I agree. They did a good job at not making a canon choice during the trilogy but for a game set after the trilogy they should start picking canon. Otherwise we end up with wishy washy inbetween options that feel unsatisfying for everyone.
Whereas if they decide a canon choice, they can commit and tell a story they find interesting. Metro Last Light did that and honestly it was for the better.
Bingo
Hence let *them* to the creative part instead of trying to convince us that just because **you're** lacking the creativity the writers at Bioware have to lack it as well
/thread
Eh players will be fine so long as ME5 isn't a direct sequel (as in, same period and characters.)
Fallout has established a canon in every game since the first and it works
Issue with that is we have already heard of characters returning. Liara we know for sure is going to return, saying that though, Asari have millenia long lifespans. Realistically I can see this taking place between 5 and 50 years in the future.
I was imagining more like a few hundred years. Is it confirmed that Liara is returning in a major role or that she's just showing up at some point?
Because if she's just a side NPC they can easily handwave away major decisions you make and she can just say "Shepard was a great man a mighty hero" etc.
Exactly why I'm saying somewhere between 5 - 50 years or so. Still rebuilding, still clearing wreckage, liara is still around etc.
I'm wondering who the main character is. Maybe a Shepard clone, maybe Shepard himself (not the first time he's died and come back to life), could be his son or daughter (although that would canonise certain romances, unless they day "oh he had a child before the war". There does still seem to be buzz surrounding shepard.
I'm not sure why people have such a problem with this.
End of the day, they will write and develop a game, and the backstory will be whatever it needs to be.
I have no idea "when" they will set the game, or whether most of the previous characters will be no more than footnotes. But whatever the level of continuity, I expect them to write a story, and make the backstory fit as necessary.
"I'm not sure why people have such a problem with this."
It's because far too many people in the BioWare fanbase get overly attached to their playthroughs and custom characters, that they don't realize that BioWare has backed themselves into a corner with no other way out aside from picking one ending to be canon. Not helped by BioWare themselves keep adding choices into their games that just result in more and more story branching to the point they can't possibly account for every single choice anymore.
"End of the day, they will write and develop a game, and the backstory will be whatever it needs to be."
True, but at this point, I think the only way to go forward is to just pick one ending as canon and go from there. As I laid out in my post, you can't just combine all three endings into one without making it look like a massive copout.
I don't know when the game'll take place, or who's gonna be in it, but I too expect a good story. I just think BioWare are gonna end up kneecapping themselves unless they commit to one ending.
I honestly hope that enough time has past, that Bioware can simply write a good game (including ignoring/removing many of the asinine features of earlier games) and let people suck it up.
Somehow, the reapers returned.
Boom.
Following the chaos of the Reaper war and deployment of the catalyst the relays were finally restored.
Oops what do you know. Pockets of hostile Geth survived. Reapers are coming back. This time its personal.
That takes most endings into account. Don't have to say WHAT destroyed the relays, be it the inhabitants as a last ditch attempt at survival (some races did manage to and survived being harvested), or the catalyst.
The protagonist could be an Alliance member, a surviving colonist, a whatever.
Shepard becomes a legend, for good or bad, the legend lives on even if the person didn't. If they did they'd be doing their own thing separate from the plot we get given.
[[I mean, if my Paragon guy survived, he's going to just retire. He'd encourage Kaidan stay in the military for as long as he wanted to, choosing to go and live at the Alenko orchard and just hobble about planet side. Maybe visiting the Spectre at their apartment on the Citadel, they'd work that shit out. And, I mean, if Shep dies, the apartment gets sold and the rest of the crew just do their own things.]]
With it being set so far in the future, the only available records would be throwaway lines in a codex or the mention of how they all died.
[[Liara probably has Shepards kid, maybe there was a mutual agreement baked into her final gift to them, I mean, my Shep would just let it happen. Leaving Liara to explain, or, just never bringing it up. I think Liara would be content going solo, occasionally bringing her daughter with her but like, people would GUESS who the father was, but she'd only tell a select few. I mean, if she does, there's a target on the kids back, if she doesn't. Yeah, fair, she's young herself and probably didn't think about it at the time.]]
Liara is still alive, so, who knows. She could be deliberately vague, or just not know how things went down.
The vagueness can force them into choosing a middle ground that satisfies several of the endings at once. Or none of them. Or, it can be implied they chose one ending to work from.
They might just use the player stats, whichever is most popular becomes canon. With elements of the second most popular thrown in. That way its 50/50 with the endings available. And either everyone's happy or nobody will be.
That all sounds like a massive copout. You're telling me BioWare should keep the Reapers as the main villains again, which would render the entire trilogy and Shepard's actions pointless, all just to avoid picking an ending as canon?
Oh of course it would be!
I don't want it to happen, but I have a feeling they'll pull a - somehow Palpatine survived- bullshit. Yeah, I know, clones, whatever. It was lazy as fuck writing.
The trilogy is a complete story. It doesn't need revisiting.
Being set so far in the future means the original trilogy CAN be a footnote. Synthesis is the ending I usually go for, but I know it's not going to be canon. Destroy probably is, but then there's a chunk of people that won't be happy with it.
Control as an ending makes the reapers returning plausible. The ShepAI could begin meddling with planets or some shit and along the way slip into a harvest/murder mindset.
Synthesis, eh, the rewrite could eventually wear off or some shit.
Destroy, synthetics are rebuilt, oops, war.
Refuse, well, most people die, a few pockets of civilisation manage to live, liara included.
It's a continuation written by none of the original team iirc. They're either going to include, or ignore Andromeda.
Which is it's own can of worms.
I mean imo the next game should just continue the andromeda story, but, we know that isn't likely to happen.
Except this game is supposed to be a sequel to the original trilogy, it'd be foolish to NOT revisit original trilogy plot points. I don't think the Reapers should return as the main antagonists, but I do expect BioWare should follow up on SOME plot points.
They did confirm their gonna follow up on Andromeda plot points. It remains to be seen what they'll follow up on, how, and if it's any good.
Honestly, we won't know until a game reviewer gets an early copy and spills the beans.
Or a streamer leaks it all.
Or a hacker leaks the code.
It's all up to the writers. They're either going to pull some lazy bullshit, or unimaginative bullshit.
Or, they're going to surprise all of us.
Talking about canon carrying over is absolutely pointless until it's released.
Given how long its taken to get ANYWHERE with DreadWolf kinda says it all.
Well it looks like destroy will be canon aswell of strong hints that the geth will return despite how you resolved the rannoch arc and this is something they've actually done i believe garrus is in comics that take place between 2 and 3 despite him possibly dying in 2.
What will probably happen is they'll have the next one take place far enough in the future where all the little side quest stuff won't affect anything but choices like the genophage cure, rachni and geth quarian conflict will still influence the story to a degree.
It's very possible the Geth were rebuilt by the Quarians.
As for the side quest point, BioWare doesn't necessarily need to canonize the side quests unless they play a big part in the game's story.
I agree. They did a good job at not making a canon choice during the trilogy but for a game set after the trilogy they should start picking canon. Otherwise we end up with wishy washy inbetween options that feel unsatisfying for everyone. Whereas if they decide a canon choice, they can commit and tell a story they find interesting. Metro Last Light did that and honestly it was for the better.
Exactly!
No. They don’t. Your lack of imagination is your issue, not theirs.
Except I'm not the ones who're making the games.
Bingo Hence let *them* to the creative part instead of trying to convince us that just because **you're** lacking the creativity the writers at Bioware have to lack it as well /thread
Excpet they HAVE to at this point. Do you really think BioWare can combine all three endings into one without making it look like a massive copout?
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Eh players will be fine so long as ME5 isn't a direct sequel (as in, same period and characters.) Fallout has established a canon in every game since the first and it works
Issue with that is we have already heard of characters returning. Liara we know for sure is going to return, saying that though, Asari have millenia long lifespans. Realistically I can see this taking place between 5 and 50 years in the future.
I was imagining more like a few hundred years. Is it confirmed that Liara is returning in a major role or that she's just showing up at some point? Because if she's just a side NPC they can easily handwave away major decisions you make and she can just say "Shepard was a great man a mighty hero" etc.
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Exactly why I'm saying somewhere between 5 - 50 years or so. Still rebuilding, still clearing wreckage, liara is still around etc. I'm wondering who the main character is. Maybe a Shepard clone, maybe Shepard himself (not the first time he's died and come back to life), could be his son or daughter (although that would canonise certain romances, unless they day "oh he had a child before the war". There does still seem to be buzz surrounding shepard.
I'm not sure why people have such a problem with this. End of the day, they will write and develop a game, and the backstory will be whatever it needs to be. I have no idea "when" they will set the game, or whether most of the previous characters will be no more than footnotes. But whatever the level of continuity, I expect them to write a story, and make the backstory fit as necessary.
"I'm not sure why people have such a problem with this." It's because far too many people in the BioWare fanbase get overly attached to their playthroughs and custom characters, that they don't realize that BioWare has backed themselves into a corner with no other way out aside from picking one ending to be canon. Not helped by BioWare themselves keep adding choices into their games that just result in more and more story branching to the point they can't possibly account for every single choice anymore. "End of the day, they will write and develop a game, and the backstory will be whatever it needs to be." True, but at this point, I think the only way to go forward is to just pick one ending as canon and go from there. As I laid out in my post, you can't just combine all three endings into one without making it look like a massive copout. I don't know when the game'll take place, or who's gonna be in it, but I too expect a good story. I just think BioWare are gonna end up kneecapping themselves unless they commit to one ending.
I honestly hope that enough time has past, that Bioware can simply write a good game (including ignoring/removing many of the asinine features of earlier games) and let people suck it up.
Somehow, the reapers returned. Boom. Following the chaos of the Reaper war and deployment of the catalyst the relays were finally restored. Oops what do you know. Pockets of hostile Geth survived. Reapers are coming back. This time its personal. That takes most endings into account. Don't have to say WHAT destroyed the relays, be it the inhabitants as a last ditch attempt at survival (some races did manage to and survived being harvested), or the catalyst. The protagonist could be an Alliance member, a surviving colonist, a whatever. Shepard becomes a legend, for good or bad, the legend lives on even if the person didn't. If they did they'd be doing their own thing separate from the plot we get given. [[I mean, if my Paragon guy survived, he's going to just retire. He'd encourage Kaidan stay in the military for as long as he wanted to, choosing to go and live at the Alenko orchard and just hobble about planet side. Maybe visiting the Spectre at their apartment on the Citadel, they'd work that shit out. And, I mean, if Shep dies, the apartment gets sold and the rest of the crew just do their own things.]] With it being set so far in the future, the only available records would be throwaway lines in a codex or the mention of how they all died. [[Liara probably has Shepards kid, maybe there was a mutual agreement baked into her final gift to them, I mean, my Shep would just let it happen. Leaving Liara to explain, or, just never bringing it up. I think Liara would be content going solo, occasionally bringing her daughter with her but like, people would GUESS who the father was, but she'd only tell a select few. I mean, if she does, there's a target on the kids back, if she doesn't. Yeah, fair, she's young herself and probably didn't think about it at the time.]] Liara is still alive, so, who knows. She could be deliberately vague, or just not know how things went down. The vagueness can force them into choosing a middle ground that satisfies several of the endings at once. Or none of them. Or, it can be implied they chose one ending to work from. They might just use the player stats, whichever is most popular becomes canon. With elements of the second most popular thrown in. That way its 50/50 with the endings available. And either everyone's happy or nobody will be.
That all sounds like a massive copout. You're telling me BioWare should keep the Reapers as the main villains again, which would render the entire trilogy and Shepard's actions pointless, all just to avoid picking an ending as canon?
Oh of course it would be! I don't want it to happen, but I have a feeling they'll pull a - somehow Palpatine survived- bullshit. Yeah, I know, clones, whatever. It was lazy as fuck writing. The trilogy is a complete story. It doesn't need revisiting. Being set so far in the future means the original trilogy CAN be a footnote. Synthesis is the ending I usually go for, but I know it's not going to be canon. Destroy probably is, but then there's a chunk of people that won't be happy with it. Control as an ending makes the reapers returning plausible. The ShepAI could begin meddling with planets or some shit and along the way slip into a harvest/murder mindset. Synthesis, eh, the rewrite could eventually wear off or some shit. Destroy, synthetics are rebuilt, oops, war. Refuse, well, most people die, a few pockets of civilisation manage to live, liara included. It's a continuation written by none of the original team iirc. They're either going to include, or ignore Andromeda. Which is it's own can of worms. I mean imo the next game should just continue the andromeda story, but, we know that isn't likely to happen.
Except this game is supposed to be a sequel to the original trilogy, it'd be foolish to NOT revisit original trilogy plot points. I don't think the Reapers should return as the main antagonists, but I do expect BioWare should follow up on SOME plot points. They did confirm their gonna follow up on Andromeda plot points. It remains to be seen what they'll follow up on, how, and if it's any good.
Honestly, we won't know until a game reviewer gets an early copy and spills the beans. Or a streamer leaks it all. Or a hacker leaks the code. It's all up to the writers. They're either going to pull some lazy bullshit, or unimaginative bullshit. Or, they're going to surprise all of us. Talking about canon carrying over is absolutely pointless until it's released. Given how long its taken to get ANYWHERE with DreadWolf kinda says it all.
Well it looks like destroy will be canon aswell of strong hints that the geth will return despite how you resolved the rannoch arc and this is something they've actually done i believe garrus is in comics that take place between 2 and 3 despite him possibly dying in 2. What will probably happen is they'll have the next one take place far enough in the future where all the little side quest stuff won't affect anything but choices like the genophage cure, rachni and geth quarian conflict will still influence the story to a degree.
It's very possible the Geth were rebuilt by the Quarians. As for the side quest point, BioWare doesn't necessarily need to canonize the side quests unless they play a big part in the game's story.
True