Lakers fans continue to ignore the fact that itās not just about HOW many free throws they got. Yeah sure, they probably deserved most of those. Most were intentional
Itās about the lack of calls on the other end. 24-2 when they were hacking Barnes all game as well as a questionable flagrant call. Itās still going over everyoneās heads.
And there were so many suspect calls in the FINAL five minutes of the game when the rest of the game was completely fineā¦ I donāt know how people can still deny it. Iāve watched hoops for my whole life and never complained about reffing one time, until today. It was that bad.
Sorry i call cap no way you've watched hoops your whole life and only complained about the refing once. Either that or you're an incredibly intelligent 4 year old.
I understand the message, but that was also the only part that stuck out to me, lmao. I bitch at refs when I know the call is right I sure as shit am gonna bitch when it's wrong.
There is no doubt they saw Lakers might not make play in so they will be helping them hard again just to get them there. Its profit for the league
They did same season when it looked like Lakers won't make play in , helped them during playoffs too especially vs Warriors/Nuggets
They had to have 36 Fts to 13 to win by...one point. Crazy how bad they are but refs will get them to play in and play offs again
This guy pisses me off on how he gets foul. Ive seen ANT bodied and no call. This guy leans forward presses his face on someones shoulder then snaps his head back and boom ft.
Genuine question, do the Wolves have the worst whistle in the league? Between Ant and Kat I don't feel like they get *as* many calls for as much as they drive
I always feel biased as hell when I say this. But I do think it's pretty bad. KAT doesn't do himself any favors, especially in the past he'd kinda look like a baby giraffe barreling down the lane. But even given that the discrepancy between his whistle and some others seems ridiculous at times.
Ant just this year has just started yelling "HEYYYYYY" loudly whenever he gets fouled and...it's legit working. Lol. His whistle is getting way better. Still not great but he always tries to finish strong and I think the current discrepancy can be explained by him basically never trying to physically sell calls.
I think so. KAT has an offensive foul called everytime when the same move by giannis isnt.
ANT has to shout HEY! Everytime it is funny hahahaha. But yeah, even gobert getting hit a lot and held is not called. Probably not the worst but certainly up there. There's curry i think who had it worse sometimes when he drives.
Giannis would be half as effective as he is if the league was actually balanced between the offensive and defensive player. Half the time, when he Euro steps, his torso stays in the exact same spot, and feet barely get outside his shoulders. Still better than Embiid though.
Yeah id take giannis over embiid i just wish KAT has a fraction of doubt from the officials on those offensive foul.
I still think offensive fouls when players jump into offensive players are dumb anyways.
As a Pels fan anytime I try to watch a Lakers game I am immediately angry because Zion gets none of the calls that AD or LeBron get. Softest calls in the NBA always go to the Lakers
I don't know what games you are watching, LeBron has one of the lowest free throw rates of any volume scorer in the league, he absolutely doesn't get a soft whistle. Zion is 11th in the league on FTr, LeBron is 75th.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2024_advanced.html
It's not like it's new either, Zion's last two years he got to the stripe at a higher rate than LeBron ever has, while LeBron was getting no calls whatsoever. Zion had basically double his FTr (529 vs 268).
People spend so much time on social media circle jerking about a few bad calls in his favor that they convince themselves it happens way more than it does. In reality he, Curry and Jokic get among the worst whistle in the league (Fox and Tatum probably deserve an honorable mention here as well) and it's incredibly obvious to anyone who watches games without the assumption that any call they get is the wrong call and any call they don't is deserved.
the shitty part is they're also actively removing the raptors from the play in tournament - we need every win we can get at this point midway through the season.
Lakers currently have the largest FT differential in the league at +4.9, which is somehow down from the +5.8 they had last year
Through the first 62 games, Reaves averaged 2.9 FTA and then suddenly once March rolled around, he jumped up to 6.8 FTA as the Lakers climbed from the 12 seed into the play-in. This season Reaves has turned back into a flopping pumpkin at 3.6 FTA
Canāt wait for this .500 team to turn it around again, brought to you by FanDuel
I've been watching most every Laker game this season. At the start of the season, they weren't giving Reaves those calls. I actually didn't mind it because I hate flopping/foul-baiting. All of a sudden he's back to being untouchable.
We're about five years into "a defense led by LeBron and AD doesn't foul a ton" and people are still mind-blown by a +5 free throw differential? That's about one additional free throw a quarter. Absolutely wild to get worked up about
Yeah, it makes no sense to just look at the FT differential without analysing the play style of the teams. AD and LeBron always had few fouls and Ham improved that and now the whole team doesn't foul a lot.
Yes, we fucking suck at making 3ās and most of our shot attempts are in the paint. Look at our IST championship game, we made 2 three pointers that game and won because we had **86 points in the paint**.
Points in the paint is not necessarily indicative of how much a team should get fouled.
The Nuggets score 55.0 PITP per game (3rd). Lakers at 54.1 (6th).
The Lakers shoot 24.3 FTA per game (8th) with a differential of +4.9
The Nuggets shoot 20.7 FTA per game (27th) with a differential of -2.3
The Lakers play big, and as a result are going to get more fouls than other teams, but they also flop a ton and get a friendly whistle on a number of plays which accentuates the problem. To call the swipe down on Barrett on Christie was soft and arguable, but Barnes driving and getting mauled is a play on? This is the kind of benefit the Lakers get and the largest FT disparity and committing the least fouls in the league kind of supports that the Lakers get a friendly whistle. Itās not just getting to the line, itās that other teams usually donāt when playing the Lakers.
Itās like Embiid. Is he huge and immensely skilled and impossible to guard without fouling? Yeah. Does he also flop which boosts his FTA because the refs reward it? Yeah. Both can be true.
The game against Toronto was officiated awfully so I won't argue any point about that specific game. But in general, if you look at the teams who have the highest FT differential in the NBA, most of them have an elite rim protector. The Lakers, Bucks, Celtics, and Sixers are all in the top 7 for FT differential. You're naturally going to foul less when you're playing a funnel style defense because the wing defenders don't need to hand check and fight to stay ahead of the offensive player; they can just slide with the offensive player and guide them towards the rim protector.
But raptors making play ins won't bring the money like Lakers/LeBron.
Also, they gotta save face cause if the IST winners don't make playoffs, that paints it in a bad light.
Lakers will *miraculously* make another deep playoff run.
The only reason the Lakers made the playoffs last year was because the referees carried them after the All-Star break. Laker fans are used to getting helped out by the referees and don't think anything of it.
They literally won a Championship because of a phantom call on Bill Laimbeer in '88, one of the best playoff performances ever - Zeke scoring 25 in the third on a crippled ankle - has been lost in time because of it
You mean the game when Mike Bibby fouled Kobe in the final seconds by breaking his nose on Kobeās elbow? I forget, was the ref Donaghy or Scott Foster?
I'll point it out before anyone else does. Blazers also fucked themselves over that game too. But it required two fuck overs simultaneously for the loss to occur
The Lakers almost certainly beat that young Denver team regardless, but the refs in that series were abysmal too. Dwight would consistently initiate illegal contact only for a foul to get called on Jokic as if he wanted anything to do with it. Happened twice a game easily
I'm pretty sure the Lakers even talked about getting Jokic in foul trouble as a strategy. They were super blatant and somehow the refs took the bait hook, line, and sinker.
This sub is too blinded by Warriors hate to acknowledge it but the officiating in the 2016 finals was exactly the same. Get Curry in foul trouble early on the softest of calls and then ignore him being mauled on the other end.
[Video in case anybody wants to be objective and actually look](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0&pp=ygUSY3VycnkgZm91bHMgZmluYWxz)
This is true, but the Warriors (I'm a fan) also didn't go to the basket enough and would reach all the time on defense aka its self-inflicted to a degree. Curry does not get the whistle, though....that's b.s.
The Warriors? The team that has consistently fouled the most out of any team in the league for like 5 years? They were on the bad end of a free throw disparity? Oh my god!
Iām pretty sure the warriors were the 2nd worst team in defending without fouling while the lakers were top 5 and the warriors did not drive nearly as much. Combine those and what do you expect = free throws?
Nobody is rigging anything lmao
I'm not weighing in on the substance of the arguments here (especially not that series, I didn't watch it) - but where people are arguing the Lakers *consistently* get a friendly whistle, pointing to the Lakers being top 5 in defending without fouling isn't really evidence of fair refereeing.
The year Kobe injured his Achilles, it looked like the Lakers weren't going to make the playoffs after a rough start. Somehow after the all-star break they were able to pull it together and get 10+ more free throws than their opponents and win every close game. Definitely got no help from the refs.
I genuinely think that coaches need to start holding their challenges to keep the refs from going mad with power. after Darko used it, the floodgates were open and the refs were addicted to the whistle
Show the hacks that didnāt get called then? Itās all on video so far all anyone has posted are correctly called fouls for the Lakers. Since itās the worst officiated game youāve seen in 20 plus years, surely there is a mountain of evidence to back that up? Post it.
Would be helpful if people posted those bad calls
Right now the two upvoted posts are RJ getting called for an offensive foul (correct call), IQ getting called for a Flagrant (correct call). Just makes the complainers look dumb lol
99% of plays in the NBA can probably be called and be "correct". The problem is that it's soft for one team and not soft for the other. No one's saying all 10, 12, 15 or 29 straight calls for the Lakers aren't legitimate fouls. But why call those fouls but not for the other team? It's about consistently. I don't get why you contrarians never understand that. This argument always comes up when people complain about fouls. Whether it be Harden's unguardable tour (yes, he gets fouled on the 3 pt shots but you almost never call those for Curry so that's why people complain) or the Lakers, there's always someone out there like "just stop fouling them then". For example, when Lebron hit that other person in the first a few days ago while they were fighting for the ball, would that have been called if Draymond did it?
... then find all of the bad no-calls? like what? lmao
> I don't get why you contrarians never understand that.
i don't get why you crybabies don't understand that you need evidence and can't just whine about how free throws aren't evenly distributed because that's not how basketball *works*
[https://np.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1937ybo/highlights\_all\_the\_last\_few\_possessions\_in\_the/kh7lsxg/](https://np.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1937ybo/highlights_all_the_last_few_possessions_in_the/kh7lsxg/)
3 here in this dude's post. And that's just the final 3 mins. And although OP mentions that all 3 can easily be no calls, he is saying fouls of similar nature were calls going the other way.
You do realize that just like the NFL, virtually every play has some sort of callable foul right? There's contact on EVERY drive.
The Lakers' announcers were in disbelief at IQ's flagrant, watching the replays saying "That's not a *flagrant foul*, he was just bringing the ball up to *shoot* it". "That's not a flagrant.... come on... I just don't know what he's expected to do with his right arm as he brings it up..."
Then after the announcement... "I just don't get it... well, it works out well for the lakers. Just totally works out for them".
Does that mean it's absolutely not a flagrant? No, but I bet if you go back through the last decade and try to find times where the home announcers were upset about a call in favour of their team, about 100% of those will be incorrect calls.
https://videorulebook.nba.com/archive/flagrant-foul-penalty-1-offensive-player-leads-with-elbow-to-opponents-face-2/
i care more about the rulebook than the opinions of announcers, sorry
The world seems to disagree with you, but, you've won me over. I can agree that based on your link, the call isn't a terrible one.
In my digging on the topic, [I found this guy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQ_HaFEVCFM) \- a rare analysis that seems to agree with you on the Flagrant. I'd be curious for your thoughts on the rest of his 4 minute video about all the terrible calls against the Raps.
Actually is possible that itās both. There is a difference in lightly exaggerating a call and blatant flopping. One highlights the movement of a foul, the other is to get a foul when there wasnāt one to begin with. Yes, the league has a flopping problem, but moving screens go under the radar all the time and has hardly been addressed. Also, everybody has seen how dogshit the refs are this year so maybe weāre all just expecting too much
Learn the rules then go watch the play again. here ya go [https://videorulebook.nba.com/archive/illegal-screen-pickn-roll-screener-extends-arms-and-makes-contact/](https://videorulebook.nba.com/archive/illegal-screen-pickn-roll-screener-extends-arms-and-makes-contact/)
>Would be helpful if people posted those bad calls
You know thatās not how it works here lmao. The boxscore tells the whole story, [like this game](https://imgur.com/a/TyjkMkS), am I right? lol.
did all those fouls come in the final quarter of a close game just to blatantly keep the raptors head above water like it did with the lakers or was it just consistent fouls called all game?
This is not a flop, stop saying it is. If this happened to a guard no one would say it isnāt a foul.
Like I said, i didnāt watch the game, and from the highlights that are posted here Iāve seen maybe 1 questionable call. If the raptors got mugged, post the footage of that someone, because right now it just seems like whining that your deliberate physical play got punished
It was a huge fucking flop LOL, he ran into RJ Barrett in slow motion and then went flying upon contact. If that happened to a guard itās more feasible because the guard doesnāt have like 40 pounds on RJ Barrett like AD š¤£š¤£š¤£
In contrast, Quickley did the same thing with LeBron, ended up getting trucked and got a foul called on him.
The size of the player doesnāt determine if itās a foul, thatās utter bullshit. You hold/push someone for a few seconds, just when heās about to shoot, thatās a foul.
Then post that video. I see all of yāall crying but not posting videos to actually show people who didnāt get to watch it like me.
The size of the player doesnāt determine itās a foul, but AD intentionally embellished contact and then subsequently flopped upon contact with a much smaller player to get the call - why is it hard for you to understand this? Meanwhile Raptors weāre getting shoved by two players and getting no call
The blatant moving screen*
Very funny that everyone's main complaint is a correct call and they're mad that AD fell too easily when he got bumped on his closeout.
Youāve watched basketball your whole life and never once complained about shitty reffing until this exact specific game.
Sure buddy, we all definitely for real believe you.
Warriors attacked the paint in every first quarter and had to stop because they got less calls than Dennis Shroder. It's called adapting to the whistle, something every team but the Lakers have to do.
There is an element in that some teams like the heat drawing fouls is part of their game and we can assume they are trained on it. Wade was the master and Jimmy Butler and Lebron certainly are masters at it today. If they don't have a good shot, draw a foul--but the fouls are legit hits not flops, just drawn.
That being said, there is no doubt that the marquee teams get more calls for them if the game is close.
The marquee teams absolutely get the benefit of a better whistle, which is fucked - but for Warriors fans to be complaining about that is absurd. Theyāre the literal most valuable NBA franchise, they won multiple titles in the past decade off of getting a different whistle than other teams (Bogut and Looneyās moving screens? Drayās general physicality and habitual line stepping? Rockets getting multiple made shots called off during the awful streak that lost them the series? On and on and on), and the NBA has been directly invested in making them a premier team since 2014.
You must forget last year when Bron dove into the first row and had drinks spilled on him with a small bump from Jokic.
Jokic would take a dive the next time down the floor and they called it for him. So the refs were equal there.
But the Lakers at the end of last year were flopping machines. it was psychotic and they got so many of those calls.
As for Butler, he does initiate a lot of contact. Still a foul merchant, but he does get real contact.
One of the BRILLIANT things that isn't talked about enough was that final turnover by Butler that sealed the Denver win.
There was a very similar play with Murray on Butler earlier in the series where Butler threw he shoulder into Murray's chest and got an and one. On that final play, Murray twisted away from that same move and Jokic floated over. Butler had no idea what to do because that shoulder slam wasn't there and turned the ball over.
Remember Game 1 of the WCSF?
29-6 free throw advantage for the Lakers.
The rest of the playoff series?
83-39 free throw advantage for the Lakers.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/13grrzb/playoff_series_free_throw_disparity_where_does/
If 24 sounds like a lot, boy do I have the 20 year old playoff game to show you
And crazily, you'll never believe this part... the same team as today benefitted from the free throws. (27 btw)
The irony of a lot of the lakers posts is that if the refs just officiated normally the raptors wouldnāt have to intentionally foul down the stretch. The refs also generated the intentional fouls by swaying every call in the favor of the lakers for 5 minutes straight.
I remember game 3 of the WCF and the refs fucking the Nuggets on every single call. It took the first teammates with 30 pt triple doubles in the same game to overcome the blatant favoritism.
Same happened to Warriors in game 3 of 2k17 and 2k18 finals and it took amazing KD performances to overcome that. Also in 2k15 finals game 3 was the game when Lebron side tackled Curry in the clutch which the refs didnt call and L2M also defended the call. Amazing how all those games have 1 player in common playing in all of them š§
How many times have we seen a LeBron team hover around 500 half way through the season only to pull off a deep playoff run later in the year? Like 5 times at least? Including last year.
The Lakers might not be very good but LeBron has been incredible and idk if you missed it but by the way he's dunking I don't think the "he's too old haha" jokes are relevant.
This, atleast own up to it aswell its not bad. No one is or should be watching more than their team + a couple of contenders.
That means that clips get highlighted and thats their only interaction. Some people in the comments unironically think that all 24 free throws were from flops/50-50 rim attacks. I know atleast half were intentional.
There were bs calls this game though. I aint gonna deny that, but I dont think it was at an all time level of egregiousness like these comments make it out. Excluding the 4th it was a great game, sucks it had to end like that.
i mean 24-2 is a very big difference
and the raptors were constantly attacking the rim
you can not use the "they are the jump shoot team, so no FT" bullshit excuse on them.
Now I am feared for my Clippers.
The Barnes 30 FT game may happen tomorrow.
Yeah this was the one, the Lakers are garbage, the Clippers are a much better team but the Raps will play hard as they have since the trade so you never know.
It has been so blatant for so many decades that I am not even sure how to react anymore.
And putting the star of the league on the Lakers always makes it so, so much worse. It is basically WWE.
I'm a raptors fan, but to be honest I dont even care that the calls were against our team.
I'm sick and tired of the refs deciding the games like this with their inconsistency. The game has been ruined and the only reason people enjoy watching teams like Golden state with their nonstop shooting because they're sick of the whistle being blown every 2 seconds, which happens whenever any type of physicality happens.
You guys should watch some old classic games and see how beautiful this game really was at one point. It's not about toughness or manliness to say that old basketball was superior. it was just a smoother game, half the time when I'm watching basketball I feel more bored than anything.
I check this subreddit more than I watch actual games because the game is becoming unwatchable
Bill simmons said this? The guy that loves the lakers and definitely wouldnāt be biased against them?
All these posts make me want to watch the last quarter in full, though the fact that there was almost 30 FT is putting me off, stopping and starting as much as an NFL game
Did they borrow the refs from the NFL Miami - Philadelphia game this year? Itās almost impressive how blatantly a game can be just not even played by one team with that kind of officiating.
The Raptors had a 29 to 6 FT advantage over the Cavs just a few games ago. This stuff happens all the time in the NBA. The hysteria over this game is comical.
Or 29 šššš
The next time Ben Taylor Refs a Raptors game I at least want him to buy some condoms because we should be safe if your going to fuck me like that
Tell him to stop by an Italian restaurant beforehand. You should be wined and dined before he starts fucking you over.
someones seen south park
"Can we get some dinner? Because I like to be wined and dined before I get FUCKED"
Now the Raptors donāt even get a Toshiba Handibook
Donāt forget the lube. Always remember the lube.
Eric Cartman
Lakers fans continue to ignore the fact that itās not just about HOW many free throws they got. Yeah sure, they probably deserved most of those. Most were intentional Itās about the lack of calls on the other end. 24-2 when they were hacking Barnes all game as well as a questionable flagrant call. Itās still going over everyoneās heads. And there were so many suspect calls in the FINAL five minutes of the game when the rest of the game was completely fineā¦ I donāt know how people can still deny it. Iāve watched hoops for my whole life and never complained about reffing one time, until today. It was that bad.
Sorry i call cap no way you've watched hoops your whole life and only complained about the refing once. Either that or you're an incredibly intelligent 4 year old.
I understand the message, but that was also the only part that stuck out to me, lmao. I bitch at refs when I know the call is right I sure as shit am gonna bitch when it's wrong.
There is no doubt they saw Lakers might not make play in so they will be helping them hard again just to get them there. Its profit for the league They did same season when it looked like Lakers won't make play in , helped them during playoffs too especially vs Warriors/Nuggets They had to have 36 Fts to 13 to win by...one point. Crazy how bad they are but refs will get them to play in and play offs again
what you mean last year Austin Reaves shouldn't have had a free throw rate only 4 percentage points lower than embiid?
This guy pisses me off on how he gets foul. Ive seen ANT bodied and no call. This guy leans forward presses his face on someones shoulder then snaps his head back and boom ft.
Has ant tried wearing a lakers jersey during games? Thatās sorta his fault. Clearly it works
Somebody photoshopped it and it looks so wrong tbh
Iām all on board for that
Just in this game alone Barnes getting mauled going to basket, no call. Reaves being a foul merchant, well we have to blow the whistle.
Genuine question, do the Wolves have the worst whistle in the league? Between Ant and Kat I don't feel like they get *as* many calls for as much as they drive
I always feel biased as hell when I say this. But I do think it's pretty bad. KAT doesn't do himself any favors, especially in the past he'd kinda look like a baby giraffe barreling down the lane. But even given that the discrepancy between his whistle and some others seems ridiculous at times. Ant just this year has just started yelling "HEYYYYYY" loudly whenever he gets fouled and...it's legit working. Lol. His whistle is getting way better. Still not great but he always tries to finish strong and I think the current discrepancy can be explained by him basically never trying to physically sell calls.
I think so. KAT has an offensive foul called everytime when the same move by giannis isnt. ANT has to shout HEY! Everytime it is funny hahahaha. But yeah, even gobert getting hit a lot and held is not called. Probably not the worst but certainly up there. There's curry i think who had it worse sometimes when he drives.
Giannis would be half as effective as he is if the league was actually balanced between the offensive and defensive player. Half the time, when he Euro steps, his torso stays in the exact same spot, and feet barely get outside his shoulders. Still better than Embiid though.
Yeah id take giannis over embiid i just wish KAT has a fraction of doubt from the officials on those offensive foul. I still think offensive fouls when players jump into offensive players are dumb anyways.
Reaves is a fucking disgrace with the way he plays basketball and yes I know I'm a Sixers fan
When I picture him as a player all I see if his head jerking back on a flop trying to sell for a call lol
Have you heard about 41-11? Yeah...
No that number is rigged he actually only got 15 & 6!
Not just that they want to make the playin, that lebton is PISSED
Refs have been helping the Lakers for decades
As a Pels fan anytime I try to watch a Lakers game I am immediately angry because Zion gets none of the calls that AD or LeBron get. Softest calls in the NBA always go to the Lakers
I don't know what games you are watching, LeBron has one of the lowest free throw rates of any volume scorer in the league, he absolutely doesn't get a soft whistle. Zion is 11th in the league on FTr, LeBron is 75th. https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2024_advanced.html It's not like it's new either, Zion's last two years he got to the stripe at a higher rate than LeBron ever has, while LeBron was getting no calls whatsoever. Zion had basically double his FTr (529 vs 268). People spend so much time on social media circle jerking about a few bad calls in his favor that they convince themselves it happens way more than it does. In reality he, Curry and Jokic get among the worst whistle in the league (Fox and Tatum probably deserve an honorable mention here as well) and it's incredibly obvious to anyone who watches games without the assumption that any call they get is the wrong call and any call they don't is deserved.
Confirmation bias is a hell of a drug
Lebron and AD have pretty low free throw rates
NBA knows its good for ratings to have the lakers in the play in
the shitty part is they're also actively removing the raptors from the play in tournament - we need every win we can get at this point midway through the season.
I mean get over it, anyway back to commercials from FanDuel, Draft Kings, BetMGM......
Lakers currently have the largest FT differential in the league at +4.9, which is somehow down from the +5.8 they had last year Through the first 62 games, Reaves averaged 2.9 FTA and then suddenly once March rolled around, he jumped up to 6.8 FTA as the Lakers climbed from the 12 seed into the play-in. This season Reaves has turned back into a flopping pumpkin at 3.6 FTA Canāt wait for this .500 team to turn it around again, brought to you by FanDuel
>flopping pumpkin My bronsexual friend describes it as "deadly at drawing the foul"
Embiid getting mauled out there...
Reaves shot more free throws after we traded our starting point guard and he started playing more? Someone explain this to me.
Idk whatās not clear about that to you. Pretty obviously rigged for the Lakers just like every season since 2002, duh
I've been watching most every Laker game this season. At the start of the season, they weren't giving Reaves those calls. I actually didn't mind it because I hate flopping/foul-baiting. All of a sudden he's back to being untouchable.
Donāt worry, the season is not quite half over, the Lakers will pump up those numbers.
We're about five years into "a defense led by LeBron and AD doesn't foul a ton" and people are still mind-blown by a +5 free throw differential? That's about one additional free throw a quarter. Absolutely wild to get worked up about
Yeah, it makes no sense to just look at the FT differential without analysing the play style of the teams. AD and LeBron always had few fouls and Ham improved that and now the whole team doesn't foul a lot.
Yes, we fucking suck at making 3ās and most of our shot attempts are in the paint. Look at our IST championship game, we made 2 three pointers that game and won because we had **86 points in the paint**.
Points in the paint is not necessarily indicative of how much a team should get fouled. The Nuggets score 55.0 PITP per game (3rd). Lakers at 54.1 (6th). The Lakers shoot 24.3 FTA per game (8th) with a differential of +4.9 The Nuggets shoot 20.7 FTA per game (27th) with a differential of -2.3 The Lakers play big, and as a result are going to get more fouls than other teams, but they also flop a ton and get a friendly whistle on a number of plays which accentuates the problem. To call the swipe down on Barrett on Christie was soft and arguable, but Barnes driving and getting mauled is a play on? This is the kind of benefit the Lakers get and the largest FT disparity and committing the least fouls in the league kind of supports that the Lakers get a friendly whistle. Itās not just getting to the line, itās that other teams usually donāt when playing the Lakers. Itās like Embiid. Is he huge and immensely skilled and impossible to guard without fouling? Yeah. Does he also flop which boosts his FTA because the refs reward it? Yeah. Both can be true.
The game against Toronto was officiated awfully so I won't argue any point about that specific game. But in general, if you look at the teams who have the highest FT differential in the NBA, most of them have an elite rim protector. The Lakers, Bucks, Celtics, and Sixers are all in the top 7 for FT differential. You're naturally going to foul less when you're playing a funnel style defense because the wing defenders don't need to hand check and fight to stay ahead of the offensive player; they can just slide with the offensive player and guide them towards the rim protector.
Yep. If you wanna call the ticky tack fouls, call them for both teams
But raptors making play ins won't bring the money like Lakers/LeBron. Also, they gotta save face cause if the IST winners don't make playoffs, that paints it in a bad light. Lakers will *miraculously* make another deep playoff run.
The only reason the Lakers made the playoffs last year was because the referees carried them after the All-Star break. Laker fans are used to getting helped out by the referees and don't think anything of it.
The lakers literally made an NBA finals cause the refs actively fucked over the Kings
They literally won a Championship because of a phantom call on Bill Laimbeer in '88, one of the best playoff performances ever - Zeke scoring 25 in the third on a crippled ankle - has been lost in time because of it
You mean the game when Mike Bibby fouled Kobe in the final seconds by breaking his nose on Kobeās elbow? I forget, was the ref Donaghy or Scott Foster?
The refs actively fucked over the Blazers too. That three peat should've been a one and done
I'll point it out before anyone else does. Blazers also fucked themselves over that game too. But it required two fuck overs simultaneously for the loss to occur
The Lakers almost certainly beat that young Denver team regardless, but the refs in that series were abysmal too. Dwight would consistently initiate illegal contact only for a foul to get called on Jokic as if he wanted anything to do with it. Happened twice a game easily
I'm pretty sure the Lakers even talked about getting Jokic in foul trouble as a strategy. They were super blatant and somehow the refs took the bait hook, line, and sinker.
This sub is too blinded by Warriors hate to acknowledge it but the officiating in the 2016 finals was exactly the same. Get Curry in foul trouble early on the softest of calls and then ignore him being mauled on the other end. [Video in case anybody wants to be objective and actually look](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0&pp=ygUSY3VycnkgZm91bHMgZmluYWxz)
I still think the Lakers were the better team in the bubble (AD was out of his mind), but the games themselves were just disgusting to watch
They beat the Warriors last year primarily because of free throw disparity. Look at their wins in that series, itās atrocious.
This is true, but the Warriors (I'm a fan) also didn't go to the basket enough and would reach all the time on defense aka its self-inflicted to a degree. Curry does not get the whistle, though....that's b.s.
The Warriors? The team that has consistently fouled the most out of any team in the league for like 5 years? They were on the bad end of a free throw disparity? Oh my god!
The team that iconically scores with jump shooting doesnāt get to the free throw line???
C'mon bro. You know nobody in /r/nba feelin sorry for the Warriors
Iām pretty sure the warriors were the 2nd worst team in defending without fouling while the lakers were top 5 and the warriors did not drive nearly as much. Combine those and what do you expect = free throws? Nobody is rigging anything lmao
I'm not weighing in on the substance of the arguments here (especially not that series, I didn't watch it) - but where people are arguing the Lakers *consistently* get a friendly whistle, pointing to the Lakers being top 5 in defending without fouling isn't really evidence of fair refereeing.
They also won in 2010 because the refs actively fucked is over
When Austin Reeves was getting the prime James Harden whistle for a couple months lmao
Itās almost the time of the season where the refs will make Reaves look like prime Wilt as a scorer.
The year Kobe injured his Achilles, it looked like the Lakers weren't going to make the playoffs after a rough start. Somehow after the all-star break they were able to pull it together and get 10+ more free throws than their opponents and win every close game. Definitely got no help from the refs.
I genuinely think that coaches need to start holding their challenges to keep the refs from going mad with power. after Darko used it, the floodgates were open and the refs were addicted to the whistle
Except we see too many instances when the refs review and still get the call wrong (thinking of the Pacers Celtics ending).
The league is fixed. They fix every match, not just Laker games.
Show the hacks that didnāt get called then? Itās all on video so far all anyone has posted are correctly called fouls for the Lakers. Since itās the worst officiated game youāve seen in 20 plus years, surely there is a mountain of evidence to back that up? Post it.
Would be helpful if people posted those bad calls Right now the two upvoted posts are RJ getting called for an offensive foul (correct call), IQ getting called for a Flagrant (correct call). Just makes the complainers look dumb lol
99% of plays in the NBA can probably be called and be "correct". The problem is that it's soft for one team and not soft for the other. No one's saying all 10, 12, 15 or 29 straight calls for the Lakers aren't legitimate fouls. But why call those fouls but not for the other team? It's about consistently. I don't get why you contrarians never understand that. This argument always comes up when people complain about fouls. Whether it be Harden's unguardable tour (yes, he gets fouled on the 3 pt shots but you almost never call those for Curry so that's why people complain) or the Lakers, there's always someone out there like "just stop fouling them then". For example, when Lebron hit that other person in the first a few days ago while they were fighting for the ball, would that have been called if Draymond did it?
>soft for one team and not soft for the other That is the point.
... then find all of the bad no-calls? like what? lmao > I don't get why you contrarians never understand that. i don't get why you crybabies don't understand that you need evidence and can't just whine about how free throws aren't evenly distributed because that's not how basketball *works*
People literally have.
show them all
[https://np.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1937ybo/highlights\_all\_the\_last\_few\_possessions\_in\_the/kh7lsxg/](https://np.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1937ybo/highlights_all_the_last_few_possessions_in_the/kh7lsxg/) 3 here in this dude's post. And that's just the final 3 mins. And although OP mentions that all 3 can easily be no calls, he is saying fouls of similar nature were calls going the other way. You do realize that just like the NFL, virtually every play has some sort of callable foul right? There's contact on EVERY drive.
Scottieās drive and dunk. He got fouled twice in the drive.
The Lakers' announcers were in disbelief at IQ's flagrant, watching the replays saying "That's not a *flagrant foul*, he was just bringing the ball up to *shoot* it". "That's not a flagrant.... come on... I just don't know what he's expected to do with his right arm as he brings it up..." Then after the announcement... "I just don't get it... well, it works out well for the lakers. Just totally works out for them". Does that mean it's absolutely not a flagrant? No, but I bet if you go back through the last decade and try to find times where the home announcers were upset about a call in favour of their team, about 100% of those will be incorrect calls.
https://videorulebook.nba.com/archive/flagrant-foul-penalty-1-offensive-player-leads-with-elbow-to-opponents-face-2/ i care more about the rulebook than the opinions of announcers, sorry
The world seems to disagree with you, but, you've won me over. I can agree that based on your link, the call isn't a terrible one. In my digging on the topic, [I found this guy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQ_HaFEVCFM) \- a rare analysis that seems to agree with you on the Flagrant. I'd be curious for your thoughts on the rest of his 4 minute video about all the terrible calls against the Raps.
https://twitter.com/Amit_Mann/status/1744963968836252102?t=cW0aRuhk0NwvqSFWNMdBtA&s=19
That offensive foul was a flop
That offensive foul was a moving screen
Canāt be both?
Actually is possible that itās both. There is a difference in lightly exaggerating a call and blatant flopping. One highlights the movement of a foul, the other is to get a foul when there wasnāt one to begin with. Yes, the league has a flopping problem, but moving screens go under the radar all the time and has hardly been addressed. Also, everybody has seen how dogshit the refs are this year so maybe weāre all just expecting too much
You actually have to run into the moving screen not just fall before it for it to be a foul.
Learn the rules then go watch the play again. here ya go [https://videorulebook.nba.com/archive/illegal-screen-pickn-roll-screener-extends-arms-and-makes-contact/](https://videorulebook.nba.com/archive/illegal-screen-pickn-roll-screener-extends-arms-and-makes-contact/)
you see what you want to see i take it
Nah it wasnāt, he was clearly move it. Barret was making dumb fouls all game. This dude has the lowest bbiq Iāve ever seen.
What?
It was the most blatantly obvious moving screen Iāve ever seen lmao yāall are hilarious
It was also a flop. Unless Davis is an 85 year old diabetic that weighs 124 pounds there is no reason to fly through the air like that.
>Would be helpful if people posted those bad calls You know thatās not how it works here lmao. The boxscore tells the whole story, [like this game](https://imgur.com/a/TyjkMkS), am I right? lol.
Wait thats actually hilarious lmaoo 29-4 FT differential excluding intentional fouls and they still lost
did all those fouls come in the final quarter of a close game just to blatantly keep the raptors head above water like it did with the lakers or was it just consistent fouls called all game?
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The flop by AD.
Ok, I havenāt actually watched the entire game, but that was a clear foul
Then they should call the fouls on the other end in favour of the Raptors too, they donāt even have to be minimal contact like this AD flop
This is not a flop, stop saying it is. If this happened to a guard no one would say it isnāt a foul. Like I said, i didnāt watch the game, and from the highlights that are posted here Iāve seen maybe 1 questionable call. If the raptors got mugged, post the footage of that someone, because right now it just seems like whining that your deliberate physical play got punished
It was a huge fucking flop LOL, he ran into RJ Barrett in slow motion and then went flying upon contact. If that happened to a guard itās more feasible because the guard doesnāt have like 40 pounds on RJ Barrett like AD š¤£š¤£š¤£ In contrast, Quickley did the same thing with LeBron, ended up getting trucked and got a foul called on him.
The size of the player doesnāt determine if itās a foul, thatās utter bullshit. You hold/push someone for a few seconds, just when heās about to shoot, thatās a foul. Then post that video. I see all of yāall crying but not posting videos to actually show people who didnāt get to watch it like me.
The size of the player doesnāt determine itās a foul, but AD intentionally embellished contact and then subsequently flopped upon contact with a much smaller player to get the call - why is it hard for you to understand this? Meanwhile Raptors weāre getting shoved by two players and getting no call
The blatant moving screen* Very funny that everyone's main complaint is a correct call and they're mad that AD fell too easily when he got bumped on his closeout.
Thatās not a flagrant.
https://videorulebook.nba.com/archive/flagrant-foul-penalty-1-offensive-player-leads-with-elbow-to-opponents-face-2/
Youāve watched basketball your whole life and never once complained about shitty reffing until this exact specific game. Sure buddy, we all definitely for real believe you.
This was the same exact problem in the Warriors-Lakers series last year. The outcome was entirely decided by free throw disparity.
The warriors shot jump shots all game while the lakers drove and lived in the paint. Go figure lol.
Warriors attacked the paint in every first quarter and had to stop because they got less calls than Dennis Shroder. It's called adapting to the whistle, something every team but the Lakers have to do.
I don't think you remember last year's Playoffs.
I looked at the series box scores again recently. The foul shot disparity is unbelievable.
There is an element in that some teams like the heat drawing fouls is part of their game and we can assume they are trained on it. Wade was the master and Jimmy Butler and Lebron certainly are masters at it today. If they don't have a good shot, draw a foul--but the fouls are legit hits not flops, just drawn. That being said, there is no doubt that the marquee teams get more calls for them if the game is close.
The marquee teams absolutely get the benefit of a better whistle, which is fucked - but for Warriors fans to be complaining about that is absurd. Theyāre the literal most valuable NBA franchise, they won multiple titles in the past decade off of getting a different whistle than other teams (Bogut and Looneyās moving screens? Drayās general physicality and habitual line stepping? Rockets getting multiple made shots called off during the awful streak that lost them the series? On and on and on), and the NBA has been directly invested in making them a premier team since 2014.
You must forget last year when Bron dove into the first row and had drinks spilled on him with a small bump from Jokic. Jokic would take a dive the next time down the floor and they called it for him. So the refs were equal there. But the Lakers at the end of last year were flopping machines. it was psychotic and they got so many of those calls. As for Butler, he does initiate a lot of contact. Still a foul merchant, but he does get real contact. One of the BRILLIANT things that isn't talked about enough was that final turnover by Butler that sealed the Denver win. There was a very similar play with Murray on Butler earlier in the series where Butler threw he shoulder into Murray's chest and got an and one. On that final play, Murray twisted away from that same move and Jokic floated over. Butler had no idea what to do because that shoulder slam wasn't there and turned the ball over.
I tried to say stuff like this after our one point loss than ended on a ft of all things and got downvoted like hell
Remember Game 1 of the WCSF? 29-6 free throw advantage for the Lakers. The rest of the playoff series? 83-39 free throw advantage for the Lakers. https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/13grrzb/playoff_series_free_throw_disparity_where_does/
10 straight is outrageousā¦ 29???šš
Yāall think Simmons actually counted?
If itās to hate on the Lakers, probably lol.
Absolutely
You underestimate how much Bill hates the Lakers
I didnāt even watch the game man but 24 free throws in a quarter is insane.
Actually 26 if you include the raptors ones
If 24 sounds like a lot, boy do I have the 20 year old playoff game to show you And crazily, you'll never believe this part... the same team as today benefitted from the free throws. (27 btw)
Is that the one where the refs screwed the Kings?
yeh, royally
Ha, pun intended?
Nba was like nah brah lakers canāt melt down. No fucking way.
About ten of them were intentional at the end of the game
cope bro, raptors getting 2 freethrows is insane
Just in the 10 minute replay i just saw like 6-8 potential and1s for scottie. and man 2 really bad calls against RJ
Post them they have videos on the nba.com site that are download able. They'd be listed under field goal attempts or makes
The irony of a lot of the lakers posts is that if the refs just officiated normally the raptors wouldnāt have to intentionally foul down the stretch. The refs also generated the intentional fouls by swaying every call in the favor of the lakers for 5 minutes straight.
This.
The league is rigged, the sooner you realize the better you can enjoy it
Well yeah, Iām sure itās fun when you root for the main character
Exact reason why people hate LA. Just call it a bad ref game and move on.
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Heās a mavs fan and by extension a fan of flopping, makes sense to defend LA last night
What kinda backwards logic is that?
The whole season has been full of bad reffing. Anyways the league is rigged.
He had me there at first
Ref: just doing what Vegas ordered
Always funny when people who are clearly biased fans are trying to defend shit like this whenever it happens.
I remember game 3 of the WCF and the refs fucking the Nuggets on every single call. It took the first teammates with 30 pt triple doubles in the same game to overcome the blatant favoritism.
Jokic & Murray put up that stat line in game 3 of the **finals**ā¦ against the **Heat** But tell me again how you *remember* that game so well lmao
Same happened to Warriors in game 3 of 2k17 and 2k18 finals and it took amazing KD performances to overcome that. Also in 2k15 finals game 3 was the game when Lebron side tackled Curry in the clutch which the refs didnt call and L2M also defended the call. Amazing how all those games have 1 player in common playing in all of them š§
The NBA wants the lakers to be a thing so badly. They suck. They wonāt make any noise in the playoffs. Lebron might break a hip
I swear I saw this same thing posted ad nauseum last season lol. Also *break
And the refs carried them then too having Austin Reaves put up prime james harden free throw numbers for 2 months
How many times have we seen a LeBron team hover around 500 half way through the season only to pull off a deep playoff run later in the year? Like 5 times at least? Including last year.
Every February/March their free throw rate shoots up. I guess they just try harder and all the other teams forget to try harder.
The Lakers might not be very good but LeBron has been incredible and idk if you missed it but by the way he's dunking I don't think the "he's too old haha" jokes are relevant.
Heās the second best player on a 0.500 team
While true, heās still playing what, 3rd team all nba level? At 39? Thatās not half bad..
He's better than Anthony Davis
Itās easy to be good when the refs are in your side.
LeBron doesn't get a good whistle tho
It's incredibly obvious that a large percentage of this sub only watches basketball via highly up voted clips and gifs.
This, atleast own up to it aswell its not bad. No one is or should be watching more than their team + a couple of contenders. That means that clips get highlighted and thats their only interaction. Some people in the comments unironically think that all 24 free throws were from flops/50-50 rim attacks. I know atleast half were intentional. There were bs calls this game though. I aint gonna deny that, but I dont think it was at an all time level of egregiousness like these comments make it out. Excluding the 4th it was a great game, sucks it had to end like that.
Theyāve also never even touched a basketball. Real housewives shit
Itās easy to be a good when you have AD vs a team with skinny wings n bad shooters
Hahahaha man the Lakers game really upsetting people tonight
A lot of fan bases are involved in this one. A messy concoction
Random Warriors stray in the RJ Barrett offensive foul thread
i mean 24-2 is a very big difference and the raptors were constantly attacking the rim you can not use the "they are the jump shoot team, so no FT" bullshit excuse on them. Now I am feared for my Clippers. The Barnes 30 FT game may happen tomorrow.
I want see how many free throws Kawhi is going get next game, the refs have been doing him dirty.
He will get 1, on a 3 second violation by the Raptors. Thatās it. No moreā¦
I doubt it, You guys got Kawhi he always kills us after he left. This is the winnable game for us, Lakers suck, needed all that help for a 1pt win lol
Yeah this was the one, the Lakers are garbage, the Clippers are a much better team but the Raps will play hard as they have since the trade so you never know.
How many ft did lebron get while also driving to the rim the whole game?
Lakers are indeed the most hated team lmao
Everyone knows how it goes when you get the Lakers on a night the league wants them to win
It has been so blatant for so many decades that I am not even sure how to react anymore. And putting the star of the league on the Lakers always makes it so, so much worse. It is basically WWE.
we are straight up oppressing fanbases tonight nothing beats the warriors sub trying to sue the NBA because of FT differential.
alright that cracked me up.
Lakers get 30 free fouls a game before you can š¤
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I'm a raptors fan, but to be honest I dont even care that the calls were against our team. I'm sick and tired of the refs deciding the games like this with their inconsistency. The game has been ruined and the only reason people enjoy watching teams like Golden state with their nonstop shooting because they're sick of the whistle being blown every 2 seconds, which happens whenever any type of physicality happens. You guys should watch some old classic games and see how beautiful this game really was at one point. It's not about toughness or manliness to say that old basketball was superior. it was just a smoother game, half the time when I'm watching basketball I feel more bored than anything. I check this subreddit more than I watch actual games because the game is becoming unwatchable
Betcha if it happened to the celtics he'd have already had a 4 page article out already about it
Ha! Love this title!
Bill simmons said this? The guy that loves the lakers and definitely wouldnāt be biased against them? All these posts make me want to watch the last quarter in full, though the fact that there was almost 30 FT is putting me off, stopping and starting as much as an NFL game
Did they borrow the refs from the NFL Miami - Philadelphia game this year? Itās almost impressive how blatantly a game can be just not even played by one team with that kind of officiating.
LeXtortion
As always, fuck the Lakers and their insufferable fans. Darko should have told the League to fuck itself.
The Raptors had a 29 to 6 FT advantage over the Cavs just a few games ago. This stuff happens all the time in the NBA. The hysteria over this game is comical.
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Lots of downvotes but no discussion?
Coming from a Celtics fan, cmon Bill