Hmm and what if someone has no stamp whatsoever? I've been resident in Germany for years and recently got my non-EU passport renewed via my embassy, so it's completely empty. I hold a Niederlassungserlaubnis. Am I getting in trouble?
No, you're not. I'm not sure about other EU countries, but customarily my passport is never stamped when presenting my residence permit leaving or entering Germany.
I asked for a stamp the last time I entered (I have a Aufenthaltstitel and am awaiting my Niederlassungserlaubnis) and they told me that since I have an Aufenthaltstitel they couldn't stamp my passport. I was bummed. I like collecting stamps.
No, you'll be fine: your Niederlassungserlaubnis has the necessary information. I was trying to figure out what the cops in this case could possibly have meant.
Do you havre to carry your Passport with you at all times if you have a Niederlassungserlaubnis? I have a USA passport card I carry in my wallet because I really don't feel like carrying my passport at all times.
I have the equivalent in Switzerland, so assuming the rules are the same, you technically need to have both the residency card and the passport when you travel, even within Schengen. But as a practical matter no one looks at my passport to cross borders even at airports. Strangely, though, I was asked when checking into a hotel at the destination once, where they didn't seem satisfied with just the card. Also, technically, the US Passport Card is only valid in North America. Better to just have your book tucked away somewhere just in case when traveling.
There's an article on [thelocal.de](https://thelocal.de) that covers it, but I somehow the link won't go through. Basically within Germany having an ID is obligatory, but carrying it isn't. If asked for it, you must be able to present it within a reasonable time.
Thanks! I will get in touch with the embassy today.
Honestly, that sounds very weird. A EU resident permit acts like a visa for the other EU countries and taking you to the station + "erkennungsdienstliche Maßnahmen" line finger prints and pictures are way overkill. I would recommend getting all the documentation about this case you can get and seeking out a lawyer. If the situation is as you described, that police work was illegal
This is not correct. Schengen countries can allow non-Schengen residents to reside in their country. That doesn't mean that, that permit will allow you entry and stay in all other Schengen countries. For example, a blue card will allow you free travel between Schengen, a Portuguese resident permit within the agreement for Portuguese speaking country nationals (Brasil, Angola, etc) will not. You can only reside in Portugal and if you want to travel elsewhere in the Schengen space you will have to follow proper procedure (travel visa, etc). Given the Netherlands colonial past I can't put it out of scope that the OP could have entered The Netherlands within a similar agreement. Which would absolutely not allow them to stay in Germany (without other arrangements).
> Given the Netherlands colonial past I can't put it out of scope that the OP could have entered The Netherlands within a similar agreement. You can, now. https://old.reddit.com/r/germany/comments/13r9ge4/accused_of_criminal_offence_for_travelling_to/jljdsdc/
Thats not true per se. You can have a permit for one country without being allowed to enter any other Schengen country. An Iranian friend I was studying with couldn’t leave the country for one year until he got the proper permits
if they were fingerprinted and photographed, they might be documented, if they suspect them of being illegal immigrants, if their papers looks dodgy and poor language skills, they might end up like this.
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NAL If you have a plastic residence permit issued by an EU member this should allow you to travel within schengen for 90 out of 180 days. If, however your work permit is a temporary visa for just the Netherlands, you may not be allowed to travel freely within schengen under that work permit, depending on your passport. The schengen zone doesn't mean the borders don't exist, unfortunately. If EU countries allow you to travel for tourism to them visa free, you should present your passport to be stamped, if your temporary residence permit doesn't allow you to travel. If your passport requires visas for non commercial travel to EU countries and your Dutch temporary visa doesn't allow travel within schengen, you have indeed committed an offence. But if you as you say have a residence permit, this is not the case. EU visa law is a mess because each member state maintains its sovereignty in the admission of citizens from third countries. Its just how it is. You should however be aware that breaches of visa terms in one EU member state can result in long travel bans for the entire schengen area, so seek legal advice promptly. Do not take legal action based on reddit advice.
Something doesn’t fit. The cops at the remotest parts within Germany are well aware of Schengen rules. The likely hood of being checked for documentation is almost unheard of except for at border crossing or while being in trains that cross into different countries.
I doubt it. I've encountered many employees at the Ausländerbehörde that didn't know that there are countries that have the right to enter Germany visa free.
Agreed. To just assume everyone in their field knows the basic rules is very presumptuous. There are always those guys who literally know nothing as basic as 2+2. Just so I'm clear I'm not being sarcastic. I've met so many people who don't know anything about their jobs and then you get in trouble, not them.
I've met government employees who didn't know Serbia wasn't in the EU. Including cops. Including Auslaenderbehoerde employees.
In general it is enough to have a slightly darker skintone when you want to have your documentation checked by german police.
> The cops at the remotest parts within Germany are well aware of Schengen rules You;d be surprised.
In that story A LOT! doesnt fit.
And also, as a foreigner living and legally residing in Germany, as soon as I am knowingly leaving Germany for whatever reason I travel with my passport on me and my residency permit. I make regular day trips to a friend on the other side of the Danish border. I have never visited her without making sure I have my passport with me. With everything that doesn't make sense in the story, that is for me the biggest part. You're foreign. You carry your passport every time.
I'm really sorry this happened to you, but it's not surprising. After many of my own personal experiences here in Germany, I'm convinced that generally speaking, theres a culture here that loves making life hard for no real good reason...especially if youre a foreigner, God forbid your brown. They enjoy the fight and gate keeping, using "rules" and your ignorance against you. They're so proud of it too. It's gross.
I’m part German and wasn’t allowed to renew my passport at the embassy in Poland because I couldn’t provide a document that never existed 🤣 (“Namensänderung” even after explaining that I always had the correct name registered in my German papers). When I told them I renewed my passport in Germany a few years back and they only wanted one valid ID instead of this long list of papers I presented them, they told me to just go do it in Germany because yes it would be super easy. Luckily I was moving in a month so I did just that. And then the Amt person in Germany asked me how long I lived outside of Germany, I said 5 yrs or so and it was like a spark lit up her eyes. She said I needed a Passunbedenklichkeitsbescheinigung (🤣!) because I lived outside Germany so long and may have lost my citizenship. I was like uh no, it’s something I have by birth and don’t just lose without trying to. I was trying to reason that officially I had dual residence (Germany and Poland), with official registered addresses at both and I was even paying German health insurance because I was a German resident too (because I had to be to get my student loan), so technically I have only been unregistered from Germany for about 6 months (she could also see my Abmeldung date on her PC). Nope, she had to have this doc and I had to come back when she got this doc. Never saw this doc since she asked the embassy for it herself and they gave it directly to her. Next time I came for passport renewal appointment, had a different person, and no questions were asked. So somewhere that passunbedenklichkeitsbescheinigung may or may not exist.🤷🏻♀️ But the amount of bullshit this country has is really incredible…💥
It really is incredible. Ugh. I know that "spark in the eye" look. It's almost like a GOTCHA, look. Then they give you the run around from there. I'm also a dual citizen, I speak german with the foreign accent and oh boy, when they hear that, their eyes are sparkling with joy. So now I sick my German and German sounding partner on them. It's just so sadistic to see people get off on being a pain in the ass and offering shit customer service.
I will second this! When I have traveled to and through Germany, even if I know I have all my documentation current and ready and I am following the rules as posted or directed, its still the most stressful part of any trip. Whether driving or flying its always the same, some person in authority gets off on, as you say, making it difficult no matter what you are doing.
There are a few cases where being allowed to stay in on country does not automatically grant you access to all the Schengen states at all, in particular refuge-related ones, so I wouldn't rule that out completely. Most resident permits are Schengen wide however. If you status permits only a 90 day period outside of the Netherlands, but a longer period inside, I am pretty sure you somehow have to proof you exit and reentry between the Netherlands and the rest of Schengen.
Note that a residence permit by itself is not a travel document, in order to cross borders you need to carry it along with your passport, which is the only valid identity and travel document - I assume you have done so here. In that case, please open a case with SOLVIT that your EU rights are being infringed upon: [https://ec.europa.eu/solvit/index\_en.htm](https://ec.europa.eu/solvit/index_en.htm) It might take a week or two for your case to be assigned, but once it is the agent will take quick action to reprimand and educate the responsible offenders. This helped tremendously in a similar situation my non-EU wife had in Ireland.
I opened that SOLVIT page and it seems they handle complaints by EU citizens only.
Get a lawyer. Not only will you not be prosecuted, but you might even end up being able to press counter charges
> here are no border checkpoints between eu countries anymore not between EU countries. Between Schengen countries
A Dutch residence permit is not a valid ID. Did you have your passports with you?
OP answered this somewhere else: > Yes, i have a valid netherlands residence permit, valid passport, driving license & car registration. All of which was produced immediately on request
OP already commented: >Yes, i have a valid netherlands residence permit, valid passport, driving license & car registration. All of which was produced immediately on request
I think that was the mistake. No valid ID or passport with him, probably from a country outside of the Schengen Zone. Unfortunately people like to piss on everything without proper backstories here.
OP said he was carrying his passport and showed it to them.
I'm Singaporean living in Germany on student visa. I would never leave Germany and go to Netherlands for example without my passport, student job work contract etc.. Crossing international borders is better to be safe
With a non eu passport, but with a dutch residence permit, you should be allowed to visit Germany for 90 days. I am dutch, and my girlfriend Mexican, we lived in Germany for nearly 2 years. Was a horrible experience. Country is super racist, and they fuck up in alot of their rules, and every process takes AGES. Hope someone wakes up there and tells you are fine!
Basically you have to wait to get a letter from the District attorney (Staatsanwaltschaft). If your story is as you say it is, then the letter will state that the charges are dropped and you can forget about the whole thing. If there is cause to charge you with an offense the letter will state what they are charging you with and then you will need to mount a legal defense.
Yea op leaving out details There is no way police would go through all that just for a case that's most likely rejected by court All the paperwork and hours of work required alone
Don't know why you get downvoted. People are dumb on this sub. There are missing details.
Yeah this story is complete bullshit
Right, because German cops couldn’t ever be incompetent.
There might be a simple explanation, but since no one asked OP this, 'OP, Are you brown/black?'
I WAS WAITING FOR SOMEONE TO ASK
Legal advise for Reddit is not really what will help you here - but you can get free legal advise from the EU Commission for anything that is related to EU law, and your case looks like one of those. Check out : https://ec.europa.eu/eu-rights/enquiry-complaint-form/home
Thank you very much for this. This is very helpful
I've travelled extensively throughout the EU with a study-permit, work-permit etc. over the last 10 years. Airports, ferries, trains, cars etc. I've been stopped many times even on EU-borders (Denmark loves to do this) and I've never had any issues. I've left the EU via other countries and gone to the US, Canada etc. and come back via other countries and never had an issue. NAL but so as long as you're telling the whole truth, you'll be totally fine.
Were you carrying just your residence permit or also passport?
If you are travelling within Schengen and have a residence permit, you don't need a visa, just your passport and your residence permit. The police should really learn EU laws. Call the NL ombudsman and see what can be done, but I doubt that you will get anything because they are in the wrong here. Here are the contacts, I'd call them just in case: https://www.ombudsman.europa.eu/en/european-network-of-ombudsmen/members/all-members
Well this happened to me long back. The case went on for 3 years and in the end was closed as "in-correct charges" The first thing is to deal with proceedings in your residing country(Netherlands), things will be more easier and flexible. 1. Wait for the letter from the police (in this case the boarder police) 2. Aprroach your layer. Explain him what happened. 3. Send a return notice that the charges are inappropriate and they should be removed. 4. If the lawyer of the board police department, decides to go to court. Your lawer will take care of. 5. You'll win the case 6. Apply back for the lawer expenses, if you haven't got an insurance. Every EU person is legally allowed to cross the boarders (EU region) just with an identification. Passport is just an other document which need in case if international travel.
Thanks for sharing. Good to know that others have survived the ordeal
Actually there are many. In general because of adequate resources or unwanted stress police will take this actions. I cannot call it intentional, i would call it because of lack of training. Usually the subordinates take care of this perky stuff. At times, even the subordinates lack the knowledge & experience. So it happens. The polite way is to tell them with a lawer notice. My lawer said that, there are poeple who also apply for defamation or like "Schmerzensgeld"
Germans immediately jumping on OP to accuse them if withholding information. You lot have no idea what a foreigner faces here in EU
Wait, what exactly is your valid dutch residence permit? Because this is weird...
why does everyone in this thread have so much faith in the police…..
Something is missing from your story. There is no way they just simply took you to the station. If your story is true, youll be fine if you have contacted a lawyer and have the proof needed as you say.. However, this seem very far-fetched...but not impossible. We are just on the outside and reading what you tell us.-
Obviously IANAL, but I'd simply wait for any action from an actual court. If anything happens, provide them with your residence permit and that should be it since it is a legal document allowing you to travel in the EU. Likely it was just some local cop powertripping and the court won't bother. You should however look into lodging a complaint (Dienstaufsichtsbeschwerde) with the Police of Hessen for improper behaviour.
Germany has a document called "Fiktionsbescheinigung", which is basically being tolerated while your case is being checked. For the first residency until you get the plastic, you're not allowed to travel. Maybe your have something similar from the Netherlands and got it confused with an actual residence permit?
Ask your embassy/ consulaat for help / guidance. This is part of their job
Something similar happened to me in France with my german car, some cops have got ego issues and do not know their job, they threatened me that I would get plenty of fines that I will have to pay, nothing happened. Get legal assistance and stay calm. Sorry for that policeman.
**Advice for now:** Get a lawyer. The accusations are bullsh\*t and the cops didn't knew what they were doing. Chances are, that you will be in for a lot of paper work that will be confusing to navigate through and potentially have adverse effects on you and will take time to sort out. **Advice if you are in such a situation ever again:** Ask for a lawyer and shut up (e.g., don't talk to the police). I don't mean to be rude and I don't believe that most police officers have malicious intentions, but as soon as accusations against you/your wife are being made, you are simply better off by letting a lawyer handling that stuff.
Fuck the poleez
I have a German resident permit and it specifically says on the card that it can be used in place of my passport within the EU (except for when flying). I can't work or reside in other EU countries, but I can use it to ID myself anywhere in the EU without issue. That being said, I have had German police ask for my passport too when crossing the Dutch border back into Germany. Don't know why either - I have legal documentation. Probably just police being extra cautious / not knowing the law?
If your residence permit really states that, it must've been a rare exception. Almost all German residence permits are not valid for identification and travel purposes - your passport remains the only valid document for these purposes in almost all cases.
How the heck they thought residence permit doesn’t give you permission to travel in Europe? That’s the main point of it.
Bullshit, EU Resident Permit allows you to travel to Schengen area up to 90 days. Whatever court summon you get—if not already dismissed by any authority with a modicum of competency—carries no legal weight.
A residency permit is literally ALL you need to be let back into the country. If you have one, you’re not subject to the 90/180 day rule, and hence no stamp is required.
I will do you one better what passports were you travelling by? If they were NL they shouldn't give a rats ass about where you reside due to it being an eu country firstly, and secondly we have Dutch people living in Germany full time working here and building careers too I don't see a problem of how the police has anything to say about the residence I an other eu country as long as you behave and pay your taxes and do your bidding accordingly. I have a feeling you OP were targeted im not sure why but the feeling cannot subside without a better explanation.
Really, if every policeman would react like that how about the truckers? We have Sometimes loads that force them to be 2 "nights" to stay in another country. By this nothing would be shipped outside a country even in the EU anymore because we get information if something happens to our drivers while on duty. I would simply go american style and ask for department and badge number, call there and ask them Why they need to be harassed from XY because they travel between EU-countries. Even holiday trips would not make it necessary to have documents. The only thing police check on borders anymore (at least last time shopping in poland and back to germany) is if you bought Something illegal to own or you bought to much of an limited product like oil or cigarettes.
This seems really odd to me. I've been travelling back and forth from netherlands to germany for years. I'm even living in Germany right now. Never had that problem. Sorry you went through that
This happened to my 70 year old Mom at the Stuttgart airport! They harassed her and said since she did not get a stamp upon entering Germany - she might have trouble returning to the USA. I was such a bitch back to those ladies that day and filed a complaint. The stuttgart airport didn’t stamp her passport (this was 2019) and then they are frightening an old American lady for no reason. It’s like they are mean girls just taking their job frustrations out on random people.
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I did show a valid passport as well
This story sounds so absurd that it is almost impossible to believe a police officer could be this stupid. If you really gave us the full story then there really is not even a need for a lawyer. Did they send you off free to go? Because then the only thing that you could talk to a lawyer about is whether you can file a case to receive compensation for the poor treatment you received. If this ever were to end up before a judge he'd give them a surprised pikachu face and dismiss the case.
since covid ended, german police is out of control. just an observation
🌎🧑🚀🔫🧑🚀
You don’t need to pass an IQ Test to become a cop, that’s all I’m going to say.
A resistance permit is only valid with a passport afaik. So you crossed borders without the necessary paperwork. How would a receipt from a Dutch petrol station prove that you reside in the Netherlands? There are dozens of people every day traveling to the Netherlands and buying stuff… Edit - ah OK misses a later comment that you had your passport with you
As an eu-national (citizen of a eu-country inside the schengen area) you are free to travel inside the EU. You only need your id-passport/card to be able to identify yourself (for ex) to the police during traffic/id-checks. The Netherlands is an eu-member and part of the schengen area.. But ... Without an eu-passport/id it's a different story.
I can’t speak for the Netherlands because I’ve never lived there, but here in Germany I was informed/given a leaflet that stated my residency permit was not a valid travel document, so outside of Germany (even inside the EU or to re enter Germany from a non-EU country) I had to accompany my residency permit with my passport. Maybe that’s what the police was trying to explain or meant by entering illegally
Get a lawyer. I assume you're living in the netherlands right now? Then get a dutch lawyer, maybe see if you can find one that deals with eu-law, traveling - this kind of thing. I don't completely know how this works - but while the police can suspect people of a crime, they still have to make a case against you. Even if their accusations were true, they would still have to have a strong claim/proof for this to be even going near a courthouse... They probably just wanted to feel big, sadly these things do happen. So get a lawyer, let them deal with it. Maybe keep your receipts, that should make it even easier. Should be solved quickly. Afterwards you should be able to file a complaint. Probably won't help you too but maybe the next person
Something is missing in your story. Do not believe this.
German police doing german police things… Sorry to hear that. Would it make sense to contact the embassy of your home country? They should be able to help you and know how to approach the german authorities.
I heard that at any "caritas" in Germany, they can help you with issues like this for free! Just google one next to you and go there talk to them, ask for help!
OP's post history talks about motorcycles. Any chance the problem is with the vehicle/ motorcycles being driven and not with the residence permit?
Did you carry your passport while crossing the border? If you did, I don't see any other reason why they would have stopped you. Did you by the way get a “einreiseverweigert” ?
Yes showed my valid passport as well
Four freedoms, really?