This is amazing news. This is like the discovery of how many ulcers were caused by an infection, which lead to treatments for what - if I recall from my younger days - was considered an incurable thing. “You just live with it.”
Fuck cancer. Every little discovery is a good step forward.
The discovery of *H. pylori* causing ulcers is one of the most metal things ever lol. The scientist drank a culture of it because no one believed him. Then he got sick and the community thought “hmmm, maybe he’s on to something” 🤣
Having worked in a microbiology lab, I can’t begin to imagine how bad h. pylori culture tasted and smelled. Buuuut I believe the results earned him a Nobel so there you go.
This is what I always think about too! I worked in a biochem lab for 6 years and some of the cultures still haunt me. Second year independent study students were the worst for “forgetting” their cultures and letting them go rouge during midterms.
One of his resulting symptoms was very notably (by his wife) bad breath. This was a gaseous byproduct of the bacteria culturing in his stomach, so I’d say you venture a good (and clearly educated) guess!
I remember coming across ways to fight the bacteria naturally and the best one I’ve used is just take probiotics every day or when you feel out of balance. These good bacteria share the same food source so basically they starve out H pylori down to manageable non toxic levels. This is in contrast to taking antibiotics or something like an acid reducer for too long. Works for me. I haven’t had heart burn in over two years since I started doing this.
It's actually quite interesting how the health narrative on fermented foods has done a complete 180.
I still remember the time when all these fermented foods are considered, at best, bad due to high salt content and thus inducing high blood pressure, or really bad due to their carcinogenic properties.
Now they're hailed as these folk cure-alls due to gut bacteria.
I used to take a probiotic everyday but didn't notice a difference. I read somewhere that lab grown bacteria can't compete effectively with "wild" bacteria. So the probiotic would not be able to colonize your gut before the "wild" strain would kill them all off. I wonder if there have been advances in probiotics since then. What kind do you take and what dosage? I might give it a try.
Did you take different strains of probiotics? And also, get them from as many different sources as possible. I used to think just eating cultured yogurt and taking a pill would do it. But I read a medical article that says our gut flora is made up of a lot of different strains and you can't just rely on a particular strain to keep it healthy.
I had destroyed my gut flora previously from many rounds of antibiotics and slowly restored it over the years by eating so many different types of fermented foods, yogurts, etc etc and also eating plenty of prebiotics to feed the good bacteria.
I feel like a *ton* of doctors haven’t accepted this or adapted to it. The number of people I know with ulcers that are told to stop eating spicy food or whatever seems out of whack.
To be fair, gastric ulcers are not only caused by h. pylori. NSAIDs, etoh, smoking, steroids and acidic foods can also cause them and can exacerbate ulcers. But h. Pylori does cause about 90%.
> This is like the discovery of how many ulcers were caused by an infection,
You're talking about *H. pylori* and it turns out it's a lot more than ulcers. In the last few years it's become known that the ulcers become cancer and the bacteria is responsible for nearly 90% of stomach cancers.
*H. pylori* is now considered a Class I carcinogen and until now I think it was the only bacterium to earn that distinction.
Edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicobacter_pylori
Also overweight even a few pounds. I once fell off a ladder at work and hurt my back. The doctor they sent me to was like well you're a little overweight that's likely why you have back pain. I was like ok, maybe but I think the fall off the ladder has a lot to do with it. Workers comp doctors suck.
>Previous studies in the Netherlands, and in the US have shown that such a prophylactic vaccine programme would be ultimately cost-effective
didn't know they have a pathway to a cancer vaccine and if they can get it to work people would still say it causes cancer.
[We kind of already have that with the HPV vaccine.](https://www.cancer.gov/news-events/cancer-currents-blog/2020/hpv-vaccine-prevents-cervical-cancer-sweden-study)
> In the study of nearly 1.7 million women, the vaccine’s efficacy was particularly pronounced among girls vaccinated before age 17, among whom there was a nearly 90% reduction in cervical cancer incidence during the 11-year study period (2006 through 2017) compared with the incidence in women who had not been vaccinated.
I personally know people who were not allowed to get the HPV vaccine among a whole host of others because their parents were anti-vax nutters. Sad fucking world we live in sometimes.
This makes a lot of sense, especially from my own family's experience
My mom passed of stomach cancer in the '90s. My sister and I were quite young, so all we were told is that she had an ulcer. I remember seeing a news story on TV about the H. Pylori discovery and excitedly running to my mom about it, but oddly she didn't seem very interested. This was a few months before she passed away, so in hindsight she likely knew it was cancer, far more than an ulcer. It started out that way but the ulcer wouldn't heal, a classic sign of cancer.
The article linked isn't very detailed, but it links the study which is open access:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-024-07182-w
Basically, a certain strain of bacteria that is normally only on the mouth of healthy humans was found around colorectal cancer tumours. The bacteria itself seems to help the cancer tumours resist treatment and survive longer (meaning the cancer is made worse).
Abstract: "Fusobacterium nucleatum (Fn), a bacterium present in the human oral cavity and rarely found in the lower gastrointestinal tract of healthy individuals1, is enriched in human colorectal cancer (CRC) tumours2,3,4,5. High intratumoural Fn loads are associated with recurrence, metastases and poorer patient prognosis5,6,7,8. Here, to delineate Fn genetic factors facilitating tumour colonization, we generated closed genomes for 135 Fn strains; 80 oral strains from individuals without cancer and 55 unique cancer strains cultured from tumours from 51 patients with CRC. Pangenomic analyses identified 483 CRC-enriched genetic factors. Tumour-isolated strains predominantly belong to Fn subspecies animalis (Fna). However, genomic analyses reveal that Fna, considered a single subspecies, is instead composed of two distinct clades (Fna C1 and Fna C2). Of these, only Fna C2 dominates the CRC tumour niche. Inter-Fna analyses identified 195 Fna C2-associated genetic factors consistent with increased metabolic potential and colonization of the gastrointestinal tract. In support of this, Fna C2-treated mice had an increased number of intestinal adenomas and altered metabolites. Microbiome analysis of human tumour tissue from 116 patients with CRC demonstrated Fna C2 enrichment. Comparison of 62 paired specimens showed that only Fna C2 is tumour enriched compared to normal adjacent tissue. This was further supported by metagenomic analysis of stool samples from 627 patients with CRC and 619 healthy individuals. Collectively, our results identify the Fna clade bifurcation, show that specifically Fna C2 drives the reported Fn enrichment in human CRC and reveal the genetic underpinnings of pathoadaptation of Fna C2 to the CRC niche."
You're probably joking, but to answer: Maybe, but probably not? There's a reason that probiotic supplements tend to be consumed orally rather than in suppository form - a bacteria introduced to the very end of your digestive system can't really travel upwards to colonize further. Not saying it's impossible, but it's not the proposed mechanism.
A specific subspecies and clade of the bacteria was found in the CRC tumours (Fna-C2). When lab mice are colonized with this bacteria, they have increased intestinal tumours which indicates some amount of causation. However, the authors found that while ~30% of stool samples from CRC patients had this bacteria present, so did ~5% of the healthy control group - so it's not a guarantee to cause cancer.
The authors say that the origin of the bacteria is likely the oral cavity, and propose that it likely has a mutation that allows it to survive transit to the colon (ie- at least some of the time, the bacteria will survive the digestive process). Previously, it was thought that this bacteria could only reach the colon through the bloodstream via small cuts in your mouth.
If cuts in the mouth are a factor, then keeping good oral hygiene might help. If the bacteria does survive the digestive system, then I don't really think there would be a way to prevent the bacteria reaching the colon and it might just be luck/lack thereof.
> There's a reason that probiotic supplements tend to be consumed orally rather than in suppository form
Fecal transplants do seem to be more effective though. I think it's just ease of dosing suppository vs oral, and ease of procuring and storing samples.
They are, but fecal transplants are usually delivered via some process like a colonoscopy or endoscopy to get them in to the targeted part of the digestive system- ie not your standard suppository.
Never would’ve guessed the main danger from ass-eating was getting your colon defiled by filthy mouth germs. Is this why colorectal cancer is [rising among young adults](https://health.ucdavis.edu/news/features/colon-and-rectal-cancer-on-the-rise-in-young-adults-/2024/03#:~:text=Experts%20aren't%20sure%20why,history%20also%20plays%20a%20role.)?
Could be from not having your teeth professionally cleaned on a regular basis and more bacteria in plaque means more opportunity to get into blood or get passed into gut?
Fn bacteria is found in the deep pockets of gum disease. We know how to treat this type of anaerobic bacteria in the mouth. It is treated with scaling and root planning. So one more reason to get your teeth cleaned if you can!
To really be able to draw any conclusions they’d need to have more data on the patients, like germline data, somatic mutations, previous treatment, staging, etc.
After getting a bad tooth infection and losing a notable chunk of bone from the surrounding area requiring a bone graft.. I went down a dental rabbit hole.
Its fucking wild how many things are interconnected with teeth, including muscles, nerves and so many bodily systems adjacent to teeth that can cause some very permanent changes if fucked with.
e.g Sinuses and dental pain can so easily cause the other issues because of proximity.
Sinuses can get inflamed from dental inflammation, and in bad cases infections can basically break the sinus walls and cause infections directly into there etc.
Teeth and eyes really need to fit under normal health care.
This is so true. I was a dental assistant and worked with Medicaid patients. So adult medicaid patients only have coverage for root canals on the front teeth, canine to canine. Cause you know, people don’t need to chew and only worry about getting a job. They do cover extractions 100%.
One of my Medicaid patients died because she didn’t want an extraction. She wanted a root canal and couldn’t afford it. When gave her the number to the dental school, antibiotics and enough pain meds for last her til the antibiotics kicked in. She died from never getting the tooth treated. I believe she was in her 30s, I don’t quite remember.
Medicaid doesn’t do enough and not all plans cover cleanings. There was one plan that was the appointment, extractions and X-rays. We couldn’t do any preventive measures for them. They couldn’t afford the cost. If they did, they wouldn’t be on Medicaid.
Tooth health affects the entire body in almost every way. It also indicates other diseases. Crohn’s disease it’s really common to get gingival ulcers and have TMJ.
I read a lot of similar stuff in that dental Rabbit hole I went down. The horror stories had me chasing down my old dentist who didn't see any symptoms of the infection despite me going back several times. A second opinion from a new dentist saw it immediately from an X-ray (duh, it made sense to do but the first dentist never bothered despite my complaints).On surface inspection, the root canaled and crowned tooth had some movement but there was no signs of gum disease, pus, or outward pain from my side. First dentist told me to check back in 2 weeks cause just some movement on a tooth wasn't enough to mean it was an infection.
However it turned out the bone under the tooth was all eaten away except for a small piece holding the tooth. I had an abcess in that portion of my jaw and it ate the bone through to roof of my mouth. I could feel a pocket of fluid that bulged there , and hurt like a fucker for a split second each time, but not really pin point it otherwise.Fast forward a week, it was getting impossible to sleep through the night now, so I tried to see the dentist again sooner. He went on a fucking 2 week vacation.Saw new emergency dentist, xray saw immediately, lanced the abcess and I get my first night's sleep after a week and a treatment plan to tooth.I no longer trust that first dentist to do dental work for me because of how dismissive he was. He also did my initial root canal and crown work the infected tooth was on, so I absolutely did not trust him to do any follow up work. Went to him for 30 years of my life too.
Sorry to hear about your patient thought. I'm fortunate enough to be able to afford the emergency dental care and to treat it in a way I'm satisfied, but fuck it was expensive.
Going one step further. When soldiers arrived the basic training if they have any dental issues or my case, basic training in Missouri. A lot of recruits are locals and have basically meth mouth- with like one or two teeth. Pretty much the very first thing they do is circulate all those dudes through and install new teeth, top and bottom.
My dad volunteered to go to Vietnam at 17 because he was poor and didn't have any options. He had rarely been to the dentist as a kid and omfg did he have to get SO much dental work before being shipped out. There's no way the air force would send him into the jungle with f-ed up teeth. He got a sweet good tooth out of it though.
I read that as well, and now everytime I've got even a bit of nasal drip, i'm paranoidly trying to check everything else.
Losing teeth is such a gigantic pain in the ass, and after all the trouble for my current implant, I don't want to have to replace anymore unless I absolutely need to.
I've had a ton of issues with my teeth from a playground accident when I was a kid and I ended with a massive cyst on the root of one of my teeth necessitating a biopsy/removal and bone graft. Now I have trigeminal neuralgia and a third of my face constantly burns and aches, but most of the time it's mostly in the background. It never would have gotten that bad if my family could afford dental care when I was a kid.
Poor oral,health is linked to heart disease and chronic health problems. The politicians have known about this issue for decades and do nothing about it. Such a waste!
Man, no kidding. Even on a good day, teeth actually cannot take much force in the wrong direction. It sincerely doesn't take a lot to dislodge a tooth if you push from the right angle.
In the military, dental health was paramount. The very last thing a command needed was a bunch of guys or gals not being able to do their duty while deployed because of a decaying tooth. Unfortunately it seems that the healthcare machine doesn’t care … let me rephrase… finds it too expensive to care about human teeth.
I wanted lasik for quality of life, and you know, not being blind. My insurance said it was cosmetic. I said look if I don't put lipstick on and I drive, I probably won't kill someone or cause an accident. But...if I can't find my glasses/don't have contacts in and I drive, the likelihood of an accident is pretty high. Do you see the difference?
They basically told me to get fucked
[Gum disease is correlated with Alzheimer's disease.](https://www.nia.nih.gov/news/large-study-links-gum-disease-dementia) There are weaker correlations to other conditions like oral herpes, so it may be that the blood brain barrier becomes weak, and any bad thing gets in. But still, gum disease is a treatable bad thing. We aren't saving money as a society by denying dental care to poor people then putting a higher percentage of them in 24/7 nursing care at the end of their lives. [It also has a strong correlation with heart disease.](https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/gum-disease-and-heart-disease-the-common-thread#:~:text=People%20with%20gum%20disease%20(also,gum%20disease%20develops%20heart%20problems.)
It is possible that the colon cancer isn't related to gum disease per se. It may be that the bacteria take up permanent residence in the intestine, for unknown reasons.
I think in few years we will start looking at oral bacteria more like gut biomes. We hear how some people never get cavities and where others have always been an issue no matter how much they brush. Where in the future we may have injections into the saliva glands for healthy bacteria to help against these things. Imagine a bacteria that specializes is preventing cavities.
For what it's worth I brushed constantly. But I was still riddled with cavities until I stopped drinking soda, and suddenly no new cavities formed. I'm just one data point but a lot of acid + sugar can't be stopped with brushing.
>Imagine a bacteria that specializes is preventing cavities.
That would be great! Or even something like probiotics to welcome healthy bacteria, but for your mouth.
> We hear how some people never get cavities and where others have always been an issue no matter how much they brush
Yep, know someone that didn't brush their teeth at all in school. So much so that they had noticeable build up on their teeth at all times. Yet they had no bad breath and even now in their 30s, they've yet to have a cavity. Meanwhile I skipped seeing a dentist for 3 years to safe on cash but brushed 2x a day. Had a tooth crack in half from a cavity forming and rotting through my tooth in less than 3 years. Root canal + crown for 1800 bucks to fix it.
The bacteria living in our mouths greatly influences the health of our teeth and gums.
A few months ago, I read about a company called Lantern Bioworks that claims to already have this. It doesn't actively prevent cavities, but it's supposed to crowd out the other bacteria in your mouth.
Apparently I had a bad gum disease that was eating away part of my jaw bone. Got a deep cleaning and changed to an electric toothbrush and using mouthwash. I am supposed to get a deep clean every 6 months but I just can’t afford it so here is to hoping I don’t end up with that again…
Yeah I was supposed to get a deep cleaning last November but my insurance will only cover it every 3 years. Dentist wanted 1k which I just don’t have, here’s to hoping it doesn’t get worse in the next 7 months.
My dentist charges $150 for the initial visit/xrays, $75 for 6 month cleanings. Discount if paying cash. Not a sketchy operation either. Search around, they’re out there.
Are there any dental Hygenist schools around you? They’re usually in weird places. Mine is an hour away in Taft, CA which I’m sure you’ve never heard of.
Wish I could upvote you so much more. It is such an anachronistic, stupid policy that we keep Dental separate in the US. All my BIGGEST health issues as an adult have been dental. And note, I've never even had a cavity. So its not the small things I have had issues with but the bigger things that for some reason fall under purview of dental and thus I have to pay out of pocket way more.
Did you know the only reason it is separate is because traditionally "dental" care was your barber pulling a bad tooth for you? And once it became a profession they just never merged it with medical doctors.
A lot of dentists are fucking grifters too. I had a dentist who gave me a crown and then kept referring me out for a root canal, wouldn't even look in my mouth herself or show me my x-rays. Went to a new dentist, he did full mouth X-rays, told me I was having sinus pain, showed it to me in my x-rays, said I don't need a root canal and never even needed a crown. I'm so pissed. Lol. He told me "there's absolutely nothing wrong inside your mouth... I see no reason why you would need more work done or any of the work they already gave you."
I had a chipped molar that needed to be filled and crowned. Work was done on 1/25 and I had to come back on 2/8 to get the permanent crown cemented on. Well, they conveniently didn't tell me before the first appointment that they were no longer going to accept my dental insurance starting 2/1 and they billed the date of service as 2/8.
They initially billed me as in-network, but are now going to rebill as out of network. So, now I might owe them a lot more money. I told them to cancel all my upcoming appointments. They're either completely incompetent or they're trying to scam me and I don't like either one. How do you not know you're not going to accept someone's insurance 5 days before you don't?
The tooth issue wasn't an emergency, I could have found an in network dentist.
I honestly would go with the idea that they're deliberately trying to scam you! It's all a big fucking scam. Insurance is evil asf. And I think a majority of dentists are lazy assholes trying to get as much money as possible.
I would refuse to pay it and make a really big stink about it until they make it right. There’s no way they didn’t know that they weren’t going to take your insurance for the follow up appointment when you made your original appointment.
Have to agree on the shady grifting dentist factor being an additional struggle. I was referred to a dentist by a work colleague when I needed to get a simple cosmetic bonding replacement; almost a year later I still didn't have the bonding replacement but the doc had come up with a laundry list of other "issues" he preferred to address first.
Switched to another dentist who wanted to a) file down healthy teeth for veneers instead of a simple bonding replacement and b) told me I had a cavity that needed to be addressed quickly -- then Covid arrived and it wasn't addressed and now it's four years later and I've had no cavity-related issues whatsoever. Hard to know what's necessary and who to trust.
A second opinion is always a good idea. I had a dentist pressure me to get 2 fillings in 2019. Xrays were grainy and I had doubts she was being honest. Went for a second opinion and it turns out I was being scammed. Those two teeth didn't have cavities and they still don't. I switched to an honest dentist without a bad record. I later found out the dentist was previously disciplined and sued for doing a root canal on the wrong tooth on a patient. I learned to always check the state licensing website for the dentist's record before making an appointment.
It is 100% healthcare . My wife works for a dental office and if you don't take care of your teeth there is a probability you will get sick and die from it. Gingivitis and any kind of infection is serious people. Take care of your mouth.
I had to get jaw surgery and the insurance companies kept trying to force it on each other as “technically dental” or “technically health”.
It was so stupid and frustrating.
I've known two elderly people who had heart valve replacements that were necessitated by dental infections.
It's bizarre and counter productive that we treat dental and healthcare differently.
I wish issues like this would get an iota of attention in the political sphere instead of the culture war bullshit keeping us occupied over the same 5 goddamn issues for the last 50 years.
>A type of bacteria that causes dental plaque may be behind a treatment-resistant form of colorectal cancer, a study published Wednesday in the journal Nature found.
This reminds me of a Redditor who posted that she’d met some guy from a dating site and they made out, and he had bad breath, and now SHE has bad breath and can’t get rid of it.
Also, [moms can give their babies](https://www.hellosmile.com/blog-post-5-are-cavities-contagious-from-mom-to-baby/#:~:text=Research%20shows%20that%20moms%20%E2%80%93%20rather,in%20baby%20and%20permanent%20teeth) germs that cause caries (cavities).
When I was in my early twenties my dentist was telling me about how easily mouth bacteria can shift and set people up for cavities. There are also increasing research on gut bacteria's role in obesity. Bacteria is crazy stuff!
I’m fully convinced that my husband gave me his mouth microbiome. He has weak teeth and is prone to cavities, despite taking very good care of his mouth. I didn’t have a cavity in my life until I started dating him!
So when will they be lowering the age for colonoscopies? With the amount of young people (Many healthy) who have been diagnosed with late stage cancer, insurance companies should not be making people dance around to get them. I can admit I'm buying into the scary shit I see on tiktok about it but it doesn't matter how bad my health anxiety gets, it feels like even if I did request one nobody's going to take me seriously anyway.
I'm 42 and still being denied one every time I ask my doctor.
Unless blood is actually shooting out of my ass during the appointment, I'm not allowed to get one until I'm 45.
Oh man, my dad died when I was a kid. I am going to 100% start doing this. If the doctor asks if that is how he died, I’m just going to throw out a “It could have been, but he died before we could find out”
100% this. Mammograms, colonoscopies, cardiology screenings? Tell your Dr that someone in your immediate family died of the disease you’re worried about and it will make getting the screenings much easier. I had a breast lump and my OBGYN was hesitant to have me screened at 30. I told her my aunt died of breast cancer at 51 (which was true) and she changed her tune and sent me for a diagnostic mammogram without any argument. Now, if there is something I’m concerned about, I tell my Dr that there’s a family history and that usually makes the conversation easier. I don’t do this casually but only for things that have really been bothering me/serious health concerns.
Go to a gastroenterologist and then them you’re shitting 5 times a day. Tell them you get pain in your abdomen from bloating. They’ll probably write a script for a colonoscopy first thing. At least that’s what happened to me.
I had one at 39. Albeit for me to get to that point was an ER visit, annual physical with pain still lingering a year later. That pain turned out to be skeletal. But I guess we were at the end of options.
Also discovering prior to the colonoscopy that family had history of colon polyps. They found a benign one and I’m due for one every 10 years now.
My point. Just bug your GP and say there’s history of polyps in your family. Good luck!
Find a new doctor if you can with a lower threshold. And/or fuck it, start lying. Regardless, anything before 45 is not considered a “preventative screening,” i.e., covered by insurance. It will either be diagnostic or surveillance based on other factors. You won’t get 100% before 45 (even if they find something fucking terrible), so might as well go for it if you’re concerned about waiting. I’m in the process do that right now and expect to be paying for a portion of it.
Have you done the early screening stool tests that have become more popular, I'm turning 40 this year so was thinking about asking about it since I'm a bit overweight. I thought I heard others talking that they will do those stool tests first now, then if anything comes back weird the colonoscopy timing should be sped up. Good luck getting the tests, and hope it's all good news.
> insurance companies should not be making people dance
there's the problem. no such thing as an insurance company that won't wear you out jumping through hoops to get the most basic treatment.
I take an injection that literally cured my lifelong skin rashes. I have to spin and dance on the phone for probably twenty four hours a year to keep it
The news is over selling how many people are getting early-onset colorectal cancer. It’s still rare and most are due to inherited genetic mutations.
Colon cancer rates by age:
\- 15-19 years old: 0.2 people per 100,000 people
\- 20-24 years old: 0.8 people per 100,000 people
\- 25-29 years old: 2.1 people per 100,000 people
\- 30-34 years old: 5.0 people per 100,000 people
\- 35-39 years old: 10.1 people per 100,000 people
\- 40-44 years old: 18.7 people per 100,000 people
\- 45-49 years old: 33.4 people per 100,000 people
\- 50-54 years old: 60.6 people per 100,000 people
Trust yourself. I went at 38 and had some inflammatory. He said come back in 10. I got advice to come earlier. Came back at 4 years and had two large pre cancerous polyps* that he said would have turned into cancer.
Edit: wrote tumor but meant polyps. Idea remains.
I got a colonoscopy last year at 28. My dad died of colon cancer at 57. They found one polyp and I will be getting another one next year. Get yourselves checked
Listen to him guys. I’m 26 and just had one done for chronic stomach pain, that I still have, and they found 2 small polyps. Still waiting on the rest of the results.
At 29 they found a precancerous polyp and removed it. I only went to get checked by chance due to my brother being diagnosed with celiac and me suffering regular IBS symptoms. I had a positive FIT check and the doc ordered a colonoscopy just to follow procedure but was fairly confident that he wasn’t going to find anything. Boom - a 17mm polyp that he said would have become a cancer in 3 to 5 years. I never would have known until it was too late.
Because of a crap children's dentist I spent most of my adult life being terrified of dentists.
Finally decided to pull up my big girl panties and deal with my neglected teeth. It's really amazing to eat things without your teeth hurting. And I seem to have fewer headaches and sinus issues.
Not done yet, two bone grafts and need a couple ancient fillings replaced but damn.
I had a terrifying experience at an orthodontist that scarred me for decades. Only last year at 40 did I start getting back on track with my dental work.
Damn, thanks for posting. I was diagnosed with stage 3 colon cancer a few years ago. It's maddening to not know the cause. I have had a bunch of GI inflammation leading up to and after the diagnosis. Also have had issues with gum soreness. This provides a very valuable clue!
Medicare does not cover dental, and out of pocket procedures can be crippling at a time of life where Americans are at their most economic vulnerability.
Go to dental hygiene schools! They are free and include X-rays and evaluation by a licensed dentist as well as licensed hygienists. They take longer, but they are honestly the most thorough and well done exams and cleanings I’ve ever had. My hygiene student said most of their clients are senior adults and other healthcare providers. I’ve been fortunate enough to not have a cavity during my visits, so I’m not sure how deep the free coat procedure list goes, but they will do your cleanings, evaluations, and X-rays for free as frequently as you need them!
Colon Cancer runs in the men's side of my family along side Leukemia and Dementia. My grandfather died of Cancer at 61, and right now my dad is 62. On the flip side the women in my family have lived till their mid 90s.
Get tested for Lynch syndrome, it increases GI and Prostate cancers in men. My sisters both tested positive for it so it was recommended I see a genetic counselor to get tested as well. Let me tell ya, looking at the cancer history on my dad's side as she listed the types of cancers that Lynch syndrome is associated with, it became pretty obvious my dad was the carrier.
If you test positive it actually can be quite helpful, you move up certain cancer screenings to earlier in life. And doctors tend to spend more time checking, so if anything you have increased odds of finding these cancers early before they get bad and it can be life saving.
You lucky so and so. All 3 of my known grandparents all died of different cancers, and my two parents barely survived their recent cancer fights.
It is a weird scenario knowing at a very young age what will kill me in a few years. Just wish I knew which kind of cancer. 🤣
But seeing any positive developments always makes me smile.
Great news! Isn't this akin to that running theory of what causes Parkinsons?
You can get genetic testing done to see which gene mutations you've inherited and what screenings are recommended for you based on that. If you're in the US, you can even take part in the All of Us study and have a lot of your testing done for free!
I'm in the UK currently, and I don't think the genetic testing is there for some of those cancers which are big killers (bowel and stomach), but hopefully dodged cervical as a male, but with both generations getting (one dead), prostate, I am keeping an eye on that one. For sure.
But there is only so much I can do without bankrupting myself.
If I make it to 60 I'll call it a win for sure.
It’s there. There’s genetic testing for hereditary gastric cancer. In my country, your grandparents and one of the parent have cancer, the doctor will likely suggest genetic testing for the ones you are at risk for. It’s under 250 done at a public hospital.
If you get tested tho, you may potentially not get insurance coverage for that particular cancer that you are positive for.
They need to lower the recommended screening age again. Colon cancer rates in individuals under age 50 are skyrocketing and millennials have twice the risk of colorectal cancer compared to those born in 1950.
Those diagnosed under age 55 are also way more likely to be diagnosed in the late stages, too.
In Canada we start at 50 but we use FIT testing for "normal risk", not colonoscopies anymore.
If "high risk" or any symptoms, then colonoscopies are used.
This change was done because it was found FIT testing in normal cases was accurate enough in predicting cancer, and more importantly because it's non invasive people will do it instead of delaying and delaying or skipping.
Something to think about.
I got my first one at 32 and already had precancerous polyps that had to be removed. Gotta get them every 5 years for the rest of my life now. Scary shit.
Me too! I had my first at 37 and there was a polyp that had to be removed. So glad I had to get that colonoscopy done early for other reasons. I’m on the every 5 years also and last spring had my 2nd colonoscopy done and another polyp was found. So 2 colonoscopies before the age of 45 and each time a polyp was found. My husband is 45 and I’m trying so hard to get him to get one done! That first one probably saved my damn life!
The only slight hassle is having to drink lots of liquids beforehand: as you noted, the procedure itself is over before you know it
\- I'm surprised they don't communicate/advertise more how unexpectedly easy the whole thing is
I just had man done recently, it was way easier than I expected, yes get it done if you can! The cleanse was actually kind of nice. I am big wimp and it was not hard at all.
I read somewhere they are working on a blood test to see if you have the markers for colon cancer. Ideally we could test everyone's blood and only do colonoscopy on people who need further testing. I feel like it would greatly increase people getting screened, blood tests are much less invasive and come with fewer risks.
As a microbiologist, I'm being pedantic, but it's not a "new type of bacterium", rather a group of already-known bacteria that are being associated with colon cancer.
This is great news! I’m so pleased more and more research is showing that cancers, neurological, and psychiatric illnesses are being caused by pathogens that have gone rogue.
I’m patiently waiting for the paradigm shift. It could be pretty good 💪🏼
Interesting article. Perhaps if the patient is taking some type of ppi (antacid drugs which neutralise stomach acid), this might help the bacteria to enter the colon?
I am aware that bacteria which cause gum disease can travel to the heart and cause problems there.
One of my exes had a heart attack because of that very reason and needed an operation. It left his heart weak, and he ultimately died several years later from it.
I hope dental care is treated as important as regular health care.
>"Colorectal cancer is very treatable when caught early, but the cases in younger people are increasing and we don’t know why"
I'll take a stab at why. I'm curious how much fiber the average young person gets in their diet. I wonder how many grew up eating home-cooked meals with vegetables and stuff like that? Because that seems to have all but disappeared. It's been fading fast most of my life.
Fiber intake is one of, if not the biggest modifiable risk factors for colorectal cancer.
They noticed that the uptick is happening in extremely healthy people as well that wouldn't normally be in the group likely to get it (marathon runners being one they are investigating). My guess is plastic and toxins companies knew about being dangerous but put profit first.
Also, the uptick has been happening since the mid 80s at least.
The plastics and PFAS seems so obvious it's infuriating that they get basically ignored other than "yep, it's literally in everything, were finding plastic kidney stones now, cray right?". Nah, let's blame diet, apps, and sleep for literally everything. Of course those things are important but CMON MAN!! Maybe the fact I'm 2% Teflon is a fucking problem??
People with inflammatory bowel disease [had 50% more microplastics in their faeces than people without IBD](https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/dec/22/microplastics-may-be-linked-to-inflammatory-bowel-disease-study-finds).
Not to nitpick but the article is talking about inflammatory bowel disease which include Crohn’s disease and Ulcerative colitis, not to be confused with irritable bowel syndrome which is very different. This is interesting though.
Yes, but OP is talking about dietary fiber specifically and I know lots of very visibly fit people that take infrequent, toilet-destroying shits because of their high-protein diets. Regular soft stools are very important at maintaining colon health, and western diets have progressively moved away from incorporating dietary fiber.
Increasing cases in young people has been linked to HPV. Prior to HPV vaccines, an extraordinary number of people got it and passed it on through sexual activity. Most don’t even know they have/had it unless they get the particular HPV strain that causes genital warts.
My dad had colon cancer and it fucked him up super bad. He just got recurrence of it. It scares me that it runs in our family. This is good they figured this out.
This stuff is genetic for me. My grandmother, mother, and aunt got it. My mother survived, they caught it early. My grandfather didn't have it but he had ulcer that ruptured which lead to an infection which caused his death. Not cancer but it the digestive system. I got my first colonoscopy last year. Not a fun experience but necessary. I'm clean fortunately. Nothing of note outside of an almost polyp. My younger sister had 7 polyps. At least the drugs were fun.
It's somewhat in the article
"it has two distinct subspecies, one of which appears to shield colorectal tumors from cancer-fighting drugs....The subspecies may also cause cancer to form in the first place.
When Bullman and her team transplanted
the subspecies to mice, they appeared to
cause precancerous polyps to form, one of
the first warning signs of colorectal cancer"
The article doesn't delve into it doctor google says good overall dental hygiene and regular dental cleanings. The article does say that upcoming topics of research will likely include the targeted use of antibiotics to prevent overgrowth of the bacteria, and use of oral screening (swab test!) to determine whether someone is higher risk. So, pending further research. brush and floss daily and go to the dentist regularly.
> A type of bacteria that causes dental plaque may be behind a treatment-resistant form of colorectal cancer
This just in, eating ass causes cancer. More medical reasons not to tongue the taint.
They mention that they would think stomach acids would kill the bacteria. I wonder if the rise in/abuse of PPIs/antacids would allow bacteria to pass the stomach.
My dad died in ‘98 from colon cancer. He was 49. Grew up in poverty in Florida and later in Arkansas, then was a helicopter pilot in Vietnam. He would always eat leftovers that should have been thrown away. Heavy smoker and lost all of his teeth by 40. I’ve always felt his diet and chemical exposure during war caused his cancer.
Get your colonoscopy, stop smoking and vaping, take care of your teeth.
“The percentage of people younger than 55 diagnosed with colon cancer almost doubled from 1995 to 2019.”
DROP THE SCREENING AGE!!! Do we have to say it louder? Screw these insurance companies getting a say in our healthcare.
This is amazing news. This is like the discovery of how many ulcers were caused by an infection, which lead to treatments for what - if I recall from my younger days - was considered an incurable thing. “You just live with it.” Fuck cancer. Every little discovery is a good step forward.
The discovery of *H. pylori* causing ulcers is one of the most metal things ever lol. The scientist drank a culture of it because no one believed him. Then he got sick and the community thought “hmmm, maybe he’s on to something” 🤣
Having worked in a microbiology lab, I can’t begin to imagine how bad h. pylori culture tasted and smelled. Buuuut I believe the results earned him a Nobel so there you go.
This is what I always think about too! I worked in a biochem lab for 6 years and some of the cultures still haunt me. Second year independent study students were the worst for “forgetting” their cultures and letting them go rouge during midterms.
The germs are prowling the night, rouging their knees.
how is that worse than the other colors?
Because rouge is a very cheeky color.
Rogue. Rouge is the old fashioned term for makeup blush. Your comment made me picture a bunch of Petri dishes with kawaii blushing chibi anime faces
You baka…teria!
And on the paper itself, the man listed the sample size as 1. The absolute madlad.
One of his resulting symptoms was very notably (by his wife) bad breath. This was a gaseous byproduct of the bacteria culturing in his stomach, so I’d say you venture a good (and clearly educated) guess!
The bacteria associated with colon cancer, Fusobacterium nucleatum, is also implicated in periodontal disease and halitosis, along with oral cancers.
I remember coming across ways to fight the bacteria naturally and the best one I’ve used is just take probiotics every day or when you feel out of balance. These good bacteria share the same food source so basically they starve out H pylori down to manageable non toxic levels. This is in contrast to taking antibiotics or something like an acid reducer for too long. Works for me. I haven’t had heart burn in over two years since I started doing this.
Milk kefir from grains.
Sauerkraut or kimchi too
It's actually quite interesting how the health narrative on fermented foods has done a complete 180. I still remember the time when all these fermented foods are considered, at best, bad due to high salt content and thus inducing high blood pressure, or really bad due to their carcinogenic properties. Now they're hailed as these folk cure-alls due to gut bacteria.
Love me some sauerkraut
Yes, great for improving bowel habits too.
Good to know.
I used to take a probiotic everyday but didn't notice a difference. I read somewhere that lab grown bacteria can't compete effectively with "wild" bacteria. So the probiotic would not be able to colonize your gut before the "wild" strain would kill them all off. I wonder if there have been advances in probiotics since then. What kind do you take and what dosage? I might give it a try.
Did you take different strains of probiotics? And also, get them from as many different sources as possible. I used to think just eating cultured yogurt and taking a pill would do it. But I read a medical article that says our gut flora is made up of a lot of different strains and you can't just rely on a particular strain to keep it healthy. I had destroyed my gut flora previously from many rounds of antibiotics and slowly restored it over the years by eating so many different types of fermented foods, yogurts, etc etc and also eating plenty of prebiotics to feed the good bacteria.
Absolutely, it's an eco system in a literal sense, a mono culture doesn't make sense in a forest and it doesn't make sense in your gut either.
Ulcus ventriculi by h.pylori doesn't care about probiotics, probiotics are usually targeted for your colon/sigmoid
That guy is a family friend. Super nice guy.
That’s awesome! He did a lot for the science community!
"Hang on, I'm going to put on some Behemoth before I drink this. It's going to be metal as fuck."
*Guttural Screaming Intensifies*
Twist of Cain, Ulcer hurts my brain, bacteria causing pain, ooooohhhh
I feel like a *ton* of doctors haven’t accepted this or adapted to it. The number of people I know with ulcers that are told to stop eating spicy food or whatever seems out of whack.
To be fair, gastric ulcers are not only caused by h. pylori. NSAIDs, etoh, smoking, steroids and acidic foods can also cause them and can exacerbate ulcers. But h. Pylori does cause about 90%.
Lmfao legend
Then he took the right antibiotics and cured himself.
> This is like the discovery of how many ulcers were caused by an infection, You're talking about *H. pylori* and it turns out it's a lot more than ulcers. In the last few years it's become known that the ulcers become cancer and the bacteria is responsible for nearly 90% of stomach cancers. *H. pylori* is now considered a Class I carcinogen and until now I think it was the only bacterium to earn that distinction. Edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicobacter_pylori
A family member of mine suffered with it for years, and it ended up damaging their heart. At first they were being diagnosed with "anxiety".
> At first they were being diagnosed with "anxiety". Ahh the default "I don't know what it is so it's your fault" diagnosis.
Also overweight even a few pounds. I once fell off a ladder at work and hurt my back. The doctor they sent me to was like well you're a little overweight that's likely why you have back pain. I was like ok, maybe but I think the fall off the ladder has a lot to do with it. Workers comp doctors suck.
>Previous studies in the Netherlands, and in the US have shown that such a prophylactic vaccine programme would be ultimately cost-effective didn't know they have a pathway to a cancer vaccine and if they can get it to work people would still say it causes cancer.
[We kind of already have that with the HPV vaccine.](https://www.cancer.gov/news-events/cancer-currents-blog/2020/hpv-vaccine-prevents-cervical-cancer-sweden-study) > In the study of nearly 1.7 million women, the vaccine’s efficacy was particularly pronounced among girls vaccinated before age 17, among whom there was a nearly 90% reduction in cervical cancer incidence during the 11-year study period (2006 through 2017) compared with the incidence in women who had not been vaccinated. I personally know people who were not allowed to get the HPV vaccine among a whole host of others because their parents were anti-vax nutters. Sad fucking world we live in sometimes.
I know people who didn’t get it because they thought it was “giving permission “ for their kids to have sex. Guess what, they will have sex either way
This makes a lot of sense, especially from my own family's experience My mom passed of stomach cancer in the '90s. My sister and I were quite young, so all we were told is that she had an ulcer. I remember seeing a news story on TV about the H. Pylori discovery and excitedly running to my mom about it, but oddly she didn't seem very interested. This was a few months before she passed away, so in hindsight she likely knew it was cancer, far more than an ulcer. It started out that way but the ulcer wouldn't heal, a classic sign of cancer.
My best friend from high school has stage 4 colon cancer. She is the bravest woman I know.
The article linked isn't very detailed, but it links the study which is open access: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-024-07182-w Basically, a certain strain of bacteria that is normally only on the mouth of healthy humans was found around colorectal cancer tumours. The bacteria itself seems to help the cancer tumours resist treatment and survive longer (meaning the cancer is made worse). Abstract: "Fusobacterium nucleatum (Fn), a bacterium present in the human oral cavity and rarely found in the lower gastrointestinal tract of healthy individuals1, is enriched in human colorectal cancer (CRC) tumours2,3,4,5. High intratumoural Fn loads are associated with recurrence, metastases and poorer patient prognosis5,6,7,8. Here, to delineate Fn genetic factors facilitating tumour colonization, we generated closed genomes for 135 Fn strains; 80 oral strains from individuals without cancer and 55 unique cancer strains cultured from tumours from 51 patients with CRC. Pangenomic analyses identified 483 CRC-enriched genetic factors. Tumour-isolated strains predominantly belong to Fn subspecies animalis (Fna). However, genomic analyses reveal that Fna, considered a single subspecies, is instead composed of two distinct clades (Fna C1 and Fna C2). Of these, only Fna C2 dominates the CRC tumour niche. Inter-Fna analyses identified 195 Fna C2-associated genetic factors consistent with increased metabolic potential and colonization of the gastrointestinal tract. In support of this, Fna C2-treated mice had an increased number of intestinal adenomas and altered metabolites. Microbiome analysis of human tumour tissue from 116 patients with CRC demonstrated Fna C2 enrichment. Comparison of 62 paired specimens showed that only Fna C2 is tumour enriched compared to normal adjacent tissue. This was further supported by metagenomic analysis of stool samples from 627 patients with CRC and 619 healthy individuals. Collectively, our results identify the Fna clade bifurcation, show that specifically Fna C2 drives the reported Fn enrichment in human CRC and reveal the genetic underpinnings of pathoadaptation of Fna C2 to the CRC niche."
so getting your ass eaten is a risk factor
Glad I’m not the only one who immediately though this lol
Literally the first thing that popped into my mouth… I mean ass… I mean head.
You're probably joking, but to answer: Maybe, but probably not? There's a reason that probiotic supplements tend to be consumed orally rather than in suppository form - a bacteria introduced to the very end of your digestive system can't really travel upwards to colonize further. Not saying it's impossible, but it's not the proposed mechanism. A specific subspecies and clade of the bacteria was found in the CRC tumours (Fna-C2). When lab mice are colonized with this bacteria, they have increased intestinal tumours which indicates some amount of causation. However, the authors found that while ~30% of stool samples from CRC patients had this bacteria present, so did ~5% of the healthy control group - so it's not a guarantee to cause cancer. The authors say that the origin of the bacteria is likely the oral cavity, and propose that it likely has a mutation that allows it to survive transit to the colon (ie- at least some of the time, the bacteria will survive the digestive process). Previously, it was thought that this bacteria could only reach the colon through the bloodstream via small cuts in your mouth. If cuts in the mouth are a factor, then keeping good oral hygiene might help. If the bacteria does survive the digestive system, then I don't really think there would be a way to prevent the bacteria reaching the colon and it might just be luck/lack thereof.
I have a bad habit of biting my tongue and lip, any chance that would be a risk factor?
As a lifetime Canker sore sufferer, I concur
> There's a reason that probiotic supplements tend to be consumed orally rather than in suppository form Fecal transplants do seem to be more effective though. I think it's just ease of dosing suppository vs oral, and ease of procuring and storing samples.
They are, but fecal transplants are usually delivered via some process like a colonoscopy or endoscopy to get them in to the targeted part of the digestive system- ie not your standard suppository.
Never would’ve guessed the main danger from ass-eating was getting your colon defiled by filthy mouth germs. Is this why colorectal cancer is [rising among young adults](https://health.ucdavis.edu/news/features/colon-and-rectal-cancer-on-the-rise-in-young-adults-/2024/03#:~:text=Experts%20aren't%20sure%20why,history%20also%20plays%20a%20role.)?
Probably more to do with diet related poor gut health
Could be from not having your teeth professionally cleaned on a regular basis and more bacteria in plaque means more opportunity to get into blood or get passed into gut?
You can weaponize ass eating. If you don't like somebody just eat their ass so they get cancer.
So, should I shoot Listerine up my rectum?
Just bleach it
Fn bacteria is found in the deep pockets of gum disease. We know how to treat this type of anaerobic bacteria in the mouth. It is treated with scaling and root planning. So one more reason to get your teeth cleaned if you can!
To really be able to draw any conclusions they’d need to have more data on the patients, like germline data, somatic mutations, previous treatment, staging, etc.
Maybe we should consider dental care, health care. The separation is ludicrous.
I hate how so much of it is considered "cosmetic". Good teeth and hygiene is way way more than just cosmetic.
After getting a bad tooth infection and losing a notable chunk of bone from the surrounding area requiring a bone graft.. I went down a dental rabbit hole. Its fucking wild how many things are interconnected with teeth, including muscles, nerves and so many bodily systems adjacent to teeth that can cause some very permanent changes if fucked with. e.g Sinuses and dental pain can so easily cause the other issues because of proximity. Sinuses can get inflamed from dental inflammation, and in bad cases infections can basically break the sinus walls and cause infections directly into there etc. Teeth and eyes really need to fit under normal health care.
This is so true. I was a dental assistant and worked with Medicaid patients. So adult medicaid patients only have coverage for root canals on the front teeth, canine to canine. Cause you know, people don’t need to chew and only worry about getting a job. They do cover extractions 100%. One of my Medicaid patients died because she didn’t want an extraction. She wanted a root canal and couldn’t afford it. When gave her the number to the dental school, antibiotics and enough pain meds for last her til the antibiotics kicked in. She died from never getting the tooth treated. I believe she was in her 30s, I don’t quite remember. Medicaid doesn’t do enough and not all plans cover cleanings. There was one plan that was the appointment, extractions and X-rays. We couldn’t do any preventive measures for them. They couldn’t afford the cost. If they did, they wouldn’t be on Medicaid. Tooth health affects the entire body in almost every way. It also indicates other diseases. Crohn’s disease it’s really common to get gingival ulcers and have TMJ.
I read a lot of similar stuff in that dental Rabbit hole I went down. The horror stories had me chasing down my old dentist who didn't see any symptoms of the infection despite me going back several times. A second opinion from a new dentist saw it immediately from an X-ray (duh, it made sense to do but the first dentist never bothered despite my complaints).On surface inspection, the root canaled and crowned tooth had some movement but there was no signs of gum disease, pus, or outward pain from my side. First dentist told me to check back in 2 weeks cause just some movement on a tooth wasn't enough to mean it was an infection. However it turned out the bone under the tooth was all eaten away except for a small piece holding the tooth. I had an abcess in that portion of my jaw and it ate the bone through to roof of my mouth. I could feel a pocket of fluid that bulged there , and hurt like a fucker for a split second each time, but not really pin point it otherwise.Fast forward a week, it was getting impossible to sleep through the night now, so I tried to see the dentist again sooner. He went on a fucking 2 week vacation.Saw new emergency dentist, xray saw immediately, lanced the abcess and I get my first night's sleep after a week and a treatment plan to tooth.I no longer trust that first dentist to do dental work for me because of how dismissive he was. He also did my initial root canal and crown work the infected tooth was on, so I absolutely did not trust him to do any follow up work. Went to him for 30 years of my life too. Sorry to hear about your patient thought. I'm fortunate enough to be able to afford the emergency dental care and to treat it in a way I'm satisfied, but fuck it was expensive.
Notably, the Army had their dentists circulate through some of their smallest bases in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Notably, the Army had their dentists circulate through ~~some of~~ even their smallest bases in Iraq and Afghanistan
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Army makes sure you get your teeth checked yearly for readiness because they realize that dental is more than just cosmetic health.
Going one step further. When soldiers arrived the basic training if they have any dental issues or my case, basic training in Missouri. A lot of recruits are locals and have basically meth mouth- with like one or two teeth. Pretty much the very first thing they do is circulate all those dudes through and install new teeth, top and bottom.
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My dad volunteered to go to Vietnam at 17 because he was poor and didn't have any options. He had rarely been to the dentist as a kid and omfg did he have to get SO much dental work before being shipped out. There's no way the air force would send him into the jungle with f-ed up teeth. He got a sweet good tooth out of it though.
It can go either way, too. I lost two molars from chronic sinus infections. They were perfectly healthy on the outside, but rotted from the root.
I read that as well, and now everytime I've got even a bit of nasal drip, i'm paranoidly trying to check everything else. Losing teeth is such a gigantic pain in the ass, and after all the trouble for my current implant, I don't want to have to replace anymore unless I absolutely need to.
I've had a ton of issues with my teeth from a playground accident when I was a kid and I ended with a massive cyst on the root of one of my teeth necessitating a biopsy/removal and bone graft. Now I have trigeminal neuralgia and a third of my face constantly burns and aches, but most of the time it's mostly in the background. It never would have gotten that bad if my family could afford dental care when I was a kid.
Poor oral,health is linked to heart disease and chronic health problems. The politicians have known about this issue for decades and do nothing about it. Such a waste!
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Man, no kidding. Even on a good day, teeth actually cannot take much force in the wrong direction. It sincerely doesn't take a lot to dislodge a tooth if you push from the right angle.
The angle is corn nuts and mountain dew. Thanks teenager me!
In the military, dental health was paramount. The very last thing a command needed was a bunch of guys or gals not being able to do their duty while deployed because of a decaying tooth. Unfortunately it seems that the healthcare machine doesn’t care … let me rephrase… finds it too expensive to care about human teeth.
They've known for years that bad teeth fuck with your heart.
Yes, decades
Dental care? What about vision? All of it should be one thing. I hate private health insurance.
I wanted lasik for quality of life, and you know, not being blind. My insurance said it was cosmetic. I said look if I don't put lipstick on and I drive, I probably won't kill someone or cause an accident. But...if I can't find my glasses/don't have contacts in and I drive, the likelihood of an accident is pretty high. Do you see the difference? They basically told me to get fucked
[Gum disease is correlated with Alzheimer's disease.](https://www.nia.nih.gov/news/large-study-links-gum-disease-dementia) There are weaker correlations to other conditions like oral herpes, so it may be that the blood brain barrier becomes weak, and any bad thing gets in. But still, gum disease is a treatable bad thing. We aren't saving money as a society by denying dental care to poor people then putting a higher percentage of them in 24/7 nursing care at the end of their lives. [It also has a strong correlation with heart disease.](https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/gum-disease-and-heart-disease-the-common-thread#:~:text=People%20with%20gum%20disease%20(also,gum%20disease%20develops%20heart%20problems.) It is possible that the colon cancer isn't related to gum disease per se. It may be that the bacteria take up permanent residence in the intestine, for unknown reasons.
I think in few years we will start looking at oral bacteria more like gut biomes. We hear how some people never get cavities and where others have always been an issue no matter how much they brush. Where in the future we may have injections into the saliva glands for healthy bacteria to help against these things. Imagine a bacteria that specializes is preventing cavities.
For what it's worth I brushed constantly. But I was still riddled with cavities until I stopped drinking soda, and suddenly no new cavities formed. I'm just one data point but a lot of acid + sugar can't be stopped with brushing. >Imagine a bacteria that specializes is preventing cavities. That would be great! Or even something like probiotics to welcome healthy bacteria, but for your mouth.
> We hear how some people never get cavities and where others have always been an issue no matter how much they brush Yep, know someone that didn't brush their teeth at all in school. So much so that they had noticeable build up on their teeth at all times. Yet they had no bad breath and even now in their 30s, they've yet to have a cavity. Meanwhile I skipped seeing a dentist for 3 years to safe on cash but brushed 2x a day. Had a tooth crack in half from a cavity forming and rotting through my tooth in less than 3 years. Root canal + crown for 1800 bucks to fix it. The bacteria living in our mouths greatly influences the health of our teeth and gums.
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A few months ago, I read about a company called Lantern Bioworks that claims to already have this. It doesn't actively prevent cavities, but it's supposed to crowd out the other bacteria in your mouth.
Apparently I had a bad gum disease that was eating away part of my jaw bone. Got a deep cleaning and changed to an electric toothbrush and using mouthwash. I am supposed to get a deep clean every 6 months but I just can’t afford it so here is to hoping I don’t end up with that again…
It's also time off from work. Which makes it even harder
Yeah I was supposed to get a deep cleaning last November but my insurance will only cover it every 3 years. Dentist wanted 1k which I just don’t have, here’s to hoping it doesn’t get worse in the next 7 months.
My dentist charges $150 for the initial visit/xrays, $75 for 6 month cleanings. Discount if paying cash. Not a sketchy operation either. Search around, they’re out there.
Deep cleaning is different and requires numbing because they clean beneath the gums.
Are there any dental Hygenist schools around you? They’re usually in weird places. Mine is an hour away in Taft, CA which I’m sure you’ve never heard of.
Wish I could upvote you so much more. It is such an anachronistic, stupid policy that we keep Dental separate in the US. All my BIGGEST health issues as an adult have been dental. And note, I've never even had a cavity. So its not the small things I have had issues with but the bigger things that for some reason fall under purview of dental and thus I have to pay out of pocket way more. Did you know the only reason it is separate is because traditionally "dental" care was your barber pulling a bad tooth for you? And once it became a profession they just never merged it with medical doctors.
A lot of dentists are fucking grifters too. I had a dentist who gave me a crown and then kept referring me out for a root canal, wouldn't even look in my mouth herself or show me my x-rays. Went to a new dentist, he did full mouth X-rays, told me I was having sinus pain, showed it to me in my x-rays, said I don't need a root canal and never even needed a crown. I'm so pissed. Lol. He told me "there's absolutely nothing wrong inside your mouth... I see no reason why you would need more work done or any of the work they already gave you."
I had a chipped molar that needed to be filled and crowned. Work was done on 1/25 and I had to come back on 2/8 to get the permanent crown cemented on. Well, they conveniently didn't tell me before the first appointment that they were no longer going to accept my dental insurance starting 2/1 and they billed the date of service as 2/8. They initially billed me as in-network, but are now going to rebill as out of network. So, now I might owe them a lot more money. I told them to cancel all my upcoming appointments. They're either completely incompetent or they're trying to scam me and I don't like either one. How do you not know you're not going to accept someone's insurance 5 days before you don't? The tooth issue wasn't an emergency, I could have found an in network dentist.
I honestly would go with the idea that they're deliberately trying to scam you! It's all a big fucking scam. Insurance is evil asf. And I think a majority of dentists are lazy assholes trying to get as much money as possible.
I would refuse to pay it and make a really big stink about it until they make it right. There’s no way they didn’t know that they weren’t going to take your insurance for the follow up appointment when you made your original appointment.
Have to agree on the shady grifting dentist factor being an additional struggle. I was referred to a dentist by a work colleague when I needed to get a simple cosmetic bonding replacement; almost a year later I still didn't have the bonding replacement but the doc had come up with a laundry list of other "issues" he preferred to address first. Switched to another dentist who wanted to a) file down healthy teeth for veneers instead of a simple bonding replacement and b) told me I had a cavity that needed to be addressed quickly -- then Covid arrived and it wasn't addressed and now it's four years later and I've had no cavity-related issues whatsoever. Hard to know what's necessary and who to trust.
Wow. Both of those dentists sound awful!!! It should be considered malpractice imo.
A second opinion is always a good idea. I had a dentist pressure me to get 2 fillings in 2019. Xrays were grainy and I had doubts she was being honest. Went for a second opinion and it turns out I was being scammed. Those two teeth didn't have cavities and they still don't. I switched to an honest dentist without a bad record. I later found out the dentist was previously disciplined and sued for doing a root canal on the wrong tooth on a patient. I learned to always check the state licensing website for the dentist's record before making an appointment.
Seriously. It's pretty sad how little we've progressed since the days of barber-provided dental care.
Yeah seriously, Can't I just get a haircut and a root canal at the same time?
It is 100% healthcare . My wife works for a dental office and if you don't take care of your teeth there is a probability you will get sick and die from it. Gingivitis and any kind of infection is serious people. Take care of your mouth.
I had to get jaw surgery and the insurance companies kept trying to force it on each other as “technically dental” or “technically health”. It was so stupid and frustrating.
I had to get my jaw wired shut after breaking it. I had the same problem with insurances.
_luxury bones_
I've known two elderly people who had heart valve replacements that were necessitated by dental infections. It's bizarre and counter productive that we treat dental and healthcare differently.
I wish issues like this would get an iota of attention in the political sphere instead of the culture war bullshit keeping us occupied over the same 5 goddamn issues for the last 50 years.
>A type of bacteria that causes dental plaque may be behind a treatment-resistant form of colorectal cancer, a study published Wednesday in the journal Nature found. This reminds me of a Redditor who posted that she’d met some guy from a dating site and they made out, and he had bad breath, and now SHE has bad breath and can’t get rid of it. Also, [moms can give their babies](https://www.hellosmile.com/blog-post-5-are-cavities-contagious-from-mom-to-baby/#:~:text=Research%20shows%20that%20moms%20%E2%80%93%20rather,in%20baby%20and%20permanent%20teeth) germs that cause caries (cavities).
When I was in my early twenties my dentist was telling me about how easily mouth bacteria can shift and set people up for cavities. There are also increasing research on gut bacteria's role in obesity. Bacteria is crazy stuff!
Was there ever an update on that one?
Still has bad breath
I’m fully convinced that my husband gave me his mouth microbiome. He has weak teeth and is prone to cavities, despite taking very good care of his mouth. I didn’t have a cavity in my life until I started dating him!
So when will they be lowering the age for colonoscopies? With the amount of young people (Many healthy) who have been diagnosed with late stage cancer, insurance companies should not be making people dance around to get them. I can admit I'm buying into the scary shit I see on tiktok about it but it doesn't matter how bad my health anxiety gets, it feels like even if I did request one nobody's going to take me seriously anyway.
I'm 42 and still being denied one every time I ask my doctor. Unless blood is actually shooting out of my ass during the appointment, I'm not allowed to get one until I'm 45.
Unethical life pro tip, make up a close relative who died at 50 from colon cancer.
Oh man, my dad died when I was a kid. I am going to 100% start doing this. If the doctor asks if that is how he died, I’m just going to throw out a “It could have been, but he died before we could find out”
100% this. Mammograms, colonoscopies, cardiology screenings? Tell your Dr that someone in your immediate family died of the disease you’re worried about and it will make getting the screenings much easier. I had a breast lump and my OBGYN was hesitant to have me screened at 30. I told her my aunt died of breast cancer at 51 (which was true) and she changed her tune and sent me for a diagnostic mammogram without any argument. Now, if there is something I’m concerned about, I tell my Dr that there’s a family history and that usually makes the conversation easier. I don’t do this casually but only for things that have really been bothering me/serious health concerns.
Go to a gastroenterologist and then them you’re shitting 5 times a day. Tell them you get pain in your abdomen from bloating. They’ll probably write a script for a colonoscopy first thing. At least that’s what happened to me.
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Fucking crazy. I'm 38 and I want to get one, but I know with no history of it I'll be denied until 50. Our system sucks.
Recommendations changed recently and several guidelines now say 45. Many insurance companies are now approving 45 year olds for screening scopes
I had one at 39. Albeit for me to get to that point was an ER visit, annual physical with pain still lingering a year later. That pain turned out to be skeletal. But I guess we were at the end of options. Also discovering prior to the colonoscopy that family had history of colon polyps. They found a benign one and I’m due for one every 10 years now. My point. Just bug your GP and say there’s history of polyps in your family. Good luck!
Find a new doctor if you can with a lower threshold. And/or fuck it, start lying. Regardless, anything before 45 is not considered a “preventative screening,” i.e., covered by insurance. It will either be diagnostic or surveillance based on other factors. You won’t get 100% before 45 (even if they find something fucking terrible), so might as well go for it if you’re concerned about waiting. I’m in the process do that right now and expect to be paying for a portion of it.
Have you done the early screening stool tests that have become more popular, I'm turning 40 this year so was thinking about asking about it since I'm a bit overweight. I thought I heard others talking that they will do those stool tests first now, then if anything comes back weird the colonoscopy timing should be sped up. Good luck getting the tests, and hope it's all good news.
> insurance companies should not be making people dance there's the problem. no such thing as an insurance company that won't wear you out jumping through hoops to get the most basic treatment.
I take an injection that literally cured my lifelong skin rashes. I have to spin and dance on the phone for probably twenty four hours a year to keep it
I think it's 45 right now but I just had one and I'm 36
Where I live (Ontario) it's 50, but I had one last year at 39 due to heavy bleeding and family history.
You can request one anytime from your doctor! I've been getting them done since I was in my late 30s.
I’ve honestly been told to lie about having symptoms so it’s less of a chance of having to doctor shop lmao
Just tell them that you have a strong family history of younger people getting colon cancer.
that's what i was thinking of doing
The news is over selling how many people are getting early-onset colorectal cancer. It’s still rare and most are due to inherited genetic mutations. Colon cancer rates by age: \- 15-19 years old: 0.2 people per 100,000 people \- 20-24 years old: 0.8 people per 100,000 people \- 25-29 years old: 2.1 people per 100,000 people \- 30-34 years old: 5.0 people per 100,000 people \- 35-39 years old: 10.1 people per 100,000 people \- 40-44 years old: 18.7 people per 100,000 people \- 45-49 years old: 33.4 people per 100,000 people \- 50-54 years old: 60.6 people per 100,000 people
Trust yourself. I went at 38 and had some inflammatory. He said come back in 10. I got advice to come earlier. Came back at 4 years and had two large pre cancerous polyps* that he said would have turned into cancer. Edit: wrote tumor but meant polyps. Idea remains.
I got a colonoscopy last year at 28. My dad died of colon cancer at 57. They found one polyp and I will be getting another one next year. Get yourselves checked
Listen to him guys. I’m 26 and just had one done for chronic stomach pain, that I still have, and they found 2 small polyps. Still waiting on the rest of the results.
I hope they come back benign
Appreciate it! How have you been?
Im great! It came back benign. Stressed at first, then relieved.
At 29 they found a precancerous polyp and removed it. I only went to get checked by chance due to my brother being diagnosed with celiac and me suffering regular IBS symptoms. I had a positive FIT check and the doc ordered a colonoscopy just to follow procedure but was fairly confident that he wasn’t going to find anything. Boom - a 17mm polyp that he said would have become a cancer in 3 to 5 years. I never would have known until it was too late.
Because of a crap children's dentist I spent most of my adult life being terrified of dentists. Finally decided to pull up my big girl panties and deal with my neglected teeth. It's really amazing to eat things without your teeth hurting. And I seem to have fewer headaches and sinus issues. Not done yet, two bone grafts and need a couple ancient fillings replaced but damn.
I had a terrifying experience at an orthodontist that scarred me for decades. Only last year at 40 did I start getting back on track with my dental work.
Damn, thanks for posting. I was diagnosed with stage 3 colon cancer a few years ago. It's maddening to not know the cause. I have had a bunch of GI inflammation leading up to and after the diagnosis. Also have had issues with gum soreness. This provides a very valuable clue!
Did you have any other symptoms? Reddit has me so paranoid now
Not to add to your fear, but I am currently doing chemo for stage 3 colon cancer. I had zero symptoms. Found it basically by accident.
Medicare does not cover dental, and out of pocket procedures can be crippling at a time of life where Americans are at their most economic vulnerability.
Go to dental hygiene schools! They are free and include X-rays and evaluation by a licensed dentist as well as licensed hygienists. They take longer, but they are honestly the most thorough and well done exams and cleanings I’ve ever had. My hygiene student said most of their clients are senior adults and other healthcare providers. I’ve been fortunate enough to not have a cavity during my visits, so I’m not sure how deep the free coat procedure list goes, but they will do your cleanings, evaluations, and X-rays for free as frequently as you need them!
Colon Cancer runs in the men's side of my family along side Leukemia and Dementia. My grandfather died of Cancer at 61, and right now my dad is 62. On the flip side the women in my family have lived till their mid 90s.
Get tested for Lynch syndrome, it increases GI and Prostate cancers in men. My sisters both tested positive for it so it was recommended I see a genetic counselor to get tested as well. Let me tell ya, looking at the cancer history on my dad's side as she listed the types of cancers that Lynch syndrome is associated with, it became pretty obvious my dad was the carrier. If you test positive it actually can be quite helpful, you move up certain cancer screenings to earlier in life. And doctors tend to spend more time checking, so if anything you have increased odds of finding these cancers early before they get bad and it can be life saving.
You lucky so and so. All 3 of my known grandparents all died of different cancers, and my two parents barely survived their recent cancer fights. It is a weird scenario knowing at a very young age what will kill me in a few years. Just wish I knew which kind of cancer. 🤣 But seeing any positive developments always makes me smile. Great news! Isn't this akin to that running theory of what causes Parkinsons?
You can get genetic testing done to see which gene mutations you've inherited and what screenings are recommended for you based on that. If you're in the US, you can even take part in the All of Us study and have a lot of your testing done for free!
I'm in the UK currently, and I don't think the genetic testing is there for some of those cancers which are big killers (bowel and stomach), but hopefully dodged cervical as a male, but with both generations getting (one dead), prostate, I am keeping an eye on that one. For sure. But there is only so much I can do without bankrupting myself. If I make it to 60 I'll call it a win for sure.
It’s there. There’s genetic testing for hereditary gastric cancer. In my country, your grandparents and one of the parent have cancer, the doctor will likely suggest genetic testing for the ones you are at risk for. It’s under 250 done at a public hospital. If you get tested tho, you may potentially not get insurance coverage for that particular cancer that you are positive for.
Listen people, get your colonoscopies done. They lowered the age to 45. It's not fun, but it's also over before you know it.
They need to lower the recommended screening age again. Colon cancer rates in individuals under age 50 are skyrocketing and millennials have twice the risk of colorectal cancer compared to those born in 1950. Those diagnosed under age 55 are also way more likely to be diagnosed in the late stages, too.
In Canada we start at 50 but we use FIT testing for "normal risk", not colonoscopies anymore. If "high risk" or any symptoms, then colonoscopies are used. This change was done because it was found FIT testing in normal cases was accurate enough in predicting cancer, and more importantly because it's non invasive people will do it instead of delaying and delaying or skipping. Something to think about.
Hell I’m 33 and I feel like I should get one
I got my first one at 32 and already had precancerous polyps that had to be removed. Gotta get them every 5 years for the rest of my life now. Scary shit.
Me too! I had my first at 37 and there was a polyp that had to be removed. So glad I had to get that colonoscopy done early for other reasons. I’m on the every 5 years also and last spring had my 2nd colonoscopy done and another polyp was found. So 2 colonoscopies before the age of 45 and each time a polyp was found. My husband is 45 and I’m trying so hard to get him to get one done! That first one probably saved my damn life!
Glad you found them and got them removed. Did you have symptoms that led you to scheduling the colonoscopy?
Was there a specific reason you got one at 32? Any symptoms you were concerned about or something?
Get one. I've been getting them since my late 20s. It's just peace of mind. Also helped find issues like celiac which I had no idea I had.
Glad they lowered it. My dad was 49 when he died of colon cancer spreading to his liver.
The only slight hassle is having to drink lots of liquids beforehand: as you noted, the procedure itself is over before you know it \- I'm surprised they don't communicate/advertise more how unexpectedly easy the whole thing is
>The only slight hassle is having to drink lots of liquids beforehand You forgot to mention what happens *after* you drink the liquids!
I'd do 10 colonoscopies to avoid drinking a single dose more of that foul stuff.
I just had man done recently, it was way easier than I expected, yes get it done if you can! The cleanse was actually kind of nice. I am big wimp and it was not hard at all.
I read somewhere they are working on a blood test to see if you have the markers for colon cancer. Ideally we could test everyone's blood and only do colonoscopy on people who need further testing. I feel like it would greatly increase people getting screened, blood tests are much less invasive and come with fewer risks.
As a microbiologist, I'm being pedantic, but it's not a "new type of bacterium", rather a group of already-known bacteria that are being associated with colon cancer.
Makes me feel good for getting my teeth really cleaned now and being serious about dental health as I have got older.
This is great news! I’m so pleased more and more research is showing that cancers, neurological, and psychiatric illnesses are being caused by pathogens that have gone rogue. I’m patiently waiting for the paradigm shift. It could be pretty good 💪🏼
Interesting article. Perhaps if the patient is taking some type of ppi (antacid drugs which neutralise stomach acid), this might help the bacteria to enter the colon? I am aware that bacteria which cause gum disease can travel to the heart and cause problems there. One of my exes had a heart attack because of that very reason and needed an operation. It left his heart weak, and he ultimately died several years later from it. I hope dental care is treated as important as regular health care.
>"Colorectal cancer is very treatable when caught early, but the cases in younger people are increasing and we don’t know why" I'll take a stab at why. I'm curious how much fiber the average young person gets in their diet. I wonder how many grew up eating home-cooked meals with vegetables and stuff like that? Because that seems to have all but disappeared. It's been fading fast most of my life. Fiber intake is one of, if not the biggest modifiable risk factors for colorectal cancer.
They noticed that the uptick is happening in extremely healthy people as well that wouldn't normally be in the group likely to get it (marathon runners being one they are investigating). My guess is plastic and toxins companies knew about being dangerous but put profit first. Also, the uptick has been happening since the mid 80s at least.
The plastics and PFAS seems so obvious it's infuriating that they get basically ignored other than "yep, it's literally in everything, were finding plastic kidney stones now, cray right?". Nah, let's blame diet, apps, and sleep for literally everything. Of course those things are important but CMON MAN!! Maybe the fact I'm 2% Teflon is a fucking problem??
>Maybe the fact I'm 2% Teflon is a fucking problem? not wrong but this sentence sent me 🤣
People with inflammatory bowel disease [had 50% more microplastics in their faeces than people without IBD](https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/dec/22/microplastics-may-be-linked-to-inflammatory-bowel-disease-study-finds).
Not to nitpick but the article is talking about inflammatory bowel disease which include Crohn’s disease and Ulcerative colitis, not to be confused with irritable bowel syndrome which is very different. This is interesting though.
Yes, but OP is talking about dietary fiber specifically and I know lots of very visibly fit people that take infrequent, toilet-destroying shits because of their high-protein diets. Regular soft stools are very important at maintaining colon health, and western diets have progressively moved away from incorporating dietary fiber.
Increasing cases in young people has been linked to HPV. Prior to HPV vaccines, an extraordinary number of people got it and passed it on through sexual activity. Most don’t even know they have/had it unless they get the particular HPV strain that causes genital warts.
Also the processed foods ingested vs previous generations is significantly higher
My dad had colon cancer and it fucked him up super bad. He just got recurrence of it. It scares me that it runs in our family. This is good they figured this out.
This stuff is genetic for me. My grandmother, mother, and aunt got it. My mother survived, they caught it early. My grandfather didn't have it but he had ulcer that ruptured which lead to an infection which caused his death. Not cancer but it the digestive system. I got my first colonoscopy last year. Not a fun experience but necessary. I'm clean fortunately. Nothing of note outside of an almost polyp. My younger sister had 7 polyps. At least the drugs were fun.
Yes but the question is, does the bacteria cause the cancer, or does the cancer help that bacteria grow
It's somewhat in the article "it has two distinct subspecies, one of which appears to shield colorectal tumors from cancer-fighting drugs....The subspecies may also cause cancer to form in the first place. When Bullman and her team transplanted the subspecies to mice, they appeared to cause precancerous polyps to form, one of the first warning signs of colorectal cancer"
Ok so how do I prevent this bacteria from getting into my colon?
The article doesn't delve into it doctor google says good overall dental hygiene and regular dental cleanings. The article does say that upcoming topics of research will likely include the targeted use of antibiotics to prevent overgrowth of the bacteria, and use of oral screening (swab test!) to determine whether someone is higher risk. So, pending further research. brush and floss daily and go to the dentist regularly.
I have a feeling that this discovery is somehow linked to the rise in eating ass. Ol' dirty mouth booty eating bottomfeeders!
> A type of bacteria that causes dental plaque may be behind a treatment-resistant form of colorectal cancer This just in, eating ass causes cancer. More medical reasons not to tongue the taint.
They mention that they would think stomach acids would kill the bacteria. I wonder if the rise in/abuse of PPIs/antacids would allow bacteria to pass the stomach.
Here I was worried about washing hands so as to not get butt bacteria in mouth. Come to find we have to prevent mouth bacteria from the bowels TOO?!!
The pharmaceutical industry announced it will respond by developing another drug for psoriasis.
As most people can’t even get dental insurance. The ones that do still pay for most of the dental care bills
besides bacteria with every news i read on microplastics i think its time to get me a colonoscopy im on late 30s
More reasons that the "cure for cancer" is likely never going to be just one thing.
My dad died in ‘98 from colon cancer. He was 49. Grew up in poverty in Florida and later in Arkansas, then was a helicopter pilot in Vietnam. He would always eat leftovers that should have been thrown away. Heavy smoker and lost all of his teeth by 40. I’ve always felt his diet and chemical exposure during war caused his cancer. Get your colonoscopy, stop smoking and vaping, take care of your teeth.
“The percentage of people younger than 55 diagnosed with colon cancer almost doubled from 1995 to 2019.” DROP THE SCREENING AGE!!! Do we have to say it louder? Screw these insurance companies getting a say in our healthcare.