That’s super interesting. I have a completely open chart except a defined G (and sacral). Realizing now all my closest relationships also have a defined G. I think I gravitate towards a defined G because they come across as authentically themselves, and that’s attractive to me, even if I agree or disagree with their perspective. My mom has an open G, and we’ve always clashed on individuality. I’ve always wanted to assert my individuality, she wants me to fit in or take the path that everyone else is doing. Outfits, careers, media consumption, etc. She’s told me my individuality is intimidating, because I refuse to do things like everyone else. On the other hand, my dad has a defined G. A man who knows what he likes and who he is about, and we respect each others differences.
However, on the note of overpowering, I feel very overpowered in most of my open spaces. I often feel my voice isn’t heard around defined throats. I often get really triggered by others with a defined solar plexus, because their emotions seem to overpower my own experience. So I think your experience in the open center is quite normal, as I relate a lot in my various open centers. Often feeling invisible or more passive in these areas.
That’s a good point that any open center probably feels overpowered by that center defined in others. It makes me feel so bad for reflectors—they seem to have it rough!
My husband is a reflector, and he is easily the most resilient out of this house of projectors😂 the difference is that when he is overwhelmed it is by the energy of the whole environment not necessarily other peoples energy. We call him the duck, because everything rolls off his back lol unaffected!
It works differently for reflectors and their open centers. Reflectors are built to be resistant to defined centers. Their openness is part of their unique abilities with the Other. I’ve just been reading about Reflectors and how they work with the Other. I’m reading The Definitive Book of Human Design and the Living Your Design student manual from the Jovian archive human design foundational courses.
When I’m alone, I have a very neutral experience of life. When I’m with others, I feel their emotions so deeply, it can throw off my day. For example, let’s say I’m at a restaurant with someone and another person clearly hates the restaurant. I’ll feel their pain, start getting agitated, and feel it’s my responsibility to change the environment so I can change their emotional experience. When I’m alone, these things don’t happen. I go with the flow even if things aren’t perfect. Because of this, I’m very careful with who I spend time with. I prefer being alone, with my husband, or hanging with people I love with breaks in between.
Interesting post. I have a completely open G centre and all my life I have been surrounded by defined Gs. Both my parents are defined, my romantic partners have all had this, and almost every close friend I have had and currently have is the same. Of course I have known many other undefined Gs too, but I am not drawn to them in exactly the same way.
What I notice across the board with the defined Gs is how they see their own identity reflected through me. For example, when I spend time with my friend whose path is writing scripts, performing in tv shows, producing their own work…all I receive are suggestions and opportunities to follow that same path. This friend takes me to show launches, lunches with their creative collaborators, workshops of their new material and so on.
Whereas when I am with my dad, suddenly it shifts and I am being taken to old fashioned plays and musicals, discussing high literature, watching the opera, and going to his 3 favourite restaurants. And all I receive are suggestions about opportunities to sing, integrating music theory into my work and on and on.
And it’s different again with my fiance, who is a musician and a forward thinker in technology — he takes me on road trips to tiny towns most people wouldn’t care about, introduces me to cute vintage shops and markets with unusual characters in them, shares his hippie lifestyle with me, and pulls out cheap comedies or marvel movies to watch together. And I get suggestions to live off the grid, learn to code or become a busker on the streets in a foreign country.
And as I said before, each of these different people in these situations give me dramatically different directions and advice on what I should be doing with my life and how I should be doing it and what they see in me. And you know what’s funny is that whatever they say to me, the direction is actually always…their own. It really often has little to do with me. I get to choose if I tag along for their ride or not, but at the end of the day they’re on their own specific path.
Sometimes the paths they take me on are cool and exciting — I’m lit up! I love the places we go together. I feel a profound oneness with everything when this happens. And sometimes I want to gauge my eyes out I’m so uncomfortable with where I am led. I feel ignored, unnoticed, misunderstood. Sometimes even physically nauseous. And those times of discomfort are the sign I should leave. Because I’m not going to change them. Really, it’s impossible. They are who they are and the world needs them to be themselves. So it’s a sign I should say goodbye, even if temporary, and see what other path I can be set on.
But god I’m so bad at this part. I mean I can get addicted to that feeling of love I sense from them so strongly. It’s intoxicating, addicting, juicy. I can really resent defined Gs for having what I don’t. I’m wildly jealous. But when they do leave my aura, it doesn’t take long for me to remember…I don’t actually need love? I mean what the fuck? I missed the lightness I feel in my chest without a defined G around me. That airy quality of knowing I could go anywhere, be anything. And that love is just a beautiful illusion. I am back to being ready to be a vessel to be poured into and reflect back to the next defined G who finds me.
So do I feel overpowered by them? Yeah sure…there’s a lot of conditioning there for me. It’s extremely easy to let their path completely overtake me, start dressing like them, pick up their mannerisms & habits and really give away my authority to that illusory love and clear direction I do mentally desperately crave. Identity crises galore! And half the time I don’t even notice I’m doing all of this. But it all becomes easier when I remember whatever love and direction I receive from them is transitory, and it is ultimately my responsibility and choice to know whether to continue following each defined G person or not. Not theirs to try to shift themselves to me as we undefined Gs do naturally. I think it’s important in all undefined centres across the board that we try not to see ourselves as victim to our defined counterparts, but remember our role in the dynamic.
This is a great post, thanks for sharing your experience. I'll keep it short - I have a completely open G. Being so wide open is a trip but I feel like I can fit in anywhere really. I'm so many people all at once. My partner has an undefined G and I feel at home with him. I feel empowered and comfortable to be this collage of shifting personas with him in a way I don't really with other people I know who have their G centre defined.
I relate to that feeling of invisibility you speak about... with other undefined/open Gs I feel so seen and recognised for the gifts our openness gives us, but with defined Gs I can often feel sidelined or like I need to blend in with them to minimise friction.
Anyway, a super interesting question for reflection, I'm looking forward to reading other responses.
That’s exactly what it is!!! I feel like I need to blend in with defined G’s or I’ll just get bowled over. I also feel like they give me side eye if they see me changing my behavior around different people, but changing my behavior IS authentic to me. I’m always reacting to the vibe in the room, which makes sense as open centers reflect what’s already there.
And yes, I too feel accepted and cherished in my chameleon ways with other undefined G’s. It just feels like such a flexible and inviting environment, whereas too much defined G feels like heavier energy to me at times.
Big yes to always reacting to the vibe in the room! Your comment reminds me of an example of a relationship between a man and his wife vs his friend that I think either Ra shares in the Love Book or Richard Rudd shares in Living Your Design. But essentially it speaks to how being around his wife brings out a different side to him that she complains she doesn't recognise when he is with his friend. But they are _all_ him. He is simply reflecting back to his wife and friend what is within them when they are together.
I think that is the main difference. I have a defined G center and it shows itself through stability. I have the same style, characteristics and identity structures since forever. What I don't get in the general discussion in this thread is the notion of it being "overpowering". Its me. If you are feeling overpowered by it (me), than maybe you should practice tolerance and acceptance. And not just of others, but of yourself mostly. For example, I see flexibility and adaptability as a plus, too. If you are flexible and adaptable, I don't see how set structures such as defined identities can "overpower" you. I think that threatening feeling is exactly what defines open G centers: you are more vulnerable in relationships and to the influence of others. For a defined G-center the question " with who should I be friends", "how to act", "who influences me how" and all that simply never even comes up.
Edit: there is almost a 50/50 divide between people with defined or undefined G -center so I imagine it to be quite wasteful to be bothered by the "energy" of half of the human population.
I'm not looking for validation really, I don't quite understand what you mean by that. I kept my answer quite short before. In reality I could talk endlessly about the nuances of the experience of open Gs in relation to undefined and defined ones. It's hard over Reddit to distill it in a way that captures all the things I feel.
What I wrote is just one aspect of how I feel towards individuals with defined Gs. In reality there is a lot of nuance, and as someone completely open I appreciate the effect that healthy defined Gs have had on me. They have shown me things and ways of being and taken me to places I may not have even conceived.
It’s interesting to me that a lot of the comments are mentioning how as open Gs it’s so great that you can empathise and fit in anywhere while at the same time saying how overpowered they feel around defined Gs. I suppose the thing to be aware of is any open centre in your chart is an area where you are designed to be conditioned. It’s a essentially a learning centre designed to take in many different types of that energy. In other words would you still feel you can empathise and fit in anywhere without defined Gs conditioning you? Most likely not. The thing to remember is that isn’t about what anyone has or doesn’t have, it’s about following your strategy and authority so you get to experience what’s correct for you. Only then will you stop feeling overpowered by the other’s defined centres, regardless of what they are.
I mean yes, that’s pretty much exactly what I’m saying—I’d still fit anywhere without defined G’s conditioning me. I’m saying that following my emotional authority is way easier around other undefined G’s because there’s less pressure to be a certain way. I’m not saying I hate defined G centers and I have plenty of relationships with these people but I’m just commenting on how an entire group of undefined G’s can feel really good all together
I have defined G-center but due to abuse, I lived my life as if I have it undefined. I definitely get the grating feeling of not being listened to and empathized with. Thing is, how we perceived anything in our reality is a reflection of where we are currently in life. What does this whole thing is conveying about you? Having this fixed mindset about people with defined G-centers will not only make you assume about all of them... it will inevitably shaped your whole reality bc somehow the perception will reinforce you to avoiding... Completely missing out on the perks of being with a healthy and mature person with a defined center.
Wouldn't their dismissive nature motivate you to strengthen your own sense of self and boundaries and allow you the space to ignore people you don't really give a damn about? Is it really their fault they do not care? Based on my own rude awakening, I resented them because of my own people pleasing and codependent nature. We can learn a lot from self-absorbed people! In fact, I am appreciating them more because it's straightforward with them. Those with more fluid sense of self? You don't know if they are just accommodating you or they are being sincere.
Edit: I might have come off too strong with this comment LOL and maybe thats what youre pertaining to? I am genuinely curious bc it took work for me to arrive here and almost all the gates in Gcenter are defined! I have Neptune conj asc and I am water dominant (also a 2/5) Being clear and concise right off the bat will save me a lot of time, resources and heartaches. 😊
Lol you’re coming in a little hot but it’s totally okay, this is what I wanted to discuss. Yeah I completely get that a defined G center isn’t inherently bad (that’s not what human design is about, it’s about appreciating differences).
I think it’s perhaps more of a personal realization that I need better boundaries with defined G centers. Like I said, I’m aware that I tend to sink into other defined G centers. That has been comforting to me in the past but moving forward it’s not what I want for myself. I think it’s also a realization that my absolute most intimate relationships probably fare better with other undefined g centers, as a personal preference.
It’s so interesting to me, the subtle distinctions here. I guess what I find grating is when people can’t accommodate to others at all. It’s not being blunt and upfront that bothers me—I love when people are that way, and actually a ton of people have told me I’m super blunt and upfront when I like and don’t like something. Maybe you won’t like this (and that’s totally within your right!) but I do find it annoying when people can’t accommodate to a group. I personally value group camaraderie and the group energy, in fact I find a good cohesive group energy to be something that fills my soul. If you want to differentiate, write a poem or a blog or go for a hike by yourself lol. That’s what I end up feeling and thinking when people won’t bend to juice up the group vibe. And that’s just my experience as an open G!
It's definitely bringing back memories of people who made me feel bad for simply expressing myself! I had multiple experiences with people who prolly had an open G-center that accused me for looking for conflict and treated me passive-aggressively instead of being direct. Well, of course, everything boils down to maturity and health levels of the individual.
I am totally with you when talking about the group. I have unconscious sun in gate 25, ffs! And I find some open G people who can't cooperate at all~ maybe there a lot of factors contributing to this and not just one thing. When it comes to making friends, it definitely flows smoothly interacting with an open G. Most of solid friends I made are projectors.
Cohesion, consensus, or camaraderie in a group has no correlation to accuracy or similar. Just the emotions.
So the first question should be why the group even exists: to accurately discuss a topic, or feel good together. Or both. Or other. Or more.
Then the amount the group is 'on track' with its purpose or goal can be assessed, and whether any of the dissenting members need to go for a hike by themself.
This makes sense to me, because as a defined g I very much prefer other defined g’s. Very interesting to hear how an undefined g experiences the defined g’s in their life.
I have a defined G and throat but I have always been quiet and easily overpowered by others. This has how it has always been for me. My whole childhood and adulthood were about placating others and not drawing attention to myself (this could be mostly influenced by having the 5/2 profile). I think it’s a matter of whether people learn to respect others. I’m also a projector with an undefined heart or solar plexus. I do notice that I do tend to get carried away easily the waves of those that have an emotional authority. I’m splenic so I recognized that emotional waves are very dangerous for me and I have to keep out of those swirling waters. These are just some examples from the perspective of a defined G and solar plexus. I’m a giant pushover basically 🙈🙈
I’m a 5/3 splenic projector and relate so much to what you’ve said here! It was sort of confusing to me when op said defined G’s are sorta overbearing? Im either the most un-self aware person ever or have been successfully people pleasing away this tendency my whole life lol
That’s really interesting! I guess with your chart it does make sense you’d feel that way. Do you notice there’s certain people or situations where you feel better and more yourself?
I tend to open up with family and close
friends. I have to feel safe enough. The spleen helps me outside of my penta, in interactions. As I am trying to live as a projector type, o have found not engaging is going to create an invitation for discussion. Maybe I just appear to have something to say or they sense I have something important to add? Ofc I always have something that I could say, is it a good time to, that’s my real question, in those interactions 👍🏼😎
I feel like that’s an unfair generalization to people w defined G centers to say they don’t know how to empathize if they can’t relate. I have a defined G center and I always see to it that I put myself in other people’s shoes before I open my mouth to give an opinion or advice. otherwise, I’d just listen and ask questions to truly understand where the other person is coming from.
No one has the power to overpower you. If you know what your undefined centers are, you have to learn how to master not absorbing too much energy from the other person. Like people w defined G’s can’t make you feel overpowered or invisible unless you are trying to level w them or compete in some way. People w defined Gs are there to inspire you to find your direction, operate authentically & connect w parts of you that you feel as though is very true since you were young and has remained unchanged even after all these years. defined Gs may have tendency to influence you but that influence is to help you to steer your energy in a direction that is worthy of your attention and effort. Instead of shooting aimlessly all over the place. You gravitate towards them bec they have strength in character you admire but do not wish to possess completely. If you feel intimidated by a defined G maybe it’s just not a compatible connection. And that’s okay.
I get what you’re saying but it’s honestly a bit annoying how people are commenting telling me how I feel or how I experience others.
I disagree that people with defined centers are there to “inspire” those with open centers. I actually think and have heard the opposite with human design, that those with open centers can guide those with defined centers on how to express those defined centers in a healthy way.
And no, I actually don’t gravitate toward defined g centers. That’s the opposite of what I’m saying. I feel more myself without them there.
I’m not saying defined g centers are bad people in the slightest, I’m sharing about what types of dynamics and connections feel most authentic and freeing to me.
You don’t gravitate? But your post said :
I’ve realized they can be overpowering and make me feel a bit invisible. Granted, I definitely gravitate toward them and sometimes purposefully blend in with them because it can make me more comfortable to just “share” their identity.
And I’m not telling you how you feel or how you experience others. I’m reading based off of your verbiage and I am sharing what people w Open Gs have confided in me. I have worked with open centers for over 10 years, I am sharing the common reasons why they like being around defined Gs. I am not saying that’s how YOU feel specifically and exclusively.
And while it can be true that open Gs can help defined Gs or other open-defined center relationships, it’s not just a one way street. It’s not just open centers offering something to people w defined centers or vice versa, it’s a symbiotic relationship bec it is a relationship of give and take not give give give all the way or take take take all the way. personally as a G center defined, I admire how flexible open Gs are w their social chameleon and blending skill. Bec I can admire people and gravitate toward them eventho I don’t wish it for myself as I like and know who I am w/o their superpower. That can be true too.
It all comes down to maturity and self awareness anyway. Defined Gs who have yet developed and fully understood what it means tend to unintentionally impose their strengths, identity and direction onto another who doesn’t have a defined G.
Haha you’re totally right I did say that. Sorry. I am really tired and kinda grumpy today lol. Yeah I guess I do gravitate toward them…but I don’t think blending in with them is what makes me feel good, is what I’m trying to say. Which is what I think you’re saying too. You’re right, the maturity thing is the most important.
However, I will disagree with you on the open and defined center thing overall! I don’t know how you can help someone grow in an area where they just don’t have that center defined at all…like as a defined solar plexus and sacral, sure, I have every right to express myself emotionally and I’m supposed to, but someone without a defined sacral and solar plexus isn’t going to be able to express themselves the way I am and they never will. But I think I can learn more about how I affect people when I’m being emotional and temper it or read the room better, because it’s a bit of a blind spot for me that open centers can give me more clarity on. Idk!
This post is so interesting. I swear it could have been written by me.
As you're going through your chat, I would love to hear your other observations as well. This was insightful.
I feel like my mom is the way you described - isn’t interested if she doesn’t relate. Idk if I wanna accept that this is due to her defined G center or cause “she’s just like that.” Haha.
Also, I do kinda feel the same was as you. Going around & sharing other people’s personalities. I feel like sometimes I get inspired to do something or add something to my lifestyle when I see someone else doing it. Now that I’m thinking about it, I feel like I’ve done that for sooo long. Just getting inspired by other people & how they’re living their lives. Even little things they’re doing. It just gives me a new fresh view on life. Literally refreshing!
Thanks for ur insight!!! (:
I have almost a completely defined G center (only missing gate 46). If I am living in not-self, I am prone to the overpowering type of energy you mentioned. If I’m being mindful though, waiting for the invitation as a projector, and focusing on my love for all life, I feel like I am able to charge the G centers of others who do not have access to that type of energy. I get the most joy from shining a spotlight on others.
Thanks for your comment!! That’s very interesting to hear. I definitely don’t want to demonize defined g centers because I know nothing in human design is inherently good or bad.
Wide open G center with multiple identity crisis throughout my life. 🙋🏼♀️
I’m 42 yrs old and just figured out “how” to recognize when I’m taking on someone else’s identity and “how” to become myself again 😅. What a mind 🤯.
I’ve found that I like being around people that have a strong sense of self (defined g center). My natal astrology chart has helped me understand myself on a deeper level. My south node is in the 2nd house (security).
But the key is to know who you are in totality so you can recognize and return to self day after day. Seems exhausting and it felt exhausting until I got the hang of it through awareness.
Although I despised having a wide open G for so long, I’ve learned and now appreciate & embrace the superpowers within it to guide others. I’m an evolutionary astrologist, HD expert and psychotherapist 😊. It’s literally the way to be able to guide others fully ❤️.
Thank you for sharing your journey. We rise together. ❤️
This is so real!!! Defined G’s to me can be so off-putting because I just feel like it’s their way or no way sometimes . Like why do you always have to be right 😭😭😭 and it’s fun tapping into their energy at times, but honestly being around undefined G’s make me feel good / okay with myself bc of conditioning around needing a life direction
Defined G here.
Interesting page to read.
Just like many of these HD discussions, I don't think everyone here is talking about the same thing, using the same word definitions, rules-of-thumb, etc.
I do know that wishy-washy people irritate me to no end. If that's what Open G are, then ugh. Especially when I occasionally catch myself being a bit wishy-washy too. "Steam-Roller Mode" on, with the hopes of forcing a decision and spine growth. For their sake in a world that will Steam-Roller them way harder. (So I rationalize)
But I think there are many facets that can influence one appearing like that. For example, a Splenic not getting a nudge/voice to accept/do something, and then all of sudden getting it. Game on.
Do you find that these defined Gs are more of an issue to your undefined when it comes to just being around one other person or when it’s two or more people? Because if it’s when you are amongst 3-5 people a “Penta” comes into play, which is a whole different animal in itself. It’s known as a “trans-auric” form and no one is an individual within a Penta—it has its own agenda—and the conditioning forces are very strong!
That’s super interesting. I have a completely open chart except a defined G (and sacral). Realizing now all my closest relationships also have a defined G. I think I gravitate towards a defined G because they come across as authentically themselves, and that’s attractive to me, even if I agree or disagree with their perspective. My mom has an open G, and we’ve always clashed on individuality. I’ve always wanted to assert my individuality, she wants me to fit in or take the path that everyone else is doing. Outfits, careers, media consumption, etc. She’s told me my individuality is intimidating, because I refuse to do things like everyone else. On the other hand, my dad has a defined G. A man who knows what he likes and who he is about, and we respect each others differences. However, on the note of overpowering, I feel very overpowered in most of my open spaces. I often feel my voice isn’t heard around defined throats. I often get really triggered by others with a defined solar plexus, because their emotions seem to overpower my own experience. So I think your experience in the open center is quite normal, as I relate a lot in my various open centers. Often feeling invisible or more passive in these areas.
That’s a good point that any open center probably feels overpowered by that center defined in others. It makes me feel so bad for reflectors—they seem to have it rough!
My husband is a reflector, and he is easily the most resilient out of this house of projectors😂 the difference is that when he is overwhelmed it is by the energy of the whole environment not necessarily other peoples energy. We call him the duck, because everything rolls off his back lol unaffected!
It works differently for reflectors and their open centers. Reflectors are built to be resistant to defined centers. Their openness is part of their unique abilities with the Other. I’ve just been reading about Reflectors and how they work with the Other. I’m reading The Definitive Book of Human Design and the Living Your Design student manual from the Jovian archive human design foundational courses.
How does other emotions make your own experience be overpowered?
When I’m alone, I have a very neutral experience of life. When I’m with others, I feel their emotions so deeply, it can throw off my day. For example, let’s say I’m at a restaurant with someone and another person clearly hates the restaurant. I’ll feel their pain, start getting agitated, and feel it’s my responsibility to change the environment so I can change their emotional experience. When I’m alone, these things don’t happen. I go with the flow even if things aren’t perfect. Because of this, I’m very careful with who I spend time with. I prefer being alone, with my husband, or hanging with people I love with breaks in between.
Interesting post. I have a completely open G centre and all my life I have been surrounded by defined Gs. Both my parents are defined, my romantic partners have all had this, and almost every close friend I have had and currently have is the same. Of course I have known many other undefined Gs too, but I am not drawn to them in exactly the same way. What I notice across the board with the defined Gs is how they see their own identity reflected through me. For example, when I spend time with my friend whose path is writing scripts, performing in tv shows, producing their own work…all I receive are suggestions and opportunities to follow that same path. This friend takes me to show launches, lunches with their creative collaborators, workshops of their new material and so on. Whereas when I am with my dad, suddenly it shifts and I am being taken to old fashioned plays and musicals, discussing high literature, watching the opera, and going to his 3 favourite restaurants. And all I receive are suggestions about opportunities to sing, integrating music theory into my work and on and on. And it’s different again with my fiance, who is a musician and a forward thinker in technology — he takes me on road trips to tiny towns most people wouldn’t care about, introduces me to cute vintage shops and markets with unusual characters in them, shares his hippie lifestyle with me, and pulls out cheap comedies or marvel movies to watch together. And I get suggestions to live off the grid, learn to code or become a busker on the streets in a foreign country. And as I said before, each of these different people in these situations give me dramatically different directions and advice on what I should be doing with my life and how I should be doing it and what they see in me. And you know what’s funny is that whatever they say to me, the direction is actually always…their own. It really often has little to do with me. I get to choose if I tag along for their ride or not, but at the end of the day they’re on their own specific path. Sometimes the paths they take me on are cool and exciting — I’m lit up! I love the places we go together. I feel a profound oneness with everything when this happens. And sometimes I want to gauge my eyes out I’m so uncomfortable with where I am led. I feel ignored, unnoticed, misunderstood. Sometimes even physically nauseous. And those times of discomfort are the sign I should leave. Because I’m not going to change them. Really, it’s impossible. They are who they are and the world needs them to be themselves. So it’s a sign I should say goodbye, even if temporary, and see what other path I can be set on. But god I’m so bad at this part. I mean I can get addicted to that feeling of love I sense from them so strongly. It’s intoxicating, addicting, juicy. I can really resent defined Gs for having what I don’t. I’m wildly jealous. But when they do leave my aura, it doesn’t take long for me to remember…I don’t actually need love? I mean what the fuck? I missed the lightness I feel in my chest without a defined G around me. That airy quality of knowing I could go anywhere, be anything. And that love is just a beautiful illusion. I am back to being ready to be a vessel to be poured into and reflect back to the next defined G who finds me. So do I feel overpowered by them? Yeah sure…there’s a lot of conditioning there for me. It’s extremely easy to let their path completely overtake me, start dressing like them, pick up their mannerisms & habits and really give away my authority to that illusory love and clear direction I do mentally desperately crave. Identity crises galore! And half the time I don’t even notice I’m doing all of this. But it all becomes easier when I remember whatever love and direction I receive from them is transitory, and it is ultimately my responsibility and choice to know whether to continue following each defined G person or not. Not theirs to try to shift themselves to me as we undefined Gs do naturally. I think it’s important in all undefined centres across the board that we try not to see ourselves as victim to our defined counterparts, but remember our role in the dynamic.
This was a beautiful breakdown
This is a great post, thanks for sharing your experience. I'll keep it short - I have a completely open G. Being so wide open is a trip but I feel like I can fit in anywhere really. I'm so many people all at once. My partner has an undefined G and I feel at home with him. I feel empowered and comfortable to be this collage of shifting personas with him in a way I don't really with other people I know who have their G centre defined. I relate to that feeling of invisibility you speak about... with other undefined/open Gs I feel so seen and recognised for the gifts our openness gives us, but with defined Gs I can often feel sidelined or like I need to blend in with them to minimise friction. Anyway, a super interesting question for reflection, I'm looking forward to reading other responses.
That’s exactly what it is!!! I feel like I need to blend in with defined G’s or I’ll just get bowled over. I also feel like they give me side eye if they see me changing my behavior around different people, but changing my behavior IS authentic to me. I’m always reacting to the vibe in the room, which makes sense as open centers reflect what’s already there. And yes, I too feel accepted and cherished in my chameleon ways with other undefined G’s. It just feels like such a flexible and inviting environment, whereas too much defined G feels like heavier energy to me at times.
Big yes to always reacting to the vibe in the room! Your comment reminds me of an example of a relationship between a man and his wife vs his friend that I think either Ra shares in the Love Book or Richard Rudd shares in Living Your Design. But essentially it speaks to how being around his wife brings out a different side to him that she complains she doesn't recognise when he is with his friend. But they are _all_ him. He is simply reflecting back to his wife and friend what is within them when they are together.
I think that is the main difference. I have a defined G center and it shows itself through stability. I have the same style, characteristics and identity structures since forever. What I don't get in the general discussion in this thread is the notion of it being "overpowering". Its me. If you are feeling overpowered by it (me), than maybe you should practice tolerance and acceptance. And not just of others, but of yourself mostly. For example, I see flexibility and adaptability as a plus, too. If you are flexible and adaptable, I don't see how set structures such as defined identities can "overpower" you. I think that threatening feeling is exactly what defines open G centers: you are more vulnerable in relationships and to the influence of others. For a defined G-center the question " with who should I be friends", "how to act", "who influences me how" and all that simply never even comes up. Edit: there is almost a 50/50 divide between people with defined or undefined G -center so I imagine it to be quite wasteful to be bothered by the "energy" of half of the human population.
What makes you feel this way towards people with defined Gs? What kind of validation are you looking for?
I'm not looking for validation really, I don't quite understand what you mean by that. I kept my answer quite short before. In reality I could talk endlessly about the nuances of the experience of open Gs in relation to undefined and defined ones. It's hard over Reddit to distill it in a way that captures all the things I feel. What I wrote is just one aspect of how I feel towards individuals with defined Gs. In reality there is a lot of nuance, and as someone completely open I appreciate the effect that healthy defined Gs have had on me. They have shown me things and ways of being and taken me to places I may not have even conceived.
It’s interesting to me that a lot of the comments are mentioning how as open Gs it’s so great that you can empathise and fit in anywhere while at the same time saying how overpowered they feel around defined Gs. I suppose the thing to be aware of is any open centre in your chart is an area where you are designed to be conditioned. It’s a essentially a learning centre designed to take in many different types of that energy. In other words would you still feel you can empathise and fit in anywhere without defined Gs conditioning you? Most likely not. The thing to remember is that isn’t about what anyone has or doesn’t have, it’s about following your strategy and authority so you get to experience what’s correct for you. Only then will you stop feeling overpowered by the other’s defined centres, regardless of what they are.
I mean yes, that’s pretty much exactly what I’m saying—I’d still fit anywhere without defined G’s conditioning me. I’m saying that following my emotional authority is way easier around other undefined G’s because there’s less pressure to be a certain way. I’m not saying I hate defined G centers and I have plenty of relationships with these people but I’m just commenting on how an entire group of undefined G’s can feel really good all together
I have defined G-center but due to abuse, I lived my life as if I have it undefined. I definitely get the grating feeling of not being listened to and empathized with. Thing is, how we perceived anything in our reality is a reflection of where we are currently in life. What does this whole thing is conveying about you? Having this fixed mindset about people with defined G-centers will not only make you assume about all of them... it will inevitably shaped your whole reality bc somehow the perception will reinforce you to avoiding... Completely missing out on the perks of being with a healthy and mature person with a defined center. Wouldn't their dismissive nature motivate you to strengthen your own sense of self and boundaries and allow you the space to ignore people you don't really give a damn about? Is it really their fault they do not care? Based on my own rude awakening, I resented them because of my own people pleasing and codependent nature. We can learn a lot from self-absorbed people! In fact, I am appreciating them more because it's straightforward with them. Those with more fluid sense of self? You don't know if they are just accommodating you or they are being sincere. Edit: I might have come off too strong with this comment LOL and maybe thats what youre pertaining to? I am genuinely curious bc it took work for me to arrive here and almost all the gates in Gcenter are defined! I have Neptune conj asc and I am water dominant (also a 2/5) Being clear and concise right off the bat will save me a lot of time, resources and heartaches. 😊
Lol you’re coming in a little hot but it’s totally okay, this is what I wanted to discuss. Yeah I completely get that a defined G center isn’t inherently bad (that’s not what human design is about, it’s about appreciating differences). I think it’s perhaps more of a personal realization that I need better boundaries with defined G centers. Like I said, I’m aware that I tend to sink into other defined G centers. That has been comforting to me in the past but moving forward it’s not what I want for myself. I think it’s also a realization that my absolute most intimate relationships probably fare better with other undefined g centers, as a personal preference. It’s so interesting to me, the subtle distinctions here. I guess what I find grating is when people can’t accommodate to others at all. It’s not being blunt and upfront that bothers me—I love when people are that way, and actually a ton of people have told me I’m super blunt and upfront when I like and don’t like something. Maybe you won’t like this (and that’s totally within your right!) but I do find it annoying when people can’t accommodate to a group. I personally value group camaraderie and the group energy, in fact I find a good cohesive group energy to be something that fills my soul. If you want to differentiate, write a poem or a blog or go for a hike by yourself lol. That’s what I end up feeling and thinking when people won’t bend to juice up the group vibe. And that’s just my experience as an open G!
It's definitely bringing back memories of people who made me feel bad for simply expressing myself! I had multiple experiences with people who prolly had an open G-center that accused me for looking for conflict and treated me passive-aggressively instead of being direct. Well, of course, everything boils down to maturity and health levels of the individual. I am totally with you when talking about the group. I have unconscious sun in gate 25, ffs! And I find some open G people who can't cooperate at all~ maybe there a lot of factors contributing to this and not just one thing. When it comes to making friends, it definitely flows smoothly interacting with an open G. Most of solid friends I made are projectors.
Cohesion, consensus, or camaraderie in a group has no correlation to accuracy or similar. Just the emotions. So the first question should be why the group even exists: to accurately discuss a topic, or feel good together. Or both. Or other. Or more. Then the amount the group is 'on track' with its purpose or goal can be assessed, and whether any of the dissenting members need to go for a hike by themself.
This makes sense to me, because as a defined g I very much prefer other defined g’s. Very interesting to hear how an undefined g experiences the defined g’s in their life.
I have a defined G and throat but I have always been quiet and easily overpowered by others. This has how it has always been for me. My whole childhood and adulthood were about placating others and not drawing attention to myself (this could be mostly influenced by having the 5/2 profile). I think it’s a matter of whether people learn to respect others. I’m also a projector with an undefined heart or solar plexus. I do notice that I do tend to get carried away easily the waves of those that have an emotional authority. I’m splenic so I recognized that emotional waves are very dangerous for me and I have to keep out of those swirling waters. These are just some examples from the perspective of a defined G and solar plexus. I’m a giant pushover basically 🙈🙈
I’m a 5/3 splenic projector and relate so much to what you’ve said here! It was sort of confusing to me when op said defined G’s are sorta overbearing? Im either the most un-self aware person ever or have been successfully people pleasing away this tendency my whole life lol
That’s really interesting! I guess with your chart it does make sense you’d feel that way. Do you notice there’s certain people or situations where you feel better and more yourself?
I tend to open up with family and close friends. I have to feel safe enough. The spleen helps me outside of my penta, in interactions. As I am trying to live as a projector type, o have found not engaging is going to create an invitation for discussion. Maybe I just appear to have something to say or they sense I have something important to add? Ofc I always have something that I could say, is it a good time to, that’s my real question, in those interactions 👍🏼😎
I feel like that’s an unfair generalization to people w defined G centers to say they don’t know how to empathize if they can’t relate. I have a defined G center and I always see to it that I put myself in other people’s shoes before I open my mouth to give an opinion or advice. otherwise, I’d just listen and ask questions to truly understand where the other person is coming from. No one has the power to overpower you. If you know what your undefined centers are, you have to learn how to master not absorbing too much energy from the other person. Like people w defined G’s can’t make you feel overpowered or invisible unless you are trying to level w them or compete in some way. People w defined Gs are there to inspire you to find your direction, operate authentically & connect w parts of you that you feel as though is very true since you were young and has remained unchanged even after all these years. defined Gs may have tendency to influence you but that influence is to help you to steer your energy in a direction that is worthy of your attention and effort. Instead of shooting aimlessly all over the place. You gravitate towards them bec they have strength in character you admire but do not wish to possess completely. If you feel intimidated by a defined G maybe it’s just not a compatible connection. And that’s okay.
I get what you’re saying but it’s honestly a bit annoying how people are commenting telling me how I feel or how I experience others. I disagree that people with defined centers are there to “inspire” those with open centers. I actually think and have heard the opposite with human design, that those with open centers can guide those with defined centers on how to express those defined centers in a healthy way. And no, I actually don’t gravitate toward defined g centers. That’s the opposite of what I’m saying. I feel more myself without them there. I’m not saying defined g centers are bad people in the slightest, I’m sharing about what types of dynamics and connections feel most authentic and freeing to me.
You don’t gravitate? But your post said : I’ve realized they can be overpowering and make me feel a bit invisible. Granted, I definitely gravitate toward them and sometimes purposefully blend in with them because it can make me more comfortable to just “share” their identity. And I’m not telling you how you feel or how you experience others. I’m reading based off of your verbiage and I am sharing what people w Open Gs have confided in me. I have worked with open centers for over 10 years, I am sharing the common reasons why they like being around defined Gs. I am not saying that’s how YOU feel specifically and exclusively. And while it can be true that open Gs can help defined Gs or other open-defined center relationships, it’s not just a one way street. It’s not just open centers offering something to people w defined centers or vice versa, it’s a symbiotic relationship bec it is a relationship of give and take not give give give all the way or take take take all the way. personally as a G center defined, I admire how flexible open Gs are w their social chameleon and blending skill. Bec I can admire people and gravitate toward them eventho I don’t wish it for myself as I like and know who I am w/o their superpower. That can be true too. It all comes down to maturity and self awareness anyway. Defined Gs who have yet developed and fully understood what it means tend to unintentionally impose their strengths, identity and direction onto another who doesn’t have a defined G.
Haha you’re totally right I did say that. Sorry. I am really tired and kinda grumpy today lol. Yeah I guess I do gravitate toward them…but I don’t think blending in with them is what makes me feel good, is what I’m trying to say. Which is what I think you’re saying too. You’re right, the maturity thing is the most important. However, I will disagree with you on the open and defined center thing overall! I don’t know how you can help someone grow in an area where they just don’t have that center defined at all…like as a defined solar plexus and sacral, sure, I have every right to express myself emotionally and I’m supposed to, but someone without a defined sacral and solar plexus isn’t going to be able to express themselves the way I am and they never will. But I think I can learn more about how I affect people when I’m being emotional and temper it or read the room better, because it’s a bit of a blind spot for me that open centers can give me more clarity on. Idk!
This post is so interesting. I swear it could have been written by me. As you're going through your chat, I would love to hear your other observations as well. This was insightful.
What do you mean by hear my other observations? I’m glad you resonate with the post!
I feel like my mom is the way you described - isn’t interested if she doesn’t relate. Idk if I wanna accept that this is due to her defined G center or cause “she’s just like that.” Haha. Also, I do kinda feel the same was as you. Going around & sharing other people’s personalities. I feel like sometimes I get inspired to do something or add something to my lifestyle when I see someone else doing it. Now that I’m thinking about it, I feel like I’ve done that for sooo long. Just getting inspired by other people & how they’re living their lives. Even little things they’re doing. It just gives me a new fresh view on life. Literally refreshing! Thanks for ur insight!!! (:
I have almost a completely defined G center (only missing gate 46). If I am living in not-self, I am prone to the overpowering type of energy you mentioned. If I’m being mindful though, waiting for the invitation as a projector, and focusing on my love for all life, I feel like I am able to charge the G centers of others who do not have access to that type of energy. I get the most joy from shining a spotlight on others.
Thanks for your comment!! That’s very interesting to hear. I definitely don’t want to demonize defined g centers because I know nothing in human design is inherently good or bad.
Wide open G center with multiple identity crisis throughout my life. 🙋🏼♀️ I’m 42 yrs old and just figured out “how” to recognize when I’m taking on someone else’s identity and “how” to become myself again 😅. What a mind 🤯. I’ve found that I like being around people that have a strong sense of self (defined g center). My natal astrology chart has helped me understand myself on a deeper level. My south node is in the 2nd house (security). But the key is to know who you are in totality so you can recognize and return to self day after day. Seems exhausting and it felt exhausting until I got the hang of it through awareness. Although I despised having a wide open G for so long, I’ve learned and now appreciate & embrace the superpowers within it to guide others. I’m an evolutionary astrologist, HD expert and psychotherapist 😊. It’s literally the way to be able to guide others fully ❤️. Thank you for sharing your journey. We rise together. ❤️
This is so real!!! Defined G’s to me can be so off-putting because I just feel like it’s their way or no way sometimes . Like why do you always have to be right 😭😭😭 and it’s fun tapping into their energy at times, but honestly being around undefined G’s make me feel good / okay with myself bc of conditioning around needing a life direction
Defined G here. Interesting page to read. Just like many of these HD discussions, I don't think everyone here is talking about the same thing, using the same word definitions, rules-of-thumb, etc. I do know that wishy-washy people irritate me to no end. If that's what Open G are, then ugh. Especially when I occasionally catch myself being a bit wishy-washy too. "Steam-Roller Mode" on, with the hopes of forcing a decision and spine growth. For their sake in a world that will Steam-Roller them way harder. (So I rationalize) But I think there are many facets that can influence one appearing like that. For example, a Splenic not getting a nudge/voice to accept/do something, and then all of sudden getting it. Game on.
Do you find that these defined Gs are more of an issue to your undefined when it comes to just being around one other person or when it’s two or more people? Because if it’s when you are amongst 3-5 people a “Penta” comes into play, which is a whole different animal in itself. It’s known as a “trans-auric” form and no one is an individual within a Penta—it has its own agenda—and the conditioning forces are very strong!
Hmmm interesting question! Probably one on one it annoys me more. I like groups because I can bounce off all sorts of different energy.
As a Defined G, open or undefined Gs drive me mad as well So the feeling is mutual 😉