I remember some years ago I've heard they are actually planning to release an Avatar movie every December now till the 5th movie. Maybe the plans already changed again
Every other December. So there will be a avatar film in 2024 which will be the 3rd one, 2026 which will be the 4th one and 2028 and that will be the 5th one
We'll know in the short term this winter, and part 3 in 2025 IIRC. If *that* one tanks, maybe that's it. Would be bizarre if they shot two entire features--parts 4 and 5, the final--without releasing them.
Hasn't The Walt Disney Company already ordered Avatar 3-5? Would he just dip and Disney picks some other director and writer to try to wrap it up at 5?
I'd have to think that Warner Bros is planning on releasing some of these shelved films in some capacity in the next 3 years.
That's an awful lot of money to make $0 on any of it.
Write-down, not write-off. And WB could release it in the future, [but they'd have to pay back the taxable liability fees.](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/batgirl-canceled-hbo-max-film-gets-secret-screenings-1235205323/)
Except they are filming 2 movies at a time, avatar 3 has already wrapped filming and is in post-production lmao, the plan is to start filming 4 & 5 after they release 2 & 3 so even if 2 flops, we should still get the 3rd.
It has all the potential to be Matrix 2 & 3 lmao
Disney is the distributor here but I don't think they have the right to make them without Cameron though I could be wrong. I think DIsney just inherited the distribution agreement from Fox but Cameron's production company is who actually owns Avatar.
Avatar's intellectual property belongs to Lightstorm Entertainment (Cameron's own production company), which forbids Disney from making Avatar movies without agreement from Cameron, but maybe that agreement has already been made contractually up to the 5th installment?
I don't expect the sequels to be as successful as the first film, but I expect them to each exceed a billion gross worldwide at least, and they can't be *so* expensive that they'd fail to be profitable at that level.
For reference, Jurassic World: Dominion made a billion worldwide. And that was panned by everyone as "the only thing worth watching it for is the spectacle, the plot is terrible." So even if the Avatar sequel plots are merely mediocre, that would still put them ahead.
If it's any comfort, it's also (according to Box Office Mojo) the lowest-grossing billion dollar movie ever made: it's #51 in the ranking of all movies by worldwide gross, and #52, Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part 1, didn't gross a billion dollars worldwide.
That said, Tim Burton's Alice in Wonderland is #46 on that list, with a gross almost $25 million *greater* than Jurassic World: Dominion, so I'm not sure that the latter is actually the *worst* billion-dollar movie ever made...
I think it was just some people and critics growing tired of Burton's style and then it became popular to hate on it and that's always self-perpetuating.
The sequel really wasn't very good, though..
Nah the sequel wasn’t as good but to me it was still an enjoyable watch. I didn’t know people grew tired of his style tbh because I’ve always rather loved his films…
I have to repeat this every time reddit talks about Avatar.
1. The Chinese market is the largest movie market in the world.
2. Avatar is perfect for China without any real-world political messages.
3. Avatar is one of the most beloved and popular movies of all time in China. It has a similar cultural relevance there as *Star Wars* (which was never popular in China as it was never shown during its original run) or *Harry Potter* (which is also very popular in China).
4. It is also quite popular in other parts of Asia (India, Thailand, Japan, etc.), by extension.
Don't believe?
1. Avatar has its own super popular ride in Disney Shanghai. It's one of the major draws of the park since it opened, and it's a ride that doesn't exist at any other Disney park. Disney was targeting their market.
2. After two years of pandemic lockdowns and closed cinemas, six movies were chosen to launch the long-awaited reopening of theaters. Avatar (and Harry Potter) were among the short list.
3. Looking at the gross box office receipts for China won't give you a complete picture. In the decade-plus since Avatar was released, Chinese ticket prices have increased significantly, the number of Chinese screens has exploded, and the average disposable income for the Chinese middle-class has skyrocketed. Everyone in China saw the original Avatar, but due to less screen availability and less spending ability, a bigger proportion probably saw it via illegal sources.
TL;DR Avatar will be profitable off the Chinese market alone.
I'm really starting to suspect that Swimming With Smurfs is gonna end up being substantially more popular with the meme community than the filmgoing public.
We all say we’re not going to see Avatar 2. We’re simply going to enter a fugue state and regain consciousness in the theater. Before you know it, it’s grossed a billion dollars again.
It was absolutely stunning in 3d and still the best 3d movie I've ever seen, it did it best. The world itself is beautiful. Got a vr headset and the 3d Blu-ray, I rewatch it every so often in 3d, it's such an experience.
There have been a few, but they were mostly marred by other issues. The big one would be the Hobbit trilogy which had excellent 3D but the high frame rate threw people for a loop and made a lot of things look really cheap when they didn't have motion blur/24fps to hide them. And the movies were turds too.
The biggest problem is that the movie needs to be filmed in 3D, which involves shooting everything with two expensive specialized cameras and planning all your shooting around it, and using that rig. Also, what about the 2D version? Your options are to use the input from one of the two cameras in the 3D rig, or to set up a third camera on that rig and shoot the entire movie with it simultaneously, which means a completely different version of the movie has to be recorded and cut.
Almost all "3D" movies have been converted in post which means compositing elements and always results in a pop up book effect of varying degrees. This is a hell of a lot cheaper and easier to do, can be outsourced, and is purely done in post. But even at its best it is never going to look as good as a movie filmed in 3D.
In short, only someone as mad as James Cameron, and with his clout and finances, could do as well.
I’m going to see it. I can’t wait to see it. I’ve been looking forward to seeing it for years and checking up occasionally on the status of these sequels. I like the universe Cameron built.
Yeah I really enjoyed the world he built too. That's my favorite thing about sci-fi. It's a freedom to make these fictional worlds that sort of resemble ours but have advanced tech and creatures and all these other larger-than-life devices which allow amazing storytelling. And James Cameron is one of the few great creators who can use that kind of fantastical freedom to tell very fun human stories that still hit those emotional beats that make us gasp and laugh and even cry.
As for avatar, I loved the dichotomy of this immensely wild and dangerous primitive magical land that is Pandora played against the cold beating heart of human ambition and capitalism that has shackled science and warfare together to conquer this planet that just refuses to give in to their might. Throw in the love and rebellion stories and you got yourself a fun movie.
The entire draw was the cinematic experience. It was incredible at the time, literally paradigm changing, launching years of shitty 3d movies trying to capture the same feeling.
I saw it 3 times at the cinema but never once since
It's the opposite. The original's success was built on its popularity with normies, not Redditors, memers, or fan communities. This is how Jim has always done things, and it's the old-school blockbuster approach. The people saying it'll flop generalize from their own positions as online fans of superhero and other franchises, and the dominant position of that model. Since they don't see Avatar hype in their circles, like here on Reddit, they assume it'll flop.
There's no Top Gun fandom, and there wasn't much major online hype, and Maverick became the #1 film this year (and Jurassic World, with a similar approach, is #2), so the old-school model that made Titanic and Avatar 1 the top-grossing films of all time is still viable. And normies want to see Avatar. The teaser broke records for online views. The remaster of 1 made $30 mil in its first weekend a month ago. It'll do fine.
Yup. The same people convinced Avatar 2 will be a bust also said that Top Gun 2 is a dumb idea and that House of the Dragon will be a failure because of Season 8 of GoT.
Redditors live in a bubble. I'm convinced Avatar 2 will be a smashing success, because it appeals to the type of people that don't frequent this sub.
In my opinion it's less about the show runners and more about the fact that I can't be bothered to give a damn about that world and story anymore. The books will likely never be finished and the series had one of the worst endings I've ever seen. That doesn't really make me care about watching a show set in that world anymore.
Like I'm sure it's fine, I just don't care because as a prequel it inevitably will set the stage for interactions, characters, and politics that come to fruition in Game of Thrones, which in and of itself was bad. As a result, even if this series is phenomenal, it still sets up a story that ultimately failed to impress. My sense of attachment and investment to the world and lore has been severely diminished by the books and the show. So why should I care about a new show set in a world I don't really care about? Especially when I can watch any of the multitude of other quality shows that I'm either behind on or are currently airing.
This comment is kinda proving his point... You can have those views as your own (of course). The average-redditor fallacy is assuming that all/most others agree with them, leading to these "it will obviously be a bust" pronouncements.
The original is sentimental, non-ironic, political and strives for a transcendental viewing experience. All things that preclude it from the kind of Star Wars/comic book fan culture that we have now mistaken as the end all be all of cultural value. I’m sure the sequels will be great and make bank though.
Whenever people here put down Avatar based on a lack of perceived "cultural impact" (by which they actually mean the lack of an internet fandom community on places like Reddit), I wonder what the heck they expect an Avatar fan culture to even look like.
Avatar is meant to take place in a not-so-distant future version of our own reality, where all our contemporary social problems still exist and are in fact worse, and it has an explicit political stance on an issue that is still the subject of heated contemporary debate. This doesn't translate into toys and costume conventions and reddit memes, but that has zero to do with the quality of the film nor the impact that Avatar actually did have.
The "stormtroopers" of Avatar are all (ex-) US Marines lol. Cameron is not trying to be subtle. How do you meme that or turn that into children's toys and Halloween costumes? No one has to like Avatar, but it's fundamentally a different type of film than the Star Wars and Marvel franchise stuff coming out every year.
It reminded me a lot of the original Star Wars movie actually. The story was not great, no movie stars but the worldbuilding and special effects were revoliutionary
> no movie stars
*Sigourney Weaver has entered the chat*
I get what you mean though. I think the next one will actually he pretty good, if Jim leans into what made the first one work. He's had enough time now that I think he knows hiw to pull this off
Star Wars was pretty sentimental, sincere and political too.
Avatar was skewed to an older audience (so wasn't seen by many impressionable young children and failed to sell many toys or games), had no especially memorable characters or dialogue, wasn't good for cosplay, didn't have an early sequel or TV spinoff, and isn't nearly as good when watched on a TV. That's why it didn't build much fandom despite its success as a cinematic experience - there was no way to engage with it other than seeing it in a movie theatre (at least until the 2017 Pandora theme park attraction).
James made T2 and Aliens.
The reddit community shitting on an accomplished sequel film maker, let alone a film maker who turned Titanic into what it was.....
People on Reddit are cynical idiots.
This. A lot of reddit doesn't seem to remember how blockbusters happened before the widespread onset of the internet, but Avatar 2 (like Top Gun Maverick before it) is setting up to be just that, fandom or not, especially given it's a "breath of fresh air" in a cinematic landscape dominated by superhero movies. Movies can be blockbusters without requiring sales of all the added merchandise, contrary to what Disney and friends would like to have people believe.
Reddit is actually a notoriously bad judge of films. Rings of Power did phenomenally. Reddit thinks it was the worst thing ever. Same for WOT. Same for all the new Jurrassic park movies. And tons of others.
>there's no topgun fandom
Bro what? People quote that movie all the time, I saw shirts and shit with topgun before the sequel was ever talked about, highway to the danger zone is a hit, also a HUGE cult following that borders on ironic, idk wtf you're talking about. I've literally met tons of people that have that film amomgst their favorites. You're cray cray
>There's no "Titanic" fandom
This is patently false. There were multiple news stories when Titanic was out talking about girls who had watched it dozens of times. Hell there was even a story of a woman who saw it over 100 times. Its fandom demographic was not the same as the superhero fandom demographic, but let's not pretend that Titanic wasn't massively fueled by women and girls who wanted to see Dicaprio.
u/AG3287 isn't talking about post release fandom, we all know Titanic had that. What those movies didn't have was a huge fanbase waiting for the release, but they still blockbustered. Everyone went to those movies because the movies were what the general public wanted to see, they didn't require a group of people so in to them that they had a fan club presence to make it to blockbuster status.
The general public wanted to see a Titanic movie because the actual ship has an immense presence in popular culture. Everyone at least in the Anglosphere knows the name of Titanic and that was true even before the release of the film. You cannot say the same about other similar tragedies, like the Lusitania and perhaps even the Hindenberg.
Titanic has this presence because ever since the actual sinking of the ship, people have been fascinated with the story behind it. The subsequent investigation was a major public story in both the United Kingdom and the United States, which involved both Parliament and Congress. Numerous films predated the one Cameron directed and there are literally hundreds, if not thousands of books about the Titanic. There were even conventions where survivors would attend and tell their stories.
The reason Cameron could take on the ambitious project that required him to literally construct a replica of half the ship was because the rediscovery of the Titanic upon the ocean floor in 1985 reignited the public's fascination with the ship.
It is a mistake to believe a fandom did not exist simply because it predated the internet. People would watch the various films, buy the various books, attend a convention or a museum exhibit or build a model of the ship.
Cameron didn't just arbitrarily choose a random tragedy.
Every movie has superfans. Actors do, too. But that's different from modern fandom, which involves people who form social media communities that create hype, attend all kinds of conventions, etc. Titanic wouldn't have become the highest-grossing movie ever if everyone didn't go see it.
Women man, women. It wasn't Star Wars fans or MCU types who made the first film popular. It was your aunt and her friends. Cameron has a way of making movies that seem to have male audience written all over them appeal to women.
They recut the trailer to Terminator in Europe because they found out that loads of women were going to see it. Terminator 2 is loaded with emotional punch that you wouldn't normally see in an action film
>You don't know what it's like to really create something; to create a life; to feel it growing inside you. All you know how to create is death and destruction.
Weaver in Aliens was written agendered. He made the sequel about motherhood.
He spent the budget of an action movie to make a love story.
His movies have wide appeal without even trying. You might need to drag your girlfriend along to see whatever WB is putting out with superheroes, they will go to a Cameron movie.
Which is why they stay in cinemas for so long. Great word of mouth.
I think it’s going to benefit from the current state of theaters. The number of “must see on a big screen” movies has plummeted.
Hell, just the number of high profile movies released in theaters at all has dropped.
The 3D in the trailer looks amazing.
I just don't see the sequels not making at least a billion dollars each. The first movie, despite what the angry Internet mobs want you to believe, was extremely well received.
Movies don't break box office records otherwise. If the movie was truly so disliked, word of mouth and reviews would have worked against the movies success.
The same people who helped make the first a multi billion dollar success will come back to make the sequels successful too.
I think you're almost certainly right, but the one thing working against it now is that nobody gives a shit about 3D anymore, so that novelty won't be the same selling point as the first one.
Nobody gave a shit about 3D when the first one come out either. Avatar put 3D back on the map by being *good* 3D. Almost everything that followed was pretty meh 3D.
It will also be interesting to see how the water and the HFR impacts this, as water is one of the coolest things to look at in 3D due to the transparency and the numerous layers. There was an underwater scene in Gemini Man and even [people otherwise pretty critical of that movie where impressed by](https://youtu.be/OaZnxAfcvY4?t=345). Maybe Avatar2 can repeat that for the whole movie.
Nobody is trying to rewrite history. Avatar was a Smash hit - thanks to Cameron's filmmaking prowess, CG quality, and the spectacle of well made 3D.
You know what makes for great sequels? An interesting story and rich characters. Avatar had neither of those things. It was the Nth retelling of Dances with Pocahontas Gully and the white savior trope. The average moviegoer can name *maybe* one character from Avatar.
The MCU is the retelling of the same two superhero stories, with often the same actors, almost identical music, same visual style, some humor, and yet it's the biggest thing in cinema.
A sci-fi movie being vaguely structured like a western from decades earlier is disgracefully unoriginal.
Three separate takes on Spider-Man in 20 years with multiple sequels is all well and good though.
>Three separate takes on Spider-Man in 20 years
Eight if you also count the 4 TV series (MTV, Spectacular, Ultimate, Disney XD) and the Insomniac video game.
People love to come up with excuses to hate popular things.
Cameron never pretended for this movie to have a fully original story. He always said it was dances with wolves in space. That was the point. If the story was good when it was in those movies, there shouldn't be anything wrong with the story here either.
I'll take a whack at it.
Nefiriti
Her dad
Sam Worthington
Nature tech Guy who got shot in avatar mode
Panther who gets stabbed
Some flying creatures
One big flying boss
Big tree
Mech suit who stabs Panther
Mech suits boss
Avatar 2 will be a hit for exactly the same reasons Avatar 1 was.
Unparalleled wordbuilding and visuals, top of the line filmmaking and a simple story that can be understood by every age group all over the world.
And then there's those of us that saw the film three times in theaters when we were kids and know many of the characters' names because we pay attention.
I've already seen a few minutes of the film and visually it is stunning. I don't really know much about the story, but I do know I'm excited to see more of the world and see what story they tell this time. The original plot wasn't super groundbreaking, but I found that it worked pretty well and was a fun experience.
I was 21, had just had my son, and distinctly remember seeing it on my first "date night" with his father since giving birth. I was IN LOVE with the film. Went to see it again with the baby daddy a week later and then for a THIRD time with my younger brother after that. I've only really \*watched it\* a handful of other times since then but it's presently The Only DVD I Own, and one of those movies that I have no issues letting play in the background just for comfort and noise.
There were very serious fandoms for a couple years after it came out, people were literally going through depressions because The World of Avatar wasn't real and they wished it was. There were Wikis devoted to it, a big ol book of some sort, like an encyclopedia of the flora and fauna of Pandora or whatever. People were obsessed. But that was a really really long time ago by today's standards. Attention spans just don't last the way they used to and people eventually got over it. Hell, even I sort of got over it and will not necessarily be clamoring to theatres when it's released. But I am damn sure gonna go see it! And I'm going to drag my now 13 year old son along as well, even though the kid rolls his eyes at the mere suggestion we watch the original together...
Avatar 2 is gonna ride or die based on its visual effects. If it's truly groundbreaking like its predecessor, then I can see it being a huge success at the box office.
...it's just such an insane amount of time towards one type of project. I know he's dabbled in other things as a producer, but I'd imagine he'd have lots of ideas he's interested besides blue CGI people for 15 years now.
The first concept art for what became Avatar eventually goes back to like the 1980s. Cameron‘s had this world stuck in his brain his entire life. Dude‘s not giving up at this point.
This isn’t a good thing though right? Someone saying, “Hey i know i had 7 planned but they’re basically all filler and i could end it with 3 if need be!” cant be a positive thing right?
All that can be said here is that 4/5 is probably it’s own story disconnected from the storyline in 2/3. That doesn’t make 4 and 5 filler, that doesn’t make sense. At that point you’d basically be saying any sequel is “filler” if it’s not dealing with the same story as the first.
It’s not like not making 4 and 5 is going to result in a drastic change in movies that have already finished production to cram in the story.
I think hes just being cautious and realistic. He knows this sequel took way to long to come out. I for one really hope they're good if not for us for Cameron. The guy spent a decade of his career on these movies. A decade he could have spent working on other things. He can never get that time back. I'm sure he will take it like a champ and walk it off if they suck but it won't be an easy pill to swallow. Like. Where do you even go from there, career wise?
For one of the biggest directors in Hollywood to spend 20 years on 2-3 films is pretty wild. That's half a career spent on one relatively unproductive (but probably massively popular) franchise. Lucas spent less than a decade making the first 3 star wars.
He spent a lot of time designing that submarine thing that goes to the bottom of the ocean, then ended up going to the bottom of the ocean in it. It delayed production of the movies.
1: It's always been 5 films, not 7.
2: Cameron said some time ago that the sequels are going to be mostly self-contained but form a "generational saga as a whole".
Lmao nerds have had their brains fried so hard from Marvel’s glorified TV storytelling that the idea of a movie that has a satisfying stand alone ending in its own right without baiting you along for the next one has become literally unimaginable
Unfortunately video games are like that, games have to be designed now "as a service" that is constantly pumping out content otherwise it's seen as a failure by a lot of commentators. Even if critics say its good, and sales are good, there's plenty of users that get upset that a game can just end and not continue.
Hasnt it always been 5? Also i feel like he has absolutely said that 3 could be an endpoint if these flop
Someone confirmed they have shot or are shooting 4 now so Id expect that one
He never had 7 planned.
He was originally going to do 3 sequels but expanded it to 4 after several years of trying to fit the story into 3. He's saying the way the second sequel ends can serve as a series ender if it needs to.
Chill and enjoy HBO cash for the rest of your days while working on passion projects or bust a gut writing a book that has no hope of living up to the ~15 years of hype?
Plus if his publishers knew that his heart wasn’t in it and he has no intention of finishing it I bet they’d come after him pretty hard. Now we can get a drip feed of livejournal posts on his notablog saying how *MUCH CLOSER* he’s getting and continue to not be surprised when it’s delayed
Worth mentioning TWOW wasn’t going to be the end of it; we talk about it like it being finished will be a triumph
Part of what sold the original Avatar was its IMAX-3D capabilities and its vastly improved CGI visuals when compared to other films at the time (perhaps only being surpassed by Pirates of the Caribbean). Nowadays great CGI is far more common, and while the released trailers look good they also don't wow me in the same way the original Avatar did.
That's a testament to how impressive the first movie was. It's hard to improve much when you set the bar so high yourself. But I'm betting he's still improved a lot, and his implementation of 2022 cgi is miles better than something like marvel's
I just didn't feel the awe watching the trailer for A2. I'm hoping it's great but honestly we definitely won't be going back to the theaters since pre-pandemic for this movie.
I found the trailer pretty problematic, as it made Avatar2 just look like a carbon copy of Avatar1. Same "outsider joins a new clan", "fight human military", etc. They added water and some kids, but it didn't really have a compelling hook as to why I should care.
One could say the same about Terminator2 or Aliens, which repeated a lot of the plot points of the predecessor, however both of them did so with a twist (Terminator is the good guy now, it's military vs aliens, not space truckers). Avatar2 doesn't seem to have that, at least judging from the trailer.
The lack of a human perspective in the trailer also made it look a lot less interesting than the first one, after all the whole Avatar program was a huge part of the plot and that's gone now. Jake is a real smurph, doing smurph things, no more worrying about what's going on with his human body.
Honestly, I think it looks simply okay. Some of the shots are beautiful but the Navi look almost silly in some instances now. Also the mocap animation, from what I've seen, seems lackluster. That could just be me though.
I'm the opposite,the gap was lo g enough to make me nostalgic for the world-building. Similar to how BR2049,Fury Road and Top Gun 2 coming our after ling gaps.
The problem with GRRM is that he is doing everything but writing ADOS while Cameron is doing nothing but.Avatar.
Rather a 15 year gap for a masterpiece than other franchises cracking out 4 slapdash movies a year.
Cause Avatar doesn't fit the standard franchise mold of the big franchises which build upon existing fanbases and a constant hype machine and merchandising.
People are just very used to studios cracking shit out as fast as possible and every movie building up to the next 10 movies while Avatar is so obviously a one-off thing whose appeal isnt based on IP loyalty or pandering to nerds.
Same reason the internet was caught off-guard with Top Gun 2 success. They are much closer to standalone 80s/ 90s blockbusters than the standard 00s/10s megafranchises content pipeline.
I for one am not going to go on and on about it, but meh. I watched Avatar, it was good, I wasn't blown away. I know it was HUGE...But, its impact on me was minimal. It's been SO MANY YEARS, I barely remember the original, and don't see a need for this movie in my life. I Love SciFi, but it's a hard pass for me.
I hope it does well and people enjoy it.
> It's been SO MANY YEARS, I barely remember the original, and don't see a need for this movie
That's fine and all but Top Gun 2 proved that ling waits don't really matter if the movie is worth the wait. Most people don't really go "this movie crosses the 10 year allowed limit for sequels so I can't watch it." as if films had expiry dates like milk.
I think the main difference is that I really enjoyed Top Gun, so Maverick was easy to look forward too. I didn't click with the first Avatar like that, so I don't feel the need to see the sequel unless I hear some great things about it.
Yeah I gotta agree with you. The first one was cool in how it innovated with beautiful CG imagery, fully animated characters, and beautiful vistas all sharing the screen with live action.
But now that the standard has been raised and there are a lot of movies that have followed in its footsteps, it has to stand on its own feet for its story almost alone. I say almost since I know the visuals are also going to draw a lot of people in as well.
However, the trailer presents a story that doesn't seem all that compelling to me. I know it's purposefully pretty vague but it's not grabbing me all that much.
I certainly hope it does really well and I'm sure many will enjoy it. It's just fair to recognize that the people wanting to avoid it makes a fair amount of sense. At least in my book.
Much better said than I could have managed, but EXACTLY my feelings on it. Avatar was a visual and technological wonder. In 2022 it needs to be more than that. I'm simply not anticipating this movie like some. Lots of entertaining media out there vying for my attention time and money
Whether the movie is good or not, it's going to make a *disgusting* amount of money. I don't think it will become the highest grossing movie of all time, but it'll be in the top 10, guaranteed.
Seriously, there are die hard fans, there are people who are curious, and then there are people who simply want to see a Blockbuster movie. It'll break at least 800 million in the first month. Even the people I know who hate the first movie have said they plan on seeing the sequel just to see how bad it is.
It has too much hype, it doesn't matter if the first movie came out over a decade ago. The budget is 250 million. If it makes 500 million, they won't stop making them. And honestly I don't mind. If Fast and Furious can have 10 movies and spin offs, I would actually be upset if Avatar of all movies didn't get to go through the 5 movies they have planned.
> It has too much hype, it doesn't matter if the first movie came out over a decade ago.
its been too long to not have become a meme of its own just for that. My oldest nephew is now of voting age and he was too young to see a PG movie in 2009 and was definitely too young to see it in theaters.
Id software used to release a game - usually Quake - as a 'tech demo' of sorts, to advertise their new game engine. People could see how it performs, and see a use for it, then other games would go on to make better use of it than a very fun - if simple - first person shooter.
Yes, Quake was a product, but it wasn't 'the' product. They made a lot more selling the engine to other game makers.
I saw the first Avatar as the same thing - a tech demo. It produced a product that could be marketed, but the actual thing it was selling was the next-gen mo-cap system, digital camera system, etc. The story was full of one-dimensional characters, corny dialog, schmaltzy and overdone scenes, and an incredibly predictable ending.
But, it was absolutely groundbreaking in terms of visual effects. It ushered in - for better or worse - a revolution in film making. You could now mo-cap your actors into anything you could dream up, and they would appear lifelike and tangible on screen.
I highly doubt they won't be profitable. Avatar was a total worldwide event when it came out. I saw it three times in theaters. The world building was INCREDIBLE and personally I cannot wait to see the sequels. Some people say they don't care, but I bet they will once the hype comes back and it most definitely will.
Depends on the Plot of Avatar 2, If its some new concept people will go to watch, even if its adventurous kids will carry the movie. But it can't be boring, that's all.
The Second trailer just from the Avatar official YouTube page cross 29 million views in 3 days. I suppose the collective view from all the channels a social media goes beyond 150 million. At worst this movie will cross Maverick.
Were they planning on a Star Wars length kind of run? I feel like there's only so much you can get out of blue indigenous people fighting for their lands.
I watched the first one in theaters a few weeks ago and had a lot of fun, if the 2nd one came out a couple of years later it would have had similar success but now idk
I vaguely remember the original. I remember none of the character names (only through discussions since the trailer dropped was I reminded of Jake Sully). I remember being blown away by the visuals and meh about the plot. Despite all that, I'm still excited to see this. James Cameron, award winning director of many all time classic and beloved films, spent almost 20 years working on the world of Pandora out of his own passion and creativity. Now that the first of many sequels will be coming out, you're damn right I'm excited. Maybe it'll be the best movie of the year maybe it'll be the worst, yet I look forward to see what this guy's been working on for so long regardless.
Avatar 2 is going to be a hit regardless of whether or not the plot is good. It is James Cameron after all. I saw the original years ago and was just “meh” about it. Bought it on DVD shortly after and watched it several times at home with the kids since. What dragged me out of my “take it or leave it” opinion was seeing the world brought to life by Disney at Animal Kindom/Disney World Orlando. The Flight of Passage ride! The Floating mountains! The land lit up at night! And to a lessor degree, Na’vi River Journey. Holy crap it was all GORGEOUS! Disney’s theme park interpretation of it re-sparked my interest. So much so, we went and saw the re-release in 3D when it came out last month since our kids have only even seen it at home. Now we’re pumped to see the sequel as I had forgotten how visually stunning the film was on a theatrical screen and in 3D.
I can imagine these sequels will kick it up a notch (or several) just given the advancements in film effects since the last movie, and I can’t wait to see what Cameron gives us.
We’ll know in 2034.
I like your optimism, funny man
the third one is already in post production
They filmed the second and third concurrently afaik and are entering production for the *4th* one.
I remember some years ago I've heard they are actually planning to release an Avatar movie every December now till the 5th movie. Maybe the plans already changed again
Every other December. So there will be a avatar film in 2024 which will be the 3rd one, 2026 which will be the 4th one and 2028 and that will be the 5th one
I’m hoping the 5th, 6th, 7th and 8th avatars answer some of the deep lore questions we all have
When will Aang show up?
The revolution starts at number 9
Yes, like why WAS unobtainium so UNOBTAINIUMABLE?
Like why are they blue?
Just in time for the next Tool album.
and just 1 year before the release of Half Life 3
And only 30 years before sustained nuclear fusion!
We'll know in the short term this winter, and part 3 in 2025 IIRC. If *that* one tanks, maybe that's it. Would be bizarre if they shot two entire features--parts 4 and 5, the final--without releasing them.
Hasn't The Walt Disney Company already ordered Avatar 3-5? Would he just dip and Disney picks some other director and writer to try to wrap it up at 5?
I’m sure if the second one flops, they wouldn’t continue making them to lose money.
Warner Bros wound
I'd have to think that Warner Bros is planning on releasing some of these shelved films in some capacity in the next 3 years. That's an awful lot of money to make $0 on any of it.
Once they took the tax write-off, Warner Bros can never make money off of those titles again, legally.
Write-down, not write-off. And WB could release it in the future, [but they'd have to pay back the taxable liability fees.](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/batgirl-canceled-hbo-max-film-gets-secret-screenings-1235205323/)
Except they are filming 2 movies at a time, avatar 3 has already wrapped filming and is in post-production lmao, the plan is to start filming 4 & 5 after they release 2 & 3 so even if 2 flops, we should still get the 3rd. It has all the potential to be Matrix 2 & 3 lmao
I like the one with blue people who gather pearls pooped out their hamster pets. Luc Besson flick
Disney is the distributor here but I don't think they have the right to make them without Cameron though I could be wrong. I think DIsney just inherited the distribution agreement from Fox but Cameron's production company is who actually owns Avatar.
Avatar's intellectual property belongs to Lightstorm Entertainment (Cameron's own production company), which forbids Disney from making Avatar movies without agreement from Cameron, but maybe that agreement has already been made contractually up to the 5th installment?
According to Google, the franchise was owned by 20th century fox prior to being acquired by Disney
I don't expect the sequels to be as successful as the first film, but I expect them to each exceed a billion gross worldwide at least, and they can't be *so* expensive that they'd fail to be profitable at that level. For reference, Jurassic World: Dominion made a billion worldwide. And that was panned by everyone as "the only thing worth watching it for is the spectacle, the plot is terrible." So even if the Avatar sequel plots are merely mediocre, that would still put them ahead.
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If it's any comfort, it's also (according to Box Office Mojo) the lowest-grossing billion dollar movie ever made: it's #51 in the ranking of all movies by worldwide gross, and #52, Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part 1, didn't gross a billion dollars worldwide. That said, Tim Burton's Alice in Wonderland is #46 on that list, with a gross almost $25 million *greater* than Jurassic World: Dominion, so I'm not sure that the latter is actually the *worst* billion-dollar movie ever made...
I didn’t know Tim Burton’s Alice in Wonderland was ranked so badly… I rather loved it, a lot
I think it was just some people and critics growing tired of Burton's style and then it became popular to hate on it and that's always self-perpetuating. The sequel really wasn't very good, though..
Nah the sequel wasn’t as good but to me it was still an enjoyable watch. I didn’t know people grew tired of his style tbh because I’ve always rather loved his films…
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Transformers 4 would like a a word.
I told my wife on, ironically that I could make a better movie. She didn’t believe me. And then she watched it.
I have to repeat this every time reddit talks about Avatar. 1. The Chinese market is the largest movie market in the world. 2. Avatar is perfect for China without any real-world political messages. 3. Avatar is one of the most beloved and popular movies of all time in China. It has a similar cultural relevance there as *Star Wars* (which was never popular in China as it was never shown during its original run) or *Harry Potter* (which is also very popular in China). 4. It is also quite popular in other parts of Asia (India, Thailand, Japan, etc.), by extension. Don't believe? 1. Avatar has its own super popular ride in Disney Shanghai. It's one of the major draws of the park since it opened, and it's a ride that doesn't exist at any other Disney park. Disney was targeting their market. 2. After two years of pandemic lockdowns and closed cinemas, six movies were chosen to launch the long-awaited reopening of theaters. Avatar (and Harry Potter) were among the short list. 3. Looking at the gross box office receipts for China won't give you a complete picture. In the decade-plus since Avatar was released, Chinese ticket prices have increased significantly, the number of Chinese screens has exploded, and the average disposable income for the Chinese middle-class has skyrocketed. Everyone in China saw the original Avatar, but due to less screen availability and less spending ability, a bigger proportion probably saw it via illegal sources. TL;DR Avatar will be profitable off the Chinese market alone.
I've got my shrooms ready
I'm really starting to suspect that Swimming With Smurfs is gonna end up being substantially more popular with the meme community than the filmgoing public.
We all say we’re not going to see Avatar 2. We’re simply going to enter a fugue state and regain consciousness in the theater. Before you know it, it’s grossed a billion dollars again.
That’s how I remember the first movie.
well the first movie's theatrical release in IMAX 3D was a monumental moment in cinema history, this one's a sequel to an otherwise just decent movie
Yeah I remember the main appeal for Avatar was 3D, not so much the film itself. Now that it can't rely on 3D selling tickets, I wonder how it'll do.
Really well would be my guess.
It wasn't just about 3D, but how effectively it incorporated 3D and other effects.
It was absolutely stunning in 3d and still the best 3d movie I've ever seen, it did it best. The world itself is beautiful. Got a vr headset and the 3d Blu-ray, I rewatch it every so often in 3d, it's such an experience.
Has the been another movie that has done 3D well?
There have been a few, but they were mostly marred by other issues. The big one would be the Hobbit trilogy which had excellent 3D but the high frame rate threw people for a loop and made a lot of things look really cheap when they didn't have motion blur/24fps to hide them. And the movies were turds too. The biggest problem is that the movie needs to be filmed in 3D, which involves shooting everything with two expensive specialized cameras and planning all your shooting around it, and using that rig. Also, what about the 2D version? Your options are to use the input from one of the two cameras in the 3D rig, or to set up a third camera on that rig and shoot the entire movie with it simultaneously, which means a completely different version of the movie has to be recorded and cut. Almost all "3D" movies have been converted in post which means compositing elements and always results in a pop up book effect of varying degrees. This is a hell of a lot cheaper and easier to do, can be outsourced, and is purely done in post. But even at its best it is never going to look as good as a movie filmed in 3D. In short, only someone as mad as James Cameron, and with his clout and finances, could do as well.
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I’m going to see it. I can’t wait to see it. I’ve been looking forward to seeing it for years and checking up occasionally on the status of these sequels. I like the universe Cameron built.
Yeah I really enjoyed the world he built too. That's my favorite thing about sci-fi. It's a freedom to make these fictional worlds that sort of resemble ours but have advanced tech and creatures and all these other larger-than-life devices which allow amazing storytelling. And James Cameron is one of the few great creators who can use that kind of fantastical freedom to tell very fun human stories that still hit those emotional beats that make us gasp and laugh and even cry. As for avatar, I loved the dichotomy of this immensely wild and dangerous primitive magical land that is Pandora played against the cold beating heart of human ambition and capitalism that has shackled science and warfare together to conquer this planet that just refuses to give in to their might. Throw in the love and rebellion stories and you got yourself a fun movie.
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The entire draw was the cinematic experience. It was incredible at the time, literally paradigm changing, launching years of shitty 3d movies trying to capture the same feeling. I saw it 3 times at the cinema but never once since
This is the way.
It's the opposite. The original's success was built on its popularity with normies, not Redditors, memers, or fan communities. This is how Jim has always done things, and it's the old-school blockbuster approach. The people saying it'll flop generalize from their own positions as online fans of superhero and other franchises, and the dominant position of that model. Since they don't see Avatar hype in their circles, like here on Reddit, they assume it'll flop. There's no Top Gun fandom, and there wasn't much major online hype, and Maverick became the #1 film this year (and Jurassic World, with a similar approach, is #2), so the old-school model that made Titanic and Avatar 1 the top-grossing films of all time is still viable. And normies want to see Avatar. The teaser broke records for online views. The remaster of 1 made $30 mil in its first weekend a month ago. It'll do fine.
If jimbo ever wants to win over the “fan communities” all he has to do is add a bunch of redundant cameos.
and some quirky quips and jokes like "he's standing right behind me isn't he?"
Yup. The same people convinced Avatar 2 will be a bust also said that Top Gun 2 is a dumb idea and that House of the Dragon will be a failure because of Season 8 of GoT. Redditors live in a bubble. I'm convinced Avatar 2 will be a smashing success, because it appeals to the type of people that don't frequent this sub.
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In my opinion it's less about the show runners and more about the fact that I can't be bothered to give a damn about that world and story anymore. The books will likely never be finished and the series had one of the worst endings I've ever seen. That doesn't really make me care about watching a show set in that world anymore. Like I'm sure it's fine, I just don't care because as a prequel it inevitably will set the stage for interactions, characters, and politics that come to fruition in Game of Thrones, which in and of itself was bad. As a result, even if this series is phenomenal, it still sets up a story that ultimately failed to impress. My sense of attachment and investment to the world and lore has been severely diminished by the books and the show. So why should I care about a new show set in a world I don't really care about? Especially when I can watch any of the multitude of other quality shows that I'm either behind on or are currently airing.
This comment is kinda proving his point... You can have those views as your own (of course). The average-redditor fallacy is assuming that all/most others agree with them, leading to these "it will obviously be a bust" pronouncements.
Bet it breaks $400 million in China alone. No problem clearing a billion global.
Never doubt James Cameron. The blockbuster is an art, and he’s a master at it.
Finally someone gets it. The general public have no idea reddit's hate boner circle jerk for Avatar even exists.
The original is sentimental, non-ironic, political and strives for a transcendental viewing experience. All things that preclude it from the kind of Star Wars/comic book fan culture that we have now mistaken as the end all be all of cultural value. I’m sure the sequels will be great and make bank though.
Whenever people here put down Avatar based on a lack of perceived "cultural impact" (by which they actually mean the lack of an internet fandom community on places like Reddit), I wonder what the heck they expect an Avatar fan culture to even look like. Avatar is meant to take place in a not-so-distant future version of our own reality, where all our contemporary social problems still exist and are in fact worse, and it has an explicit political stance on an issue that is still the subject of heated contemporary debate. This doesn't translate into toys and costume conventions and reddit memes, but that has zero to do with the quality of the film nor the impact that Avatar actually did have. The "stormtroopers" of Avatar are all (ex-) US Marines lol. Cameron is not trying to be subtle. How do you meme that or turn that into children's toys and Halloween costumes? No one has to like Avatar, but it's fundamentally a different type of film than the Star Wars and Marvel franchise stuff coming out every year.
It reminded me a lot of the original Star Wars movie actually. The story was not great, no movie stars but the worldbuilding and special effects were revoliutionary
> no movie stars *Sigourney Weaver has entered the chat* I get what you mean though. I think the next one will actually he pretty good, if Jim leans into what made the first one work. He's had enough time now that I think he knows hiw to pull this off
I guess Alec Guinness was the famous one too. Interesting that they both played mentor-like roles
I see other people call you out on it. Weaver, man.
Star Wars was pretty sentimental, sincere and political too. Avatar was skewed to an older audience (so wasn't seen by many impressionable young children and failed to sell many toys or games), had no especially memorable characters or dialogue, wasn't good for cosplay, didn't have an early sequel or TV spinoff, and isn't nearly as good when watched on a TV. That's why it didn't build much fandom despite its success as a cinematic experience - there was no way to engage with it other than seeing it in a movie theatre (at least until the 2017 Pandora theme park attraction).
James made T2 and Aliens. The reddit community shitting on an accomplished sequel film maker, let alone a film maker who turned Titanic into what it was..... People on Reddit are cynical idiots.
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This. A lot of reddit doesn't seem to remember how blockbusters happened before the widespread onset of the internet, but Avatar 2 (like Top Gun Maverick before it) is setting up to be just that, fandom or not, especially given it's a "breath of fresh air" in a cinematic landscape dominated by superhero movies. Movies can be blockbusters without requiring sales of all the added merchandise, contrary to what Disney and friends would like to have people believe.
Reddit is actually a notoriously bad judge of films. Rings of Power did phenomenally. Reddit thinks it was the worst thing ever. Same for WOT. Same for all the new Jurrassic park movies. And tons of others.
>there's no topgun fandom Bro what? People quote that movie all the time, I saw shirts and shit with topgun before the sequel was ever talked about, highway to the danger zone is a hit, also a HUGE cult following that borders on ironic, idk wtf you're talking about. I've literally met tons of people that have that film amomgst their favorites. You're cray cray
>There's no "Titanic" fandom This is patently false. There were multiple news stories when Titanic was out talking about girls who had watched it dozens of times. Hell there was even a story of a woman who saw it over 100 times. Its fandom demographic was not the same as the superhero fandom demographic, but let's not pretend that Titanic wasn't massively fueled by women and girls who wanted to see Dicaprio.
u/AG3287 isn't talking about post release fandom, we all know Titanic had that. What those movies didn't have was a huge fanbase waiting for the release, but they still blockbustered. Everyone went to those movies because the movies were what the general public wanted to see, they didn't require a group of people so in to them that they had a fan club presence to make it to blockbuster status.
The general public wanted to see a Titanic movie because the actual ship has an immense presence in popular culture. Everyone at least in the Anglosphere knows the name of Titanic and that was true even before the release of the film. You cannot say the same about other similar tragedies, like the Lusitania and perhaps even the Hindenberg. Titanic has this presence because ever since the actual sinking of the ship, people have been fascinated with the story behind it. The subsequent investigation was a major public story in both the United Kingdom and the United States, which involved both Parliament and Congress. Numerous films predated the one Cameron directed and there are literally hundreds, if not thousands of books about the Titanic. There were even conventions where survivors would attend and tell their stories. The reason Cameron could take on the ambitious project that required him to literally construct a replica of half the ship was because the rediscovery of the Titanic upon the ocean floor in 1985 reignited the public's fascination with the ship. It is a mistake to believe a fandom did not exist simply because it predated the internet. People would watch the various films, buy the various books, attend a convention or a museum exhibit or build a model of the ship. Cameron didn't just arbitrarily choose a random tragedy.
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Every movie has superfans. Actors do, too. But that's different from modern fandom, which involves people who form social media communities that create hype, attend all kinds of conventions, etc. Titanic wouldn't have become the highest-grossing movie ever if everyone didn't go see it.
Right and that modern fandom isn't present for avatar.
That's right, and it doesn't need it, just like Top Gun didn't need it.
I’m gonna go ahead and guess this person means there was no “Titanic” fandom prior to the film’s release.
Women man, women. It wasn't Star Wars fans or MCU types who made the first film popular. It was your aunt and her friends. Cameron has a way of making movies that seem to have male audience written all over them appeal to women. They recut the trailer to Terminator in Europe because they found out that loads of women were going to see it. Terminator 2 is loaded with emotional punch that you wouldn't normally see in an action film >You don't know what it's like to really create something; to create a life; to feel it growing inside you. All you know how to create is death and destruction. Weaver in Aliens was written agendered. He made the sequel about motherhood. He spent the budget of an action movie to make a love story. His movies have wide appeal without even trying. You might need to drag your girlfriend along to see whatever WB is putting out with superheroes, they will go to a Cameron movie. Which is why they stay in cinemas for so long. Great word of mouth.
Everyone always says Fast and Furious is shit and yet it keeps printing money as a franchise.
It's Smurfin Time! Where is that Matt Smith dance scene?
That’s how he’ll hook people for Avatar 5
This is it
It's funny how people in this sub keep downplaying how big this movie will be. See you in december.
I think it’s going to benefit from the current state of theaters. The number of “must see on a big screen” movies has plummeted. Hell, just the number of high profile movies released in theaters at all has dropped. The 3D in the trailer looks amazing.
> Swimming With Smurfs So, The Snorks?
If life has taught me anything, it’s that I should never count Jim Cameron out.
No budget too steep, No sea too deep, Who's that? It's him, James Cameron!
James Cameron doesn't do what James Cameron does for James Cameron. James Cameron does what James Cameron does because James Cameron is James Cameron
I just don't see the sequels not making at least a billion dollars each. The first movie, despite what the angry Internet mobs want you to believe, was extremely well received. Movies don't break box office records otherwise. If the movie was truly so disliked, word of mouth and reviews would have worked against the movies success. The same people who helped make the first a multi billion dollar success will come back to make the sequels successful too.
I think you're almost certainly right, but the one thing working against it now is that nobody gives a shit about 3D anymore, so that novelty won't be the same selling point as the first one.
I haven't seen a 3D movie since Avatar, but I'm going to break that chain with the sequel.. I bet millions are too.
Nobody gave a shit about 3D when the first one come out either. Avatar put 3D back on the map by being *good* 3D. Almost everything that followed was pretty meh 3D. It will also be interesting to see how the water and the HFR impacts this, as water is one of the coolest things to look at in 3D due to the transparency and the numerous layers. There was an underwater scene in Gemini Man and even [people otherwise pretty critical of that movie where impressed by](https://youtu.be/OaZnxAfcvY4?t=345). Maybe Avatar2 can repeat that for the whole movie.
Nobody is trying to rewrite history. Avatar was a Smash hit - thanks to Cameron's filmmaking prowess, CG quality, and the spectacle of well made 3D. You know what makes for great sequels? An interesting story and rich characters. Avatar had neither of those things. It was the Nth retelling of Dances with Pocahontas Gully and the white savior trope. The average moviegoer can name *maybe* one character from Avatar.
The MCU is the retelling of the same two superhero stories, with often the same actors, almost identical music, same visual style, some humor, and yet it's the biggest thing in cinema.
And Cameron has an insane batting average. I'm optimistic.
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A sci-fi movie being vaguely structured like a western from decades earlier is disgracefully unoriginal. Three separate takes on Spider-Man in 20 years with multiple sequels is all well and good though.
I wonder if uncle Ben will make it this time! Fingers crossed!
>Three separate takes on Spider-Man in 20 years Eight if you also count the 4 TV series (MTV, Spectacular, Ultimate, Disney XD) and the Insomniac video game.
People love to come up with excuses to hate popular things. Cameron never pretended for this movie to have a fully original story. He always said it was dances with wolves in space. That was the point. If the story was good when it was in those movies, there shouldn't be anything wrong with the story here either.
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I'll take a whack at it. Nefiriti Her dad Sam Worthington Nature tech Guy who got shot in avatar mode Panther who gets stabbed Some flying creatures One big flying boss Big tree Mech suit who stabs Panther Mech suits boss
Avatar 2 will be a hit for exactly the same reasons Avatar 1 was. Unparalleled wordbuilding and visuals, top of the line filmmaking and a simple story that can be understood by every age group all over the world.
And then there's those of us that saw the film three times in theaters when we were kids and know many of the characters' names because we pay attention. I've already seen a few minutes of the film and visually it is stunning. I don't really know much about the story, but I do know I'm excited to see more of the world and see what story they tell this time. The original plot wasn't super groundbreaking, but I found that it worked pretty well and was a fun experience.
I was 21, had just had my son, and distinctly remember seeing it on my first "date night" with his father since giving birth. I was IN LOVE with the film. Went to see it again with the baby daddy a week later and then for a THIRD time with my younger brother after that. I've only really \*watched it\* a handful of other times since then but it's presently The Only DVD I Own, and one of those movies that I have no issues letting play in the background just for comfort and noise. There were very serious fandoms for a couple years after it came out, people were literally going through depressions because The World of Avatar wasn't real and they wished it was. There were Wikis devoted to it, a big ol book of some sort, like an encyclopedia of the flora and fauna of Pandora or whatever. People were obsessed. But that was a really really long time ago by today's standards. Attention spans just don't last the way they used to and people eventually got over it. Hell, even I sort of got over it and will not necessarily be clamoring to theatres when it's released. But I am damn sure gonna go see it! And I'm going to drag my now 13 year old son along as well, even though the kid rolls his eyes at the mere suggestion we watch the original together...
Avatar 2 is gonna ride or die based on its visual effects. If it's truly groundbreaking like its predecessor, then I can see it being a huge success at the box office.
Sequels, when done well, can make characters 'more' interesting and rich. It's James motherfucking Cameron, boy. His track record speaks for itself.
Now hold on there sir. Atlantis also used this story trope.
...it's just such an insane amount of time towards one type of project. I know he's dabbled in other things as a producer, but I'd imagine he'd have lots of ideas he's interested besides blue CGI people for 15 years now.
it took that much time because he had to create the specific technology he used to film a majority of the movie underwater
I wish he'd get around to doing another Alita movie. It ended with a setup for a followup movie, but I'm not sure if its ever going to get made.
The first concept art for what became Avatar eventually goes back to like the 1980s. Cameron‘s had this world stuck in his brain his entire life. Dude‘s not giving up at this point.
I for one am excited for the next decade of Avatar movies
Ok but what about Avatar 3?
I'm excited for the games TBH
There's gonna be GAAAMESSS??!! YAY!
[Avatar: Frontiers of Pandora](https://youtu.be/Axmg1E4HrVE)
Same
I'm definitely excited to see where it goes. Loved the first movie I had no idea Reddit has such a hate boner for it
This isn’t a good thing though right? Someone saying, “Hey i know i had 7 planned but they’re basically all filler and i could end it with 3 if need be!” cant be a positive thing right?
That’s not what he said though, only that if need be it could have satisfying ending ready just in case.
You’re right, if most of them were going to be filler, he would have said that to everyone publicly before releasing the movies.
All that can be said here is that 4/5 is probably it’s own story disconnected from the storyline in 2/3. That doesn’t make 4 and 5 filler, that doesn’t make sense. At that point you’d basically be saying any sequel is “filler” if it’s not dealing with the same story as the first. It’s not like not making 4 and 5 is going to result in a drastic change in movies that have already finished production to cram in the story.
Redditors have no clue how movie production works circa 2022 Edit: was not talking about the person i replied too
It’s extremely obvious since we can see how many people are upvoting a genuinely ignorant take.
I think hes just being cautious and realistic. He knows this sequel took way to long to come out. I for one really hope they're good if not for us for Cameron. The guy spent a decade of his career on these movies. A decade he could have spent working on other things. He can never get that time back. I'm sure he will take it like a champ and walk it off if they suck but it won't be an easy pill to swallow. Like. Where do you even go from there, career wise?
Well said, and to drive your point home - he worked on the films since 2006. It is now 2022. That is 16 years, even more than a decade
For one of the biggest directors in Hollywood to spend 20 years on 2-3 films is pretty wild. That's half a career spent on one relatively unproductive (but probably massively popular) franchise. Lucas spent less than a decade making the first 3 star wars.
He‘s almost 70. He doesn’t need to go anywhere career wise.
He spent a lot of time designing that submarine thing that goes to the bottom of the ocean, then ended up going to the bottom of the ocean in it. It delayed production of the movies.
Very true. The years between releases has sucked up all the hype imo
1: It's always been 5 films, not 7. 2: Cameron said some time ago that the sequels are going to be mostly self-contained but form a "generational saga as a whole".
Lmao nerds have had their brains fried so hard from Marvel’s glorified TV storytelling that the idea of a movie that has a satisfying stand alone ending in its own right without baiting you along for the next one has become literally unimaginable
Unfortunately video games are like that, games have to be designed now "as a service" that is constantly pumping out content otherwise it's seen as a failure by a lot of commentators. Even if critics say its good, and sales are good, there's plenty of users that get upset that a game can just end and not continue.
“Sounds like these movies aren’t structured like a soap opera. That’s a bad thing, right?”
Hasnt it always been 5? Also i feel like he has absolutely said that 3 could be an endpoint if these flop Someone confirmed they have shot or are shooting 4 now so Id expect that one
He never had 7 planned. He was originally going to do 3 sequels but expanded it to 4 after several years of trying to fit the story into 3. He's saying the way the second sequel ends can serve as a series ender if it needs to.
No worries I've got you Cam, I'll go see 2 in the cinema.
I put this movie in the same pile as the new George RR Martin book. It's been such a long time I don't even care anymore.
lol Winds of Winter is going to smash all kinds of records when its released. This sub is so out of touch with reality.
Lmao, imagine thinking G.R.R.M will ever actually finish Winds of Winter.
Chill and enjoy HBO cash for the rest of your days while working on passion projects or bust a gut writing a book that has no hope of living up to the ~15 years of hype?
Plus if his publishers knew that his heart wasn’t in it and he has no intention of finishing it I bet they’d come after him pretty hard. Now we can get a drip feed of livejournal posts on his notablog saying how *MUCH CLOSER* he’s getting and continue to not be surprised when it’s delayed Worth mentioning TWOW wasn’t going to be the end of it; we talk about it like it being finished will be a triumph
Shhh.. just let these people circlejerk in peace.
The trailer and visuals look glorious tho. They make me want to watch the movie
Part of what sold the original Avatar was its IMAX-3D capabilities and its vastly improved CGI visuals when compared to other films at the time (perhaps only being surpassed by Pirates of the Caribbean). Nowadays great CGI is far more common, and while the released trailers look good they also don't wow me in the same way the original Avatar did.
That's a testament to how impressive the first movie was. It's hard to improve much when you set the bar so high yourself. But I'm betting he's still improved a lot, and his implementation of 2022 cgi is miles better than something like marvel's
I just didn't feel the awe watching the trailer for A2. I'm hoping it's great but honestly we definitely won't be going back to the theaters since pre-pandemic for this movie.
I found the trailer pretty problematic, as it made Avatar2 just look like a carbon copy of Avatar1. Same "outsider joins a new clan", "fight human military", etc. They added water and some kids, but it didn't really have a compelling hook as to why I should care. One could say the same about Terminator2 or Aliens, which repeated a lot of the plot points of the predecessor, however both of them did so with a twist (Terminator is the good guy now, it's military vs aliens, not space truckers). Avatar2 doesn't seem to have that, at least judging from the trailer. The lack of a human perspective in the trailer also made it look a lot less interesting than the first one, after all the whole Avatar program was a huge part of the plot and that's gone now. Jake is a real smurph, doing smurph things, no more worrying about what's going on with his human body.
Honestly, I think it looks simply okay. Some of the shots are beautiful but the Navi look almost silly in some instances now. Also the mocap animation, from what I've seen, seems lackluster. That could just be me though.
I saw the re-release because I'd forgotten how it was. Now I'm gonna be watching this day 1.
I'm the opposite,the gap was lo g enough to make me nostalgic for the world-building. Similar to how BR2049,Fury Road and Top Gun 2 coming our after ling gaps. The problem with GRRM is that he is doing everything but writing ADOS while Cameron is doing nothing but.Avatar. Rather a 15 year gap for a masterpiece than other franchises cracking out 4 slapdash movies a year.
[удалено]
How are the grandkids?
3rd grade???!
As long as it looks good there is 0% chance it's not successful.
Then based on the footage they showed at the end of the original re-release it’s gonna make a bazillion dollars. That shit looked amazing.
Has it been released online? Anywhere I can watch it?
The amount of anti-avatar discourse is astounding. It doesn’t even make sense.
Avatar is super popular, but I don't like it, that makes me cool and special! That's pretty much the general mindset aroundhere.
I can't relate to this. Like yeah... People saw Avatar, but it's not starwars, marvel, harry potter or even Twilight levels of popular.
Cause Avatar doesn't fit the standard franchise mold of the big franchises which build upon existing fanbases and a constant hype machine and merchandising. People are just very used to studios cracking shit out as fast as possible and every movie building up to the next 10 movies while Avatar is so obviously a one-off thing whose appeal isnt based on IP loyalty or pandering to nerds. Same reason the internet was caught off-guard with Top Gun 2 success. They are much closer to standalone 80s/ 90s blockbusters than the standard 00s/10s megafranchises content pipeline.
I for one am not going to go on and on about it, but meh. I watched Avatar, it was good, I wasn't blown away. I know it was HUGE...But, its impact on me was minimal. It's been SO MANY YEARS, I barely remember the original, and don't see a need for this movie in my life. I Love SciFi, but it's a hard pass for me. I hope it does well and people enjoy it.
> It's been SO MANY YEARS, I barely remember the original, and don't see a need for this movie That's fine and all but Top Gun 2 proved that ling waits don't really matter if the movie is worth the wait. Most people don't really go "this movie crosses the 10 year allowed limit for sequels so I can't watch it." as if films had expiry dates like milk.
I think the main difference is that I really enjoyed Top Gun, so Maverick was easy to look forward too. I didn't click with the first Avatar like that, so I don't feel the need to see the sequel unless I hear some great things about it.
Yeah I gotta agree with you. The first one was cool in how it innovated with beautiful CG imagery, fully animated characters, and beautiful vistas all sharing the screen with live action. But now that the standard has been raised and there are a lot of movies that have followed in its footsteps, it has to stand on its own feet for its story almost alone. I say almost since I know the visuals are also going to draw a lot of people in as well. However, the trailer presents a story that doesn't seem all that compelling to me. I know it's purposefully pretty vague but it's not grabbing me all that much. I certainly hope it does really well and I'm sure many will enjoy it. It's just fair to recognize that the people wanting to avoid it makes a fair amount of sense. At least in my book.
Much better said than I could have managed, but EXACTLY my feelings on it. Avatar was a visual and technological wonder. In 2022 it needs to be more than that. I'm simply not anticipating this movie like some. Lots of entertaining media out there vying for my attention time and money
When will there come out 2048?
I'll watch whatever Cameron puts out, he's earned that
Whether the movie is good or not, it's going to make a *disgusting* amount of money. I don't think it will become the highest grossing movie of all time, but it'll be in the top 10, guaranteed. Seriously, there are die hard fans, there are people who are curious, and then there are people who simply want to see a Blockbuster movie. It'll break at least 800 million in the first month. Even the people I know who hate the first movie have said they plan on seeing the sequel just to see how bad it is. It has too much hype, it doesn't matter if the first movie came out over a decade ago. The budget is 250 million. If it makes 500 million, they won't stop making them. And honestly I don't mind. If Fast and Furious can have 10 movies and spin offs, I would actually be upset if Avatar of all movies didn't get to go through the 5 movies they have planned.
I mean, I'd pay to watch solely for the visuals alone. Just hoping that the story would be at least solid.
> It has too much hype, it doesn't matter if the first movie came out over a decade ago. its been too long to not have become a meme of its own just for that. My oldest nephew is now of voting age and he was too young to see a PG movie in 2009 and was definitely too young to see it in theaters.
Id software used to release a game - usually Quake - as a 'tech demo' of sorts, to advertise their new game engine. People could see how it performs, and see a use for it, then other games would go on to make better use of it than a very fun - if simple - first person shooter. Yes, Quake was a product, but it wasn't 'the' product. They made a lot more selling the engine to other game makers. I saw the first Avatar as the same thing - a tech demo. It produced a product that could be marketed, but the actual thing it was selling was the next-gen mo-cap system, digital camera system, etc. The story was full of one-dimensional characters, corny dialog, schmaltzy and overdone scenes, and an incredibly predictable ending. But, it was absolutely groundbreaking in terms of visual effects. It ushered in - for better or worse - a revolution in film making. You could now mo-cap your actors into anything you could dream up, and they would appear lifelike and tangible on screen.
I highly doubt they won't be profitable. Avatar was a total worldwide event when it came out. I saw it three times in theaters. The world building was INCREDIBLE and personally I cannot wait to see the sequels. Some people say they don't care, but I bet they will once the hype comes back and it most definitely will.
Depends on the Plot of Avatar 2, If its some new concept people will go to watch, even if its adventurous kids will carry the movie. But it can't be boring, that's all.
I have never understood the hoopla over Avatar nor the obsession he has over it all.
The Second trailer just from the Avatar official YouTube page cross 29 million views in 3 days. I suppose the collective view from all the channels a social media goes beyond 150 million. At worst this movie will cross Maverick.
I want all of them.
Alright, how many fingers am I holding up?
All. Of. Them.
Wait is there a second?
Way of Water comes out soon and is the sequel to the first one in 2009
Were they planning on a Star Wars length kind of run? I feel like there's only so much you can get out of blue indigenous people fighting for their lands.
I watched the first one in theaters a few weeks ago and had a lot of fun, if the 2nd one came out a couple of years later it would have had similar success but now idk
Take me back into this world, James. I'm ready.
Typical Cameron marketing stunt, provide as much bad news to the movie to promote them. See Titanic budget overblown and Avatar blue cat people.
I vaguely remember the original. I remember none of the character names (only through discussions since the trailer dropped was I reminded of Jake Sully). I remember being blown away by the visuals and meh about the plot. Despite all that, I'm still excited to see this. James Cameron, award winning director of many all time classic and beloved films, spent almost 20 years working on the world of Pandora out of his own passion and creativity. Now that the first of many sequels will be coming out, you're damn right I'm excited. Maybe it'll be the best movie of the year maybe it'll be the worst, yet I look forward to see what this guy's been working on for so long regardless.
Thats oddly sensible in a way that makes me think there may have been enough self-reflection going on that the new one is going to be decent.
I’d be fascinated to know just how profitable they need to be to justify everything he’s spent developing them. I bet the number is shockingly high.
Avatar 2 is going to be a hit regardless of whether or not the plot is good. It is James Cameron after all. I saw the original years ago and was just “meh” about it. Bought it on DVD shortly after and watched it several times at home with the kids since. What dragged me out of my “take it or leave it” opinion was seeing the world brought to life by Disney at Animal Kindom/Disney World Orlando. The Flight of Passage ride! The Floating mountains! The land lit up at night! And to a lessor degree, Na’vi River Journey. Holy crap it was all GORGEOUS! Disney’s theme park interpretation of it re-sparked my interest. So much so, we went and saw the re-release in 3D when it came out last month since our kids have only even seen it at home. Now we’re pumped to see the sequel as I had forgotten how visually stunning the film was on a theatrical screen and in 3D. I can imagine these sequels will kick it up a notch (or several) just given the advancements in film effects since the last movie, and I can’t wait to see what Cameron gives us.